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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly conversation

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Speaker 1: about mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions

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Speaker 1: we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves.

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Speaker 1: I'm your host, Doctor Joy Harden Bradford, a licensed psychologist

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Speaker 1: in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or to find a

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Speaker 1: therapist in your area, visit our website at Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you love listening to

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Speaker 1: and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to

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Speaker 1: be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental

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Speaker 1: health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me

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Speaker 1: for session three forty two of the for Black Girls Podcast.

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Speaker 1: We'll get right into our conversation after a word from

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Speaker 1: our sponsors. Welcome back for another episode of our January

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Speaker 1: Jumpstart mini series. All month long, we're having conversations with

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Speaker 1: talented black women leaders across creative and professional mediums to

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Speaker 1: assist you in putting the p in prioritizing your personal growth.

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Speaker 1: If you've been holding back on doing you, this is

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Speaker 1: your sign to jump headfirst into the possibilities of a

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Speaker 1: new year. I don't think it would be too far

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Speaker 1: fetched to say that human beings were never meant to

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Speaker 1: see so many people's opinions on a daily basis, and

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Speaker 1: yet social media makes this a reality. With us entering

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Speaker 1: a new year, I think it's a perfect time to

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Speaker 1: begin to reevaluate our relationship with social media. Joining me

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Speaker 1: to share more about the relationship between mental health and

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Speaker 1: social media is Board certified psychiatrist Doctor Judith Joseph. Doctor

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Speaker 1: Joseph is an expert on various media platforms and has

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Speaker 1: made national television appearances on Good Morning America, The Today Show,

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Speaker 1: CBS News, and War. She recently received a US Congress

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Speaker 1: Proclamation Award from the US House of Representatives for her

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Speaker 1: social media advocacy and research in mental health. In our

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Speaker 1: conversation today, doctor Joseph and I discuss how to determine

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Speaker 1: what a healthy use of social media looks like, some

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Speaker 1: small strategies to unplug without quitting social media, colde Turkey,

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Speaker 1: and ways to avoid comparing yourself to the people on

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Speaker 1: your feed. If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation,

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Speaker 1: please share it with us on social media using the

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Speaker 1: hashtag TVG in Session or join us over in the

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Speaker 1: Sister Circle to talk more about the episode. You can

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Speaker 1: join us at community dot therapy for Blackgirls dot com.

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Speaker 1: Here's our conversation. Thank you so much for joining me today,

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Speaker 1: doctor Joseph.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for having me today.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an honor to chat with you. So I'd

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Speaker 1: love for you to take us down a trip down

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Speaker 1: memory lane to tell us about your earliest experience actually

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Speaker 1: using social media for yourself.

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Speaker 3: For me, it was really using my Space Facebook. Those

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Speaker 3: were the early precursors to social media, and I just

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Speaker 3: remember in college people talking about it and saying that

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Speaker 3: it was a great way to basically keep up with

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Speaker 3: your friends and see what they were doing, and also

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Speaker 3: a way to feel as if you're part of the

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Speaker 3: gossip because people were doing hot or notts and things

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Speaker 3: like that, so you didn't want to be left out.

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Speaker 3: So those are my earlier experiences with FOMO.

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Speaker 1: And how would you you've seen that the social media

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Speaker 1: landscape change throughout your career.

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Speaker 3: It's interesting because I treat children, adults and adolescents, and

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Speaker 3: early in my training, we really didn't know much about

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Speaker 3: social media and how it impacted children because it was

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Speaker 3: so new and right now I'm seeing that the generations

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Speaker 3: that were born into a world where there was always

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Speaker 3: social media, there was always internet access, there was always

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Speaker 3: tech that was transportable. You could have tech wherever you wanted.

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Speaker 3: I'm seeing that the data is finally catching up and

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Speaker 3: we're seeing some harmful patterns with overuse. And just like

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Speaker 3: anything in life, if you use things without knowing the dangers,

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Speaker 3: then you don't know how to protect yourself. You don't

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Speaker 3: know how to not be as vulnerable. So I think

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Speaker 3: we're seeing a lot, especially in my practice, of how

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Speaker 3: social media is impacting human development and your well being.

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Speaker 1: Can you say a little bit more about some of

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Speaker 1: the connections that you're seeing between mental health and social

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Speaker 1: media use.

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Speaker 3: It Definitely people who use social media to basically communicate

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Speaker 3: and to replace one on one in person interactions are

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Speaker 3: finding that it's difficult to feel satisfied with these interactions.

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Speaker 3: They have this metric, this constant way of holding their

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Speaker 3: celves up to someone else. They're constantly comparing themselves to others.

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Speaker 3: There's no break. They're bombarded with images and it becomes

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Speaker 3: kind of like a new reality for them. So being

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Speaker 3: in the real world, being one on one with someone,

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Speaker 3: that doesn't become reality for a person if the majority

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Speaker 3: of their interactions are online that becomes their new reality.

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Speaker 3: And I'm seeing this across all developmental phases. As I mentioned,

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Speaker 3: I treat children, adolescents and adults, and children who are

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Speaker 3: using social media or social digital means to interact with

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Speaker 3: the world. Their brains are just not made for that.

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Speaker 3: We were not designed to interact with the world in

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Speaker 3: a two dimensional screen. We were designed to be a

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Speaker 3: part of the world. And what I'm seeing is delayed learning,

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Speaker 3: shorter attention spans, irritability, and poor social reciprocity with the

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Speaker 3: younger individuals who have had exposure to digital devices and

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Speaker 3: social media early in life, because it replaces and it

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Speaker 3: has replaced the one on one rich interactions that we

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Speaker 3: as human beings were made to have throughout development. So

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Speaker 3: I'm seeing that in earlier ages, in adolescent ages, I

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Speaker 3: see a lot of anxiety and depression, and looking at

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Speaker 3: the CDC's data, it's very evident that with exposure to

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Speaker 3: prolonged social media use over time, people have more anxiety,

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Speaker 3: they have more depression, they don't feel as if they're

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Speaker 3: good enough, their self esteem issues, and some said show

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Speaker 3: a correlation with eating.

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Speaker 2: Disorders as well. With adults.

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Speaker 3: We're fortunate that the majority of us have had our

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Speaker 3: early development not impacted by social media. We had the

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Speaker 3: typical experiences. We were out playing outside, we had interactions

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Speaker 3: where we had to be one on one with someone.

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Speaker 3: If we said something mean to someone, we saw their

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Speaker 3: phase reacting and we're like, oops, I shouldn't have said that.

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Speaker 3: You know. We didn't have that siloed experience where we

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Speaker 3: could send a mean text or mean comment and not

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Speaker 3: see the person's reaction. So we've developed that social reciprocity.

