1 00:00:14,956 --> 00:00:15,396 Speaker 1: Pushkin. 2 00:00:31,036 --> 00:00:32,556 Speaker 2: All right, all right, welcome back. 3 00:00:32,676 --> 00:00:37,636 Speaker 1: Make some noise. We're backing on our fest. Hey, it's Maya. 4 00:00:38,156 --> 00:00:40,996 Speaker 1: Welcome to a very special episode of A slight Change 5 00:00:41,036 --> 00:00:44,316 Speaker 1: of Plans. We recorded this conversation in front of a 6 00:00:44,396 --> 00:00:48,596 Speaker 1: live audience at on AirFest, an event that brings people 7 00:00:48,636 --> 00:00:52,676 Speaker 1: together in Brooklyn every year to celebrate audio storytelling. 8 00:00:53,116 --> 00:00:56,796 Speaker 3: Please welcome to the stage, Doctor Maya Shankar and Rachel Gross. 9 00:00:59,396 --> 00:01:03,036 Speaker 1: Rachel Gross is an award winning science journalist who's written 10 00:01:03,076 --> 00:01:06,316 Speaker 1: for outlets like The New York Times and National Geographic. 11 00:01:06,796 --> 00:01:10,636 Speaker 1: I've heard people compare Rachel to Miss Frizzle, the beloved 12 00:01:10,836 --> 00:01:14,596 Speaker 1: frizzy hair teacher from the PBS show The Magic School Bus. 13 00:01:15,276 --> 00:01:19,476 Speaker 1: I totally get what they're saying. There's definitely something frizzlesque 14 00:01:19,676 --> 00:01:23,956 Speaker 1: about Rachel's approach to science journalism. Her writing serves as 15 00:01:23,996 --> 00:01:27,956 Speaker 1: that metaphorical shape shifting school bus, with the power to 16 00:01:27,996 --> 00:01:32,196 Speaker 1: take readers deep into niche worlds, filling them with wonder 17 00:01:32,396 --> 00:01:37,316 Speaker 1: and discovery. In twenty twenty four, Rachel unexpectedly became the 18 00:01:37,396 --> 00:01:41,276 Speaker 1: subject of her own reporting when some strange things started 19 00:01:41,316 --> 00:01:43,556 Speaker 1: happening in her body that she couldn't explain. 20 00:01:44,196 --> 00:01:46,036 Speaker 2: I couldn't control my voice. 21 00:01:46,196 --> 00:01:48,316 Speaker 3: Things were not coming out as I intended them, and 22 00:01:48,356 --> 00:01:51,116 Speaker 3: my body wasn't moving as I was instructing it. It 23 00:01:51,156 --> 00:01:53,556 Speaker 3: was like there's something getting lost from my brain to 24 00:01:53,636 --> 00:01:56,876 Speaker 3: my body. I felt like an alien, impersonating myself. 25 00:01:58,356 --> 00:02:01,516 Speaker 1: This is a story about suddenly feeling like a stranger 26 00:02:01,556 --> 00:02:04,916 Speaker 1: to yourself and the curious work of figuring out what 27 00:02:05,036 --> 00:02:10,036 Speaker 1: makes you you. I'm Maya Shunker and this is a 28 00:02:10,036 --> 00:02:12,916 Speaker 1: slight change of plans, a show about who we are 29 00:02:13,156 --> 00:02:22,516 Speaker 1: and who we become in the face of a big change. 30 00:02:25,996 --> 00:02:28,556 Speaker 1: I of course had to start our conversation with a 31 00:02:28,596 --> 00:02:32,756 Speaker 1: nod to Miss Frizzle. Fun side note, I too have 32 00:02:32,796 --> 00:02:35,356 Speaker 1: been called Miss Frizzle, but it is because on a 33 00:02:35,436 --> 00:02:39,316 Speaker 1: humid day my husband believes that I resemble this fictional character. 34 00:02:40,836 --> 00:02:43,876 Speaker 2: To Miss Frizzles on stage is very powerful. 35 00:02:43,476 --> 00:02:46,076 Speaker 1: And I've you know, flow dry and all help today. 36 00:02:47,036 --> 00:02:48,956 Speaker 1: It was so interesting because when you look at your 37 00:02:49,036 --> 00:02:52,356 Speaker 1: journey as a reporter, you studied fascinating things that I 38 00:02:52,356 --> 00:02:55,476 Speaker 1: would say or maybe related to your life, but not 39 00:02:55,516 --> 00:02:59,316 Speaker 1: necessarily where you are the subject of the reporting. And 40 00:02:59,396 --> 00:03:03,316 Speaker 1: there was a recent episode in twenty twenty four where 41 00:03:03,356 --> 00:03:07,356 Speaker 1: you ended up turning the camera on yourself because you 42 00:03:07,436 --> 00:03:09,116 Speaker 1: had something that you had to figure out in your 43 00:03:09,196 --> 00:03:12,836 Speaker 1: personal life. Let's go back to twenty twenty four when 44 00:03:12,876 --> 00:03:16,036 Speaker 1: you first noticed that something was feeling a little bit 45 00:03:16,156 --> 00:03:18,156 Speaker 1: off in your body. Tell me about that moment. 46 00:03:18,636 --> 00:03:21,196 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's a pleasure to be here, Maya. 47 00:03:21,476 --> 00:03:24,716 Speaker 3: It was late in May twenty twenty four, and over 48 00:03:24,756 --> 00:03:27,276 Speaker 3: the course of a week, these like weird things started 49 00:03:27,316 --> 00:03:31,516 Speaker 3: happening to my body that I couldn't fully explain. So, 50 00:03:32,036 --> 00:03:35,636 Speaker 3: like my handwriting and typing started kind of being off, 51 00:03:35,756 --> 00:03:40,036 Speaker 3: like really awkward and stilted. And when I like went running, 52 00:03:40,356 --> 00:03:43,476 Speaker 3: instead of it sort of being this background activity like 53 00:03:43,516 --> 00:03:45,876 Speaker 3: I could think my thoughts while running, I had to 54 00:03:45,916 --> 00:03:49,196 Speaker 3: like force all my arms and my legs like pumped together. 55 00:03:49,716 --> 00:03:54,396 Speaker 3: Like these automatic things were somehow becoming conscious. I go 56 00:03:54,476 --> 00:03:58,236 Speaker 3: to karaoke every week, and I couldn't control my voice. 57 00:03:58,636 --> 00:04:00,796 Speaker 3: Things were not coming out as I intended them, and 58 00:04:00,836 --> 00:04:03,596 Speaker 3: my body wasn't moving as I was instructing it. It 59 00:04:03,636 --> 00:04:06,036 Speaker 3: was like there's something getting lost from my brain to 60 00:04:06,156 --> 00:04:09,116 Speaker 3: my body, and it kind of just intensified over a way. 61 00:04:10,356 --> 00:04:13,876 Speaker 1: How did you find yourself explaining these symptoms in the moment. 62 00:04:13,676 --> 00:04:17,036 Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, It's amazing how powerful denial can be. So 63 00:04:18,436 --> 00:04:22,476 Speaker 3: I honestly never thought of anything neurological. I was just like, 64 00:04:23,276 --> 00:04:26,276 Speaker 3: that's odd. I feel a little bit like awkward and shaky. 65 00:04:26,316 --> 00:04:27,956 Speaker 3: And I told some friends and they were like, yeah, 66 00:04:27,996 --> 00:04:30,516 Speaker 3: when I get stressed and anxious, I also mix up 67 00:04:30,556 --> 00:04:32,396 Speaker 3: words or I have trouble typing. Why don't you like 68 00:04:32,636 --> 00:04:34,396 Speaker 3: sleep on it? Give it a couple of days. And 69 00:04:34,436 --> 00:04:36,996 Speaker 3: I was like, that sounds right. A friend even sent 70 00:04:36,996 --> 00:04:39,036 Speaker 3: me an article that was like from WebMD that was 71 00:04:39,036 --> 00:04:40,916 Speaker 3: like stress or stroke, and I like went. 72 00:04:40,756 --> 00:04:43,676 Speaker 2: Through it and the answer was stress. That was like great. 73 00:04:44,516 --> 00:04:46,956 Speaker 2: But I was like asking people in my life. 74 00:04:46,956 --> 00:04:49,076 Speaker 3: I was telling them I felt off that week, which 75 00:04:49,116 --> 00:04:50,956 Speaker 3: I think is a good instinct to maybe one as 76 00:04:50,996 --> 00:04:53,516 Speaker 3: a reporter, and so I think I knew something was 77 00:04:54,156 --> 00:04:57,956 Speaker 3: more wrong than it was outwardly showing because everyone's like, 78 00:04:57,996 --> 00:04:59,876 Speaker 3: you sound fine. I could hear like a slur in 79 00:04:59,916 --> 00:05:02,916 Speaker 3: my voice there, like I don't hear anything. And over 80 00:05:02,956 --> 00:05:04,636 Speaker 3: the course of the week, it was like my body 81 00:05:04,636 --> 00:05:06,636 Speaker 3: had kind of figured it out before my brain had. 82 00:05:06,676 --> 00:05:09,396 Speaker 3: So my heart was like beating faster a troublesleep being, 83 00:05:09,796 --> 00:05:12,756 Speaker 3: and I kind of started like bursting into tears randomly, 84 00:05:13,436 --> 00:05:15,556 Speaker 3: and that, honestly like clued me in that this was 85 00:05:15,596 --> 00:05:16,276 Speaker 3: something important. 