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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Left Steps Podcast.

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Speaker 1: My guest today is movie producer, record producer, all around

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Speaker 1: creative wonder Kin Spencer Prophet Spencer. Good to have you

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Speaker 1: on the podcast, Bob. It's good. I've been following you

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Speaker 1: for a year. It's good to see you're good to

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Speaker 1: talk to you man. Okay, So you have this new

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Speaker 1: movie about American Pie, Don McLean's legendary song. How did

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Speaker 1: this come to be? Well, it started when I was

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Speaker 1: a student U c l A. I pulled over when

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Speaker 1: I heard the song. Three minutes and I still kept listening.

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Speaker 1: Six minutes and I still kept listening. I was in

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Speaker 1: a band. I've failed, but I said to myself, if

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Speaker 1: I ever grow up and get to be a macher

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Speaker 1: in the music business, I'd like to do something with it.

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Speaker 1: Four years ago, I heard from Don's manager after I

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Speaker 1: finished my John Coltrane documentary with Denzel Washington narrating, and

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Speaker 1: Kurt Webster said, are you interested in doing it doc

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Speaker 1: on Don? I said, I'm really interested because I knew

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Speaker 1: that Don wrote American Pie to me a great piece

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Speaker 1: of poetry, not that I put it with you know,

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Speaker 1: Keats and Shakespeare, and Dennison, but I consider it great,

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Speaker 1: great literary work. I said it would be my honor

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Speaker 1: if I could do a dock on the journey of

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Speaker 1: the song, taking down up to when he wrote it

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Speaker 1: and then following the trajectory of the song for the

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Speaker 1: life of the song, past president of future. That's what

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Speaker 1: we did. But I got involved with it spiritually way

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Speaker 1: back fifty plus years ago. Okay, what was the inspiration

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Speaker 1: for the manager to call you to connect? I believe

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Speaker 1: we had a mutual friend, Ray Dela Garza, and he's

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Speaker 1: seen my John coltrane Um documentary which was on Netflix

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Speaker 1: at the time, directed by John Sheinfeld and Denzel Washington

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Speaker 1: had narrated Bill Clinton, Common Santana Or in it. It's

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Speaker 1: real good. And my approach to making dots is very

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Speaker 1: different than the normal bear. And possibly that that plus

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Speaker 1: Forbes article that said that I was from the inside

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Speaker 1: coming out as opposed to guys like brilliant guys Scorsese,

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Speaker 1: e Ron Howard, Peter Jackson, genius directors. But they're from

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Speaker 1: the outside end, as you know, because we met during

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Speaker 1: your sanctuary days. I come from the music. I care,

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Speaker 1: I get goose bumps, and uh, I want to make

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Speaker 1: film that reflects the goose bumps. Okay, so he calls you,

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Speaker 1: at what point do you decide you're gonna do it?

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Speaker 1: And what's the first step? First step is I immediately

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Speaker 1: and viscerally and spiritually said I have to be involved.

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Speaker 1: Then the question is who pays for it, who distributes it,

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Speaker 1: who markets it. There's some wonderful guys running the new

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Speaker 1: Paramount Global company from Bob back issues the chairman to

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Speaker 1: Bruce Kilmer, president of music. Now Bruce for thirty five

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Speaker 1: years used to be a VH one. So I called Bruce.

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Speaker 1: I sent him the Coltrane film. I said I'd like

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Speaker 1: to talk to you about gave him a little bit

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Speaker 1: of the vision. He set up a zoom call Bob,

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Speaker 1: Bruce and I talked, and within seventy two hours I

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Speaker 1: started the process. We papered it with his business affairs

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Speaker 1: guys who were terrific, and literally within three weeks I

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Speaker 1: was on a director search. So how did you know

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Speaker 1: what the budget would be? Because I asked for and

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Speaker 1: so you just pull the pull the number out of

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Speaker 1: your rear red and said this this sounds to be

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Speaker 1: like what it would take to make a Doomic Lane film. No,

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Speaker 1: I said, how much is Bob lefts it's his house

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Speaker 1: worth now triple it now, now, seriously, I can't spend

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Speaker 1: less than a couple of million bucks to do something

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Speaker 1: the way I want to do it. Um, we brainstormed

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Speaker 1: what it could be. I didn't know who I would get,

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Speaker 1: I didn't know how deeply Garth Brooks would get into it.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know how many songs we would use to

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Speaker 1: decorate the spirit of the time, the trajectory. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to do new, young versions of it to show the

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Speaker 1: public that the song is not only a classic then,

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Speaker 1: but it could be for the future. And we did,

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Speaker 1: and I just estimated in my head. I pulled the

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Speaker 1: number a little bit out of my butt, but I

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Speaker 1: kind of knew what it takes to do it at

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Speaker 1: the level that I want to do it. And it's

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Speaker 1: not like a generica. Okay, if you make a deal

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Speaker 1: with Paramount and the Paramount plus it ultimately released on

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Speaker 1: and how many how many rights do you cough up?

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Speaker 1: Do they own it a percent? Do you have a

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Speaker 1: back end interest? What are the deals in today's documentary world? Well,

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Speaker 1: the deals with me are different than they are with others,

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Speaker 1: and I can't you know, it's almost like Woodward and Bernstein.

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Speaker 1: I can't reveal my sources. I can tell you that's

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Speaker 1: the copyright is in the name of uh my company

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Speaker 1: named Morland, named after my children. I can tell you

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Speaker 1: that they have the perpetual right to stream it. I

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Speaker 1: have some territories. I have some extension rights. We've done

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Speaker 1: an illustrated children's book on it, which is a prequel,

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Speaker 1: and it kind of talks about Donna as a young

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Speaker 1: newspaper boy learning about friendship and hope and how music.

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Speaker 1: For me it's people soul. I'm able to carve out

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Speaker 1: certain extension rights to it, but I can't go into

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Speaker 1: the details of what the deals truly are, other than

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Speaker 1: saying I continue making an Elvis comeback doc right now

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Speaker 1: with the same people, plan to do anymore. I really

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Speaker 1: like working with this team over a paramount plus, so

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Speaker 1: I had to find a director. I looked at different

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Speaker 1: people's work over a period of six months. Don was

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Speaker 1: tremendous in doing zoom calls. When I found someone I

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Speaker 1: was interested in, we did four and I remember when

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Speaker 1: Godless I'm Argan, when he was alive, he had told

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Speaker 1: me of a director that had done that Tom dow

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Speaker 1: Dock that actually dealt with them, great documentary, right, And

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Speaker 1: this guy is not famous, he's not a household name.

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Speaker 1: He's not sitting with m Emmy. He's an Academy nominations

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Speaker 1: like some of the people that I talked to. But

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Speaker 1: I'm all about the work. I'm not just about somebody's

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Speaker 1: resume or somebody you know that somebody's going to pay

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Speaker 1: me to do something. So I looked him up, and

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Speaker 1: I looked at a couple of other things Mark Mormon

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Speaker 1: that he did, and I said, oh my god, this

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Speaker 1: guy is really good. He really understands the psychist of

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Speaker 1: music and the evolution of music through periods, which is

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Speaker 1: what that doctor Tom down Dock was. And I was

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Speaker 1: also working with Eddie Kramer, who is kind of one

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Speaker 1: of the quintessential engineers. I am making Eddie stock through

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Speaker 1: his Hendrix, Rolling Stone Zeppelin period. And I said to myself, Man,

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Speaker 1: this guy Mormon really knows the stuff. I reached out

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Speaker 1: to him cold and we talked and we bonded. He

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Speaker 1: flew out to l A. I did a zoom call

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Speaker 1: it Don. Don trusted me Don like Mark, and we started. Okay,

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Speaker 1: now the film goes extensively into the plane crash with

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Speaker 1: Buddy Holly, the Big Bopper. Richie Valens has uh the

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Speaker 1: actual corn field that they crashed in. How did you

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Speaker 1: decide on the construction of the movie in terms of

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Speaker 1: what was going to be the varying, varying elements. Well,

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Speaker 1: the elements were product of brainstorming between myself and the director.

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Speaker 1: But Mark has vision, he's a cinematographer. We definitely wanted

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Speaker 1: to anchor this to the field of Dreams and Iowa,

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Speaker 1: where the plane did crash. Don doesn't pilgrimage. He did

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Speaker 1: one fifty years later to the Surf Ballroom, which was

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Speaker 1: the place, the last place that Buddy Holly and you

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Speaker 1: know they did that concert. So all of this was

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Speaker 1: the vision of his start there. But it's not a

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Speaker 1: Buddy Holly doc. It's not Iowa a doc. It's just

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Speaker 1: the anchor. But the song traveled way beyond Iowa. Okay.

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Speaker 1: So I'm very interested having watched the film. Was the

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Speaker 1: Surf Ballroom just preserved as it was because they realize

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Speaker 1: the monumental effect of those artists that they have gigs there?

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Speaker 1: Is it a museum? I know that ultimately Don plays

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Speaker 1: there in the in the film. But what's the status

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Speaker 1: of the Surf Ballroom today? It's living and breathing. It

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Speaker 1: is considered a national monument. They've kind of upgraded it.

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Speaker 1: You can see by watching the film the pictures of

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Speaker 1: some of the icons who have played there, and of

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Speaker 1: course you see a tribute to Richie Ballance and Buddy

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Speaker 1: Holly and the Big Bopper. But now it's a living, breathing,

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Speaker 1: functioning place. But at the same time it became the

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Speaker 1: anchor of the stock at least get going with it. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you have a long history of dealing with artists, and

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Speaker 1: one thing we know about artists, it's their one and

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Speaker 1: only career. If they make a mistake, it might kill

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Speaker 1: their career and a manager, dus or whatever label can

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Speaker 1: move on. Right, How difficult was it working with Don

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Speaker 1: who does not have a reputation for being easy going.

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Speaker 1: I think Don is a brilliant, wonderful, warm guy if

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Speaker 1: you catch him properly, he's intelligent, he's got a number

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Speaker 1: of degrees. He doesn't suffer fools. Well, I had to

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Speaker 1: be on my game and I was, and he's got

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Speaker 1: a very smart manager who also paid attention. But I

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Speaker 1: found on to be very gracious, and he said, if

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Speaker 1: it ain't broke down, fixed it. Every time Mark and

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Speaker 1: I would come up with stuff and we'd have rough

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Speaker 1: cuts of this stat or the other. I'd share it

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Speaker 1: with them. I'm very collaborative with the artists, and because

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Speaker 1: I come from the music as opposed to a suit

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Speaker 1: trying to impose my view on it, Don became very collaborative.

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Speaker 1: He was great. Who is Don's manager? Guy named Kurt

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Speaker 1: Webster based on a national Okay, so what did you

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Speaker 1: learn making the movie about American Pie and Don mc lane? Well?

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Speaker 1: I learned the reveals that he decided to reveal. Who

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Speaker 1: was the jester? Was it Bob Dylan? What was thorny crown? Well,

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Speaker 1: Elvis was the king, but he didn't wear a thorny

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Speaker 1: crown because Jesus Christ bore the thorny crown. What I

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Speaker 1: learned was what was inside Donald's head and a heart

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Speaker 1: and spirit. When he wrote a big song for the country,

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Speaker 1: the Marching, I used to run the sts at u

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Speaker 1: c l A very much protesting the war in my

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Speaker 1: younger days, and when the marching element came up in

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Speaker 1: the song, little did I know that there was a

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Speaker 1: march that was really happening. People were marching in seventy

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Speaker 1: seventy one. I got it's very deep. It's much deeper

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Speaker 1: than just a campfire song, but it's got a good hook.

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Speaker 1: How did you segue from making records to making documentaries?

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Speaker 1: By having directed a number of videos on the records

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Speaker 1: that I produced, getting next to the creative as I've

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Speaker 1: always been, And actually in nine seven I had the

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Speaker 1: good fortune to work with Robbie Robertson, whose best friend

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Speaker 1: at the time was Martin Scorsese. We made it doc

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Speaker 1: on how Robbie kind of wanted to be in film

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Speaker 1: Scorsese wanted to be in music. How they teamed up

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Speaker 1: after the Last Waltz and I was able to work

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Speaker 1: with Ida grow Wits and some people that I knew

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Speaker 1: In putting that doc together. We had two Emmy nominations.

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Speaker 1: That was before it was fashionable to do music docs.

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Speaker 1: How did I segue? Because I come from the music

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Speaker 1: and I care about with the songs and the music

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Speaker 1: represents It became a logical outgrowth for me as I

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Speaker 1: started evolving my career and morphing into the next step.

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Speaker 1: As you get older, you don't want a babysit rock

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Speaker 1: artists anymore. I had the good fortune to spend three

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Speaker 1: songs with Stevie Wonder that I got to produce and

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Speaker 1: arrange music with him with the Symphony Orchardstrap. Very the

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Speaker 1: quiet riot very different than when I met you, Bob,

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Speaker 1: when you were working in Sanctuary, I was producing The

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Speaker 1: wasp Ountain, which wind up selling a couple of million

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Speaker 1: records back in But I do remember you coming into

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Speaker 1: my studio, and boy, little did I know that you

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Speaker 1: would become probably the most articulate purveyor of pop cultures

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Speaker 1: through your writing. So I'm really thrilled to talk to you. Man. Wow,

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Speaker 1: I don't know how to respond to that, so I'll

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Speaker 1: just keep flowing. Okay, many many producers from your era

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Speaker 1: you have have no more work, and if they're they're

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Speaker 1: living on their glory. Then there are people like Tom

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Speaker 1: Mormon who did a complete one eighty and ended up

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Speaker 1: running a B and B. In your particular case, did

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Speaker 1: you ultimately see way, there's no future for me in

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Speaker 1: this The game changes. I'm getting older and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to pivot to this. How conscious was the whole decision? It?

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Speaker 1: It was a natural outgrowth. I never worried that I

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Speaker 1: would be lacking work. I've been working since I worked

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Speaker 1: for Clive Davis, one of his twenty three um. I decided,

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Speaker 1: after having two children, I didn't want a babysit rock

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Speaker 1: artists anymore, and I didn't want to be in the studio,

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Speaker 1: so I started supervising music for film before it became fashionable.

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Speaker 1: A good friend of mine, Jerry Off say it became

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Speaker 1: the head of production at showtime, and if you look

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Speaker 1: at my IMDb you'll see fifty five films that I quarterback.

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Speaker 1: I mixed the scores, I wrote some title songs, and

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Speaker 1: that was my gradual evolution. I didn't do it to

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Speaker 1: make a living because I did a lot of back

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Speaker 1: end deals, because I'm the kind of guy that eats

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Speaker 1: what I killed. I don't try and frontload anything. By

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Speaker 1: the way, I was up in Massachusetts at Rman's place.

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Speaker 1: Tom is an old friend of mine. It's wonderful. I

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Speaker 1: love the whole, that whole Brookshire's area lot, which is

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Speaker 1: pretty cool. But now my conscious thing was logical. In

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Speaker 1: two thousand two, I teamed up with the buddy of mine.

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Speaker 1: We made the first DH one on biographical movie, which

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Speaker 1: I put together, and I decided, you know, this is

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Speaker 1: kind of cool building uh, media out of music, and

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Speaker 1: I started doing that way before it became super fashionable.

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Speaker 1: I started that as I told you did any cost

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Speaker 1: for VH one in two thousand two, and it just

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Speaker 1: naturally evolved to do that making a difference in pop

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Speaker 1: culture using music and media. Now, the music business and

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Speaker 1: movie business are different in many ways. Certainly, the budgets

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Speaker 1: are lower in music and it's easier to get started.

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Speaker 1: There are producers who have multiple projects and they're waiting

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Speaker 1: for funding for decades. What has been your experience and

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Speaker 1: how do you deal with this frustration? I kind of

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Speaker 1: feel that I don't pitch. I share, and because I'm

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Speaker 1: next to the talent and I get the proprietary rights, uh,

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Speaker 1: I p is king and distribution is great and for me,

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Speaker 1: I don't have a problem making anything that I do

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Speaker 1: get out to the World's the question of who's the

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Speaker 1: appropriate distributor marketing. I have a great team that worked

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Speaker 1: for me, that I believe in, I trust, and we've

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Speaker 1: all known each other for one guy does all my

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Speaker 1: underscore stuff. I've known for forty years. But if you

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Speaker 1: look at my sight, the average longevity of my relationships

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Speaker 1: to my team is probably a decade plus. And my

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Speaker 1: model also is I pay out of budgets so they

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Speaker 1: can go and build their life and do their work

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Speaker 1: their own way. But I've got fierce loyalty because maybe

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Speaker 1: I'm a decent guy at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: but I really care about the art. Well, Eddie Kramer

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Speaker 1: certainly deserves a documentary. Anything else in the pipe yeah part,

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Speaker 1: you would know all these people who, as you are

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Speaker 1: a student of the business of pop culture. My friend

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Speaker 1: Del Bryant, who used to be the president of b

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Speaker 1: m I, his parents, Police and Buddle O'Brian actually wrote

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Speaker 1: all the big Everley Brothers hits. So the doc we're

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Speaker 1: going to make his call. That's done. It signed papered.

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Speaker 1: All I Have to Do Is Dream, which was one

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Speaker 1: of the big Everley hits. But when you think of

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Speaker 1: the people who covered some of the Bryant songs from

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Speaker 1: Paul Simon too, you look at the influence that the

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Speaker 1: Everley Harmonies have had on McCarty, Lennon McCartney, etcetera. We're

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Speaker 1: going to make a doc called All I Have to

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Speaker 1: Do Is Dream, the pioneers of Nashville, and I can

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Speaker 1: link a little bit about that because in the sixties,

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Speaker 1: as you know, New York was a hotbed of new

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Speaker 1: acoustic music and there were a lot of renegades there. Well,

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Speaker 1: the Bryants were the pioneers of bohemians of Nashville before

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Speaker 1: it was fashionable, you know, to be cool in Nashville,

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Speaker 1: which it is today. So they would Devil would be

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Speaker 1: sitting on his dad's knee when Orbison and the Release

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Speaker 1: and Carl Perkins and all these people would come over,

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Speaker 1: and we're going to have demos that Della has. This

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Speaker 1: is a doc about his parents journey, but we're also

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Speaker 1: going to deal with the music. But we're not going

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Speaker 1: to do a generic music doc. It's really going to

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Speaker 1: be about pioneering music out of a Nashville Anchor will

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Speaker 1: bring it forward with some modern covers like I did

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Speaker 1: with McLean, But really that's the project of Excited about

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Speaker 1: Steven Schwartz wrote Godspell, Pippen, and the current Wicked movie

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Speaker 1: which he has written. Stephen is elected for me to

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Speaker 1: be his producer and produced the doc on his journey,

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Speaker 1: not a Wicked documentary, documentary on the kid who was

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Speaker 1: at Carnegie Mellon when he wrote god Steal. Then he

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Speaker 1: went and wrote Pippen. Then he had a problem with

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Speaker 1: Bob Fosse. Then he started writing music for films. He

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Speaker 1: tamed up with Alamanka. That's going to be an interesting story.