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Speaker 3: But even adults who have had quote unquote traditional childhoods

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Speaker 3: are still impacted by prolonged social media use. In some studies,

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Speaker 3: it shows that if you use social media for hours

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Speaker 3: a day, if you don't limit it to less than

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Speaker 3: thirty minutes a day, you're more likely to have depression

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Speaker 3: and anxiety compared to people who limit it or who

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Speaker 3: don't have access to it. So even as adults who've

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Speaker 3: had rich traditional typical childhood developmental experiences without for long

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Speaker 3: social media or digital use, even we are impacted. So

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Speaker 3: imagine a brain that is developing, that is learning how

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Speaker 3: to be in the world, learning how to interact in

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Speaker 3: the world. Imagine that brain being exposed to prolonged digital

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Speaker 3: technology and social media. We really don't even know what

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Speaker 3: the really long term effects are, but we know short

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Speaker 3: term studies are showing that there is a delay in

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Speaker 3: social reciprocity and increase in depression and anxiety. So this

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Speaker 3: is a cause for concern.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so glad did just sharing this with us

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Speaker 1: actual Jose, because it does feel like we're just now

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Speaker 1: getting some research, especially with young people in social media.

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Speaker 1: But I'm curious, so even with kids still kind of

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Speaker 1: spending the whole day at school, right, so even the

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Speaker 1: school day that is about six to eight hours where

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Speaker 1: they may be using some technology but probably not a

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Speaker 1: lot of social media, we are still not seeing that

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Speaker 1: be enough to counteract the impact of being on social

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Speaker 1: media for a couple of hours a day.

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Speaker 3: It's not And a lot of schools are adopting a

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Speaker 3: technology driven platform for their education. And I know that

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Speaker 3: in schools in Manhattan, a lot of the schools have laptops.

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Speaker 3: Even children as young as kindergarten age are hiking up

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Speaker 3: the stairs with these laptops, right, So they're not really

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Speaker 3: getting a respite, they're not really getting that full non

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Speaker 3: screen exposure even at school. And think about that. That's

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Speaker 3: where they get a lot of their learning, that's where

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Speaker 3: they're supposed to connect to others.

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Speaker 2: But many of them.

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Speaker 3: Are spending time on screens at school, after school, and

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Speaker 3: then for their relaxation when they're done with their homework.

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Speaker 3: So these are brains that are constantly online. And I

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Speaker 3: know it sounds like alarming and it's a cause for anxiety.

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Speaker 3: And we are not going to escape technology, but there

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Speaker 3: are ways to balance that so that you're not entirely online.

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Speaker 1: So I'm curious to hear your thoughts, doctor Joseph about

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Speaker 1: kids being bored without social media. So we see those

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Speaker 1: conversations online all the time, and this idea that like

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Speaker 1: children don't enjoy like being outside and like playing with

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Speaker 1: their cousins, like you know, one of our producers is

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Speaker 1: talking about e and over the holiday break she observed

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Speaker 1: this with people in her own family. What are your

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Speaker 1: thoughts about that?

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Speaker 3: You know what, boredom is a natural and typical part

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Speaker 3: of childhood development. If you look at really young children,

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Speaker 3: even younger than two, if you put them on the

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Speaker 3: floor and you put an empty box there and a spoon,

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Speaker 3: they're going to crawl to it. They're gonna want to

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Speaker 3: be curious. That's built into our DNA as human beings,

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Speaker 3: to be curious, to be imaginative, to use what we

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Speaker 3: have at the tip of our fingers literally and figuratively,

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Speaker 3: to entertain ourselves. Because children's brains are so malleable, we're

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Speaker 3: learning how to interact with the world. We're learning how

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Speaker 3: to explore our senses. That's why children put things into

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Speaker 3: their mouths. If you ever saw a small child licking

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Speaker 3: on their fingers and then tasting everything in the room,

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Speaker 3: it's because they're built to explore and to be curious.

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Speaker 3: So when a child says they're bored, that really means

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Speaker 3: that they haven't tapped into that imagination. They haven't tapped

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Speaker 3: into the creativity. So that's an opportunity for us to

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Speaker 3: encourage that, to allow them to play, to draw, to color,

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Speaker 3: to build, and that's where they really learn because they're

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Speaker 3: learning problem solving, you know, the problem being on board

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Speaker 3: what I do about it. They're learning that they have

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Speaker 3: that mastery, that agency, and that they can entertain themselves,

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Speaker 3: that they can create play And if you put any

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Speaker 3: child in a room with another child without technology.

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Speaker 2: They'll figure out a way to play.

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Speaker 3: I know because I have cameras everywhere in my clinic

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Speaker 3: because I treat children and sometimes I want to see

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Speaker 3: what they're doing. Sometimes I observe them when they're in

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Speaker 3: the waiting area to see, oh, okay, that child has

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Speaker 3: their attention improved or their adeges is getting better. The

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Speaker 3: anxieties are based on what I'm seeing. And if you

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Speaker 3: see children in the waiting area, even if they don't

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Speaker 3: know each other, there's there are no video games there,

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Speaker 3: so they will figure out a way to play with

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Speaker 3: each other. I've seen the most creative things, like kids

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Speaker 3: playing as if the waiting room table and chairs are

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Speaker 3: like a tent or a fort. They're just built to

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Speaker 3: do that by design. But children are not built to

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Speaker 3: be on screens all day. So boredom is an opportunity

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Speaker 3: for creativity. It's an opportunity for imagination. And I find

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Speaker 3: that a lot of the parents that I work with

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Speaker 3: they want to solve this issue of boredom. They see

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Speaker 3: it as a problem. They see it as being a

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Speaker 3: bad parent, like, oh my child is bored that means

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Speaker 3: that I'm not providing enough. But sometimes as parents, the

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Speaker 3: best thing we can do is just to sit on

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Speaker 3: our hands. Literally, one of my colleagues Jactor Harstin says,

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Speaker 3: put your hands under your thighs and literally just wait.

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Speaker 3: Don't try to fix it. They will figure it out,

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Speaker 3: because sometimes children need to figure it out. That's how

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Speaker 3: they learn, that's how they grow.

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Speaker 1: So what are your recommendations for parents and other adults

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Speaker 1: in your practice around how they do then limit or

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Speaker 1: take all away any screen time for the young people

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Speaker 1: in their lives.

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Speaker 3: I think that it depends on the individuals, and I

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Speaker 3: use this acronym across the board for individuals, so I

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Speaker 3: call it reset. The R is realization is this issue

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Speaker 3: causing a problem for you? Because not everyone sees this

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Speaker 3: as a problem. Some people think, listen, this is a

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Speaker 3: part of my job. I have to be online. I

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Speaker 3: can't get around this. But for others it's a problem.