86 00:05:16,676 --> 00:05:20,156 Speaker 1: Yeah, did you feel that your symptoms were intensifying with 87 00:05:20,276 --> 00:05:21,316 Speaker 1: each subsequent day? 88 00:05:21,756 --> 00:05:24,676 Speaker 3: They were eventually got to the point where I tried 89 00:05:24,716 --> 00:05:26,756 Speaker 3: to like write in my journal and I couldn't read 90 00:05:26,796 --> 00:05:28,996 Speaker 3: my own writing. It was like chicken scratch and I 91 00:05:29,196 --> 00:05:31,596 Speaker 3: couldn't stop my body from kind of having a panic attack. 92 00:05:31,676 --> 00:05:34,036 Speaker 3: So I ended up going to urgent care, and that's 93 00:05:34,076 --> 00:05:36,076 Speaker 3: how I eventually learned that I had a bleed in 94 00:05:36,116 --> 00:05:38,156 Speaker 3: the back of my brain, which I didn't realize at 95 00:05:38,196 --> 00:05:39,436 Speaker 3: the time, but it was a stroke. 96 00:05:39,876 --> 00:05:45,996 Speaker 1: So wow, when you first heard, oh my god, you 97 00:05:45,996 --> 00:05:49,356 Speaker 1: have a stroke, what was your initial reaction. 98 00:05:49,836 --> 00:05:51,316 Speaker 2: Well, the way it was put to me, it was interesting. 99 00:05:51,396 --> 00:05:53,476 Speaker 3: It was like they did a CT scan and the 100 00:05:53,556 --> 00:05:56,476 Speaker 3: PA was like, honey, you have a bleed in the 101 00:05:56,516 --> 00:05:58,436 Speaker 3: back of your brain, but the good news is this 102 00:05:58,556 --> 00:05:59,636 Speaker 3: explains your symptoms. 103 00:06:00,436 --> 00:06:04,156 Speaker 2: I was like, okay, So I really went into shop. 104 00:06:04,236 --> 00:06:06,956 Speaker 3: To be honest, I was in shock for a little while, 105 00:06:07,356 --> 00:06:10,916 Speaker 3: and I was in hospital room like on a stroke 106 00:06:10,956 --> 00:06:15,516 Speaker 3: ward and my family came and I still couldn't process 107 00:06:15,596 --> 00:06:17,316 Speaker 3: the news. It was kind of how the fact that 108 00:06:17,356 --> 00:06:21,196 Speaker 3: they were so serious and terrified. Kind of helped me 109 00:06:21,316 --> 00:06:24,356 Speaker 3: realize the gravity of the situation. Yeah, it was just 110 00:06:24,396 --> 00:06:27,676 Speaker 3: so foreign to me. I'd never thought about brain stuff. 111 00:06:28,356 --> 00:06:30,596 Speaker 3: That's really weird to say. As a science journalist, everything 112 00:06:30,636 --> 00:06:33,036 Speaker 3: I write about is all like down here in the pelvis, 113 00:06:33,156 --> 00:06:36,996 Speaker 3: and it was just unfathomable. And I think that's why 114 00:06:37,036 --> 00:06:39,236 Speaker 3: nobody guessed it over the course of the week, Like, 115 00:06:40,036 --> 00:06:42,076 Speaker 3: why would you think that a healthy thirty five year 116 00:06:42,076 --> 00:06:46,436 Speaker 3: old woman who was literally writing articles, running, going to 117 00:06:46,516 --> 00:06:49,436 Speaker 3: karaoke would ever be having a stroke at the same time. 118 00:06:49,676 --> 00:06:50,196 Speaker 2: Yeah. 119 00:06:50,476 --> 00:06:53,556 Speaker 1: One thing that was so fascinating is that doctors told 120 00:06:53,596 --> 00:06:57,916 Speaker 1: you you actually got que quite lucky when it came 121 00:06:58,036 --> 00:07:00,956 Speaker 1: to the part of your brain that was affected by 122 00:07:00,956 --> 00:07:03,556 Speaker 1: the stroke. What exactly did they tell. 123 00:07:03,396 --> 00:07:05,836 Speaker 3: You, Yeah, that's right. It was basically like I won 124 00:07:05,876 --> 00:07:10,116 Speaker 3: the stroke lottery. They said, this is cerebellum and I 125 00:07:10,156 --> 00:07:12,356 Speaker 3: was like, what is that. I have no idea what 126 00:07:12,356 --> 00:07:15,196 Speaker 3: that means. And they were like, fortunately, it's a part 127 00:07:15,196 --> 00:07:17,116 Speaker 3: of the brain that kind of does motor stuff, which 128 00:07:17,156 --> 00:07:20,636 Speaker 3: again explains your motor symptoms, your trouble with fine movement. 129 00:07:21,116 --> 00:07:24,396 Speaker 3: It's like aha, And they said, eventually you will have 130 00:07:24,436 --> 00:07:27,276 Speaker 3: to get a surgery, but when you wake up, you'd 131 00:07:27,316 --> 00:07:30,476 Speaker 3: be clumsy, but you'll still be you. And I took 132 00:07:30,556 --> 00:07:34,036 Speaker 3: that as very reassuring. One surgeon said, if I had 133 00:07:34,036 --> 00:07:36,556 Speaker 3: a stroke, I would want it to be in the cerebellum, 134 00:07:37,036 --> 00:07:39,796 Speaker 3: and I was like, that's I guess great. 135 00:07:39,836 --> 00:07:40,356 Speaker 2: Like I didn't know. 136 00:07:40,396 --> 00:07:42,596 Speaker 3: I got that this was such a lucky thing to happen, 137 00:07:42,676 --> 00:07:44,036 Speaker 3: but I guess I'll hold onto that. 138 00:07:44,716 --> 00:07:48,556 Speaker 1: Yeah, when the doctor said you will still be you, 139 00:07:49,276 --> 00:07:52,396 Speaker 1: how did you process that given you felt very much 140 00:07:52,516 --> 00:07:54,556 Speaker 1: not like you in the preceding week. 141 00:07:54,636 --> 00:07:56,796 Speaker 3: Right, I mean, I didn't know what to think because 142 00:07:56,836 --> 00:07:59,396 Speaker 3: I was in the middle of a totally acute crisis 143 00:07:59,556 --> 00:08:02,476 Speaker 3: and I absolutely did not feel like me. Besides the 144 00:08:02,476 --> 00:08:04,556 Speaker 3: motor stuff, I also felt like the gears of my 145 00:08:04,636 --> 00:08:07,796 Speaker 3: brain were kind of like running through molasses at the end, 146 00:08:07,836 --> 00:08:09,956 Speaker 3: Like it was really difficult for me to hold on 147 00:08:10,036 --> 00:08:13,916 Speaker 3: to conversation and to pay attention, to focus and to 148 00:08:13,956 --> 00:08:18,476 Speaker 3: find the right word, which obviously feels quite cognitive. So 149 00:08:18,756 --> 00:08:22,436 Speaker 3: on the one hand, I am like really clinging to 150 00:08:22,556 --> 00:08:25,916 Speaker 3: any reassurance that I can get and to this idea 151 00:08:25,956 --> 00:08:28,796 Speaker 3: that this could explain most of my symptoms, But in 152 00:08:28,836 --> 00:08:33,676 Speaker 3: the back of my head, no pun intended. I think 153 00:08:33,716 --> 00:08:36,516 Speaker 3: I was, like, there's something wrong. My brain is injured. 154 00:08:36,876 --> 00:08:39,956 Speaker 3: I can feel the difference, and I have no experience 155 00:08:39,996 --> 00:08:41,836 Speaker 3: with this. So what I don't know is how much 156 00:08:41,876 --> 00:08:44,116 Speaker 3: the brain can bounce back, how much it can heal. 157 00:08:45,076 --> 00:08:47,116 Speaker 3: I've just never been through anything like this, but like, 158 00:08:47,276 --> 00:08:50,836 Speaker 3: I'm scared yea. So it kind of went between like 159 00:08:51,076 --> 00:08:54,796 Speaker 3: trying to comfort myself and being like this is truly 160 00:08:55,076 --> 00:08:55,716 Speaker 3: an unknown. 161 00:08:56,116 --> 00:08:59,316 Speaker 1: Yeah. One of the areas that I've explored as a 162 00:08:59,316 --> 00:09:04,636 Speaker 1: cognitive scientist is psychological essentialism, and it's basically almost a 163 00:09:04,636 --> 00:09:08,596 Speaker 1: philosophical inquiry into what makes each of us us right? 164 00:09:08,676 --> 00:09:11,996 Speaker 1: So is or maya essence is the Rachel essence right? 165 00:09:12,036 --> 00:09:14,276 Speaker 1: What does it even mean to feel like ourselves? And 166 00:09:14,276 --> 00:09:18,356 Speaker 1: I'm curious to know in what way did you not 167 00:09:18,516 --> 00:09:22,876 Speaker 1: feel like Rachel? Was it simply, oh, I can identify 168 00:09:22,996 --> 00:09:25,556 Speaker 1: these five impairments and that makes me feel not like me? 169 00:09:26,236 --> 00:09:30,116 Speaker 1: Or did it feel almost like a binary shift? Like 170 00:09:30,156 --> 00:09:32,556 Speaker 1: I can't quite even put my finger on it, but 171 00:09:32,676 --> 00:09:35,076 Speaker 1: I simply don't feel like myself. I would not be 172 00:09:35,076 --> 00:09:37,036 Speaker 1: able to describe on a checklist all the ways in 173 00:09:37,076 --> 00:09:38,436 Speaker 1: which I'm not feeling like myself. 