Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power. CALLI
Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with
Speaker 1: Emily jam I'm Caroline Hide in family Chat and this
Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Technology. Coming up in the next hour. Media
Speaker 1: Mogul's billionaires and some of the biggest names from tech, media,
Speaker 1: business and finance and sports while they're converging in some valley.
Speaker 1: This week, we'll get the latest from the ground. Last
Speaker 1: one of the most famous apps in the world, It's TikTok.
Speaker 1: It is under pressure with the challenge of its own
Speaker 1: the SEC Commissioner. Pressure is big Tech to delete it
Speaker 1: from its app stores. We speak with him live in
Speaker 1: a moment And companies last year defied the pandemic to
Speaker 1: go public at a record pace. Now inflation and recession
Speaker 1: fears of caught up and brought the listing party to
Speaker 1: a bit of a halt. We speak with the our
Speaker 1: section of Commercial Officer Jeff Thomas. What to expect for
Speaker 1: the second half get to all of that, but a
Speaker 1: moment a first, let's gotta look in the markets. Crenny
Speaker 1: Gupta in the house and text talk stuff pretty well. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they made a complete turnaround Caroline's fascinating when you see
Speaker 1: this because if you had looked at the market at
Speaker 1: nine thirty am this morning, this is not what the
Speaker 1: markets looked like. You did not see green on the screen.
Speaker 1: You had an almost two percent decline in those opening bells.
Speaker 1: A lot of that driven by the stronger dollar story
Speaker 1: that we saw, but you kind of saw a turnaround
Speaker 1: story in about i won't say, halfway through the session,
Speaker 1: a lot of it driven by Big Tex, so much
Speaker 1: to the point that you can actually see at the
Speaker 1: SPI close to up only two tenths of one percent.
Speaker 1: The NASDAC though outperforming in a very big way, up
Speaker 1: one point seven percent on the day. But take a
Speaker 1: look at these yields, because I bet some of the
Speaker 1: yield picture is playing in two as well. Down only
Speaker 1: six basis points, well seven, I should say seven basis points,
Speaker 1: and I'm say only seven basis points, Caroline, because in
Speaker 1: the last couple of days and weeks, we've had eleven, twelve,
Speaker 1: even twenty basis point moves in just one day. So
Speaker 1: it's almost a muted day for bonds, but perhaps lifting
Speaker 1: the stock market just a little bit, especially those tech
Speaker 1: stocks that we know are extremely ultra rate sensitive, which
Speaker 1: brings me to the high beta stocks in particular. Let's
Speaker 1: talk about ARC the R innovation E t F. We
Speaker 1: know that's the trade that has not been working this year,
Speaker 1: but today it actually performed well. And that's because the
Speaker 1: lights of Tesla, Microsoft, Google, all the big technics have
Speaker 1: been taking a baiting. They did really well today. But look,
Speaker 1: isn't enough to have a tartground story for the lights
Speaker 1: of our innovation. It doesn't seem so, at least on
Speaker 1: this one day basis, just given the kind of blood
Speaker 1: that we've seen in this particular market. So that's something
Speaker 1: that we're gonna have to keep an eye on. And
Speaker 1: let's get to actually the next slide, which I should
Speaker 1: mention it's not just a small tech that's bounced, because
Speaker 1: you saw that in cryptocurrency, you saw that in biotech
Speaker 1: as well, but big tech really really lead the charge.
Speaker 1: I want to emphasize as much as I can, Caroline,
Speaker 1: because take a look at this. These are your biggest
Speaker 1: movers on the day, but also your biggest index contributors
Speaker 1: on the day. Your Amazon to your Apples, your Microsoft's,
Speaker 1: your Tesla. Do we see this again tomorrow? How much
Speaker 1: of this is a technical trade. Caroline, I don't have
Speaker 1: those answers, are you, but I'm curious to see if
Speaker 1: this is a sustainable move on wheel Creaty. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much a great round up. Meanwhile, Tesla one of
Speaker 1: the names could you just mentioned, actually higher that's even
Speaker 1: after disappointing quarter of deliveries and record month of production.
Speaker 1: Now factories in both China and Germany will remain idle
Speaker 1: for several weeks. Joining us on the phone to discuss
Speaker 1: all of this when I was down a hall who
Speaker 1: covers the company, Danna. We've sort of had mixed messages
Speaker 1: from Elon Musque about the cash burn that's going on,
Speaker 1: and indeed they didn't seem to paint the picture that
Speaker 1: will be closing down some of their manufacturing units for
Speaker 1: for some sort of break. Yeah, they've been a coule
Speaker 1: different reports out of China and Germany that the plants
Speaker 1: are going to be offline for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 1: Uh this this month, Um, you know, the half class
Speaker 1: empty would say, oh god, this is what a terrible
Speaker 1: time to be offline. Right, they just gave off of
Speaker 1: this sort of bad quarter where production was paused because
Speaker 1: of COVID. Now they're you know, shutting down production again
Speaker 1: the glass how cool? Would say, well, this is all
Speaker 1: built back better. You know, auto companies typically tick plans offline,
Speaker 1: especially around the July was holiday here in the US,
Speaker 1: to kind of do retooling, to do equipment maintenance, and
Speaker 1: you could often get better production after you've had an
Speaker 1: opportunity to kind of do that. So we'll just have
Speaker 1: to wait and see what production is like going forward. Um,
Speaker 1: the company did say that they had a really strong
Speaker 1: production for June. Yeah, what was it, two d fifty
Speaker 1: four thousand, six nine deliveries for June, which is the
Speaker 1: most they've ever made in history, but it actually was
Speaker 1: still less than the market wanted. Well, that was no excellent. No, Actually,
Speaker 1: to fifty four was the was the deliveries for the quarter,
Speaker 1: which was a dip from the first quarter. But but
Speaker 1: the market kind of expected that because we knew that China,
Speaker 1: which is their most productive factory, had been offline for
Speaker 1: several weeks because of the COVID lockdown. Um. But yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's definitely a mixed bag. I mean, I
Speaker 1: think there's gonna be a lot of questions about production
Speaker 1: and the ramp up of the new factories in Austin
Speaker 1: and Berlin. When the company reports earnings twenty Yeah, Berlin,
Speaker 1: Austin losing billions of dollars right now because there's a
Speaker 1: ton of expense and hardly any output. Musque seemed to
Speaker 1: be telling Tesla owner's back on May thirty one. Is
Speaker 1: he painting in general a gloomier picture or not beat one?