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Speaker 3: And some people will say my partner says that I'm

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Speaker 3: always on my device, or my child always says that

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Speaker 3: I don't have time to play, or they realize that

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Speaker 3: they're not feeling fulfilled. They feel anxious and depressed if

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Speaker 3: they're distracted by tech. So realize, if this is an

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Speaker 3: issue for you, you may not be able to identify

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Speaker 3: it on your own. There are online tests that you

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Speaker 3: can use to see if you have a social media

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Speaker 3: habit that is unhealthy and that may be able to

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Speaker 3: give you that feedback. And the second the E and

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Speaker 3: RESET is educate. Learn about the resources out there. There

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Speaker 3: are studies the American Psychiatric Association, the American Psychological Association,

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Speaker 3: American Pediatric Association. They give you guideline. There are recent

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Speaker 3: CDC studies that tell you about what the impact of

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Speaker 3: social media is on the child and adult brain and

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Speaker 3: your mood and your behavior, So learn about it. They're

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Speaker 3: excellent podcasts out there and communities that are devoted to

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Speaker 3: educating people about this. So really educate yourself. And then

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Speaker 3: the US is a solution or a strategy. So you

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Speaker 3: want to figure out what is workable for you, right,

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Speaker 3: like what is feasible because many of us, if you're

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Speaker 3: in marketing like a lot of my clients, or if

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Speaker 3: you are in media, a lot of times you can't

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Speaker 3: just tune it out completely, so you're going to have

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Speaker 3: a different benchmark compared to someone else. You're going to

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Speaker 3: have another measure, and so figure out what it is

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Speaker 3: for you. With the families that I work with, sometimes

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Speaker 3: it's like okay after seven pm, no devices, or they'll

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Speaker 3: turn the internet off in their home. And for some others,

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Speaker 3: students that I work with, it's okay, I'm going to

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Speaker 3: allot this time to that time to not be on

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Speaker 3: a device, and I'm going to be doing something else pleasurable,

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Speaker 3: like exercising, reading, seeing friends one on one.

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Speaker 2: You have to come up with a strategy for yourself.

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Speaker 3: For others, it's you know, new parents who are expecting

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Speaker 3: their first child. They come up with a plan together

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Speaker 3: that Okay, we're both going to stay on task with this.

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Speaker 3: We're not going to let the child be on a

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Speaker 3: screen earlier than age two. We're going to follow these guidelines.

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Speaker 3: You have to come up with the strategy that works

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Speaker 3: for you, and then you know the E and reset

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Speaker 3: is what is your expectation? What are you hoping? So

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Speaker 3: like the second E, what are you hoping to gain

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Speaker 3: from this? Are you hoping to feel better? Are you

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Speaker 3: hoping to have less anxiety, less depression, better sleep because

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Speaker 3: social media use and digital use is associated with poor sleep.

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Speaker 3: Are you hoping to have more meaningful relationships morituc relationships

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Speaker 3: and communication? So what are your expectations? Because you need

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Speaker 3: a way to figure out if you're making progress in

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Speaker 3: the direction that you want to go into. And then

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Speaker 3: the T is the thoughtfulness reflect on it. How is

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Speaker 3: this making you feel? I don't think we spend enough

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Speaker 3: time thinking about how we feel. A part of that

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Speaker 3: is technology. You know, we depend on mes and feedback

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Speaker 3: online to tell us how to feel, but we lose

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Speaker 3: sense of who we are, We lose a sense of

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Speaker 3: our own inner barometer for how we feel. So just

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Speaker 3: reflect on the process. So really be thoughtful. Did it work?

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Speaker 3: Did it not work? Do you need a bit of tweaking?

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Speaker 3: Is there trial and error that needs to be done?

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Speaker 3: And the thoughtfulness part also plays a role when you're

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Speaker 3: thinking about what are you going to do with this

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Speaker 3: extra time? Are you going to use this time as

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Speaker 3: a family to say, listen, we now have this pocket

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Speaker 3: of time to use, let's spend time together, let's all

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Speaker 3: vote on it. Or as an individual, what am I

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Speaker 3: going to do with this time to make it meaningful,

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Speaker 3: to make it so that I'm not replacing this unhealthy

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Speaker 3: habit with another unhealthy habit. Right, that's the thoughtfulness part.

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Speaker 3: So the R and the tea at the end of

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Speaker 3: reset are very very introspective, reflective insightful type of practices

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Speaker 3: because I feel like we do have to spend time

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Speaker 3: with ourselves, with our thoughts, practicing, you know, sitting still

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Speaker 3: in how this process makes us feel. Because when we

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Speaker 3: are in tune with how we feel, we make better

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Speaker 3: decisions for ourselves.

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Speaker 1: I love that. Thank you so much, doctor Joseph. So

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Speaker 1: that is your own framework that you've come up with,

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Speaker 1: the reset framework.

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Speaker 2: It is.

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Speaker 3: It is based on evidence based medicine and literature and

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Speaker 3: so forth. And I mean, I give a lot of

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Speaker 3: talks to organizations and zoom fatigue comes up a lot,

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Speaker 3: and people don't know that there's an entire center at

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Speaker 3: Stanford dedicated to zoom fatigue. I'll encourage people to go

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Speaker 3: on that website and do the zoom fatigue tests, and

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Speaker 3: people are like, oh my gosh, I have zoom fatigue.

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Speaker 2: This is real. It's not just me.

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Speaker 3: It's not just me feeling a natural looking at someone's

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Speaker 3: eyes the entire time. We're not meant to look at

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Speaker 3: people's eyes all the time. But if you don't do it,

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Speaker 3: then you appear to be not interested.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 3: We're not supposed to be planted on a desk looking

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Speaker 3: at a computer at the entire time. We're supposed to be

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Speaker 3: up and walking, right, but being online takes that away

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Speaker 3: from us. We weren't built to respond to emails when

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Speaker 3: they come in right away. Years ago, if the mail

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Speaker 3: came in, there was always gonna be more male. So

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Speaker 3: you can't rush and open them all because there's always

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Speaker 3: gonna be more male. But there's something about seeing those

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Speaker 3: unopen boxes that drives us crazy. Right, so we have

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Speaker 3: to acknowledge us why I say at the beginning and

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Speaker 3: the end of rest are really reflective, because we just

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Speaker 3: get so accustomed to the rat race that it becomes

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Speaker 3: the norm, and we are gaslining ourselves into believing that

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Speaker 3: this is normal, and that's something's wrong with us when

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Speaker 3: we're exhausted and burnt out. No, this is not how

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Speaker 3: our brains were made. We were meant to be out gathering, hunting, collecting,

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Speaker 3: interacting with each other, singing songs. We're not doing that anymore,

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Speaker 3: and these screens are replacing it. But we can't discount

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Speaker 3: the fact that these screens have also improved our lives.

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Speaker 3: We just have to figure out how to make it

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Speaker 3: work for us using evidence based information.

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Speaker 1: You know, doctor Joseph, as you're talking I am thinking

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Speaker 1: about how many more concerns and difficulties have been introduced

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Speaker 1: into our jobs as mental health professionals and to all

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Speaker 1: of our lives just by the advert of technology. Right,

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Speaker 1: Just this idea that zoom fatigue fifteen years ago, like

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Speaker 1: that center wouldn't have existed, right. So it definitely feels

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Speaker 1: like to your point, there have been so many advantages

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Speaker 1: and so many great things that have come with technology,

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Speaker 1: but there's also the other side of it, right, that

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Speaker 1: it has caused all of these difficulties. And even the

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Speaker 1: way we talk about social media like needing a detox

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Speaker 1: and all of these things. Can you talk about some

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Speaker 1: of the addictive properties that exist within social media, like

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Speaker 1: is it something that somebody can actually become addicted to?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely?