174 00:09:38,876 --> 00:09:41,236 Speaker 3: Well, first of all that's a mind blowing field and 175 00:09:41,236 --> 00:09:44,556 Speaker 3: I totally want to learn more about that, especially now. 176 00:09:44,836 --> 00:09:47,116 Speaker 3: So yeah, it depends at what point because I was 177 00:09:47,156 --> 00:09:49,436 Speaker 3: still processing how to make sense of all this, But 178 00:09:49,476 --> 00:09:52,876 Speaker 3: I guess after the show for them months afterwards, it 179 00:09:52,916 --> 00:09:56,156 Speaker 3: was like I had pictured myself like many people probably 180 00:09:56,636 --> 00:09:59,716 Speaker 3: picture this Discardian mind body divide, where like, my mind 181 00:09:59,796 --> 00:10:02,556 Speaker 3: exists and it controls my body, which is my flesh cage. 182 00:10:02,996 --> 00:10:06,476 Speaker 3: And there was some like again breakdown in the transmission 183 00:10:06,516 --> 00:10:10,596 Speaker 3: from like my control commands to the body, and like, 184 00:10:10,636 --> 00:10:13,356 Speaker 3: I didn't anticipate how off that would make me feel, 185 00:10:13,756 --> 00:10:16,996 Speaker 3: so let me thank like how it changed my sense 186 00:10:17,036 --> 00:10:17,916 Speaker 3: of self. 187 00:10:18,316 --> 00:10:22,436 Speaker 1: For example, if I had waved a magic wand and 188 00:10:22,556 --> 00:10:25,716 Speaker 1: some of the impairments resolved themselves, let's say three out 189 00:10:25,716 --> 00:10:28,276 Speaker 1: of five of the biggest impairments, would that have made 190 00:10:28,316 --> 00:10:31,676 Speaker 1: you feel closer to feeling like Rachel or do you 191 00:10:31,716 --> 00:10:33,956 Speaker 1: think again it was more just like a categorical shift, 192 00:10:34,036 --> 00:10:36,476 Speaker 1: like until everything's resolved, they're just not going to feel 193 00:10:36,636 --> 00:10:39,036 Speaker 1: like my old self, or there's something just separate from 194 00:10:39,076 --> 00:10:41,796 Speaker 1: even the neurological impairments that's making me feel different. 195 00:10:42,196 --> 00:10:44,076 Speaker 3: No, it would have helped, and I think it has 196 00:10:44,156 --> 00:10:46,196 Speaker 3: helped over time, as I have recovered a lot of 197 00:10:46,196 --> 00:10:46,596 Speaker 3: it back. 198 00:10:46,716 --> 00:10:48,076 Speaker 2: Yeah, because it was really. 199 00:10:47,836 --> 00:10:52,476 Speaker 3: This delay and this distance between how I saw myself 200 00:10:52,516 --> 00:10:55,796 Speaker 3: in my head and how I was conceptualizing myself and 201 00:10:55,836 --> 00:10:58,116 Speaker 3: what was coming out and how I was coming off 202 00:10:58,156 --> 00:11:01,156 Speaker 3: to people. So it's partly like how I'm being perceived, 203 00:11:02,236 --> 00:11:05,876 Speaker 3: how my intentions are like manifesting in real life, and 204 00:11:06,196 --> 00:11:11,276 Speaker 3: the amount of effort it's taking to honestly like performed myself. 205 00:11:11,836 --> 00:11:15,276 Speaker 3: I felt like an alien impersonating myself. Even like being 206 00:11:15,276 --> 00:11:17,636 Speaker 3: in the subway trying to get into a subway train, 207 00:11:17,756 --> 00:11:19,316 Speaker 3: I had to be like, wait, you need to go 208 00:11:19,356 --> 00:11:21,596 Speaker 3: to the right. Wait, you're going to hit someone. Wait, 209 00:11:21,596 --> 00:11:24,396 Speaker 3: you need to keep focused on the subway car. So 210 00:11:24,476 --> 00:11:27,956 Speaker 3: I was having this internal dialogue. I felt like jerky 211 00:11:28,036 --> 00:11:30,956 Speaker 3: and off and not kind of smooth and fluid and 212 00:11:31,036 --> 00:11:33,916 Speaker 3: at one with my body and with my surroundings. 213 00:11:34,196 --> 00:11:36,276 Speaker 1: Yeah, sounds like so many of the things that it 214 00:11:36,356 --> 00:11:39,876 Speaker 1: felt effortless that were the results of unconscious processing were 215 00:11:39,916 --> 00:11:43,916 Speaker 1: now the result of very deliberate conscious processing, And that 216 00:11:44,556 --> 00:11:48,836 Speaker 1: you're used to being the conductor of your body and mind, 217 00:11:49,076 --> 00:11:50,716 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, like the orchestra is not 218 00:11:50,716 --> 00:11:54,996 Speaker 1: paying attention. It's like, hello, musicians, violinists, feelss, why aren't 219 00:11:55,036 --> 00:11:57,876 Speaker 1: you playing when you're supposed to do? Like you're off tempo? Right? 220 00:11:58,236 --> 00:12:00,916 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And that's exactly how I described it. It 221 00:12:00,956 --> 00:12:03,636 Speaker 3: was like I hadn't realized there was an invisible conductor 222 00:12:03,876 --> 00:12:07,356 Speaker 3: that was doing all this choreography behind the scenes and 223 00:12:07,396 --> 00:12:10,716 Speaker 3: making it feel smooth and seemless. Now the seams were 224 00:12:10,756 --> 00:12:13,716 Speaker 3: showing and I was kind of now to switch the metaphor, 225 00:12:13,836 --> 00:12:17,076 Speaker 3: I was like a puppet master, pulling each string individually, 226 00:12:17,516 --> 00:12:19,796 Speaker 3: and that took a lot of conscious effort. It was 227 00:12:19,836 --> 00:12:22,196 Speaker 3: like everything was unconscious kind of bubbled up to the 228 00:12:22,276 --> 00:12:25,876 Speaker 3: surface and became within my awareness, which, let me tell you, 229 00:12:25,996 --> 00:12:26,596 Speaker 3: is exhausting. 230 00:12:26,876 --> 00:12:29,956 Speaker 1: Yeah. I obviously cannot relate in any way to the 231 00:12:29,996 --> 00:12:32,036 Speaker 1: magnitude of what you endured, but I have a little 232 00:12:32,076 --> 00:12:36,916 Speaker 1: anecdote that makes me empathize with what you went through, 233 00:12:36,956 --> 00:12:40,316 Speaker 1: which is I had a career ending violin injury, and 234 00:12:40,356 --> 00:12:42,316 Speaker 1: I remember, after years and years of not being able 235 00:12:42,356 --> 00:12:45,276 Speaker 1: to play in multiple surgeries, I picked back up my 236 00:12:45,316 --> 00:12:48,996 Speaker 1: instrument and my mind had not forgotten how to play 237 00:12:49,196 --> 00:12:50,596 Speaker 1: the mentals and violin concerto. 238 00:12:50,796 --> 00:12:50,916 Speaker 3: Right. 239 00:12:50,996 --> 00:12:53,436 Speaker 1: It was it felt like effortless, and I knew exactly 240 00:12:53,476 --> 00:12:56,196 Speaker 1: how I would phrase it and what my finger should do, 241 00:12:56,716 --> 00:13:00,116 Speaker 1: and yet my brain had lost all the muscle memory 242 00:13:00,116 --> 00:13:02,276 Speaker 1: around how to actually play the instrument, and I would 243 00:13:02,276 --> 00:13:06,956 Speaker 1: get so frustrated not being able to translate what was 244 00:13:06,996 --> 00:13:10,196 Speaker 1: in my head into the actual mut that I was producing. 245 00:13:10,596 --> 00:13:12,036 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's exactly it. 246 00:13:12,036 --> 00:13:14,796 Speaker 3: I'm really glad you actually used that imagery, if you 247 00:13:14,836 --> 00:13:18,476 Speaker 3: do understand. I literally felt like I'd been handed an 248 00:13:18,476 --> 00:13:22,436 Speaker 3: out of tune instrument because suddenly I was doing the 249 00:13:22,476 --> 00:13:26,596 Speaker 3: same things mentally and it wasn't producing what I was 250 00:13:26,716 --> 00:13:29,996 Speaker 3: used to. And that's definitely what I felt in karaoko. 251 00:13:29,996 --> 00:13:31,276 Speaker 3: It was like I know how to listen to a 252 00:13:31,356 --> 00:13:34,036 Speaker 3: note and just like repeat it and make the same 253 00:13:34,076 --> 00:13:36,396 Speaker 3: sound come out, Like I know how to perform this, 254 00:13:36,836 --> 00:13:40,476 Speaker 3: and suddenly it was like I don't know what's coming 255 00:13:40,516 --> 00:13:42,796 Speaker 3: out of me. I can't do all these things at once. 256 00:13:43,236 --> 00:13:46,156 Speaker 3: Like again, I kind of felt like an alien. I 257 00:13:46,236 --> 00:13:48,316 Speaker 3: was like, yeah, this isn't me. 258 00:13:49,836 --> 00:13:52,316 Speaker 1: I'm so interested to explore something that you mentioned, which 259 00:13:52,356 --> 00:13:55,236 Speaker 1: is you felt like you had to be an actress 260 00:13:55,236 --> 00:13:58,116 Speaker 1: of sorts when it came to engaging with your community, 261 00:13:58,276 --> 00:14:01,676 Speaker 1: right your friends and family, and I imagine that you 262 00:14:01,716 --> 00:14:05,036 Speaker 1: were presenting to them as normal, but we're feeling at 263 00:14:05,036 --> 00:14:08,396 Speaker 1: the same time massively impaired. What did that look like 264 00:14:08,476 --> 00:14:12,796 Speaker 1: in daily life? And how did you figure out how 265 00:14:12,796 --> 00:14:15,196 Speaker 1: to get your community to catch up to what your 266 00:14:15,236 --> 00:14:17,036 Speaker 1: mind knew about your actual state. 