Speaker 1: On the Bechdelcast.
Speaker 2: The questions asked if movies have women and them, are
Speaker 2: all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands or do they
Speaker 2: have individualism? It's the patriarchy, zeph and best start changing
Speaker 2: with the Bechdel Cast.
Speaker 3: Hello Bechdel Cast listeners, Hello Jamie and Caitlin.
Speaker 4: Here a little plug at the top.
Speaker 3: It's all coming together, it's all happening. I am going
Speaker 3: to be going on a book tour for the paperback
Speaker 3: release of my book Raw Dog, The Naked Truth about
Speaker 3: hot Dogs. Ever heard of it? It is coming out
Speaker 3: in soft cover. If you are the kind of person
Speaker 3: that doesn't want to spend twenty eight dollars out of book,
Speaker 3: fair enough, we have a more affordable option. And if
Speaker 3: you haven't purchased the book and you know, maybe you're
Speaker 3: able to now you know, it's also a great gift.
Speaker 3: I sound so desperate. The thing is, it's a soft
Speaker 3: cover book and people love us.
Speaker 4: And I love a flaccid book.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a little book. And if you do have
Speaker 3: the hardcover and you're a completionist, there is also a
Speaker 3: brand new ForWord that I wrote, and also the acknowledgments
Speaker 3: have been adjusted to acknowledge that my agents were resionists,
Speaker 3: so I don't really thank them anymore. So there's a
Speaker 3: thrilling edition there as well. But there is new stuff
Speaker 3: in the book and it costs less and we love that.
Speaker 3: I will be going on tour throughout the country to
Speaker 3: promote the new book, and if you're a Bechdel head
Speaker 3: and you're in the area, this is a really great
Speaker 3: chance to come and hang out. It's all I'm at bookstores.
Speaker 3: I did kind of bigger shows the first time around,
Speaker 3: but this time we're just chilling. So for you kitling
Speaker 3: with your permission, I'm just going to rattle off some dates.
Speaker 3: What if I was like, no, no, click z, I'm
Speaker 3: going to go pee.
Speaker 4: No please, by all means tell us Okay.
Speaker 3: May thirteenth, twenty twenty five, almost my birthday, So I
Speaker 3: know I'm missing your birthday. It's an act of violence.
Speaker 3: I will be at North Fig Bookshop in Los Angeles,
Speaker 3: hosted by friend of the cast Julia Clair. May fourteenth.
Speaker 3: I will be at Carmichael's Bookstore in Louisville, Kentucky. On
Speaker 3: May fifteenth, I will be at the Cambridge Public Library
Speaker 3: in Massachusetts with the Harvard Bookstore and I will be
Speaker 3: in conversation with one of my dear friends, PBS's own
Speaker 3: Tory Bedford. On the nineteenth of May, I will be
Speaker 3: in Portland, Maine at Longfellow Books, hosted by friend of
Speaker 3: the cast, Mayo Williams.
Speaker 5: I am very, very excited.
Speaker 3: On the twentieth, I will be going down to Harrisburg, Pennsylvania,
Speaker 3: my home state. I know they're going to be begging,
Speaker 3: They're like, where are they? I will be at the
Speaker 3: Midtown Scholar Bookstore and Cafe in conversation with Joe Piazza.
Speaker 3: Then on May twenty first, I will be at the
Speaker 3: Fountain Bookstore in Richmond, Virginia. And on May twenty second,
Speaker 3: I will be at Coppersfield Books in Pedaluma, California. And finally,
Speaker 3: on May thirty first, I will be at Marin Country Mart,
Speaker 3: which is also with Coppersfield's book in Larkspur, California. So
Speaker 3: if you live in those areas, please come out. I
Speaker 3: would love to see you. I'd love to chat. Please
Speaker 3: recommend your favorite hot dog, Let's talk, beck tol Cast,
Speaker 3: let's do whatever. And there will be dates announced later
Speaker 3: in the summer. So if you would like a show
Speaker 3: or a signing to happen in your town. Please reach
Speaker 3: out and I will send it to my publisher and
Speaker 3: be like, see, I should go there. Anyways, that's a great.
Speaker 3: It's begging works sometimes, and we'll link this full thing
Speaker 3: in the description. But see you soon. I'm making a
Speaker 3: little outfit and that's the Jamie Loftus promise.
Speaker 4: I can't wait to see.
Speaker 3: So if you click the link in the description, it
Speaker 3: will take you to the full page where you can
Speaker 3: register to go to these events. They are all free events,
Speaker 3: so come and hang out and provided that I get
Speaker 3: my shit together in time, there will also be speakers
Speaker 3: from local unions at all of these signings, So come out,
Speaker 3: make some friends, come hang out and h let's eat
Speaker 3: some hot dogs.
Speaker 4: Beautiful. We'll throw the link to be able to access
Speaker 4: registration for the events on our link tree as well
Speaker 4: link tree slash Bechtel Cast, so there's no excuse not
Speaker 4: to come.
Speaker 3: It's free, it's fun. I'll be wearing a little outfit.
Speaker 3: Come buy the book.
Speaker 1: Woo.
Speaker 4: One last quick note about this episode. We were kind
Speaker 4: of strapped for time during this recording and we ended
Speaker 4: up having to record some pickups a few days later
Speaker 4: with just Jamie and myself. So there's a chunk toward
Speaker 4: the end of the episode where you might know notice
Speaker 4: that our guest is not saying anything because she is
Speaker 4: not there. So just giving everyone a quick heads up
Speaker 4: about that. Enjoy the episode the cast.
Speaker 1: Do Do Do Do Wow?
Speaker 4: Jamie, will you always be my Maybe?
Speaker 3: No, I'll always be your baby. I'll be your baby girl,
Speaker 3: Always be your baby, Always be my baby girl, Nicole
Speaker 3: Kipman twenty four.
Speaker 4: So true.
Speaker 3: I you know, it is funny thinking about after now
Speaker 3: having seen the movie there that even the title is
Speaker 3: indicating are these two right for each other? Welcome to
Speaker 3: the Bechel Cast. My name is Jamie Loftus.
Speaker 4: My name is Caitlin Deonte. This is our show where
Speaker 4: we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using the
Speaker 4: Bechdel Test as a jumping off point, and that, of course,
Speaker 4: is a medium created by Alison Bechtel. There are many
Speaker 4: versions of the test, and the one that we use
Speaker 4: is this, do two characters of a marginalized gender have names?
Speaker 4: Do they speak to each other? And is there conversation
Speaker 4: about something other than a man?
Speaker 3: And in this economy is it too much to ask?
Speaker 4: Yes?
Speaker 3: Today? We'll find out. Yeah, we're really excited to We're
Speaker 3: just gonna jump in this week. This is a long
Speaker 3: time request. I think we have been getting consistent requests
Speaker 3: for this movie since it came out almost six years ago. So,
Speaker 3: you know, thank you for your patience. The time is now,
Speaker 3: the guest is perfect. We are covering Always Be My Maybe,
Speaker 3: twenty nineteen, directed by Nanachica, con starring and written by
Speaker 3: Ali Wong and Randall Park.
Speaker 4: Ever heard of them?
Speaker 5: Hopefully they're right.
Speaker 4: They're so funny. And speaking of so funny, our guest
Speaker 4: today is an author, screenwriter, journalist, actress, also best friend
Speaker 4: to the Pod period and you know her from past
Speaker 4: episodes such as Ever After, Hairspray, Cadet Kelly nineteen ninety seven, Cinderella,
Speaker 4: It's Kia Brown, Yay, I'm I'm.
Speaker 1: So happy to be here, and they totally organically came
Speaker 1: up with calling me bestie of the Pod. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: was totally organic. I didn't treasure them at all.
Speaker 5: It just felt right. It felt right, it did.
Speaker 1: I just love them, and I was like, I need
Speaker 1: to be here. I miss you, we miss you.
Speaker 4: Thanks for coming back, come back always always always, So,
Speaker 4: what is your history your relationship with always be my maybe.
Speaker 1: Okay, So here's the thing. I love Ali Wong, and
Speaker 1: when it first premiered, I was like, Okay, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: watch it play like period. And then I watched it,
Speaker 1: I fell in love with Randall Park, and I've been,
Speaker 1: you know, rewatching it kind of regularly since because I
Speaker 1: mean I knew who Randall Park was because he was
Speaker 1: on Fresh off the Boat. But really my relationship is
Speaker 1: just like, Wow, a man who I like.
Speaker 4: Wild They really make it hard to like them, Yeah,
Speaker 4: they do.
Speaker 3: But Randall Park is I think, like s Tier, just
Speaker 3: naturally charming, very much like it, just irresistible, very likable.
Speaker 4: So yeah, you watch it when it first came out,
Speaker 4: and then have just been watching it steadily since.
Speaker 1: Yes, pretty much. It had been a while since I
Speaker 1: did rewatch before the pod, but I rewatched it this
Speaker 1: morning just to you know, refresh myself. But I tend
Speaker 1: to watch it a lot when I'm like I need
Speaker 1: a rom com day. I need something that feels like,
Speaker 1: you know, life is good.
Speaker 4: Nice. I'm not a big rom com person, never have been,
Speaker 4: but this is one that I like a lot more
Speaker 4: than a lot of other rom cos I saw that
Speaker 4: when it I think right when it first came out.
Speaker 4: Also my concept of time. I mean, I'm not saying
Speaker 4: anything new here, but the pandemic really warped all of
Speaker 4: our understanding.
Speaker 3: This movie came out like yet the year before. I
Speaker 3: feel like I have a real hard time with movies
Speaker 3: from twenty nineteen now where you're like, you have no idea,
Speaker 3: you don't know what it's like here. Well, I was like, yeah,
Speaker 3: not the movie's fault, but I'm just like buckle in assholes.
Speaker 4: Well, I was like, yeah, this movie probably came out
Speaker 4: in like twenty twenty three. No, it came out so
Speaker 4: many years before that, but.
Speaker 1: Which felt like the weirdest time capsule. Watching it back,
Speaker 1: You're like, yeah, why does this feel like an old
Speaker 1: time film?
Speaker 5: It is?
Speaker 3: That was another thing I had in my notes where
Speaker 3: I feel like this movie for me right now exists
Speaker 3: in this kind of like Uncanny Valley where it feels
Speaker 3: kind of dated because it was six years ago and
Speaker 3: it's very like of the moment it came out, but
Speaker 3: it's not old enough to feel nostalgic for it. And
Speaker 3: so I feel like comedy movies that are like between
Speaker 3: like six and you know, ten ish years old. You're like,
Speaker 3: it's just it's I don't know, it's it's it doesn't
Speaker 3: feel like, oh yeah, I miss this time. I'm like,
Speaker 3: I don't miss twenty ninety. I guess in some ways
Speaker 3: I do. But it was already pretty bad.
Speaker 5: It was.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but yeah, I mean I saw it pretty early
Speaker 4: on into it being released on Netflix. I think I
Speaker 4: got like a tiny theatrical release, but it was like
Speaker 4: mostly a Netflix movie. Yeah.
Speaker 3: And you can tell because they mentioned Fix broadly mentioned Netflix.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: But the thing is, you know, it's the grossest part.
Speaker 1: I find that so charming.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's like the Christmas Expanded. Yeah, when Lindsay
Speaker 3: Lohan is watching the Christmas Prints, I'm like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: I like that. But is there anything more twenty nineteen
Speaker 3: than Ali Wong being like, is it the Crown? I'm like,
Speaker 3: oh my god, it was a moment. It was a moment.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Anyway, So I generally like this movie. I have some thoughts,
Speaker 4: I have some notes, but this is more my speed
Speaker 4: when it comes to rom coms, and I'd seen it
Speaker 4: I think twice before prepping for this episode. But yeah,
Speaker 4: I'm excited to talk about it. Jamie what about You.
