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Speaker 1: Hi everyone at Sophia, Welcome back to work in Progress.

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Speaker 1: This is the third episode in our four part mini

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Speaker 1: series Well and Good, a series of shorter episodes that

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Speaker 1: focus on all things sustainability. I am so jazzed to

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Speaker 1: introduce you to our guest. Today. We have with us

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Speaker 1: the smart and savvy fashion writer and clothing sustainability expert

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Speaker 1: Alden Wicker. Alden is the founder and editor in chief

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Speaker 1: of the website eco Cult, which has been mentioned by

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Speaker 1: The New York Times, Teen, Vogue, MSNBC, NPR, and Nylon Magazine,

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Speaker 1: just to name a few. It features shopping guides and

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Speaker 1: researched articles about the big ideas and issues in the

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Speaker 1: international sustainable fashion industry. Alden is also a contributing freelance

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Speaker 1: writer for publications like Glamour, Popular Science, Newsweek, Box, and

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Speaker 1: Refinery twenty nine. She knows her staff, and as someone

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Speaker 1: who also now works in sustainable fashion, I feel extra

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Speaker 1: fortunate to have been able to sit down and speak

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Speaker 1: with Alden about the industry in the years that she

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Speaker 1: has spent developing her knowledge and skills as an expert

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Speaker 1: in it. I thoroughly enjoyed my eye opening conversation with

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Speaker 1: Alden and I can't wait to start using her consumer

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Speaker 1: fashion tips, and I know you all will feel the same. Enjoy. Hello,

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Speaker 1: and welcome to work in progress. Alden. I'm so excited

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Speaker 1: that you are here with me today. You are the

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Speaker 1: founder and the editor in chief of Eco Cult. You

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Speaker 1: are a sustainable fashion writer and expert. You have spoken

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Speaker 1: at the u N. You are this incredible human and

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Speaker 1: I want to know how you wound up doing the

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Speaker 1: work that you do. But before we we get into

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Speaker 1: why so many of us know you to day, I

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Speaker 1: I want to go backwards with you. I always like

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Speaker 1: to know how people started. I became aware of you

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Speaker 1: as this fashion expert and this very cheek woman and

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Speaker 1: someone who tells the truth about you know, industries and humanity.

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Speaker 1: And and how something that I think so many people

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Speaker 1: treat as ornamental or frivolous is actually a huge global

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Speaker 1: industry that's so impactful. But I wonder how you became

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Speaker 1: this way? Were you always into cool outfits and scarves

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Speaker 1: and and speaking out about you know, people's quality of life?

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Speaker 1: Who who was all in it? I don't know, eight

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Speaker 1: or ten years old? Uh well I was at Dork

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Speaker 1: first of all. Um. Yeah, so my mom got subscriptions

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Speaker 1: to Newsweek and Time, and I would I would read

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Speaker 1: them and try to absorb whatever I could get through

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Speaker 1: my head. Um at that age. And um, I do

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Speaker 1: remember I read about the peak oil, which never actually happened,

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Speaker 1: but it's it's a problem for other reasons. And I

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Speaker 1: would go to the mall after reading that and say

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Speaker 1: no to plastic bags because bags are made from oil

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Speaker 1: and I didn't want to contribute to some to this

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Speaker 1: environmental problem. Um. And so you know, I would go

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Speaker 1: in Claires and I'd be like, no bag, please, I'll

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Speaker 1: put my Claes purchase in my limited to in my

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Speaker 1: limited to bag. Thanks. So that was I mean, I

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Speaker 1: was a huge dork about that. And you know my

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Speaker 1: mom cares about the environment as well. And I would

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Speaker 1: tramp around in the woods around our house and um,

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Speaker 1: but I was not fashionable at all at all. And

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Speaker 1: I still feel like I'm trying to catch up. I

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Speaker 1: get that I had to wear a uniform for so

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Speaker 1: much of my school girl years, I guess you could say.

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Speaker 1: And now I dress up as other people and trying

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Speaker 1: to figure out what I like to wear still feels

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Speaker 1: like a mystery to me. Um, because I literally have

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Speaker 1: to be people other than myself for work. So I

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Speaker 1: really feel you on that. And the photos of me tramping,

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Speaker 1: you know, trampling around in the woods as a kid,

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Speaker 1: are mortifying in terms of my fashion choices. But I

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Speaker 1: really I just I liked what I liked. So maybe

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Speaker 1: maybe that's why, you know, maybe that's why we've ended

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Speaker 1: up here. Um when you say the woods, where did

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Speaker 1: you grow up? Yeah? I grew up in North Carolina,

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Speaker 1: in a very very tiny town outside of Rali, and

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Speaker 1: we had hud eighty acres of woods around our house

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Speaker 1: and so I could just take off for the whole

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Speaker 1: day and wander around. And my mom let me do that.

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Speaker 1: She was like so she wanted me to be independent.

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Speaker 1: And then when she was she needed a break, she

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Speaker 1: dropped me off of my great aunt uncle's cow farm

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Speaker 1: on the other side of town, and I would tramp

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Speaker 1: around trying to avoid u cow pies in the middle

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Speaker 1: of the field. So I had a very uh, I

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Speaker 1: had a lovely childhood, really protected and full of love.

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Speaker 1: I love that I am. I wound up spending gosh

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Speaker 1: the years from the time that I was just twenty

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Speaker 1: one to twenty nine in Wilmington, North Carolina, So that

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Speaker 1: makes me you're mentioned of being from there, makes me

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Speaker 1: feel very nostalgic. Yeah. I mean, if you started speaking

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Speaker 1: with a North Carolina accent, I would pick it back

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Speaker 1: up very quickly. Put me, put me in a restaurant

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Speaker 1: or a bar there, and give me a beer and

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Speaker 1: we're back. It happens real fast. What was that like

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Speaker 1: for you? I mean you, you know you say it

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Speaker 1: felt safe and idyllic and you got to be curious

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Speaker 1: and explore. Um were you Were you doing that on

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Speaker 1: your own? Did you have siblings? Yeah? I have an

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Speaker 1: older sister, so also, you know, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: you're an older younger sibling. When you're the younger sibling,

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Speaker 1: your older sibling protects you from from anything bad going wrong, right, So, um,

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Speaker 1: it felt very protected in that way. And also our

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Speaker 1: family are big readers, right. We would all, you know,

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Speaker 1: eat our cereal for breakfast with a book next to us,

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Speaker 1: so always reading and finding out things. And my mom

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Speaker 1: was single for most of that time because my dad

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Speaker 1: passed away when I was three, So she modeled for

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Speaker 1: me being a good mother but also knowing how to

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Speaker 1: use a drill. You know. She liked to buy houses

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Speaker 1: and renovate them. And so I would be over there

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Speaker 1: and she'd hand me a hammer and teach me how

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Speaker 1: to put a nail in. So um, that is so cool. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's really great to grow with the mom like that

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Speaker 1: because now I didn't ever need to ask, you know,

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Speaker 1: and now I've learned, I guess how to ask for help.