Speaker 1: What do you think? Well, I mean he's I think
Speaker 1: he's always been fairly you know, to his credit. I
Speaker 1: think he's always been fairly frank about the state of
Speaker 1: the economy as a whole. And this is a man
Speaker 1: who is now the longest running auto auto industry CEO.
Speaker 1: I mean, he's been the CEO of tessil two thousand
Speaker 1: and eight. He steered the company through the first recession
Speaker 1: or the most recent recession in two thousand and eight
Speaker 1: two thousand nine, the company became very close to bankruptcy
Speaker 1: during the Model three ramp and eighteen. And it is
Speaker 1: this dance of like, you're investing all of this money
Speaker 1: into getting new production capacity online, but until they're actually
Speaker 1: producing cars and you're delivery in the cars, you're not
Speaker 1: really making that much money. So I think he's actually
Speaker 1: gotten fairly good at kind of managing cash and figuring
Speaker 1: out which leverage to pull. Um, you know, demand is
Speaker 1: not seen to be a problem at least the moment,
Speaker 1: and Tesla has raised prices quite a bit to kind
Speaker 1: of cover the costs of you know, higher energy costs
Speaker 1: and higher commodity costs, and let's face it, making a
Speaker 1: lot more revs than anyone else out there. Donna. Lastly,
Speaker 1: just the moon music around Shanghai in general, because again
Speaker 1: we were worrying about further lockdowns coming from those cities.
Speaker 1: Is as a zero COVID policy seems very much still
Speaker 1: in effect. How much are we worried about the longer
Speaker 1: term meant that the Tesla has made. I mean, I
Speaker 1: think that you know, Tesla's footprint in China is so
Speaker 1: important to the company and then also just very important
Speaker 1: to China. I can't see that they are gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: let that plant you know fall by the wayside. I mean,
Speaker 1: they were having people were living in the plant, you know,
Speaker 1: in the closed loop system for as long as they
Speaker 1: possibly could. So. Um, but you know, the I mean,
Speaker 1: the geopolitical questions about China visity of the US are
Speaker 1: always really interesting ones but no, it's it's a very
Speaker 1: strategic plant for the company for sure. Danaha always love
Speaker 1: her on to talk all things Tesla. We thank you indeed. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: well Elon Musk is actually meant to be out in
Speaker 1: Sun Valley as our media moguls, billionaires, some of the
Speaker 1: biggest names in tech, media, business and finance and sports,
Speaker 1: and well our own notable attribute, which is Ed Ludlow
Speaker 1: is on the ground there too, along with Shinali Bassa.
Speaker 1: Can Ed talk to us about what's going on on
Speaker 1: the ground. Who have you seen? What if you managed
Speaker 1: to already? So Bob By, former Disney CEO of course
Speaker 1: now upstairs, has just walked past me and I said
Speaker 1: to him, Bob, what's top of mind for you? And
Speaker 1: he said, Ed, I'm retired, having a good time in
Speaker 1: the sun. Its top of mind for me. But you
Speaker 1: do get people that come and talk about the industry,
Speaker 1: right and one of those was one a Discovery CEO,
Speaker 1: David doust Love, and he actually basically set the scene
Speaker 1: of what's being discussed there having it. I think it's
Speaker 1: going to be a great term. But that having a
Speaker 1: lot of opportunity. One of rose Discover, who's got great
Speaker 1: body content. I think the world's changed, and it's not
Speaker 1: about how much, it's about how it work. The world's changed,
Speaker 1: car but the vibe is very similar here this year
Speaker 1: to last year. Really heavy COVID restrictions in place for attendees.
Speaker 1: But there's there's a lot that they're discussing that's big picture,
Speaker 1: and of course the backrupt drop that they're all competing
Speaker 1: each other in a in a highly competitive streaming space
Speaker 1: while the consumer is suffering with inflation and fears of
Speaker 1: a recession overall. I mean, remember last time you were
Speaker 1: looking at the relationships, for example, the fact that whether
Speaker 1: indeed Mark Zuckerberg was indeed chhotting to Cheryl Samberg. There's
Speaker 1: been a lot of change at the top since you
Speaker 1: were last there. Yeah, and and those same awkward moments
Speaker 1: are expected to happen, right, you know, I talked about
Speaker 1: Bob Vigor what Bob j Peck from Disney the currency
Speaker 1: over here as well. There have been rumors that their
Speaker 1: relationship is under stress. You have Elon Musks due to
Speaker 1: come here along with the Twitter CEO Paraga and CFO
Speaker 1: Ned Segel. Of course they're going to talk about the
Speaker 1: Twitter deal, and even if they are when they're walking
Speaker 1: through the corridors to brunch, or they're out on their
Speaker 1: mountain bike having an adventure, or their fly fishing whatever.
Speaker 1: It is. Obviously that deal is going to be discussed
Speaker 1: here because it's the one that everyone in this media
Speaker 1: landscape talking about. Just remind us what everyone there is
Speaker 1: actually meant to be doing, apart from fly fish is it?
Speaker 1: Is it about relationship building? Is it about sharing knowledge?