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Speaker 1: We will do that working with God bless his memory.

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Speaker 1: Lamont Dozer was one of my dearest friends. We've written

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Speaker 1: some songs together when our kids had play dates. My

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Speaker 1: younger son Morgan used to date. Is not date could

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Speaker 1: go to school with his daughter. So he had written

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Speaker 1: the songs that he wrote in the sixties, whether it

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Speaker 1: be you know heat wave or standing in the Shadows

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Speaker 1: or this same old song. We live that through the

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Speaker 1: administration prior to Biden and so are we in a

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Speaker 1: heat wave? Is it the same old song? Were we

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Speaker 1: hearing the same things? So I've teamed up with a

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Speaker 1: director who's a South African, brilliant guy, and we are

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Speaker 1: sculpting the story from a South African point of view culturally,

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Speaker 1: but from a world point of view because Laumont, after

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Speaker 1: he left Motown, he toured South Africa, he toured Nigeria.

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Speaker 1: We're just going to approach it a little differently than

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Speaker 1: the normal person. That which is do a soup to nuts. Hey,

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Speaker 1: it's a dock on all this hits. Guys had fifty

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Speaker 1: one number one songs. But I'm interested in what those

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Speaker 1: songs mean to people then and today, as we did

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Speaker 1: with Lamont, as we did with Don McLean. Okay, going

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Speaker 1: back to Dell, who owns his parents songs now? Del

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Speaker 1: how Sobriant he and his brother own a So I

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Speaker 1: have no licensing issues, I have no sink issues. Everything

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Speaker 1: is built in into my partnership with Dell. Great. So

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Speaker 1: you're a student of the game yourself. What do you

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Speaker 1: think about all these artists selling their catalogs. I'm talking

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Speaker 1: about publishing catalog primarily those Springsteen were sold the records too, well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: we understand, and an opal of years who were in

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Speaker 1: the Sanctuary it was kind of next to that. Mark

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Speaker 1: I think, Yeah, I think, And funny I've gone back

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Speaker 1: and forth with them. I'm proud of how he's built

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Speaker 1: what is hip knows his company. I see what the

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Speaker 1: big boys are doing, and I think that's really smart

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Speaker 1: because if you're Paul Simon, if you're Bob Dylan, and

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Speaker 1: you're after seventy years all you can get three four

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Speaker 1: five million dollars for your work and still consult on

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Speaker 1: it and still have a voice on how the things

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Speaker 1: are used and licensed. I think that's actually really smart,

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Speaker 1: because songs are the bedrock of the business. Who owns

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Speaker 1: all your rights? Me? So you haven't sold anything? No,

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Speaker 1: Well I did in the past, um because well, these

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Speaker 1: days I'm owning the i P to my films. I

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Speaker 1: used to own the I P to the copyrights on

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Speaker 1: the songs that I wrote and the records I produced.

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Speaker 1: Some of them were owned by the distributors. When I

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Speaker 1: got smart, I wound up having j vs after my

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Speaker 1: Billy Thorpe experience. If you remember Children of the Sun,

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Speaker 1: of course I wrote that I produced that with Billy.

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Speaker 1: It was on Capricorn when they went belly up. I

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Speaker 1: didn't get a dime and we sold a million records. Bob.

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Speaker 1: In y eight I developed laser computer animated laser light shows,

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Speaker 1: started Planet Arry shows, and I didn't get paid a time.

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Speaker 1: I realized I need to control my i P a

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Speaker 1: little more, so it evolved. I did go to law school.

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Speaker 1: The only thing I learned out of that was that

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Speaker 1: I didn't want to be a lawyer. A and B.

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Speaker 1: When Clive offered me a job, he could either pick

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Speaker 1: up my option as an artist, or take the job.

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Speaker 1: I took the job, kidding forget. That was the end

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Speaker 1: of my recording career. So I've been that guy behind

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Speaker 1: the curtain, the frustrated artist, that frustrated guitar player. My

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Speaker 1: last who odd guitar? As I played with Ray Parker Jr.

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Speaker 1: On the Tina Turner asked the Queen album, if you

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Speaker 1: look and you google if there were only two guitarists

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Speaker 1: me and right. But you know what, when I got

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Speaker 1: the chance to work with Jeff Beck with Brian May,

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Speaker 1: I said, wait a minute, these are real good guitarists.

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Speaker 1: If you see that guitar behind there, I use it

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Speaker 1: to strom you know, my hope, my future grandchildren to sleep.

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Speaker 1: But I'll tell you man, I'm not as good as

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Speaker 1: the people have worked with. That's why I defer. Don

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Speaker 1: McLean is one of the best guitarist show ever meet. Okay,

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Speaker 1: the Quiet Riot stuff. Yeah, I assumed that Sony owns

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Speaker 1: the recordings. Are you still getting revenue from that or

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Speaker 1: if you sold the rights to that? Now? I still

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Speaker 1: get revenue every quarter and the masters because at the

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Speaker 1: time I didn't have the Cloud, I had the opportunity.

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Speaker 1: Walter Yetnikoff gave me the opportunity, and that's the story

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Speaker 1: into itself. Because they all hated that record. I made it.

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Speaker 1: I directed the videos with a guy named Mark Rezko,

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Speaker 1: who was an out of work commercial Sky and MTV.

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Speaker 1: Actually Bob Pittman and his team Les Garland helped me

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Speaker 1: get it on the air. When I put a second

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Speaker 1: on my house made the video at cal Arts bypassed

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Speaker 1: the label, sent it to EMPTV. They put on the air,

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Speaker 1: went through the roof the first bang your Head video.

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Speaker 1: But I didn't own the masters. I owned the publishing

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Speaker 1: that I did sell back. Okay, you sold the publishing

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Speaker 1: just on that. Yeah, what was your motivation? M getting divorced?

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Speaker 1: That's a good motivation. Absolutely. How many times you've been married?

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Speaker 1: While I have the best marriage a human being could have.

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Speaker 1: I my first marriage was was someone you probably know of,

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Speaker 1: Trudy Green who and Trudy is still my dear friend.

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Speaker 1: After fifty years of friendship, we realized we'd be better

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Speaker 1: business partners than husband and wife. So that thing lasted

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Speaker 1: a year in my twenties, then the mother of my

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Speaker 1: children fifteen years when that didn't work, I met Judy

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Speaker 1: by accident. She's been with me now. Twenty two years

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Speaker 1: she was the publisher of the l A Weekly. She's brilliant.

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Speaker 1: She's got a heart of gold, and rather than me

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Speaker 1: talk about it on this podcast, people can read about

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Speaker 1: her and google her. But she runs my book division

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Speaker 1: and she is about the smartest person I've ever met

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Speaker 1: in my life, next to my kids. My kids are

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Speaker 1: pretty smart too. Okay, if you stop working today, do

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Speaker 1: you have enough money to get to the end? Yes? Okay,

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Speaker 1: that's good. What's what's up with your book division? Well?

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Speaker 1: I like the idea of making books, whether it's the

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Speaker 1: book first and then the doc. I'll show you this

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Speaker 1: Elvis book that Babs Lerman wrote the forward too, just so,

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Speaker 1: just so you know, we're audio only. Oh okay. Bass

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Speaker 1: Lerman is a brilliant director. He's now crossed the three

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Speaker 1: million mark with the Elvis Stone. My dear friend Steve

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Speaker 1: Steve Binder actually directed and produced the original Comeback special.

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Speaker 1: I'm in production on that now, telling the Elvis and

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Speaker 1: Steve Buddy story Elman, Louise, Butch and Sundance, Elvis and Steve.

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Speaker 1: As you can see when you watch the bass Lerman movie,

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Speaker 1: Elvis and Steve, will Steve Divide Colonel Parker. He didn't

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Speaker 1: want to do a some special. And if you remember

426
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 1: the scene in the Bass Movie when Elvis says, so, Steve,

427
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,400
Speaker 1: what do you think of my career? And Steve says,

428
00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:12,920
Speaker 1: it's in the toilet, it's true. So partnering with Viacom

429
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 1: and Paramount Plus and Paramount Corporate and CBS UM on

430
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,960
Speaker 1: this who are my partners? We are making the story

431
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,520
Speaker 1: from through Steve's lens. And it happened that Steve wrote

432
00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 1: a book on it. We published if we put it out.

433
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 1: He got Bads to write the forward to the book.

434
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:35,480
Speaker 1: He consulted on Bads this movie, and we're using the

435
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:39,080
Speaker 1: Bads movie, not using but it's propelling sales of the

436
00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: book when our doc comes out. It's also going to

437
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 1: help that book came first. Judy helped me put the

438
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: book together with Steve. Steve wrote it. He's brilliant, he lived.

439
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:52,199
Speaker 1: He is the only living guy who can truly speak

440
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: to the Elvis Comeback Special because he's the guy who

441
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 1: directed it, produced it, and conceived it. Um on the

442
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,159
Speaker 1: lean thing. When I got to know Don and learned

443
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: his story of being a young paper boy and being

444
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 1: inspired and being affected by Buddy Holly's death, Judy and

445
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,600
Speaker 1: I talked about it. She came up with a brilliant

446
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 1: idea on how to look at the prequel to him

447
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:19,719
Speaker 1: writing the song that's the Journey. I have a distribution

448
00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,280
Speaker 1: deal with kind of the A and M Records Island

449
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: speaking at Chris Blackwell of books called IPG based out

450
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:30,359
Speaker 1: of Chicago, and they're doing that book and a dozen

451
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 1: other books for us. I'm making a book on every

452
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:38,400
Speaker 1: dock that I produced because I can. Okay, going back

453
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:43,720
Speaker 1: to the American Pie, you have recreations. They're done very subtly.

454
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,359
Speaker 1: At first you think that, uh, it's actually the film

455
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 1: from that era. That's an interesting choice. How did you

456
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: and the director make that choice? First of all, I'm

457
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,879
Speaker 1: going to correct you. It's not recreations, Chloral, It's only

458
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 1: a slight piece that exists. And that was Mark Mormon's

459
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 1: genius because it couldn't we couldn't get footage from seventy one,

460
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:11,679
Speaker 1: but it could look like seventy one who could feel

461
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 1: like it and Don guided him through it because Don

462
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:18,199
Speaker 1: was there. So if you do it, and you do

463
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 1: it with some vision, you pull it off. And I

464
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 1: give a lot of props to Mark Mormon for doing that. Okay,

465
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 1: let's pull the lens back. If someone who's been in

466
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 1: the game from many decades, and what do you think

467
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 1: about the recorded music business today? I think songs of

468
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: the bedrock of music and harmony. I'm working on a

469
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 1: dock with the guys Manhattan Transfer Pentatonics that takes you

470
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 1: back to the Andrew sisters and the Mills brothers, and

471
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:57,120
Speaker 1: that Jordanaire's harmony. Songs will always exist. How you sell it.

472
00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:00,639
Speaker 1: Used to be a tracks, used to be in you

473
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,640
Speaker 1: used to spin it around on seventy eight eight tracks too,

474
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 1: you know, digital to now downloads. It's always going to

475
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,680
Speaker 1: have content. So what do I think of it? If

476
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:14,880
Speaker 1: the songs are great, I'm a big believer you use

477
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,719
Speaker 1: media to propel the songs. That's why I'm doing what

478
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 1: I'm doing at this age. I'm doing it because I

479
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,119
Speaker 1: get off on it. I love it, I understand it,

480
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:27,159
Speaker 1: I relate to it. And yeah, money is a byproduct

481
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,919
Speaker 1: of the work. You do the work, the money comes.

482
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:31,720
Speaker 1: I don't do it for the money. I do it

483
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 1: for the goose bumps. Once you have those, the money comes.

484
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 1: I make a lot of money, but I make the

485
00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: money doing good work. Okay, let's go a little deeper

486
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:45,160
Speaker 1: into the music itself. Okay, you made your bones in

487
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,640
Speaker 1: the rock era. What do you think of rock today

488
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:50,520
Speaker 1: and what do you think of hip hop and pop?

489
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:56,160
Speaker 1: I think if there's a story, whether it's rock, whether

490
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 1: it's bang your head, which became a social cultural thing.

491
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: And by the way, I had produced Tina Turner and

492
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 1: Paul Anka, which wasn't rock. Before I had mixed records

493
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 1: for Bobby Womack and Bobby Goldsboro. So I you know,

494
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 1: I had this great success as a rock producer, but

495
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 1: I'm a music producer. Working with Stevie Wonder with a

496
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: symphony orchestra, working with BB King. That's not rock. It's music,

497
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 1: and I'm all about the music and I care about it.

498
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,560
Speaker 1: Stephen Schwartz, his songs that he wrote for Pippen and

499
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: Godspell and Wicked, that's not rock, it's good music. I'm

500
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: a big fan of songs. Laura Nero, James Taylor, Elton,

501
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,280
Speaker 1: John Kat Stevens. Those are my favorite. Paul Simon is

502
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,479
Speaker 1: my favorite writer the history of my life, because when

503
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,320
Speaker 1: we all came to look for America, that was my story.

504
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 1: I was born in Germany. I came to America when

505
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 1: I was six. My kids are the firstborn propers in America,

506
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: so I'm all about it. And he epitomized the spirit

507
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 1: of coming to America in a song. I love Paul

508
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 1: Simon and I love songs. So what I think of

509
00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 1: the music business. I think Taylor Swift is a fine

510
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:10,719
Speaker 1: artist that she writes songs. I think there's some artists

511
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 1: that still harkened back to songs. I think riffs and rap.

512
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: If rap has a story to it, I did it.

513
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 1: I like anything that's storytelling. Okay, let's go back to

514
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 1: Quiet Riot. Warrener and his partner with the managers was

515
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 1: that David Jacob was his name or something like that.

516
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:34,480
Speaker 1: Warren was the sole manager. Warren used to be in

517
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 1: the grassroots and he he nderstood music, but now he

518
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: didn't partner. Maybe subsequently he partnered with others. But during

519
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: the Quiet Riot era, Warren was the manager. Okay, So

520
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: Quiet Riot was a local band Los Angeles had two

521
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 1: Japanese albums. How did you get involved? When I made

522
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 1: my label deal with CBS and Night One, I had

523
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 1: to have a day job because I was real poor

524
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:10,280
Speaker 1: coming up, so I was producing any money for the company.

525
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:15,320
Speaker 1: And I remember working for Clive that I went to

526
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: a concert that actually when we signed Pink Floyd. I

527
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 1: was drafting papers during the day and at night i'd

528
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 1: go out with Gilmore Waters. We went to Hammersmith and

529
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 1: I heard Slave, and I heard them invite the audience

530
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 1: to participate with songs like Mama, We're all crazy now

531
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 1: and you know, uh, come on Field a Noise, and

532
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: I thought, well, that just I remembered that. So on

533
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 1: this poor guy producing any money, not that poor anymore,

534
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 1: but I was producing it had this label deal. I

535
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: lost the window with Billy Thorpe because when those masters

536
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: got hung up in bankruptcy. I continued on Billy because

537
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 1: I built my relationship with the artists. We put on

538
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 1: a Thorpe record. It didn't do much, and I said,

539
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,120
Speaker 1: holy Ship. Yet mcough gave me this deal because he

540
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:04,760
Speaker 1: thought I had vision. What am I gonna do? I'm

541
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 1: driving around. I hear Police Rock Sand, I hear soft

542
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 1: Sell on the radio, very passive. Then I hear KHJ

543
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 1: radio playing come on Field the Noise, the oldie by Slave.

544
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 1: I said, holy Ship. That jumps right out of the radio.

545
00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: A friend of mine who was managing an epic band

546
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: called Molly Hatchett called Pat Armstrong. He said, are you

547
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 1: hip to this band that's doing? I said, friendly with

548
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 1: Patty wanted me to produce and stuff for him. I said,

549
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:35,720
Speaker 1: I need to find a band who can sing anthem

550
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:39,080
Speaker 1: participatory rock songs. He goes, there's this band playing the

551
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,840
Speaker 1: country club and resida. I'm an l a guy, and

552
00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 1: they sing those kind of songs. The lead singers Demonich.

553
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 1: He looks like a Marcel Mars character. So I said, okay,

554
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 1: you know what, Pat, you got credit with me. I

555
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 1: got in the car. I drove up one night to

556
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 1: the country club and there were six people in the audience,

557
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:00,800
Speaker 1: and there was this group called Why. They were called

558
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 1: do Bro, named after Kevin du Bro. Rudy Sarzo was

559
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 1: still working with Ozzie Osborne, playing bass for Ozzie. So

560
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 1: I listened to them and I hear party all night,

561
00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 1: I hear bang your head. I'm going, okay, if I

562
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 1: can convince these guys to do a cover, which I

563
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:24,560
Speaker 1: understood was really hard, and that's why the disconnect with

564
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:28,320
Speaker 1: Kevin I started day one. But I had a studio passion,

565
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 1: the one you were in and I saw after the show.

566
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 1: I went up to them and I said, I'm an

567
00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 1: ex Spenser proper. Kevin was a student of music. He said,

568
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 1: didn't you produce that Tina Turner album? I said yeah.

569
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,160
Speaker 1: He said, didn't you get involved with Billy Thorpe. I

570
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,120
Speaker 1: said yeah, I produced his records and I wrote Children

571
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: of the Sun with Billy. I'm that guy. He said, wow,

572
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 1: well that's cool. I said, hey, i'll produce you, but

573
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,360
Speaker 1: you need to do something for me. I'll do three

574
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 1: of your songs. I'll give you a studio time. You

575
00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: got to do a cover. He said, I hate slave

576
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,240
Speaker 1: their posers. I said, yeah, you might hate them, but

577
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: guess what. They had a number one record in England,

578
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:08,279
Speaker 1: and if you do a cover, it's congruent with all

579
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 1: your other songs. So he talked to Frankie Bennelli, the drummer,

580
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,759
Speaker 1: Carlos the guitar player. They couldn't get arrested. They've been

581
00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:18,919
Speaker 1: shot everywhere. They've all been turned down, poisoned, wrap. All

582
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,360
Speaker 1: these bands were totally rejected by the l A record

583
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 1: community because music was passive, you know, Duran Durant was happening.

584
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,280
Speaker 1: Cindy Labera girls just want to have fun. What's happening?