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Speaker 1: But for a while I was like, no, I can

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Speaker 1: always do it myself. I don't need anybody, at least

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Speaker 1: of all a man. That's so funny. I think that

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Speaker 1: I got a lot of that because for my parents,

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Speaker 1: I was I was am the only child, and I

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Speaker 1: think my mom and your mom sound very similar energetically.

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Speaker 1: And my dad is actually an artist who's a photographer

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Speaker 1: and and also grew up you know, for so much

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Speaker 1: of his I foun a on a farm in Canada.

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Speaker 1: And so it's really interesting because I kind of got

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Speaker 1: all of the dynamics you were talking about from them

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Speaker 1: as well. You know, they wanted to make sure that

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Speaker 1: as a girl, I would be solid in you know,

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Speaker 1: any sort of on any end of the spectrum, whether

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Speaker 1: it was you know, more traditionally or stereotypically female or male.

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Speaker 1: They wanted me to be able to hold my own,

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Speaker 1: you know, so whether that was like knowing how to

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Speaker 1: use a power drill and my dad had a mikita.

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Speaker 1: I just thought that was so cool. I was like,

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Speaker 1: I can wield a mikita, yeah, you know, or or

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Speaker 1: my mom, you know that nikita is like that be'st

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Speaker 1: the best drill. It was a fabulous drill, really, you

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Speaker 1: know what you're talking about. And my mom wanted to

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Speaker 1: make sure that when I turned five, I started learning

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Speaker 1: how to box because she was just not having, you know,

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Speaker 1: me run into any situation I could handle. And I

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Speaker 1: think it's so cool, you know, whatever the circumstances of

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Speaker 1: your family are as you mentioned. You know, you said

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Speaker 1: your dad passed when you were young, and I'm so right.

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Speaker 1: I can't imagine how hard that must have been. It was,

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Speaker 1: it was it was harder for my older sister. She

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Speaker 1: protected me from from that, and my mom protected me

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Speaker 1: from that, so I didn't really realize I didn't absorb

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Speaker 1: that trauma the way they absorbed it for me. So

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Speaker 1: that's also another way I was really protected. Wow, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I imagine because you were I mean, you were so young.

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Speaker 1: What a moment, and I don't know, you're you know,

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Speaker 1: despite what I can only estimate, it was a very

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Speaker 1: devastating loss. The amount of love you were surrounded by

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Speaker 1: is palpable. Even in the way that you tell the

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Speaker 1: story stories of your mom and and the stories about

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Speaker 1: your sister. It's it's really cool to to see that

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Speaker 1: like huge grin on your face as you speak about them,

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Speaker 1: and and I don't know if you know, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at you. You light up when you talk

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Speaker 1: about them, and it's it's really it's really special. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they're really they're really special people. Yeah. Were you and

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Speaker 1: your sister, you know, in terms of running around and

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Speaker 1: being out on thee And did you guys get into

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Speaker 1: fashion together or was that really your your sort of

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Speaker 1: venue for discovery. Yeah, you know, it's weird that I

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Speaker 1: ended up in fashion, and I think, you know, I

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Speaker 1: cared deeply about the environment. I also took as many

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Speaker 1: classes as were available in my two majors in college,

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Speaker 1: so I majored in in communications and journalism and uh

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Speaker 1: in business and the business was just in case of

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Speaker 1: journalism didn't work out. And I graduated and the food

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Speaker 1: movement was really taking off. You know, you had food

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Speaker 1: inc you had omnivorous dilemma and learning about where my

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Speaker 1: food came from and the environment and how choosing something

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Speaker 1: that's environmentally friendly can also improve your own health. It

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Speaker 1: really changed my life for the better. I mean I

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Speaker 1: had food issues, typical food issues of a of a

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Speaker 1: girl in college, and um, I was able to shed

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Speaker 1: those by learning about where my food came from. And

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Speaker 1: so I thought, what about where everything else comes from? Right?

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Speaker 1: Our beauty, our fashion? You know, what about how we travel?

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Speaker 1: So I started learning about it and writing about it.

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Speaker 1: And then I found an eco cold in two thousand thirteen,

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Speaker 1: and it was about everything. It was about sustainable lifestyle,

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Speaker 1: and at that point in my journey, I thought, Okay,

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Speaker 1: this is how I'm going to contribute to the to

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Speaker 1: the movement. I'm just going to research, share information and

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Speaker 1: uh and and of course include pretty pictures. Right There's

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Speaker 1: it was the heyday of blogs. Everybody was starting a

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Speaker 1: blog and I thought, Okay, that's how I'm That's how

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Speaker 1: I'm going to do it. And then um, not a

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Speaker 1: few weeks after that, the RNA plausa garment factory collapsed

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Speaker 1: in Bangladesh and that was over one thousand one garment

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Speaker 1: workers died. It was horrific pictures of people mourning their

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Speaker 1: loved ones in the rubble, and um, the world woke

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Speaker 1: up to the fact that people make our clothes with

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Speaker 1: their hands, right, think, a lot of people thought it

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Speaker 1: was just machines or something, and it took off. And

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Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of amazing people speaking about food, right,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of people speaking about clean beauty. But

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Speaker 1: at the time, I was one of the only people

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Speaker 1: researching writing about sustainable fashion. Um, it was not sexy,

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Speaker 1: God blessed. But the first editor at Refinery, Connie, He's amazing.

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Speaker 1: He was like, Okay, fine, you keep pitching me, I'll

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Speaker 1: let you write about it. And of course, now here

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Speaker 1: we are right, like everybody is aware that this is

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Speaker 1: a problem. And the more strings you pull, the more

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Speaker 1: you learn. So I love it because there's always more

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Speaker 1: to learn and there's always more to advocate for. And

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Speaker 1: it's brought me in contact with people all of the world,

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Speaker 1: all types of people, and it's really taught me lessons

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Speaker 1: about life as well, because fashion is connected to everything.

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Speaker 1: That's so cool. Now when you when you talk about

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Speaker 1: you go col and moment that you know, it feels

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Speaker 1: like such an inflection point in terms of what you're referencing,

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Speaker 1: the awareness of fashion production. Um, the fact that this

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Speaker 1: expression of identity is, as you say, made by someone.

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Speaker 1: Every shirt was made by someone, you know, the way

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Speaker 1: that it needs to be personalized, that the source feels

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Speaker 1: so important. I'm I'm curious because you reference the you know,

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Speaker 1: the awakening coming from food and where food comes from.

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Speaker 1: And I think the parallel path of the agriculture industry

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Speaker 1: and the fashion industry and the truly the frontline workers

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Speaker 1: at the source of both. You know, that's that's a

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Speaker 1: big system to begin analyzing as a young woman. What

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Speaker 1: was it that led to that kind of awakening for you?

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Speaker 1: What was it that led you to want to be

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Speaker 1: an activist, to really go down the rabbit hole of

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Speaker 1: of supply chain in the first place. Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think it was the same thing that made me

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Speaker 1: start refusing classic bags that I was nine, where I

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Speaker 1: just I don't know, I guess I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: there's a problem here, and um, and I love researching

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Speaker 1: and sharing information and I love speaking to people. That's

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Speaker 1: why I'm a journalist, right, And there's just always more

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Speaker 1: to learn, and some of it is really surprising and

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Speaker 1: it satisfies my sense of curiosity, and because it touches

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Speaker 1: so many different things, it's just it's just never boring, right.