Speaker 1: What is actually the the overall impact of a Some Valley? Yeah? So,
Speaker 1: so Some Valley is hosted by Alan and Co. And
Speaker 1: Alan and Co is a boutique investment bank that it's
Speaker 1: advised on some of the biggest deals in history. Right,
Speaker 1: you look at their name and where the deals they've
Speaker 1: been involved in this past year. They are advisors on
Speaker 1: the Twitter deal, right, they have been involved in the
Speaker 1: Microsoft Activision deal. The ideas that they bring together all
Speaker 1: of these people principally from telecoms, media and tech, but
Speaker 1: you see other people. Mary Barrett from gm IS used
Speaker 1: to be here, and you know, the hope, let's not
Speaker 1: beat around the bush. The hope is that this is
Speaker 1: a place where future deals are born. You know, the
Speaker 1: idea is discussed, then you know what's thrown in this
Speaker 1: year is that the world is changing like that. As
Speaker 1: I've said, markets are incredibly bollet ale Um. You know,
Speaker 1: central banks around the world are fighting sort of seemingly
Speaker 1: unpamable inflation, and they do have behind closed doors these
Speaker 1: kind of big picture discussion with a number of speakers
Speaker 1: basically giving their world view. That's kind of what the
Speaker 1: premium access is. You get to get the thoughts of
Speaker 1: the creme de la creme of Wall Street Company executive,
Speaker 1: big thinkers and big thinking for us, we thank you
Speaker 1: for meg, said Ludlow out there on the ground. In
Speaker 1: the US. TikTok spin installed over three and twenty million times,
Speaker 1: and now our next guest is calling on Apple and
Speaker 1: Google to remove that app from the app store, is
Speaker 1: calling it a sophisticated surveillance tool. John us Now as
Speaker 1: SEC Commissioner, Running CAR Commissioner, thank you for joining us. Um.
Speaker 1: Why would you want it removed from the app stores?
Speaker 1: What power do you think that would have? Well, I
Speaker 1: TikTok certainly isn't what it appears to be on the service.
Speaker 1: It's not just another app for sharing plenty of videos
Speaker 1: or memes. That's just the sheep's clothing. It really does
Speaker 1: operate as a sophisticated surveillance to what's pulling all sorts
Speaker 1: of information from UH web browsing, to biometrics like base
Speaker 1: print and voice prints, to location information and some circumstances
Speaker 1: draft messages. So that's a national security concern. But I
Speaker 1: also think it comes into play with Google and apples
Speaker 1: policies to your question, because there's been new revelations, particular
Speaker 1: the last couple of weeks that more data has been
Speaker 1: flowing back to Beijing and previously reported in data flows
Speaker 1: are very important in terms of how the app stores
Speaker 1: allow applications to continue to be on those platforms, and
Speaker 1: so I've said, take a look at your app policies, UH,
Speaker 1: and if these data flows are inconsistent with the representations
Speaker 1: that TikTok has been making, and it seems to be
Speaker 1: that way to me, then they could boot them from
Speaker 1: the app store. You're referencing the reason BuzzFeed piece of course,
Speaker 1: that looked at bite Dance saying it repeatedly access private
Speaker 1: information on US uses despite company assurances to the contrary.
Speaker 1: What data are you assessing to ensure that this is
Speaker 1: factually correct and indeed some of the other accusations that
Speaker 1: you have prior to that. Yeah. So the BuzzFeed news
Speaker 1: story has internal communications from TikTok and bitte Dance officials,
Speaker 1: including ones that say everything can be seen in China,
Speaker 1: and also TikTok itself sent a letter to a number
Speaker 1: of senators on Friday that for the first time indicated
Speaker 1: again a lot of information going back to Beijing. So
Speaker 1: some of their missions themselves, some of those information there
Speaker 1: that was shared in the BuzzFeed article, And the administration,
Speaker 1: through Sippius, an agency group out of Treasury, is also
Speaker 1: taking a look at some of this, and I would
Speaker 1: encourage that Sippius process to move swiftly in light of
Speaker 1: these new revelations. Indeed, overrule the company, TikTok has said
Speaker 1: China based employees can access use at US stay to
Speaker 1: subject to series though of robust cybersecurity controls and authorization
Speaker 1: approval protocols overseen by US bus based security team. The
Speaker 1: CEO has come out saying, look, I'm being very willing
Speaker 1: to engage with lawmakers and indeed what he said is
Speaker 1: set the record straight. According to a spokesperson, have you
Speaker 1: reached out TikTok to the leadership there, have they been
Speaker 1: able to set you straight or at least have a conversation.
Speaker 1: I've not been set straight by TikTok just yet, but
Speaker 1: I'm happy to meet with TikTok officials and engaged directly
Speaker 1: with them on this. I mean, again, there's two sort
Speaker 1: of main functions here. One has been for years they
Speaker 1: were asked directly by government officials. Are officials in Beijing
Speaker 1: accessing private US user data? And every time instead of
Speaker 1: saying yes, but it's not a problem for these reasons,
Speaker 1: they would say, well, all U S data is stored
Speaker 1: in the US, and now we find out that there's
Speaker 1: apparently a tremendous amount of information that was flowing back
Speaker 1: to Beijing, and that's those new protections are going to
Speaker 1: be putting in place. I'm not so sure about that. Again,
Speaker 1: that BuzzFeed News article how a TikTok official saying that
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, these are tools built
Speaker 1: by China and we'll see if they can continue to
Speaker 1: get access even after those controls are put in place.
Speaker 1: So frankly, this comes down to a matter of trust
Speaker 1: and when there's been apparent misrepresentation, but how much data
Speaker 1: is being pulled where it's going for years now. I
Speaker 1: don't have a lot of trust left in TikTok. And
Speaker 1: I'm not alone. There was a member of the Australian
Speaker 1: Parliament that just wrote a letter saying, I see your
Speaker 1: US user data is going to Beijing. I want to
Speaker 1: know is Australia user data going there? So I think
Speaker 1: this is probably broader effort to take a look with
Speaker 1: more scrutiny at the data flows in TikTok. You're one
Speaker 1: of the three FCC commissioners who are appointed under the
Speaker 1: Trump administration. Of course, under the Trump administration we saw
Speaker 1: bands floated of TikTok, but in general, it's not what
Speaker 1: users want. And do you see any sort of middle
Speaker 1: ground here and any assurances that the company could make
Speaker 1: cause some sort of ability to maintain and use hair
Speaker 1: in the US, but ensure that you're not worried about
Speaker 1: information flows. I'm open minded, though obviously I'm skeptical. I
Speaker 1: think step one has to be let's get a full
Speaker 1: airing of the information that did flow before, we talk
Speaker 1: about blessing through some sort of process, additional data flows
Speaker 1: going forward. And you're right, I want of four STEC
Speaker 1: commissioners we can only take official action as a body
Speaker 1: through a vote of the four of US, and so
Speaker 1: we'll see what happens here. But again I think there's
Speaker 1: other agencies that hopefully can be stepping in as well
Speaker 1: with these concerns. Have you had back from alphabet and
Speaker 1: the parent company in Google and uncle's Apple about any
Speaker 1: moves that make on the rap stoles I have, and
Speaker 1: I've asked for a response by July eighth. Then there's
Speaker 1: precedent for those app stores when data has flowed, for instance,
Speaker 1: two servers in China without that being disclosed, to kick
Speaker 1: that app out when there's other surreptitious uses of data
Speaker 1: for them to take action. So I'm open for them
Speaker 1: to tell me, you know, here's why it's a violation
Speaker 1: our policies, or here's why it's not a violation of
Speaker 1: our policies. But the national security question is pretty clear.