585
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 1: Heavy metal was not anywhere close. Black Sabboth couldn't get

586
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:38,760
Speaker 1: arrested them Pop radio okay. I took them into the studio. Uh.

587
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 1: I did it all on spec On on a weekend

588
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:44,160
Speaker 1: at my time. We recorded the first four songs, which

589
00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:46,879
Speaker 1: became the Metal Health Album. I dug it. I sink

590
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 1: to twenty four track machines together. I made it sound

591
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:51,840
Speaker 1: like we were in a stadium because I wanted to

592
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 1: replicate what I experienced was Slade. And I mixed, and

593
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: I called Tony Martell and Don Dempsey epic and I said, guys,

594
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:03,280
Speaker 1: we made a deal. My Thorpe record failed. I got something.

595
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 1: They said, oh, what do you got? I said, I

596
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: really believe in that. I believe it will connect with

597
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:10,919
Speaker 1: the street, it'll connect with the kids. I flew into

598
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:14,359
Speaker 1: New York. My hair was longer than yours currently, Bob,

599
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,080
Speaker 1: and certainly longer than mine. Was down to my shoulders.

600
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:20,839
Speaker 1: And I flew in to New York. I sat off

601
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:24,359
Speaker 1: in a conference room and I played the first four

602
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 1: songs on the Mental Health Album. By the second song,

603
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,040
Speaker 1: Tony Martell wrote me a note, We'll pay you the

604
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 1: full cost of the album. We hate this, we we

605
00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:38,320
Speaker 1: don't get it. Would you please not play the rest?

606
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: I wrote them back a note, I'm playing the four

607
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:43,040
Speaker 1: songs because I took the time to fly out of here.

608
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:46,239
Speaker 1: Listen to it. They listened to it. Then Tony said

609
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 1: to me, we'll give you. At the time, I had

610
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 1: seven My deal was seventy all in the in the

611
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 1: world for an album. It increased after that, but it

612
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,400
Speaker 1: was that so they gave. They made it commitment to me.

613
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 1: Zach Rolis was the lawyer who became the coachair of Universal,

614
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 1: and they paid me the seventy grand I then spent

615
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 1: six months shopping those four songs. Everybody I played it

616
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:13,959
Speaker 1: to hated it, turned it down, am it? Clive, mo Joe,

617
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 1: all the guys that you know. So I called the

618
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 1: Ethnic I'm revealing stuff that I didn't put in a book.

619
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 1: That I've written a book, and I'm not going to

620
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:25,440
Speaker 1: for a few years anyway. So I called Walter and

621
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 1: I said, you made a label deal with me because

622
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 1: you thought I had vision. I need you to put

623
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 1: out this, this quiet right thing. I need to finish

624
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:35,200
Speaker 1: the album. You paid me. You don't have to give

625
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:37,480
Speaker 1: me any more. Money, but I need to make the record,

626
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 1: he said, finished. I finished. Took me three weeks because

627
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 1: those days. Paul Simon spent three years making Bridge over

628
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:49,840
Speaker 1: Troubled Water. I spent three weeks making the Acquired Right album.

629
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:52,359
Speaker 1: I flew back to New York, I played it. They

630
00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: hated it even more. So, you know, it's the album

631
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: that's sold eight almost eight million copies at the time.

632
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 1: It would have million albums today. But anyway, so Walter

633
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:07,239
Speaker 1: did me a solid God rest his soul, and he

634
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:11,760
Speaker 1: put out four thousand records under miscellaneous Q. Well, Bob,

635
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:15,520
Speaker 1: you know when Cindy Lauber, when Michael Jackson's selling you

636
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:18,160
Speaker 1: and it's on thrill or four thousand under miscellaneous. Q

637
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 1: meets dick. Right. So what I did is I got

638
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,320
Speaker 1: on the plane and I went to the stations that

639
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:28,799
Speaker 1: took the Billy Thorpe record number one, and I went

640
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 1: to kat x Q and Dallas, to k M O

641
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 1: D and Tulsa, and I did interviews and they played

642
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 1: Bang your Head and the phones went perserved. To MTV's credit.

643
00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 1: Why I loved the Viacom MTV machine so much. They

644
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: were doing call out research and I got a call

645
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: from my friend of mine at the time, Les Garland,

646
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 1: or for Pittman. He said, you know, you got a

647
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:54,399
Speaker 1: record that's really tracking. And Tulsa case App and Sacramento

648
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 1: and kat x Q and d Alice km odeon tell Us,

649
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 1: I said, and kiss Sam Antonia. Those are the stations

650
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,520
Speaker 1: I went to interview times. So give me a video.

651
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:09,560
Speaker 1: So I called Martel and MC give me give me

652
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 1: a budget for video or whatever they cost. They said,

653
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 1: when you get to a hundred thousand units, call us okay.

654
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: So I said, you're wrong. This is the beginning of

655
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 1: me bucking the man. And I don't care. It's funny.

656
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 1: I didn't. I thought interview years ago I called me

657
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:30,000
Speaker 1: a renaissance disruptor. Why because I care about the music.

658
00:38:30,280 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 1: I don't care about what you Mr Sup think. What

659
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:35,720
Speaker 1: I care about is what the artists in the street

660
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,439
Speaker 1: and the kids and the public things. So I put

661
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:41,839
Speaker 1: a second on my house. I had a business card

662
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 1: that said Pasha CBS because I called my company Pasha

663
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: because I liked what the word meant. That started to

664
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:50,919
Speaker 1: saying letter as my last name, and I went out.

665
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,359
Speaker 1: I called every ad agency I knew because I thought

666
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: a video would be like an a commercial and there

667
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: was a director named Mark Ressica who was directing commercials,

668
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: but he was out of work and he was working

669
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 1: with a lady named Beth brod A who is subsequently

670
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: became a terrific film producer and doc producer. And I

671
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 1: got marked together. I put up the second of my house.

672
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: I went. I talked to the d N at cal

673
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:20,640
Speaker 1: Arts and I said, your kids can work on the video.

674
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:23,400
Speaker 1: Let me have your venue. It's a CBS because I

675
00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,200
Speaker 1: had a poscious CBS card, so I bullshitted him that

676
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:29,400
Speaker 1: this is a CBS thing, and he gave me access

677
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: to their gym. We made the doc. We used some

678
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:36,279
Speaker 1: techniques to make fifty kids look like five kids, and

679
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,200
Speaker 1: I didn't bypassed effect. I sent it directly to the

680
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 1: guys that MTV. To their credit, they put her on

681
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:45,240
Speaker 1: the air four Am, then two am, then twelve am,

682
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,279
Speaker 1: then ten pm. Then when it became a number one

683
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:53,480
Speaker 1: video after UM has video. All of a sudden, director

684
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:56,839
Speaker 1: and I told Warren, we need to image this band

685
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: as a metal band. They're a pop band, but let's

686
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:02,080
Speaker 1: put a out. And I had a relationship with Don

687
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 1: Arden because Don used to manage l O and I

688
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:08,720
Speaker 1: had brought el O from England when I was running

689
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 1: A and R at United Artists. So I got the

690
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 1: band out with Black Sabbath. Then when it was time

691
00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: for the next record to put out, and we put

692
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:20,880
Speaker 1: uct Bang Your Head. Didn't do much pop radio, but

693
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: come On, Feel the Noise. I thought that's the single,

694
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: so I serialized the video the Kid who Caught the Mask,

695
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 1: because we merchandise masks. I brought the album cover to

696
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:33,399
Speaker 1: life because there was a mask on the album cover.

697
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 1: Because every kid, it could be every kid and a

698
00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:38,160
Speaker 1: red leather strait jacket. He had to bust out of

699
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:41,240
Speaker 1: the room to rock right Bang your Head, that's the video.

700
00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:45,160
Speaker 1: So the kid who Caught the Mask in the first video,

701
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,799
Speaker 1: the mask was a crucifix over his bed. Come on

702
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,560
Speaker 1: Feel the Noise. The band appears there and they had

703
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,880
Speaker 1: to rock. The record went to number one. The record

704
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:58,520
Speaker 1: sold millions. Epic was my best friends. I renegotiated my

705
00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:01,920
Speaker 1: deal for a ten album put I retroactively got my

706
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:04,440
Speaker 1: royalties up to where they should have been. Because I

707
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,440
Speaker 1: know you're going to ask me about the business, but

708
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:10,640
Speaker 1: I gave the increase to the band. Why because I could,

709
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 1: because my half of it as partnered. I do partnership deals,

710
00:41:14,239 --> 00:41:17,360
Speaker 1: whether it be McClean dale, anybody I worked with, Schwartz.

711
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:21,520
Speaker 1: Why because they're invested. I'm invested. But we make money

712
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 1: if the work is good. I didn't make money on

713
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 1: quite right up front and made set. I actually lost money.

714
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:29,760
Speaker 1: But when it's sold, they made a lot of money.

715
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 1: You know why, because the work speaks. Okay, let's go

716
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:44,320
Speaker 1: a little bit slower, mental health Garland puts it on.

717
00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: At what point does Epic wake up or they don't

718
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:50,560
Speaker 1: wake up until come on feel the noise? Now they

719
00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 1: woke up when we started selling records because when the

720
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:58,400
Speaker 1: video hit, MTV would be a driver of attention and

721
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 1: the band was not on the road. Black Sabbath, who's

722
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:04,520
Speaker 1: doing some good stuff. They they have a wonderful machine,

723
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:09,879
Speaker 1: the Columbia record of the CBS distribution machine, Second and None.

724
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 1: They woke up and we didn't put up common Field

725
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,759
Speaker 1: a noise until the album sold five units. Then we

726
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:20,799
Speaker 1: started kicking and selling, having five days of five thousand them.

727
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 1: But now they woke up when the band did their

728
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 1: job on the road, when MTV did their job and

729
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:30,479
Speaker 1: the kids responded, and then they woke up and said,

730
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:34,439
Speaker 1: wait a minute, maybe this guy's right. Let's go back

731
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:40,319
Speaker 1: a chapter. Don Arden forget his daughter. He's got an

732
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,600
Speaker 1: interesting reputation. To what degree is it true? And what

733
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 1: were your experiences with him. He's passed away and he

734
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:49,800
Speaker 1: at Alzheimer's before, so it's not like you have to

735
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:53,680
Speaker 1: worry about retribution. I don't worry about retribution unless you're

736
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: a Republican. I didn't say that. Okay, um, here's a punchline.

737
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 1: Don was a gentleman to me because nobody United Artists

738
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:04,720
Speaker 1: in America would release Jeff Lynn or Roy Wood's Wizard

739
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 1: because it was too cool. I flew over to England

740
00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:09,759
Speaker 1: when I became head of an art and I heard

741
00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:11,719
Speaker 1: Jeff Lynn, I heard I can't get it out of

742
00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 1: my head. I heard El Dorado. I said, holy sh it,

743
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 1: this is cool. So I was able to because I

744
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 1: was in charge of twenty four years old at Ballston Steele.

745
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:24,960
Speaker 1: We put the record out. Don Arden became my new

746
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:29,400
Speaker 1: friend because you know, and so when it was time

747
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:33,520
Speaker 1: for Quiet Riot ten years later to find an act

748
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 1: to open for it was very logical because Don Arden

749
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 1: at the time when he was alive, he's he's a

750
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 1: real good manager, He knew his stuff. Did he threaten people?

751
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 1: Was he a tough guy? Did Bob Hoskins play the

752
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:51,080
Speaker 1: Don Arden role as the quasi mob guy? I don't know.

753
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:54,319
Speaker 1: He treated me with respect and therefore I can only

754
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:58,360
Speaker 1: say good things about him. May rest in peace. Okay,

755
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:00,120
Speaker 1: just because we worked with him, how did you end

756
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 1: up finding Dwayne Baron to work with you on the

757
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:06,600
Speaker 1: first Quiet Ride album? Because Dwayne worked for me. He

758
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:09,799
Speaker 1: actually picked up my laudry at the time, and he

759
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 1: was kind of a junior guy at my studio. When

760
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:17,440
Speaker 1: my very dear friend he's still next to me, Larry Brown,

761
00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:20,640
Speaker 1: had a health scare. He couldn't do the spec work

762
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 1: that I told you about on the weekend. So I

763
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:27,320
Speaker 1: asked Dwayne to join because I Dayne learned the engineering process.

764
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:30,440
Speaker 1: This is his first time at bat. He did a

765
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: great job, so I gave him the whole album to engineer.

766
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,279
Speaker 1: He built a career from that. Okay, let's stay with

767
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 1: Quiet Riot. They have this monster album. You know, they

768
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 1: paved the way for a lot of other acts. It's

769
00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 1: the heyday of MTV. How did the band react and

770
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 1: what happened on the second record when Kevin du Bro

771
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:53,520
Speaker 1: May he rest in peace. And I don't know I'm

772
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:56,600
Speaker 1: saying this shot off this big mouth that he was

773
00:44:56,680 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 1: better AUSSI is a phony. He is best rock artists

774
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:04,839
Speaker 1: in history. Seven and a half eight million records went

775
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: to two million on the second run, and radio started

776
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:12,240
Speaker 1: getting wise to not liking Kevin. How did the band react?

777
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:14,680
Speaker 1: They were pissed at Kevin. Ultimately they threw him out

778
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: of the band. How did I react? It hurt my

779
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 1: bottom line, but thank god it wasn't the only act

780
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:23,280
Speaker 1: that I was working with. But how did the band react?

781
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:27,800
Speaker 1: Kevin was not the best thing for He's a great singer,

782
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: he was a good showman, and he was an hassle Okay,

783
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 1: I mean Kevin who used to be around. It wasn't

784
00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 1: like he was hiding out ends up moving to Vegas, uh,

785
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,280
Speaker 1: drugging himself to death. I mean, there are some people

786
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:46,560
Speaker 1: you can see that coming. But I said, this guy

787
00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:49,000
Speaker 1: is like a suburban night What was the what was

788
00:45:49,080 --> 00:45:53,240
Speaker 1: going on there? I lost touch with them after the band,

789
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,720
Speaker 1: after Frankie and Carlos threw him out of the band,

790
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 1: we got a new singer named Paul Shortino made a

791
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:04,040
Speaker 1: quiet riot for album. Because I kept the brand alive.

792
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,359
Speaker 1: It didn't do what people expected. That was the end

793
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:10,840
Speaker 1: of my connectivity until they sued me for conspiring with

794
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:14,760
Speaker 1: CBS to steal the royalties because they were broken I wasn't,

795
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 1: and they lost. He got thrown out some rejudgment, the

796
00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:20,400
Speaker 1: only time I've actually been sued in my career. But

797
00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:23,320
Speaker 1: I lost touch with them. I don't know how Kevin

798
00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: imploded in Vegas. He was doing too many drugs earlier

799
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:30,799
Speaker 1: on all of them. Frankie actually not, but yeah, I mean,

800
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 1: Kevin is Kevin. I don't want to speak ill of anyone.

801
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 1: I just wanted to look at the future. I'm more

802
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 1: excited about working with the people i'm working with than

803
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:40,560
Speaker 1: the people I had. Although I had a good fortune

804
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:45,960
Speaker 1: Stevie Wonder, total gentleman, Little Riverband, Johnny Farnham, brilliant people,

805
00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 1: terrific eyes. I've had the good fortune to work with

806
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: some gentlemen, and I've had the good fortune or the

807
00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 1: bad fortune to work with some assholes. You brought up

808
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 1: the asshole Okay. As you mentioned earlier, you were born

809
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:04,160
Speaker 1: in Europe. What were the circumstances there? My parents were

810
00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:07,719
Speaker 1: in Auschwitz and broken out. I was born everyway. Let's

811
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,399
Speaker 1: let's stop there. They were literally in And how did

812
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:15,239
Speaker 1: my father survive Auschwitz? You're probably are going to ask

813
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:21,000
Speaker 1: me exactly. He was a brilliant chess player, and he

814
00:47:21,080 --> 00:47:24,840
Speaker 1: and his fellow inmates would carve little pieces of chess

815
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:27,920
Speaker 1: guys and they play the German guards. I learned this

816
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:31,400
Speaker 1: as a kid from my parents. Of course, the Germans

817
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 1: loved how Saul prophets Sorsky. That was my real name.

818
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,480
Speaker 1: If you look me up on Wikipedia, it isn't profit.

819
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 1: I'm a I'm a Polish Jew that was brought up

820
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 1: by Eastern European people who didn't speak English. Pretty cool,

821
00:47:46,120 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 1: and the Germans wanted to learn how to play chess

822
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:51,920
Speaker 1: as good as Saul. So he was that guy that

823
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:54,360
Speaker 1: taught some of the guards how to play. One of

824
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 1: them even I'll never forget my dad told me in Yiddish,

825
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:00,000
Speaker 1: because I grew up speaking German and Jewish to my parents,

826
00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:02,840
Speaker 1: he said, I'm going to play the fuel now that

827
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,960
Speaker 1: I know how to checkmate. You know whatever. The point

828
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:11,560
Speaker 1: assault survived, he my mother made it through. They ultimately

829
00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:14,160
Speaker 1: moved to Germany. They were a little bit, a little

830
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 1: bit slower. How long were each of them in the

831
00:48:16,640 --> 00:48:23,960
Speaker 1: camps five years wow. And they Okay, where did they?

832
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 1: Where were they in Poland? And what were their circumstances

833
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 1: before the war? My father they were in Slomnicki Pole,

834
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:34,720
Speaker 1: in the small village where I actually had my younger

835
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:38,040
Speaker 1: son have his bar mitzvah. I found that temple that

836
00:48:38,120 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: my dad had his bar mitsvan in this little village

837
00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:45,080
Speaker 1: thirty kilometers outside of Krako. That's where my parents are from.

838
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:47,879
Speaker 1: And so your parents knew each other before they went

839
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:52,560
Speaker 1: into the camps. My father's best friend was my mother's

840
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:58,160
Speaker 1: first husband. His name was Michael Novotny. Michael went into

841
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:02,200
Speaker 1: the camps too. He was killed, he was gassed. They

842
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:07,120
Speaker 1: had a son named ben Oh Barry in English my stepbrother.

843
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:12,319
Speaker 1: In ninety eight he left, Uh Well, he got out

844
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 1: of the camps when they were liberated. He went to

845
00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:18,439
Speaker 1: Israel to fight for Israeli independence. He wounded up being

846
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,960
Speaker 1: at the top of Israeli intelligence. Had passed away nineteen

847
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 1: seventy two. So next year, seventy fifth anniversary of Israel's independence,

848
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:29,840
Speaker 1: I'm also working with a few friends of mine to

849
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:34,600
Speaker 1: produce a special on the seventy fifth anniversary of Israel's independence.