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Speaker 1: And you know, a couple of years ago, UM, I

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Speaker 1: convinced my husband to quit his job and um we

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Speaker 1: packed up our apartment when we traveled around the world

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Speaker 1: for fourteen months. And yeah, it was absolutely incredible. And

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Speaker 1: it was so much more incredible because every time I

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Speaker 1: drive to a new country, somebody would reach out who

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Speaker 1: is on my newsletter or followed me on Instagram at

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Speaker 1: the time, and they would say like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: welcome to our city. You know, I work for a

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Speaker 1: nonprofit here in Argentina and we worked with artisans using

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Speaker 1: you know, alpaca and Wanaco fiber, and we would love

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Speaker 1: to have you over for lunch, you know, like those

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Speaker 1: sorts of connections, or please come and visit my plant

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Speaker 1: dying workshop and weaving workshop outside of Omnibod in Gujarat, India,

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Speaker 1: like we would love to have you. And it was

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Speaker 1: such an incredible experience. And I got to do that

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Speaker 1: because because fashion is you know, some people think it's

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Speaker 1: just a woman's thing and it doesn't matter and it's

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Speaker 1: just about looks. But it's about so much more. Right,

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Speaker 1: it's about our identity, it's about it's a tool, right,

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Speaker 1: it keeps us warm, it keeps us cool, and it's

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Speaker 1: an economy, and it's a way to make money. It's

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Speaker 1: all of these things, and so we wear it all

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Speaker 1: the time, and so it's so important and it touches everything,

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Speaker 1: and it's a way to reach out across the world.

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Speaker 1: And you know, it's an excuse for me to reach

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Speaker 1: out across the world and say, hey, person in a

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Speaker 1: country I've never visited before, I want to learn about

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Speaker 1: what you do. Can you tell me about what you do?

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Speaker 1: That that's an incredible place to be. Yeah, it's beautiful.

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Speaker 1: And when you think about, as you said, the industry,

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Speaker 1: the economy, and also the legacy, you know, what an

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Speaker 1: amazing thing to be able to go into a museum

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Speaker 1: and and see human history through the clothes that have

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Speaker 1: been preserved. You're right, so many people treat it like

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Speaker 1: it's not a serious industry. But either are designers whose

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Speaker 1: clothes I've been lucky enough to you know, see, or

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Speaker 1: or at times like this borrow and I think about

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Speaker 1: it and and I'm like, this is like wearing a building.

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Speaker 1: It's architecture, it's engineering. It's at its highest I think

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Speaker 1: capacity or or perhaps you know, achievable goal. It's really

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Speaker 1: wearable art and what it can mean for people in

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Speaker 1: terms of their expression of identity. Um, the social movements

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Speaker 1: that have been tied to fashion, you know, the secret

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Speaker 1: messaging that that was signified by what the suffragettes were wearing,

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Speaker 1: and and what pride celebrates around the world, and how

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Speaker 1: entrenched that celebration is in fashion. You know, if you

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Speaker 1: think about Brazil and Carnival. I mean it really matters

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Speaker 1: to people, not just for as you mentioned, form and function,

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Speaker 1: but for real you know, identity, for for how we

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Speaker 1: see ourselves, how we feel about ourselves. Yeah. I definitely

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Speaker 1: had a day during the pandemic probably you know, three

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Speaker 1: months into the original shutdown here in California, I was like,

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Speaker 1: I gotta start wearing pants. I can't wear spots anymore.

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Speaker 1: It's really it's doing something to my mental health. I feel.

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Speaker 1: I just felt yucky, and so I started getting up

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Speaker 1: and even just the act of putting on like a

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Speaker 1: vintage T shirt that I love in a great pair

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Speaker 1: of jeans to be in my house made me feel different.

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Speaker 1: And it's such a reminder that it impacts us in

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Speaker 1: greater ways than I think we we admit at times. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah it does. I mean, speaking of identity, I mean

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Speaker 1: people people do express their identity, either a modern identity

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Speaker 1: or a traditional identity through their clothing. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I think that's also a really wonderful way to connect

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Speaker 1: with other cultures, is to just learn about how they

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Speaker 1: make the clothes and also like these different materials. You know,

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Speaker 1: when the lockdown happened and everybody was switching to sweatpants,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not gonna lie. I bought a couple

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Speaker 1: of pairs. Yeah, but I also started doing this thing

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Speaker 1: where I bought I had this blue coal balt blue

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Speaker 1: captain that I bought from a designer here in New York,

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Speaker 1: and it's full silk. It's it's incredible, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna wear this every day. I love that

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Speaker 1: because then I could pretend that I meant to do this,

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Speaker 1: I meant to stay home and this is just how

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Speaker 1: I live my life, you know, lounging in this full silk,

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Speaker 1: heavy heavyweight silk captain around and it made everything a

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Speaker 1: lot more bearable, and it really it kind of shifted

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Speaker 1: a little bit my understanding of fashion as well, because

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Speaker 1: I just it just brought me back to the reason

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Speaker 1: why fashion, right, it's a tool. But also if you

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Speaker 1: can reconnect with the feel of it, right, if you

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Speaker 1: can choose fabrics, especially natural fabrics that just feel good,

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Speaker 1: it really can make the act of choosing and wearing

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Speaker 1: fashion not only feel really good, it also just makes

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Speaker 1: it more sustainable because you're really you're choosing things that

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Speaker 1: you love, you're you're wearing them, You're reconnecting to yourself

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Speaker 1: through fashion. So those are all things that I recommend

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Speaker 1: people do instead of sort of stressing out about choosing

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Speaker 1: the right fabric that's certified or you know, recycled or anything,

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Speaker 1: but just choosing like knowing learning about these fabrics and

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Speaker 1: learning about how things are made and these different traditions

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Speaker 1: and why different cultures where what they do, so that

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Speaker 1: also you can avoid you know, appropriating and wearing something

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Speaker 1: and not knowing where it came from and then sort

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Speaker 1: of being caught out, you know, like you know, where

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Speaker 1: did you get that? And you're like, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: urban outfitters, But if you had learned about say the

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Speaker 1: squash blossom necklace and it's important to importance to Native Americans,

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Speaker 1: and you would know that, you know, you cannot get

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Speaker 1: it for from a market, like they're very precious things.