Speaker 1: I mean, US military branches have almost all been TikTok
Speaker 1: from their devices. UH, agencies that deal with national security
Speaker 1: have banned them from their devices as well. We warned
Speaker 1: families of US troops not to put it on their
Speaker 1: personal devices either. So there's a lot of concern about
Speaker 1: the national security threats. SEC Commissioner Brandon Carr, we thank you.
Speaker 1: Come back when you perhaps her back from the companies,
Speaker 1: and and indeed let us know if you do manage
Speaker 1: to speak to some of those TikTok executives as well,
Speaker 1: We thank you. Let's talk about deals. Broll com sixty
Speaker 1: one billion dollar deal for vm Ware I was going
Speaker 1: to move forward after a rival bidder failed to emerge
Speaker 1: to break up the deal for the cloud computing company
Speaker 1: during its so called go shop period. That's going into
Speaker 1: people familiar with the matter and the exploration of the
Speaker 1: goo shop gets broad Com past at least one hurdle
Speaker 1: to the biggest ever takeover by semiconductor maker. Representatives for
Speaker 1: vm Ware and broad Colm can immediately be reached for comment.
Speaker 1: The UK or force owners of apps such as social
Speaker 1: media and search engines to curb quote, state innked dis information.
Speaker 1: If they don't, they face fines of as much as
Speaker 1: ten percent of annual global sales. The crackdown is part
Speaker 1: of the forthcoming Online Safety Bill. Meanwhile, the EU IT
Speaker 1: wants to increase the number of tech startups in Europe,
Speaker 1: doing this through the EU Listings app, which is saying
Speaker 1: will make it easier for founders to keep control of
Speaker 1: a firm once it goes public, as well as raising
Speaker 1: some forty five billion in europs. The EU has far
Speaker 1: fewer deep tech firms in the U S and China,
Speaker 1: and the goal is to attract more tech and even
Speaker 1: have them will relocate to Europe, as well as invest
Speaker 1: in women and diverse founders f d x u S
Speaker 1: the crypto exchange co founded by billionaire Sam Magma. Freed
Speaker 1: signs an agreement with Block five that includes an option
Speaker 1: to purchase the crypto lender for as much as two
Speaker 1: million dollars and Bangma Freed spoke exclusively Women in Motion
Speaker 1: aartibasek on Friday. There are synergies between the businesses A
Speaker 1: you know, um, I you know, if you look at
Speaker 1: what what you know Block fay is built out. I
Speaker 1: think they have a loyal customer base. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: they have a real business model. They have a hard
Speaker 1: program that that people love. They's a strong you know,
Speaker 1: they're strong leadership. And I think that we have been
Speaker 1: focusing on a lot of the back end infrastructor right
Speaker 1: on you know, everything from the exchange of matching engine,
Speaker 1: risk engine and everything else. UM and and those match
Speaker 1: up somewhat nicely. And so I think that there are
Speaker 1: a lot of ways that our products can work together
Speaker 1: and can mesh together, um, in a way that's sort
Speaker 1: of better than you know, either would be independently. And
Speaker 1: I will also say that you know, they've been working
Speaker 1: really productively with regulators on you know, building out regulated
Speaker 1: yield products and licensed yield products, which which you know
Speaker 1: we're excited about and excited that they've been doing it
Speaker 1: in a regulated way. I think that's a healthy way
Speaker 1: to do it. And I think that's going to serve
Speaker 1: them well, um, you know, long term um. And it's
Speaker 1: something that you know work Sage work with as well.
Speaker 1: You know you had told political that FTX is looking
Speaker 1: for opportunities to bail out, you know, places where customers
Speaker 1: would otherwise be underwater. But are you worried here about
Speaker 1: moral hazard at all that bailing out a company may
Speaker 1: not actually be what's best for the industry at large.
Speaker 1: It's a good question, and you know, and and guessing
Speaker 1: what you're getting at there is like does that bail
Speaker 1: out a company that really should have failed? And and
Speaker 1: teacher is the wrong lesson to that company? Um? And
Speaker 1: I think what I would say there's two things. First
Speaker 1: of all, I'm way more excited to bail out customers
Speaker 1: than shareholders, right. And so the focus of this is
Speaker 1: not how do we deliver as much shareholder value do
Speaker 1: troubled assets as possible? Right, It's how do we protect customers?
Speaker 1: And I think those imply pretty different things. Um Uh.
Speaker 1: So that that's that's one thing that will say. And
Speaker 1: I think that one of them is way more important
Speaker 1: for the ecosystem, and the other is the one that
Speaker 1: has the biggest moral hazard. Um. The older thing is
Speaker 1: that um uh is that you know, we are trying
Speaker 1: to find who were the responsible players who were building
Speaker 1: out you know, a good business you know, how to
Speaker 1: sustainable model and you know would use short term liquidity
Speaker 1: um and and and that that could help protect customer
Speaker 1: funds built you know, a a a real valuable business
Speaker 1: that I think, um, you know, had something real to
Speaker 1: offer to customers rather than you know, which companies honestly
Speaker 1: should never have existed probably and um and you know
Speaker 1: as of today, you know, maybe we should just let
Speaker 1: let them sort of uh you know, die quiet death. UM.
