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Speaker 1: Al Zone Media.

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Speaker 2: Hey everybody, Robert Evans here, and I wanted to let

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Speaker 2: you know this is a compilation episode, So every episode

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Speaker 2: of the week that just happened is here in one

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Speaker 2: convenient and with somewhat less ads package for you to

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Speaker 2: listen to in a long stretch if you want. If

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Speaker 2: you've been listening to the episodes every day this week,

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Speaker 2: there's gotta be nothing new here for you, but you

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Speaker 2: can make your own decisions.

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Speaker 3: Hello, this is Mia from the Future. The whole crew

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Speaker 3: is off this week, so you'll be getting a series

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Speaker 3: of episodes from our past, and this episode in particular,

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Speaker 3: I wanted to rerun for Indigenous People's Day, but it

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Speaker 3: is also from before I came out, So hope you

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Speaker 3: all enjoy and we will be back next week.

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Speaker 4: Welcome to Ick It Up and Here, a podcast that

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Speaker 4: is on the cycle of being sort of okayly introduced.

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Speaker 4: When this episode out, it will be Indigenous People's Day

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Speaker 4: and so to talk about that more. Where we're going

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Speaker 4: to talk to Dalia Killsback, who is a member of

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Speaker 4: the Northern Cheyenne or has a Northern Cheyen tribal citizenship

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Speaker 4: and has studied and worked in federal India Tribal Policy Dahlia. Hello,

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Speaker 4: how are you doing?

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Speaker 5: I'm doing one all. Thank you for inviting me here today.

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Speaker 4: Of course Garrison is also here. Garrison Hello, Hello.

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Speaker 6: I'm currently also doing writing about indigenous stuff, but within

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Speaker 6: the context of Canada, which people should. We'll probably here

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Speaker 6: later this week.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, I guess first thing I wanted to talk

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Speaker 4: about is a little bit is about what Indigenous People's

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Speaker 4: Day is and why it is that and not the

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Speaker 4: other thing.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. So, Indigenous People's Day, as many people know, is

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Speaker 5: replacing I'm going to say it, Chris chrispher Columbus to

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Speaker 5: day that is still like a federal holiday, but multiple

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Speaker 5: cities and states have opted to use Indigenous People's Day instead.

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Speaker 5: And the reasoning for that is achnology. The atrocities that

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Speaker 5: were committed by Christopher Columbus, who first of all, did

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Speaker 5: not discover America, but continue to not only use slavery,

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Speaker 5: but commit different forms of genocide, rape, et cetera, all

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Speaker 5: of these terrible atrocities. And so rather than celebrating somebody

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Speaker 5: like that, Indigenous People's Day has been implemented in order

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Speaker 5: to recognize the people who are actually here first and

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Speaker 5: Indigenous peoples across the America's their histories, cultures, and contributions.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Columbus, real piece of shit, worst Christopher, Like, yeah,

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Speaker 4: it really cannot be overstated how bad that guy was.

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Speaker 4: Even you know, even people in that era who had

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Speaker 4: committed their own genocides like Isabelle and Ferdinand, who you know,

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Speaker 4: expelled the Jews from Spain, where it's like, you know,

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Speaker 4: if once you've reached the sentence expelled the Jews from X,

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Speaker 4: like you're already in the shit list of the worst

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Speaker 4: people in human history.

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Speaker 7: And even they saw.

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Speaker 4: What Columbus was doing, it was like what on earth?

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Speaker 4: Bad bad guy, bad name. Things are going to continue

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Speaker 4: to go badly. And yeah, that was a'n everthing that

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Speaker 4: I wanted to talk about, which is federal Indian policy.

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Speaker 4: And you know, this is an incredibly broad it's an

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Speaker 4: incredibly broad area spanning like three hundred years, So we're

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Speaker 4: not gonna be able to go into like an enormous

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Speaker 4: amount of depth in it, but I think it's important

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Speaker 4: that people have an understanding of, i mean, a just

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Speaker 4: what the US did and how everyone else has had

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Speaker 4: this sort of deal with it, and then also the

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Speaker 4: fact that this is something that changes over time and

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Speaker 4: has has looked different. It's it's been bad in different ways.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and so in talking about federal Indian policy, uh

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Speaker 5: I always like to contextualize it within a larger sort

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Speaker 5: of like euro American like teleology of colonial conquests and

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Speaker 5: then moving on to settler colonialism and where we are

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Speaker 5: with federal Indian policy currently. So how do we connect

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Speaker 5: Christopher Columbus to where we are currently? And this is

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Speaker 5: the history of federal Indian policy and Western legal discourse

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Speaker 5: and how European powers throughout history have defined what it

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Speaker 5: means to be an Indian person and relationship to indigenous

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Speaker 5: people's rights to their own land and to self governance.

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Speaker 5: So when we're looking at the different periods of federal

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Speaker 5: Indian policy prior to their being a United States government,

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Speaker 5: we have the colonial period, which is fourteen ninety two

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Speaker 5: to seventeen seventy six. This is how federal Indian policy

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Speaker 5: legal scholars divide that, and it's really important to kind

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Speaker 5: of give the difference between what is a colonial state

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Speaker 5: versus a settler colonial state when you're talking about not

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Speaker 5: just the United States government, but also the Canadian government

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Speaker 5: and different governments globally. But I want to talk just

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Speaker 5: a little bit about what I mean by the difference

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Speaker 5: between a colonial government and a settler colonial government, because

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Speaker 5: they're tied together. So by a sutler colonial government, I

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Speaker 5: mean what I mean is that it is defined by

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Speaker 5: the de territorialization of indigenous population populations. And so rather

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Speaker 5: than in a colonial government as you had with Christopher

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Speaker 5: Columbus and the Spanish and with the English, et cetera,

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Speaker 5: is rather than a state and sovereignty being conceived as

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Speaker 5: all these resources are going back to the metropoal, all

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Speaker 5: these resources are going back to England or to Spain,

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Speaker 5: et cetera. And colonial occupation is in is conceptualized within

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Speaker 5: this way in set the colonial governments. The colonists come

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Speaker 5: to these lands and stay and they're what they define

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Speaker 5: as sovereignty is within this land that they define now

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Speaker 5: as their own. So and in order for that process

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Speaker 5: to happen, there needs to be different forms of genocide

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Speaker 5: of the indigenous populations. And so that's what we saw

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Speaker 5: with Christopher Columbus and throughout history was just the depletion

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Speaker 5: of a lot of our indigenous populace. And so when

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Speaker 5: I mean about the United States being a setlar colonial state.

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Speaker 5: I mean that this is current and ongoing, and so

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Speaker 5: when we talk about federal Indian policy, federal Indian policy

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Speaker 5: is always in this conversation with what started with Christopher

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Speaker 5: Columbus as the doctrine of discovery. And so that's how

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Speaker 5: we define the colonial period. And feel free to like

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Speaker 5: stop me and ask me questions. Also, I'm just going

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Speaker 5: to try to move quickly because there's a lot.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think we probably should briefly talk about what

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Speaker 4: the doctory discovery is, at least before we get through

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Speaker 4: the Marshall trilogy and stuff, for sure. So what does

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Speaker 4: that actually mean legally?

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Speaker 5: So the it's the discovery of a quote unquote newfound

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Speaker 5: Land by European colonial forces. And the reason why it's

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Speaker 5: called the doctrine of discovery was that indigenous peoples on

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Speaker 5: these lands were deemed unable to govern themselves and they

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Speaker 5: did not know how to utilize their land up to

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Speaker 5: the definition of what the European powers thought land use.

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Speaker 5: Was that indigenous peoples didn't have the same concept of property,

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Speaker 5: and same with their relationship with resources and resource extraction.

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Speaker 5: So when Christopher Columbus and all of these other colonizers

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Speaker 5: conkystic doors came to the quote unquote New Land. They

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Speaker 5: saw all of this rich, plentiful resource and thought to themselves, well,

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Speaker 5: obviously these people don't know what they're doing because there's

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Speaker 5: just so much they have not done anything with it,

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Speaker 5: and we're going to take this back to to ours

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Speaker 5: because obviously their inferior beings and don't know what property is.

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Speaker 5: So legally, the adoption of discovery conveyed legal title to

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Speaker 5: an ownership of American soil to European nations, a title

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Speaker 5: that devolved to the United States, and so this definition

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Speaker 5: is expansive and expansive discovery implies that Native nations have

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Speaker 5: a right to lands as occupants or possessors, but they

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Speaker 5: are incompetent to manage those lands and need a quote

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Speaker 5: unquote benevolent guardian such as a federal government who holds

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Speaker 5: legal title. And so when we're talking about this legal title,

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Speaker 5: it to the United States later on in history after

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Speaker 5: the American Revolution, and so rather than being colonial states

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Speaker 5: as the United States like thirteen original colonies, given the

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Speaker 5: American Revolution and its own constitution and its creation of

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Speaker 5: itself as a nation state, then that turns into a

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Speaker 5: settler colonial government.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think we can, Yeah, we can get

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Speaker 4: to what happens next then, because yeah, yeah, you have

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Speaker 4: this elaborate lab or framework that lets you steal people's

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Speaker 4: land and murder them and then control it. And then

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Speaker 4: the outgrowth of that is this sort of weird event

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Speaker 4: where the colonies go into rebellion and suddenly, yeah, there's

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Speaker 4: not a colony. They're not colonies anymore. They just are

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Speaker 4: the state. And so yeah, what happens next after the

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Speaker 4: sort of formation of the United States.

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Speaker 5: So after the formation of the United States, so we

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Speaker 5: have this period the American Revolution that's all not really

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Speaker 5: dive that into. It is seventeen seventy six to seventeen

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Speaker 5: eighty nine, and it's called the Confederation period. But next

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Speaker 5: we have the Trade and Intercourse Act era, which is

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Speaker 5: from seventeen eighty nine to eighteen thirty five. And so

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Speaker 5: this is defined with the United States Constitution and Congress's

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Speaker 5: exclusive right to regulate trade relations and make leans since

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Speaker 5: land secessions, and enter into treaties with tribes. So this

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Speaker 5: is a treaty making era with the tribes that only

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Speaker 5: the United States federal government is able to and there's

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Speaker 5: a distinction there because there had been a lot of

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Speaker 5: contestation between states and the federal government as to who

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Speaker 5: is going to now deal with these these nations that

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Speaker 5: are within our own settler colonial borders. Whose job is

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Speaker 5: that to solve this issue? So within the United States Constitution,

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Speaker 5: there are three clauses that define the United States' legal

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Speaker 5: relationship to American Indians, and so these are the treaty

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Speaker 5: making clause, the commerce clause, and the property clause. And

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Speaker 5: so this movement from just relying on the doctrine of

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Speaker 5: discovery and treaty making processes between different European powers now

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Speaker 5: is between the United States federal government and tribes. And

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Speaker 5: so what this does is now tribes are located within

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Speaker 5: the United States territory, and this places Indians within the

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Speaker 5: boundaries and jurisdiction of the United States, and now they're

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Speaker 5: a matter of domestic interest.

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Speaker 3: Something at least.

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Speaker 4: It's one of the sort of complicated questions that changes

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Speaker 4: through this whole era, which is about what does sovereignty

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Speaker 4: mean for these tribes and to what extent they even

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Speaker 4: continue to possess it, and how does that even sort

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Speaker 4: of you know, how does that work if when you

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Speaker 4: have this new state that sort of just has his

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Speaker 4: clean control.

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Speaker 5: Here, right, and also during this period, well, well later

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Speaker 5: on when we have sorry jumping ahead of myself, when

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Speaker 5: we have the extermination of the treaty making process, and

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Speaker 5: this completely removes seeing tribes as independent sovereign nations. So

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Speaker 5: I think that we'll kind of get more into that later.

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Speaker 5: But the thing with federal Indian policy is that it's

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Speaker 5: sort of self prophesizing. So as settlers are moving across America,

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Speaker 5: the United States government also has to create these policies

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Speaker 5: in order to legalize these land cessations and movements. And

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Speaker 5: pattern that we do see here throughout history and throughout

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Speaker 5: time is that the United States federal government, as a

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Speaker 5: settler state, is over the rights of over the rights

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Speaker 5: to land and rights of indigenous peoples themselves. You have

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Speaker 5: a priority of the settler state in order to acquire land.

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Speaker 5: So a lot of the reason why later these treaties

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Speaker 5: will be broken, et cetera, is because settlers are moving

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Speaker 5: into these lands and the United States is then breaking

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Speaker 5: these treaties in order to have more more land, more

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Speaker 5: land successions.

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Speaker 8: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the law, the law sort of just following the

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Speaker 4: violence and it just becomes a sort of retroactive justification

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Speaker 4: for yes, just.

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Speaker 5: It's it's a self justifying sort of sovereignty. So this

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Speaker 5: is the Removal period, and what a lot of people

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Speaker 5: may have heard of. So it's from eighteen thirty five

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Speaker 5: to eighteen sixty one, and what we have is the

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Speaker 5: extinguishment of Indian title to eastern lands and the removal

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Speaker 5: of Indian tribes westward. So one of the most notable

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Speaker 5: acts is the Removal Act, which was authorized by President

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Speaker 5: Andrew Jackson, which moved Indians from the east to the

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Speaker 5: west of the Mississippi River into what is was called

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Speaker 5: Indian Territory. And what brought about this federal Act was

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Speaker 5: a series of three foundational statutes within federal Indian policy,

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Speaker 5: dictated by Chief Justice John Marshall. So first we have

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Speaker 5: Johnson B. McIntosh, Cherokee Nation v. Georgia and Worcester v. Georgia.

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Speaker 5: And I won't go into two to detail, but what

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Speaker 5: this these essentially did and legally defined tribes as being

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Speaker 5: domestic dependent nations. And so it clarified more that again

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Speaker 5: tribal nations are underneath the federal government's overview, not the states.

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Speaker 5: So yeah, it placed tribes above state jurisdiction, and what

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Speaker 5: this was trying to do was solve some issues that

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Speaker 5: tribes such as the Cherokee Nation had with different states

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Speaker 5: when it came to land and jurisdiction over said land.

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Speaker 5: But that is kind of the basis of a lot

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Speaker 5: of federal Indian policy and still remained truth day. And

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Speaker 5: what is notable in each one of these statutes, I believe,

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Speaker 5: particularly in Worcester the Georgia, although it seems that it

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Speaker 5: was supporting tribal sovereignty in them and that they were

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Speaker 5: above state jurisdiction, a lot of these statute cited racist

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Speaker 5: president and the doctrine of Discovery. So what you see

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Speaker 5: for federal Indian policy is that a lot of the founder,

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Speaker 5: well all the foundation for a federal Indian policy based

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Speaker 5: on President is the Doctrine of Discovery, which is reliant

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Speaker 5: on the idea that American Indians were savages and needed

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Speaker 5: federal benevolence and paternalism in order to regulate their own affairs.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think that's well, okay, we should probably

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Speaker 4: not just immediately get to allotment, but yeah, because there's

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Speaker 4: there's there's also yeah, this is also the period used. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: the thing you were talking about earlier, the thing you

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Speaker 4: helped me know about, which is, Okay, it's not true

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Speaker 4: to say this is when this starts, but this is

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Speaker 4: Indian Removal Act, Trail of Tears territory. And yeah, one

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Speaker 4: thing that you know, I think one of the sort

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Speaker 4: of running themes of this is that, you know, the

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Speaker 4: the law in this context is just sort of it

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Speaker 4: becomes a sort of retroactive excuse to do whatever needs

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Speaker 4: to be done from the perspective quote unquote of the

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Speaker 4: sort of of the settler state to just take all

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Speaker 4: of this land.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: And I think maybe like one of the keystones of

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Speaker 4: this is Andrew Jackson just straight up telling the Supreme

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Speaker 4: Court to fuck off so that he can do so

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Speaker 4: he can do a trail of tears.

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Speaker 5: Yeah. So the Removal Act happened after all of these

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Speaker 5: statutes that you already had that supported federal Indian sovereignty.

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Speaker 5: And so the Cherokees in Georgia were one of the

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Speaker 5: tribes that were removed. And so you kind of see

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Speaker 5: what you talked about, the the retrograde kind of justifications

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Speaker 5: for said removal despite the statutes that are there. So

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Speaker 5: although that like Marshall in Worchester feed Georgia determined that

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Speaker 5: the State of Georgia did not have jurisdiction over Cherokee

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Speaker 5: Territory all this although this territory was in the state's borders.

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Speaker 5: Later on, you see with the Removal Act that although

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Speaker 5: these statutes are still president in federal Undian policy, those

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Speaker 5: were null in order for there to be more expansion

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Speaker 5: of settlers within these areas. So when it was decided that, oh, wait,

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Speaker 5: we do need this land and we don't actually want

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Speaker 5: these Indians here, let's put them to the side overpast

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Speaker 5: the Mississippi so that they're out of sight, out of mind, right,

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Speaker 5: So we see more of this justification for settler expansion.

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Speaker 5: And so again we bring back to these themes of

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Speaker 5: like settler colonialism in order to and kind of gain

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Speaker 5: more of this land.

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Speaker 1: And a lot.

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Speaker 5: Of these statutes are still cited the doctrine of discovery

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Speaker 5: in them, and rather than supporting tribal policy, the relationship

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Speaker 5: between the United States federal government and American Indians was

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Speaker 5: not based on the rights of Indians, but more that

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Speaker 5: they can't they can't govern themselves, right and so so,

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Speaker 5: and that's the whole issue is, like people were like

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Speaker 5: they don't know what they're doing, so we're gonna push

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Speaker 5: them and like take their land again. So I don't

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Speaker 5: know if you want me to go too much into

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Speaker 5: the trail of tears, but you're seeing a lot of

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Speaker 5: patterns here, I think, different forms of genocide, different forms

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Speaker 5: of taking the land.

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Speaker 6: This was this is all around the same time as

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Speaker 6: the Indian Action Canada as well, which was a very

299
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Speaker 6: similar thing, especially starting in the nineteen hundred's, starting in

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Speaker 6: the twentieth century as well with thee like expansion of

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Speaker 6: the like assimilation programs.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think I guess one other thing I

303
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Speaker 4: want to point out about this is that, you know,

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Speaker 4: so one of the things that happens trails here is

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Speaker 4: that the Supreme Court like tells Jackson that he can't

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Speaker 4: do this, and Jackson just does it anyways. And I

307
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Speaker 4: think that's a very interesting important moment because you know,

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Speaker 4: this is this is this thing right where the federal

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Speaker 4: government can tell the Supreme Court to fuck off, right,

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Speaker 4: and there's nothing that the Streme Court could do about it.

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Speaker 4: And if you look at what they did it to do,

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Speaker 4: the thing they did it to do was genocide, and

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Speaker 4: it's I think it's it's just I think this is

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Speaker 4: very sort of I don't know, this incredibly grim, like

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Speaker 4: you know, encapsulation of like what this state actually is,

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Speaker 4: which is this sort of genocide machine and whatever sort

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Speaker 4: of you know, this is what sovereignty is, right, the

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Speaker 4: ability to break your own rules to sort of art

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Speaker 4: to maintain the system. So you you know, you break

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Speaker 4: your own laws and you know, as we're going to

321
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Speaker 4: get to in a second, like you break your own

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Speaker 4: treaties continuously, and you do this because you know, the

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Speaker 4: gene slide machine has to keep moving, right.

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Speaker 5: And there's a couple of federal Indian policy theorists Bendelari

325
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Speaker 5: Junior who's one of the most famous ones, and David

326
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Speaker 5: Wilkins who talks about how there is no need for

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Speaker 5: checks and balances within the federal Indian policy system. So

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Speaker 5: you have Congress that is able to pass whatever act

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Speaker 5: they want, and then you also have the Supreme Court,

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Speaker 5: and then you also have executive action. But it wasn't

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Speaker 5: really delineated that well within especially when it comes to

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Speaker 5: this period as to who is going to be dealing

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Speaker 5: with the Indians kind of thing, and so this kind

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Speaker 5: of confusion and not really completely defining what it means

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Speaker 5: to be a domestic dependent nation. I think really just

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Speaker 5: goes to show how much of a fragile edifice like

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Speaker 5: settler colonial policy is for it is within the system.

338
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Speaker 5: But again moving on, it comes back again to land.

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Speaker 5: So the reservation area era in eighteen sixty one to

340
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Speaker 5: eighteen eighty sevens you have a lot of westward expansion

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Speaker 5: of non Indians settlers, specifically to California. You also have

342
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Speaker 5: the creation of Indian reservations and resulting Indian wars. So

343
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Speaker 5: during this era, what you see a lot of are

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Speaker 5: different types of the times that assimulation and a lot

345
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Speaker 5: of warfare. So you have a lot of the planes

346
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Speaker 5: tribes my tribe for instance, that are going through all

347
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Speaker 5: of these battles fighting forced removal onto reservations. One of

348
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Speaker 5: the most famous ones was the Battle of Greece Grass.

349
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Speaker 5: There was a little Big Horn where General Custer was

350
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Speaker 5: killed by Sioux, Cheyennes and Arapahos, and different instances of

351
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Speaker 5: battles such as those, and also where a lot of

352
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Speaker 5: tribes were forcibly removed to era areas that they were

353
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Speaker 5: weren't originally from, so like how the rapes were moved

354
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Speaker 5: to Oklahoma. There was attempts of my tribe, for instance,

355
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Speaker 5: Northern Cheyenne, to be moved down to Oklahoma as well,

356
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Speaker 5: and that's why there's some Southern Cheyennes in Oklahoma and

357
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Speaker 5: then my tribe, the Northern Chan's in Montana. Another another

358
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Speaker 5: thing that is happening during this period are boarding schools,

359
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,840
Speaker 5: the boarding school era. So this attempt at assimilation through

360
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 5: education and assimilation is also within within the settler colonial

361
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Speaker 5: kind of structure. It's it's defined the process where indigenous

362
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:09,280
Speaker 5: people end up conforming to different constructed notions of setular norms.

363
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Speaker 5: So if they're not absorbed within the state completely, then

364
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:21,360
Speaker 5: their attempted attempt to be assimilated culturally through education, through languages,

365
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,399
Speaker 5: in terms of economics. So now you have a bunch

366
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Speaker 5: of different sort of bureaucratic structures on these reservations trying

367
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Speaker 5: to make tribal governments appear to be or constructed as

368
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Speaker 5: as setular colonial governments are. So maybe it's the three

369
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Speaker 5: branches in ways that aren't just compatible with different tribes culturally,

370
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Speaker 5: and you also have the attempted eradication of different kind

371
00:25:56,520 --> 00:26:03,720
Speaker 5: of spiritual and cultural practices and a lot of Christianity

372
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:07,000
Speaker 5: being forced on to different people and just kind of

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Speaker 5: terrible things that I think more and more people are

374
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Speaker 5: becoming aware of due to current movements. But we'll get

375
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Speaker 5: into that moment later.

376
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Speaker 4: Do we want to talk about a lot of pass

377
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Speaker 4: if in the same.

378
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Speaker 5: Period, Yes, a lotment period and force a similation. So

379
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,080
Speaker 5: this is like eighteen seventy one to nineteen thirty four,

380
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Speaker 5: and so this is the end of the treaty making process.

381
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Speaker 5: So the whole idea of trying to force tribes onto

382
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:53,600
Speaker 5: reservations and sign these treaties were to again take land

383
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Speaker 5: and make sure that the United States has more land

384
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Speaker 5: and all the land, et cetera that they possibly have.

385
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:06,960
Speaker 5: So at this end of treaty making and federal allotment

386
00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:12,040
Speaker 5: of Indian lands also happened in the the DAWs Act.

387
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Speaker 5: And so what this was was an attempt to further

388
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,959
Speaker 5: shrink the reservation lands that tribes were already guaranteed within treaties.

389
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Speaker 5: So during this period, I think that somewhere like nine

390
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 5: million acres were taken from tribal reservations during the allotment process.

391
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Speaker 5: So what the allotment process did was it counted each

392
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:48,240
Speaker 5: in every individual Indian that was eligible. I think there

393
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:56,119
Speaker 5: were adults. Yeah, adults that were eligible, and each one

394
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Speaker 5: of them were given a certain parcel of land a

395
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 5: certain number eight bridge. And once all of this land

396
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:08,439
Speaker 5: was calculated, what you had was an excess of land

397
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 5: quote unquote excess of land that the tribes obviously didn't

398
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 5: need because they had still to too many people. And

399
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 5: so what the excess of land was utilized for us,

400
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 5: for pioneers and for settlers if it didn't go to

401
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:33,399
Speaker 5: the federal government, it was to incentivize settlers to colonize

402
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 5: the secil on Indian lands, so trying its hardest to

403
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 5: not stay true to its treemaking practices.

404
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 4: I think the every thing that was interesting to me

405
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 4: about this is that like because one of the other

406
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 4: goals of this is to sort of like, oh is

407
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,200
Speaker 4: the civilizing missions, Like yeah, we're going to turn them

408
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:57,200
Speaker 4: into We're gona tell these people into like like yeoman farmers,

409
00:28:57,240 --> 00:29:00,080
Speaker 4: like true American fintiersmen or whatever. And it's just like

410
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 4: it just doesn't work because economically it doesn't make any sense,

411
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 4: Like breaking up all these like lens is like it

412
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 4: doesn't you can't just give someone like a small patch

413
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,840
Speaker 4: of like shitty land and have them farm like this

414
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 4: doesn't like this, it doesn't it doesn't.

415
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 5: It's like they.

416
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 6: Certainly tried and then yeah, yeah, yeah, like that was

417
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,719
Speaker 6: one of the main thing, one of the main things

418
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:24,800
Speaker 6: in Canada was about getting them to adopt like, uh,

419
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 6: like European farming practices, which which they they they already

420
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 6: knew how to like get their own food, right, they

421
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 6: were trying to change this whole system of of of

422
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 6: like of food growth to to this like to this

423
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 6: European way of farming, and it just and they were

424
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 6: just forcing them to and there's yeah, it's it's yes,

425
00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 6: it gets, it gets, it gets super, it gets super

426
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 6: like dark and horrible. Once you like look at like

427
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 6: the letters that were being written by like the heads

428
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 6: of these programs, like you know, instructing like these agents

429
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,480
Speaker 6: were stationed at these like reservations to like force people

430
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,800
Speaker 6: to be doing this horrible farming for like all day

431
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 6: every day.

432
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 4: And I think, you know the sign that this was

433
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 4: like like this is this is so bad that even

434
00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 4: the US government eventually is like wait this like this

435
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 4: is fucked up and doesn't work. So I think that's yeah,

436
00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:25,640
Speaker 4: your transition to sort of like the next phase, I guess.

437
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 5: Yeah, a very short phase.

438
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 9: Yeah.

439
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 5: So the next phase is the Indian Reorganization Act. And

440
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,840
Speaker 5: so this something lasted six years from nineteen thirty four

441
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:41,080
Speaker 5: to nineteen forty. So this is when allotment ended. As

442
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,239
Speaker 5: you said, the United States government was like, wait, this

443
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 5: isn't working. What else can we do? The Indians aren't

444
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 5: dying off, they're not assimilating, they're not a culturating. We

445
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 5: don't know what to do with them. So maybe we'll

446
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:59,120
Speaker 5: We'll have them adopt these constitutions and a lot of

447
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 5: them just templates. So regardless of whether or not they

448
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 5: were I think compatible with tribal different tribes way of life,

449
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 5: they were like, you have these constitutions. Now now you're

450
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 5: you're a tribe, and this is what each tribe has

451
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 5: to look like in order for us, the federal government

452
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 5: to recognize you as a legitimate entity. And then so

453
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 5: you have the establishment of these tribal governments that consist

454
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 5: of tribal councils and big business committees, et cetera. However,

455
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:42,280
Speaker 5: this period is fleeting, very fleeting, and next you have

456
00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:46,160
Speaker 5: the termination era. So this is the period of time

457
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:51,680
Speaker 5: where the federal government essentially even more so, wants to

458
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 5: just get rid of the quote unquote Indian problem, which

459
00:31:54,880 --> 00:32:00,680
Speaker 5: is the existence of indigenous peoples that are reminders to

460
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 5: the government essentially that they are a setlar colonial force

461
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 5: and they don't know what to do with us because

462
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 5: they tried to commit genocide, they tried to remove us,

463
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:14,960
Speaker 5: et cetera, et cetera. It's still not working. They decided

464
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 5: that our Chibel governments are aren't legitimate, and they just decide, well,

465
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 5: it's too much to try to keep up with our

466
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 5: treaties and what we promised them when it comes to

467
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 5: health care, education, housing, et cetera, et cetera. How about

468
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 5: we terminate our federal responsibility, our trust responsibility that are

469
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 5: delineated in federal Unian policy and in our treaties and

470
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 5: give them off to this to the states to decide

471
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 5: what to do with. And so during this period you

472
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 5: see sort of the federal dissolution of some tribes such

473
00:32:55,480 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 5: as the monogamy and other ones as well. So this

474
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 5: is another dark time there. The dark times just keep

475
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 5: on coming. And but Federalumbian policy scholars have characterized federal

476
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 5: run new policy as a pendulum. So swing swinging from

477
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 5: side to side between this termin this termination of tribes,

478
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 5: So the federal Indian government as trying to get rid

479
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 5: of tribes, especially as you can see in this era,

480
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 5: and then the pendulum of the other side of self determination.

481
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 5: But both of these are held within the context of

482
00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 5: goals of assimilation. So this is just another phase of terribleness.

483
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 1: Yep.

484
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 4: Well, I think this this phase also like one thing

485
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 4: I think that also like is important people understand is

486
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:53,680
Speaker 4: it like like it's not like people aren't fighting this

487
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 4: like the whole time. I mean even going like even

488
00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 4: going back to the stuff the Seventh Cavalry, like the

489
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 4: stuff of cavalry loose was like bors Dayli's bells all

490
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 4: the time. People are fighting constantly, and this is this period.

491
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:10,359
Speaker 4: The termination period is also where you see the rise

492
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:11,759
Speaker 4: of the American Indian movements.

493
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,959
Speaker 5: Yeah, a lot of these periods can be like dove

494
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:19,760
Speaker 5: into more and all of these different things. In every instance,

495
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,319
Speaker 5: in every instance of federal Indian policy, you have resistance,

496
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,160
Speaker 5: which we're not covering here right now, but you have

497
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 5: instances throughout history where Indigenous peoples have fought for their

498
00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:38,040
Speaker 5: rights to land, for their community, to being sovereign nations,

499
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 5: et cetera. And that's why the federal Indian the federal government,

500
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 5: not federal Indian government, the federal government has not been

501
00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 5: able to eradicate us, much to their dismay. Yeah, and

502
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 5: so now I'm going to switch into the era that

503
00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 5: we are considered to be in, which I had mentioned

504
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 5: when I talked about the pendulum of federal Indian policy.

505
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 5: So now we are in the self determination era, which

506
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:12,799
Speaker 5: began in nineteen sixty two, and we have the right

507
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:17,400
Speaker 5: it's characterized with the revitalization of tribal entities. So going

508
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 5: kind of back to when there was the Indian Reorganization Act,

509
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 5: that we have our tribal councils. There's restoration of some

510
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 5: tribes under federal recognition who were terminated, again not all

511
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 5: of them. We also have the Indian Civil Rights Act,

512
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 5: so this kind of guaranteed individual Indians some rights, not

513
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:47,200
Speaker 5: just characterized by their tribes. Also the self determination policy,

514
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 5: so this is when Nixon condemned the termination policy and

515
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 5: gave more control to Indians rather than the Bureau of

516
00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:00,839
Speaker 5: Indian ferris which just a federal bureau and just kind

517
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 5: of like other policies that have given the tribes more

518
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:11,319
Speaker 5: rights to determine for themselves and their own trust, their

519
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:15,920
Speaker 5: own people to a certain degree, underneath the federal government

520
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:20,319
Speaker 5: as semess of dependent nations. And again I think that

521
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 5: we have seen a lot more movement, but within the

522
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 5: context of being within a settler colonial state, it's always

523
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 5: I think a possibility that the federal unding government, or

524
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,400
Speaker 5: the federal government I keep saying Indian, the federal government

525
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:45,319
Speaker 5: will try to take more and more. And I think,

526
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 5: for instance, when it comes to issues of fishing rights,

527
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,560
Speaker 5: issues of hunting rights with states, not even just with

528
00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:59,320
Speaker 5: the federal government. So you have a lot of states

529
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:04,840
Speaker 5: throughout throughout history but still ongoing that attempt to encroach

530
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:10,239
Speaker 5: on tribal treaties. And again, treaties are the basis of

531
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 5: federal Indian policy. Without these treaties, the lands would have

532
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:20,560
Speaker 5: never been seceeded to the United States. And so there's

533
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 5: this sort of like legal legal conundrum I would say,

534
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 5: of where all these all treaties in the history of

535
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 5: the United States with Indian with Indian tribes have been

536
00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,880
Speaker 5: broken in some way, shape or form.

537
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:38,319
Speaker 10: But still.

538
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 5: American Indians have to live on their reservations instead of

539
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 5: having their their land back, and so nowadays a lot

540
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 5: of movement has been towards land back. What this means?

541
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 5: What is this process? And I think it means a

542
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:59,760
Speaker 5: lot of different things for different people, Indigenous people because

543
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 5: again and there's there's five hundred and seventy four federally

544
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 5: recognized tribes, and so it's not one monolith of ideas,

545
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 5: the monolith of beliefs. But by just by saying land back,

546
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:15,799
Speaker 5: that's like recognition that this is our this was our

547
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:18,920
Speaker 5: land first, and you're not keeping your side of the

548
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 5: deal and never have been.

549
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:24,520
Speaker 6: Could you maybe go a bit more into land back

550
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:27,240
Speaker 6: as the topic, because like specifically, like the past five years,

551
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 6: it has really gained a lot more like popularity as

552
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 6: like a slogan ye, But I think for a lot

553
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 6: of a lot of people who you like, chanted and

554
00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:43,759
Speaker 6: hear it don't always really know exactly what it means.

555
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 6: There's a lot of like mixed opinions on what it means.

556
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 6: Of course, on like the more like reactionary side, it's

557
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 6: like people be like, what you're gonna like kick white

558
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 6: people out of these areas, Like that's kind of that's

559
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,399
Speaker 6: what a lot of like the reactionary takes on land

560
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 6: Back is and I'm sure most people are listening to

561
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:05,359
Speaker 6: this podcast that's not what they think, but they may

562
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,680
Speaker 6: not really know exactly what it means either. They may

563
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 6: think it sounds a good idea, but they're not quite

564
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:13,280
Speaker 6: sure what it is. Do you mind kind of talking

565
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,920
Speaker 6: about how land back has like developed as an idea

566
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,360
Speaker 6: and what like you mean by it personally?

567
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 5: At least? Yeah, I think I could talk about more

568
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 5: about like what I mean by it personally and what

569
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,520
Speaker 5: I've understood it to mean to other people, because I

570
00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:34,319
Speaker 5: think land back itself it means like a lot of

571
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 5: different things, and I don't think that there has been

572
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 5: a concrete kind of idea of what it means. But

573
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 5: I think a lot of the movement I want to

574
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 5: like contextualize it within a lot of the sort of

575
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:55,320
Speaker 5: activism that we've seen in their recent years. So for instance,

576
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,719
Speaker 5: you know, Dapple the Dakota Access Pipeline in twenty sixteen,

577
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:02,800
Speaker 5: and kind of I think that's one of the more

578
00:40:03,760 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 5: recent events that have really illustrated on a wide scale,

579
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 5: like globally about indigenous movements, sovereign movements, and then especially

580
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:18,799
Speaker 5: when it comes to environmental justice. But what you saw

581
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:26,400
Speaker 5: there was encroachment on tribal treaty land within what it

582
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:29,440
Speaker 5: had to do with the Dakota Access pipeline. So although

583
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 5: it didn't cross some of the current reservation borders, it

584
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 5: was in treaty land, you know that kind of thing.

585
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 6: The same thing with Stop line three, how it encroached

586
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:42,480
Speaker 6: on like the hunting land and the farmland that was

587
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:47,080
Speaker 6: not technically in the like residential like like like, not

588
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:49,239
Speaker 6: in like the reservation area where people live, but it's

589
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:52,400
Speaker 6: in the surrounding area that is for hunting that is

590
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 6: specified in the treaty, and keep trying to use these

591
00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 6: loopholes to get the pipelines through.

592
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 5: Right right, And so I think what we see as

593
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:05,359
Speaker 5: a lot of solidarity across tribes because this is not new,

594
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,880
Speaker 5: this has never been new, and a lot of tribes

595
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 5: can relate to that. And what you've seen and what

596
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 5: I've hoped that I've highlighted throughout this kind of very

597
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 5: brief overview of vetereral new policy is the different ways

598
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:26,320
Speaker 5: that indigenous rights to land and sovereignty has been attacked

599
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 5: in different forms by settler and colonial governments. And I

600
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:34,319
Speaker 5: think that the day and age that we live in

601
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 5: now has allowed for sort of more widespread solidarity, especially

602
00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:44,360
Speaker 5: over social media. And so when we say land back,

603
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:48,640
Speaker 5: for me, how I interpret it as what people mean

604
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:53,040
Speaker 5: when they're saying it is recognition of our tribal sovereignty,

605
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 5: of our right to this land that has not been respected.

606
00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 5: And then I also think that it means, well, if

607
00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 5: these treaties aren't being respected, then how is this treaty

608
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,080
Speaker 5: still valid?

609
00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:07,919
Speaker 11: Right?

610
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:10,680
Speaker 5: How come we aren't getting our land back because you're

611
00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:13,760
Speaker 5: not upholding your end of the deal. Well, some people

612
00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:18,320
Speaker 5: also might mean and recognize that this whole United States

613
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 5: government is a settler state right based on the doctrine

614
00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 5: of discovery, which is based on denying tribes and American

615
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:34,719
Speaker 5: Indians of their rights to this land. So some people

616
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 5: might take it to this whole other context of yeah,

617
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,120
Speaker 5: well maybe this is all of our land, et cetera,

618
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:43,520
Speaker 5: et cetera. But in practice, what does this look like?

619
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,279
Speaker 5: And I think in practice a lot of people are

620
00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 5: seeing it with reparations or people buying land back for

621
00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 5: tribes and giving it back to tribes, and we have

622
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:59,360
Speaker 5: seen some of that, or also just people interrupting the

623
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,440
Speaker 5: narrative in their own mind of their euro American identity,

624
00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 5: so not non American Indians and primarily European settlers and

625
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:13,960
Speaker 5: their history of their own families taking part of the

626
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 5: setler colonial process, and how has that what about their lands.

627
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:25,880
Speaker 5: There's everyone who descends, I guess, from these these settlers,

628
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:27,840
Speaker 5: and I want to be specific when I'm talking about

629
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 5: Euro American settlers and how they currently benefit from these systems.

630
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:38,720
Speaker 5: And I think by saying land back, it's we're able

631
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:44,120
Speaker 5: to highlight this movement for tribal sovereignty and recognition on

632
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:47,920
Speaker 5: a global scale instead of searching for justice within the

633
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 5: quote unquote like searching for justice within the courts of

634
00:43:51,680 --> 00:43:55,760
Speaker 5: the conqueror, How how do we expect for the conqueror

635
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 5: to be held accountable for all of these atrocities attempts

636
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 5: of genocide is simile, et cetera. By taking it more

637
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:05,720
Speaker 5: towards a global scale, such as no adaptle highlighting these

638
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:11,200
Speaker 5: to other people as these are injustices, this is this

639
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 5: is ongoing genocide. I think that land back has many,

640
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:22,239
Speaker 5: like a plethora of meanings in that sense. Yeah, yeah,

641
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:26,160
Speaker 5: I hope that answers your question. I myself might use

642
00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 5: it in in some some different ways because land as

643
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 5: we conceive it to be property kind of grew. That

644
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 5: concept grew in conversation with Euro American conceptions of property.

645
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:48,200
Speaker 5: So I think that moving forward, when we talk about

646
00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:53,680
Speaker 5: decolonization as a process and not like a metaphor, that

647
00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 5: thinking of land back not within that whole idea of

648
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:01,759
Speaker 5: your American profit video as well. That's that's kind of

649
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:04,360
Speaker 5: another thing to consider.

650
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,239
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think I think lend back will just be

651
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 6: a whole other thing that will pay someone more qualified

652
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 6: than our team to talk about on this show, because yeah,

653
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 6: that's definitely, like you know, like all of the things

654
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:23,359
Speaker 6: we've we've discussed, they deserve their own deep dives by

655
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:29,359
Speaker 6: people that are uh, not me, Robert and Chris. Let's see,

656
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:34,280
Speaker 6: is there any kind of resources, either books or stuff

657
00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 6: online that you would recommend for people wanting to learn

658
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:41,360
Speaker 6: more about this history and then any kind of ways

659
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:44,759
Speaker 6: to I don't know, I guess show support in these

660
00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 6: and these kind of like efforts that are going on.

661
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, for sure. So in terms of resources and reading,

662
00:45:55,160 --> 00:46:01,160
Speaker 5: I have read Lorenzo Ercini's Settler Book on settler colonialism.

663
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 5: That's really helpful when you're trying to understand that framework

664
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:08,840
Speaker 5: in terms of getting to know kind of more of

665
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:16,480
Speaker 5: the basics of like current issues impacting tribes. The National

666
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:19,040
Speaker 5: Congress of American Indians does a lot of work on

667
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,720
Speaker 5: the federal level. If you want to talk more about

668
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 5: kind of lived current lived experiences of American Indians, there's

669
00:46:28,239 --> 00:46:34,719
Speaker 5: illuminatives and getting more involved in those as well. I

670
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:38,040
Speaker 5: think that they have some tips, but I would recommend

671
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 5: everyone getting more familiar with the land that they are

672
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 5: on currently, the tribes within their state, and what they

673
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:49,319
Speaker 5: can do not just on the local level, but on

674
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 5: the state level to support tribal sovereignty because a lot

675
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 5: of issues. For instance, I worked on the state policy

676
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 5: level in Washington and in Montana, and both of those

677
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 5: have a significant amount of tribes, but you have a

678
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:11,919
Speaker 5: lot of legislation that's trying to happen that infringes on

679
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:17,720
Speaker 5: tribal treaty rights. And the thing is is as ugly

680
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:23,480
Speaker 5: as it may be to say, but sometimes voices of

681
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 5: non indigenous peoples are listening to more within those contexts,

682
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:34,680
Speaker 5: So you need to get more involved on those levels.

683
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:41,960
Speaker 5: What sort of like at nonprofit organizations work with your

684
00:47:42,080 --> 00:47:45,920
Speaker 5: tribes or and what sort of issues are impacting tribes

685
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 5: and again, these are all going to probably be surrounding

686
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 5: tribal sovereignty, so maybe it's fishing access, hunting rights, et cetera.

687
00:47:57,400 --> 00:47:59,480
Speaker 5: I think that's a really good way to make some

688
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:05,319
Speaker 5: more tangible change, to feel like you're doing something to

689
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:10,080
Speaker 5: support tribal sovereignty while you're also educating yourself and making

690
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 5: sure that their voices are at the forefront. And that's

691
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 5: also applicable to the federal level, especially with as you

692
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:23,399
Speaker 5: already said, like stop line three in Minnesota, contacting your legislators,

693
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:28,200
Speaker 5: et cetera, et cetera. And I think also with when

694
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 5: it comes to one of one of the larger issues

695
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:38,080
Speaker 5: besides environmental justice for Indigenous peoples such as pipelines, you

696
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 5: have right now missing a murdered Indigenous women, So looking

697
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:47,000
Speaker 5: and looking into that a little bit more and who

698
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:53,000
Speaker 5: you can support who's addressing those issues along with there

699
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:59,640
Speaker 5: is another movement with boarding schools right now, because there's

700
00:48:59,719 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 5: been a lot of bodies of young children that have

701
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 5: been uncovered. And this is not an issue that happened

702
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:15,000
Speaker 5: a long long time ago, like for instance, my grandmother

703
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 5: went to a boarding school. There's still schools that, although

704
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:24,240
Speaker 5: they're not called boarding schools right now that we're boarding

705
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:27,160
Speaker 5: schools but are still in operation under different names, et cetera.

706
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:32,520
Speaker 5: So kind of familiarizing yourself with those histories. And then

707
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:38,200
Speaker 5: also there's a national I think it's called the National

708
00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 5: Boarding School Healing Coalition based out of Minnesota, and looking

709
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 5: into them and supporting their efforts with this issue is

710
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:50,480
Speaker 5: also a good place to start.

711
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:56,400
Speaker 6: Is there anywhere that people can find you online?

712
00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 5: Yes?

713
00:49:59,160 --> 00:49:59,520
Speaker 7: I don't.

714
00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 5: I don't really use social media that much. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

715
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:12,359
Speaker 5: I try not to. I don't know if I want

716
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:13,320
Speaker 5: people to find.

717
00:50:13,080 --> 00:50:20,000
Speaker 6: Me, don't do it better. But it's better that people

718
00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 6: don't find anyone online. It's better we're all just just

719
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:27,640
Speaker 6: posting into the void. There's nothing, just just the void.

720
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 6: Well that that is I think gonna wrap up what

721
00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 6: we have today, Chris, Do you want to close us

722
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:36,520
Speaker 6: out with a funny bit?

723
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:45,000
Speaker 4: I light your local gas station on fire. Wow, Jesus

724
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:51,719
Speaker 4: Christ killing here? Oh my god, geez wow. All right,

725
00:50:51,760 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 4: goodbye for buddy.

726
00:51:16,520 --> 00:51:20,080
Speaker 7: You probably don't remember passage of Title forty two, let

727
00:51:20,120 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 7: alone that of Title forty two taped to six a

728
00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:26,799
Speaker 7: sub chapter two, Part G Section two sixty four. But

729
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 7: it's a part of US federal law that gives the

730
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:32,239
Speaker 7: government the authority to take emergency action to keep communical

731
00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:35,840
Speaker 7: diseases out of the country. The portion which allows a

732
00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:39,439
Speaker 7: sweeping disregard for asylum. Law passed in nineteen forty four,

733
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:43,279
Speaker 7: reads in one giant run on paragraph sentences.

734
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:46,600
Speaker 12: Follows, whenever the Surgeon General determines that, by reason of

735
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:49,880
Speaker 12: the existence of any communicable disease in a foreign country,

736
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:52,720
Speaker 12: there is serious danger of the introduction of such disease

737
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:55,360
Speaker 12: into the United States, and that this danger is so

738
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:58,279
Speaker 12: increased by the introduction of persons or property from such

739
00:51:58,320 --> 00:52:00,799
Speaker 12: country that a suspension of the right to introduce such

740
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:03,440
Speaker 12: persons and property is required in the interest of the

741
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:06,920
Speaker 12: public health. The Surgeon General, in accordance with regulations approved

742
00:52:06,920 --> 00:52:09,400
Speaker 12: by the President, shall have the power to prohibit in

743
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 12: a whole or in part, the introduction of persons and

744
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:15,240
Speaker 12: property from such countries or places as he shall designate,

745
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:17,920
Speaker 12: in order to avert such danger, and for such period

746
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:20,320
Speaker 12: of time as he may deem necessary for such purpose.