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Speaker 1: And so learning about these things and being curious about

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Speaker 1: them is a way to give respect to fashion and

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Speaker 1: give respect to its makers, give respect to yourself. I

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Speaker 1: love that and the idea that we all deserve that

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Speaker 1: kind of respect and that these transactions deserve to be

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Speaker 1: done with respect. I'm curious about these learnings that you reference,

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Speaker 1: because again, you you've become an expert, and ego called

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Speaker 1: is a long standing I mean, you're you're close to

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Speaker 1: being a decade into this. What are some of the

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Speaker 1: things you've learned that have been the most surpris rising

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Speaker 1: a fabricue, learned about a story or a tradition. What's

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Speaker 1: one of those things you can share with us, Oh

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Speaker 1: man um yeah, okay. So so one thing that's really

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Speaker 1: fun is um So, I got to visit this brocade

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Speaker 1: weaving unit in India outside of Omnibad, which is not

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Speaker 1: a tourist town, and so we went out there and

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Speaker 1: they have these huge looms and they've been doing it

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Speaker 1: the same way since the turn of the last century.

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Speaker 1: And it's a precursor to the computer because the way

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Speaker 1: they do these beautiful brocade fabrics, which by the way,

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Speaker 1: are so fine that they sell them to Tie Royalty

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Speaker 1: for some of their fashion. So it's got this rich

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Speaker 1: history of the silk road, right. It's made in India

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Speaker 1: and then shipped over land to to Thailand. So the

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Speaker 1: way they do these is they have these giant looms

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Speaker 1: and then they have these punch cards with holes in them,

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Speaker 1: and those punch cards are the signs, and they slopped

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Speaker 1: them into this old wooden loom and that ends up

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Speaker 1: making this brocade design and it's it's sort of it's

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Speaker 1: a binary system like a computer, but it's it's physical.

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Speaker 1: It was so incredible to see that and to just

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Speaker 1: feel that connection to the past of fashion, where you know,

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Speaker 1: cultures were trading right like they were, they were buying

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Speaker 1: from each other and then recreating it or requesting tweaks,

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Speaker 1: and and the idea that this kind of fabric and

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Speaker 1: this fabric exactly had was now being worn in Thailand. Um,

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Speaker 1: even though it's made in India. It just sort of

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Speaker 1: exploded my my mind around if it's high quality and

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Speaker 1: it's made with love, can really help us make these connections. Wow,

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Speaker 1: that's so cool. It makes me want to go back

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Speaker 1: through your website and read every article from from the

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Speaker 1: year that you were traveling. What what has it been

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Speaker 1: like to to run the site? You know, you said

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Speaker 1: it it was the era where so many people were

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Speaker 1: starting blogs and now we're in this you know new time.

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Speaker 1: Tech is constantly changing, communication is changing where people source

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Speaker 1: their news. What what has this journey been like to

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Speaker 1: to run a media company for you? Yeah, it's been well,

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Speaker 1: test up, ups and downs. But you know, I have

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Speaker 1: to say that I did get sucked very far into Instagram,

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Speaker 1: and um, you know, I founded the blog because I

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Speaker 1: wanted to share information. Um. And I loved to write, right,

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Speaker 1: and so you know, and I wanted to make a

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Speaker 1: change in the industry. And then, um, of course, you know,

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Speaker 1: I made a little Instagram account because they're supposed to

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Speaker 1: bring traffic to the blog. And then and then along

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Speaker 1: the way, I realized that I'd become an influencer, right,

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Speaker 1: and I was feeling I was feeling increasingly not okay

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Speaker 1: with with it because people have such short and attention spans, right,

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Speaker 1: I wanted people to sit down with me and learn

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Speaker 1: about these things. The way they would with an article,

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Speaker 1: and it didn't feel like people were doing that right,

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Speaker 1: like scroll tap tap, scroll tap tap, and I had

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Speaker 1: to leave. I had to get off. I didn't like

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Speaker 1: myself on social media, right, I mean, it's just people

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Speaker 1: fight a lot on social media, and I was just like,

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Speaker 1: this isn't my best self. This is what I came

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Speaker 1: to do. I came to make a change, and I

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Speaker 1: want to I want to support people the best way

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Speaker 1: I know how. And so um, I took a step

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Speaker 1: back from social media and I just focused on Eco

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Speaker 1: Colt and you know, everybody was migrating to social media,

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Speaker 1: but I realized that there was still a space for

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Speaker 1: for me to answer people's questions. And so people are

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Speaker 1: looking for answers to a lot of these questions, right

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Speaker 1: like who are the best sustainable denim brands? Or is

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Speaker 1: a fabric like Ryan Biscos biodegradable or you know, there's

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Speaker 1: just questions that people have and they were finding them

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Speaker 1: on ecoc cult And I realized once I just really

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Speaker 1: focused on on doing that thing that like my soul work, right,

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Speaker 1: you know, sharing this information instead of taking pictures in

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Speaker 1: my face and putting it online, and you know, taking

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Speaker 1: another picture of my face and putting online, and you know,

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Speaker 1: seeking out situations that make people envious, right like, oh, here,

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Speaker 1: I'm in this beautiful place. Here, I'm in this beautiful place.

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Speaker 1: I realized that people really connected with that, and so

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Speaker 1: traffic went up. Wait wait, wait, way up. Yeah, even

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Speaker 1: after I got off of social media, which really surprised me.

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Speaker 1: And so now I have a team of people who

428
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:32,159
Speaker 1: are helping me. I have contributors from all over the world.

429
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 1: I have somebody who runs my social media for me

430
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,800
Speaker 1: who's absolutely wonderful. And and I'm just continuing to focus

431
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:41,080
Speaker 1: on not only ecocol but also my freelance journalism work

432
00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:44,600
Speaker 1: for places like The New York Times or Vogue or Vox.

433
00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 1: And so I just get to be me, and I

434
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 1: get a nerd out on these topics and and yeah,

435
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 1: call up really smart people and ask some questions, which

436
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 1: I know you like to do as well. Yes, Oh

437
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 1: my gosh, I mean being able to do this is

438
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,240
Speaker 1: like heaven. And and it's funny because you know, you

439
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 1: talked about get in a business degree as a backup

440
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 1: for journalism, and I started laughing when you said that,

441
00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: because I was like, oh, I studied journalism as a

442
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 1: backup and kids acting didn't work. It's like we all

443
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 1: toggle what we believe is the most intense risk and

444
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 1: then find what feels like a relative other plan. And

445
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,360
Speaker 1: it's and it's been so cool because I realized you

446
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 1: run a business as a journalist, and I I use

447
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:26,919
Speaker 1: my platform as an actor to have conversations based in

448
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:31,280
Speaker 1: journalistic curiosity, and so how cool. It's like we're really

449
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:35,199
Speaker 1: nailing it. Yeah, Oh, that totally makes sense that you

450
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:37,960
Speaker 1: also learned how to tea journalism because you're so good

451
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 1: at this. I love him, like I feel closer to

452
00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:46,160
Speaker 1: you now. Um. You you mentioned something you know about

453
00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: the fact that you can use the website to answer

454
00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:51,040
Speaker 1: people's questions to say these are the most sustainable dynam

455
00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:55,040
Speaker 1: brands for example, and and so much more. There are

456
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 1: so many people out there who want to shop more sustainably,

457
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:02,520
Speaker 1: but I can't seem in in some of the you know,

458
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: writing and like you said, comments on social and stuff

459
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 1: that I've seen so many people are frustrated because they

460
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,640
Speaker 1: can't seem to find steady um or affordable brands is easily.

