WEBVTT - 9021One on One: Chuck Rosin (PART 2) 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:04.600 It's nine O G one og with Jenny Garth and 0:00:04.720 --> 0:00:12.040 Tory spelling. Hello, Charles Rosen. 0:00:12.400 --> 0:00:15.360 He love Jenny and Tory, welcome. 0:00:15.120 --> 0:00:16.360 Back our friends. 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:20.840 What am I? Chuck Chuck liver? And there were you Amy, 0:00:21.000 --> 0:00:24.640 Hello there with all the beverages. Hello, beverages. 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:28.960 It's perfume. It's perfume. We all think she's a boozer too, 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:31.000 but it's really balls of perfume. 0:00:31.840 --> 0:00:34.920 You get me on a really great day. We just 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:40.520 a diagnosis at one thirty that my three year old 0:00:40.560 --> 0:00:43.559 granddaughter who had been through the battle Jenny, you remember, 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:50.160 finally today gets diagnosed to all cancer free. S's looking 0:00:50.240 --> 0:00:53.880 good and my poor daughter Lindsey just just you know, 0:00:53.960 --> 0:00:56.400 when this news came out three weeks ago, she was 0:00:57.040 --> 0:00:59.320 that there was more of a thread again. She went, 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:03.920 just you know, just nuts. And so we're all there's 0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:05.160 a celebration going on. 0:01:05.480 --> 0:01:09.320 Yeah, that's amazing, and you still made time for us. 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:10.080 We're grateful. 0:01:10.440 --> 0:01:15.000 That's amazing. Well that too, you know, but we started 0:01:15.040 --> 0:01:16.920 a nice conversation. I had fun last time. 0:01:17.280 --> 0:01:19.760 Well that makes me feel terrible that I have to 0:01:19.800 --> 0:01:22.600 tell you that I still don't like the episode from 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:23.759 the sixties. 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:27.400 Well, you know, I bet you many times, Amy you 0:01:27.640 --> 0:01:30.320 you you stood shoulder to shoulder with the Grand Old Party, 0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:33.520 so we would be looking at the history of that 0:01:33.680 --> 0:01:34.840 engagement differently. 0:01:35.440 --> 0:01:37.360 So here's my question for you. Not to get right 0:01:37.400 --> 0:01:39.560 into it, because I am so happy for your beautiful, 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:40.560 wonderful news. 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:40.760 Thank you. 0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:43.039 Here's why I don't like it. And I do think 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:44.360 you're right that I would have liked it more if 0:01:44.360 --> 0:01:47.480 the music was the right music. But I am so 0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:51.440 invested in these characters, as you know, like I spent 0:01:52.560 --> 0:01:56.640 many many years with them in the nineties and probably 0:01:56.680 --> 0:02:00.639 again years later and then again now. But I don't 0:02:00.960 --> 0:02:04.440 want to see them, even if it's them, even if 0:02:04.480 --> 0:02:07.920 it's Tory Spelling and Jenny Garth playing not them. 0:02:08.320 --> 0:02:09.800 So I think, is that the only time that we 0:02:09.880 --> 0:02:11.200 do that? We do that? 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:14.400 Yeah, I have no other one coming. 0:02:17.360 --> 0:02:20.600 With that one, the Western one that's coming later. 0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:26.320 Yeah, well you know it just I gotta tell you, 0:02:27.040 --> 0:02:32.120 even in a serialized format, even when you're doing thirty two, 0:02:32.639 --> 0:02:35.040 you know, and one kind of rolls into the next 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:37.560 and you're keeping the storyline alive, et cetera, et cetera. 0:02:37.919 --> 0:02:41.320 Sure you got to come up with ideas I had 0:02:41.360 --> 0:02:44.600 already done so many television and it was the twenty 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:50.600 fifth anniversary of Woodstock, sure, and it was the idea 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:54.240 of seeing them be different, that the audience gets to 0:02:54.320 --> 0:02:58.839 see them being different people, and it was only imaginary. 