Speaker 3: Okay, I this is my first time seeing this movie.
Speaker 3: I was going in like kind of not even thinking
Speaker 3: that I would not enjoy it because I love Ali
Speaker 3: Wong Randall Park, one of the most charismatic comic actors
Speaker 3: that exists. I read a little bit about the movie before.
Speaker 3: I love that they co wrote it together. I love
Speaker 3: that there was so much energy, like their fans to
Speaker 3: get this movie made. I love that they have like
Speaker 3: randomly known each other for a long time and wanted
Speaker 3: to do this for I found the background story so charming.
Speaker 3: I'm like, let's go. I can't wait. And I did
Speaker 3: not like the movie.
Speaker 5: I didn't like it.
Speaker 3: I found it and part of this is like me
Speaker 3: projecting a little bit. But but but hear me out.
Speaker 3: I think this couple is not gonna make it.
Speaker 5: I think this.
Speaker 3: I found it very stressful. I found this couple to
Speaker 3: be very, very, very stressful. I think she should not
Speaker 3: have this man's child. He learned how to do laundry
Speaker 3: three days ago. And she's like, I think I'm gonna
Speaker 3: I want to be with you for the rest of
Speaker 3: my life. I like, I don't know, I don't And
Speaker 3: I also find it like this is very rom comy,
Speaker 3: but I feel like a lot of rom coms, the
Speaker 3: reason that they don't quite click is because they don't
Speaker 3: bother to write one of the characters. But both of
Speaker 3: these characters are We know a lot about them. They're
Speaker 3: fully realized. We know about their backgrounds, and that is
Speaker 3: why I feel confident when I say these people are
Speaker 3: fundamentally incompatible for each other. They're not going to make it.
Speaker 3: I think they should marry other people and then like
Speaker 3: hook up over the holidays like grown ups. To you,
Speaker 3: they should not get married. I think truly. Like I
Speaker 3: the the watching the last fifteen minutes, I was like,
Speaker 3: I'm so worried for her because this guy and I
Speaker 3: am projecting here, but like these things happen. A guy
Speaker 3: comes up, you know, he's like.
Speaker 5: Guess what, guess what.
Speaker 3: Two weeks ago, everything about me changed. I am a
Speaker 3: fundamentally new person, and it's for you. I no longer
Speaker 3: resent your success. I am willing to uproot my entire
Speaker 3: life to be with you. I've fully processed the death
Speaker 3: of my mother, and actually I think it would be
Speaker 3: amazing if you made a ton of money making her recipes.
Speaker 3: I also think that's creepy.
Speaker 4: But anyways, his mom like plagiarizing his mom's recipes.
Speaker 5: I think she should.
Speaker 3: I mean, I feel like she should have like checked
Speaker 3: in with him more before being like, just's what my
Speaker 3: business is your dead mom's recipes?
Speaker 5: What? I like?
Speaker 3: I am not rooting for them. I think that ten
Speaker 3: days after the events of the last scene in this movie,
Speaker 3: he wakes up and is like, oh my god, I
Speaker 3: have left everything I ever know. I don't have a job.
Speaker 3: I have stated in public that it is my dream
Speaker 3: to like, I feel like the feminism of this movie
Speaker 3: is very weird, where it's like feminism is a man
Speaker 3: definitely changing and giving up on any of his ambition.
Speaker 3: You're like, no, it's not, but his band isn't gonna
Speaker 3: be successful, like we all saw it that.
Speaker 5: It's just I found.
Speaker 3: It so stressful, like she has taken on and I
Speaker 3: think she's asking too much of him by having him
Speaker 3: move across the country, like she is not compromised with
Speaker 3: him at all. I just am like, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I've been in couples counseling before, and these two are
Speaker 3: they are not gonna go the distance I feel I
Speaker 3: feel for them. They deserve happiness, but not with each other.
Speaker 4: I don't disagree. I also don't think they're compatible nor
Speaker 4: will they make it. But I've never seen a rom call.
Speaker 3: Blood pressure was off the charts. I was so scared
Speaker 3: for them.
Speaker 4: For me, I'm just like, I watch any rom com
Speaker 4: and I'm like, yeah, none of these people are gonna
Speaker 4: make it. I don't even like consider that.
Speaker 3: See I get I think, I mean, I see what
Speaker 3: you're saying, but I think that I just found it busy.
Speaker 3: I mean, and there's we'll talk about. There's so much
Speaker 3: to love about this movie. There's a lot to love
Speaker 3: about this movie, but I just was so I found
Speaker 3: the central relationship to be so distracting, where every beat
Speaker 3: of the movie of them growing closer, I'm like, this
Speaker 3: is toxic.
Speaker 5: This is toxic.
Speaker 3: And you don't need to marry the person you lost
Speaker 3: your virginity too, Like you can just be close with
Speaker 3: them and be like I always find that to be
Speaker 3: like a weirdly conservative thing to be like, oh, you know,
Speaker 3: it's your first love. Also this, oh my god, sorry,
Speaker 3: I was like, my face is hot the scene where
Speaker 3: and this is definitely be projecting because I recently lost
Speaker 3: a parent. But like the way that that is the
Speaker 3: dead mom trope I thought was so cheap and like
Speaker 3: he also, I mean, it is funny that Randall Park
Speaker 3: is visibly like forty five and he's like, I'm just
Speaker 3: a seventeen year I'm just a little guy.
Speaker 5: I loved that.
Speaker 1: I loved it because I felt the same way about
Speaker 1: Elie Wong. I was like, yeah, they try it.
Speaker 3: It was literally watching Penn fifteen for ten minutes of
Speaker 3: the movie.
Speaker 1: Literally, you're like, I loved them fifteen, So yeah, celebratory.
Speaker 3: I wish I almost wish they'd played into that a
Speaker 3: little more. But I mean I didn't have an issue
Speaker 3: with that, but just that that, like the way that
Speaker 3: that played out where his mom had just died. Ali
Speaker 3: Wong is like, well, she's my mom too, and and
Speaker 3: Randall Park correctly is like, well, no she's not. And
Speaker 3: then she's like, I'm never gonna speak to you again.
Speaker 3: I was like, that's awful. You're being a bad friend.
Speaker 3: And she never apologizes, She never apologizes for doing that.
Speaker 3: I oh, ooh, these characters. I just think they need
Speaker 3: to go to therapy and don't move in together, don't
Speaker 3: have a kid, focus on yourselves.
Speaker 1: What I'm about to say it's so controversial, I can't wait.
Speaker 1: First of all, I disagree entirely. Okay, So here's the thing. Okay,
Speaker 1: I think it wasn't that he I'm speaking solely of
Speaker 1: the end of the movie. I don't think he flew
Speaker 1: there and was like I changed all of these things
Speaker 1: about myself just for you. I think it was just like,
Speaker 1: I would rather fuck up on all lives things win
Speaker 1: you than I would without you. And so for me.
Speaker 1: And here's the kicker. We deeply agree that she never apologized,
Speaker 1: and I hate it. That's so weird. I don't understand
Speaker 1: why movie he's well meaning or not cut out necessary
Speaker 1: apologies because I think that she desperately needed to give
Speaker 1: him one when she's like, you're an asshole and didn't
Speaker 1: talk to him for like fifteen years because she said, hey,
Speaker 1: my mom just died. Like my mom just died, and
Speaker 1: I know you loved her. Cool, we love that, but
Speaker 1: she was my mom, Like he's grieving hello, But I
Speaker 1: don't know. There was just something about it that I
Speaker 1: was just like, And this is really in part because
Speaker 1: I'm so used to couples not having chemistry anymore.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like that's a very their chemistry is amazing.
Speaker 1: Their chemistry is amazing, So I think that that's what's
Speaker 1: doing the heavy lifting for me. But I literally was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I hope they make it.
Speaker 3: I hope they're make it, even though.
Speaker 1: They've got a ton of stuff to work through. Like,
Speaker 1: like you said, she doesn't really compromise at all throughout
Speaker 1: the movie, Like I forgot until you said it that
Speaker 1: they literally flew across the world and the dad it's like,
Speaker 1: thanks for letting us visit to see the new rest
Speaker 1: And then I was like, oh.
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, she's like I made this right. She doesn't
Speaker 3: mean even though she has a restaurant in San Francisco.
Speaker 1: That she can easily run, she could have changed the
Speaker 1: restaurant in San Francisco to be closer to what she
Speaker 1: always wanted it to be, not open a new one.
Speaker 3: And the end of the plot moved so quickly that
Speaker 3: it was very whiplashy, where yeah, no, she doesn't compromise
Speaker 3: at all, which is I guess, okay to the extent
Speaker 3: that they broke up, Like she didn't, she didn't owe
Speaker 3: him anything. But like there is this montage of like
Speaker 3: Randall Park randomly gets his shit together and he's like,
Speaker 3: I'm just he just moved into his own apartment and
Speaker 3: now he's leaving, Like what do you mean?
Speaker 1: And you know how expensive it is to break a lease.
Speaker 3: He's like, San Francisco, I'll like get real. He's like,
Speaker 3: I'm out of here all right before we sorry, sorry,
Speaker 3: Let's take a quick break and then we'll come back
Speaker 3: to the recap and then we will dive back in.
Speaker 4: And we're bad.
Speaker 3: This is thrilling, this, this is hot.
Speaker 4: This is this is heat from a stove that.
Speaker 3: Sasha Randall Park's dead Mom's recipe.
Speaker 1: Like also, like, no, it got to be rude, but like,
Speaker 1: why couldn't they kill off the dam Like.
Speaker 3: I like, I thought his I thought the dad character
Speaker 3: was so charming.
Speaker 1: I love the dad. But if you're gonna kill off
Speaker 1: a character, why is it always the mom?
Speaker 6: It's always so often always And I was literally, okay again,
Speaker 6: I just like, don't think this movie is very well written,
Speaker 6: because I was literally in the middle of writing down
Speaker 6: I love the mom character, and then it cut to
Speaker 6: they're just chilling on a bridge and the dad walks.
Speaker 3: It reminded me of the first scene in a series
Speaker 3: of unfortunate events, just like he comes out of the
Speaker 3: shadows and he's like, bad news, your mom's dead, and
Speaker 3: then cut to their fucking You're like, what the pasic.
Speaker 5: Is so bizarre?
Speaker 2: You know what?
Speaker 1: I hated. I hated her parents because I hate when
Speaker 1: it's like parents are absentee and then they're like, well
Speaker 1: I showed up now, and like again this has been projecting,
Speaker 1: But I hate an absentee parent that's like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: you know, I went in and bought the food at
Speaker 1: the restaurant, and I didn't tell them that we were related,
Speaker 1: so like I paid full price, but that's gonna be
Speaker 1: the fix to our relationship. It's like either way, yeah,
Speaker 1: I know that Randall's mom wasn't her mom, but her
Speaker 1: parents still like she didn't have anybody else. When she
Speaker 1: said I had me, she's like you had parents, and
Speaker 1: she's like, yeah, they were alive, but they weren't.
Speaker 3: I wish that they had like gotten into that a
Speaker 3: little bit more, because too, we didn't. We weren't really
Speaker 3: told unless I missed it and it was said in passing.
Speaker 3: We weren't really told why they weren't around. There wasn't
Speaker 3: really which I mean, I just would have appreciated I
Speaker 3: guess more context there. And then on Randall Park's side,
Speaker 3: I feel like you could get I mean, it's still
Speaker 3: I agree the dead mom troupe is such a trope,
Speaker 3: but like if more reference was made to her throughout
Speaker 3: the movie, it would feel less tropy. But she really
Speaker 3: only comes up at very plot convenient moments.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I was curious about her parents too, because you're totally right.