Speaker 1: I do think that's something that we have been thinking
Speaker 1: about coming up. We're going to speak to the NASA
Speaker 1: Chief Commercial Officer, Jeff Thomas on the abrupt halt companies
Speaker 1: get in public and whether it will pick up in
Speaker 1: the second half. Stay tuned for it. That's a bling bag.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to BLW Technology. I'm Caroline Hind in New York. Now,
Speaker 1: last year, companies defined the pandemic to go public at
Speaker 1: a record pace. Now, macro volatility, inflation, recession phase, you
Speaker 1: name it, it's kind of brought an abrupt end to
Speaker 1: that listing party. Well, next, Jeff Thomas is here to
Speaker 1: tell us nasta's chief Commercial officer joining us Now, Jeff
Speaker 1: is a party of it. Well, if you look at
Speaker 1: the first half, we had a hundred and eight new listings.
Speaker 1: So while that's a dramatic fall off from last year,
Speaker 1: if you go back historically, that was actually a pretty
Speaker 1: good number of new listings for US. And by the way,
Speaker 1: that's compared to twelve on the New York Stock Exchange,
Speaker 1: so we had about an eight percent win rate in
Speaker 1: the first half. What really fell off a cliff was
Speaker 1: the capital raise. So we only saw twelve billion dollars
Speaker 1: raised in the first half of last year, and so
Speaker 1: that was a fraction of what we saw last year
Speaker 1: what we've seen in a typical year, So still seeing
Speaker 1: a number of new listings, but not a lot of
Speaker 1: big listings. At one point it was very very much
Speaker 1: felt like a spack party in one has that gone
Speaker 1: the special purpose acquisition companies. So of the eight i
Speaker 1: p o s we had in the first half, fifty
Speaker 1: nine were spack I p o s. And so you
Speaker 1: did still see new sponsors coming to market. There has
Speaker 1: been a slowdown in that market compared to what we
Speaker 1: saw last year based on kind of the market reception
Speaker 1: on some of the recent spact business combinations as well
Speaker 1: as some proposed new rules from the SEC over. We
Speaker 1: did also see thirty one spack business combinations get completed
Speaker 1: in the first half of this year. So it's still
Speaker 1: a viable way for companies to come to market, but
Speaker 1: definitely under a little bit more scrutiny suddenly, and we've
Speaker 1: had sort of theorized likes of instacr, the likes of
Speaker 1: Discord have made it known that they want to go public.
Speaker 1: How are they now assessing the market, What does the
Speaker 1: backlog look like. I think there's an enormous backlog of
Speaker 1: companies that we've been working with since some of which
Speaker 1: last year, right, So if the company went on file
Speaker 1: confidentially in December, it typically takes two to three months
Speaker 1: to work through the sec comment process. By the time
Speaker 1: they got to the end of that process, they were
Speaker 1: really not going to go into the market as choppy
Speaker 1: it was as it was in Q two. So I
Speaker 1: think everybody's looking for a little bit more stability in
Speaker 1: the market. They want to see the volatility index or
Speaker 1: the VIX come back down below twenty five or twenty
Speaker 1: even um and they want to see some of the
Speaker 1: macro uncertainty get flushed out of the market in terms
Speaker 1: of what's the FED doing on rate hikes, the entire
Speaker 1: geopolitical situation. So we're hopeful we're going to see some
Speaker 1: big deal start to come back to market after Labor Day,
Speaker 1: but it's still a bit uncertain. We'll talk to us
Speaker 1: about therefore, how private companies can help their employee base
Speaker 1: by having some sort of secondary offering, or how we
Speaker 1: can have liquidity events for these businesses, many of which
Speaker 1: have got talent and they need to keep incentivized. I
Speaker 1: know that you were president in Liquidity Solutions before you
Speaker 1: talked about you know, when you're in the private market,
Speaker 1: how you can have these sorts of events. What are
Speaker 1: people looking at? That's right, So NASDAC private market is
Speaker 1: still a very viable alternative as long as the private
Speaker 1: capital markets hold up. We still see a lot of
Speaker 1: capital available in the private market. Gets although we are
Speaker 1: starting to see valuations come down in the private markets
Speaker 1: to follow along with the public markets. And so whether
Speaker 1: companies are going to do a tender offer out to
Speaker 1: give a broad based liquidity for their employees, whether they
Speaker 1: want to run an auction to do some price discovery
Speaker 1: and see what's the true value of their common stock now,
Speaker 1: or just do one off block sales for some of
Speaker 1: the founders in early execs. NASA Private Market has a
Speaker 1: great platform to help companies achieve that liquidity while they're
Speaker 1: waiting a little bit longer for the I p O.
Speaker 1: How many of those companies actually want to look in
Speaker 1: those sorts of new valuations though, because some of them
Speaker 1: are eye watering. When we're looking at the reports about Klana,
Speaker 1: for example, Well, I think you know, if you look
Speaker 1: at it, there's a lot of companies on the public
Speaker 1: side whose valuations have been compressed, and so it makes
Speaker 1: sense that companies on the private side would see a
Speaker 1: similar compression, especially those in a similar sector. And so
Speaker 1: one of the things we track really closely is the
Speaker 1: price to earnings multiple in the public markets relative to
Speaker 1: the ten year interest rate. And there's a pretty clear
Speaker 1: trend over time that has that tenure interest rate goes up,
Speaker 1: pe multiples come down because those future cash flows or
Speaker 1: lack thereof, are a little bit less valuable in a
Speaker 1: high interest rate environment. Who are some of the pools
Speaker 1: of money who are still willing to commit to this
Speaker 1: private market at the moment, or indeed to new recent
Speaker 1: I p O s. We've heard of certain institutions looking
Speaker 1: to actually help bridge that gap when companies are unable
Speaker 1: to raise new funding rounds or indeed go to the
Speaker 1: public markets. That's right, I think a lot of folks
Speaker 1: will look to step in. The question a lot of
Speaker 1: companies are asking about is should I raise that new
Speaker 1: round at equity where I have to price the round
Speaker 1: or is it better to do some type of a
Speaker 1: convertible debt security where I can bridge around without having
Speaker 1: to price that. Part of this is the psychology of
Speaker 1: the founders and ceo s out there. You know, they
Speaker 1: just raised a round and funding. Last year they probably
Speaker 1: announced that very proudly to their employees, and now they're
Speaker 1: probably reticent to go out and announce a new lower
Speaker 1: round valuation, even though that's probably where the market will clear.
