WEBVTT - Bewitched: Everything You Didn't Know

0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:10.240
<v Speaker 1>Too Much Information is a production of iHeartRadio. Hello everyone,

0:00:10.280 --> 0:00:13.079
<v Speaker 1>and welcome to another episode of Too Much Information, the

0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.360
<v Speaker 1>show that brings you the secret histories and little known

0:00:15.440 --> 0:00:19.040
<v Speaker 1>facts and figures behind your favorite movies, music, TV shows

0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:22.600
<v Speaker 1>and more. We are your dueling Darren's of Details. You're

0:00:22.680 --> 0:00:26.000
<v Speaker 1>Larry Taits of Tedium. Your uncle Arthur is of awesomely

0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:29.120
<v Speaker 1>inaned facts twitching up god knows how many hours of

0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:30.280
<v Speaker 1>mid century trivia.

0:00:30.880 --> 0:00:33.600
<v Speaker 2>My name's Jordan Runtogg and I'm Alex Heigel.

0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:36.640
<v Speaker 1>And today we are talking about one of the pillars

0:00:36.640 --> 0:00:37.600
<v Speaker 1>of my beloved.

0:00:37.320 --> 0:00:39.040
<v Speaker 2>Nicket night TV programming block.

0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:42.839
<v Speaker 1>It's one half of the supernatural women on sitcoms in

0:00:42.880 --> 0:00:46.280
<v Speaker 1>the mid sixties, dimming their shine for totally mediocre Dude's Access.

0:00:47.640 --> 0:00:49.080
<v Speaker 2>No not, I Dream of Jeannie.

0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:52.320
<v Speaker 1>The other one, though, as we'll discuss their basically sister shows.

0:00:52.720 --> 0:00:57.720
<v Speaker 1>I'm talking about Bewitched. Premiering sixty years ago this September,

0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:00.720
<v Speaker 1>it quickly became one of the highest rated shows on television,

0:01:01.200 --> 0:01:04.160
<v Speaker 1>airing for eight seasons on ABC between nineteen sixty four

0:01:04.160 --> 0:01:07.240
<v Speaker 1>and nineteen seventy two. Bewitched follows the adventures of a

0:01:07.280 --> 0:01:10.920
<v Speaker 1>friendly witch named Samantha, played by the legendary Elizabeth Montgomery,

0:01:11.040 --> 0:01:14.319
<v Speaker 1>who marries a mortal named Darren famously played by two

0:01:14.360 --> 0:01:17.160
<v Speaker 1>different men named Dick, and her attempts to live as

0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:19.000
<v Speaker 1>an ordinary suburban housewife.

0:01:19.560 --> 0:01:21.920
<v Speaker 2>Hilarity ensues.

0:01:23.240 --> 0:01:25.960
<v Speaker 1>I don't have super deep emotions about this show, and

0:01:26.040 --> 0:01:30.720
<v Speaker 1>in fact, I think, yeah, how could you really? Upon

0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:34.440
<v Speaker 1>revisiting it, I am thoroughly charmed by Elizabeth Montgomery. I

0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:36.760
<v Speaker 1>forgot like how great she is to watch, and like

0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:39.880
<v Speaker 1>fun she is and everything. Yeah, but I as a kid,

0:01:39.920 --> 0:01:42.120
<v Speaker 1>I think I gave the edge to Genie on a

0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:44.560
<v Speaker 1>Dream of Genie because first of all, I like space

0:01:44.720 --> 0:01:47.200
<v Speaker 1>and Tony Nelson was an astronaut and I thought the

0:01:47.200 --> 0:01:49.880
<v Speaker 1>whole Middle Eastern thing was more cool and exotic.

0:01:50.000 --> 0:01:52.320
<v Speaker 2>But I also love to be witch problematic of you

0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:55.960
<v Speaker 2>come on the bottle like I having a clubhouse.

0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:57.880
<v Speaker 1>I was like that bottles pretty cool.

0:01:58.280 --> 0:02:02.080
<v Speaker 2>Ooh, I don't know. We'll see if you get canceled yet. No,

0:02:02.200 --> 0:02:04.120
<v Speaker 2>I'm kidding, that's all fine, don't panic about that, like

0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:05.880
<v Speaker 2>I know you will. Haiger.

0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:07.280
<v Speaker 1>What do you think about Bewitch? Do you like it

0:02:07.280 --> 0:02:11.040
<v Speaker 1>better than the Brady Bunch? Yes, because it's got a

0:02:11.080 --> 0:02:11.600
<v Speaker 1>witch in it.

0:02:12.200 --> 0:02:16.160
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, fair. I remember watching this and also I

0:02:16.240 --> 0:02:21.040
<v Speaker 2>dream of Genie, but I took absolutely nothing from them, sure,

0:02:21.639 --> 0:02:24.440
<v Speaker 2>like in one ear and out the other man. And

0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.120
<v Speaker 2>I think it's because like in those days, like I

0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:30.120
<v Speaker 2>didn't really have like a sense of narrative television because

0:02:30.160 --> 0:02:33.640
<v Speaker 2>everything was I was watching was syndicated. Yeah, So I

0:02:33.800 --> 0:02:35.360
<v Speaker 2>was just like I was like, there, I don't know

0:02:35.400 --> 0:02:37.440
<v Speaker 2>these plots. I don't know anything, and I kind of

0:02:37.440 --> 0:02:39.600
<v Speaker 2>gravitate towards that still, like I am one of those

0:02:39.639 --> 0:02:43.160
<v Speaker 2>blasphemous X Files fans. That's like I wish every single

0:02:43.200 --> 0:02:45.680
<v Speaker 2>episode was Monster of the Week. I don't care about

0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:49.760
<v Speaker 2>the overch and kids, like I'm bad like that. But

0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:54.240
<v Speaker 2>so because of that, I just don't remember anything about this,

0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:56.880
<v Speaker 2>like there was nothing to golm Onto except I also

0:02:56.960 --> 0:03:01.320
<v Speaker 2>remember finding Elizabeth Montgomery like charming as hell. Yes, And

0:03:01.960 --> 0:03:05.040
<v Speaker 2>I remember and Dora, Yeah, I feel like you'd like

0:03:05.080 --> 0:03:09.720
<v Speaker 2>Andorra Yeah yeah, Wisecracker love it. And I just remember

0:03:09.720 --> 0:03:12.160
<v Speaker 2>then reading about like in all of my coffee table

0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:14.960
<v Speaker 2>books about the mid middle of the twentieth century that

0:03:15.000 --> 0:03:17.720
<v Speaker 2>I read of a lot of which probably shared with you,

0:03:18.360 --> 0:03:21.000
<v Speaker 2>that you know, they switched Dix and that was such

0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:24.040
<v Speaker 2>a big thing. But yeah, man, I don't know. I

0:03:24.960 --> 0:03:27.400
<v Speaker 2>I think at the vague sense of disappointment is my

0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:30.960
<v Speaker 2>only kind of of well just to being like this

0:03:31.000 --> 0:03:35.040
<v Speaker 2>isn't witchy, oh, or like yeah, this isn't you know

0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:38.600
<v Speaker 2>because I'm watching this in like nineteen ninety four five,

0:03:39.160 --> 0:03:42.200
<v Speaker 2>I was like, I had an established notion of witchcraft

0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:46.200
<v Speaker 2>by the already, Yeah, as any child should. So yeah,

0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:47.480
<v Speaker 2>going back to this, I was like, I don't I

0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:52.880
<v Speaker 2>don't understand this, but I understand Elizabeth Montgomery. So you

0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:55.400
<v Speaker 2>thought there was a bait and switch. Yeah, yeah, I

0:03:55.480 --> 0:03:57.680
<v Speaker 2>was deceived by the amount of black magic that I

0:03:57.720 --> 0:04:03.040
<v Speaker 2>was promised. The black magic too suburban drama. Yeah was unequal.

0:04:03.040 --> 0:04:05.960
<v Speaker 2>It was uneven. Okay, So I have a pretty robust foundation.

0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.080
<v Speaker 2>I just don't remember any of them other than that

0:04:08.120 --> 0:04:10.400
<v Speaker 2>I watched them. But I mean that's what mid century

0:04:10.440 --> 0:04:13.800
<v Speaker 2>sitcoms are for. You watch them, you don't get invested.

0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:15.600
<v Speaker 2>Although I do say.

0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:17.480
<v Speaker 1>I feel like Bewitched is important in the history of

0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:20.000
<v Speaker 1>television because it's one of the first shows where it's

0:04:20.000 --> 0:04:22.520
<v Speaker 1>dirty laundry was aired in public in real time.

0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:23.799
<v Speaker 2>Because, as we'll touch.

0:04:23.600 --> 0:04:26.960
<v Speaker 1>On with the Dicks with with the Dicks, yes, several

0:04:27.000 --> 0:04:29.880
<v Speaker 1>of the cast members died mid series, and Dick Yark

0:04:29.920 --> 0:04:32.520
<v Speaker 1>had to be replace after five seasons by Dick Sergeant

0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:35.960
<v Speaker 1>as Darren the male lead. So, as far as I'm concerned,

0:04:36.000 --> 0:04:38.680
<v Speaker 1>Bewitch was like behind the scenes TV drama one oh

0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:41.240
<v Speaker 1>one and helped pave the way for stuff like each

0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:44.200
<v Speaker 1>true Hollywood stories because you know, everyone kind of knew

0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.640
<v Speaker 1>that there was some dirt and shadiness under the slick

0:04:46.720 --> 0:04:50.000
<v Speaker 1>sitcom veneer, and they sent producers of those kinds of

0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:53.280
<v Speaker 1>docudrama TV shows to start looking at like you know,

0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:56.240
<v Speaker 1>the Brady Bunch or a Dream of Genie or family

0:04:56.279 --> 0:04:59.640
<v Speaker 1>Affair stuff like that. So anyway, I feel like Bewitched

0:04:59.680 --> 0:05:01.640
<v Speaker 1>has an important place in TV history for that. It

0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:05.600
<v Speaker 1>just seems tailor made for these people. Magazine expose's and

0:05:05.640 --> 0:05:06.760
<v Speaker 1>we'll be quoting from a few.

0:05:06.880 --> 0:05:10.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, I can't summon up any feelings. Even

0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:13.000
<v Speaker 2>my usual bile has left me. I'm just like, yeah,

0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:16.359
<v Speaker 2>give Elizabeth Montgomery her flowers. Whatever. Man, she's cute. She

0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.200
<v Speaker 2>did the wiggle, the face wiggle thing face wiggle, that's fine.

0:05:19.320 --> 0:05:21.240
<v Speaker 2>She worked hard and she did good things for a

0:05:21.240 --> 0:05:21.800
<v Speaker 2>lot of people.

0:05:21.960 --> 0:05:25.640
<v Speaker 1>As we're talking about cool cool lady, and I should

0:05:25.640 --> 0:05:27.400
<v Speaker 1>have saved this at the very end, but I'm gonna

0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:29.000
<v Speaker 1>say it to you now because I think it'll maybe

0:05:29.760 --> 0:05:31.839
<v Speaker 1>flavor of the rest of this episode for you. Did

0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:35.919
<v Speaker 1>you know that her last performance, it came out just

0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:39.680
<v Speaker 1>after she died, by her request, was a voiceover performance

0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:42.599
<v Speaker 1>for your beloved Batman, the animated series. She played a barmaid.

0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:45.680
<v Speaker 1>That was her last performance. Yeah, I love that.

0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:49.440
<v Speaker 2>I think they dedicated the episode to her. Oh that's wonderful. Yeah,

0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:50.240
<v Speaker 2>she's super cool.

0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:54.240
<v Speaker 1>But aside from dirt and behind the scenes stories allow

0:05:54.320 --> 0:05:57.599
<v Speaker 1>me to over intellectualize some of the precise reasons why

0:05:57.640 --> 0:06:00.760
<v Speaker 1>Bewitch has meant so much to so many. As initially

0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:03.680
<v Speaker 1>conceived and even outlined in the show bible, the focus

0:06:03.720 --> 0:06:06.800
<v Speaker 1>of the show wasn't supposed to be on magic or witchcraft,

0:06:06.839 --> 0:06:09.800
<v Speaker 1>as you noted. Instead, it was a subversion of an

0:06:09.920 --> 0:06:13.039
<v Speaker 1>old and tired plot line where a working class man

0:06:13.320 --> 0:06:16.080
<v Speaker 1>marries a woman and afterwards finds out that she's from

0:06:16.080 --> 0:06:19.479
<v Speaker 1>an extremely rich family, and the man then struggles to

0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:22.960
<v Speaker 1>maintain his stubborn insistence that they live within their means.

0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:25.480
<v Speaker 1>This obviously meant a lot more in the sixties, when

0:06:25.520 --> 0:06:27.160
<v Speaker 1>men were supposed to be the breadwinner and the head

0:06:27.200 --> 0:06:29.920
<v Speaker 1>of the household and all that. So, in short, Bewitch

0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:32.599
<v Speaker 1>was about a man trying to maintain social norms and

0:06:32.680 --> 0:06:35.719
<v Speaker 1>retain his dominance despite the fact that his wife is

0:06:35.800 --> 0:06:38.760
<v Speaker 1>far more powerful. And in that way, it's a very

0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:42.520
<v Speaker 1>powerful proto feminist concept, at least as far as nineteen

0:06:42.560 --> 0:06:46.720
<v Speaker 1>sixty four network sitcoms were concerned. Interestingly, Elizabeth Montgomery actually

0:06:46.720 --> 0:06:49.440
<v Speaker 1>refused to wear a brawl in later seasons, and it's

0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:52.520
<v Speaker 1>a subtle nod to the women's liberation movement. Oh, I

0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:55.960
<v Speaker 1>bet it was subtle, But I mean, it's just like

0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:58.080
<v Speaker 1>a crazy thing that can like sneak onto a network

0:06:58.120 --> 0:07:01.839
<v Speaker 1>sitcom in like nineteen seventies. Yeah, the Witch was expected

0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.640
<v Speaker 1>to be subservient, lesser than her man, and that's just

0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:08.719
<v Speaker 1>not who she was. One of the early writers of

0:07:08.760 --> 0:07:11.280
<v Speaker 1>The Witch, Danny Arnold, believed that the main theme of

0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:13.640
<v Speaker 1>the show is the conflict of a powerful woman and

0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:17.040
<v Speaker 1>a husband who cannot deal with that power, and also

0:07:17.120 --> 0:07:19.880
<v Speaker 1>the woman's mother who's furious that she married beneath her station.

0:07:20.720 --> 0:07:23.200
<v Speaker 1>In February nineteen sixty four, just a few months before

0:07:23.200 --> 0:07:27.400
<v Speaker 1>Bewitch premiered, Betty Freudan, the legendary.

0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:33.560
<v Speaker 2>Freedom I talk about a Freudian slip. Oh wow, I'll

0:07:33.680 --> 0:07:34.000
<v Speaker 2>keep that.

0:07:35.840 --> 0:07:40.000
<v Speaker 1>Betty fri Dan, the legendary feminist writer philosopher. I don't

0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:41.920
<v Speaker 1>even know how you'd sum up her work, who wrote

0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:44.720
<v Speaker 1>The Feminine Mystique, wrote a two part essay for the

0:07:44.760 --> 0:07:48.240
<v Speaker 1>TV Guide called Television and the Feminine Mystique, in which

0:07:48.280 --> 0:07:52.360
<v Speaker 1>she lamented the fact that women on sitcoms were quote simplistic, manipulative,

0:07:52.400 --> 0:07:55.720
<v Speaker 1>and insecure household drudges whose time was spent in dreaming

0:07:55.800 --> 0:08:00.000
<v Speaker 1>of love and plotting revenge on their husbands. But Samantha Stevens,

0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:03.040
<v Speaker 1>the witch from Bewitched, was very different, and her mother,

0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:05.560
<v Speaker 1>who hates that she married a mortal, speaks of Samantha's

0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:07.640
<v Speaker 1>household duties in language that seems to.

0:08:07.520 --> 0:08:09.520
<v Speaker 2>Come straight from the feminine mystique.

0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:11.720
<v Speaker 1>She's basically saying, you know you're better than this, Be

0:08:11.800 --> 0:08:14.920
<v Speaker 1>who you are. It's funny because in recent years and Dora,

0:08:15.040 --> 0:08:17.640
<v Speaker 1>who is conceived as a metalsome mother in law character

0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:20.760
<v Speaker 1>archetype for the show, has actually gained more sympathy than

0:08:20.840 --> 0:08:23.320
<v Speaker 1>Darren Stevens, the every man who married a witch and

0:08:23.360 --> 0:08:25.840
<v Speaker 1>wants her to, you know, act like a normal housewife.

0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:28.880
<v Speaker 1>Many evolved in the making of Bewitch said that they

0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:31.480
<v Speaker 1>deliberately intended the show to be analogous to real life

0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:36.160
<v Speaker 1>mixed marriages. Darren and Samantha decided to conceal Sam's true identity,

0:08:36.760 --> 0:08:39.559
<v Speaker 1>while in real life many couples concealed the race, ethnicity,

0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:42.600
<v Speaker 1>or religion of one of their spouses. And the LGBTQ

0:08:42.720 --> 0:08:46.040
<v Speaker 1>community also embraced Bewitch because many related to Samantha feeling

0:08:46.080 --> 0:08:48.160
<v Speaker 1>as though she just to disguise her true self in

0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:51.719
<v Speaker 1>order to pass in a much more dull, homogeneous world.

0:08:52.120 --> 0:08:54.800
<v Speaker 1>This despite the fact that her true self is quite

0:08:54.800 --> 0:08:55.760
<v Speaker 1>literally magical.

0:08:56.640 --> 0:08:59.000
<v Speaker 2>So there's a lot to unpack. Yeah, and I mean,

0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:01.280
<v Speaker 2>I think this whole era is just so fascinating to

0:09:01.360 --> 0:09:04.480
<v Speaker 2>me because as a horror dork, because you know, it's

0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:08.040
<v Speaker 2>so much of it is directly traceable to Universal Studios,

0:09:08.920 --> 0:09:12.320
<v Speaker 2>really shaping the nature of how we thought about this stuff,

0:09:12.360 --> 0:09:18.160
<v Speaker 2>because you know, those films were so gigantic in their era,

0:09:18.320 --> 0:09:20.960
<v Speaker 2>but by this time when the television comes along, they

0:09:21.040 --> 0:09:24.040
<v Speaker 2>had really started to slow. They were well into their meat.

0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:27.040
<v Speaker 2>S Abbott and Costello face, I love what you hate

0:09:27.080 --> 0:09:31.080
<v Speaker 2>that yeah, and you know, of the canonical sort of

0:09:31.320 --> 0:09:34.920
<v Speaker 2>monsters that we think of like Frankenstein, Dracula, Wolfman, Mummy,

0:09:35.000 --> 0:09:39.640
<v Speaker 2>and Wet Beast, they only produced the Mummy and the

0:09:40.000 --> 0:09:43.080
<v Speaker 2>and the monster creature from the Black Lagoon. Oh yeah,

0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:48.000
<v Speaker 2>they afore mentioned Wet Beast. The only produced those as originals.

0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:50.000
<v Speaker 2>But what they had done was release a lot of

0:09:50.000 --> 0:09:53.240
<v Speaker 2>their stuff to cables or cable not television, to local

0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:56.840
<v Speaker 2>affiliates for rebroadcasts. And that's when you get the whole

0:09:56.920 --> 0:10:02.440
<v Speaker 2>horror host thing with well Vampiro is the first one

0:10:02.720 --> 0:10:06.120
<v Speaker 2>and Zacherlee out of Philadelphia. But you know, all that

0:10:06.160 --> 0:10:09.520
<v Speaker 2>stuff is really ripe for reimagining it in the same

0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:12.319
<v Speaker 2>context or getting these same readings from it. I mean, famously,

0:10:12.480 --> 0:10:15.120
<v Speaker 2>Brida Frankenstein is like one of the gayest movies ever

0:10:15.160 --> 0:10:18.880
<v Speaker 2>made because the director, James Whale, was an openly gay

0:10:18.920 --> 0:10:21.640
<v Speaker 2>man in Hollywood, which was like practically a death sentence

0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:25.839
<v Speaker 2>at the time. But that movie has been tremendously reclaimed

0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:29.520
<v Speaker 2>by the queer community, and so is have all of

0:10:29.559 --> 0:10:32.400
<v Speaker 2>them to an extent, because it's all about being an outsider,

0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:37.920
<v Speaker 2>and that's such a fascinating thing to bring into the

0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:41.400
<v Speaker 2>context of a sitcom because it is like, you know,

0:10:41.640 --> 0:10:43.880
<v Speaker 2>the whole narrative that's been shoved down our throat by

0:10:43.880 --> 0:10:45.800
<v Speaker 2>boomers and everything was in the era of post war

0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:49.760
<v Speaker 2>prosperity that followed, like society became boring and like not

0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.000
<v Speaker 2>really if you were trying to struggle for basic human

0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:57.440
<v Speaker 2>rights during that period. But it's funny. It is interesting

0:10:57.520 --> 0:11:01.280
<v Speaker 2>to see how some people look at it, or how

0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:04.960
<v Speaker 2>it can be read as this idea of Darren, like

0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:10.280
<v Speaker 2>the central all American male figure essentially trying and failing

0:11:10.320 --> 0:11:14.000
<v Speaker 2>to keep anything that is, you know, not the conformist,

0:11:14.120 --> 0:11:17.920
<v Speaker 2>white picket fence lifestyle in check. And I think that's

0:11:17.960 --> 0:11:21.240
<v Speaker 2>a really wonderful reading of it that prefigures much of

0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:23.400
<v Speaker 2>the civil rights movement, much of the queer movement, much

0:11:23.440 --> 0:11:26.280
<v Speaker 2>of the counterculture movement, the new left that was about

0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:29.079
<v Speaker 2>to happen in the following decade, Which is my over

0:11:29.160 --> 0:11:33.040
<v Speaker 2>intellectualization of it. You know, you have like literally white America,

0:11:33.200 --> 0:11:36.680
<v Speaker 2>white straight male America not realizing what it was about

0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:37.959
<v Speaker 2>to have to reckon with.

0:11:38.240 --> 0:11:40.440
<v Speaker 1>That's so much more articulate the top of your head

0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:44.800
<v Speaker 1>than what I literally wrote down, which annoys me. No,

0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:48.199
<v Speaker 1>I mean, and that's fascinating for me because to bring

0:11:48.240 --> 0:11:54.720
<v Speaker 1>an outsider perspective to the most insider of platforms network TV,

0:11:54.960 --> 0:11:58.079
<v Speaker 1>sitcom in the mid sixties when there are only three networks.

0:11:58.120 --> 0:11:59.920
<v Speaker 1>I just find that such a weird dichotomy.

0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:02.679
<v Speaker 2>And we talked about this in the context of Adam's

0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:05.880
<v Speaker 2>Family as well, But Adam's family is such it has

0:12:05.920 --> 0:12:08.559
<v Speaker 2>a different pedigree because it came from that whole macabre

0:12:08.720 --> 0:12:12.560
<v Speaker 2>Edward Gorey New Yorker aesthetic as opposed to monsters, but

0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:15.200
<v Speaker 2>they're both all. They're all fascinating for it, especially in

0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:18.040
<v Speaker 2>mediums of film and television. You can see the generations

0:12:18.200 --> 0:12:21.079
<v Speaker 2>start to take control of this, like there's a reason

0:12:21.080 --> 0:12:27.960
<v Speaker 2>that Tim Burton and like the usc well more than

0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:30.200
<v Speaker 2>any like. I mean, he's the biggest one because he

0:12:30.240 --> 0:12:32.040
<v Speaker 2>came out of Disney, that comes to my mind. But

0:12:32.120 --> 0:12:34.680
<v Speaker 2>like you see the people who grew up with these

0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:39.080
<v Speaker 2>mid century fascinations start to create stuff based on it.

0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:40.640
<v Speaker 2>We talked about it last week with Tales from the

0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:42.560
<v Speaker 2>Crypt where it was like all of those guys who

0:12:42.559 --> 0:12:45.760
<v Speaker 2>were the first generation of this fifties culture that bewitch

0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:49.360
<v Speaker 2>is it on the continuum of eventually started being able

0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:53.200
<v Speaker 2>to shape culture. In there in their nostalgia, and we

0:12:53.320 --> 0:12:55.640
<v Speaker 2>got all this stuff that looked back to the era,

0:12:55.760 --> 0:12:59.959
<v Speaker 2>and sadly, it was by and large straight white guys,

0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:03.200
<v Speaker 2>so we didn't really get the repressed reading. But it

0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:03.880
<v Speaker 2>has popped up.

0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:04.040
<v Speaker 1>Man.

0:13:04.080 --> 0:13:07.839
<v Speaker 2>I mean there's Clive Barker is like, you know, perennially

0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:11.520
<v Speaker 2>sadly perennially like number two or three to Stephen King

0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:14.200
<v Speaker 2>and I don't know Dean Koomts in terms of like

0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:18.920
<v Speaker 2>horror books, but Clive Barker has always been quite edgier

0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:21.400
<v Speaker 2>than either of those guys, because a ton of his

0:13:21.440 --> 0:13:24.240
<v Speaker 2>stuff is about sex and violence. And I forget if

0:13:24.240 --> 0:13:27.959
<v Speaker 2>he's identifies as gay or bisexual. But you know, Night Breed,

0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:31.079
<v Speaker 2>which is one of the great failures of Hollywood, was

0:13:31.120 --> 0:13:34.319
<v Speaker 2>like an explicitly very queer coded movie that he was

0:13:34.360 --> 0:13:37.760
<v Speaker 2>at the reins of after getting the juice to make

0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:41.000
<v Speaker 2>it because of the success of Hell Raiser, Clive Barker

0:13:41.160 --> 0:13:44.120
<v Speaker 2>having created Pinhead, who he does not like it when

0:13:44.120 --> 0:13:47.720
<v Speaker 2>we call him Pinhead, but it is. I mean, it's fascinating.

0:13:47.880 --> 0:13:50.200
<v Speaker 2>I love the queer reading of horror films and anything

0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:52.560
<v Speaker 2>horror jacent, you know, because the second you start talking

0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:54.960
<v Speaker 2>about othering. It comes up in those readings, and quite

0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:57.960
<v Speaker 2>a few of them were made by gay people. Child's

0:13:57.960 --> 0:14:00.839
<v Speaker 2>Play was written by Tom n He as a gay man.

0:14:01.040 --> 0:14:03.040
<v Speaker 2>You know. That's why Chucky has gone on to have

0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:07.320
<v Speaker 2>like a non binary child towards the end of the franchise.

0:14:08.240 --> 0:14:10.679
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, it's fascinating to see. I think it's very

0:14:10.679 --> 0:14:14.560
<v Speaker 2>interesting to see that reading of queer othering into all

0:14:14.600 --> 0:14:17.600
<v Speaker 2>of these situations or other other ring. You know, race

0:14:17.640 --> 0:14:21.760
<v Speaker 2>goes into it, political affiliations goes into it, played out

0:14:21.840 --> 0:14:25.360
<v Speaker 2>in stuff that is ostensibly kitchy and lightweight. Yeah.

0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:28.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's what I find so fascinating about it. And also,

0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:31.160
<v Speaker 1>I mean, going back to the feminist reading, I make

0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:33.760
<v Speaker 1>a point in this episode to not discuss the two

0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:36.440
<v Speaker 1>thousand and five movie with Nicole Gimmin and Will Ferrell because.

0:14:36.200 --> 0:14:36.840
<v Speaker 2>It was so bad.

0:14:37.280 --> 0:14:40.880
<v Speaker 1>But it was written by Nora Efron, who's, like, you know,

0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:44.040
<v Speaker 1>has writible background as a writer, I mean, one of

0:14:44.080 --> 0:14:47.360
<v Speaker 1>the most brilliant screenwriters of the twentieth century. So it

0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:49.360
<v Speaker 1>kind of follows in that linear like the fact that

0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:52.880
<v Speaker 1>she chose to do that even though it got.

0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:57.080
<v Speaker 2>Horrible, horrible reviews. Yeah, well, it's hard to find the

0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.440
<v Speaker 2>tone because like I think, having Will Ferrell in as

0:15:00.560 --> 0:15:05.520
<v Speaker 2>like an ostensibly in control, dominant male figure is like

0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:09.600
<v Speaker 2>totally false. I mean they should have gone with like yeah,

0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:14.400
<v Speaker 2>John Hamm or somebody that is effectively authoritarian and square enough,

0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:16.960
<v Speaker 2>whereas like Will Ferrell, you're just automatically a conditioned to

0:15:17.000 --> 0:15:20.960
<v Speaker 2>be like ah the buffoon. So it's yeah. And that's

0:15:21.000 --> 0:15:23.560
<v Speaker 2>why I think a lot of the updates at tonally

0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:27.600
<v Speaker 2>getting this kind of stuff like Mars Attacks partially succeeds,

0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.880
<v Speaker 2>but like Rob Zombie did Monsters and it's it's hard

0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:32.680
<v Speaker 2>to get the camp right. It's hard to get the

0:15:32.720 --> 0:15:37.960
<v Speaker 2>attitude correct. Anyway, shut up, let's too bowitch. Oh wait. First,

0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:40.640
<v Speaker 2>in the middle of all this pontificating, thank you as

0:15:40.680 --> 0:15:43.520
<v Speaker 2>always to our supporters on KOFE, drop us a message.

0:15:43.840 --> 0:15:48.680
<v Speaker 2>I love bantering, whether it's gift or textual. And you

0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:50.400
<v Speaker 2>guys put for you in the tank. It's so great

0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.520
<v Speaker 2>to hear personal stories of what the show means to

0:15:53.520 --> 0:15:55.720
<v Speaker 2>you or what you take from it. And we are

0:15:55.840 --> 0:15:58.880
<v Speaker 2>keeping track of suggestions. I promise you, I say, whether

0:15:58.920 --> 0:16:02.400
<v Speaker 2>it's gift or jif no, no, no, I see I

0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:05.600
<v Speaker 2>see the vein in your neck. You can see it.

0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.600
<v Speaker 1>Oh all right, Well, there's a lot to unpack, and

0:16:08.680 --> 0:16:10.880
<v Speaker 1>this is probably a contender for the longest episode we've

0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:14.600
<v Speaker 1>ever done. It's ten thirty PM. I'm jet lagged in sick,

0:16:14.720 --> 0:16:17.040
<v Speaker 1>so let's get right to it. No fact teases for

0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.360
<v Speaker 1>you this episode, Ladies and gentlemen, here is everything you

0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:29.560
<v Speaker 1>didn't know about be Witched. Oh man, Well, we're starting

0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:31.400
<v Speaker 1>off on kind of a bummer note here. Of folks,

0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:34.840
<v Speaker 1>I'm sad to report that this beloved sitcom has its

0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:40.720
<v Speaker 1>origins and a truly hilarious good executive brainstorming. Harry Ackerman,

0:16:40.800 --> 0:16:44.360
<v Speaker 1>who led the television production studio screen Gems, wanted to

0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:45.440
<v Speaker 1>make a show about a witch.

0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:48.600
<v Speaker 2>Cool and I'm on board.

0:16:48.760 --> 0:16:52.440
<v Speaker 1>That's all he had, folks, That's that's what he's got.

0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:55.240
<v Speaker 1>A bunch of witch movies were owned by the Screen

0:16:55.320 --> 0:16:58.320
<v Speaker 1>Gems parent company, Columbia Pictures, and so it seemed like

0:16:58.360 --> 0:17:00.720
<v Speaker 1>money on the table as far as old Harry was concerned.

0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:04.560
<v Speaker 1>And to flesh out this groundbreaking premise, you put in

0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:07.800
<v Speaker 1>a call of Soul Sachs, an experienced radio and TV

0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:11.000
<v Speaker 1>writer who's responsible for episodes of Ozzie and Harriet. My

0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:15.280
<v Speaker 1>favorite husband. I married Joan and many others. They dined

0:17:15.320 --> 0:17:18.240
<v Speaker 1>at the legendary Hollywood Musso and Frank seen in the

0:17:18.280 --> 0:17:20.080
<v Speaker 1>opening of Once Upon a Time in Hollywood.

0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:22.520
<v Speaker 2>If I recall, I think that's where Leo and Brad

0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:25.880
<v Speaker 2>are eating with it. Was it Alpacino? Who's their their

0:17:25.920 --> 0:17:30.200
<v Speaker 2>agent in that Alpucino is in the dinner scene, I think,

0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:32.240
<v Speaker 2>But I think it's there. I think it's there. Yeah,

0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:33.200
<v Speaker 2>what a picture.

0:17:33.520 --> 0:17:36.440
<v Speaker 1>Yes, So Saul Sacks and Harry Ackerman go to Musso

0:17:36.480 --> 0:17:39.080
<v Speaker 1>and Frank and they talk it through and Saul expands

0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:42.960
<v Speaker 1>this idea into a witch marring immortal, and within three

0:17:42.960 --> 0:17:45.320
<v Speaker 1>weeks he turned in a pilot script that he called

0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:49.040
<v Speaker 1>The Witch of Westport, which is kind of a great title,

0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:51.160
<v Speaker 1>like arguably better than Bewitched.

0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:54.680
<v Speaker 2>Maybe I like the alliteration. Yeah, I'm a sucker for literation.

0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:57.919
<v Speaker 1>The script followed the adventures of a witch named Cassandra,

0:17:58.240 --> 0:18:01.640
<v Speaker 1>who falls in love with and marries Mortal. The series

0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:04.120
<v Speaker 1>would focus on Cassandra's attempts to adapt to her life

0:18:04.160 --> 0:18:09.000
<v Speaker 1>as a suburban housewife in Westpark, Connecticut. Now Sechs would

0:18:09.040 --> 0:18:12.800
<v Speaker 1>freely admit that he borrowed heavy air quotes the idea

0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:16.640
<v Speaker 1>from a pair of movies nineteen fifty eight's Bail Booken Candle,

0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:20.359
<v Speaker 1>and perhaps most obviously, a nineteen forty two movie called

0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:22.080
<v Speaker 1>I Married a Witch.

0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:26.680
<v Speaker 2>Kind of gives away the lead the guy.

0:18:27.320 --> 0:18:29.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it does what it says on the ten although

0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:31.520
<v Speaker 1>this movie kind of seems great.

0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:34.239
<v Speaker 2>Have you ever heard of this movie? No? I have not.

0:18:34.640 --> 0:18:35.159
<v Speaker 2>I kind of.

0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:37.200
<v Speaker 1>Think you would like it. It's about a woman living

0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:40.000
<v Speaker 1>in the sixteen sixties New England who vows to get

0:18:40.000 --> 0:18:42.280
<v Speaker 1>revenge after she sentenced to burn at the Steak for

0:18:42.359 --> 0:18:46.640
<v Speaker 1>being accused of being a witch. Correctly, I assume being

0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:50.240
<v Speaker 1>a witch. Centuries later, her soul was accidentally set free

0:18:50.280 --> 0:18:53.359
<v Speaker 1>and roams the earth, and she develops an interest in

0:18:53.400 --> 0:18:57.240
<v Speaker 1>a local politician. But then she discovers that the politician

0:18:57.359 --> 0:18:59.800
<v Speaker 1>is descended from the people who had her killed.

0:19:00.880 --> 0:19:02.760
<v Speaker 2>Hilarity, I think, insus.

0:19:02.880 --> 0:19:05.560
<v Speaker 1>I'm pretty sure she should have killed them. Yeah, I

0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:08.719
<v Speaker 1>think that's ques terrifically. I think that's what she's grappling with.

0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:11.399
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, okay.

0:19:11.680 --> 0:19:14.280
<v Speaker 1>Salt Sacks was open about these influences, one because they

0:19:14.320 --> 0:19:16.800
<v Speaker 1>were so obvious, and two, as we mentioned, the production

0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:19.639
<v Speaker 1>company owned them so he could proceed without fear of lawsuits.

0:19:20.440 --> 0:19:23.920
<v Speaker 2>After writing the pilot, he received a show creator credit.

0:19:23.760 --> 0:19:26.760
<v Speaker 1>And basically backed off and had no involvement in the

0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:29.880
<v Speaker 1>show for the rest of its run. He didn't really

0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:32.600
<v Speaker 1>do anything after this either. He basically just counted his

0:19:32.680 --> 0:19:35.120
<v Speaker 1>money for the rest of his life until his death

0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:39.679
<v Speaker 1>in twenty eleven at age one hundred. Hell yeah, right,

0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:42.840
<v Speaker 1>So for this you do the one good thing. You

0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:46.960
<v Speaker 1>take an executive a's like one word idea, couple it

0:19:47.000 --> 0:19:50.000
<v Speaker 1>with stuff that already exists, do the bare minimum and

0:19:50.000 --> 0:19:51.639
<v Speaker 1>bang on a script in three weeks, and then just

0:19:51.680 --> 0:19:53.920
<v Speaker 1>sit back and cash checks for the rest of your life.

0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:56.960
<v Speaker 2>Until you live to a hundred. That's Hollywood, baby. Hell yeah.

0:19:57.000 --> 0:19:59.240
<v Speaker 2>The only downside about his long life means.

0:19:59.000 --> 0:20:01.600
<v Speaker 1>That he unfortunately I was alive when the two thousand

0:20:01.640 --> 0:20:02.640
<v Speaker 1>and five movie came out.

0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:06.560
<v Speaker 2>Who did that? We studio? Now the director, I don't know.

0:20:06.760 --> 0:20:09.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, nor Efron didn't just write it, she directed

0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:15.159
<v Speaker 2>it too. O man, Oh that's tough. It's funny to

0:20:15.160 --> 0:20:16.919
<v Speaker 2>me that you hate it so much. I mean, they

0:20:16.960 --> 0:20:19.880
<v Speaker 2>took some standtrack, stand track, stand track.

0:20:20.520 --> 0:20:22.840
<v Speaker 1>They took my beloved mid century media and made a

0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:23.960
<v Speaker 1>mockery of it.

0:20:24.000 --> 0:20:26.800
<v Speaker 2>It's nothing sacred. I hate to tell you, Bud, But

0:20:27.359 --> 0:20:29.400
<v Speaker 2>there's probably gonna be a lot more of that coming up.

0:20:29.600 --> 0:20:32.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, well no, I think the boomer stuff has

0:20:32.800 --> 0:20:35.399
<v Speaker 1>been mined. That's that's the only stuff I care about.

0:20:35.640 --> 0:20:37.360
<v Speaker 2>Hey, we still can hold out hope for my mother

0:20:37.400 --> 0:20:42.080
<v Speaker 2>of the Car, a gritty reboot. I can see it now.