Speaker 3: He like, I think like the bond that she has
Speaker 3: with Randall Park's mom Marcus, sorry, Marcus's mom. I believe
Speaker 3: her name is Judy, but I thought that was like
Speaker 3: really cool and like a surrogate parent and like someone
Speaker 3: who can give you emotional support but they just don't
Speaker 3: really get into it ever. And I don't know, Yeah,
Speaker 3: I just it' And then the way that, yeah, she
Speaker 3: the way she forgives her parents at the end, it
Speaker 3: feels like she just does that because the movie needs her. Yes,
Speaker 3: And like you're saying, like, oh, how convenient that now
Speaker 3: that I am wildly successful, You're like, I don't know,
Speaker 3: I guess I'll show up and like get a bunch
Speaker 3: of fancy food and like you're even.
Speaker 1: The little birthday party they had where she was they
Speaker 1: were like oh, they go all out for the sun
Speaker 1: god son whatever he is. And she's like, oh, when
Speaker 1: I was eight, they gave me like a I don't know.
Speaker 4: A pair of foot flop.
Speaker 1: Thank you, I said, a trapper Jesus, I'm aging myself
Speaker 1: a pair of foot flaps.
Speaker 5: And I'm just like and like, what changed?
Speaker 1: Yeah, like explore that. Why are they not saying, like,
Speaker 1: I just think not enough round coms show apologies in
Speaker 1: the way that I need them to.
Speaker 4: For sure. Yeah, we've talked about that quite a bit
Speaker 4: on many but.
Speaker 3: On a few levels here like yeah, like we we
Speaker 3: needed a better I mean, there was technically an apology
Speaker 3: from the parents, but it was like half asked.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I was like, hey, we're here now, Yeah, we
Speaker 1: flew to you, so like lead on a plane, let's let's.
Speaker 3: Just let everything else go like step one. Because also
Speaker 3: like some bouscemis hast stuff in here. That Again, towards
Speaker 3: the end, it's so rushed where they break up. It
Speaker 3: seems like the understanding is they're not going to speak anymore.
Speaker 3: But then he starts calling her I do her every
Speaker 3: single day, being like, hey, I don't know if you
Speaker 3: want to hear from me, and you aren't replying, but
Speaker 3: guess what, I learned how to do laundry on this
Speaker 3: my forty fifth birthday, or like whatever the fuck he's doing,
Speaker 3: and he keeps contacting her, and the plot validates that
Speaker 3: he was right to do that because she was buying
Speaker 3: all of his merch or something and she wasn't upset,
Speaker 3: And you're like.
Speaker 1: It's like, if that's the case, the merch buying was
Speaker 1: what both because I was like, if you're buying his
Speaker 1: merch and you're not upset anymore, then reach out and
Speaker 1: say something. Especially because they had the earlier scene where
Speaker 1: they both wanted to text each other and neither of
Speaker 1: them did. It would have been a real nice callback
Speaker 1: for her to be like, even if she wasn't like
Speaker 1: everything's good, just like you know, good luck or whatever
Speaker 1: some sort of like dramatic ass sign off, but you
Speaker 1: know that even when they get back to being in touch,
Speaker 1: that would have made it even sweeter. But I will
Speaker 1: say my favorite part of the entire movie, surprisingly is
Speaker 1: when they like hook up for the first time after
Speaker 1: he punches Keanu Reeves, because I remember watching it for
Speaker 1: the first time and being like, oh, so, like Randall
Speaker 1: Park is hot, you know, like I was just like,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, plot aside, I was like, oh okay, because
Speaker 1: I forget that men can be hot. I forget that
Speaker 1: they can be so often, so often. And then I'm
Speaker 1: just like, oh wow, okay, I see what she was
Speaker 1: doing all right, Like everybody she kisses in the movie
Speaker 1: is attractive. She's so right, she's so real for that.
Speaker 1: But then it's just like, yeah, I think about certain
Speaker 1: things of like I love the movie. I love their chemistry.
Speaker 1: Chemistry is so rare from movies these days. I think
Speaker 1: that they can just put hot people together and it's
Speaker 1: gonna be great, like any anyone.
Speaker 4: But you you know, oh, is that the Glenn Powell?
Speaker 4: What's her face?
Speaker 3: Seeing it?
Speaker 1: I hate it?
Speaker 4: Not a shred of chemistry so badly written of a
Speaker 4: movie as well.
Speaker 1: She literally acts like she just took a Bena drill
Speaker 1: before each of her lines, like she took a benadrill.
Speaker 1: They said action and she did a line. I can't
Speaker 1: no chemistry. It was like watching paint dry, but worse,
Speaker 1: so bad.
Speaker 3: That was a movie that I was like, I've watched
Speaker 3: it on a plane in five years.
Speaker 4: You know, don't skip it, don't even bother.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's better playing movies to watch.
Speaker 4: Yes, anyway, So the recap of.
Speaker 5: We've told you a lot of what happens.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I'm gonna speak for this.
Speaker 5: Okay, here we go.
Speaker 4: We meet two best friends kids in San Francisco in
Speaker 4: nineteen ninety six.
Speaker 3: They mysteriously sound like an Ali Sorry I'm complaining again.
Speaker 3: Every character in this movie mysteriously sounds like they're reading
Speaker 3: Ali Wong's stand up. It doesn't matter. These children speak
Speaker 3: in lines from Baby Cobras.
Speaker 4: So this is Sasha Tran and Marcus Kim. They're best friends.
Speaker 4: Sasha is a latch key kid. Her parents are often
Speaker 4: out running their store, so she goes over to Marcus's
Speaker 4: house quite a bit and hangs out with him and
Speaker 4: his mom and his dad. His mom teaches Sasha a
Speaker 4: few things about cooking. She also already has kind of
Speaker 4: like a proclivity for it, and she has to like
Speaker 4: prepare her own meals quite a bit. This will obviously
Speaker 4: pay off later because she becomes a chef. Anyway, they
Speaker 4: hang out. There's a quick montage of them growing up together.
Speaker 4: They're goofing, they're hanging. Marcus is in a band as
Speaker 4: a teenager that'll also be a thing. Later in the movie,
Speaker 4: we cut to two thousand and three. They are now
Speaker 4: seniors in high school. Sasha is played by Ali Wong,
Speaker 4: Marcus is played by Randall Park. Now they're still best friends,
Speaker 4: and then Marcus gets word that his mom has died
Speaker 4: in an accident, and after the funeral, Sasha gets Marcus
Speaker 4: out of the house to try to get his mind
Speaker 4: off of it. They start kissing via her surprise, kissing
Speaker 4: him initially.
Speaker 3: But again, I'm just like her bedside manner with his
Speaker 3: mother's tragic passing is so unbelievably bad, which she's like,
Speaker 3: will this help?
Speaker 4: Like no, But they start making out and they have
Speaker 4: sex in the back of his Toyota Corolla, but it's
Speaker 4: very awkward afterward and they get into an argument and
Speaker 4: Sasha storms off. Cut to twenty nineteen in Los Angeles.
Speaker 4: Ever heard of it? Sasha and Marcus haven't for many years.
Speaker 3: They were at Stories. Did you notice when they were
Speaker 3: at Stories?
Speaker 1: Oh?
Speaker 5: No, I didn't.
Speaker 3: There was definitely one scene. It was supposed to be
Speaker 3: San Francisco, but La heads well, no, the bookstore Stories
Speaker 3: is uh one of the greatest places in the city,
Speaker 3: and there's definitely they definitely shot teenage Randall Park being
Speaker 3: in his band was like at one of our bookstores
Speaker 3: down the street.
Speaker 4: Over, I did not realize that.
Speaker 3: Wow, I would recognized that weird mural. It's just like
Speaker 3: when Lady Gaga was at the Verge.
Speaker 5: Wow.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Wow, a star is born.
Speaker 3: Hollywood, Hollywood. I was like, wow, I've bombed on both
Speaker 3: of those stages.
Speaker 5: That's so cool.
Speaker 4: Same yeah, okay. Anyway, So it's twenty nineteen. Now, Sasha
Speaker 4: is now a successful celebrity chef. She's about to open
Speaker 4: a restaurant in San Francisco in a couple of weeks.
Speaker 4: She's got a hot fiance, a fiance Brandon, played by
Speaker 4: Daniel day Kim.
Speaker 3: I'm for cheering Daniel day Kim in a beige track suit.
Speaker 3: I was like a bu, like a b really horny
Speaker 3: for the beige tracksuit for some reason, and I was
Speaker 3: like wow.
Speaker 1: I was like, yes, Diva, I didn't I didn't know
Speaker 1: your game, but I know it now.
Speaker 3: You know when someone can look hot in a tracksuit,
Speaker 3: it's like, okay, this is a this is another level.
Speaker 4: Yeah, good for you, good for you. Truly. Anyway, So
Speaker 4: they're engaged, but it doesn't seem like they have a
Speaker 4: very warm or loving relationship. Meanwhile, Marcus lives in San Francisco.
Speaker 4: He's still in his band called Hello Peril. They play,
Speaker 4: you know, like crummy gigs or what we're supposed to
Speaker 4: think or crummy gigs. He smokes a lot of weed.
Speaker 4: He still lives with his dad, who's played by James Sato,
Speaker 4: and Marcus is not motivated by capitalism, so we are
Speaker 4: supposed to think that he's kind of a loser. And
Speaker 4: I have a lot of stuff to talk about regarding class.
Speaker 3: Okay, that's another big thing about, Like, yeah, I don't
Speaker 3: I do like that their business, which again they're like,
Speaker 3: oh you're not. I'm like, these are really good union jobs,
Speaker 3: like right, like shut up.
Speaker 1: Let's call a spaderes bad do. I think that the
Speaker 1: band is trash absolutely, But his day dadad, his day
Speaker 1: job is kind of like a big one, Like that's
Speaker 1: a good job. That's a good man, Savannah, and it
Speaker 1: is wild.
Speaker 3: I truly, I was like, I cannot like especially because
Speaker 3: these characters are in their thirties, Like I would not
Speaker 3: be like, oh, you know this man that I'm in
Speaker 3: love with who has a like great union job, I'm
Speaker 3: not going to be like quit, leave everything you know
Speaker 3: and be in.
Speaker 5: Your horrible band, Like I don't.
Speaker 3: Support men's dreams like that.
Speaker 4: Like, well, I think it's because he works a blue
Speaker 4: collar job that we're supposed to be, Like he needs
Speaker 4: to get out of that.
Speaker 5: He needs to do more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's sort of part of the girl bossiness of
Speaker 3: this of like it is coded that someone could not
Speaker 3: possibly be satisfied or content working at blue collar job,
Speaker 3: or that they couldn't be content living where they grew
Speaker 3: up either, like you have to move to New York
Speaker 3: City and be an artist or you're a failure.
Speaker 4: Totally okay. So back in La Sasha's fiance Brandon says
Speaker 4: that he wants to postpone their wedding and see other
Speaker 4: people for a while, and Sasha's friend and colleague, Veronica
Speaker 4: played by Michelle Buteau, is like what the fuck, like
Speaker 4: fuck that guy, and Sasha's like, yeah, probably. Then she
Speaker 4: and Veronica head to San Francisco together to open the
Speaker 4: new restaurant. They rent a house there and Veronica hires
Speaker 4: Marcus and his dad to install or repair an air
Speaker 4: conditioning unit. And Veronica did this to try to get
Speaker 4: Sasha and Marcus to reconnect, but things are still awkward
Speaker 4: between them. This is the first time they're seeing each
Speaker 4: other in like sixteen years or something. Mister Kim suggests
Speaker 4: that Sasha goes to Marcus's gig the following night, and
Speaker 4: he also says like, hmm, I'm surprised you lost touch.
Speaker 4: I always thought you'd maybe get together, and they're.