850
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:38,240
Speaker 1: It parallels mine. I'm gonna spend my seventy fifth birthday

851
00:49:38,239 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 1: in Jerusalem, Tel Aviv and Haifa next year. Okay, what

852
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:47,440
Speaker 1: economic circumstances did your parents come from before the war? Poor?

853
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:51,879
Speaker 1: Poor and poor. My father made twenty bucks a week

854
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 1: when he came to America after he exhausted the few

855
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:57,879
Speaker 1: dollars that he had made. He and my mother were

856
00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:01,960
Speaker 1: really smart, so they opened a shop in Munich selling

857
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:06,839
Speaker 1: feather beds and quilts, and with a partner, my dad

858
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:10,280
Speaker 1: cashed out of that. He brought everything to America because

859
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,440
Speaker 1: he didn't want his only kid, I was born after

860
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:15,359
Speaker 1: the war to grow up and post war Germany. We

861
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:17,680
Speaker 1: went to a movie once when I was five years old,

862
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:21,960
Speaker 1: and the graffiti on the wall box was Juden and

863
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:26,880
Speaker 1: Hunt Hunt. It's like Hunton Uton for voting, juice and

864
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 1: dogs forbidden. My dad broke down and started to cry,

865
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:33,480
Speaker 1: and he said he didn't want his only son to

866
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:36,360
Speaker 1: grow up in Germany. So we packed it up. We

867
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: took the vote over, We did the Elis Island thing.

868
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:41,440
Speaker 1: Lived in New York. But wait a little bit, wait, wait, love,

869
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:43,800
Speaker 1: It's flow down for a second. The war is over.

870
00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: How do your parents find each other? They knew each

871
00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:51,480
Speaker 1: other in Slomniki, Poland because my mother's husband was my

872
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:54,160
Speaker 1: dad's best right. But there was a whole issue after

873
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:57,760
Speaker 1: the war of literally reconstructing and finding people, taking ads

874
00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 1: in Jewish newspapers, etcetera. The have any idea how they reconnected? No,

875
00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:07,239
Speaker 1: wasn't there. I do know that I'm a product of

876
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:10,640
Speaker 1: their love, and nothing I love more in my life

877
00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:13,759
Speaker 1: than my parents who came to America. Like Paul Simon said,

878
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 1: they how came to look for America. That's my story.

879
00:51:17,760 --> 00:51:19,680
Speaker 1: I came here when I was six years old. Okay,

880
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:21,400
Speaker 1: so you came here when you're sick. Do you have

881
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:27,239
Speaker 1: any memories of living in Munich? Just the graffiti on

882
00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:30,200
Speaker 1: the wall and my dad cried just playing with my

883
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:34,880
Speaker 1: German Shepherd dog because my parents wanted me to have

884
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:38,120
Speaker 1: a dog. My son, Sterling, has a new shepherd. My

885
00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:40,960
Speaker 1: two kids grew up with German shepherd's. I'm a I'm

886
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:44,840
Speaker 1: a dog guy. Judy, my my wife, my best friend

887
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:48,759
Speaker 1: loves dogs too, but we had pugs. They just passed away.

888
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 1: But anyway, do I have any recollection? Answer your question? Okay,

889
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: you get the Alice island. Is that where the name

890
00:51:56,239 --> 00:52:00,360
Speaker 1: is changed or when is the name changed? My parents

891
00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 1: didn't speak English. I did okay in school. We lived

892
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:06,279
Speaker 1: in Albuquerque. We moved to l A when I was ten.

893
00:52:06,680 --> 00:52:12,720
Speaker 1: They became naturalized citizens when I turned sixteen. My dad said,

894
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:16,319
Speaker 1: do we do you want to Sammy? Because they called

895
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:20,399
Speaker 1: me Sammy if you look my My Polish name was

896
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:23,839
Speaker 1: German name was Solid and Samuel is the name I

897
00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 1: was going to school with. And I had my bar

898
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 1: missi a ring that said sp So my dad said,

899
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:32,880
Speaker 1: this is an opportunity if we get our citizenship. At

900
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:35,960
Speaker 1: the age of sixteen, Well, my favorite actor at the

901
00:52:36,040 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: time I started becoming pretty tuned into things with Spencer

902
00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:42,960
Speaker 1: Tracy and they hurt. The win started with an s.

903
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 1: My favorite band was Steve Uh Spencer Davis Group with

904
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:50,560
Speaker 1: Stevie one would say keep on Running, one of my

905
00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:53,839
Speaker 1: favorite songs of all time. So I decided Sam could

906
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:58,680
Speaker 1: become Spencer Proffitt need Profits Sorsky needed to be shortened

907
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:01,080
Speaker 1: because I didn't want to go through my life with

908
00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 1: the name Sam Profsky, which is what I started high

909
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 1: school with. So Spencer my bar mr Ring sp Sam

910
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:12,560
Speaker 1: Profit Sursky became Spencer Proffer. When I turned sixteen, which

911
00:53:12,600 --> 00:53:18,240
Speaker 1: is when the name champion. Okay, you go through Ellis Island.

912
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:22,520
Speaker 1: Did you have any relatives? Where did your parents start

913
00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:25,400
Speaker 1: a hundred percent fresh? You were in New York for?

914
00:53:25,440 --> 00:53:27,480
Speaker 1: How long and how did you end up in Albuquerque?

915
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:30,600
Speaker 1: Six weeks in New York. The only Jews my parents

916
00:53:30,680 --> 00:53:34,160
Speaker 1: knew from Poland lived in Albuquerque. So we took a train.

917
00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:36,799
Speaker 1: We are in New York for six weeks just to

918
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 1: get our bearings. Stayed in a hotel. I have a

919
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:43,640
Speaker 1: few memories of that, and we took a train to Albuquerque.

920
00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:45,440
Speaker 1: I got the ship beat out of me as a

921
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 1: kid going to school. In my first day at school,

922
00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:51,760
Speaker 1: my mom wanted a little girl. I were later hosen.

923
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:57,600
Speaker 1: I didn't speak English and there were many wonderful Hispanic

924
00:53:58,120 --> 00:54:01,440
Speaker 1: and Indian people there who thought that I was somebody

925
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:03,640
Speaker 1: who could get beat up on. So they beat up

926
00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:07,280
Speaker 1: on me. And that's that was my first experience in America.

927
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:12,080
Speaker 1: How long did you live in Albuquerque? Four years? And

928
00:54:12,280 --> 00:54:15,840
Speaker 1: were although you have these Jewish friends, how many Jews

929
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:19,680
Speaker 1: were in Albuquerque? Very few? And did you feel the

930
00:54:19,719 --> 00:54:28,120
Speaker 1: anti semitism totally? And usually children of immigrants certainly Jewish

931
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:31,360
Speaker 1: parents want their children to do very well in school?

932
00:54:31,360 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 1: Did you feel that pressure all day? That's why I

933
00:54:34,040 --> 00:54:36,600
Speaker 1: got my PA at twenty That's why I passed the

934
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:40,280
Speaker 1: bar twenty three. But at the same time, I love music.

935
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:44,279
Speaker 1: I started playing guitar when I was fifteen sixteen. I

936
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:46,760
Speaker 1: used to with my buddy, who went to med school,

937
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:52,440
Speaker 1: right songs, to beat the lyrics, right um lyrics, to

938
00:54:52,560 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 1: beatle melodies, and I wanted to do that. I started

939
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 1: a band with my buddy and we got signed. We

940
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,840
Speaker 1: had four different record deals, ultimately signed by Clive Davis

941
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 1: to Columbia Records. That's how I met Clive. That's how

942
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:09,920
Speaker 1: I got that job. While I was last Okay, what

943
00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:12,480
Speaker 1: are your parents doing for a living in Albuquerque and

944
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:16,279
Speaker 1: what is their motivation to move to Los Angeles. My

945
00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:21,400
Speaker 1: mother was not super well physically. She was a house like.

946
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:25,240
Speaker 1: My father fixed sewing machines and made twenty dollars a week.

947
00:55:25,760 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 1: He worked for Brother International, and he was he saw

948
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:34,640
Speaker 1: one of the kindest, nicest, most wonderful guys. He was

949
00:55:34,719 --> 00:55:38,000
Speaker 1: so good at his craft. He was so meticulous, like

950
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:43,400
Speaker 1: he approached Chessie approach fixing sewing machines. When brother International

951
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:47,520
Speaker 1: set up their offices in Los Angeles, saw that transferred

952
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 1: to be a mechanic in Los Angeles. We moved to

953
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:52,120
Speaker 1: l A to Broil Heights, to the heart of the

954
00:55:52,160 --> 00:55:56,919
Speaker 1: Jewish gatop. Okay, at what point, into what degree did

955
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:01,920
Speaker 1: your parents end up speaking English? And since you know,

956
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:04,400
Speaker 1: the other thing is they probably didn't understand what your

957
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:08,839
Speaker 1: life was about. And to what degree did you uh

958
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:11,680
Speaker 1: exercise freedoms that if they knew what was going on,

959
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 1: they probably wouldn't have approved. I'll tell you a funny story.

960
00:56:15,719 --> 00:56:17,920
Speaker 1: The first time I got whipped by my dad with

961
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 1: the belt. Okay, first of all, they started speaking broken English.

962
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:26,960
Speaker 1: I enrolled them in night school because I started supporting

963
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:28,880
Speaker 1: my folks when I was thirteen years old. That's a

964
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:32,480
Speaker 1: long story. I started selling newspaper subscriptions. I started making

965
00:56:32,520 --> 00:56:34,799
Speaker 1: out hunter bucks a week. I would help my dad

966
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:38,000
Speaker 1: buy the food. We go to Canador's Delly every Sunday week,

967
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:40,359
Speaker 1: buy holi weet, buy egg bread, We buy all kinds

968
00:56:40,400 --> 00:56:43,879
Speaker 1: of stuff to eat for the week. But I'll never

969
00:56:44,040 --> 00:56:50,040
Speaker 1: forget my dad playing chess at a park and with

970
00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,800
Speaker 1: these other refugees from Poland, and they had a daughter

971
00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:56,880
Speaker 1: who was twelve, and I was twelve, and I wound

972
00:56:56,920 --> 00:57:01,839
Speaker 1: up in the bushes with the daughter, and and all

973
00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:03,799
Speaker 1: I can say is when I got home that night,

974
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:07,120
Speaker 1: I got beat up by my dad, Sammy, how dare

975
00:57:07,160 --> 00:57:10,399
Speaker 1: you go into the whatever? So but my parents were

976
00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:14,399
Speaker 1: wonderful parents. They were the biggest influence on me spiritually

977
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:18,919
Speaker 1: and ethically than any human could ever be. And that's

978
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:23,120
Speaker 1: why I have such a strong immigrant dreamer mentality. That's

979
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:26,560
Speaker 1: why I'm such a fan of the current administration. I

980
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 1: love Michelle Obama, Barack Obama. They were two of my

981
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:33,800
Speaker 1: favorite presidents. And anybody who's about immigrants against immigrants and

982
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:36,400
Speaker 1: dreamers is not the sight of the coin that I

983
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:40,120
Speaker 1: grew up. Okay, and you end up going to high

984
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:43,120
Speaker 1: school where fair facts? I Well, you've got a fair

985
00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:45,640
Speaker 1: faxx I. You know, a fountain right there on Melrose,

986
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:50,520
Speaker 1: a fountain of music legends. What kind of student were you?

987
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:53,520
Speaker 1: I mean, not only academically? Were you were good? Were

988
00:57:53,560 --> 00:57:56,440
Speaker 1: you popular? Did you have a lot of friends or

989
00:57:56,440 --> 00:57:58,040
Speaker 1: did you go home and study? What were we like?

990
00:57:59,640 --> 00:58:02,560
Speaker 1: I was popular, I was smart, I was class president.

991
00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:06,160
Speaker 1: I was playing sports. I was at an all city

992
00:58:06,200 --> 00:58:10,600
Speaker 1: football quarterback and I had a couple of girlfriends and

993
00:58:10,800 --> 00:58:13,439
Speaker 1: I got right into u c l A right after

994
00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:16,680
Speaker 1: at the age of seventeen. And what was your experience

995
00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:20,280
Speaker 1: like at u c l A. Fabulous. I love the campus,

996
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:23,560
Speaker 1: but I had to work. My dad had a heart attack.

997
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,080
Speaker 1: He didn't speak good English. I bought him a liquor

998
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:30,200
Speaker 1: store on Washington Boulevard and Culver City. What I would

999
00:58:30,240 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 1: do at u c l AS, I'd go to I'd

1000
00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:35,480
Speaker 1: opened the store, drive down with my dad, then go

1001
00:58:35,560 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 1: because that was Culver City, U c l AS and westward.

1002
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:41,160
Speaker 1: I'd go do my classes. Then I would go teach

1003
00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:44,800
Speaker 1: young kids guitar, make a few bucks doing that. Then

1004
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 1: at the end of the day come back. My dad

1005
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:50,440
Speaker 1: would be sitting across the counter, just selling liquor and stuff.

1006
00:58:50,520 --> 00:58:53,520
Speaker 1: I bring him home. That was my life for about

1007
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:56,040
Speaker 1: three years until my god, my dad got too sick

1008
00:58:56,080 --> 00:59:00,120
Speaker 1: to do that. Then we sold the liquor store. Ok A,

1009
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:07,320
Speaker 1: you were in the sixties, you know there's an explosion

1010
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:11,160
Speaker 1: of music, certainly Los Angeles, never mind in UK and

1011
00:59:11,160 --> 00:59:13,840
Speaker 1: the rest of the world. You are in the heart

1012
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:17,560
Speaker 1: of the action. Do you feel it? Into what degree

1013
00:59:17,880 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 1: are you embracing it? I felt that I loved it.

1014
00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:27,240
Speaker 1: I had a girlfriend whose boyfriend Lucien Clark, who was

1015
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:30,880
Speaker 1: the lead singer of the Birds, so I would I

1016
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 1: met Jean, I met Roger mcgwen, I met all those guys,

1017
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:37,280
Speaker 1: so I was able to get into Ceros the night

1018
00:59:37,560 --> 00:59:42,080
Speaker 1: June one nine when they played Tambourine Man, which was

1019
00:59:42,200 --> 00:59:44,919
Speaker 1: their big cover that blew it up, blew up. I

1020
00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:48,200
Speaker 1: was kind of there when Elliott l I seen. I

1021
00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:50,880
Speaker 1: was a big, tall kid. I was smart enough to

1022
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:54,040
Speaker 1: talk my way into the Troubadour and I loved that

1023
00:59:54,240 --> 00:59:57,520
Speaker 1: early music. That's where Elton first. I saw Elton John

1024
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:00,960
Speaker 1: when he was brought over Rostrigan brought him over on UNI.

1025
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:04,840
Speaker 1: That's when I saw Crosby Stillson, Nash Jackson, Brown, Carol King.

1026
01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:08,240
Speaker 1: I embraced it all. I loved Steven Stills. For what

1027
01:00:08,360 --> 01:00:11,440
Speaker 1: It's Worth was one of my favorite songs of all time.

1028
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:14,000
Speaker 1: So for me as a kid growing up with this,

1029
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:17,320
Speaker 1: it really rang my belt. My parents didn't know shift

1030
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 1: from Shinola about what any of that was. But I

1031
01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:23,000
Speaker 1: was a good boy because I did good in school

1032
01:00:23,120 --> 01:00:26,280
Speaker 1: and I supported them, But more importantly, I loved them

1033
01:00:26,360 --> 01:00:28,960
Speaker 1: and they loved me. That to me permeated my soul

1034
01:00:29,040 --> 01:00:32,960
Speaker 1: for the rest of my life. Okay, now simultaneous who

1035
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:35,560
Speaker 1: you were playing the guitar and trying to make it

1036
01:00:35,600 --> 01:00:40,440
Speaker 1: as an artist. Yes, I had a record deal on MGM.

1037
01:00:40,480 --> 01:00:43,760
Speaker 1: I had a record deal on ABC Dundehill. I actually

1038
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,480
Speaker 1: had a single out that I used for a TV

1039
01:00:46,520 --> 01:00:48,919
Speaker 1: show I wrote music for called the Hardy Boys, called

1040
01:00:49,040 --> 01:00:52,160
Speaker 1: Namby Pamby and the Days of the United Food com

1041
01:00:52,200 --> 01:00:54,720
Speaker 1: Company and me I got love on my comming. I

1042
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:57,400
Speaker 1: had a single that I sang and played guitar and

1043
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:01,360
Speaker 1: called Namby Pamby, You're Sweeter and Candy. Anyway, I had

1044
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:04,880
Speaker 1: these record deals until I started getting influenced by Edison

1045
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:07,880
Speaker 1: Lighthouse member My Baby Loves Love and some of those songs.

1046
01:01:08,160 --> 01:01:11,080
Speaker 1: So I put a band together where I was the

1047
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:14,240
Speaker 1: lead guitar guy and I wrote the songs with my buddy.

1048
01:01:14,400 --> 01:01:16,720
Speaker 1: But I found a good singer named Joe Reid. So

1049
01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:19,120
Speaker 1: I had a band of signed the Clive Sign called

1050
01:01:19,160 --> 01:01:22,640
Speaker 1: Proper Marmal's at Read and we had a record that

1051
01:01:22,760 --> 01:01:27,520
Speaker 1: went I think with an anchor and and But that

1052
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:30,919
Speaker 1: was like my first real not real record deal, because

1053
01:01:30,920 --> 01:01:33,320
Speaker 1: I had three record deals before that. But that was

1054
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 1: the first time that it was really kind of cool.

1055
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:38,840
Speaker 1: And when I met Clive, to his credit, I auditioned

1056
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:42,160
Speaker 1: for him at the Beverly Hills Hotel. And the lawyers

1057
01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:44,160
Speaker 1: that I got to work for me, that's a long

1058
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 1: story on how I got them. Actually, he said to Clive,

1059
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:49,280
Speaker 1: this guy is doing well in law school. I was

1060
01:01:49,360 --> 01:01:51,720
Speaker 1: executive editor of Law Review. You know what that means.

1061
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:54,400
Speaker 1: I was published. I was one of these kind of

1062
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:58,600
Speaker 1: overachiever guys, which I still am to my detriment. So

1063
01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:01,000
Speaker 1: why I had talked too much? I worked too hard.

1064
01:02:01,240 --> 01:02:03,880
Speaker 1: I care too much. But you know what, when I

1065
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:06,000
Speaker 1: leave this planet, at least I will have had a

1066
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 1: great run. Let's go back to the initial three record deals.