0:20:42.080 --> 0:20:43.720
<v Speaker 2>I can see it now. It's like it's gonna be like,

0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:50.880
<v Speaker 2>there's gonna be a mournful lower register, single piano key rendition.

0:20:50.920 --> 0:20:52.840
<v Speaker 2>If I'm in love with my car. I was going

0:20:52.920 --> 0:20:54.040
<v Speaker 2>to say, drive my car.

0:20:54.240 --> 0:20:55.760
<v Speaker 1>Actually, oh, that's better.

0:20:56.119 --> 0:20:59.480
<v Speaker 2>And then like there's like a shot fades in someone

0:20:59.520 --> 0:21:02.520
<v Speaker 2>going out to dilapidated garage and ripping off a dust

0:21:02.520 --> 0:21:04.280
<v Speaker 2>cover of a car, but you also see that there's

0:21:04.400 --> 0:21:07.560
<v Speaker 2>chains over the car. And then it's like we do

0:21:07.680 --> 0:21:09.560
<v Speaker 2>like a probably a medium maybe a two shot of

0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:11.840
<v Speaker 2>the woman talking to the man and she's like, there's

0:21:11.840 --> 0:21:15.119
<v Speaker 2>a lot about my family, you don't know, Darren. And

0:21:15.119 --> 0:21:18.000
<v Speaker 2>then we get another slow interruption. I was gonna say, yeah.

0:21:18.000 --> 0:21:20.600
<v Speaker 2>Then the lights pop on, yeah, and then it kicks

0:21:20.600 --> 0:21:23.360
<v Speaker 2>into I don't know, probably new metal. Maybe I think

0:21:23.400 --> 0:21:26.320
<v Speaker 2>the kids are back into that these days, or like

0:21:26.400 --> 0:21:29.640
<v Speaker 2>a vapor wave. No, not vaporway. Yeah, like a new

0:21:29.640 --> 0:21:32.280
<v Speaker 2>metal cover of Drive My Car. We could maybe get

0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:34.520
<v Speaker 2>Jack Antonof on that. I know he's a favorite of

0:21:34.520 --> 0:21:37.240
<v Speaker 2>yours with what he does with the Beatles work. And

0:21:37.280 --> 0:21:39.480
<v Speaker 2>then it kicks up and then it ramps into like

0:21:39.520 --> 0:21:44.840
<v Speaker 2>a Christine esque series of car murders. Yeah what kind

0:21:44.840 --> 0:21:48.280
<v Speaker 2>of car? I don't care, that's I material, Okay, all right.

0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:51.879
<v Speaker 2>They would be what's the funniest car? An AMC, Gremlin,

0:21:52.480 --> 0:21:56.880
<v Speaker 2>ya Spectra, kiasol, Oh, what's the square one? A Scion

0:21:57.720 --> 0:22:01.160
<v Speaker 2>or a Yugo? You go pretty funny and old? Yougo

0:22:01.760 --> 0:22:06.119
<v Speaker 2>pontiac az tech Ooh also good? Also good? And then

0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:07.600
<v Speaker 2>it has to come back. It has to come back

0:22:07.640 --> 0:22:10.360
<v Speaker 2>to Geometros. Yeah, it has to come back to Satan

0:22:10.400 --> 0:22:12.320
<v Speaker 2>in some way, Like it's like a blood and there

0:22:12.359 --> 0:22:14.159
<v Speaker 2>has to be like a woke twist on it. So

0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:16.000
<v Speaker 2>it's like it would be something about how she was

0:22:16.040 --> 0:22:18.040
<v Speaker 2>like prisoned in a car for like it was.

0:22:18.000 --> 0:22:21.280
<v Speaker 1>Like a dashboard Satan, a dashboard devil or something on

0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:22.200
<v Speaker 1>like springs.

0:22:22.560 --> 0:22:26.680
<v Speaker 2>But then like there's actual light behind the eyes. Yeah yeah,

0:22:26.800 --> 0:22:28.639
<v Speaker 2>or it's just like yeah, or it's like she was

0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:31.400
<v Speaker 2>like it would go back to like her being cursed

0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:36.560
<v Speaker 2>by like a cabal of like the seventies, like blood sacrifice,

0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:41.720
<v Speaker 2>Satan worshiping, like business guys, a glowing pine air freshener.

0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:43.320
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's good, that's good.

0:22:43.359 --> 0:22:45.919
<v Speaker 1>That's good, Like that represents her soul or something or

0:22:45.920 --> 0:22:46.520
<v Speaker 1>as sentience.

0:22:47.000 --> 0:22:49.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and then we get like a histrionically wailing Berkeley

0:22:49.720 --> 0:22:54.639
<v Speaker 2>Grad to be like baby, you can drop that, and

0:22:54.640 --> 0:22:57.800
<v Speaker 2>then it's like and then like coming December twenty twenty five.

0:22:58.520 --> 0:23:00.639
<v Speaker 2>Everything we pitch on here is a verbal contract. So

0:23:01.119 --> 0:23:03.120
<v Speaker 2>someone who's someone who's this money when that comes out.

0:23:03.320 --> 0:23:05.040
<v Speaker 1>I was just texting a friend of the pod Dora

0:23:05.080 --> 0:23:07.800
<v Speaker 1>a little while ago, and it never occurred to me

0:23:08.400 --> 0:23:11.439
<v Speaker 1>the line from driving my car, but you could do

0:23:11.480 --> 0:23:12.440
<v Speaker 1>something in between.

0:23:13.440 --> 0:23:16.199
<v Speaker 2>That's a really obscene sounding line. Never occurred to me.

0:23:16.560 --> 0:23:20.040
<v Speaker 2>Who cares, there's your Beatles' reference. Oh yeah, well.

0:23:20.200 --> 0:23:22.400
<v Speaker 1>The script for The Witch of Westport made its way

0:23:22.440 --> 0:23:25.560
<v Speaker 1>around Hollywood and screen. Jam's first choice for the lead

0:23:25.680 --> 0:23:29.000
<v Speaker 1>was a woman named Tammy Grimes, who was a Broadway star.

0:23:29.080 --> 0:23:31.560
<v Speaker 1>She won a Best Actress Tony in nineteen sixty one

0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:36.200
<v Speaker 1>for playing Molly Brown in The Unsinkable Molly Brown used

0:23:36.200 --> 0:23:37.320
<v Speaker 1>my Titanic drinkable.

0:23:37.480 --> 0:23:39.720
<v Speaker 2>You love the unsinkable Molly Brown so much.

0:23:39.880 --> 0:23:43.119
<v Speaker 1>I love a brassy Southern lady who survives the Titanic. Well,

0:23:43.119 --> 0:23:43.920
<v Speaker 1>what's not the love?

0:23:44.040 --> 0:23:46.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Ultimately, Tandy Crimes.

0:23:46.280 --> 0:23:49.480
<v Speaker 1>Backed out of playing the lead on Bewitched because she

0:23:49.560 --> 0:23:53.800
<v Speaker 1>found the idea too far fetched, reportedly wondering why the

0:23:53.840 --> 0:23:58.040
<v Speaker 1>witch in question wouldn't use her powers to either stop

0:23:58.160 --> 0:24:02.720
<v Speaker 1>wars or deal with Los Angeles traffic. Those were the

0:24:02.720 --> 0:24:08.160
<v Speaker 1>two examples she provided, stopping wars or stopping LA traffic.

0:24:08.480 --> 0:24:12.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's fair, that's fair. Actors are special people, they are.

0:24:12.960 --> 0:24:15.560
<v Speaker 2>I don't know. I always with witchcraft and anything. I'm

0:24:15.600 --> 0:24:18.480
<v Speaker 2>really I'm just always like, like I believe that they

0:24:18.520 --> 0:24:20.400
<v Speaker 2>believe in it, But I'm always just like, why does

0:24:20.440 --> 0:24:22.919
<v Speaker 2>this always just come down to like people in strip

0:24:22.960 --> 0:24:26.880
<v Speaker 2>malls lighting candles, like strip malls that you go into. Yeah, yeah,

0:24:26.960 --> 0:24:28.840
<v Speaker 2>strike that. I don't want to make them witchy women

0:24:28.880 --> 0:24:29.280
<v Speaker 2>mad at me.

0:24:29.359 --> 0:24:33.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, I'm keeping it for that recent Yeah. The

0:24:33.280 --> 0:24:36.080
<v Speaker 1>script for The Witches of Westport eventually landed on the

0:24:36.080 --> 0:24:39.760
<v Speaker 1>desk of William Asher. Asher was a director and producer

0:24:39.800 --> 0:24:42.080
<v Speaker 1>who directed one hundred and ten of I Love Lucy's

0:24:42.080 --> 0:24:44.679
<v Speaker 1>one hundred and seventy nine episodes, as well as some

0:24:44.760 --> 0:24:47.760
<v Speaker 1>of my beloved Beach Party Franking in that teen movies.

0:24:48.560 --> 0:24:51.800
<v Speaker 1>He just got married to an actress named Elizabeth Montgomery,

0:24:51.960 --> 0:24:54.280
<v Speaker 1>whom he'd met while directing her in the TV movie

0:24:54.560 --> 0:24:59.080
<v Speaker 1>Johnny Cool and this Guy yuh For being like kind

0:24:59.080 --> 0:25:02.840
<v Speaker 1>of a dumpyfore something balding guy, he had something going

0:25:02.880 --> 0:25:03.240
<v Speaker 1>for him.

0:25:03.600 --> 0:25:04.439
<v Speaker 2>Though he was married.

0:25:04.480 --> 0:25:07.960
<v Speaker 1>While directing Johnny Coole, he was having affairs with three

0:25:08.000 --> 0:25:12.560
<v Speaker 1>separate women on the set before getting serious with Elizabeth Montgomery,

0:25:13.280 --> 0:25:16.360
<v Speaker 1>and they were deeply in love and soon after their

0:25:16.359 --> 0:25:18.399
<v Speaker 1>marriage in nineteen sixty three, they wanted to find a

0:25:18.440 --> 0:25:20.520
<v Speaker 1>project to work on together so they could be together

0:25:20.600 --> 0:25:23.800
<v Speaker 1>all the time, ideally a sitcom which provided more of

0:25:23.800 --> 0:25:26.280
<v Speaker 1>a stable routine that would allow them to start a family.

0:25:26.600 --> 0:25:30.320
<v Speaker 1>The Witch of Westport fit the bill perfectly. They began

0:25:30.400 --> 0:25:33.560
<v Speaker 1>work on the pilot, making alterations the Salt Sacks original script.

0:25:33.800 --> 0:25:37.439
<v Speaker 1>The title was changed to Bewitched because it just just

0:25:37.480 --> 0:25:42.920
<v Speaker 1>because cleaner, and Cassandra was named Samantha. Apparently, Elizabeth Montgomery

0:25:42.920 --> 0:25:45.280
<v Speaker 1>didn't like Cassandra because she thought it was too connected

0:25:45.480 --> 0:25:47.439
<v Speaker 1>to the evil witches of Greek mythology.

0:25:47.600 --> 0:25:50.919
<v Speaker 2>Oh a little anti Greek, little anti Greek bias going on.

0:25:51.000 --> 0:25:56.080
<v Speaker 2>I love this. This just got interesting for me. Cassandra

0:25:56.320 --> 0:25:59.760
<v Speaker 2>was a temple priestess. Now I thought she was like

0:25:59.800 --> 0:26:02.320
<v Speaker 2>a I was gonna say, yeah, wasn't she the one

0:26:02.480 --> 0:26:06.720
<v Speaker 2>who claimed to Yeah yeah, Trojan princess and priestess. Oh

0:26:06.760 --> 0:26:08.399
<v Speaker 2>she was the one who was cursed so that she

0:26:08.480 --> 0:26:12.880
<v Speaker 2>had visions of the future, but that no one would believe. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

0:26:13.160 --> 0:26:13.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean same.

0:26:14.400 --> 0:26:16.560
<v Speaker 1>ABC was pitched the show, but they turned it down

0:26:16.600 --> 0:26:20.840
<v Speaker 1>initially because I this is kind of a hilarious reason,

0:26:20.880 --> 0:26:24.000
<v Speaker 1>but I guess kind of makes sense given that it

0:26:24.040 --> 0:26:26.159
<v Speaker 1>was the sixties. They were worried that a show with

0:26:26.200 --> 0:26:29.399
<v Speaker 1>a witch's a main character would repel audiences in the

0:26:29.880 --> 0:26:31.080
<v Speaker 1>highly religious South.

0:26:31.640 --> 0:26:35.000
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, absolutely, Yeah, yeah, that was a smart call.

0:26:35.040 --> 0:26:37.159
<v Speaker 2>They were right, No, it was those people are crazy.

0:26:37.240 --> 0:26:39.120
<v Speaker 1>It was only when Chevy came on as a sponsor

0:26:39.160 --> 0:26:41.080
<v Speaker 1>that they realized that maybe this had the potential to

0:26:41.080 --> 0:26:42.920
<v Speaker 1>make a ton of money after all, and they ended

0:26:42.960 --> 0:26:43.679
<v Speaker 1>up greenlighting it.

0:26:44.400 --> 0:26:47.680
<v Speaker 2>So. Elizabeth Montgomery, the star of Bewitched, is a fascinating woman.

0:26:48.040 --> 0:26:51.639
<v Speaker 2>Aside from her obvious charm that captivated Jordan and I

0:26:51.680 --> 0:26:55.199
<v Speaker 2>at an early age. And many others. It's not even

0:26:55.520 --> 0:27:01.000
<v Speaker 2>it's that asexual what it's like at that age, it

0:27:01.119 --> 0:27:05.520
<v Speaker 2>was just purely being like she seems neat or was

0:27:05.560 --> 0:27:09.440
<v Speaker 2>it sexual for you? She was a real pretty lady,

0:27:09.720 --> 0:27:13.560
<v Speaker 2>just a pretty lady who was magical and powerful anyway.

0:27:14.240 --> 0:27:17.119
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth Montgomery, the start of The Bewitched, is a fascinating woman,

0:27:17.240 --> 0:27:20.480
<v Speaker 2>incredibly talented, driven as well as big hearted. She made

0:27:20.520 --> 0:27:23.680
<v Speaker 2>over two hundred guest appearances on TV before Bewitch came along,

0:27:24.000 --> 0:27:26.200
<v Speaker 2>and she got an Emmy nomination for an episode of

0:27:26.200 --> 0:27:29.320
<v Speaker 2>The Untouchables. She also starred in Broadway productions like The

0:27:29.320 --> 0:27:32.520
<v Speaker 2>Miracle Worker and Late Love. I don't know what that is?

0:27:32.800 --> 0:27:35.159
<v Speaker 2>It sounds weird. Well, the Miracle Worker, I do is

0:27:35.240 --> 0:27:37.159
<v Speaker 2>the hell in kellor one? No? Yeah, I don't know

0:27:37.200 --> 0:27:41.520
<v Speaker 2>what is late nevermind, I don't care. She's also sadly

0:27:42.080 --> 0:27:46.160
<v Speaker 2>or finely depending on your point of view, a NEPO.

0:27:45.920 --> 0:27:48.240
<v Speaker 1>Baby, depending on who's listening and whether or not they

0:27:48.320 --> 0:27:49.600
<v Speaker 1>have access to our coffee.

0:27:49.320 --> 0:27:53.879
<v Speaker 2>Pitge Yeah, yeah, yeah, yuh. Her father was actor Robert Montgomery,

0:27:53.880 --> 0:27:55.760
<v Speaker 2>who was a big star in the thirties and forties

0:27:55.800 --> 0:27:59.720
<v Speaker 2>before he began hosting his own anthology television series Predictably

0:27:59.760 --> 0:28:04.000
<v Speaker 2>Tight Robert Montgomery Presents from nineteen fifty to nineteen fifty seven.

0:28:04.200 --> 0:28:07.280
<v Speaker 2>I've never heard of this, neither of I. Elizabeth made

0:28:07.280 --> 0:28:10.159
<v Speaker 2>her debut on this show, but the father daughter relationship

0:28:10.320 --> 0:28:13.040
<v Speaker 2>was a tense one. She struggled to escape his shadow,

0:28:13.119 --> 0:28:15.479
<v Speaker 2>and he didn't make that easier by being a critic

0:28:15.640 --> 0:28:18.119
<v Speaker 2>of everything in her life. He didn't want her to

0:28:18.119 --> 0:28:20.439
<v Speaker 2>follow in his footsteps and become an actress, and then

0:28:20.480 --> 0:28:23.040
<v Speaker 2>he became deeply jealous of her when her fame eclipsed

0:28:23.040 --> 0:28:26.280
<v Speaker 2>his own. Friends would say that Elizabeth presented her father

0:28:26.400 --> 0:28:28.760
<v Speaker 2>but also desperately tried to please him on some level,

0:28:29.160 --> 0:28:31.840
<v Speaker 2>and that push pool tied her in knots it's a

0:28:31.840 --> 0:28:34.960
<v Speaker 2>good metaphor, too many metaphors. No, No, it's good. Push

0:28:34.960 --> 0:28:37.800
<v Speaker 2>and pull in yeah, push pull, you make a not yeah.

0:28:37.920 --> 0:28:40.320
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth asked Robert if he would provide narration for the

0:28:40.320 --> 0:28:43.760
<v Speaker 2>pilot episode of Bewitched, and he refused. She then asked

0:28:43.840 --> 0:28:45.760
<v Speaker 2>him if he'd play her father in the series, and

0:28:45.800 --> 0:28:49.120
<v Speaker 2>he also refused. That Later in her career, when she

0:28:49.200 --> 0:28:52.640
<v Speaker 2>appeared in the TV movie The Legend of Lizzie Borden, which,

0:28:53.280 --> 0:28:55.080
<v Speaker 2>for those of you not in the Know is about

0:28:55.160 --> 0:28:58.120
<v Speaker 2>the woman who famously took an axe and gave her

0:28:58.160 --> 0:29:03.880
<v Speaker 2>parents forty wax. Robert Montgomery took that as a personal affront.

0:29:04.360 --> 0:29:09.840
<v Speaker 2>He reportedly told her, you would star in that. Uh.

0:29:10.240 --> 0:29:14.240
<v Speaker 2>He criticized her posture, her gait, and her affection for

0:29:15.760 --> 0:29:20.840
<v Speaker 2>finding familial dynamics. In other dimensions of that she liked

0:29:20.840 --> 0:29:26.360
<v Speaker 2>older men. He would openly accuse her of trying to

0:29:26.400 --> 0:29:29.160
<v Speaker 2>replace him with the relationships that she had with older

0:29:29.160 --> 0:29:31.080
<v Speaker 2>men in her life. That's weird.

0:29:31.440 --> 0:29:35.720
<v Speaker 1>It's an inside thought, yeah yeah, Or it's like something

0:29:35.720 --> 0:29:39.240
<v Speaker 1>you like grouse about with mother, but not.

0:29:42.640 --> 0:29:45.160
<v Speaker 2>You know, all those fifties weirdos called their wives mother.

0:29:45.560 --> 0:29:46.920
<v Speaker 2>John Lennon called Yoka mother.

0:29:47.720 --> 0:29:50.640
<v Speaker 1>But that was for entirely different weird reason, much more

0:29:50.680 --> 0:29:51.480
<v Speaker 1>on settling reason.

0:29:54.480 --> 0:30:00.400
<v Speaker 2>Uh, moving on, moving on, moving on. He had been

0:30:00.400 --> 0:30:03.320
<v Speaker 2>buried twice before Asher, who was twelve years or senior,

0:30:03.600 --> 0:30:06.440
<v Speaker 2>and she seemed to be drawn to bad boys in

0:30:06.480 --> 0:30:08.920
<v Speaker 2>the parlance of the times, or what we today would

0:30:08.960 --> 0:30:16.120
<v Speaker 2>call dirtbacks, charitably men struggling with substance abuse issues and

0:30:16.160 --> 0:30:19.600
<v Speaker 2>their mental health. Her second husband was the incredibly named

0:30:19.720 --> 0:30:23.200
<v Speaker 2>Gig Young, an actor who famously struggled with alcoholism for

0:30:23.240 --> 0:30:27.280
<v Speaker 2>many years. Actually was the original choice for the Waco Kid,

0:30:27.280 --> 0:30:30.480
<v Speaker 2>the Gene Wilder character in Blazing Saddles, but he collapsed

0:30:30.520 --> 0:30:33.360
<v Speaker 2>while shooting his first scene because he was brying out.

0:30:34.040 --> 0:30:34.600
<v Speaker 2>That's awful.

0:30:36.920 --> 0:30:40.200
<v Speaker 1>I think he was like literally like turning green because

0:30:40.240 --> 0:30:44.000
<v Speaker 1>his inside were just so destroyed. And mel Brooks had

0:30:44.000 --> 0:30:46.280
<v Speaker 1>the recast like over the Weekend.

0:30:47.200 --> 0:30:50.360
<v Speaker 2>Young died in October of nineteen seventy eight after shooting

0:30:50.400 --> 0:30:53.600
<v Speaker 2>his wife of three weeks before turning the gun onto himself.

0:30:53.720 --> 0:30:56.600
<v Speaker 2>That is a fast turnaround time. There was no note

0:30:56.640 --> 0:30:59.880
<v Speaker 2>found and a motive was never determined and a fun

0:31:00.360 --> 0:31:02.720
<v Speaker 2>Now we're just pulling in every single one of your connections.

0:31:02.760 --> 0:31:05.440
<v Speaker 2>Go ahead, Jordan, bring this in. Take me, take us

0:31:05.440 --> 0:31:06.440
<v Speaker 2>home to the Beach Boys.

0:31:07.040 --> 0:31:10.440
<v Speaker 1>Yes, Gig Young was being treated by the therapist Eugene Landy,

0:31:10.560 --> 0:31:15.680
<v Speaker 1>the ethically dubious, unscrupulous therapist who brainwashed Brian Wilson, kidnapped

0:31:15.720 --> 0:31:17.920
<v Speaker 1>him from his family, and tried to sign himself on

0:31:17.960 --> 0:31:21.360
<v Speaker 1>to various Beach Boys contracts before he lost his license

0:31:21.360 --> 0:31:24.400
<v Speaker 1>in a flurry of lawsuits. Let's job, Jean. That worked

0:31:24.400 --> 0:31:27.280
<v Speaker 1>out real great for gig Young. Some excellent therapy.

0:31:27.880 --> 0:31:32.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, good Lord, So you know, naturally men were drawn

0:31:32.280 --> 0:31:35.640
<v Speaker 2>to Elizabeth Montgomery being just a charming A charming lady

0:31:36.640 --> 0:31:42.200
<v Speaker 2>with improbable bone structure, my new favorite turn affairs. She

0:31:42.320 --> 0:31:44.320
<v Speaker 2>was rumored to have had an affair with Gary Cooper

0:31:44.560 --> 0:31:47.440
<v Speaker 2>on the movie The Court Martial of Billy Mitchell, also

0:31:47.440 --> 0:31:50.840
<v Speaker 2>famous for his line in Putting on the Ritz. Oh yeah,

0:31:51.000 --> 0:31:53.360
<v Speaker 2>Dean Martin was smitten with her when they filmed Who's

0:31:53.360 --> 0:31:57.120
<v Speaker 2>been Sleeping in My Bed? Answer? Well, I mean I

0:31:57.120 --> 0:31:59.000
<v Speaker 2>would give it to Dino. He could. He could have

0:31:59.000 --> 0:32:02.120
<v Speaker 2>pulled that out on a man. Was charm personified in

0:32:02.200 --> 0:32:05.080
<v Speaker 2>the fifties. Oh, Elvis Presley made overtures to her when

0:32:05.080 --> 0:32:07.920
<v Speaker 2>he and Gig Young were co starring in Kid Galahad.

0:32:08.040 --> 0:32:11.720
<v Speaker 2>But Montgomery's anti Greek prejudice, I have to assume would

0:32:11.720 --> 0:32:16.280
<v Speaker 2>have played a role in shooting him down. Gig Young

0:32:16.440 --> 0:32:18.600
<v Speaker 2>got upset. I cannot believe that's that guy's name. What

0:32:18.720 --> 0:32:25.120
<v Speaker 2>is it short for gigathin Giggless Gigathy Gary.

0:32:24.920 --> 0:32:28.400
<v Speaker 1>It's not, it's just a it's a totally separate stage name.

0:32:28.480 --> 0:32:31.840
<v Speaker 1>His name is Byron Byron bar which is also a great.

0:32:31.720 --> 0:32:37.160
<v Speaker 2>Name, and he went with gig Young. Yep, huh, Gig Young. Anyway,

0:32:37.320 --> 0:32:39.320
<v Speaker 2>Gig got upset when he saw Elvis flirting with her

0:32:39.360 --> 0:32:42.040
<v Speaker 2>on the set, and Presley called him an apple, and

0:32:42.080 --> 0:32:46.200
<v Speaker 2>he was not wrong. Many years later, in a positively

0:32:46.360 --> 0:32:50.200
<v Speaker 2>Sex in the City esque twist, Elizabeth Montgomery was connected

0:32:50.200 --> 0:32:54.040
<v Speaker 2>with ballet star Alexander Godeneuve, who later became a successful

0:32:54.080 --> 0:32:57.200
<v Speaker 2>actor with films like Witness and Die Hard. He was

0:32:57.200 --> 0:32:59.880
<v Speaker 2>a severe alcoholic, and his split from Montgomery sent him

0:32:59.880 --> 0:33:02.800
<v Speaker 2>in a downward spile that essentially resulted in him drinking

0:33:02.840 --> 0:33:03.600
<v Speaker 2>himself to death.

0:33:03.840 --> 0:33:06.200
<v Speaker 1>His body was found on the same day that Elizabeth

0:33:06.200 --> 0:33:09.280
<v Speaker 1>Montgomery died, but he'd been dead for days.

0:33:11.280 --> 0:33:15.000
<v Speaker 2>You said that, like it was days days. He said that,

0:33:15.200 --> 0:33:18.080
<v Speaker 2>like it was supposed to be like conciliatory. Note.

0:33:18.560 --> 0:33:22.440
<v Speaker 1>Oh no, it wasn't like for days. It wasn't like

0:33:22.480 --> 0:33:25.440
<v Speaker 1>we found out about her death. And I was like, oh, oh, okay,

0:33:25.480 --> 0:33:26.040
<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean.

0:33:26.120 --> 0:33:28.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. We'd also like to give an honorable mention to

0:33:28.880 --> 0:33:31.560
<v Speaker 2>the second role that Montgomery not so secretly played on

0:33:31.600 --> 0:33:35.120
<v Speaker 2>the show in season three, the twin Cousin, a trope

0:33:35.160 --> 0:33:40.400
<v Speaker 2>so expertly weaponized later on in Twin Peaks, in which

0:33:41.160 --> 0:33:45.240
<v Speaker 2>Cheryl Lee playing both Laura Palmer and her identical cousin,

0:33:45.320 --> 0:33:49.840
<v Speaker 2>except for when she's wearing glasses Maddie. The wild and

0:33:49.880 --> 0:33:52.760
<v Speaker 2>crazy character of Serena was basically created to give Montgomery

0:33:52.800 --> 0:33:57.080
<v Speaker 2>more to do after playing the perpetually perky, buttoned up Samantha.

0:33:57.240 --> 0:33:58.760
<v Speaker 2>She loved putting on a dark wig and a go

0:33:58.800 --> 0:34:02.920
<v Speaker 2>go dress and being slightly edgy on set to keep

0:34:03.000 --> 0:34:07.240
<v Speaker 2>up with the illusion. As one such measure of this edgy,

0:34:07.640 --> 0:34:10.240
<v Speaker 2>she asked that the character be credited to the false

0:34:10.320 --> 0:34:17.680
<v Speaker 2>stage name of Pandora Spocks. Get it is that Greek spos?

0:34:17.760 --> 0:34:23.800
<v Speaker 2>Is that a Greek name? A. Despite being this obvious pun,

0:34:24.000 --> 0:34:28.440
<v Speaker 2>many presumably horny men sent fan letters, possibly from prison,

0:34:28.760 --> 0:34:32.760
<v Speaker 2>to miss Spocks. Even the crew people were just dumber

0:34:32.760 --> 0:34:35.360
<v Speaker 2>in the fifties. Even the crew were fooled by this

0:34:35.440 --> 0:34:38.640
<v Speaker 2>flimsy illusion. A producer on set started hitting on her,

0:34:38.920 --> 0:34:42.040
<v Speaker 2>not realizing that it was Elizabeth Montgomery, the wife of

0:34:42.080 --> 0:34:47.080
<v Speaker 2>the director, merely clad in a wig. Ah, here's a

0:34:47.200 --> 0:34:51.360
<v Speaker 2>fun and creepy bit. Ashure would allude to sometimes taking

0:34:51.719 --> 0:34:55.719
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth Montgomery, in costume as Serena Spocks to a cheap

0:34:55.719 --> 0:34:59.920
<v Speaker 2>motel after shooting for the day. That's fine, consenting it

0:35:00.040 --> 0:35:02.480
<v Speaker 2>whatever consenting adults want to do in the privacy of

0:35:02.520 --> 0:35:05.560
<v Speaker 2>a CD hotel is AOK by me. And the last

0:35:05.600 --> 0:35:08.600
<v Speaker 2>thing would drop about cousin Serena is that her character's

0:35:08.640 --> 0:35:11.920
<v Speaker 2>makeup was supposedly the inspiration for Tim Curry's look as

0:35:11.960 --> 0:35:16.440
<v Speaker 2>Doctor frank Enferd in The Rocky Horror Picture Show. Is

0:35:16.480 --> 0:35:18.120
<v Speaker 2>that great? I love all that?

0:35:18.600 --> 0:35:21.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Now we have to move on to the male

0:35:21.800 --> 0:35:24.759
<v Speaker 1>lead of the show, Darren Stevens, the hapless mortal who's

0:35:24.760 --> 0:35:30.880
<v Speaker 1>Samantha throws it all away for or Mary's Way. There

0:35:30.920 --> 0:35:33.840
<v Speaker 1>was a persistent rumor that producers originally wanted Dick Sargent,

0:35:34.040 --> 0:35:35.760
<v Speaker 1>the man who would go on to be the replacement

0:35:35.840 --> 0:35:38.160
<v Speaker 1>Darren a few years later, but he was cast in

0:35:38.200 --> 0:35:42.520
<v Speaker 1>another project during the audition process. That's not quite accurate.

0:35:42.840 --> 0:35:45.680
<v Speaker 1>He was the top choice much earlier, when Tammy Grimes

0:35:45.719 --> 0:35:48.920
<v Speaker 1>was being considered for the part of Samantha, before Asher

0:35:48.960 --> 0:35:53.160
<v Speaker 1>and Elizabeth Montgomery got involved. Funnily enough, instead of doing Bewitched,

0:35:53.360 --> 0:35:56.600
<v Speaker 1>Sergent was cast in a short lived sitcom alongside Tammy Grimes,

0:35:56.640 --> 0:36:00.440
<v Speaker 1>where he played her twin brother, So Many Twins and

0:36:00.520 --> 0:36:07.680
<v Speaker 1>Dick's and stuff Is that weird? Molly Browns not for

0:36:07.760 --> 0:36:12.279
<v Speaker 1>My Friday. Richard Krena was the next actor off of

0:36:12.320 --> 0:36:14.920
<v Speaker 1>the part of Darren. But hell yeah, he was just

0:36:15.320 --> 0:36:17.640
<v Speaker 1>spent several years on the real McCoy's and he wanted

0:36:17.680 --> 0:36:19.719
<v Speaker 1>to try something else rather than a sitcom, so we

0:36:19.800 --> 0:36:20.560
<v Speaker 1>passed as well.

0:36:20.640 --> 0:36:23.160
<v Speaker 2>What else Richard Crowna Do I just know him from

0:36:23.280 --> 0:36:25.320
<v Speaker 2>uh he's Rambo's handler.

0:36:25.920 --> 0:36:28.520
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

0:36:28.640 --> 0:36:30.959
<v Speaker 2>He's that great speech about how boned they are because

0:36:31.000 --> 0:36:35.160
<v Speaker 2>they pissed off John Rambo. Yeah, this man, he says

0:36:35.239 --> 0:36:38.200
<v Speaker 2>eight things that would make a goat sick something something

0:36:38.239 --> 0:36:38.520
<v Speaker 2>like that.

0:36:39.840 --> 0:36:42.440
<v Speaker 1>But that's just a whole other twist to Darren Stevens

0:36:42.440 --> 0:36:43.040
<v Speaker 1>on Bewitched.

0:36:43.840 --> 0:36:46.239
<v Speaker 2>Could have been virtud Yeah, I like that. I like that.

0:36:46.880 --> 0:36:50.000
<v Speaker 1>But Bill Asher and Elizabeth Montgomery always wanted Dick York

0:36:50.040 --> 0:36:53.040
<v Speaker 1>as Darren now took Curek had an impressive list of

0:36:53.080 --> 0:36:56.440
<v Speaker 1>acting credits and film, Broadway and on TV. He began

0:36:56.480 --> 0:36:59.000
<v Speaker 1>his acting career as a child, performing in radio shows

0:36:59.000 --> 0:37:01.799
<v Speaker 1>in Chicago, where his family moved when he was very young.

0:37:02.280 --> 0:37:05.200
<v Speaker 1>One of his radio roles was Jack Armstrong, the All

0:37:05.239 --> 0:37:08.040
<v Speaker 1>American Boy, which was the kind of role you could

0:37:08.080 --> 0:37:09.320
<v Speaker 1>have had in the thirties.

0:37:09.960 --> 0:37:11.520
<v Speaker 2>What kind of a show is that? Was it?

0:37:11.560 --> 0:37:14.040
<v Speaker 1>When I was like, like I found a nickel on

0:37:14.040 --> 0:37:17.600
<v Speaker 1>the ground and I gave it to somebody. He was

0:37:17.640 --> 0:37:19.960
<v Speaker 1>a depression. He was finally like I'm eating an apple

0:37:20.239 --> 0:37:21.120
<v Speaker 1>and you all can listen.

0:37:23.000 --> 0:37:26.960
<v Speaker 2>Is that from the plucky orphan genre? Like the famous

0:37:26.960 --> 0:37:33.400
<v Speaker 2>Annie orphan Annie? Yeah? Well I yes, famous amos orphan Annie? Yeah?

0:37:33.520 --> 0:37:39.239
<v Speaker 2>Except he also was Jack Armstrong also an orphan? I

0:37:39.320 --> 0:37:39.920
<v Speaker 2>old please.

0:37:40.120 --> 0:37:43.200
<v Speaker 1>It was the thirties, probably like one in two people

0:37:43.920 --> 0:37:46.520
<v Speaker 1>fifty one that show went off the air. This was

0:37:46.560 --> 0:37:51.040
<v Speaker 1>the radio version, so it was probably earlier, earlier, Noah.

0:37:51.080 --> 0:37:54.680
<v Speaker 2>It was carried by CBS, NBC and then finally ABC

0:37:55.080 --> 0:37:59.240
<v Speaker 2>All Radio. It was a creation of General Mills, okay,

0:37:59.480 --> 0:38:00.800
<v Speaker 2>intended to promote wheaties.

0:38:01.120 --> 0:38:04.160
<v Speaker 1>What was the plot? Jack Armstrong, the All American Boy?

0:38:04.200 --> 0:38:10.080
<v Speaker 2>What what I mean? Singing about wheaties? Literally first apparently

0:38:10.120 --> 0:38:11.759
<v Speaker 2>and I'm just this is going off wikipedia. I haven't

0:38:11.760 --> 0:38:16.440
<v Speaker 2>fact fact chestice, but the first commercial jingle on the

0:38:16.520 --> 0:38:19.120
<v Speaker 2>radio was for wheaties in nineteen twenty six, and that

0:38:19.200 --> 0:38:22.719
<v Speaker 2>was great fact on the Jack Armstrong Show, Have you

0:38:22.760 --> 0:38:25.600
<v Speaker 2>tried wheaties? Their whole wheat with all of the brand.

0:38:25.840 --> 0:38:28.720
<v Speaker 2>Won't you try wheaties, for wheat is the best food

0:38:28.760 --> 0:38:33.960
<v Speaker 2>of man. Wow, that's curiously byronic, speaking of poetry, which

0:38:34.040 --> 0:38:37.280
<v Speaker 2>is the best food of man? Yeah right. They're crispy

0:38:37.320 --> 0:38:40.640
<v Speaker 2>and crunchy the whole year through. Jack Armstrong never tires

0:38:40.640 --> 0:38:43.800
<v Speaker 2>of them, and neither will you. So just buy wheaties

0:38:44.120 --> 0:38:47.480
<v Speaker 2>the best breakfast food in the land. That's a I

0:38:47.640 --> 0:38:50.279
<v Speaker 2>like the last tuo. Just buy them. It sounds like

0:38:50.320 --> 0:38:53.239
<v Speaker 2>something Christopher walk of, So just just buy buy them.

0:38:53.680 --> 0:38:55.560
<v Speaker 2>It's your problem, five wheaties.

0:38:56.840 --> 0:38:59.000
<v Speaker 1>Who was it? I think it was Kevin Pollock had

0:38:59.000 --> 0:39:01.600
<v Speaker 1>a bit where hecause he a he famously does a

0:39:01.680 --> 0:39:04.000
<v Speaker 1>really really dead on Christopher Walking impression.

0:39:04.160 --> 0:39:09.520
<v Speaker 2>Is goes for walking selling skills. It's not entertaining that

0:39:09.680 --> 0:39:12.640
<v Speaker 2>this is even more interesting. The guy who created Jack

0:39:12.760 --> 0:39:16.239
<v Speaker 2>Armstrong also created Betty Crocker. Oh that's wild.

0:39:16.520 --> 0:39:19.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, how about that like the character or like actually

0:39:19.920 --> 0:39:21.520
<v Speaker 1>founded the brand. Uh.

0:39:22.360 --> 0:39:26.440
<v Speaker 2>Samuel Chester Gaale, vice president of advertising at General Mills,

0:39:26.520 --> 0:39:28.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm still unable to find anything that this guy actually

0:39:28.880 --> 0:39:32.200
<v Speaker 2>with the show. Actually yeah, oh wait, he's a popular

0:39:32.280 --> 0:39:39.239
<v Speaker 2>athlete friends his friends. That's good. He's a family so

0:39:39.320 --> 0:39:42.440
<v Speaker 2>he wasn't frequently Uncle Jim, an industrialist would have to

0:39:42.520 --> 0:39:44.680
<v Speaker 2>visit an exotic part of the world for business, and

0:39:44.719 --> 0:39:47.520
<v Speaker 2>he would take Jack Armstrong and his friends, the Fairfield

0:39:47.560 --> 0:39:51.120
<v Speaker 2>siblings along with him. They were just like travelogs. I

0:39:51.120 --> 0:39:55.040
<v Speaker 2>guess really. Oh and then in the final season the

0:39:55.080 --> 0:39:59.799
<v Speaker 2>program was renamed Armstrong of the SBI when Jack graduated

0:39:59.800 --> 0:40:03.600
<v Speaker 2>from high school and became a fed the SBI. Yeah,

0:40:03.640 --> 0:40:07.320
<v Speaker 2>I assume that's because they were uncomfortable saying FBI or something.