461
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 1: There's also I think a big misnomer that sustainable is

462
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:21,640
Speaker 1: like really crunchy and you know, not actually fashionable, which

463
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:25,440
Speaker 1: isn't true. So as an expert, how do you dispel

464
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,440
Speaker 1: that myth that sustainable and chic are mutually exclusive because

465
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,239
Speaker 1: they're not. Uh? And and what brand recommendations do you

466
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: have for people listening who are newer to this kind

467
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 1: of sustainable exploration. Yeah, so, well, first thing that I

468
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,480
Speaker 1: want to say is it's really important to understand that

469
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,400
Speaker 1: sustainability is not a binary right. So I've been trying

470
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 1: to walk away from saying like this brand is sustainable

471
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 1: and this brand is not sustainable because it's a continued right.

472
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,439
Speaker 1: You have brands are doing nothing and then you have

473
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,400
Speaker 1: brands that are really trying to do everything and everything

474
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,879
Speaker 1: in between. So I like to say, like, this brand

475
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 1: is more sustainable than the typical brands. And yes, like

476
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,880
Speaker 1: there's I guess are there people who still think it's crunchy.

477
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:10,119
Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many great brands out there in

478
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: every style that are just like it's streetwear and officewear

479
00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 1: and bathing suits. There's like a dozen different bathing suit

480
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 1: brands made from a cycle fabric. I mean, you can

481
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:24,919
Speaker 1: really find almost exactly what you want. And if you can't.

482
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:27,560
Speaker 1: You can find a second hand so that's great. But

483
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: I mean I can talk about a few brands that

484
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 1: I really like. So I really like what Lanma Cartney

485
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:34,439
Speaker 1: is doing. I think you're wearing one of her pieces

486
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,600
Speaker 1: right now. I did. I got we because we did

487
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 1: a video element today. I was actually really lucky and

488
00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:42,320
Speaker 1: I got to borrow this unbelievable jumpsuit that she made.

489
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 1: And I admitted this to you before we started recording.

490
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 1: But the sort of l o l of it all

491
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,919
Speaker 1: is because it doesn't belong to me. It's like a

492
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 1: foot too long. I'm too short for it. My god,

493
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,399
Speaker 1: I haven't rolled up around my ankles. But from the

494
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 1: from the desk up for our for our video, it

495
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,640
Speaker 1: goes along with this podcast, it looks great. So I'm

496
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 1: really I'm thrilled and I feel very special that I

497
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: got to pull it for today. But it felt like

498
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 1: the right theme, you know, for for first month and

499
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:14,560
Speaker 1: a whole conversation around sustainability at the core of all this. Yeah,

500
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,360
Speaker 1: and I totally feel you. I'm five ft two. I

501
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,560
Speaker 1: just assumed that I have to get everything shortened when

502
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,320
Speaker 1: I buy it. I have a whole pile of things

503
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 1: that I bought way too optimistically in the pandemic. And

504
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:28,880
Speaker 1: when I say a whole pile, I mean like five

505
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 1: or six things. So I bought a suit from this

506
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 1: new brand called Another Tomorrow, and it's just power dressing,

507
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 1: right like if you are going to run a company

508
00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,000
Speaker 1: like this is the brand to go to. But I

509
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: have to get it tailored, and so I bought it

510
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 1: last March. I am going to get it tailored probably

511
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: this month. I love that. I am ready to step

512
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 1: out in beautiful clothing. I'm so ready. It's gonna happen.

513
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 1: It's gonna happen soon. I love that. I love that.

514
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: And you mentioned I don't think a lot of people

515
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 1: consider streetwear to be a sustainable, you know, vertical of fashion,

516
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 1: because it's always kind of changing. It feels like something

517
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: where there's a lot of turnover. But you said there's

518
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: a great sustainable streetwear brand. Who's that? Oh God, you're

519
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 1: gonna get me because I'm not. I don't personally wear

520
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:19,360
Speaker 1: a streetwear and now I have to think about um.

521
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:23,400
Speaker 1: In terms of streetwear, there's a brand called Christopher Rayburn

522
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:29,520
Speaker 1: and he does up cycled streetwear that's super cool from yeah,

523
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 1: from materials, that otherwise would have gone to waste um

524
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: and a lot of other sustainability things that he does

525
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 1: as well. So that's a good streetwear brand that I

526
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 1: would recommend. Okay, cool And when you talk about you

527
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,520
Speaker 1: actually just mentioned that you don't personally wear streetwear, but

528
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 1: you're looking at who's doing cool things in that space

529
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 1: and in so many other uh you know, verticals or

530
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: arenas whatever we want to call them of fashion. I

531
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 1: think it can be hard for us to figure out

532
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: at times what our personal style is. I was mentioning

533
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 1: to you earlier. I struggle with that because since I

534
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 1: was in college, I've literally dressed up as other people

535
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 1: for a living. So sometimes I'm looking at things and

536
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, well, I love that, but can I wear that?

537
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:13,959
Speaker 1: And it can really help to have, you know, a

538
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: friend or you know, when I'm working and I get

539
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: to work with a professional kind of way in I'm

540
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 1: curious to know more about digital sustainable stylists. What what

541
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: was your process to find one? How can other people

542
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 1: find one? What even is a digital sustainable stylist? Oh

543
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 1: my gosh. Yeah, So Cassandra. Cassandra did murt she is

544
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 1: uh silas that has gone sustainable and she lost the

545
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:45,520
Speaker 1: service during the pandemic where she would do everything at

546
00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 1: home and for you like digitally. And she reached out

547
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: and said, asked me if I wanted to try it.

548
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,880
Speaker 1: And I actually have used a stylist before, not for

549
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 1: an event, not for like a red carpet event like

550
00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 1: you would, but just to come over and tell me

551
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 1: what I should get rid of, because you know, when

552
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 1: I moved here from the South, I have a lot

553
00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 1: of sun dresses. I did not own a leather jacket,

554
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: and I was just like totally overwhelmed and I just

555
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 1: needed someone to tell me what to do. So Cassandra

556
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: will do this, and she's super sweet, and I ended

557
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 1: up doing this service where you know she will just

558
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 1: you feel out of survey. I sent her a pinchest board,

559
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,760
Speaker 1: I told her what I wanted, and then she picked

560
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 1: out sustainable brands to fill some of the holes in

561
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 1: my closet. But she'll also, I was talking about this

562
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 1: with someone else the other night, she'll also do a

563
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 1: closet clean out. So like you know, you can do

564
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 1: the zoom call and train it on your closet and

565
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: you can hold up all the things and and she'll

566
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,520
Speaker 1: she'll help you clean it out and also like tell

567
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,080
Speaker 1: you things like based on what you love, you know,

568
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: to be like do you love it? Like yes, I

569
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 1: love it? Okay, if you love this, you'll probably also

570
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 1: love that. And she'll help you restyle things so you

571
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 1: can wear them if you haven't figured out how to

572
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:55,640
Speaker 1: style them, which I really loved as well. I mean,

573
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 1: she I think I'm wearing the scarf because she told

574
00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:00,239
Speaker 1: me like I should try. She was like, you need

575
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 1: you need something good for your zoom calls. That's like cute,

576
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 1: that's up here, and she was like, try wrapping a

577
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:07,320
Speaker 1: scarpor on your neck and and now I'm doing it,

578
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: and um, yeah. So it was a really fun process.