1067
01:02:17,160 --> 01:02:20,680
Speaker 1: How does a little you know, a little picture. You

1068
01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:25,880
Speaker 1: know what. I end up getting a record deal because

1069
01:02:26,560 --> 01:02:30,920
Speaker 1: I'm a smart little pisher and I was a decent

1070
01:02:30,960 --> 01:02:36,240
Speaker 1: looking pisher who had girlfriends whose bosses worked at some companies.

1071
01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:39,600
Speaker 1: And that's how I wound up getting her Albert deal

1072
01:02:39,680 --> 01:02:42,800
Speaker 1: on her breast to cover one of my songs. Because

1073
01:02:42,840 --> 01:02:47,160
Speaker 1: I was dating Don Costa's assistant, and Don Costa was

1074
01:02:47,200 --> 01:02:52,000
Speaker 1: a major major guy was producing Sinatra, and I went

1075
01:02:52,040 --> 01:02:55,160
Speaker 1: to a Sinatra session just as a fan way back

1076
01:02:55,200 --> 01:02:58,880
Speaker 1: at our c a on sunset, way back and the

1077
01:02:58,960 --> 01:03:01,880
Speaker 1: session finished early, and my buddy and I, who had

1078
01:03:01,880 --> 01:03:04,760
Speaker 1: written songs for pro from almost Ad and Reid, had

1079
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:08,480
Speaker 1: written this instrumental thing, so don let me have this

1080
01:03:08,680 --> 01:03:11,840
Speaker 1: three hour sessions, you know, union sessions, so don let

1081
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:15,400
Speaker 1: me have I made up the court chart. I gave

1082
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:17,840
Speaker 1: it to the guys. We did it. That was my demo,

1083
01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:21,360
Speaker 1: pretty good. And I read that Chuck k was the

1084
01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:25,680
Speaker 1: guy running Irving Almo Publishing, and I kind of bullshitted

1085
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 1: my way into saying, hey, I have a song for

1086
01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:31,360
Speaker 1: her Bralbert blah blah blah. I got in. I brought

1087
01:03:31,400 --> 01:03:35,320
Speaker 1: the demo, which was used the Sinatra musicians, and he said,

1088
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:38,320
Speaker 1: you got anything else? Because Chuck is a really smart guy.

1089
01:03:38,520 --> 01:03:42,040
Speaker 1: He ran a really great publishing company. Subsequently, I think

1090
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:45,560
Speaker 1: he became president of Warner Chapel. Really good guy. And

1091
01:03:45,720 --> 01:03:48,160
Speaker 1: I said yeah. So I went to the car, I

1092
01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:50,920
Speaker 1: got my guitar and I sang the song called Picture

1093
01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:54,320
Speaker 1: Postcard that I had just written. He said, Gary Lewis

1094
01:03:54,360 --> 01:03:57,680
Speaker 1: and the Playboys are doing a new album. They just

1095
01:03:57,800 --> 01:04:00,160
Speaker 1: had a hit with Rhythm of the Rain. I need

1096
01:04:00,200 --> 01:04:03,520
Speaker 1: to call snuff Garrett let him hear the song, so

1097
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:06,480
Speaker 1: he calls, he holds up the phone. I get my guitar,

1098
01:04:06,680 --> 01:04:09,480
Speaker 1: I sing, I play it. Within two days, I was

1099
01:04:09,520 --> 01:04:12,600
Speaker 1: in my first recording studio, producing my first demo. This

1100
01:04:12,680 --> 01:04:16,280
Speaker 1: was when I was eighteen years old. When do you

1101
01:04:16,320 --> 01:04:22,720
Speaker 1: give up the dream of being an artist? Ship? When

1102
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:26,160
Speaker 1: Clive offered me a choice of picking up my option

1103
01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:29,280
Speaker 1: or taking a job, and I knew I couldn't sing

1104
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:34,000
Speaker 1: for Ship. I was twenty three years old. Okay, So

1105
01:04:34,240 --> 01:04:37,080
Speaker 1: at what point do you decide you're going to go

1106
01:04:37,160 --> 01:04:39,720
Speaker 1: to law school? Was that something your parents instilled in

1107
01:04:39,760 --> 01:04:45,520
Speaker 1: you from a young age. Yes, and the fact that

1108
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:49,520
Speaker 1: I would kind of logically do a lot of my

1109
01:04:49,920 --> 01:04:53,440
Speaker 1: deals or look at the paper, and I kind of

1110
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:57,200
Speaker 1: thought that could be good. Of course, my mother wanted, Sammy,

1111
01:04:57,280 --> 01:04:58,680
Speaker 1: you got to go to law school. You've got to

1112
01:04:58,680 --> 01:05:01,720
Speaker 1: be a lawyer. You know that good Jewish ethic. And

1113
01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:04,560
Speaker 1: I applied and I got in, so I decided I

1114
01:05:04,560 --> 01:05:06,720
Speaker 1: would go. But I still kick my band. You'll think

1115
01:05:06,760 --> 01:05:08,880
Speaker 1: this stop. My third year in law school, I have

1116
01:05:08,960 --> 01:05:12,919
Speaker 1: a scholarship and I already knew I had my job

1117
01:05:13,120 --> 01:05:15,520
Speaker 1: with Clive because Clive offered me the job. I was

1118
01:05:15,520 --> 01:05:17,640
Speaker 1: in my second year, so my third year, I just

1119
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:19,600
Speaker 1: needed to get through and I was doing real good

1120
01:05:19,600 --> 01:05:22,160
Speaker 1: as the top five percent of my class. I hired

1121
01:05:22,200 --> 01:05:25,880
Speaker 1: people to take my class, the classes to do notes.

1122
01:05:26,160 --> 01:05:28,240
Speaker 1: I go on the road with my band. Then i'd

1123
01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:30,400
Speaker 1: come back and I take the test. Believe me, I

1124
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:34,480
Speaker 1: dropped my standing. But I kind of knew that I

1125
01:05:34,640 --> 01:05:36,960
Speaker 1: was just crazy. Gain how I passed the bar the

1126
01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:40,040
Speaker 1: first time. I have no idea, but I did. And

1127
01:05:40,160 --> 01:05:41,680
Speaker 1: I moved to New York because I knew I had

1128
01:05:41,720 --> 01:05:44,640
Speaker 1: my job at CBS. Okay, so how long do you

1129
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:47,240
Speaker 1: work at CBS and what exactly you doing? Your drafting

1130
01:05:47,240 --> 01:05:50,920
Speaker 1: contracts anything else? Yeah, I was a shadow. I was

1131
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:54,840
Speaker 1: listening to mixes, I was drafting contracts. I had a

1132
01:05:54,920 --> 01:05:58,640
Speaker 1: title as an assistant director of business Affairs, so budget wise,

1133
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:02,600
Speaker 1: they could pay me through particular pipe. Clive got blown out,

1134
01:06:02,760 --> 01:06:04,880
Speaker 1: you know, the whole scandal. My office was down in

1135
01:06:04,920 --> 01:06:09,000
Speaker 1: the hall. My dad had another heart attack, addressed his soul,

1136
01:06:09,480 --> 01:06:11,840
Speaker 1: and I wanted to move back to California's living in

1137
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:15,960
Speaker 1: New York in an apartment and actually a brownstone that

1138
01:06:16,480 --> 01:06:19,880
Speaker 1: was owned by a photographer who was Jean Shrtmann's photographer

1139
01:06:19,880 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 1: and I had dated her for a minute. That was crazy.

1140
01:06:22,600 --> 01:06:25,720
Speaker 1: But anyway, long story short, I wanted to come back

1141
01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:31,760
Speaker 1: to California, so Erwin Siegelstein became the president of CBS,

1142
01:06:31,800 --> 01:06:34,000
Speaker 1: and they didn't want to lose me because they thought

1143
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:36,160
Speaker 1: I knew what I was doing, so they offered me

1144
01:06:36,200 --> 01:06:39,320
Speaker 1: a big gig in San Francisco. While I was there,

1145
01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:41,560
Speaker 1: I wanted to come back to oh I because that's

1146
01:06:41,600 --> 01:06:44,240
Speaker 1: where my parents lived. We sold the liquor store, so

1147
01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 1: I started putting the word out. A guy named Mike

1148
01:06:47,360 --> 01:06:51,240
Speaker 1: Stewart was chairman of the United Artists Records at the time,

1149
01:06:51,680 --> 01:06:54,280
Speaker 1: and he saw that I was looking for a job,

1150
01:06:54,480 --> 01:06:56,760
Speaker 1: so I had an interview. He gave me the job

1151
01:06:56,800 --> 01:06:59,400
Speaker 1: on the spot to be his number two guys twenty

1152
01:06:59,440 --> 01:07:02,600
Speaker 1: four years old. So guess what. I didn't take the

1153
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:05,760
Speaker 1: CBS San Francisco job. I took the job to be

1154
01:07:05,960 --> 01:07:08,920
Speaker 1: head of at our national executive director of the company.

1155
01:07:09,240 --> 01:07:12,000
Speaker 1: Stewart thought he was getting a clone, Clive clone. I'm

1156
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:14,400
Speaker 1: not a Clive clone. Clive is his own guy in

1157
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:16,640
Speaker 1: his own right, but he was a big mentor to

1158
01:07:16,680 --> 01:07:19,000
Speaker 1: me and I respect the shift out of him. Sorry

1159
01:07:19,000 --> 01:07:22,280
Speaker 1: to use such good words. But I'm a rock guy

1160
01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:26,120
Speaker 1: through and through anyway. So the answer to your question

1161
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:29,520
Speaker 1: is I took the gig at U A and that

1162
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:32,880
Speaker 1: lasted until Transamerica sold the company. That I okay, wait

1163
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,160
Speaker 1: wait wait, wait a little bit slower. So what's your

1164
01:07:35,200 --> 01:07:39,479
Speaker 1: take on Clive? I think Clive is brilliant. I think

1165
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:43,480
Speaker 1: Clive said to me after the debicot that happened at

1166
01:07:43,520 --> 01:07:46,960
Speaker 1: CBS that since the guys that he had meantor be

1167
01:07:47,080 --> 01:07:49,760
Speaker 1: at Dick ash Er Walker at the coff they had

1168
01:07:49,760 --> 01:07:52,560
Speaker 1: their best quarter ever when Clive left. But I give

1169
01:07:52,560 --> 01:07:55,440
Speaker 1: it as a tribute to Clive and his spirit and

1170
01:07:55,640 --> 01:07:59,120
Speaker 1: his way with artists when he had started ariston. So

1171
01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:02,640
Speaker 1: I'm a at Clive Davids stand. I have a different style.

1172
01:08:03,240 --> 01:08:06,680
Speaker 1: I'm different. I come from the music. But the point is,

1173
01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:08,880
Speaker 1: what's my take on Clive. I have a lot of

1174
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:11,520
Speaker 1: respect to Clive David's. Okay, you go to U A

1175
01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:14,720
Speaker 1: U A at the time is this is before it

1176
01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:18,519
Speaker 1: ends up being merged in the Capital with R you know,

1177
01:08:18,760 --> 01:08:24,240
Speaker 1: with Artie Mogul already Mogul, etcetera, etcetera. So it's a

1178
01:08:24,280 --> 01:08:31,240
Speaker 1: relatively moribund company. So that's a big change from CBS Records. Secondly,

1179
01:08:32,680 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 1: Mike hires you as an A and R guy. You're

1180
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:38,439
Speaker 1: not gonna do any business affairs now. I'm gonna be

1181
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:41,800
Speaker 1: almost like a GM. So Harold Cider ahead of business

1182
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:45,479
Speaker 1: affairs would interface with me, the marketing people would, the

1183
01:08:45,479 --> 01:08:48,839
Speaker 1: promote people would. Ultimately the guy who's had a promote,

1184
01:08:48,880 --> 01:08:52,280
Speaker 1: Ray Anderson, went to work for me when I started Passion, Okay,

1185
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:55,240
Speaker 1: I pulled him out of that. So what I did

1186
01:08:55,280 --> 01:08:58,639
Speaker 1: and how I dealt with this moribound company. As I

1187
01:08:58,680 --> 01:09:02,360
Speaker 1: went and listened to re record and every artist that

1188
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:05,599
Speaker 1: was on the roster, most of which were sleeping, That's

1189
01:09:05,640 --> 01:09:09,080
Speaker 1: when I heard that the English company had Hawkwind, they

1190
01:09:09,120 --> 01:09:13,160
Speaker 1: had Roy Woods Wizard, they had electric light orchestra. I

1191
01:09:13,240 --> 01:09:15,799
Speaker 1: said to Mike Store, I gotta get on a plane,

1192
01:09:15,880 --> 01:09:19,280
Speaker 1: I gotta go here. What else This guy Andrew Africans

1193
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:23,360
Speaker 1: last night had an are in English Company. But during

1194
01:09:23,400 --> 01:09:26,479
Speaker 1: the day I would do the Anar gig. I would

1195
01:09:26,520 --> 01:09:29,599
Speaker 1: deal with the guys that war Cherry Old, Steven, Steve Gold.

1196
01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:32,120
Speaker 1: I had all that good fortune to get to do

1197
01:09:32,160 --> 01:09:34,600
Speaker 1: that gig. But at night I put my hands on

1198
01:09:34,760 --> 01:09:37,599
Speaker 1: every record I could as a producer, because I come

1199
01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 1: from the music so I had a dual job. I

1200
01:09:40,320 --> 01:09:42,880
Speaker 1: had eleven records in the top fifty and eighteen months

1201
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:46,360
Speaker 1: bot as a producer that I hit Royalty No why

1202
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:49,799
Speaker 1: work for an insurance company. Lenny Warnerker got a Royalty

1203
01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:52,479
Speaker 1: Russ titled and the Guys that Warners did. I didn't.

1204
01:09:52,680 --> 01:09:56,920
Speaker 1: But you know what, I'm years old. Good opportunity, That's

1205
01:09:56,920 --> 01:10:00,120
Speaker 1: what I did. I helped build that asset up that

1206
01:10:00,200 --> 01:10:04,200
Speaker 1: when Jerry rubenstand Artie Mogul came to buy the company,

1207
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:06,360
Speaker 1: I helped build it up so that they could make

1208
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:09,840
Speaker 1: more money. So what year do you leave you? Ay?

1209
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:13,639
Speaker 1: And what do you do I leave you? I moved

1210
01:10:13,680 --> 01:10:17,280
Speaker 1: in with Trudy Green, who you probably know was a manager.

1211
01:10:17,400 --> 01:10:21,400
Speaker 1: Trudy was my girlfriend at the time, and we moved

1212
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:24,400
Speaker 1: into a one room apartment with a four poster bed

1213
01:10:24,439 --> 01:10:29,000
Speaker 1: in My guitar and I I was friendly with. I

1214
01:10:29,120 --> 01:10:32,040
Speaker 1: met Graham Nash through the Hollies because the Hollies were

1215
01:10:32,040 --> 01:10:34,839
Speaker 1: assigned to CBS. They were the first people to actually

1216
01:10:34,840 --> 01:10:39,160
Speaker 1: cover Springsteen with a song called Sandy, and Alan Clark

1217
01:10:39,360 --> 01:10:41,760
Speaker 1: was the lead singer. He had to have these my

1218
01:10:41,840 --> 01:10:45,160
Speaker 1: brother here that I breathed and Alan wanted to make

1219
01:10:45,200 --> 01:10:48,759
Speaker 1: a solo record and he asked me if I would produce.

1220
01:10:48,960 --> 01:10:52,000
Speaker 1: That was the first time I took a superstar like that,

1221
01:10:52,040 --> 01:10:54,080
Speaker 1: although I had worked with Tea and I've worked with Paul.

1222
01:10:54,479 --> 01:10:57,439
Speaker 1: Remember I'm a punk and I make a solo record

1223
01:10:57,439 --> 01:11:01,320
Speaker 1: with Alan. David Geffen had ship. It's just in the

1224
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:06,360
Speaker 1: process of leaving Asylum. But I actually played him a

1225
01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:08,960
Speaker 1: couple of songs that I decided I wanted to do

1226
01:11:09,479 --> 01:11:12,600
Speaker 1: with Alan because Alan had a voice of gold. I

1227
01:11:12,720 --> 01:11:15,639
Speaker 1: loved Alan. I thought Alan his real name is Harold Clark,

1228
01:11:15,880 --> 01:11:18,400
Speaker 1: and he and Graham Nash, who is still my friend today,

1229
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 1: close friend love Graham Um started the Hollies. So I

1230
01:11:23,320 --> 01:11:26,880
Speaker 1: made the deal with Geffen. We made the deal on Asylum,

1231
01:11:27,680 --> 01:11:30,519
Speaker 1: and I made the album with Alan. What I did

1232
01:11:30,680 --> 01:11:32,720
Speaker 1: is I made a few dollars on that because I

1233
01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:35,320
Speaker 1: was partnered with that, and I made a decent deal,

1234
01:11:35,800 --> 01:11:38,400
Speaker 1: so we got to keep what we didn't spend. So

1235
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:41,000
Speaker 1: I had friends because remember I was at u A,

1236
01:11:41,280 --> 01:11:44,240
Speaker 1: so I'd make deals with studios and stuff. I made

1237
01:11:44,280 --> 01:11:48,200
Speaker 1: the album for less money than I got from Lecture Asylum,

1238
01:11:48,520 --> 01:11:51,160
Speaker 1: so that helped me a little bit. That's the beginning

1239
01:11:51,280 --> 01:11:54,519
Speaker 1: of Pasha, Let's slow down now here, you make the

1240
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:57,640
Speaker 1: deal for the Alan Clark record, which is not a

1241
01:11:57,720 --> 01:12:01,320
Speaker 1: hit record. Geffen leaves as he thinks he's gonna die,

1242
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:04,320
Speaker 1: which turns out to be untrue. Where does that leave you?

1243
01:12:06,080 --> 01:12:09,839
Speaker 1: Knowing that cut one side one of Alan's album Blinded

1244
01:12:09,880 --> 01:12:13,960
Speaker 1: by the Light was a hit because Alan lived near

1245
01:12:14,040 --> 01:12:20,800
Speaker 1: Manford Mann, who in England, and Joe Smith came over

1246
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:23,839
Speaker 1: to take over. He and Mel Posner were running elect

1247
01:12:25,080 --> 01:12:29,160
Speaker 1: and I did Alan's album that was cut one side one.

1248
01:12:29,479 --> 01:12:31,760
Speaker 1: We did a rock version of Blinded by the Light.