Speaker 1: So trade off between debt and equity is something we
Speaker 1: hear a lot of companies talking about. And what about
Speaker 1: where companies are coming from? Are they all US domestic based?
Speaker 1: Of course there used to be that time where as
Speaker 1: the Chinese based companies wanted to list in the US.
Speaker 1: Is that sort of fall in a file as well? Well.
Speaker 1: We definitely have seen some headwinds in terms of recruiting
Speaker 1: international listings along with a lot of the geopolitical uncertainty,
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of UH nationalism in the search
Speaker 1: for new listings. So while things have slowed down a
Speaker 1: bit with the Chinese listings, while we've been working through
Speaker 1: some of the accounting issues that the SEC is working
Speaker 1: with their regulators on, we have seen an increase in
Speaker 1: demand from companies in Southeast Asia, Latin America and other
Speaker 1: emerging markets. So for US investors, you know, we think
Speaker 1: it's critical that we keep attracting these high growth companies
Speaker 1: from emerging markets to the US capital markets, So we're
Speaker 1: hard to work on that. And what about the innovation
Speaker 1: on your side? What more are you looking to do
Speaker 1: at the moment in terms of ensuring that they keep
Speaker 1: on coming to NaSTA Because you say you've got a
Speaker 1: big win rate, how are you looking to Joel, You're busy.
Speaker 1: If indeed the pool of companies wanting to come to
Speaker 1: market is a little bit smaller, well, we always like
Speaker 1: to say we have solutions for companies at every stage
Speaker 1: of their life cycle. So we talked a little bit
Speaker 1: about how NAZDAC private market can help with liquidity pre
Speaker 1: I p O. Once you're a public company, an issue
Speaker 1: that's getting more and more important is what are you
Speaker 1: doing around your E s G disclosures? The SEC has
Speaker 1: proposed some rules around climate disclosure, so we're actively working
Speaker 1: with our issuers to advocate on their behalf with the
Speaker 1: SEC to make sure that those new regulations are reasonable.
Speaker 1: At the same time, we're looking into what are the
Speaker 1: commercially viable options for us to help our companies with
Speaker 1: these new reporting requirements from regulators, investors, and all of
Speaker 1: their stakeholders. So we recently completed the acquisition of Metrio
Speaker 1: and E s G KPI reporting platform that's going to
Speaker 1: help companies accelerate the way that they report their non
Speaker 1: financial metrics. And let's just talk a little bit. When
Speaker 1: you think of the S, G immediately started to think
Speaker 1: of the moves that ASDA was making and showing that, well,
Speaker 1: the s was uplifted as well, not just environmental, but
Speaker 1: thinking about diversity on boards and who you have on
Speaker 1: and listening, how is that conversation going. How much investors
Speaker 1: sort to be blunt caring about that at the moment. Well,
Speaker 1: I think one of the hallmarks of a great market
Speaker 1: is to have great corporate governance standards, and that's why
Speaker 1: we did introduce a new disclosure rule around board diversity.
Speaker 1: We think it's a critical part for investors to be
Speaker 1: informed about the diversity of companies boards and so we've
Speaker 1: seen a great response from that in terms of both
Speaker 1: companies UH and investors. And as you mentioned on the
Speaker 1: S there is a lot of work that's going into
Speaker 1: especially around human capital management within the issuers and how
Speaker 1: they're thinking about their employee base, especially during this challenging time. Jeff,
Speaker 1: it's great to catch up with you. Thank you spending
Speaker 1: a time. Jeff thomasr VP at NASDAC. Let's talk about
Speaker 1: crypto for a cause now, because in the world a
Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies actually fundraising events have been forming around all types
Speaker 1: of causes. Now with the overturn of rovers as way,
Speaker 1: digital assets are being looked to potentially aid women around
Speaker 1: the country with some of the costs that they might
Speaker 1: have traveling outside of state. For example. Listen, Marcaline is
Speaker 1: with us CEO of Women Labs and are we pleased
Speaker 1: to have some time with you just talk to us
Speaker 1: a little bit about what Women Labs is looking to
Speaker 1: do in terms of while forming some sort of tao
Speaker 1: of course around supporting from a decentralized, automous organization funding
Speaker 1: women to be able to still access abortions. Yes. So,
Speaker 1: I think one of the really interesting things we've started
Speaker 1: to see as a surge in the world of n
Speaker 1: f T s in crypto as a lever for social activism.
Speaker 1: So people are now going to crypto, They're going to
Speaker 1: n f T s as a way to donate money
Speaker 1: in order to support causes like planned parenthood. We my
Speaker 1: organization RANS an n f T project called crypto checks,
Speaker 1: and we were actually back all the way back in January.