267 00:14:18,276 --> 00:14:24,716 Speaker 3: Yeah, that was the challenge because like in some conditions, 268 00:14:24,756 --> 00:14:27,916 Speaker 3: I think maybe it was a little bit more obvious. 269 00:14:29,156 --> 00:14:32,716 Speaker 3: So in karaoke, like everything is kind of magnified, like 270 00:14:32,756 --> 00:14:34,876 Speaker 3: you're on stage as a spotlight. And I guess I 271 00:14:35,596 --> 00:14:38,556 Speaker 3: didn't realize until then, but my stage name is Rikira, 272 00:14:38,636 --> 00:14:39,116 Speaker 3: and I do a. 273 00:14:39,076 --> 00:14:39,836 Speaker 2: Lot of hip stuff. 274 00:14:39,876 --> 00:14:43,076 Speaker 3: Apparently, like unconsciously, I'm always just like rolling my hips 275 00:14:43,116 --> 00:14:45,316 Speaker 3: and just like shaking my ass and everything. 276 00:14:45,516 --> 00:14:48,516 Speaker 2: So and like that wasn't happening anymore. 277 00:14:48,556 --> 00:14:50,836 Speaker 3: So I'd be on stage and suddenly like be aware, like, oh, 278 00:14:50,836 --> 00:14:53,276 Speaker 3: the audience looks kind of bored. Maybe you should shake 279 00:14:53,316 --> 00:14:55,836 Speaker 3: a little or like shimmy Rachel and be like, oh, wait, 280 00:14:55,876 --> 00:14:57,996 Speaker 3: you have to keep singing at the same time, like wait, 281 00:14:58,076 --> 00:15:00,156 Speaker 3: sing the words, and I'd like focus really hard on 282 00:15:00,196 --> 00:15:03,516 Speaker 3: the screen and I just like standing there woodenly, and 283 00:15:03,556 --> 00:15:05,596 Speaker 3: when you're doing that and you're singing, like I touch 284 00:15:05,676 --> 00:15:07,836 Speaker 3: myself by Da Vinil's It's not really going to like 285 00:15:07,996 --> 00:15:10,516 Speaker 3: sell the song I'd I learned, so I'd have like 286 00:15:10,556 --> 00:15:12,676 Speaker 3: these awkward moments from like I'm really not getting like 287 00:15:12,716 --> 00:15:15,516 Speaker 3: the applause that I usually do, Like something's not working. 288 00:15:15,916 --> 00:15:18,676 Speaker 3: But in my regular life, Yeah, people didn't notice, even 289 00:15:18,756 --> 00:15:22,876 Speaker 3: my closest friends and family, which was very like alienating. 290 00:15:24,076 --> 00:15:26,436 Speaker 3: So I got a ton of reassurance that I looked 291 00:15:26,436 --> 00:15:28,476 Speaker 3: and seemed fine, which like on the one hand, like 292 00:15:28,556 --> 00:15:31,876 Speaker 3: good on the other hand, than what is happening internally? 293 00:15:32,236 --> 00:15:36,236 Speaker 3: What is this discrepancy, this like chasm between what I 294 00:15:36,276 --> 00:15:40,156 Speaker 3: feel and what people notice. And what I learned is 295 00:15:40,156 --> 00:15:42,836 Speaker 3: that like, if you do have to perform yourself, you 296 00:15:43,236 --> 00:15:45,436 Speaker 3: kind of can do it pretty well because you know 297 00:15:45,516 --> 00:15:47,756 Speaker 3: your mannerisms, how you move through the world, you know 298 00:15:48,156 --> 00:15:50,636 Speaker 3: the stories you tell and how people react, and if 299 00:15:50,636 --> 00:15:53,476 Speaker 3: you have to pull every lever yourself, you can. But 300 00:15:53,556 --> 00:15:58,076 Speaker 3: it's very exhausting and it's very isolating. As someone who's 301 00:15:58,116 --> 00:16:01,836 Speaker 3: an extrovert and like really craves like deep connection with people, 302 00:16:02,276 --> 00:16:05,036 Speaker 3: I wasn't getting that I was just performing and like 303 00:16:05,276 --> 00:16:06,516 Speaker 3: hoping they didn't notice. 304 00:16:06,756 --> 00:16:11,716 Speaker 1: Yeah, and what is sobering high level observation, which is, Wow, 305 00:16:11,796 --> 00:16:13,676 Speaker 1: even the people with whom we think we have the 306 00:16:13,716 --> 00:16:17,436 Speaker 1: most intimate connections, are they really only getting a snapshot 307 00:16:17,516 --> 00:16:19,996 Speaker 1: of who we are and any given moments such that 308 00:16:20,596 --> 00:16:25,756 Speaker 1: you could pass as quote normal, Rachel, your cognitive impairments. 309 00:16:26,116 --> 00:16:26,836 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. 310 00:16:27,796 --> 00:16:31,156 Speaker 3: It was definitely an instance of like passing was the 311 00:16:31,156 --> 00:16:32,276 Speaker 3: word that came to mind. 312 00:16:32,476 --> 00:16:33,836 Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah. 313 00:16:33,596 --> 00:16:36,756 Speaker 3: That was like a philosophical kind of disturbing question I had. 314 00:16:37,236 --> 00:16:39,076 Speaker 3: On the other hand, I think that people have a 315 00:16:39,116 --> 00:16:42,836 Speaker 3: lot of unconscious cognitive processes themselves to reassure themselves that 316 00:16:42,836 --> 00:16:45,196 Speaker 3: the situation is okay. They're kind of like filling in 317 00:16:45,236 --> 00:16:47,516 Speaker 3: the gaps and kind of projecting what they know about you. 318 00:16:47,756 --> 00:16:50,436 Speaker 3: People started like finishing my sentences and cutting me off 319 00:16:50,476 --> 00:16:53,516 Speaker 3: all the time because I was slower to you complete 320 00:16:53,516 --> 00:16:55,676 Speaker 3: it myself, or I couldn't find the word, and they 321 00:16:55,676 --> 00:16:57,716 Speaker 3: didn't notice that was happening. They just thought I had 322 00:16:57,756 --> 00:16:59,716 Speaker 3: finished the sentence and they knew what I was going 323 00:16:59,756 --> 00:17:02,236 Speaker 3: to say anyways, And I was like, this is interesting. 324 00:17:02,316 --> 00:17:03,636 Speaker 3: That's not where I was going to go with that, 325 00:17:03,796 --> 00:17:05,636 Speaker 3: But I'm observing this now. 326 00:17:05,556 --> 00:17:07,836 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that is so fascinating. Yeah, you're saying 327 00:17:08,556 --> 00:17:10,916 Speaker 1: if you love someone, your protective instincts are going to 328 00:17:10,956 --> 00:17:13,476 Speaker 1: go into full gear in order to protect yourself from 329 00:17:13,476 --> 00:17:16,916 Speaker 1: the devastating truth that this loved one might be, you know, 330 00:17:16,956 --> 00:17:19,196 Speaker 1: impaired in some way. You just figure out how not 331 00:17:19,276 --> 00:17:19,716 Speaker 1: to see it. 332 00:17:20,076 --> 00:17:22,636 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you put that beautifully. But I will say, 333 00:17:22,676 --> 00:17:23,436 Speaker 3: like I think there's. 334 00:17:23,636 --> 00:17:27,036 Speaker 2: It was your idea, some mispriss all. 335 00:17:27,156 --> 00:17:32,556 Speaker 3: I mean, stop, no you, But I think there's like 336 00:17:32,636 --> 00:17:35,996 Speaker 3: love in that gesture, right, because like they were also 337 00:17:36,036 --> 00:17:38,676 Speaker 3: seeing a part of me that I was having trouble accessing. 338 00:17:39,036 --> 00:17:40,876 Speaker 3: And like it's true I was in there, and like 339 00:17:40,956 --> 00:17:43,116 Speaker 3: I was recovering over time, so parts of me were 340 00:17:43,156 --> 00:17:45,956 Speaker 3: not accessible and not being expressed. But like it was 341 00:17:45,996 --> 00:17:47,836 Speaker 3: being around people that knew be the most that helped 342 00:17:47,876 --> 00:17:51,076 Speaker 3: bring that out. So like there is beauty in it, 343 00:17:50,996 --> 00:17:53,756 Speaker 3: it's not there's devastation as well. I definitely don't like 344 00:17:53,796 --> 00:17:57,516 Speaker 3: to sugarcoat, but like I'm also grateful because I was 345 00:17:57,556 --> 00:17:59,956 Speaker 3: eventually able to access a little more of that and 346 00:18:00,396 --> 00:18:02,916 Speaker 3: like they kind of like bullied me during that. 347 00:18:07,436 --> 00:18:11,116 Speaker 1: After the break, Rachel's cauriosity leads her on a magic 348 00:18:11,196 --> 00:18:15,156 Speaker 1: school bus ride into her own brain. We'll be right 349 00:18:15,196 --> 00:18:32,996 Speaker 1: back with a slight change of plans. Rachel's stroke affected 350 00:18:32,996 --> 00:18:36,476 Speaker 1: a part of the brain called the sarahbellum. Doctor said 351 00:18:36,516 --> 00:18:39,516 Speaker 1: her motor function would be affected, but outside of that 352 00:18:40,236 --> 00:18:42,996 Speaker 1: she should expect to feel more or less like herself. 