747
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:24,520
Speaker 7: Before President Donald Trump's administration used it on March twentieth,

748
00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:27,800
Speaker 7: twenty twenty, it had been used only in nineteen twenty

749
00:52:27,880 --> 00:52:30,200
Speaker 7: nine to keep ships from China and the Philippines from

750
00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:34,040
Speaker 7: entering US ports during to meningitis outbreak, but in March

751
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:36,640
Speaker 7: of twenty twenty, when you probably weren't paying much attention

752
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:39,279
Speaker 7: because the world was falling apart, or when I just

753
00:52:39,360 --> 00:52:41,920
Speaker 7: returned from a work trip to Rwanda, where I was

754
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:45,200
Speaker 7: months before any precautions appeared in the USA screened for

755
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 7: a novel coronavirus. The Trump administration cited this public health

756
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:53,279
Speaker 7: law in instructions to the Department of Homeland Security on

757
00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:58,000
Speaker 7: restrictions for migrants entering the United States. That very same day,

758
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:02,400
Speaker 7: Center for Disease Control Direct Robert R. Redfield relied on

759
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 7: this regulation to issue an order suspending the introduction into

760
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,960
Speaker 7: the United States of certain individuals who had been in

761
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 7: quote unquote coronavirus impacted areas and quote who would be

762
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 7: introduced into a congregate setting at the port of entry

763
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 7: or a border station. This includes individuals coming from Canada

764
00:53:23,239 --> 00:53:26,439
Speaker 7: or Mexico who would normally be detained by CBP after

765
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:30,480
Speaker 7: arriving at the border, people including asylum seekers and accompanied children,

766
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,520
Speaker 7: and people attending to enter the United States between ports

767
00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:37,960
Speaker 7: of entry. Citing the new CDC order, that same day,

768
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:42,080
Speaker 7: the Border patrol began expelling individuals who arrived at the

769
00:53:42,160 --> 00:53:47,239
Speaker 7: US Mexico border without giving them the opportunity to seek asylum.

770
00:53:47,600 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 7: Reports indicate the CDC scientist expressed opposition to the invocation

771
00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:53,799
Speaker 7: of Title forty two, arguing that there was really no

772
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:57,880
Speaker 7: public health rationale to support it. Ever since then, public

773
00:53:57,920 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 7: health experts outside the CDC have gones continue to agree,

774
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:05,040
Speaker 7: arguing that while international borders largely remain open to other travelers,

775
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:07,800
Speaker 7: there is no need to turn away refugees and expel

776
00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:10,560
Speaker 7: them to their home countries or send them to Mexico.

777
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:15,000
Speaker 7: Despite this, DHS has been applying Title forty two to

778
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:18,560
Speaker 7: migrants for three years since then, and people have been

779
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:21,080
Speaker 7: turned away without getting a chance to plead their case

780
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:23,120
Speaker 7: for asylum three million times.

781
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:24,520
Speaker 8: Now.

782
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:27,799
Speaker 7: Trump is no longer president, but Title forty two has persisted.

783
00:54:28,239 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 7: It's actually persisted for much longer under Biden's watch two

784
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:34,840
Speaker 7: years and four months than it did under Trump ten months.

785
00:54:35,280 --> 00:54:38,399
Speaker 7: But we'll get to that part later. First, let's look

786
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 7: at what this bureaucratic wrinkle does when it's supplied for

787
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,759
Speaker 7: three years across the land border spanning three one and

788
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:48,720
Speaker 7: forty five kilometers. That's nine hundred and fifty four miles

789
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:52,280
Speaker 7: for the Americans listening at a time when climate change,

790
00:54:52,560 --> 00:54:56,640
Speaker 7: economic decline, and state and nonstate violence are driving more

791
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:59,640
Speaker 7: and more people towards the USA's southern border in the

792
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:03,680
Speaker 7: hope of better life. We're talking about the title forty

793
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:06,360
Speaker 7: two this week because it ended on Mail eleventh. In

794
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:08,640
Speaker 7: a sense, this marks an important change in immigration law,

795
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 7: but in a sense it doesn't. Immigration was complicated and

796
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,800
Speaker 7: cruel for migrants and profitable for people on both sides

797
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:18,080
Speaker 7: of the border before March of twenty twenty, and it's

798
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:21,440
Speaker 7: the same after Title forty two has gone. But nonetheless,

799
00:55:21,440 --> 00:55:24,280
Speaker 7: Title forty two represented a distinct change in how asylum

800
00:55:24,280 --> 00:55:27,440
Speaker 7: works in the US, and, especially when combined with other

801
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:31,440
Speaker 7: Trump policies that Biden has continued, a distinct change in

802
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:34,640
Speaker 7: how many people die when coming to this country to

803
00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:36,720
Speaker 7: try and have a better chance at a save future.

804
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 7: By April of twenty twenty, Title forty two expulsions at

805
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:45,400
Speaker 7: the border overtook the previous record for expulsions under the

806
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:48,759
Speaker 7: so called Migrant Protection Protocol, which is better known as

807
00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:51,600
Speaker 7: Remain in Mexico, that was set in August of twenty

808
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:55,600
Speaker 7: nineteen under an agreement reached with the Mexican government. In

809
00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 7: late March of twenty twenty, the Border Patrol began sending

810
00:55:59,440 --> 00:56:03,680
Speaker 7: quote unquot quote back to Mexico most Mexican, but also

811
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:08,840
Speaker 7: Guatemala and Honduran and Saldarrean families and seeingle adults encountered

812
00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:12,879
Speaker 7: at the border. This group of nationalities remained unchanged until

813
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:15,680
Speaker 7: May of twenty twenty two, when the Biden administration came

814
00:56:15,719 --> 00:56:19,400
Speaker 7: to an agreement with Mexico to accept quote unquote thousands

815
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:23,840
Speaker 7: of Cubans and Nicaraguans sent from the United States to Mexico.

816
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:28,759
Speaker 7: But this doesn't really matter. You'll see that alone these episodes.

817
00:56:29,280 --> 00:56:32,080
Speaker 7: Immigration law on the ground and immigration law in Washington,

818
00:56:32,239 --> 00:56:36,640
Speaker 7: DC are two very different things. There has been extensive

819
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:40,080
Speaker 7: documentation of individuals expelled to Mexico who do not fit

820
00:56:40,239 --> 00:56:44,000
Speaker 7: within these nationalities, including Haitian asylum seekers, some of whom

821
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:48,839
Speaker 7: I've spoken to myself. People who are expelled are often

822
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:51,600
Speaker 7: driven by bus to the nearest port of entry that's

823
00:56:51,640 --> 00:56:56,240
Speaker 7: a land border crossing, and told to walk back to Mexico,

824
00:56:56,280 --> 00:56:59,239
Speaker 7: often without their luggage and other belongings. I've found that

825
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:03,120
Speaker 7: luggage and belong including ID cards, clothing and even little

826
00:57:03,120 --> 00:57:06,520
Speaker 7: stuffed animals all along the border in the three years

827
00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:09,719
Speaker 7: since Title forty two has been in place. I asked

828
00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:12,000
Speaker 7: my friend Paul to describe what we found in Texas,

829
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:13,960
Speaker 7: and we've been for a walk along the border wall

830
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:16,840
Speaker 7: during our time reporting on the National Butterfly Center.

831
00:57:16,920 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 13: There you'd find driver's licenses, I believe. At one point

832
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:27,000
Speaker 13: we found like an almost an information packet for like

833
00:57:27,120 --> 00:57:29,640
Speaker 13: it was for a teenager, a teenage girl. I remember

834
00:57:29,680 --> 00:57:33,880
Speaker 13: that because we got pictures of it. And then when

835
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 13: we took that long walk, remember we walked down the

836
00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:39,640
Speaker 13: border wall, it's two two and a half mile walk

837
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:42,000
Speaker 13: something like that. When we got to the very end

838
00:57:42,080 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 13: of the wall where the river was, there was just

839
00:57:49,160 --> 00:57:53,120
Speaker 13: a giant pile of people's stuff. And some of it

840
00:57:53,200 --> 00:57:58,680
Speaker 13: was obviously trash, you know, they were abandoning clothes after

841
00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 13: they changed from crossing and stuff like that, but a

842
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:06,360
Speaker 13: lot of it was full backpacks, a lot of ID

843
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:12,120
Speaker 13: documents just in piles, just piles of them. Yeah, yeah,

844
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:14,640
Speaker 13: just big piles of documents that proved who you were.

845
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:17,920
Speaker 7: The other thing we found with ladders, tons of them.

846
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:22,120
Speaker 7: Apparently someone built a gazebo out of them. The wall

847
00:58:22,160 --> 00:58:24,880
Speaker 7: varies in design a bit along the border, depending on

848
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:27,200
Speaker 7: when and by whom it was built, but the trum

849
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:29,680
Speaker 7: design has a flat anti climb plate at the top.

850
00:58:30,200 --> 00:58:32,200
Speaker 7: I'll let Paul describe how that's going.

851
00:58:32,600 --> 00:58:35,080
Speaker 13: It was literally like somebody went to the hardware store

852
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 13: bought two of the longest or actually sorry, three of

853
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 13: the longest two by four as you could put two

854
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,840
Speaker 13: of them beside each other, and then just nailed steps

855
00:58:45,240 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 13: up them, so you know, they were like sixteen twenty

856
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:51,960
Speaker 13: feet long, and which was enough to just climb over

857
00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:57,600
Speaker 13: the wall Like there weren't There weren't many places actually,

858
00:58:57,640 --> 00:59:00,480
Speaker 13: because most of the wall had that anti climb at

859
00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 13: the top, Whereas when you didn't have the anti climb barrier,

860
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:06,840
Speaker 13: you didn't actually have something to set it against. But

861
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:08,520
Speaker 13: once you put that on there, you could just lean

862
00:59:08,560 --> 00:59:10,680
Speaker 13: the ladder up against it. It's like self defeating.

863
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:15,840
Speaker 7: Sometimes these expulsions are not as straightforward as a bus

864
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 7: to nearest port of entry. CBP has carried out what

865
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:22,880
Speaker 7: are called lateral transfers by plane or bus, taking migrants

866
00:59:23,160 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 7: to another location along the border, to towns like San

867
00:59:26,680 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 7: Diego or El Paso, even if they entered in Arizona

868
00:59:29,680 --> 00:59:33,720
Speaker 7: or California. This leaves families stranded in the town where

869
00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:38,080
Speaker 7: they have no connections, no resources, and no community. Again,

870
00:59:38,120 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 7: these are people I've met. It won't have escaped the listeners'

871
00:59:41,560 --> 00:59:44,880
Speaker 7: attention that those planes and buses and other means of

872
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:49,040
Speaker 7: detention and transport are indeed congregate settings, But that doesn't

873
00:59:49,080 --> 00:59:52,800
Speaker 7: seem to matter here. Title forty two didn't stop people

874
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,200
Speaker 7: trying to come, but it made the journey more difficult.

875
00:59:57,040 --> 00:59:59,440
Speaker 7: Instead of crossing and trying to turn themselves in for

876
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:03,360
Speaker 7: asylum or approaching a port of entry, people began crossing

877
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:07,160
Speaker 7: in more remote places, places without border walls or barriers,

878
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:12,280
Speaker 7: with less frequent border patrols. In twenty twenty, the Border

879
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:15,120
Speaker 7: Patrol found two hundred and forty seven dead bodies along

880
01:00:15,160 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 7: the border. This is unlikely to represent the full human

881
01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:21,600
Speaker 7: toll of border enforcement. Many deaths in the desert go

882
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:26,240
Speaker 7: unreported and undiscovered, but it gives some kind of point

883
01:00:26,280 --> 01:00:29,080
Speaker 7: of comparison for the twenty twenty one number. After a

884
01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:32,840
Speaker 7: year of Title forty two, five hundred and forty six

885
01:00:32,880 --> 01:00:36,680
Speaker 7: people died that year. In twenty twenty two, third year

886
01:00:36,680 --> 01:00:39,920
Speaker 7: of Title forty two, eight one hundred and fifty seven

887
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 7: people died. None of those people were guilty of any

888
01:00:43,560 --> 01:00:46,280
Speaker 7: crime other than wanting a better life, but under Title

889
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:49,560
Speaker 7: forty two, they lost their lives because the US didn't

890
01:00:49,600 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 7: give them a safe way to exercise the human right

891
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:57,520
Speaker 7: to claim asylum. One local advocate, Hamaira Yusefi from a

892
01:00:57,520 --> 01:00:59,760
Speaker 7: group called PANA, the Partnership for the Advance with of

893
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:03,000
Speaker 7: New Americans, explain what Title forty two have been like

894
01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:05,560
Speaker 7: for her as an advocate for asylum seekers.

895
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:11,600
Speaker 14: When the pandemic hit, we saw that Title forty two

896
01:01:12,120 --> 01:01:16,400
Speaker 14: heavily restricted those who were able to seek asylum in

897
01:01:16,440 --> 01:01:20,560
Speaker 14: this country. So while there was chaos happening and folks

898
01:01:20,720 --> 01:01:22,840
Speaker 14: around the world who were trying to come to the

899
01:01:22,920 --> 01:01:25,720
Speaker 14: United States for refuge, they were unable to do so.

900
01:01:26,080 --> 01:01:29,280
Speaker 14: And what this resulted in is people taking an even

901
01:01:29,320 --> 01:01:33,320
Speaker 14: more dangerous path right than before and going between the

902
01:01:33,600 --> 01:01:36,560
Speaker 14: ports of entries in order to try to seek refuge.

903
01:01:36,640 --> 01:01:39,800
Speaker 14: And so we have had hundreds of cases of individuals

904
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:44,320
Speaker 14: who have gotten themselves injured, who the hospitals are calling

905
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:47,160
Speaker 14: us because they've tried to cross and got injured, and

906
01:01:47,320 --> 01:01:49,880
Speaker 14: where we're trying to help them with getting some basic

907
01:01:50,000 --> 01:01:54,080
Speaker 14: legal services and immediate shelter and those types of things.

908
01:01:54,640 --> 01:01:57,840
Speaker 7: Since Biden took off his human rights first says, it's

909
01:01:57,880 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 7: identified more than thirteen thousand incidents of kidnapping, torture, rape,

910
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,680
Speaker 7: or other violent attacks on people blocked or expelled to

911
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:09,959
Speaker 7: Mexico and a Title forty two. That's because it's easy

912
01:02:10,000 --> 01:02:12,440
Speaker 7: for violence to follow people who have no resources and

913
01:02:12,520 --> 01:02:15,800
Speaker 7: no community to protect them. It's for that reason that

914
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:18,680
Speaker 7: you won't always see faces in my photographs at the border,

915
01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:21,960
Speaker 7: and that some of the names in this series have changed,

916
01:02:22,080 --> 01:02:25,520
Speaker 7: or perhaps we're just using someone's first name. It's also

917
01:02:25,560 --> 01:02:27,920
Speaker 7: for that reason they're not everyone at the Border always

918
01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:30,560
Speaker 7: wants to talk. But we do have some interviews coming

919
01:02:30,600 --> 01:02:33,480
Speaker 7: up for you tomorrow. Here's a clip from a discussion

920
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:35,320
Speaker 7: about this which I recorded the border last week.

921
01:02:35,400 --> 01:02:37,720
Speaker 15: I'm trying to get people's face, and that's what everybody

922
01:02:37,760 --> 01:02:38,040
Speaker 15: is doing.

923
01:02:39,600 --> 01:02:41,560
Speaker 10: I can't speak to what they're doing. That's what I'm doing.

924
01:02:41,720 --> 01:02:42,840
Speaker 15: I don't know about other people.

925
01:02:43,080 --> 01:02:46,160
Speaker 7: You should ask. You should if you think someone's taking

926
01:02:46,200 --> 01:02:47,520
Speaker 7: a photo of you, it's okay.

927
01:02:47,600 --> 01:02:50,120
Speaker 8: I don't have a why.

928
01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 16: You know?

929
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:52,560
Speaker 1: I wish I could.

930
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:55,040
Speaker 7: I could tell you people who are subject to Title

931
01:02:55,080 --> 01:02:57,960
Speaker 7: forty to expulsion are not given an opportunity to contest

932
01:02:58,000 --> 01:03:00,680
Speaker 7: their expulsion on the grounds it would face persecure in

933
01:03:00,720 --> 01:03:03,000
Speaker 7: the country to which they will be expelled. There's a

934
01:03:03,080 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 7: very limited exceptions Title forty two for people who quote

935
01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 7: unquote spontaneously inform CBP officers that they fear being tortured

936
01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:12,960
Speaker 7: in the country to which they will be expelled. However,

937
01:03:13,720 --> 01:03:15,960
Speaker 7: in order to receive an official screening by an asylum

938
01:03:15,960 --> 01:03:19,320
Speaker 7: officer for exemption under that provision, the CBP officer must

939
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:23,000
Speaker 7: first determine that the claim is reasonably believable. From March

940
01:03:23,040 --> 01:03:26,280
Speaker 7: twenty twenty through September twenty twenty one, just two hundred

941
01:03:26,320 --> 01:03:28,439
Speaker 7: and seventy two people were granted the right to seek

942
01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:31,840
Speaker 7: asylum under this exception. The use of Title forty two

943
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 7: has been despite the relative lack of outrage sin sur

944
01:03:34,720 --> 01:03:39,360
Speaker 7: Bide the administration took office bipartisan in twenty twenty one.

945
01:03:39,640 --> 01:03:42,840
Speaker 7: A few weeks before Bileen's inauguration, I spent some time

946
01:03:42,840 --> 01:03:45,919
Speaker 7: talking to migrants at the southern border for Slate. Many

947
01:03:45,920 --> 01:03:47,840
Speaker 7: of them had come to a small, tense city that

948
01:03:48,040 --> 01:03:51,080
Speaker 7: popped up just feet from the pedestrian border crossing and

949
01:03:51,120 --> 01:03:53,080
Speaker 7: the country that they had traveled thousands of miles to

950
01:03:53,120 --> 01:03:57,000
Speaker 7: get to but that they couldn't reach. You can see

951
01:03:57,080 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 7: America through the fence there, but you can't get there.

952
01:04:01,320 --> 01:04:04,400
Speaker 7: The camp was diverse in its composition. On one trip,

953
01:04:04,440 --> 01:04:08,440
Speaker 7: I interviewed folks from Haiti, Honduras, Ol Salvador, Gatemana, and Ethiopia.

954
01:04:09,240 --> 01:04:10,640
Speaker 7: Here's what one of them said to me when he

955
01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:14,240
Speaker 7: asked his message to President Biden. You recognize the voices Daniel's.

956
01:04:14,640 --> 01:04:16,960
Speaker 7: That's because I don't have his permission to use his voice.

957
01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:20,600
Speaker 12: Here we are appealing to President Biden. We aren't bad people.

958
01:04:20,880 --> 01:04:22,840
Speaker 12: Our goal is to work and get ahead in the

959
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:25,280
Speaker 12: world for our children. We don't want to go back.

960
01:04:25,440 --> 01:04:27,480
Speaker 12: They will kill us, so we are here.

961
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:30,800
Speaker 7: Some of them wore Biden T shirts, which I suspect

962
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:33,520
Speaker 7: rightually a plant by right wing our Jean provocateur looking

963
01:04:33,600 --> 01:04:37,439
Speaker 7: to make the new administration look weak. They needn't really

964
01:04:37,480 --> 01:04:39,760
Speaker 7: have bothered with all the effort Biden would do plenty

965
01:04:39,800 --> 01:04:41,800
Speaker 7: in the next few months to make himself look cruel

966
01:04:41,960 --> 01:04:44,600
Speaker 7: and unkind. Before we talk about that, I want to

967
01:04:44,600 --> 01:04:47,360
Speaker 7: play you a clip from Biden's first press confidence. President.

968
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:51,360
Speaker 17: You just listed the reasons that people are coming talking

969
01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:54,040
Speaker 17: about in country problems, saying that it happens every year.

970
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:55,080
Speaker 3: You blamed the.

971
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:58,080
Speaker 17: Last administration, Sir. I just got back last night from

972
01:04:58,080 --> 01:05:01,360
Speaker 17: a recording trip to the border where I met nine

973
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:05,800
Speaker 17: year old Jose who walked here from Honduras by himself,

974
01:05:06,160 --> 01:05:09,320
Speaker 17: along with another little boy. He had that snout on him,

975
01:05:09,640 --> 01:05:12,600
Speaker 17: and we were able to call his family. His mother

976
01:05:13,040 --> 01:05:15,920
Speaker 17: says that she sent her son to this country because

977
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:20,760
Speaker 17: she believes that you are not deporting unaccompanied miners like

978
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:24,720
Speaker 17: her son. That's why she's sent him alone from Honduras. So, Sir,

979
01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:28,000
Speaker 17: you blamed the last administration, But is your messaging and

980
01:05:28,120 --> 01:05:30,840
Speaker 17: saying that these children are and will be allowed to

981
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:33,360
Speaker 17: stay in this country and work their way through this process,

982
01:05:33,880 --> 01:05:37,160
Speaker 17: encouraging families like Jo says to come.

983
01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:38,920
Speaker 1: Well, look.

984
01:05:44,280 --> 01:05:48,000
Speaker 18: The idea that I'm going to say, which I would

985
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:51,640
Speaker 18: never do. If an unaccompanied child ends up at the border,

986
01:05:51,640 --> 01:05:53,480
Speaker 18: We're just gonna let him starve to death and stay

987
01:05:53,480 --> 01:05:59,920
Speaker 18: on the other side. No previous administrations dead either except Trump.

988
01:06:00,880 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 18: I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to

989
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:07,160
Speaker 18: do it. That's why I've asked the Vice President of

990
01:06:07,160 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 18: the United States yesterday to be the lead person I'm

991
01:06:11,680 --> 01:06:18,080
Speaker 18: dealing with focusing on the fundamental reasons why people leave Honduras, Guatemala,

992
01:06:18,200 --> 01:06:19,800
Speaker 18: or Salvadora in the first place.

993
01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:22,560
Speaker 7: In the coming months, some of which I covered for

994
01:06:22,600 --> 01:06:26,400
Speaker 7: an op ed in NBC about the Biden Administration's cruel

995
01:06:26,400 --> 01:06:29,200
Speaker 7: treatment of Haitian migrants. Things on the border didn't get

996
01:06:29,240 --> 01:06:32,959
Speaker 7: any better. Biden deported more Haitian people in a few

997
01:06:32,960 --> 01:06:36,200
Speaker 7: weeks than the Trump administration did in a year, eight

998
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:39,480
Speaker 7: hundred and ninety five people reporting in twenty twenty versus

999
01:06:39,520 --> 01:06:42,800
Speaker 7: more than one two hundred people. From January twentieth to

1000
01:06:42,920 --> 01:06:47,240
Speaker 7: March twenty second, twenty twenty one. While making declarations about

1001
01:06:47,240 --> 01:06:51,320
Speaker 7: showing compassion to migrants, the Biden administration packed Haitians onto

1002
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:54,600
Speaker 7: crowded planes and buses and sent them back to Haiti

1003
01:06:54,680 --> 01:06:58,280
Speaker 7: in the middle of the pandemic. In March, the US

1004
01:06:58,320 --> 01:07:03,120
Speaker 7: sent another pointed invitation to Haitians. The US Embassy in

1005
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:06,320
Speaker 7: Haiti tweeted a picture President Joe Biden looking off into

1006
01:07:06,320 --> 01:07:08,880
Speaker 7: the distance with a caption in both English and Haitian Creole.

1007
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:15,800
Speaker 7: In Creole, it read wing kadi sa bienkie pavini. The

1008
01:07:15,840 --> 01:07:17,240
Speaker 7: translation above it was.

1009
01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:20,439
Speaker 12: I can say quite clearly don't come over.

1010
01:07:22,120 --> 01:07:26,240
Speaker 7: In July of that year, Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Majorcas,

1011
01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:29,560
Speaker 7: himself a child of parents who fled from Cuba, said

1012
01:07:29,600 --> 01:07:32,800
Speaker 7: that Haitians and Cubans fleeing unrest in their countries will

1013
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:35,280
Speaker 7: not find safety in the US even if they have

1014
01:07:35,320 --> 01:07:38,280
Speaker 7: a credible claim for asylum, and especially if they flee

1015
01:07:38,320 --> 01:07:41,760
Speaker 7: by sea. In doing so, he was echoing statements to

1016
01:07:41,800 --> 01:07:45,720
Speaker 7: the US broadcast from planes flying over Haiti following the

1017
01:07:45,760 --> 01:07:49,880
Speaker 7: devastating earthquake in twenty ten. Following these announcements, the US

1018
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:52,760
Speaker 7: diverted resources that it could have used to help people

1019
01:07:52,760 --> 01:07:55,040
Speaker 7: from suffering in a country which have been destroyed by

1020
01:07:55,040 --> 01:07:59,919
Speaker 7: a natural disaster to stop them coming to this country.

1021
01:08:00,120 --> 01:08:04,160
Speaker 7: He was also overlooking that under both international and domestic law,

1022
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:07,160
Speaker 7: asylum seekersts are entitled to make claims no matter how

1023
01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:10,240
Speaker 7: they enter the country. Here's what Mayoka said at his

1024
01:08:10,280 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 7: press conference.

1025
01:08:11,480 --> 01:08:14,360
Speaker 12: Allow me to be clear, if you take to the sea,

1026
01:08:14,720 --> 01:08:16,920
Speaker 12: you will not come to the United States.

1027
01:08:17,320 --> 01:08:20,320
Speaker 7: Part of this hardline is because of a perceived crisis

1028
01:08:20,360 --> 01:08:22,760
Speaker 7: at the border. You don't have to go far on

1029
01:08:22,800 --> 01:08:25,120
Speaker 7: Twitter dot com before you run into people like Fox News.

1030
01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:28,200
Speaker 7: Is Bill Malugan yep, the tampon in the coffee guy

1031
01:08:28,240 --> 01:08:31,960
Speaker 7: is now a border reporter and he's shamelessly repeating CBP

1032
01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:35,439
Speaker 7: statistics about apprehensions on the southern border. Here he is

1033
01:08:35,720 --> 01:08:38,160
Speaker 7: talking to his buddy Tucker Carlson. Do you remember that guy?

1034
01:08:38,760 --> 01:08:41,679
Speaker 11: Bill Malujin has covered the border more closely than any

1035
01:08:41,720 --> 01:08:43,639
Speaker 11: reporter in the United States for the last two years,

1036
01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:47,960
Speaker 11: and today, in his estimation, the single largest caravan of

1037
01:08:48,040 --> 01:08:51,320
Speaker 11: illegal aliens flowing into this country in his two years

1038
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 11: of watching crossed. Today he broke the story. He's got

1039
01:08:54,160 --> 01:08:56,720
Speaker 11: remarkable video for us. He's live at the border now.

1040
01:08:57,080 --> 01:08:58,000
Speaker 1: Bill. Great to see you.

1041
01:08:58,040 --> 01:09:00,640
Speaker 19: What did you see, Tucker, Good evenings. You mentioned it

1042
01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:03,120
Speaker 19: right off the top. This was easily the biggest group

1043
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:06,000
Speaker 19: we have ever seen during our nineteen months of covering

1044
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:09,000
Speaker 19: this border crisis. And they all crossed illegally into El

1045
01:09:09,040 --> 01:09:11,679
Speaker 19: Paso last night, and we got some pretty wild camera

1046
01:09:11,720 --> 01:09:13,120
Speaker 19: footage to show you. Take a look at this. This

1047
01:09:13,240 --> 01:09:16,719
Speaker 19: was last night in ol Paso. A massive caravan, over

1048
01:09:17,120 --> 01:09:21,200
Speaker 19: one thousand illegal immigrants crossing into l Paso last night.

1049
01:09:21,240 --> 01:09:23,559
Speaker 19: Local media they're reporting it was potentially up to two

1050
01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:26,679
Speaker 19: thousand people and that it was possibly the biggest mass

1051
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:29,360
Speaker 19: crossing in the city's history. Now, as you look at

1052
01:09:29,360 --> 01:09:32,080
Speaker 19: the video, you'll see just wave after wave after wave

1053
01:09:32,280 --> 01:09:35,360
Speaker 19: of these people walking across the river and then gathering

1054
01:09:35,400 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 19: on the US side of the river where they kind

1055
01:09:37,120 --> 01:09:39,040
Speaker 19: of form a single file line.

1056
01:09:39,160 --> 01:09:42,120
Speaker 7: But it's not just Fox News doing this. You'll see

1057
01:09:42,200 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 7: MPR and other more liberal outlets quoting these same statistics

1058
01:09:46,320 --> 01:09:51,599
Speaker 7: without the necessary context. They're not lying. Apprehensions are higher,

1059
01:09:52,120 --> 01:09:55,080
Speaker 7: but that is in some part because migrants are now

1060
01:09:55,120 --> 01:09:58,920
Speaker 7: crossing more than once. In twenty nineteen, before Title forty

1061
01:09:58,920 --> 01:10:01,960
Speaker 7: two went into effect, seven percent of migrants apprehended by

1062
01:10:01,960 --> 01:10:06,280
Speaker 7: the Border Patrol had previously been apprehended. The reapprehension rate

1063
01:10:06,320 --> 01:10:09,559
Speaker 7: grew to twenty seven percent in fiscal year twenty twenty two.

1064
01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:12,400
Speaker 7: This is because we're expelling people to places where they

1065
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:14,759
Speaker 7: have no hope of a better future and not leaving

1066
01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:17,519
Speaker 7: them with many options other than to try again in

1067
01:10:17,600 --> 01:10:23,120
Speaker 7: more remote and risky settings. Meanwhile, there's much less concern

1068
01:10:23,760 --> 01:10:26,160
Speaker 7: from the right and from Democrats at the fact that

1069
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:29,840
Speaker 7: Ukrainians are exempted from Title forty two, and Russians and

1070
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:33,680
Speaker 7: Ukrainians generally experience expedited processing of the sort which one

1071
01:10:33,720 --> 01:10:36,000
Speaker 7: would hope this country could offer to other people escaping

1072
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:40,080
Speaker 7: conflicts around the world, including many that we started. I

1073
01:10:40,120 --> 01:10:43,559
Speaker 7: asked my friend Gustavo Solis, a border investigative reporter at

1074
01:10:43,640 --> 01:10:47,240
Speaker 7: KPBS in San Diego, to summarize the Biden administration to

1075
01:10:47,280 --> 01:10:48,639
Speaker 7: take on Title forty two.

1076
01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:51,360
Speaker 20: Now, on paper of the rationalists, there's a pandemic going on.

1077
01:10:51,439 --> 01:10:54,120
Speaker 20: We need to stop or slow the spread of COVID nineteen.

1078
01:10:54,680 --> 01:10:58,240
Speaker 20: So because of this extraordinary circumstance, we need Title forty

1079
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:03,400
Speaker 20: two to shore up the order that was bullshit, and

1080
01:11:03,479 --> 01:11:06,959
Speaker 20: we know that now through reporting that it was total bullshit.

1081
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:11,200
Speaker 20: We know that from as early as twenty eighteen, Stephen Miller,

1082
01:11:11,240 --> 01:11:16,000
Speaker 20: Trump's White House aid wanted to use Title forty two

1083
01:11:15,800 --> 01:11:20,200
Speaker 20: to stop this type of migration. We know that Vice

1084
01:11:20,240 --> 01:11:23,440
Speaker 20: President Mike Pence pressured the top doctors at the CDC

1085
01:11:24,240 --> 01:11:27,000
Speaker 20: into doing this, basically saying, if you don't do this,

1086
01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:29,800
Speaker 20: you might lose your job. Because even then in March

1087
01:11:29,840 --> 01:11:32,840
Speaker 20: twenty twenty, doctors at the CDC knew that there was

1088
01:11:32,880 --> 01:11:35,360
Speaker 20: no real public health rationale for this. I mean, if

1089
01:11:35,400 --> 01:11:37,639
Speaker 20: you look at the order, it's supposed to stop COVID,

1090
01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:41,400
Speaker 20: but there weren't any exceptions for migrants who were vaccinated

1091
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:45,720
Speaker 20: or there was no testing component to it. So that's

1092
01:11:45,800 --> 01:11:48,600
Speaker 20: kind of the beginning of Title forty two. By the

1093
01:11:48,600 --> 01:11:51,360
Speaker 20: time Biden came in office, Biden had promised to end

1094
01:11:51,400 --> 01:11:55,439
Speaker 20: it along with Roman in Mexico and restore the humane

1095
01:11:55,479 --> 01:11:59,280
Speaker 20: asylum system. But he kept Title forty two in place.

1096
01:11:59,320 --> 01:12:01,760
Speaker 20: And he didn't just keep it in place, he expanded

1097
01:12:01,800 --> 01:12:05,360
Speaker 20: it to include nationalities that weren't included when Trump first

1098
01:12:05,439 --> 01:12:06,080
Speaker 20: rolled it out.

1099
01:12:06,479 --> 01:12:08,920
Speaker 7: Even as a legal battle went back and forth, another

1100
01:12:09,000 --> 01:12:12,559
Speaker 7: major bottleneck emerged in a migration system in the form

1101
01:12:12,600 --> 01:12:15,920
Speaker 7: of never ending clusterfuck. That is the CBP one app.

1102
01:12:16,080 --> 01:12:18,800
Speaker 7: Again a let Gustavo explain his reporting here.

1103
01:12:19,360 --> 01:12:22,400
Speaker 20: It actually kind of started with the Ukrainians. That was

1104
01:12:22,840 --> 01:12:26,400
Speaker 20: kind of how they started using it for the asylum context.

1105
01:12:26,439 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 20: But CBP one is essentially a phone app for asylum,

1106
01:12:33,479 --> 01:12:36,400
Speaker 20: and on paper it kind of makes sense, right instead

1107
01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:39,680
Speaker 20: of like, you know, Joe Biden and the Dems are

1108
01:12:39,760 --> 01:12:42,360
Speaker 20: really terrified of the optics of a lot of people

1109
01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:46,320
Speaker 20: at the border, and they a lot of their policy

1110
01:12:46,600 --> 01:12:50,240
Speaker 20: is revolved around stopping that right. They don't want masses

1111
01:12:50,240 --> 01:12:54,120
Speaker 20: of people at the border. The CBP one app aims

1112
01:12:54,160 --> 01:12:56,960
Speaker 20: to address that by telling micros, hey, instead of coming

1113
01:12:56,960 --> 01:12:58,839
Speaker 20: all the way to Mexico and showing up the border,

1114
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:03,080
Speaker 20: just download this app and schedule an appointment to come here,

1115
01:13:03,840 --> 01:13:06,519
Speaker 20: and we'll let you to see if you're eligible for

1116
01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:12,920
Speaker 20: asylum or not. Another example of a policy in Washington,

1117
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:16,720
Speaker 20: DC that has no reality in what's going on the

1118
01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:22,639
Speaker 20: border because migrants live in shelters with really bad Wi

1119
01:13:22,680 --> 01:13:28,559
Speaker 20: Fi access, and they have crappy phones. So what I've

1120
01:13:28,600 --> 01:13:31,920
Speaker 20: found in the reporting is that CBP one rewards people

1121
01:13:31,960 --> 01:13:34,960
Speaker 20: with the best phones, not necessarily people who are most vulnerable.

1122
01:13:35,439 --> 01:13:38,160
Speaker 20: And the story I came out with last week was

1123
01:13:38,200 --> 01:13:41,120
Speaker 20: about how data from the Mexican government shows that at

1124
01:13:41,200 --> 01:13:45,240
Speaker 20: least in Tijuana, about forty four percent of every migrant

1125
01:13:45,240 --> 01:13:47,800
Speaker 20: who has gotten a CBP one application to enter the

1126
01:13:47,840 --> 01:13:52,559
Speaker 20: country is a Russian national, and Russian nationals makeup at

1127
01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:56,879
Speaker 20: most ten percent of the overall migrant population in Tijuana.

1128
01:13:56,920 --> 01:14:02,240
Speaker 20: So you have this situation where a relatively affluent ten

1129
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:06,080
Speaker 20: percent of the population is getting almost half of these

1130
01:14:06,160 --> 01:14:09,360
Speaker 20: humanitarian protection appointments that are designed for the world's most

1131
01:14:09,439 --> 01:14:13,519
Speaker 20: vulnerable people. And that's what if you one does like

1132
01:14:13,640 --> 01:14:17,040
Speaker 20: it they call it the Ticketmaster of asylum, and that's

1133
01:14:17,080 --> 01:14:20,799
Speaker 20: not a compliment. That is like ticketmaster fucking sucks. Nobody

1134
01:14:20,920 --> 01:14:21,320
Speaker 20: likes it.

1135
01:14:21,760 --> 01:14:24,600
Speaker 7: I also spoke to Caba, an activist who participated a

1136
01:14:24,680 --> 01:14:27,240
Speaker 7: mutual aid at the border. We talked about the app

1137
01:14:27,439 --> 01:14:30,519
Speaker 7: because Caba has some professional insight into the technologies used.

1138
01:14:31,120 --> 01:14:34,240
Speaker 8: I do data science and machine learning the native things

1139
01:14:34,280 --> 01:14:39,600
Speaker 8: for a living. And the problem of building these systems

1140
01:14:39,640 --> 01:14:44,000
Speaker 8: trained entirely on databases of white faces and then the

1141
01:14:44,160 --> 01:14:51,719
Speaker 8: motain working for people, you know, the backgrounds is very

1142
01:14:51,760 --> 01:14:54,880
Speaker 8: well known in this field. That is a very well

1143
01:14:54,920 --> 01:14:59,479
Speaker 8: documented issue for more than a decade. And anyone that

1144
01:14:59,520 --> 01:15:01,720
Speaker 8: could tell you by building a facial recognition or some

1145
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:05,560
Speaker 8: kind of a camera app that does image processing and

1146
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:07,680
Speaker 8: and I'm only training it on my face, is it

1147
01:15:08,040 --> 01:15:10,519
Speaker 8: like that this is a This is not something that

1148
01:15:10,640 --> 01:15:14,000
Speaker 8: I think any competent, separate development house would have done

1149
01:15:14,240 --> 01:15:18,679
Speaker 8: and not expected. So I have a hard time believing

1150
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:22,320
Speaker 8: that the whole chain of everyone's had to go through

1151
01:15:22,360 --> 01:15:26,280
Speaker 8: from the developers on up to you know, anyone who

1152
01:15:26,400 --> 01:15:30,400
Speaker 8: does it or you know has authority of these things

1153
01:15:30,479 --> 01:15:35,400
Speaker 8: at CBP or Homland Security. This is just it's it's

1154
01:15:35,439 --> 01:15:39,280
Speaker 8: it's like, I don't know, it's it's, it's, it's it's

1155
01:15:39,320 --> 01:15:41,240
Speaker 8: hard to believe that this was enough.

1156
01:15:42,640 --> 01:15:45,160
Speaker 7: Anyway, before we get too far from discussing things to

1157
01:15:45,280 --> 01:15:50,559
Speaker 7: fucking suck, he's an advertising break. You might be wondering

1158
01:15:50,600 --> 01:15:53,040
Speaker 7: why Title forty two is ending now and how we

1159
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:55,200
Speaker 7: got here, given there seems to be a consensus in

1160
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:57,360
Speaker 7: DC that the border is in crisis, and that that

1161
01:15:57,479 --> 01:15:59,479
Speaker 7: crisis is not that people were leaving to die on

1162
01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:01,559
Speaker 7: the streets the other side or in the deserts of

1163
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:05,080
Speaker 7: California and Arizona, but the people were allowing to come

1164
01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:08,000
Speaker 7: to the richest country that's ever existed from countries that

1165
01:16:08,040 --> 01:16:10,720
Speaker 7: we've destabilized for decades to have a chance of a

1166
01:16:10,720 --> 01:16:14,800
Speaker 7: decent life. Well, the answer is complicated. Some of it's

1167
01:16:14,800 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 7: a bit too complicated for me to really spend the

1168
01:16:16,960 --> 01:16:19,519
Speaker 7: time explaining, and you don't really need to know the

1169
01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:22,360
Speaker 7: ins and outs of court cases to understand that. Essentially,

1170
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:26,000
Speaker 7: the Biden administration had planned to end Title forty two

1171
01:16:26,680 --> 01:16:30,200
Speaker 7: in late twenty twenty two, right after the midterms. Title

1172
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:33,280
Speaker 7: forty two actually became theoretically unenforceable in November of that

1173
01:16:33,400 --> 01:16:36,120
Speaker 7: year thanks to a court ruling, but the Supreme Court

1174
01:16:36,120 --> 01:16:39,000
Speaker 7: in December prevented the Biden administration from ending Title forty two,

1175
01:16:39,600 --> 01:16:41,559
Speaker 7: while the Justice is considered a request by a group

1176
01:16:41,600 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 7: of Republican led states that want to continue the expulsions,

1177
01:16:45,120 --> 01:16:49,080
Speaker 7: which had previously been decaarred unlawful by lower court. Biden's

1178
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:52,320
Speaker 7: Department of Justice had previously defended Title forty two as

1179
01:16:52,360 --> 01:16:55,240
Speaker 7: necessary to public health, but by the end of twenty

1180
01:16:55,280 --> 01:16:57,840
Speaker 7: twenty two, they were ready to end enforcement a Title

1181
01:16:57,880 --> 01:17:00,160
Speaker 7: forty two politically, even if there were no way when

1182
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:04,599
Speaker 7: near prepared on the ground. A coalition of Republican led states, however,

1183
01:17:04,800 --> 01:17:06,880
Speaker 7: managed to get a federal judge in Louisiana to prevent

1184
01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:10,280
Speaker 7: officials fremending Title forty two, saying the Biden administration and

1185
01:17:10,280 --> 01:17:14,400
Speaker 7: had not taken adequate steps required to terminate the policy. Then,

1186
01:17:14,439 --> 01:17:17,240
Speaker 7: on November fifteenth, another federal judge declared Title forty two

1187
01:17:17,240 --> 01:17:19,920
Speaker 7: are lawful, saying the CDC had not properly explained the

1188
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:22,720
Speaker 7: policy's public health ration art or considered its impact on

1189
01:17:22,760 --> 01:17:26,120
Speaker 7: asylum seekers. At the request of the Biden administration, the

1190
01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:29,240
Speaker 7: judge gave border officials five weeks until December the twenty

1191
01:17:29,280 --> 01:17:33,719
Speaker 7: first to end Title forty two nineteen, Republican led States

1192
01:17:33,800 --> 01:17:37,120
Speaker 7: asked several courts to delay Title forty two's resision indefinitely,

1193
01:17:37,760 --> 01:17:41,600
Speaker 7: warning that chaos would otherwise ensue. After their request was

1194
01:17:41,600 --> 01:17:44,320
Speaker 7: denied by lower courts, the States asked a Supreme Court

1195
01:17:44,360 --> 01:17:47,760
Speaker 7: to intervene. On December twenty seventh, the Supreme Court said

1196
01:17:47,760 --> 01:17:50,080
Speaker 7: it would suspend the lower court order that found Title

1197
01:17:50,120 --> 01:17:53,200
Speaker 7: forty two to be illegal until it decided whether the

1198
01:17:53,240 --> 01:17:55,880
Speaker 7: Republican led States should be allowed to intervene in the case.

1199
01:17:56,320 --> 01:17:59,760
Speaker 7: That's some Christmas spirit for you. Eventually, with the end

1200
01:17:59,800 --> 01:18:02,840
Speaker 7: of the federal emergency over COVID nineteen, Title forty two

1201
01:18:03,040 --> 01:18:06,400
Speaker 7: just kind of went away. Customs and Border Protection, the

1202
01:18:06,439 --> 01:18:08,840
Speaker 7: federal agency which put up the most staunch resistance to

1203
01:18:08,920 --> 01:18:12,560
Speaker 7: vaccine mandates, would begin processing migrants under Title eight of

1204
01:18:12,680 --> 01:18:15,559
Speaker 7: US immigration law on the eleventh of May twenty twenty three.

1205
01:18:16,360 --> 01:18:19,360
Speaker 7: I'll let them summarize what they see this to mean.

1206
01:18:20,000 --> 01:18:24,559
Speaker 7: According to the USCIS website, individuals who unlawfully cross the

1207
01:18:24,560 --> 01:18:28,840
Speaker 7: Southwest border will generally be processed under Title eight expedited

1208
01:18:28,920 --> 01:18:32,920
Speaker 7: removal authorities. In a matter of days, they will be

1209
01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:35,120
Speaker 7: barred from re entry to the United States for at

1210
01:18:35,200 --> 01:18:38,280
Speaker 7: least five years if ordered removed, and they will be

1211
01:18:38,320 --> 01:18:42,719
Speaker 7: presumed ineligible for asylum under the proposed Circumvention of Lawful

1212
01:18:42,760 --> 01:18:47,880
Speaker 7: Pathways regulation absent and applicable exception. What this means is,

1213
01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:51,840
Speaker 7: if you cross into the United States not of the pordamentry,

1214
01:18:51,960 --> 01:18:55,479
Speaker 7: you will be assumed ineligible for asylum and the process

1215
01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:58,040
Speaker 7: to remove you from the United States will begin immediately.

1216
01:18:58,800 --> 01:19:00,639
Speaker 7: You have a chance to file a de into asylum

1217
01:19:00,680 --> 01:19:04,200
Speaker 7: claim against that, but the process could be rushed and

1218
01:19:04,280 --> 01:19:09,040
Speaker 7: more difficult. Despite this and having almost three years to repair,

1219
01:19:09,720 --> 01:19:14,080
Speaker 7: they were by no means. Ready, let's hear from Gustavo again. Gustavo,

1220
01:19:14,120 --> 01:19:17,720
Speaker 7: can you explain to us a little bit about what

1221
01:19:17,800 --> 01:19:20,800
Speaker 7: you found that by the administration has been planning for

1222
01:19:20,920 --> 01:19:22,320
Speaker 7: the end of Title forty two.

1223
01:19:23,479 --> 01:19:26,320
Speaker 20: Yeah, what I found is they haven't really been doing

1224
01:19:26,400 --> 01:19:30,040
Speaker 20: much planning, right, I mean they talk about I think

1225
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:34,040
Speaker 20: with Title forty two, it's a clear example of immigration

1226
01:19:34,160 --> 01:19:38,800
Speaker 20: policy being decided in Washington and no one really from

1227
01:19:38,800 --> 01:19:43,040
Speaker 20: the border being involved or told what's going on. So, like,

1228
01:19:43,080 --> 01:19:48,080
Speaker 20: I think it was last week the HS Secretary Majorca

1229
01:19:48,640 --> 01:19:51,000
Speaker 20: did this press release about what they're doing in terms

1230
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:56,080
Speaker 20: of processing centers in Guatemala and Colombia so people can

1231
01:19:56,160 --> 01:19:58,080
Speaker 20: just go there instead of coming all the way to

1232
01:19:58,120 --> 01:20:01,519
Speaker 20: the border, which actually there have been timelines of when

1233
01:20:01,520 --> 01:20:04,400
Speaker 20: those will open. But they had asked all these things

1234
01:20:04,439 --> 01:20:07,360
Speaker 20: for like big picture things, right, to stop people from

1235
01:20:07,360 --> 01:20:10,280
Speaker 20: coming in the first place, expanding some legal pathways, like

1236
01:20:10,439 --> 01:20:13,320
Speaker 20: making it easier for people with families already here to

1237
01:20:13,360 --> 01:20:18,040
Speaker 20: get sponsors, fixing some of the little things with CVP one,

1238
01:20:18,920 --> 01:20:23,240
Speaker 20: but they don't talk about like on the ground logistics right. So,

1239
01:20:23,320 --> 01:20:26,400
Speaker 20: for example, I went to Tijuana to talk to the

1240
01:20:26,439 --> 01:20:30,200
Speaker 20: head of the Department of Migrant Affairs there who told

1241
01:20:30,240 --> 01:20:33,679
Speaker 20: me this, and I checked with him yesterday morning, who said,

1242
01:20:34,280 --> 01:20:37,200
Speaker 20: still to this day, less than forty eight hours before

1243
01:20:37,200 --> 01:20:39,719
Speaker 20: Title forty two ends, he doesn't know how many migrants

1244
01:20:39,760 --> 01:20:42,799
Speaker 20: CBP will allow to cross through the ports of entry

1245
01:20:42,920 --> 01:20:48,080
Speaker 20: in Sandy Seerro. His guess is that maybe two hundred,

1246
01:20:48,080 --> 01:20:49,920
Speaker 20: because that's kind of the number that they floated around

1247
01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:53,200
Speaker 20: in December when they originally wanted to get rid of

1248
01:20:53,200 --> 01:20:56,639
Speaker 20: Title forty two before their lawsuit. And if it's two hundred,

1249
01:20:56,680 --> 01:20:59,519
Speaker 20: he basically said, Tijuana is going to be screwed because

1250
01:21:00,080 --> 01:21:02,679
Speaker 20: two hundred doesn't even cover the number of new migrants

1251
01:21:02,720 --> 01:21:05,960
Speaker 20: coming in and deporties being sent to Tijuana. So it's

1252
01:21:06,000 --> 01:21:09,639
Speaker 20: gonna like we have this bottleneck of migration in Tijuana

1253
01:21:09,680 --> 01:21:12,439
Speaker 20: and all over the border because of Title forty two.