1249
01:12:32,439 --> 01:12:35,800
Speaker 1: When I'm told that whoever wrote that the lyrics are

1250
01:12:35,800 --> 01:12:39,240
Speaker 1: to us so terror it's too off the wall. We

1251
01:12:39,280 --> 01:12:42,680
Speaker 1: don't understand it. And Nikki Chan of My Chapman had

1252
01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:45,840
Speaker 1: had some hits and I knew Nikki pretty well, and

1253
01:12:46,320 --> 01:12:50,960
Speaker 1: so they picked that song to release his single didn't happen.

1254
01:12:51,400 --> 01:12:54,120
Speaker 1: I was pushing Blinded by the Light. People told me

1255
01:12:54,160 --> 01:12:57,639
Speaker 1: I was nuts. Manford Man covered it had the record

1256
01:12:57,680 --> 01:13:02,080
Speaker 1: of the year. Where did it leave me? Frustrated? But

1257
01:13:02,240 --> 01:13:05,919
Speaker 1: I had some frustration with Billy Thorpe when that company

1258
01:13:06,360 --> 01:13:12,200
Speaker 1: Capricorn a little bit slower? Okay, Yallen Clark album comes out.

1259
01:13:12,560 --> 01:13:15,559
Speaker 1: Are you then done with Asylum? And how do you

1260
01:13:15,600 --> 01:13:20,639
Speaker 1: get hooked up with Billy Thorpe? Okay, these are great questions.

1261
01:13:20,840 --> 01:13:23,519
Speaker 1: You did your homework, man, Thank you. I remember all

1262
01:13:23,560 --> 01:13:28,040
Speaker 1: this keep going okay, and I remember it too. And

1263
01:13:28,120 --> 01:13:30,719
Speaker 1: the only reason I'm a little more long winded about

1264
01:13:30,760 --> 01:13:34,720
Speaker 1: it is because nobody has asked me these questions. No, no, no, no,

1265
01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:36,880
Speaker 1: go into this is what this is the juice, this

1266
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:41,320
Speaker 1: is what I'm interested in. Okay, all right. I made

1267
01:13:41,320 --> 01:13:46,200
Speaker 1: four albums with Alan, not one even though it failed.

1268
01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:48,680
Speaker 1: The next album I did, I made the deal with

1269
01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:52,240
Speaker 1: Ahmed Atlantic. We had actually we had a hit, but

1270
01:13:52,280 --> 01:13:54,120
Speaker 1: I'll tell you about that in a minute, because he

1271
01:13:54,160 --> 01:13:58,000
Speaker 1: didn't ask me what to talk about Billy Thorpe. So

1272
01:13:59,640 --> 01:14:03,680
Speaker 1: I went to a party in nineteen. So I'm now

1273
01:14:03,720 --> 01:14:06,960
Speaker 1: working for myself and I have a few dollars because

1274
01:14:07,000 --> 01:14:09,839
Speaker 1: I made the Silent Clark deal and it was a stiff,

1275
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:13,840
Speaker 1: but I still I made my follow up to the

1276
01:14:13,880 --> 01:14:16,640
Speaker 1: Billy Thorpe album with Electric Silent. They gave me a

1277
01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:19,559
Speaker 1: lot of money to do that because Thorpe Children of

1278
01:14:19,560 --> 01:14:22,000
Speaker 1: the Son was a big deal, but Capricorn had gone

1279
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:25,880
Speaker 1: belly up and Billy. Whooooooa, whoa, whoa. You're doing the

1280
01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:30,240
Speaker 1: Alan Clark record. How do you find Billy Thorpe and

1281
01:14:30,439 --> 01:14:35,280
Speaker 1: end up on Capricorn? Okay, So while I'm making the

1282
01:14:35,400 --> 01:14:40,320
Speaker 1: Alan Clark album, I'm invited to a party at a

1283
01:14:40,439 --> 01:14:45,240
Speaker 1: lawyer's house and mc fleetwood was there, and Alan Parsons

1284
01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:48,080
Speaker 1: was there, and all these people were there, and Billy

1285
01:14:48,160 --> 01:14:51,479
Speaker 1: Thorpe was there. Who's Billy Thorpe. Billy Thorpe was the

1286
01:14:51,600 --> 01:14:56,040
Speaker 1: spring stand up Australia. Billy Thorpe could sell out stadiums

1287
01:14:56,240 --> 01:14:59,320
Speaker 1: and he wanted to come to America to make a mark.

1288
01:15:00,120 --> 01:15:02,720
Speaker 1: He was going to work with Alan Parsons, who was

1289
01:15:02,800 --> 01:15:06,879
Speaker 1: a brilliant talent before he started the Alan Parsons project.

1290
01:15:07,280 --> 01:15:09,639
Speaker 1: But Alan had just produced a record by a group

1291
01:15:09,640 --> 01:15:14,160
Speaker 1: on Capitol called Pilot, and they thought that they should

1292
01:15:14,600 --> 01:15:17,960
Speaker 1: do the follow up with their uncle's brother's cousin or whoever.

1293
01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:21,519
Speaker 1: So Alan didn't get the nod to produce the follow

1294
01:15:21,560 --> 01:15:24,680
Speaker 1: up after having its Magic being a huge hit, so

1295
01:15:26,240 --> 01:15:28,840
Speaker 1: I think Alan wanted to start his own thing. That's

1296
01:15:28,840 --> 01:15:31,559
Speaker 1: when he started the Allen Parson's project. He was going

1297
01:15:31,600 --> 01:15:34,280
Speaker 1: to work with Billy admit Billy at the party, so

1298
01:15:34,720 --> 01:15:38,559
Speaker 1: we just started talking. And I had just bought some

1299
01:15:38,640 --> 01:15:43,080
Speaker 1: paintings by a surrealist named Ario Campanelli, and I knew

1300
01:15:43,120 --> 01:15:47,360
Speaker 1: that Billy was kind of like thinking about things that

1301
01:15:47,439 --> 01:15:50,920
Speaker 1: are very extra tresteal and very you know, very tripped out,

1302
01:15:51,200 --> 01:15:56,519
Speaker 1: and I like, uh, I like impressionistic guard, I love mone,

1303
01:15:56,640 --> 01:15:59,679
Speaker 1: I love and Go. But I also like mcgreet and Dali,

1304
01:16:00,640 --> 01:16:04,320
Speaker 1: and Billy did too, So we started having an art conversation.

1305
01:16:04,640 --> 01:16:08,880
Speaker 1: Then we started having a music conversation. And Close Encounters

1306
01:16:08,880 --> 01:16:11,960
Speaker 1: had just come out as a movie, and you see

1307
01:16:12,000 --> 01:16:14,639
Speaker 1: the last scene aliens to make contact with you don't

1308
01:16:14,640 --> 01:16:17,599
Speaker 1: know what happened after them. So Billy and are hanging out.

1309
01:16:17,600 --> 01:16:20,320
Speaker 1: There were too many cute girls at the party. And

1310
01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:23,040
Speaker 1: he's a guitar player. He's a great guitar player. Was

1311
01:16:23,040 --> 01:16:25,400
Speaker 1: a great guitar player. I played a little bit. So

1312
01:16:25,439 --> 01:16:27,840
Speaker 1: we said, why don't we go out and see this movie?

1313
01:16:27,960 --> 01:16:30,880
Speaker 1: Then let's go to my house and jam. So we did,

1314
01:16:31,840 --> 01:16:34,719
Speaker 1: and we saw Close Encounters. Then we went to my house.

1315
01:16:34,840 --> 01:16:37,200
Speaker 1: We smoke a couple of joints, we drank some Corvosier.

1316
01:16:37,800 --> 01:16:41,160
Speaker 1: We were hanging out and Billy I was reading Carl

1317
01:16:41,200 --> 01:16:45,360
Speaker 1: Sagan's Cosmos, and Billy was a fan of extraterrestrials, so

1318
01:16:45,439 --> 01:16:47,960
Speaker 1: we made up a thing the Earth was going to

1319
01:16:48,120 --> 01:16:52,719
Speaker 1: self destruct in the year this is down nineteen seventy

1320
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:57,000
Speaker 1: seven seventy eight, and Eastern Afghana standing in crisis was

1321
01:16:57,080 --> 01:17:00,920
Speaker 1: happening politically, so we said we were talked, is really smart?

1322
01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:05,479
Speaker 1: I like smart people. So Billy said, Americans and the

1323
01:17:05,479 --> 01:17:09,599
Speaker 1: Afghanistans are Afghanistanians are going to team up to fight

1324
01:17:09,640 --> 01:17:13,200
Speaker 1: the Russians and the world will blow up. So why

1325
01:17:13,200 --> 01:17:16,720
Speaker 1: don't we write a song about that? Because we're off

1326
01:17:16,720 --> 01:17:19,519
Speaker 1: the wall kind of guys. And we made up a

1327
01:17:19,600 --> 01:17:22,559
Speaker 1: friendly race from another galaxy called the Children of the Sun.

1328
01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:25,599
Speaker 1: We're going to watch the self destruction and come down

1329
01:17:25,680 --> 01:17:28,600
Speaker 1: from a crystal planet, made up planet to offer the

1330
01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:31,120
Speaker 1: Earth links and choice of staying or leaving. By the

1331
01:17:31,200 --> 01:17:33,760
Speaker 1: end of the song, they're gonna leave by the end

1332
01:17:33,800 --> 01:17:36,719
Speaker 1: of the album. That who started new civilization? That became

1333
01:17:36,760 --> 01:17:40,720
Speaker 1: my laser lightshop. So we wrote this song five in

1334
01:17:40,720 --> 01:17:43,160
Speaker 1: the morning. We finished it. It was like seven minutes.

1335
01:17:43,400 --> 01:17:45,559
Speaker 1: That's why I fell in love with the Don McLean song,

1336
01:17:45,720 --> 01:17:48,360
Speaker 1: because I wasn't afraid of long songs. As long as

1337
01:17:48,400 --> 01:17:51,040
Speaker 1: they told the story. And Children of the Sun told

1338
01:17:51,040 --> 01:17:54,559
Speaker 1: the story, told the story of the self destruction, of

1339
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:57,720
Speaker 1: the destruction of the earth, and the optionality for the

1340
01:17:57,760 --> 01:18:01,240
Speaker 1: people who were left. That was the song. Okay, Capricorn,

1341
01:18:02,000 --> 01:18:06,200
Speaker 1: I went shopping that we had the song. So I

1342
01:18:06,280 --> 01:18:08,240
Speaker 1: knew a couple of people because I just come out

1343
01:18:08,280 --> 01:18:12,400
Speaker 1: of you a. Everybody hated it, hated it, just like

1344
01:18:12,439 --> 01:18:15,439
Speaker 1: they hated quiet. Right, So I'm not used. I'm not

1345
01:18:15,560 --> 01:18:18,240
Speaker 1: against being told no because I know how to say no.

1346
01:18:18,520 --> 01:18:21,120
Speaker 1: He turned it in DS through the side door. Okay.

1347
01:18:21,560 --> 01:18:26,320
Speaker 1: So there's a promotion guy who's working at ABC Records

1348
01:18:26,360 --> 01:18:29,599
Speaker 1: at the time named John Scott. I don't know if

1349
01:18:29,640 --> 01:18:31,559
Speaker 1: you know John. Of course I know John Scott. It

1350
01:18:31,560 --> 01:18:33,639
Speaker 1: takes a lot of credit for the success of Tom

1351
01:18:33,640 --> 01:18:37,200
Speaker 1: Petty's career. Okay, Well, he can take credit for this.

1352
01:18:37,960 --> 01:18:41,160
Speaker 1: He heard Children of the Son, he got it, and

1353
01:18:41,240 --> 01:18:44,679
Speaker 1: he was working at ABC. What did ABC Records mean

1354
01:18:44,720 --> 01:18:47,960
Speaker 1: to me? Well, Trudy and I started the management company

1355
01:18:48,160 --> 01:18:51,160
Speaker 1: and our first client with Stephen Bishop and save it

1356
01:18:51,200 --> 01:18:53,519
Speaker 1: for Ray. Need to add on and on for number

1357
01:18:53,520 --> 01:18:57,280
Speaker 1: one records on ABC. John Scott was a promotion man

1358
01:18:57,320 --> 01:19:01,800
Speaker 1: at ABC together with Charlie Minor to ABC, so I

1359
01:19:01,920 --> 01:19:04,479
Speaker 1: knew John and I called John and I said, hey,

1360
01:19:04,479 --> 01:19:07,240
Speaker 1: I'm getting all these people that passed on the Children

1361
01:19:07,280 --> 01:19:11,400
Speaker 1: of the Sun song. What do you think? He said,

1362
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:17,000
Speaker 1: fucking great. And I'm trying to remember the chronology of

1363
01:19:17,160 --> 01:19:20,120
Speaker 1: when I made the record, which I made on my

1364
01:19:20,240 --> 01:19:23,559
Speaker 1: dime on spec because I just built a studio. That's

1365
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:26,479
Speaker 1: another story. And how I built Pasha, how I used

1366
01:19:26,479 --> 01:19:29,880
Speaker 1: my money and all that. But anyway, John was friends

1367
01:19:29,920 --> 01:19:32,840
Speaker 1: of Frank Fentor and Phil Walden. He used to party

1368
01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:38,000
Speaker 1: with those guys. So when he told them about it,

1369
01:19:38,320 --> 01:19:41,640
Speaker 1: they came to Pasha, which I had just built. I

1370
01:19:41,720 --> 01:19:45,640
Speaker 1: lit some candles, I burned some incense. I played them

1371
01:19:45,720 --> 01:19:48,559
Speaker 1: Children of the Sun. They got it, so they said,

1372
01:19:48,760 --> 01:19:53,360
Speaker 1: won't put it out? Okay? I had everybody else passed

1373
01:19:53,400 --> 01:19:56,479
Speaker 1: on it. John Scott promoted it for me because he

1374
01:19:56,560 --> 01:20:01,080
Speaker 1: left ABC became an independent promotion man. The rest that

1375
01:20:01,080 --> 01:20:04,040
Speaker 1: that was a struggle to that record only happened regionally.

1376
01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:07,320
Speaker 1: It happened in phases. Ultimately it caught on. It became

1377
01:20:07,400 --> 01:20:10,360
Speaker 1: the biggest rock record after My Sharona. I think My

1378
01:20:10,439 --> 01:20:13,000
Speaker 1: Sharona beat it, but it was a number two it's

1379
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:16,040
Speaker 1: still on Syrious Sex Sem on Deep Tracks is one

1380
01:20:16,080 --> 01:20:18,680
Speaker 1: of the biggest recurrens of all time. But that was

1381
01:20:20,120 --> 01:20:24,240
Speaker 1: seventy eight, was on Capricorn, the Almond Brothers suit Felt Walden.

1382
01:20:25,000 --> 01:20:28,400
Speaker 1: There was a lot of money changing hands sideways, and

1383
01:20:28,560 --> 01:20:30,479
Speaker 1: I got stuck in it because I had a number

1384
01:20:30,520 --> 01:20:32,800
Speaker 1: one record and you couldn't buy the record because they

1385
01:20:32,800 --> 01:20:43,120
Speaker 1: couldn't press them because the company went back. Okay, how

1386
01:20:43,120 --> 01:20:46,320
Speaker 1: did you decide and where did you get the money

1387
01:20:46,439 --> 01:20:52,640
Speaker 1: to build Pasha? Right there on Melrose. Okay, when I

1388
01:20:52,720 --> 01:20:56,720
Speaker 1: made my Alan Clark record, I made the deal. And

1389
01:20:57,280 --> 01:21:00,599
Speaker 1: I'm a big believer in the world outside of because

1390
01:21:00,640 --> 01:21:04,120
Speaker 1: I came from there. So I made a deal X,

1391
01:21:04,479 --> 01:21:08,519
Speaker 1: the Asylum deal, the Electric deal with US in Canada.

1392
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:12,519
Speaker 1: I had built a relationship with a guy named Freddie

1393
01:21:12,560 --> 01:21:14,960
Speaker 1: Hind who had also passed to all these guys bomb

1394
01:21:15,000 --> 01:21:18,840
Speaker 1: are leaving us or and I produced a band called

1395
01:21:18,920 --> 01:21:21,559
Speaker 1: Randy Pie. It was a platinum record in Europe. The

1396
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:23,960
Speaker 1: only guy who spoke English was the lead singer of

1397
01:21:24,040 --> 01:21:26,840
Speaker 1: the rest of the guy spoke German and French, and

1398
01:21:26,920 --> 01:21:29,599
Speaker 1: I speak fluent German. So I made the record there

1399
01:21:30,000 --> 01:21:34,720
Speaker 1: when they had the gold record party. PolyGram flew me

1400
01:21:34,800 --> 01:21:38,479
Speaker 1: to Hamburg as the guest of being the producer. I

1401
01:21:38,600 --> 01:21:43,120
Speaker 1: met Don dr Verner Vogel Sang, who was a Nazi,

1402
01:21:43,520 --> 01:21:47,040
Speaker 1: I think, but I spoke fluent German, which is pretty cool,

1403
01:21:47,160 --> 01:21:50,520
Speaker 1: and I produced the record. He offered me the presidency

1404
01:21:50,560 --> 01:21:53,400
Speaker 1: of Polydor Records. I had already left you a because

1405
01:21:53,400 --> 01:21:56,200
Speaker 1: I had done Alec clark solo record, worked with Clark,

1406
01:21:56,560 --> 01:21:59,360
Speaker 1: and I didn't want the job. I said, why don't

1407
01:21:59,360 --> 01:22:02,200
Speaker 1: I do it? Produce action deal with you, and we

1408
01:22:02,280 --> 01:22:05,360
Speaker 1: did a five album deal. I negotiated. My lawyer at

1409
01:22:05,360 --> 01:22:07,800
Speaker 1: the time was Don Passman, who's turned out to be

1410
01:22:07,880 --> 01:22:11,320
Speaker 1: a fantastic lawyer and he graduated to be one of them.

1411
01:22:11,479 --> 01:22:13,840
Speaker 1: He's still a dear friend of mine now fifty years later.