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:00.359 And then you get to the end of ye, so 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:03.560 you see the pictures and they those people who were 0:03:03.560 --> 0:03:06.880 being described obviously didn't look like our characters. It just 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:11.120 right cultered through it. And I don't know, you know, 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:16.200 we only have the only really record we have of 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:20.520 what we did is what we we ended up putting 0:03:20.560 --> 0:03:23.919 on the air. So you look at you guys' performances 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:28.560 in there, and I mean top to bottom everybody because 0:03:28.560 --> 0:03:32.480 it was different. Everybody was having a real good time 0:03:32.680 --> 0:03:35.240 and that kind of I agree with that. I love 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:40.000 you the experience, you know, just for me who watches 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:45.800 it really closely and you know remembers. Remember I got 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:50.240 to see always outtakes. Jenny and Tory would know what 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:53.080 I'm talking about, you know, when when the kiss would 0:03:53.160 --> 0:03:56.000 stop and the actors would break and they would run 0:03:56.040 --> 0:03:58.680 to the hills, you know, so I you know when 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:01.000 people were not having this good time together. 0:04:01.720 --> 0:04:04.280 Wait, Chuck, do you still have any of those You 0:04:04.400 --> 0:04:07.960 got to put those together for us. 0:04:08.120 --> 0:04:10.720 I have to tell you this. This is no criticism 0:04:10.840 --> 0:04:16.400 of your beloved father, Torri, but he did not want you. Remember, 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:20.359 Dick Clark was making a fortun with Gagru. 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:22.600 Bloomers and bloopers and practical. 0:04:22.240 --> 0:04:25.320 Jokepers, practical all of that. You know you you probably 0:04:25.400 --> 0:04:30.280 hosted it Amy, I don't know, but but uh, but 0:04:30.600 --> 0:04:33.680 Aaron had one none none of that. Didn't want us 0:04:33.720 --> 0:04:38.080 to keep any of that any editorial group. Uh there 0:04:38.160 --> 0:04:40.760 was one good that that was kind of keeping it, 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:42.919 you know within this would be great for that, and 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:45.120 then you know we did the Kabash was put on, 0:04:45.200 --> 0:04:47.000 so we never even thought about that. 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:51.920 You're so right. He didn't like that, Like, don't you 0:04:52.120 --> 0:04:54.120 how do you I've never asked you this, Chuck, Like, 0:04:54.200 --> 0:04:57.000 what do you think he would think of reality TV? 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.839 I you know, with the first thing that came across 0:05:04.880 --> 0:05:07.440 my mind, and this is this is only a compliment. 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:11.080 He would have found a way to own it. Yeah, fair, 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:13.640 you know, he would have found a way. He would 0:05:13.680 --> 0:05:17.480 have looked at it as as as business, and he 0:05:17.520 --> 0:05:21.560 would have thought of it in terms of you know 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:23.840 what he he would do in it. I mean, and 0:05:24.480 --> 0:05:27.400 I think that you know, you guys being so involved 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:29.400 with it over it. I don't think you know, people 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:32.279 also have you know, you know, no choice. This is 0:05:32.320 --> 0:05:35.960 what's being done at that point. It's interesting reality television 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:38.720 a little bit of television history here. You know, reality 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:43.800 television really took off during the time of the eighty 0:05:43.839 --> 0:05:48.880 eight eighty nine writers strike, and that's when MTV kind 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:52.600 of built on the all their real worlds and started 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:55.440 building out on that, and then it just always would 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:58.680 would keep going. But I remember I was trying to 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:03.599 go into lobudget TV in the late nineties, early oughts. 0:06:03.880 --> 0:06:06.640 I was had it down. I had done a low 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:09.760 budget pilot, fun little low budget pilot for Fox called 0:06:09.839 --> 0:06:13.760 Damage Goods with Elizabeth Helden's who's gone on to do 0:06:13.880 --> 0:06:19.120 lots of great stuff in TV and network TV even 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:24.520 but we and I couldn't and I had it and 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:26.839 it was low budget, but I couldn't. You couldn't get 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:30.080 lower than reality TV right right at that point, you 0:06:30.080 --> 0:06:31.040 couldn't compete. 