353 00:18:43,716 --> 00:18:46,516 Speaker 1: But the problem was that Rachel didn't feel at all 354 00:18:46,676 --> 00:18:51,676 Speaker 1: like herself. Everyday behaviors things that had once felt so automatic, 355 00:18:52,316 --> 00:18:55,156 Speaker 1: like how to laugh at an appropriate volume or how 356 00:18:55,236 --> 00:18:59,756 Speaker 1: to articulate her thoughts out loud, now required thinking an effort. 357 00:19:00,716 --> 00:19:03,996 Speaker 1: Rachel had questions, and so she did the one thing 358 00:19:04,116 --> 00:19:07,316 Speaker 1: she knew to do in situations like these, She put 359 00:19:07,356 --> 00:19:09,996 Speaker 1: on her journalist's hat. And this frizzled it. 360 00:19:10,556 --> 00:19:13,036 Speaker 3: But I definitely remember literally being in the hospital room 361 00:19:13,116 --> 00:19:15,636 Speaker 3: and asking for more research on the cerebellum and being 362 00:19:15,676 --> 00:19:18,796 Speaker 3: handed a paper that said, this part of the brain 363 00:19:18,916 --> 00:19:23,276 Speaker 3: is ineloquent and redundant and it doesn't have a role 364 00:19:23,356 --> 00:19:26,636 Speaker 3: in language recognition and it's safe to operate. 365 00:19:26,356 --> 00:19:28,076 Speaker 2: In so have bad it, guys. 366 00:19:28,876 --> 00:19:29,116 Speaker 1: Wow. 367 00:19:29,156 --> 00:19:30,956 Speaker 3: And I just remember at that moment, like again my 368 00:19:31,276 --> 00:19:35,076 Speaker 3: thinking was pretty impaired, but just being like huh, Like 369 00:19:35,116 --> 00:19:37,676 Speaker 3: how can they say what it doesn't do? Because like, 370 00:19:37,716 --> 00:19:39,036 Speaker 3: how do you really know what any part of the 371 00:19:39,036 --> 00:19:41,716 Speaker 3: brain does. It's all like mysterious and interconnected. Like to 372 00:19:42,276 --> 00:19:46,436 Speaker 3: definitively say that it doesn't do that sounds weird, but 373 00:19:47,236 --> 00:19:50,476 Speaker 3: I kind of realized that, like that was the party line. 374 00:19:50,516 --> 00:19:54,836 Speaker 3: But there was this whole like cadre of neuroscientists who 375 00:19:55,356 --> 00:19:58,956 Speaker 3: were questioning it and saying, like, actually, the cerebellum might 376 00:19:58,996 --> 00:20:03,436 Speaker 3: be more interconnected and central than we thought. And it's 377 00:20:03,476 --> 00:20:06,236 Speaker 3: called the downstairs brain, but it's connected to the upstairs 378 00:20:06,316 --> 00:20:08,876 Speaker 3: brain in a way that we didn't realize until recently. 379 00:20:09,836 --> 00:20:13,036 Speaker 3: And it seems like summarizing all these scientists I talk to, 380 00:20:14,036 --> 00:20:18,116 Speaker 3: every kind of thought and gesture and emotion before it 381 00:20:18,156 --> 00:20:21,716 Speaker 3: makes its way from inside your brain to outside, it 382 00:20:21,796 --> 00:20:25,396 Speaker 3: kind of passes through this part of the brain. 383 00:20:25,436 --> 00:20:27,116 Speaker 2: It's like the unionstation of the brain. 384 00:20:27,676 --> 00:20:31,076 Speaker 3: And so something's happening where this thought gets transformed in 385 00:20:31,156 --> 00:20:33,676 Speaker 3: some way. We're not exactly sure how, but it might 386 00:20:33,716 --> 00:20:36,556 Speaker 3: be some kind of polishing or refining process to make 387 00:20:36,556 --> 00:20:40,196 Speaker 3: it more appropriate to the situation, so that by the 388 00:20:40,236 --> 00:20:43,356 Speaker 3: time it leaves your brain it's kind of what you intended. 389 00:20:43,756 --> 00:20:46,676 Speaker 3: And all this is happening unconsciously, like we're saying, this 390 00:20:46,716 --> 00:20:50,316 Speaker 3: is all automatic in the background, So you can imagine 391 00:20:50,396 --> 00:20:54,716 Speaker 3: that when it gets damaged suddenly, like all those tiny 392 00:20:54,756 --> 00:20:59,796 Speaker 3: little tweaks now are conscious and it's just like overwhelming, 393 00:21:00,556 --> 00:21:03,236 Speaker 3: and I don't know, learning that made me really appreciate 394 00:21:03,236 --> 00:21:05,276 Speaker 3: what ceahbellum had been doing, and like, I do hope 395 00:21:05,316 --> 00:21:08,716 Speaker 3: that's something that people get out of this. And it 396 00:21:08,756 --> 00:21:10,356 Speaker 3: also it made me feel like it's kind of this 397 00:21:10,396 --> 00:21:14,636 Speaker 3: connective tissue between like mind and body and between you 398 00:21:14,756 --> 00:21:15,796 Speaker 3: and your environment. 399 00:21:15,916 --> 00:21:18,276 Speaker 2: It's like working at that interface between the two. 400 00:21:19,156 --> 00:21:22,156 Speaker 1: Before you found out that the cerebellum might play this 401 00:21:22,196 --> 00:21:24,716 Speaker 1: critical role, and you just got that paper saying the 402 00:21:24,716 --> 00:21:26,116 Speaker 1: cerebellum doesn't do anything. 403 00:21:26,716 --> 00:21:28,076 Speaker 2: Yeah, did you almost. 404 00:21:27,716 --> 00:21:30,396 Speaker 1: Feel like the science was gaslighting you or that I 405 00:21:30,516 --> 00:21:34,676 Speaker 1: was denying or undermining your experience in some way? Oh? 406 00:21:34,796 --> 00:21:37,076 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it is funny because most of my 407 00:21:37,156 --> 00:21:40,516 Speaker 3: reporting is on medical gaslighting and is on diseases that 408 00:21:40,556 --> 00:21:43,796 Speaker 3: are considered to be all in your head or to 409 00:21:43,876 --> 00:21:46,996 Speaker 3: be no big deal that turnout have like. 410 00:21:46,996 --> 00:21:48,276 Speaker 2: A very physical basis. 411 00:21:48,956 --> 00:21:50,476 Speaker 3: So it was very odd to be put in the 412 00:21:50,476 --> 00:21:54,676 Speaker 3: patient perspective, to put it mildly, I don't know, to 413 00:21:54,716 --> 00:21:56,916 Speaker 3: be like I was still putting it together because I 414 00:21:57,036 --> 00:22:00,636 Speaker 3: was still being told by everyone around me, including every neurologist, 415 00:22:00,956 --> 00:22:03,796 Speaker 3: like they're giving me cognitive tests or saying you're cognitively intact, 416 00:22:03,836 --> 00:22:07,596 Speaker 3: you look perfect, you're graduating from occupational therapy, physical therapy. 417 00:22:07,996 --> 00:22:11,116 Speaker 3: So like, by their stay, it's true, this part of 418 00:22:11,156 --> 00:22:13,916 Speaker 3: the brain wasn't crucial, and like I am able to 419 00:22:13,916 --> 00:22:17,956 Speaker 3: speak and write again, but then like there's something weird. 420 00:22:17,996 --> 00:22:20,196 Speaker 3: There's still a chasm between my experience and when I'm 421 00:22:20,236 --> 00:22:22,796 Speaker 3: being told, and I think I was still figuring it 422 00:22:22,876 --> 00:22:28,356 Speaker 3: out rather than feeling gas lit. There was one moment 423 00:22:28,396 --> 00:22:32,076 Speaker 3: where I had started like misfrizzling and like calling scientists, 424 00:22:32,076 --> 00:22:35,356 Speaker 3: and I talked to a speech therapist who specifically worked 425 00:22:35,396 --> 00:22:38,636 Speaker 3: on singing and the cerebellum, and she was telling me, yeah, 426 00:22:38,676 --> 00:22:40,676 Speaker 3: all my cerebella patients, they're. 427 00:22:40,516 --> 00:22:42,716 Speaker 2: Really fatigued, like exhausted. 