Speaker 3: Like, he's really plot vibes at different moments. Yeah, he
Speaker 3: walks into the city. He's like, your mother is dead.
Speaker 3: He walks into the cities, like you two should be
Speaker 3: to get together. At the end of the.
Speaker 1: Movie, I acause, first of all, I love the actor
Speaker 1: who plays his dad, but I also laughed at the
Speaker 1: point in the film when he was like, I can
Speaker 1: do my shot in the ass by myself, and it's
Speaker 1: like we saw him to give you a shot on
Speaker 1: the shoulder, so I was right when did it twitch right? There?
Speaker 3: Again, it's just like the lack of detail that appears
Speaker 3: a different because it's like they're like, I'm his caretaker,
Speaker 3: but we don't know, we don't know have any context
Speaker 3: for what that means. He implies that he doesn't need
Speaker 3: a caretaker, but then it kind of comes back later
Speaker 3: as if he does like it was just really confused
Speaker 3: and and and then again, I think Ali Wank's character
Speaker 3: was super insensitive by being like, what.
Speaker 5: Do you mean you're just saying you need to be.
Speaker 3: Your dad's caretaker because you won't follow your dream or
Speaker 3: such like how projecting you're projecting?
Speaker 1: And then the thing with him getting with the Diana
Speaker 1: Ross impersonator. I was like, Okay, I guess, like I
Speaker 1: get it. Yeah, like I'm happy for you, you know,
Speaker 1: but it just it just seems so rare and don
Speaker 1: and and also too, I did not like the character
Speaker 1: of his girlfriend. I know you're not supposed to like
Speaker 1: the girlfriend Jenny, but I particularly found the like Keanu
Speaker 1: Reeves bit with her annoying, like not him, we love Keanu,
Speaker 1: and like she's a great actress, but it was also
Speaker 1: just like flat wise, she's like I'm just gonna stay
Speaker 1: and like, you know, talk to him about saving yet sorry.
Speaker 4: Oh we're about to be We're getting close.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is this is a chaos episode. I love you.
Speaker 4: Oh Okay. So Sasha decides to go to Marcus's band's
Speaker 4: gig that night or the next night or whatever, and
Speaker 4: it's a nice time and it seems like maybe things
Speaker 4: are starting to be less awkward between Marcus and Sasha.
Speaker 4: But then Marcus's girlfriend, Jenny played by Vivian Bang shows up.
Speaker 4: She's a big fan of Sasha's and wants to cook
Speaker 4: for her, So Jenny invites her back to like her
Speaker 4: and Marcus's place and basically makes a hot dog based
Speaker 4: dish for Sasha.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and uh, Sasha has a real snob about it.
Speaker 3: I'm like, listen, there's a b I have a book
Speaker 3: for you.
Speaker 1: I got to be fair. Who likes who likes? Though, and.
Speaker 3: I think, well, okay, I'm uniquely going to defend them.
Speaker 3: But when properly cooked, it didn't seem like she cooked
Speaker 3: it very well though.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it seemed like a pretty gross dish. Yeah, But
Speaker 4: the whole idea here is that Jenny is very cooky
Speaker 4: and clearly not the right match for Marcus.
Speaker 3: Even though it's like they're making it out like and
Speaker 3: and there, I thought we were a couple of cheap
Speaker 3: jokes that they have this character say where it's like
Speaker 3: the idea again where it's just like, this movie has
Speaker 3: moments that feel bizarrely conservative, like Jenny's character brings up
Speaker 3: that she was she used to be poly amorous, and
Speaker 3: that's very much like.
Speaker 5: She's weird.
Speaker 1: Weird. Yeah, I didn't have the spiritually married thing right.
Speaker 1: That was also played for laughs.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was just yeah, it was just kind of
Speaker 3: cheap because it's like, Okay, if polyamory is not your thing,
Speaker 3: that's fine, But we're looking at two characters who lost
Speaker 3: their virginity to each other and barely get along. Like
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to take your feelings on polyamory seriously, get
Speaker 3: a grip.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 4: Anyway, So they're all hanging out and then Marcus gives
Speaker 4: Sasha a ride home in the car that they had
Speaker 4: sex in all those years ago.
Speaker 1: Which I like, sorry, but I just hate to eat
Speaker 1: get that car like it took me off. I don't
Speaker 1: know why I had such a visible reaction, and I
Speaker 1: was like, get a new.
Speaker 3: You've got a good job, Like, I don't know that
Speaker 3: it's not a it's not a money Why he's still
Speaker 3: driving the carl.
Speaker 4: Get a vehicle shrug.
Speaker 3: They're both such anyway.
Speaker 4: They they're reminiscing about the past, and then she invites
Speaker 4: him to a birthday party the following day at her parents' house.
Speaker 4: They're celebrating a little cousin or something. During the party,
Speaker 4: Sasha gets a call from her fiance Brandon, who she
Speaker 4: had seen on social media canoodling with pad Malakshmi, and
Speaker 4: so Sasha yells.
Speaker 3: At him, Daniel Da Kevin pad Mlakhvi, like, honestly make
Speaker 3: it happen, watch someone arrange that day.
Speaker 4: Anyway, they break up is basically what happens. Meanwhile, Sasha
Speaker 4: and Marcus seem to be connecting more and more, although
Speaker 4: it's still a little awkward between them, but they go
Speaker 4: out for some food and they talk about Marcus's band.
Speaker 4: Sasha thinks that they're good and they can be really big,
Speaker 4: but Mark doesn't have huge aspirations, and she keeps judging him.
Speaker 3: For that, which again is like this is where it starts.
Speaker 3: It really started to kick in for me of like,
Speaker 3: then you guys just aren't compatible. It's okay, Like it's
Speaker 3: it's not a character I mean, I think the way
Speaker 3: that she's judgmental of him is a character flaw and
Speaker 3: is a dark quality. But it's like, if she wants
Speaker 3: someone who is really ambitious and working in a creative field,
Speaker 3: this is not the person for you. Accept it.
Speaker 1: Also, I think the bigger thing is and again as
Speaker 1: the defender of this relationship aside.
Speaker 4: I'm neutral, is like, the band's not good, Like I look.
Speaker 3: That because Randall Park, I guess was He's like, it's
Speaker 3: based on my band from the nineties. I was like, well, yeah,
Speaker 3: claud you're an act right.
Speaker 1: The thing is is like I know he likes to
Speaker 1: wrap and do that stuff. Like I'm like talk shows
Speaker 1: and stuff, and that's great. We love a hobby, but
Speaker 1: the the band is so that sounded Sony Randall Park,
Speaker 1: I love you, You're perfect, but it's just like, I
Speaker 1: just don't feel like the band itself was as good
Speaker 1: as she was trying to make us believe it was. Therefore,
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, she wants to really like him
Speaker 1: because she just keeps telling people, Oh my god, they're
Speaker 1: good and they could be big. No, they won't be.
Speaker 1: They can't be.
Speaker 5: When she's like, why don't you.
Speaker 3: Go on a world tour, I'm like, what do you talk?
Speaker 5: Did you hear?
Speaker 1: What? Talent and money and time? What do you guys
Speaker 1: do it? And I think maybe that's very AI wound
Speaker 1: with me. I'm an earth sign, but I just feel
Speaker 1: like I'm a virgirl, so like we love a plan
Speaker 1: I just feel like your job with your daughter is
Speaker 1: great if you want to just take over that. Butiness
Speaker 1: that made more sense to me than like holding on
Speaker 1: to I'm gonna be in this bak like do it
Speaker 1: for fun. But I just felt like plot wise, it
Speaker 1: didn't work to me, Like her opening the restaurant after
Speaker 1: his mom worked for her character.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 4: I didn't mind some of the band's lyrics. I'll say that.
Speaker 4: Oh I thought they were kind of funny.
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, Like I punched on I've seen that all
Speaker 1: the time, Like I was, I was singing it, I
Speaker 1: was the credits, and I'm like, why don't I remember
Speaker 1: all these words?
Speaker 3: I thought the tennis ball song was cute, but they're
Speaker 3: they're like forty. I was like, I can't be just
Speaker 3: like saying songs about tennis ball different and be like
Speaker 3: and I'm a viable partner. That's again.
Speaker 5: But like, yeah, I agree that they were.
Speaker 3: They were really pushing the band is like, but and
Speaker 3: and like you're saying, Kia that his character. It didn't
Speaker 3: seem like that was his Like I want to be
Speaker 3: a famous musician like that, right, I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's like it's if he is content and I don't know.
Speaker 3: It just felt like so like, uh, black and white
Speaker 3: in terms of what needed to happen with his character,
Speaker 3: because it does seem like, yes, it would probably make
Speaker 3: sense for him to like have his own place if
Speaker 3: he's able to and like mature a little bit and it,
Speaker 3: but because the movie doesn't seem interested in like examining
Speaker 3: his grief for like why he's making those choices and
Speaker 3: doesn't want to leave the home or whatever, it is,
Speaker 3: like I just wish that there was some sort of
Speaker 3: gray area to explore of like, yes, he has a
Speaker 3: ways to go and like he's still growing as a person,
Speaker 3: but that doesn't mean like I don't know, yeah, just
Speaker 3: that the only version of success is being a famous
Speaker 3: musician in New York City is like wild kind.
Speaker 1: It's it's also just I think really weird that, like
Speaker 1: I think you can absolutely be career focused, like Eli
Speaker 1: Lung's character. Why do I not know their names? What
Speaker 1: is going on with me?
Speaker 4: Sasha and Marcus Sasha?
Speaker 1: Okay, the thing with like Alis, the thing with Sasha, Like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I know I want to do I want to I
Speaker 1: want to have restaurants. I want to do like like
Speaker 1: this is important to me and his sort of thing
Speaker 1: is like I'm grieving and that's important to me. But
Speaker 1: I don't know. I just felt like it would have
Speaker 1: been so much richer if he had a thing that
Speaker 1: he was like good at, you know, right again that's
Speaker 1: that's me speaking from a capitalistic society. But like what
Speaker 1: if he could draw girl folded like a launcher.
Speaker 3: I would have felt like like one of his French girls.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, I don't know.
Speaker 4: I just felt like I maybe I'm just a defender
Speaker 4: of the band Hello Peril, But I was like that
Speaker 4: was his thing, that that is what he's doing.
Speaker 5: It needs your support.
Speaker 4: Is it amazing?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 4: But I would have gone to see them for fun
Speaker 4: one night.
Speaker 1: I don't know, for fun for sure.
Speaker 3: Yeah for fun, Yeah, for fun one night.
Speaker 1: Imagine her trying to follow him around in a world tour.
Speaker 1: I mean it's just the songs.
Speaker 3: I was like, this band has been together for twenty
Speaker 3: years or something and they I only have three songs.
Speaker 1: Which is why it because everybody looks younger than I.
Speaker 3: Mean they are, because I did it, Charlie ye Is
Speaker 3: they were born. I mean they're like fifteen years younger
Speaker 3: than well.
Speaker 4: They addressed that in the movie, they're like, oh, it's
Speaker 4: just me and I forget the other guy's name, but
Speaker 4: it's like those were the original members and then they're
Speaker 4: like and then we added new people later.
Speaker 1: So also, like, again, I've seen this movie a handful
Speaker 1: of times at this point, never knew that the parents
Speaker 1: had a store.
Speaker 4: Never only because it's in one quick, almost throwaway line
Speaker 4: where they leave a message on the answering machine for
Speaker 4: young Sasha and they're like, sorry, we won't be home.