0:06:31.960 --> 0:06:33.760 What do you think Aaron Spelling would have thought of 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:38.400 a podcast like this where his not just his daughter, 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:43.120 but his stars are thirty years later watching the shows again. 0:06:43.200 --> 0:06:46.560 Well, I think he'd loved the thirty years later. I 0:06:46.600 --> 0:06:50.800 think it blows. I know it blows my mind. And 0:06:51.240 --> 0:06:53.640 I think, you know, he maybe had a plan for 0:06:53.800 --> 0:06:56.839 it in the thirty years, but I think that truthfully, 0:06:57.480 --> 0:07:01.520 you know, and Aaron, I mean, we lived the same thing, 0:07:01.720 --> 0:07:05.280 you know, the first seat. It was so precarious and 0:07:05.320 --> 0:07:08.320 there was, for lack of a better way to describe this, 0:07:08.440 --> 0:07:10.720 and I don't do it with malice, there was, like, 0:07:11.360 --> 0:07:15.840 you know, there was so much humiliation in one sense, 0:07:16.160 --> 0:07:19.000 Ed Corey, you would understand in the in the in 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:21.680 the sense that we were doing this little fell for 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:23.960 Fox and our ratings weren't good, and we didn't know 0:07:24.000 --> 0:07:25.360 what the money we were doing this and we're trying 0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:28.880 to get through. This is because he really loved the process. 0:07:29.240 --> 0:07:34.160 As opposed to five years before then there was this 0:07:34.280 --> 0:07:39.480 was a fully functional studio with this department and that department, 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:44.200 and that superseded all the show departments, you know, And 0:07:45.160 --> 0:07:47.400 I guess I should always I don't know how I feel. 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:49.920 I know that we it built back up to that 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:54.240 same thing, especially with the with the CW shows and 0:07:54.400 --> 0:07:58.520 you know, and and Charmed and and and everything that 0:07:58.560 --> 0:08:01.520 he built right back up that same kind of level 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:02.360 of engagement. 0:08:03.280 --> 0:08:07.040 But the bls who do you believe owns them? 0:08:08.640 --> 0:08:10.040 Which way? Where are they? 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:13.400 Where are the blooper reels? Like all the outtakes? I 0:08:13.400 --> 0:08:16.840 mean not the reels, the outtakes, because we did, am 0:08:16.840 --> 0:08:19.440 I wrong? Didn't at some point, like at Christmas parties 0:08:19.440 --> 0:08:21.560 when it was just the cast and crew, didn't we 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:25.400 play something that I feel like put together in the 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:26.600 Kenny Millers like. 0:08:27.400 --> 0:08:29.200 But I don't think. I think that had to be 0:08:29.280 --> 0:08:33.800 post me. I bet that was after me, because you're right, 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:34.520 you're right, you're right. 0:08:34.600 --> 0:08:35.400 It was towards the edge? 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:38.760 When when was? When is? When? 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:41.920 Where are the blooper reels? Where's the outtakes? 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:42.240 I mean? 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:43.320 Who would own those? 0:08:43.400 --> 0:08:43.640 Chuck? 0:08:43.720 --> 0:08:44.760 The early ones? 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:51.640 Well, all of the yes, Well, this is the question of. 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:54.240 There is always a question, and it was raised by 0:08:54.280 --> 0:08:58.160 an editor named Jerry Frizell whether a lot of our 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:04.440 material burned hmm, what burned in a laser Pacific fire? 0:09:05.120 --> 0:09:05.960 M M wait. 0:09:06.000 --> 0:09:07.800 I'm vaguely remembering this. 0:09:08.720 --> 0:09:12.040 Yeah, around the turn of the century, around there, I 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:15.800 guess I was not privy to it to years later, 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:18.560 and still I'm not. I can't get my hands on 0:09:18.600 --> 0:09:19.719 what exactly was. 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:23.640 Burned that sounds shady old by CB. I mean, yeah, 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:27.800 your fright, there's CBS firecom you know the ones. It 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:29.880 was funny because, you know, the first time I. 0:09:29.840 --> 0:09:33.800 Went to talk to them, David Staff, you know, they're 0:09:34.920 --> 0:09:37.360 and his question to me is that he said, well, 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:40.120 how well do you know Tori or Jenny. He said, well, 0:09:40.160 --> 0:09:42.320 I haven't talked to them in a long time, you know, 0:09:42.400 --> 0:09:44.720 And they said, well, they're selling a show like that. 