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Speaker 3: There are many centers that research social media addiction. There's

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Speaker 3: a social media Addiction scale I believe it was developed

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Speaker 3: by I think Bergen, and then there's Internet Addiction Scale

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Speaker 3: by Young And there are centers that study this that

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Speaker 3: have created cognitive behavioral therapy for this type of addiction

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Speaker 3: because it is real behaviors are capable of having tolerance

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Speaker 3: and dependence. People have withdrawal just like they would with

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Speaker 3: the substance when they don't have access to the behavior

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Speaker 3: that they've become addicted to. And so the things that

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Speaker 3: make social media very addictive is the fact that we

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Speaker 3: have access to it. When you look at any substance treatment,

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Speaker 3: you'll see that access is the first step. If someone

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Speaker 3: who uses has access, then that's a problem. And guess what,

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Speaker 3: we have access all the time. I just told you

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Speaker 3: I had to silence three devices. I have access to

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Speaker 3: three devices. I remember when I had the Nokia and

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Speaker 3: the flip phone. It wasn't as seamless. And that's the

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Speaker 3: other issue. The experience is so seamless. We praise these

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Speaker 3: devices that just get us right. We don't want something

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Speaker 3: that's clunky. But the problem is that when you have access,

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Speaker 3: it's seamless, it's easy to get your high, so to speak.

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Speaker 3: Then it's habit forming. And then with most of the

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Speaker 3: substances that I see, at least in my practice, there

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Speaker 3: tends to be something missing. There tends to be something

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Speaker 3: in the person that has to find comfort in overuse

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Speaker 3: of anything. Right. So it could be trauma that's unresolved.

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Speaker 3: It could be a lack of meat full connections. It

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Speaker 3: could be a replacement for feeling lonely, so there tends

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Speaker 3: to be something else. And so I find that people

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Speaker 3: who have a harder time with finding balance in their use.

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Speaker 3: And so we want to understand that a bit more

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Speaker 3: because I want to tailor my treatment to the individual

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Speaker 3: and not just say, well it's because everyone's like this,

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Speaker 3: or everyone has a childhood trauma or everyone. We want

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Speaker 3: to understand what's happening with each person. And that's why

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Speaker 3: the beginning and end of RESET are reflective, because I

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Speaker 3: want you to really understand what's happening in you and

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Speaker 3: why that there's this need to soothe in a healthy way.

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Speaker 1: And I wonder if you can dig a little more

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Speaker 1: into that for us, doctor Joseph, Like, what kinds of

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Speaker 1: questions would somebody ask for them to be able to

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Speaker 1: uncover whether there is some concern around their social media usage?

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Speaker 1: Because you said sometimes other people will see it, right,

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Speaker 1: like your kids will say like, Mama, never see your face,

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Speaker 1: you always on your phone or whatever. But what are

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Speaker 1: some questions we can ask ourselves to examine our relationship.

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Speaker 3: Well, I say that understanding how you feel is sometimes

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Speaker 3: the most challenging part. And so when I ask my patients,

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Speaker 3: what do you feel when you're using it, They're like, well,

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Speaker 3: I don't know, I'm bored. Okay, Well let's go a

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Speaker 3: step before that. What were you feeling right before you

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Speaker 3: were bored? And sometimes they're like, well, I don't know.

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Speaker 3: And I'll encourage my patients to journal and to write

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Speaker 3: down their feelings, similar to the way that with children

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Speaker 3: in school, we show them the faces and we show

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Speaker 3: them like, this is a sad face, this is an

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Speaker 3: anxious face, this is an angry face. Sometimes I have

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Speaker 3: to do that with my adult patients and say, well,

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Speaker 3: let's use the face shart. How are you feeling? And

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Speaker 3: many times they'll say I was feeling anxious, I was

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Speaker 3: feeling unsettled, I was feeling lonely, I felt fatigued, and

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Speaker 3: I just didn't have anything left in me. So I

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Speaker 3: just got onto this device and before I know it,

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Speaker 3: hours have passed. So understanding how you feel is important.

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Speaker 3: And here's why. If we enter a room and it's

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Speaker 3: dark and we hear a scary noise, we're just going

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Speaker 3: to start swinging right as if our life depended on it.

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Speaker 3: But if somebody turned that light on and we saw, oh,

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Speaker 3: a book fell, we're not gonna be swinging, we're going

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Speaker 3: to understand what we're dealing with, what we're working with,

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Speaker 3: So understanding how you feel is just as important because

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Speaker 3: as human beings, we're afraid of the unknown, and if

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Speaker 3: we don't know how we feel, we're not going to

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Speaker 3: know how to appropriately respond. And that's a very very

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Speaker 3: big step. And people acknowledging whatever it is that they're feeling,

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Speaker 3: then we work on how do we address that. So

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Speaker 3: if it's anxiety, we may want to do some more

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Speaker 3: grounded techniques, more somatic or bodily techniques. With my clients,

435
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,560
Speaker 3: the younger ones, I'll have them sit on the chairs

436
00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:40,119
Speaker 3: in my office and we'll practice squeezing oranges with the

437
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,639
Speaker 3: stress balls and so we use a lot of vivid

438
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:47,159
Speaker 3: imagery with them and get playful. But with my adult patients,

439
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,919
Speaker 3: we'll do some deep diaphragmatic breathing because many of them

440
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 3: are not aware that they're holding so much in their body,

441
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 3: that they're holding their breath all day long, and that

442
00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:59,920
Speaker 3: they're not breathing in the way that is the best

443
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,240
Speaker 3: suited a way to release some of that tension. My

444
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 3: clients will sit and we'll do progressive muscle relaxation because

445
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:09,240
Speaker 3: they're not aware that they're holding a lot of their

446
00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:12,640
Speaker 3: stress in their shoulders. And so we'll focus on these

447
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:17,080
Speaker 3: tiny muscle groups and mastering relaxing and tensing them so

448
00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 3: that eventually they can calm down that fight or flight

449
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 3: sensation on their own and use it and practice it

450
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:26,280
Speaker 3: when they're not in fighter flight so that they're able

451
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:29,920
Speaker 3: to utilize it readily when they are in an anxious situation.

452
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,399
Speaker 3: If it's depression. I want to understand that because a

453
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:37,360
Speaker 3: lot of my clients have something that I call antedonia.

454
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:39,560
Speaker 3: It's in the medical literature, it's been around for ages,

455
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 3: but a lot of people don't know what it is,

456
00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 3: but it's literally a lack of pleasure and interest. What

457
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 3: they'll describe is, eh, I feel this blah. But I

458
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:52,800
Speaker 3: find that is associated highly with overt technology usage because

459
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 3: you're constantly online, you're checking emails, you're using these devices

460
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,720
Speaker 3: to give you that boost of dope. Mean, but over time,

461
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 3: it's not going to make you feel satiated, and those

462
00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:09,840
Speaker 3: are unnatural ways to boost your dopamine levels. And so

463
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 3: what I'll do with these clients is I'll say you're

464
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,119
Speaker 3: not gonna feel like getting up, You're not going to

465
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 3: feel like exercise. You're not going to feel like going

466
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 3: for a walk, but we're not going to wait for

467
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 3: you to feel like you want to do those things.

468
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 3: What we're gonna do is we're gonna shift that cognitive

469
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:25,280
Speaker 3: behavioral therapy triangle and we're going to start the behavior first.