Speaker 1: We were the first crypto donation ever to IPPF, which
Speaker 1: is the parent organization of Planned Parenthood. So I think
Speaker 1: we're starting to see n f t S as a
Speaker 1: fundraising measure, but I believe we'll also start to see
Speaker 1: one step further than that, where decentralized autonomous organizations, which
Speaker 1: are basically self governed entities, will start to create this
Speaker 1: network nationwide of people that live in safe states where
Speaker 1: women can get an abortion in a safe clinic legally,
Speaker 1: and people that live in states where they in the
Speaker 1: past couple of weeks woke up in the morning and
Speaker 1: realize that if they need access to to an abortion
Speaker 1: or safe reproductive healthcare, they no longer can legally do
Speaker 1: that in their state, and a DOW can provide the
Speaker 1: mechanism to not only just connect women, but to be
Speaker 1: able to sponsor emergency trips to states where women can
Speaker 1: get access to safe healthcare. So the really interesting thing
Speaker 1: with this is that for people who are upset about
Speaker 1: what just happened with over Turning Road v Wade, now
Speaker 1: there's an opportunity to really get involved in a mobilized,
Speaker 1: action driven way instead of just getting out into the
Speaker 1: streets and protesting, which we've seen over the past few
Speaker 1: years with various different human rights causes, doesn't always have
Speaker 1: as much of an impact as we would love to
Speaker 1: see an actually driving change. So I think this is
Speaker 1: a really great way to actually mobilize people who are
Speaker 1: passionate about how can I wake up in the morning
Speaker 1: and and actually do something that has a difference in
Speaker 1: this cause. Do you think it brings new people to
Speaker 1: the world of cryptoconnocies. I think it does. I think
Speaker 1: there was this kind of misconception and a lot of
Speaker 1: people's minds still about the fact that um crypto is
Speaker 1: associated with the deep dark web, right, and now we
Speaker 1: are seeing that yes, it is actually creating this this
Speaker 1: underground network, but it's an underground network for good where
Speaker 1: you're able to connect people from all around the world
Speaker 1: to drive together towards something that is fundamentally what we
Speaker 1: believe in driving human rights. So I think it is
Speaker 1: bringing new people in. What is also a misconception is
Speaker 1: that crypto is in some way anonymous, because the blockchain
Speaker 1: makes it evidently clear that it's not anonymous. So how
Speaker 1: do you work out how do you ensure that you're
Speaker 1: protecting so the women who are actually using the funds
Speaker 1: to ensure that they are legally protected in some way. Yes,
Speaker 1: so I would I would strongly advise anyone who is
Speaker 1: getting involved or the recipient of any of these types
Speaker 1: of funds to use your crypto and a self hosted wallet,
Speaker 1: so that means that you own the keys to your wallet,
Speaker 1: using a cold wallet like Ledger or any of those
Speaker 1: other providers, and not using in storing platforms that you
Speaker 1: might be more traditionally familiar with like coin base. For
Speaker 1: there's news recently that came out that coin based might
Speaker 1: be selling geo tracking data to the government, and we're
Speaker 1: waiting to hear on a Freedom of Information Act exactly
Speaker 1: the extent of that information that's being shared. But I
Speaker 1: would just caution people to realize that when you are
Speaker 1: using a centralized body as a platform for sending crypto,
Speaker 1: they are tracking your information. So if you're using something
Speaker 1: that purely lives on the black chain that you manage
Speaker 1: and host and story yourself, then you can maintain that
Speaker 1: anonymity that you're looking for in a situation like this
Speaker 1: where you're worried about potentially being tracked by the government,
Speaker 1: And of course we'll we'll look to get some sort
Speaker 1: of reaction from coin based and other more centralized entities
Speaker 1: on that fact. But Alyssa, I'm I'm interested in your
Speaker 1: perspective more broadly on when we're at a time of
Speaker 1: great volatility. I mean, I look at, of course, crypto chicks.
Speaker 1: What you've provided in a lot of it is n
Speaker 1: f T projects. Of course, n f T s have
Speaker 1: lost a lawful lot of their value and indeed an
Speaker 1: awful lot of their minting. And I'm interested as to
Speaker 1: whether that makes people less willing. I would think of
Speaker 1: the height of the crypto craze, money was raised like
Speaker 1: within a click of your thumbs about around, you know,
Speaker 1: buying the constitution for example, how quickly you're able to
Speaker 1: raise funds and this more difficult environment, we saw incredible
Speaker 1: excitement from the market. I think there's a lot of
Speaker 1: people in the crypto industry and even outside of the
Speaker 1: crypto industry industry that we're just outraged with the news
Speaker 1: that that came to light in the past couple of weeks,
Speaker 1: and people who are thinking about this as an opportunity
Speaker 1: to really be a part of driving change in history.
Speaker 1: And so we had people just outpouring support from our community,
Speaker 1: but from the broader community as well, and there's a
Speaker 1: few other projects that are doing similar fundraising measures to
Speaker 1: to raise to be able to donate back to organizations
Speaker 1: like plant Parenthood, and the whole market has been rallying
Speaker 1: and support behind these initiatives, which has been very heartwarming
Speaker 1: to see, as you said, even in light of the
Speaker 1: fact that there's a bear market happening right now in
Speaker 1: the crypto world. Do you think dows in general will
Speaker 1: be used more prominently going forward for chariteable endeavors need
Speaker 1: not be about fundraising for something suchuch as this, but
Speaker 1: just the more accountable way of raising funds from no
Speaker 1: matter what way. Absolutely there's complete transparency with how the
Speaker 1: funds are used, and every person that is donating and
Speaker 1: participate in within the ecosystem gets to say and how
Speaker 1: the funds are then distributed, and so for every individual
Speaker 1: individual person to feel like they are a partial owner
Speaker 1: of what's being created and then what's being distributed. I
Speaker 1: think that's a lot more action oriented and from a
Speaker 1: personal impact perspective, a lot of people feel like they're
Speaker 1: actually really driving change and being a part of that,
Speaker 1: and so having that sense of closeness towards the results
Speaker 1: of what you're putting your funds towards does really help
Speaker 1: to get people a little bit more involved. So I
Speaker 1: think there will be plenty more initiatives that come out
Speaker 1: of the world of Taos that are charitable or social
Speaker 1: impact oriented in nature out of interest of you looked
Speaker 1: for celebrity endorsement in any way of these funds going
Speaker 1: towards a helping abortions. In some way, I felt like
Speaker 1: n f T has got very much caught up in
Speaker 1: the world of celebrity and kind of has back fard somewhat.