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:47.080 Because I was trying just to get them interested in 0:09:47.120 --> 0:09:50.480 the music, you know, in the music in that at 0:09:50.480 --> 0:09:52.520 that time, and that's right when you started going out 0:09:52.600 --> 0:09:56.360 with you know, Oh. 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.839 My gosh, we should ask them where those outtakes are. 0:09:59.840 --> 0:10:01.520 I I would just personally like to see them, like 0:10:02.200 --> 0:10:04.240 when you sign like an NDA or something, just so 0:10:04.280 --> 0:10:09.800 we could see them. Yeah, that would be great. 0:10:08.600 --> 0:10:12.680 Thanks that. Well, you know, here's an interesting thing that 0:10:12.760 --> 0:10:16.840 I've learned subsequently since the last time we talked, which 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:20.760 is there was an article in the La Times that 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:30.280 showed that Moonlighting, thirty something, La Law, Homicide on the Street, 0:10:31.440 --> 0:10:37.040 and Northern Exposure, which I actually wrote for all five 0:10:37.120 --> 0:10:40.360 of them get no streaming and are not in syndication 0:10:40.559 --> 0:10:45.960 because of the music situation. Really and then you think 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:48.880 about the shows that have been stripped. It's not just us, 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:53.240 it's Quantum Leap or Happy Days and others. And so 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:57.520 what gets me amy is that is that ours, the 0:10:57.559 --> 0:11:00.240 television industry, is the only one that has there is 0:11:00.280 --> 0:11:08.800 no even remote feeling of obligation to preservation. Have it 0:11:08.840 --> 0:11:11.200 in the music industry and you have it in the 0:11:11.200 --> 0:11:15.800 film industry different ways. I actually went to the to 0:11:15.840 --> 0:11:18.600 the federal government. I went to the Library of Congress 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:22.360 and said, how do I get things preserved? Because we're 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:25.199 in the Library of Congress, right, what about like the 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:30.319 museum and we're submitted Your dad did that toy he 0:11:30.480 --> 0:11:33.520 submitted the original nine O two one O to the 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:34.719 Library of Congress. 0:11:35.720 --> 0:11:36.760 Oh my gosh, this is. 0:11:38.800 --> 0:11:41.720 Have our original music preserved because they did it at 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:42.959 the end of every season. 0:11:43.240 --> 0:11:45.040 And what about the Museum of TV and Radio. 0:11:45.080 --> 0:11:48.320 They don't have the original Not a real museum. 0:11:48.880 --> 0:11:49.920 Is a museum? 0:11:51.559 --> 0:11:53.760 No, it's it's kind of out of business there, it's 0:11:54.640 --> 0:11:58.440 it's not where it should be where I would not. 0:11:59.360 --> 0:12:02.800 I reached out to the Television Academy, Yeah, yeah, and 0:12:03.720 --> 0:12:10.120 the UH and they were uh and they passed And 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:13.440 I was surprised they have a legacy thing. But their 0:12:13.559 --> 0:12:17.760 legacy thing would be to like do interviews with someone 0:12:17.880 --> 0:12:20.720 like your dad or now if you were doing it 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:24.080 you maybe you were doing with Shonda Rhymes or or 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:26.840 or or you know Ryan. 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:28.800 Seacrest. 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:33.520 Yeah, you know the just the yes, well you know whoever, yes, 0:12:33.720 --> 0:12:37.320 people of real celebrity and real stature, and in that interview, 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:39.920 that's what they're preserving. But it's not the content of 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:44.040 the right right right that really surprised me. But at 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:48.440 the same time, it's just one that's that's not there 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:50.679 and you're seeing it in the nature right now. 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:53.280 And let me ask you this question thirty years later, 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:57.000 if you if somebody went back to try and get 0:12:57.120 --> 0:13:00.840 rights in perpetuity to the original songs, wouldn't it be 0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:04.480 cheaper now, because it's so much that music has got 0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:07.480 to be cheaper now than at least most of it 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:09.679 than it was even in the nineties. 