1254
01:21:12,439 --> 01:21:14,479
Speaker 20: For the last three years, no one's been able to move.

1255
01:21:15,880 --> 01:21:18,479
Speaker 20: And if they just open it up to two hundred people,

1256
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:20,640
Speaker 20: that's not really going to address any of the bottleneck.

1257
01:21:21,680 --> 01:21:25,000
Speaker 7: Right There's like, I think, is it sixteen thousand people

1258
01:21:25,400 --> 01:21:28,479
Speaker 7: are waiting like an asylum application right now?

1259
01:21:28,560 --> 01:21:28,760
Speaker 1: Yeah?

1260
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:29,040
Speaker 21: Yeah.

1261
01:21:29,160 --> 01:21:32,400
Speaker 20: I hear different numbers throwing around, like ten, thy, fifteen, sixteen,

1262
01:21:32,800 --> 01:21:34,920
Speaker 20: and nobody really knows because there's like a network of

1263
01:21:34,920 --> 01:21:37,960
Speaker 20: official shelters, and there's a bunch of unofficial shelters, and

1264
01:21:38,040 --> 01:21:40,960
Speaker 20: there's a bunch of Russian dudes staying in hotels in airbnbs.

1265
01:21:41,200 --> 01:21:44,959
Speaker 20: But I think, yeah, tens of thousands. I think sixteen

1266
01:21:45,000 --> 01:21:46,559
Speaker 20: is an accurate number.

1267
01:21:47,120 --> 01:21:48,920
Speaker 7: I think it's intructive here to listen to the Fox

1268
01:21:48,960 --> 01:21:51,600
Speaker 7: News coverage of this and how much Secretary of my

1269
01:21:51,720 --> 01:21:53,720
Speaker 7: Orcus tries to panda to them.

1270
01:21:53,720 --> 01:21:57,280
Speaker 20: Want to be very clear, our borders are not open.

1271
01:21:57,400 --> 01:22:00,800
Speaker 22: Home in Security Secretary Alejandro Majorcis said when Title forty

1272
01:22:00,800 --> 01:22:03,760
Speaker 22: two expires at midnight tonight, anyone who arrives at the

1273
01:22:03,800 --> 01:22:08,160
Speaker 22: southern border will be presumed ineligible for asylum and face consequences.

1274
01:22:08,479 --> 01:22:12,400
Speaker 22: But withholding facilities already overwhelmed, the administration is ratcheting up

1275
01:22:12,439 --> 01:22:15,919
Speaker 22: tough rhetoric while also clearing the way for mass releases

1276
01:22:15,960 --> 01:22:19,479
Speaker 22: into US communities with no way for authorities to track people.

1277
01:22:19,720 --> 01:22:22,000
Speaker 22: You said at the beginning that you've prepared for this

1278
01:22:22,160 --> 01:22:25,439
Speaker 22: moment for almost two years. So why is part of

1279
01:22:25,439 --> 01:22:27,160
Speaker 22: that plan and honor system.

1280
01:22:28,000 --> 01:22:29,880
Speaker 1: Oh, it is not an honor system.

1281
01:22:30,000 --> 01:22:32,879
Speaker 20: They are a subject of our apprehension efforts.

1282
01:22:32,920 --> 01:22:35,880
Speaker 22: But under parole release authorized by the US Border Patrol

1283
01:22:35,960 --> 01:22:39,599
Speaker 22: Chief last night, migrants do not receive an alien registration

1284
01:22:39,720 --> 01:22:42,120
Speaker 22: number for authorities to track them. They don't even get

1285
01:22:42,120 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 22: a court date. Instead, migrants are asked to turn themselves

1286
01:22:45,040 --> 01:22:49,280
Speaker 22: into Ice within sixty days to start immigration proceedings on themselves.

1287
01:22:49,360 --> 01:22:50,640
Speaker 2: The American people are watching this.

1288
01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:51,920
Speaker 10: They know what they see.

1289
01:22:52,040 --> 01:22:53,479
Speaker 23: They see a wide open border.

1290
01:22:53,520 --> 01:22:57,000
Speaker 22: Florida's Attorney General is suing the administration, arguing the parole

1291
01:22:57,040 --> 01:22:59,920
Speaker 22: plan is identical to a policy a federal judge struck

1292
01:23:00,120 --> 01:23:01,280
Speaker 22: down earlier this year.

1293
01:23:01,439 --> 01:23:03,639
Speaker 1: You have confidence in the lawfulness of our actions.

1294
01:23:03,760 --> 01:23:06,519
Speaker 22: Plans to release migrants at bus stops, gas stations, and

1295
01:23:06,600 --> 01:23:09,920
Speaker 22: supermarkets was first detailed last year, according to a memo

1296
01:23:10,080 --> 01:23:13,760
Speaker 22: uncovered by the Florida Legal Proceedings. Today, Texas Governor Greg

1297
01:23:13,800 --> 01:23:17,160
Speaker 22: Abbott sent a busload of migrants to the Vice President's Residents.

1298
01:23:17,680 --> 01:23:21,120
Speaker 7: Greg Abbot's disgusting antics aside, there was a real attempt

1299
01:23:21,160 --> 01:23:23,760
Speaker 7: by the Biden deministration to come to Republican side on

1300
01:23:23,840 --> 01:23:27,320
Speaker 7: migration that we can see clearly here in the hours

1301
01:23:27,320 --> 01:23:30,920
Speaker 7: before we expected Title forty two to die. Folks like

1302
01:23:31,000 --> 01:23:34,839
Speaker 7: me who cover the border made plans the day before.

1303
01:23:35,240 --> 01:23:38,240
Speaker 7: On the tenth, Majorcas announced the Title forty two would

1304
01:23:38,240 --> 01:23:41,800
Speaker 7: be enforced up until eleven fifty nine pm Eastern time,

1305
01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:46,200
Speaker 7: and in San Diego, Border Patrol offices closed down the

1306
01:23:46,240 --> 01:23:49,360
Speaker 7: port of entry at Sandy Sedra, the border town just

1307
01:23:49,400 --> 01:23:52,519
Speaker 7: south of San Diego, for a training exercise in which

1308
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:54,519
Speaker 7: they lined up in front of the cars waiting to

1309
01:23:54,520 --> 01:24:00,760
Speaker 7: cross the border with plexiglass shields and riotgear. Meanwhile, in

1310
01:24:00,800 --> 01:24:04,280
Speaker 7: between the two thirty football offenses that divide San Asidra

1311
01:24:04,360 --> 01:24:11,280
Speaker 7: from Tijuana, Board of Patrol began corraling migrants Afghans, Colombians, Vietnamese,

1312
01:24:11,400 --> 01:24:16,200
Speaker 7: Koreans and Golan Sudanese Tagiks and Congolese people all shared

1313
01:24:16,240 --> 01:24:18,600
Speaker 7: little more than a few tarps and cardboard boxes for

1314
01:24:18,640 --> 01:24:22,760
Speaker 7: shelter as they waited for something to happen. Despite having

1315
01:24:22,800 --> 01:24:25,840
Speaker 7: months to repair in years to plan, it appears at

1316
01:24:25,880 --> 01:24:28,400
Speaker 7: Department of Home Land Security totally failed to create so

1317
01:24:28,520 --> 01:24:31,799
Speaker 7: much as a scrap of shade or shelter, and instead

1318
01:24:31,880 --> 01:24:35,519
Speaker 7: chose to house people detain pending processing in the open air.

1319
01:24:36,240 --> 01:24:38,599
Speaker 7: In tomorrow's episode, We'll hear from some.

1320
01:24:38,520 --> 01:24:45,559
Speaker 24: Of them went on yelling and Genlink Bob, Molly, it's

1321
01:24:45,600 --> 01:24:49,000
Speaker 24: going off, not going likely, and Elma see im for

1322
01:24:49,080 --> 01:24:54,080
Speaker 24: the sky and Mama said, some push free and for

1323
01:24:54,280 --> 01:24:57,400
Speaker 24: them must smile them. No, no, i'must and Red vie

1324
01:24:57,479 --> 01:25:03,240
Speaker 24: Gannata gonna watch me. Hey man, grateful man, grateful I

1325
01:25:03,520 --> 01:25:07,960
Speaker 24: when not in an aguan MANASMI Yeah, once there is

1326
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:11,400
Speaker 24: a live got a'll want give me everything for some

1327
01:25:11,640 --> 01:25:16,840
Speaker 24: five Yeah love sakries pick up to dom, I got

1328
01:25:16,840 --> 01:25:20,280
Speaker 24: to eat on combakom sin Yeah man, that's it one

1329
01:25:20,400 --> 01:25:21,679
Speaker 24: love Oh.

1330
01:25:22,280 --> 01:25:24,760
Speaker 7: On the eleventh of May this year, title forty two

1331
01:25:24,840 --> 01:25:27,920
Speaker 7: finally ended. I stually began to write this episode the

1332
01:25:27,960 --> 01:25:30,400
Speaker 7: day before, on the tenth of May, but it was

1333
01:25:30,400 --> 01:25:33,000
Speaker 7: that day the DHS announced that Title forty two would

1334
01:25:33,000 --> 01:25:36,599
Speaker 7: be enforced until eight fifty nine pm Pacific or midnight Eastern.

1335
01:25:37,120 --> 01:25:39,479
Speaker 7: They kept Title forty two in place for every single

1336
01:25:39,560 --> 01:25:42,880
Speaker 7: minute they could, and that same day, five hundred active

1337
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:46,040
Speaker 7: duty troops arrived in El Paso and one thousand more

1338
01:25:46,080 --> 01:25:48,599
Speaker 7: set off for other border towns to join the two thousand,

1339
01:25:48,680 --> 01:25:52,400
Speaker 7: five hundred troops already deployed to the border. According to

1340
01:25:52,400 --> 01:25:55,120
Speaker 7: a press release from the Apartment of Homeland Security.

1341
01:25:55,120 --> 01:25:59,240
Speaker 12: CBP and US Immigration and Customs Enforcement are further expanding

1342
01:25:59,280 --> 01:26:03,120
Speaker 12: detention compared, ramping up removal flights, and shifting agents and

1343
01:26:03,160 --> 01:26:07,599
Speaker 12: officers to high priority regions along the southwest border. This week,

1344
01:26:07,720 --> 01:26:10,800
Speaker 12: CBP opened two new holding facilities, and the Department of

1345
01:26:10,840 --> 01:26:14,080
Speaker 12: Health and Human Services is increasing its bed capacity to

1346
01:26:14,120 --> 01:26:18,280
Speaker 12: prepare for a potential increase in unaccompanied children. DHS also

1347
01:26:18,360 --> 01:26:22,320
Speaker 12: launched targeted enforcement operations and high priority regions along the border,

1348
01:26:22,520 --> 01:26:26,040
Speaker 12: including El Paso, to quickly process migrants and place them

1349
01:26:26,040 --> 01:26:30,040
Speaker 12: in removal proceedings. DHS last week also announced over two

1350
01:26:30,160 --> 01:26:33,880
Speaker 12: hundred and fifty million dollars in additional assistance for communities

1351
01:26:33,920 --> 01:26:35,639
Speaker 12: receiving migrants.

1352
01:26:35,600 --> 01:26:38,120
Speaker 7: On the ground. This assistance and planning didn't exactly meet

1353
01:26:38,120 --> 01:26:41,080
Speaker 7: the task at hand, albeit the specific call out of

1354
01:26:41,120 --> 01:26:43,519
Speaker 7: El Paso does suggest that they saw their task as

1355
01:26:43,560 --> 01:26:46,879
Speaker 7: not looking bad. In the right wing media hitse Mordiere

1356
01:26:46,880 --> 01:26:49,320
Speaker 7: recorded after a couple of hours walking around talking to

1357
01:26:49,360 --> 01:26:52,960
Speaker 7: people at Santisedra, where Customs and Border Protection had detained

1358
01:26:53,000 --> 01:26:56,040
Speaker 7: around five hundred people in between the two thirty foot

1359
01:26:56,040 --> 01:26:59,000
Speaker 7: fences that make up the border between Santisedro and Tijuana.

1360
01:26:59,360 --> 01:27:02,320
Speaker 7: I'm just for people familiar with said, you've got like

1361
01:27:02,320 --> 01:27:07,320
Speaker 7: in the Tijuana River Valley park by International Hill, where

1362
01:27:07,400 --> 01:27:12,440
Speaker 7: border patrol are holding people in between the two border fences.

1363
01:27:12,920 --> 01:27:16,439
Speaker 7: For those who thought we didn't have a border wall

1364
01:27:16,840 --> 01:27:18,800
Speaker 7: or weren't having a border wall, we have at least two,

1365
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:23,200
Speaker 7: sometimes three, but right here we have two. People are

1366
01:27:23,240 --> 01:27:25,920
Speaker 7: being put in between these fences by border patrol. So

1367
01:27:26,040 --> 01:27:28,879
Speaker 7: I just spoke to some young Colombian women who had

1368
01:27:29,439 --> 01:27:34,360
Speaker 7: crossed about fifteen miles east of here and then being

1369
01:27:34,560 --> 01:27:36,800
Speaker 7: relocated here and there in between these border walls. They

1370
01:27:36,800 --> 01:27:39,519
Speaker 7: don't have running water. What food and water they have

1371
01:27:39,560 --> 01:27:42,720
Speaker 7: appear to be in surpied by volunteers on the northern side.

1372
01:27:43,200 --> 01:27:45,200
Speaker 7: They've just been given space blankets, but a lot of

1373
01:27:45,240 --> 01:27:48,360
Speaker 7: people are literally sleeping under bin bags right now. Blankets.

1374
01:27:49,320 --> 01:27:52,080
Speaker 7: It's pretty brief. There's one portal toilet sort of thing

1375
01:27:52,120 --> 01:27:54,519
Speaker 7: that we can see about five hundred people, So I

1376
01:27:54,640 --> 01:27:57,519
Speaker 7: kind of give you an idea of the conditions. Obviously

1377
01:27:57,600 --> 01:27:59,679
Speaker 7: those don't live up to the detention conditions at border

1378
01:27:59,720 --> 01:28:04,679
Speaker 7: patrol are supposed to hold people under. But here we are,

1379
01:28:04,840 --> 01:28:08,919
Speaker 7: I guess have just said that they're calling an ambulance.

1380
01:28:08,960 --> 01:28:11,160
Speaker 7: There have been a number of medical emergencies that nearly

1381
01:28:11,200 --> 01:28:15,240
Speaker 7: always are in these situations because you're holding people, you know,

1382
01:28:15,320 --> 01:28:18,280
Speaker 7: old people, young people, sick people, and they're in the

1383
01:28:18,320 --> 01:28:20,240
Speaker 7: sun all day, they're in the cold all night. If

1384
01:28:20,240 --> 01:28:22,479
Speaker 7: it rains, they get wet. If it's hot, they get hot,

1385
01:28:22,680 --> 01:28:26,040
Speaker 7: if it's cold, they get cold. Their little children were

1386
01:28:26,080 --> 01:28:30,120
Speaker 7: just asking me for a blanket a minute ago. She's

1387
01:28:30,120 --> 01:28:32,800
Speaker 7: always a pretty bleak thing. If you've not been here,

1388
01:28:32,920 --> 01:28:34,680
Speaker 7: you'd be forgiven for not knowing that. We have a

1389
01:28:34,680 --> 01:28:37,560
Speaker 7: double layer of wall separating us from our neighbors in Tijuana.

1390
01:28:38,080 --> 01:28:40,840
Speaker 7: Both sections are now the Trump period design. But we're

1391
01:28:40,880 --> 01:28:42,559
Speaker 7: standing in a place we're not so very long ago,

1392
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:45,400
Speaker 7: Nancy Reagan stood and said she hoped that they wouldn't

1393
01:28:45,400 --> 01:28:48,000
Speaker 7: be a fence here for very long. Now there are

1394
01:28:48,000 --> 01:28:51,400
Speaker 7: two towering walls and their little children stuck sleeping in

1395
01:28:51,400 --> 01:28:54,719
Speaker 7: the dust between them. Or the aid to these people

1396
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:57,000
Speaker 7: had to go through the wall, too, and that meant

1397
01:28:57,160 --> 01:28:59,479
Speaker 7: no hot meals because the gaps are smaller than a plate.

1398
01:29:00,400 --> 01:29:03,599
Speaker 7: Someone tried to bring tents, but they wouldn't fit. Everything

1399
01:29:03,640 --> 01:29:06,800
Speaker 7: from food to clothes to medical supplies had to go

1400
01:29:06,840 --> 01:29:10,080
Speaker 7: through the gaps in the wall. Hamara you Sephi, a

1401
01:29:10,160 --> 01:29:12,880
Speaker 7: volunteer from the Partnership for the Advancement of New Americans,

1402
01:29:13,520 --> 01:29:15,160
Speaker 7: described to me what she saw that night.

1403
01:29:15,680 --> 01:29:22,040
Speaker 14: I see about five hundred beautiful, smiling faces of people

1404
01:29:22,080 --> 01:29:28,480
Speaker 14: who are desperately trying to get to safety. And they're confused.

1405
01:29:28,760 --> 01:29:30,720
Speaker 14: They don't know what's going on. They don't know how

1406
01:29:30,800 --> 01:29:34,920
Speaker 14: long it will take them. You know, they many of

1407
01:29:34,960 --> 01:29:38,640
Speaker 14: them are aware that something is happening today. Many of

1408
01:29:38,680 --> 01:29:41,639
Speaker 14: them are asking, does this mean that I'll be turned back?

1409
01:29:42,080 --> 01:29:48,439
Speaker 14: What is going on? I see, you know, people who

1410
01:29:48,439 --> 01:29:52,719
Speaker 14: don't even have many kids, don't have shoes, they don't

1411
01:29:52,800 --> 01:29:56,960
Speaker 14: have I talked to individuals who lost everything on them.

1412
01:29:57,000 --> 01:30:00,160
Speaker 14: They don't have jackets. They're trying to cover themselves with

1413
01:30:00,200 --> 01:30:02,800
Speaker 14: any kind of covering that they have, some of them

1414
01:30:02,920 --> 01:30:08,040
Speaker 14: using trash bags, others using scarves and other types of

1415
01:30:08,080 --> 01:30:10,519
Speaker 14: things to cover themselves from the sun. We are in

1416
01:30:10,560 --> 01:30:12,599
Speaker 14: San Diego, so it's quite sunny here.

1417
01:30:13,160 --> 01:30:15,920
Speaker 7: The first thing I noticed on arrival was it dozens

1418
01:30:15,960 --> 01:30:18,960
Speaker 7: of hands sticking through the wall holding phones and charges.

1419
01:30:20,200 --> 01:30:22,479
Speaker 7: That's because people need to use the CBP one app

1420
01:30:22,520 --> 01:30:25,880
Speaker 7: to interact with border enforcement, but they've been detained by

1421
01:30:25,880 --> 01:30:28,479
Speaker 7: the same border enforcement in between two walls and an

1422
01:30:28,479 --> 01:30:32,599
Speaker 7: open field where there obviously isn't any electricity. They also

1423
01:30:32,600 --> 01:30:34,480
Speaker 7: need their phones to stay in touch with their families,

1424
01:30:34,880 --> 01:30:37,160
Speaker 7: to let them know they survived a difficult and dangerous

1425
01:30:37,240 --> 01:30:41,559
Speaker 7: journey and that they're now technically inside the USA. Here's

1426
01:30:41,560 --> 01:30:44,679
Speaker 7: the advert a CBP broadcast in Spanish to encourage asylum

1427
01:30:44,720 --> 01:30:47,240
Speaker 7: seekers to download the app before they put them in

1428
01:30:47,280 --> 01:30:48,920
Speaker 7: a place they couldn't charge their phones.

1429
01:30:49,360 --> 01:30:51,439
Speaker 5: Attencion migrane at.

1430
01:30:51,880 --> 01:30:55,719
Speaker 12: Attention migrants in Mexico City or further north in the country.

1431
01:30:56,240 --> 01:30:58,880
Speaker 12: Why do you need to download CBP one. It's a

1432
01:30:58,920 --> 01:31:01,680
Speaker 12: free and legal way to get an appointment guaranteed at

1433
01:31:01,680 --> 01:31:04,920
Speaker 12: a port of entry. It's a clear way to solicit asylum,

1434
01:31:05,040 --> 01:31:07,439
Speaker 12: and you have the possibility to work while your case

1435
01:31:07,520 --> 01:31:10,800
Speaker 12: is being processed. If you present without an appointment, you

1436
01:31:10,840 --> 01:31:13,960
Speaker 12: can be prohibited from entering the US for five years.

1437
01:31:14,320 --> 01:31:17,519
Speaker 12: You will be subject to expedite a deportation unless you

1438
01:31:17,560 --> 01:31:21,080
Speaker 12: comply with the strict requirements of the asylum process. In

1439
01:31:21,160 --> 01:31:24,120
Speaker 12: the majority of cases, it is assumed that migrants do

1440
01:31:24,200 --> 01:31:27,080
Speaker 12: not comply with the requirements for asylum, and you won't

1441
01:31:27,120 --> 01:31:29,439
Speaker 12: have the right to work unless you comply with the

1442
01:31:29,479 --> 01:31:32,719
Speaker 12: strict requirements. Again, if you are now in Mexico City

1443
01:31:32,840 --> 01:31:35,880
Speaker 12: or further north, download CBP one.

1444
01:31:37,400 --> 01:31:39,840
Speaker 7: As we heard yesterday, CBP one has been an a

1445
01:31:39,960 --> 01:31:43,160
Speaker 7: mitigated disaster and has shown a very clear bias towards

1446
01:31:43,160 --> 01:31:47,080
Speaker 7: certain types of wealthy and white asylum seekers. Despite that

1447
01:31:47,280 --> 01:31:48,800
Speaker 7: it seems to have been the only plan in place

1448
01:31:48,880 --> 01:31:51,759
Speaker 7: the end of Title forty two. The hundreds of people

1449
01:31:51,800 --> 01:31:55,479
Speaker 7: detained in between defenses humbly didn't have appointments, and with

1450
01:31:55,560 --> 01:31:57,960
Speaker 7: no way to charge their phones, they couldn't make them.

1451
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:00,760
Speaker 7: It's not clear of making them would have helped, as

1452
01:32:00,800 --> 01:32:03,200
Speaker 7: it seems that they were already being detained and thus

1453
01:32:03,240 --> 01:32:06,920
Speaker 7: they would have to file defensive asylum claims, effectively stopping

1454
01:32:06,920 --> 01:32:09,840
Speaker 7: the repatriation process by claiming that they couldn't safely be

1455
01:32:09,880 --> 01:32:12,639
Speaker 7: sent back to their country of origin. This is opposed

1456
01:32:12,680 --> 01:32:15,360
Speaker 7: to making an affirmative asylum claim that people should have

1457
01:32:15,400 --> 01:32:17,040
Speaker 7: been able to make at the border. With a CBP

1458
01:32:17,120 --> 01:32:20,200
Speaker 7: one appointment, these would not have to be argued with

1459
01:32:20,240 --> 01:32:24,680
Speaker 7: the threat of repatriation hanging over the person making the claim. Volunteers,

1460
01:32:24,880 --> 01:32:28,000
Speaker 7: local people, a mosque group, and a church group all

1461
01:32:28,040 --> 01:32:31,559
Speaker 7: showed up soon after CBP began dumping more people in

1462
01:32:31,600 --> 01:32:35,120
Speaker 7: between the fences. An hour after my own arrival. I'd

1463
01:32:35,120 --> 01:32:36,840
Speaker 7: given away all the charge cables that I had in

1464
01:32:36,880 --> 01:32:38,600
Speaker 7: my truck, which is a lot more charge cables than

1465
01:32:38,640 --> 01:32:41,000
Speaker 7: I thought I had in my truck, and all my

1466
01:32:41,120 --> 01:32:43,599
Speaker 7: charge bricks acrued over six years of getting free shared

1467
01:32:43,600 --> 01:32:46,840
Speaker 7: at the consumer electronics show in Las Vegas. Later, I

1468
01:32:46,840 --> 01:32:48,880
Speaker 7: came back with a massive solar generator that I'd like

1469
01:32:48,920 --> 01:32:50,559
Speaker 7: to use when I'm living off grid, But I still

1470
01:32:50,560 --> 01:32:54,120
Speaker 7: need to write stuff. Even all my home electronics ephemera

1471
01:32:54,479 --> 01:32:57,760
Speaker 7: and the combined efforts of nonprofits, religious and mutual aid

1472
01:32:57,760 --> 01:33:00,880
Speaker 7: groups couldn't really make much difference to five hundred people

1473
01:33:00,880 --> 01:33:04,479
Speaker 7: from around the world, mostly families with children being held

1474
01:33:04,520 --> 01:33:08,200
Speaker 7: between the two fences. When it got hot, they got hot.

1475
01:33:08,920 --> 01:33:11,800
Speaker 7: When it got cold, they got cold. When the wind blew,

1476
01:33:12,080 --> 01:33:15,679
Speaker 7: they got dust in their eyes, and everything was constantly dirty.

1477
01:33:16,120 --> 01:33:18,920
Speaker 7: The only hot food volunteers could get to them was pizza.

1478
01:33:19,600 --> 01:33:21,599
Speaker 7: Some of the detained people had cash, and they were

1479
01:33:21,600 --> 01:33:24,200
Speaker 7: able to order door dash on the Tijuana side, but

1480
01:33:24,280 --> 01:33:26,240
Speaker 7: again the meals had to fit through a hole barely

1481
01:33:26,240 --> 01:33:29,200
Speaker 7: wider than my arm. The only way to get clean

1482
01:33:29,479 --> 01:33:32,080
Speaker 7: was with wet wipes, and there was only one bathroom.

1483
01:33:32,720 --> 01:33:35,120
Speaker 7: There was no shade or shelter either, and the only

1484
01:33:35,120 --> 01:33:37,880
Speaker 7: way people could construct shelters were through tying tops to

1485
01:33:37,920 --> 01:33:41,360
Speaker 7: the border wall itself. I like Kaber, one of the

1486
01:33:41,400 --> 01:33:44,519
Speaker 7: volunteers who came to help, describe what they saw when

1487
01:33:44,520 --> 01:33:47,120
Speaker 7: participating in mutual aid a couple of days after, but.

1488
01:33:47,120 --> 01:33:51,960
Speaker 8: It was definitely was I don't think it really struck

1489
01:33:52,040 --> 01:33:56,160
Speaker 8: me into you after everything, and you know, after I

1490
01:33:56,320 --> 01:34:01,479
Speaker 8: left several hours later. But I mean, I am right

1491
01:34:01,520 --> 01:34:03,640
Speaker 8: about the situation at the the kind of matter of

1492
01:34:03,640 --> 01:34:08,880
Speaker 8: fackness of there's just several hundred people, including children, just

1493
01:34:09,000 --> 01:34:14,120
Speaker 8: kind of between this fence and they're just stuck there

1494
01:34:14,240 --> 01:34:17,680
Speaker 8: with nothing, and the sort of matter of factness of

1495
01:34:17,760 --> 01:34:23,719
Speaker 8: that all was I think that's struck me the most,

1496
01:34:25,320 --> 01:34:27,480
Speaker 8: and it's been a much challenge in the process.

1497
01:34:27,720 --> 01:34:29,519
Speaker 7: In the days before the end of Title forty two,

1498
01:34:29,720 --> 01:34:32,360
Speaker 7: confusion had reigned at the border. A lot of people

1499
01:34:32,400 --> 01:34:34,439
Speaker 7: I talked to mentioned that they thought they had to

1500
01:34:34,479 --> 01:34:37,040
Speaker 7: cross before the end of Title forty two or they

1501
01:34:37,040 --> 01:34:39,599
Speaker 7: would be ejected and not able to apply for five

1502
01:34:39,680 --> 01:34:43,719
Speaker 7: years at a Title eight. This misunderstanding might in part

1503
01:34:43,920 --> 01:34:45,880
Speaker 7: be due to some of the misleading rhetoric put out

1504
01:34:45,880 --> 01:34:49,400
Speaker 7: by MAJORCAS and others, which focused on the harsh penalties

1505
01:34:49,400 --> 01:34:52,320
Speaker 7: for crossing between ports of entry an attempt to appear

1506
01:34:52,400 --> 01:34:55,840
Speaker 7: strong on the border to their colleagues in DC. They

1507
01:34:55,880 --> 01:34:58,080
Speaker 7: didn't place as much emphasis on the right to present

1508
01:34:58,160 --> 01:35:01,400
Speaker 7: and claim asylum at a port of entry. But as

1509
01:35:01,439 --> 01:35:04,040
Speaker 7: we saw yesterday, it's virtually impossible to actually do that,

1510
01:35:04,280 --> 01:35:06,800
Speaker 7: and Tijuana is already full of thousands of people trying

1511
01:35:06,840 --> 01:35:10,760
Speaker 7: to do that exact thing. Given a set of circumstances,

1512
01:35:11,040 --> 01:35:13,240
Speaker 7: it makes sense that many people took the days before

1513
01:35:13,280 --> 01:35:15,759
Speaker 7: the end of Title forty two and the final chance

1514
01:35:15,760 --> 01:35:19,240
Speaker 7: to cross before Title forty two ended. I spoke to

1515
01:35:19,280 --> 01:35:22,800
Speaker 7: Diana Rodriguez from Colombia about her understanding of what was

1516
01:35:22,800 --> 01:35:23,400
Speaker 7: going to happen.

1517
01:35:23,479 --> 01:35:26,720
Speaker 25: Later that night, Dianna Rodriguez the Columbia.

1518
01:35:27,439 --> 01:35:30,200
Speaker 7: Diana was with two friends, all of them wearing little

1519
01:35:30,280 --> 01:35:33,000
Speaker 7: daisies in their hair and sharing a tarp shelter they'd

1520
01:35:33,000 --> 01:35:35,760
Speaker 7: made by tying a blue top against the wall so

1521
01:35:35,760 --> 01:35:38,960
Speaker 7: they could get some shade in privacy. I asked her

1522
01:35:39,000 --> 01:35:41,599
Speaker 7: where the flowers had come from. You hear the rest

1523
01:35:41,600 --> 01:35:43,000
Speaker 7: of into your voice by cherin.

1524
01:35:44,520 --> 01:35:47,920
Speaker 26: Oh, the flowers, the flowers are well, there are these

1525
01:35:47,960 --> 01:35:51,400
Speaker 26: little flowers, flowers that are growing here, like in the garden.

1526
01:35:52,160 --> 01:35:53,960
Speaker 26: So when we went and took a walk over there

1527
01:35:54,000 --> 01:35:57,120
Speaker 26: and we found them, we put them on and they're pretty.

1528
01:35:57,920 --> 01:36:01,080
Speaker 26: We call these the little yellow flowers of hope, and

1529
01:36:01,120 --> 01:36:04,120
Speaker 26: they match the color of our bracelets. We picked them

1530
01:36:04,160 --> 01:36:06,200
Speaker 26: on the day we arrived, and we knew that we

1531
01:36:06,280 --> 01:36:09,879
Speaker 26: needed a little bit of encouragement. We got the yellow bracelets.

1532
01:36:09,920 --> 01:36:13,040
Speaker 26: Because we arrived on Tuesday, everyone got the same bracelet.

1533
01:36:13,640 --> 01:36:15,760
Speaker 7: I asked, Diana, which you'd heard about title forty two,

1534
01:36:16,280 --> 01:36:20,559
Speaker 7: which is ending a few hours after we talked, Yes,

1535
01:36:20,680 --> 01:36:21,439
Speaker 7: it's the end.

1536
01:36:21,320 --> 01:36:24,679
Speaker 26: Of title forty two. Title forty two is the one

1537
01:36:24,680 --> 01:36:29,040
Speaker 26: that endorses mass deportations. Yes, and well it's a question

1538
01:36:29,120 --> 01:36:34,439
Speaker 26: of you not just getting deported, but being repatriated. In

1539
01:36:34,479 --> 01:36:38,439
Speaker 26: other words, after this they do a full repatriation. But

1540
01:36:38,600 --> 01:36:41,559
Speaker 26: right now you are not registered in the system. But

1541
01:36:41,600 --> 01:36:44,280
Speaker 26: what they do is that they only return you. They

1542
01:36:44,280 --> 01:36:47,760
Speaker 26: don't register you. But let's say, on the basis of

1543
01:36:47,840 --> 01:36:51,360
Speaker 26: Article eight, is that a few at least we are

1544
01:36:51,360 --> 01:36:56,280
Speaker 26: invading American territory, then we are in effect breaking a law.

1545
01:36:56,960 --> 01:36:59,680
Speaker 26: And what Article eight does is that they deport you.

1546
01:37:00,040 --> 01:37:02,400
Speaker 26: They put you in the registered database saying that you

1547
01:37:02,479 --> 01:37:05,559
Speaker 26: broke the law, and they punish you for five years

1548
01:37:05,680 --> 01:37:08,599
Speaker 26: and you lose the right to request your asylum through

1549
01:37:08,720 --> 01:37:10,439
Speaker 26: legal channels.

1550
01:37:10,680 --> 01:37:13,080
Speaker 7: Law people at another camp in cu Cumba heard the

1551
01:37:13,120 --> 01:37:16,080
Speaker 7: same thing from Colombians, and it seems like there are

1552
01:37:16,080 --> 01:37:18,680
Speaker 7: even news pieces run on domestic television explaining that the

1553
01:37:18,800 --> 01:37:21,799
Speaker 7: US planned to return many Colombians in the coming months

1554
01:37:21,960 --> 01:37:24,240
Speaker 7: and this might be the last best chance to cross

1555
01:37:24,280 --> 01:37:28,200
Speaker 7: the border without permanent consequences. You got caught in a

1556
01:37:28,240 --> 01:37:31,559
Speaker 7: Cumba volunteers estimated that two thirds of the people corraled

1557
01:37:31,640 --> 01:37:35,200
Speaker 7: under the deasert son from Colombia. Of course, in recent years,

1558
01:37:35,200 --> 01:37:38,519
Speaker 7: there has been instability and violence there, which also drives migration.

1559
01:37:39,560 --> 01:37:41,719
Speaker 7: One of my sources also mentioned a lot of Colombian

1560
01:37:41,720 --> 01:37:45,040
Speaker 7: people had seen misleading information about immigration law on TikTok.

1561
01:37:46,360 --> 01:37:49,720
Speaker 7: Two days had passed since Janna arrived. She came with

1562
01:37:49,760 --> 01:37:51,599
Speaker 7: one of the girls she was now sharing a tarp with.

1563
01:37:51,760 --> 01:37:53,640
Speaker 7: I met another when they were all dumped in the

1564
01:37:53,680 --> 01:37:57,400
Speaker 7: camp together. In the days before they were detained here,

1565
01:37:57,960 --> 01:37:59,880
Speaker 7: they crossed three countries on their way to what they

1566
01:38:00,080 --> 01:38:01,800
Speaker 7: it was a better life for young women like them.

1567
01:38:02,200 --> 01:38:03,960
Speaker 7: I asked them to describe that journey for me.

1568
01:38:04,920 --> 01:38:08,400
Speaker 26: Yes, eight days, eight days more or less walking from

1569
01:38:08,400 --> 01:38:12,519
Speaker 26: Columbia from El Salvador to Guatemala, then New Mexico. To

1570
01:38:12,560 --> 01:38:17,200
Speaker 26: hear all that time walking and taking the bus. There's

1571
01:38:17,240 --> 01:38:19,840
Speaker 26: a part fifteen or twenty minutes from here where the

1572
01:38:19,880 --> 01:38:23,120
Speaker 26: wall ends, and we crossed there. There was a Mexican

1573
01:38:23,160 --> 01:38:26,280
Speaker 26: patrol and when they changed shifts, we ran and here

1574
01:38:26,320 --> 01:38:29,840
Speaker 26: we are on American soil. We arrived on foot and

1575
01:38:29,880 --> 01:38:32,400
Speaker 26: the police brought us here. They opened the gate and

1576
01:38:32,520 --> 01:38:33,240
Speaker 26: dropped us here.

1577
01:38:34,560 --> 01:38:36,400
Speaker 7: Along the way. She said, they've run into a lot

1578
01:38:36,400 --> 01:38:39,160
Speaker 7: of people. The migrant journey north is such a common

1579
01:38:39,200 --> 01:38:41,120
Speaker 7: trick that people living along the way have found a

1580
01:38:41,160 --> 01:38:43,320
Speaker 7: way to make a buck, but also a way to

1581
01:38:43,360 --> 01:38:47,400
Speaker 7: make a difference. It's not uncommon for migrants to be extorted, robbed,

1582
01:38:47,479 --> 01:38:50,080
Speaker 7: or threatened. It's also not uncommon for them to be

1583
01:38:50,080 --> 01:38:52,840
Speaker 7: fed by strangers, perhaps handing off bags with food in

1584
01:38:52,880 --> 01:38:55,600
Speaker 7: them to passing trains or buses, or perhaps given a

1585
01:38:55,600 --> 01:38:57,559
Speaker 7: place to sleep for the night by someone they might

1586
01:38:57,600 --> 01:38:58,400
Speaker 7: never see again.

1587
01:39:00,080 --> 01:39:02,639
Speaker 26: Parts where we were extorted, they took all the money

1588
01:39:02,640 --> 01:39:05,760
Speaker 26: we brought, They robbed us, they stole our passports, they

1589
01:39:05,800 --> 01:39:10,040
Speaker 26: stole our documents. So it's always quite dangerous. Let's say

1590
01:39:10,040 --> 01:39:13,800
Speaker 26: that it's dangerous to take this journey. Yes, just as

1591
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:16,200
Speaker 26: we have met some bad people along the way, we

1592
01:39:16,240 --> 01:39:18,600
Speaker 26: have also met some very good people, people who have

1593
01:39:18,640 --> 01:39:21,200
Speaker 26: given us a hand, people who have helped us, people

1594
01:39:21,200 --> 01:39:24,400
Speaker 26: who have collaborated with us in ways you least expect.

1595
01:39:25,240 --> 01:39:27,040
Speaker 7: I asked Dianna what she hoped for now she was

1596
01:39:27,080 --> 01:39:29,200
Speaker 7: technically inside the USA.

1597
01:39:30,360 --> 01:39:32,479
Speaker 26: Yes, let's say the hope is that they will listen

1598
01:39:32,520 --> 01:39:34,760
Speaker 26: to our case, listen to our case, and let us

1599
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:38,120
Speaker 26: fight the case inside. Yes, because we want to be

1600
01:39:38,160 --> 01:39:40,640
Speaker 26: able to explain the conditions we are in and the

1601
01:39:40,760 --> 01:39:43,240
Speaker 26: reasons that those of us who are here came here,

1602
01:39:43,800 --> 01:39:47,439
Speaker 26: things like extortion, kidnapping, and because our lives are in

1603
01:39:47,560 --> 01:39:51,080
Speaker 26: danger in Colombia. So we wish that they at least

1604
01:39:51,120 --> 01:39:54,200
Speaker 26: listened to our case and let us plead our cause.

1605
01:39:55,120 --> 01:39:58,599
Speaker 7: Before we started recording, Deanna asked what network I was with.

1606
01:39:58,880 --> 01:40:01,640
Speaker 7: I thought that was in stute Qui question. Networks like

1607
01:40:01,680 --> 01:40:03,519
Speaker 7: Fox show up at the word, although I didn't see

1608
01:40:03,560 --> 01:40:06,639
Speaker 7: any Fox National reporters on my trip. Certainly local news

1609
01:40:06,720 --> 01:40:09,280
Speaker 7: channel kus I was there, but they're reporting on the

1610
01:40:09,280 --> 01:40:13,080
Speaker 7: ground differed from their xenophobic and outright incorrect online coverage.

1611
01:40:13,439 --> 01:40:15,320
Speaker 7: I asked Deana what you'd want to say to folks

1612
01:40:15,360 --> 01:40:17,479
Speaker 7: who might have had their perspective influence by the contentt

1613
01:40:17,520 --> 01:40:19,599
Speaker 7: demonization of migrants by right wing media.

1614
01:40:21,360 --> 01:40:23,880
Speaker 26: There are many people who, let's say, are in a

1615
01:40:23,920 --> 01:40:27,680
Speaker 26: mindset of not wanting migrants, and they view them with contempt.

1616
01:40:28,600 --> 01:40:32,800
Speaker 26: Because wherea xenophobia exists, it's hard for us because we

1617
01:40:32,840 --> 01:40:35,920
Speaker 26: suffer along the way. We would like you to change

1618
01:40:35,920 --> 01:40:38,280
Speaker 26: your way of seeing things and your way of thinking

1619
01:40:38,760 --> 01:40:41,400
Speaker 26: so that you don't look at us with contempt. We

1620
01:40:41,479 --> 01:40:44,479
Speaker 26: have a saying in Columbia that says that he who

1621
01:40:44,560 --> 01:40:48,160
Speaker 26: was born in a golden cradle never suffers or never

1622
01:40:48,240 --> 01:40:51,559
Speaker 26: sees what he does not know. So it's hard when

1623
01:40:51,600 --> 01:40:54,200
Speaker 26: you're born in a golden cradle and you don't see

1624
01:40:54,240 --> 01:40:57,160
Speaker 26: beyond what you have. So there are people that in

1625
01:40:57,200 --> 01:40:59,760
Speaker 26: our case, in my case, I lived a very hard

1626
01:40:59,840 --> 01:41:03,680
Speaker 26: life where you see the war between armed groups. They

1627
01:41:03,720 --> 01:41:06,519
Speaker 26: exist outside the law and they can control an area,

1628
01:41:06,920 --> 01:41:13,519
Speaker 26: and you see the kidnapping, you see the rape of girls, recruitment, extortion, death. Yes,

1629
01:41:13,720 --> 01:41:16,719
Speaker 26: so it's hard when we experience that and people say

1630
01:41:17,520 --> 01:41:20,839
Speaker 26: things like these migrants are coming to invade our country,

1631
01:41:21,680 --> 01:41:24,840
Speaker 26: we also ask them to treat us as people, because

1632
01:41:24,880 --> 01:41:27,280
Speaker 26: if we are here, it is not because we want

1633
01:41:27,320 --> 01:41:30,400
Speaker 26: to invade a territory. It is because we want to

1634
01:41:30,439 --> 01:41:33,479
Speaker 26: come to fight for a better future for our children

1635
01:41:33,880 --> 01:41:38,640
Speaker 26: without stepping on anyone. Nobody wants this. But where we

1636
01:41:38,760 --> 01:41:43,120
Speaker 26: come from, we receive travelers with open arms. And it's

1637
01:41:43,120 --> 01:41:46,320
Speaker 26: hard when one is a migrant, when one lives the

1638
01:41:46,360 --> 01:41:49,559
Speaker 26: experience of being a migrant, it is a very hard

1639
01:41:49,600 --> 01:41:55,080
Speaker 26: thing to be a migrant, having to endure cold, hunger, rain, sun,

1640
01:41:56,000 --> 01:41:59,479
Speaker 26: that is all these things, and then arriving here and

1641
01:41:59,520 --> 01:42:05,800
Speaker 26: seeing of contempt. It's hard. It is very hard. So yes,

1642
01:42:06,160 --> 01:42:09,439
Speaker 26: the important thing is that people must know that being

1643
01:42:09,479 --> 01:42:16,280
Speaker 26: an immigrant is not easy. Being an immigrant is not easy.

1644
01:42:16,400 --> 01:42:18,200
Speaker 7: One of her friends, who she was sharing a top with,

1645
01:42:18,280 --> 01:42:19,639
Speaker 7: leaned over to give an example.

1646
01:42:20,400 --> 01:42:25,200
Speaker 26: Everyone despairs because everyone wants to leave, so everyone sees

1647
01:42:25,280 --> 01:42:30,400
Speaker 26: each other as enemies. So let's say, for example, right now,

1648
01:42:30,800 --> 01:42:33,680
Speaker 26: when they are sending cars to collect people to process,

1649
01:42:34,320 --> 01:42:38,240
Speaker 26: so everyone there thinks, I hope they take me. Then

1650
01:42:38,360 --> 01:42:41,240
Speaker 26: when they don't, it gets to a point where, yes,

1651
01:42:41,600 --> 01:42:46,599
Speaker 26: where you despair. I mean it's desperate, but well everyone

1652
01:42:47,080 --> 01:42:50,479
Speaker 26: everyone is in the fight together, all in the fight.

1653
01:42:57,240 --> 01:42:59,680
Speaker 7: I have to get another dusting down from a cbpah

1654
01:42:59,720 --> 01:43:01,960
Speaker 7: and who really like to RaSE his squad bike passing

1655
01:43:02,040 --> 01:43:05,360
Speaker 7: Mutulaid tables. Spoke to a man from Angola. I leave

1656
01:43:05,400 --> 01:43:07,240
Speaker 7: his name out, as he preferred for me not to

1657
01:43:07,280 --> 01:43:10,080
Speaker 7: share it. He'd been into Juana for three days, he said,

1658
01:43:10,280 --> 01:43:12,880
Speaker 7: I was waiting his chance to plead his case for asylum.

1659
01:43:13,160 --> 01:43:18,479
Speaker 12: No, it's just me and my sister. We suffered a lot.

1660
01:43:18,680 --> 01:43:22,639
Speaker 12: There were bandits. We came here to be safe. It's

1661
01:43:22,640 --> 01:43:24,960
Speaker 12: no way to live. People broke into our house to

1662
01:43:25,040 --> 01:43:28,639
Speaker 12: violate women, to look for people and I was injured, then, Yeah,

1663
01:43:28,680 --> 01:43:31,679
Speaker 12: why did I leave to come here? Over there? They're

1664
01:43:31,720 --> 01:43:33,960
Speaker 12: not they're not the means to live.

1665
01:43:34,720 --> 01:43:36,400
Speaker 7: We didn't get a chance to talk for long, and

1666
01:43:36,560 --> 01:43:39,040
Speaker 7: some of the recording I got wasn't very good. He

1667
01:43:39,120 --> 01:43:40,960
Speaker 7: was waiting in line for food, and to be quite honest,

1668
01:43:40,960 --> 01:43:43,280
Speaker 7: I don't like prodding people to share their trauma, but

1669
01:43:43,400 --> 01:43:46,120
Speaker 7: with so many journalists crowding the border asking him to

1670
01:43:46,160 --> 01:43:48,559
Speaker 7: do just that, it tends to be what people offer.