0:40:07.400 --> 0:40:10.000
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, the kid literally graduated high school and became

0:40:10.280 --> 0:40:16.160
<v Speaker 2>a fed. Well that's sickening. Oh and this goes, dude,

0:40:16.160 --> 0:40:19.800
<v Speaker 2>this goes all the way down. A Jack Armstrong animated

0:40:19.800 --> 0:40:23.880
<v Speaker 2>TV pilot was developed by Hanna Barbera, and then negotiations

0:40:23.880 --> 0:40:26.719
<v Speaker 2>fell through and the plan series was reworked into what

0:40:26.760 --> 0:40:30.560
<v Speaker 2>would become Johnny Quest. Whoa, oh that makes a lot

0:40:30.600 --> 0:40:31.040
<v Speaker 2>of sense.

0:40:31.440 --> 0:40:35.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, wow, that's wild, far out man. That was one

0:40:35.600 --> 0:40:38.919
<v Speaker 1>of our better conversational detours. That was very good.

0:40:38.960 --> 0:40:41.439
<v Speaker 2>I did not know Jack Armstrong, the all American boy,

0:40:41.440 --> 0:40:42.720
<v Speaker 2>would would prove so fertile.

0:40:43.080 --> 0:40:46.560
<v Speaker 1>No no, no, but yeah, that was Dick York's earliest roles.

0:40:46.920 --> 0:40:53.359
<v Speaker 2>Fertile and breedable submissive. Sorry what that.

0:40:53.360 --> 0:40:58.960
<v Speaker 1>Was one of Dick York's earliest roles his upbringing was Dickensian.

0:40:59.120 --> 0:41:01.760
<v Speaker 1>You're about to get real bummed out now. I highly

0:41:01.760 --> 0:41:04.920
<v Speaker 1>advise you to fast forward about a minute. Otherwise, gimme

0:41:05.000 --> 0:41:07.680
<v Speaker 1>you know if you're suffering from seasonal effective disorder in

0:41:07.760 --> 0:41:10.160
<v Speaker 1>these days, I'd like to quote from a nineteen eighty

0:41:10.239 --> 0:41:13.799
<v Speaker 1>nine People magazine piece, Homelessness and poverty are more than

0:41:13.880 --> 0:41:16.759
<v Speaker 1>abstractions to Dick York, who believes the seed of his

0:41:16.880 --> 0:41:20.520
<v Speaker 1>acting career were sown during his Depression era childhood in Chicago.

0:41:21.160 --> 0:41:23.360
<v Speaker 1>You had to be an actor growing up then, he says,

0:41:23.880 --> 0:41:25.799
<v Speaker 1>he didn't want your parents to know that you knew

0:41:25.840 --> 0:41:30.040
<v Speaker 1>your toys were secondhand. His parents, Bernard, a sometimes salesman,

0:41:30.080 --> 0:41:33.399
<v Speaker 1>and Betty, a seamstress, acted too, telling him they'd eaten

0:41:33.840 --> 0:41:37.600
<v Speaker 1>when York knew they hadn't. As a boy, York saw

0:41:37.600 --> 0:41:40.440
<v Speaker 1>his father struggle with other men for food discarded in

0:41:40.480 --> 0:41:43.440
<v Speaker 1>a garbage can when they didn't have rent, which was

0:41:43.440 --> 0:41:46.520
<v Speaker 1>often someone had to stay inside the family apartment at

0:41:46.560 --> 0:41:48.520
<v Speaker 1>all times to prevent the landlord from.

0:41:48.400 --> 0:41:49.640
<v Speaker 2>Walking everybody else out.

0:41:50.600 --> 0:41:53.200
<v Speaker 1>When he was eleven, an infant brother died, but the

0:41:53.200 --> 0:41:56.040
<v Speaker 1>family couldn't afford to bury him. So York and his

0:41:56.080 --> 0:41:58.600
<v Speaker 1>father slipped into a graveyard at night and laid the

0:41:58.640 --> 0:42:00.759
<v Speaker 1>youngster to rest in a coffin and craft it from

0:42:00.760 --> 0:42:01.440
<v Speaker 1>a shoebox.

0:42:03.719 --> 0:42:09.359
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's a new low for us, dude, that's yeah. Yeah,

0:42:09.480 --> 0:42:13.719
<v Speaker 2>eleven year old burying an infant at night in a

0:42:13.800 --> 0:42:14.480
<v Speaker 2>shoe box.

0:42:14.960 --> 0:42:21.840
<v Speaker 1>M yeah, yeah, his whole story. It gets worse and

0:42:21.880 --> 0:42:24.239
<v Speaker 1>then it gets slightly better, and then it gets worse again.

0:42:25.960 --> 0:42:28.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah.

0:42:29.280 --> 0:42:32.040
<v Speaker 1>Dick York's talent, which was initially spotted by a porochial

0:42:32.040 --> 0:42:35.640
<v Speaker 1>school none, ultimately got him out and led him to Broadway.

0:42:36.280 --> 0:42:38.520
<v Speaker 1>He was in a play called Tea and Sympathy alongside

0:42:38.560 --> 0:42:41.239
<v Speaker 1>the actress Debora Kerr, and he was so good that

0:42:41.280 --> 0:42:44.600
<v Speaker 1>Paul Newman once boarded his subway car and approached York

0:42:44.680 --> 0:42:47.160
<v Speaker 1>to say, I'm not going this direction, but I just

0:42:47.200 --> 0:42:48.759
<v Speaker 1>wanted to tell you how great you were and Tea

0:42:48.760 --> 0:42:53.000
<v Speaker 1>and Sympathy, which I love. Dick York spotted Elizabeth Montgomery

0:42:53.040 --> 0:42:54.880
<v Speaker 1>in the hall the day he showed up to audition

0:42:54.960 --> 0:42:58.240
<v Speaker 1>to play Darren, and he reminded him of his own wife, Joey.

0:42:58.800 --> 0:43:01.279
<v Speaker 1>As he later said, I walked into the office more

0:43:01.320 --> 0:43:03.520
<v Speaker 1>confident than I've ever been in my life, and he

0:43:03.560 --> 0:43:06.480
<v Speaker 1>bluffs his way through the audition by basically pretending mentally

0:43:06.520 --> 0:43:09.640
<v Speaker 1>that they were already married. He got the gig, but

0:43:09.719 --> 0:43:13.719
<v Speaker 1>he was nursing a terrible hidden secret, which we'll get

0:43:13.760 --> 0:43:14.240
<v Speaker 1>too later.

0:43:15.200 --> 0:43:20.919
<v Speaker 2>Cliffhanger, Done, done, done. I can't get over that. Never

0:43:20.920 --> 0:43:26.280
<v Speaker 2>saying a bad word about that man again. That is well, okay, sorry,

0:43:26.360 --> 0:43:28.399
<v Speaker 2>I take that back, but that is maybe a new

0:43:28.440 --> 0:43:31.719
<v Speaker 2>low for this show. Yeah, no, it's rough.

0:43:31.800 --> 0:43:37.080
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Well, Dick York had another less hidden secret. Unfortunately,

0:43:37.080 --> 0:43:39.160
<v Speaker 1>the whole pretending they were married thing got a little

0:43:39.160 --> 0:43:41.680
<v Speaker 1>too real during the production of the show, and York

0:43:42.120 --> 0:43:47.920
<v Speaker 1>supposedly developed feelings for Montgomery and made them fairly obvious.

0:43:48.880 --> 0:43:50.520
<v Speaker 1>It's worth noting that he was also on a ton

0:43:50.520 --> 0:43:52.759
<v Speaker 1>of pain killers at the time for reasons that we'll

0:43:52.800 --> 0:43:54.800
<v Speaker 1>mention later, so his inhibitions were lowered.

0:43:55.560 --> 0:43:56.839
<v Speaker 2>There were times when he would just.

0:43:56.800 --> 0:43:59.160
<v Speaker 1>Be lying down on a couch resting while the others

0:43:59.160 --> 0:44:05.560
<v Speaker 1>were filming, staring at Elizabeth Montgomery. This understandably creeped her out.

0:44:05.800 --> 0:44:08.880
<v Speaker 1>She didn't like Dick York that way, and also she

0:44:09.080 --> 0:44:11.640
<v Speaker 1>was married to the show's director producer, who was a

0:44:11.719 --> 0:44:15.560
<v Speaker 1>relatively frequent presence on the set, but his behavior just

0:44:15.719 --> 0:44:17.879
<v Speaker 1>got worse and worse over the years, to the point

0:44:17.920 --> 0:44:20.680
<v Speaker 1>where Elizabeth Montgomery actually complained that she didn't want to

0:44:20.680 --> 0:44:23.399
<v Speaker 1>work with him quite as closely, you'll notice that after

0:44:23.440 --> 0:44:26.840
<v Speaker 1>season three, while the plotlines became less romantic comedy centric

0:44:26.920 --> 0:44:30.920
<v Speaker 1>and began to stress the magical fantastical elements more, just

0:44:30.920 --> 0:44:32.000
<v Speaker 1>so that they would have to be.

0:44:33.000 --> 0:44:34.200
<v Speaker 2>In fewer two shots.

0:44:34.239 --> 0:44:37.719
<v Speaker 1>Basically, this is a testament to how bad it must

0:44:37.719 --> 0:44:40.640
<v Speaker 1>have gotten with York, because presumably, as a beautiful actress

0:44:40.680 --> 0:44:43.319
<v Speaker 1>coming up in the fifties and early sixties, she heard

0:44:43.400 --> 0:44:45.640
<v Speaker 1>terrible stuff from men on a daily basis, so this

0:44:45.719 --> 0:44:47.160
<v Speaker 1>must have been uniquely terrible.

0:44:48.280 --> 0:44:50.319
<v Speaker 2>Though she was very cordial when speaking about him in

0:44:50.320 --> 0:44:52.000
<v Speaker 2>interviews in later years. I read a.

0:44:51.960 --> 0:44:54.640
<v Speaker 1>Report that she never spoke to Dick York again after

0:44:54.680 --> 0:44:59.160
<v Speaker 1>he left the show in nineteen sixty nine. So yeah,

0:44:59.440 --> 0:45:02.839
<v Speaker 1>but we'll tell you some stories about Dick York later

0:45:02.920 --> 0:45:05.239
<v Speaker 1>that will also make you want a weep. So it

0:45:05.400 --> 0:45:11.280
<v Speaker 1>kind of complicated. Man kind of cancels out, Okay, gross, we'll.

0:45:11.160 --> 0:45:13.520
<v Speaker 2>Save those for later. Yeah, Okay.

0:45:13.600 --> 0:45:16.120
<v Speaker 1>Also, while we're on the topic of Samantha and Darren, Stevens'

0:45:16.160 --> 0:45:20.799
<v Speaker 1>sexual relations. They are apparently the first sitcom couple to

0:45:20.880 --> 0:45:25.560
<v Speaker 1>share a bed, with some caveats. The ones who preceded

0:45:25.600 --> 0:45:28.480
<v Speaker 1>them were married in real life Daisy and Lucy and

0:45:28.520 --> 0:45:31.240
<v Speaker 1>I Love Lucy, Ozzy and Harriet Nelson in the Adventures

0:45:31.239 --> 0:45:34.080
<v Speaker 1>of Ozzy and Harriet, and Mary Kay and Johnny Stearns

0:45:34.640 --> 0:45:37.440
<v Speaker 1>in Mary Kay and Johnny, which most people haven't heard of,

0:45:37.480 --> 0:45:40.480
<v Speaker 1>but it's widely hailed as the first sitcom from I

0:45:40.520 --> 0:45:42.200
<v Speaker 1>think it's like nineteen forty seven or something.

0:45:42.239 --> 0:45:43.000
<v Speaker 2>It was super early.

0:45:43.840 --> 0:45:47.840
<v Speaker 1>Other entries are The Flintstones, which are animated and the Monsters.

0:45:48.680 --> 0:45:51.919
<v Speaker 2>I think we're a close runner up to be Witched.

0:45:51.880 --> 0:45:54.120
<v Speaker 1>Because it also premiered in nineteen sixty four, the same

0:45:54.160 --> 0:45:58.560
<v Speaker 1>year as Bewitched. But I wouldn't count it because they're

0:45:58.600 --> 0:45:59.439
<v Speaker 1>not a human couple.

0:45:59.480 --> 0:46:02.760
<v Speaker 2>They're months. Oh, come off it. I mean Herma's a monster.

0:46:02.840 --> 0:46:05.360
<v Speaker 2>What is Lily a vampire? She's like a vampire?

0:46:05.520 --> 0:46:07.640
<v Speaker 1>Just yeah, yeah, although I got I mean, the Stevens

0:46:07.640 --> 0:46:09.600
<v Speaker 1>aren't a human couple either, because he's a mortal and

0:46:09.640 --> 0:46:12.640
<v Speaker 1>she's a witch, so maybe that shouldn't count either.

0:46:12.880 --> 0:46:14.520
<v Speaker 2>Do we have like a southern guy on hand? We

0:46:14.560 --> 0:46:20.239
<v Speaker 2>can contact about miscegenation. I'm imagining a guy in a

0:46:20.280 --> 0:46:23.360
<v Speaker 2>bow string tie and like a seersucker suit coming on

0:46:23.400 --> 0:46:26.840
<v Speaker 2>and be like, now a witch is positively offensive for

0:46:27.080 --> 0:46:30.279
<v Speaker 2>witches to cohabitate with. Man, it's a very good frank

0:46:30.360 --> 0:46:33.640
<v Speaker 2>underword voice. We don't speak his name, he's can't.

0:46:36.520 --> 0:46:38.759
<v Speaker 1>We're gonna take a quick break, but we'll be right

0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:40.680
<v Speaker 1>back with more too much information in.

0:46:40.840 --> 0:46:41.400
<v Speaker 2>Just a moment.

0:46:52.560 --> 0:46:55.399
<v Speaker 1>Ohigo, tell us a little bit about the meddling mother

0:46:55.440 --> 0:46:59.399
<v Speaker 1>in law to end all meddling mother in law, sweet indoor. Yeah,

0:46:59.440 --> 0:47:01.399
<v Speaker 1>I still have a hard time believing that this entire

0:47:01.520 --> 0:47:04.120
<v Speaker 1>series wasn't just an elaborate setup to a My mother

0:47:04.160 --> 0:47:07.000
<v Speaker 1>in law is a real witch joke, which is actually

0:47:07.000 --> 0:47:08.520
<v Speaker 1>how they sold its sponsors.

0:47:08.560 --> 0:47:12.640
<v Speaker 2>Incredible. Yeah, and what's your feed? Is your favorite Indora line?

0:47:12.960 --> 0:47:16.080
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, well it was actually spoken to her by

0:47:16.120 --> 0:47:20.759
<v Speaker 1>her strange husband. And Dora, your charm is ageless, so

0:47:20.840 --> 0:47:22.400
<v Speaker 1>sad about the rest of you.

0:47:22.480 --> 0:47:25.439
<v Speaker 2>Good stuff. It's a good line. Yeah. She and Dora

0:47:25.520 --> 0:47:29.440
<v Speaker 2>is played by the legendary screen actress Agnes moorehead Steady.

0:47:30.160 --> 0:47:33.040
<v Speaker 2>She's a native of Clinton, Massachusetts, the town where young

0:47:33.120 --> 0:47:35.960
<v Speaker 2>Jordan cut his teeth as a Buddying Team trivia host

0:47:36.239 --> 0:47:41.719
<v Speaker 2>under his mentor the great DJJBJ. So do with that

0:47:41.840 --> 0:47:42.920
<v Speaker 2>what you will, listeners.

0:47:42.960 --> 0:47:46.120
<v Speaker 1>I always always love Agnus Morehead. She's a a hometown girl.

0:47:47.239 --> 0:47:51.719
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, yeah, that was a little Minnesota. Yeah, like

0:47:51.760 --> 0:47:53.200
<v Speaker 1>I can't, I can't do a boss then.

0:47:53.160 --> 0:47:55.440
<v Speaker 2>No, I'm trying to give you a second. Probably with

0:47:55.520 --> 0:47:58.160
<v Speaker 2>all the blue hairs out in Medved they go for

0:47:58.360 --> 0:48:00.760
<v Speaker 2>they go for Agnes. This is my girl.

0:48:02.480 --> 0:48:05.759
<v Speaker 1>A lot of the what's her name who played in

0:48:06.280 --> 0:48:09.520
<v Speaker 1>Harold Maud She's from uh Ruth Gordon.

0:48:09.600 --> 0:48:11.600
<v Speaker 2>Ruth Gordon's from Quincy, Massachusetts.

0:48:11.640 --> 0:48:14.520
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, a lot of those like like like I mean

0:48:14.600 --> 0:48:17.480
<v Speaker 1>this affectionately like tough old broads are from Massachusetts.

0:48:17.800 --> 0:48:20.040
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, you almost got it there, you slipped into it.

0:48:20.719 --> 0:48:23.399
<v Speaker 1>I never I never had never You never I never

0:48:23.440 --> 0:48:26.239
<v Speaker 1>had it? Yeah. No. The only the only word I

0:48:26.239 --> 0:48:31.400
<v Speaker 1>could actually say was some degree of authenticity is noth North.

0:48:31.400 --> 0:48:35.960
<v Speaker 2>No, Yeah, that's a good one. Uh Well, Old Morehead

0:48:37.320 --> 0:48:40.640
<v Speaker 2>veteran of Orson Wells famous Mercury players. She appeared in

0:48:40.880 --> 0:48:44.319
<v Speaker 2>Citizen Kane as the mother of the titular character and

0:48:44.719 --> 0:48:48.320
<v Speaker 2>got it four Oscar noombs before Bewitched even came around.

0:48:48.760 --> 0:48:51.920
<v Speaker 2>Also if one for another Wells joint, the Magnificent Amberson's

0:48:52.320 --> 0:48:58.279
<v Speaker 2>and also Hush Ellipses, Hush, Sweet Charlotte, Charlotte. I didn't

0:48:58.320 --> 0:49:03.680
<v Speaker 2>do that intentionally, but it's funnier, it's cleaner. In addition

0:49:03.719 --> 0:49:06.560
<v Speaker 2>to her talent, she was kind of a badass, and

0:49:06.719 --> 0:49:10.040
<v Speaker 2>like Dick York overcame a horrifying upbringing. Morehead would later

0:49:10.040 --> 0:49:12.680
<v Speaker 2>recall going four days without food at one point in

0:49:12.719 --> 0:49:14.680
<v Speaker 2>her early acting career and that it had taught her

0:49:14.880 --> 0:49:17.920
<v Speaker 2>the value of a dollar. All this being said, though,

0:49:18.080 --> 0:49:19.640
<v Speaker 2>it does make a certain amount of sense that she

0:49:19.680 --> 0:49:22.759
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't have been exactly thrilled to be a mother in

0:49:22.880 --> 0:49:25.360
<v Speaker 2>law in a sitcom, and she got the role totally

0:49:25.360 --> 0:49:27.600
<v Speaker 2>by chance. The producer was struggling to come up with

0:49:27.640 --> 0:49:29.880
<v Speaker 2>an actress who had the right combination of gravitas and

0:49:29.920 --> 0:49:32.239
<v Speaker 2>playfulness to play the role of the mother in law

0:49:32.239 --> 0:49:36.480
<v Speaker 2>who terrorizes her daughter's husband. Elizabeth Montgomery was strolling through

0:49:36.480 --> 0:49:39.080
<v Speaker 2>Bloomingdale's one day in New York City and she heard

0:49:39.400 --> 0:49:44.560
<v Speaker 2>that voice dune meme with the mom saying use the voice,

0:49:44.600 --> 0:49:47.600
<v Speaker 2>and it's Agnes Morehead's voice. She followed it through the

0:49:47.600 --> 0:49:50.240
<v Speaker 2>store until she was confronted by the site of Morehead

0:49:50.280 --> 0:49:54.960
<v Speaker 2>herself with a high quaffed orange Bouffont style hairdoo wrapped

0:49:54.960 --> 0:49:59.080
<v Speaker 2>in pink tool. Montgomery recalled that Morehead looked like this

0:49:59.200 --> 0:50:04.120
<v Speaker 2>oversized being of cotton candy. I love that. She approached

0:50:04.120 --> 0:50:06.480
<v Speaker 2>her on the spot, and according to an interview, their

0:50:06.520 --> 0:50:09.320
<v Speaker 2>exchange went like this, Ms Morehead, would you be interested

0:50:09.360 --> 0:50:13.959
<v Speaker 2>in doing a series? No? No, well, I don't know why.

0:50:15.440 --> 0:50:18.040
<v Speaker 2>Once Morehead warmed to the idea, Montgomery went straight to

0:50:18.040 --> 0:50:22.719
<v Speaker 2>the producers and exclaimed, I found mother tremendousness has just

0:50:22.760 --> 0:50:26.920
<v Speaker 2>done dead pan in knocks on the door, knocks on

0:50:26.960 --> 0:50:29.760
<v Speaker 2>the door, eyes completely blank and completely stoic. I found

0:50:29.840 --> 0:50:35.840
<v Speaker 2>Mother Norman Bates Morehead. Heads. Yeah. Moorehead had some serious

0:50:35.920 --> 0:50:39.040
<v Speaker 2>terms that were part of her conditions for joining Bewitched.

0:50:39.320 --> 0:50:42.480
<v Speaker 2>She was deeply religious and had serious problems with portraying

0:50:42.480 --> 0:50:45.520
<v Speaker 2>a witch. Hilariously, and Dora gets its name from a

0:50:45.520 --> 0:50:50.440
<v Speaker 2>biblical passage supposedly at her request and or recommendation. In

0:50:50.520 --> 0:50:53.000
<v Speaker 2>the first Book of Samuel, there's a story about Saul

0:50:53.120 --> 0:50:56.440
<v Speaker 2>consulting the Witch of Endor to use her powers to

0:50:56.480 --> 0:51:01.000
<v Speaker 2>connect him with the deceased Samuel. Samuel becomes Samantha and

0:51:01.200 --> 0:51:05.799
<v Speaker 2>Endoor became Indora. Fine. I guess that's where Steven Spielberg

0:51:05.880 --> 0:51:08.640
<v Speaker 2>got it too, or George Lucas got Endored the Moons

0:51:08.640 --> 0:51:12.319
<v Speaker 2>of Endor. Oh really? Oh wow? Maybe I don't know

0:51:12.400 --> 0:51:14.120
<v Speaker 2>who cares. I didn't read that part of the Bible,

0:51:14.320 --> 0:51:17.680
<v Speaker 2>skimmed it, got the cliff notes. I don't watch that

0:51:17.719 --> 0:51:22.360
<v Speaker 2>part of Star Wars. Morehead's concerns were all so practical.

0:51:22.719 --> 0:51:24.359
<v Speaker 2>She accepted the role in the condition that she only

0:51:24.400 --> 0:51:26.640
<v Speaker 2>had to appear in eight out of every twelve episodes,

0:51:26.680 --> 0:51:29.279
<v Speaker 2>which would leave her time to pursue other projects. It's

0:51:29.320 --> 0:51:31.359
<v Speaker 2>a story that's similar to that of Natalie Shaeffer, who

0:51:31.360 --> 0:51:34.440
<v Speaker 2>took the part of Missus Howell and Jordan's beloved Gilligan's Island,

0:51:34.600 --> 0:51:36.880
<v Speaker 2>thinking that the show pilot would never go to series,

0:51:37.200 --> 0:51:41.040
<v Speaker 2>and then bursting into tears when it did. Morehead, for

0:51:41.120 --> 0:51:43.000
<v Speaker 2>her part, did not expect Bewitch to be a hit,

0:51:43.320 --> 0:51:46.040
<v Speaker 2>even going so far as to dismiss the scripts as

0:51:46.239 --> 0:51:49.000
<v Speaker 2>hack in a nineteen sixty five interview with TV Guide

0:51:49.760 --> 0:51:52.279
<v Speaker 2>at a time when it's worth noting be Witch was

0:51:52.320 --> 0:51:55.399
<v Speaker 2>basically the biggest sitcom on television. She would later say

0:51:55.400 --> 0:51:58.880
<v Speaker 2>elsewhere that the show was not breathtaking. She's just a

0:51:58.880 --> 0:52:03.080
<v Speaker 2>tremendous bit of passive aggression. I'm banking that. Despite the

0:52:03.120 --> 0:52:05.200
<v Speaker 2>six Emmy gnoms she earned for her work on the show,

0:52:05.280 --> 0:52:07.200
<v Speaker 2>Morehead was always quick to note that she used to

0:52:07.280 --> 0:52:11.480
<v Speaker 2>earn nods for a little something called the Oscars. As

0:52:11.480 --> 0:52:13.680
<v Speaker 2>she told the New York Daily News in nineteen sixty five,

0:52:14.000 --> 0:52:16.840
<v Speaker 2>I've been in movies and played theater from coast to coast,

0:52:16.920 --> 0:52:19.080
<v Speaker 2>so I was quite well known before Bewitched, and I

0:52:19.120 --> 0:52:23.080
<v Speaker 2>don't particularly want to be identified as the witch. Even so,

0:52:23.360 --> 0:52:25.680
<v Speaker 2>she remained with Bewitched until its run ended in nineteen

0:52:25.719 --> 0:52:28.200
<v Speaker 2>seventy two, largely due to her fondness of working with

0:52:28.280 --> 0:52:33.319
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth Montgomery and the og Darren Dick York. She would have,

0:52:33.440 --> 0:52:36.279
<v Speaker 2>as we will get to, a tougher relationship with New

0:52:36.360 --> 0:52:41.239
<v Speaker 2>Dick Sergeant Deputy to Darin, who would go on to

0:52:41.360 --> 0:52:44.200
<v Speaker 2>describe her Morehead as a tough old bird.

0:52:44.680 --> 0:52:48.160
<v Speaker 1>Moorhead died of cancer on April thirtieth, nineteen seventy four,

0:52:48.200 --> 0:52:51.000
<v Speaker 1>at the age of seventy three. She was outlived by

0:52:51.000 --> 0:52:54.800
<v Speaker 1>her mother, who was one hundred and six. Oh, higel

0:52:54.880 --> 0:52:58.120
<v Speaker 1>you'll here, this will interest you. Morehead was one of

0:52:58.160 --> 0:53:00.400
<v Speaker 1>the many people who developed cancer while war working on

0:53:00.480 --> 0:53:03.879
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen fifty six John Wayne movie The Conqueror, which

0:53:03.960 --> 0:53:07.560
<v Speaker 1>was shot in Iron City, Utah, just downwind from above

0:53:07.600 --> 0:53:14.080
<v Speaker 1>ground atomic bomb testing. These are truly horrifying stats. Of

0:53:14.120 --> 0:53:17.600
<v Speaker 1>the two hundred and twenty cast and crew, ninety one

0:53:17.640 --> 0:53:20.120
<v Speaker 1>of them developed some form of cancer within the next

0:53:20.120 --> 0:53:23.160
<v Speaker 1>twenty five years, and forty six of them would die

0:53:23.160 --> 0:53:25.600
<v Speaker 1>of the disease, So a little less than a quarter

0:53:25.680 --> 0:53:28.719
<v Speaker 1>of the cast died from cancer that's believed to be

0:53:28.840 --> 0:53:34.160
<v Speaker 1>triggered by the above ground radiation. Tho included John Wayne himself,

0:53:34.280 --> 0:53:37.719
<v Speaker 1>Susan Haywood, and the film's director, Dick Powell. Actors on

0:53:37.760 --> 0:53:40.840
<v Speaker 1>the set to Bewitched recall hearing Morehead discussing her concern

0:53:40.840 --> 0:53:44.960
<v Speaker 1>about the radioactive fallout, which is horrifying. It even bugged

0:53:45.000 --> 0:53:46.400
<v Speaker 1>her years later that she'd.

0:53:46.239 --> 0:53:47.920
<v Speaker 2>Been exposed to that that's so sad.

0:53:49.239 --> 0:53:51.200
<v Speaker 1>I don't know where else to put this, and it's

0:53:51.239 --> 0:53:53.359
<v Speaker 1>sort of not even worth really going into other than

0:53:53.400 --> 0:53:56.200
<v Speaker 1>it serves as a transition to talk about another Bewitch performer.

0:53:56.239 --> 0:53:59.240
<v Speaker 1>But the years, there have been rumors that Agnes Moorehead

0:53:59.360 --> 0:54:03.320
<v Speaker 1>was gay. And supposedly had an affair with Debbie Reynolds.

0:54:03.680 --> 0:54:04.560
<v Speaker 2>Heh yeah, good for her.

0:54:04.680 --> 0:54:06.680
<v Speaker 1>I'm ninety percent sure that this was one of the

0:54:06.800 --> 0:54:10.279
<v Speaker 1>so called revelations in the gossipy memoir that reynolds ex

0:54:10.360 --> 0:54:12.759
<v Speaker 1>husband Eddie Fisher, published in nineteen ninety nine.

0:54:12.920 --> 0:54:14.360
<v Speaker 2>Woh, he was such a bitch.

0:54:14.560 --> 0:54:17.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, a book that was so trashy that it caused

0:54:17.200 --> 0:54:20.480
<v Speaker 1>their daughter, Carrie Fisher. Yes, that Carrie Fisher to quip

0:54:20.840 --> 0:54:24.640
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to have my DNA fumigated after that, an

0:54:24.760 --> 0:54:26.040
<v Speaker 1>incredible line.

0:54:26.360 --> 0:54:28.560
<v Speaker 2>That's why she was a punch up writer. Yep.

0:54:29.480 --> 0:54:32.799
<v Speaker 1>Reynolds herself dismissed these lesbian rumors as malicious tales put

0:54:32.840 --> 0:54:35.600
<v Speaker 1>around by one of Agnes Moorehead's ex husbands during their divorce,

0:54:36.200 --> 0:54:39.239
<v Speaker 1>but Moore had herself tease these stories during her lifetime.

0:54:40.000 --> 0:54:43.319
<v Speaker 1>In a nineteen seventy three interview, journalist Bose Hadley gave

0:54:43.360 --> 0:54:46.360
<v Speaker 1>her the opportunity to confirm or deny these rumors, and

0:54:46.480 --> 0:54:50.040
<v Speaker 1>Moorehead decided to play coy. The exchange went like this,

0:54:50.920 --> 0:54:55.440
<v Speaker 1>just one more question. Numerous Hollywood actresses, Garbo Gish, Dietrich Gene,

0:54:55.440 --> 0:54:59.960
<v Speaker 1>author Kay Francis, Barbara Stanwick, Duluah Bankhead, del Rio, Janet Gainer,

0:55:00.120 --> 0:55:03.600
<v Speaker 1>et cetera, et cetera. Have enjoyed lesbian or by relationships?

0:55:04.360 --> 0:55:04.959
<v Speaker 2>Have you ever?

0:55:05.920 --> 0:55:09.000
<v Speaker 1>And Moreheads quoted as saying, yes, you'd love to put

0:55:09.000 --> 0:55:11.640
<v Speaker 1>me in their excellent company, even if I don't belong

0:55:11.719 --> 0:55:17.840
<v Speaker 1>in the same category. Brackets smiles, Riley, you don't. Those ladies,

0:55:17.880 --> 0:55:20.000
<v Speaker 1>she says, were more beautiful than me.

0:55:20.400 --> 0:55:23.520
<v Speaker 2>Hmmm, cooy of her. That's great, that's great.

0:55:24.520 --> 0:55:27.080
<v Speaker 1>A big source of these rumors was Uncle Arthur himself,

0:55:27.239 --> 0:55:32.440
<v Speaker 1>Paul Lynde, who was also a bitch yes, semi closeted

0:55:32.520 --> 0:55:36.240
<v Speaker 1>in his lifetime. Lynde, who lives Morehead by almost a decade,

0:55:36.560 --> 0:55:40.560
<v Speaker 1>was pretty unambiguous in interviews, offering this all time sound bite.

0:55:41.320 --> 0:55:43.919
<v Speaker 2>If I wasn't so sick, I could do a Paul

0:55:43.960 --> 0:55:47.240
<v Speaker 2>lynd voice, But I well, the whole world.

0:55:47.239 --> 0:55:49.920
<v Speaker 1>No z Agnes was a lesbian, I mean, classy as hell,

0:55:50.040 --> 0:55:50.920
<v Speaker 1>but at all time.

0:55:50.880 --> 0:55:51.520
<v Speaker 2>But one of them.

0:55:51.440 --> 0:55:54.200
<v Speaker 1>I can't see this, but one of the all time

0:55:54.280 --> 0:55:55.320
<v Speaker 1>Hollywood doe.

0:55:56.600 --> 0:55:59.600
<v Speaker 2>Can I say? I'd have to bleep that, yeah, probably okay.

0:56:00.080 --> 0:56:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Lynde also told a story in which she supposedly caught

0:56:02.680 --> 0:56:05.480
<v Speaker 1>one of her husband's cheating on her. Agnes screamed at

0:56:05.520 --> 0:56:07.839
<v Speaker 1>him that if he could have a mistress, so could she.

0:56:08.719 --> 0:56:17.600
<v Speaker 1>Oh Paul Land a messy, messy, messy man. Oh Pauland

0:56:17.640 --> 0:56:19.680
<v Speaker 1>I love Pauland this is the perfect segue to talk

0:56:19.719 --> 0:56:24.120
<v Speaker 1>about one of my favorite performers of all time, Templeton. Templeton,

0:56:24.280 --> 0:56:27.640
<v Speaker 1>Yes before Me, which he was famous as Harry McAfee,

0:56:27.680 --> 0:56:29.600
<v Speaker 1>the Dad and Bye Bye Birdie. No, he's a rat

0:56:29.600 --> 0:56:34.200
<v Speaker 1>guy and the center square on Hollywood Squares.

0:56:34.520 --> 0:56:35.399
<v Speaker 2>No, he's a rat guy.

0:56:35.600 --> 0:56:38.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he will be the rat guy in the Charlotte's Web.

0:56:38.320 --> 0:56:40.360
<v Speaker 1>An made an adaptation Humbaull.

0:56:42.680 --> 0:56:44.480
<v Speaker 2>That was good. I used.

0:56:46.400 --> 0:56:48.800
<v Speaker 1>There are periods of my life, but I would speak

0:56:48.800 --> 0:56:52.080
<v Speaker 1>in Pauland's voice for extended stretches.

0:56:52.960 --> 0:56:53.920
<v Speaker 2>I missed those days.

0:56:54.520 --> 0:56:57.600
<v Speaker 1>He's probably famous to most non millennials for his role

0:56:57.600 --> 0:57:00.760
<v Speaker 1>in the daytime staple Hollywood Squares, which began in nineteen

0:57:00.800 --> 0:57:01.359
<v Speaker 1>sixty six.

0:57:01.400 --> 0:57:03.279
<v Speaker 2>I forgot it started that early and.

0:57:03.280 --> 0:57:07.360
<v Speaker 1>Gave birth to some truly incredible one liners delivered in

0:57:07.520 --> 0:57:09.880
<v Speaker 1>Lyn's distinctive nasal snarl.

0:57:10.800 --> 0:57:12.960
<v Speaker 2>Can I share a few of them? Right now? Hit us?

0:57:13.080 --> 0:57:15.520
<v Speaker 2>Lightning around? Do you want to be? Can you do

0:57:15.560 --> 0:57:17.400
<v Speaker 2>a land? Nor do you want to ask.

0:57:17.680 --> 0:57:19.880
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, because under the setup for those who haven't actually

0:57:19.880 --> 0:57:23.000
<v Speaker 1>watched Hollywood Squares, the host Peter Marshall would ask Paul

0:57:23.240 --> 0:57:25.360
<v Speaker 1>a question and he would.

0:57:25.240 --> 0:57:27.800
<v Speaker 2>Answer to ask me some of these questions. Why do

0:57:27.880 --> 0:57:33.960
<v Speaker 2>motorcyclists wear leather because chiffon wrinkles? Medium phony, You're the

0:57:33.960 --> 0:57:39.040
<v Speaker 2>world's most popular fruit. What are you humbo? That's good?

0:57:39.280 --> 0:57:41.760
<v Speaker 2>The Great Whiter George Bernard Shaw once wrote, It's such

0:57:41.760 --> 0:57:44.440
<v Speaker 2>a wonderful thing. What a crime to waste it on children?

0:57:44.640 --> 0:57:45.240
<v Speaker 2>What is that?

0:57:45.560 --> 0:57:46.080
<v Speaker 1>A whipping?

0:57:47.880 --> 0:57:51.600
<v Speaker 2>Got me for a daytime TV in like nineteen seventy.

0:57:52.000 --> 0:57:54.800
<v Speaker 2>The Great White is one of the most feared animals, Paul,

0:57:54.840 --> 0:57:55.920
<v Speaker 2>what is the Great White?

0:57:56.320 --> 0:57:59.720
<v Speaker 1>This is amazing. A sheriff in Alabama.

0:58:00.080 --> 0:58:04.680
<v Speaker 2>In Alice in Wonderland who kept crying I'm late, I'm late, Alice,

0:58:04.760 --> 0:58:07.680
<v Speaker 2>and her mother is sick about it. Diamond should not

0:58:07.720 --> 0:58:10.880
<v Speaker 2>be kept with your family. Jewels, why they're so cold?

0:58:11.400 --> 0:58:13.800
<v Speaker 2>So half of this is like borsch belt garbage. I'm sorry.

0:58:14.440 --> 0:58:17.000
<v Speaker 2>The tin man wanted a heart and the lion want encourage.

0:58:17.240 --> 0:58:19.400
<v Speaker 2>What did the straw man want? He wanted the tin

0:58:19.480 --> 0:58:24.360
<v Speaker 2>man to notice him. That's good. Yeah, in what state

0:58:24.400 --> 0:58:25.520
<v Speaker 2>was Abraham Lincolnborn.

0:58:26.160 --> 0:58:30.600
<v Speaker 1>This is great, like the rest of us, naked and screaming, Yeah,

0:58:30.640 --> 0:58:31.280
<v Speaker 1>that's funny.