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:12.360 Well you would think so. But what happened really was 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:16.880 when Napster came out in nineteen ninety nine and people 0:13:17.920 --> 0:13:22.160 there wasn't you know, didn't have to buy the recorded 0:13:22.280 --> 0:13:29.199 music anymore and wouldn't and didn't. The record industries went 0:13:29.240 --> 0:13:33.640 scrambling for places that they could where they had ownership, 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:40.240 and they leveraged this to a nauseating catastrophic level at 0:13:40.440 --> 0:13:42.680 the UH. And it was very interesting because you know, 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:47.080 i'd left after I left two and zero a fewyears, 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:50.240 I had one season at Dawson's Creek. That's right, I 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:52.400 said that, And I was not It was not a 0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:55.440 I wasn't really that much on the creative enterprise there. 0:13:55.480 --> 0:13:58.480 It turned out much more on the business enterprise. And 0:13:58.559 --> 0:14:00.760 one if it had to do with get the Music, 0:14:02.720 --> 0:14:07.440 that that for a much lower rate because the heads 0:14:07.440 --> 0:14:10.080 of the studios at Warner Brothers at the time felt 0:14:10.120 --> 0:14:13.520 that we're giving promotion. Why are we paying all this 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:17.680 money for the promotion that we give? And and it 0:14:17.760 --> 0:14:20.200 was really the right way to look at it. But 0:14:20.400 --> 0:14:23.040 that was, you know again right at the time, right 0:14:23.080 --> 0:14:29.640 before the the market, you know, change humbled. 0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:45.160 Yeah, now not to make an abrupt change in conversation, 0:14:45.840 --> 0:14:52.080 do you feel that Brendan, sorry, Brenda, and I know 0:14:52.120 --> 0:14:52.640 everyone I. 0:14:52.560 --> 0:14:54.840 Get really irrito Peeve and she will. 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:56.320 Call him Brendan. 0:14:57.240 --> 0:15:02.760 But Brandon and Brenda played other and sister slightly too flirty. 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:09.880 That's my one criticism of them. I love them as siblings. 0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:12.800 But the kissing on the cheek and then grabbing of 0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:15.200 the waist is slightly strange. 0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:17.720 I don't know, you know, one of the things is 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:22.520 especially from the beginning, and so I go back to 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:26.080 that far. But I think that our audience always knew 0:15:26.080 --> 0:15:30.360 we were making a television series, and they did flirt 0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:32.320 with each other in that way. I think that the 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:36.520 audience mostly enjoyed it. I think that that at that point, 0:15:36.560 --> 0:15:39.480 given the statue that you guys had what you wanted 0:15:39.520 --> 0:15:42.160 from it, that they were coming back that they hadn't 0:15:42.240 --> 0:15:47.200 seen that. Could it mean that, you know, I wasn't 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:50.400 that much of a stickler. I don't know. 0:15:50.640 --> 0:15:53.120 Chs to me, but you guys can't. 0:15:53.480 --> 0:15:56.080 But you guys noticed it, Like people were like, wait, 0:15:56.320 --> 0:15:57.120 they knew that. 0:15:57.080 --> 0:15:59.880 We were making a TV show. No, I know, a 0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:02.720 real brother and sister. The way the fans are now 0:16:02.800 --> 0:16:04.480 they think it's the burial brother and sister. 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:08.400 I it was, I know, but at the time, like, 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:11.160 did you guys watch dailies and say like, oh, why 0:16:11.200 --> 0:16:14.240 is that happening? But okay, it's fine, like or no 0:16:14.280 --> 0:16:15.280 one noticed. 0:16:14.960 --> 0:16:17.320 It very obvious. 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:21.160 Somebody had to notice. Yeah, no, we noted, we knew 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:24.160 what was going on we had we watched it. Well, 0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:26.360 that was one of the things stories. And Jenny, I 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:28.080 don't know when you were making your shows if you 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:31.120 had a luxury of doing that, but you know, one 0:16:31.120 --> 0:16:33.120 of the key things was to be the first to 0:16:33.120 --> 0:16:37.600 get to watch dailies, to get it before anybody else thought. 