Speaker 1: As everyone's taken off their their n f T s
Speaker 1: from the Twitter handles and the light we we are
Speaker 1: connected with a few very high profile women who are
Speaker 1: excited to be involved off with what we're building, and
Speaker 1: and we feel like that's been really helpful for us
Speaker 1: because as a lot of women are kind of scared
Speaker 1: of the world of crypto, seeing familiar faces that you
Speaker 1: respect and know are really high profile individuals in in
Speaker 1: the mass media world. Having those people be a part
Speaker 1: of the ecosystem and a part of a part of
Speaker 1: the community helps to to normalize it a little bit.
Speaker 1: And so I think the people that have really been
Speaker 1: interested in crypto and n f T s still are.
Speaker 1: They're still active advocates and and we are connected with
Speaker 1: quite a few of those that we are excited to
Speaker 1: be to be sharing. Son, have you kind of changed
Speaker 1: your narrative though a little bit as to you say,
Speaker 1: people who are slightly scared of the world of crypto,
Speaker 1: how do you ensure that people are doing this with
Speaker 1: the financial literacy that you want to ensure that they have,
Speaker 1: that they could lose an awful lot of money when
Speaker 1: putting it to work in an investment perspective. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying that your fundraising is in any way that related,
Speaker 1: but for example and more of your older n f
Speaker 1: T projects. Yeah, so I think it's really important to
Speaker 1: educate specifically women who, as we know from public stock
Speaker 1: market data, are a little bit more risk averse in
Speaker 1: their investments, educating on what is the impact are you
Speaker 1: investing in something that you view as a short term
Speaker 1: r O I are you thinking about this from a
Speaker 1: long term investment horizon and really encouraging people to do
Speaker 1: a significant amount of research before they invest in anything
Speaker 1: with the assumption that, yes, there may be a downturn
Speaker 1: in the market right now, but as you look across
Speaker 1: the whole, the whole, the whole tech market in terms
Speaker 1: of risk assets in stocks, everything is down. And so
Speaker 1: if we are encouraging people to spend this time doing
Speaker 1: a lot of research and understanding what do they view
Speaker 1: being around and being a really strong driving factor in
Speaker 1: the n f T or crypto industry in one year
Speaker 1: from now or two years from now. And if people
Speaker 1: want to then invest, they invest with a lot more
Speaker 1: conviction having had the time and energy invested in educating themselves.
Speaker 1: And we, of course as a community, put a lot
Speaker 1: of effort into making sure that women across the gamut
Speaker 1: of Web three are well educated on what are all
Speaker 1: the different terms, What are the ways that you can invest,
Speaker 1: What are the ways that you can get involved in
Speaker 1: the industry beyond just being a collector or an investor,
Speaker 1: but also being an entrepreneur project builder as well. Women
Speaker 1: lad CEO Alissa Martime, thank you so much spending some
Speaker 1: time talking about some of your latest focus. Meanwhile, coming
Speaker 1: up a Broomberg scoop details on how Washington wants to
Speaker 1: Beijing's plan to become a world leader in chip production.
Speaker 1: This is a Broomberg now to a Blueberg scoop the
Speaker 1: US is pushing the Netherlands to van a s mL
Speaker 1: from selling chip making gear to China. This is according
Speaker 1: to people familiar with the matter joining US now as
Speaker 1: blogs Eric Martin, who helped break that very story. So
Speaker 1: this is at a time where we look at potentially
Speaker 1: US we're using some tarifs from China, but still looking
Speaker 1: to well ensure that some of the technology isn't going
Speaker 1: that direction. That's absolutely right, Caroline Uh. This is something
Speaker 1: that we've seen both the Trump administration and now the
Speaker 1: Biden administration United in terms of trying to stop China's advance.
Speaker 1: China looking to catch up and sort of pass the
Speaker 1: US in terms of high technology, and one of the
Speaker 1: choke points in their bid to do so is this
Speaker 1: lithography equipment, this equipment for printing computer chips. And what
Speaker 1: we understand is that US officials have been pressuring the
Speaker 1: Netherlands and a s mL UH to stop providing China
Speaker 1: with this equipment. China produces very little of its own
Speaker 1: equipment for this process, and so this is really an
Speaker 1: area where if China can't get access to it through
Speaker 1: a s mL, which provides about of this UH equipment,
Speaker 1: has market share globally. It really could put the brakes
Speaker 1: on their ability to catch up with the US on printing,
Speaker 1: not even just the most high tech kinds of computer chips,
Speaker 1: but even kind of more mature, older computer chips as well.
Speaker 1: Do you think has m L will do it? Do
Speaker 1: you think the Netherlands will will agree? Well, that that's
Speaker 1: something that we that we're under that we understand that
Speaker 1: they have not yet agreed to what the US has
Speaker 1: been asking for. But this is certainly a place where
Speaker 1: the Biden administration has been looking to build consensus with allies.
Speaker 1: We understand that a similar request has been made of
Speaker 1: Japan and Nikon in terms of the one other major
Speaker 1: company to have about uh the very small percentage, very
Speaker 1: small minority of that market, the part that that a
Speaker 1: SML does not have. But this has been an area
Speaker 1: where the Biden administration has been working with allies globally
Speaker 1: to try to align export controls to make sure that
Speaker 1: something that trying to get from one country to prevent
Speaker 1: them from getting it from another. Our Martin, it's a
Speaker 1: great scoop. We thank you for bringing it a truly
Speaker 1: global perspective coming from the chip industry, and indeed, as
Speaker 1: we continue to keep abreast of what Washington is doing
Speaker 1: in terms of those tariffs on Chinese goods. Meanwhile, well
Speaker 1: that does it for this addition of Bloom Big Technology,
Speaker 1: Well cook off our coverage from Sun Valley beginning Wednesday,
Speaker 1: the number of great guests including twenty three and CEO
Speaker 1: so Far, CEO, Event Rights, CEO, I've got a few
Speaker 1: there for you, indeed, chairmans too. Don't forget to check
Speaker 1: out our new podcasts as well. You can find it
Speaker 1: on the terminal as well as online on Apple, Spotify.
Speaker 1: And I heard from New York the subreme Berg pick
Speaker 1: wi a pick wick, a kick, whip, a pick a whip,
Speaker 1: hip a pip He would a hip wi a ship
Speaker 1: stick to it