0:58:32.080 --> 0:58:34.120
<v Speaker 2>What's one thing you should never do in bed? Pine

0:58:34.160 --> 0:58:38.400
<v Speaker 2>and laugh? Eddie Fisher recently said I am sorry. I

0:58:38.440 --> 0:58:41.200
<v Speaker 2>am sorry for them both. Who was he referring to

0:58:41.480 --> 0:58:47.160
<v Speaker 2>his fans? That's solid. According to Tony Randall, every woman

0:58:47.240 --> 0:58:50.080
<v Speaker 2>I've been intimate with in my life has been what

0:58:50.520 --> 0:58:52.600
<v Speaker 2>bitterly disappointed.

0:58:53.240 --> 0:58:55.360
<v Speaker 1>I need though I wish i'd worked. There's a time

0:58:55.400 --> 0:58:56.960
<v Speaker 1>I could do a really good ball in that I

0:58:56.960 --> 0:58:59.440
<v Speaker 1>can't do it right now. I'm sad. I'm whiffing it

0:58:59.520 --> 0:59:03.280
<v Speaker 1>all right. I was devastated to discover years later that

0:59:03.360 --> 0:59:05.400
<v Speaker 1>all these lines were written for Paul by a staff

0:59:05.440 --> 0:59:07.320
<v Speaker 1>of writers. I just thought for years that he came

0:59:07.400 --> 0:59:09.760
<v Speaker 1>up with it on the spot, but no one could

0:59:09.800 --> 0:59:12.720
<v Speaker 1>deliver them like he could. Mel Brooks wants to describe

0:59:12.720 --> 0:59:15.240
<v Speaker 1>Paul In as being capable of getting laughs by reading

0:59:15.320 --> 0:59:19.800
<v Speaker 1>quote a phone book, Tornado alert or seed catalog, and

0:59:19.880 --> 0:59:22.080
<v Speaker 1>I'd like the second fat although it's kind of a

0:59:22.080 --> 0:59:24.760
<v Speaker 1>love him or hate him scenario. Paul himself told a

0:59:24.800 --> 0:59:26.800
<v Speaker 1>story on Carson about a man coming up to him

0:59:26.840 --> 0:59:29.440
<v Speaker 1>and saying it's you stay right there. I have to

0:59:29.440 --> 0:59:30.120
<v Speaker 1>get my wife.

0:59:30.160 --> 0:59:33.640
<v Speaker 2>She can't stand you. That's good, Yeah, that's pretty good.

0:59:34.800 --> 0:59:38.280
<v Speaker 1>Incidentally, it's believed that he borrowed his distinctive nasal delivery

0:59:38.320 --> 0:59:43.040
<v Speaker 1>from another Bewitched bit player, Alice Ghostly, who played Esmeralda

0:59:43.160 --> 0:59:47.760
<v Speaker 1>the hapless Witch Made Made Witch Witch Made. Yeah, it

0:59:47.800 --> 0:59:49.800
<v Speaker 1>makes sense considering both of them cut their teeth in

0:59:49.840 --> 0:59:52.680
<v Speaker 1>a review called New Faces of nineteen fifty two, which

0:59:52.760 --> 0:59:55.600
<v Speaker 1>launched both of their careers, as well as that of

0:59:55.680 --> 0:59:59.680
<v Speaker 1>Earth A Kit Ah Earth a Kit Alice Ghostly and

0:59:59.720 --> 1:00:01.320
<v Speaker 1>Paul lynd on stage together.

1:00:02.160 --> 1:00:07.640
<v Speaker 2>That sounds devastating, Yeah for all parties involved. Yeah yeah.

1:00:07.720 --> 1:00:10.800
<v Speaker 1>Speaking of legendary friends from his pre famed days, pauland

1:00:10.840 --> 1:00:13.240
<v Speaker 1>once shared an apartment building with Marlon Brando when they

1:00:13.280 --> 1:00:16.680
<v Speaker 1>were both young and hungry and in Marlin's case, very hungry.

1:00:17.040 --> 1:00:18.920
<v Speaker 1>The building had communal kitchens.

1:00:18.560 --> 1:00:19.600
<v Speaker 2>And very hung.

1:00:21.160 --> 1:00:24.600
<v Speaker 1>The building had communal kitchens, and Lynde claimed that Brando

1:00:24.640 --> 1:00:26.880
<v Speaker 1>would steal his food from the fridge all the time.

1:00:28.160 --> 1:00:30.240
<v Speaker 1>It's a testament to his talent that Paul Land made

1:00:30.280 --> 1:00:32.720
<v Speaker 1>such an impression and Bewitched those people assumed that he

1:00:32.760 --> 1:00:35.160
<v Speaker 1>was a series regular. But Uncle Arthur was only in

1:00:35.360 --> 1:00:38.200
<v Speaker 1>ten of the show's two hundred and fifty four episodes.

1:00:38.880 --> 1:00:41.120
<v Speaker 1>He also appeared in a pre Uncle Arthur role as

1:00:41.160 --> 1:00:44.320
<v Speaker 1>Samantha's nervous driving teacher, and he was so well received

1:00:44.320 --> 1:00:47.080
<v Speaker 1>that Montgomery and Asher decided to write him a recurring role.

1:00:47.520 --> 1:00:51.040
<v Speaker 1>Lynd had a complicated relationship to his talents, though he

1:00:51.080 --> 1:00:53.439
<v Speaker 1>wanted to be recognized as a serious actor. He said,

1:00:53.480 --> 1:00:55.680
<v Speaker 1>we live in a world that needs laughter. Now I've

1:00:55.720 --> 1:00:58.439
<v Speaker 1>decided that if I can make people laugh, I'm making

1:00:58.480 --> 1:01:02.560
<v Speaker 1>a more important contribution. His time on Hollywood Squares made

1:01:02.640 --> 1:01:05.720
<v Speaker 1>him rich enough to buy Errol Flynn's old Hollywood mansion,

1:01:06.400 --> 1:01:09.040
<v Speaker 1>but Lynde himself was a deeply troubled man.

1:01:09.720 --> 1:01:11.840
<v Speaker 2>Tell him why. In addition to not living up to

1:01:11.880 --> 1:01:14.680
<v Speaker 2>his own expectations as an actor, Paul had to contend

1:01:14.680 --> 1:01:17.040
<v Speaker 2>with being a gay man in Hollywood, which meant being

1:01:17.800 --> 1:01:22.200
<v Speaker 2>grading on the Paul Lynde to Curve closeted. He explained

1:01:22.200 --> 1:01:24.480
<v Speaker 2>his status as a lifelong bachelor by claiming that his

1:01:24.520 --> 1:01:26.760
<v Speaker 2>high school sweetheart had broken his heart and he was

1:01:26.800 --> 1:01:29.160
<v Speaker 2>still too hurt to give other women a chance. In

1:01:29.280 --> 1:01:32.360
<v Speaker 2>nineteen seventy six, People magazine profile described a man named

1:01:32.400 --> 1:01:36.360
<v Speaker 2>stan Fine Smith as Linden sounds like one of those

1:01:36.640 --> 1:01:42.200
<v Speaker 2>made up anchor names and anchorman Wes Mantooth Stan Fine

1:01:42.240 --> 1:01:48.400
<v Speaker 2>Smith described a man named Stan fin Smith as Lynde's hairstylist,

1:01:48.680 --> 1:01:53.320
<v Speaker 2>sweet mate and chauffeur bodyguard. Those barely veiled euphemisms were

1:01:53.320 --> 1:01:55.320
<v Speaker 2>about as close as Linde ever came to coming out

1:01:55.320 --> 1:01:59.200
<v Speaker 2>in his lifetime. Despite his campy and flamboyant television persona,

1:01:59.440 --> 1:02:02.200
<v Speaker 2>Lynn's prime life and sexual orientation were never directly or

1:02:02.240 --> 1:02:05.400
<v Speaker 2>acknowledged or discussed in the media. Later in his life,

1:02:05.440 --> 1:02:07.720
<v Speaker 2>he was offered gay roles, but he always refused them.

1:02:08.680 --> 1:02:10.800
<v Speaker 2>He said in the aforementioned People cover story that he

1:02:10.840 --> 1:02:15.240
<v Speaker 2>was glad his following was quote straight before declaring, gay

1:02:15.280 --> 1:02:21.840
<v Speaker 2>people killed Judy Garland, but they're not going to kill me. True.

1:02:22.120 --> 1:02:24.920
<v Speaker 2>What do you mean true? I believe it. I'll believe anything.

1:02:27.640 --> 1:02:32.680
<v Speaker 2>I'm a very credulous person. In private, though he reportedly

1:02:32.680 --> 1:02:37.240
<v Speaker 2>criticized famed anti gay activist Anita Bryant, saying she attacked

1:02:37.280 --> 1:02:41.200
<v Speaker 2>my people. Lynd was also haunted by a tragedy that

1:02:41.200 --> 1:02:44.080
<v Speaker 2>occurred on July eighteenth, nineteen sixty five, when a young

1:02:44.120 --> 1:02:47.479
<v Speaker 2>actor named James being, Davidson fell from the eighth floor

1:02:47.520 --> 1:02:51.000
<v Speaker 2>balcony of Lynde's room at San Francisco's Sir Francis Drake Hotel.

1:02:51.880 --> 1:02:55.040
<v Speaker 2>The incident was reportedly result of horsing around after the

1:02:55.040 --> 1:02:59.160
<v Speaker 2>pair had spent hours drinking. Davidson supposedly said, watch me

1:02:59.240 --> 1:03:02.120
<v Speaker 2>do a trick like a toddler would. The next thing,

1:03:02.200 --> 1:03:04.920
<v Speaker 2>Lynde realized he was dangling by his fingertips from a

1:03:04.960 --> 1:03:08.160
<v Speaker 2>tiny ledge outside the window. At first, Linden thought this

1:03:08.240 --> 1:03:10.200
<v Speaker 2>was a prank and assumed the guy was actually standing

1:03:10.240 --> 1:03:12.680
<v Speaker 2>on a ledge lower down, but he was actually faced

1:03:12.720 --> 1:03:15.960
<v Speaker 2>and hanging on by his fingertips, much like Harrison Ford

1:03:16.240 --> 1:03:19.240
<v Speaker 2>in one of the most iconic composite shots in film history,

1:03:20.080 --> 1:03:22.800
<v Speaker 2>as deckred at the end of Blade Runner, Tears and

1:03:22.880 --> 1:03:27.280
<v Speaker 2>Rain and so forth. Unfortunately, Bing had a zero point

1:03:27.280 --> 1:03:30.600
<v Speaker 2>two four bac could not hoist himself back in and

1:03:30.840 --> 1:03:33.640
<v Speaker 2>hung there for two minutes, eighty feet above the street.

1:03:34.200 --> 1:03:37.520
<v Speaker 2>Lynd grabbed his arms and tried to haul him back inside,

1:03:37.560 --> 1:03:40.880
<v Speaker 2>but failed, and Davidson fell eight stories onto the street

1:03:40.880 --> 1:03:45.720
<v Speaker 2>below and died instantly, too soon following the tragic death

1:03:45.720 --> 1:03:49.960
<v Speaker 2>of Liam Payne. I didn't do it. It was that devil,

1:03:50.000 --> 1:03:56.600
<v Speaker 2>alcohol and cocaine and fame, et cetera, tears and rain.

1:03:57.760 --> 1:04:01.240
<v Speaker 2>I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. It's so funny

1:04:01.240 --> 1:04:02.960
<v Speaker 2>how all that tears in ren speech is just like

1:04:03.160 --> 1:04:06.560
<v Speaker 2>this could have easily been like a fully gay queer

1:04:06.960 --> 1:04:10.680
<v Speaker 2>like queen speech, like something creed to the Desert or

1:04:10.680 --> 1:04:16.320
<v Speaker 2>something yeah yeah, imagining like Guy Pierce in like full

1:04:16.400 --> 1:04:20.640
<v Speaker 2>drag makeup, delivering delivering that line at the end of Priscilla.

1:04:20.800 --> 1:04:23.120
<v Speaker 2>This accident was actually a witness, not Liam Payne or

1:04:23.200 --> 1:04:26.280
<v Speaker 2>Guy Pierce in drag. Was witnessed by two police officers

1:04:26.320 --> 1:04:29.680
<v Speaker 2>standing outside who did clear lind of wrongdoing. The whispers

1:04:29.680 --> 1:04:32.600
<v Speaker 2>about the incident dogged him for years, basically insinuating that

1:04:32.640 --> 1:04:34.320
<v Speaker 2>he had something to do with it, and he was

1:04:34.360 --> 1:04:36.320
<v Speaker 2>haunted by the memory for the rest of his life,

1:04:36.800 --> 1:04:39.800
<v Speaker 2>supposedly saying that's the end of my career shortly after

1:04:39.840 --> 1:04:42.040
<v Speaker 2>it happened. If that wasn't the only reason for his

1:04:42.080 --> 1:04:45.840
<v Speaker 2>burgeoning alcoholism, it deserved to be. But Lynde was a

1:04:46.000 --> 1:04:49.240
<v Speaker 2>famously mean drunk who could decimate his friends verbally when

1:04:49.240 --> 1:04:51.400
<v Speaker 2>the mood took him, and it also landed him in

1:04:51.440 --> 1:04:55.240
<v Speaker 2>numerous scrapes with the law. One famous, possibly apocryphal story

1:04:55.280 --> 1:04:57.360
<v Speaker 2>claims that he led cops and a drunken high speed

1:04:57.480 --> 1:04:59.919
<v Speaker 2>chase through the valley one night before crashing into a male.

1:05:01.080 --> 1:05:03.000
<v Speaker 2>When the police came to the car with their guns drawn,

1:05:03.000 --> 1:05:05.960
<v Speaker 2>he supposedly lowered his window and said, I'll have a cheeseburger,

1:05:06.000 --> 1:05:07.840
<v Speaker 2>hold the onions and a large sprite.

1:05:08.680 --> 1:05:11.160
<v Speaker 1>I'll have a cheeseburger, hauled the onions and a lot spry.

1:05:12.200 --> 1:05:15.400
<v Speaker 2>This was incorporated into the script for a Groundhog Day.

1:05:15.560 --> 1:05:18.400
<v Speaker 2>As those of you who remember that episode will remember,

1:05:19.560 --> 1:05:22.480
<v Speaker 2>he got sober shortly before his fatal heart attack on

1:05:22.560 --> 1:05:25.800
<v Speaker 2>January tenth, nineteen eighty two, at the age of fifty five,

1:05:26.600 --> 1:05:28.840
<v Speaker 2>and doctor said that his heart resembled that of a

1:05:28.920 --> 1:05:31.760
<v Speaker 2>ninety year old man. He simply loved too hard.

1:05:32.240 --> 1:05:34.280
<v Speaker 1>Well, that story was a bummer, and you know what,

1:05:34.880 --> 1:05:38.000
<v Speaker 1>go on, here's another one. Let's talk about the sad

1:05:38.080 --> 1:05:40.800
<v Speaker 1>story of Gladys Kravits.

1:05:42.560 --> 1:05:44.960
<v Speaker 2>It sounds like one of those like anthologies. Is the

1:05:45.000 --> 1:05:47.040
<v Speaker 2>mysterious case of Gladys Kravitz.

1:05:47.720 --> 1:05:50.280
<v Speaker 1>Well, she was the nosy next door neighbor, and apparently

1:05:50.320 --> 1:05:53.720
<v Speaker 1>the term Gladys Kravitz, you know, entered the popular lexicon.

1:05:53.400 --> 1:05:55.520
<v Speaker 2>Like as like a devastating put down.

1:05:55.720 --> 1:05:57.600
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I was like, you're acting a real Gladys Kravit.

1:05:57.680 --> 1:06:00.160
<v Speaker 2>So I don't really remember hearing that. Are you just

1:06:00.200 --> 1:06:01.960
<v Speaker 2>locked into the pol invoice now for like the rest

1:06:02.000 --> 1:06:03.680
<v Speaker 2>of your life, like you can't shake it? Like Austin

1:06:03.680 --> 1:06:07.360
<v Speaker 2>Butler and Elvis was that Paul In, I didn't hear

1:06:07.400 --> 1:06:10.880
<v Speaker 2>that you're really Gladys If you're real Gladys Kravitz.

1:06:10.880 --> 1:06:12.920
<v Speaker 1>Oh, that's an old time radio voice, but.

1:06:13.040 --> 1:06:15.560
<v Speaker 2>Also like it sort of dovetails into the Hannibal lecter

1:06:15.640 --> 1:06:19.760
<v Speaker 2>at some point. It's all in this continuous like yeah, raspy,

1:06:20.000 --> 1:06:21.920
<v Speaker 2>sassy seois.

1:06:21.920 --> 1:06:24.520
<v Speaker 1>That's because I'm sick too, as a different level of.

1:06:24.760 --> 1:06:27.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I wasn't criticizing you. I was. I was saying

1:06:27.360 --> 1:06:29.160
<v Speaker 2>that was a hopeful thing, and I hope you're locked

1:06:29.160 --> 1:06:31.080
<v Speaker 2>into the Paul invoice for the rest of your life.

1:06:31.360 --> 1:06:33.400
<v Speaker 1>I mean, now I really want to like, I'm really

1:06:33.440 --> 1:06:35.600
<v Speaker 1>sad because I could do it. I'm sure my father

1:06:35.680 --> 1:06:37.400
<v Speaker 1>is very proud listening to this right now. I could

1:06:37.400 --> 1:06:40.200
<v Speaker 1>do it pretty well, but I'm kind of I'm kind

1:06:40.200 --> 1:06:40.919
<v Speaker 1>of blowing it here.

1:06:41.120 --> 1:06:43.120
<v Speaker 2>I think you're doing a great job. Oh, thank thank you.

1:06:43.160 --> 1:06:43.760
<v Speaker 2>Thank you Chief.

1:06:45.840 --> 1:06:48.000
<v Speaker 1>The whole gag with Gladys Kravitz was that she was

1:06:48.000 --> 1:06:51.560
<v Speaker 1>this nosy neighbor who would see the various magical supernatural

1:06:51.640 --> 1:06:54.400
<v Speaker 1>goings on in the Stevens house, but everyone just thought

1:06:54.440 --> 1:06:58.640
<v Speaker 1>she was nuts. Her husband, Abder Kravitz, assumed she quote

1:06:58.680 --> 1:07:02.520
<v Speaker 1>hadn't taken her medicine fun aside. The role of Abner

1:07:02.560 --> 1:07:05.520
<v Speaker 1>Kravitz was originally offered to Jim Backus, the voice of

1:07:05.520 --> 1:07:07.680
<v Speaker 1>Mister Magoo, who turned it down because he was already

1:07:07.680 --> 1:07:11.160
<v Speaker 1>working on Gilligan's Island as Thurston Howl, the Third That

1:07:11.200 --> 1:07:14.120
<v Speaker 1>man would have owned network sitcoms in the sixties.

1:07:14.160 --> 1:07:15.560
<v Speaker 2>Can you imagine if you'd been on both?

1:07:15.800 --> 1:07:18.520
<v Speaker 1>Everyone's favorite busy body, Gladys was played by the comedic

1:07:18.560 --> 1:07:22.080
<v Speaker 1>actress Alice Pierce. She was a character actress with a

1:07:22.160 --> 1:07:27.520
<v Speaker 1>distinctive chin I guess called a weak chin. I hate

1:07:27.520 --> 1:07:31.120
<v Speaker 1>the use that term, but that's the description I always see.

1:07:31.320 --> 1:07:33.240
<v Speaker 1>It was the result of a childhood injury where she

1:07:33.320 --> 1:07:36.200
<v Speaker 1>fell from a playground swing and landed on her chin

1:07:36.720 --> 1:07:40.320
<v Speaker 1>and her jawn never developed. It was just god horrifying,

1:07:40.400 --> 1:07:42.520
<v Speaker 1>but she made it work. She turned herself into a

1:07:42.960 --> 1:07:46.120
<v Speaker 1>very popular character actress that was not the worst thing

1:07:46.160 --> 1:07:48.000
<v Speaker 1>to happen to poor Alex Pears as far as her

1:07:48.040 --> 1:07:52.040
<v Speaker 1>health was concerned. Four months before getting cast on Bewitched,

1:07:52.240 --> 1:07:56.040
<v Speaker 1>she was given a terminal cancer diagnosis. She told none

1:07:56.040 --> 1:07:58.560
<v Speaker 1>of her coworkers of the condition, and other than being

1:07:58.600 --> 1:08:00.240
<v Speaker 1>a little tired on the set every now and then,

1:08:00.320 --> 1:08:02.960
<v Speaker 1>no one suspected her of being ill. She died in

1:08:03.000 --> 1:08:05.400
<v Speaker 1>March nineteen sixty six, just as the show was wrapping

1:08:05.400 --> 1:08:09.160
<v Speaker 1>its second season, and was awarded a posthumous Outstanding Supporting

1:08:09.200 --> 1:08:10.080
<v Speaker 1>Actress Emmy.

1:08:09.880 --> 1:08:12.600
<v Speaker 2>Award two months later. This is nice.

1:08:12.640 --> 1:08:15.120
<v Speaker 1>Though William Asher gave her widower a gig on the

1:08:15.160 --> 1:08:17.760
<v Speaker 1>show directing, he basically put his career on hold to

1:08:17.800 --> 1:08:19.960
<v Speaker 1>take care of her, so it was both a nice

1:08:19.960 --> 1:08:22.360
<v Speaker 1>distraction and a way to get his career moving again,

1:08:22.479 --> 1:08:26.360
<v Speaker 1>which I think is nice. Sandra Gould later took over

1:08:26.400 --> 1:08:29.080
<v Speaker 1>the role of Gladys Kravitz for the remainder of the series.

1:08:29.360 --> 1:08:31.920
<v Speaker 2>And this is just one of three roles.

1:08:31.560 --> 1:08:35.400
<v Speaker 1>That were unceremoniously recast midstream un Bewitched. In addition to

1:08:35.400 --> 1:08:37.960
<v Speaker 1>Gladys Kravitz and of course Darren Stevens, which we talk

1:08:38.000 --> 1:08:40.599
<v Speaker 1>about later, there was also the wife of Darren's boss,

1:08:40.720 --> 1:08:41.320
<v Speaker 1>mister Tate.

1:08:41.840 --> 1:08:42.920
<v Speaker 2>Her name was Louise Tate.

1:08:43.400 --> 1:08:46.080
<v Speaker 1>She was initially played by Irene Vernon until the second

1:08:46.120 --> 1:08:49.920
<v Speaker 1>season wrapped in nineteen sixty six, when writer Danny Arnold

1:08:50.000 --> 1:08:54.160
<v Speaker 1>left the show. During this period under less than friendly circumstances, apparently,

1:08:54.160 --> 1:08:57.679
<v Speaker 1>Elizabeth Montgomery William Asher pressured Irene Vernon the follow suit

1:08:58.040 --> 1:09:03.480
<v Speaker 1>due to their friendship Cold World these mid sixties sitcoms.

1:09:03.800 --> 1:09:05.960
<v Speaker 1>The role of Louise Tate was later taken over by

1:09:06.120 --> 1:09:11.920
<v Speaker 1>Casey Rogers, who was apparently named after the Casey at

1:09:12.000 --> 1:09:12.960
<v Speaker 1>Bat poem.

1:09:12.840 --> 1:09:16.479
<v Speaker 2>What oh you know not Casey Jones A Casey at

1:09:16.479 --> 1:09:18.200
<v Speaker 2>the bat? Excuse me? You know Casey at the bat?

1:09:18.840 --> 1:09:21.880
<v Speaker 2>Do I don't put words in my mouth, don't put

1:09:21.920 --> 1:09:23.080
<v Speaker 2>things in my head. Yeah.

1:09:23.120 --> 1:09:26.040
<v Speaker 1>It's about like a baseball team from the fictional town

1:09:26.040 --> 1:09:28.840
<v Speaker 1>of Mudville's losing by two runs in the last inning.

1:09:28.880 --> 1:09:30.880
<v Speaker 1>Both the team and its fans believe they can win.

1:09:30.920 --> 1:09:35.040
<v Speaker 1>Of Casey Mudville star player gets to bat. Whoever, Casey's

1:09:35.080 --> 1:09:36.800
<v Speaker 1>scheduled to be the fifth batter of the inning and

1:09:36.840 --> 1:09:41.519
<v Speaker 1>the first two batters failed to get on base. Yeah,

1:09:41.560 --> 1:09:43.519
<v Speaker 1>it's a poem about baseball.

1:09:43.560 --> 1:09:46.200
<v Speaker 2>You wouldn't you wouldn't get it, No, I wouldn't.

1:09:46.920 --> 1:09:49.360
<v Speaker 1>One actress who was not replaced when she died.

1:09:51.680 --> 1:09:52.599
<v Speaker 2>Was Aunt Clara.

1:09:53.520 --> 1:09:57.400
<v Speaker 1>She was played by actress Marion Lorne, who straight up died.

1:09:57.479 --> 1:09:59.519
<v Speaker 2>In nineteen sixty eight. I don't know why I wrote

1:09:59.560 --> 1:10:03.080
<v Speaker 2>straight up there who died in nineteen sixty eight.

1:10:03.640 --> 1:10:06.479
<v Speaker 1>Apparently the producers did not deem her role as particularly

1:10:06.600 --> 1:10:08.960
<v Speaker 1>essential to the show, and thus did not recast her

1:10:09.000 --> 1:10:12.400
<v Speaker 1>with a rando. This is possibly because the eccentric character

1:10:12.479 --> 1:10:15.320
<v Speaker 1>was largely based on the actress who played her. Aunt

1:10:15.360 --> 1:10:18.639
<v Speaker 1>Clara's obsession with door knobs was based on maryon Lauren's

1:10:18.680 --> 1:10:22.800
<v Speaker 1>own real life collection. She'd assembled over a thousand antique

1:10:22.880 --> 1:10:23.559
<v Speaker 1>door openers.

1:10:23.720 --> 1:10:28.400
<v Speaker 2>Isn't that great? I love people collect things, okay, sure, yeah,

1:10:28.520 --> 1:10:31.640
<v Speaker 2>I mean yeah we do. But antique to just knobs,

1:10:31.920 --> 1:10:35.440
<v Speaker 2>yeah it's kind of cool. Okay. But bed knobs and broomsticks,

1:10:35.439 --> 1:10:37.680
<v Speaker 2>you know, you know, she makes her a purpose. Those

1:10:37.680 --> 1:10:38.840
<v Speaker 2>are different. Those are different.

1:10:39.240 --> 1:10:43.280
<v Speaker 1>Oh, you're right, different knobs, an idiot, different knobs.

1:10:43.479 --> 1:10:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Get off my show. I feel like a different kind

1:10:45.760 --> 1:10:48.400
<v Speaker 2>of knob right now. Who was waiting for that to

1:10:48.400 --> 1:10:48.760
<v Speaker 2>come up?

1:10:50.200 --> 1:10:53.320
<v Speaker 1>Much like Alice Pears, Maryon Lauren was given a posthumous.

1:10:52.880 --> 1:10:55.360
<v Speaker 2>Emmy for her role on Bewitched Good.

1:10:56.280 --> 1:10:59.120
<v Speaker 1>But we talked about Darren's boss, the advertising executive Larry

1:10:59.120 --> 1:10:59.840
<v Speaker 1>Tait a little while.

1:11:00.800 --> 1:11:03.760
<v Speaker 2>He was played by the character actor David White, and

1:11:03.800 --> 1:11:05.160
<v Speaker 2>he was reportedly very sweet.

1:11:05.160 --> 1:11:07.719
<v Speaker 1>He insisted that Tate's son on the show be named

1:11:07.720 --> 1:11:10.680
<v Speaker 1>after his own son, Jonathan, who he'd raised as a

1:11:10.720 --> 1:11:13.960
<v Speaker 1>single father after his wife died due to complications during

1:11:13.960 --> 1:11:18.960
<v Speaker 1>her second pregnancy. Sad Tragically, Jonathan was a passenger on

1:11:19.040 --> 1:11:21.559
<v Speaker 1>pan Am flight one oh three, which was blown up

1:11:21.600 --> 1:11:25.799
<v Speaker 1>by terras over Lockabye, Scotland on December twenty first, nineteen

1:11:25.840 --> 1:11:29.479
<v Speaker 1>eighty eight, killing all two hundred and fifty nine on board.

1:11:30.600 --> 1:11:34.040
<v Speaker 1>Very very famous terrorist attack. I actually don't know who

1:11:34.320 --> 1:11:38.720
<v Speaker 1>it was. I so rebrogated by Libyan nationalists.

1:11:39.080 --> 1:11:39.920
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah.

1:11:39.960 --> 1:11:42.880
<v Speaker 1>In two thousand and three, Gadaffie accepted Libby's responsibility for

1:11:42.920 --> 1:11:45.439
<v Speaker 1>the Lockabe bombing and paid compensation for the victims of

1:11:45.439 --> 1:11:48.320
<v Speaker 1>the families, although he maintained he had never given the

1:11:48.400 --> 1:11:49.200
<v Speaker 1>order for the attack.

1:11:49.760 --> 1:11:51.160
<v Speaker 2>I don't know I feel about Libya.

1:11:51.600 --> 1:11:53.439
<v Speaker 1>Uh well, the bad guys in Back to the Future

1:11:53.640 --> 1:11:56.200
<v Speaker 1>and true in Goadaffi.

1:11:56.360 --> 1:11:58.799
<v Speaker 2>So that's kind of all I need yeah, that's fair.

1:11:58.920 --> 1:12:01.280
<v Speaker 1>David White essentially ever recovered from the death of his

1:12:01.360 --> 1:12:03.799
<v Speaker 1>son and died two years later of a heart attack.

1:12:04.520 --> 1:12:07.680
<v Speaker 1>He's interred with his son's remains in a niche at

1:12:07.680 --> 1:12:11.880
<v Speaker 1>the Hollywood Forever Cemetery. I've actually visited him. The only

1:12:13.040 --> 1:12:15.400
<v Speaker 1>marginally funny story, if you could call it that, is

1:12:15.439 --> 1:12:19.280
<v Speaker 1>that Scott Michaels, the proprietor of the former Hollywood Death

1:12:19.320 --> 1:12:22.559
<v Speaker 1>Tour and the host of the Dearly Departed podcast, one

1:12:22.560 --> 1:12:25.719
<v Speaker 1>of my favorite podcasts. They do a great episode on Bewitched,

1:12:25.760 --> 1:12:28.640
<v Speaker 1>which I listened to in preparation for this, bought his

1:12:28.680 --> 1:12:31.240
<v Speaker 1>own niche at Hollywood Forever and it happened to be

1:12:31.320 --> 1:12:35.559
<v Speaker 1>directly beneath David Whites. The funny part is that Scott

1:12:35.600 --> 1:12:38.439
<v Speaker 1>was always terrified of this creepy bust that got made

1:12:38.520 --> 1:12:40.840
<v Speaker 1>on Bewitched as some plot point. I don't know what

1:12:40.880 --> 1:12:44.240
<v Speaker 1>it is. I forget exactly it was. Magic was involved somehow,

1:12:44.280 --> 1:12:46.320
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure, but it's this really creepy looking bust

1:12:46.320 --> 1:12:50.960
<v Speaker 1>of Larry Tait. For some reason, David White, the actor

1:12:51.000 --> 1:12:53.800
<v Speaker 1>played Larry Tate, has included it in his niche, which

1:12:53.840 --> 1:12:56.759
<v Speaker 1>is like a little cubby hole at the Mausoleum Hollywood Forever.

1:12:57.120 --> 1:13:00.839
<v Speaker 1>So now Scott Michaels, he's gonna spend eternity directly beneath

1:13:01.520 --> 1:13:04.799
<v Speaker 1>like this monument to his kindred trauma. This like scary

1:13:04.960 --> 1:13:08.280
<v Speaker 1>bust from Bewitched that like always used to freaking out

1:13:08.320 --> 1:13:08.760
<v Speaker 1>as a kid.

1:13:09.000 --> 1:13:10.439
<v Speaker 2>That's gonna be like right above him on the shelf,

1:13:10.479 --> 1:13:15.280
<v Speaker 2>above him. Good, that's all. Well. Rehearsals for the which

1:13:15.280 --> 1:13:18.720
<v Speaker 2>pilot began on November twenty second, nineteen sixty three, the

1:13:18.840 --> 1:13:24.840
<v Speaker 2>day a Bostonian died and forever cultured the world and

1:13:25.160 --> 1:13:32.439
<v Speaker 2>gave us madmen and feminism CCR, CCR, so many other

1:13:32.520 --> 1:13:33.879
<v Speaker 2>things that were so important.

1:13:34.240 --> 1:13:40.280
<v Speaker 1>I've been told, Uh, wow, American Pie. They really missed

1:13:40.320 --> 1:13:42.639
<v Speaker 1>the mark on the yeah all line.

1:13:43.680 --> 1:13:47.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I wonder if there's like a local like Southy

1:13:47.960 --> 1:13:50.720
<v Speaker 2>parodist who can take a crack at that America call

1:13:50.800 --> 1:13:54.880
<v Speaker 2>it like Bostonian pie or some shit that would suck.

1:13:55.280 --> 1:14:01.519
<v Speaker 2>According to biographer Herbie Pallato, the aforma mentioned Bostonian's death

1:14:01.640 --> 1:14:05.679
<v Speaker 2>was especially hard on Elizabeth Montgomery and her husband William Asher,

1:14:05.720 --> 1:14:08.000
<v Speaker 2>who were friends with John F. Kennedy. Asher to even

1:14:08.080 --> 1:14:11.240
<v Speaker 2>co produced the birthday party at which Marilyn Monroe famous

1:14:11.240 --> 1:14:16.240
<v Speaker 2>hornily saying happy Birthday to JFK. And Sinatra was the

1:14:16.280 --> 1:14:18.479
<v Speaker 2>other co producer. That's gross.

1:14:19.439 --> 1:14:22.639
<v Speaker 1>He was probably less sad by JFK's assassination.

1:14:22.439 --> 1:14:25.519
<v Speaker 2>So they were just trafficking women, right like that was

1:14:25.600 --> 1:14:29.800
<v Speaker 2>just like a we passed the blonde a round situation. Oh,

1:14:29.880 --> 1:14:33.840
<v Speaker 2>I have to assume Kennedy was a monster. Kennedy was

1:14:33.880 --> 1:14:37.360
<v Speaker 2>a monster. I'm sorry that whole don't maybe don't get

1:14:37.360 --> 1:14:39.000
<v Speaker 2>me on a rant with the Kennedy's.

1:14:39.080 --> 1:14:41.479
<v Speaker 1>I actually don't know as much as you probably think

1:14:41.479 --> 1:14:44.160
<v Speaker 1>I know about JFK's sexual escapades.

1:14:45.240 --> 1:14:48.160
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I mean he probably had what can be

1:14:48.160 --> 1:14:51.760
<v Speaker 2>considered a sex addiction. Yeah, I actually I did hear that.

1:14:52.000 --> 1:14:54.320
<v Speaker 2>I think he said something insane and just that in

1:14:54.360 --> 1:14:57.960
<v Speaker 2>weird situations like making people watch or like just people

1:14:58.000 --> 1:15:01.639
<v Speaker 2>like hanging out just three different people, three different women

1:15:01.680 --> 1:15:06.960
<v Speaker 2>a night, supposedly and you know teens. Oh, you know,

1:15:07.560 --> 1:15:10.120
<v Speaker 2>just gross. But he was handsome and he was the

1:15:10.160 --> 1:15:12.599
<v Speaker 2>first Catholic president, so that's okay.

1:15:12.840 --> 1:15:14.680
<v Speaker 1>Maybe that was why his back was so screwed up.

1:15:16.840 --> 1:15:19.599
<v Speaker 1>It's a pretty pretty genial laugh for a terrible joke.

1:15:20.120 --> 1:15:23.200
<v Speaker 1>I feel like he's he's probably he was Pillow Princess.

1:15:23.320 --> 1:15:24.920
<v Speaker 1>I feel like he just laid back and made the

1:15:24.960 --> 1:15:28.280
<v Speaker 1>women do all the work. He gives that, he gives

1:15:28.320 --> 1:15:33.960
<v Speaker 1>that energy. Actually, Pillow Princess, I've never heard that.

1:15:35.720 --> 1:15:39.520
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what that is. You have old detour

1:15:39.680 --> 1:15:44.920
<v Speaker 2>here about Palm Springs and Gilligan's Island. We're cutting that.

1:15:47.680 --> 1:15:49.120
<v Speaker 1>Oh no, no, I mean the weird thing about Gilligan

1:15:49.200 --> 1:15:51.559
<v Speaker 1>Island was that they also were filming the pilot on

1:15:51.720 --> 1:15:54.960
<v Speaker 1>the day JFK was assassinated, and you can see on

1:15:55.120 --> 1:15:57.240
<v Speaker 1>shots of the middow pulling out of the harbor, the

1:15:57.240 --> 1:15:59.640
<v Speaker 1>flag is at half mast because you know, in the

1:15:59.680 --> 1:16:00.639
<v Speaker 1>morning for JFK.

1:16:00.920 --> 1:16:01.720
<v Speaker 2>So I think it's weird.

1:16:01.720 --> 1:16:03.559
<v Speaker 1>On the day of the first read through of Bewitched

1:16:04.320 --> 1:16:07.519
<v Speaker 1>was also the day JFK was killed. Two huge bits

1:16:07.560 --> 1:16:12.559
<v Speaker 1>of mid century Americana television were birthed on the day

1:16:12.640 --> 1:16:13.639
<v Speaker 1>JFK was killed.