470
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,880
Speaker 3: We're going to have you getting up and walking when

471
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 3: you're feeling eh, when you're having that in Edonia, and

472
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,960
Speaker 3: then we're going to see how your thoughts and your

473
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 3: feelings are. Then we're going to track that because sometimes

474
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 3: the behavior actually drives the thinking and the feelings, similar

475
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,000
Speaker 3: to when people say, when you wake up in the morning,

476
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 3: make your bed, because it's the behavior that is pushing

477
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 3: the feelings and the thinking in the right direction and

478
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 3: not necessarily trying to challenge the thought.

479
00:25:51,560 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 1: Beautiful more from our conversation after the break. So, you

480
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:09,520
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier that one of the things that you're seeing,

481
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 1: especially with your younger patients, is the difficulty with like

482
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,920
Speaker 1: social reciprocity. And we do know lots of people talk

483
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: about like how social media has impacted their relationships, So

484
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:21,159
Speaker 1: can you dig a little deeper into that, like what

485
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: kinds of concerns are you seeing with some of your patients,

486
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 1: whether that be romantic relationships, photonic relationships with their family,

487
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:28,600
Speaker 1: what's happening.

488
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 2: You know.

489
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 3: What's interesting is that Gen Z is the first generation

490
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 3: to be born into a world where social media was

491
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 3: always there, the Internet was always there. So they deal

492
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:46,159
Speaker 3: with these unique challenges that older generations did not have

493
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:46,719
Speaker 3: to deal with.

494
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 2: Right.

495
00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,359
Speaker 3: These are people who were born into world where their

496
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:53,840
Speaker 3: parents were looking at their phones instead of looking at them.

497
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 3: Imagine that and when you see a baby born. When

498
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 3: I was in medical school, we would deliver babies and

499
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 3: from it was just like the most miraculous thing and

500
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 3: never got tired of it because every baby was like

501
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,359
Speaker 3: a miracle. When the parent held the baby up, the

502
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 3: baby would start imitating the parent automatically. They didn't have

503
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:12,919
Speaker 3: to learn it. They learned it from their parents. So

504
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 3: you would see like the parents making these googly faces

505
00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 3: and the baby would do it. It would be delayed

506
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,400
Speaker 3: because the baby's processing is slower, but the parent would

507
00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:21,920
Speaker 3: stick their tongue out, the baby would stick their tongue

508
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:23,840
Speaker 3: out a couple of seconds later. So if you have

509
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 3: this generation where they weren't getting as much of that

510
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 3: interaction because either the parents were busy with the screens

511
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:31,880
Speaker 3: or they were getting a lot of their one on

512
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 3: one replaced with screens. Then you're set up for challenges

513
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:40,040
Speaker 3: with social reciprocity, right, you're not able to recuse as

514
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 3: well as a child who didn't have that replaced that

515
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:48,200
Speaker 3: interaction in real life replaced by a digital interaction or

516
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 3: a screen. And being aware of this is really helpful

517
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 3: because many people aren't aware of this. And the other

518
00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 3: thing is that when you're online constantly gen Z I

519
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:05,719
Speaker 3: find within my practice, they're constantly comparing themselves to other people.

520
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 3: Generations before didn't have that constant comparison. You didn't know

521
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:12,919
Speaker 3: what someone was doing all the time. You didn't know

522
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 3: that people were like having a macho latte and you weren't.

523
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 3: All of that information was not necessary before. You have

524
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:26,399
Speaker 3: this generation that's been bombarded with information since they were babies,

525
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 3: since there were children, since there were teens, and then

526
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 3: on top of it, they were being captured digitally and

527
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 3: their information was put up there by their parents. So

528
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:36,720
Speaker 3: they just have so many more challenges. I have a

529
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 3: lot of empathy for this generation. I do think that

530
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 3: they have strengths. McKinsey did a recent study looking at

531
00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:45,960
Speaker 3: generations and how they tend to interact in society and

532
00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 3: what they found with this study that was based in

533
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:53,160
Speaker 3: Brazil because it had the largest consumer population of multi generations.

534
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 3: What they found was that this Gen Z population, they're

535
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 3: more into making sure that their paars are doing well.

536
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,720
Speaker 3: They're not okay with having progress if everyone doesn't have progress.

537
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 3: They have a lot of strengths. They are more open

538
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 3: about their mental health and early generations. But we also

539
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 3: have diacknowledges the challenges that they have and empathize with

540
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 3: them because they have challenges that we didn't have due

541
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:17,720
Speaker 3: to their exposure, their NonStop exposure. And we want to

542
00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 3: arm them with knowledge because again, if you know what

543
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 3: you're dealing with, if you know, oh that's why I

544
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,000
Speaker 3: feel this way, It's not just me. There's not something

545
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 3: wrong with me. I just didn't know that this was harmful,

546
00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 3: then they actually can do something about it. They can

547
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,520
Speaker 3: make that decision to do something about it. We don't

548
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 3: want to be preaching and tell them what to do.

549
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 3: We know that when people are intrinsically motivated to change,

550
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 3: their outcome is better. When they try to change, they're

551
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:42,920
Speaker 3: gonna have better results than if we're like, you should

552
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,280
Speaker 3: do this right, and that's all humans, regardless of generations,

553
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:48,560
Speaker 3: and so we have to make sure that we put

554
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:50,920
Speaker 3: out that information there. That's why I use my social

555
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,719
Speaker 3: media platform to educate. Sometimes I get a lot of like,

556
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 3: well what am I supposed to do now? Like my

557
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 3: kid's been looking at screens and you know, oh great,

558
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:01,280
Speaker 3: I feel bad. It's not for that reason. It's to

559
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 3: give you the education because we don't have the education.

560
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,560
Speaker 3: Many of us don't have the time to read journals, right,

561
00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:08,720
Speaker 3: we don't have time to do the research. And so

562
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 3: learning as much as you can listen to a podcasts,

563
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 3: read a short article, educational, take an online test to

564
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,720
Speaker 3: see what your habits are like. These are all ways

565
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 3: that you can have agency and eventually, I think master

566
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 3: a good balance and then consider a reset and figure

567
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 3: out how to work with technology to enhance your life

568
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 3: versus having it potentially harm your well being.

569
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 1: So you've mentioned this idea of comparison a couple of times,

570
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 1: and that comes up quite a lot in the Therapy

571
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 1: for Black Girls community as well. So it seems like

572
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 1: this is an issue across generations, right, Like young kids

573
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 1: are comparing themselves and we also have older adults who

574
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,720
Speaker 1: are comparing themselves, Like you said, like who's having a

575
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: lot to you? What kind of workout are you doing?

576
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 1: Like that kind of thing. What tips do you have

577
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,520
Speaker 1: for people to kind of stop that habit of comparing

578
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 1: themselves to what they're seeing online.

579
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:02,080
Speaker 3: So within my reset construct, some of it is time boundaries,

580
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 3: so you can enforce, Okay, I'm going to limit the

581
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 3: amount of time I spend on these accounts on social

582
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 3: media in general, and that could be done very slowly.