1412
01:22:14,360 --> 01:22:16,760
Speaker 1: And I called on. I said, these guys wanted to

1413
01:22:16,800 --> 01:22:18,559
Speaker 1: do a five album deal with me. Can you get

1414
01:22:18,600 --> 01:22:21,400
Speaker 1: on a plane? He said, well, he just started his

1415
01:22:21,439 --> 01:22:25,120
Speaker 1: gang tyrant round thing and he couldn't. But I sat

1416
01:22:25,240 --> 01:22:27,840
Speaker 1: there and I made notes, and he gave me all

1417
01:22:27,840 --> 01:22:29,559
Speaker 1: the notes that I should do. I go into a

1418
01:22:29,640 --> 01:22:32,840
Speaker 1: meeting the next day. I make this five album deal

1419
01:22:32,840 --> 01:22:34,840
Speaker 1: in the form of a loan. The guys were speaking

1420
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:36,960
Speaker 1: German to each other. They didn't think I knew. They

1421
01:22:36,960 --> 01:22:39,080
Speaker 1: didn't know I had a lot of degree. I'm listening

1422
01:22:39,160 --> 01:22:41,280
Speaker 1: to it all. I actually had to take a leak.

1423
01:22:41,360 --> 01:22:44,439
Speaker 1: I started cracking up because they didn't know that. I

1424
01:22:44,479 --> 01:22:50,160
Speaker 1: closed the deal and I took the recording budgets of

1425
01:22:50,280 --> 01:22:54,679
Speaker 1: that some cash. I then went to City National Bank,

1426
01:22:54,720 --> 01:22:59,439
Speaker 1: a local bank. I got matching funds. I had Larry Brown,

1427
01:22:59,479 --> 01:23:02,160
Speaker 1: who was the engineer that Duane Barron took over for.

1428
01:23:02,840 --> 01:23:06,479
Speaker 1: His dad was a builder, and we built Pasha. How

1429
01:23:06,479 --> 01:23:10,960
Speaker 1: did you get the space? It was garbage space on

1430
01:23:11,040 --> 01:23:14,800
Speaker 1: Melrose next to Astro Burger, and I wanted to be

1431
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:17,960
Speaker 1: in Hollywood because I thought it would be cool and

1432
01:23:18,160 --> 01:23:22,040
Speaker 1: it was available space, and we just gutted it and

1433
01:23:22,160 --> 01:23:25,600
Speaker 1: Larry Brown's dad and Larry designed it to my aspects.

1434
01:23:25,920 --> 01:23:28,720
Speaker 1: I listened to it. We really made it. Stated the

1435
01:23:28,840 --> 01:23:32,799
Speaker 1: art to speaker systems, I sink up machines, and Larry

1436
01:23:33,000 --> 01:23:35,280
Speaker 1: is brilliant to this day. If you go into my website.

1437
01:23:35,600 --> 01:23:38,439
Speaker 1: He's now an Emmy winning composer, but he was an

1438
01:23:38,439 --> 01:23:42,400
Speaker 1: engineering engineered a lot of stuff for Zeppelin earlier. I'm

1439
01:23:42,439 --> 01:23:45,439
Speaker 1: a big believer that you keep your friends that are

1440
01:23:45,479 --> 01:23:48,479
Speaker 1: your friends. I just met most of mine through the business.

1441
01:23:48,800 --> 01:23:50,920
Speaker 1: My wife has a lot of friends that she met

1442
01:23:51,160 --> 01:23:53,600
Speaker 1: not as a publisher the Early Weekly, but as a

1443
01:23:53,680 --> 01:23:56,920
Speaker 1: pure soul, as as a good person. My friends I've

1444
01:23:56,920 --> 01:23:59,240
Speaker 1: met through the business, but some of them are great

1445
01:23:59,240 --> 01:24:03,839
Speaker 1: people that my friends. Okay, did you leased the building

1446
01:24:03,920 --> 01:24:06,879
Speaker 1: or own the at least it I had an option

1447
01:24:06,960 --> 01:24:08,960
Speaker 1: to buy it. I was a schmuck. I should have.

1448
01:24:09,600 --> 01:24:12,640
Speaker 1: I didn't because there was a leak once and my

1449
01:24:12,720 --> 01:24:17,160
Speaker 1: current lawyer, my litigator, who's the smartest lawyer litigator I know.

1450
01:24:17,640 --> 01:24:21,800
Speaker 1: We took on the landlord and then he got set

1451
01:24:21,880 --> 01:24:24,040
Speaker 1: with me because we beat him. He had to pay

1452
01:24:24,080 --> 01:24:28,040
Speaker 1: for the damage to somebody inside of Pasha, and therefore

1453
01:24:28,160 --> 01:24:30,479
Speaker 1: he wouldn't sell me the building. So the answer is,

1454
01:24:30,600 --> 01:24:34,680
Speaker 1: at least okay, Now you have the studio. What are

1455
01:24:34,680 --> 01:24:42,360
Speaker 1: you making making fourteen years of a couple of hundred albums?

1456
01:24:42,400 --> 01:24:45,080
Speaker 1: But because I could build back studio time under my

1457
01:24:45,160 --> 01:24:48,080
Speaker 1: label deal, I would make a few extra dollars. What

1458
01:24:48,160 --> 01:24:52,840
Speaker 1: am I making? Archie Trick Little I mixed my little

1459
01:24:52,920 --> 01:24:55,599
Speaker 1: river band record there. I've worked with a lot of

1460
01:24:55,800 --> 01:24:59,240
Speaker 1: famous things and not so famous things. John Butcher, black

1461
01:24:59,320 --> 01:25:03,679
Speaker 1: artist who channeled I did four albums with John, including

1462
01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:07,280
Speaker 1: one with Glenn Ballard, who wound up becoming his own guy.

1463
01:25:07,360 --> 01:25:10,920
Speaker 1: So I made good records there. It was great sounding

1464
01:25:10,960 --> 01:25:14,040
Speaker 1: stuff because I come from there. But when my kids

1465
01:25:14,360 --> 01:25:20,519
Speaker 1: came onto the planet Sterling in more eight, I decided

1466
01:25:20,560 --> 01:25:23,559
Speaker 1: to sell out. I didn't want to make records anymore,

1467
01:25:23,640 --> 01:25:27,000
Speaker 1: although I could, and subsequently I still ten years later,

1468
01:25:27,200 --> 01:25:30,400
Speaker 1: did three records with Stevie Wonder. I did stuff, but

1469
01:25:30,520 --> 01:25:32,640
Speaker 1: I didn't want to do that as a career. I

1470
01:25:32,760 --> 01:25:34,880
Speaker 1: kind of wanted to graduate and I was all of

1471
01:25:34,920 --> 01:25:38,439
Speaker 1: my visual correlations and stuff anyway when I started with

1472
01:25:38,479 --> 01:25:41,880
Speaker 1: Thorpe when I was shipped twenty seven years old, so

1473
01:25:42,040 --> 01:25:45,439
Speaker 1: I decided I kind of wanted to go into that

1474
01:25:45,560 --> 01:25:50,320
Speaker 1: realm and put music and visual together. So that happened.

1475
01:25:50,680 --> 01:25:54,479
Speaker 1: My dad died finally, unfortunately, I moved up to santy

1476
01:25:54,560 --> 01:25:58,040
Speaker 1: Andez before Bernie Toppon did. I bought a ranch and

1477
01:25:58,120 --> 01:26:00,559
Speaker 1: I lived there for a year. That I came back

1478
01:26:00,600 --> 01:26:02,439
Speaker 1: and a friend of mine became the head of Showtime,

1479
01:26:02,520 --> 01:26:05,320
Speaker 1: Jerry off site, So Jerry said, I'm going to change

1480
01:26:05,320 --> 01:26:07,200
Speaker 1: the what we got together. We had lung Time down.

1481
01:26:07,280 --> 01:26:09,960
Speaker 1: Jerry used to be a lawyer, low below, and he said,

1482
01:26:10,880 --> 01:26:14,160
Speaker 1: I'm gonna change the look of this network Showtime. Would

1483
01:26:14,200 --> 01:26:16,679
Speaker 1: you help me change the sound of it? I said,

1484
01:26:16,720 --> 01:26:18,479
Speaker 1: I don't want a job. I don't need a job.

1485
01:26:18,720 --> 01:26:22,280
Speaker 1: He said, but if you put the compoke you, you

1486
01:26:22,360 --> 01:26:25,880
Speaker 1: hired composers, you decide what music goes where. We'll do

1487
01:26:26,080 --> 01:26:27,880
Speaker 1: the kind of deal you want. So I did a

1488
01:26:27,920 --> 01:26:30,360
Speaker 1: back end deal. I didn't take big fees, but I

1489
01:26:30,400 --> 01:26:34,439
Speaker 1: took a piece of I took half the publishing every

1490
01:26:34,680 --> 01:26:38,320
Speaker 1: film I've worked on. You don't like that. I got

1491
01:26:38,320 --> 01:26:43,000
Speaker 1: a book a it was VHS at the time. Every

1492
01:26:43,040 --> 01:26:47,559
Speaker 1: Showtime movie turned into a VHS, and Jerry had great taste.

1493
01:26:47,800 --> 01:26:50,479
Speaker 1: We made some great movies, so I got a lot

1494
01:26:50,520 --> 01:26:52,720
Speaker 1: of back in that was good. So I did that

1495
01:26:52,760 --> 01:26:56,920
Speaker 1: for seven years. Okay, just we'll go back before we

1496
01:26:56,960 --> 01:27:00,200
Speaker 1: go forward. You have this deal with Polly do her

1497
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:04,960
Speaker 1: for X number of albums? How do you end up

1498
01:27:05,000 --> 01:27:11,840
Speaker 1: going to CBS? Because okay, I have the polydordeal. The

1499
01:27:11,840 --> 01:27:14,320
Speaker 1: Thorpe deal happens that they put out Children the Sun

1500
01:27:14,400 --> 01:27:18,680
Speaker 1: internationally does good, put out some other records or noble failures.

1501
01:27:18,840 --> 01:27:21,880
Speaker 1: They're really good, but they didn't make it. And I

1502
01:27:21,960 --> 01:27:27,320
Speaker 1: knew Yetnikov when he was running international, when Clive Davis

1503
01:27:27,400 --> 01:27:32,280
Speaker 1: was president, and yet Nikov became the chairman of CBS.

1504
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:35,760
Speaker 1: And when I got stiffed on the Thorpe record and

1505
01:27:35,800 --> 01:27:39,960
Speaker 1: the Polydor deal was ex North America, I wanted and

1506
01:27:40,080 --> 01:27:44,000
Speaker 1: Jimmy Garcio started Cariboo and he was a producer. He

1507
01:27:44,080 --> 01:27:47,519
Speaker 1: started Cariboo a seventy two. But and and Clarence Avon

1508
01:27:47,640 --> 01:27:51,880
Speaker 1: had Taboo. These are really great guys, terrific guys who

1509
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:54,040
Speaker 1: had their own labels. I thought, you know what, I

1510
01:27:54,080 --> 01:27:57,360
Speaker 1: should have a label, not because my ego. I should

1511
01:27:57,360 --> 01:27:59,280
Speaker 1: have a label because I'm going to do stuff different

1512
01:27:59,320 --> 01:28:02,280
Speaker 1: than the guy don't block. So I'd like to find

1513
01:28:02,520 --> 01:28:05,960
Speaker 1: talent and do something with it. So I called Walter,

1514
01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:10,280
Speaker 1: and Walter said, boy, chick, you can understand one worse.

1515
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:15,679
Speaker 1: You should meet Tony Martell. Because Tony Martell got rest

1516
01:28:15,760 --> 01:28:20,320
Speaker 1: Hissal Martel Foundation ran the division feeding into Don dem

1517
01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:24,320
Speaker 1: c an epic and subsequent is funny enough. When Don

1518
01:28:24,400 --> 01:28:26,960
Speaker 1: Dempsey left, the guy who took this place with Ray Anderson,

1519
01:28:26,960 --> 01:28:31,400
Speaker 1: who used to work for me, crazy. Okay, it's six degrees.

1520
01:28:31,439 --> 01:28:34,080
Speaker 1: It's not six degrees for me. It's two degrees. Anyway,

1521
01:28:34,439 --> 01:28:39,320
Speaker 1: the punchline is Walter introduced me to Tony. He said,

1522
01:28:39,479 --> 01:28:42,200
Speaker 1: a guy like you should have a label. Tony was

1523
01:28:42,240 --> 01:28:45,960
Speaker 1: a match. He said, okay, So we did a really

1524
01:28:46,160 --> 01:28:51,200
Speaker 1: horrible deal. A guy named Zach Horol was represented CBS

1525
01:28:52,439 --> 01:28:55,160
Speaker 1: the way before he went to Universal. This is Zach

1526
01:28:55,560 --> 01:28:59,160
Speaker 1: as a lawyer on staff, and Zach did the deal

1527
01:28:59,240 --> 01:29:02,120
Speaker 1: with me. It was a great deal for CBS and

1528
01:29:02,160 --> 01:29:05,400
Speaker 1: a horrible deal for me. But that's why I went

1529
01:29:05,479 --> 01:29:08,240
Speaker 1: to do an any money project because I could get

1530
01:29:08,240 --> 01:29:11,000
Speaker 1: paid as a producer. Because my label deal was seventy

1531
01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:14,240
Speaker 1: five grand all in for the world. Well, guess what

1532
01:29:14,840 --> 01:29:17,800
Speaker 1: how much money can I make? Recording costs? Even if

1533
01:29:17,800 --> 01:29:20,439
Speaker 1: I own the studio, I still have hard costs. Still

1534
01:29:20,479 --> 01:29:22,800
Speaker 1: got to give it. I did a fifty deal with

1535
01:29:22,880 --> 01:29:25,200
Speaker 1: the band I do with all my people, have done

1536
01:29:25,200 --> 01:29:29,000
Speaker 1: this my whole life until today. So I made nothing,

1537
01:29:29,400 --> 01:29:33,799
Speaker 1: but I got a label there. But then the first

1538
01:29:33,840 --> 01:29:37,519
Speaker 1: record I put out was the subsequent Thought record, which stiffed.

1539
01:29:38,240 --> 01:29:41,200
Speaker 1: So that's when I said that Pat Armstrong, who had

1540
01:29:41,240 --> 01:29:44,599
Speaker 1: Molly Hatchett an epic, what the funk? I heard um

1541
01:29:44,880 --> 01:29:47,320
Speaker 1: come on field the noise on the radio. That was

1542
01:29:47,360 --> 01:29:50,000
Speaker 1: the second record I put out through my deal. There

1543
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:54,679
Speaker 1: you go. You say you had a fifty fifty deal

1544
01:29:54,840 --> 01:29:57,920
Speaker 1: with the acts, go a little bit deeper. Fifty fifty

1545
01:29:58,000 --> 01:30:03,280
Speaker 1: of net, No, fifty fifty of anything I make. If

1546
01:30:03,080 --> 01:30:05,719
Speaker 1: if something comes off the top, it comes off the top.

1547
01:30:05,840 --> 01:30:08,479
Speaker 1: That's the same deal I do with investors and people.

1548
01:30:08,479 --> 01:30:11,280
Speaker 1: Now you give me a dollar, you recoup your dollar.

1549
01:30:11,439 --> 01:30:14,760
Speaker 1: I don't get anything once it's recouped. If its success,

1550
01:30:14,960 --> 01:30:21,560
Speaker 1: will whack it up. Okay, So whiir Riot was signed

1551
01:30:21,600 --> 01:30:27,439
Speaker 1: to you? Correct? So you weren't worried about a producer

1552
01:30:27,520 --> 01:30:31,120
Speaker 1: royalty because you were the label. Correct. But you'll like

1553
01:30:31,280 --> 01:30:35,200
Speaker 1: this as a lawyer. The label was signed you know,

1554
01:30:35,280 --> 01:30:40,120
Speaker 1: corporations in California or people. But Spencer is an individual.

1555
01:30:41,080 --> 01:30:43,880
Speaker 1: So Baskar Mannett and I had a relationship. I did

1556
01:30:43,880 --> 01:30:46,439
Speaker 1: a bunch of records at Capital as a producer. Little

1557
01:30:46,479 --> 01:30:50,479
Speaker 1: River Band put Butcher Dempsey didn't think black people could rock,

1558
01:30:50,920 --> 01:30:52,960
Speaker 1: and John Butcher wanted to make a record with me.

1559
01:30:53,120 --> 01:30:55,120
Speaker 1: So I went to Capital. I made it three Alton

1560
01:30:55,200 --> 01:30:58,639
Speaker 1: deal as a partner with John. But Pasha was here.

1561
01:30:59,200 --> 01:31:01,960
Speaker 1: I had records of Pasha after quite right, I had

1562
01:31:02,000 --> 01:31:05,400
Speaker 1: a lot more and I was producing Records on Capital

1563
01:31:05,439 --> 01:31:08,360
Speaker 1: to Carmine. Hit Piece has banned King Cobra. I did

1564
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:10,679
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff there. I'm one of those crazy

1565
01:31:10,720 --> 01:31:14,840
Speaker 1: guys that loves to work. Okay, but if you're getting

1566
01:31:14,880 --> 01:31:19,639
Speaker 1: seventy k an album YEP for Quiet Riot YEP, and

1567
01:31:19,720 --> 01:31:25,600
Speaker 1: the record recoups, how's the money whacked up? Well, to

1568
01:31:25,720 --> 01:31:30,400
Speaker 1: answer your question, before it recoups, you do the second record.

1569
01:31:30,800 --> 01:31:34,439
Speaker 1: Then the band wants to do videos. My cheap videos

1570
01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:38,599
Speaker 1: became they wanted the biggest directors. All of a sudden,

1571
01:31:38,680 --> 01:31:41,240
Speaker 1: videos are now a hundred thousand dollars. I meet my

1572
01:31:41,400 --> 01:31:46,080
Speaker 1: video for nineteen, But that's recoupable. Zach Horowitz did a

1573
01:31:46,120 --> 01:31:50,200
Speaker 1: good deal. Everything is recoupable. So my deal is fifty

1574
01:31:50,240 --> 01:31:54,519
Speaker 1: fifty after recoupment. But we weren't recouped until years and

1575
01:31:54,600 --> 01:31:58,160
Speaker 1: years later because we did a second record that advanced

1576
01:31:58,200 --> 01:32:01,000
Speaker 1: was bigger. The band got a big vance. Then there

1577
01:32:01,080 --> 01:32:04,960
Speaker 1: was a third record. They were never recouped. But so

1578
01:32:05,120 --> 01:32:07,439
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, did I get paid

1579
01:32:07,479 --> 01:32:10,679
Speaker 1: as a producer a pittance? Because I own the label?

1580
01:32:11,160 --> 01:32:14,040
Speaker 1: So I did I get a label share? Yeah? But

1581
01:32:14,400 --> 01:32:17,960
Speaker 1: do I get paid retroactive to record one as a producer? Yes?

1582
01:32:18,160 --> 01:32:21,280
Speaker 1: When it recoups didn't recoup. Did I get my label

1583
01:32:21,320 --> 01:32:23,840
Speaker 1: share when you cross collateral lives that it gives the

1584
01:32:23,880 --> 01:32:26,439
Speaker 1: other eight albums? Did I see any money there? No?