428 00:22:43,036 --> 00:22:45,516 Speaker 3: And it's not because like this is the part of 429 00:22:45,516 --> 00:22:49,156 Speaker 3: the brain that causes more fatigue. It's because suddenly, like 430 00:22:49,756 --> 00:22:53,476 Speaker 3: instead of being on autopilot, they're on manual, so they're 431 00:22:53,676 --> 00:22:55,956 Speaker 3: thinking each thing out loud. And the most extreme or 432 00:22:55,956 --> 00:22:59,276 Speaker 3: obvious way I can explain it is when I was 433 00:22:59,356 --> 00:23:02,996 Speaker 3: learning to walk again after surgery, I had to literally 434 00:23:03,276 --> 00:23:05,916 Speaker 3: tell my feet. I was like, you need to put 435 00:23:05,956 --> 00:23:08,196 Speaker 3: your weight on the inner corners of your feet, which 436 00:23:08,236 --> 00:23:10,476 Speaker 3: if you've ever learned to like ice skater, roller skate, 437 00:23:10,516 --> 00:23:13,596 Speaker 3: that's something that you started being consciously and later becomes 438 00:23:13,676 --> 00:23:16,316 Speaker 3: muscle memory, like you were mentioning. So it's like I 439 00:23:16,436 --> 00:23:20,076 Speaker 3: lost the muscle memory. So that's like there are things 440 00:23:20,116 --> 00:23:22,116 Speaker 3: that are much more subtle, but that's kind of the 441 00:23:22,156 --> 00:23:24,756 Speaker 3: most obvious, I think, way to explain what the Sarah 442 00:23:24,756 --> 00:23:25,356 Speaker 3: Beltan's doing. 443 00:23:26,316 --> 00:23:30,196 Speaker 1: You know, after a big incident like this one, obviously 444 00:23:30,756 --> 00:23:33,236 Speaker 1: one can feel gratitude. Okay, I'm grateful it wasn't worse. 445 00:23:33,276 --> 00:23:38,316 Speaker 1: I'm grateful on having, you know, a pretty significant recovery here, 446 00:23:38,396 --> 00:23:41,436 Speaker 1: and maybe I'm surpassing expectations by my doctors. But there's 447 00:23:41,476 --> 00:23:44,436 Speaker 1: also the reality of, oh wow, I'm a working professional, 448 00:23:44,796 --> 00:23:48,116 Speaker 1: I'm a science journalist. I'm not working with the same 449 00:23:48,196 --> 00:23:53,116 Speaker 1: raw materials I had before. How did you adapt to 450 00:23:53,596 --> 00:23:57,636 Speaker 1: this new mental state that was constantly in flux? Right? 451 00:23:57,676 --> 00:23:59,156 Speaker 1: You don't know how much you're going to improve over 452 00:23:59,196 --> 00:24:01,716 Speaker 1: a three month period or six month period. And you know, 453 00:24:01,796 --> 00:24:03,516 Speaker 1: not everyone here has had a stroke, but a lot 454 00:24:03,516 --> 00:24:05,516 Speaker 1: of people have dealt with some kind of loss that 455 00:24:05,636 --> 00:24:07,596 Speaker 1: set them back in some way or prevented them from 456 00:24:07,596 --> 00:24:10,316 Speaker 1: doing what they love. And so I'm curious to know 457 00:24:10,356 --> 00:24:11,196 Speaker 1: what your approach was. 458 00:24:11,876 --> 00:24:13,796 Speaker 3: I think it's a really good way of putting it. 459 00:24:13,796 --> 00:24:16,516 Speaker 3: It was really dealing with the unknown that was the scariest. 460 00:24:16,956 --> 00:24:18,756 Speaker 2: This is part of whatever. 461 00:24:18,516 --> 00:24:20,516 Speaker 3: I want to call it, my thinking brain, the brain 462 00:24:20,556 --> 00:24:23,156 Speaker 3: I value, the brain that I think of as I. 463 00:24:23,236 --> 00:24:26,316 Speaker 3: So now how do I incorporate that into my identity? 464 00:24:27,636 --> 00:24:29,716 Speaker 3: And Yeah, it made me do a lot of soul 465 00:24:29,756 --> 00:24:33,596 Speaker 3: searching about what I value and what I valued about 466 00:24:33,636 --> 00:24:39,036 Speaker 3: my quickness of processing, and about my kind of fluency 467 00:24:39,356 --> 00:24:45,236 Speaker 3: in the world of science and literature and journalism. Like I, 468 00:24:46,076 --> 00:24:48,396 Speaker 3: like probably many people in this room, I was very 469 00:24:48,476 --> 00:24:52,836 Speaker 3: much like brought up to value high academic achievement. My 470 00:24:52,916 --> 00:24:55,276 Speaker 3: parents were all scientists. I didn't get into that, but like, 471 00:24:55,516 --> 00:24:58,596 Speaker 3: my dad's a theoretical physicist. My mom's a doctor researcher. 472 00:24:58,636 --> 00:25:00,356 Speaker 3: Oh my god, stop stop this guzzle. 473 00:25:01,596 --> 00:25:03,916 Speaker 1: Quantum mechanics, that's matter physics. 474 00:25:03,996 --> 00:25:04,476 Speaker 3: Oh my god. 475 00:25:04,556 --> 00:25:06,036 Speaker 1: I don't understand it at all. I just know what 476 00:25:06,076 --> 00:25:09,756 Speaker 1: he does. Oh my goodness. I even say, people whose 477 00:25:09,836 --> 00:25:11,836 Speaker 1: dads are theoretical physicists, Okay, keep going. 478 00:25:12,076 --> 00:25:20,036 Speaker 3: Yeah, I shaped some very odd progeny so odd curious, 479 00:25:19,116 --> 00:25:23,316 Speaker 3: and mom's a doctor and my stepmom's a molecular biologists. 480 00:25:23,316 --> 00:25:25,996 Speaker 3: So I think hard science was really pushed on me, 481 00:25:26,396 --> 00:25:29,596 Speaker 3: and like it ended up because I big a science journalists, 482 00:25:29,596 --> 00:25:32,756 Speaker 3: Like a lot of my job relies on convincing PhD 483 00:25:32,836 --> 00:25:35,876 Speaker 3: scientists that I am smart enough to understand that their 484 00:25:35,956 --> 00:25:39,236 Speaker 3: latest research that they have spent twenty years mastering, and 485 00:25:39,356 --> 00:25:41,356 Speaker 3: to like distill it and translate it to the public 486 00:25:41,436 --> 00:25:44,836 Speaker 3: without screwing up while stroking their ego while I'm interviewing them. 487 00:25:44,956 --> 00:25:47,436 Speaker 3: So there's a lot of emotional and other forms of 488 00:25:47,436 --> 00:25:50,316 Speaker 3: technical intelligence going on. And yeah, it was a total 489 00:25:50,516 --> 00:25:54,636 Speaker 3: panic of like, can I still, I don't know, maintain 490 00:25:54,716 --> 00:25:56,596 Speaker 3: this like status and do what I love? 491 00:25:56,876 --> 00:25:58,556 Speaker 2: And it was also a realization. 492 00:25:58,116 --> 00:25:59,916 Speaker 3: Of what I love about all this, Like I love 493 00:26:00,036 --> 00:26:02,956 Speaker 3: being a bridge between science and the public. I love 494 00:26:03,036 --> 00:26:06,276 Speaker 3: getting to know scientists really closely as like these interesting, quirky, 495 00:26:06,316 --> 00:26:11,156 Speaker 3: flawed characters like miss Brissil, and I do love communicating, 496 00:26:11,276 --> 00:26:15,076 Speaker 3: whether that's public speaking or whatever, and I didn't want 497 00:26:15,116 --> 00:26:18,836 Speaker 3: to lose that. But I think like the deeper fear 498 00:26:19,196 --> 00:26:22,356 Speaker 3: in there was kind of losing my connection to people 499 00:26:22,556 --> 00:26:28,276 Speaker 3: period and through my writing and science fluency and like storytelling, 500 00:26:28,396 --> 00:26:30,596 Speaker 3: that was how I just connected to the world and 501 00:26:30,596 --> 00:26:34,236 Speaker 3: connected people deeply. And the idea that because I've lost 502 00:26:34,276 --> 00:26:38,356 Speaker 3: some memory or the ability to like convey my personality 503 00:26:38,436 --> 00:26:40,436 Speaker 3: or my humor, that I would just be more like 504 00:26:40,516 --> 00:26:43,756 Speaker 3: isolated from people. I think that was the really the 505 00:26:43,956 --> 00:26:45,076 Speaker 3: underlying fear. 506 00:26:46,236 --> 00:26:48,956 Speaker 1: Did you have any adaptations you employed at. 507 00:26:48,836 --> 00:26:52,476 Speaker 3: The time, Yeah, so I think fortunately I just started 508 00:26:52,956 --> 00:26:57,916 Speaker 3: like over doing everything, like over reporting, overwriting, writing more 509 00:26:57,956 --> 00:27:01,156 Speaker 3: stuff down, like writing down outlines to timelines, and I 510 00:27:01,196 --> 00:27:03,996 Speaker 3: don't know, as a woman in a pretty male dominated 511 00:27:03,996 --> 00:27:05,836 Speaker 3: field of science journals, something I'm pretty used to that 512 00:27:05,956 --> 00:27:08,556 Speaker 3: doing like twice as much work to yeah, have the 513 00:27:08,596 --> 00:27:09,276 Speaker 3: same cut. 514 00:27:10,836 --> 00:27:11,556 Speaker 2: As someone else. 515 00:27:12,036 --> 00:27:16,396 Speaker 3: But I guess I'm glad that I sort of experimented 516 00:27:16,476 --> 00:27:20,356 Speaker 3: with what worked for me, and and I like, yes, 517 00:27:20,436 --> 00:27:24,116 Speaker 3: I did need to find new systems and adaptations and 518 00:27:24,276 --> 00:27:26,316 Speaker 3: kind of get to know my new brain even as 519 00:27:26,356 --> 00:27:28,836 Speaker 3: it was evolving, and even though I didn't know exactly 520 00:27:29,076 --> 00:27:31,036 Speaker 3: how what recovery was going to look like. 521 00:27:31,596 --> 00:27:32,596 Speaker 2: So I'm glad I did that. 522 00:27:33,796 --> 00:27:37,396 Speaker 3: I wish that I hadn't resisted for so long the 523 00:27:37,516 --> 00:27:40,836 Speaker 3: need to change, so I think I was so stuck 524 00:27:40,876 --> 00:27:43,156 Speaker 3: in my brain and with this idea that I had 525 00:27:43,156 --> 00:27:45,396 Speaker 3: to write the same amount the same kind of stuff. 