583
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,880
Speaker 3: I recommend not doing a cold turkey because again, some

584
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 3: people have withdrawal, they have FOMO, and so that's one

585
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 3: thing that you can do. Another thing you can do

586
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 3: is an account boundary, so like you're only going to

587
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 3: follow certain accounts that you feel are authentic, where people

588
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 3: are showing their good and their bad days. They're not

589
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 3: just showing when everything's going great. It could be a

590
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,239
Speaker 3: full on boundary as to whether or not you're going

591
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 3: to post, because I think that for many of us,

592
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 3: it's this rejection that we feel when we post and

593
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 3: we don't get the feedback that we hoped we would receive,

594
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:46,840
Speaker 3: or we get negative feedback. So some people are okay

595
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 3: with I'm just gonna like, use this account just to

596
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 3: see how my friends are doing and not post about myself.

597
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:55,200
Speaker 3: That's a boundary within yourself, right within your own practices.

598
00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:57,240
Speaker 2: It could be Okay.

599
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,719
Speaker 3: What I'm going to do is I'll only follow accounts

600
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 3: that give me meaningful information and not the frivolous stuff,

601
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 3: because we are not aware of how the frivolous stuff

602
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 3: impacts us. I love fashion, but sometimes I have to

603
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 3: unfollow some fashion brands because if I see another perfect image,

604
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 3: I'm gonna be like, oh, like, maybe I shouldn't have

605
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 3: had that bagel or whatever, you know, like so I'm

606
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 3: guilty of it too. I have to unfollow some things

607
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 3: because they're not healthy for me. And so I think

608
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 3: that we have to figure out a way that works

609
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 3: for ourselves, that works for our own wellness, that meets

610
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 3: our individual needs. But that requires getting to know ourselves.

611
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:37,720
Speaker 3: And sometimes you may need to actually sit with a

612
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,240
Speaker 3: therapist and go over what some of your practices are

613
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 3: because it's not as readily apparent to all of us

614
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 3: and we need help. So sometimes I'll sit with my

615
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 3: clients and I'll go through what they typically look through.

616
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 3: I'll sit with them and look at the accounts and

617
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 3: we'll talk about how they feel and what they did

618
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 3: after or before.

619
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 2: And so sometimes you do need that.

620
00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 1: Support you mentioned earlier. This idea is sometimes because because

621
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 1: of what you do for work, you can't just get

622
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 1: off social media, right, And I'm thinking about content creators specifically, right,

623
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 1: So this idea that you make your money, you make

624
00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 1: your living based on posting online and being visible. But

625
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: we know the algorithms are always changing. Right. So you

626
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 1: just mentioned you post something and then you only get

627
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: twelve likes and what that might do to your self

628
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 1: esteem or your mental health. Can you say a little

629
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 1: bit about what should content creators keep in mind given

630
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: that they may have to be on these platforms more

631
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 1: than most people.

632
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 3: For content creators, know your business, know your industry, you know,

633
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:39,800
Speaker 3: like researching it and understanding that the algorithm does xyz

634
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 3: and why it does that. I think that's the first

635
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 3: step and that's a part of the education, part of

636
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 3: reset the E. The first E is educating yourself because

637
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,600
Speaker 3: when you know that, Okay, this is not me, this

638
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 3: is the algorithm, a part of your brain, the unconscious,

639
00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 3: will take that in and you won't feel as bad

640
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 3: when you have that education and that information and what

641
00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 3: you're going to do with that knowledge is important. So

642
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 3: knowing that the algorithm will sometimes reward you and sometimes

643
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:09,160
Speaker 3: will not reward you, what are you going to do

644
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 3: with that information? Are you going to spend your time

645
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:15,279
Speaker 3: constantly checking that platform if you know that it's hit

646
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,560
Speaker 3: or miss right? Are you going to take the time

647
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 3: to say, Okay, I'm going to leave this phone outside

648
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:20,839
Speaker 3: of my room. I'm not going to keep it in

649
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 3: my bedroom because then I'm going to keep checking it.

650
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:24,360
Speaker 3: So what are you going to do with that information?

651
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:25,960
Speaker 3: Are you going to use it to create your plan,

652
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 3: your strategy? So I want people to be mindful about

653
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 3: that and to really think about what they're going to

654
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:33,680
Speaker 3: do with that information that they've learned. Are they going

655
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 3: to implement that into their better practices? Are they going

656
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 3: to create change within their lives? And if they're resistant,

657
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:42,520
Speaker 3: then I want to understand that a bit more. Why

658
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 3: are they resistant now that they know this and they

659
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:48,319
Speaker 3: know that there are options and solutions? What's decreasing their

660
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 3: motivation to change? And for me as a therapist, I

661
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 3: like to understand that because I feel like when my

662
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 3: patients understand that they can make better choices.

663
00:34:57,080 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break. So something else

664
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 1: that comes up quite often is the level of distressing

665
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 1: images we are privy to on social media, right, Like,

666
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 1: there's no shortage of awful things happening all across the world,

667
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:22,279
Speaker 1: and sometimes you will stumble across videos and different kinds

668
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 1: of things that I think are often very violent and

669
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,560
Speaker 1: traumatic to witness. What kinds of things or strategies would

670
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 1: you suggest for people around how to take care of themselves,

671
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 1: given that you could stumble upon kind of anything online

672
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: At this point.

673
00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:38,399
Speaker 3: It's really a recent phenomenon. When I was growing up,

674
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 3: we didn't have constant information.

675
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: I saw this meme.

676
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 3: I don't know who first posted it, but I find

677
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:48,799
Speaker 3: it to be very brilliant. This woman says that she's

678
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:50,600
Speaker 3: on a plane and she's afraid of flying, and she says,

679
00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna sleep on this flight because I'm gonna

680
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 3: use all my mental energy to keep this plane.

681
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 2: In the air.

682
00:35:55,600 --> 00:36:00,160
Speaker 3: And I love that meme because as human beings, we

683
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,320
Speaker 3: are like, well, if I don't follow every news story,

684
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:05,960
Speaker 3: if I don't respond and champion every cause for this

685
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 3: specific belief, then I'm failing the group. And it's so

686
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,960
Speaker 3: not true. For hundreds of years, things went on in

687
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 3: the world and we didn't know about them. It's not

688
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 3: to say that it's not important, because we do want

689
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 3: to make sure that we are informed, but there is

690
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:26,279
Speaker 3: no need unless you are like a journalist who's specifically

691
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,759
Speaker 3: covering a region. There is no need for us to

692
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 3: be informed twenty.

693
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:32,240
Speaker 2: Four to seven.

694
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 3: And collective trauma is real. PTSD that is secondary is real.