1:16:14.040 --> 1:16:18.800
<v Speaker 2>Good most good, Uh, Okay. The pilot of Bewitched is

1:16:18.800 --> 1:16:20.880
<v Speaker 2>actually really odd given the way that the rest of

1:16:20.880 --> 1:16:23.040
<v Speaker 2>the series was made. It's been given a sort of

1:16:23.080 --> 1:16:26.320
<v Speaker 2>faux professorial voiceover, which gives the episode the feel of

1:16:26.360 --> 1:16:30.679
<v Speaker 2>a sociological documentary. She's kind of a favorite satirical technique

1:16:30.720 --> 1:16:33.679
<v Speaker 2>at the time. The episode follows Samantha and Darren meeting,

1:16:33.800 --> 1:16:37.240
<v Speaker 2>falling in love, and getting married. Whilst on their honeymoon,

1:16:37.240 --> 1:16:40.840
<v Speaker 2>Samantha drops the bomb that she's a witch. Darren then

1:16:40.880 --> 1:16:42.960
<v Speaker 2>goes to the bar complains to the bartender that he

1:16:43.000 --> 1:16:46.800
<v Speaker 2>married a witch. The bartender then offers up an absolute,

1:16:47.400 --> 1:16:50.120
<v Speaker 2>absolutely predictable. God, they men just use this show as

1:16:50.120 --> 1:16:51.719
<v Speaker 2>an excuse to just talk about how much they hated

1:16:51.720 --> 1:16:54.120
<v Speaker 2>their wives, right, yeah, and every writer in the world. Yeah,

1:16:54.160 --> 1:16:56.600
<v Speaker 2>And mother in law's bartender hits them back with you

1:16:56.600 --> 1:16:58.719
<v Speaker 2>got to do just like that, just what I done, pal,

1:16:59.040 --> 1:17:01.880
<v Speaker 2>learn to live with it. Darren makes her promise to

1:17:01.880 --> 1:17:04.280
<v Speaker 2>give up her powers, but when they inexplicably go have

1:17:04.320 --> 1:17:08.479
<v Speaker 2>dinner at his rude ex's house, as newly married couples

1:17:08.479 --> 1:17:11.320
<v Speaker 2>are wont to do, Yeah, I don't really get that. Yeah,

1:17:11.800 --> 1:17:14.719
<v Speaker 2>she uses her magic to get even in her own words,

1:17:15.000 --> 1:17:18.479
<v Speaker 2>it's harder to break the habit than she thought, much

1:17:18.520 --> 1:17:24.519
<v Speaker 2>like fentanyl the Bosonian's death. That joke said that doesn't

1:17:24.520 --> 1:17:26.439
<v Speaker 2>have legs. It's funny for you and me, But the

1:17:26.479 --> 1:17:29.840
<v Speaker 2>assassination of JFK and the loss of our national innocence.

1:17:30.560 --> 1:17:33.680
<v Speaker 2>That particular straw that finally broke our camel's back of

1:17:33.680 --> 1:17:38.600
<v Speaker 2>a country built on blood. Ah sadly was not the

1:17:38.640 --> 1:17:43.160
<v Speaker 2>only thing that marked Elizabeth Montgomery's time During this stretch

1:17:43.439 --> 1:17:46.240
<v Speaker 2>of the show. She was pregnant, which in the sixties

1:17:46.280 --> 1:17:51.280
<v Speaker 2>could be treated as a rare form of cancer if

1:17:51.280 --> 1:17:53.320
<v Speaker 2>you were in show business. I mean, they used to

1:17:53.320 --> 1:17:55.759
<v Speaker 2>go to such extreme lanes to shoot around it and stuff,

1:17:55.920 --> 1:17:57.800
<v Speaker 2>and they did for here. Rather than go the I

1:17:57.920 --> 1:18:00.320
<v Speaker 2>Love Lucy route and write it into the program, they

1:18:00.320 --> 1:18:03.400
<v Speaker 2>decided to shoot around it. This was partially because Samantha

1:18:03.400 --> 1:18:05.160
<v Speaker 2>and Darren were newly married in the show, and it

1:18:05.200 --> 1:18:09.000
<v Speaker 2>was deemed unseemly for her to already be showing unless

1:18:09.040 --> 1:18:11.200
<v Speaker 2>it was like a shotgun witch wedding, which sounds like

1:18:11.240 --> 1:18:16.040
<v Speaker 2>a sixth whoa yeah, shotgun witch wedding playing at the

1:18:16.040 --> 1:18:22.519
<v Speaker 2>Whiskey ram Alem. It was a little early in the

1:18:22.560 --> 1:18:25.400
<v Speaker 2>show's life to welcome in a new child the hideous

1:18:25.439 --> 1:18:28.120
<v Speaker 2>cross breeding of a witch wife and a mortal husband,

1:18:28.560 --> 1:18:30.800
<v Speaker 2>so she was given looser clothing to disguise the bump.

1:18:30.920 --> 1:18:33.720
<v Speaker 2>Body doubles were occasionally used, but for her next two

1:18:33.720 --> 1:18:36.080
<v Speaker 2>pregnancies they did decide to work it into the script.

1:18:37.040 --> 1:18:39.479
<v Speaker 2>Her son, Robert Asher was born in nineteen sixty five

1:18:39.640 --> 1:18:42.599
<v Speaker 2>as daughter Tabitha appeared in the series, and daughter Rebecca

1:18:42.680 --> 1:18:45.800
<v Speaker 2>Asher was born in nineteen sixty nine as Adam Stevens

1:18:45.880 --> 1:18:49.080
<v Speaker 2>was born into the series. Tabitha became a beloved character

1:18:49.080 --> 1:18:51.200
<v Speaker 2>on the show and later anchored a short lived spin

1:18:51.240 --> 1:18:53.280
<v Speaker 2>off of her own in the late seventies, which we

1:18:53.360 --> 1:18:56.800
<v Speaker 2>know nothing about. It was a major point of suspense

1:18:57.320 --> 1:18:59.479
<v Speaker 2>as Samantha and Darren waited to see if she had

1:18:59.600 --> 1:19:03.000
<v Speaker 2>inherit did her mother's powers, and she did as they

1:19:03.120 --> 1:19:06.639
<v Speaker 2>learned when random things started flying around. This is actually

1:19:06.680 --> 1:19:09.280
<v Speaker 2>a theme that's explored well in the a little bit

1:19:09.360 --> 1:19:13.240
<v Speaker 2>too much at times comic book series and Amazon show

1:19:13.280 --> 1:19:16.240
<v Speaker 2>The Boys, where they have like this genetically They have

1:19:16.320 --> 1:19:19.360
<v Speaker 2>like a genetically engineered like Superman, and it's revealed that

1:19:19.400 --> 1:19:21.320
<v Speaker 2>he spent like the first eighteen years of his life

1:19:21.360 --> 1:19:23.639
<v Speaker 2>locked in an isolation room with like a neutron bomb

1:19:23.760 --> 1:19:26.360
<v Speaker 2>strapped to his chest because he was so like when

1:19:26.360 --> 1:19:28.479
<v Speaker 2>he came out, he like killed his mom and then

1:19:28.720 --> 1:19:31.479
<v Speaker 2>massacred everyone else with laser vision, and it kept happening,

1:19:32.360 --> 1:19:35.040
<v Speaker 2>so that wonders I wonder if like which children are

1:19:35.200 --> 1:19:37.960
<v Speaker 2>are in control of their powers until a certain age.

1:19:38.080 --> 1:19:40.840
<v Speaker 2>I would guess not like a first communion or a

1:19:40.920 --> 1:19:41.680
<v Speaker 2>bar mitzvah.

1:19:41.680 --> 1:19:43.640
<v Speaker 1>It's probably like the way that children aren't really in

1:19:43.760 --> 1:19:45.280
<v Speaker 1>charge of their their their voices.

1:19:45.320 --> 1:19:47.559
<v Speaker 2>They just kind of like scream and like spew it

1:19:47.600 --> 1:19:50.320
<v Speaker 2>out there. Yeah. Probably yeah, And if you do that

1:19:50.360 --> 1:19:54.200
<v Speaker 2>with spells. Man much to consider.

1:19:53.960 --> 1:19:57.920
<v Speaker 1>This is we're getting dark in this episode Give me children?

1:19:58.080 --> 1:20:01.000
<v Speaker 2>When can which children control their power? Yeah? And avoid

1:20:01.080 --> 1:20:07.960
<v Speaker 2>killing their parents or loved ones miscegenation bull Connor. During

1:20:08.000 --> 1:20:10.599
<v Speaker 2>the second season of the show, five different babies played

1:20:10.600 --> 1:20:12.519
<v Speaker 2>Tabitha because you had to throw one out at the

1:20:12.600 --> 1:20:16.479
<v Speaker 2>end of the day. Just kidding. They had to throw

1:20:16.520 --> 1:20:18.280
<v Speaker 2>them all out at the end of the day, just

1:20:18.320 --> 1:20:21.800
<v Speaker 2>like the doughnuts babies, babies craft services. They will go

1:20:21.840 --> 1:20:27.519
<v Speaker 2>in the same dumpster. Uh dark Ah. It's easier to

1:20:27.520 --> 1:20:31.040
<v Speaker 2>shoot with twins, as you remember from our full House episode,

1:20:31.080 --> 1:20:34.360
<v Speaker 2>because with young characters, child actors are only allowed to

1:20:34.400 --> 1:20:38.720
<v Speaker 2>work a fraction as much as their adult colleagues. The

1:20:38.720 --> 1:20:41.320
<v Speaker 2>Olsen twins in particular also had to wear baby dentures,

1:20:41.320 --> 1:20:44.519
<v Speaker 2>which is a horrifying thing. Speaking of child labor, lowers.

1:20:45.360 --> 1:20:47.960
<v Speaker 2>John Landis was violating them when he killed these people,

1:20:48.360 --> 1:20:52.519
<v Speaker 2>two children and Vic Morro just a reminder, is he

1:20:52.600 --> 1:20:55.200
<v Speaker 2>the new enemy of the pond as he just supplanted?

1:20:56.520 --> 1:20:59.439
<v Speaker 2>His son is just a real piece of who's his son?

1:20:59.479 --> 1:21:03.040
<v Speaker 2>You always? Oh he is? Oh Max Landis. He's like

1:21:03.080 --> 1:21:09.360
<v Speaker 2>a legendary like Hollywood fail son. He uh. He wrote

1:21:09.360 --> 1:21:13.160
<v Speaker 2>like one good script and has just been like everything

1:21:13.200 --> 1:21:18.439
<v Speaker 2>else has been just a failure or at least not

1:21:18.560 --> 1:21:20.720
<v Speaker 2>a hit. And he has been accused of being a

1:21:20.880 --> 1:21:25.160
<v Speaker 2>disgusting garbage human. He's just always like combative on Twitter

1:21:25.200 --> 1:21:30.559
<v Speaker 2>with people. Yeah, he's like a NEPO baby m One

1:21:30.600 --> 1:21:32.639
<v Speaker 2>of the twins, Aaron Murphy, would say that the whole

1:21:32.680 --> 1:21:34.840
<v Speaker 2>magical aspect of the show left her confused as a

1:21:34.880 --> 1:21:37.639
<v Speaker 2>little girl. She recalled the time when her real life

1:21:37.680 --> 1:21:39.760
<v Speaker 2>mother asked her what she wanted for breakfast, and she

1:21:39.840 --> 1:21:42.920
<v Speaker 2>answered eggs. The only problem was they were out of them,

1:21:43.720 --> 1:21:46.799
<v Speaker 2>and Aaron quipped back, that's no problem, mom, let's twitch

1:21:46.840 --> 1:21:50.280
<v Speaker 2>some up and she was serious. Isn't that cute? Yeah?

1:21:50.560 --> 1:21:53.639
<v Speaker 2>Twitch has a weird context these days. First always thought

1:21:53.640 --> 1:21:57.120
<v Speaker 2>about tweaking like meth, and now it's just that video

1:21:57.120 --> 1:22:02.240
<v Speaker 2>game platform where people have whole careers just playing video games.

1:22:04.000 --> 1:22:09.160
<v Speaker 2>How long do you spend on this? Anyway, it seems

1:22:09.200 --> 1:22:11.440
<v Speaker 2>like the goodest place as any to observe that. Maureen McCormick,

1:22:11.600 --> 1:22:14.840
<v Speaker 2>Everyone's beloved Marcia Brady played two unrelated bit parts on

1:22:14.920 --> 1:22:17.040
<v Speaker 2>Bewitched prior to achieving her start. I'm on the Brady

1:22:17.040 --> 1:22:21.320
<v Speaker 2>Bunch first, and a fantasy sequence as Darren and Samantha's

1:22:21.320 --> 1:22:25.040
<v Speaker 2>future child before Tabitha and then again is Andorra under

1:22:25.080 --> 1:22:27.559
<v Speaker 2>a spell that made her look like a child.

1:22:27.960 --> 1:22:29.960
<v Speaker 1>I cannot believe we've met it this far without talking

1:22:30.040 --> 1:22:32.960
<v Speaker 1>about the famous nose twitch that Samantha does to cast

1:22:33.000 --> 1:22:36.320
<v Speaker 1>the spells, although you'll notice it's not really a nose

1:22:36.400 --> 1:22:39.320
<v Speaker 1>twitch but a wiggle of the upper lip. In any event,

1:22:39.360 --> 1:22:42.200
<v Speaker 1>it's really hard to do. Go ahead, try it now, Higel,

1:22:42.280 --> 1:22:43.519
<v Speaker 1>try it now, everyone, Try it now.

1:22:43.520 --> 1:22:47.160
<v Speaker 2>You can't. No, you do it? Yeah? No, no, I'm

1:22:47.200 --> 1:22:48.880
<v Speaker 2>not doing it. I don't have that much control over

1:22:48.880 --> 1:22:51.040
<v Speaker 2>that part of my face. It's just it's all the sneering,

1:22:51.120 --> 1:22:52.200
<v Speaker 2>burned out the muscles.

1:22:52.720 --> 1:22:56.040
<v Speaker 1>I actually no, it's just my chin. Never mind, No, No,

1:22:56.280 --> 1:22:59.559
<v Speaker 1>it's really hard. H but apparently it's really easy for

1:22:59.600 --> 1:23:01.760
<v Speaker 1>Elizabeth Montgomery because it was just something that she did

1:23:01.760 --> 1:23:05.120
<v Speaker 1>in real life. The nose twitch gesture was inspired by

1:23:05.120 --> 1:23:07.920
<v Speaker 1>something William Asher saw her do whenever she was frustrated.

1:23:08.160 --> 1:23:10.400
<v Speaker 1>She would screw up her mouth, which had the unintended

1:23:10.439 --> 1:23:13.519
<v Speaker 1>effect of wiggling her nose. And while they were developing

1:23:13.520 --> 1:23:15.559
<v Speaker 1>the show and looking for some kind of trademark gesture

1:23:15.560 --> 1:23:19.000
<v Speaker 1>for Samantha to do to activate her magic, Asher suggested

1:23:19.120 --> 1:23:22.480
<v Speaker 1>she do that nose twitching things she always did. Unfortunately,

1:23:22.520 --> 1:23:24.840
<v Speaker 1>Montgomery had no idea what he was talking about. You know,

1:23:24.960 --> 1:23:27.839
<v Speaker 1>the nose twitch thing you do, he said, And apparently

1:23:27.880 --> 1:23:30.280
<v Speaker 1>she was unaware of this tick and not too pleased

1:23:30.320 --> 1:23:31.679
<v Speaker 1>about having it pointed out.

1:23:32.439 --> 1:23:33.599
<v Speaker 2>After a lengthy back.

1:23:33.479 --> 1:23:35.280
<v Speaker 1>And forth, which you know, people who have been in

1:23:35.360 --> 1:23:37.280
<v Speaker 1>relationships for a long time know exactly what it's like.

1:23:37.479 --> 1:23:40.000
<v Speaker 2>You know the thing, what thing? You know the thing?

1:23:40.240 --> 1:23:44.200
<v Speaker 1>Do the thing, she got so frustrated that she did

1:23:44.240 --> 1:23:46.720
<v Speaker 1>the thing organically, and he goes up, But there there's

1:23:46.760 --> 1:23:50.960
<v Speaker 1>the thing, and that led to a famous TV gesture.

1:23:52.320 --> 1:23:55.720
<v Speaker 1>She tells the story a little differently. She related to

1:23:55.880 --> 1:23:58.439
<v Speaker 1>the journey news Bill said to me, once before I

1:23:58.479 --> 1:24:00.720
<v Speaker 1>ever did Bewitched, you do a funny thing with your

1:24:00.800 --> 1:24:03.320
<v Speaker 1>nose whenever you get impatient. Then he asked me to

1:24:03.320 --> 1:24:05.120
<v Speaker 1>do it for him, and I couldn't. I didn't know

1:24:05.160 --> 1:24:07.840
<v Speaker 1>what he meant. Then one night, my nose twitched and

1:24:07.920 --> 1:24:10.760
<v Speaker 1>Bill said, that's it, and then I knew. We were

1:24:10.800 --> 1:24:13.479
<v Speaker 1>at a Dodgers game once and the bases were loaded.

1:24:13.640 --> 1:24:16.479
<v Speaker 1>There were two outs and Sandy Kofax was coming up,

1:24:16.680 --> 1:24:19.479
<v Speaker 1>and Bill said to me, come on, Liz, twitch.

1:24:20.240 --> 1:24:23.799
<v Speaker 2>So I did, and Sandy Kofax walked and the winning

1:24:23.880 --> 1:24:24.679
<v Speaker 2>runs scored.

1:24:25.360 --> 1:24:27.120
<v Speaker 1>Then I was at a Chicago Cubs game and I

1:24:27.120 --> 1:24:29.960
<v Speaker 1>twitched my nose for Ernie Banks, who hadn't hit anything

1:24:29.960 --> 1:24:32.920
<v Speaker 1>all day. When I twitched, Ernie hit the ball right

1:24:32.960 --> 1:24:33.679
<v Speaker 1>out of the park.

1:24:34.400 --> 1:24:35.439
<v Speaker 2>That's cute. I like that.

1:24:36.080 --> 1:24:38.040
<v Speaker 1>It's easy to forget now, but a huge part of

1:24:38.040 --> 1:24:42.439
<v Speaker 1>the Witch's appeal or all the imaginative special effects which

1:24:42.600 --> 1:24:46.839
<v Speaker 1>made it look wildly different from any other sitcom on television. Obviously,

1:24:46.880 --> 1:24:49.519
<v Speaker 1>this was long before CGI, so all these were practical

1:24:49.560 --> 1:24:53.479
<v Speaker 1>effects achieved by hard working stage hands. The most famous

1:24:53.479 --> 1:24:56.479
<v Speaker 1>were pop offs or pop ins. I've heard both, where

1:24:56.520 --> 1:24:59.080
<v Speaker 1>people or objects would appear and disappear in a blink

1:24:59.080 --> 1:25:02.360
<v Speaker 1>of an eye. And this was achieved through the time

1:25:02.400 --> 1:25:06.360
<v Speaker 1>honored practice of turning the camera off and on. Not

1:25:06.800 --> 1:25:12.679
<v Speaker 1>exactly that hard technologically, but hard to do physically. Casey Rodgers,

1:25:12.720 --> 1:25:15.360
<v Speaker 1>who played Larry Tate's wife Louise, talked about.

1:25:15.160 --> 1:25:17.679
<v Speaker 2>How everyone got really good at knowing how.

1:25:17.479 --> 1:25:21.320
<v Speaker 1>To freeze and hold really still while the cameraman stopped

1:25:21.400 --> 1:25:23.360
<v Speaker 1>rolling in a pa grabbed a purse out of her

1:25:23.360 --> 1:25:26.840
<v Speaker 1>hand or something whatever they wanted to disappear. Montgomery told

1:25:26.880 --> 1:25:29.120
<v Speaker 1>The New York Times in a contemporary profile, it took

1:25:29.120 --> 1:25:31.000
<v Speaker 1>a lot of practice before I learned to hold my

1:25:31.080 --> 1:25:34.600
<v Speaker 1>hands perfectly still. But even that's much easier than the

1:25:34.640 --> 1:25:36.120
<v Speaker 1>scene in which I was supposed to clean up my

1:25:36.200 --> 1:25:39.320
<v Speaker 1>kitchen by witchery. I sort of went swoosh with my

1:25:39.479 --> 1:25:41.720
<v Speaker 1>arms raised, and then I had to leave them up

1:25:41.720 --> 1:25:44.840
<v Speaker 1>in the air, aching while the crew rushed in and

1:25:44.880 --> 1:25:47.439
<v Speaker 1>swept and dusted and got the kitchen immaculate before the

1:25:47.479 --> 1:25:50.320
<v Speaker 1>scene resumed. I'm getting better at it, I guess. I

1:25:50.360 --> 1:25:53.400
<v Speaker 1>almost never flinch over coil anymore, no matter what happens.

1:25:53.520 --> 1:25:56.000
<v Speaker 1>For coil, well, I mean, you have to keep your

1:25:56.120 --> 1:25:58.080
<v Speaker 1>arms up in the air and freeze for like, you know,

1:25:58.080 --> 1:26:00.720
<v Speaker 1>a couple minutes while they're like running around everything neat

1:26:00.720 --> 1:26:02.600
<v Speaker 1>and so that they could turn the camera back on

1:26:02.640 --> 1:26:04.360
<v Speaker 1>and make it look like, you know, in the blink.

1:26:04.120 --> 1:26:06.240
<v Speaker 2>Of an eye. I'm not familiar with the process. I'm

1:26:06.280 --> 1:26:08.479
<v Speaker 2>just wondering what would have happened that caused would cause

1:26:08.479 --> 1:26:11.639
<v Speaker 2>her to recoil just like, oh no, I don't want

1:26:11.640 --> 1:26:13.559
<v Speaker 2>to do this. Oh yeah.

1:26:13.640 --> 1:26:16.040
<v Speaker 1>They eventually gave her something that kind of resembled crutches

1:26:16.080 --> 1:26:18.080
<v Speaker 1>to rest her arms, to make it a little easier

1:26:18.080 --> 1:26:21.400
<v Speaker 1>for when a character popped in and out in a

1:26:21.400 --> 1:26:22.479
<v Speaker 1>different set of clothes.

1:26:23.040 --> 1:26:24.240
<v Speaker 2>This is really interesting to me.

1:26:24.600 --> 1:26:27.599
<v Speaker 1>The director made sure that the actor's shoes were fixed

1:26:27.600 --> 1:26:30.559
<v Speaker 1>in place on the stage with glue while the actor

1:26:30.680 --> 1:26:33.840
<v Speaker 1>dashed backstage and changed costumes, and then slipped back into

1:26:33.840 --> 1:26:36.280
<v Speaker 1>the shoes that were glued onto the floor, ensuring that

1:26:36.320 --> 1:26:40.360
<v Speaker 1>they were in the exact same mark. I think that's cool. Yeah, yeah,

1:26:40.680 --> 1:26:44.760
<v Speaker 1>less cool. Some actors received minor burns from the pyrotechnics

1:26:44.800 --> 1:26:47.000
<v Speaker 1>that were used when they had popped in the screen.

1:26:47.520 --> 1:26:49.559
<v Speaker 2>Oh that's like when John Land has killed those kids.

1:26:50.880 --> 1:26:52.960
<v Speaker 1>And I was gonna say, more like more like Michael

1:26:53.000 --> 1:26:55.360
<v Speaker 1>Jackson getting his hair burned on the pepsiad.

1:26:55.160 --> 1:26:58.400
<v Speaker 2>Or James Headfield being engulfed and on stage Pyro in

1:26:58.439 --> 1:27:01.200
<v Speaker 2>front of like two hundred thousand and hard rock fans

1:27:01.240 --> 1:27:02.040
<v Speaker 2>in Moscow.

1:27:02.240 --> 1:27:04.599
<v Speaker 1>I think, oh, and did another band that to come

1:27:04.640 --> 1:27:05.760
<v Speaker 1>on and like save the day?

1:27:05.960 --> 1:27:10.519
<v Speaker 2>And oh no they did not know. That's the famous

1:27:10.560 --> 1:27:13.600
<v Speaker 2>bit is that, uh you know Axel, Axel could have

1:27:14.000 --> 1:27:16.920
<v Speaker 2>Guns and Roses could have gone on and uh after

1:27:17.080 --> 1:27:23.200
<v Speaker 2>James Headfield was literally horribly burned. Uh always in Montreal,

1:27:23.400 --> 1:27:27.320
<v Speaker 2>I was incorrect. Oh yeah, apologies to Canada, uh and

1:27:27.439 --> 1:27:31.280
<v Speaker 2>Russia whoever? Uh yeah, James Henfield like literally walked into

1:27:31.400 --> 1:27:34.559
<v Speaker 2>an on stage tower of flame and was horrifically burned,

1:27:34.600 --> 1:27:37.559
<v Speaker 2>and Guns and Roses had a tremendous opportunity to come

1:27:37.600 --> 1:27:40.160
<v Speaker 2>in and save the day, and Axel Rose was like

1:27:41.160 --> 1:27:44.240
<v Speaker 2>as as I think it's Jason Newstead the Metallica basis

1:27:44.280 --> 1:27:47.840
<v Speaker 2>at the time. He said something like we go backstage

1:27:47.840 --> 1:27:50.759
<v Speaker 2>and Axel sit there with a glasses champagne smoking a cigarette,

1:27:50.760 --> 1:27:52.880
<v Speaker 2>going like, yeah, my voice doesn't feel up to it.

1:27:54.439 --> 1:27:58.000
<v Speaker 2>So then all the Canadians, Uh.

1:27:57.000 --> 1:28:01.320
<v Speaker 1>Right, James Hepfield was given fuel and given fire, either

1:28:01.360 --> 1:28:03.600
<v Speaker 1>of which he desired.

1:28:04.400 --> 1:28:08.880
<v Speaker 2>The fuel was Jegermeister. I don't think he felt so

1:28:08.960 --> 1:28:12.120
<v Speaker 2>good about the actual fire. No, maybe that song was

1:28:12.160 --> 1:28:14.400
<v Speaker 2>a form of potent like it was working something out

1:28:14.439 --> 1:28:19.320
<v Speaker 2>like John Lennon and Mother give it fool, give me

1:28:19.439 --> 1:28:23.000
<v Speaker 2>fuck beat that which I desired. Just therapist is over there, Like, yes, James,

1:28:24.000 --> 1:28:28.519
<v Speaker 2>how does that really make you feel bad? I could

1:28:28.560 --> 1:28:30.120
<v Speaker 2>have something to do with my mom.

1:28:30.800 --> 1:28:38.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's a new That's one of the best you doing,

1:28:38.720 --> 1:28:43.680
<v Speaker 1>James Hetfield in therapy and Freudian analysis.

1:28:43.920 --> 1:28:44.920
<v Speaker 2>That's one of the best.

1:28:45.240 --> 1:28:47.160
<v Speaker 1>That's one of the best bits you've ever done.

1:28:48.040 --> 1:28:50.479
<v Speaker 2>I really worked on his uh the the one the

1:28:50.600 --> 1:28:57.000
<v Speaker 2>yip that he does like live uh oh wow, the

1:28:57.080 --> 1:29:00.840
<v Speaker 2>precisely timed end of yell of voice crack. It's actually

1:29:00.880 --> 1:29:04.040
<v Speaker 2>also frequently used in a lot of appellation ballad singing.

1:29:04.360 --> 1:29:07.240
<v Speaker 2>Is there more going on with James Hetfield than I expect? Well,

1:29:07.280 --> 1:29:10.000
<v Speaker 2>I do find it hilarious that he is literally the

1:29:10.040 --> 1:29:13.400
<v Speaker 2>son of an opera singer and a truck driver, which

1:29:13.439 --> 1:29:17.600
<v Speaker 2>is like, yes, that voice came out of that pairing. Yeah,

1:29:17.640 --> 1:29:21.400
<v Speaker 2>nothing about that is weird to me. Nope, Well, from James.

1:29:21.120 --> 1:29:24.559
<v Speaker 1>Hetfield, we go back to the special effects used on Bewitched.

1:29:27.800 --> 1:29:29.800
<v Speaker 2>We are halfway through the outline.

1:29:30.880 --> 1:29:35.439
<v Speaker 1>Other effects included fast motion film, backwards motion film, and

1:29:35.479 --> 1:29:40.200
<v Speaker 1>invisible wires for levitation. Samantha's self operating vacuum cleaner was

1:29:40.200 --> 1:29:42.679
<v Speaker 1>outfitted with a motor on the bottom instead of brushes,

1:29:42.880 --> 1:29:44.960
<v Speaker 1>and was operated remotely off stage.

1:29:45.439 --> 1:29:46.639
<v Speaker 2>An electric light bulb.

1:29:46.680 --> 1:29:48.719
<v Speaker 1>I love this one appears to light up when Samantha

1:29:48.760 --> 1:29:51.799
<v Speaker 1>handles it thanks to wires threaded up her long sleeved

1:29:51.800 --> 1:29:55.360
<v Speaker 1>shirt connected to a twelve vault battery. For a scene

1:29:55.360 --> 1:29:57.679
<v Speaker 1>where Samantha has a fight with Darren and walks out

1:29:57.720 --> 1:30:01.040
<v Speaker 1>on him, she goes invisible, thus creating the appearance of

1:30:01.040 --> 1:30:04.640
<v Speaker 1>her suitcases magically flying out of the closet, packing themselves

1:30:04.640 --> 1:30:07.840
<v Speaker 1>and walking down the stairs on their own. Those effect

1:30:07.960 --> 1:30:10.639
<v Speaker 1>was achieved by a special effects man walking on planks

1:30:10.680 --> 1:30:14.160
<v Speaker 1>above the set, manipulating wires attached to the luggage like

1:30:14.200 --> 1:30:18.120
<v Speaker 1>puppet strings. He's basically playing luggage like Marioness. I think

1:30:18.160 --> 1:30:18.639
<v Speaker 1>that's cool.

1:30:18.840 --> 1:30:19.679
<v Speaker 2>Hollywood magic.

1:30:20.080 --> 1:30:23.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, movie back or TV magic. It seems quaint today,

1:30:23.360 --> 1:30:25.200
<v Speaker 1>but the amount of effort that went into these effects

1:30:25.280 --> 1:30:27.680
<v Speaker 1>is really staggering. I like to quote for the New

1:30:27.760 --> 1:30:30.800
<v Speaker 1>York Times piece once again, the chief special effects man,

1:30:30.960 --> 1:30:33.160
<v Speaker 1>Dick Albane, has been doing this.

1:30:33.200 --> 1:30:34.840
<v Speaker 2>Kind of thing for over twenty.

1:30:34.560 --> 1:30:37.599
<v Speaker 1>Years, and he says he still spends sleepless nights trying

1:30:37.640 --> 1:30:41.040
<v Speaker 1>to visualize all the special riggings and stands dripping with

1:30:41.080 --> 1:30:44.720
<v Speaker 1>perspiration the first time they're tried. Of course, we rig

1:30:44.760 --> 1:30:47.240
<v Speaker 1>everything two ways, he says, so that if it doesn't

1:30:47.240 --> 1:30:49.320
<v Speaker 1>work the first time, we can get it to happen

1:30:49.360 --> 1:30:52.320
<v Speaker 1>on the second. That way, we're sure that most of

1:30:52.360 --> 1:30:54.600
<v Speaker 1>the stunts will work. But there's a certain element of

1:30:54.680 --> 1:30:57.760
<v Speaker 1>danger to the performers. When you're blowing up lamps with

1:30:57.800 --> 1:31:01.760
<v Speaker 1>powder charges. There has to be I'm responsible for any

1:31:01.760 --> 1:31:04.640
<v Speaker 1>injuries in their California state law, so you can be

1:31:04.680 --> 1:31:06.160
<v Speaker 1>sure that I'm careful.

1:31:06.760 --> 1:31:10.040
<v Speaker 2>I love that. That reminds me of the in Gremlins

1:31:10.080 --> 1:31:12.080
<v Speaker 2>when they blew up the theater and a young, fresh

1:31:12.120 --> 1:31:15.559
<v Speaker 2>faced Zach Callaghan was asking the pyro guy, and the

1:31:15.560 --> 1:31:20.800
<v Speaker 2>pyro guy said something like, oh, it'll be big, or

1:31:20.840 --> 1:31:23.200
<v Speaker 2>like I put enough in there, or something like that.

1:31:24.360 --> 1:31:27.120
<v Speaker 1>I just always think of the Keith Moon on the

1:31:27.160 --> 1:31:29.280
<v Speaker 1>who are on the on the Smothers Brothers in the

1:31:29.640 --> 1:31:32.760
<v Speaker 1>sineteen sixty seven and just I think he bribed like

1:31:32.800 --> 1:31:35.200
<v Speaker 1>a stage hand to put like four times as much

1:31:35.200 --> 1:31:37.920
<v Speaker 1>explosives in his drum kit cost John and Twistle was

1:31:37.960 --> 1:31:41.679
<v Speaker 1>hearing now Pete towsend his hearing and singed his hair,

1:31:42.200 --> 1:31:44.439
<v Speaker 1>and Keith had his arms sliced that when a symbol

1:31:44.520 --> 1:31:47.400
<v Speaker 1>turned into shrapnel just sliced all his arms.

1:31:47.720 --> 1:31:50.040
<v Speaker 2>It certainly didn't have any effect on his drumming. Oh

1:31:50.080 --> 1:31:52.519
<v Speaker 2>that's why I forgot your anti Keith Moon. You're not anti.

1:31:52.600 --> 1:31:54.360
<v Speaker 2>I just don't think it's really all that cracked up

1:31:54.400 --> 1:31:56.800
<v Speaker 2>to me. It made me go on my whole thing

1:31:56.840 --> 1:32:00.719
<v Speaker 2>about British drummers. I genuinely don't think I know, because

1:32:00.720 --> 1:32:03.880
<v Speaker 2>I thought we don't have time for this. Come on.

1:32:04.680 --> 1:32:08.080
<v Speaker 2>I think like certain British drummers like have a real difficulty,

1:32:08.200 --> 1:32:11.600
<v Speaker 2>especially the ones who are like some of that incredibly

1:32:11.640 --> 1:32:14.960
<v Speaker 2>patronizing generation of British musicians who like Eric Burden were

1:32:15.000 --> 1:32:17.720
<v Speaker 2>like we rescued Black American music from the garbage bin.

1:32:18.640 --> 1:32:23.839
<v Speaker 2>It's like, no, you didn't go yourself like you arrogant

1:32:24.080 --> 1:32:27.559
<v Speaker 2>troll of a man. But like all of those guys

1:32:27.600 --> 1:32:30.160
<v Speaker 2>like Ginger Baker, Keith Moon, a lot of those guys

1:32:30.200 --> 1:32:33.160
<v Speaker 2>I do not think they can swing, especially for playing

1:32:33.200 --> 1:32:35.840
<v Speaker 2>like ripped off black music. I mean, and Ginger Baker

1:32:35.920 --> 1:32:37.680
<v Speaker 2>is the worst one of them all for me, he

1:32:37.800 --> 1:32:40.960
<v Speaker 2>just plays. He plays like marching band rudiments on drums,

1:32:41.240 --> 1:32:45.840
<v Speaker 2>like everything is just which is like exactly the same

1:32:45.840 --> 1:32:48.920
<v Speaker 2>thing Lars Alder gets dragged for in Metallica is that

1:32:48.960 --> 1:32:51.639
<v Speaker 2>all of his films are just like eighth notes around

1:32:51.720 --> 1:32:54.439
<v Speaker 2>the kit, just like the way that you do when

1:32:54.479 --> 1:32:57.920
<v Speaker 2>you see a drum kit and you go, you know,

1:32:58.560 --> 1:33:00.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, there's a part in Crosswords in the Isolated Guitar,

1:33:01.360 --> 1:33:04.200
<v Speaker 2>the Isolated drum track and Crossroads the other day, and

1:33:04.200 --> 1:33:06.200
<v Speaker 2>it's just like there's a part where he's just going

1:33:08.840 --> 1:33:12.040
<v Speaker 2>the kick drum like sounds like a Toddler programming and

1:33:12.080 --> 1:33:16.880
<v Speaker 2>drum machine and the only two. Though I'm sure there

1:33:16.880 --> 1:33:19.360
<v Speaker 2>are some British funk drummers. It's if there is such

1:33:19.360 --> 1:33:23.520
<v Speaker 2>a thing, which is hard to believe. But no, I'm

1:33:23.600 --> 1:33:28.240
<v Speaker 2>bonhom and and and particularly bill Ward were the best

1:33:28.800 --> 1:33:31.200
<v Speaker 2>bonhom I think because he was just wasted all the time,

1:33:31.240 --> 1:33:33.479
<v Speaker 2>probably for Billboard two. But both of those guys were

1:33:33.520 --> 1:33:38.040
<v Speaker 2>big fans of Gene Croupa and actually our mutual well

1:33:38.320 --> 1:33:40.559
<v Speaker 2>he's a guy whose work I read, but I believe

1:33:40.600 --> 1:33:43.800
<v Speaker 2>you actually know him. Hank Steamer has a whole blog

1:33:43.840 --> 1:33:47.000
<v Speaker 2>called Dark Forces Swing, which is about the intersection of

1:33:47.040 --> 1:33:50.040
<v Speaker 2>heavy metal and jazz and it is very cool. He

1:33:50.080 --> 1:33:52.840
<v Speaker 2>has interviewed Bill Ward about it, uh and and and

1:33:53.000 --> 1:33:55.439
<v Speaker 2>just knowing that. John Bonham has also talked about Gene Crouper,

1:33:55.560 --> 1:33:58.080
<v Speaker 2>like those guys listen to to swing band music. Same

1:33:58.120 --> 1:34:00.280
<v Speaker 2>with Charlie Watts. Now that I think, god, I hate

1:34:00.320 --> 1:34:02.519
<v Speaker 2>Charlie Watts. All of those guys who were like, well,

1:34:02.560 --> 1:34:05.280
<v Speaker 2>actually I'm a jazz drummer and I'm just slum playing this,

1:34:05.400 --> 1:34:07.360
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, well, you suck at this, so I can't

1:34:07.400 --> 1:34:11.840
<v Speaker 2>imagine how good you are at your real job. Please

1:34:13.120 --> 1:34:13.720
<v Speaker 2>surprise me.

1:34:14.120 --> 1:34:16.519
<v Speaker 1>Weren't the Stones famous, like their songs would always like

1:34:16.720 --> 1:34:19.400
<v Speaker 1>start at one tempo and and can't keep tempo.

1:34:19.560 --> 1:34:21.840
<v Speaker 2>He can't get he does this thing that people talk

1:34:21.880 --> 1:34:23.800
<v Speaker 2>about like he is this one thing about lifting the

1:34:23.880 --> 1:34:26.519
<v Speaker 2>high hat or opening the high hat before like a

1:34:26.560 --> 1:34:30.759
<v Speaker 2>downbeat or before the snare hit. And there's a debate

1:34:30.880 --> 1:34:32.760
<v Speaker 2>in the drummer community as to whether or not this

1:34:32.920 --> 1:34:35.920
<v Speaker 2>is like an error that people make before when they

1:34:35.960 --> 1:34:38.519
<v Speaker 2>start drumming and have to be trained out of, or

1:34:38.560 --> 1:34:42.240
<v Speaker 2>like the essence of Charlie Watts's genius, they're just like, well, yeah,

1:34:42.280 --> 1:34:44.439
<v Speaker 2>children learn how to do like children do that because

1:34:44.439 --> 1:34:47.360
<v Speaker 2>you can't. You're like, you're trained not to coordinate the

1:34:47.439 --> 1:34:50.760
<v Speaker 2>high hat with the the snare hit. But people can't

1:34:50.760 --> 1:34:53.160
<v Speaker 2>stop themselves from doing that, so they will open or

1:34:53.200 --> 1:34:55.840
<v Speaker 2>close the high hat before the snarehead and then all

1:34:55.840 --> 1:34:57.479
<v Speaker 2>the pro Charlie Watts people are like, oh, but it

1:34:57.520 --> 1:35:00.479
<v Speaker 2>gives his songs, It gives it such a propulse of lift,

1:35:00.760 --> 1:35:04.080
<v Speaker 2>Like I can't even keep one tempo for like an

1:35:04.200 --> 1:35:06.080
<v Speaker 2>entire song. Man. A lot of those songs just like

1:35:06.280 --> 1:35:08.719
<v Speaker 2>end up ten clicks after Oh he plays to the song.