Speaker 4: We're stuck at the store. Make yourself dinner. So like
Speaker 4: that's the only time we have any indication of what
Speaker 4: they do, right, But yeah, that also could have been
Speaker 4: like why don't we see them at the store or
Speaker 4: something something? Anyway, so where were we? This is shortly
Speaker 4: after Sasha and Brandon have broken off their engagement and
Speaker 4: oh yeah, and then like Sasha is like, Marcus, you
Speaker 4: should try to be a famous new musician and he's like, no,
Speaker 4: no thanks, that's not really why I'm doing this. And
Speaker 4: then that night, while Sasha is catering a wrap party
Speaker 4: for a Netflix show, she meets someone and we don't
Speaker 4: know who it is at first, and we're like, oh,
Speaker 4: who could it be? And we'll find out soon that
Speaker 4: it's Keanu Reeves.
Speaker 3: I remember this was like, this was like a very
Speaker 3: like break the Internet kind of moment when it happened.
Speaker 3: That's the only thing I knew about this movie was
Speaker 3: that there is an extended Keanu Reeves cameo and it.
Speaker 4: Yes where he plays himself, which I don't mind. I
Speaker 4: had a good time.
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it.
Speaker 5: I'm a hater.
Speaker 3: I mean, I love Kia know, I just I'm burned
Speaker 3: out on like a celebrity being like celebrities are weird.
Speaker 1: It's like, well, I think I liked it because he
Speaker 1: just seems so excited because he was like and I
Speaker 1: never get to play, you know, and I'm like half
Speaker 1: agent or something. There was like some interview you did
Speaker 1: where he like made it deeply philosophia, when I was like,
Speaker 1: I love that for you can like if you're happy,
Speaker 1: I'm happy and I'm the only thing that I really
Speaker 1: like about it is the extended bit when he like
Speaker 1: goes to visit Ellie Wong and like a stand up
Speaker 1: show or whatever. She'll be like, oh, my ex husband
Speaker 1: or my my ex boyfriend came to see me and
Speaker 1: like that's the bit that I like. It's like this extended,
Speaker 1: years long thing that they're like, Oh, it's beautiful we
Speaker 1: used to do.
Speaker 3: I mean, Ali Wong is the close I also love.
Speaker 3: I feel like she and Bill Hayter what a powerful couple.
Speaker 5: I know too.
Speaker 3: I was like that, it just makes sense. I love
Speaker 3: it. It does.
Speaker 4: They seem so happy they do had no idea they
Speaker 4: were together.
Speaker 5: Isn't that a.
Speaker 3: Good match though?
Speaker 1: You're just like such a good match.
Speaker 4: Oh okay. So then Sasha has just met some mystery guy. Meanwhile,
Speaker 4: Marcus's dad is like, I don't know about your girlfriend, Jenny.
Speaker 4: You should be with Sasha and tell her how you feel.
Speaker 4: And Marcus is like, hmm, sounds like a good idea.
Speaker 4: So he goes to her and he's about to tell her,
Speaker 4: but before he can, Sasha is like, I met someone.
Speaker 4: Let's all go on a double date. And then it
Speaker 4: turns out to be Keanu Reeves is her new lover,
Speaker 4: playing himself, and Jenny is starstruck. Marcus is like, oh
Speaker 4: my fucking god, Like, how am I supposed to compete
Speaker 4: with Keanu Reeves. Marcus also thinks that he's like a
Speaker 4: pretentious douchebag because he's playing a very goofy version of himself.
Speaker 4: And then everyone goes to Keanu's hotel for a nightcap
Speaker 4: and they play a game where they ask each other
Speaker 4: questions and Sasha reveals that she has always had a
Speaker 4: crush on Marcus, or at least like during their childhood,
Speaker 4: and he's like, what really, I had no idea, and.
Speaker 3: Then she's like, but not anymore, not for nothing. I
Speaker 3: found that line confusing that he was like, you liked me.
Speaker 3: I was like, you guys did have sex likes. It's
Speaker 3: not that, I mean, I guess, the whole life thing,
Speaker 3: but I was like, you fucked. You can't be completely
Speaker 3: shocked that she was attracted to you.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah? And then things escalate from there, and this
Speaker 4: game culminates in Marcus and Keanu getting into a fistfight,
Speaker 4: and so Marcus and Sasha leave together. Jenny stays with
Speaker 4: Keanu because they're like kind of vibing, I guess, and
Speaker 4: then in the car ride home, Sasha and Marcus get
Speaker 4: into another fight where Marcus accuses Sasha of, you know,
Speaker 4: like filling her life with meaningless awards and related ships,
Speaker 4: and Sasha accuses him of wasting his talent and potential,
Speaker 4: and then he, surprised kisses her this time, but she's like, oh,
Speaker 4: let's keep smooching, and then they go to her place
Speaker 4: and have sex.
Speaker 5: The sex scene is great.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, no, no complaints, no complaints.
Speaker 1: No good scene.
Speaker 3: Let's keep it. Let's keep that scene in.
Speaker 1: There, keep that scene in there.
Speaker 4: And then after this, Sasha and Marcus start dating and
Speaker 4: it's nice for a little while, but then Sasha has
Speaker 4: to go to New York to open her restaurant there.
Speaker 4: Marcus is apprehensive about going with her, and then after
Speaker 4: this like red carpet event, they get in another fight
Speaker 4: where he's like, I think the food you make is
Speaker 4: pretentious and it caters to rich white people, and she's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 4: well I need you to be more supportive of my
Speaker 4: capitalistic ambitions.
Speaker 3: Well, I mean it's it's fair to ask for support
Speaker 3: of her ambition. I would think that that is unreasonable.
Speaker 3: I think what is unreasonable is at the end of
Speaker 3: the movie, she is still making food basically for rich
Speaker 3: white people, but now she's making his dead mom's recipes
Speaker 3: for rich white people, and I'm like, it's it's worst
Speaker 3: question mark.
Speaker 1: Like, meanwhile, I'm like, girl, get your bill.
Speaker 3: I'm not upset that she's like successful, I don't know.
Speaker 3: That's fine.
Speaker 4: I have a whole piece that I'll be quoting from
Speaker 4: later that's all about how Sasha's character is complicit in
Speaker 4: gentrification and all this stuff. All yeah, we'll get to that.
Speaker 4: But anyway, So now it's the night of the opening
Speaker 4: of Sasha's San Francisco restaurant. Marcus doesn't go with her,
Speaker 4: and he says he doesn't want to go to New
Speaker 4: York with her either, So they basically break up and
Speaker 4: they're both very sad, and Sasha goes to New York
Speaker 4: alone and he starts to harass her. Yeah, but he
Speaker 4: then he tries to start to get his life together. First,
Speaker 4: there's like an audition with his band that he absolutely
Speaker 4: blows because he gets drunk and like pisses on the stage.
Speaker 4: But then they redo the audition and this time they
Speaker 4: nail it. And then he moves into his own apartment
Speaker 4: and he takes over the merch sales for his band
Speaker 4: and they start selling a bunch of.
Speaker 3: Merch except no, they don't. And this is never like again,
Speaker 3: I'm like that never to me should be a source
Speaker 3: of conflict of like, oh, you think so little of
Speaker 3: my potential as an artist that you were buying all
Speaker 3: of the merch, Like, how would that not be a
Speaker 3: hit to his confidence?
Speaker 7: See that's not even see yeah, I would be like,
Speaker 7: oh you bought all my thank you, I love you
Speaker 7: bad because if somebody was like, oh I want to
Speaker 7: see if he succeed.
Speaker 1: And they bought all my books. Baby, I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: be upset. I'm gonna be like, thank you, I love you.
Speaker 1: Let's like you know, fair enough, Yeah, you know, go
Speaker 1: do it, or like.
Speaker 4: Yeah, anyway, the movie's almost over. So now he goes
Speaker 4: to Sasha's San Francisco restaurant because he's like, maybe she's
Speaker 4: there and maybe I can talk to her. But she's
Speaker 4: not in New York famously like she said, right. But
Speaker 4: he goes into her office and this is when he
Speaker 4: sees that she had bought all of his merch and
Speaker 4: so he's like, wait a minute, does she love me?
Speaker 4: So then he buys a suit and he goes to
Speaker 4: New York to surprise Sasha at an awards ceremony, and
Speaker 4: he makes a big speech about how he wants to
Speaker 4: be with her no matter what, and they kiss and
Speaker 4: make up, and then she takes him to her New
Speaker 4: York City restaurant and then twist, it's the restaurant where
Speaker 4: she has plagiarized his mom's recipes and you guys, she.
Speaker 1: Got her blessing from beyond. I don't know how this.
Speaker 3: At this point, I'm like, if I'm Randall Park, I'm
Speaker 3: ever speaking to this woman again, and I'm suing her.
Speaker 4: And he said, he's like, wow, that's awesome.
Speaker 8: She's like, I stole your mom's recipes and I'm going
Speaker 8: to do it in my little gentrification pistro and then
Speaker 8: goes to her like the widower.
Speaker 3: And is like, she'd love this right after the business
Speaker 3: is open, Like, yeah, that.
Speaker 1: Would be nice. If it was just like not open
Speaker 1: and that's what she was planning to do, right, that
Speaker 1: would have that would have worked a little bit better,
Speaker 1: I think. But I also saw in the beginning how
Speaker 1: her mom was like very supportive of her cooking and
Speaker 1: she's like, oh, here's how you do it. So in
Speaker 1: a way, it felt like she was sharing in this
Speaker 1: moment with I'm just excuse, but she was sharing this
Speaker 1: moment with his mom, and it was like.
Speaker 3: You know, I mean, I knew what they were going for.
Speaker 3: I just like it just felt so I mean, I
Speaker 3: think that this was one of the many elements of
Speaker 3: like the last fifteen to twenty minutes of the movie.
Speaker 3: They just felt really really really rush.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Well, anyways, that's the end of the movie. Basically, like
Speaker 4: Marcus Loves the Restaurant, the opening goes, well, everyone has
Speaker 4: a nice time the end. So let's take another quick
Speaker 4: break and we'll come back to discuss further.
Speaker 3: And we're back. I know that we have a lot
Speaker 3: to get to. One of the things I just wanted
Speaker 3: to sort of go back to the original round of
Speaker 3: press around this movie when it came out, because something
Speaker 3: that I also, you know, knew about this movie that
Speaker 3: is absolutely worth talking about is that it is one
Speaker 3: of the few, like mainstream rom coms that has Asian
Speaker 3: American characters at its center and is also written by
Speaker 3: literally the stars of the movie but Asian American, right.
Speaker 3: I believe the director in Nanachaka Khan, who also has
Speaker 3: is like a PROLIFICXIT comm director, is Iranian American, and
Speaker 3: there is a lot of diversity in front of and
Speaker 3: behind the camera, which in rom comms is still extremely
Speaker 3: extremely rare. I mean, we were just talking about anyone
Speaker 3: but you, which is my understanding. Is a blindingly white movie,
Speaker 3: and there was a lot written at the time this
Speaker 3: movie came out celebrating that, I think gratefully so there
Speaker 3: was a vox essay that I bravely read by writer
Speaker 3: Jason Sheen that sort of breaks down a lot of
Speaker 3: what he felt the Asian American stereotypes being challenged very
Speaker 3: subtly in this movie. The piece is called why Always
Speaker 3: Be My Maybe's Asian American Underachiever is groundbreaking and specifically
Speaker 3: into Randall Park's character and talking about how, you know,
Speaker 3: the representation of an Asian American character who is not
Speaker 3: fighting against but not meeting the like very model minority
Speaker 3: stereotypes that we often see Asian American characters written into.
Speaker 3: We can link it in the description, but I just
Speaker 3: wanted to share sort of hys thesis here. He writes.