579
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: And I think it is inherently sustainable to work with

580
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 1: a stylist if you can afford one, and her services

581
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 1: is more affordable than a typical stylist would be because

582
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,320
Speaker 1: it's digital and um and she's got all these different

583
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: tiers and it's just inherently sustainable because you know, you're

584
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 1: not going to go out and buy a bunch of

585
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 1: stuff that doesn't look good on you and then try

586
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 1: to make it work and then end up donating it.

587
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: So it's just so much more sustainable to buy less

588
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 1: and buy better, and the stylist can help you figure

589
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: out what that better looks like for you. Yeah, I

590
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: really love that there's a brand I'm I'm sure you

591
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: know that I'm a big fan of and again, like

592
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 1: not an ad, I just think they're so cool Kuana

593
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 1: and that's their whole thing. Fewer but better and they're

594
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 1: doing recycled cashmir now and all of this stuff that

595
00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 1: I'm just so impressed by. I get really excited about

596
00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 1: companies that are really living the ethos of reducing impact

597
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: and giving us as consumers, um, you know, things that

598
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 1: are of quality so that we keep them for longer.

599
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:15,360
Speaker 1: And I'm curious, you know, what are the when we

600
00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 1: think about the way the industry can make an impact

601
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 1: like that, and how a lot of brands also aren't.

602
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 1: And as you mentioned, I mean the horror that you

603
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 1: could return something you ordered online and it's cheaper for

604
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: the brand to throw it away and restock it. That

605
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: that makes me itchy, like literally it makes my skin crawl.

606
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 1: So where are we really? You know, how is the

607
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:41,080
Speaker 1: fashion industry actually doing in terms of sustainability? Is it

608
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 1: doing well? Is it doing horribly? Like where are we

609
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,600
Speaker 1: now and where do you think we're heading? Oh yeah, so,

610
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: oh no, you're making me nervous. No no, no, no, no, no, okay,

611
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 1: no no no, it's not that bad. It's not that bad.

612
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 1: So there is a couple of large brands that know

613
00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 1: this is a problem and they're they're trying to fix. Okay,

614
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 1: So it's always like the same dozen brands, Like you

615
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,120
Speaker 1: have your levies, you have your H and M, Nike,

616
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 1: Adi Das, Patagonia. You know, I Land Fisher is always

617
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: in there, and sometimes Gap is in there, and they're

618
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,640
Speaker 1: trying to measure their footprint. They've set targets to reduce

619
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,080
Speaker 1: their emissions. You know, they are trying to get toxic

620
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:24,279
Speaker 1: chemicals out of their supply chain. Um. They they're part

621
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,919
Speaker 1: of all these initiatives. Um, so they know it's a problem. Okay.

622
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 1: The problem though, is that it's all voluntary and you

623
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:39,400
Speaker 1: have ultra fast fashion brands coming in underneath them and

624
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 1: undercutting them and just committing agregious labor environmental violations. I

625
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: mean you have like you know, you have Boo hoo

626
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:53,120
Speaker 1: that was like paying a few dollars an hour in

627
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:58,000
Speaker 1: the UK factories And what makes me really sad, is

628
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 1: like there's this huge fure on that, and then sales

629
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:06,240
Speaker 1: continue to go up and like we're at a moment

630
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:10,960
Speaker 1: where it's actually a really cool moment that people are like, oh, okay,

631
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 1: like this isn't working, maybe I should be political about it.

632
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 1: And we're seeing really cool things like there is a

633
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 1: nonprofit named Remake by Aisha Baron Blatt, and they do

634
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 1: such good work advocating for garment workers. I mean, when

635
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: the pandemic hit and all of these huge corporate brands

636
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,839
Speaker 1: just turned to the factories and said, you know what,

637
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 1: we're just not going to pay you for that order

638
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 1: that you've already put on the ship to us, like

639
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 1: it's made, you know, the labor went into it, the

640
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,439
Speaker 1: fabric went into it, and they were like we don't

641
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,239
Speaker 1: want it. We're just not gonna take it, and we're

642
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:47,839
Speaker 1: not gonna pay for it. And Remake came out swinging

643
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 1: and was like, no, we are going to make life

644
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 1: so difficult for you until you pay for those orders.

645
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:58,680
Speaker 1: Is it a long term solution. No, But they clawed

646
00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:02,320
Speaker 1: back millions and millions of dollars for these garment factories,

647
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: which then could pay their workers for the work that

648
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: they did, and so that's great. And so they're doing

649
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 1: work in California right now to reform the labor conditions

650
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,240
Speaker 1: there so that there's no wait theft and garment workers

651
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,439
Speaker 1: are getting paid fairly for the work that they're doing.

652
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:22,439
Speaker 1: So that is incredibly exciting. So yeah, I mean to summarize,

653
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 1: we're at an inflection point where you know, there's a problem.

654
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:30,480
Speaker 1: We tried doing it voluntarily, it's not really working. Okay, Cool,

655
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: We're going to start organizing. We're going to start getting political.

656
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:37,319
Speaker 1: We're gonna use our voices to demand change, not just

657
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:41,399
Speaker 1: by shopping, but by yeah, advocating. Yeah, it's very cool

658
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:42,919
Speaker 1: and it's cool to see the way that so many

659
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 1: organizing groups are coming together. I have a really good friend,

660
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: Ianna Elizabeth Johnson, who is a marine biologist and a

661
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 1: climate activist, and she wrote this um. She edited this

662
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,879
Speaker 1: collection of essays called All We Can Save and one

663
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 1: of the essays is the is the one that when Russell,

664
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:05,320
Speaker 1: the famous model, wrote to the producers of fashion talking

665
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,760
Speaker 1: about how she literally has been a vessel for fashion,

666
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 1: but what does that mean for garment workers? And it's

667
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 1: hands down one of the most powerful things I've read

668
00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 1: on the subject, and it just moved me so much.

669
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 1: And to see her advocating for exactly this, you know,

670
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:27,319
Speaker 1: end of the spectrum we're discussing today alongside other scientists

671
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: advocating for ocean protections, and it's it's really also interconnected.

672
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 1: And I just find the fact that we are all

673
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:37,239
Speaker 1: able to be more and more connected to each other

674
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,759
Speaker 1: and to support each other's advocacy that my hope is

675
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,959
Speaker 1: that that means that this rising tide will lift all

676
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:48,920
Speaker 1: of our ships. Yeah, it's you know, for a long time, scientists,

677
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:53,359
Speaker 1: we're not including fashion in this conversation kind of change

678
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:57,360
Speaker 1: or out around plastic waste, and now we're starting to

679
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: see that shift. And fashion should be held accountable, just

680
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:04,800
Speaker 1: like we're trying to hold the oil industry accountable, just

681
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 1: like we're trying to hold packaging, you know, for beverages accountable.