1:35:09.320 --> 1:35:13.559
<v Speaker 2>Whatever Rolling Stones drummer is is Keith Richard's right hand

1:35:13.600 --> 1:35:15.920
<v Speaker 2>and that's the be all end all of it. Do

1:35:15.960 --> 1:35:18.840
<v Speaker 2>you show how much Keith Richards hated Bill Wyman? No,

1:35:19.320 --> 1:35:23.000
<v Speaker 2>I didn't know that. Why because he married seventeen year olds. Well,

1:35:23.400 --> 1:35:26.040
<v Speaker 2>I don't think so. I think he just was curmudgeingly

1:35:26.200 --> 1:35:31.360
<v Speaker 2>about everything. Well yeah, yeah, and and didn't want to

1:35:31.400 --> 1:35:32.360
<v Speaker 2>do things.

1:35:33.640 --> 1:35:36.599
<v Speaker 1>And and well he was like he like lied about

1:35:36.600 --> 1:35:38.960
<v Speaker 1>his age. He was like significantly older than the others.

1:35:39.000 --> 1:35:40.559
<v Speaker 1>I think he was like ten years older than the

1:35:40.560 --> 1:35:41.360
<v Speaker 1>rest of the Stones.

1:35:41.960 --> 1:35:44.880
<v Speaker 2>Well, he certainly didn't have a head start on the musically. No,

1:35:45.240 --> 1:35:48.320
<v Speaker 2>I think he just like had a namp. Yeah, yeah,

1:35:48.600 --> 1:35:51.439
<v Speaker 2>was that the story with him? Yeah? Yeah, dogship bassist.

1:35:51.920 --> 1:35:52.479
<v Speaker 2>Where were we?

1:35:55.800 --> 1:36:00.519
<v Speaker 1>Back to Bewitched and the magic of Bewitched. Most of

1:36:00.560 --> 1:36:03.479
<v Speaker 1>the magic took place within the Stephens Home of one

1:36:03.560 --> 1:36:06.599
<v Speaker 1>one six ' four Morning Glory Circle, an upper middle

1:36:06.640 --> 1:36:10.280
<v Speaker 1>class neighborhood located either in Westport, Connecticut, as the pilot

1:36:10.280 --> 1:36:13.559
<v Speaker 1>would dictate, or Patterson, New York. There were differing accounts

1:36:13.600 --> 1:36:16.519
<v Speaker 1>throughout the series. I love when shows, like in the

1:36:16.600 --> 1:36:20.960
<v Speaker 1>pre DVD like Rewatch Era, can't keep their own storyline straight.

1:36:21.600 --> 1:36:24.679
<v Speaker 2>Like yeah, no, no, I don't care. Was the dividing

1:36:24.680 --> 1:36:25.639
<v Speaker 2>line there the dicks?

1:36:26.080 --> 1:36:29.280
<v Speaker 1>No, they just like at the same house was located

1:36:29.280 --> 1:36:30.920
<v Speaker 1>at different times in different states.

1:36:31.160 --> 1:36:33.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I guess they didn't have like script supervisors for this.

1:36:33.360 --> 1:36:33.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah No.

1:36:35.520 --> 1:36:39.280
<v Speaker 1>Until very recently, like very recently. The facade of the

1:36:39.320 --> 1:36:42.439
<v Speaker 1>Stephens Home was located on the Columbia later Warner Brothers

1:36:42.560 --> 1:36:47.200
<v Speaker 1>Ranch in beautiful downtown Burbank. The facade was actually modeled

1:36:47.240 --> 1:36:49.519
<v Speaker 1>on a real house in Santa Monica where the nineteen

1:36:49.600 --> 1:36:52.800
<v Speaker 1>fifty nine movie Gidget was filmed, and they constructed this

1:36:52.840 --> 1:36:56.880
<v Speaker 1>facsimile backstage where Gidget Goes to Rome in nineteen sixty

1:36:56.880 --> 1:36:59.200
<v Speaker 1>three at the Gidget sequel, the same year that be

1:36:59.320 --> 1:37:02.120
<v Speaker 1>Wish Pilot was filmed, and when the Gidget story was

1:37:02.160 --> 1:37:05.400
<v Speaker 1>adapted for an ABC sitcom starring Sally Field, they used

1:37:05.400 --> 1:37:08.000
<v Speaker 1>the facade for that show as well, and it also

1:37:08.040 --> 1:37:10.280
<v Speaker 1>appeared in I Dream of Genie as the home owns

1:37:10.320 --> 1:37:14.120
<v Speaker 1>by Tony Nelson's boss, Doctor Bellows, and it was seen

1:37:14.160 --> 1:37:17.800
<v Speaker 1>briefly in an episode of The Monkeys and Home Improvement,

1:37:18.400 --> 1:37:22.720
<v Speaker 1>and most recently in WandaVision. This little fake street known

1:37:22.760 --> 1:37:25.760
<v Speaker 1>as Blondie Street for the fifty sitcom that was shot there, is,

1:37:26.120 --> 1:37:29.360
<v Speaker 1>or at least was a mecca for pop culture heads.

1:37:29.360 --> 1:37:31.800
<v Speaker 1>They used so many of these facades on so many

1:37:31.800 --> 1:37:35.439
<v Speaker 1>different shows. The Tates exteriors were shot at the I

1:37:35.560 --> 1:37:38.840
<v Speaker 1>Dream of Genie House, so Genie and Major Nelson lived

1:37:38.920 --> 1:37:42.320
<v Speaker 1>at the Tates House, and Gladys Kravitz, the nosy neighbor,

1:37:42.600 --> 1:37:44.679
<v Speaker 1>lived at a home that was used for the Donna

1:37:44.720 --> 1:37:47.840
<v Speaker 1>Reed Show and was later used for The Partridge Family.

1:37:47.920 --> 1:37:49.519
<v Speaker 1>Is the house where the Partridge Family lived?

1:37:49.680 --> 1:37:52.160
<v Speaker 2>Is that that? It's like the same house? Yeah? Right,

1:37:52.280 --> 1:37:54.160
<v Speaker 2>Like I don't know, that's fine.

1:37:54.320 --> 1:37:56.760
<v Speaker 1>It's like the televisual equivalent of like The Wrecking Crew.

1:37:56.880 --> 1:37:59.320
<v Speaker 1>For me, it's like, oh wow, you're on like everything,

1:38:00.160 --> 1:38:02.280
<v Speaker 1>notice it, because you could just blend in right.

1:38:02.720 --> 1:38:03.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1:38:04.120 --> 1:38:06.479
<v Speaker 1>The exterior of the Stevens House on Bewitch was also

1:38:06.479 --> 1:38:08.759
<v Speaker 1>featured in National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation.

1:38:08.880 --> 1:38:10.840
<v Speaker 2>I think it was Clark Griswold's childhood home.

1:38:11.760 --> 1:38:16.080
<v Speaker 1>Unfortunately, this time last year, Warner Brothers decided to raise

1:38:16.160 --> 1:38:18.680
<v Speaker 1>the ranch to make way for office buildings.

1:38:19.520 --> 1:38:20.880
<v Speaker 2>The iconic Friends.

1:38:20.560 --> 1:38:22.880
<v Speaker 1>Fountain, which also could be seen in various episodes of

1:38:22.960 --> 1:38:24.880
<v Speaker 1>be Wished, was moved to a different place on a

1:38:24.920 --> 1:38:28.000
<v Speaker 1>Willer Brothers lot, but little else was spared, and pieces

1:38:28.040 --> 1:38:30.719
<v Speaker 1>of pop culture history from titles like Father Knows Best,

1:38:31.040 --> 1:38:33.639
<v Speaker 1>Mock from the Middle, The Three Stooges, Dennis the Menace,

1:38:33.880 --> 1:38:38.360
<v Speaker 1>Lethal Weapon, Hocus Pocus, Pushing Daisies, Hazel, The Waltons, plus

1:38:38.400 --> 1:38:42.879
<v Speaker 1>all the other shows we just mentioned were destroyed. Fittingly,

1:38:43.280 --> 1:38:46.560
<v Speaker 1>the Bewitched House facade was demolished on Friday the thirteenth

1:38:46.720 --> 1:38:51.120
<v Speaker 1>in October twenty twenty three, and as the final insult.

1:38:51.360 --> 1:38:53.240
<v Speaker 1>One of the last shows to shoot on the ranch

1:38:53.320 --> 1:38:56.599
<v Speaker 1>was Young Sheldon, and that production depicted all the demolition

1:38:56.680 --> 1:38:58.920
<v Speaker 1>in the background as the result of a tornado.

1:38:59.200 --> 1:38:59.960
<v Speaker 2>God a nindig.

1:39:00.960 --> 1:39:03.200
<v Speaker 1>It seems like something that be I mean, their house facades.

1:39:03.200 --> 1:39:05.040
<v Speaker 2>It seems like something that would have been pretty easy.

1:39:04.760 --> 1:39:08.519
<v Speaker 1>To like build a small sound stage four and like Nope,

1:39:08.600 --> 1:39:11.040
<v Speaker 1>Celtic Tour, well not even that's just.

1:39:11.000 --> 1:39:15.400
<v Speaker 2>Like the tour. Yeah, no, people don't care. Universal backlots

1:39:15.439 --> 1:39:18.720
<v Speaker 2>so cool. David zaslov Kan's entire movies to make the

1:39:18.760 --> 1:39:20.639
<v Speaker 2>numbers jump before an earning scull, you think he gives

1:39:20.680 --> 1:39:25.120
<v Speaker 2>a about a house facade. True. It is truly amazing, though,

1:39:25.160 --> 1:39:27.800
<v Speaker 2>how judicious film crews can be with small backlots like

1:39:27.800 --> 1:39:30.000
<v Speaker 2>the ones on these shows, and the producers of the

1:39:30.040 --> 1:39:33.080
<v Speaker 2>which were justice thrifty with their wardrobe budget. According to

1:39:33.120 --> 1:39:37.080
<v Speaker 2>actress Casey Rodgers, who played Louise Tate, the minor cast

1:39:37.120 --> 1:39:40.200
<v Speaker 2>would simply wear their own clothes from home a week

1:39:40.280 --> 1:39:42.320
<v Speaker 2>prior to the shoot. They were expected to come to

1:39:42.360 --> 1:39:44.679
<v Speaker 2>the studio with the selection from which the costume team

1:39:44.720 --> 1:39:49.080
<v Speaker 2>would make their picks and then iron them. Speaking of costumes,

1:39:49.160 --> 1:39:52.160
<v Speaker 2>Agnes Moorehead often wore a starburst brooch on the show

1:39:52.280 --> 1:39:56.080
<v Speaker 2>with eight point five characters of old Mine Diamonds, which

1:39:56.120 --> 1:40:02.800
<v Speaker 2>I guess means more racist. Is there, extra good, extra bloody. Yeah.

1:40:03.760 --> 1:40:06.479
<v Speaker 2>Montgomery had always admired the pin, and when Morehead died,

1:40:06.560 --> 1:40:09.240
<v Speaker 2>she willed it to her, which is so classic and

1:40:09.320 --> 1:40:11.920
<v Speaker 2>so sweet. As a general design note on the show,

1:40:11.920 --> 1:40:14.160
<v Speaker 2>the color green is a major motif. You'd see it

1:40:14.160 --> 1:40:17.479
<v Speaker 2>in Samantha's outfits, or the Stevens home carpet, or various

1:40:17.520 --> 1:40:19.960
<v Speaker 2>emerald accents. And this is their way of playing up

1:40:20.000 --> 1:40:22.080
<v Speaker 2>the witchy folklore that most people would have had in

1:40:22.120 --> 1:40:24.320
<v Speaker 2>their mind at this time period, which was from the

1:40:24.400 --> 1:40:30.280
<v Speaker 2>Wizard of Oz. Speaking of themes un bewitched loosely defined,

1:40:30.320 --> 1:40:33.639
<v Speaker 2>another one was alcohol. The characters on this show got

1:40:33.720 --> 1:40:35.599
<v Speaker 2>drunk so much on camera that there is a fan

1:40:35.680 --> 1:40:39.599
<v Speaker 2>website compiling all of the drinking incidents that happened, complete

1:40:39.600 --> 1:40:44.080
<v Speaker 2>with location and episode numbers. You read somewhere that they

1:40:44.120 --> 1:40:45.200
<v Speaker 2>were drinking real alcohol.

1:40:45.800 --> 1:40:47.040
<v Speaker 1>That's what I heard.

1:40:47.400 --> 1:40:49.559
<v Speaker 2>It wouldn't surprise me. Man. It's like back when people

1:40:49.600 --> 1:40:55.599
<v Speaker 2>just made pictures of like Martini's for themselves. From all

1:40:55.640 --> 1:41:00.080
<v Speaker 2>the pain of the prosperity, all that pain of by

1:41:00.160 --> 1:41:02.439
<v Speaker 2>a house for five dollars money, it's not going to

1:41:02.479 --> 1:41:08.360
<v Speaker 2>drink itself. Speaking yet again, of themes. In an even

1:41:08.400 --> 1:41:10.880
<v Speaker 2>more broad sense, we can't forget the theme tune to

1:41:10.920 --> 1:41:13.599
<v Speaker 2>the show. At one point, producers of the show, using

1:41:13.800 --> 1:41:18.160
<v Speaker 2>common producer thought patterns, wanted to use the song Bewitched,

1:41:18.320 --> 1:41:21.880
<v Speaker 2>Bothered and Bewilders from the Richard Rodgers and Lorenz Heart

1:41:21.960 --> 1:41:26.360
<v Speaker 2>musical pal Joey as the show's theme song. Ultimately, they

1:41:26.360 --> 1:41:30.799
<v Speaker 2>decided to use an original song instead because it was cheaper,

1:41:33.120 --> 1:41:37.400
<v Speaker 2>probably presumably that's the real reason. Though familiar to fans

1:41:37.439 --> 1:41:40.040
<v Speaker 2>as an instrumental, the theme song was supposed to have lyrics.

1:41:40.360 --> 1:41:44.560
<v Speaker 2>Singer Jerry Vale, who is most famous for being summarily

1:41:44.640 --> 1:41:48.679
<v Speaker 2>mocked by the rat Pack, who called him Jerry Fail

1:41:50.040 --> 1:41:53.840
<v Speaker 2>in a devastating burn, initially agreed to record the theme

1:41:54.120 --> 1:41:56.880
<v Speaker 2>but the deal fell through it the last minute, supposedly

1:41:56.920 --> 1:41:59.519
<v Speaker 2>because the lyrics weren't finished in time Jesus Christ, Buddy,

1:41:59.520 --> 1:42:03.639
<v Speaker 2>this is the Night like nineteen sixties lyrics Warren Peace.

1:42:04.320 --> 1:42:06.640
<v Speaker 2>The song has though been recorded with lyrics by the

1:42:06.720 --> 1:42:10.519
<v Speaker 2>likes of Steve Lawrence, the Wonderful Peggy Lee and Jimmy Smith,

1:42:10.840 --> 1:42:14.600
<v Speaker 2>the Man who Blew Everybody's mind on the Hammond B

1:42:14.720 --> 1:42:17.599
<v Speaker 2>three organ and basically set a new standard for how

1:42:17.600 --> 1:42:20.160
<v Speaker 2>you have to play that instrument that people still cannot

1:42:20.240 --> 1:42:26.080
<v Speaker 2>escape from. Yeah, as you meditate on that, we'll be

1:42:26.160 --> 1:42:29.200
<v Speaker 2>right back with more too much information after these messages.

1:42:34.600 --> 1:42:43.360
<v Speaker 1>Yow Wow Be, which premiere on September seventeenth, nineteen sixty four,

1:42:43.479 --> 1:42:46.800
<v Speaker 1>a Thursday night, at nine pm Eastern. There were some

1:42:46.840 --> 1:42:49.320
<v Speaker 1>protests in advance of the launch, mostly from viewers in

1:42:49.360 --> 1:42:51.479
<v Speaker 1>the Bible Belt States who are afraid that the show

1:42:51.479 --> 1:42:55.120
<v Speaker 1>would promote devil worship. Hell yeah, But those concerns quickly

1:42:55.120 --> 1:42:57.760
<v Speaker 1>fell by the wayside as viewers were charmed by the

1:42:57.800 --> 1:43:01.120
<v Speaker 1>premise and particularly by Elizabeth Montgomery. By the end of

1:43:01.160 --> 1:43:03.719
<v Speaker 1>its first season, Be, which was ABC's number one show

1:43:03.800 --> 1:43:07.160
<v Speaker 1>and the best rated sitcom on all three networks, coming

1:43:07.200 --> 1:43:08.640
<v Speaker 1>second only to Bonanza.

1:43:08.680 --> 1:43:10.360
<v Speaker 2>Bonanza was a real juggernaut back then.

1:43:10.960 --> 1:43:13.919
<v Speaker 1>Creator Saul Sachs would say an interview with the Television Academy,

1:43:14.280 --> 1:43:16.240
<v Speaker 1>it was a hit immediately, the first one of its

1:43:16.320 --> 1:43:20.200
<v Speaker 1>kind supernatural shows on television. It's been done since the

1:43:20.240 --> 1:43:23.920
<v Speaker 1>Greeks where a supernatural being comes to life. He's not

1:43:23.960 --> 1:43:26.200
<v Speaker 1>wrong about it being the first. It beat The Adams

1:43:26.240 --> 1:43:29.320
<v Speaker 1>Family by a day and the Monsters by a week.

1:43:29.640 --> 1:43:33.639
<v Speaker 1>Out of fantasy shows around this realm. The press coverage

1:43:33.720 --> 1:43:36.280
<v Speaker 1>was slightly skeptical at first, with The New York Times

1:43:36.280 --> 1:43:38.920
<v Speaker 1>sniffing there were laughs in the scene, to be sure,

1:43:39.000 --> 1:43:42.080
<v Speaker 1>but they were attended by some grounds or apprehension too

1:43:42.160 --> 1:43:45.880
<v Speaker 1>many trick camera effects and supernatural gimmickry could rather quickly

1:43:45.960 --> 1:43:50.639
<v Speaker 1>irlitate the effectiveness of the show's premise. However, they quickly

1:43:50.720 --> 1:43:54.080
<v Speaker 1>changed their tune and joined the rapturous and honestly in

1:43:54.160 --> 1:43:57.400
<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty four pretty hilarious press coverage of the show.

1:43:57.920 --> 1:44:00.880
<v Speaker 1>I'd like to read excerpts from two pieces. The first

1:44:00.880 --> 1:44:03.679
<v Speaker 1>from The Gray Lady herself from November twenty second, nineteen

1:44:03.680 --> 1:44:06.800
<v Speaker 1>sixty four, a year to the day after the assassination

1:44:06.880 --> 1:44:09.880
<v Speaker 1>of JFK and the initial pilot rehearsals. This is the

1:44:09.880 --> 1:44:14.200
<v Speaker 1>New York Times article the Bewitching Miss Montgomery. If any

1:44:14.280 --> 1:44:17.200
<v Speaker 1>of the poor biddies incarcerated at Salem had even the

1:44:17.240 --> 1:44:21.360
<v Speaker 1>most elementary acquaintance with sorcery, they would surely have arranged

1:44:21.400 --> 1:44:24.640
<v Speaker 1>to return almost three hundred years later as Elizabeth Montgomery.

1:44:25.120 --> 1:44:28.839
<v Speaker 1>Miss Montgomery's existence on be wished as the golden dimpled

1:44:28.960 --> 1:44:32.639
<v Speaker 1>queen of the new television season, her crown firmly affixed

1:44:32.640 --> 1:44:35.599
<v Speaker 1>by the latest Nielsen ratings, must certainly be the most

1:44:35.600 --> 1:44:40.439
<v Speaker 1>desirable of all reincarnations. ABC describes Samantha as someone yearning

1:44:40.479 --> 1:44:44.479
<v Speaker 1>to be quote a normal woman scrubbing floors, a premise

1:44:44.520 --> 1:44:47.840
<v Speaker 1>which becomes patently ridiculous after one look at Miss Montgomery.

1:44:48.360 --> 1:44:51.040
<v Speaker 1>A product of the Westlake School in Los Angeles and

1:44:51.040 --> 1:44:53.280
<v Speaker 1>the spent School in the Academy of Dramatic Arts in

1:44:53.320 --> 1:44:55.720
<v Speaker 1>New York, she enjoys being a witch as long as

1:44:55.720 --> 1:44:58.880
<v Speaker 1>it's a young and pretty one. A pal of sorceress

1:44:58.960 --> 1:45:02.240
<v Speaker 1>jokes is already beginning. A plague or however, bank clerk's

1:45:02.240 --> 1:45:04.960
<v Speaker 1>invited her to twitch up a little money, and friends

1:45:05.000 --> 1:45:07.280
<v Speaker 1>ask her to give a little magical help when sticking

1:45:07.320 --> 1:45:10.600
<v Speaker 1>refrigerator trays. In a couple of years, she mused, I

1:45:10.640 --> 1:45:12.479
<v Speaker 1>may get a little tired of these jokes.

1:45:13.080 --> 1:45:14.639
<v Speaker 2>It would take less than a couple of years.

1:45:15.400 --> 1:45:17.599
<v Speaker 1>That was a New York Times article. This one from

1:45:17.640 --> 1:45:22.400
<v Speaker 1>Time Magazine is even funnier. The girl with a necromantic nose.

1:45:22.640 --> 1:45:25.080
<v Speaker 1>It's from October thirtieth, nineteen sixty four.

1:45:25.280 --> 1:45:30.360
<v Speaker 2>That's gross and weird. Necromancy is just raising the dead.

1:45:31.280 --> 1:45:32.000
<v Speaker 2>I didn't write it.

1:45:33.040 --> 1:45:37.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, many a man is convinced the witch lives under

1:45:37.520 --> 1:45:40.559
<v Speaker 1>his roof. With the arrival of the present TV season,

1:45:40.760 --> 1:45:44.800
<v Speaker 1>many another is probably wishing he could exchange his incumbent Hag.

1:45:44.840 --> 1:45:46.160
<v Speaker 2>For Elizabeth Montgomery.

1:45:46.640 --> 1:45:49.080
<v Speaker 1>Pretty and blonde with a turned up nose, she hardly

1:45:49.120 --> 1:45:52.040
<v Speaker 1>suggests cauldrons full of rat guts and eels, but she

1:45:52.080 --> 1:45:56.200
<v Speaker 1>plays a thoroughbred sorceress married to an advertising executive on

1:45:56.280 --> 1:45:57.960
<v Speaker 1>ABC's Bewitched.

1:45:57.920 --> 1:46:01.160
<v Speaker 2>Like she's drifting into the mid Atlantic accent as this goes, Oh.

1:46:01.120 --> 1:46:06.280
<v Speaker 1>Yah, yeah, yeah, see that are Paul Lind's. She's done

1:46:06.280 --> 1:46:09.439
<v Speaker 1>over two hundred TV shows, a Broadway play, in three movies.

1:46:09.760 --> 1:46:12.680
<v Speaker 1>She was Dino Martin's fiance and Who's been sleeping in

1:46:12.680 --> 1:46:15.880
<v Speaker 1>My bed? She's been a divorcee herself a couple of times.

1:46:16.200 --> 1:46:20.120
<v Speaker 1>Her first husband was Freddie Camon Harvard fifty one, descendant

1:46:20.160 --> 1:46:24.160
<v Speaker 1>of Albert Gallatin, fourth Secretary of the Treasury. Since Elizabeth

1:46:24.200 --> 1:46:26.479
<v Speaker 1>was only an actor's daughter, she knocked Freddie out of

1:46:26.520 --> 1:46:29.080
<v Speaker 1>the social register when she married him in nineteen fifty four.

1:46:29.560 --> 1:46:32.240
<v Speaker 2>Jesus Christ, just as.

1:46:32.240 --> 1:46:37.040
<v Speaker 1>Robert Montgomery himself depaganated Buffy Harkness when he married her

1:46:37.040 --> 1:46:38.400
<v Speaker 1>in nineteen fifty.

1:46:38.560 --> 1:46:41.800
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I'm taking acid, is what. None of

1:46:41.800 --> 1:46:42.880
<v Speaker 2>those words are in the Bible.

1:46:43.479 --> 1:46:45.760
<v Speaker 1>Well, the social register, you know, the social register is

1:46:45.840 --> 1:46:48.479
<v Speaker 1>This is all in a profile of Elizabeth Montgomery in

1:46:48.560 --> 1:46:52.160
<v Speaker 1>Time magazine talking about how she married somebody out of

1:46:52.200 --> 1:46:55.839
<v Speaker 1>her social standing and result and as a result, dragged

1:46:55.920 --> 1:46:59.280
<v Speaker 1>him off the social register, which is hilarious considering what

1:46:59.320 --> 1:47:01.439
<v Speaker 1>we were talking about about the premise of this show,

1:47:02.880 --> 1:47:05.920
<v Speaker 1>a mixed social standing couple. Cavin was not out of

1:47:05.920 --> 1:47:09.280
<v Speaker 1>the book long, however. Elizabeth divorcedhim in nineteen fifty five,

1:47:09.680 --> 1:47:12.400
<v Speaker 1>then was married for six years to actor Gig Young.

1:47:13.040 --> 1:47:16.080
<v Speaker 1>Her current husband is William Asher, who directs Bewitched. They

1:47:16.120 --> 1:47:18.320
<v Speaker 1>live in Malibu with their infant son, an, a Siamese

1:47:18.360 --> 1:47:21.960
<v Speaker 1>cat named Zip Zip. She no longer gives yeah, she

1:47:22.040 --> 1:47:24.960
<v Speaker 1>no longer gives interviews to magazines that are doing spreads

1:47:24.960 --> 1:47:29.120
<v Speaker 1>on children of famous parents. She's her own girl. Oh wow,

1:47:29.760 --> 1:47:33.080
<v Speaker 1>her father's a Republican, says gig Young, reminiscing Fondley. Why

1:47:33.080 --> 1:47:36.599
<v Speaker 1>would you interview somebody's ex husband who then would talk

1:47:36.640 --> 1:47:41.599
<v Speaker 1>about her father's political affiliations. Her father's a Republican, says

1:47:41.600 --> 1:47:44.720
<v Speaker 1>gig Young, reminiscing Fondley. And she's probably a Democrat.

1:47:45.320 --> 1:47:45.760
<v Speaker 2>She may.

1:47:47.280 --> 1:47:49.479
<v Speaker 1>She may soon be worth a fortune on her own too.

1:47:50.120 --> 1:47:52.680
<v Speaker 1>As part owner of Bewitched, she gets twenty percent of

1:47:52.720 --> 1:47:55.439
<v Speaker 1>the show's profits, which will amount to two million if

1:47:55.479 --> 1:47:58.600
<v Speaker 1>the program lasts for more than three seasons, which it

1:47:58.640 --> 1:47:59.360
<v Speaker 1>probably will.

1:48:00.479 --> 1:48:04.800
<v Speaker 2>Maybe killing print Media was not a mistake. Yeah, it's

1:48:04.800 --> 1:48:07.920
<v Speaker 2>pretty astonishing. Given the success of Bewitch. The production company

1:48:07.920 --> 1:48:10.400
<v Speaker 2>that made it, Screen Gems, they were eager for a

1:48:10.479 --> 1:48:13.920
<v Speaker 2>follow up to pitch a rival network enter I Dream

1:48:13.920 --> 1:48:18.519
<v Speaker 2>of Genie nineteen sixty five sadly did not tape it's

1:48:18.600 --> 1:48:25.160
<v Speaker 2>pilot on the days of any prominent assassinations. That game, Malcolm, Oh,

1:48:25.240 --> 1:48:28.800
<v Speaker 2>that game went to writer Sidney Sheldon, future romantic suspense

1:48:28.880 --> 1:48:31.240
<v Speaker 2>thriller novelist who is then working as a TV writer.

1:48:31.360 --> 1:48:33.640
<v Speaker 2>I hate all of those words in that name. He

1:48:33.680 --> 1:48:35.640
<v Speaker 2>felt bad about working on a rival show because he'd

1:48:35.680 --> 1:48:37.880
<v Speaker 2>been close with Bewitch director William Asher after working with

1:48:37.960 --> 1:48:40.960
<v Speaker 2>him on The Patty Duke Show years earlier. So Sheldon

1:48:40.960 --> 1:48:43.360
<v Speaker 2>gave Asher a call, and Asher gave his blessing. I

1:48:43.400 --> 1:48:45.200
<v Speaker 2>think he liked helped them flesh out the idea a

1:48:45.200 --> 1:48:53.400
<v Speaker 2>bit too. She's a genie, But what do you want print,

1:48:53.720 --> 1:48:56.880
<v Speaker 2>got a bottle of it? Yeah, little boy, to have

1:48:56.920 --> 1:49:03.720
<v Speaker 2>a clubhouse. Look like some day we're gonna naval Did

1:49:03.720 --> 1:49:07.599
<v Speaker 2>that do anything for you? The I Dream of Genie

1:49:07.600 --> 1:49:10.559
<v Speaker 2>and Bewitch became something of sister shows. They both taped

1:49:10.560 --> 1:49:14.160
<v Speaker 2>at Columbia Studios on Sunset and Gower, and also nine

1:49:14.160 --> 1:49:16.880
<v Speaker 2>miles away at the Columbia Movie Ranch, where as you mentioned,

1:49:16.880 --> 1:49:19.599
<v Speaker 2>they exchanged housing facades. Despite the fact that Bewitch took

1:49:19.640 --> 1:49:22.160
<v Speaker 2>place in a New York suburb or Connecticut, and I

1:49:22.240 --> 1:49:27.120
<v Speaker 2>Dream of Genie took place in Cocoa Beach, Florida. Bewitched,

1:49:27.160 --> 1:49:29.320
<v Speaker 2>I Dream of Genie, the Monkeys, the Parture Family, and

1:49:29.360 --> 1:49:31.920
<v Speaker 2>the Flying Nun all had their makeup done in the

1:49:31.960 --> 1:49:36.000
<v Speaker 2>same room, and Sally Field, the titular Flying Nun, recalled

1:49:36.040 --> 1:49:38.400
<v Speaker 2>Barbara Eden, singing all the time she was getting her

1:49:38.400 --> 1:49:41.760
<v Speaker 2>makeup done, which would drive Elizabeth Montgomery insane. Despite this,

1:49:41.840 --> 1:49:44.599
<v Speaker 2>the pair were reportedly very close, according to Barbara Eden,

1:49:44.640 --> 1:49:47.679
<v Speaker 2>at least as she told the Sydney Morning Harold, Elizabeth

1:49:47.720 --> 1:49:49.680
<v Speaker 2>and I were on the same lot. I'd see her

1:49:49.720 --> 1:49:52.080
<v Speaker 2>every morning. We were both pregnant together. Both had our

1:49:52.080 --> 1:49:54.640
<v Speaker 2>babies around the same time. We chatted a lot. If

1:49:54.680 --> 1:49:58.679
<v Speaker 2>there was any perceived rivalry, it was the producer's invention. Samantha, meanwhile,

1:49:58.760 --> 1:50:01.200
<v Speaker 2>was rumored to be privately in by the similarities between

1:50:01.240 --> 1:50:04.880
<v Speaker 2>the two shows, possibly just a dose of good old

1:50:04.960 --> 1:50:08.479
<v Speaker 2>women competing with women in there because Barbara Eden was

1:50:08.920 --> 1:50:16.519
<v Speaker 2>quickly television's newest hot slut. In reality, the shows were

1:50:16.520 --> 1:50:18.920
<v Speaker 2>not truly competitors. They didn't air at the same time,

1:50:19.120 --> 1:50:22.160
<v Speaker 2>and Bewitched thoroughly stomped I Dream of Genie in the ratings.

1:50:22.720 --> 1:50:24.760
<v Speaker 2>That show never even broke the top twenty during its

1:50:24.800 --> 1:50:30.719
<v Speaker 2>original run. That's crazy, And back to the dis Dick Sargent,

1:50:30.840 --> 1:50:33.000
<v Speaker 2>who took over as Darren, had a small role on

1:50:33.000 --> 1:50:36.800
<v Speaker 2>Igam of Dreney as a lawyer, just six months before

1:50:36.840 --> 1:50:40.160
<v Speaker 2>he took over the co star slot on Bewitched. I

1:50:40.240 --> 1:50:42.479
<v Speaker 2>promise you were going to get to the Dicks. The

1:50:42.520 --> 1:50:45.599
<v Speaker 2>Flintstones crossover. Speaking of crossover, I don't know why I've

1:50:45.600 --> 1:50:48.320
<v Speaker 2>read the title heading there. Speaking of crossovers, Bewitched had

1:50:48.320 --> 1:50:52.120
<v Speaker 2>a crossover episode with another ABC show, The Flintstones. Screen

1:50:52.200 --> 1:50:54.800
<v Speaker 2>Gems owned a twenty percent steak in Hannah Barbera. The

1:50:54.800 --> 1:50:59.120
<v Speaker 2>animation studio behind the cartoon sitcom. They handled the opening

1:50:59.160 --> 1:51:02.559
<v Speaker 2>for Bewitched. As you recall, so ABC got some synergy

1:51:02.760 --> 1:51:05.479
<v Speaker 2>going by having a cartoon Samantha and Darren drop into

1:51:05.479 --> 1:51:10.880
<v Speaker 2>Bedrock as the Flintstones new Neighbors time travel multiverse. I

1:51:10.880 --> 1:51:12.920
<v Speaker 2>don't know, yeah, I don't know how that worked, Hanna

1:51:12.960 --> 1:51:15.479
<v Speaker 2>Barbara really had. It was just all over the place.

1:51:15.520 --> 1:51:18.439
<v Speaker 2>I mean this, we already tied him into this episode once.

1:51:18.760 --> 1:51:21.759
<v Speaker 2>How they turned a Jack Armstrong pilot into Johnny Quest

1:51:22.720 --> 1:51:25.479
<v Speaker 2>Stay in her lane, Hanna Barbera, And now we have

1:51:25.520 --> 1:51:30.000
<v Speaker 2>to get to the racism. Perhaps the most notorious episode

1:51:30.000 --> 1:51:32.960
<v Speaker 2>of Bewitched is a nineteen seventy Christmas episode called Sisters

1:51:32.960 --> 1:51:37.519
<v Speaker 2>at Heart, and it is a very special episode in

1:51:37.600 --> 1:51:41.240
<v Speaker 2>all meetings of the phrase, it is the only instance

1:51:41.439 --> 1:51:46.800
<v Speaker 2>where you could plausibly describe something as the heartwarming blackface episode.

1:51:47.040 --> 1:51:52.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah hear us out. This episode was actually written collaboratively

1:51:52.800 --> 1:51:56.080
<v Speaker 2>by twenty two students of Mis Marcella Saunders tenth grade

1:51:56.120 --> 1:51:59.760
<v Speaker 2>English class at Jefferson High School in south central Los Angeles.

1:52:00.439 --> 1:52:02.360
<v Speaker 2>MSS Saunders was a twenty three year old teacher who

1:52:02.360 --> 1:52:05.000
<v Speaker 2>found that her students struggle with reading and interpreting text.

1:52:05.520 --> 1:52:07.920
<v Speaker 2>But she knew they were all big Bewitched fans, so

1:52:07.960 --> 1:52:10.760
<v Speaker 2>she started typing up scripts of various episodes and incorporating

1:52:10.800 --> 1:52:13.920
<v Speaker 2>those into her lesson plans. She wrote to screen Gems

1:52:13.920 --> 1:52:16.320
<v Speaker 2>to share her story with the producers, and Elizabeth Montgomery

1:52:16.320 --> 1:52:18.400
<v Speaker 2>and William Asher were so touched that they invited them

1:52:18.439 --> 1:52:21.480
<v Speaker 2>down to visit the studio and even cover their travel expenses.

1:52:22.640 --> 1:52:25.559
<v Speaker 2>Saunders thanked them by sharing an original plot line that

1:52:25.640 --> 1:52:28.120
<v Speaker 2>all the students had collaborated on, and the writers were

1:52:28.120 --> 1:52:31.719
<v Speaker 2>so impressed that they adapted into a full length episode.

1:52:31.920 --> 1:52:35.000
<v Speaker 2>There is possibly some money that changed Anne, but Montgomery

1:52:35.000 --> 1:52:36.920
<v Speaker 2>made it clear whose idea was at the start of

1:52:36.960 --> 1:52:39.920
<v Speaker 2>the episode, which featured a tape segment shouting out the

1:52:39.920 --> 1:52:43.920
<v Speaker 2>class and explaining the genesis of the episode. That was

1:52:43.960 --> 1:52:47.439
<v Speaker 2>all necessary because the plot involves mister Brockway, who is

1:52:47.439 --> 1:52:50.200
<v Speaker 2>an openly racist owner of a toy company Darren is

1:52:50.240 --> 1:52:53.679
<v Speaker 2>working with at his ad agency. Brockway refused to allow

1:52:53.760 --> 1:52:56.559
<v Speaker 2>Darren to handle his account since he mistakenly believed that

1:52:56.640 --> 1:52:59.599
<v Speaker 2>Darren was married to a black woman who was actually

1:52:59.640 --> 1:53:04.080
<v Speaker 2>the white of Darren's co workers. Meanwhile, that coworker's daughter

1:53:04.120 --> 1:53:07.800
<v Speaker 2>was Tabitha's close friend and spending the weekend with the Stevens.