1671
01:43:49,080 --> 01:43:51,240
Speaker 7: Lots of African migrants can be quite cautious of the

1672
01:43:51,280 --> 01:43:53,720
Speaker 7: media because talking to the media at home could get

1673
01:43:53,760 --> 01:43:56,519
Speaker 7: them in trouble. I spoke to a friend of mine

1674
01:43:56,560 --> 01:43:59,679
Speaker 7: himself a migrant from Africa. He said that if migrants

1675
01:43:59,720 --> 01:44:01,320
Speaker 7: don't to be English or Spanish, it can be very

1676
01:44:01,320 --> 01:44:03,760
Speaker 7: hard for them to get information, and there aren't as

1677
01:44:03,760 --> 01:44:05,680
Speaker 7: many nonprofits set up to serve them as there are

1678
01:44:05,760 --> 01:44:08,960
Speaker 7: for Spanish speaking people, for example. They can often end

1679
01:44:09,000 --> 01:44:12,439
Speaker 7: up isolated and alone. I did get a better chance

1680
01:44:12,479 --> 01:44:15,040
Speaker 7: to talk to a Jamaican man called Joseph. It's his

1681
01:44:15,120 --> 01:44:18,320
Speaker 7: singing you've heard at the start of this episode. Mostly

1682
01:44:18,400 --> 01:44:21,080
Speaker 7: we talked about things in America, about how he lost

1683
01:44:21,080 --> 01:44:23,360
Speaker 7: his phone on his journey we got him another one

1684
01:44:23,360 --> 01:44:27,479
Speaker 7: at Walmart and about things like football and music. I

1685
01:44:27,520 --> 01:44:29,439
Speaker 7: didn't record all of that because sometimes it's nice to

1686
01:44:29,520 --> 01:44:31,760
Speaker 7: just talk to people. Hopefully it makes their dair a

1687
01:44:31,760 --> 01:44:34,080
Speaker 7: bit brighter and gives them some information maybe they could help.

1688
01:44:35,080 --> 01:44:36,799
Speaker 7: He did let me record a bit of an interview

1689
01:44:37,320 --> 01:44:40,280
Speaker 7: and some of him singing. He was pretty guarded on

1690
01:44:40,320 --> 01:44:41,960
Speaker 7: the recording, but as you can hear in this clip,

1691
01:44:42,000 --> 01:44:43,639
Speaker 7: we had a good time when we weren't recording.

1692
01:44:54,360 --> 01:44:56,800
Speaker 27: Up up.

1693
01:44:59,320 --> 01:45:03,479
Speaker 10: You know it's journally is it going on yelling gen length?

1694
01:45:03,560 --> 01:45:06,519
Speaker 24: But Molly, it's going off, not going lengthy, and let

1695
01:45:06,520 --> 01:45:09,559
Speaker 24: me see Ian for this sky and me I'm pre

1696
01:45:10,400 --> 01:45:12,840
Speaker 24: my mama says something push free and glow and read

1697
01:45:13,200 --> 01:45:15,400
Speaker 24: for them, say might smile them, No normals do and

1698
01:45:15,479 --> 01:45:17,360
Speaker 24: read beIN gonna talk.

1699
01:45:17,680 --> 01:45:22,439
Speaker 10: Can I watch me? Hey man? Grateful man, grateful? I

1700
01:45:22,640 --> 01:45:25,679
Speaker 10: went not and go my smile. Yeah.

1701
01:45:26,160 --> 01:45:29,559
Speaker 24: Once there is life. God, I want to give you

1702
01:45:29,680 --> 01:45:35,040
Speaker 24: everything for some fune. Yeah, love suck pick up to

1703
01:45:35,080 --> 01:45:36,880
Speaker 24: job me a car. I got to eat and come back.

1704
01:45:37,040 --> 01:45:39,720
Speaker 24: I'm seeing Yeah, man, that's it one love.

1705
01:45:40,600 --> 01:45:45,040
Speaker 10: Oh that was beautiful. Yeah, I'm I'm I'm Joseph.

1706
01:45:44,880 --> 01:45:46,479
Speaker 7: And asked him about some of the stuff we spoke

1707
01:45:46,479 --> 01:45:48,280
Speaker 7: about before, but he didn't want to share it.

1708
01:45:48,840 --> 01:45:51,800
Speaker 24: Yeah, that's the whole testimony, Me and you and God

1709
01:45:51,840 --> 01:45:53,000
Speaker 24: have to go into church for that.

1710
01:45:53,439 --> 01:45:55,000
Speaker 10: But I'm gonna give you that the next time.

1711
01:45:55,040 --> 01:45:58,200
Speaker 7: Okay, buddy, all right, just experienced a lot of personal

1712
01:45:58,200 --> 01:46:00,840
Speaker 7: harm from conflict back home in Jamaica. I had a

1713
01:46:00,840 --> 01:46:02,840
Speaker 7: difficult journey here with his five year old son.

1714
01:46:03,120 --> 01:46:05,400
Speaker 10: Yeah, it's rough. It's rough out there, man, you know

1715
01:46:05,479 --> 01:46:06,040
Speaker 10: it's rough.

1716
01:46:06,520 --> 01:46:08,880
Speaker 7: How did you come like you come? I asked him

1717
01:46:08,880 --> 01:46:11,080
Speaker 7: how his young son had dealt with the journey. It's

1718
01:46:11,120 --> 01:46:13,000
Speaker 7: not a safe or easy one for an adult, let

1719
01:46:13,040 --> 01:46:14,080
Speaker 7: alone for a little child.

1720
01:46:14,880 --> 01:46:19,360
Speaker 24: It's like he's just kind of scary, broll he pulled you.

1721
01:46:19,920 --> 01:46:20,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's good.

1722
01:46:20,720 --> 01:46:23,080
Speaker 10: You have my energy inside.

1723
01:46:23,160 --> 01:46:23,639
Speaker 1: That's good.

1724
01:46:23,720 --> 01:46:24,520
Speaker 10: Yeah.

1725
01:46:24,520 --> 01:46:26,840
Speaker 7: Are you how's he finding it here in the camp?

1726
01:46:27,320 --> 01:46:31,040
Speaker 10: Oh? Yeah, that camp. I don't know why. That guy

1727
01:46:31,120 --> 01:46:31,760
Speaker 10: is just like me.

1728
01:46:31,920 --> 01:46:36,240
Speaker 24: We just don't make anything better us. Yeah, what's it's

1729
01:46:36,240 --> 01:46:38,479
Speaker 24: working here? Because you guys give it a strength and

1730
01:46:38,479 --> 01:46:39,200
Speaker 24: supporting us.

1731
01:46:39,240 --> 01:46:41,280
Speaker 7: You know, Joseph wanted me to know that he wasn't

1732
01:46:41,280 --> 01:46:44,599
Speaker 7: giving up his home. He loves Jamaica, but he also

1733
01:46:44,640 --> 01:46:45,840
Speaker 7: wants a better life for his son.

1734
01:46:46,280 --> 01:46:49,719
Speaker 24: It's not that, it's not that. It's not like I'm

1735
01:46:50,000 --> 01:46:53,840
Speaker 24: giving away my home. My home is a good place. Yeah, yeah,

1736
01:46:53,840 --> 01:46:55,640
Speaker 24: it's a good island, nice place to be.

1737
01:46:55,920 --> 01:46:58,280
Speaker 7: Of course, his perspective is very common, and it's one

1738
01:46:58,280 --> 01:47:01,200
Speaker 7: that often gets left out of reporting. Coming to the

1739
01:47:01,320 --> 01:47:04,479
Speaker 7: USA is a very hopeful act. It's not abandoning your

1740
01:47:04,479 --> 01:47:07,400
Speaker 7: family or your home. It's trying to make their lives better,

1741
01:47:07,439 --> 01:47:11,280
Speaker 7: in your life livable. Joseph was quite guided with this story,

1742
01:47:11,280 --> 01:47:13,000
Speaker 7: and that's fine. It's his to share as much as

1743
01:47:13,040 --> 01:47:15,960
Speaker 7: little as he wants. I came to the USA without

1744
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:18,439
Speaker 7: having to get persecuted or hurt, and people who don't

1745
01:47:18,439 --> 01:47:22,160
Speaker 7: look like me should have that same right as well. Sadly,

1746
01:47:22,960 --> 01:47:25,760
Speaker 7: coming to the USA is also scary and confusing, even

1747
01:47:25,760 --> 01:47:28,360
Speaker 7: for me with three university degrees and all the intersectional

1748
01:47:28,360 --> 01:47:32,200
Speaker 7: privilege I have and fifteen years living here, and I've

1749
01:47:32,240 --> 01:47:35,400
Speaker 7: recently minted US passport. Now, I worried for years that

1750
01:47:35,479 --> 01:47:38,000
Speaker 7: maybe I'd made a mistake on a form or missed

1751
01:47:38,040 --> 01:47:41,760
Speaker 7: some kind of deadline. Speaking of deadlines, what none of

1752
01:47:41,760 --> 01:47:44,120
Speaker 7: the migrants could tell us, what they all wanted to

1753
01:47:44,160 --> 01:47:46,479
Speaker 7: ask about, was exactly what was happening to them as

1754
01:47:46,520 --> 01:47:50,519
Speaker 7: Title forty two expired. A Congolese lady asked me if

1755
01:47:50,560 --> 01:47:53,559
Speaker 7: her passport would be confiscated. A lady from Senegal asked

1756
01:47:53,600 --> 01:47:55,000
Speaker 7: if she needed to pay a bribe like the one

1757
01:47:55,040 --> 01:47:58,120
Speaker 7: she'd paid in Mexico. It wasn't really clear at first

1758
01:47:58,160 --> 01:48:00,439
Speaker 7: if these people were being detained and under what process

1759
01:48:00,439 --> 01:48:03,040
Speaker 7: they were being received. Would they be sent back to

1760
01:48:03,080 --> 01:48:08,160
Speaker 7: Mexico and a Title forty two repatriated under Biden's interpretation

1761
01:48:08,240 --> 01:48:10,920
Speaker 7: of Title eight, or given the right to plead their

1762
01:48:10,920 --> 01:48:13,200
Speaker 7: case with international and US law suggests it should be

1763
01:48:13,200 --> 01:48:17,519
Speaker 7: able to CBP made people sit in lines all day

1764
01:48:17,600 --> 01:48:19,439
Speaker 7: with no indication of when they would be taken to

1765
01:48:19,439 --> 01:48:22,800
Speaker 7: the porta Entry for processing. Sometimes I heard people saying

1766
01:48:22,840 --> 01:48:25,320
Speaker 7: if everyone didn't sit down, there will be nobody process

1767
01:48:25,439 --> 01:48:28,519
Speaker 7: that day. But the only food, water, and medical attention

1768
01:48:29,000 --> 01:48:31,599
Speaker 7: available to the migrants was that which could be passed

1769
01:48:31,640 --> 01:48:34,040
Speaker 7: through the wall, and they had to get out of

1770
01:48:34,040 --> 01:48:37,280
Speaker 7: their lines to receive this aid. I'll let Kaber describe

1771
01:48:37,280 --> 01:48:37,920
Speaker 7: what this looked like.

1772
01:48:38,160 --> 01:48:40,640
Speaker 8: And they had people waiting in lines that you had

1773
01:48:40,680 --> 01:48:46,120
Speaker 8: to sit in a line and sign spot and but

1774
01:48:46,160 --> 01:48:48,719
Speaker 8: it wasn't always clear if these how those lines actually

1775
01:48:49,000 --> 01:48:51,080
Speaker 8: worked because they would kind of take people for some

1776
01:48:51,400 --> 01:48:54,600
Speaker 8: lots of places. I think they might have been prioritizing

1777
01:48:54,640 --> 01:48:58,160
Speaker 8: from children, people with some kind of medical needs or

1778
01:48:58,200 --> 01:49:02,160
Speaker 8: something like that that you would never know when they

1779
01:49:02,160 --> 01:49:04,320
Speaker 8: were going to come, and we didn't seem to know

1780
01:49:04,439 --> 01:49:06,600
Speaker 8: us that they were going to choused to take. We

1781
01:49:06,680 --> 01:49:08,439
Speaker 8: assume we didn't know exactly we were taking them, but

1782
01:49:08,479 --> 01:49:09,960
Speaker 8: we assume they were taking the point of entry in

1783
01:49:10,000 --> 01:49:13,760
Speaker 8: Senna Secret, which is beout a mile away, and so

1784
01:49:13,840 --> 01:49:15,840
Speaker 8: moment always happened when they come and get a group

1785
01:49:16,040 --> 01:49:17,800
Speaker 8: is like three or four people from that group would

1786
01:49:17,840 --> 01:49:20,400
Speaker 8: sprint over to the world because we still had their

1787
01:49:20,400 --> 01:49:24,200
Speaker 8: phones and side people wasn't going to wait for us

1788
01:49:24,240 --> 01:49:24,880
Speaker 8: to get the funds.

1789
01:49:25,240 --> 01:49:27,160
Speaker 7: One thing a lot of people we talked to shared

1790
01:49:27,560 --> 01:49:30,080
Speaker 7: was that there was another camp, which we later found

1791
01:49:30,080 --> 01:49:33,360
Speaker 7: house as many as eight hundred single men. It's fairly

1792
01:49:33,439 --> 01:49:36,040
Speaker 7: usual to keep single men apart from families, but keeping

1793
01:49:36,040 --> 01:49:39,000
Speaker 7: them in an inaccessible place without adequate food or water

1794
01:49:39,120 --> 01:49:43,000
Speaker 7: is not usual. The camp was further west, and despite

1795
01:49:43,040 --> 01:49:46,280
Speaker 7: repeated requests from myself and others, including those delivering aid,

1796
01:49:46,479 --> 01:49:49,360
Speaker 7: we were not allowed to access it. One pair of

1797
01:49:49,439 --> 01:49:53,240
Speaker 7: Jamaican twins. Both young men told me they had walked

1798
01:49:53,280 --> 01:49:56,080
Speaker 7: up there and that things were very bad. People were

1799
01:49:56,120 --> 01:49:58,559
Speaker 7: only given one small water bottom the granola bar every day,

1800
01:49:58,600 --> 01:50:03,040
Speaker 7: they said. One person told me they'd heard people eating grass.

1801
01:50:03,960 --> 01:50:06,320
Speaker 7: I asked CBP's press office for information on this, but

1802
01:50:06,360 --> 01:50:10,000
Speaker 7: they didn't respond. Here's one clip of a man trying

1803
01:50:10,040 --> 01:50:12,680
Speaker 7: to explain how bad things were there. It's hard to

1804
01:50:12,720 --> 01:50:15,640
Speaker 7: communicate across language barriers, and with a war between you,

1805
01:50:15,680 --> 01:50:18,080
Speaker 7: it's even harder. But I could tell he was very

1806
01:50:18,120 --> 01:50:21,439
Speaker 7: concerned for the folks that we couldn't get to. Despite

1807
01:50:21,439 --> 01:50:24,439
Speaker 7: myself and others trying, and me addressing this issue directly

1808
01:50:24,479 --> 01:50:27,360
Speaker 7: and emails to CBP, I never got any response on

1809
01:50:27,400 --> 01:50:29,400
Speaker 7: why people were not allowed to help the single men

1810
01:50:29,439 --> 01:50:30,160
Speaker 7: in the other camp.

1811
01:50:30,880 --> 01:50:31,599
Speaker 10: Just not helping.

1812
01:50:34,200 --> 01:50:42,320
Speaker 28: What little water, chocold nothing else, No food, no water, blankets,

1813
01:50:43,120 --> 01:50:45,280
Speaker 28: blows nothing.

1814
01:50:51,120 --> 01:50:54,320
Speaker 7: I'll go try and go up there. Even with these

1815
01:50:54,360 --> 01:50:57,880
Speaker 7: camps being pretty desperate places, folks look after one another.

1816
01:50:58,800 --> 01:51:01,240
Speaker 7: We spoke a lot with one lady who spoke English.

1817
01:51:01,560 --> 01:51:03,920
Speaker 7: She was there with her own family, but she was

1818
01:51:03,920 --> 01:51:07,400
Speaker 7: also looking after two Tagik children who'd come alone. Their

1819
01:51:07,439 --> 01:51:09,960
Speaker 7: mother spoke a little English, so she relayed news to

1820
01:51:10,000 --> 01:51:13,160
Speaker 7: the children by calling their mother and having her translated

1821
01:51:13,200 --> 01:51:16,519
Speaker 7: for her children. Other folks took it upon themselves to

1822
01:51:16,560 --> 01:51:18,519
Speaker 7: try and walk to the camp for single men with water,

1823
01:51:19,439 --> 01:51:22,000
Speaker 7: and people constantly helped us find the owners of phone

1824
01:51:22,040 --> 01:51:24,559
Speaker 7: by wandering through the rows of people sheltering under taps

1825
01:51:24,560 --> 01:51:26,760
Speaker 7: and space blankets to look for people who had left

1826
01:51:26,800 --> 01:51:33,960
Speaker 7: us their devices to charge. In Nucumber, a town an

1827
01:51:34,000 --> 01:51:36,639
Speaker 7: hour or so east of San Diego, things were worse.

1828
01:51:37,600 --> 01:51:40,519
Speaker 7: Cumber's home to a cute hotel, a lovely lake, a

1829
01:51:40,520 --> 01:51:43,800
Speaker 7: hot spring, and an awful lot of big rugs. When

1830
01:51:43,840 --> 01:51:45,840
Speaker 7: the border war was being built in Earnest before the

1831
01:51:45,880 --> 01:51:48,759
Speaker 7: twenty twenty election, they skipped some of the harder areas.

1832
01:51:49,280 --> 01:51:51,200
Speaker 7: Perhaps they figured it would be too hard to cross there,

1833
01:51:51,560 --> 01:51:54,800
Speaker 7: it's not perhaps they wanted to maximize the mileage before

1834
01:51:54,840 --> 01:51:58,000
Speaker 7: election day. Well it didn't help much, but either way,

1835
01:51:58,200 --> 01:52:00,320
Speaker 7: for some reason, the wall just takes a little break

1836
01:52:00,320 --> 01:52:04,639
Speaker 7: in her Cumber and this makes crossing marginally easier there. However,

1837
01:52:05,160 --> 01:52:08,360
Speaker 7: the boulder fields, scorching hot days and cold nights make

1838
01:52:08,400 --> 01:52:12,160
Speaker 7: it anything but easy. On Thursday night, the eleventh of May,

1839
01:52:12,400 --> 01:52:15,519
Speaker 7: locals in a Cumber became aware that CBP were holding

1840
01:52:15,520 --> 01:52:17,479
Speaker 7: people on a dirt road in the open desert, just

1841
01:52:17,600 --> 01:52:19,880
Speaker 7: a few miles east of town and a few hundred

1842
01:52:19,880 --> 01:52:22,400
Speaker 7: feet from the wall. The people held they didn't have

1843
01:52:22,479 --> 01:52:25,759
Speaker 7: access to toilets, running water, or shelter. With every hour

1844
01:52:25,800 --> 01:52:29,360
Speaker 7: that went past, the number of people grew. The biggest

1845
01:52:29,360 --> 01:52:32,400
Speaker 7: camp soon held over a thousand people desperately trying to

1846
01:52:32,400 --> 01:52:35,559
Speaker 7: scratch out a little shade in the desert. Other smaller

1847
01:52:35,560 --> 01:52:38,800
Speaker 7: camps popped up. One was apparently in someone's yard, and

1848
01:52:38,800 --> 01:52:41,280
Speaker 7: the people of this tiny desert town sod about helping

1849
01:52:41,320 --> 01:52:45,080
Speaker 7: as best they could. Soon they were joined by volunteers

1850
01:52:45,120 --> 01:52:48,440
Speaker 7: from all over the county. Katie was one of those volunteers.

1851
01:52:48,920 --> 01:52:50,720
Speaker 7: She doesn't live in a cumber but her friends do

1852
01:52:50,920 --> 01:52:54,080
Speaker 7: and her family sometimes spends time there. Once she heard

1853
01:52:54,080 --> 01:52:56,240
Speaker 7: about what was happening, she knew she had to help.

1854
01:52:57,000 --> 01:52:59,479
Speaker 7: I let her describe her feelings after she saw the

1855
01:52:59,520 --> 01:53:02,320
Speaker 7: posts on, and then drove out to Kumba to see

1856
01:53:02,320 --> 01:53:03,320
Speaker 7: what she could do to help.

1857
01:53:04,320 --> 01:53:08,520
Speaker 25: At first, I was just super touched by the activation

1858
01:53:09,439 --> 01:53:17,080
Speaker 25: and the carrying, and my son was asleep, comfortable in

1859
01:53:17,240 --> 01:53:22,840
Speaker 25: his car seat, you know, in our Mercedes van, and

1860
01:53:23,400 --> 01:53:29,160
Speaker 25: my husband is still trying to get citizenship after being

1861
01:53:29,240 --> 01:53:34,639
Speaker 25: here since he was two years old. So and we're

1862
01:53:34,640 --> 01:53:40,320
Speaker 25: married and he pays taxes. And when I saw our

1863
01:53:40,360 --> 01:53:44,840
Speaker 25: friends activating, I just told him tomorrow's Mother's Day and

1864
01:53:46,040 --> 01:53:50,280
Speaker 25: I need to come back here, and it's not safe

1865
01:53:50,280 --> 01:53:55,679
Speaker 25: for you here. So when I first arrived, I thought

1866
01:53:55,720 --> 01:54:01,400
Speaker 25: it was kind of odd that everything was organized around

1867
01:54:01,439 --> 01:54:06,200
Speaker 25: a random road that has a gate, and there were

1868
01:54:06,320 --> 01:54:15,320
Speaker 25: five only five border patrol at the time, and about

1869
01:54:17,720 --> 01:54:20,040
Speaker 25: that was a larger camp. So I want to say

1870
01:54:20,200 --> 01:54:25,160
Speaker 25: at least eight hundred people, maybe a thousand. I didn't

1871
01:54:25,200 --> 01:54:30,599
Speaker 25: see them all because many of them were received their

1872
01:54:30,760 --> 01:54:35,960
Speaker 25: donations and the assistance and went back to their shelters.

1873
01:54:37,120 --> 01:54:39,600
Speaker 7: A few days after the migrants arrived, I camped out

1874
01:54:39,600 --> 01:54:42,360
Speaker 7: in Hucumber. I was cold in my sleeping bag at

1875
01:54:42,440 --> 01:54:45,240
Speaker 7: night and dizzy in the sun in the day. It's

1876
01:54:45,240 --> 01:54:46,960
Speaker 7: not a place where you'd want to be stuck outside

1877
01:54:46,960 --> 01:54:49,720
Speaker 7: the law, but it's a place where fifteen hundred or

1878
01:54:49,720 --> 01:54:52,320
Speaker 7: so people were held for days, little more than the

1879
01:54:52,360 --> 01:54:54,760
Speaker 7: shelters they built out of career certain mesquite to protect

1880
01:54:54,760 --> 01:54:57,840
Speaker 7: their families from the elements. They slept on the dirt

1881
01:54:57,920 --> 01:55:00,640
Speaker 7: or in cardboard boxes left over from the foodolunteers fed

1882
01:55:00,640 --> 01:55:04,200
Speaker 7: them and under whatever folks and tiny desert count could

1883
01:55:04,200 --> 01:55:07,440
Speaker 7: find to give them. By the time I arrived, the

1884
01:55:07,560 --> 01:55:11,040
Speaker 7: migrants were gone and volunteers were cleaning up. The landscape

1885
01:55:11,040 --> 01:55:15,320
Speaker 7: was dotted with impressively constructed brush shelters. Volunteers from her

1886
01:55:15,360 --> 01:55:19,360
Speaker 7: Cumba set up tables to distribute food, blankets, water, and clothing.

1887
01:55:20,320 --> 01:55:22,560
Speaker 7: Other volunteers stayed away from the camp itself and spent

1888
01:55:22,640 --> 01:55:26,480
Speaker 7: time packing things into individual sizes, perhaps combining hats and

1889
01:55:26,560 --> 01:55:28,760
Speaker 7: socks and maybe a toy for child in one bag,

1890
01:55:29,120 --> 01:55:32,560
Speaker 7: or breaking down costco packages of snacks into individual portions.

1891
01:55:33,040 --> 01:55:35,720
Speaker 7: It's not necessarily the most rewarding task, but it's an

1892
01:55:35,760 --> 01:55:40,080
Speaker 7: important one. I asked Marissa, another volunteer who had previously

1893
01:55:40,080 --> 01:55:42,680
Speaker 7: worked in San Diego for the Forest Service, what she

1894
01:55:42,760 --> 01:55:44,919
Speaker 7: felt when we were cleaning out some of those shelters

1895
01:55:44,920 --> 01:55:46,160
Speaker 7: together a couple of days later.

1896
01:55:46,560 --> 01:55:48,000
Speaker 29: I don't know the best way to say this, but

1897
01:55:51,520 --> 01:55:56,160
Speaker 29: what hit me deeper was when this might seem strange,

1898
01:55:56,160 --> 01:55:59,080
Speaker 29: but when I saw women's sanitary napkins.

1899
01:55:59,000 --> 01:56:01,480
Speaker 26: Or the diaper or.

1900
01:56:02,880 --> 01:56:05,760
Speaker 29: The babies like it was kind of like a fabric

1901
01:56:05,920 --> 01:56:11,480
Speaker 29: padded crib basinet type thing that suddenly hit me on

1902
01:56:11,520 --> 01:56:15,280
Speaker 29: a deeper level. Would make me emotional because it's like

1903
01:56:16,560 --> 01:56:20,640
Speaker 29: then you start to realize, like, wow, what if that

1904
01:56:20,920 --> 01:56:25,160
Speaker 29: was me and my child or I'm not a mother,

1905
01:56:25,240 --> 01:56:27,480
Speaker 29: but I can only imagine what that must be like

1906
01:56:27,600 --> 01:56:31,200
Speaker 29: for them to be going through these things as a

1907
01:56:31,200 --> 01:56:35,360
Speaker 29: as a woman, being on your period and being out

1908
01:56:35,440 --> 01:56:38,839
Speaker 29: and not having anything, you know, going to the bathroom

1909
01:56:38,880 --> 01:56:41,440
Speaker 29: out there. What do you use when you don't have

1910
01:56:41,520 --> 01:56:42,400
Speaker 29: those supplies?

1911
01:56:44,360 --> 01:56:46,920
Speaker 4: So yeah, it just.

1912
01:56:50,200 --> 01:56:55,280
Speaker 29: That was when it hit me deeper and I knew

1913
01:56:55,320 --> 01:56:57,080
Speaker 29: I was doing the right thing by being out there

1914
01:56:57,120 --> 01:57:01,760
Speaker 29: and helping in whatever way I could. I don't when

1915
01:57:01,760 --> 01:57:03,680
Speaker 29: it comes to the politics side of it, when it

1916
01:57:03,720 --> 01:57:10,320
Speaker 29: comes to like legality and just different aspects of it.

1917
01:57:10,400 --> 01:57:15,280
Speaker 29: In that way, I don't have necessarily an opinion one

1918
01:57:15,280 --> 01:57:17,560
Speaker 29: way or another. I'm not educated enough to feel like

1919
01:57:17,640 --> 01:57:21,000
Speaker 29: I can argue one way or another or defend one

1920
01:57:21,120 --> 01:57:26,160
Speaker 29: position or another. I went out there purely for my

1921
01:57:26,320 --> 01:57:30,440
Speaker 29: love of humanity, and I think being able to support

1922
01:57:31,360 --> 01:57:33,400
Speaker 29: in whatever way I can that was the way that

1923
01:57:33,440 --> 01:57:36,720
Speaker 29: I felt like I could serve and be a support.

1924
01:57:37,040 --> 01:57:39,240
Speaker 7: Katie hadn't expected to meet migrants at the camp when

1925
01:57:39,280 --> 01:57:41,920
Speaker 7: she first showed up, She knew it was important not

1926
01:57:41,920 --> 01:57:44,200
Speaker 7: to flog the camp with volunteers, and the help was

1927
01:57:44,200 --> 01:57:46,600
Speaker 7: needed packaging and preparing aid drops, which she was happy

1928
01:57:46,640 --> 01:57:49,360
Speaker 7: to do. But in the end she traveled up to

1929
01:57:49,360 --> 01:57:51,600
Speaker 7: the camp with a friend who spoke Portuguese so they

1930
01:57:51,600 --> 01:57:55,440
Speaker 7: could help translate and distribute supplies. I asked her what

1931
01:57:55,480 --> 01:57:57,240
Speaker 7: it was like to see the supplies she'd purchased a

1932
01:57:57,280 --> 01:57:59,680
Speaker 7: few hours before end up in the hands of people

1933
01:57:59,680 --> 01:58:01,040
Speaker 7: who but you needed them.

1934
01:58:01,400 --> 01:58:06,560
Speaker 25: They don't even have a grocery store in Hukumba. They

1935
01:58:06,560 --> 01:58:14,040
Speaker 25: have one mini mart with nothing in it, and that

1936
01:58:14,200 --> 01:58:22,520
Speaker 25: was sold out the first day. So these people who

1937
01:58:22,880 --> 01:58:26,960
Speaker 25: we would look at without a lot of resources, passing

1938
01:58:27,000 --> 01:58:31,280
Speaker 25: the abundance of what they actually have, well, I saw

1939
01:58:31,360 --> 01:58:34,720
Speaker 25: a lot of families there. I could tell that there

1940
01:58:34,760 --> 01:58:38,960
Speaker 25: were leaders within the group because they were helping organize

1941
01:58:39,320 --> 01:58:45,360
Speaker 25: as much as the volunteers were. And unfortunately there was

1942
01:58:45,560 --> 01:58:50,440
Speaker 25: language barriers, you know, and so those that could speak

1943
01:58:51,160 --> 01:58:57,600
Speaker 25: multiple languages, whether they were border crossers or volunteers, were

1944
01:58:57,640 --> 01:59:00,720
Speaker 25: together in it and or and that was part of

1945
01:59:00,720 --> 01:59:08,520
Speaker 25: that organization that I'm talking about, you know. And it

1946
01:59:08,600 --> 01:59:13,720
Speaker 25: was actually a very calm scene when we first came

1947
01:59:13,840 --> 01:59:18,480
Speaker 25: up I saw my son's hat that I donated and

1948
01:59:18,520 --> 01:59:23,040
Speaker 25: a little boy hugging this jaguar stuffed animal, and the

1949
01:59:23,160 --> 01:59:27,240
Speaker 25: jaguar was really significant to my friend and I when

1950
01:59:27,240 --> 01:59:31,720
Speaker 25: we found it. So it was really touching just to

1951
01:59:31,920 --> 01:59:38,280
Speaker 25: like see the things that we were bringing being literally

1952
01:59:38,320 --> 01:59:42,800
Speaker 25: being distributed, like sometimes when you think you're helping. I

1953
01:59:42,840 --> 01:59:46,040
Speaker 25: worked for a door to door campaign when I was

1954
01:59:46,200 --> 01:59:49,480
Speaker 25: in my teens and I got fifty percent of what

1955
01:59:49,560 --> 01:59:53,440
Speaker 25: I raised, and it was like disheartening, and you're like, oh,

1956
01:59:53,520 --> 01:59:58,440
Speaker 25: this is how it works. And in this case, money

1957
01:59:58,520 --> 02:00:03,400
Speaker 25: that I directly you spent on resources that were needed

1958
02:00:03,920 --> 02:00:06,240
Speaker 25: was going directly to the people.

1959
02:00:07,120 --> 02:00:10,320
Speaker 7: In all likelihood, people crossed in a specific spot because

1960
02:00:10,360 --> 02:00:12,839
Speaker 7: someone dropped them there telling them it would be easy.

1961
02:00:13,360 --> 02:00:16,920
Speaker 7: In fact it was anything but people die crossing around here.

1962
02:00:17,840 --> 02:00:20,920
Speaker 7: In the dirt around Cucumber, I found discarded flight circtineries

1963
02:00:20,920 --> 02:00:24,960
Speaker 7: and documents from Turkey, Nicaragua, Columbia, Mexico. There were also

1964
02:00:24,960 --> 02:00:28,800
Speaker 7: little children's toys, shoes, and hundreds of empty water bottles

1965
02:00:28,840 --> 02:00:31,480
Speaker 7: which we diligently picked up. But none of the more

1966
02:00:31,480 --> 02:00:33,720
Speaker 7: than one thousand people who the Boarder Patrol held in

1967
02:00:33,760 --> 02:00:36,760
Speaker 7: this camp had planned for what they got, which was

1968
02:00:36,800 --> 02:00:39,560
Speaker 7: several days being detained in the desert by CBP with

1969
02:00:39,600 --> 02:00:43,360
Speaker 7: intefficient water, no shelter, and very little food, and no

1970
02:00:43,440 --> 02:00:45,360
Speaker 7: information on what was happening or how long they could

1971
02:00:45,360 --> 02:00:49,000
Speaker 7: expect to be there. Sadly didn't get there in time

1972
02:00:49,080 --> 02:00:51,440
Speaker 7: to speak to any of them. I was in Arizona

1973
02:00:51,480 --> 02:00:54,120
Speaker 7: looking for border vigilantes and wondering what CBP had been

1974
02:00:54,120 --> 02:00:56,600
Speaker 7: doing to migrants there where they have the full support

1975
02:00:56,640 --> 02:00:59,120
Speaker 7: of local law enforcement and a large percentage of the

1976
02:00:59,160 --> 02:01:03,680
Speaker 7: aging population. To my surprise, he didn't find much. It

1977
02:01:03,760 --> 02:01:05,800
Speaker 7: seems like most people had crossed in the San Diego

1978
02:01:05,840 --> 02:01:10,520
Speaker 7: County area. Many had flown or walked to Tijuana. Of course, migrants,

1979
02:01:10,600 --> 02:01:12,760
Speaker 7: just like us, have accessed the news and to weather

1980
02:01:12,800 --> 02:01:16,080
Speaker 7: forecast and maps. Crossing in Arizona, a place known for

1981
02:01:16,120 --> 02:01:18,880
Speaker 7: cruelty and very hot weather, doesn't make any sense when

1982
02:01:18,920 --> 02:01:22,320
Speaker 7: California offers a better political and weather climate, and with

1983
02:01:22,360 --> 02:01:24,800
Speaker 7: the mixed messages coming out of immigration law, these folks

1984
02:01:25,160 --> 02:01:27,760
Speaker 7: may not have been intending to evade border patrol, but

1985
02:01:27,840 --> 02:01:29,880
Speaker 7: to come to the USA and take their legal right

1986
02:01:29,920 --> 02:01:33,800
Speaker 7: to claim asylum. I spoke to Sam, a volunteer with

1987
02:01:33,840 --> 02:01:37,480
Speaker 7: extensive on the ground experience in humanitarian crises about what

1988
02:01:37,520 --> 02:01:38,440
Speaker 7: he'd seen at the camp.

1989
02:01:39,000 --> 02:01:40,400
Speaker 1: Oh, my name is Sam Schultz.

1990
02:01:41,040 --> 02:01:42,840
Speaker 7: He said, many of the people who found themselves in

1991
02:01:42,840 --> 02:01:46,120
Speaker 7: Cucumber had likely been told by people smugglers, but this

1992
02:01:46,240 --> 02:01:48,800
Speaker 7: was an easy way into the US. In the end,

1993
02:01:48,920 --> 02:01:49,720
Speaker 7: it was anything but.

1994
02:01:50,040 --> 02:01:52,480
Speaker 30: They I mean, I know they didn't expect that they

1995
02:01:52,560 --> 02:01:55,600
Speaker 30: organic waltz across the border at a normal check station,

1996
02:01:55,840 --> 02:01:57,560
Speaker 30: but they thought it was going to be.

1997
02:01:57,600 --> 02:01:58,760
Speaker 1: They were sold in bill the goods.

1998
02:01:58,760 --> 02:02:02,280
Speaker 30: So let's put it back, Yes, that's it, And so

1999
02:02:03,640 --> 02:02:05,760
Speaker 30: I mean, I feel sorry for anybody who's take advantage

2000
02:02:05,800 --> 02:02:07,640
Speaker 30: of all like that. But most of the people that

2001
02:02:07,720 --> 02:02:11,600
Speaker 30: I met again who are not Colombians, were of the

2002
02:02:11,640 --> 02:02:15,400
Speaker 30: wealthier side of the on their countries. I met Tomspecks,

2003
02:02:15,480 --> 02:02:18,600
Speaker 30: some Kazakis, a bunch of people from India, a couple

2004
02:02:18,640 --> 02:02:20,760
Speaker 30: of Pakistani guys, minery.

2005
02:02:20,840 --> 02:02:22,680
Speaker 1: I mean, they didn't get here cheap.

2006
02:02:23,000 --> 02:02:25,560
Speaker 7: The wall behind the people in Hookumba cost twenty five

2007
02:02:25,640 --> 02:02:28,920
Speaker 7: million dollars a mile. On average. The border patrol agent

2008
02:02:29,080 --> 02:02:31,360
Speaker 7: drove around in f one to fifty rapped to trucks

2009
02:02:31,600 --> 02:02:34,839
Speaker 7: that started eighty thousand dollars and each make a starting

2010
02:02:34,880 --> 02:02:37,240
Speaker 7: salary of over sixty thousand dollars in their first year.

2011
02:02:38,280 --> 02:02:41,839
Speaker 7: Surveillance towers that dot the desert, including one which provided

2012
02:02:41,880 --> 02:02:44,120
Speaker 7: a tiny scrap of shade to migrants to restic under

2013
02:02:44,160 --> 02:02:47,800
Speaker 7: its solar panels, can cost a million dollars apiece, but

2014
02:02:47,880 --> 02:02:50,520
Speaker 7: people in the Cumba received only one small water bottle

2015
02:02:50,560 --> 02:02:55,280
Speaker 7: each day despite the punishing weather. Although Customs and Border

2016
02:02:55,320 --> 02:02:57,480
Speaker 7: Protection did not seem to make any plan to shelter

2017
02:02:57,560 --> 02:03:00,440
Speaker 7: migrants in a cumber, they did plan to have contractors

2018
02:03:00,960 --> 02:03:04,520
Speaker 7: paid forty dollars an hour to take them away. I

2019
02:03:04,560 --> 02:03:08,280
Speaker 7: found a job advert for a Southwest Border Transportation and

2020
02:03:08,360 --> 02:03:13,320
Speaker 7: security officer at ISS Action Security. The agency photograph transporting

2021
02:03:13,360 --> 02:03:17,560
Speaker 7: migrants in Hakumba. The job posting, which was posted two

2022
02:03:17,600 --> 02:03:20,160
Speaker 7: weeks before the end of Title forty two, has a

2023
02:03:20,200 --> 02:03:24,280
Speaker 7: description that includes patting down all detainees and applying appropriate

2024
02:03:24,320 --> 02:03:29,480
Speaker 7: restraints prior to boarding vehicles. The process through its migrants

2025
02:03:29,520 --> 02:03:33,360
Speaker 7: become detainees normally involves processing which had not been done

2026
02:03:33,400 --> 02:03:36,760
Speaker 7: in Nucumber, But it seems that presumption of ineligibility announced

2027
02:03:36,840 --> 02:03:39,360
Speaker 7: on the day Title forty two ended came into effect here.

2028
02:03:40,080 --> 02:03:43,120
Speaker 7: This might seem a minor distinction, but it's important It

2029
02:03:43,160 --> 02:03:45,560
Speaker 7: means that people have to file a defensive asylum claim

2030
02:03:45,600 --> 02:03:48,320
Speaker 7: and not an affirmative one. They have to plead why

2031
02:03:48,360 --> 02:03:50,440
Speaker 7: they shouldn't be deported rather than why they have a

2032
02:03:50,560 --> 02:03:54,320
Speaker 7: right to stay. Many of the people who have been

2033
02:03:54,320 --> 02:03:56,360
Speaker 7: trying to cross before the end of Title forty two,

2034
02:03:56,440 --> 02:03:58,920
Speaker 7: like Diana, because they felt they would face a less

2035
02:03:58,920 --> 02:04:02,080
Speaker 7: serious penalty. Many of them flew to Twinea. I walked

2036
02:04:02,080 --> 02:04:04,480
Speaker 7: from further south in Mexico or even in Central America.

2037
02:04:04,920 --> 02:04:07,320
Speaker 7: I likely spent their entire savings on a trip to

2038
02:04:07,360 --> 02:04:09,640
Speaker 7: the gap in the wall near Heucumber that ended with

2039
02:04:09,680 --> 02:04:11,880
Speaker 7: them being held by border patrol in the open desert.

2040
02:04:11,920 --> 02:04:14,000
Speaker 7: Was next to nothing in the way of shelter, sanitation,

2041
02:04:14,400 --> 02:04:17,800
Speaker 7: or sustenance. As a way to quantify this, I want

2042
02:04:17,800 --> 02:04:22,640
Speaker 7: a reference to UCSD US Immigration Policy Center report apparently

2043
02:04:22,640 --> 02:04:26,440
Speaker 7: had some pretty problematic practices, but anyway, these are results

2044
02:04:26,440 --> 02:04:30,360
Speaker 7: from its survey. When asked whether border patrol gave them

2045
02:04:30,480 --> 02:04:33,040
Speaker 7: enough water for the day, over half of the asylum

2046
02:04:33,080 --> 02:04:36,440
Speaker 7: seekers that we interviewed, approximately fifty three percent said no.

2047
02:04:37,040 --> 02:04:40,040
Speaker 7: Border patrol distributed one water bottle to each migrant in

2048
02:04:40,080 --> 02:04:43,640
Speaker 7: the morning. When asked whether border patrol gave them enough

2049
02:04:43,640 --> 02:04:46,800
Speaker 7: food for the day, All of the asylum seekers said no.

2050
02:04:47,360 --> 02:04:51,240
Speaker 7: Border patrol did not distribute any food. When asked whether

2051
02:04:51,320 --> 02:04:55,200
Speaker 7: border patrol provided adequate sanitation such as toilets, all of

2052
02:04:55,200 --> 02:04:58,520
Speaker 7: the asylum seekers that we interviewed, meaning one hundred percent,

2053
02:04:58,640 --> 02:05:01,960
Speaker 7: said no. Bordert troll provided one porter body for the

2054
02:05:02,120 --> 02:05:07,080
Speaker 7: entire encampment. When asked where the border patrol provided adepriate shelter,

2055
02:05:07,200 --> 02:05:09,640
Speaker 7: such as shade to protect them from the sun, all

2056
02:05:09,640 --> 02:05:12,880
Speaker 7: of the asylum seekers that we interviewed said no. Border

2057
02:05:12,880 --> 02:05:16,800
Speaker 7: patrol did not provide any shelter. When asked whether border

2058
02:05:16,800 --> 02:05:19,920
Speaker 7: patrol provided blankets to keep them warm at night, all

2059
02:05:19,960 --> 02:05:22,640
Speaker 7: but one of the asylum seekers we interviewed said no.

2060
02:05:23,120 --> 02:05:27,280
Speaker 7: Border patrol provided blankets some migrants, but the overwhelming majority,

2061
02:05:27,280 --> 02:05:31,200
Speaker 7: did not receive blankets. Altogether, two thirds of the asylum

2062
02:05:31,280 --> 02:05:34,720
Speaker 7: seekers we interviewed said that they agree or strongly agree

2063
02:05:34,760 --> 02:05:37,480
Speaker 7: with the statement. If I did not receive food and

2064
02:05:37,520 --> 02:05:40,240
Speaker 7: water from volunteers, I would not get enough food and

2065
02:05:40,280 --> 02:05:45,480
Speaker 7: water from border patrol to survive. These aren't exaggerations, as

2066
02:05:45,520 --> 02:05:48,760
Speaker 7: we'll see, several migrants did come very close to losing

2067
02:05:48,800 --> 02:05:50,920
Speaker 7: their lives in the five or more days that CBP

2068
02:05:51,040 --> 02:06:02,240
Speaker 7: detained people out in the open along the border. Medical

2069
02:06:02,240 --> 02:06:04,960
Speaker 7: incidents in this kind of attention are far from uncommon.

2070
02:06:05,800 --> 02:06:08,200
Speaker 7: A lawsuit filed against Customs of Border Protection by the

2071
02:06:08,240 --> 02:06:12,160
Speaker 7: Southern Border Communities Coalition regarding their actions this week, stated

2072
02:06:12,200 --> 02:06:15,440
Speaker 7: that quote, many migrants have fallen into medical distress because

2073
02:06:15,440 --> 02:06:18,320
Speaker 7: of the conditions, and CVP has been slow to provide

2074
02:06:18,320 --> 02:06:22,000
Speaker 7: access to medical attention, often only responding at the insistence

2075
02:06:22,000 --> 02:06:26,160
Speaker 7: of advocates. As a result, one woman suffered life threatening allergies,

2076
02:06:26,440 --> 02:06:29,400
Speaker 7: a child suffered an epileptic seizure, and a man suffered

2077
02:06:29,400 --> 02:06:33,360
Speaker 7: an unattended infection on his leg. Medical attention was slow

2078
02:06:33,360 --> 02:06:37,320
Speaker 7: to arrive, and when it did arrive, it was often insufficient. Kay,

2079
02:06:37,320 --> 02:06:39,440
Speaker 7: but describe the conditions they saw a couple of days

2080
02:06:39,440 --> 02:06:40,840
Speaker 7: after the end of Title forty two.

2081
02:06:41,280 --> 02:06:45,520
Speaker 8: That's really the partct that hard inter state. The conditions

2082
02:06:45,520 --> 02:06:50,280
Speaker 8: there were not safe or sanitary. I guess this is

2083
02:06:50,360 --> 02:06:54,320
Speaker 8: sort of related to medical issues, but there was that's been,

2084
02:06:54,840 --> 02:06:57,440
Speaker 8: you know, to their credit. A suspect has been reported

2085
02:06:57,720 --> 02:07:02,480
Speaker 8: in the media that there was a single portable toilet

2086
02:07:02,640 --> 02:07:05,080
Speaker 8: for anywhere from I guess there's probably a twilet to

2087
02:07:05,120 --> 02:07:08,960
Speaker 8: four hundred people there. I heard a couple of different

2088
02:07:10,320 --> 02:07:14,480
Speaker 8: citations of how often this toilet is serviced and cleaned

2089
02:07:14,560 --> 02:07:18,240
Speaker 8: and the waste removed anywhere from once or twice a

2090
02:07:18,280 --> 02:07:21,560
Speaker 8: week to once every week or two weeks. Either way,

2091
02:07:21,640 --> 02:07:25,000
Speaker 8: that's not remotely sufficient for four hundred people using the

2092
02:07:25,000 --> 02:07:28,600
Speaker 8: bathroom multiple times a day in this single portable like

2093
02:07:28,720 --> 02:07:33,320
Speaker 8: just a construction site toilet. It was right next to

2094
02:07:33,320 --> 02:07:35,440
Speaker 8: the phone charging station on the other side of the wall,

2095
02:07:35,560 --> 02:07:39,960
Speaker 8: and I would just feel sick if I got if

2096
02:07:39,960 --> 02:07:42,760
Speaker 8: I sit too close to it. It was really vile.

2097
02:07:43,160 --> 02:07:46,640
Speaker 8: It was not safe. It is not a way for

2098
02:07:46,680 --> 02:07:49,200
Speaker 8: people to be helping. And I do know, I think

2099
02:07:49,240 --> 02:07:54,120
Speaker 8: a lot of thankfully people stop using it, but then

2100
02:07:54,280 --> 02:07:56,920
Speaker 8: they don't have any you know, a privacy or that

2101
02:07:56,920 --> 02:07:59,760
Speaker 8: that's still not you know, a sanitary situation to be

2102
02:07:59,840 --> 02:08:02,920
Speaker 8: in since I mean, they don't have a future space anywhere.

2103
02:08:04,160 --> 02:08:06,040
Speaker 8: So that's definitely one of the way is that people

2104
02:08:07,040 --> 02:08:08,080
Speaker 8: intention to help safe.

2105
02:08:08,560 --> 02:08:11,560
Speaker 7: He's Samara who hear more from tomorrow describe being another

2106
02:08:11,600 --> 02:08:12,360
Speaker 7: medical incident.