Speaker 3: It might sound strange, but an Asian American lead character
Speaker 3: playing a low achiever might be just what our community
Speaker 3: needs right now. The story of Asians in America is
Speaker 3: a happy one at first glance. As the nation's fastest
Speaker 3: growing racial group, we're seen as an educated quote unquote
Speaker 3: model minority citizens who have earned society's respect, but Asian
Speaker 3: American achievement often faces backlash. And we've discussed these trips
Speaker 3: on the show before. But I think that it definitely
Speaker 3: is a positive thing to just have again simple thing
Speaker 3: that we never see, these characters that exist that we
Speaker 3: never see. So I think that that is great. I
Speaker 3: don't totally agree that Randall Park's character having a blue
Speaker 3: collar job is passively accepted by the movie. I think
Speaker 3: that's sort of where I chafe it that a little bit.
Speaker 3: But I do think, you know, from a representation standpoint,
Speaker 3: it's wonderful.
Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. A lot of movies treat Asian characters
Speaker 4: and Asian American characters as a monolith and adhere to
Speaker 4: so many reductive tropes, and I agree that this movie
Speaker 4: subverts a lot of them. I wanted to share a
Speaker 4: quote from Ali Wong from an interview that she and
Speaker 4: Randall Park did in Glamour, where she says, quote to me,
Speaker 4: Marcus's character is very much a type of guy that
Speaker 4: I grew up with, a very Asian American dude who
Speaker 4: grew up in the Bay and lives at home well
Speaker 4: into his thirties. Because of gentrification and rent is so
Speaker 4: expensive in San Francisco. They have this artistic passion and
Speaker 4: they're not that ambitious because they're third generation. Their parents
Speaker 4: don't have that crazy immigrant mentality. That's something I have
Speaker 4: never seen on camera before. But that's something I very
Speaker 4: much grew up with. These guys were so sexy and confident,
Speaker 4: but they're good, you know, and his dad is his friend,
Speaker 4: and you haven't seen that kind of Asian dad before.
Speaker 4: My dad was born in the United States. He didn't
Speaker 4: have any accent. He was very progressive and he journaled.
Speaker 4: He's really into self reflection. I know a lot of
Speaker 4: dads like that, and I have always felt like it's
Speaker 4: a shame that they weren't on camera. This is not
Speaker 4: the Asian American rom com. This is an Asian American
Speaker 4: rom com. That's an Asian American dad. That's an Asian
Speaker 4: American guy I haven't seen before parentheses on screen, and
Speaker 4: that's very exciting to me. Unquote. So that's from Ali Wong.
Speaker 4: Randall Ark had similar comments about seeing a lack of
Speaker 4: Asian American characters in certain roles in media. I'm going
Speaker 4: to paraphrase from an interview with him in Associated press,
Speaker 4: where he says that he always wanted to play the
Speaker 4: romantic lead in a movie, but those parts weren't available
Speaker 4: to him in Hollywood, so he was like, well, in
Speaker 4: that case, I have to write my own story where
Speaker 4: I can be the romantic lead since the industry isn't
Speaker 4: affording me those opportunities. And then Ali Wong also says
Speaker 4: that it was very important to her that all of
Speaker 4: her characters love interests be Asian American and that in
Speaker 4: all of her work, it's important that she shows her
Speaker 4: attraction and desire toward Asian American men, which all of
Speaker 4: that speaks to Hollywood's tendency to desexualize Asian men and
Speaker 4: the refusal to present Asian men as romantically viable p
Speaker 4: and so all of this to say, obviously, Ali Wang
Speaker 4: and Randall Park were very mindful of the stereotypical representation
Speaker 4: of Asian American characters that existed on screen previously, and
Speaker 4: with this movie, they wanted to show more nuance and
Speaker 4: diversity in the type of Asian American characters who appear
Speaker 4: on screen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think what's really nice as like the person
Speaker 1: of color, like the black person right now on the
Speaker 1: pot is like I went into it being like I
Speaker 1: forgot how nice it was not to have something centered
Speaker 1: around whiteness, Like, yeah, there was a conversation around like,
Speaker 1: you know, you're catering your restaurant to like rich white people,
Speaker 1: but it was like not to be inundated with whiteness
Speaker 1: as a default was really really nice because it's been
Speaker 1: such a long time, which again, what is time with
Speaker 1: the pandemic, but it's been such a long time since
Speaker 1: I've seen that happen.
Speaker 3: Since, right, for sure. That's why I feel we've I
Speaker 3: feel like we will probably unfortunately keep talking about this
Speaker 3: on the show of like feeling like around this time
Speaker 3: in the late twenty tens, where there was starting to
Speaker 3: be more representation in genres where we didn't normally see it,
Speaker 3: we were getting better written characters who weren't meant like
Speaker 3: sis men weren't the default. And then in the last
Speaker 3: couple of years, it feels like, I mean, amongst many
Speaker 3: other things, that that progress is sliding backwards and experiencing
Speaker 3: significant backlash. And yeah, I mean, for all the gripes
Speaker 3: I have about this movie, it's I can't think of many,
Speaker 3: you know, movies that have made at this budget with
Speaker 3: this amount of marketing as well that center Asian American characters.
Speaker 4: Well that's the thing, because I just saw two movies
Speaker 4: that are at the time of this recording, I think,
Speaker 4: still in theaters but hard to find because they don't
Speaker 4: have huge releases. But I saw The Wedding Banquet.
Speaker 3: And Oh Yes, It's a Nice.
Speaker 4: Indian Boy, which are two queer romantic comedies slash dramaedis
Speaker 4: that feature predominantly Asian American characters, and but they're not
Speaker 4: They don't have the same marketing around them, so I
Speaker 4: feel like a lot of people don't know about them
Speaker 4: or as much about them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're on my list. I'm trying to figure out
Speaker 1: how I can see them both because I've heard good thing.
Speaker 3: They're both really good right there, but they're hard to like.
Speaker 3: I I also saw The Wedding Banquet and it's already
Speaker 3: like halved in terms of the numbers of screenings that
Speaker 3: it's getting, and I haven't seen any marketing for it.
Speaker 3: Like I just knew I'll see anything Bowen yangs in,
Speaker 3: so the ads found me.
Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean overall, like I saw a lot
Speaker 4: of writing about this movie to the effect of how
Speaker 4: refreshing it was for so many viewers, particularly Asian American audiences,
Speaker 4: where they were able to see a pretty standard rom
Speaker 4: com story because the idea for this movie was Ali
Speaker 4: Wang and Rendall Park being like, hey, we should make
Speaker 4: our own version of When Harry Met Sally, right, And
Speaker 4: the movie follows a lot of the same beats as
Speaker 4: that movie, So it's a pretty you know, standard rom
Speaker 4: com narrative, but it features characters who look like them
Speaker 4: and who had similar upbringings and who had similar cultural experiences,
Speaker 4: and who were also living regular lives. Because this movie,
Speaker 4: because it came out a year after Crazy Rich Asians,
Speaker 4: a lot of people who wrote about this movie were like,
Speaker 4: Crazy Rich Asians was fun and everything, but I couldn't
Speaker 4: really relate to those characters because they're literal billionaires. But
Speaker 4: Always be My Maybe had like familiar people in it.
Speaker 4: And also a lot of people had written about how
Speaker 4: there was in Always Be My Maybe no real focus
Speaker 4: on their like quote unquote otherness, and that there was
Speaker 4: like no real clash of Eastern versus Western values. Not
Speaker 4: that those things aren't worth exploring in media, but this
Speaker 4: movie is more like, hey, look at these regular American
Speaker 4: people who are living laughing, loving, and they just happen
Speaker 4: to be Asian. So that was like very refreshing for
Speaker 4: a lot of people. I'll share a quote from a
Speaker 4: New Yorker piece written by Jiayang Fan entitled what Always
Speaker 4: Be My Maybe understands about making an Asian American rom
Speaker 4: com quote. I watched Always Be My Maybe alone in
Speaker 4: a theater in Manhattan, acutely aware that this was a
Speaker 4: mainstream movie of America's favorite variety, the rom com, and
Speaker 4: of the fact that a multi ethnic audience had sat
Speaker 4: down to watch two Asian leads fall in love. More
Speaker 4: than anything else, it was the film's depiction of growing
Speaker 4: up in the US in an Asian home that made
Speaker 4: my heart yelp. The and oh oh no, a word
Speaker 4: that I don't know how to say, involuble yeah now that, oh,
Speaker 4: thank you so much, ritual of removing shoes before entering
Speaker 4: a house, the plastic covered furniture in Sasha's parents' home,
Speaker 4: which so resembled my own childhood living room. To watch
Speaker 4: these mundane, culturally specific details exposed on the big screen,
Speaker 4: the very things that I and many Asian American kids
Speaker 4: once wanted to hide, felt quietly radical. And then the
Speaker 4: piece goes on to talk about various other culturally specific
Speaker 4: things that the movie includes that felt very familiar and
Speaker 4: authentic to the writer, such as like having to consume
Speaker 4: media about white people like Clarissa's plans at all and
Speaker 4: Wayne's world because that's all there was when they were
Speaker 4: growing up, or parents trying to avoid any service that
Speaker 4: requires tipping because they were poor and had to be
Speaker 4: very careful with their money.
Speaker 1: So I also think it's funny too, like as the
Speaker 1: disabled person, the joke. I remember when I first watched
Speaker 1: the movie, the joke about the parking placards really pissed
Speaker 1: me off. But then I watched it today and I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, that's really funny. Like I think part
Speaker 1: of it is just like one I chilled out because
Speaker 1: like for a while there, I was just like yeah,
Speaker 1: and then you know, I like relaxed a little bit.
Speaker 1: But it was actually funny this go around.
Speaker 4: You mean the scene where they noticed how when they're
Speaker 4: in Chinatown and.
Speaker 1: Yeah, how every every part has the parking platters. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that scene, I was like, Oh, this is actually funny.
Speaker 1: And I don't know, I think I think two, it
Speaker 1: really shows the passing of time for me. I mean
Speaker 1: this said nothing to do technically with a movie. But
Speaker 1: when I first sat like, I think I wrote an
Speaker 1: article about it about how like or a tweet or
Speaker 1: something when Twitter was good about how that singular section
Speaker 1: upset me. And then I noticed today that I was
Speaker 1: like fully laughing at it, and I said, oh, what
Speaker 1: was you look at that? Just so sometimes it just
Speaker 1: takes a second, but I think that there's something. I
Speaker 1: think jokes like that are a good way of punching up,
Speaker 1: and not enough people do it. And I'm just saying
Speaker 1: that it's like a person who has never fully seen
Speaker 1: herself represented in rob concert otherwise, and like jokes like
Speaker 1: that that's a good one because it's not like cracking
Speaker 1: on disabled people to do what it's just like with
Speaker 1: all these placards.
Speaker 4: Like yeah, and then and then Sasha is like, yeah,
Speaker 4: they have these placards, but look at him getting out
Speaker 4: of his truck all able bodied, which could mean that
Speaker 4: he just has an invisible disability, right you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I think it.
Speaker 1: Does a good job and either both like poking at
Speaker 1: her and the idea that she has no idea how
Speaker 1: like disability actually works, and also the idea that like
Speaker 1: people are just so convinced that disable people have all
Speaker 1: kinds are gaming the system. I remember once this lady
Speaker 1: like knocked on the car door and I put my
Speaker 1: hand out, like my right hand out so she could see.
Speaker 1: I'm like, hello, what what are you gonna do? Like
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to have this? Why are you tryed? God,
Speaker 1: I just wanted to let you know that the police
Speaker 1: are out here. Okay, thanks? Cool fun.
Speaker 4: I mean, for me, my big criticism around this movie,
Speaker 4: and I've already alluded to this is the way that
Speaker 4: the movie handles class and.