1:53:08.479 --> 1:53:11.519
<v Speaker 2>Tabitha liked to pretend that the two were sisters and

1:53:11.600 --> 1:53:14.680
<v Speaker 2>tried to make them both the same color so that

1:53:14.720 --> 1:53:17.599
<v Speaker 2>they'd be twins, because she's a witch and she can,

1:53:17.760 --> 1:53:21.280
<v Speaker 2>like you know. Unfortunately, she got the spell wrong, and

1:53:21.320 --> 1:53:23.599
<v Speaker 2>Tabitha ended up with black poka dots on her face,

1:53:24.080 --> 1:53:27.080
<v Speaker 2>while her friend Lisa had white spots. In the end,

1:53:27.240 --> 1:53:29.439
<v Speaker 2>Samantha explained that all men and women are brothers and

1:53:29.479 --> 1:53:32.320
<v Speaker 2>sisters despite the color of their skin, and to prove

1:53:32.360 --> 1:53:34.920
<v Speaker 2>a point, she used her magic to zap everyone at

1:53:34.920 --> 1:53:39.120
<v Speaker 2>their Christmas party into blackface when the aforementioned openly racist

1:53:39.240 --> 1:53:44.080
<v Speaker 2>mister Brockway arrived. Rather than throwing him into a murderous rage,

1:53:45.000 --> 1:53:48.920
<v Speaker 2>this allowed him to see the air of his ways,

1:53:49.840 --> 1:53:53.519
<v Speaker 2>and he gave Darren the account and his heart grew

1:53:53.560 --> 1:53:59.200
<v Speaker 2>three sizes that day. The episode won an Emmy Hilarious

1:53:59.360 --> 1:54:02.479
<v Speaker 2>Wonderful Stuff. Elizabeth Montgomery declared it her favorite.

1:54:03.600 --> 1:54:05.880
<v Speaker 1>It makes sense because it plays on the whole mixed

1:54:05.960 --> 1:54:08.720
<v Speaker 1>marriage metaphor of a witch is immortal.

1:54:09.840 --> 1:54:11.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, it wasn't Amos and Andy still on the

1:54:11.800 --> 1:54:16.080
<v Speaker 2>air nineteen seventy Oh, I don't know, no, no, yeah,

1:54:16.080 --> 1:54:18.479
<v Speaker 2>you're right, that wasn't Yeah, Amos Andy had got Amos

1:54:18.479 --> 1:54:20.759
<v Speaker 2>and Andy. There was a spin off called Amos Andy's

1:54:20.840 --> 1:54:25.479
<v Speaker 2>Music Hall that stopped in nineteen sixty. Wow, Amos and

1:54:25.520 --> 1:54:31.080
<v Speaker 2>Andy stopped in nineteen fifty five. So yeah, yikes, not

1:54:31.160 --> 1:54:36.880
<v Speaker 2>too long out from that. But hey, witchcraft, they don't

1:54:36.880 --> 1:54:39.080
<v Speaker 2>call it that old black magic for nothing? Am I right? Folks?

1:54:39.400 --> 1:54:41.240
<v Speaker 1>Wow? Wow?

1:54:41.400 --> 1:54:45.320
<v Speaker 2>Can we keep that? Judges? I just go nuts. No,

1:54:45.360 --> 1:54:47.440
<v Speaker 2>it actually is quite stup because there's a whole ton

1:54:47.480 --> 1:54:50.480
<v Speaker 2>of like racial stuff tied up in witchcraft because of

1:54:50.560 --> 1:54:52.640
<v Speaker 2>voodoo and like, oh yeah, you know, one of the

1:54:52.680 --> 1:54:55.120
<v Speaker 2>first zombie movies that came out, I Walked With a Zombie,

1:54:55.240 --> 1:54:59.320
<v Speaker 2>is actually about not the Night of the Living Dead concept,

1:54:59.360 --> 1:55:01.879
<v Speaker 2>which was the dead returning to life, which is coined

1:55:01.880 --> 1:55:05.400
<v Speaker 2>by George Romero, but the idea of actual Haitian voodoo,

1:55:05.440 --> 1:55:07.720
<v Speaker 2>which is putting people under like a trance to do

1:55:07.800 --> 1:55:10.320
<v Speaker 2>your bidding and in a state akin to living death,

1:55:10.400 --> 1:55:12.760
<v Speaker 2>but not actually being dead. So that was like, honestly

1:55:12.800 --> 1:55:14.840
<v Speaker 2>the first time a lot of people had been exposed

1:55:14.880 --> 1:55:19.120
<v Speaker 2>to just any Haitian culture. Year did that movie come

1:55:19.160 --> 1:55:26.520
<v Speaker 2>out nineteen forty three, So American attitude towards Witchcraft were

1:55:26.520 --> 1:55:30.560
<v Speaker 2>influenced by that because it was a very influential film,

1:55:30.680 --> 1:55:34.840
<v Speaker 2>So I brought it back. Thank you? Still racist as yeah?

1:55:35.040 --> 1:55:39.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, but is it racist if the people who

1:55:39.760 --> 1:55:41.920
<v Speaker 1>wrote it were little black kids?

1:55:43.960 --> 1:55:48.839
<v Speaker 2>No? Yeah, I don't really understand.

1:55:48.920 --> 1:55:51.600
<v Speaker 1>How like being zapping everybody in the black face at

1:55:51.600 --> 1:55:52.800
<v Speaker 1>the end, I'm.

1:55:52.680 --> 1:55:54.440
<v Speaker 2>Saying, if this dude was that racist, he probably just

1:55:54.520 --> 1:55:57.320
<v Speaker 2>would have walked in and started shooting right like, or

1:55:57.440 --> 1:56:01.400
<v Speaker 2>got outside and burned across, Like, how does being confront

1:56:01.440 --> 1:56:04.480
<v Speaker 2>with the thing you hate most make you tolerate it?

1:56:05.160 --> 1:56:08.640
<v Speaker 2>That's white panic, Like, that's why this is why white

1:56:08.640 --> 1:56:11.760
<v Speaker 2>people left the fucking cities and created the suburbs, honestly,

1:56:12.200 --> 1:56:15.360
<v Speaker 2>because they started they started looking around, and it sure

1:56:15.400 --> 1:56:16.600
<v Speaker 2>didn't result in brotherhood.

1:56:17.000 --> 1:56:18.760
<v Speaker 1>That story in that King Cole when he moved in

1:56:18.800 --> 1:56:21.360
<v Speaker 1>this like Canoga Park or some like nice part of

1:56:21.520 --> 1:56:24.960
<v Speaker 1>LA and a bunch of his neighbors like showed up

1:56:25.040 --> 1:56:27.720
<v Speaker 1>to basically petition him, and they said, like, you know,

1:56:27.840 --> 1:56:30.480
<v Speaker 1>we don't want any desirables moving into our neighborhood. And

1:56:30.520 --> 1:56:33.400
<v Speaker 1>he said, if I see any undesirables, I'll let you know. Yeah,

1:56:33.520 --> 1:56:35.520
<v Speaker 1>I think they still like burnt crosses on his lawn

1:56:35.600 --> 1:56:36.000
<v Speaker 1>or something.

1:56:36.960 --> 1:56:42.160
<v Speaker 2>Ah, and that like wasn't this country.

1:56:41.160 --> 1:56:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was LA, which I mean, I guess LA,

1:56:43.040 --> 1:56:46.320
<v Speaker 1>especially them, was not exactly as liberal as we see

1:56:46.320 --> 1:56:49.000
<v Speaker 1>it today. But I mean, I don't know. Nineteen ninety two,

1:56:49.120 --> 1:56:56.280
<v Speaker 1>never mind, there's an incredible documentary I think, directed by

1:56:56.760 --> 1:56:59.080
<v Speaker 1>John Singleton. I'm pretty sure John Singleton just called I

1:56:59.080 --> 1:57:03.000
<v Speaker 1>Think LA ninety two and it's all not found footage

1:57:03.040 --> 1:57:06.600
<v Speaker 1>but like news footage and handheld cam quarter footage of

1:57:06.640 --> 1:57:08.839
<v Speaker 1>the LA riots after the Rodney King verdict.

1:57:09.160 --> 1:57:10.960
<v Speaker 2>It is astonishing.

1:57:11.360 --> 1:57:16.560
<v Speaker 1>It is an incredible documentary anyway, on the topic of magic,

1:57:17.600 --> 1:57:21.320
<v Speaker 1>I guess this whole episode bad Sameway. Another notable string

1:57:21.320 --> 1:57:24.560
<v Speaker 1>of episodes occurred during the same season, season seven, for

1:57:24.600 --> 1:57:27.680
<v Speaker 1>an eight part story arc in which Samantha, Darren, and

1:57:27.680 --> 1:57:31.839
<v Speaker 1>Indorra traveled to Salem, Massachusetts for the Centennial Witch's Convention.

1:57:32.720 --> 1:57:33.720
<v Speaker 2>This was the first time that.

1:57:33.680 --> 1:57:36.560
<v Speaker 1>The show had shot on location, and many assumed it

1:57:36.600 --> 1:57:38.680
<v Speaker 1>was because the show had fallen out of the top

1:57:38.760 --> 1:57:41.200
<v Speaker 1>ten and even the top twenty by this point, but.

1:57:41.240 --> 1:57:43.760
<v Speaker 2>In truth, it was for a much more practical reason.

1:57:44.320 --> 1:57:46.400
<v Speaker 1>The sound stage where they filmed and caught on fire,

1:57:46.800 --> 1:57:49.880
<v Speaker 1>destroying a significant portion of the sets, and yet this

1:57:50.040 --> 1:57:52.760
<v Speaker 1>wasn't the biggest catastrophe the producers had to contend with.

1:57:53.160 --> 1:57:56.680
<v Speaker 1>They had already replaced two minor characters without announcement and

1:57:56.760 --> 1:57:59.440
<v Speaker 1>had another die on them, But then tragedy struck with

1:57:59.440 --> 1:58:04.520
<v Speaker 1>their male Dick York. And now we finally get to

1:58:05.040 --> 1:58:08.520
<v Speaker 1>the Darren drama, also known as the Tale of the

1:58:08.520 --> 1:58:09.120
<v Speaker 1>Two Dicks.

1:58:09.400 --> 1:58:13.000
<v Speaker 2>Yes, it's funny. I'm I'm sorry, it's funny.

1:58:13.720 --> 1:58:15.920
<v Speaker 1>You know that Dick Sergent's real name is Dick Cox.

1:58:17.920 --> 1:58:21.320
<v Speaker 2>I did. It's true? Good for him. Yeah, I always

1:58:21.360 --> 1:58:23.200
<v Speaker 2>was pressure to one of the guys who played Michael

1:58:23.240 --> 1:58:29.640
<v Speaker 2>Myers a Dick Warlock. Oh wow, a hell of a name, man. Yeah,

1:58:29.680 --> 1:58:31.640
<v Speaker 2>but he kind of looks like a wolf's dick. No,

1:58:31.840 --> 1:58:35.480
<v Speaker 2>does he low hanging fruit with that joke, But he's

1:58:35.560 --> 1:58:36.320
<v Speaker 2>kind of gnarled.

1:58:37.760 --> 1:58:40.320
<v Speaker 1>It's funny where you don't know what he looks like. Yeah,

1:58:40.480 --> 1:58:42.600
<v Speaker 1>this is extra funny to me because my dad's name Dick,

1:58:42.680 --> 1:58:45.000
<v Speaker 1>and it was always an endless source of amusement for

1:58:45.080 --> 1:58:45.800
<v Speaker 1>me and my friends.

1:58:46.120 --> 1:58:47.640
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, he's listening right now. I'm sure.

1:58:47.680 --> 1:58:49.320
<v Speaker 1>I hope he's aware of that. I assume he is.

1:58:50.240 --> 1:58:51.800
<v Speaker 1>My middle name is Richard too. So a lot of

1:58:51.800 --> 1:58:55.240
<v Speaker 1>my close friends call me Dick. You don't though, No, no,

1:58:55.320 --> 1:58:55.680
<v Speaker 1>I don't.

1:58:55.720 --> 1:58:56.640
<v Speaker 2>I'll let you sit with that.

1:58:59.520 --> 1:59:03.320
<v Speaker 1>Yes, like all this section their dick, his back might

1:59:03.320 --> 1:59:08.160
<v Speaker 1>bewitch cast just got jacked delivered in the my neck,

1:59:08.240 --> 1:59:09.400
<v Speaker 1>my back, cadence.

1:59:09.480 --> 1:59:11.880
<v Speaker 2>No, this is fine, this is fine. Okay, that's fine.

1:59:12.040 --> 1:59:14.200
<v Speaker 1>So we teased this earlier, but Dick York arrived at

1:59:14.200 --> 1:59:17.200
<v Speaker 1>his audition for Bewished with a secret He was nursing

1:59:17.200 --> 1:59:21.240
<v Speaker 1>a deeply painful chronic back injury, which my father also has.

1:59:21.600 --> 1:59:23.720
<v Speaker 1>It began when he was making a nineteen fifty nine

1:59:23.720 --> 1:59:27.760
<v Speaker 1>movie called They Came to Cadora, starring Gary Cooper and

1:59:27.840 --> 1:59:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Tab Hunter, another fascinating mid century figure Edrita Hayworth. Dick

1:59:33.920 --> 1:59:37.560
<v Speaker 1>York was on set operating a hand car along railway tracks.

1:59:37.560 --> 1:59:39.720
<v Speaker 1>You know those things in like Thelony Tunes episodes, look

1:59:39.800 --> 1:59:41.960
<v Speaker 1>like see saws that you pop up and down.

1:59:42.040 --> 1:59:42.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1:59:42.840 --> 1:59:46.160
<v Speaker 1>When the director yelled cut, suddenly one of the extras

1:59:46.200 --> 1:59:49.080
<v Speaker 1>reached up and pulled himself up on the opposite side

1:59:49.120 --> 1:59:51.440
<v Speaker 1>that Dick was on by using the handle. But Dick

1:59:51.520 --> 1:59:54.040
<v Speaker 1>was about to lift up so, as he described it

1:59:54.040 --> 1:59:56.640
<v Speaker 1>in a nineteen ninety two interview with Film Facts Magazine.

1:59:56.720 --> 1:59:59.520
<v Speaker 1>Instead of lifting up the expected weight, I was suddenly

1:59:59.640 --> 2:00:02.960
<v Speaker 1>jarring lifting his entire weight off the flatbed one hundred

2:00:03.000 --> 2:00:06.240
<v Speaker 1>and eighty pounds or so. The muscles alongside the right

2:00:06.280 --> 2:00:07.440
<v Speaker 1>side of my back tore.

2:00:07.640 --> 2:00:09.200
<v Speaker 2>They just snapped and let loose.

2:00:09.800 --> 2:00:11.760
<v Speaker 1>And that was the start of it, all the pain,

2:00:11.960 --> 2:00:15.960
<v Speaker 1>the painkillers, the addiction, the lost career. I didn't attend

2:00:15.960 --> 2:00:18.560
<v Speaker 1>to the problem. Then I continued to work through it.

2:00:19.680 --> 2:00:22.480
<v Speaker 1>His spine never healed correctly, and it basically meant he

2:00:22.480 --> 2:00:25.760
<v Speaker 1>was inexcruciating pain at all times. The disks in his

2:00:25.840 --> 2:00:28.640
<v Speaker 1>spine slowly crumbled, and over the years he shrunk from

2:00:28.640 --> 2:00:32.520
<v Speaker 1>six foot one to five foot ten. At the time,

2:00:32.560 --> 2:00:34.680
<v Speaker 1>there was no surgery to correct the problem, so Dick

2:00:34.760 --> 2:00:37.320
<v Speaker 1>York coped with an ever increasing dosage of pain killers.

2:00:38.000 --> 2:00:40.120
<v Speaker 1>This allowed him to work through the first four seasons

2:00:40.120 --> 2:00:42.280
<v Speaker 1>of Bewitched, but over time they became less and less

2:00:42.320 --> 2:00:44.720
<v Speaker 1>able to keep up with the fourteen hour days and

2:00:44.760 --> 2:00:46.160
<v Speaker 1>the physical demands of the roles.

2:00:46.360 --> 2:00:48.160
<v Speaker 2>Very relied a lot on physical comedy.

2:00:48.800 --> 2:00:51.000
<v Speaker 1>It got to the point where Darren Less scripts were

2:00:51.040 --> 2:00:53.800
<v Speaker 1>kept permanently on hand in case he wasn't well enough

2:00:53.800 --> 2:00:56.280
<v Speaker 1>to work on any given week, fans of the show

2:00:56.280 --> 2:00:58.800
<v Speaker 1>will notice to their round. Season three, Darren was traveling

2:00:58.840 --> 2:01:01.280
<v Speaker 1>out of town on business great deal, and even when

2:01:01.320 --> 2:01:03.360
<v Speaker 1>he was home, a lot of setups were contrived to

2:01:03.400 --> 2:01:06.440
<v Speaker 1>allow him to sit down or reclimb. They even built

2:01:06.480 --> 2:01:09.520
<v Speaker 1>an angled like wall perch seat thing for him to

2:01:09.560 --> 2:01:12.480
<v Speaker 1>sit on during takes, similar to what they did for

2:01:12.520 --> 2:01:14.680
<v Speaker 1>the actor playing the Tin Man and the Wizard of Oz.

2:01:14.680 --> 2:01:17.120
<v Speaker 1>Because the costume didn't have any like knees or anything

2:01:17.120 --> 2:01:19.240
<v Speaker 1>able to allow him to bend. When he was in pain,

2:01:19.320 --> 2:01:21.680
<v Speaker 1>he could barely walk, and when he was on pills

2:01:21.680 --> 2:01:23.160
<v Speaker 1>he could baible to remember his lines.

2:01:23.320 --> 2:01:26.040
<v Speaker 2>So all in all, this was less than ideal.

2:01:28.560 --> 2:01:31.160
<v Speaker 1>And now we're at a section I like to call

2:01:32.200 --> 2:01:33.680
<v Speaker 1>pulling their dick out.

2:01:34.160 --> 2:01:35.320
<v Speaker 2>The incident.

2:01:36.360 --> 2:01:44.720
<v Speaker 1>Matters with Dick came to a head in early sixty nine,

2:01:47.680 --> 2:01:53.520
<v Speaker 1>though sadly not morehead, when the cast and crew were

2:01:53.520 --> 2:01:56.640
<v Speaker 1>hard at work on an episode called Seriously this is

2:01:56.640 --> 2:01:59.280
<v Speaker 1>what it was called Dad, I can't say it.

2:02:00.040 --> 2:02:00.800
<v Speaker 2>He does his thing.

2:02:03.640 --> 2:02:06.840
<v Speaker 1>He started the day sick and skipped lunch to see

2:02:06.840 --> 2:02:09.680
<v Speaker 1>the doctor, who gave him a B twelve shot instead

2:02:09.680 --> 2:02:13.440
<v Speaker 1>of his usual novaque and in courtizone health in the sixties.

2:02:14.920 --> 2:02:16.520
<v Speaker 1>He then had to come back and do a special

2:02:16.520 --> 2:02:19.480
<v Speaker 1>effect shot that required him to be suspended fifteen feet

2:02:19.520 --> 2:02:20.000
<v Speaker 1>in the air.

2:02:20.800 --> 2:02:22.680
<v Speaker 2>This, plus the hot lights, the.

2:02:22.640 --> 2:02:26.560
<v Speaker 1>Medication, and the exhaustion, not to mention the pain, it

2:02:26.640 --> 2:02:29.840
<v Speaker 1>was all less than ideal. York tells the story in

2:02:29.880 --> 2:02:33.720
<v Speaker 1>his autobiography, The Seesaw Girl and Me. I was too

2:02:33.760 --> 2:02:35.680
<v Speaker 1>sick to go on. I had a temperature of one

2:02:35.720 --> 2:02:38.800
<v Speaker 1>hundred and five, was full of strong antibiotics for almost

2:02:38.840 --> 2:02:41.160
<v Speaker 1>ten days. I went to work that day, but I

2:02:41.240 --> 2:02:43.680
<v Speaker 1>was sick. I lay in my dressing room after being

2:02:43.720 --> 2:02:46.480
<v Speaker 1>in makeup, waiting to be called on set. They knew

2:02:46.480 --> 2:02:48.440
<v Speaker 1>I was feeling pretty rotten, and they tried to give

2:02:48.440 --> 2:02:51.320
<v Speaker 1>me time to rest. I kept having chills. It was

2:02:51.360 --> 2:02:52.880
<v Speaker 1>the middle of the summer and it was wearing a

2:02:52.880 --> 2:02:57.000
<v Speaker 1>sheepskin jacket, and I was chilling, shaking all over. Then,

2:02:57.080 --> 2:02:59.720
<v Speaker 1>while sitting on a scaffolding with Maurice Evans being lit

2:02:59.720 --> 2:03:02.520
<v Speaker 1>for a special effects scene, they were setting an inky.

2:03:02.560 --> 2:03:04.560
<v Speaker 1>It was a little tiny spotlight that was supposed to

2:03:04.600 --> 2:03:08.240
<v Speaker 1>just be flickering over my eyes. That flick flickering, flickering

2:03:08.280 --> 2:03:11.200
<v Speaker 1>made me feel weird. I was sitting on this platform

2:03:11.280 --> 2:03:12.960
<v Speaker 1>up in the air, and I turned to a friend

2:03:13.000 --> 2:03:14.560
<v Speaker 1>of mine on the site. He was just down below,

2:03:14.560 --> 2:03:16.920
<v Speaker 1>and I said, I think I have to get down.

2:03:17.720 --> 2:03:19.440
<v Speaker 1>He started to help me down, and that's the last

2:03:19.480 --> 2:03:21.480
<v Speaker 1>thing I remember until I woke up on the floor.

2:03:21.920 --> 2:03:24.560
<v Speaker 1>That's about all I'll remember of the incident. I managed

2:03:24.600 --> 2:03:26.480
<v Speaker 1>to bite a very large hole in the side of

2:03:26.480 --> 2:03:29.320
<v Speaker 1>my tongue before they could pry my teeth apart. Oh,

2:03:29.480 --> 2:03:32.760
<v Speaker 1>he basically had a seizure. Essentially, he was immediately rushed

2:03:32.760 --> 2:03:36.200
<v Speaker 1>to the hospital, never to return to the Bewitch set again.

2:03:37.040 --> 2:03:39.360
<v Speaker 1>Bill Asher paid him a visit while he was recovering

2:03:39.400 --> 2:03:40.960
<v Speaker 1>and asked him if he wanted to hang it up.

2:03:41.720 --> 2:03:45.600
<v Speaker 1>York replied, if it's all right with you, Billy, and

2:03:45.680 --> 2:03:48.480
<v Speaker 1>with that, Dick Yorke left the sitcom to devote himself

2:03:48.520 --> 2:03:51.440
<v Speaker 1>to his recovery. The only public comment he made at

2:03:51.480 --> 2:03:53.680
<v Speaker 1>the time in relation to his departure from the series

2:03:53.960 --> 2:03:57.680
<v Speaker 1>was to the Sacramento Bee in March of nineteen sixty nine.

2:03:57.720 --> 2:04:00.320
<v Speaker 1>Five years was Liz's husband on Bewitched. There are no

2:04:00.400 --> 2:04:02.680
<v Speaker 1>hard feelings. I just want a chance to do other

2:04:02.720 --> 2:04:07.960
<v Speaker 1>stage and movie roles. But privately, he was devastated describing

2:04:07.960 --> 2:04:10.560
<v Speaker 1>his onset collapse as quote the worst day of my

2:04:10.640 --> 2:04:14.120
<v Speaker 1>life because I felt like I'd failed everybody. It was

2:04:14.160 --> 2:04:16.600
<v Speaker 1>the only thing that I started that I didn't finish.

2:04:16.880 --> 2:04:19.480
<v Speaker 1>I felt so guilty and I felt embarrassed that I

2:04:19.560 --> 2:04:20.560
<v Speaker 1>let everybody down.

2:04:21.160 --> 2:04:25.280
<v Speaker 2>And now ran a section called dick swapping that is

2:04:25.320 --> 2:04:28.520
<v Speaker 2>just so sad man. Oh it gets so much worse.

2:04:28.920 --> 2:04:29.480
<v Speaker 2>Oh great.

2:04:29.760 --> 2:04:32.640
<v Speaker 1>The whole situation left Bill Asher in a tough spot.

2:04:33.120 --> 2:04:35.640
<v Speaker 1>They'd finished out the fifth season by filming Darren less

2:04:35.680 --> 2:04:37.560
<v Speaker 1>episodes and mixing them in with the ones that had

2:04:37.600 --> 2:04:39.960
<v Speaker 1>already shot with Dick York, so his absence seemed a

2:04:40.000 --> 2:04:44.160
<v Speaker 1>little less obvious, But once those aired, Asher considered canceling

2:04:44.160 --> 2:04:47.680
<v Speaker 1>the show altogether. As we'll talk about Elizabeth Montgomery had

2:04:47.720 --> 2:04:50.440
<v Speaker 1>already grown tired of doing it, but ratings were still high.

2:04:51.040 --> 2:04:52.600
<v Speaker 1>When she tried to quit after the end of the

2:04:52.640 --> 2:04:55.280
<v Speaker 1>fifth season, the network responded by not only giving her

2:04:55.320 --> 2:04:57.880
<v Speaker 1>a pay raise, but offering her twenty percent share of

2:04:57.920 --> 2:05:01.040
<v Speaker 1>the series and greater creative control. So the Beast had

2:05:01.080 --> 2:05:03.520
<v Speaker 1>to be fed. Though they were down a leading man,

2:05:04.280 --> 2:05:06.520
<v Speaker 1>divorce was seen as out of the question, and killing

2:05:06.600 --> 2:05:09.680
<v Speaker 1>him off seemed a little too gothic. Especially considering Elizabeth

2:05:09.680 --> 2:05:12.160
<v Speaker 1>Montgomery was now pregnant and they're about to have another

2:05:12.160 --> 2:05:14.000
<v Speaker 1>baby on the show. It just seemed sad for it

2:05:14.000 --> 2:05:16.680
<v Speaker 1>to be a single mom whose husband.

2:05:16.400 --> 2:05:17.000
<v Speaker 2>Had just died.

2:05:17.400 --> 2:05:19.560
<v Speaker 1>So they decided to go with the least subtle solution

2:05:19.760 --> 2:05:23.400
<v Speaker 1>and simply replaced dick Yorke with another actor with no explanation.

2:05:23.720 --> 2:05:26.200
<v Speaker 1>Asher simply assumed that viewers would understand that this was

2:05:26.240 --> 2:05:28.520
<v Speaker 1>an actor playing a role and they had to get

2:05:28.520 --> 2:05:32.200
<v Speaker 1>a new actor. It was a ruthlessly pragmatic decision, but

2:05:32.320 --> 2:05:35.560
<v Speaker 1>ultimately he decided that the best explanation was none at all.

2:05:36.560 --> 2:05:38.920
<v Speaker 1>In doing so, they birth the phenomenon known in TV

2:05:39.040 --> 2:05:42.320
<v Speaker 1>circles as the Darren syndrome. It's happened a lot over

2:05:42.320 --> 2:05:45.480
<v Speaker 1>the years see Laurie from That seventy show, Bobby Draper

2:05:45.520 --> 2:05:48.280
<v Speaker 1>from mad Men, Chris and the Partridge Family, and many others.

2:05:48.800 --> 2:05:51.640
<v Speaker 1>My favorite is Becky from Roseanne because they made constant

2:05:51.720 --> 2:05:54.360
<v Speaker 1>jokes about it on the show. In one episode, the

2:05:54.400 --> 2:05:59.000
<v Speaker 1>family watched Bewitched on TV and the deputy Becky Sarah

2:05:59.080 --> 2:06:01.600
<v Speaker 1>Chalk I think her name is, remarked that she preferred

2:06:01.640 --> 2:06:04.600
<v Speaker 1>the second Theren, because of course she did.

2:06:04.920 --> 2:06:08.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Sarah chalk Is from Scrubs, Rick and Morty. Oh yeah, yeah,

2:06:08.760 --> 2:06:12.400
<v Speaker 2>and you're forgetting Aunt Viv from Fresh Prince of bel Air.

2:06:12.720 --> 2:06:14.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, I thought she was only in the first

2:06:14.160 --> 2:06:16.560
<v Speaker 1>episode and then she and Will Smith had a big

2:06:16.600 --> 2:06:17.200
<v Speaker 1>falling out.

2:06:17.680 --> 2:06:20.360
<v Speaker 2>Well she was, Yeah, basically that's been the rumor. I thought.

2:06:20.400 --> 2:06:22.240
<v Speaker 1>She like literally has quoted and interviews of being like,

2:06:22.280 --> 2:06:24.240
<v Speaker 1>I'm not going to work with that all Will Smith.

2:06:23.920 --> 2:06:28.400
<v Speaker 2>Ever again, Yeah, she's claiming now that she was offered

2:06:28.680 --> 2:06:31.200
<v Speaker 2>a really bad deal and also in an abusive marriage.

2:06:31.400 --> 2:06:33.839
<v Speaker 2>She did say that Smith got her fired at one point.

2:06:34.200 --> 2:06:38.200
<v Speaker 2>Oh aw, but yeah, I don't know. Wacky. Yeah. The

2:06:38.320 --> 2:06:39.240
<v Speaker 2>Roseanne almost funny.

2:06:39.280 --> 2:06:43.840
<v Speaker 1>I remember the first Becky came back like later on

2:06:43.960 --> 2:06:45.760
<v Speaker 1>for some reason. I think she left to go to college,

2:06:45.760 --> 2:06:47.280
<v Speaker 1>and then when she was done, she came back to

2:06:47.320 --> 2:06:51.919
<v Speaker 1>the show. And whenever her character entered the room, Roseanne

2:06:52.040 --> 2:06:54.000
<v Speaker 1>or whoever was in the room, John Gooman wouldever be like,

2:06:54.200 --> 2:06:55.080
<v Speaker 1>where have you been?

2:06:56.680 --> 2:06:58.520
<v Speaker 2>It is great? This is really funny.

2:07:00.160 --> 2:07:03.160
<v Speaker 1>The obvious choice for Darren two point zero was Dick Sargeant,

2:07:03.320 --> 2:07:05.880
<v Speaker 1>who not only bore a passic resemblance to York, but

2:07:05.920 --> 2:07:08.040
<v Speaker 1>it also been an early contender for the Roles. We

2:07:08.160 --> 2:07:11.200
<v Speaker 1>mentioned he had a rough time getting integrated in the cast. However,

2:07:11.640 --> 2:07:14.520
<v Speaker 1>during his first read through, Agnes moorehead in Dora, who

2:07:14.520 --> 2:07:17.160
<v Speaker 1>was very close to Dick York, stood up and announced

2:07:17.760 --> 2:07:21.160
<v Speaker 1>I don't like change, before sitting back down.

2:07:23.080 --> 2:07:23.160
<v Speaker 2>Me.

2:07:23.880 --> 2:07:26.600
<v Speaker 1>That's probably why Sergeant would recall hear is a tough

2:07:26.600 --> 2:07:29.600
<v Speaker 1>old bird or tough old broad or something. Yeah, but

2:07:29.720 --> 2:07:32.839
<v Speaker 1>his relationship with Elizabeth Montgomery was better than hers with York's,

2:07:33.360 --> 2:07:35.480
<v Speaker 1>possibly because he was gay and they didn't have that

2:07:35.520 --> 2:07:39.920
<v Speaker 1>same weirdness that tainted her relationship with Dick York.

2:07:40.320 --> 2:07:42.480
<v Speaker 2>Maybe yeah, I don't know.

2:07:43.560 --> 2:07:45.600
<v Speaker 1>The first episode he films seemed to be a nod

2:07:45.680 --> 2:07:50.720
<v Speaker 1>to the unusual circumstances called Samantha's Better Halves, and Dora

2:07:50.920 --> 2:07:55.839
<v Speaker 1>splits Darren into two personalities, one gregarious and another all business,

2:07:56.240 --> 2:07:58.560
<v Speaker 1>and Samantha can be heard moaning stuff like but I

2:07:58.560 --> 2:08:02.480
<v Speaker 1>only want one Darren, which is pretty on the nose.

2:08:02.680 --> 2:08:04.200
<v Speaker 1>And there are a lot of people who thought that

2:08:04.280 --> 2:08:07.480
<v Speaker 1>the script was a jab from writers who were angry

2:08:07.520 --> 2:08:10.040
<v Speaker 1>that the producers hadn't stuck by Dick York and just

2:08:10.160 --> 2:08:12.680
<v Speaker 1>ended the series or tried to coax him back or something.

2:08:13.480 --> 2:08:18.400
<v Speaker 1>Reviews for Dick Sergeant were tepid. As Variety wrote in

2:08:18.440 --> 2:08:21.840
<v Speaker 1>case anyone noticed, and assuredly a large number did, Hubby

2:08:21.920 --> 2:08:24.840
<v Speaker 1>Darren is not quite the same as before. That's because

2:08:24.880 --> 2:08:27.280
<v Speaker 1>he used to be Dick York and now he's Dick Sergent.

2:08:28.000 --> 2:08:30.600
<v Speaker 1>Whether the unspoken change will be accepted by the audience

2:08:30.640 --> 2:08:33.320
<v Speaker 1>remains to be seen. Some might find it odd to

2:08:33.320 --> 2:08:36.080
<v Speaker 1>see Samantha just as affectionate with a man who seemingly

2:08:36.160 --> 2:08:40.680
<v Speaker 1>unbeknownst to her as a stranger. Generally, be Witch fans

2:08:40.720 --> 2:08:43.080
<v Speaker 1>tended to prefer Dick York, who portrayed Darren as a

2:08:43.160 --> 2:08:45.720
<v Speaker 1>much more reactive and hysterical.

2:08:45.120 --> 2:08:48.920
<v Speaker 2>Figure, rather than Sergeant, who was much more restrained. Uh.

2:08:49.400 --> 2:08:52.400
<v Speaker 1>Dick Sergent would later act in a movie called Hardcore,

2:08:52.720 --> 2:08:55.840
<v Speaker 1>where George C. Scott discovers that his missing daughter is

2:08:55.920 --> 2:08:56.680
<v Speaker 1>doing porn.

2:08:56.960 --> 2:09:00.000
<v Speaker 2>Have you heard of this? No? I haven't. Nineteen seventy nine.

2:09:00.280 --> 2:09:03.480
<v Speaker 2>Peter Boyle's in this. Paul Schrader wrote and directed it

2:09:03.560 --> 2:09:05.600
<v Speaker 2>So music by Jack Nietzsche.

2:09:06.040 --> 2:09:09.320
<v Speaker 1>Wow, Okay, this is like hitting all the bases. The

2:09:09.320 --> 2:09:13.680
<v Speaker 1>Wikipedia intrograph is kind of nuts. It's plot follows a

2:09:13.680 --> 2:09:18.000
<v Speaker 1>conservative Midwestern businessman whose teenage daughter goes missing. In California

2:09:18.400 --> 2:09:20.760
<v Speaker 1>with the help of a prostitute. His search leads him

2:09:20.760 --> 2:09:24.680
<v Speaker 1>to the illicit subculture of pornography inclording snuff films.

2:09:25.120 --> 2:09:31.520
<v Speaker 2>Schrader developed it with John Millius. It all comes back, ye, judge,

2:09:31.800 --> 2:09:33.560
<v Speaker 2>Oh my god.

2:09:33.920 --> 2:09:36.520
<v Speaker 1>The poster is incredible. It's just the phrase, oh my god,

2:09:36.560 --> 2:09:39.880
<v Speaker 1>that's my daughter over black text with George C. Scott

2:09:39.920 --> 2:09:42.320
<v Speaker 1>in the lower corner with his head in his hands.

2:09:42.520 --> 2:09:45.200
<v Speaker 2>It is funny because he's making He does that exact

2:09:45.280 --> 2:09:52.240
<v Speaker 2>same thing an Exorcist three in like twenty one years later. Uh,

2:09:52.320 --> 2:09:52.920
<v Speaker 2>he's up there.

2:09:52.800 --> 2:09:55.360
<v Speaker 1>With Michael Kaine in terms of like, was it pay

2:09:55.960 --> 2:09:56.360
<v Speaker 1>I'll do it?

2:09:56.440 --> 2:09:59.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly. I think he was drunk for a lot

2:09:59.360 --> 2:10:02.760
<v Speaker 2>of it. Yeah. Originally born Baby was in this oh

2:10:02.800 --> 2:10:05.640
<v Speaker 2>weird as the Jersey Sky character.

2:10:05.960 --> 2:10:11.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh yeah's he couldn't pull off conservative Midwestern dad.

2:10:11.680 --> 2:10:14.960
<v Speaker 2>In his contract, George C. Scott stipulated the production include

2:10:15.000 --> 2:10:17.960
<v Speaker 2>five break days for the actor due to his drinking

2:10:17.960 --> 2:10:21.080
<v Speaker 2>problem at the time. Yeah, I have I've got a

2:10:21.160 --> 2:10:21.879
<v Speaker 2>drinking problem.

2:10:21.880 --> 2:10:25.000
<v Speaker 1>Can I have like five days off? It was a

2:10:24.760 --> 2:10:25.760
<v Speaker 1>week or a month.

2:10:26.240 --> 2:10:29.840
<v Speaker 2>I need about five days off for I assume per month,

2:10:30.080 --> 2:10:33.640
<v Speaker 2>just for the odd bender God love him. Five break

2:10:33.720 --> 2:10:36.400
<v Speaker 2>days built in essentially, I guess if he was too

2:10:36.480 --> 2:10:39.200
<v Speaker 2>hungover up to work. It was like it was like

2:10:39.280 --> 2:10:42.200
<v Speaker 2>vacation days. It was rolling over. Anyway, this gets so

2:10:42.280 --> 2:10:45.760
<v Speaker 2>much worse. Yeah, it does bad reviews with the least

2:10:46.040 --> 2:10:48.840
<v Speaker 2>that God and her infinite cruelty had in store for

2:10:48.880 --> 2:10:51.360
<v Speaker 2>Dick York. He was more or less on his back

2:10:51.400 --> 2:10:54.200
<v Speaker 2>for a year due to a combination of prescription prescription

2:10:54.960 --> 2:10:56.800
<v Speaker 2>that's kind of funny word. He was more or less

2:10:56.840 --> 2:10:58.400
<v Speaker 2>on his back for a year due to a combination

2:10:58.480 --> 2:11:01.640
<v Speaker 2>of prescription drug abuse and pain. He dropped pills cold

2:11:01.680 --> 2:11:05.000
<v Speaker 2>turkey in nineteen seventy one, though, which is not generally

2:11:05.040 --> 2:11:09.160
<v Speaker 2>the preferred way to drop anything. I'm told. He moved

2:11:09.160 --> 2:11:11.280
<v Speaker 2>in with his mother to spare his wife the sight

2:11:11.360 --> 2:11:15.880
<v Speaker 2>of his ongoing suffering, describing his withdrawal process to the

2:11:16.040 --> 2:11:18.400
<v Speaker 2>La Times as six months of hell. I had a

2:11:18.400 --> 2:11:21.920
<v Speaker 2>band playing in my head bagpipes night and day. It

2:11:22.040 --> 2:11:24.280
<v Speaker 2>just went on and on and on and on and on.