695
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 3: When we see things that are life threatening, that are violent,

696
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 3: that are just horrifying, we can experience trauma responses. And

697
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 3: so again that's where the knowledge comes in. I do

698
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 3: a lot of content about that guard your brain, Like

699
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 3: when whatever you see leaves a print on your brain,

700
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,080
Speaker 3: it leaves a print on your soul, your spirit. So

701
00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 3: we want to limit it to the best of our

702
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 3: ability those that exposure to those horrifying images, because they

703
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:10,719
Speaker 3: may lead to secondary PTSD symptoms, which are poor sleep, nightmares,

704
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:15,760
Speaker 3: feeling tense, having poor concentration, feeling angry at the world,

705
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 3: feeling like there's no safe place in the world. For

706
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 3: some people, it's reckless behavior. Some people feel as if

707
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 3: they're not in touch with their bodies. They have dissociative experiences,

708
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:30,760
Speaker 3: and especially people who have a history of trauma. Again,

709
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 3: if you have a history of your own personal trauma,

710
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 3: being exposed to these secondary traumas can trigger your own

711
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 3: trauma response. So knowledge is so powerful. If you know this,

712
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,480
Speaker 3: then you can make hopefully more informed decisions, better decisions

713
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 3: moving forward.

714
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,480
Speaker 1: So you mentioned doctor Joseph. Then going cold Turkey completely

715
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 1: disconnecting from social media maybe difficult for people. Can you

716
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 1: get us started with maybe some no phone zones or

717
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:00,400
Speaker 1: no device zones that if we want to take this

718
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 1: first step, where should we start?

719
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,920
Speaker 3: Well, if you're in your home, I say, I used

720
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:07,400
Speaker 3: to be an anti sociologists before I switched to psychiatry,

721
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:10,880
Speaker 3: and the most important parts of anesesia were the takeoff

722
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 3: like a pilot and the landing. Right, So you put

723
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 3: the patient under, then you wake them up, and I

724
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 3: say the same things to my patient. The most important

725
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:19,799
Speaker 3: part of your day is how you start your day

726
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 3: and how you end your day, because those are the

727
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 3: times when you supposedly have the most control. Right when

728
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:28,080
Speaker 3: you leave the house, things can happen, work can happen,

729
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:30,000
Speaker 3: school can happen, life happens.

730
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:31,600
Speaker 2: Right, But I hope.

731
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:34,400
Speaker 3: For many people they have some more power as to

732
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 3: how they start and end of day. So let's start there.

733
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:38,799
Speaker 3: Those are the baby steps. When you wake up in

734
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,960
Speaker 3: the morning, and I'll have my clients take journals.

735
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:42,600
Speaker 2: What are you doing?

736
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 3: What's the first thing you're doing when you wake up?

737
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:46,799
Speaker 3: I tell you many people will say the first thing

738
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:51,400
Speaker 3: they do is check their phone. Right Now, hundreds of

739
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 3: years went by with people not having a phone next

740
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 3: to them, So I think you'd be okay if you

741
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 3: put the phone outside, right, And for many people that's

742
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,719
Speaker 3: the hardest part. They want to sleep with their phone right.

743
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 3: And so if you can slowly move that phone away

744
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 3: from you, So the first week, maybe not put it

745
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 3: on the nightstand, but plug it into the wall. And

746
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 3: then the next week, maybe not plug it into the

747
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 3: wall in your room, but plug it into the wall

748
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 3: right outside your room. And you know, you get the idea,

749
00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 3: you move it further and further away from the bed

750
00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 3: because even that little bit amount of light can disrupt

751
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 3: your melatonin, can disrupt your sleep. So we don't want

752
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:30,240
Speaker 3: people having that disruption. And also knowing that the phone

753
00:39:30,280 --> 00:39:33,439
Speaker 3: is there and starting your day that way can set

754
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 3: you into a mood of anxiety for the rest.

755
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:36,439
Speaker 2: Of the day.

756
00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:39,759
Speaker 3: So with my clients, I'll say keep the phone as

757
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,320
Speaker 3: far away from the bed as possible and give yourself

758
00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:45,399
Speaker 3: as much time in the morning as possible, because when

759
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 3: any of us are rushed, things are worse. Being rushed

760
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:51,120
Speaker 3: is like probably one of the worst ways to start

761
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 3: a day. And then as you wake up and these

762
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 3: in Manhattan, I ask people to move the shades and

763
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:01,200
Speaker 3: get some fresh sunlight because we are living, breathing humans, right,

764
00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 3: we need that vitamin. Do we need that sunlight? We

765
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:06,719
Speaker 3: need that to reset and restore our inner clocks. And

766
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,439
Speaker 3: drink a glass of water and just reflect and use mindfulness.

767
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 3: Think about that water, think about it going down your throat,

768
00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 3: think about how it feels. Try to engage your senses

769
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:19,400
Speaker 3: because again that's the first part of reset, the realization,

770
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 3: you know. And so if you can do that for

771
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 3: the beginning of your day and then the end of

772
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,799
Speaker 3: your day, right, I mentioned that melatonin is important, So

773
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:29,960
Speaker 3: try to keep that digital light as low as possible,

774
00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 3: try not to use any of it if possible after nine.

775
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,799
Speaker 3: For some people who can't do that, they'll use the

776
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,840
Speaker 3: orange glasses that you can buy in the store online

777
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:43,680
Speaker 3: to block that digital light and try to do something

778
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,800
Speaker 3: relaxing before you go to bed, not checking emails, because

779
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:50,359
Speaker 3: the emails will really make you anxious if you're checking

780
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 3: before bed, doom scrolling will make you anxious before you

781
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,919
Speaker 3: go to bed. Journaling is a great replacement. So put

782
00:40:56,960 --> 00:40:59,360
Speaker 3: three things for the day that you're grateful for and

783
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 3: next to three things that you're worried about, and then

784
00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:04,360
Speaker 3: close it and then put it away, right, So you're unloading,

785
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 3: unpacking your worries onto something and then also being grateful

786
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,400
Speaker 3: and putting it away. So these are calming things you

787
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 3: can do at the end of the day, along with

788
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 3: other things. There's a slew of sleep hygiene things. But

789
00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:16,960
Speaker 3: if you can start with the beginning and the end

790
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:18,960
Speaker 3: of your day, I think that's a great start. I

791
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:20,840
Speaker 3: think it's harder in the middle of the day because

792
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:23,960
Speaker 3: many people work online and they need to check their emails.

793
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:27,399
Speaker 3: But you know, some small things that you can do

794
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:30,680
Speaker 3: during your work days. Okay, maybe you can get up

795
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 3: during lunch, maybe you don't have to eat through lunch

796
00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 3: looking at your screen, or if you don't have that luxury,

797
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 3: maybe you can at least take five minutes away from

798
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:40,759
Speaker 3: your desk to go get a cup of tea or

799
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 3: get a glass of water to go to the bathroom,

800
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:45,359
Speaker 3: because many people work throughout their day and don't even

801
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 3: use a bathroom. Inm I study on high functioning depression,

802
00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 3: I see this a lot, people just working through their day, eating,

803
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 3: drinking at their desk, not going in the bathroom, rushing home,

804
00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:55,759
Speaker 3: you know. So like, try and be mindful about those

805
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 3: tiny breaks during the day if you can. But I

806
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:01,560
Speaker 3: feel like you have more mastery agency over the beginning

807
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 3: and ends of the day because you're home supposedly.