Speaker 3: Which in some ways I've also noticed that, And I
Speaker 3: was like, in some ways, I feel like that is
Speaker 3: it is truly just like they made a rom com
Speaker 3: that centers Asian American characters in a way that I
Speaker 3: think was very impactful, but they still made an American
Speaker 3: rom com where it is like insensitive to class and
Speaker 3: like very bootstrap aspirational in all the ways that American
Speaker 3: rom coms tend to be.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I almost I mean not to invalidate what
Speaker 1: you're saying, obviously, Caitlin, but I almost feel like that's
Speaker 1: the beauty in it, because when you approach any genre
Speaker 1: as a person of color, people do expect you to have,
Speaker 1: like the set decisions and set thoughts on all of
Speaker 1: the things that other rom coms tend to ignore.
Speaker 9: So there's some power in the fact that they didn't
Speaker 9: address it in that way, because it was like, Okay,
Speaker 9: we don't have to in the same way that they don't,
Speaker 9: you know, when Harry met.
Speaker 3: Staley totally right, like setting the bar high, like higher
Speaker 3: for marginalized creators kind of thing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I see what you're saying, because I mean,
Speaker 4: so much of art, the creators of color make is
Speaker 4: held to a very rigid standard, and if there's too
Speaker 4: much subversion then people will be all up in arms
Speaker 4: and oh, this isn't a rom com because X y
Speaker 4: Z I just I mean. And also this came out
Speaker 4: in twenty nineteen, when culturally we were less critical of capitalism.
Speaker 4: I think in the past five years there's been a
Speaker 4: pretty significant shift.
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, the pandemic got a lot of people radicalized.
Speaker 4: For sure, So I'm not surprised that this movie isn't
Speaker 4: very critical of capitalism, but I still think it's worth
Speaker 4: pointing out where it manifests in a couple different ways.
Speaker 4: One of them is part of the dynamic of their
Speaker 4: relationship is that by capitalists society's standards, Sasha is more
Speaker 4: quote unquote successful because she's a business owner and she
Speaker 4: has more money and more ambition. And then by those
Speaker 4: same standards, Marcus is quote unquote not successful because he
Speaker 4: lives with his dad and he has a blue collar
Speaker 4: job and he doesn't have these huge career ambitions, and
Speaker 4: he still drives the same car from when he was
Speaker 4: a teenager, and he's you know, content to play in
Speaker 4: this band at this small club and never make any
Speaker 4: money from the band and all this kind of stuff,
Speaker 4: and they constantly argue about these differences, which to your point, Jamie,
Speaker 4: is that they are, like they're not catal. But the
Speaker 4: movie it frames Marcus's situation as something that needs to
Speaker 4: be fixed more or less, where he has the arc
Speaker 4: where he you know, he moves out of the dad's
Speaker 4: place and he you know, gets the audition at the
Speaker 4: bigger club and he starts making money, which is actually
Speaker 4: just Sasha buying his march. But like it's not until
Speaker 4: then that they end up together and happy.
Speaker 3: But he's like quote unquote viable. Yeah, which again I
Speaker 3: feel like for me the fix here because I hear
Speaker 3: what you're both saying, and I feel like the fix
Speaker 3: here is the writing gets caught up in this like
Speaker 3: capitalistic idea of what happiness looks like when this conversation
Speaker 3: I feel like would be more effective and would make
Speaker 3: me feel less kind of icky about the relationship if
Speaker 3: it was about passion versus success. And I think Kia
Speaker 3: you mentioned earlier, like if we saw that Randall Park
Speaker 3: loves being in this band, it is his passion. It
Speaker 3: is like his source of joy. And Ali Wong's character
Speaker 3: loves being a chef and like building these restaurants. But
Speaker 3: the conflict is she is making a lot of money
Speaker 3: doing it. He isn't. But they have passion, but it
Speaker 3: feels like it gets instead sort of involved like a
Speaker 3: very capitalistic, rigid definition of success.
Speaker 1: And also too, it just seems like the thing with
Speaker 1: Sastress like does she love it or is it just
Speaker 1: the career she's good at? Right?
Speaker 5: Not clear?
Speaker 1: That's the question that I have too, because I was
Speaker 1: just like, do you love your job because you don't
Speaker 1: seem that happy doing right.
Speaker 3: She's like, I'm doing it because I have to. And
Speaker 3: it's also but it's like why do you have to
Speaker 3: let's keep Yeah, you just want to like push the
Speaker 3: script a little further. And I mean, and Kaitlyn, you're
Speaker 3: totally right the gentrification aspect, Like in some ways it's like, yeah,
Speaker 3: this is what Meg Ryan would do it in a
Speaker 3: I mean, at least, at very least, this is not
Speaker 3: the most egregious gentrification realm complot point that will always
Speaker 3: go to you've got mail.
Speaker 10: But but but yeah, it just especially if a movie
Speaker 10: made in twenty nineteen, it felt again, I'm wondering if
Speaker 10: there were drafts of the script that dealt with this
Speaker 10: a little or that developed this.
Speaker 3: Or a little more thoughtfully, because it just felt so
Speaker 3: fast at the end.
Speaker 1: Even I think too then it's is gonna be I
Speaker 1: don't know, but like remember the white girl that she
Speaker 1: was like the assistant of and she she was gonna
Speaker 1: get Yes, she was scared, she was gonna get fired
Speaker 1: the whole time, even if she was like, you know what,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna relinquish dealing with this one here. I'll give
Speaker 1: Michelle Puto's other one and I'm gonna put my focus
Speaker 1: on this one restaurant. Even that I feel like would
Speaker 1: have helped with the like less feeling work monopoly pieces,
Speaker 1: you know, because after a while it was like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I got one.
Speaker 3: In New York, I got a she's franchising, Like, yeah,
Speaker 3: she's franchising.
Speaker 1: It was like, girl, I get it. But at the
Speaker 1: same time, you can't the mean Marcus for not having
Speaker 1: direction when your direction is just you and constant movement
Speaker 1: without being able to rest. There's something to have to
Speaker 1: your therapist, a bounty, but like, why do you need
Speaker 1: to be in constant movement? Sit down somewhere, take on that, take.
Speaker 3: Us correct, as the kids said, touch some grass, Ali Wong. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And I mean it's the criticism of the gentrification aspects
Speaker 3: of the restaurant come up really fast and only at
Speaker 3: the end, and the only resolution given for it is, oh,
Speaker 3: I'll just steal your dead mom's recipe. Does that work?
Speaker 3: And it weirdly and he's like, oh, yeah, that solves
Speaker 3: gentrification as long as you.
Speaker 1: Like, as long as we can stop the whole fusion,
Speaker 1: just make them as they are, and that's that. And
Speaker 1: it's just like, I don't I don't think we knew
Speaker 1: enough of their material thoughts in a lot of places
Speaker 1: that we needed them.
Speaker 3: For sure, sure, because we don't know I mean like
Speaker 3: is again, yeah, where it's just like it seems like
Speaker 3: there's a sort of void of passion between these two
Speaker 3: characters in their pursuits, where I'm like, is Ali Wong
Speaker 3: really passionate about the food her restaurants serve? We don't
Speaker 3: really know, we don't really ever see her cooking. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: I have alluded to this piece a couple times already,
Speaker 4: but I just want to share a few quotes from
Speaker 4: a piece in plan A magazine by writer Promise Lee
Speaker 4: entitled Always Be My Maybe Gentrification and the Asian American
Speaker 4: rom com. The piece starts by commenting on the criticisms
Speaker 4: of crazy rich Asians when that movie came out, how
Speaker 4: it only portrayed very affluent Asian characters really just.
Speaker 3: The richest people humanly possible. Yeah, reruly.
Speaker 4: It goes on to make a similar point that we
Speaker 4: were making earlier regarding the Sasha characters, kind of like
Speaker 4: constantly berating Marcus for his lifestyle.
Speaker 3: And the movie, like the events and logic of the movie.
Speaker 3: Siding with her on that is, I feel like it's
Speaker 3: never like she has a because it's one thing if
Speaker 3: she has a realization of like I've been so judgmental
Speaker 3: based on class, or like, I think there's such a
Speaker 3: thing as like projecting at the class you grew up in,
Speaker 3: or whatever it may be, But there is no such realization.
Speaker 3: It's just like it seems like those are the values
Speaker 3: of the movie, right, Yeah.
Speaker 4: And then the piece goes on to examine her work
Speaker 4: as a like restauranteur and the types of restaurants that
Speaker 4: she's opening, and so the piece says, quote of course,
Speaker 4: the film's concluding scene demonstrates that its ideal of innovation
Speaker 4: does not equate to a rejection of all tradition. Tradition
Speaker 4: for Sasha must be done well. It needs to sell.
Speaker 4: Sasha's final invention in the film is a Korean restaurant,
Speaker 4: more quote unquote authentic then her previous eateries, as it
Speaker 4: is based on Marcus's late mother, Judy's old recipes. But
Speaker 4: despite the film's occasionally positive portrayal of local, authentic restaurants,
Speaker 4: its end goal is clear. The ideal isn't the local
Speaker 4: Cantonese dim sum joint with rude service that Marcus and
Speaker 4: Sasha grew up frequenting. It is Judy's way, the gentrifying
Speaker 4: hip Korean eatery that reworks old family recipes for a
Speaker 4: different demographic. For all the talk of Sashu's turned to authenticity,
Speaker 4: the film shows no ambiguity as to who the target
Speaker 4: audience is for Judy's Way. In its final shot of
Speaker 4: the restaurant's long line of white professionals and high heels
Speaker 4: in pinstriped blazers, the piece goes on to say gentrification
Speaker 4: has been widely portrayed in rigidly racialized terms, with working
Speaker 4: class residents of color being forced out of their neighborhoods
Speaker 4: by affluent or middle class white developers and residents. But
Speaker 4: always be my maybe show as a crucial element frequently
Speaker 4: understated or overlooked in the relentless calculus of gentrification, the
Speaker 4: act of complicity of more affluent people of color in
Speaker 4: displacing their less privileged counterparts. Entrepreneurs like Sashia churn out
Speaker 4: restaurant after restaurant that no one needs in the community,
Speaker 4: but that threatens the livelihood of workers of color that
Speaker 4: depend on the sustenance of local businesses unquote. So yeah,
Speaker 4: I just wanted to share that. I thought that was
Speaker 4: a really great piece.
Speaker 3: And the thing that is frustrating about this is I
Speaker 3: think that you can maintain the tone of this movie
Speaker 3: and still address it. And it's sort of hint because
Speaker 3: the elements of gentrification are hinted at in passing with jokes.
Speaker 3: You can tackle a topic as serious and insidious as
Speaker 3: gentrification in a rom com, and I think that these
Speaker 3: writers are well qualified to do it, which kind of
Speaker 3: makes it a little more bizarre that it goes in
Speaker 3: so hard on the capitalism.
Speaker 4: Angle, right, so disappointing.
Speaker 3: But again, I mean, as as Kio is saying too,
Speaker 3: it's you know, it is one of the ways in
Speaker 3: which this movie kind of for worse adheres to the
Speaker 3: values of the American rom com because American rom coms
Speaker 3: are nothing if very pro capitalist.
Speaker 4: Absolutely. One of the things that is subverted switching gears here.
Speaker 4: But that I wanted to comment on is glasses representation.
Speaker 5: Oh, I thought that too.
Speaker 3: I mean, that's Ali Wong in general. She's been on
Speaker 3: that beat for for many years. And some of the
Speaker 3: best glasses in the game.
Speaker 4: Such good glasses. Yeah. Friend of the Show Canise Mobley
Speaker 4: often cites this movie when talking about representation of characters
Speaker 4: wearing glasses. And then I would go on to realize
Speaker 4: that there's like, there are whole Reddit threads about her
Speaker 4: glasses in this movie. But basically the idea is, this
Speaker 4: is one of the only movies where a woman or
Speaker 4: I guess, person of any gender, but specifically a woman
Speaker 4: in this case in a romantic lead who wears glasses
Speaker 4: in general and keeps them on the whole movie and
Speaker 4: like doesn't take them off as some like she's all
Speaker 4: that style makeover.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: No, I I appreciate that. I think about that a
Speaker 3: lot because I I guess it is like sort of
Speaker 3: drilled into you culturally because I wear glass. My vision's horrible.