526 00:27:45,716 --> 00:27:48,036 Speaker 3: I had to ask myself hard questions like why do 527 00:27:48,116 --> 00:27:50,516 Speaker 3: you need to perform at this level and do this 528 00:27:50,756 --> 00:27:55,836 Speaker 3: much and be like this much smarter and impress this 529 00:27:55,996 --> 00:27:56,676 Speaker 3: many people? 530 00:27:57,836 --> 00:27:59,276 Speaker 1: Like what. 531 00:28:00,756 --> 00:28:00,956 Speaker 2: Is this? 532 00:28:00,996 --> 00:28:03,476 Speaker 3: What gives you value in the world? And do you 533 00:28:03,516 --> 00:28:06,316 Speaker 3: expect to keep doing this until what? Like what is 534 00:28:06,356 --> 00:28:11,356 Speaker 3: this going to get you? Eventually? So I spent a 535 00:28:11,396 --> 00:28:14,076 Speaker 3: lot of energy resisting and trying to be who I 536 00:28:14,276 --> 00:28:17,076 Speaker 3: was and just like struggling behind the scenes and treading 537 00:28:17,156 --> 00:28:20,196 Speaker 3: water and losing sleep, which was especially bad with a 538 00:28:20,276 --> 00:28:23,276 Speaker 3: brain injury, and like, honestly, I just hit a wall 539 00:28:23,316 --> 00:28:25,876 Speaker 3: at some point and I had a breakdown, which involves 540 00:28:25,916 --> 00:28:29,316 Speaker 3: like kind of losing some short term memory for like 541 00:28:29,356 --> 00:28:31,836 Speaker 3: a short amount of time. And that was kind of 542 00:28:31,836 --> 00:28:33,636 Speaker 3: a come to Jesus for me. I was like, I 543 00:28:33,636 --> 00:28:36,396 Speaker 3: actually can't just run myself to the ground trying to 544 00:28:36,436 --> 00:28:41,236 Speaker 3: perform myself in public life because I physically literally can't. 545 00:28:41,836 --> 00:28:43,556 Speaker 3: It's going to hurt me in the long run, and 546 00:28:43,676 --> 00:28:47,396 Speaker 3: like it's making me miserable. Yeah, and again I think, right, 547 00:28:47,516 --> 00:28:50,436 Speaker 3: not everyone has had a stroke but I And but 548 00:28:50,476 --> 00:28:54,196 Speaker 3: the experience of realizing you're not invincible, whether through aging 549 00:28:54,436 --> 00:28:57,636 Speaker 3: or any confrontation with loss. Like, I think that's pretty relatable. 550 00:28:57,876 --> 00:28:59,356 Speaker 3: It was just a little more extreme for me. 551 00:28:59,716 --> 00:29:01,596 Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's one thing to have to come to 552 00:29:01,676 --> 00:29:06,436 Speaker 1: Jesus moment, but it's another thing to actually practice changing 553 00:29:06,756 --> 00:29:11,076 Speaker 1: these fundamental principles and these north stars that you've lived 554 00:29:11,076 --> 00:29:13,276 Speaker 1: your whole life kind of shooting towards. Right. You said 555 00:29:13,276 --> 00:29:17,436 Speaker 1: you grew up in a high intensity, high achievement oriented household. 556 00:29:18,556 --> 00:29:20,836 Speaker 1: Tell me about so when you were asking yourself these 557 00:29:20,956 --> 00:29:24,236 Speaker 1: really thought provoking questions like why do I need to 558 00:29:24,276 --> 00:29:26,316 Speaker 1: perform at this level in order to feel valuable in 559 00:29:26,356 --> 00:29:28,876 Speaker 1: this world? What were the answers that your brain was 560 00:29:28,916 --> 00:29:33,356 Speaker 1: serving up? And then how did you actually force yourself 561 00:29:33,396 --> 00:29:35,556 Speaker 1: to slow down and not be so bothered by it? 562 00:29:38,276 --> 00:29:41,556 Speaker 3: I did know, deep down like some of the reasons 563 00:29:41,596 --> 00:29:44,996 Speaker 3: that I perform like that. I know that just based 564 00:29:45,036 --> 00:29:47,276 Speaker 3: on my personality and upbringing, Like I did want that 565 00:29:47,396 --> 00:29:49,796 Speaker 3: external validation like so many of us. 566 00:29:50,156 --> 00:29:51,516 Speaker 2: I did thrive on that. 567 00:29:52,636 --> 00:29:53,036 Speaker 1: And. 568 00:29:54,436 --> 00:30:01,676 Speaker 3: I I liked being able to have some sort of 569 00:30:01,716 --> 00:30:05,076 Speaker 3: platform for like the work I do and care about, 570 00:30:05,156 --> 00:30:07,396 Speaker 3: and be able to have my voice out there. For sure, 571 00:30:09,116 --> 00:30:11,556 Speaker 3: maybe I always kind of lived under this pressure or 572 00:30:11,596 --> 00:30:15,596 Speaker 3: fear of I don't know, disappointing. I think just like 573 00:30:15,716 --> 00:30:17,516 Speaker 3: the only reason I wore a dress was because when 574 00:30:17,516 --> 00:30:19,596 Speaker 3: I was introduced to your podcast, I was introduced as 575 00:30:19,636 --> 00:30:21,956 Speaker 3: a well dressed journalist, and I didn't want to let 576 00:30:21,956 --> 00:30:22,396 Speaker 3: you down. 577 00:30:22,636 --> 00:30:25,516 Speaker 2: So I wanted to make sure that I'm showing up here. 578 00:30:26,036 --> 00:30:29,916 Speaker 1: So thankfully I've never been called a well dressed host. Yeah, 579 00:30:29,996 --> 00:30:32,476 Speaker 1: I was going to do orys that I was allowed. 580 00:30:32,236 --> 00:30:36,076 Speaker 3: To, but I Rachel who we did this for each 581 00:30:36,116 --> 00:30:40,676 Speaker 3: other over two halves of the same person for yeah, yeah, 582 00:30:40,716 --> 00:30:44,196 Speaker 3: So I think I was partially like doing a lot 583 00:30:44,236 --> 00:30:46,436 Speaker 3: for like the outer gaze or for like there was 584 00:30:46,476 --> 00:30:48,156 Speaker 3: a person inside. There was an idea of who I 585 00:30:48,156 --> 00:30:51,156 Speaker 3: should be in the world, right, And some of that 586 00:30:51,156 --> 00:30:53,716 Speaker 3: comes to internally, some comes from external factors. 587 00:30:55,076 --> 00:30:55,436 Speaker 2: I think. 588 00:30:55,556 --> 00:30:57,436 Speaker 3: Yeah, being like an author and a public speaker kind 589 00:30:57,436 --> 00:30:59,196 Speaker 3: of puts you in the public spotlight in a way 590 00:30:59,196 --> 00:31:01,636 Speaker 3: that's weird and kind of warps your sense of self. 591 00:31:02,556 --> 00:31:04,996 Speaker 3: And I did have to get back to like why 592 00:31:05,036 --> 00:31:06,556 Speaker 3: do I love writing these stories? 593 00:31:06,596 --> 00:31:08,036 Speaker 2: What's meaningful about it for me? 594 00:31:08,596 --> 00:31:11,036 Speaker 3: And I know one thing I kept going back to 595 00:31:11,236 --> 00:31:14,956 Speaker 3: was like authenticity, which I know is super overused. I 596 00:31:15,036 --> 00:31:17,276 Speaker 3: used to be like really allergic to like aphorism and 597 00:31:17,316 --> 00:31:19,796 Speaker 3: cliche and now I like draw a tarot card every 598 00:31:19,876 --> 00:31:24,516 Speaker 3: day and do my yoga and I'm like authenticity and gratitude. 599 00:31:24,996 --> 00:31:26,836 Speaker 2: But it is true that like. 600 00:31:26,956 --> 00:31:29,436 Speaker 3: A lot of a lot of people can be very 601 00:31:29,436 --> 00:31:34,196 Speaker 3: smart and synthesize things and still information. AI can do that, actually, 602 00:31:34,636 --> 00:31:38,316 Speaker 3: but like when it comes to really both speaking your truth, 603 00:31:38,356 --> 00:31:40,356 Speaker 3: and I would like to think that when I tell 604 00:31:40,396 --> 00:31:44,236 Speaker 3: like patient stories in my work, like getting to the 605 00:31:44,356 --> 00:31:47,116 Speaker 3: marrow of something and like a true lived experience or 606 00:31:47,156 --> 00:31:50,076 Speaker 3: doing the best I can, like that takes a different 607 00:31:50,356 --> 00:31:53,156 Speaker 3: skill set. That's something I really value on that I know, 608 00:31:53,356 --> 00:31:57,236 Speaker 3: like speaks to people and to whatever extent I can do. 609 00:31:57,116 --> 00:31:59,996 Speaker 2: That, Like I really really value that. 610 00:31:59,996 --> 00:32:03,676 Speaker 3: Emotional connection, and so like the technical stuff, some of 611 00:32:03,716 --> 00:32:04,756 Speaker 3: it is harder for me now. 612 00:32:05,916 --> 00:32:06,916 Speaker 2: It was really interesting. 