2107
02:08:12,560 --> 02:08:14,320
Speaker 14: And the call that I got this morning was of

2108
02:08:14,360 --> 02:08:18,440
Speaker 14: a woman who was rushed out because she had an

2109
02:08:18,440 --> 02:08:22,360
Speaker 14: emergency situation, taken to the hospital. The hospital didn't know

2110
02:08:22,360 --> 02:08:24,520
Speaker 14: what to do with her, so they sat her right

2111
02:08:24,560 --> 02:08:26,640
Speaker 14: back here in the middle of the night, in the

2112
02:08:26,680 --> 02:08:29,240
Speaker 14: middle of the night, and they brought her here. She

2113
02:08:29,280 --> 02:08:32,160
Speaker 14: doesn't have any documents. CBP didn't get a chance to

2114
02:08:32,200 --> 02:08:35,240
Speaker 14: process her yet, so she doesn't even have any proof

2115
02:08:35,320 --> 02:08:38,080
Speaker 14: that she actually came to the port of entry and

2116
02:08:38,120 --> 02:08:41,320
Speaker 14: try to seek asylum. And she was just sleeping right here.

2117
02:08:41,440 --> 02:08:44,760
Speaker 14: And she has burns all over her body, has an infection.

2118
02:08:44,920 --> 02:08:49,280
Speaker 14: I read the the seven medications that they gave her,

2119
02:08:49,560 --> 02:08:53,160
Speaker 14: and she speaks daddy. She's from avon Astan. Her husband

2120
02:08:53,240 --> 02:08:56,000
Speaker 14: got taken by the Taliban, and she escaped, running for

2121
02:08:56,040 --> 02:08:59,680
Speaker 14: her life. And she's here and she has sunburns all

2122
02:08:59,720 --> 02:09:02,440
Speaker 14: over her face and she has nowhere to go. She

2123
02:09:02,520 --> 02:09:04,840
Speaker 14: thought she was still detained. She actually thought she was

2124
02:09:04,880 --> 02:09:07,160
Speaker 14: still detained. She was just trying to get back to

2125
02:09:07,200 --> 02:09:09,400
Speaker 14: the other side of the border. She thought she was

2126
02:09:09,400 --> 02:09:12,960
Speaker 14: still in Mexico. No one explained anything to her. They

2127
02:09:13,000 --> 02:09:15,120
Speaker 14: brought her back here in the middle of the night,

2128
02:09:15,320 --> 02:09:18,880
Speaker 14: and she was freezing, and so we brought That's why

2129
02:09:18,920 --> 02:09:21,040
Speaker 14: I came out here. I talked to her. The other

2130
02:09:21,080 --> 02:09:23,000
Speaker 14: folks who were out here didn't know why she was

2131
02:09:23,040 --> 02:09:26,520
Speaker 14: just sleeping here, and I came out and tried to

2132
02:09:26,800 --> 02:09:29,080
Speaker 14: translate it, and now we have her at a hotel.

2133
02:09:29,880 --> 02:09:32,520
Speaker 7: Cable witness one of the emergencies described in the Southern

2134
02:09:32,520 --> 02:09:35,760
Speaker 7: Border Communities Coalition lawsuit when they visited the camp. He's

2135
02:09:35,840 --> 02:09:37,240
Speaker 7: him describing it in.

2136
02:09:37,240 --> 02:09:39,920
Speaker 8: Terms of you know, medical care as well. Like I said,

2137
02:09:39,920 --> 02:09:43,160
Speaker 8: one of the parts of the aid operation, I was

2138
02:09:43,160 --> 02:09:46,600
Speaker 8: my n most people. I think there's a permonation both

2139
02:09:46,640 --> 02:09:50,000
Speaker 8: of people who were you know and the true medicine

2140
02:09:50,440 --> 02:09:52,960
Speaker 8: as well as people who were like nurses volunteering their

2141
02:09:52,960 --> 02:09:57,640
Speaker 8: prime and mostly taking care of just kind of retained

2142
02:09:57,680 --> 02:10:02,160
Speaker 8: first aid for the most part. There was a situation

2143
02:10:02,240 --> 02:10:09,200
Speaker 8: where someone was having an ellergic reaction, a fairly severe one,

2144
02:10:10,080 --> 02:10:13,240
Speaker 8: and and I happen to carry an EpiPen, so I

2145
02:10:13,240 --> 02:10:17,640
Speaker 8: have simply give that to the one of one of

2146
02:10:17,640 --> 02:10:22,400
Speaker 8: the stegematics, and then they eventually did call this person.

2147
02:10:23,480 --> 02:10:26,640
Speaker 8: The reaction got severe enough that it was an an

2148
02:10:26,720 --> 02:10:30,200
Speaker 8: hour or so later at that nine one was called,

2149
02:10:30,200 --> 02:10:35,080
Speaker 8: I assumed by one of the volunteers, and uh Amber

2150
02:10:35,120 --> 02:10:37,280
Speaker 8: Villaince and Border Patrol came to open the gate and

2151
02:10:37,280 --> 02:10:40,360
Speaker 8: and bring this person in the country. They did eventually

2152
02:10:40,520 --> 02:10:42,720
Speaker 8: treat her, but it was a very it was a

2153
02:10:42,720 --> 02:10:47,160
Speaker 8: long time. I connunced it acceptance, which is someone as

2154
02:10:47,200 --> 02:10:51,360
Speaker 8: someone who has anaphlexis reactions food and it's had that

2155
02:10:51,400 --> 02:10:54,040
Speaker 8: happened many times in their life. That is absolutely terrifying.

2156
02:10:54,160 --> 02:10:57,040
Speaker 8: I cannot imagine how terrifying it would be to be

2157
02:10:57,120 --> 02:11:01,520
Speaker 8: experiencing uh A her wife priding situation, and when you

2158
02:11:01,560 --> 02:11:06,000
Speaker 8: worked for APPS and you know there's no authority about

2159
02:11:06,000 --> 02:11:08,960
Speaker 8: many parents that you're there, and I don't know if

2160
02:11:08,960 --> 02:11:10,960
Speaker 8: she would have been able to get help if there

2161
02:11:10,960 --> 02:11:14,280
Speaker 8: have been volunteers in the s while especially once.

2162
02:11:14,080 --> 02:11:19,480
Speaker 7: We're training, where volunteers weren't. Things were worse in Texas.

2163
02:11:19,800 --> 02:11:23,680
Speaker 7: And Rees Alvarez, an eight year old girl born in

2164
02:11:23,720 --> 02:11:27,480
Speaker 7: Panama to or On daur and parents, died in CBP custody.

2165
02:11:28,560 --> 02:11:33,320
Speaker 7: Roselle Rees, the girl's father, told NBC News that they

2166
02:11:33,360 --> 02:11:37,320
Speaker 7: gave authorities documents about the girl's medical conditions congenital heart

2167
02:11:37,360 --> 02:11:40,919
Speaker 7: disease and sickle cell anemia while they were in immigration custody.

2168
02:11:42,040 --> 02:11:44,920
Speaker 7: They said that a doctor there examined danideath and that

2169
02:11:44,960 --> 02:11:50,160
Speaker 7: she had contracted the flu. Alvarez, her mother said she

2170
02:11:50,200 --> 02:11:53,280
Speaker 7: spoke to both detentional authorities and medical personnel at the

2171
02:11:53,280 --> 02:11:56,400
Speaker 7: station multiple times to explain her daughter was complaining of

2172
02:11:56,440 --> 02:11:59,440
Speaker 7: pain and shortness of breath and that she was getting worse.

2173
02:12:00,520 --> 02:12:02,920
Speaker 7: I'll quite the next part directly from the NBC story.

2174
02:12:04,400 --> 02:12:07,480
Speaker 7: They never listened to me, she said. Veas said his

2175
02:12:07,560 --> 02:12:10,320
Speaker 7: daughter was in a lot of pain, a lot of pain.

2176
02:12:11,480 --> 02:12:15,200
Speaker 7: I begged them to call an ambulance, Alvarez said, adding

2177
02:12:15,200 --> 02:12:18,160
Speaker 7: the authorities told her the girl's condition wasn't serious enough

2178
02:12:18,160 --> 02:12:22,040
Speaker 7: to warrant calling an ambulance. Alvarez said her daughter begged

2179
02:12:22,120 --> 02:12:25,520
Speaker 7: authorities as well, telling them she could not breathe from

2180
02:12:25,520 --> 02:12:29,640
Speaker 7: her nose or mouth. Alvarez says that eventually her daughter

2181
02:12:29,720 --> 02:12:35,800
Speaker 7: lost consciousness and died in my arms. She said, authorities

2182
02:12:35,800 --> 02:12:37,640
Speaker 7: took the girl from her arms and put her on

2183
02:12:37,680 --> 02:12:42,160
Speaker 7: the floor trying to revive her. My daughter died there

2184
02:12:42,520 --> 02:12:47,040
Speaker 7: in the station, she said. Avare said she feels authorities

2185
02:12:47,080 --> 02:12:50,400
Speaker 7: did not do enough to help her little girl. My

2186
02:12:50,520 --> 02:12:53,360
Speaker 7: daughter is a human being. They had to take care

2187
02:12:53,400 --> 02:12:56,680
Speaker 7: of her, she said. Despite what you might have heard

2188
02:12:56,680 --> 02:12:59,880
Speaker 7: on the network news, the asylum process is anything but easy.

2189
02:13:00,440 --> 02:13:03,680
Speaker 7: I've had several visas, a green card and a US passport,

2190
02:13:03,720 --> 02:13:05,640
Speaker 7: and I can completly tell you the only easy way

2191
02:13:05,680 --> 02:13:08,320
Speaker 7: I've ever seen to come here is to be very rich.

2192
02:13:09,240 --> 02:13:12,440
Speaker 7: But even among the convoluted bureaucratic mess that is US immigration,

2193
02:13:13,000 --> 02:13:16,880
Speaker 7: the asylum process stands out as both rigorous and complicated.

2194
02:13:17,440 --> 02:13:20,440
Speaker 7: Asylum is a process by which people unable or unwilling

2195
02:13:20,440 --> 02:13:23,120
Speaker 7: to return to their country because of persecution or a

2196
02:13:23,200 --> 02:13:29,440
Speaker 7: well founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, politics,

2197
02:13:29,800 --> 02:13:33,040
Speaker 7: or membership of a particular social group may remain in

2198
02:13:33,080 --> 02:13:37,040
Speaker 7: a safe country. From the eleventh of May onwards, migrants

2199
02:13:37,040 --> 02:13:40,240
Speaker 7: at the border were assumed ineligible for asylum. If they

2200
02:13:40,320 --> 02:13:43,839
Speaker 7: cross between points of entry, they must enter the defensive

2201
02:13:43,840 --> 02:13:47,440
Speaker 7: asylum process to prevent themselves from being deported. What this

2202
02:13:47,560 --> 02:13:49,760
Speaker 7: means for people we heard from earlier is that they

2203
02:13:49,800 --> 02:13:52,520
Speaker 7: are now taken for whatever God forsake and holding area they'rein,

2204
02:13:53,000 --> 02:13:56,080
Speaker 7: and bust to a processing facility where they are interviewed

2205
02:13:56,080 --> 02:13:58,120
Speaker 7: by an asylum officer to determine if they have a

2206
02:13:58,120 --> 02:14:01,200
Speaker 7: credible fear of persecution. They may need to provide a

2207
02:14:01,200 --> 02:14:04,440
Speaker 7: translator if there is an interviewing agent who speaks their language,

2208
02:14:04,880 --> 02:14:07,200
Speaker 7: and if they're determined to have a credible fear they're

2209
02:14:07,240 --> 02:14:09,240
Speaker 7: told to check in with the US Customs and Immigration

2210
02:14:09,320 --> 02:14:12,640
Speaker 7: Office and sometimes given a notice which may or may

2211
02:14:12,640 --> 02:14:15,880
Speaker 7: not be dated to appear in court. My colleague Joe

2212
02:14:15,880 --> 02:14:17,800
Speaker 7: tried to get into one of these hotels to talk

2213
02:14:17,840 --> 02:14:19,720
Speaker 7: to one of the people we'd spoken to at the border,

2214
02:14:20,080 --> 02:14:21,560
Speaker 7: but he was pretty quickly shut down.

2215
02:14:22,240 --> 02:14:26,720
Speaker 15: Yeah, how you doing either, I'm a freelance journalist. I'm

2216
02:14:26,800 --> 02:14:30,080
Speaker 15: here reporting for my boss, James Stout, he's at iHeartMedia.

2217
02:14:30,400 --> 02:14:32,400
Speaker 15: I'm wondering if you're letting media in here to see

2218
02:14:32,400 --> 02:14:32,840
Speaker 15: the causa.

2219
02:14:33,480 --> 02:14:36,080
Speaker 10: Okay, also the act you guys and I took the

2220
02:14:36,160 --> 02:14:38,080
Speaker 10: strict any of this area here? Okay.

2221
02:14:38,120 --> 02:14:39,520
Speaker 1: Well, if you're going to set up, it has to

2222
02:14:39,520 --> 02:14:40,879
Speaker 1: be on the side of the line.

2223
02:14:40,680 --> 02:14:42,240
Speaker 10: Because they have a line of traffic.

2224
02:14:42,400 --> 02:14:44,080
Speaker 23: Yeah, and it's very dangerous for your ka.

2225
02:14:44,360 --> 02:14:47,120
Speaker 10: So like beyond here, past the college. Yeah, from here

2226
02:14:47,320 --> 02:14:48,720
Speaker 10: over okay, cool, I'll.

2227
02:14:48,560 --> 02:14:49,120
Speaker 31: Say how you're way.

2228
02:14:49,240 --> 02:14:49,480
Speaker 16: Thank you.

2229
02:14:50,920 --> 02:14:52,760
Speaker 7: One of the folks we'd met was able to stay

2230
02:14:52,760 --> 02:14:55,000
Speaker 7: in touch for our WhatsApp and share the hotel rules

2231
02:14:55,000 --> 02:14:58,840
Speaker 7: with us. They were pretty strict. Migrants are confined to

2232
02:14:58,880 --> 02:15:01,120
Speaker 7: their rooms, they can't have visitors, and they can't even

2233
02:15:01,200 --> 02:15:05,240
Speaker 7: order food delivery from the hotel where they're hosted by

2234
02:15:05,240 --> 02:15:08,200
Speaker 7: Catholic charities. Migrants need to get to their sponsor in

2235
02:15:08,200 --> 02:15:10,480
Speaker 7: the United States if they have one. If they don't

2236
02:15:10,520 --> 02:15:12,600
Speaker 7: have one, they can be sent just about anywhere. I've

2237
02:15:12,600 --> 02:15:15,040
Speaker 7: heard of East African folks having ended up in Alaska,

2238
02:15:15,080 --> 02:15:18,480
Speaker 7: for example. Once they get to where they're going to be,

2239
02:15:18,880 --> 02:15:21,960
Speaker 7: they check in with US Customs and Immigration Services in

2240
02:15:22,000 --> 02:15:24,400
Speaker 7: their new location, and they're given a special phone which

2241
02:15:24,440 --> 02:15:27,600
Speaker 7: also tracks their movements. They may have a DNA sample

2242
02:15:27,600 --> 02:15:31,600
Speaker 7: take and in addition to fingerprints. Later, sometimes years later,

2243
02:15:31,840 --> 02:15:34,080
Speaker 7: they attend a court hearing or two to determine their

2244
02:15:34,080 --> 02:15:37,880
Speaker 7: eligibility to stay. I've heard of lawyers charging from five

2245
02:15:37,920 --> 02:15:41,160
Speaker 7: thousand dollars to twelve thousand dollars for these hearings, and

2246
02:15:41,440 --> 02:15:44,320
Speaker 7: nonprofit legalists and services are totally overwhelmed. At the moment,

2247
02:15:45,160 --> 02:15:48,200
Speaker 7: the system's massively backed up, and court dates are being

2248
02:15:48,240 --> 02:15:51,480
Speaker 7: given as far out as twenty twenty seven already. They

2249
02:15:51,520 --> 02:15:53,839
Speaker 7: may or may not be able to work during that period,

2250
02:15:54,200 --> 02:15:56,280
Speaker 7: and under the table work is getting harder and harder

2251
02:15:56,320 --> 02:15:59,720
Speaker 7: to find. Even if they do find work on less

2252
02:15:59,720 --> 02:16:01,760
Speaker 7: than minut wage, it can be very hard to say

2253
02:16:01,760 --> 02:16:04,600
Speaker 7: about five thousand dollars for a lawyer. A Migrants who

2254
02:16:04,600 --> 02:16:07,520
Speaker 7: can't find nonprofit help are at a significant disadvantage when

2255
02:16:07,520 --> 02:16:11,680
Speaker 7: it comes to their asylum hearings again private security contractors,

2256
02:16:11,680 --> 02:16:15,320
Speaker 7: this time from Allied. We're transporting migrants to the hotel

2257
02:16:15,320 --> 02:16:19,240
Speaker 7: and guarding it. Like CBP, the private contractors you guard,

2258
02:16:19,360 --> 02:16:22,200
Speaker 7: transport and incarce rate migrants or rely on the broken

2259
02:16:22,200 --> 02:16:26,360
Speaker 7: in immigration system to make money. Unlike CBP, the agents

2260
02:16:26,400 --> 02:16:29,480
Speaker 7: themselves aren't well paid. Nineteen dollars an hours are going

2261
02:16:29,560 --> 02:16:32,400
Speaker 7: rate for Allied, not much higher than San Diego's sixteen

2262
02:16:32,480 --> 02:16:36,199
Speaker 7: dollars and thirty cents minimum wage. But the company itself

2263
02:16:36,280 --> 02:16:39,080
Speaker 7: is huge. It's the third last year as private employer

2264
02:16:39,120 --> 02:16:42,920
Speaker 7: in North America after Walmart and Amazon. Allied guards are

2265
02:16:42,920 --> 02:16:46,400
Speaker 7: at prisons, airports, and shopping malls across America, and it's

2266
02:16:46,440 --> 02:16:50,320
Speaker 7: alleged that some are underpaid, in sufficiently trained, and improperly vetted.

2267
02:16:51,200 --> 02:16:55,480
Speaker 7: The company grosses over twenty billion dollars, and it's affiliates

2268
02:16:55,520 --> 02:16:59,280
Speaker 7: of frequent political donors. All across this story, you'll see

2269
02:16:59,280 --> 02:17:05,040
Speaker 7: this Allied Security iss action, security people, smugglers, customs and

2270
02:17:05,080 --> 02:17:08,480
Speaker 7: border protection contractors who build the wall pieces, and contractors

2271
02:17:08,480 --> 02:17:12,480
Speaker 7: who install the wall pieces, General Atomics, who sell CBP drones,

2272
02:17:12,520 --> 02:17:16,320
Speaker 7: and the Israelian American companies who sell the surveillance technology.

2273
02:17:15,840 --> 02:17:16,360
Speaker 1: To the government.

2274
02:17:17,080 --> 02:17:20,320
Speaker 7: All these people make money, but the poorest people in

2275
02:17:20,320 --> 02:17:22,920
Speaker 7: the world are the only ones losing money, and sometimes

2276
02:17:22,959 --> 02:17:27,160
Speaker 7: they're lives when they cross our southern border. Tomorrow we're

2277
02:17:27,200 --> 02:17:29,039
Speaker 7: hear from some of the people who made no money

2278
02:17:29,440 --> 02:17:31,879
Speaker 7: and looked after the migrants and will continue to support

2279
02:17:31,920 --> 02:17:33,400
Speaker 7: them through the asylum process.

2280
02:17:43,400 --> 02:17:46,440
Speaker 17: Try and carpool, try and shove into cars as best

2281
02:17:46,480 --> 02:17:48,840
Speaker 17: you can, just so that we don't have a mile long.

2282
02:17:50,680 --> 02:17:51,720
Speaker 13: Line of cars.

2283
02:17:52,680 --> 02:17:56,360
Speaker 17: We have trash bags, we have gloves, we have things

2284
02:17:56,400 --> 02:17:59,760
Speaker 17: that we're bringing up there, so what we have cars

2285
02:17:59,760 --> 02:18:01,600
Speaker 17: of you can get all of that out of.

2286
02:18:03,360 --> 02:18:04,400
Speaker 10: Once we pull over.

2287
02:18:04,520 --> 02:18:06,240
Speaker 29: We're also setting up a couple.

2288
02:18:06,040 --> 02:18:06,800
Speaker 10: Of pop ups.

2289
02:18:06,840 --> 02:18:09,959
Speaker 7: Hoocomber, California, is a tiny town. You've probably never heard

2290
02:18:09,959 --> 02:18:12,600
Speaker 7: of it. It's actually really charming. There's a hot spring

2291
02:18:12,920 --> 02:18:16,320
Speaker 7: and a gorgeous hotel, a few stores selling trinkets that

2292
02:18:16,440 --> 02:18:18,920
Speaker 7: kind of thing. There's a lovely lake fed by the spring,

2293
02:18:19,240 --> 02:18:21,440
Speaker 7: and on this sunbake morning, there are about fifty people

2294
02:18:21,480 --> 02:18:24,800
Speaker 7: outside an old petrol station nervously pounding bottles of water,

2295
02:18:25,120 --> 02:18:27,480
Speaker 7: applying sunscreen, and getting ready to head out to the

2296
02:18:27,480 --> 02:18:30,200
Speaker 7: desert to clear up the ad hoc migrant camp that

2297
02:18:30,240 --> 02:18:32,400
Speaker 7: has held as many as fifteen hundred people out in

2298
02:18:32,480 --> 02:18:35,440
Speaker 7: the open when Title forty two ended and Border Patrol

2299
02:18:35,520 --> 02:18:38,480
Speaker 7: made no plans to keep them anywhere. It was a

2300
02:18:38,480 --> 02:18:41,480
Speaker 7: diverse bunch of people hidden beneath sun hats. There's an

2301
02:18:41,480 --> 02:18:43,800
Speaker 7: Australian film producer who was at a conference in Orlando

2302
02:18:43,800 --> 02:18:46,560
Speaker 7: and booked a fly over, a grad student painter. The

2303
02:18:46,600 --> 02:18:48,760
Speaker 7: folks who were in the Hookumber Hotel who organize this

2304
02:18:48,840 --> 02:18:52,959
Speaker 7: whole thing, they're friends from the hospitality industry in San Diego.

2305
02:18:53,120 --> 02:18:55,400
Speaker 7: There were students and mums and dads and about the

2306
02:18:55,520 --> 02:18:59,000
Speaker 7: entire population of this tiny desert town. There were also

2307
02:18:59,040 --> 02:19:01,320
Speaker 7: two form international aid workers who are in a tower

2308
02:19:01,400 --> 02:19:03,240
Speaker 7: where you can look at the desert, which is actually

2309
02:19:03,240 --> 02:19:06,000
Speaker 7: a much cooler thing than it sounds. And there's also

2310
02:19:06,040 --> 02:19:07,760
Speaker 7: a museum of boulders right next to it. You should

2311
02:19:07,760 --> 02:19:10,400
Speaker 7: probably check them out during the area. I spent the

2312
02:19:10,480 --> 02:19:13,440
Speaker 7: day helping out in Acumber after the refugees, some of

2313
02:19:13,440 --> 02:19:17,160
Speaker 7: them in handcuffs, have been taken by private contractors to

2314
02:19:17,240 --> 02:19:20,920
Speaker 7: be processed by CBP's Office of Field Operations. We met

2315
02:19:21,080 --> 02:19:23,160
Speaker 7: at a petrol station in the middle of town. The

2316
02:19:23,200 --> 02:19:25,720
Speaker 7: space where the pumps should be was filled with tons,

2317
02:19:25,720 --> 02:19:28,560
Speaker 7: and I do mean tons of bottled water, masks, hand

2318
02:19:28,640 --> 02:19:32,120
Speaker 7: sanitized or and other necessary supplies. When I'd arrived the

2319
02:19:32,200 --> 02:19:35,280
Speaker 7: night before around ten pm, the eerie green and yellow

2320
02:19:35,360 --> 02:19:37,560
Speaker 7: lights reflecting from the roof had lit up the palace

2321
02:19:37,600 --> 02:19:40,080
Speaker 7: of water like some kind of giant lava lamp, and

2322
02:19:40,240 --> 02:19:43,080
Speaker 7: driving across the desert, the town looked like it was glowing.

2323
02:19:44,440 --> 02:19:46,160
Speaker 7: The town certainly has had a bit of a glow

2324
02:19:46,240 --> 02:19:49,720
Speaker 7: up in the last few years. Three business partners purchased

2325
02:19:49,720 --> 02:19:52,040
Speaker 7: their cumber hot Springs Hotel, a down in the mouth

2326
02:19:52,080 --> 02:19:55,320
Speaker 7: property that had once been a glamorous desert resort, and

2327
02:19:55,360 --> 02:19:59,080
Speaker 7: they've been restoring the place for nearly two years. Inadvertently,

2328
02:19:59,120 --> 02:20:01,080
Speaker 7: they also purchased a lot of land and a few

2329
02:20:01,080 --> 02:20:03,200
Speaker 7: other rundown buildings in a town that were sold as

2330
02:20:03,200 --> 02:20:05,280
Speaker 7: a lot with the hotel. It was in one of

2331
02:20:05,280 --> 02:20:08,640
Speaker 7: these buildings, the old gas station, that they set up

2332
02:20:08,720 --> 02:20:12,480
Speaker 7: a de facto mutual aid hubbo almost overnight. The hotel's

2333
02:20:12,520 --> 02:20:14,600
Speaker 7: not finished yet, and they probably didn't make much progress

2334
02:20:14,600 --> 02:20:16,120
Speaker 7: on it during the week when they were feeding more

2335
02:20:16,160 --> 02:20:19,640
Speaker 7: than a thousand people in the desert. The town's lake,

2336
02:20:19,680 --> 02:20:22,640
Speaker 7: fed by a natural spring, an old bath house used

2337
02:20:22,640 --> 02:20:25,920
Speaker 7: to be attractions. Today the bathhouse of roof has fallen off,

2338
02:20:25,959 --> 02:20:28,879
Speaker 7: but it still makes a pretty cool coincert venue, and

2339
02:20:28,920 --> 02:20:31,520
Speaker 7: the whole town offers commanding views of the border wall,

2340
02:20:31,600 --> 02:20:33,879
Speaker 7: which sadly is only a couple of hundred yards from

2341
02:20:33,879 --> 02:20:37,800
Speaker 7: the main street. When I arrived in Cucumber, everything was close.

2342
02:20:38,320 --> 02:20:40,600
Speaker 7: The mini mark was sold out, the hotel was still

2343
02:20:40,600 --> 02:20:43,160
Speaker 7: being worked on, and the hotel kitchen was churning out

2344
02:20:43,200 --> 02:20:47,119
Speaker 7: food for volunteers at the clean up effort. I asked Marissa,

2345
02:20:47,240 --> 02:20:49,600
Speaker 7: one of the volunteers I met that day, about her

2346
02:20:49,640 --> 02:20:51,879
Speaker 7: first impressions on arriving at the meeting point.

2347
02:20:52,080 --> 02:20:56,040
Speaker 29: I was incredibly impressed by what the people of Hukumber

2348
02:20:56,400 --> 02:21:00,680
Speaker 29: and the hotel group of individuals that have organize this,

2349
02:21:00,840 --> 02:21:04,720
Speaker 29: Like I couldn't believe seeing their donation depot in that

2350
02:21:05,120 --> 02:21:08,400
Speaker 29: old car wash, just to how well organized everything was,

2351
02:21:08,520 --> 02:21:12,160
Speaker 29: and that they provided so much for the volunteers, and

2352
02:21:12,640 --> 02:21:18,280
Speaker 29: they just the level of love and compassion and was Yeah,

2353
02:21:18,320 --> 02:21:21,320
Speaker 29: it was an amazing opportunity to be part of very humbling.

2354
02:21:21,920 --> 02:21:24,199
Speaker 7: I've been there since late the night before after visiting

2355
02:21:24,280 --> 02:21:27,560
Speaker 7: border crossings in California and Arizona, and Jeff, one of

2356
02:21:27,560 --> 02:21:29,720
Speaker 7: the co owners a hotel kind you let me put

2357
02:21:29,800 --> 02:21:32,840
Speaker 7: up my truck in some desert behind his house. Now,

2358
02:21:32,840 --> 02:21:34,879
Speaker 7: I'm a person who enjoys sleeping outside, and I do

2359
02:21:34,920 --> 02:21:36,840
Speaker 7: it as often as I can. I try and camp

2360
02:21:36,840 --> 02:21:40,480
Speaker 7: police once a month. But that night I was cold,

2361
02:21:40,720 --> 02:21:43,440
Speaker 7: even underneath my down blanket, and I couldn't help but

2362
02:21:43,480 --> 02:21:45,600
Speaker 7: think of how desperate it must have been to spend

2363
02:21:45,680 --> 02:21:47,600
Speaker 7: nearly a week out there with nothing but in my

2364
02:21:47,680 --> 02:21:51,080
Speaker 7: last base blanket and some thorny bushes to keep you warm.

2365
02:21:51,440 --> 02:21:53,400
Speaker 7: It's certainly not the welcome that one would expect from

2366
02:21:53,440 --> 02:21:56,400
Speaker 7: their richest nation on Earth, which had three years to repair.

2367
02:21:56,520 --> 02:21:59,120
Speaker 7: For the day, Title forty two ended to get a

2368
02:21:59,160 --> 02:22:01,359
Speaker 7: bit of background, or I spoke to Natalie.

2369
02:22:01,600 --> 02:22:06,039
Speaker 21: So the previous owner bought it at an auction, and

2370
02:22:07,000 --> 02:22:09,240
Speaker 21: I don't think that the previous owner didn't realize how

2371
02:22:09,320 --> 02:22:11,800
Speaker 21: much she was getting, and he kind of just like

2372
02:22:11,959 --> 02:22:14,200
Speaker 21: neglected a bunch of it, you know. And then he

2373
02:22:14,640 --> 02:22:16,920
Speaker 21: was older, and so he finally sold off the hotel.

2374
02:22:17,000 --> 02:22:18,640
Speaker 21: He thought he was just buying the hotel, but he

2375
02:22:19,200 --> 02:22:21,480
Speaker 21: buying all the land as well, so they when they

2376
02:22:21,480 --> 02:22:24,120
Speaker 21: bought the hotel, they acquired all the land and they're

2377
02:22:24,120 --> 02:22:26,600
Speaker 21: actually putting money into it and fixing everything up, which

2378
02:22:26,640 --> 02:22:27,720
Speaker 21: is really wonderful.

2379
02:22:28,200 --> 02:22:30,320
Speaker 7: The hotel in Lake and hot Spring really are wonderful.

2380
02:22:30,360 --> 02:22:31,840
Speaker 7: But the scene that had played out there on the

2381
02:22:31,840 --> 02:22:34,680
Speaker 7: eleventh of May with anything but within a short period

2382
02:22:34,720 --> 02:22:37,000
Speaker 7: of time, more than a thousand people of all ages

2383
02:22:37,040 --> 02:22:39,840
Speaker 7: and nationalities will be held in the open desert and

2384
02:22:39,879 --> 02:22:42,920
Speaker 7: left defend large for themselves. I let Natalie describe the

2385
02:22:42,920 --> 02:22:43,640
Speaker 7: space there in.

2386
02:22:44,520 --> 02:22:49,080
Speaker 21: There's lots of cactuses everywhere, so there's environmental like a

2387
02:22:49,240 --> 02:22:53,560
Speaker 21: watch out where you're walking that it's hot. It's hot

2388
02:22:53,600 --> 02:22:55,680
Speaker 21: in the day and really cold at night. Because it's

2389
02:22:55,680 --> 02:22:59,400
Speaker 21: the high desert, there can be gusts of wind that

2390
02:22:59,480 --> 02:23:04,400
Speaker 21: can just take over, get dust in your eyes, your hair,

2391
02:23:04,560 --> 02:23:08,080
Speaker 21: everything is. You're just filthy and lack of food. I mean,

2392
02:23:08,120 --> 02:23:10,160
Speaker 21: there's no resources. You're in the middle of nowhere.

2393
02:23:10,879 --> 02:23:12,440
Speaker 7: I talked to a lot of the volunteers, many of

2394
02:23:12,520 --> 02:23:14,959
Speaker 7: whom have been in the desert for Mediet Week. It'd

2395
02:23:15,000 --> 02:23:17,640
Speaker 7: first been made aware of the impending humanitarian crisis late

2396
02:23:17,640 --> 02:23:20,040
Speaker 7: on Thursday night, but one of the people working on

2397
02:23:20,080 --> 02:23:22,560
Speaker 7: the renovation of the Hotsprings Hotel got a call about it.

2398
02:23:22,920 --> 02:23:24,800
Speaker 7: Within a few hours, the hotel z owners and all

2399
02:23:24,800 --> 02:23:27,440
Speaker 7: their staff were running what became very nearly the only

2400
02:23:27,480 --> 02:23:29,520
Speaker 7: source of food, shelter, and water for more than a

2401
02:23:29,600 --> 02:23:33,080
Speaker 7: thousand people trapped and held in the desert by CBP.

2402
02:23:34,480 --> 02:23:37,520
Speaker 7: I spoke to Sam, another volunteer, to get a sense

2403
02:23:37,520 --> 02:23:41,080
Speaker 7: of response. Now, Sam is a kind of guy who

2404
02:23:41,120 --> 02:23:43,240
Speaker 7: just looks like he's a home in the desert, his

2405
02:23:43,360 --> 02:23:45,800
Speaker 7: wire brim hat, boots, and long cleaved shirt and pants.

2406
02:23:45,920 --> 02:23:48,080
Speaker 7: Told me he spent plenty of days under the baking

2407
02:23:48,120 --> 02:23:51,400
Speaker 7: sun out here, and his redness with an isoprople alcohol

2408
02:23:51,400 --> 02:23:54,280
Speaker 7: spray to disinfect people's boots after walking in an area

2409
02:23:54,320 --> 02:23:57,080
Speaker 7: that was likely covered in human shit, told me he'd

2410
02:23:57,080 --> 02:23:59,560
Speaker 7: been around one or two situations like this in the past.

2411
02:24:00,120 --> 02:24:02,240
Speaker 30: I spent a great deal of my life as his

2412
02:24:02,360 --> 02:24:07,039
Speaker 30: second career, working for in developmental relief logistics in Southeast Asia,

2413
02:24:07,120 --> 02:24:12,359
Speaker 30: mainly working with large age organizations for example, World Food Program,

2414
02:24:12,480 --> 02:24:14,279
Speaker 30: Doctors without Borders.

2415
02:24:14,360 --> 02:24:16,879
Speaker 1: Shoe units, many many different place things.

2416
02:24:17,280 --> 02:24:19,160
Speaker 7: In the context of that kind of experience, it's easy

2417
02:24:19,200 --> 02:24:22,200
Speaker 7: to understand why people come to the United States, but

2418
02:24:22,560 --> 02:24:25,480
Speaker 7: I asked Sam to put the situation here into perspective

2419
02:24:25,560 --> 02:24:28,440
Speaker 7: for me. It's understandable that folks came to the US,

2420
02:24:28,480 --> 02:24:31,520
Speaker 7: but why into a tiny desert town of five hundred people.

2421
02:24:31,920 --> 02:24:34,400
Speaker 30: These people were radically unprepared for what they were going

2422
02:24:34,440 --> 02:24:36,800
Speaker 30: to go through because they were sold to BILLI Goods

2423
02:24:37,160 --> 02:24:40,000
Speaker 30: by coyotes on the other side about what was going

2424
02:24:40,000 --> 02:24:42,960
Speaker 30: to happen to them, you understand. So they had really

2425
02:24:43,000 --> 02:24:46,120
Speaker 30: no idea what they were getting into at all. And

2426
02:24:46,760 --> 02:24:51,120
Speaker 30: so there was not anything in the way of life

2427
02:24:51,160 --> 02:24:55,400
Speaker 30: threatening situations for any of those people in any meaningful way,

2428
02:24:55,480 --> 02:24:56,920
Speaker 30: a great deal of discomfort.

2429
02:24:57,440 --> 02:24:58,480
Speaker 1: It could have turned.

2430
02:24:58,320 --> 02:25:01,080
Speaker 30: Very badly at these people here had not stepped up

2431
02:25:01,120 --> 02:25:02,560
Speaker 30: because the border patrol.

2432
02:25:02,520 --> 02:25:03,800
Speaker 1: Was completely overwhelmed.

2433
02:25:04,360 --> 02:25:08,560
Speaker 30: Yeah, and so there was never that bad of a

2434
02:25:08,640 --> 02:25:11,200
Speaker 30: situation here compared to what I have seen in other

2435
02:25:11,240 --> 02:25:12,279
Speaker 30: places in the past.

2436
02:25:12,720 --> 02:25:14,720
Speaker 7: A sound pointed out the migrants were now gone, but

2437
02:25:14,720 --> 02:25:17,680
Speaker 7: we were still surrounded by times of supplies. But at

2438
02:25:17,720 --> 02:25:20,240
Speaker 7: the time there was no way of knowing the scope

2439
02:25:20,320 --> 02:25:22,880
Speaker 7: or scale of the need, and people reacted as best

2440
02:25:22,879 --> 02:25:23,280
Speaker 7: they could.

2441
02:25:23,959 --> 02:25:27,400
Speaker 30: Actually, it was overkilled, but you had no way of

2442
02:25:27,440 --> 02:25:28,680
Speaker 30: knowing right at the time.

2443
02:25:28,800 --> 02:25:30,200
Speaker 1: There's just no way to know. How do you know

2444
02:25:30,240 --> 02:25:30,720
Speaker 1: ahead of time?

2445
02:25:30,959 --> 02:25:32,640
Speaker 30: You always ask for as much as you can get,

2446
02:25:32,680 --> 02:25:34,200
Speaker 30: because why would you not.

2447
02:25:34,360 --> 02:25:36,000
Speaker 1: I mean, you never know.

2448
02:25:35,640 --> 02:25:38,200
Speaker 30: You don't know how many children with babies are on

2449
02:25:38,200 --> 02:25:39,520
Speaker 30: the other side of that wall right now.

2450
02:25:39,800 --> 02:25:42,680
Speaker 1: Might be zero, might be five hundred. You have no idea,

2451
02:25:42,800 --> 02:25:42,959
Speaker 1: you know.

2452
02:25:43,280 --> 02:25:45,760
Speaker 7: Before anyone knew how if this was going to end,

2453
02:25:45,920 --> 02:25:48,520
Speaker 7: or really what even was going on, dozens of people

2454
02:25:48,520 --> 02:25:51,760
Speaker 7: across the county decided to help. One of them was Katie.

2455
02:25:52,640 --> 02:25:55,359
Speaker 7: Here she is describing some of the volunteers she worked alongside.

2456
02:25:55,840 --> 02:25:59,760
Speaker 25: There was a hard hodgepodge of people and as volunteers

2457
02:26:00,040 --> 02:26:06,400
Speaker 25: and leading it were some of the owners of a

2458
02:26:06,440 --> 02:26:11,480
Speaker 25: hotel out there and that was the main organizers. But

2459
02:26:11,560 --> 02:26:15,720
Speaker 25: who showed up were people from the town, people that

2460
02:26:15,800 --> 02:26:20,360
Speaker 25: I knew and recognized. There were some really devout, like

2461
02:26:20,480 --> 02:26:22,879
Speaker 25: they're twenty four hours a day, and then there was

2462
02:26:22,920 --> 02:26:27,600
Speaker 25: some coming in and out. But I met people from

2463
02:26:27,760 --> 02:26:33,400
Speaker 25: all over the county and most of them answered the

2464
02:26:33,440 --> 02:26:36,720
Speaker 25: call through instagram of the hotel.

2465
02:26:37,520 --> 02:26:40,480
Speaker 7: All those volunteers called their friends, who called their friends,

2466
02:26:40,480 --> 02:26:44,440
Speaker 7: who gradually coordinated response. Natalie first became aware of this,

2467
02:26:44,600 --> 02:26:47,760
Speaker 7: as many volunteers did, through an Instagram post by Melissa,

2468
02:26:47,840 --> 02:26:49,920
Speaker 7: another the three co owners of the Comba Hotel. On

2469
02:26:50,000 --> 02:26:53,440
Speaker 7: Thursday night, just as title forty two was ending, Natalie

2470
02:26:53,440 --> 02:26:56,160
Speaker 7: saw the post and decided to help. At first, she

2471
02:26:56,200 --> 02:26:58,360
Speaker 7: wanted to leave right then at one am as soon

2472
02:26:58,360 --> 02:27:01,039
Speaker 7: as she'd seen the post, but often consulting her family,

2473
02:27:01,040 --> 02:27:03,720
Speaker 7: she decided to make her own post, asking for people

2474
02:27:03,760 --> 02:27:07,119
Speaker 7: to bring supplies that were needed. Soon she was overwhelmed

2475
02:27:07,120 --> 02:27:07,800
Speaker 7: by the response.

2476
02:27:08,200 --> 02:27:11,080
Speaker 21: Yeah, I mean immediately, even at one in the morning,

2477
02:27:11,120 --> 02:27:13,360
Speaker 21: I was getting messages because I posted it. That's when

2478
02:27:13,400 --> 02:27:18,959
Speaker 21: I posted the story. I immediately got messages from front

2479
02:27:19,160 --> 02:27:20,920
Speaker 21: say I'll bring a blanket over.

2480
02:27:21,800 --> 02:27:24,040
Speaker 5: What's your address? Yeah.

2481
02:27:24,080 --> 02:27:26,640
Speaker 21: Everyone just kind of rallied and started bringing supplies over,

2482
02:27:27,120 --> 02:27:30,880
Speaker 21: collecting money as well. Some friends started collecting money and

2483
02:27:30,959 --> 02:27:35,480
Speaker 21: then bought stuff and brought loads of food and things

2484
02:27:35,520 --> 02:27:36,240
Speaker 21: to my house.

2485
02:27:36,760 --> 02:27:39,800
Speaker 7: Her husband ferried the supplies to Komba, where they were

2486
02:27:39,840 --> 02:27:42,240
Speaker 7: joined by donations from all over the county in the

2487
02:27:42,280 --> 02:27:46,240
Speaker 7: old petrol station. Like Natalie, Katie also saw a post

2488
02:27:46,320 --> 02:27:49,480
Speaker 7: and immediately felt compelled to help. She called a friend

2489
02:27:49,720 --> 02:27:52,680
Speaker 7: and some members of her family instead about raising funds

2490
02:27:52,680 --> 02:27:53,560
Speaker 7: and buying supplies.

2491
02:27:54,640 --> 02:27:57,720
Speaker 25: So I met my friend at a cafe and in

2492
02:27:57,760 --> 02:28:01,280
Speaker 25: that in the meantime, and I don't know how much

2493
02:28:01,320 --> 02:28:05,760
Speaker 25: of this is really important. So in the meantime, I

2494
02:28:05,920 --> 02:28:10,160
Speaker 25: text my mother and my two sisters who live on

2495
02:28:10,200 --> 02:28:13,000
Speaker 25: the East Coast, and just it was late at night

2496
02:28:13,040 --> 02:28:17,280
Speaker 25: for them, and I just said, I would love for

2497
02:28:17,360 --> 02:28:23,160
Speaker 25: you to send prayers, because.

2498
02:28:26,160 --> 02:28:29,920
Speaker 5: That's something that I believe in.

2499
02:28:30,280 --> 02:28:37,200
Speaker 25: I believe in prayer or intention and thought reality. So

2500
02:28:39,040 --> 02:28:44,400
Speaker 25: and some of it was just because I felt so touch,

2501
02:28:44,760 --> 02:28:49,440
Speaker 25: like praying for the community that I love too. And

2502
02:28:53,040 --> 02:28:56,320
Speaker 25: the next thing I know, like my venmo was blowing

2503
02:28:56,440 --> 02:28:58,640
Speaker 25: up and there was one thousand dollars in my venmo

2504
02:28:59,760 --> 02:29:03,960
Speaker 25: send from my family members. And so by the time

2505
02:29:04,000 --> 02:29:07,000
Speaker 25: my friend arrived, we were like, let's go, and we

2506
02:29:08,600 --> 02:29:15,520
Speaker 25: filled our car with Amazingly, we found like organic, there's

2507
02:29:15,680 --> 02:29:20,040
Speaker 25: grocery outlet, right, So we found organic soup for you know,

2508
02:29:20,240 --> 02:29:26,240
Speaker 25: dollars something a can, and we spent a few hundred dollars.

2509
02:29:26,320 --> 02:29:30,560
Speaker 25: And the next morning we met early and we stopped

2510
02:29:30,560 --> 02:29:32,760
Speaker 25: in El Cone on the way and we spent all

2511
02:29:32,800 --> 02:29:35,520
Speaker 25: the rest on We went to three or four thrift

2512
02:29:35,560 --> 02:29:39,199
Speaker 25: stores and bought every blanket and hat and baby carrier

2513
02:29:40,160 --> 02:29:48,800
Speaker 25: because we have both focused on motherhood in our careers.

2514
02:29:49,280 --> 02:29:51,160
Speaker 7: I asked people I spoke to about a week later

2515
02:29:51,200 --> 02:29:52,720
Speaker 7: how the experience had impacted them.

2516
02:29:53,120 --> 02:29:59,800
Speaker 21: It was overwhelming, just the way the community really came

2517
02:30:00,080 --> 02:30:04,280
Speaker 21: around and supported the people in Cucumber that were just

2518
02:30:04,360 --> 02:30:10,360
Speaker 21: finding help. You know, after we finished cleaning up, when

2519
02:30:10,600 --> 02:30:15,840
Speaker 21: we were back at the gas station, the Amazon driver

2520
02:30:16,400 --> 02:30:19,360
Speaker 21: was delivering, like I think he delivered three hundred and

2521
02:30:19,440 --> 02:30:23,760
Speaker 21: fifty boxes, and so we had to open them up

2522
02:30:23,760 --> 02:30:29,680
Speaker 21: and sort them, and there was so much food. I

2523
02:30:29,680 --> 02:30:34,240
Speaker 21: think that it was insane amount of food, and it

2524
02:30:34,280 --> 02:30:36,480
Speaker 21: was awesome. It was really cool just to see how

2525
02:30:36,959 --> 02:30:38,839
Speaker 21: many people stabbed.

2526
02:30:38,440 --> 02:30:39,400
Speaker 32: Up and donated.

2527
02:30:39,959 --> 02:30:42,920
Speaker 7: I like some of the people I saw in Santa Sedro. Natalie, Katie,

2528
02:30:43,000 --> 02:30:45,520
Speaker 7: Sam and Marissa are not part of an NGO or

2529
02:30:45,600 --> 02:30:48,760
Speaker 7: a mutual aid collective. They're just people who wanted to help,

2530
02:30:49,440 --> 02:30:52,320
Speaker 7: and that describes most of the people in Hucomber. Whether

2531
02:30:52,440 --> 02:30:55,119
Speaker 7: some of them did have previous and regular volunteer experience

2532
02:30:55,120 --> 02:30:58,240
Speaker 7: with excellent groups like Border Kindness. I asked Katie to

2533
02:30:58,240 --> 02:31:01,080
Speaker 7: reflect on the mutual aid approach and the absence of massive,

2534
02:31:01,160 --> 02:31:02,840
Speaker 7: multimillion dollar organizations.

2535
02:31:03,280 --> 02:31:04,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, wasn't there.

2536
02:31:04,560 --> 02:31:08,560
Speaker 25: Race, No, they weren't there. We were told that the

2537
02:31:08,600 --> 02:31:11,800
Speaker 25: Red Cross couldn't come unless Border patrol called, and Border

2538
02:31:11,840 --> 02:31:14,440
Speaker 25: patrol told us that they weren't allowed to call the

2539
02:31:14,440 --> 02:31:15,080
Speaker 25: Red Cross.