2:11:24.640 --> 2:11:26.920
<v Speaker 2>The fans whisper to you, and the walls whisper to you.

2:11:26.960 --> 2:11:29.160
<v Speaker 2>And you look at the television and sometimes it flashes

2:11:29.160 --> 2:11:30.760
<v Speaker 2>in a certain way that sends you into a fit,

2:11:30.840 --> 2:11:32.880
<v Speaker 2>and you know that your wife has put her hand

2:11:32.880 --> 2:11:34.560
<v Speaker 2>in your mouth so you won't bite off your tongue.

2:11:35.000 --> 2:11:37.640
<v Speaker 2>You can't sleep, you hallucinate. I used to make a

2:11:37.640 --> 2:11:39.360
<v Speaker 2>tape recording of rain so I could listen to the

2:11:39.440 --> 2:11:41.280
<v Speaker 2>rain lying in bed at night, to drown out those

2:11:41.360 --> 2:11:44.480
<v Speaker 2>damned bagpipes. That sounds like hell on earth. I love

2:11:44.480 --> 2:11:48.960
<v Speaker 2>the Scottish. I love bagpipes, but a tattoo, I gotta say, man,

2:11:49.080 --> 2:11:51.040
<v Speaker 2>I was pretty goddamn sick of them after like two

2:11:51.280 --> 2:11:57.560
<v Speaker 2>days in Scotland. I can't image image of you in Scotland.

2:11:58.000 --> 2:11:59.880
<v Speaker 2>I hadn't no idea you've ever gone to Scotland. That's

2:12:00.040 --> 2:12:03.000
<v Speaker 2>that's pretty hilarious to me. For some reason. H Glasgow

2:12:03.000 --> 2:12:04.800
<v Speaker 2>and Edinburgh was part of like a cruise around the

2:12:04.880 --> 2:12:07.520
<v Speaker 2>northern UK. Whoa, it seems like something I'd be into.

2:12:08.800 --> 2:12:11.000
<v Speaker 2>It was fun. I just mostly that's where I really

2:12:11.000 --> 2:12:13.600
<v Speaker 2>fell in love with Ireland. I didn't know that. Oh

2:12:13.720 --> 2:12:17.120
<v Speaker 2>so yeah, I couldn't drink though. That was I could

2:12:17.200 --> 2:12:18.960
<v Speaker 2>drink there, but I couldn't drink on the boat. That

2:12:19.040 --> 2:12:24.240
<v Speaker 2>was the drag. Anyway. That is a truly horrific withdrawal story.

2:12:24.360 --> 2:12:28.400
<v Speaker 2>But once again things got worse. Yeah. After that, York

2:12:28.400 --> 2:12:32.040
<v Speaker 2>found himself relieved when the hallucinations stopped, but then the

2:12:32.160 --> 2:12:36.160
<v Speaker 2>ordinary pain returned. He was rendered unable to act beyond

2:12:36.160 --> 2:12:38.840
<v Speaker 2>small bit parts because his teeth had rotted out due

2:12:38.880 --> 2:12:42.000
<v Speaker 2>to his drug abuse, and with limited residuals from bewitched,

2:12:42.240 --> 2:12:44.480
<v Speaker 2>York took his savings and bought an apartment building in

2:12:44.560 --> 2:12:46.760
<v Speaker 2>West Covina. The plan was to live out the rest

2:12:46.760 --> 2:12:48.880
<v Speaker 2>of his days there, but it didn't quite happen that way,

2:12:49.640 --> 2:12:53.160
<v Speaker 2>because when tenants had difficulty paying their rent, York refused

2:12:53.160 --> 2:12:57.080
<v Speaker 2>to evict them, seemingly recalling the similar circumstances of his

2:12:57.120 --> 2:13:00.240
<v Speaker 2>own youth. This caused him, however, to fall behind on

2:13:00.280 --> 2:13:03.680
<v Speaker 2>his mortgage payments, and the bank foreclosed. York and his

2:13:03.760 --> 2:13:06.640
<v Speaker 2>wife ended up cleaning units in the building they once

2:13:06.760 --> 2:13:09.920
<v Speaker 2>owned in order to make ends meet, and by nineteen

2:13:09.960 --> 2:13:12.720
<v Speaker 2>seventy six they were living on welfare checks. Three packa

2:13:12.800 --> 2:13:17.200
<v Speaker 2>day smoker, York developed emphysema started wearing an oxygen canister.

2:13:18.320 --> 2:13:20.440
<v Speaker 2>When his wife's father died, they flew home to the

2:13:20.440 --> 2:13:23.760
<v Speaker 2>small town of Rockford, Michigan, and while there, he collapsed

2:13:23.800 --> 2:13:25.560
<v Speaker 2>in the yard of his in law's home due to

2:13:25.560 --> 2:13:30.080
<v Speaker 2>his emphysema. York never returned to California, instead moved into

2:13:30.080 --> 2:13:32.640
<v Speaker 2>the home that his father in law had recently vacated

2:13:32.760 --> 2:13:35.600
<v Speaker 2>after dying. And it was there in this tiny red

2:13:35.640 --> 2:13:40.080
<v Speaker 2>bungalow that bedridden slowly dying of emphysema and surviving on

2:13:40.160 --> 2:13:41.960
<v Speaker 2>six hundred and fifty dollars a month from the Screen

2:13:42.000 --> 2:13:45.960
<v Speaker 2>Actors Guild, that York embarked on his later life career

2:13:46.200 --> 2:13:50.879
<v Speaker 2>end of life career as just a saint. He started.

2:13:51.240 --> 2:13:53.600
<v Speaker 2>It started with a friend asking him to record an

2:13:53.680 --> 2:13:56.720
<v Speaker 2>inspirational message for a young girl who was comatosed, and

2:13:56.840 --> 2:13:58.960
<v Speaker 2>gradually he started doing more and more of these tapes

2:13:59.000 --> 2:14:02.560
<v Speaker 2>for others who were home. This eventually blossomed into a

2:14:02.600 --> 2:14:05.680
<v Speaker 2>full scale crusade to help the homeless, which was a

2:14:05.760 --> 2:14:08.560
<v Speaker 2>cause near and dear to his heart given his impoverished upbringing.

2:14:08.640 --> 2:14:12.560
<v Speaker 2>During the Great Depression, York found an organization called Acting

2:14:12.600 --> 2:14:16.120
<v Speaker 2>for Life, which he ran from his living room, calling politicians,

2:14:16.160 --> 2:14:19.520
<v Speaker 2>business people, and the general public to contribute supplies, money,

2:14:19.520 --> 2:14:22.440
<v Speaker 2>and sleeping bags. He even tried to pressure Congress to

2:14:22.520 --> 2:14:26.520
<v Speaker 2>convert dozens of military bases recently scheduled for abandonment by

2:14:26.520 --> 2:14:30.960
<v Speaker 2>a federal commission into homeless shelters. At one point, he

2:14:31.040 --> 2:14:34.000
<v Speaker 2>was also active in trying to save a whale trapped

2:14:34.080 --> 2:14:38.680
<v Speaker 2>in ice. I'm just now learning. Despite the circumstances of

2:14:38.680 --> 2:14:42.520
<v Speaker 2>his life, York preached optimism. I've been blessed, he told

2:14:42.520 --> 2:14:45.640
<v Speaker 2>a reporter. I have no complaints. I've been surrounded by

2:14:45.680 --> 2:14:48.400
<v Speaker 2>people in radio, on stage, and in motion pictures and

2:14:48.440 --> 2:14:51.000
<v Speaker 2>television who love me. The things that have gone wrong

2:14:51.040 --> 2:14:54.400
<v Speaker 2>have simply been physical things. And he told another one

2:14:54.520 --> 2:14:56.280
<v Speaker 2>in what is a quote that will haunt me for

2:14:56.320 --> 2:14:59.240
<v Speaker 2>the rest of my days? I feel wonderful. It's just

2:14:59.280 --> 2:15:03.360
<v Speaker 2>my body that's dying. In nineteen eighty nine, People magazine

2:15:03.360 --> 2:15:05.960
<v Speaker 2>did a big profile on him, and we're just going

2:15:06.000 --> 2:15:08.320
<v Speaker 2>to quote it in full because we love to see

2:15:08.320 --> 2:15:12.400
<v Speaker 2>you suffer. A few miles outside Grand Rapids mission and

2:15:12.400 --> 2:15:14.880
<v Speaker 2>I put on my podcast or voice for it. A

2:15:14.920 --> 2:15:17.640
<v Speaker 2>few miles outside Grand Rapids, Michigan, stands a small red

2:15:17.680 --> 2:15:20.720
<v Speaker 2>house with a flat roof. Inside the cramped living room,

2:15:20.840 --> 2:15:23.600
<v Speaker 2>a man dressed in a bathrobe, slippers, and knee socks

2:15:23.640 --> 2:15:27.120
<v Speaker 2>talks animatedly while a hose feeds oxygen to his depleted lungs.

2:15:28.080 --> 2:15:31.200
<v Speaker 2>His tall, once robust frame is now fragile, the result

2:15:31.200 --> 2:15:34.800
<v Speaker 2>of a degenerating spine. When he tries to walk and

2:15:34.840 --> 2:15:38.680
<v Speaker 2>Fisima leaves him breathless after three steps. But when he speaks,

2:15:38.840 --> 2:15:41.680
<v Speaker 2>it is with a clear, strong, and very familiar voice,

2:15:42.160 --> 2:15:45.080
<v Speaker 2>the voice of Dick York, who played Darren Stevens, a

2:15:45.200 --> 2:15:48.440
<v Speaker 2>mortal married to a witch on the popular sixties sitcom Bewitched.

2:15:49.080 --> 2:15:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Reports are I'm dying, he says. Tethered to a twenty

2:15:51.960 --> 2:15:57.120
<v Speaker 2>five foot oxygen lifeline, York, sixty, hasn't been outside since July. Physically,

2:15:57.160 --> 2:15:59.400
<v Speaker 2>his world, which once included a six figure income in

2:15:59.440 --> 2:16:01.960
<v Speaker 2>a house in the Hallwood Hills, has been reduced largely

2:16:02.040 --> 2:16:05.160
<v Speaker 2>to this green walled room. And yet, after a twenty

2:16:05.240 --> 2:16:07.880
<v Speaker 2>year downslide during which he battled an addiction to painkillers,

2:16:08.120 --> 2:16:10.160
<v Speaker 2>saw the bank foreclothes in the apartment building that was

2:16:10.160 --> 2:16:12.920
<v Speaker 2>his only asset, and ended up living on welfare, York

2:16:13.000 --> 2:16:14.920
<v Speaker 2>is filled by the boundless energy of a man with

2:16:14.960 --> 2:16:18.680
<v Speaker 2>a cause. Encouraged by Joan, his wife of thirty seven years,

2:16:19.360 --> 2:16:22.920
<v Speaker 2>and using his second lifeline, the phone, York has worked

2:16:22.960 --> 2:16:25.880
<v Speaker 2>furiously to gather aid for the needy. There is no

2:16:25.920 --> 2:16:29.680
<v Speaker 2>program drug addiction homelessness that I would not give whatever

2:16:29.720 --> 2:16:33.120
<v Speaker 2>I can, says York. I'm fortunate I still have my voice.

2:16:33.600 --> 2:16:36.119
<v Speaker 2>He continued, I must be crazy to think that one

2:16:36.120 --> 2:16:37.800
<v Speaker 2>guy with a hose up his nose, living on a

2:16:37.800 --> 2:16:39.600
<v Speaker 2>six hundred and fifty dollars a month pension in this

2:16:39.640 --> 2:16:42.080
<v Speaker 2>little house in Michigan can make a difference, says Yorke,

2:16:42.280 --> 2:16:47.560
<v Speaker 2>trying to laugh. But you know I'm not crazy. As evidence,

2:16:47.640 --> 2:16:50.120
<v Speaker 2>he describes the three hundred sleeping bags he rounded up

2:16:50.120 --> 2:16:52.880
<v Speaker 2>for the homeless in Chicago and Detroit, the five thousand

2:16:52.959 --> 2:16:55.520
<v Speaker 2>cans of grapefruitus he helped deliver to the Dwelling Place

2:16:55.560 --> 2:16:58.680
<v Speaker 2>Project for the Homeless and Grand Rapids, the twelve thousand

2:16:58.680 --> 2:17:02.360
<v Speaker 2>surplus Navy jackets he had to shelters in Chicago. He

2:17:02.480 --> 2:17:06.000
<v Speaker 2>is also content, say the Yorks. There's no difference in

2:17:06.040 --> 2:17:08.480
<v Speaker 2>how things are today from when we were in Hollywood,

2:17:08.520 --> 2:17:11.360
<v Speaker 2>says Joan. It's all been thrilling and it still is.

2:17:12.080 --> 2:17:14.480
<v Speaker 2>They say, the show goes on, it may just be

2:17:14.520 --> 2:17:20.160
<v Speaker 2>a different performance. Ouch though their kids have scattered, Dick

2:17:20.200 --> 2:17:23.040
<v Speaker 2>says he feels the warmth of their support. My dad

2:17:23.040 --> 2:17:25.600
<v Speaker 2>helped people his whole life, says son Matthew, who now

2:17:25.680 --> 2:17:28.920
<v Speaker 2>lives in Covina, California. I wouldn't expect anything else from him.

2:17:29.840 --> 2:17:32.880
<v Speaker 2>Looking back, Matthew adds, our poorest time financially was our

2:17:32.959 --> 2:17:38.120
<v Speaker 2>richest in love. I don't love things, Dick explains, a

2:17:38.200 --> 2:17:41.920
<v Speaker 2>flower the sky people, they're different, but I don't have

2:17:41.959 --> 2:17:45.640
<v Speaker 2>strong ties to my grandmother's teacup, or to anyone else's teacups,

2:17:45.680 --> 2:17:48.279
<v Speaker 2>or blankets or boots, all the worldly goods he passes

2:17:48.320 --> 2:17:50.520
<v Speaker 2>on to the needy. I don't know how I do it,

2:17:50.560 --> 2:17:54.000
<v Speaker 2>he admits, it just gets done. I have one rule.

2:17:54.360 --> 2:17:56.200
<v Speaker 2>Don't give me anything you don't want me to give away.

2:17:57.760 --> 2:18:00.240
<v Speaker 2>Three years after that profile was published, Dick York died

2:18:00.240 --> 2:18:06.680
<v Speaker 2>of emphysema in February of nineteen ninety two. Jesus Christ Jordan.

2:18:07.160 --> 2:18:11.480
<v Speaker 1>The only time we broke was mister Roger's episode, I believe.

2:18:11.520 --> 2:18:15.760
<v Speaker 1>But this is a close second. Yes, that's a rough one.

2:18:16.240 --> 2:18:19.080
<v Speaker 2>The line from like a deposed actress. They say the

2:18:19.120 --> 2:18:22.080
<v Speaker 2>show must go on, but maybe it's just a different

2:18:22.080 --> 2:18:26.640
<v Speaker 2>performance that is horrifying, like that should have been in

2:18:26.680 --> 2:18:28.200
<v Speaker 2>Sunset Boulevard.

2:18:28.600 --> 2:18:31.439
<v Speaker 1>Whoof which I saw on Broadway and it was incredible.

2:18:31.480 --> 2:18:33.000
<v Speaker 1>By the way, is the best thing I've ever seen

2:18:33.040 --> 2:18:34.039
<v Speaker 1>on Broadway.

2:18:33.840 --> 2:18:37.400
<v Speaker 2>Pussycat Doll, The Whole Share Singer, and Eddie Murphy Baby.

2:18:37.400 --> 2:18:42.240
<v Speaker 1>Mama, No, She's not an Eddie Murphy baby. That's racist,

2:18:43.240 --> 2:18:46.880
<v Speaker 1>just wrong, right, I cut that. All right, Let's bring this,

2:18:46.959 --> 2:18:51.600
<v Speaker 1>let's land this plane. Man one am for you. The

2:18:51.760 --> 2:18:54.000
<v Speaker 1>Witch dropped from number eleven in the ratings said number

2:18:54.000 --> 2:18:57.120
<v Speaker 1>twenty four in nineteen seventy. Some of this was a

2:18:57.160 --> 2:18:59.600
<v Speaker 1>negative response to Dick Sergeant, but it was also a

2:18:59.640 --> 2:19:01.199
<v Speaker 1>result of changing tastes.

2:19:01.959 --> 2:19:03.520
<v Speaker 2>Shows like All in the Family were.

2:19:03.360 --> 2:19:05.400
<v Speaker 1>Coming along, paving the way for a new type of

2:19:05.400 --> 2:19:09.400
<v Speaker 1>sitcom that reflected reality instead of a fantastical, idealized family

2:19:09.400 --> 2:19:11.959
<v Speaker 1>that didn't really exist. Bewitch was the last of the

2:19:11.959 --> 2:19:14.959
<v Speaker 1>so called fantasy sitcoms that premiered in the mid sixties,

2:19:15.360 --> 2:19:17.840
<v Speaker 1>the Adams Family and the Monsters, which only lasted two

2:19:17.920 --> 2:19:20.880
<v Speaker 1>years from sixty four to sixty six, and Odrew of Genie,

2:19:20.879 --> 2:19:25.000
<v Speaker 1>which wrapped in nineteen seventy. Also after eight years, everyone

2:19:25.000 --> 2:19:28.520
<v Speaker 1>associated with Bewitched was kind of getting tired of it.

2:19:29.080 --> 2:19:32.680
<v Speaker 1>The writers had resorted to recycling premises in even repeating

2:19:32.760 --> 2:19:35.640
<v Speaker 1>much of the same dialogue. They started doing this with

2:19:35.680 --> 2:19:37.879
<v Speaker 1>episodes that were filmed in black and white before the

2:19:37.920 --> 2:19:40.040
<v Speaker 1>show was shot in color in the third season, so

2:19:40.080 --> 2:19:42.280
<v Speaker 1>I think they kind of viewed it as like remakes

2:19:42.360 --> 2:19:45.840
<v Speaker 1>with you know, beautiful technicolor, and then once Dick Sargent

2:19:45.920 --> 2:19:48.560
<v Speaker 1>into the picture, there was all the more reason to

2:19:48.600 --> 2:19:51.800
<v Speaker 1>have remix because now they got a whole new actor. Also,

2:19:51.879 --> 2:19:53.480
<v Speaker 1>this was back in the era when they crammed like

2:19:53.520 --> 2:19:55.440
<v Speaker 1>thirty episodes into a season, which.

2:19:55.280 --> 2:19:56.320
<v Speaker 2>Is kind of insane.

2:19:57.240 --> 2:19:59.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so it kind of makes sense that they were

2:19:59.360 --> 2:20:02.080
<v Speaker 1>like trying to cut corners. But no one was more

2:20:02.080 --> 2:20:05.720
<v Speaker 1>tired of Bewitched than Elizabeth Montgomery. As were previously mentioned,

2:20:05.720 --> 2:20:07.879
<v Speaker 1>she tried to quit the show after season five, but

2:20:07.959 --> 2:20:11.720
<v Speaker 1>ABC offered her the world, and so she signed on

2:20:11.800 --> 2:20:13.320
<v Speaker 1>for another five seasons.

2:20:14.120 --> 2:20:16.279
<v Speaker 2>But she appeared visibly bored.

2:20:15.959 --> 2:20:19.080
<v Speaker 1>In these later episodes, which is kind of hilarious to watch.

2:20:19.600 --> 2:20:22.199
<v Speaker 1>Bewitched historian Yes there is such a thing, and author

2:20:22.240 --> 2:20:25.879
<v Speaker 1>Herbie Pilato is quoted as saying Elizabeth was tired of

2:20:25.920 --> 2:20:28.480
<v Speaker 1>Bewitched and tried to quit the fifth season, but ABC

2:20:28.560 --> 2:20:31.360
<v Speaker 1>offered hers so much money she couldn't refuse. But you

2:20:31.360 --> 2:20:33.600
<v Speaker 1>can see by the final season that she's plodding through

2:20:33.640 --> 2:20:37.520
<v Speaker 1>each episode brawless as a nod the Women's liberation and

2:20:37.600 --> 2:20:41.560
<v Speaker 1>didn't want to be there. In addition to being creatively unfulfilling,

2:20:41.680 --> 2:20:44.200
<v Speaker 1>the set was tense because her relationship with husband William

2:20:44.200 --> 2:20:48.680
<v Speaker 1>Asher was deteriorating. He apparently slept around a lot, and

2:20:48.720 --> 2:20:51.920
<v Speaker 1>Elizabeth started an affair with the show's director, Richard Michaels,

2:20:52.000 --> 2:20:57.680
<v Speaker 1>which that's a risky, risky move to Minefield. Husban produced

2:20:57.680 --> 2:20:59.959
<v Speaker 1>the show having an affair with the director of the show,

2:21:00.000 --> 2:21:04.440
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, it's like a French farce. By the time

2:21:04.520 --> 2:21:06.760
<v Speaker 1>the last season of Bewitch wrapped in nineteen seventy two,

2:21:06.760 --> 2:21:09.920
<v Speaker 1>there was still two years on the contract, but Sdbuwish

2:21:10.000 --> 2:21:13.720
<v Speaker 1>historian Harvey Palato says everyone thinks ABC canceled the show

2:21:13.760 --> 2:21:16.880
<v Speaker 1>because of low ratings, but Elizabeth Montgomery canceled the show.

2:21:17.520 --> 2:21:20.160
<v Speaker 1>When the final episode was broadcast on March twenty fifth,

2:21:20.280 --> 2:21:23.760
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy two, it had fallen to number seventy two

2:21:23.840 --> 2:21:27.200
<v Speaker 1>in the ratings. All concerned decided it was time to

2:21:27.200 --> 2:21:30.040
<v Speaker 1>move on after eight years and two hundred and fifty

2:21:30.080 --> 2:21:33.640
<v Speaker 1>four episodes. To make up for the final two years

2:21:33.640 --> 2:21:36.800
<v Speaker 1>on the contract, Bill Asher offered up a sitcom starring

2:21:36.840 --> 2:21:40.000
<v Speaker 1>Paul lynd my beloved Paul Lynde with the less than

2:21:40.040 --> 2:21:43.039
<v Speaker 1>imaginative title The Paul Lynn Show, and they even used

2:21:43.080 --> 2:21:44.560
<v Speaker 1>some of the same sets and a lot of the

2:21:44.600 --> 2:21:47.640
<v Speaker 1>same bit players from Bewitched. The show made a play

2:21:47.720 --> 2:21:50.000
<v Speaker 1>for social relevance with an all in the family style

2:21:50.120 --> 2:21:53.400
<v Speaker 1>generation gap plot where Lynn's daughter and her slacker husband

2:21:53.480 --> 2:21:57.080
<v Speaker 1>moved him with Paul moved him with lynd But they

2:21:57.160 --> 2:22:00.320
<v Speaker 1>lacked any discussion of topical issues, and so it just

2:22:00.400 --> 2:22:03.520
<v Speaker 1>didn't have any degree of social realism and it really

2:22:03.800 --> 2:22:04.959
<v Speaker 1>tanked when it premiered.

2:22:05.000 --> 2:22:06.760
<v Speaker 2>It's like one of the great TV flops.

2:22:07.360 --> 2:22:10.640
<v Speaker 1>A lot of it is because Paul's stick kind of

2:22:10.640 --> 2:22:13.400
<v Speaker 1>started grading on people, like, you know, a little paul

2:22:13.480 --> 2:22:14.480
<v Speaker 1>In goes a long.

2:22:14.320 --> 2:22:16.000
<v Speaker 2>Way, Ain't that the truth? Brother.

2:22:16.280 --> 2:22:19.560
<v Speaker 1>He couldn't anchor a series, so it was canceled after

2:22:19.560 --> 2:22:20.320
<v Speaker 1>its first season.

2:22:20.560 --> 2:22:23.160
<v Speaker 2>Elizabeth Montgomery, for her part, wanted to get as far

2:22:23.200 --> 2:22:26.880
<v Speaker 2>away from Samantha Stevens as was humanly possible, and thus

2:22:27.040 --> 2:22:30.400
<v Speaker 2>she became the Queen of TV movies, ultimately racking up

2:22:30.400 --> 2:22:33.800
<v Speaker 2>eight Emmy nominations. She played a sexual assault victim in

2:22:33.840 --> 2:22:37.199
<v Speaker 2>the unimaginably titled A Case of Rape and an axe

2:22:37.280 --> 2:22:40.320
<v Speaker 2>killer in the Legend of Lizzie Borden, which was fitting

2:22:40.320 --> 2:22:43.080
<v Speaker 2>because it was later revealed that she was distantly related

2:22:43.120 --> 2:22:46.520
<v Speaker 2>to Lizzie bordon That's cool. Yeah. She also appeared in

2:22:46.560 --> 2:22:50.000
<v Speaker 2>the police drama alongside OJ Simpson as two detectives who

2:22:50.080 --> 2:22:53.240
<v Speaker 2>are romantically involved, this one with the slightly better title

2:22:53.520 --> 2:22:56.600
<v Speaker 2>A Killing Affair, OJ Simpson, Yeah, that guy got away

2:22:56.640 --> 2:22:59.720
<v Speaker 2>with murder. Funnily enough, she had a gallery wall filled

2:22:59.720 --> 2:23:02.600
<v Speaker 2>with from all of her movies, but none from Bewitched.

2:23:02.760 --> 2:23:04.960
<v Speaker 2>Although she was very kind to fans and always answered

2:23:05.000 --> 2:23:08.720
<v Speaker 2>her fan mail personally, Elizabeth Montgomery was by all accounts,

2:23:08.760 --> 2:23:12.000
<v Speaker 2>a pretty neat lady. Aside from her acting, she worked

2:23:12.000 --> 2:23:14.640
<v Speaker 2>tirelessly for animal rights causes and used her stature to

2:23:14.640 --> 2:23:16.960
<v Speaker 2>take a stand for feminist platforms like the Equal Rights

2:23:17.000 --> 2:23:19.879
<v Speaker 2>Amendment and reproductive rights. She was also one of the

2:23:19.920 --> 2:23:23.080
<v Speaker 2>first stars to support AIDS victims and campaigned for gay rights,

2:23:23.080 --> 2:23:26.640
<v Speaker 2>which many in the LGBT community felt was an undercurrent

2:23:26.720 --> 2:23:29.880
<v Speaker 2>of the show. In a nineteen ninety two interview, Montgomery

2:23:29.879 --> 2:23:32.959
<v Speaker 2>was asked if Bewitched was an allegory about closeted homosexuality.

2:23:33.400 --> 2:23:35.720
<v Speaker 2>She answered, don't think that didn't enter our minds. At

2:23:35.760 --> 2:23:38.320
<v Speaker 2>the time. We talked about it on the set that

2:23:38.440 --> 2:23:40.440
<v Speaker 2>this was about people not being allowed to be who

2:23:40.440 --> 2:23:43.080
<v Speaker 2>they really are. If you think about it, Bewitched is

2:23:43.080 --> 2:23:45.879
<v Speaker 2>about repression in general and all the frustration in trouble

2:23:45.920 --> 2:23:49.040
<v Speaker 2>it can cause. She was co grand Marshal for the

2:23:49.120 --> 2:23:52.000
<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety two Gay Pride Parade in Los Angeles, alongside

2:23:52.040 --> 2:23:56.200
<v Speaker 2>her former co star, a newly out Dick Sergeant. When

2:23:56.240 --> 2:24:00.560
<v Speaker 2>asked why, she offered the possibly apocryphal reply, I did

2:24:00.600 --> 2:24:05.120
<v Speaker 2>it for the love of Dick, well for applause.

2:24:06.840 --> 2:24:10.280
<v Speaker 1>Elizabeth Montgomery was filming Deadline for Murder in the spring

2:24:10.360 --> 2:24:12.680
<v Speaker 1>of nineteen ninety five when she started to feel sick.

2:24:13.440 --> 2:24:15.440
<v Speaker 1>She assumed it was just the flu and waited until

2:24:15.440 --> 2:24:18.440
<v Speaker 1>shooting Rap to go to the doctor's. It turned out

2:24:18.520 --> 2:24:22.199
<v Speaker 1>that it was colon cancer. Ope, I don't have colon cancer.

2:24:24.520 --> 2:24:29.440
<v Speaker 2>But coughs into a napkin spotted with blood. Yeah.

2:24:29.440 --> 2:24:32.520
<v Speaker 1>I don't really understand how the symptoms relate, but by

2:24:32.560 --> 2:24:35.640
<v Speaker 1>this point the disease was inop. I sometimes I have

2:24:35.640 --> 2:24:37.959
<v Speaker 1>trouble like regulating Mike cadence of.

2:24:38.160 --> 2:24:39.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

2:24:39.520 --> 2:24:42.120
<v Speaker 1>By this point, the disease was inoperable, and she opted

2:24:42.120 --> 2:24:45.199
<v Speaker 1>to return home to her twenty sixth room Beverly Hills Mansion,

2:24:45.520 --> 2:24:47.680
<v Speaker 1>where she jokingly requested a Pina.

2:24:47.400 --> 2:24:49.840
<v Speaker 2>Colada IV drip. Funny Lady.

2:24:50.600 --> 2:24:53.200
<v Speaker 1>She sent her family away from her deathbed, preferring the

2:24:53.240 --> 2:24:57.760
<v Speaker 1>dialge just six weeks after the diagnosis. She didn't want

2:24:57.760 --> 2:25:00.440
<v Speaker 1>anyone to see her that way, recalled ex husband William Masher,

2:25:00.520 --> 2:25:04.640
<v Speaker 1>with whom she remained friends. Then she slipped away, and

2:25:04.680 --> 2:25:07.720
<v Speaker 1>Asher reportedly deeply regretted his affairs by the end of

2:25:07.760 --> 2:25:10.600
<v Speaker 1>his life and tearfully admitted to his friends, it was

2:25:10.640 --> 2:25:12.920
<v Speaker 1>all my fault that we got divorced, and he never

2:25:12.959 --> 2:25:19.680
<v Speaker 1>really got over her sad Yes, Montgomery was actually married

2:25:19.680 --> 2:25:22.560
<v Speaker 1>at the time of her death to former Falcon Crest

2:25:22.600 --> 2:25:26.440
<v Speaker 1>star Robert Foxworth. They were together for twenty years before

2:25:26.440 --> 2:25:29.320
<v Speaker 1>they got married just eighteen months before she died, but

2:25:29.400 --> 2:25:31.880
<v Speaker 1>she was such a private person that most obits said

2:25:31.920 --> 2:25:34.160
<v Speaker 1>she was single, and they got lots of other things

2:25:34.200 --> 2:25:36.600
<v Speaker 1>wrong too. They listed her age as fifty seven rather

2:25:36.640 --> 2:25:40.320
<v Speaker 1>than sixty two and listed her name as Elizabeth A. Montgomery,

2:25:40.400 --> 2:25:43.960
<v Speaker 1>despite the fact that her actual middle name was Victoria,

2:25:44.120 --> 2:25:46.680
<v Speaker 1>as I mentioned earlier. Her final work to be aired

2:25:46.840 --> 2:25:50.400
<v Speaker 1>was a voiceover part as a barmaid on Your Beloved

2:25:50.720 --> 2:25:56.200
<v Speaker 1>Batman the animated series. Television executives are more of the

2:25:56.240 --> 2:25:59.400
<v Speaker 1>content to continue making a buck off the cooling corpse

2:25:59.720 --> 2:26:03.320
<v Speaker 1>of Bewitched. In nineteen seventy seven, just five years after

2:26:03.320 --> 2:26:05.879
<v Speaker 1>Bewitched went off the air, they launched the spin off

2:26:06.400 --> 2:26:10.360
<v Speaker 1>Tabitha The Stars showed Lisa Hartman as Tabitha, the daughter

2:26:10.360 --> 2:26:13.960
<v Speaker 1>of Samantha and Darren, who was also a witch. In reality,

2:26:14.080 --> 2:26:16.480
<v Speaker 1>with the timeline, Tabitha would have been about twelve, but

2:26:16.520 --> 2:26:18.000
<v Speaker 1>the series aged her up to her.

2:26:17.879 --> 2:26:24.120
<v Speaker 2>Early twenties to make it more appealing sexy. Yeah, I

2:26:24.160 --> 2:26:24.920
<v Speaker 2>don't know.

2:26:26.120 --> 2:26:29.080
<v Speaker 1>I guess there's more to do with a adult actress

2:26:29.080 --> 2:26:30.520
<v Speaker 1>than a teenage character.

2:26:30.600 --> 2:26:31.000
<v Speaker 2>I don't know.

2:26:31.400 --> 2:26:35.119
<v Speaker 1>Moving on, Tabitha's TV parents never guest starred on the show.

2:26:35.160 --> 2:26:36.800
<v Speaker 1>It's just probably for the best because it kind of

2:26:36.800 --> 2:26:37.600
<v Speaker 1>looks terrible and.

2:26:37.560 --> 2:26:39.400
<v Speaker 2>It lasted only a year. I think.

2:26:39.800 --> 2:26:43.000
<v Speaker 1>Over the ensuing decades, multiple networks have attempted to reanimate

2:26:43.040 --> 2:26:46.600
<v Speaker 1>the corpse of Bewitched. In twenty eleven, CBS ordered a

2:26:46.640 --> 2:26:49.279
<v Speaker 1>script for a be Witch remake from writer Mark Lawrence

2:26:49.280 --> 2:26:52.600
<v Speaker 1>and producers Douglas Wick and Lucy Fisher, the married duo

2:26:52.640 --> 2:26:54.960
<v Speaker 1>who also produced the two thousand and five film remake,

2:26:55.640 --> 2:26:59.959
<v Speaker 1>which we will pointedly not speak about. In twenty four

2:27:00.040 --> 2:27:02.640
<v Speaker 1>Routine NBC committed to a follow up series that would

2:27:02.640 --> 2:27:06.120
<v Speaker 1>have followed Samantha's granddaughter, but nothing happened with that, and

2:27:06.200 --> 2:27:09.160
<v Speaker 1>in twenty eighteen Blackish creator Can You Barrass salto be

2:27:09.240 --> 2:27:12.880
<v Speaker 1>Wished revamp? Mercifully, none of these have come the pass,

2:27:13.240 --> 2:27:15.960
<v Speaker 1>although Sony apparently has an animated series in the works

2:27:16.240 --> 2:27:19.959
<v Speaker 1>which focuses on Tabitha as a teenager, which sounds like

2:27:20.040 --> 2:27:21.880
<v Speaker 1>bootleg Sabrina the teenage Witch.

2:27:22.080 --> 2:27:22.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah who cares?

2:27:23.160 --> 2:27:27.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah no, yeah, well it is the Witching Hour on

2:27:27.520 --> 2:27:31.000
<v Speaker 1>the East Coast. I am sick and jet lagged and tired.

2:27:31.040 --> 2:27:34.320
<v Speaker 1>We have done twenty four pages on this, folks. I

2:27:34.360 --> 2:27:37.800
<v Speaker 1>have nothing left to say about Bewitched, so higl Instead,

2:27:37.840 --> 2:27:40.360
<v Speaker 1>before we sign off, let's discuss who could defeat God?

2:27:40.640 --> 2:27:42.080
<v Speaker 1>Genie or Samantha.

2:27:41.840 --> 2:27:45.520
<v Speaker 2>Tweeted us, using the hashtag which nineteen sixty sitcom Idol

2:27:45.600 --> 2:27:52.600
<v Speaker 2>Supernatural Idol Supernatural Idol could find and kill God Lily Munster. No, no, no,

2:27:52.680 --> 2:27:56.880
<v Speaker 2>we got a limited the Geni or Samantha Mortisia Adams. Yeah,

2:27:57.600 --> 2:28:01.680
<v Speaker 2>the car and my mother of the car M M.

2:28:02.200 --> 2:28:11.800
<v Speaker 2>Gilligan by accident. Uh, the racist boss from Bewitched. God

2:28:11.840 --> 2:28:16.120
<v Speaker 2>has turned black for an episode and so furious mister

2:28:16.160 --> 2:28:20.039
<v Speaker 2>Brockway I believe his name was killed God using a

2:28:20.040 --> 2:28:24.680
<v Speaker 2>suit of armor forged by the KKK. I just gave

2:28:24.760 --> 2:28:28.280
<v Speaker 2>so many Southern people ideas for fanfic. I can really

2:28:28.320 --> 2:28:31.600
<v Speaker 2>apologize for that well in this episode that veered from

2:28:31.720 --> 2:28:33.720
<v Speaker 2>some of our I hope you will, folks all have

2:28:33.720 --> 2:28:36.560
<v Speaker 2>fun listening to this episode, which sworned to new heights

2:28:36.600 --> 2:28:41.400
<v Speaker 2>of distracted googling and plunge to new depths of absolute

2:28:41.480 --> 2:28:46.320
<v Speaker 2>human suffering. Thanks for listening. Has been too much information.

2:28:47.240 --> 2:28:50.280
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what I'm doing here, and I'm Alex Hagel,

2:28:50.720 --> 2:28:59.520
<v Speaker 2>I'm Jordan Talk. We'll catch you next time. Too Much

2:28:59.560 --> 2:29:03.359
<v Speaker 2>Information was a production of iHeartRadio. The show's executive producers

2:29:03.360 --> 2:29:06.840
<v Speaker 2>are Noel Brown and Jordan Runtog. The show's supervising producer

2:29:06.920 --> 2:29:10.160
<v Speaker 2>is Michael Alder June. The show was researched, written and

2:29:10.240 --> 2:29:12.279
<v Speaker 2>hosted by Jordan Runtog and Alex.

2:29:12.040 --> 2:29:14.959
<v Speaker 1>Heigel, with original music by Seth Applebaum and the Ghost

2:29:15.040 --> 2:29:15.760
<v Speaker 1>Funk Orchestra.

2:29:16.120 --> 2:29:18.120
<v Speaker 2>If you like what you heard, please subscribe and leave

2:29:18.200 --> 2:29:18.720
<v Speaker 2>us a review.

2:29:18.959 --> 2:29:23.320
<v Speaker 1>For more podcasts on iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

2:29:23.520 --> 2:29:25.199
<v Speaker 1>or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.