682
00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:11,759
Speaker 1: Like these are all things that fashion is connected to,

683
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 1: and so it's not just a woman's issue for sure,

684
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:20,480
Speaker 1: and I I'm just very inspired to see where it's

685
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:24,280
Speaker 1: going if it does feel like people are doing smart

686
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 1: and exciting things. I've actually been learning about a lot

687
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:31,280
Speaker 1: of this for the past few years from my friend

688
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 1: Nina Farren, who founded this incredible company called fashion Kind

689
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:37,920
Speaker 1: that is all about essentially trying to make a dent

690
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:42,680
Speaker 1: in the luxury market because, you know, her, her studies

691
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: in business school, examining you know, the numbers of all

692
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: of this, and and and the industry of all of

693
00:38:49,080 --> 00:38:52,839
Speaker 1: this really led her to see that when you can

694
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:55,280
Speaker 1: create shifts in a luxury market, you can create shifts

695
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 1: in high story markets and and everything else. And I

696
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 1: find that I've find the awareness of exactly where you're

697
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:07,000
Speaker 1: kind of political power can come in to be so important.

698
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:10,000
Speaker 1: And she just said, look, I want to create market shifts,

699
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 1: and I've I've been working with her now and um

700
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: I'm officially on the advisory board now. And and the

701
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 1: idea that we can support makers, you know, the folks

702
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 1: making these beautiful garments and bags and things around the world,

703
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 1: you know, I mean just the artisans in Latin America

704
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 1: alone that we're working with are are some of the

705
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 1: most inspiring humans who have had the opportunity to you know,

706
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:40,600
Speaker 1: meet digitally. And I'm so excited about what the potential

707
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 1: because of a piece of art there is for a

708
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:49,400
Speaker 1: new conversation. What is consumption mean? What is collecting me

709
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,360
Speaker 1: and what what is a living wage as you mentioned

710
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 1: for a worker mean, because there is no way to

711
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 1: buy an eight dollar T shirt and not have harmed someone.

712
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 1: So how do we as customers, consumers, businesswomen, how do

713
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:08,360
Speaker 1: we learn to create better impact? So I'm just really

714
00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:13,439
Speaker 1: excited about the potential you know, in the industry. I'm

715
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 1: curious where you think it's going. You know, what do

716
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:21,400
Speaker 1: you think are the biggest issues or or challenges in

717
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:23,319
Speaker 1: the industry right now? And where do you think the

718
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 1: solutions come from? Yeah, so I think, Um, well, if

719
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 1: I may, I want to go back to what you

720
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: just said about luxury faction and the power it can have,

721
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:35,160
Speaker 1: because you know, I think everybody should add access to

722
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:37,799
Speaker 1: fashion that they can afford it. So there, I think

723
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: there's definitely a place for mass market fashion that is

724
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: made more sustainably, but also there's always there, always has

725
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,520
Speaker 1: to be a place for luxury fashion because that is

726
00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: the kind of fashion, like you said, that supports the

727
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:53,879
Speaker 1: ability of an artisan to sit and make a high

728
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:57,239
Speaker 1: quality product in the way her culture has always made

729
00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 1: that product right at a seticand loom. Thank you so much, Yes,

730
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 1: thank you for pointing that out because really, I have

731
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,359
Speaker 1: to admit, when I first met with Nina to talk

732
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,319
Speaker 1: about this, I was a little turned off by the

733
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 1: notion of luxury. I thought, we're talking about how we

734
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:16,200
Speaker 1: need to democratize the world and make things more accessible

735
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:19,200
Speaker 1: and make you know, make it more fair. And then

736
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:24,280
Speaker 1: I realized the idea that less expensive is fair comes

737
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 1: at the very human cost of the underpaid worker in

738
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: a sweatshop, the person who dies in a collapsing factory

739
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: in in Bangladesh. And and I I agree with you

740
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,880
Speaker 1: that we need to figure out how to bring accessibility

741
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:41,439
Speaker 1: much more mass market, but do it in a way

742
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 1: that supports the workers on the other end. And so

743
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,320
Speaker 1: the data really pointed me too. If you want to

744
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:51,440
Speaker 1: learn about this in a real big way, start here.

745
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:54,360
Speaker 1: And I'm really I'm honored that I was given the

746
00:41:54,400 --> 00:42:00,240
Speaker 1: space to begin learning about this stuff. So I I

747
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:03,200
Speaker 1: I appreciate you, you know, pointing out the reality that

748
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 1: living wages matter and in ways that sometimes we don't

749
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 1: connect the idea of of living wages too. You know,

750
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,320
Speaker 1: we don't think about that when we buy a T shirt,

751
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 1: but we should. Yeah. Absolutely, Um, And to your question

752
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 1: about you know, where the industry is going well, some

753
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:26,399
Speaker 1: of the biggest problems that we're seeing right now. I mean,

754
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 1: there's so many different things, but the biggest problems right

755
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 1: is there's the climate crisis. Um fashion is responsible for

756
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:37,160
Speaker 1: anywhere from five four or five eight percent of global

757
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,920
Speaker 1: carbon emissions according to varying estimates, and that's that's a

758
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:44,360
Speaker 1: big choke that we could address. Whether with the fashion

759
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:47,800
Speaker 1: it's responsible for four percent of global fashion waste. I

760
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:51,759
Speaker 1: mean New Yorkers alone, in New York City, average New

761
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:55,759
Speaker 1: Yorker throws out fifty four pounds of textile waste every year,

762
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,800
Speaker 1: and in New York State as a whole, we're throwing

763
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:04,320
Speaker 1: out the equivalent of two million dollars worth of fashions

764
00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:10,359
Speaker 1: like clothing, accessories. Yeah, every year. If we just recovered it,

765
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:12,560
Speaker 1: if we could just like recover it, it would be

766
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 1: worth that much. But it's too complicated and expensive, you know.

767
00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:19,760
Speaker 1: So fashion waste is a huge problem. But there's glimmers

768
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:21,920
Speaker 1: of hope, right. I Mean, somebody was telling me about

769
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:24,920
Speaker 1: how Frances instituted this thing where you can't burn your

770
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 1: fashion anymore. Right, So a lot of fashion brands were

771
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:30,839
Speaker 1: doing this thing where if they didn't sell their merch

772
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:33,960
Speaker 1: for one year, they would destroy it. They would burn

773
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 1: it or shredded or whatever, perfectly fine stuff because they

774
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 1: didn't want it to you know, end up secondhand, like

775
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:43,640
Speaker 1: second you know, on the wrong person. Right. So Frances like,

776
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:45,760
Speaker 1: you can't do that anymore. And so somebody was telling

777
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:50,839
Speaker 1: me that that act has revved up certain parts of

778
00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: Italy because the fashion brands are now going, okay, we

779
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:58,839
Speaker 1: can't burn it. Here are like traditional artisans who work

780
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:03,319
Speaker 1: with leather and recycle and can recycle will like, can

781
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:06,279
Speaker 1: you take this merchandise apart and make something new and

782
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:10,200
Speaker 1: fresh with it for the next season? That stuff would

783
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 1: have been destroyed and now it's providing employment to people.