2540
02:31:15,680 --> 02:31:18,400
Speaker 7: That's a pretty expanded The one institution that did show

2541
02:31:18,440 --> 02:31:20,720
Speaker 7: support to people in ucumber was one that you might

2542
02:31:20,720 --> 02:31:23,520
Speaker 7: not expect, given the support for this cruel immigration policy

2543
02:31:23,560 --> 02:31:26,960
Speaker 7: by almost all the Democrats in DC. But things are

2544
02:31:27,000 --> 02:31:29,360
Speaker 7: different when you can see the results of these policies

2545
02:31:29,360 --> 02:31:31,640
Speaker 7: with your own eyes. Perhaps that's why I didn't see

2546
02:31:31,640 --> 02:31:33,840
Speaker 7: a single elected official in my entire week at the border.

2547
02:31:34,560 --> 02:31:38,600
Speaker 7: But one person I missed who everyone mentioned was a

2548
02:31:38,680 --> 02:31:42,760
Speaker 7: lady who worked for California Senator Steve Pidea. I won't

2549
02:31:42,840 --> 02:31:45,400
Speaker 7: name her as I don't have her permission, but hopefully

2550
02:31:45,400 --> 02:31:47,400
Speaker 7: one day soon we'll be able to interview her. I'll

2551
02:31:47,480 --> 02:31:49,199
Speaker 7: let Katie describe the role this woman played.

2552
02:31:49,560 --> 02:31:54,080
Speaker 25: There was someone from Steve Padia's team, and that's the

2553
02:31:54,160 --> 02:32:00,320
Speaker 25: woman I rode with, and she was incredible. Her her

2554
02:32:00,400 --> 02:32:04,160
Speaker 25: brother in law is the chef at the hotel, so

2555
02:32:04,480 --> 02:32:08,800
Speaker 25: I think, I mean, she might have came anyway, but

2556
02:32:09,640 --> 02:32:15,480
Speaker 25: she came faster and there was true connection and she

2557
02:32:15,720 --> 02:32:18,440
Speaker 25: stood up to the border patrol and said, you know,

2558
02:32:18,600 --> 02:32:23,400
Speaker 25: said we're allowed. We're here on behalf of the senator. So,

2559
02:32:23,840 --> 02:32:28,600
Speaker 25: I mean I saw some like had had like arguments

2560
02:32:28,640 --> 02:32:33,360
Speaker 25: about our right to be there, and most of us didn't.

2561
02:32:33,400 --> 02:32:36,160
Speaker 25: Weren't paying attention to that. We were paying attention to

2562
02:32:36,240 --> 02:32:40,240
Speaker 25: the people that we were, you know, around and no

2563
02:32:40,280 --> 02:32:46,280
Speaker 25: one that was out there didn't believe that we should

2564
02:32:46,360 --> 02:32:50,360
Speaker 25: be out there and that more help should be out there.

2565
02:32:51,120 --> 02:32:54,720
Speaker 7: Sadly, part of that familiarity with the system this woman

2566
02:32:54,800 --> 02:32:57,520
Speaker 7: brought to the team also meant a familiarity with the

2567
02:32:57,600 --> 02:33:00,720
Speaker 7: cruel and arbitrary nature of it. Katie says that they

2568
02:33:00,720 --> 02:33:02,000
Speaker 7: had to organize for that as well.

2569
02:33:02,480 --> 02:33:06,520
Speaker 25: So my friend and I we ended up writing in

2570
02:33:06,600 --> 02:33:14,760
Speaker 25: her truck, so in Steve Padia's Senator Padilla's assistant truck.

2571
02:33:14,959 --> 02:33:19,280
Speaker 25: So we had the opportunity to ask some questions that

2572
02:33:19,360 --> 02:33:24,000
Speaker 25: probably everyone out there wanted to know, including the migrants,

2573
02:33:25,080 --> 02:33:30,320
Speaker 25: And it was like, what will happen in what's the

2574
02:33:30,400 --> 02:33:33,560
Speaker 25: process from here? And how do you know that these

2575
02:33:33,600 --> 02:33:37,680
Speaker 25: people are being tended to? And I literally heard her

2576
02:33:37,760 --> 02:33:41,959
Speaker 25: on the phone getting as many bodies on the ground

2577
02:33:42,040 --> 02:33:45,280
Speaker 25: to start going to those centers where they're being taken

2578
02:33:45,760 --> 02:33:49,920
Speaker 25: to make sure that they were, that we would follow

2579
02:33:50,040 --> 02:33:57,920
Speaker 25: them through the entire process as best possible, monitoring their

2580
02:33:58,000 --> 02:34:02,120
Speaker 25: well cared for that they were well cared for as

2581
02:34:02,200 --> 02:34:08,280
Speaker 25: well cared for as possible in a system and a

2582
02:34:08,959 --> 02:34:10,040
Speaker 25: process like that.

2583
02:34:10,640 --> 02:34:10,840
Speaker 7: Yeah.

2584
02:34:12,760 --> 02:34:18,040
Speaker 25: Yeah, but she literally said they're going to be busted

2585
02:34:18,040 --> 02:34:22,959
Speaker 25: off and putt in cages, and that they would do

2586
02:34:23,000 --> 02:34:26,360
Speaker 25: their best to make sure that that no one was

2587
02:34:26,400 --> 02:34:34,360
Speaker 25: split up and that everyone was fed, showered, and they

2588
02:34:34,400 --> 02:34:39,520
Speaker 25: weren't allowed to bring anything with them, So a lot

2589
02:34:39,520 --> 02:34:44,359
Speaker 25: of the cleanup was all of the things that everyone

2590
02:34:44,480 --> 02:34:52,200
Speaker 25: donated that had to be left behind, including some of

2591
02:34:52,240 --> 02:34:53,720
Speaker 25: the stuffed animals.

2592
02:34:54,280 --> 02:34:56,080
Speaker 7: For all the volunteers I spoke to, the chance to

2593
02:34:56,120 --> 02:35:00,080
Speaker 7: be of service was empowering. Here's Natalie discussing that, Yeah.

2594
02:35:00,040 --> 02:35:01,560
Speaker 21: I mean, well, like and so many times do you

2595
02:35:01,600 --> 02:35:05,320
Speaker 21: like feel overwhelmed with like so much suffering in this world,

2596
02:35:05,360 --> 02:35:07,320
Speaker 21: and like what can one person do?

2597
02:35:08,160 --> 02:35:08,400
Speaker 10: You know?

2598
02:35:08,520 --> 02:35:12,720
Speaker 21: And so it did feel good that to actually see

2599
02:35:12,720 --> 02:35:15,120
Speaker 21: an immediate impact, like I'm doing this and this is

2600
02:35:15,160 --> 02:35:19,360
Speaker 21: a result, because sometimes you can just get discouraged, you know,

2601
02:35:19,440 --> 02:35:20,680
Speaker 21: like we're just one person.

2602
02:35:20,800 --> 02:35:22,120
Speaker 32: What can we really do?

2603
02:35:22,200 --> 02:35:25,560
Speaker 21: And can we really make an impact and just seeing

2604
02:35:25,600 --> 02:35:29,600
Speaker 21: that and being able to see directly how that one

2605
02:35:29,640 --> 02:35:33,120
Speaker 21: person can impact, you know, can rally. Like the scene

2606
02:35:33,120 --> 02:35:37,160
Speaker 21: how my friends came together, you know, went shopping, bought things,

2607
02:35:37,240 --> 02:35:41,520
Speaker 21: gathered money, collected money. You know, my really good friend Sam,

2608
02:35:42,080 --> 02:35:45,640
Speaker 21: she went to her local bar after she collected a

2609
02:35:45,640 --> 02:35:48,879
Speaker 21: bunch of money, went and dropped stuff, supplies off at

2610
02:35:48,920 --> 02:35:52,400
Speaker 21: my house. She was just down at her local bar

2611
02:35:52,440 --> 02:35:55,440
Speaker 21: and just chatting with them and like, oh, what did

2612
02:35:55,520 --> 02:35:57,240
Speaker 21: you do today, And so she told them, oh, I

2613
02:35:57,280 --> 02:36:00,680
Speaker 21: collected money and I bought supplies, and then the people

2614
02:36:00,800 --> 02:36:03,320
Speaker 21: She ended up collecting about two hundred more dollars at

2615
02:36:03,360 --> 02:36:06,760
Speaker 21: the bar from people hearing her story. And so then

2616
02:36:06,800 --> 02:36:09,080
Speaker 21: the next day she went and bought more supplies and

2617
02:36:09,160 --> 02:36:11,320
Speaker 21: she actually ended up driving them out herself. She ended

2618
02:36:11,360 --> 02:36:15,440
Speaker 21: up doing like three drips just from her own talking

2619
02:36:15,440 --> 02:36:18,359
Speaker 21: to people and collecting. So just like the little impact

2620
02:36:18,400 --> 02:36:21,160
Speaker 21: that you know, everyone just kind of coming together and

2621
02:36:21,200 --> 02:36:22,040
Speaker 21: making a difference.

2622
02:36:43,879 --> 02:36:46,640
Speaker 7: Santas Dre a pretty diverse range of San Diegans came

2623
02:36:46,680 --> 02:36:49,440
Speaker 7: to help. On the first night, I personally left at

2624
02:36:49,440 --> 02:36:52,080
Speaker 7: about one in the morning after spending almost two hours

2625
02:36:52,080 --> 02:36:54,760
Speaker 7: trying to leave but needing to get charge phones back

2626
02:36:54,800 --> 02:36:58,560
Speaker 7: to their owners by loudly in Spanish and French, then English,

2627
02:36:58,640 --> 02:37:01,840
Speaker 7: describing the backgrounds on the phone or the color of

2628
02:37:01,879 --> 02:37:17,760
Speaker 7: their case. It wasn't a great system, and by the weekend,

2629
02:37:17,800 --> 02:37:20,400
Speaker 7: Caber and others had seen that more help an organization

2630
02:37:20,560 --> 02:37:23,920
Speaker 7: was needed and they decided to plan a response. He's

2631
02:37:24,000 --> 02:37:25,760
Speaker 7: Caba describing how they prepared for that.

2632
02:37:26,080 --> 02:37:34,240
Speaker 8: Yeah, yeah, we met target near my area. Anxiety. Maybe

2633
02:37:34,360 --> 02:37:37,600
Speaker 8: I'll just grab some I was paying attention to people

2634
02:37:37,640 --> 02:37:41,720
Speaker 8: and what supplies they were saying was needed. A particular

2635
02:37:41,920 --> 02:37:45,520
Speaker 8: store near me has like a wall of travel size

2636
02:37:46,360 --> 02:37:50,800
Speaker 8: time prodestionally just scoop out one hundred hands and past

2637
02:37:50,879 --> 02:37:51,560
Speaker 8: and things like that.

2638
02:37:52,080 --> 02:37:53,800
Speaker 7: Caber met up with some other members of a local

2639
02:37:53,879 --> 02:37:56,800
Speaker 7: mutual aid group. I'll make sure to include donation links

2640
02:37:56,800 --> 02:37:58,440
Speaker 7: for all the groups I've mentioned at the end of

2641
02:37:58,480 --> 02:38:00,480
Speaker 7: this series, so please make sure to listen right through

2642
02:38:00,480 --> 02:38:00,879
Speaker 7: to the end.

2643
02:38:01,080 --> 02:38:04,480
Speaker 8: I met up with him and he had just received

2644
02:38:04,600 --> 02:38:08,960
Speaker 8: a bunch of donations through through mutually networks, so we

2645
02:38:08,959 --> 02:38:11,360
Speaker 8: were not even more of a travel size I got

2646
02:38:11,400 --> 02:38:16,960
Speaker 8: some truth Truth hygiene kits and guderate and and a

2647
02:38:16,959 --> 02:38:20,400
Speaker 8: bunch of friends and papers because because the kids that

2648
02:38:20,520 --> 02:38:26,599
Speaker 8: are between the walls don't really have actually do unfortunately,

2649
02:38:26,640 --> 02:38:29,680
Speaker 8: so so that those were those went really fast and

2650
02:38:29,800 --> 02:38:32,520
Speaker 8: so we got a whole bunch of bags of all

2651
02:38:32,560 --> 02:38:34,600
Speaker 8: those kinds of supplies and then we drop down the

2652
02:38:34,640 --> 02:38:35,320
Speaker 8: border from there.

2653
02:38:35,600 --> 02:38:39,080
Speaker 7: By the time they arrived, various organizations had organized areas

2654
02:38:39,080 --> 02:38:41,000
Speaker 7: along the wall for different kinds of aid to be

2655
02:38:41,040 --> 02:38:45,160
Speaker 7: passed through. Everything from clothes to food to medical supplies

2656
02:38:45,160 --> 02:38:47,959
Speaker 7: and toilet paper was piled up given out the.

2657
02:38:48,040 --> 02:38:50,920
Speaker 8: Watch donations and you know, organized the toilet paper, food,

2658
02:38:50,959 --> 02:38:53,040
Speaker 8: everything like that, and peopleould just come up to the

2659
02:38:53,080 --> 02:38:55,160
Speaker 8: wall and if their family needed something, they would just

2660
02:38:55,280 --> 02:38:58,000
Speaker 8: kind of point to it and were asked us if

2661
02:38:58,000 --> 02:38:59,400
Speaker 8: we were able to, you know, if there was a

2662
02:38:59,480 --> 02:39:02,560
Speaker 8: common languae there. So yeah, we just kind of you know,

2663
02:39:02,760 --> 02:39:07,200
Speaker 8: do things as people needing them. I know that I

2664
02:39:07,240 --> 02:39:09,840
Speaker 8: helped them out some prints and pads of paper and

2665
02:39:09,879 --> 02:39:14,360
Speaker 8: those where those tons of kids all came running over

2666
02:39:14,480 --> 02:39:16,640
Speaker 8: from the whole all the parts of the camp when

2667
02:39:16,640 --> 02:39:19,840
Speaker 8: they heard that there was there were twys being given out.

2668
02:39:20,640 --> 02:39:23,640
Speaker 8: So that was it was it was heartbreaking, but it

2669
02:39:23,760 --> 02:39:26,600
Speaker 8: was also you know, it made me smile.

2670
02:39:26,360 --> 02:39:30,480
Speaker 7: Through smiled because of the need to use CBP one

2671
02:39:30,560 --> 02:39:32,000
Speaker 7: and of course they need to stay in touch with

2672
02:39:32,040 --> 02:39:35,720
Speaker 7: families back home. There was a constant and overwhelming demand

2673
02:39:35,840 --> 02:39:39,000
Speaker 7: for phone charging. News reporters took phones back to charge

2674
02:39:39,000 --> 02:39:42,720
Speaker 7: in their cars. Some people bought charge bricks and power strips,

2675
02:39:42,760 --> 02:39:45,320
Speaker 7: and mutual aid groups wrote names on the back of

2676
02:39:45,360 --> 02:39:48,200
Speaker 7: the phones using painters tape and sharpie so they wouldn't

2677
02:39:48,200 --> 02:39:51,480
Speaker 7: get separated from their owners. By the second day it

2678
02:39:51,560 --> 02:39:53,520
Speaker 7: was a better system, but on the first day it

2679
02:39:53,560 --> 02:39:56,240
Speaker 7: was chaos. I let Kaber, who spent a whole day

2680
02:39:56,320 --> 02:39:59,080
Speaker 7: charging phones, described the system that volunteers came up with

2681
02:39:59,200 --> 02:40:00,760
Speaker 7: to mitigate that also a little bit.

2682
02:40:01,360 --> 02:40:04,840
Speaker 8: And obviously they couldn't charge their phones if they're just

2683
02:40:04,879 --> 02:40:09,720
Speaker 8: in this kind of desert gap between between these walls

2684
02:40:09,720 --> 02:40:12,640
Speaker 8: that doesn't you know, have any kind of amenities or anything.

2685
02:40:13,560 --> 02:40:17,360
Speaker 8: So we had a system where they would pass the

2686
02:40:17,400 --> 02:40:21,480
Speaker 8: phone through, and we had we would we would put

2687
02:40:21,480 --> 02:40:23,640
Speaker 8: a piece of tape on it with their name and

2688
02:40:24,160 --> 02:40:26,080
Speaker 8: give them a piece of tape with their name, the

2689
02:40:26,400 --> 02:40:28,920
Speaker 8: same name, and then they would give us that if

2690
02:40:28,920 --> 02:40:30,440
Speaker 8: they came back a couple hours later and give us

2691
02:40:30,440 --> 02:40:32,520
Speaker 8: the tape back, and we would match their names and

2692
02:40:32,680 --> 02:40:36,680
Speaker 8: in the phone, and and that was It worked well.

2693
02:40:36,800 --> 02:40:37,039
Speaker 10: Enough.

2694
02:40:37,240 --> 02:40:41,960
Speaker 8: I mean it was still extraordinarily chaotic process. I mean,

2695
02:40:42,000 --> 02:40:44,240
Speaker 8: we had we always had at least one hundred phones

2696
02:40:45,000 --> 02:40:47,720
Speaker 8: on our side of the wallet any given time, and

2697
02:40:47,720 --> 02:40:51,120
Speaker 8: and some people had you know, some people had chargers,

2698
02:40:51,120 --> 02:40:54,240
Speaker 8: some people didn't. Some people had Android or Samsung or

2699
02:40:54,520 --> 02:40:58,200
Speaker 8: or the iPhones, and some people had wall adaptors, and

2700
02:40:58,240 --> 02:41:00,880
Speaker 8: some people didn't have the wallet says, So we kind

2701
02:41:00,879 --> 02:41:03,160
Speaker 8: of had to every phone that came through was we

2702
02:41:03,160 --> 02:41:05,360
Speaker 8: had to find a way to get it, you know,

2703
02:41:05,680 --> 02:41:08,640
Speaker 8: basically chained into the set of generators that we had,

2704
02:41:08,680 --> 02:41:10,160
Speaker 8: which was do we have our power strips and we

2705
02:41:10,200 --> 02:41:12,879
Speaker 8: have to write cables and and we have space on

2706
02:41:12,920 --> 02:41:15,840
Speaker 8: those cables, and and I think it was it was

2707
02:41:15,879 --> 02:41:18,440
Speaker 8: a bit of a puzzle the whole time. The only

2708
02:41:18,640 --> 02:41:21,960
Speaker 8: part of it that really overwhelmed me was we did overload.

2709
02:41:22,800 --> 02:41:28,880
Speaker 8: Someone brought a bunch of USBC power strips and we

2710
02:41:29,160 --> 02:41:33,200
Speaker 8: blew out one of them, and so there was now

2711
02:41:33,400 --> 02:41:35,400
Speaker 8: eight phones attached to it that I had to find

2712
02:41:35,440 --> 02:41:39,400
Speaker 8: new spaces for. And I was just like that was

2713
02:41:39,440 --> 02:41:41,160
Speaker 8: the really point where I was just I was just

2714
02:41:41,200 --> 02:41:45,480
Speaker 8: frustrated by the you know, this whole situation. And in

2715
02:41:45,520 --> 02:41:48,840
Speaker 8: addition to the fact that I'm just the phones were

2716
02:41:49,120 --> 02:41:51,360
Speaker 8: plug that plug in the net strip had been charging

2717
02:41:51,400 --> 02:41:54,440
Speaker 8: for who knows how long since that been is I

2718
02:41:54,520 --> 02:41:57,640
Speaker 8: think short, sparticular or whatever happened to it.

2719
02:41:57,640 --> 02:41:59,760
Speaker 7: It was chaos, but it was a good nature chaos.

2720
02:42:00,440 --> 02:42:02,840
Speaker 7: Over several days that migrants would attained in the open

2721
02:42:02,879 --> 02:42:05,720
Speaker 7: with no shelter and inadequate sanitation, just about two miles

2722
02:42:05,760 --> 02:42:08,040
Speaker 7: from the discount mall where you can buy cheap Ralpherend's

2723
02:42:08,040 --> 02:42:10,879
Speaker 7: shirts if that's your jam. People showed up in ever

2724
02:42:10,959 --> 02:42:15,720
Speaker 7: increasing numbers. The American Friends Service Committee helped organize volunteers

2725
02:42:15,760 --> 02:42:19,840
Speaker 7: into groups to distribute food, package up wet white snacks, medicines,

2726
02:42:20,280 --> 02:42:23,240
Speaker 7: give out tops, and do just about anything else that

2727
02:42:23,280 --> 02:42:25,720
Speaker 7: they could, or anything else that they could fit into

2728
02:42:25,760 --> 02:42:27,680
Speaker 7: ziploc bags. It could be passed through gaps in the wall.

2729
02:42:27,760 --> 02:42:31,039
Speaker 7: At least people who had been immigrants themselves or who

2730
02:42:31,040 --> 02:42:34,160
Speaker 7: were the children of immigrants were not to be numerous

2731
02:42:34,200 --> 02:42:36,760
Speaker 7: among the volunteers. I spoke to one of them.

2732
02:42:37,600 --> 02:42:39,200
Speaker 23: My name is Lantai.

2733
02:42:39,840 --> 02:42:42,800
Speaker 33: I'm a part of Asian Soliday Collective, a grass with

2734
02:42:42,920 --> 02:42:46,760
Speaker 33: organization here in San Diego. I've been cooming over here

2735
02:42:46,760 --> 02:42:49,879
Speaker 33: since yesterday. I came here around five six yesterday, and

2736
02:42:49,920 --> 02:42:52,760
Speaker 33: then I came back through here this morning and been

2737
02:42:52,760 --> 02:42:55,039
Speaker 33: here since. I got home at twelve last night and

2738
02:42:55,240 --> 02:42:57,280
Speaker 33: woke up, dropped my kid off, and came right back

2739
02:42:57,600 --> 02:43:00,600
Speaker 33: with more supplies. I've been reaching out to family, friends

2740
02:43:00,600 --> 02:43:04,640
Speaker 33: and community to help donate supplies and things like that, food, whatever,

2741
02:43:04,720 --> 02:43:05,680
Speaker 33: whatever they may have.

2742
02:43:06,280 --> 02:43:10,160
Speaker 23: And I've pretty much been driving around city.

2743
02:43:09,840 --> 02:43:12,240
Speaker 33: And collecting from from folks that can't make it so

2744
02:43:12,280 --> 02:43:13,520
Speaker 33: I could bring it down here myself.

2745
02:43:14,240 --> 02:43:15,240
Speaker 23: So that's what I've been doing.

2746
02:43:15,720 --> 02:43:17,879
Speaker 7: LUNCHA explain to me why it was so important to

2747
02:43:17,879 --> 02:43:20,640
Speaker 7: show up my community.

2748
02:43:20,959 --> 02:43:24,080
Speaker 33: I'm pretty sure they they they're sympathetic to this because

2749
02:43:24,640 --> 02:43:27,920
Speaker 33: I'm coming from I'm a first generation uh Cambodon American

2750
02:43:27,920 --> 02:43:31,160
Speaker 33: here in the US, and when my parents and my

2751
02:43:31,240 --> 02:43:35,560
Speaker 33: family fled their country, they went through this as well.

2752
02:43:35,920 --> 02:43:39,879
Speaker 33: So somebody somewhere came and provided to support, provided to

2753
02:43:39,920 --> 02:43:42,720
Speaker 33: aid the donations for them to be able to make

2754
02:43:42,760 --> 02:43:47,120
Speaker 33: it to America to crossover, and able to provide out

2755
02:43:47,120 --> 02:43:49,480
Speaker 33: here for for me growing up out here, you know.

2756
02:43:49,640 --> 02:43:52,360
Speaker 33: So it's just I just sympathize with it, with the

2757
02:43:52,400 --> 02:43:55,640
Speaker 33: whole thing. I mean, I mean, everybody should should should

2758
02:43:55,640 --> 02:43:58,040
Speaker 33: feel the same way. Because somewhere down the line, our

2759
02:43:58,080 --> 02:44:01,439
Speaker 33: families went through similar situations. If you're not an indigenous,

2760
02:44:01,600 --> 02:44:04,119
Speaker 33: then then then your family somewhere down down to history

2761
02:44:04,120 --> 02:44:05,000
Speaker 33: went through the same thing.

2762
02:44:05,120 --> 02:44:06,959
Speaker 23: So you know that everybody should have a heart for

2763
02:44:06,959 --> 02:44:07,600
Speaker 23: this and be able.

2764
02:44:07,520 --> 02:44:10,040
Speaker 33: To come down here and and and and donate or

2765
02:44:10,080 --> 02:44:12,280
Speaker 33: donate their time or supplies, whatever the case may be.

2766
02:44:12,360 --> 02:44:13,280
Speaker 23: You know, come out in help.

2767
02:44:13,760 --> 02:44:17,039
Speaker 7: He also explained why he feels it's important to encourage

2768
02:44:17,040 --> 02:44:18,120
Speaker 7: empathy for refugees.

2769
02:44:18,680 --> 02:44:20,320
Speaker 33: Well, it's it's you have to, you have to, you

2770
02:44:20,320 --> 02:44:22,199
Speaker 33: have to be keep in mind, there's there's this families

2771
02:44:22,200 --> 02:44:25,080
Speaker 33: out here, there's this young children, there's babies. I mean,

2772
02:44:25,120 --> 02:44:27,800
Speaker 33: it takes a lot for for for a mother to

2773
02:44:27,879 --> 02:44:30,480
Speaker 33: pick up her infant child and to leave where she's

2774
02:44:30,520 --> 02:44:31,080
Speaker 33: coming from.

2775
02:44:31,240 --> 02:44:33,320
Speaker 23: So that just says a lot about where.

2776
02:44:33,160 --> 02:44:34,920
Speaker 33: What's going on where she's coming for for her to

2777
02:44:35,040 --> 02:44:37,640
Speaker 33: to to trek and to go through this, to to

2778
02:44:37,680 --> 02:44:39,040
Speaker 33: sit out here in the cold and stuff.

2779
02:44:39,080 --> 02:44:41,879
Speaker 23: Because if she would rather endure her endure this.

2780
02:44:41,920 --> 02:44:44,600
Speaker 33: And and and and take the risk and the chances

2781
02:44:44,720 --> 02:44:47,640
Speaker 33: that means where she's coming from is not as you know,

2782
02:44:47,840 --> 02:44:49,039
Speaker 33: she's willing to take that risk.

2783
02:44:50,080 --> 02:44:52,200
Speaker 7: Latest that night I saw an Afghan family come to

2784
02:44:52,240 --> 02:44:55,400
Speaker 7: help the other Afghan families. Their kids talk to other

2785
02:44:55,440 --> 02:44:59,359
Speaker 7: Afghan kids separated by the border war. They passed crayons

2786
02:44:59,360 --> 02:45:02,160
Speaker 7: to the war and coloring books, and the little daughter

2787
02:45:02,200 --> 02:45:03,959
Speaker 7: asked her dad if she could give her watch to

2788
02:45:03,959 --> 02:45:06,360
Speaker 7: the Afghan girl being held in the camp. Her dad said,

2789
02:45:06,360 --> 02:45:10,000
Speaker 7: of course, I don't record or photograph people's children, certainly

2790
02:45:10,480 --> 02:45:12,560
Speaker 7: not without asking, and I wasn't about to interrupt them,

2791
02:45:12,560 --> 02:45:15,360
Speaker 7: but it was a very sweet moment. The father of

2792
02:45:15,360 --> 02:45:17,920
Speaker 7: the family had worked in the Army Corps of Engineers.

2793
02:45:18,240 --> 02:45:20,959
Speaker 7: He'd been to the border before to build this section

2794
02:45:21,000 --> 02:45:23,840
Speaker 7: of the wall. I didn't really need to ask him

2795
02:45:23,920 --> 02:45:25,840
Speaker 7: how it felt to see folks stuck behind it, but

2796
02:45:26,360 --> 02:45:27,840
Speaker 7: it said a lot that he and his family had

2797
02:45:27,840 --> 02:45:31,039
Speaker 7: taken the time to drive down, buy bags and supplies,

2798
02:45:31,400 --> 02:45:33,080
Speaker 7: and then come face to face with the people who

2799
02:45:33,120 --> 02:45:36,520
Speaker 7: needed them and hand them out. Like dozens of other folks,

2800
02:45:36,720 --> 02:45:39,119
Speaker 7: they tried to pass whatever they could through little gaps

2801
02:45:39,160 --> 02:45:42,000
Speaker 7: in the wall to make someone's day a little bit brighter.

2802
02:45:42,879 --> 02:45:45,280
Speaker 7: Another volunteer who we heard from yesterday came from a

2803
02:45:45,280 --> 02:45:48,760
Speaker 7: local group called Partner Hermira had been at the wall

2804
02:45:48,800 --> 02:45:50,400
Speaker 7: since five in the morning, and it was getting on

2805
02:45:50,440 --> 02:45:53,119
Speaker 7: for five pm. When we spoke. I normally asked people

2806
02:45:53,160 --> 02:45:54,760
Speaker 7: what they ate for breakfast, just to tune in the

2807
02:45:54,800 --> 02:45:57,000
Speaker 7: volume levels on the recorder a bit, but I'm going

2808
02:45:57,040 --> 02:45:58,760
Speaker 7: to include it this time, just so you can see

2809
02:45:58,760 --> 02:46:00,280
Speaker 7: how long her day had been and how hot she've

2810
02:46:00,320 --> 02:46:00,800
Speaker 7: been working.

2811
02:46:01,560 --> 02:46:04,320
Speaker 14: Okay, do you know what you want me to say? Second,

2812
02:46:04,680 --> 02:46:07,160
Speaker 14: we have a breakfast again. I don't remember anymore French

2813
02:46:07,200 --> 02:46:11,440
Speaker 14: showsts FRESD shosts, but my name is Hamaira y Safi,

2814
02:46:11,600 --> 02:46:13,560
Speaker 14: and I'm with a Partnership for the Advancement of New

2815
02:46:13,600 --> 02:46:18,039
Speaker 14: Americans PANA, or an organization in San Diego that fights

2816
02:46:18,040 --> 02:46:22,200
Speaker 14: for the full inclusion of refugees and those who come

2817
02:46:22,200 --> 02:46:23,800
Speaker 14: from refugee producing countries.

2818
02:46:24,640 --> 02:46:26,920
Speaker 7: We spoke about the emergency that had kept our hair

2819
02:46:26,959 --> 02:46:27,360
Speaker 7: all day.

2820
02:46:27,640 --> 02:46:30,320
Speaker 14: So in terms of this morning, I mean I was,

2821
02:46:30,360 --> 02:46:33,400
Speaker 14: I was, you know, very concerned because there was an

2822
02:46:33,440 --> 02:46:38,840
Speaker 14: asylum seeker who had an emergency and was rushed out

2823
02:46:38,879 --> 02:46:41,200
Speaker 14: of this place where now, like for example, where we

2824
02:46:41,240 --> 02:46:45,080
Speaker 14: are at right now, is people who are being detained

2825
02:46:45,680 --> 02:46:49,000
Speaker 14: and the most inhumane way possible. This is going against

2826
02:46:49,000 --> 02:46:53,119
Speaker 14: CBP's own protocols and policies as to how they're being

2827
02:46:53,160 --> 02:46:56,320
Speaker 14: detained with no they're not giving them food, they're not

2828
02:46:56,400 --> 02:46:59,320
Speaker 14: giving them bathrooms, they're not giving them basic, basic things

2829
02:46:59,320 --> 02:47:01,280
Speaker 14: that they need to survive. And so that's why the

2830
02:47:01,320 --> 02:47:03,560
Speaker 14: community is out here today to do that.

2831
02:47:08,760 --> 02:47:11,560
Speaker 7: Sadly, not everyone who showed up at the makeshift detention

2832
02:47:11,640 --> 02:47:15,440
Speaker 7: facility was showing up in solidarity. Local anti migrant activist

2833
02:47:15,480 --> 02:47:17,039
Speaker 7: and blogger Roger Ogden showed up.

2834
02:47:17,360 --> 02:47:17,520
Speaker 16: Now.

2835
02:47:17,520 --> 02:47:19,560
Speaker 7: Ogden might be familiar to some listeners due to his

2836
02:47:19,600 --> 02:47:22,160
Speaker 7: attempts to host he called a Patriot picnic and his

2837
02:47:22,200 --> 02:47:25,800
Speaker 7: advocacy for the removal of the historic murals in Chicago Park.

2838
02:47:26,400 --> 02:47:28,920
Speaker 7: Ogden organized gatherings in the park in twenty seventeen and

2839
02:47:29,000 --> 02:47:31,959
Speaker 7: twenty eighteen, and they resulted in a huge and overwhelming

2840
02:47:31,959 --> 02:47:35,720
Speaker 7: community response to defend the park. And this time Olden

2841
02:47:35,720 --> 02:47:39,040
Speaker 7: decided to keep to himself, but Natalie ran into some

2842
02:47:39,040 --> 02:47:41,840
Speaker 7: people who weren't quite as shy about their opinions.

2843
02:47:42,120 --> 02:47:44,560
Speaker 21: You know, a lot of the people in the community

2844
02:47:45,080 --> 02:47:48,800
Speaker 21: are you know, lower income, and you know, they are

2845
02:47:48,959 --> 02:47:52,760
Speaker 21: struggling in their own struggle on their and so I know,

2846
02:47:55,000 --> 02:47:57,880
Speaker 21: you know, maybe I don't know, it's like for those people,

2847
02:47:57,879 --> 02:48:03,920
Speaker 21: I don't know, like, yeah, it's hard.

2848
02:48:04,120 --> 02:48:04,520
Speaker 5: I don't know.

2849
02:48:05,879 --> 02:48:08,160
Speaker 21: I mean towards the end, like when I was walking

2850
02:48:08,200 --> 02:48:11,360
Speaker 21: to my car, this man, this man in a car

2851
02:48:11,480 --> 02:48:13,560
Speaker 21: like pulled up and he's excuse me, what's going on

2852
02:48:13,600 --> 02:48:15,800
Speaker 21: over there? And I was like, Oh, we're gathering, you know,

2853
02:48:15,879 --> 02:48:20,360
Speaker 21: supplies for the asylum seekers. And then I you know, like,

2854
02:48:20,440 --> 02:48:22,800
Speaker 21: if you're from here, you kind of if you're in Hookumba,

2855
02:48:22,920 --> 02:48:25,160
Speaker 21: you kind of already knew what was going on, and

2856
02:48:25,200 --> 02:48:27,200
Speaker 21: so him asking me that, I was kind of like,

2857
02:48:27,320 --> 02:48:32,000
Speaker 21: m and then he just started laying into I've had illegals,

2858
02:48:32,840 --> 02:48:35,040
Speaker 21: you know, have broken into my house a few times.

2859
02:48:35,040 --> 02:48:37,600
Speaker 21: Why are you supporting illegals? And I'm like, we're trying

2860
02:48:37,640 --> 02:48:41,520
Speaker 21: to let like make sure that people don't die, and

2861
02:48:41,600 --> 02:48:44,120
Speaker 21: he just kept going off on me, and so he,

2862
02:48:44,280 --> 02:48:45,359
Speaker 21: you know, his the whole.

2863
02:48:47,400 --> 02:48:48,920
Speaker 5: All the talking.

2864
02:48:48,600 --> 02:48:54,039
Speaker 21: Points that people have about not allowing people to seek

2865
02:48:54,080 --> 02:48:56,960
Speaker 21: asylum here, and so I just walked away.

2866
02:48:57,520 --> 02:48:59,959
Speaker 7: Maurica didn't run into the same kind of vocal opposition,

2867
02:49:00,280 --> 02:49:03,279
Speaker 7: but she said in her conversations and attempts to process

2868
02:49:03,320 --> 02:49:05,840
Speaker 7: everything she'd see, she ran into some of the sort

2869
02:49:05,840 --> 02:49:08,119
Speaker 7: of need jate responses. So people can only really make

2870
02:49:08,120 --> 02:49:10,640
Speaker 7: about immigration when they haven't looked the cruelty that they're

2871
02:49:10,680 --> 02:49:11,840
Speaker 7: advocating for in the face.

2872
02:49:12,320 --> 02:49:16,000
Speaker 29: It took me a little while to kind of work

2873
02:49:16,040 --> 02:49:19,640
Speaker 29: through just how I felt about it on an emotional,

2874
02:49:22,000 --> 02:49:23,160
Speaker 29: maybe a spiritual level.

2875
02:49:25,640 --> 02:49:25,800
Speaker 5: You know.

2876
02:49:25,879 --> 02:49:29,240
Speaker 29: I spoke with family and friends about it, about my experience,

2877
02:49:29,320 --> 02:49:36,720
Speaker 29: and it's difficult to I found it difficult to explain

2878
02:49:37,240 --> 02:49:42,960
Speaker 29: my experience because I don't know that somebody can really

2879
02:49:43,000 --> 02:49:45,640
Speaker 29: truly understand that unless they've actually been out there and

2880
02:49:45,680 --> 02:49:51,959
Speaker 29: done it themselves. Because the arguments or they're kind of.

2881
02:49:53,920 --> 02:49:55,800
Speaker 5: Debate, so to speak.

2882
02:49:55,840 --> 02:49:58,760
Speaker 29: What they would come back at me with when I

2883
02:49:58,840 --> 02:50:03,520
Speaker 29: was sharing that is, but we don't have enough food

2884
02:50:03,760 --> 02:50:07,039
Speaker 29: or housing to be able to support that many people

2885
02:50:07,080 --> 02:50:10,760
Speaker 29: coming in. And I'm like, but we just had so

2886
02:50:10,920 --> 02:50:13,680
Speaker 29: many people and so much money put out there to

2887
02:50:13,879 --> 02:50:16,360
Speaker 29: help in a very short amount of time. Look how

2888
02:50:16,360 --> 02:50:19,680
Speaker 29: many donations were donated, how much money was contributed in

2889
02:50:19,720 --> 02:50:21,680
Speaker 29: a short amount of time from not that many people.

2890
02:50:21,680 --> 02:50:24,760
Speaker 29: I'm like, obviously we do have the money, Obviously we

2891
02:50:24,800 --> 02:50:30,160
Speaker 29: do have the food. So where's the breakdown? Like, is

2892
02:50:30,200 --> 02:50:33,400
Speaker 29: it our system that just doesn't allow for that happened?

2893
02:50:33,440 --> 02:50:36,720
Speaker 29: I don't know, And that that's where I don't understand

2894
02:50:36,720 --> 02:50:37,199
Speaker 29: it enough.

2895
02:50:37,280 --> 02:50:37,959
Speaker 5: But I feel like.

2896
02:50:40,040 --> 02:50:43,000
Speaker 29: It just made me realize that I don't know that

2897
02:50:43,280 --> 02:50:47,520
Speaker 29: anybody that I spoke to afterward really understands it enough,

2898
02:50:47,560 --> 02:50:51,960
Speaker 29: either because their arguments or they're a defense. And what

2899
02:50:52,000 --> 02:50:55,160
Speaker 29: they tried to share on the opposite side of me

2900
02:50:55,320 --> 02:50:58,000
Speaker 29: going out there and supporting just felt like it was

2901
02:51:02,800 --> 02:51:05,280
Speaker 29: just something to say, you know, and like what they

2902
02:51:05,400 --> 02:51:09,280
Speaker 29: what they hear from the general media out there, and

2903
02:51:09,520 --> 02:51:13,080
Speaker 29: they also don't really they can't quite grasp it, so

2904
02:51:13,080 --> 02:51:15,160
Speaker 29: they're just kind of throwing something out there, I guess,

2905
02:51:15,240 --> 02:51:16,720
Speaker 29: is what what it felt like.

2906
02:51:17,440 --> 02:51:20,400
Speaker 7: Kaber also ran into some less in charitable San Diegans,

2907
02:51:20,440 --> 02:51:21,720
Speaker 7: this time down in Santasiedra.

2908
02:51:22,480 --> 02:51:25,920
Speaker 8: Yeah, so I guess the first part is why they

2909
02:51:26,000 --> 02:51:28,959
Speaker 8: might have how they might have found us there, which

2910
02:51:29,000 --> 02:51:34,560
Speaker 8: is there's a local news organization in San Diego which

2911
02:51:34,959 --> 02:51:38,400
Speaker 8: is kind of a I would describe as a local

2912
02:51:38,520 --> 02:51:41,080
Speaker 8: equivalent of something like one American News, which is really

2913
02:51:41,120 --> 02:51:46,360
Speaker 8: unfortunate because we already have American News here, but they

2914
02:51:46,440 --> 02:51:52,040
Speaker 8: are pretty well known for kind of a lot of

2915
02:51:52,160 --> 02:51:57,800
Speaker 8: like misinformation, kind of scared wandering about and has people

2916
02:51:58,440 --> 02:52:02,600
Speaker 8: immigrants scenes and all that sort of sort of thing,

2917
02:52:02,640 --> 02:52:04,600
Speaker 8: but with kind of a local news sort of aesthetic

2918
02:52:04,680 --> 02:52:07,200
Speaker 8: to it, and they were, as far as I could tell,

2919
02:52:07,280 --> 02:52:09,920
Speaker 8: they were really the only identify the media that were

2920
02:52:09,959 --> 02:52:13,320
Speaker 8: there throughout the day. I read articles eventually made me

2921
02:52:13,440 --> 02:52:18,320
Speaker 8: realize there were other reporters there, but they were identifying

2922
02:52:18,320 --> 02:52:21,280
Speaker 8: themselves the way that has I was. But they sign

2923
02:52:21,480 --> 02:52:24,960
Speaker 8: was one cameraman just shooting b rule, I guess, and

2924
02:52:25,000 --> 02:52:26,760
Speaker 8: he was walking to all the different parts of the

2925
02:52:26,800 --> 02:52:29,600
Speaker 8: wall and like all the different sort of stations for

2926
02:52:29,720 --> 02:52:32,600
Speaker 8: aid and like trying to really trying to get as

2927
02:52:32,640 --> 02:52:35,680
Speaker 8: many faces as possible. You could kind of tell that

2928
02:52:35,680 --> 02:52:39,280
Speaker 8: that's like what he was doing. Everyone who I was

2929
02:52:39,320 --> 02:52:41,520
Speaker 8: around I was. I was kind of you know, oriented

2930
02:52:41,560 --> 02:52:44,440
Speaker 8: mostly with kind of like sort of like anapist mutual

2931
02:52:44,480 --> 02:52:47,880
Speaker 8: aid people. And and you know, when they saw the

2932
02:52:47,920 --> 02:52:49,800
Speaker 8: Kaside truck, they were like, okay, I'm wanted to their

2933
02:52:49,840 --> 02:52:53,199
Speaker 8: mask on, you know. And I'm still in in ninety

2934
02:52:53,240 --> 02:52:55,519
Speaker 8: five with me, so I'm more of that. And I

2935
02:52:55,520 --> 02:52:58,880
Speaker 8: I had a you know, slightly identifying logo on my

2936
02:52:59,240 --> 02:53:03,440
Speaker 8: sweatshirt which I take over so that you know, that

2937
02:53:03,760 --> 02:53:05,800
Speaker 8: image wouldn't show up.

2938
02:53:06,280 --> 02:53:08,959
Speaker 7: Now k us I have drifted further and further right

2939
02:53:09,000 --> 02:53:13,520
Speaker 7: since twenty twenty along with their relatively miniscule viewership. These days,

2940
02:53:13,520 --> 02:53:16,000
Speaker 7: they engage in fake news culture war stuff, like repeating

2941
02:53:16,040 --> 02:53:19,000
Speaker 7: the recent false accusations that Target was making tuckable swimming

2942
02:53:19,040 --> 02:53:22,400
Speaker 7: costumes for kids, or labeling everyone in the asylum process

2943
02:53:22,440 --> 02:53:26,520
Speaker 7: illegal immigrants. It's sadly pretty standard for writing news organizations now.

2944
02:53:27,280 --> 02:53:29,080
Speaker 7: Kaba thinks that some of the people who saw footage

2945
02:53:29,120 --> 02:53:31,600
Speaker 7: on k Usi, or perhaps found the location posted on

2946
02:53:31,760 --> 02:53:35,080
Speaker 7: Ogden's blog, came down to the border.

2947
02:53:34,480 --> 02:53:38,240
Speaker 8: That's where that's the one started to see people you know,

2948
02:53:39,680 --> 02:53:43,920
Speaker 8: kind of went buy and we could tell that they

2949
02:53:43,959 --> 02:53:46,720
Speaker 8: weren't advantage because like when people who like playing people

2950
02:53:46,720 --> 02:53:49,000
Speaker 8: who weren't even necessarily volteer, which are on buy and

2951
02:53:49,000 --> 02:53:50,600
Speaker 8: so like, hey, I just went watching man I brought

2952
02:53:50,600 --> 02:53:52,680
Speaker 8: a pitch of manner and they bring up a matter

2953
02:53:52,760 --> 02:53:55,040
Speaker 8: and then they drive away. But the people who are

2954
02:53:55,040 --> 02:53:57,160
Speaker 8: doing who are like here where I think you know,

2955
02:53:57,200 --> 02:54:00,120
Speaker 8: kind of some kind of intimidation where you know, the

2956
02:54:00,200 --> 02:54:03,240
Speaker 8: approach directly they would just kind of get out of

2957
02:54:03,280 --> 02:54:08,480
Speaker 8: their exceptionally large entivies and and just kind of just

2958
02:54:08,560 --> 02:54:11,200
Speaker 8: kind of watch and they would kind of, you know,

2959
02:54:11,240 --> 02:54:13,440
Speaker 8: get a little bit closer at a time and then

2960
02:54:13,520 --> 02:54:16,760
Speaker 8: you know, a little bit closer and kind of whispered

2961
02:54:16,840 --> 02:54:19,080
Speaker 8: to each other and you know, point at things, and

2962
02:54:19,200 --> 02:54:21,000
Speaker 8: you know, it's just kind of they were just watching,

2963
02:54:21,680 --> 02:54:23,440
Speaker 8: and you know, they got close enough that I could

2964
02:54:23,480 --> 02:54:27,199
Speaker 8: read their shirts, and and the shirts had a slogan

2965
02:54:27,280 --> 02:54:31,920
Speaker 8: that's associated with a Christian nationalism slogan, so as this

2966
02:54:31,959 --> 02:54:34,040
Speaker 8: whole family is kind of kind of sad that the

2967
02:54:34,120 --> 02:54:40,520
Speaker 8: kids wore wearing shirts too, and and so I kind of, yeah,

2968
02:54:40,520 --> 02:54:42,120
Speaker 8: I figured out that that's what was going on. And

2969
02:54:42,160 --> 02:54:44,280
Speaker 8: I never talked to them. I didn't approach them, but

2970
02:54:44,400 --> 02:54:47,840
Speaker 8: I stood when I was something to get closer closer,

2971
02:54:47,840 --> 02:54:50,480
Speaker 8: I kind of positioned myself in between the rest of

2972
02:54:50,520 --> 02:54:55,040
Speaker 8: volunteers and and this group and and just kind of,

2973
02:54:55,800 --> 02:54:58,640
Speaker 8: you know, didn't really stare at them, just kind of

2974
02:54:59,000 --> 02:55:01,720
Speaker 8: looked at them and just made it clear with my

2975
02:55:01,720 --> 02:55:04,760
Speaker 8: body language that I, like I knew what they were doing,

2976
02:55:04,800 --> 02:55:06,440
Speaker 8: Like they weren't you know, they weren't doing any kind

2977
02:55:06,440 --> 02:55:09,160
Speaker 8: of secret agent thing or whatever, Like they were being

2978
02:55:09,240 --> 02:55:12,400
Speaker 8: really really obvious. And I would just you know, stood

2979
02:55:12,680 --> 02:55:15,160
Speaker 8: and position myself in a way that indicated that you know,

2980
02:55:15,200 --> 02:55:16,560
Speaker 8: I know what you're doing, and you're not going to

2981
02:55:16,600 --> 02:55:19,680
Speaker 8: get close. You're not going to interfere with you know

2982
02:55:19,760 --> 02:55:21,440
Speaker 8: what we're doing here. You're not going to contact any

2983
02:55:21,520 --> 02:55:24,040
Speaker 8: wine or you thrill anyone or like what everyone do.