808
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,000
Speaker 1: Thank you for those tips. I think those would be

809
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 1: super helpful for people. So I'm really curious to hear

810
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:12,279
Speaker 1: more about this transition from anthesiology to psychiatry. Can you

811
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:14,920
Speaker 1: give me the short version of that story and what

812
00:42:15,080 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 1: prompted that change.

813
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:20,760
Speaker 3: Well, I was raised in a very traditional Caribbean religious household.

814
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:23,839
Speaker 3: My dad's a pastor, and mental health was not really

815
00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:26,880
Speaker 3: talked about in a way that being explained as a

816
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,480
Speaker 3: spiritual issue. And so when I went to college, I

817
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 3: do I studied religion and biology and chemistry, so I

818
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 3: was like, okay, which is the real thing? And then

819
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:38,480
Speaker 3: I came to a point in my life that I

820
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:40,520
Speaker 3: don't have to choose. I can have faith, and I

821
00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:42,960
Speaker 3: could have spirituality, and I can also believe in science.

822
00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:45,680
Speaker 3: And when I went to medical school, I just found

823
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:49,359
Speaker 3: that I wasn't feeling fulfilled in my field of anti soziology,

824
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 3: and I wanted to talk to patients. And I remember

825
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:55,279
Speaker 3: when I was in medical school, before I matched into

826
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 3: anissiology residency, I did a rotation in South Africa where

827
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 3: we were working with these children who had severe levels

828
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 3: of trauma, and we did these trauma based focused groups

829
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 3: with them, trauma based cognitive behavioral therapy. That was like

830
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 3: the best I felt throughout all of medical school, and

831
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,359
Speaker 3: I thought, wouldn't be great if I could just do that,

832
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:16,440
Speaker 3: you know, instead of something where I feel as if

833
00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:19,480
Speaker 3: I'm not really making a difference. And don't get me wrong,

834
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:22,160
Speaker 3: and sociologists, I have a high respect for them. They

835
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 3: have to keep patients alive during a surgery and then

836
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:27,919
Speaker 3: wake them up and then make sure they're not in pain.

837
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:30,799
Speaker 3: It's a very difficult job. But it wasn't fulfilling for me,

838
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,120
Speaker 3: and I just felt as if I wasn't being my

839
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:35,920
Speaker 3: authentic self. I was doing what I thought would make

840
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:38,319
Speaker 3: my parents proud, and in a Caribbean household. If you

841
00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:40,719
Speaker 3: tell them I'm gonna leave this profession where I'm in

842
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 3: the operating room and I'm gonna go and work with

843
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:44,880
Speaker 3: people who have mental health issues, They're like, why are

844
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:45,839
Speaker 3: you gonna go and work with them?

845
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:46,799
Speaker 2: Crazy people? You know?

846
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 3: And I had to educate my community that what we

847
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:53,520
Speaker 3: were seeing in the church, we're calling it spirits, that

848
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 3: was a psychotic condition, you know, the person may have

849
00:43:56,880 --> 00:43:59,879
Speaker 3: had trauma. And I think that at least within my church,

850
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 3: it's grown significantly, But there was a lot of taboo.

851
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:08,200
Speaker 3: And I'm so fortunate that my program at Columbia had

852
00:44:08,200 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 3: an opening that I was able to switch from anti

853
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 3: sociology there to psychiatry and never looked back. Psychiatry is

854
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 3: so rewarding on so many levels. And I run a

855
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,440
Speaker 3: lab here, so I'm still able to do the procedures

856
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,840
Speaker 3: that I love from antistiology, but I apply them to

857
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 3: behavioral science, and I'm able to use the knowledge in

858
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 3: my lab to educate people to make these videos that

859
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:33,680
Speaker 3: are simple but evidence based and bring science to the

860
00:44:33,719 --> 00:44:36,440
Speaker 3: masses in a way that it's easy to digest and

861
00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:38,720
Speaker 3: they are feeling as if they're going back to school.

862
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 3: I love when people are like, oh, I'm learning so much.

863
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:42,480
Speaker 3: That was the point, you know, to make these videos

864
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:44,839
Speaker 3: that are where you're learning. Because again, if you don't

865
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 3: know what you're dealing with, if you're in the dark,

866
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:49,200
Speaker 3: you're going to be afraid. You're going to be swinging.

867
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 3: But then when you know what you're dealing with, you're

868
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:54,120
Speaker 3: not gonna be swinging. You're gonna make informed decisions.

869
00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 1: Well, we are grateful that you answered that calling and

870
00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:59,279
Speaker 1: stepped into that for Thank you for sharing with me.

871
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 1: I can talk to you all day. I feel like

872
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 1: doctor Joseph, and I know you have a busy schedule

873
00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:05,480
Speaker 1: and have to get back to your day, So tell

874
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:07,680
Speaker 1: us where can we stay connected with you? What's your

875
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 1: website as well as any social media handles you'd like

876
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 1: to share.

877
00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 3: I enjoyed speaking with you. I'm a huge fan of

878
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:16,879
Speaker 3: your work and so fortunate for doctors like you who

879
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 3: put themselves out there.

880
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 2: It's risky, but you do it.

881
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 3: And it is so beneficial to millions of people. So

882
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,919
Speaker 3: thank you for having me. You can find me at

883
00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:29,160
Speaker 3: doctor Judith Joseph on TikTok and Instagram, and that's also

884
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 3: my website name. And I started a newsletter and a

885
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:34,920
Speaker 3: podcast where I can give informative tips that I use

886
00:45:34,920 --> 00:45:38,839
Speaker 3: in my practice and hopefully with your therapist. You can

887
00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 3: use these tips to support your mental health, but we

888
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 3: will be sure to include all of that in the

889
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:45,359
Speaker 3: show notes. Thank you so much for spending some time

890
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 3: with us today.

891
00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:47,319
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me.

892
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:52,839
Speaker 1: I'm so glad Doctor Joseph was able to share her

893
00:45:52,840 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 1: exercise with us today. To learn more about her and

894
00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 1: the work she's doing, be sure to visit the show

895
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,719
Speaker 1: notes at therapyfroth Blackgirls dot com slash Session three forty two,

896
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:04,480
Speaker 1: and don't forget to text this episode to two of

897
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 1: your girls right now and encourage them to check out

898
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,400
Speaker 1: the episode. If you're looking for a therapist in your area,

899
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:14,240
Speaker 1: visit our therapist directory at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com

900
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 1: slash directory. And if you're looking for a support system

901
00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:20,359
Speaker 1: to aid you in your New Year journey, join us

902
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:23,120
Speaker 1: over in the Sister Circle. It's our cozy corner of

903
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 1: the Internet where we celebrate support and practice vulnerability each

904
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 1: week this January, we're setting the foundation to turn our

905
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:34,719
Speaker 1: resolutions into realities. You can join us at community dot

906
00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:38,480
Speaker 1: Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. This episode was produced by

907
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:42,719
Speaker 1: Frida Lucas, Elise Ellis and Zaria Taylor. Editing was done

908
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: by Dennison Bradford. Thank y'all so much for joining me

909
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:49,920
Speaker 1: again this week. I look forward to continuing this conversation

910
00:46:50,000 --> 00:46:51,320
Speaker 1: with you all real soon.

911
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 2: Take good care. What's