Speaker 3: I wear glasses, but usually not two occasions, and that
Speaker 3: is a very culturally bashed in thing. I do wonder
Speaker 3: to some extent if that movie because there is the
Speaker 3: she's all that element of I feel like just the lazy,
Speaker 3: you know, twentieth century person wearing glasses, dork thing.
Speaker 5: Nerd alert.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but also having worked in production, I do sort
Speaker 3: of wonder if it's just a glare issue sometimes, like
Speaker 3: it is hard to film people in glasses, but the
Speaker 3: glasses are such a huge part of who Ali Wong is,
Speaker 3: and you know, certainly no one could accuse Ali Wang
Speaker 3: of being anything but very hot and like treated as such. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that is a good I hadn't even thought of that.
Speaker 3: I just was admiring her frames. She has great taste
Speaker 3: in frames, she really does.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the movie does pass the Bechdel test. Yeah, but
Speaker 4: between Sasha and Veronica and her mom and Marcus's mom,
Speaker 4: so yeah, there's many interactions.
Speaker 3: I will say, we didn't have a lot of time
Speaker 3: to talk about Michelle Buttoe's character, not that there's a
Speaker 3: ton to talk but I did think again where this
Speaker 3: is like, this is firmly an American rom com where
Speaker 3: Michelle Buteau is best friending the hell out of this role.
Speaker 3: Like we don't know anything. We do find out that
Speaker 3: she has a partner, but her whole thing is she's
Speaker 3: pregnant and she really cares about Ali Wong's character's interior life.
Speaker 3: It's very rom com.
Speaker 1: Also, I noticed this time for the first time that
Speaker 1: she knew them when they were kids. Yes, I never
Speaker 1: noticed that she was supposed to be the other little
Speaker 1: girl at the table.
Speaker 9: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I also noticed that on my most recent watch.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like, oh, I never popped them.
Speaker 4: Because they don't talk to her or address her by
Speaker 4: name or anything like that.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and I was just like, it really reiterated
Speaker 1: my desire. I know that she has survival as the thickest,
Speaker 1: but it really reiterated my desire to see her in
Speaker 1: like a firmly rom com movie that's full of all
Speaker 1: of the tropes.
Speaker 3: I haven't seen it, but she was in Babes last year, right, Yeah, Babes.
Speaker 5: Was it bad?
Speaker 3: I haven't seen it.
Speaker 4: Oh no, I didn't love it, and she plays the
Speaker 4: same best friend character. It's not it doesn't center her
Speaker 4: quite as much, and.
Speaker 1: So like, I just want to see her like in
Speaker 1: that way, even though I know she has figures. I'm like,
Speaker 1: give give the girl, and I rang it on Netflix movie.
Speaker 1: She's so funny. She carries a lot of these as
Speaker 1: the best friend, a lot of these roles.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like she has replaced like the Judy
Speaker 4: Greer best friend rom cos she has.
Speaker 3: Kind of millennial Judy Greer, and much like Judy Greer,
Speaker 3: we must free her. She has so much talent.
Speaker 1: She does.
Speaker 4: As far as our nipple scale goes, where we raped
Speaker 4: the movie zero to five nipples based on examining it
Speaker 4: through an intersectional feminist lens, there's a lot to love
Speaker 4: and appreciate about this movie as far as represent goes
Speaker 4: of centering Asian American characters written by Asian American writers
Speaker 4: who are pulling from their own experiences, pulling from people
Speaker 4: they know, broadening the scope of the type of Asian
Speaker 4: American person you tend to see represented on screen. Letting
Speaker 4: these characters be the romantic leads in a rom com
Speaker 4: who are falling in love and arguing all the time.
Speaker 3: But you still get like all the rom com you know,
Speaker 3: itches scratched, where there's I thought that Ali Wong's wardrobe
Speaker 3: in this movie is fucking spectacular. Yeah, it has the
Speaker 3: visuals of a rom com. It has the fashion, it
Speaker 3: has the random big parties, it has.
Speaker 5: You know, it is like.
Speaker 3: An actual, real, real representation in a needed way, and
Speaker 3: also has a very familiar rom coom plot.
Speaker 4: For sure, And it's one of the few rom coms
Speaker 4: it actually attempts jokes. I don't necessarily think all of
Speaker 4: them land that well, but like I was laughing many times,
Speaker 4: there's calm.
Speaker 5: There's calm.
Speaker 4: There's calm in the rom com and so many wrong
Speaker 4: coms don't actually have calm, which has always bugged me.
Speaker 4: But yeah, there's there's jokes in this and I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: And also it has the thing that I love the
Speaker 1: most in all calms of the wrong is the big
Speaker 1: embarrassing moment. So like when she gets caught letting do
Speaker 1: in Your Day, Cam's character have it in the windows
Speaker 1: open and they can all hear. That's one of the
Speaker 1: cornerstones of all good rom comes.
Speaker 3: You do, yes, you do need, uh that moment where
Speaker 3: everyone's like, pretty lady doing what scaring.
Speaker 4: In front of children and you're scaring the goats.
Speaker 1: I did laugh.
Speaker 3: That was great.
Speaker 1: That was funny.
Speaker 4: But yeah, and again the thing about it not interrogating
Speaker 4: capitalism at all and kind of just being like, yeah,
Speaker 4: the only way that they that it makes sense for
Speaker 4: them to end up together is if the Marcus character
Speaker 4: sort of embraces capitalism.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So, I mean, yeah, when you put it that way.
Speaker 4: I think I'll give the movie like three point seventy
Speaker 4: five for somewhere around their nipples, and I will give
Speaker 4: them to the goats at the party.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna go I guess I'm gonna go thre I
Speaker 3: think I'm gonna go three. I mean, for all the
Speaker 3: reasons you just described, Caitlin, I was so nervous to
Speaker 3: come into that. Thank you for being perceptive to be
Speaker 3: really not rooting for this couple. But I do, I
Speaker 3: do agree. I mean, I obviously, I mean I'm I'm
Speaker 3: not Asian American. I have I see myself in rom
Speaker 3: comms all the time. There's nothing, if not many white
Speaker 3: women with brown hair and rom coms, and so I
Speaker 3: can't speak to the experience of feeling represented in this genre.
Speaker 3: And it was really cool reading through a lot of
Speaker 3: the specifics of and also just how Ali Wong and
Speaker 3: Randall Park really intentionally collaborated on that. I don't think
Speaker 3: it's a coincidence that Nanatchka Khan had worked extensively with
Speaker 3: both of them on Fresh Off the Boat, which is
Speaker 3: a show that has a very similar goal. And so
Speaker 3: I think, like representationally, this movie is wonderful and takes
Speaker 3: a lot of great steps forward. I do feel like
Speaker 3: it's guilty of girl Boss feminism, which was so many
Speaker 3: things in twenty nineteen. So it's not a like this
Speaker 3: movie is I think every so many attempts at feminism
Speaker 3: in twenty nineteen had this Sheryl Sandbergie vibe to it.
Speaker 3: But ultimately I'm dogging it for this couple does not
Speaker 3: belong together. I found the relationship very stressful, which is
Speaker 3: me fully projecting as a woman that once moved to
Speaker 3: Maine to try to make it work. So yeah, these
Speaker 3: fictional people should learn form my mistakes and break up.
Speaker 4: I think more people should break up. I love breaking up,
Speaker 4: normalize breaking up. People break up, please, Kia, how about you?
Speaker 1: I'm going to also go three points eight five?
Speaker 4: Oh, I know, groundbreaking, groundbreaking, Kia, Yes.
Speaker 1: I think so because I just like it and I
Speaker 1: know that they have all their issues, but I really
Speaker 1: hope they make it. And also one of the nipples
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give to the dad because I just think
Speaker 1: I did appreciate that little friendship that they were like
Speaker 1: genuinely close, and he didn't do the thing where he
Speaker 1: pulled away after the mom died, because I hate that
Speaker 1: trop even more than I hate the dead mom Troke.
Speaker 5: I love his dance too, right, And so.
Speaker 1: I'm going to give another nipple to Michelle Bhutto because duh.
Speaker 1: And then my last nipple is going to be to
Speaker 1: the very quick scene where Ali Wong Sasha flashes herself.
Speaker 1: So then so then so that you can see her
Speaker 1: bro I just think it's so funny and I like
Speaker 1: cackled out loud. I just love it and I would
Speaker 1: love for them to work together again. And like again
Speaker 1: Randall Park, it just like that's sexy. Just shifted so
Speaker 1: much for me in terms of how I view him,
Speaker 1: and so I see him now, I'm like, heyvid hair O, well.
Speaker 4: Nice, well, Kia, thank you so much for joining us
Speaker 4: once again. Come back anytime. You're always welcome back.
Speaker 1: Please. I love it here.
Speaker 4: What would you like to plug? Tell us where people
Speaker 4: can follow you and find your work?
Speaker 1: Okay, you can follow me on Instagram at Kia k
Speaker 1: E A H Underscore, Maria m A R I A.
Speaker 1: I'm also on Blue Sky at Kia Brown at Blue
Speaker 1: Skot I don't shit. And if you're like on Facebook,
Speaker 1: I don't know who is anymore, but I do still
Speaker 1: have a Facebook page and it's the Kia Brown. I'm
Speaker 1: currently writing what I hope will read, my fourth book,
Speaker 1: Another Esthet. But you can always and please do purchase
Speaker 1: any of the three books that I have out right now.
Speaker 1: And if you want to be the al woe to
Speaker 1: my to my Marcus, please buy all of the books
Speaker 1: and just keep buying them.
Speaker 4: Buy so many copies of Kiya's books to show her
Speaker 4: that you love her exactly.
Speaker 3: My mom has a copy of Sam's Super Seeds in
Speaker 3: her classrooms.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that makes me so happy.
Speaker 3: Yes, so also, I mean it's predicalar I'm a fan
Speaker 3: of all of your work, But if you have a
Speaker 3: teacher in your life, get a copy of sam Super
Speaker 3: Seeds for their classroom.
Speaker 1: Yes, it's a great book. I'm biased, but it's right.
Speaker 5: It's true, it's true, you're not wrong.
Speaker 4: You can follow us at the place called Instagram if
Speaker 4: you must, please do.
Speaker 3: It's the only place we are so if not there,
Speaker 3: you're gonna have a hard time keep it up, so
Speaker 3: head over there. You can also join us on our
Speaker 3: Patreon aka Matreon, and please do that too, where for
Speaker 3: five dollars a month, you can get access to two
Speaker 3: new episodes with Caitlin and myself doing a theam of
Speaker 3: sometimes You're Choosing Sometimes ours. It's a very sort of
Speaker 3: like goofy looser version of our format. And you don't
Speaker 3: only get access to those two new episodes a month,
Speaker 3: you can access to a back catalog of nearly two
Speaker 3: hundred episodes. So if you're running out of episodes on
Speaker 3: the main feed. Guess what, there is an affordable way
Speaker 3: to have that not be true anymore. And there's a
Speaker 3: really fun community over there, and.
Speaker 4: We love you. Yes, so thanks for listening, and you
Speaker 4: listeners will always be our maybe babies.
Speaker 3: Babies, I love you, babies, Bye bye bye.
Speaker 4: The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted by
Speaker 4: Caitlin Drante and Jamie Loftis, produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited
Speaker 4: by mo La Boord. Our theme song was composed by
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