2984
02:55:25,440 --> 02:55:28,840
Speaker 8: And eventually one of the people who is either volunteer

2985
02:55:29,000 --> 02:55:30,760
Speaker 8: or work for like one of the m gas contestently

2986
02:55:30,800 --> 02:55:33,440
Speaker 8: tell there was something going on. So she went over

2987
02:55:33,720 --> 02:55:36,160
Speaker 8: and had a conversation with them that I couldn't hear,

2988
02:55:36,520 --> 02:55:40,320
Speaker 8: and eventually they decided to leave. And I think she

2989
02:55:40,480 --> 02:55:42,440
Speaker 8: was just kind of trying to be diplomatic, but just

2990
02:55:42,480 --> 02:55:44,520
Speaker 8: sort of like ask them if they wanted to help,

2991
02:55:44,560 --> 02:55:48,000
Speaker 8: and if they don't want to help, and you know,

2992
02:55:47,840 --> 02:55:53,160
Speaker 8: you go be somewhere else, I suppose. And and it was,

2993
02:55:54,320 --> 02:55:58,080
Speaker 8: I mean, the sort of one amusing part, if you

2994
02:55:58,200 --> 02:56:01,279
Speaker 8: call it, that was that they apparently in the complaint

2995
02:56:01,320 --> 02:56:05,520
Speaker 8: to this person about me, because they said that I

2996
02:56:05,520 --> 02:56:09,080
Speaker 8: had been watching them and I was I'm traditionally profiling

2997
02:56:09,120 --> 02:56:14,320
Speaker 8: them because they were white, and I realized that this interview,

2998
02:56:14,360 --> 02:56:17,480
Speaker 8: but just for the listeners, I am very very white myself.

2999
02:56:18,120 --> 02:56:21,040
Speaker 7: I think it's important when we discuss volunteering to honor

3000
02:56:21,080 --> 02:56:24,600
Speaker 7: how hard this kind of experience can be on people. Obviously,

3001
02:56:24,680 --> 02:56:27,280
Speaker 7: the trauma associated with seeing people brutalized by the state

3002
02:56:27,280 --> 02:56:29,440
Speaker 7: and capital. It's not the same as being brutalized by

3003
02:56:29,440 --> 02:56:32,560
Speaker 7: state and capital yourself, but that doesn't mean it's easy.

3004
02:56:33,600 --> 02:56:35,880
Speaker 7: I asked Natalie to reflect a little on children's toys

3005
02:56:35,879 --> 02:56:37,640
Speaker 7: we found in the shelter when we were cleaning up

3006
02:56:37,680 --> 02:56:38,800
Speaker 7: the camp, like.

3007
02:56:38,720 --> 02:56:40,840
Speaker 21: As a mom, like I have my own children, and

3008
02:56:40,879 --> 02:56:43,600
Speaker 21: it just really its emotional.

3009
02:56:43,760 --> 02:56:45,039
Speaker 5: It's like it's just.

3010
02:56:46,560 --> 02:56:49,560
Speaker 21: Like I'm like, who's who, Like childhood is playing with this,

3011
02:56:50,280 --> 02:56:53,640
Speaker 21: you know here in this space, and you know that

3012
02:56:53,720 --> 02:56:57,600
Speaker 21: no child should be ever in, you know, an encampment

3013
02:56:57,680 --> 02:57:01,400
Speaker 21: like that or it just no one should be living outside,

3014
02:57:01,600 --> 02:57:04,080
Speaker 21: no one should be doing that. But also it's like

3015
02:57:04,200 --> 02:57:06,720
Speaker 21: kind of like the humanity in a way like that,

3016
02:57:07,240 --> 02:57:10,520
Speaker 21: you know, even a child's going to play wherever child's

3017
02:57:10,560 --> 02:57:13,600
Speaker 21: going to play, and like that little toy of little

3018
02:57:14,360 --> 02:57:17,760
Speaker 21: hopefully it brought that kid some joy in that moment,

3019
02:57:17,879 --> 02:57:19,880
Speaker 21: you know, if it was there a little piece of

3020
02:57:20,000 --> 02:57:23,480
Speaker 21: home or someone gave it to him or what, you know,

3021
02:57:24,760 --> 02:57:27,840
Speaker 21: it was Yeah, the reality, it was like it was

3022
02:57:27,879 --> 02:57:29,920
Speaker 21: like a person, you know, like a little artifact of

3023
02:57:29,920 --> 02:57:32,320
Speaker 21: someone who was actually there, you know, like it was

3024
02:57:32,320 --> 02:57:34,480
Speaker 21: a little more tangible than you know.

3025
02:57:34,480 --> 02:57:34,879
Speaker 1: A sock.

3026
02:57:35,200 --> 02:57:37,240
Speaker 21: You know, that's not that's not I'm not think you

3027
02:57:37,280 --> 02:57:40,400
Speaker 21: know who wore that sock. But think of who who

3028
02:57:40,480 --> 02:57:41,520
Speaker 21: was playing with that toy?

3029
02:57:41,720 --> 02:57:41,920
Speaker 16: You know?

3030
02:57:42,120 --> 02:57:44,119
Speaker 5: Was it a little boy, a little girl? Hold were

3031
02:57:44,200 --> 02:57:46,840
Speaker 5: they did they bring up home? Are they missing it?

3032
02:57:47,600 --> 02:57:49,320
Speaker 21: When they When I saw they have that, she needed

3033
02:57:49,320 --> 02:57:51,920
Speaker 21: people to clean up, it was like, Okay, I took

3034
02:57:51,959 --> 02:57:55,840
Speaker 21: a day off of work and went out there and

3035
02:57:56,959 --> 02:58:01,040
Speaker 21: just felt overwhelming almost, I mean, and just one day

3036
02:58:01,040 --> 02:58:04,959
Speaker 21: of me working out there was really emotional. I can't

3037
02:58:05,240 --> 02:58:07,120
Speaker 21: imagine how you know, Melissa and all the people that

3038
02:58:07,120 --> 02:58:09,040
Speaker 21: were on the ground just dealing with it. I know

3039
02:58:09,280 --> 02:58:13,160
Speaker 21: they're just struggling a little bit and just processing it

3040
02:58:13,240 --> 02:58:17,800
Speaker 21: all has been really hard, you know, really hard. It's

3041
02:58:17,840 --> 02:58:21,720
Speaker 21: just just just how how privileged we are. You know,

3042
02:58:21,800 --> 02:58:23,920
Speaker 21: like no one leaves their country because they want to.

3043
02:58:24,400 --> 02:58:27,760
Speaker 21: They leave because they have to, but they feel like

3044
02:58:27,800 --> 02:58:32,600
Speaker 21: they have to. And you know, it's I mean, it's

3045
02:58:33,400 --> 02:58:36,600
Speaker 21: respecting and honoring and understanding the privilege that you're in

3046
02:58:36,800 --> 02:58:42,039
Speaker 21: and not taking it for granted because it's very easy.

3047
02:58:41,720 --> 02:58:45,520
Speaker 7: To both Katie Marisias said they don't really identify as

3048
02:58:45,560 --> 02:58:47,760
Speaker 7: political and that they wanted to be there as people.

3049
02:58:48,520 --> 02:58:52,720
Speaker 7: Sometimes often politics can become a complicated game of numbers

3050
02:58:52,720 --> 02:58:55,160
Speaker 7: and statistics, but it's important to remember that what this

3051
02:58:55,320 --> 02:58:57,640
Speaker 7: is really about is organizing in such a way that

3052
02:58:57,680 --> 02:58:59,800
Speaker 7: we can take care of one another, and that the

3053
02:58:59,800 --> 02:59:02,400
Speaker 7: most important politics of war is the politics of feeding

3054
02:59:02,440 --> 02:59:04,960
Speaker 7: how many people and maybe bringing a sad child of

3055
02:59:05,000 --> 02:59:09,359
Speaker 7: stuffed animal's Katie talking about the community response.

3056
02:59:10,240 --> 02:59:14,280
Speaker 25: I think I'm a really compassionate person, and I'm not

3057
02:59:14,640 --> 02:59:18,680
Speaker 25: very political in the sense that, like, I don't really participate.

3058
02:59:21,440 --> 02:59:27,280
Speaker 25: My life in my community's life is solution oriented. So

3059
02:59:29,640 --> 02:59:34,680
Speaker 25: I saw like that on a large scale, the like

3060
02:59:34,840 --> 02:59:41,520
Speaker 25: when people come together, we create solutions when and you

3061
02:59:41,600 --> 02:59:46,680
Speaker 25: don't wait for someone like the government to show up

3062
02:59:46,720 --> 02:59:52,879
Speaker 25: and fix it, because then people will die. Yeah, you know,

3063
02:59:53,360 --> 02:59:58,000
Speaker 25: I mean that's the reality is if that community didn't activate,

3064
02:59:58,480 --> 03:00:00,320
Speaker 25: there would have been a lot of dead people in

3065
03:00:00,320 --> 03:00:00,840
Speaker 25: the desert.

3066
03:00:01,800 --> 03:00:03,920
Speaker 7: Katie shared with me that she's been having a difficult time,

3067
03:00:04,400 --> 03:00:06,760
Speaker 7: feeling guilty for not having the language skills to do

3068
03:00:06,840 --> 03:00:09,320
Speaker 7: more and questing her own worthiness to be their helping

3069
03:00:10,120 --> 03:00:12,520
Speaker 7: But in the end, she said she felt that what

3070
03:00:12,560 --> 03:00:15,760
Speaker 7: she'd done was right and important. I'll leave you with

3071
03:00:15,800 --> 03:00:18,240
Speaker 7: her thoughts and tomorrow I'll be back to talk about

3072
03:00:18,280 --> 03:00:20,320
Speaker 7: the people who put everyone in this situation in the

3073
03:00:20,360 --> 03:00:23,480
Speaker 7: first place, the Department of Homeland Security.

3074
03:00:24,800 --> 03:00:28,800
Speaker 25: I think an important thing is like so many times

3075
03:00:29,760 --> 03:00:33,400
Speaker 25: we hear about things and we say, isn't that awful,

3076
03:00:33,560 --> 03:00:37,560
Speaker 25: and we kind of shut down because we don't feel

3077
03:00:38,560 --> 03:00:44,960
Speaker 25: empowered or we don't know how to help. And literally,

3078
03:00:45,160 --> 03:00:52,680
Speaker 25: a smile makes a difference. A feeling of like I

3079
03:00:52,800 --> 03:00:56,800
Speaker 25: see you and you belong on this planet makes a difference.

3080
03:00:57,680 --> 03:01:04,519
Speaker 25: And you know, little kids packing up canned goods and

3081
03:01:04,760 --> 03:01:09,359
Speaker 25: fruit snacks for other little kids. They didn't see those kids,

3082
03:01:09,400 --> 03:01:12,640
Speaker 25: but when the adult said they're gonna be so happy

3083
03:01:12,760 --> 03:01:16,960
Speaker 25: to get that package, they felt like they made a difference.

3084
03:01:17,600 --> 03:01:20,680
Speaker 25: And those little girls are gonna grow up and not

3085
03:01:20,840 --> 03:01:25,120
Speaker 25: be afraid to step up and make a difference. I

3086
03:01:25,160 --> 03:01:28,039
Speaker 25: think a lot of people think like they can't do enough,

3087
03:01:28,280 --> 03:01:31,840
Speaker 25: so they don't do anything. And if we all just

3088
03:01:32,040 --> 03:01:37,959
Speaker 25: do a little bit or what you can, then I

3089
03:01:38,000 --> 03:01:43,880
Speaker 25: think we would see a very large impact. Kumba is

3090
03:01:43,920 --> 03:01:47,920
Speaker 25: a town of five hundred and they just fed thousands,

3091
03:01:49,760 --> 03:01:58,480
Speaker 25: house thousands, clothed, thousands, hugged and welcomed thousands of human beings.

3092
03:01:59,800 --> 03:02:03,360
Speaker 25: And those people in that town don't have much excess,

3093
03:02:04,520 --> 03:02:11,840
Speaker 25: and they made a difference. And I was proud to

3094
03:02:11,879 --> 03:02:15,440
Speaker 25: be a part of that community in a way that

3095
03:02:16,680 --> 03:02:19,720
Speaker 25: I'm on the fringe of it, and it made me

3096
03:02:19,760 --> 03:02:23,680
Speaker 25: want to be even more a part of it. My

3097
03:02:23,800 --> 03:02:30,920
Speaker 25: feelings and intuition about that town were confirmed by watching

3098
03:02:31,760 --> 03:02:37,560
Speaker 25: the simplest action make an incredible impact on real lives

3099
03:02:38,400 --> 03:02:48,560
Speaker 25: and real people, and that this isn't demographics. It's real

3100
03:02:49,440 --> 03:02:55,119
Speaker 25: bodies that have beating hearts and breathe and we all

3101
03:02:55,160 --> 03:02:59,960
Speaker 25: share the same air in the same water, and we're

3102
03:03:00,080 --> 03:03:04,760
Speaker 25: all connected. And when you make one little drip in

3103
03:03:04,840 --> 03:03:09,320
Speaker 25: the bucket, it actually does make a difference. And I

3104
03:03:09,360 --> 03:03:13,000
Speaker 25: think that stops us sometimes when we think what we

3105
03:03:13,200 --> 03:03:18,120
Speaker 25: have isn't enough to give, but when someone has nothing,

3106
03:03:18,800 --> 03:03:31,720
Speaker 25: what you have is more than what they can imagine.

3107
03:03:33,400 --> 03:03:36,039
Speaker 7: The history of the border and its enforcement begins in

3108
03:03:36,120 --> 03:03:38,600
Speaker 7: fourteen ninety two with the colonization of what will become

3109
03:03:38,640 --> 03:03:41,640
Speaker 7: known as the Americas. It goes through the eighteen forty

3110
03:03:41,680 --> 03:03:44,959
Speaker 7: two Mexican American War and a sou indigenous people's lands

3111
03:03:45,000 --> 03:03:47,200
Speaker 7: without their knowledge or consent in the eighteen fifty three

3112
03:03:47,240 --> 03:03:50,400
Speaker 7: Gasden purchase, and of course through the eighteen eighty two

3113
03:03:50,480 --> 03:03:53,760
Speaker 7: Chinese Exclusion Act and numerous other explicit attempts to prevent

3114
03:03:53,879 --> 03:03:57,039
Speaker 7: non white people from moving to the USA. From there,

3115
03:03:57,200 --> 03:03:59,760
Speaker 7: it weaves its way through the Mexican Revolution and the

3116
03:03:59,800 --> 03:04:02,480
Speaker 7: firm World Wars German proposal to ally with Mexico to

3117
03:04:02,520 --> 03:04:05,800
Speaker 7: reclaim those territories it had lost in the decades before then.

3118
03:04:06,040 --> 03:04:09,760
Speaker 7: The Border Patrol story itself begins in May nineteen twenty four,

3119
03:04:10,320 --> 03:04:12,520
Speaker 7: and in the ninety nine years since it has encompassed

3120
03:04:12,560 --> 03:04:14,840
Speaker 7: everything from David Duke to nine to eleven in its

3121
03:04:14,920 --> 03:04:18,480
Speaker 7: journey to becoming the biggest and least accountable law enforcement

3122
03:04:18,560 --> 03:04:22,080
Speaker 7: agency in the federal government. People from the colonial periphery

3123
03:04:22,160 --> 03:04:25,040
Speaker 7: have always migrated to the metropol. It's why a man

3124
03:04:25,040 --> 03:04:27,400
Speaker 7: called fat Led singing a song about Vindulu is basically

3125
03:04:27,400 --> 03:04:30,400
Speaker 7: in my country's second national anthem, and why every four

3126
03:04:30,440 --> 03:04:33,039
Speaker 7: years France accepts black Frenchmen onto its football team before

3127
03:04:33,040 --> 03:04:35,320
Speaker 7: it returns to vilifying them in other forms of discourse.

3128
03:04:36,320 --> 03:04:39,480
Speaker 7: Migration to the United States is no different. Climate change

3129
03:04:39,480 --> 03:04:42,440
Speaker 7: in US imperialism have destabilized and impoverished nations from the

3130
03:04:42,480 --> 03:04:46,119
Speaker 7: Americas to Afghanistan, and driven people to the US border

3131
03:04:46,160 --> 03:04:49,400
Speaker 7: looking for a better life. What's distinct about the US

3132
03:04:49,520 --> 03:04:51,840
Speaker 7: is how obsessed it has become with keeping these people

3133
03:04:51,879 --> 03:04:55,119
Speaker 7: out and enforcing the longest land borders in the world.

3134
03:04:55,720 --> 03:04:57,480
Speaker 7: But the US border is much bigger than the land

3135
03:04:57,480 --> 03:05:00,480
Speaker 7: boundary between the USA and Mexico to the south, Canada

3136
03:05:00,520 --> 03:05:02,480
Speaker 7: to the north. If you're listening to this in the

3137
03:05:02,560 --> 03:05:04,800
Speaker 7: United States, the chances are that you live in the

3138
03:05:04,800 --> 03:05:08,920
Speaker 7: Border Enforcement Zone. This swath of territory outside the Constitution

3139
03:05:09,320 --> 03:05:12,080
Speaker 7: has been established since the Immigration and Nationality Act of

3140
03:05:12,160 --> 03:05:15,680
Speaker 7: nineteen fifty two. Established at a reasonable distance of the

3141
03:05:15,720 --> 03:05:19,440
Speaker 7: border would extend one hundred air miles around the outline

3142
03:05:19,480 --> 03:05:22,800
Speaker 7: of the country. Two thirds of the US's population live

3143
03:05:22,840 --> 03:05:27,080
Speaker 7: within this zone. Washington, d C. San Francisco, Chicago, New Orleans,

3144
03:05:27,080 --> 03:05:29,760
Speaker 7: and Boston are all within it, and that means that

3145
03:05:29,840 --> 03:05:32,560
Speaker 7: cbpagents can search vehicles and vessels to look for property

3146
03:05:32,560 --> 03:05:35,039
Speaker 7: that's in the country without the right documents. They can

3147
03:05:35,040 --> 03:05:38,279
Speaker 7: board public transportation or set up interior checkpoints and stop,

3148
03:05:38,560 --> 03:05:41,720
Speaker 7: interrogate and search citizens and non citizens without the need

3149
03:05:41,760 --> 03:05:44,800
Speaker 7: for a warrant. Within twenty five miles of the border,

3150
03:05:44,840 --> 03:05:47,160
Speaker 7: they can enter your property provide it's not a domicile.

3151
03:05:47,640 --> 03:05:50,480
Speaker 7: The Fourth Amendment, part of a foundational bill of rights.

3152
03:05:50,480 --> 03:05:52,640
Speaker 7: At US likes to tout that's what makes it different

3153
03:05:52,640 --> 03:05:55,160
Speaker 7: from the rest of the world. Doesn't apply when you're

3154
03:05:55,160 --> 03:05:58,400
Speaker 7: near the border. An all encompassing history of the border

3155
03:05:58,400 --> 03:06:01,440
Speaker 7: and its enforcement is beyond the skill this podcast. Even

3156
03:06:01,480 --> 03:06:03,320
Speaker 7: a history of the Southwest border could take up a

3157
03:06:03,320 --> 03:06:05,960
Speaker 7: whole bookshelf, but we will try and skim the high

3158
03:06:05,959 --> 03:06:09,360
Speaker 7: points here. Let's start with a Gadsden purchase, when a

3159
03:06:09,400 --> 03:06:12,120
Speaker 7: party of military surveyors first bumped into the Horn Autum

3160
03:06:12,440 --> 03:06:15,560
Speaker 7: elders as they attempted to draw a line dividing to

3161
03:06:15,640 --> 03:06:19,640
Speaker 7: Horn Autumn people from to Horn Autumn people. The southern

3162
03:06:19,640 --> 03:06:21,560
Speaker 7: border is no more obvious today than it was then,

3163
03:06:22,040 --> 03:06:24,199
Speaker 7: and of course, to the Autumn it was and remains

3164
03:06:24,200 --> 03:06:26,720
Speaker 7: an aberration that divides them from much of their ancestral

3165
03:06:26,760 --> 03:06:30,960
Speaker 7: and current homelands. It has over the years seen violent

3166
03:06:31,040 --> 03:06:34,200
Speaker 7: enforcement on members of the nation and a growing encroachment

3167
03:06:34,200 --> 03:06:37,080
Speaker 7: of the border patrol into today's to Horn Autumn Reservation,

3168
03:06:37,600 --> 03:06:40,720
Speaker 7: which is the second largest in the USA, only represents

3169
03:06:40,800 --> 03:06:44,840
Speaker 7: a fraction of the tribe's historical homeland. These surveyors were

3170
03:06:44,840 --> 03:06:47,120
Speaker 7: in the process of finalizing most of the California and

3171
03:06:47,160 --> 03:06:49,960
Speaker 7: Arizona border, a border I drove most of in the

3172
03:06:50,040 --> 03:06:53,240
Speaker 7: days after Title forty two. The southern border as it

3173
03:06:53,240 --> 03:06:56,400
Speaker 7: looks now was largely shaped by the Treaty of Guadalupihidalgo,

3174
03:06:57,000 --> 03:07:00,000
Speaker 7: which Mexico lost fifty five percent of its territory include

3175
03:07:00,240 --> 03:07:03,240
Speaker 7: all of what is today California, Arizona, New Mexico, Utah,

3176
03:07:03,240 --> 03:07:07,160
Speaker 7: and Nevada, and parts of what is today Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas,

3177
03:07:07,200 --> 03:07:10,959
Speaker 7: and Oklahoma. The Gaston Purchase of eighteen fifty three added

3178
03:07:10,959 --> 03:07:14,560
Speaker 7: more of southern Arizona. In New Mexico, the specific border

3179
03:07:14,560 --> 03:07:17,119
Speaker 7: in Santa Cidro withdrawn so that San Diego Bay would

3180
03:07:17,120 --> 03:07:19,480
Speaker 7: fall to the north of the line. The border in a

3181
03:07:19,560 --> 03:07:22,720
Speaker 7: cumba seems more arbitrary, a straight line in the desert

3182
03:07:22,720 --> 03:07:26,039
Speaker 7: that runs into a pile of rocks. Of course, long

3183
03:07:26,080 --> 03:07:28,760
Speaker 7: before the border divided San Asidra from Tijuana, this was

3184
03:07:28,800 --> 03:07:32,080
Speaker 7: Cumia Land, and despite the border, it still is. The

3185
03:07:32,160 --> 03:07:35,600
Speaker 7: name Tijuana derives from Tijuan, which means by the sea

3186
03:07:35,640 --> 03:07:40,039
Speaker 7: in Cumiai. Despite this, the Cumii and many other indigenous

3187
03:07:40,040 --> 03:07:42,640
Speaker 7: peoples were ignored when the border crossed them, and it's

3188
03:07:42,680 --> 03:07:45,879
Speaker 7: becoming harder and harder for them to cross it. In

3189
03:07:45,959 --> 03:07:47,960
Speaker 7: parts of desert, it can be pretty hard to see

3190
03:07:47,959 --> 03:07:51,040
Speaker 7: the border at all. In twenty twenty, while out with

3191
03:07:51,080 --> 03:07:53,120
Speaker 7: a group of Cumi people who are in ceremony to

3192
03:07:53,160 --> 03:07:56,240
Speaker 7: honor their ancestors whose burial sites have been and continue

3193
03:07:56,280 --> 03:07:59,240
Speaker 7: to be desecrated by border walk construction, it had to

3194
03:07:59,280 --> 03:08:01,720
Speaker 7: be worried of steppe over it to better frame my shots.

3195
03:08:02,320 --> 03:08:05,280
Speaker 7: The emerging Declaration Donald Trump made allowed war construction to

3196
03:08:05,280 --> 03:08:08,800
Speaker 7: sidestep legislation in place to protect archaeological and sacred sites,

3197
03:08:09,360 --> 03:08:11,480
Speaker 7: but it didn't allow me to sidestep into Mexico to

3198
03:08:11,480 --> 03:08:15,840
Speaker 7: get a better shot. Luckily, Bortac, a team of armed

3199
03:08:15,920 --> 03:08:18,120
Speaker 7: Border patrol agents who you might remember from Portland in

3200
03:08:18,160 --> 03:08:20,680
Speaker 7: twenty twenty, provided a guy ad dressed like he was

3201
03:08:20,680 --> 03:08:23,119
Speaker 7: in the Battle of Falluja to help me. I would

3202
03:08:23,120 --> 03:08:24,560
Speaker 7: say the border is a line in the sand, but

3203
03:08:24,879 --> 03:08:26,879
Speaker 7: at the time there wasn't a line that was visible

3204
03:08:26,920 --> 03:08:29,600
Speaker 7: at all in Valley the Moon, a few miles east

3205
03:08:29,600 --> 03:08:32,040
Speaker 7: to where that Bortec patrol guide shouted at people stepping

3206
03:08:32,040 --> 03:08:34,840
Speaker 7: too close in twenty twenty. The border wall is about

3207
03:08:34,879 --> 03:08:38,040
Speaker 7: waist high, rusty, and essentially comprised of a single strand

3208
03:08:38,080 --> 03:08:42,280
Speaker 7: of barbed wire in Hoocumber, the thirty foot trump wall

3209
03:08:42,320 --> 03:08:44,800
Speaker 7: pushes right up to a boulder pile and then stops

3210
03:08:45,680 --> 03:08:47,760
Speaker 7: the logic as much as there can be any logic,

3211
03:08:47,800 --> 03:08:50,160
Speaker 7: and spending twenty five million dollars a mile to desecrate

3212
03:08:50,200 --> 03:08:53,360
Speaker 7: sacred spaces and defile the landscape is that people will

3213
03:08:53,400 --> 03:08:56,200
Speaker 7: be deterred from crossing by the harsh landscape brutally hot

3214
03:08:56,280 --> 03:09:00,520
Speaker 7: days and brutally cold nights. This logic, of course, fails

3215
03:09:00,520 --> 03:09:04,160
Speaker 7: to consider not just where people are going, why they're leaving,

3216
03:09:04,200 --> 03:09:07,760
Speaker 7: the places they've come from. Risking one's life crossing the

3217
03:09:07,760 --> 03:09:11,200
Speaker 7: border makes sense only when one considers the danger that

3218
03:09:11,240 --> 03:09:13,560
Speaker 7: many people in places around the world face every day.

3219
03:09:14,360 --> 03:09:17,560
Speaker 7: It hasn't always been this way. Fear reference here in

3220
03:09:17,720 --> 03:09:21,320
Speaker 7: Reagan and Bush talking about migration in nineteen eighty, heait.

3221
03:09:21,200 --> 03:09:23,520
Speaker 34: I'm going to ask you what you would do about Cuba.

3222
03:09:23,560 --> 03:09:25,000
Speaker 16: But now we're going to call you.

3223
03:09:25,800 --> 03:09:28,000
Speaker 35: Now we're going to have some questions from the audience.

3224
03:09:29,480 --> 03:09:31,520
Speaker 4: Yes, my name is David Grosberg, and I'd like to

3225
03:09:31,560 --> 03:09:33,920
Speaker 4: know do you think that children of illegal aliens should

3226
03:09:33,920 --> 03:09:34,599
Speaker 4: be allowed.

3227
03:09:34,280 --> 03:09:37,119
Speaker 31: To attend Texas Public schools free or do you think

3228
03:09:37,160 --> 03:09:38,920
Speaker 31: that their parents should pay for their education?

3229
03:09:40,760 --> 03:09:41,680
Speaker 8: Who are you addressing that?

3230
03:09:41,920 --> 03:09:42,920
Speaker 35: I think you're first in this.

3231
03:09:43,280 --> 03:09:45,160
Speaker 8: He was looking right at you. I said that he

3232
03:09:45,360 --> 03:09:48,080
Speaker 8: was what I'd.

3233
03:09:47,879 --> 03:09:50,840
Speaker 36: Like to see something done about the illegal alien problem.

3234
03:09:50,840 --> 03:09:54,320
Speaker 36: That would be so sensitive and so understanding about labor

3235
03:09:54,400 --> 03:09:56,720
Speaker 36: needs and human needs that that.

3236
03:09:56,760 --> 03:09:57,879
Speaker 20: Problem wouldn't come up.

3237
03:09:58,160 --> 03:09:59,039
Speaker 5: But today, if.

3238
03:09:58,959 --> 03:10:01,840
Speaker 12: Those people are here, I would.

3239
03:10:01,520 --> 03:10:04,800
Speaker 36: Reluctantly say I think they would. They would get whatever

3240
03:10:04,840 --> 03:10:07,800
Speaker 36: it is that they're you know, what the society.

3241
03:10:07,360 --> 03:10:09,359
Speaker 8: Is giving to their neighbors.

3242
03:10:09,640 --> 03:10:12,200
Speaker 36: But it has the problem has to be solved. The

3243
03:10:12,320 --> 03:10:16,440
Speaker 36: problem has to be solved because as we have kind

3244
03:10:16,440 --> 03:10:19,680
Speaker 36: of made illegal some kinds of labor that I'd like

3245
03:10:19,760 --> 03:10:22,640
Speaker 36: to see legal, we're doing two things. We're creating a

3246
03:10:22,640 --> 03:10:27,440
Speaker 36: whole society of really honorable, decent, family loving people that

3247
03:10:27,520 --> 03:10:30,480
Speaker 36: are in violation of the law. And secondly, we're exacerbating

3248
03:10:30,520 --> 03:10:31,600
Speaker 36: relations with Mexico.

3249
03:10:31,959 --> 03:10:32,480
Speaker 7: The change.

3250
03:10:32,520 --> 03:10:35,960
Speaker 36: The answer to your question is much more fundamental than

3251
03:10:36,000 --> 03:10:39,000
Speaker 36: whether they attend Houston schools. It seems to me, I

3252
03:10:39,000 --> 03:10:40,760
Speaker 36: don't want to see a whole if they're living here,

3253
03:10:40,840 --> 03:10:42,880
Speaker 36: I don't want to see a whole. I think a

3254
03:10:43,000 --> 03:10:46,760
Speaker 36: six and eight year old kids being made, you know,

3255
03:10:46,959 --> 03:10:50,520
Speaker 36: one totally uneducated and made to feel that they're living

3256
03:10:50,520 --> 03:10:53,720
Speaker 36: with outside the law. Let's address ourselves to the fundamentals.

3257
03:10:53,760 --> 03:10:56,000
Speaker 36: These are good people, strong people.

3258
03:10:56,200 --> 03:10:57,880
Speaker 7: Part of my family is in Mexican.

3259
03:10:58,400 --> 03:11:03,560
Speaker 35: Then I added that I think the time has come

3260
03:11:04,160 --> 03:11:07,080
Speaker 35: that the United States and our neighbors, particularly our neighbor

3261
03:11:07,080 --> 03:11:09,480
Speaker 35: to the south, should have a better understanding and a

3262
03:11:09,480 --> 03:11:12,200
Speaker 35: better relationship than we've ever had. And I think but

3263
03:11:12,320 --> 03:11:15,640
Speaker 35: we haven't been sensitive enough to our size and our power.

3264
03:11:16,080 --> 03:11:18,640
Speaker 35: They have a problem of forty to fifty percent unemployment.

3265
03:11:19,360 --> 03:11:24,600
Speaker 35: Now this cannot continue without the possibility arising with regard

3266
03:11:24,640 --> 03:11:27,039
Speaker 35: to that other country that we talked about of Cuba

3267
03:11:27,080 --> 03:11:30,080
Speaker 35: and what it is stirring up of the possibility of

3268
03:11:30,160 --> 03:11:32,280
Speaker 35: trouble below the border, and we could have a very

3269
03:11:32,320 --> 03:11:36,040
Speaker 35: hostile and strange neighbor on our border. Rather than making

3270
03:11:36,080 --> 03:11:39,480
Speaker 35: them or talking about putting up a fence, why don't

3271
03:11:39,480 --> 03:11:43,119
Speaker 35: we work out some recognition of our mutual problems. Make

3272
03:11:43,160 --> 03:11:45,200
Speaker 35: it possible for them to come here legally with the

3273
03:11:45,240 --> 03:11:48,360
Speaker 35: work permit, and then while they're working and earning here,

3274
03:11:48,520 --> 03:11:50,959
Speaker 35: they pay taxes here, and when they go on to

3275
03:11:50,959 --> 03:11:52,560
Speaker 35: go back, they can go back and they can cross

3276
03:11:52,600 --> 03:11:56,760
Speaker 35: and open the border both ways by understanding their problem.

3277
03:11:57,160 --> 03:11:59,640
Speaker 7: The modern era of border enforcement began. As far as

3278
03:11:59,640 --> 03:12:02,920
Speaker 7: we can point a single date was Silvestre Reyes, that

3279
03:12:03,080 --> 03:12:06,759
Speaker 7: then sector chief of the Border Patrol in McAllen, Texas,

3280
03:12:07,320 --> 03:12:11,200
Speaker 7: and his operation Hold the Line. The community around McAllen

3281
03:12:11,240 --> 03:12:13,959
Speaker 7: had got tired of border patrol snooping around businesses and

3282
03:12:14,040 --> 03:12:18,000
Speaker 7: even schools in a Rio Grand valley, and instead Rayes

3283
03:12:18,040 --> 03:12:20,840
Speaker 7: deployed his agents forward in a sort of human fence

3284
03:12:20,879 --> 03:12:24,280
Speaker 7: along the Rio Grand. Rayes would later become the chief

3285
03:12:24,320 --> 03:12:27,160
Speaker 7: of the El Paso sector and a Democratic Congressman. He

3286
03:12:27,200 --> 03:12:29,199
Speaker 7: lost his seat to be to A. Rourke in twenty thirteen,

3287
03:12:29,959 --> 03:12:33,160
Speaker 7: but this strategy would long outlive his career with border patrol.

3288
03:12:33,879 --> 03:12:37,960
Speaker 7: The following year, on September seventeenth, nineteen ninety four, US

3289
03:12:38,080 --> 03:12:42,240
Speaker 7: Attorney General Janet Reno announced the start of Operation Gatekeeper.

3290
03:12:43,200 --> 03:12:45,400
Speaker 7: The first phase of the operation focus on the first

3291
03:12:45,440 --> 03:12:48,360
Speaker 7: five miles of the western border, including the place where

3292
03:12:48,360 --> 03:12:50,920
Speaker 7: I recorded all those interviews you heard earlier this week.

3293
03:12:52,000 --> 03:12:53,800
Speaker 7: According to a piece written a quarter of a century

3294
03:12:53,879 --> 03:12:56,400
Speaker 7: later in the La Times, the strategy was to deter

3295
03:12:56,600 --> 03:12:59,800
Speaker 7: migrants from illegally crossing in the first place, and for

3296
03:12:59,840 --> 03:13:03,000
Speaker 7: the who remained undeterred to encourage them to cross in

3297
03:13:03,080 --> 03:13:05,720
Speaker 7: more isolated wilderness areas to the east where they could

3298
03:13:05,760 --> 03:13:09,680
Speaker 7: be more easily captured. There were already fences in nineteen

3299
03:13:09,720 --> 03:13:12,800
Speaker 7: ninety four, first a chain link fence and then one

3300
03:13:12,840 --> 03:13:15,520
Speaker 7: made of helicopter landing mats left over from Vietnam that

3301
03:13:15,600 --> 03:13:19,080
Speaker 7: had horizontal struts that closely resembled and were used as

3302
03:13:19,200 --> 03:13:23,840
Speaker 7: a ladder. Anti migrant rhetoric was already there too. California

3303
03:13:23,840 --> 03:13:26,720
Speaker 7: Governor Pete Wilson became an outspoken advocate for Prop One

3304
03:13:26,760 --> 03:13:29,360
Speaker 7: to eighty seven, a ballot measure that cut off state

3305
03:13:29,400 --> 03:13:33,360
Speaker 7: services like health care and education to undocumented people. Here's

3306
03:13:33,360 --> 03:13:34,920
Speaker 7: a clip of Wilson's reelection ad.

3307
03:13:35,360 --> 03:13:39,440
Speaker 37: They keep coming two million illegal immigrants in California. The

3308
03:13:39,520 --> 03:13:42,640
Speaker 37: federal government won't stop them at the border, yet requires

3309
03:13:42,720 --> 03:13:45,840
Speaker 37: us to pay billions to take care of them. Governor

3310
03:13:45,879 --> 03:13:49,000
Speaker 37: Pete Wilson sent the National Guard to help the border patrol.

3311
03:13:49,360 --> 03:13:50,280
Speaker 8: But that's not all.

3312
03:13:50,400 --> 03:13:53,960
Speaker 16: For Californians who work hard, pay taxes, and obey the laws,

3313
03:13:54,240 --> 03:13:56,840
Speaker 16: I'm suing to force the federal government to control the

3314
03:13:56,840 --> 03:13:59,920
Speaker 16: border and are working to deny state services to illeg

3315
03:14:01,240 --> 03:14:04,119
Speaker 16: Enough is enough, Governor Pete Wilson.

3316
03:14:04,560 --> 03:14:07,560
Speaker 7: Under the operation, a much higher number of agents were

3317
03:14:07,560 --> 03:14:11,520
Speaker 7: deployed to the border. Apprehensions increased, and with them, so

3318
03:14:11,600 --> 03:14:15,280
Speaker 7: did funding for border enforcement. It was around this time

3319
03:14:15,360 --> 03:14:18,200
Speaker 7: that the narrative around the border began to change. It

3320
03:14:18,240 --> 03:14:20,760
Speaker 7: was also around this time, a few months earlier in fact,

3321
03:14:20,879 --> 03:14:23,960
Speaker 7: that the US, Mexico and Canada entered into the North

3322
03:14:24,000 --> 03:14:27,040
Speaker 7: American Free Trade Agreement, which made it easier than ever

3323
03:14:27,080 --> 03:14:29,640
Speaker 7: for capital to move across the border and take advantage

3324
03:14:29,680 --> 03:14:32,560
Speaker 7: of lower wages in Mexico. To learn a little bit

3325
03:14:32,560 --> 03:14:35,000
Speaker 7: more about Operation Gatekeeper, I spoke to one of the

3326
03:14:35,000 --> 03:14:36,840
Speaker 7: agents who was tasked with executing it.

3327
03:14:38,040 --> 03:14:40,320
Speaker 32: My name is Jen Budd and I'm a former senior

3328
03:14:40,400 --> 03:14:44,000
Speaker 32: Patrol agent with the United States Boarder Patrol. I was

3329
03:14:44,040 --> 03:14:48,560
Speaker 32: a senior intelligence agent as well at San Diego Sector Headquarters.

3330
03:14:48,959 --> 03:14:51,400
Speaker 7: Jenner Sin's left the Border Patrol, but she realizes the

3331
03:14:51,400 --> 03:14:54,680
Speaker 7: impact of Operation Gatekeeper on migrants was anything but positive.

3332
03:14:55,080 --> 03:14:55,320
Speaker 16: Yeah.

3333
03:14:55,440 --> 03:14:58,640
Speaker 32: Operation Gatekeeper started in nineteen ninety four, in October of

3334
03:14:58,680 --> 03:15:03,560
Speaker 32: nineteen ninety four, and to Campo in November of nineteen

3335
03:15:03,760 --> 03:15:09,120
Speaker 32: ninety five, and so right afterwards the fence was just

3336
03:15:09,200 --> 03:15:12,480
Speaker 32: getting to Takata. When I got there, so most of

3337
03:15:12,480 --> 03:15:15,119
Speaker 32: my class, I think we had I don't know, forty

3338
03:15:15,120 --> 03:15:17,440
Speaker 32: people graduate or something. Most of them went down to

3339
03:15:17,680 --> 03:15:20,959
Speaker 32: Imperial Beach and they had a wall there, and so

3340
03:15:21,040 --> 03:15:24,240
Speaker 32: that was the idea, is to fill the San Diego

3341
03:15:24,320 --> 03:15:26,880
Speaker 32: City area with as many agents and weapons and all this,

3342
03:15:27,520 --> 03:15:29,520
Speaker 32: and then that would push the traffic for that to

3343
03:15:29,560 --> 03:15:32,440
Speaker 32: the mountains, making it more difficult for them to cross,

3344
03:15:32,480 --> 03:15:34,160
Speaker 32: and some of them would get injured, and we knew

3345
03:15:34,200 --> 03:15:36,800
Speaker 32: some of them would die. So it was intentional. The

3346
03:15:36,879 --> 03:15:41,520
Speaker 32: death and the injuries, according to management, would deter future crossings.

3347
03:15:41,560 --> 03:15:43,359
Speaker 32: But of course that that's.

3348
03:15:43,120 --> 03:15:43,720
Speaker 8: Not the case.

3349
03:15:44,280 --> 03:15:47,920
Speaker 7: Alan Bersin, US attorney in San Diego, was named the

3350
03:15:47,959 --> 03:15:50,720
Speaker 7: so called Borders Are by President Bill Clinton a few

3351
03:15:50,800 --> 03:15:54,320
Speaker 7: years later to implement that same Gatekeeper strategy across the

3352
03:15:54,360 --> 03:15:57,080
Speaker 7: rest of the Southwest border. Burst In saw things a

3353
03:15:57,120 --> 03:15:57,760
Speaker 7: little differently.

3354
03:15:58,320 --> 03:16:01,680
Speaker 12: Neither side claims it, but Gatekeeper was probably the most

3355
03:16:01,680 --> 03:16:05,720
Speaker 12: important domestic achievement accomplished in a purely bipartisan manner through

3356
03:16:05,760 --> 03:16:09,840
Speaker 12: three administrations, and the greatest accomplishment since President Eisenhower and

3357
03:16:09,879 --> 03:16:12,280
Speaker 12: the Democrats put together the state highway system in the

3358
03:16:12,280 --> 03:16:13,839
Speaker 12: mid nineteen fifties.

3359
03:16:13,680 --> 03:16:16,800
Speaker 7: But in fact, while apprehensions did drop in San Diego,

3360
03:16:16,959 --> 03:16:19,360
Speaker 7: they spiked by five hundred and ninety one percent in

3361
03:16:19,400 --> 03:16:22,320
Speaker 7: the Tucson sector between nineteen ninety two and two thousand

3362
03:16:22,360 --> 03:16:26,279
Speaker 7: and four. The La Times quotes the non partisan Congressional

3363
03:16:26,320 --> 03:16:31,280
Speaker 7: Research Service as saying, one unintended consequence of this enforcement

3364
03:16:31,320 --> 03:16:34,120
Speaker 7: posture and the shift in migration patterns has been an

3365
03:16:34,160 --> 03:16:37,840
Speaker 7: increase in the number of migrant deaths each year. On average,

3366
03:16:37,959 --> 03:16:41,120
Speaker 7: two hundred migrants died each year in the early nineteen nineties,

3367
03:16:41,600 --> 03:16:44,039
Speaker 7: compared with four hundred and seventy two migrant deaths in

3368
03:16:44,040 --> 03:16:47,360
Speaker 7: two thousand and five. Many of those deaths are now

3369
03:16:47,360 --> 03:16:50,880
Speaker 7: in a sector that encompasses the Autumn Reservation. The desert

3370
03:16:50,959 --> 03:16:53,800
Speaker 7: there is particularly hard to cross, and the enforcement that

3371
03:16:53,840 --> 03:16:57,119
Speaker 7: began with Operation Gatekeeper pushes more and more people onto

3372
03:16:57,120 --> 03:17:01,120
Speaker 7: the reservation. Dahn Autumn people to travel between the United

3373
03:17:01,120 --> 03:17:04,680
Speaker 7: States and Mexico fairly easily a roads without checkpoints, to

3374
03:17:04,760 --> 03:17:07,840
Speaker 7: visit family, go to school, visit a doctor, or perform

3375
03:17:07,920 --> 03:17:12,120
Speaker 7: their traditional ceremonial practices. But after nine to eleven, the

3376
03:17:12,240 --> 03:17:14,720
Speaker 7: United States and its border patrol began a more visible

3377
03:17:14,760 --> 03:17:18,880
Speaker 7: and violent occupation of the reservation. It started with a

3378
03:17:18,959 --> 03:17:21,840
Speaker 7: vehicle barrier in two thousand and seven, and it continued

3379
03:17:21,879 --> 03:17:26,600
Speaker 7: with CBP's quote unquote virtual wall of surveillance technology, cameras

3380
03:17:26,720 --> 03:17:30,600
Speaker 7: and drones. The Israeli company Elbit Systems has built fixed

3381
03:17:30,600 --> 03:17:34,080
Speaker 7: surveillance towers which they pioneered in the West Bank on

3382
03:17:34,160 --> 03:17:38,840
Speaker 7: tribal land with the permission of tribal council. Meanwhile, other

3383
03:17:38,879 --> 03:17:41,520
Speaker 7: members of the nation strongly oppose the militarization of their

3384
03:17:41,520 --> 03:17:44,240
Speaker 7: homeland in the name of security of whatever homeland the

3385
03:17:44,240 --> 03:17:48,240
Speaker 7: Department of Homeland Security is securing. I'll quote hear from

3386
03:17:48,280 --> 03:17:50,400
Speaker 7: Todd Miller, whose excellent work on the border has required

3387
03:17:50,480 --> 03:17:54,640
Speaker 7: reading for anyone interested in the subject. Amy Juan and

3388
03:17:54,720 --> 03:17:58,480
Speaker 7: Nellie Joe David, members of the Horn Autumn, Hermagicum Writs Network.

3389
03:17:58,959 --> 03:18:03,000
Speaker 7: Tohrn joined a delegation to the West Bank in October

3390
03:18:03,200 --> 03:18:06,680
Speaker 7: twenty seventeen, convened by the Palestinian Organization stopped the war.

3391
03:18:07,600 --> 03:18:10,520
Speaker 7: It was a relief, one says, to talk with people

3392
03:18:10,560 --> 03:18:14,400
Speaker 7: who understand our fears, who are dealing with militarization and technology.

3393
03:18:16,240 --> 03:18:19,720
Speaker 7: In twenty seventeen, the Horn Autumn vice chairman Verlin Jose

3394
03:18:20,200 --> 03:18:22,560
Speaker 7: said that a war will be built quote over my

3395
03:18:22,720 --> 03:18:25,959
Speaker 7: dead body, and the tribe released a video saying there

3396
03:18:26,000 --> 03:18:29,039
Speaker 7: is no Autumn word for war. The sixty two miles

3397
03:18:29,040 --> 03:18:31,680
Speaker 7: of the border on their reservation would remain without one,

3398
03:18:31,800 --> 03:18:35,600
Speaker 7: they said. By twenty twenty, the Trump administration had fought

3399
03:18:35,640 --> 03:18:37,320
Speaker 7: through a wall on much of the border using what

3400
03:18:37,440 --> 03:18:40,240
Speaker 7: is known as the Roosevelt Reservation. This is a sixty

3401
03:18:40,240 --> 03:18:42,680
Speaker 7: foot wide strip of land that the federal government owns

3402
03:18:42,720 --> 03:18:47,360
Speaker 7: along the border in California, Arizona, and New Mexico. Although

3403
03:18:47,440 --> 03:18:50,200
Speaker 7: much of the Autumn Nation remains war free and some

3404
03:18:50,280 --> 03:18:52,560
Speaker 7: has what's called a vehicle barrier or a Normandy barrier,

3405
03:18:52,959 --> 03:18:55,840
Speaker 7: approximately one third of the Roosevelt Reservation is on tribal land.