784
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:18,560
Speaker 1: It's being used again like before it was just so wasteful,

785
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:22,399
Speaker 1: and like just that little tweak has created a whole new,

786
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,360
Speaker 1: more sustainable industry and I would love to see that everywhere.

787
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:28,800
Speaker 1: That's I mean, that's something that really got me excited

788
00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:31,880
Speaker 1: to hear about. That is so so cool. What that

789
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 1: feels like, such an achievement, that's a big globally impactful win.

790
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 1: What what do you when when you take the idea

791
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 1: of impactful winds into the personal, into the singular moving forward,

792
00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 1: what do you most want to achieve with Eco call Oh,

793
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:49,880
Speaker 1: that's such a good question. So I'm very concerned with

794
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:52,920
Speaker 1: being accurate. And so right now we're going through the

795
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:57,240
Speaker 1: process of just going through our entire back catalog of articles,

796
00:44:57,239 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 1: which still get a ton of traffic. And I don't

797
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:02,600
Speaker 1: know of a websites do this, but I hired a

798
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:05,040
Speaker 1: fact checker and I've just been sending her a couple

799
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:07,480
Speaker 1: of these articles every month and saying like, can you

800
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:09,759
Speaker 1: go through them and just make sure they're accurate? And

801
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:13,879
Speaker 1: so that's really exciting because I'm learning from her. She's

802
00:45:13,920 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 1: going through and I'm adding to my knowledge, and then

803
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 1: we're making sure that everything we put out is incredibly accurate.

804
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:24,360
Speaker 1: And so it's helpful for you know, it's helpful for consumers,

805
00:45:24,400 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 1: of course, but like also what I where I really

806
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 1: want to go is I want the industry to be

807
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:32,359
Speaker 1: able to turn to Eco Cole and know that they

808
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:34,279
Speaker 1: can get an answer to their questions. So like if

809
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:39,240
Speaker 1: there's a designer at Caring or you know, like a Gucci,

810
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:42,120
Speaker 1: or there's a designer at any of these companies that

811
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,320
Speaker 1: are like, hey, maybe we should think about going more sustainable,

812
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: they can literally google the answer and they'll be able

813
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:50,359
Speaker 1: to find it. And the idea that this work can

814
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:54,040
Speaker 1: have ripple effects across the industry and you know, reach

815
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:57,560
Speaker 1: people who are are pulling the levers in that way.

816
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:01,360
Speaker 1: Like that feels really really good to me because you know,

817
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,360
Speaker 1: before it was about like, oh, if I just convinced

818
00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 1: everybody to shop more sustainably, like that will be the

819
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:07,880
Speaker 1: way I have an impact. And now I'm like, no,

820
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 1: I want to talk to the people who who are

821
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:17,480
Speaker 1: who have this power to to make these changes and

822
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 1: give them the information they need to do the right thing.

823
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 1: I love that, And it just feels like it's all

824
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:27,239
Speaker 1: such positive energy toward progress. Yeah, exactly, yes, And that's

825
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: really you know, that's the theme of this show, of

826
00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 1: these conversations, and and it feels like the most perfect

827
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 1: segue to ask you my favorite question to ask everyone

828
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:37,920
Speaker 1: who comes on the show, which is, you know, whether

829
00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:41,920
Speaker 1: it be something that is personal or professional or or

830
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:45,880
Speaker 1: falls somewhere in between, what feels like work in progress

831
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:50,480
Speaker 1: in your life right now? Yeah? So, um, I'm still

832
00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 1: kind of addicted to my phone. Um, And I know

833
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:57,879
Speaker 1: that it's like a common answer, but I have been

834
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 1: trying so hard during this pandemic to do everything I

835
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: can to just start my day off analog right, like

836
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:08,280
Speaker 1: the journal, I meditate, I do yoga, but I still

837
00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 1: wander out. I have I keep my phone outside of

838
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:14,959
Speaker 1: the bedroom, and I still wander out after I've said

839
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:17,040
Speaker 1: the very demanding cat at six thirty in the morning,

840
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:18,800
Speaker 1: and I still wander out, and I pick up my

841
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:20,440
Speaker 1: phone and I sit down and I check the email.

842
00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:23,640
Speaker 1: And why am I still doing this? Like It's the

843
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 1: habit that bothers me the most right now. So that

844
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:29,440
Speaker 1: is something that I'm still working on about, you know,

845
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 1: pulling back a little bit further and being alone with

846
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:35,959
Speaker 1: my thoughts instead of giving into that dopeyman hit every

847
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:37,840
Speaker 1: morning like what email did I get? You know, like

848
00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 1: what newsletters? And I like who liked my things? Like

849
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:43,400
Speaker 1: who commented? You know, I'd rather just sit with my

850
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 1: journal and write. You know. Yeah, I think that that's

851
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:50,360
Speaker 1: really such a good goal. And you've given us so

852
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:53,280
Speaker 1: many great resources that I'll give you one. I started

853
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 1: reading this fantastic book called How to Break Up with

854
00:47:56,040 --> 00:48:00,319
Speaker 1: Your Phone. It's, i mean, smaller than this journal. It's

855
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,080
Speaker 1: a quick read. The irony being that it started to

856
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 1: make me feel so panicky about the changes I'd have

857
00:48:05,200 --> 00:48:06,799
Speaker 1: to make that I only got through the first half

858
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:09,480
Speaker 1: of it. Um, So I've committed to myself that now

859
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 1: that I'm home from shooting, I'm going to start over

860
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 1: from the beginning and read it until the end. Um.

861
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:17,560
Speaker 1: So maybe we can book club that and and see

862
00:48:17,560 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 1: what kind of change we can make. Yeah, I would

863
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:23,839
Speaker 1: love that. I mean, thank you for the recommendation. It's

864
00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:28,320
Speaker 1: exactly what I need right now, you know, it's really excellent.

865
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 1: Well all, then, thank you so much. This has been

866
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:37,440
Speaker 1: so just phenomenal and and I must admit that getting into,

867
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:42,440
Speaker 1: you know, a conversation about a massive polluter industry, I

868
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 1: was a little nervous about how dire it was going

869
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:47,719
Speaker 1: to feel by the end, and you've really inspired me

870
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:51,239
Speaker 1: to feel hopeful and to remember that, you know, there's

871
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,560
Speaker 1: a lot that we can do and innovate and and

872
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: a lot of change we can make. So I'm very

873
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:59,640
Speaker 1: grateful for that. Sophia, thank you so much for having me.

874
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:01,440
Speaker 1: It was well get to talk with you, and I

875
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:04,160
Speaker 1: can't help but be hopeful when you know someone like

876
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: you is is curious about this and wanting to share

877
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:09,520
Speaker 1: the message with everyone. I mean it's great to know

878
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 1: that like this is important to people like yourself, and

879
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:16,840
Speaker 1: you're willing to um yeah share that with your audience

880
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:18,480
Speaker 1: as well. Thanks, I mean lut