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:41.120 So you knew, and you could be and you could 0:16:41.160 --> 0:16:46.640 be conversant because, yeah, your dad would watch dailies and 0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:51.520 he he would get worried. As he was your dad, 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:53.640 he'd worried about things. So you better knew what was 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:56.760 going on in dailies and and and stuff and and 0:16:56.840 --> 0:16:57.920 be able to be conversant. 0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:02.320 Chuck's we're we're we're in season four. This is the 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:05.199 very end of season four on our podcasts. 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:06.720 All that great stuff you did. 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:10.360 Jenny, Shannon, Oh, thank you. Shannon is going to be 0:17:11.640 --> 0:17:16.200 leaving the show the beginning of season five, end of season. 0:17:15.840 --> 0:17:21.280 Four, right, correct? Yeah, did did you know, like at the. 0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:23.080 What point did you know that she was not going 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:25.679 to be returning and what at what point did we know? 0:17:25.760 --> 0:17:28.639 Because we're having trouble remembering the timeline of it all. 0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:33.199 Fair enough, it was it was when we got picked 0:17:33.280 --> 0:17:36.560 up for season five. 0:17:37.800 --> 0:17:40.920 Nil, because was that when we were we. 0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:45.200 When it was that was when it was clear when 0:17:45.200 --> 0:17:49.960 the network picked us up for season five was about 0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:52.520 I think Shannon at that. 0:17:52.640 --> 0:17:54.439 There was when we were doing a pig as a 0:17:54.480 --> 0:17:57.879 boy as a dog, all the environmental yeah ones, the 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:02.320 animal rights ones, yes, okay, so there you go, Amy, 0:18:02.520 --> 0:18:05.400 Why did I do animal rights ones? Well? Fun? First 0:18:05.440 --> 0:18:07.760 of all, Larry Mullen had an idea about and he 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:08.520 wanted to do it. 0:18:08.640 --> 0:18:09.720 I was all for those. 0:18:10.160 --> 0:18:13.639 Diane's reasonch yes, But I mean I got that because 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:17.639 Jenny was was interested in Peter at that point and 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:20.920 had interesting you know, it's just oh, well, my cats, 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:24.000 so this art will. So I tried to always do 0:18:24.160 --> 0:18:27.080 things that you guys were well, I was seeing in 0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:32.199 your personal life I could incorporate into these characters. I 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:33.840 tried to do that at least I'm all for that. 0:18:33.960 --> 0:18:37.240 I also love the sort of even though the other 0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:39.600 characters were in it. I love when Brandon went to 0:18:39.600 --> 0:18:42.840 San Francisco and it's sort of a Brandon centric episode. 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:47.560 I even like when when Dylan goes off what's her name? 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:58.479 Jenny? Oh? And am all I get is yes? Say it? 0:18:59.080 --> 0:19:02.119 When we started that was the A story and the 0:19:02.160 --> 0:19:06.320 B story had to do with Dana getting roughed up 0:19:06.359 --> 0:19:10.000 by David Arquette. That was the story, if you'll notice 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:13.879 in the episode that's completely shifted around, And we just 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:16.840 kept cutting it and cutting it and cutting it because 0:19:16.880 --> 0:19:22.680 it really was it was an experimenting quite couldn't work. 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:26.120 We thought it would be really cool. And I bet 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:28.840 if it wasn't in the hands of a different director 0:19:28.880 --> 0:19:31.400 at that moment, no offense to my director friend who 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:35.240 directed it, it would be a different It would have 0:19:35.400 --> 0:19:36.879 worked slightly better. 