1585
01:32:27,320 --> 01:32:30,200
Speaker 1: So the point is did I see money at Capital

1586
01:32:30,200 --> 01:32:34,560
Speaker 1: because I wasn't getting at CBS. Sure, I'm a survivor

1587
01:32:34,680 --> 01:32:38,640
Speaker 1: and I'm a survivor's kid. Okay, So you work with Showtime?

1588
01:32:38,680 --> 01:32:42,800
Speaker 1: What comes after Showtime? Your present? Uh? Now? Endeavor? No,

1589
01:32:43,920 --> 01:32:48,800
Speaker 1: so Jerry leaf Showtime. After building that network up, I

1590
01:32:48,920 --> 01:32:53,240
Speaker 1: then make a movie for VH one. I'd make an

1591
01:32:53,400 --> 01:32:58,400
Speaker 1: MTV deal to build media using their platform. I then

1592
01:32:58,520 --> 01:33:00,720
Speaker 1: team up with an old friend of mine who you

1593
01:33:00,760 --> 01:33:04,280
Speaker 1: know who managed Monthly Crew at the time, named Doc McGee.

1594
01:33:05,080 --> 01:33:07,839
Speaker 1: And Doc and I set up a company called McGee Proffer.

1595
01:33:08,439 --> 01:33:13,719
Speaker 1: We set up joint venture together, partners, and we get

1596
01:33:13,800 --> 01:33:17,479
Speaker 1: offices together. That's how I met Darius Rucker because Doc

1597
01:33:17,640 --> 01:33:21,280
Speaker 1: was you know, Doc ultimately managed Arius. Doc is a

1598
01:33:21,360 --> 01:33:24,200
Speaker 1: real good guy. But he managed. He didn't manage Kiss,

1599
01:33:24,479 --> 01:33:27,800
Speaker 1: now I think he did. Yeah, he did. He managed Kiss.

1600
01:33:27,880 --> 01:33:30,960
Speaker 1: He didn't manage Von Jovi or Monthly Crew anymore. But

1601
01:33:31,040 --> 01:33:33,880
Speaker 1: I met Doc at Pasha when Monthly Crew made their

1602
01:33:33,920 --> 01:33:37,840
Speaker 1: first record there so Doc and I got together. Socially,

1603
01:33:38,240 --> 01:33:40,719
Speaker 1: I don't like Doc a lot. He's a very smart guy,

1604
01:33:40,800 --> 01:33:44,439
Speaker 1: he's very honorable, he's very ethical, and so my next

1605
01:33:44,520 --> 01:33:47,720
Speaker 1: chapter was Mgee Proffer and I would do stuff. I

1606
01:33:47,760 --> 01:33:49,880
Speaker 1: made a deal at the h one. We made a

1607
01:33:49,880 --> 01:33:54,000
Speaker 1: deal with um Brian Becker, whose chairman of Clear Channel,

1608
01:33:54,320 --> 01:33:57,800
Speaker 1: Mike would consult them on building assets out of Clear

1609
01:33:57,920 --> 01:34:02,320
Speaker 1: Channel properties. It was an interesting period where I decided,

1610
01:34:02,479 --> 01:34:05,679
Speaker 1: ultimately I want to do stuff with music and visual

1611
01:34:06,120 --> 01:34:09,479
Speaker 1: and you know, Doc moved to Nashville with Arius. Then

1612
01:34:09,560 --> 01:34:15,479
Speaker 1: I started this next chapter, Medior seventeen. Okay, how do

1613
01:34:15,520 --> 01:34:20,080
Speaker 1: you get hooked up with space Camp? Morgan, my son

1614
01:34:20,479 --> 01:34:23,479
Speaker 1: who is now flying for United Airlines for aur RA.

1615
01:34:23,880 --> 01:34:27,880
Speaker 1: He's thirty four years old, always wanted to be a

1616
01:34:27,880 --> 01:34:31,200
Speaker 1: pilot from the age of five. When my I love

1617
01:34:31,240 --> 01:34:34,200
Speaker 1: my children. My children mean everything by holding companies called

1618
01:34:34,200 --> 01:34:39,160
Speaker 1: Morlan Morgan sterling. Okay, Morgan, when he went to the bathroom,

1619
01:34:39,200 --> 01:34:41,120
Speaker 1: when he sat down on the john, there was a

1620
01:34:41,200 --> 01:34:44,040
Speaker 1: seven forty seven cockpit there, so he took off every

1621
01:34:44,040 --> 01:34:50,320
Speaker 1: time he took off. Okay, So Morgan decided he found

1622
01:34:50,600 --> 01:34:53,479
Speaker 1: his credit space Camp. There was a space Camp in

1623
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:58,000
Speaker 1: northern California. Then there's the headquarters in Huntsville. So Morgan

1624
01:34:58,479 --> 01:35:02,840
Speaker 1: went to Space Camp first sleep away camp. I went there,

1625
01:35:03,200 --> 01:35:07,840
Speaker 1: I checked him in, I came back home. When he graduated,

1626
01:35:07,880 --> 01:35:10,000
Speaker 1: he goes to school, he gets to be a at

1627
01:35:10,000 --> 01:35:15,679
Speaker 1: American You. He's living in Paris, and he says to me, Dad,

1628
01:35:16,479 --> 01:35:18,720
Speaker 1: I want to go and do some gift back back

1629
01:35:18,760 --> 01:35:21,639
Speaker 1: to Space Camp because I learned fraternal skills. He went

1630
01:35:21,720 --> 01:35:25,960
Speaker 1: there eight consecutive summers as a camper. I'm very proud

1631
01:35:26,040 --> 01:35:28,240
Speaker 1: of my kids. And he learned to be a match

1632
01:35:28,439 --> 01:35:31,880
Speaker 1: at the highest order. And he said, Dad, I'm going

1633
01:35:31,960 --> 01:35:34,000
Speaker 1: to go back to be a counselor for the summer

1634
01:35:34,320 --> 01:35:37,519
Speaker 1: profile dollar. I don't even know what he made because

1635
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:40,759
Speaker 1: my kids have their things. That's there's I think mine,

1636
01:35:40,960 --> 01:35:44,360
Speaker 1: But my thing is there's still anyways. Bottom line is

1637
01:35:44,400 --> 01:35:47,719
Speaker 1: he said, Dad, there's a movie here. I said, what,

1638
01:35:47,720 --> 01:35:50,360
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? He said, there's a movie here.

1639
01:35:50,720 --> 01:35:53,479
Speaker 1: Because there's so many kids who aspirationally want to be

1640
01:35:53,560 --> 01:35:56,920
Speaker 1: astronauts and they want to be what I wanted to be.

1641
01:35:57,200 --> 01:36:00,880
Speaker 1: Let me introduce you to the CEO Space Camp. So

1642
01:36:01,439 --> 01:36:05,519
Speaker 1: I got hooked up initially because Morgan went there but

1643
01:36:05,640 --> 01:36:08,600
Speaker 1: then to make a movie there. Morgan introduced me to

1644
01:36:08,640 --> 01:36:11,000
Speaker 1: Deborah Barnhardt, who was the CEO of Space Camp. I

1645
01:36:11,040 --> 01:36:14,040
Speaker 1: got on the plane, I flew there. I said, blah

1646
01:36:14,080 --> 01:36:15,800
Speaker 1: blah blah. I can do this, I can do that.

1647
01:36:16,240 --> 01:36:19,200
Speaker 1: I'd like to. I had an idea to make a

1648
01:36:19,280 --> 01:36:23,760
Speaker 1: film about the campers and make it some joy long

1649
01:36:23,800 --> 01:36:26,759
Speaker 1: story short on how the story came together, but Morgan

1650
01:36:26,920 --> 01:36:29,840
Speaker 1: helped me sculpt it because he lived it. I made

1651
01:36:29,840 --> 01:36:32,280
Speaker 1: the deal, and I also fell so in love with

1652
01:36:32,320 --> 01:36:35,240
Speaker 1: the ethos of the place. I gave twenty five scholarships

1653
01:36:35,240 --> 01:36:38,439
Speaker 1: out of my pocket for kids who wanted to be

1654
01:36:38,760 --> 01:36:43,480
Speaker 1: Space Campers. We made the movie Walden Media, where my partners,

1655
01:36:43,560 --> 01:36:47,720
Speaker 1: Walden Media still Entrances company. My Clarity was the lead guy.

1656
01:36:47,880 --> 01:36:50,280
Speaker 1: We made the movie Danny Glover of Mirrors or you

1657
01:36:50,360 --> 01:36:53,840
Speaker 1: know There's some good people. It's called Space Warriors, and

1658
01:36:53,920 --> 01:36:56,439
Speaker 1: they had a put deal. We thought it should be

1659
01:36:56,560 --> 01:37:01,000
Speaker 1: Disney Sunday Night movie, but the Walden had a with Hallmark,

1660
01:37:01,320 --> 01:37:03,599
Speaker 1: so the movie had to go on the Hallmark channel.

1661
01:37:04,000 --> 01:37:06,360
Speaker 1: I don't think it was the right channel for that movie,

1662
01:37:06,800 --> 01:37:09,320
Speaker 1: but what it was, it was wonderful. We won the

1663
01:37:09,360 --> 01:37:12,240
Speaker 1: Set Award for the best movie of the year. Teaching

1664
01:37:12,520 --> 01:37:15,840
Speaker 1: kids about science, space and education. I give all the

1665
01:37:15,880 --> 01:37:19,599
Speaker 1: credit to my son Morgan. So a couple of times

1666
01:37:19,640 --> 01:37:23,280
Speaker 1: you mentioned politics and being on the left side of

1667
01:37:23,320 --> 01:37:27,880
Speaker 1: the divide. There's someone who's very worldly and has had

1668
01:37:27,920 --> 01:37:33,559
Speaker 1: the perspective of growing up and immigrating from Europe to America.

1669
01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:37,800
Speaker 1: How do you see today's world divided the way that

1670
01:37:37,880 --> 01:37:41,160
Speaker 1: Don McLean did when he wrote American Pie. We were

1671
01:37:41,200 --> 01:37:46,439
Speaker 1: a divided country back in seventy two when there was

1672
01:37:46,520 --> 01:37:51,240
Speaker 1: Nixon until things changed. How do I see it? I

1673
01:37:51,439 --> 01:37:55,360
Speaker 1: kind of I'm that immigrant dreamer guy who just wants

1674
01:37:55,400 --> 01:37:58,439
Speaker 1: to do right. I want people to have the lives.

1675
01:37:58,479 --> 01:38:00,960
Speaker 1: I want people to earn what they make. I want

1676
01:38:01,000 --> 01:38:03,960
Speaker 1: them to keep what they earn. I'm a big believer

1677
01:38:04,120 --> 01:38:08,280
Speaker 1: in treating people right, never lying, ever cheating, keeping to

1678
01:38:08,680 --> 01:38:10,720
Speaker 1: who you are, Like I was brought up by my

1679
01:38:10,800 --> 01:38:13,200
Speaker 1: parents that I told you about. So, how do I

1680
01:38:13,240 --> 01:38:17,120
Speaker 1: see the world messed up? Um? How do I feel

1681
01:38:17,160 --> 01:38:19,599
Speaker 1: about it? I want to make a difference in media,

1682
01:38:20,360 --> 01:38:23,479
Speaker 1: in pop culture, using media because I can't. That's why

1683
01:38:23,520 --> 01:38:25,479
Speaker 1: I did the Rock and the Core thing for the U.

1684
01:38:25,520 --> 01:38:27,120
Speaker 1: S Marine cars. I don't know if you know about that.

1685
01:38:27,479 --> 01:38:30,200
Speaker 1: Quincy Jones and I teamed up in two thousand five

1686
01:38:30,680 --> 01:38:33,280
Speaker 1: and we did an event at Camp Pendleton for forty

1687
01:38:33,320 --> 01:38:37,720
Speaker 1: five thousand marines. Beyonce and Kiss headlined it. Doc let

1688
01:38:37,760 --> 01:38:40,840
Speaker 1: me have his production crew. We produced the event and

1689
01:38:40,880 --> 01:38:42,880
Speaker 1: we formed a five or one C three so the

1690
01:38:42,960 --> 01:38:45,519
Speaker 1: proceeds could go to the people coming back from Iraq,

1691
01:38:46,080 --> 01:38:50,000
Speaker 1: Education Fund for returning troops, Reparation fund for the families

1692
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:52,519
Speaker 1: that got killed. I produced it. Doc McGhee was my

1693
01:38:52,640 --> 01:38:56,080
Speaker 1: partner on it. Quincy Jones was the executive producer. But

1694
01:38:56,680 --> 01:38:59,240
Speaker 1: I didn't do that for politics. I did it because

1695
01:38:59,520 --> 01:39:02,479
Speaker 1: guys needed If you're a if you're a soldier man,

1696
01:39:02,760 --> 01:39:05,960
Speaker 1: you're fighting for what you believe in, whether you're on

1697
01:39:06,000 --> 01:39:08,320
Speaker 1: the left or the right. The bullets don't have a

1698
01:39:08,360 --> 01:39:11,559
Speaker 1: donkey or an elephant on it. So where do I

1699
01:39:11,640 --> 01:39:14,439
Speaker 1: come out. I come out right in the middle. I

1700
01:39:14,520 --> 01:39:17,360
Speaker 1: want everyone to get married and to be a unit.

1701
01:39:17,760 --> 01:39:19,960
Speaker 1: Is that the way of the world today? Now? Whose

1702
01:39:20,000 --> 01:39:23,760
Speaker 1: fault is? It? Not my place to say on your podcast.

1703
01:39:23,960 --> 01:39:26,280
Speaker 1: But what I want to do is I want to

1704
01:39:26,320 --> 01:39:30,519
Speaker 1: tell stories of brilliant music people don McLean being at

1705
01:39:30,520 --> 01:39:33,960
Speaker 1: the top of that list. Lamont Stephen Schwartz Del Bryant,

1706
01:39:33,960 --> 01:39:36,920
Speaker 1: who's a kid who grew up with his parents being bohemians.

1707
01:39:37,040 --> 01:39:41,880
Speaker 1: And there's more Lee Abrams. You know the Abrams very well. Well.

1708
01:39:41,960 --> 01:39:44,960
Speaker 1: Lee and I are doing a project called Sonic Messengers.

1709
01:39:45,439 --> 01:39:48,400
Speaker 1: It's about radio's impact on pop culture in the world.

1710
01:39:48,840 --> 01:39:52,040
Speaker 1: We just got John Clice to be our executive producer

1711
01:39:52,080 --> 01:39:54,200
Speaker 1: because I want to see I want there to be

1712
01:39:54,240 --> 01:39:58,439
Speaker 1: an English perspective on American radio to the fifties, sixties, seventies, eighties.

1713
01:39:58,880 --> 01:40:02,280
Speaker 1: Lee had the oumption. I met Lee when brook Hard

1714
01:40:02,400 --> 01:40:05,840
Speaker 1: Abrams took My Billy Thorpe Blazer Light Show and he

1715
01:40:05,880 --> 01:40:08,400
Speaker 1: ad Means the guest speaker, and I premiered as the

1716
01:40:08,479 --> 01:40:11,560
Speaker 1: Rubeny Fleet Space Theater in San Diego. Became friends with

1717
01:40:11,680 --> 01:40:15,040
Speaker 1: Lee in nine seventy nine. So Lee and I got

1718
01:40:15,040 --> 01:40:18,360
Speaker 1: back in touch. We're doing a project together two as partners,

1719
01:40:18,479 --> 01:40:20,800
Speaker 1: Lee and I fifty fifty. So those are the kind

1720
01:40:20,840 --> 01:40:23,080
Speaker 1: of people I like to work with. People who are smart,

1721
01:40:23,800 --> 01:40:27,120
Speaker 1: who are ethical, who have vision, and who want to

1722
01:40:27,160 --> 01:40:29,639
Speaker 1: make a difference. And Lee wants to talk about how

1723
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:32,559
Speaker 1: radio form pop culture all the way to when he

1724
01:40:32,560 --> 01:40:35,639
Speaker 1: founded XM Radio. And you know, we wanted to we'll

1725
01:40:35,680 --> 01:40:38,400
Speaker 1: do some podcasts with you. We'll figure out what we

1726
01:40:38,479 --> 01:40:41,840
Speaker 1: need to do. But leaves. My friend Del Bryant is

1727
01:40:41,880 --> 01:40:44,040
Speaker 1: my friend Stephen Schwartz, and my friend Don McLean has

1728
01:40:44,080 --> 01:40:47,960
Speaker 1: become my friend. Why because I'm that kind of guy.

1729
01:40:48,280 --> 01:40:53,120
Speaker 1: I don't know. Well, you're a great talker, great salesman.

1730
01:40:53,240 --> 01:40:56,639
Speaker 1: You're still active. I'm sure you'll be reaching your hand

1731
01:40:56,720 --> 01:41:01,320
Speaker 1: out of the coffin trying to make one more deal. Uh, Spencer, Spencer,

1732
01:41:01,360 --> 01:41:03,160
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for taking the time to

1733
01:41:03,200 --> 01:41:06,160
Speaker 1: talk to my audience. Bob, I want to thank you

1734
01:41:06,240 --> 01:41:10,719
Speaker 1: even more for inviting me because your podcasts, your blog

1735
01:41:11,200 --> 01:41:13,200
Speaker 1: is as about as good as it gets from the

1736
01:41:13,280 --> 01:41:16,559
Speaker 1: monorn music business, at least to me. And I agree

1737
01:41:16,600 --> 01:41:18,720
Speaker 1: with when you have your people right, and when you

1738
01:41:19,000 --> 01:41:21,639
Speaker 1: people say you shouldn't have said this, I say hell

1739
01:41:21,800 --> 01:41:25,000
Speaker 1: with them. I agree with Bob. Judy loves your podcast.

1740
01:41:25,120 --> 01:41:27,840
Speaker 1: She doesn't subscribe like I do. I read it religiously,

1741
01:41:28,160 --> 01:41:30,320
Speaker 1: but my wife reads up and she does go. This

1742
01:41:30,360 --> 01:41:32,000
Speaker 1: guy's a good guy. You should talk to him one

1743
01:41:32,080 --> 01:41:36,120
Speaker 1: day and guess what we're talking here? We are? Okay,

1744
01:41:36,200 --> 01:41:40,120
Speaker 1: great talk Ada Spencer. Until next time. This is Bob

1745
01:41:40,200 --> 01:41:40,759
Speaker 1: left Sex