613 00:32:07,396 --> 00:32:11,756 Speaker 3: Everyone's very I'm very obsessed with Alyssa lu the ice 614 00:32:11,796 --> 00:32:14,596 Speaker 3: Ginter right, and I feel like part of the attraction. 615 00:32:14,836 --> 00:32:16,476 Speaker 3: There's a lot of things that are really cool about her, 616 00:32:16,716 --> 00:32:18,996 Speaker 3: but her fluidity and how at home she is in 617 00:32:19,076 --> 00:32:21,796 Speaker 3: her body and how she's just like she's like performing 618 00:32:22,036 --> 00:32:26,756 Speaker 3: joy and ease and fluidity and and like, in some sense, 619 00:32:26,796 --> 00:32:28,796 Speaker 3: I still strive for that, like that's what I feel 620 00:32:28,876 --> 00:32:31,316 Speaker 3: is missing in a lot of the way I move 621 00:32:31,356 --> 00:32:35,316 Speaker 3: through the world now. But also I'm trying to come 622 00:32:35,356 --> 00:32:37,716 Speaker 3: to peace with like maybe I'm not as fluid in 623 00:32:37,756 --> 00:32:40,556 Speaker 3: this world and maybe like I'm a little more jerky 624 00:32:40,596 --> 00:32:43,836 Speaker 3: and not as like great to watch on the ice, definitely, 625 00:32:45,116 --> 00:32:48,836 Speaker 3: but like that it's okay to show up that way, 626 00:32:48,876 --> 00:32:52,076 Speaker 3: and you're gonna draw different things out of people, and 627 00:32:52,116 --> 00:32:54,756 Speaker 3: you're gonna appreciate the moments when you feel that like 628 00:32:55,356 --> 00:32:58,956 Speaker 3: flow and being at one. You're gonna appreciate those moments 629 00:32:58,996 --> 00:33:01,556 Speaker 3: a lot more because they're rare and you're aware of 630 00:33:01,556 --> 00:33:03,876 Speaker 3: them now. And I think that's like maybe the biggest 631 00:33:03,916 --> 00:33:08,316 Speaker 3: gift this is given to me is that heightened awareness 632 00:33:08,796 --> 00:33:12,076 Speaker 3: of when things are flowing and when I feel like 633 00:33:12,316 --> 00:33:15,436 Speaker 3: connected or like at one with an audience, in a 634 00:33:15,516 --> 00:33:18,596 Speaker 3: room with a person. And I thought a lot about 635 00:33:18,676 --> 00:33:21,436 Speaker 3: embodied cognition, the fact that we do like move through 636 00:33:21,436 --> 00:33:23,956 Speaker 3: the world in a body, and I used to kind 637 00:33:23,956 --> 00:33:27,996 Speaker 3: of dismiss these very physical activities that I do, like 638 00:33:28,636 --> 00:33:33,796 Speaker 3: now yoga and running and singing, and now I think 639 00:33:33,796 --> 00:33:36,596 Speaker 3: there's something very special about those moments where like body 640 00:33:36,596 --> 00:33:40,036 Speaker 3: and mind come together and when you're like emotionally, physically 641 00:33:40,276 --> 00:33:46,996 Speaker 3: and intellectually present, everything is kind of flowing or connected, 642 00:33:48,196 --> 00:33:51,236 Speaker 3: and it's kind of there's like a for singers, there's 643 00:33:51,236 --> 00:33:53,676 Speaker 3: like a space between your chest and your head voice. 644 00:33:53,676 --> 00:33:56,676 Speaker 3: There's like a transition that's extra awkward and you're likely 645 00:33:56,716 --> 00:33:59,076 Speaker 3: to like break your voice during that part, and it's 646 00:33:59,156 --> 00:34:01,236 Speaker 3: kind of like the transition between updog and down dog 647 00:34:01,276 --> 00:34:04,556 Speaker 3: and yoga. So there's these like times where it's like 648 00:34:04,716 --> 00:34:07,036 Speaker 3: it demands a lot of you when it's very uncomfortable. 649 00:34:07,396 --> 00:34:09,636 Speaker 3: But I think that if you can and like the 650 00:34:09,716 --> 00:34:12,996 Speaker 3: gift is that you were fully present and alive in 651 00:34:13,076 --> 00:34:15,796 Speaker 3: that moment and you're kind of in the world in 652 00:34:15,836 --> 00:34:19,516 Speaker 3: a different way and experiencing it with a heightened awareness. 653 00:34:20,156 --> 00:34:22,596 Speaker 3: And I think maybe that's also something that I feared 654 00:34:22,676 --> 00:34:26,356 Speaker 3: losing with the stroke, was that presence and being aware 655 00:34:26,396 --> 00:34:27,556 Speaker 3: and alive in the world. 656 00:34:28,356 --> 00:34:28,956 Speaker 2: And so now I. 657 00:34:28,876 --> 00:34:33,476 Speaker 3: Really really treasure those moments and those experiences, and I 658 00:34:33,476 --> 00:34:36,836 Speaker 3: guess I appreciate my body more and I think of 659 00:34:36,876 --> 00:34:38,596 Speaker 3: that as a type of intelligence, I guess, is what 660 00:34:38,596 --> 00:34:39,396 Speaker 3: I'm trying to say. 661 00:34:39,756 --> 00:34:42,196 Speaker 2: So I have a greater appreciation for that. 662 00:34:42,716 --> 00:34:47,556 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's beautiful. Thank you so much, Rachel forting for long. 663 00:34:47,836 --> 00:34:50,156 Speaker 1: I know, I feel like we only just scratch the surface. 664 00:34:50,316 --> 00:34:53,596 Speaker 1: Thank you all for joining us, and thanks. 665 00:34:53,236 --> 00:34:56,156 Speaker 2: For time to be here. Appreciate it. Thank you. 666 00:34:57,876 --> 00:35:27,716 Speaker 1: Hard Hey, thanks so much for listening. If you enjoyed 667 00:35:27,756 --> 00:35:30,076 Speaker 1: this episode, we hope you'll send it to someone who 668 00:35:30,116 --> 00:35:33,116 Speaker 1: might resonate with Rachel's story, and if it moved you, 669 00:35:33,436 --> 00:35:36,436 Speaker 1: be sure to leave a comment or review wherever you're listening. 670 00:35:36,836 --> 00:35:40,076 Speaker 1: We love hearing from you, and any engagement with the 671 00:35:40,116 --> 00:35:43,436 Speaker 1: show helps other people discover it. We'll be back in 672 00:35:43,436 --> 00:35:46,476 Speaker 1: a week with another episode of A Slight Change of Plans. 673 00:35:46,836 --> 00:36:00,236 Speaker 1: I'll see you then. A Slight Change of Plans is created, written, 674 00:36:00,356 --> 00:36:04,076 Speaker 1: and executive produced by me Maya Schunker. The Slight Change 675 00:36:04,116 --> 00:36:08,956 Speaker 1: family includes our showrunner Alexandra Garratin, our editor Daphne Chen, 676 00:36:09,516 --> 00:36:14,156 Speaker 1: our lead producer Megan Lubin, our associate producer Sonia Gerwitz, 677 00:36:14,516 --> 00:36:18,836 Speaker 1: and our sound engineer Erica Huang. Luis Scara wrote our 678 00:36:18,836 --> 00:36:22,236 Speaker 1: delightful theme song, and Ginger Smith helped arrange the vocals. 679 00:36:23,076 --> 00:36:26,316 Speaker 1: A Slight Change of Plans is a production of Pushkin Industries, 680 00:36:26,636 --> 00:36:30,236 Speaker 1: So big thanks to everyone there, and of course a 681 00:36:30,476 --> 00:36:54,996 Speaker 1: very special thanks to Jimmy Lee. And I have yet 682 00:36:54,996 --> 00:36:57,596 Speaker 1: another Magic School Bus episode with my husband where I 683 00:36:57,636 --> 00:37:00,116 Speaker 1: once had to get this horrible procedure called the laryn 684 00:37:00,156 --> 00:37:03,116 Speaker 1: goscabee where they put tubes up your nose in order 685 00:37:03,156 --> 00:37:04,956 Speaker 1: to put cameras down your throat in order to look 686 00:37:04,956 --> 00:37:08,516 Speaker 1: at your vocal cords. So I was diagnosed with a 687 00:37:08,556 --> 00:37:10,836 Speaker 1: problem called I get so excited when I talk, I 688 00:37:10,876 --> 00:37:13,276 Speaker 1: forget to breathe syndrome, and so I had to do 689 00:37:13,316 --> 00:37:15,716 Speaker 1: speech therapy for multiple months and I had to get 690 00:37:15,716 --> 00:37:17,316 Speaker 1: the larrogospy because they were like, we don't know why 691 00:37:17,316 --> 00:37:18,956 Speaker 1: your vocal cords are screwed up. And I'm like, I'll 692 00:37:18,996 --> 00:37:22,836 Speaker 1: change my personality. I promise, And so I still remember 693 00:37:22,876 --> 00:37:24,596 Speaker 1: my husband was in the exam room and as we're 694 00:37:24,636 --> 00:37:27,356 Speaker 1: doing this horribly painful thing, he treated it like the 695 00:37:27,396 --> 00:37:30,316 Speaker 1: Magic School Bus. He's like, whoa, there we go. Now 696 00:37:30,356 --> 00:37:33,116 Speaker 1: we're going down into like there's her tongue, We're going 697 00:37:33,116 --> 00:37:34,716 Speaker 1: to her throat. It's like, Jimmy, stop it