0:19:37.560 --> 0:19:41.439 So I have a question. Sorry, So us watching it 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:45.040 back now as fans in a different way obviously than 0:19:45.040 --> 0:19:50.560 how we experienced it originally, we are seeing foreshadowing, so 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:53.639 we thought, oh, they must have known Shannon was leaving 0:19:53.640 --> 0:19:57.440 like it just there's so many signs. Was that Did 0:19:57.480 --> 0:19:59.720 you put that in on purpose because it was questionable? 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:07.760 Well, we well, you really got to go back since 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:10.280 you're when that's this conversation you you really have to 0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:14.040 go back to when we started season four and and 0:20:14.359 --> 0:20:17.640 Brenda went to a different university. I mean, we used 0:20:17.680 --> 0:20:20.240 all that to sort it out and try to let's 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:23.439 calm things down, Let's let's have a little summer break. 0:20:23.640 --> 0:20:26.120 We don't have to shoot summer episodes for the first time, 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:28.760 you know, we had a little little bit of a breather, 0:20:28.920 --> 0:20:31.360 all of us, and and that was the first time 0:20:31.359 --> 0:20:34.639 to see how it would all work, uh in the 0:20:34.880 --> 0:20:39.280 in the season. Uh and and once it it fell apart, 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:45.840 you know when when at that point, that's when the 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:49.679 clean break happened and we were all gonna be moving 0:20:49.760 --> 0:20:53.120 on and your dad even had second thoughts about that, 0:20:53.320 --> 0:20:56.200 you know, we I don't. I don't think I said 0:20:56.200 --> 0:20:58.240 that on this podcast, but I said it on the 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:01.520 other one that I got a call from business affairs 0:21:01.520 --> 0:21:03.479 that he still was going to send out the pickup 0:21:03.560 --> 0:21:08.880 letter to to Shanon. Did my business affairs person want 0:21:08.960 --> 0:21:13.320 me to do that? I know, we better check. We know, no, no, no, 0:21:13.400 --> 0:21:16.679 please don't. And you know when Deck down and reminded 0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:19.560 Aaron that the network had signed off on this and 0:21:20.320 --> 0:21:23.240 it was the right decision for us right at that moment, 0:21:24.680 --> 0:21:27.560 it felt like for the show. And then I often 0:21:27.720 --> 0:21:30.400 feel and this is what you guys were talking about, 0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:34.840 starting kind of for me with the sixties episode, but 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:40.520 certain moving into Divas in that is that she connect 0:21:40.600 --> 0:21:45.720 reconnected with the character reconnected, Yeah, and really brought Berenda 0:21:45.840 --> 0:21:51.359 Brenda to life in a way that look, the whole 0:21:51.560 --> 0:21:54.240 arc that you had, story arc that she had with 0:21:54.320 --> 0:21:57.920 the rich boy m hm, David Gale a nice guy, 0:21:58.160 --> 0:22:01.239 nice actor. We all liked David mm hmm. But that 0:22:01.400 --> 0:22:03.320 was one that was done off to the side so 0:22:03.359 --> 0:22:07.080 there wouldn't have to be interactions and fictions and whatever 0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:09.680 else would be going on. I mean, we did think 0:22:09.960 --> 0:22:21.040 so guilty as charged weed to affect ourselves. 0:22:26.640 --> 0:22:29.640 Were you worried on your side of things? How her 0:22:29.760 --> 0:22:32.840 absence would you know, affect the show in the ratings. 0:22:34.520 --> 0:22:37.480 I let mister do the worrying for me, you know, 0:22:37.960 --> 0:22:40.440 I just had to get all this big number done. 0:22:40.800 --> 0:22:44.120 And I felt that Look, as I've said, I think 0:22:44.200 --> 0:22:46.320 we talked about it, I always feel I did five 0:22:46.440 --> 0:22:50.679 different TV series and building it and developing it with 0:22:51.680 --> 0:22:55.640 in season five and creating you know, the Valerie character, 0:22:55.840 --> 0:23:00.639 and knowing we were becoming just straight into a pure 0:23:00.760 --> 0:23:04.000 serialization and that and that it was heading that way 0:23:04.040 --> 0:23:10.680 after my tenure even more so, you know we we 0:23:10.840 --> 0:23:14.320 uh so that was I was, well, we did lose Ray. 0:23:14.440 --> 0:23:18.760 We certainly we didn't catapult, but certainly, uh you know, 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:22.119 Brenda Shannon had a following, and and uh, and there 0:23:22.119 --> 0:23:24.840 are people who pick up the show new and then 0:23:25.359 --> 0:23:28.879 who move away from it. But I felt that I 0:23:28.880 --> 0:23:34.639 felt really good going into season five. I feel whethered it. 0:23:35.440 --> 0:23:38.440 You know, we made the transition into college. Our ratings 0:23:38.480 --> 0:23:42.560 are really strong. And I had this great moment that 0:23:42.560 --> 0:23:44.520