3406
03:18:56,600 --> 03:18:59,959
Speaker 7: Since two thousand and five, realized the Act Environmental Survey

3407
03:19:00,120 --> 03:19:02,760
Speaker 7: and laws have been waived for border security, and this

3408
03:19:02,800 --> 03:19:05,320
Speaker 7: gave the Tramp administration a way to justify the destruction

3409
03:19:05,400 --> 03:19:08,720
Speaker 7: of Artum and Kumi burial grounds, swad or cacti that

3410
03:19:08,800 --> 03:19:12,400
Speaker 7: the Autumn Seas relatives, and other sacred sites along the border.

3411
03:19:12,680 --> 03:19:16,040
Speaker 7: Despite efforts by tribal members and allies to stop the construction,

3412
03:19:17,400 --> 03:19:20,640
Speaker 7: members of the Tahana Autumn Nation have been pepper sprayed beaten,

3413
03:19:21,120 --> 03:19:24,400
Speaker 7: tailed and shot by Border patrol. In two thousand and two,

3414
03:19:24,760 --> 03:19:28,000
Speaker 7: a Border patrol agent ran over and killed an Artam teenager.

3415
03:19:29,040 --> 03:19:31,600
Speaker 7: Last week, the same night I was waiting down by

3416
03:19:31,600 --> 03:19:34,119
Speaker 7: the border for the end of Title forty two, border

3417
03:19:34,160 --> 03:19:37,600
Speaker 7: patrol agent shot and killed Raymond Mattia, an ardum man

3418
03:19:37,800 --> 03:19:40,440
Speaker 7: who had called and asked him for help. He was

3419
03:19:40,480 --> 03:19:43,440
Speaker 7: shot thirty eight times just two feet from his front door,

3420
03:19:43,440 --> 03:19:47,480
Speaker 7: recording to his family. While mister Mattia's death is still

3421
03:19:47,520 --> 03:19:50,480
Speaker 7: being investigated, the Border Patrol has a long tradition of

3422
03:19:50,560 --> 03:19:54,000
Speaker 7: literally getting away with murder. This is because they investigate

3423
03:19:54,040 --> 03:19:58,039
Speaker 7: themselves using so called critical incident teams. I talked to

3424
03:19:58,120 --> 03:20:00,560
Speaker 7: Jen about what those teams do, and so.

3425
03:20:00,680 --> 03:20:03,080
Speaker 32: What they would do is they would get there first

3426
03:20:03,080 --> 03:20:05,240
Speaker 32: on the scene because we would call them first. We

3427
03:20:05,280 --> 03:20:08,240
Speaker 32: wouldn't call anybody else, we'd call them first. And then

3428
03:20:08,320 --> 03:20:10,520
Speaker 32: they come, They get rid of the witnesses, they set

3429
03:20:10,560 --> 03:20:12,959
Speaker 32: the scene up the way we want to be done,

3430
03:20:13,080 --> 03:20:15,039
Speaker 32: and they tell you the narrative that you're going.

3431
03:20:15,040 --> 03:20:15,560
Speaker 8: To stick with.

3432
03:20:15,879 --> 03:20:17,760
Speaker 32: You talk to your union reps, and it's all this

3433
03:20:17,879 --> 03:20:18,720
Speaker 32: giant cover up.

3434
03:20:19,160 --> 03:20:22,119
Speaker 7: Here's John call Us Free, a journalist who covered ci

3435
03:20:22,160 --> 03:20:25,360
Speaker 7: T cover ups talking to Democracy Now about how these

3436
03:20:25,360 --> 03:20:25,959
Speaker 7: teams work.

3437
03:20:26,800 --> 03:20:30,440
Speaker 27: Within the actual agency of the US Board Patrol, there

3438
03:20:30,480 --> 03:20:33,960
Speaker 27: is an investigated body called SIT, the Critical Incident Team.

3439
03:20:34,560 --> 03:20:38,119
Speaker 27: They are tasked with investigating incidents that involve border patrol

3440
03:20:38,160 --> 03:20:40,680
Speaker 27: and it can be anything from a car accident to

3441
03:20:40,840 --> 03:20:43,800
Speaker 27: in this case, an individual who's killed at the hands

3442
03:20:43,800 --> 03:20:46,760
Speaker 27: of the US Border Patrol. In this particular case of

3443
03:20:46,840 --> 03:20:51,640
Speaker 27: Anastasio Hernandez Rojas, border Patrol agents deleted video, they collected

3444
03:20:51,680 --> 03:20:54,680
Speaker 27: evidence at the scene. They were present in the hospital

3445
03:20:54,680 --> 03:20:58,680
Speaker 27: when Anastasio was being treated, They were present at the autopsy.

3446
03:20:59,440 --> 03:21:05,959
Speaker 27: They fudge reports, they deleted reports, They coached their own

3447
03:21:06,040 --> 03:21:09,040
Speaker 27: agents on what kind of testimony they were to give.

3448
03:21:09,080 --> 03:21:12,520
Speaker 27: They were present at every one of the depositions. They

3449
03:21:12,560 --> 03:21:15,160
Speaker 27: made sure that they were the victims in this case.

3450
03:21:15,200 --> 03:21:17,039
Speaker 27: And when I say that, what I mean is that

3451
03:21:17,120 --> 03:21:21,959
Speaker 27: Border Patrol agents SIT team agents make sure that Border

3452
03:21:22,000 --> 03:21:25,760
Speaker 27: Patrol agents are looked at as the victims in any

3453
03:21:25,760 --> 03:21:28,240
Speaker 27: sort of an incident, meaning that they are allowed then

3454
03:21:28,320 --> 03:21:31,440
Speaker 27: to use lethal force if a Border Patrol agent has

3455
03:21:31,560 --> 03:21:33,840
Speaker 27: rocks thrown at them or in the case of Anastasio,

3456
03:21:33,920 --> 03:21:37,040
Speaker 27: they alleged that Anastasio was violent and that he was

3457
03:21:37,160 --> 03:21:41,200
Speaker 27: kicking and punching, and he needed to be subdued. If

3458
03:21:41,200 --> 03:21:43,840
Speaker 27: we take a look at the videotape, that's not actually

3459
03:21:43,879 --> 03:21:46,440
Speaker 27: what happened. He's handcuffed, he's prone on the ground, his

3460
03:21:46,520 --> 03:21:49,160
Speaker 27: face is down, agents are on top of him. But

3461
03:21:49,200 --> 03:21:51,280
Speaker 27: if you read the reports in this case that were

3462
03:21:51,280 --> 03:21:54,600
Speaker 27: prepared by SIT, Anastasio was a violent man and needed

3463
03:21:54,600 --> 03:21:55,359
Speaker 27: to be subdued.

3464
03:21:55,760 --> 03:21:58,560
Speaker 7: In twenty twenty one, Border Patrol was ordered to disband

3465
03:21:58,560 --> 03:22:01,760
Speaker 7: these teams gentsas they simply moved them somewhere else and

3466
03:22:01,760 --> 03:22:02,760
Speaker 7: gave them a different name.

3467
03:22:03,160 --> 03:22:05,840
Speaker 32: So then they said that they disbanded them because we

3468
03:22:05,920 --> 03:22:07,640
Speaker 32: brought the truth out and how they did all this

3469
03:22:08,200 --> 03:22:11,200
Speaker 32: and we proved it. But what they actually did is

3470
03:22:11,240 --> 03:22:13,680
Speaker 32: they did a retention. So they had the Border Patrol

3471
03:22:13,680 --> 03:22:17,320
Speaker 32: agents resigned from the Border Patrol and move over to

3472
03:22:17,440 --> 03:22:21,039
Speaker 32: cbp OPR and we hired them under there. So the

3473
03:22:21,120 --> 03:22:25,760
Speaker 32: team that likely went to go investigate the tahonum Otum killing,

3474
03:22:26,480 --> 03:22:32,400
Speaker 32: I believe his name is Matia Matia Raymond Matia is

3475
03:22:32,640 --> 03:22:36,879
Speaker 32: likely the Border Patrol sit teams. So if the Border

3476
03:22:36,959 --> 03:22:39,280
Speaker 32: Patrol agents, a lot of people don't understand it's like

3477
03:22:39,320 --> 03:22:42,840
Speaker 32: a cult, you know, they always say you bleed green,

3478
03:22:43,240 --> 03:22:45,200
Speaker 32: you know, and you don't go back from green, and

3479
03:22:45,360 --> 03:22:47,920
Speaker 32: probably one of the few that ever left, you know,

3480
03:22:48,000 --> 03:22:49,680
Speaker 32: and tells the truth about it.

3481
03:22:50,080 --> 03:22:52,760
Speaker 7: Of Course, the vast majority of people whose families will

3482
03:22:52,760 --> 03:22:55,879
Speaker 7: never find justice because of these cit teams are not white,

3483
03:22:56,440 --> 03:22:58,760
Speaker 7: and of course Border Patrol has long rooted links to

3484
03:22:58,800 --> 03:23:02,880
Speaker 7: white nationalism. In nineteen seventy seven, about forty five minutes

3485
03:23:02,879 --> 03:23:05,440
Speaker 7: from San Diego and another forty five minutes from Komba,

3486
03:23:06,000 --> 03:23:08,440
Speaker 7: David Duke, grand Dragon of the Knights of the klu

3487
03:23:08,520 --> 03:23:11,600
Speaker 7: Klux Klan at the time, announced the official beginning of

3488
03:23:11,680 --> 03:23:15,760
Speaker 7: Clan Border Watch. Duke claimed there were hundreds of clansmen

3489
03:23:15,840 --> 03:23:18,760
Speaker 7: on the border, but local newspapers The Desert Sun reported

3490
03:23:18,760 --> 03:23:22,160
Speaker 7: that there were in reality at least ten are quote

3491
03:23:22,200 --> 03:23:24,280
Speaker 7: directly from the Desert Suns reporting at a time here,

3492
03:23:25,360 --> 03:23:28,320
Speaker 7: Duke said clansmen would refrain from direct contact with illegal

3493
03:23:28,360 --> 03:23:31,480
Speaker 7: aliens if any have found. He said, klansmen would not

3494
03:23:31,520 --> 03:23:34,600
Speaker 7: talk to them or contact them, but if any illegal

3495
03:23:34,640 --> 03:23:37,280
Speaker 7: crossings are scene, they're going to use CBE radios to

3496
03:23:37,320 --> 03:23:42,279
Speaker 7: relay the information to Border Patrol, Duke said. Duke of Metairie, Louisiana,

3497
03:23:42,600 --> 03:23:45,039
Speaker 7: claimed the clan has the support of the American people

3498
03:23:45,200 --> 03:23:47,680
Speaker 7: and helping the Border patrol stem the influx of illegal

3499
03:23:47,680 --> 03:23:51,240
Speaker 7: aliens into this country. He claimed. The illegal aliens take

3500
03:23:51,320 --> 03:23:56,039
Speaker 7: jobs away from US citizens. We feel this rising tide

3501
03:23:56,120 --> 03:23:58,279
Speaker 7: washing over our border is going to affect our culture,

3502
03:23:58,480 --> 03:24:00,800
Speaker 7: he told reporters at the time, in a statement that

3503
03:24:00,800 --> 03:24:04,280
Speaker 7: wouldn't sound out of place on Fox News today. In response,

3504
03:24:04,360 --> 03:24:06,880
Speaker 7: more than one thousand, five hundred brown Berries threatened to

3505
03:24:06,959 --> 03:24:09,840
Speaker 7: rally against Duke. A protest fire out numbering his patrols,

3506
03:24:09,879 --> 03:24:13,160
Speaker 7: popped up along the border. In the late nineteen seventies

3507
03:24:13,200 --> 03:24:16,400
Speaker 7: and early nineteen eighties, Texas Knights of the KKK leader

3508
03:24:16,440 --> 03:24:18,920
Speaker 7: Louis Beam, a Vietnam war veteran who had helped to

3509
03:24:19,000 --> 03:24:23,040
Speaker 7: organize and promote Duke's border stunt, established paramilitary camps around

3510
03:24:23,040 --> 03:24:25,320
Speaker 7: Texas and trained children as young as eight in the

3511
03:24:25,360 --> 03:24:29,760
Speaker 7: deadly guerrilla warfare tactics he learned overseas. He rallied white

3512
03:24:29,800 --> 03:24:36,480
Speaker 7: fishermen against Vietnamese migrants and burned their boats. In twenty nineteen,

3513
03:24:37,040 --> 03:24:40,360
Speaker 7: a Border patrol agent from Logales named Matthew Bowen was

3514
03:24:40,400 --> 03:24:42,920
Speaker 7: accused of knocking down a Guatemala man with his vehicle

3515
03:24:43,240 --> 03:24:47,040
Speaker 7: then lying to a quart about the incident. The prosecutors

3516
03:24:47,040 --> 03:24:50,800
Speaker 7: in the case showed the jury text Bowen sent, including

3517
03:24:50,840 --> 03:24:54,840
Speaker 7: one which called migrants quote disgusting, sub human shit unworthy

3518
03:24:54,840 --> 03:24:58,560
Speaker 7: of being kindling for a fire. In several text messages,

3519
03:24:58,879 --> 03:25:02,879
Speaker 7: Bowen references quote tonks. This is a derogatory term for

3520
03:25:02,920 --> 03:25:06,200
Speaker 7: border crossing migrants. The urging is determined a little bit unclear,

3521
03:25:06,200 --> 03:25:08,400
Speaker 7: but it seems to be derived from the sound of

3522
03:25:08,440 --> 03:25:12,760
Speaker 7: a flashlight hitting the back of someone's head. In argument,

3523
03:25:12,800 --> 03:25:16,240
Speaker 7: again submitting the texts, defense lawyer Sean Chapman wrote that

3524
03:25:16,280 --> 03:25:19,760
Speaker 7: he would argue certain terms are quote commonplace throughout the

3525
03:25:19,760 --> 03:25:22,600
Speaker 7: Border Patrols twos on sector. This is part of the

3526
03:25:22,640 --> 03:25:25,920
Speaker 7: agency's culture and therefore it says nothing about mister Bowen's

3527
03:25:25,959 --> 03:25:29,120
Speaker 7: mindset genses. This kind of language and attitude was not

3528
03:25:29,200 --> 03:25:31,280
Speaker 7: uncommon in her time in border patrol from the mid

3529
03:25:31,360 --> 03:25:34,240
Speaker 7: nineties to the early two thousands, but things have got worse.

3530
03:25:34,040 --> 03:25:37,360
Speaker 32: Since there have been some definite changes in the Border

3531
03:25:37,400 --> 03:25:40,760
Speaker 32: Patrol in the training from before nine to eleven to

3532
03:25:40,800 --> 03:25:46,280
Speaker 32: after nine to eleven, and what you also see so

3533
03:25:46,680 --> 03:25:50,920
Speaker 32: their vocabulary has changed, so like they refer to migrants

3534
03:25:50,920 --> 03:25:54,200
Speaker 32: and asylum secrecis invaders. We never use that term prior

3535
03:25:54,240 --> 03:25:58,840
Speaker 32: to nine to eleven, and we did have racist words

3536
03:25:58,840 --> 03:26:01,400
Speaker 32: that were used for there. I mean I use them

3537
03:26:01,400 --> 03:26:02,879
Speaker 32: as well. I'm not denying there.

3538
03:26:03,480 --> 03:26:06,000
Speaker 7: Of course, this kind of language isn't just restricted to

3539
03:26:06,040 --> 03:26:06,640
Speaker 7: border patrol.

3540
03:26:07,480 --> 03:26:14,959
Speaker 31: The US has become a dumping ground for everybody else's problems.

3541
03:26:18,840 --> 03:26:19,280
Speaker 5: Thank care.

3542
03:26:21,600 --> 03:26:25,959
Speaker 31: It's true, and these are the best and the finest.

3543
03:26:26,320 --> 03:26:30,160
Speaker 31: When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best.

3544
03:26:30,720 --> 03:26:33,160
Speaker 7: They're not sending you. They're not sending you.

3545
03:26:34,240 --> 03:26:38,360
Speaker 31: They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're

3546
03:26:38,400 --> 03:26:44,360
Speaker 31: bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs, they're bringing crime,

3547
03:26:44,920 --> 03:26:48,440
Speaker 31: they're rapists, and some I assume are good people.

3548
03:26:49,080 --> 03:26:51,520
Speaker 7: There has been white supremacist violence at the border ever

3549
03:26:51,560 --> 03:26:54,760
Speaker 7: since Duke and long before. Often it's been at the

3550
03:26:54,800 --> 03:26:57,160
Speaker 7: hands of groups outside of the state. Sometimes it's been

3551
03:26:57,160 --> 03:27:00,360
Speaker 7: at the hands of the state. In Arizona, groups like

3552
03:27:00,400 --> 03:27:03,960
Speaker 7: Arizona Border Ricon and Minutemen American Defense have terrorized border

3553
03:27:03,959 --> 03:27:08,760
Speaker 7: communities for decades, engaged renewed momentum from Trump's consistent demonization

3554
03:27:08,840 --> 03:27:11,360
Speaker 7: of migrants. I spent a bit of time looking for

3555
03:27:11,400 --> 03:27:13,240
Speaker 7: them in the desert in Arizona last week, but I

3556
03:27:13,400 --> 03:27:17,760
Speaker 7: didn't see much, not that I really wanted to. Interaction

3557
03:27:17,840 --> 03:27:20,360
Speaker 7: with these militias, probably far more often than we have

3558
03:27:20,400 --> 03:27:23,879
Speaker 7: documented evidence for, can be fatal, just like interaction with

3559
03:27:23,920 --> 03:27:28,320
Speaker 7: customs and border protection. Here's just one example culled from

3560
03:27:28,360 --> 03:27:33,280
Speaker 7: David Newitt's excellent book, and Hell followed with her. On

3561
03:27:33,360 --> 03:27:36,960
Speaker 7: May thirtieth, two thousand and nine, Sean of Ford, Jason

3562
03:27:36,959 --> 03:27:41,400
Speaker 7: Eugene Bush, and Albert Gacxiola, all members of Ford's vigilante

3563
03:27:41,440 --> 03:27:45,520
Speaker 7: group Minuteman American Defense, forced their way into Raoul Flores

3564
03:27:45,560 --> 03:27:48,920
Speaker 7: Junior's home in Aravika, Arizona, by pretending to be border

3565
03:27:48,959 --> 03:27:52,320
Speaker 7: patrol agents. The group planned to steal and sell drugs

3566
03:27:52,360 --> 03:27:55,039
Speaker 7: they thought Flora's had in his house. The FBI knew

3567
03:27:55,080 --> 03:27:58,080
Speaker 7: about this, but did nothing to stop them, Finding no

3568
03:27:58,160 --> 03:28:01,400
Speaker 7: drugs in the house. Civitilante's murder Flores and his nine

3569
03:28:01,480 --> 03:28:06,880
Speaker 7: year old daughter, Bricennia, Flora's wife and Brisenia's mother, Gina

3570
03:28:06,959 --> 03:28:10,920
Speaker 7: Marie Gonzalez, was shot three times. She played dead, but

3571
03:28:10,959 --> 03:28:13,840
Speaker 7: when attack has returned, she exchanged fire with them, using

3572
03:28:13,879 --> 03:28:18,000
Speaker 7: her husband's handgun. In doing so, she hit Bush. Bush

3573
03:28:18,000 --> 03:28:20,480
Speaker 7: had previously been charged with a September nineteen ninety seven

3574
03:28:20,520 --> 03:28:23,879
Speaker 7: execution of an Aryan Nation associate for the supposed crime

3575
03:28:24,000 --> 03:28:28,360
Speaker 7: of being a race traitor. Both Ford and Bush are

3576
03:28:28,400 --> 03:28:32,440
Speaker 7: currently on death row in Arizona. The KKAK was not

3577
03:28:32,520 --> 03:28:35,800
Speaker 7: the only group recruiting children for border patrolling. Since the

3578
03:28:35,840 --> 03:28:39,520
Speaker 7: mid nineteen eighties, the Border Patrol's Explorer program has recruited

3579
03:28:39,560 --> 03:28:42,680
Speaker 7: young men and women of high school age. The program

3580
03:28:42,720 --> 03:28:45,360
Speaker 7: is charted through Learning for Life, which is a subsidiary

3581
03:28:45,400 --> 03:28:48,959
Speaker 7: of the Scouts of America. For kids, often the children

3582
03:28:48,959 --> 03:28:51,920
Speaker 7: of immigrants living in border towns where industry has long

3583
03:28:51,959 --> 03:28:53,920
Speaker 7: since gone in a decent wage is hard to come by,

3584
03:28:54,320 --> 03:28:56,760
Speaker 7: the program offers the chance at a starting salary of

3585
03:28:56,800 --> 03:29:00,000
Speaker 7: sixty two thousand dollars twice a median income. In stide

3586
03:29:00,000 --> 03:29:04,920
Speaker 7: some of these towns, young Explorers will learn tracking, survival, shooting,

3587
03:29:05,320 --> 03:29:08,640
Speaker 7: and how to detain and process on documented migrants, people

3588
03:29:08,640 --> 03:29:10,840
Speaker 7: who in some cases are walking in the footsteps of

3589
03:29:10,840 --> 03:29:14,360
Speaker 7: their own parents. According to an article by Moraling Music

3590
03:29:14,360 --> 03:29:16,720
Speaker 7: in the Nation, young Explorers have to earn the writer

3591
03:29:16,840 --> 03:29:20,840
Speaker 7: their uniform by participating their sixty hour Basic Explorer Academy,

3592
03:29:21,480 --> 03:29:24,160
Speaker 7: of which they learned CPR drills and the methods of

3593
03:29:24,160 --> 03:29:28,760
Speaker 7: conducting vehicle stops. It also offers courses in radio communications,

3594
03:29:28,840 --> 03:29:33,119
Speaker 7: public speaking, report writing, and ethics and integrity, and introduces

3595
03:29:33,120 --> 03:29:36,400
Speaker 7: the youth to criminal juvenile immigration of Fourth Amendment law.

3596
03:29:37,560 --> 03:29:39,080
Speaker 7: While I was writing it, so checked out the San

3597
03:29:39,120 --> 03:29:42,400
Speaker 7: Diego sector page, which seems to show young people running, shooting,

3598
03:29:42,520 --> 03:29:44,000
Speaker 7: and one who looks like he's just been mased in

3599
03:29:44,000 --> 03:29:46,840
Speaker 7: the face. The next photo on the Facebook page dedicated

3600
03:29:46,840 --> 03:29:49,480
Speaker 7: to this Border Patrol sector shows a man in handcuffs.

3601
03:29:50,040 --> 03:29:51,920
Speaker 7: Above this is a video of someone dropping a chart

3602
03:29:51,959 --> 03:29:55,120
Speaker 7: from the top of the border fence. Without figures from

3603
03:29:55,160 --> 03:29:57,160
Speaker 7: the CVP, it's hard to tell of participation in the

3604
03:29:57,200 --> 03:30:00,800
Speaker 7: Explorers has dropped as public awareness of family separation assault

3605
03:30:01,000 --> 03:30:03,480
Speaker 7: now the behavior doesn't exactly fit with the Border Patrol's

3606
03:30:03,480 --> 03:30:06,960
Speaker 7: motto on a first has spread. I asked Jen for

3607
03:30:07,000 --> 03:30:08,720
Speaker 7: her take on the Explorer program.

3608
03:30:08,879 --> 03:30:11,200
Speaker 32: Well, I call it Border Patrol Youth because it reminds

3609
03:30:11,240 --> 03:30:12,879
Speaker 32: me a lot of the Hitler youth, where we go

3610
03:30:12,959 --> 03:30:16,400
Speaker 32: into their high schools and we get the kids that

3611
03:30:16,560 --> 03:30:22,280
Speaker 32: are in trouble, and typically they are Latino dominant high schools,

3612
03:30:21,840 --> 03:30:25,520
Speaker 32: and we teach them how to be Many Border Patrol agents,

3613
03:30:25,560 --> 03:30:28,119
Speaker 32: and we teach them to hate somebody else instead of themselves.

3614
03:30:28,320 --> 03:30:31,480
Speaker 32: We indoctrinate them into the same stuff that I was

3615
03:30:31,520 --> 03:30:34,320
Speaker 32: indoctrinating into. But it's even gone so far now as

3616
03:30:34,360 --> 03:30:36,320
Speaker 32: to they do the dog and pony shows at the

3617
03:30:36,320 --> 03:30:39,640
Speaker 32: elementary school, so they're getting them when they're like six

3618
03:30:39,840 --> 03:30:42,800
Speaker 32: seven years old, and they go there with you a

3619
03:30:42,800 --> 03:30:45,400
Speaker 32: little Border Patrol bulletproof vest and put them on them

3620
03:30:45,400 --> 03:30:48,199
Speaker 32: and take pictures and put it on social media, and

3621
03:30:47,680 --> 03:30:49,879
Speaker 32: they have them sit in their trucks and turn the

3622
03:30:49,959 --> 03:30:51,680
Speaker 32: signs on and all this other stuff.

3623
03:30:51,879 --> 03:30:54,920
Speaker 7: That indoctrination is crucial to border patrol culture. And to

3624
03:30:54,959 --> 03:30:56,680
Speaker 7: be honest, the reason I wanted to talk to Jen

3625
03:30:56,840 --> 03:31:01,200
Speaker 7: was to understand it better. In Ocomber, young border patrol agent,

3626
03:31:01,400 --> 03:31:05,960
Speaker 7: a woman giving volunteers right, I'm not about to get

3627
03:31:05,959 --> 03:31:08,160
Speaker 7: into a Border Patrol truck myself, and I wasn't going

3628
03:31:08,200 --> 03:31:09,800
Speaker 7: to get a response by asked the agent how she

3629
03:31:09,840 --> 03:31:11,879
Speaker 7: squared up her role in holding people in the desert

3630
03:31:12,240 --> 03:31:14,280
Speaker 7: with the fact that some volunteers said she'd spend her

3631
03:31:14,360 --> 03:31:17,480
Speaker 7: own money buying supplies. Jen said that this kind of

3632
03:31:17,480 --> 03:31:19,400
Speaker 7: behavior can be pretty common with young agents.

3633
03:31:19,800 --> 03:31:22,040
Speaker 32: I had intended to go to law school to be

3634
03:31:22,120 --> 03:31:24,400
Speaker 32: a civil rights attorney when I joined the Border Patrol,

3635
03:31:24,520 --> 03:31:30,119
Speaker 32: and for me, I ignored my core values and ignored

3636
03:31:30,440 --> 03:31:33,520
Speaker 32: that I was enforcing laws that sent thousands of human

3637
03:31:33,520 --> 03:31:36,920
Speaker 32: beings to their deaths because I felt like I was

3638
03:31:36,959 --> 03:31:40,200
Speaker 32: trying to survive. I was raped in the academy by

3639
03:31:40,240 --> 03:31:44,280
Speaker 32: a fellow agent, and they covered that up, and I

3640
03:31:44,440 --> 03:31:46,720
Speaker 32: was really trying to get out of the South and

3641
03:31:46,879 --> 03:31:50,840
Speaker 32: start my life. I oftould say, like, especially with female agents,

3642
03:31:50,840 --> 03:31:53,240
Speaker 32: they cause it ers five percent, because there's never been

3643
03:31:53,240 --> 03:31:56,720
Speaker 32: more than five percent women in the Border Patrol rates.

3644
03:31:57,000 --> 03:31:58,640
Speaker 32: And they say, oh, it's because it's very hard. It's

3645
03:31:58,680 --> 03:32:00,480
Speaker 32: not because it's very hard. I mean, it is very

3646
03:32:00,520 --> 03:32:03,440
Speaker 32: hard to get through, but it's also it's because they're

3647
03:32:03,480 --> 03:32:06,080
Speaker 32: sexually assaulting us all the time in the academy and

3648
03:32:06,160 --> 03:32:10,480
Speaker 32: halassing us. So I go back and forth in my mind,

3649
03:32:10,480 --> 03:32:12,600
Speaker 32: and I would imagine this young woman, you know, she

3650
03:32:12,680 --> 03:32:17,000
Speaker 32: has days where she arrests some pretty decent criminals every

3651
03:32:17,040 --> 03:32:18,600
Speaker 32: now and then once in a blue moon, but the

3652
03:32:18,640 --> 03:32:23,720
Speaker 32: majority of them, if she's paying attention and not completely

3653
03:32:23,760 --> 03:32:27,119
Speaker 32: self absorbed, she'll realize that they're not criminals, and their

3654
03:32:27,120 --> 03:32:30,560
Speaker 32: families just simply seeking asylum, so she at some point

3655
03:32:30,959 --> 03:32:34,600
Speaker 32: has to decide in her mind, is this what I

3656
03:32:34,640 --> 03:32:35,240
Speaker 32: got into?

3657
03:32:35,440 --> 03:32:37,920
Speaker 8: Is this what I want to do with my life?

3658
03:32:38,560 --> 03:32:40,800
Speaker 7: In the wake of nine to eleven and quite telling me,

3659
03:32:41,240 --> 03:32:43,879
Speaker 7: the Border Patrol moved from oversight by the Department of

3660
03:32:44,040 --> 03:32:47,240
Speaker 7: Justice to the new Department of Homeland Security. This move

3661
03:32:47,680 --> 03:32:50,840
Speaker 7: from Justice as security has been echoed, and it's recruiting,

3662
03:32:51,360 --> 03:32:54,080
Speaker 7: which once you heavily on those, it's humanitarian aid experience

3663
03:32:54,640 --> 03:32:56,480
Speaker 7: and now tries to appeal to veterans of the two

3664
03:32:56,480 --> 03:32:59,000
Speaker 7: decades of war that have accompanied the growth of DHS

3665
03:32:59,000 --> 03:33:03,640
Speaker 7: since two thousand and one. When the DHS was first established,

3666
03:33:03,760 --> 03:33:06,640
Speaker 7: the name struck many as problematic. In the two thousand

3667
03:33:06,640 --> 03:33:09,280
Speaker 7: and two article in The New York Times, Elizabeth Becker

3668
03:33:09,520 --> 03:33:11,640
Speaker 7: wrote that the name had worrying similarities to the way

3669
03:33:11,640 --> 03:33:14,640
Speaker 7: the Nazis talked about their fatherland, and it didn't really

3670
03:33:14,640 --> 03:33:18,000
Speaker 7: fit with the way Americans spoke. Nobody in two thousand

3671
03:33:18,000 --> 03:33:20,640
Speaker 7: and one was talking about the homeland. But two decades

3672
03:33:20,640 --> 03:33:22,920
Speaker 7: and billions of dollars later, it's hard to find much

3673
03:33:22,920 --> 03:33:24,720
Speaker 7: in the way of criticism of the agency in DC,

3674
03:33:25,400 --> 03:33:27,440
Speaker 7: despite the fact that the twenty twenty two budgets of

3675
03:33:27,440 --> 03:33:31,000
Speaker 7: CBP and ICE was sixteen and eight billion, respectively, and

3676
03:33:31,160 --> 03:33:34,160
Speaker 7: every year since two thousand and one, DHS has obtained

3677
03:33:34,200 --> 03:33:37,920
Speaker 7: more guns, more drones, and more surveillance technology that is

3678
03:33:37,920 --> 03:33:41,000
Speaker 7: inevitably used to spy on citizens as well as non citizens.

3679
03:33:42,920 --> 03:33:46,359
Speaker 7: In nineteen ninety five, there are about four thousand CBP agents.

3680
03:33:46,800 --> 03:33:50,280
Speaker 7: By twenty twenty there were twenty thousand, with seventeen thousand

3681
03:33:50,280 --> 03:33:53,160
Speaker 7: stations on the southern border. This is a slight drop

3682
03:33:53,200 --> 03:33:55,880
Speaker 7: from a peak of just over twenty one thousand under Obama,

3683
03:33:56,240 --> 03:33:58,520
Speaker 7: who is often called the deporter in Chief, is fondness

3684
03:33:58,520 --> 03:34:01,520
Speaker 7: for expelling people from the United States for crimes like

3685
03:34:01,720 --> 03:34:05,640
Speaker 7: having a PieP or financial misconduct, the so called aggravated

3686
03:34:05,680 --> 03:34:09,520
Speaker 7: felonies and crimes of moral turpitude that only exist for

3687
03:34:09,560 --> 03:34:13,120
Speaker 7: non citizens. These agents today have the ability to operate

3688
03:34:13,120 --> 03:34:16,720
Speaker 7: in what the ACLU calls a constitution free zone and

3689
03:34:16,800 --> 03:34:20,840
Speaker 7: can conduct suspicion free searches of electronic devices, use cell

3690
03:34:20,879 --> 03:34:24,000
Speaker 7: site simulators, and sweep up data about thousands of people

3691
03:34:24,040 --> 03:34:26,840
Speaker 7: never accused of any crime. One of the more notable

3692
03:34:26,840 --> 03:34:28,959
Speaker 7: examples of this happened only a few yards from where

3693
03:34:29,000 --> 03:34:31,520
Speaker 7: I was recording last week. In Santa Cudro. It's a

3694
03:34:31,560 --> 03:34:34,640
Speaker 7: story worth recounting in detail because it brings together the

3695
03:34:34,640 --> 03:34:39,119
Speaker 7: themes we've spoken about so far, demonization of migrants, government overreach,

3696
03:34:39,360 --> 03:34:43,080
Speaker 7: and a frank disregard for international and national law. In

3697
03:34:43,160 --> 03:34:45,640
Speaker 7: late twenty eighteen, I was enjoying a break from work

3698
03:34:45,640 --> 03:34:48,160
Speaker 7: in a caravan near in Sonata. If you think back

3699
03:34:48,200 --> 03:34:51,000
Speaker 7: to that time, right before the midterms, you might remember

3700
03:34:51,000 --> 03:34:53,040
Speaker 7: some of the rhetoric that's circulated around a large group

3701
03:34:53,080 --> 03:34:55,760
Speaker 7: of migrants making their way to the southern border. I'll

3702
03:34:55,760 --> 03:34:57,920
Speaker 7: play some of the clips from Fox that MPR cut

3703
03:34:57,959 --> 03:34:59,560
Speaker 7: together in their coverage of the issue.

3704
03:35:00,160 --> 03:35:06,040
Speaker 9: Sympathetic, overwrought coverage of this invading horde. Is calling it

3705
03:35:06,080 --> 03:35:09,640
Speaker 9: a caravan is a misnomer? In a frankly sickness.

3706
03:35:09,240 --> 03:35:11,959
Speaker 38: Or sampled that Chipper Morning show Fox and Friends.

3707
03:35:11,680 --> 03:35:14,119
Speaker 11: I've gotten so many email from people who said, don't

3708
03:35:14,160 --> 03:35:17,160
Speaker 11: call it a caravan, call it an invasion.

3709
03:35:17,400 --> 03:35:17,640
Speaker 1: Yes?

3710
03:35:17,760 --> 03:35:18,360
Speaker 2: Is that fair?

3711
03:35:18,480 --> 03:35:21,680
Speaker 38: Host Steve Doocy put the question to conservative pundit Michelle Malkin.

3712
03:35:21,920 --> 03:35:22,640
Speaker 5: Of course it is.

3713
03:35:22,680 --> 03:35:25,680
Speaker 29: It is a full scale invasion by a hostile force,

3714
03:35:25,959 --> 03:35:28,840
Speaker 29: and it requires our president and our commander in chief

3715
03:35:28,879 --> 03:35:31,760
Speaker 29: to use any means necessary to protect our sovereignty.

3716
03:35:31,879 --> 03:35:35,080
Speaker 38: CNN's Brian Stelter found that Fox News featured segments using

3717
03:35:35,120 --> 03:35:37,960
Speaker 38: the phrase invasion more than sixty times this month about

3718
03:35:37,959 --> 03:35:41,760
Speaker 38: the migrants. On Fox Business Network, Lou Dobbs's program invoked

3719
03:35:41,760 --> 03:35:45,080
Speaker 38: it dozens of times. Trump ordered five thousand troops to

3720
03:35:45,120 --> 03:35:47,840
Speaker 38: the border. He tweeted yesterday, quote, this is an invasion

3721
03:35:47,920 --> 03:35:50,840
Speaker 38: of our country, and Trump has, without evidence, claimed gang

3722
03:35:50,879 --> 03:35:54,480
Speaker 38: members and criminals and Middle Easterners are among them. Over

3723
03:35:54,560 --> 03:35:58,440
Speaker 38: on Fox, guests have similarly, without supporting facts, suggested people

3724
03:35:58,480 --> 03:36:02,039
Speaker 38: from Isis and the Taliban be among those migrants. Even so,

3725
03:36:02,280 --> 03:36:05,200
Speaker 38: the network's chief news anchor, Shepherd Smith, tried to put

3726
03:36:05,200 --> 03:36:06,280
Speaker 38: on the brakes yesterday.

3727
03:36:06,440 --> 03:36:11,520
Speaker 39: Tomorrow is one week before the midterm election, which is

3728
03:36:11,520 --> 03:36:14,959
Speaker 39: what all of this is about. There is no invasion,

3729
03:36:16,000 --> 03:36:19,040
Speaker 39: No one's coming to get you. There's nothing at all

3730
03:36:19,080 --> 03:36:19,760
Speaker 39: to worry about.

3731
03:36:19,840 --> 03:36:22,800
Speaker 38: This month, Fox hosts and guests have repeatedly questions whether

3732
03:36:22,840 --> 03:36:26,560
Speaker 38: the migrants might bring in infectious diseases, again without evidence.

3733
03:36:26,959 --> 03:36:30,400
Speaker 9: Laura Ingram, we don't know what people have coming in here.

3734
03:36:30,440 --> 03:36:33,240
Speaker 9: We have diseases in this country we haven't had for decades.

3735
03:36:33,720 --> 03:36:35,920
Speaker 7: I'll leave you to process the incredible army of the

3736
03:36:35,959 --> 03:36:38,240
Speaker 7: network that killed the decent percentage of its viewers by

3737
03:36:38,240 --> 03:36:41,480
Speaker 7: denying that COVID was serious, or a disease, or the

3738
03:36:41,560 --> 03:36:45,320
Speaker 7: vaccines and masks are useful panicking about infectious diseases. Just

3739
03:36:45,360 --> 03:36:48,920
Speaker 7: two years before the pandemic began, the Tree of Life shooter,

3740
03:36:48,920 --> 03:36:51,000
Speaker 7: who we won't name here, who is currently facing a

3741
03:36:51,000 --> 03:36:53,960
Speaker 7: death penunty trial for murdering eleven people in a Pittsburgh synegogue,

3742
03:36:54,040 --> 03:36:56,680
Speaker 7: was obsessed with the caravan. The victims of the largest

3743
03:36:56,680 --> 03:36:59,800
Speaker 7: anti Semitic mass murder in US history included a beloved

3744
03:37:00,000 --> 03:37:03,320
Speaker 7: county doctor, a great grandmother, and a couple who'd gotten

3745
03:37:03,320 --> 03:37:05,720
Speaker 7: married at the same synagogue more than sixty years earlier.

3746
03:37:06,560 --> 03:37:09,840
Speaker 7: The shooter's last post on hate speech social media site gab,

3747
03:37:10,320 --> 03:37:13,680
Speaker 7: posted just minutes before the synagogue massacre began, spells it

3748
03:37:13,680 --> 03:37:17,120
Speaker 7: out with a reference to the Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society,

3749
03:37:17,400 --> 03:37:20,640
Speaker 7: the Jewish nonprofit that resettles refugees in the United States.

3750
03:37:21,360 --> 03:37:23,880
Speaker 7: HIAS liked to bring invaders to kill our people. I

3751
03:37:23,959 --> 03:37:26,920
Speaker 7: can't sit by and watch my people get slaughtered. Screw

3752
03:37:26,920 --> 03:37:30,080
Speaker 7: your optics, I'm going in. The shooter was obsessed with

3753
03:37:30,120 --> 03:37:32,039
Speaker 7: the idea that a caravan of migrants with not a

3754
03:37:32,040 --> 03:37:34,440
Speaker 7: group of people trying to save their own lives, but

3755
03:37:34,520 --> 03:37:37,720
Speaker 7: a coordinated and somehow Jewish led invasion and attempts to

3756
03:37:37,720 --> 03:37:41,360
Speaker 7: demographically restructure the United States. If you're ending where he

3757
03:37:41,400 --> 03:37:44,440
Speaker 7: got that idea from, He's America's favorite job seeker. Tucker

3758
03:37:44,440 --> 03:37:45,520
Speaker 7: Carlson on the caravan.

3759
03:37:46,000 --> 03:37:49,359
Speaker 11: Over the past month, a caravan of Central American migrants

3760
03:37:49,400 --> 03:37:52,039
Speaker 11: has gradually made its way up from Hunduras through Mexico

3761
03:37:52,480 --> 03:37:55,720
Speaker 11: all the way to Tijuana opposite San Diego. At one point,

3762
03:37:55,800 --> 03:37:59,480
Speaker 11: Mexican authorities claimed they broke up the group, and American media,

3763
03:37:59,520 --> 03:38:02,800
Speaker 11: of course dutifully reported that they did, But they didn't.

3764
03:38:02,920 --> 03:38:05,480
Speaker 11: That was just a pr gesture and a temporary one.

3765
03:38:05,520 --> 03:38:09,279
Speaker 11: In fact, during parts of the trip, Mexican police escorted

3766
03:38:09,280 --> 03:38:10,359
Speaker 11: the migrants northwards.

3767
03:38:10,400 --> 03:38:11,320
Speaker 1: In other words, the.

3768
03:38:11,280 --> 03:38:14,879
Speaker 11: Mexican government embedded illegal immigration into this country, as it

3769
03:38:14,920 --> 03:38:18,080
Speaker 11: has done for many years. Well tonight, the caravan is

3770
03:38:18,120 --> 03:38:20,680
Speaker 11: on our southern border. Rather than wait for the crossing

3771
03:38:20,720 --> 03:38:23,440
Speaker 11: station at Sanya Sidro to open, many of them just

3772
03:38:23,560 --> 03:38:27,040
Speaker 11: jumped the fence. Some waved Honduran flags when they got

3773
03:38:27,080 --> 03:38:30,160
Speaker 11: to the top. And that tells you everything. When you

3774
03:38:30,280 --> 03:38:32,640
Speaker 11: arrive in a country to contribute to it and to

3775
03:38:32,720 --> 03:38:35,959
Speaker 11: assimilate into its culture. You don't wave the flag of

3776
03:38:36,000 --> 03:38:39,200
Speaker 11: a foreign nation. That's what you do in triumph when

3777
03:38:39,240 --> 03:38:40,320
Speaker 11: you invade a country.

3778
03:38:40,720 --> 03:38:42,840
Speaker 7: On my way home from Mansonado in twenty eighteen, I

3779
03:38:42,879 --> 03:38:46,000
Speaker 7: saw that quote invading Horde in the Benito Juadi Sports

3780
03:38:46,000 --> 03:38:49,520
Speaker 7: Complex and probably turned around and went back. My instinct

3781
03:38:49,560 --> 03:38:52,280
Speaker 7: as a journalist is to couple things like this, but

3782
03:38:52,360 --> 03:38:55,120
Speaker 7: my instinct to the person is to help first. On

3783
03:38:55,160 --> 03:38:57,000
Speaker 7: the first day, I was there with two friends I

3784
03:38:57,080 --> 03:38:59,440
Speaker 7: know from the weird world of pro cycling. Things were

3785
03:38:59,440 --> 03:39:02,520
Speaker 7: pretty bad. We'd obtained a backpack full of stroop waffles

3786
03:39:02,520 --> 03:39:04,360
Speaker 7: that a friend who makes stroop waffles have given us.

3787
03:39:04,800 --> 03:39:06,640
Speaker 7: Once we gave those out, I talked to a few

3788
03:39:06,640 --> 03:39:09,440
Speaker 7: people about what they needed. We coordinated with mutual a

3789
03:39:09,480 --> 03:39:12,279
Speaker 7: groups in Tijuana and offered to support her for we could.

3790
03:39:13,000 --> 03:39:14,600
Speaker 7: In the next few weeks, my friends and I spent

3791
03:39:14,680 --> 03:39:17,560
Speaker 7: tens of thousands of dollars at a Tijuana costco, received

3792
03:39:17,640 --> 03:39:19,840
Speaker 7: thousands of dollars in donations from people we hadn't seen

3793
03:39:19,840 --> 03:39:22,680
Speaker 7: in years, and in one memorable instance, rigged up and

3794
03:39:22,720 --> 03:39:25,160
Speaker 7: projected as someone had tactically obtained from an office to

3795
03:39:25,200 --> 03:39:27,280
Speaker 7: a DVD player which we'd installed in the roof of

3796
03:39:27,280 --> 03:39:30,200
Speaker 7: a dilapidated nightclub full of little children and their mothers

3797
03:39:30,480 --> 03:39:33,000
Speaker 7: so they could watch Beverly Hills, Chihuahua and forget about

3798
03:39:33,000 --> 03:39:35,040
Speaker 7: the fact that the country they were traveling to was

3799
03:39:35,080 --> 03:39:38,360
Speaker 7: portraying these little infants as invaders. I have a lot

3800
03:39:38,360 --> 03:39:41,520
Speaker 7: of very complicated memories of those few weeks, little girls

3801
03:39:41,520 --> 03:39:44,880
Speaker 7: braiding my hair, little boys and girls trying to comprehend

3802
03:39:44,879 --> 03:39:47,560
Speaker 7: exactly how I could be this bad at football, and

3803
03:39:47,640 --> 03:39:50,920
Speaker 7: people from San Diego churches, tijuan anarchist kitchens, and mutual

3804
03:39:50,959 --> 03:39:53,600
Speaker 7: a groups around the region coming together to look after

3805
03:39:53,640 --> 03:39:55,800
Speaker 7: a group of people who'd been so heavily demonized by

3806
03:39:55,840 --> 03:39:57,880
Speaker 7: folks who had never met them or even been here.

3807
03:39:58,600 --> 03:40:01,240
Speaker 7: His Trump defending calling the CA caravan an invasion and

3808
03:40:01,240 --> 03:40:04,480
Speaker 7: simultaneously explaining why migrants low wage labor it's desirable for

3809
03:40:04,520 --> 03:40:05,400
Speaker 7: people like him.

3810
03:40:05,720 --> 03:40:08,800
Speaker 34: Thank you, miss President. I challenge you on on one

3811
03:40:08,840 --> 03:40:10,760
Speaker 34: of the statements that you made in the tail end

3812
03:40:10,800 --> 03:40:14,080
Speaker 34: of the campaign, uh in the mid terms, that here

3813
03:40:14,120 --> 03:40:16,520
Speaker 34: we go that well, if you don't mind, miss President,

3814
03:40:16,600 --> 03:40:19,320
Speaker 34: coming that this caravan was an invasion, as you know,

3815
03:40:19,840 --> 03:40:21,520
Speaker 34: consider it to be. As you know, miss President, the

3816
03:40:21,560 --> 03:40:24,080
Speaker 34: caravan was not an invasion. It's a it's a a

3817
03:40:24,240 --> 03:40:27,320
Speaker 34: group of migrants moving up from Central America towards the

3818
03:40:27,360 --> 03:40:30,959
Speaker 34: border with the US. Thank you. And why why did

3819
03:40:31,000 --> 03:40:33,240
Speaker 34: you why did you characterize it as such?

3820
03:40:33,920 --> 03:40:34,040
Speaker 16: Uh?

3821
03:40:34,400 --> 03:40:36,760
Speaker 1: Because I consider an invasion. You and I have a

3822
03:40:36,800 --> 03:40:37,600
Speaker 1: difference of a button.

3823
03:40:37,720 --> 03:40:40,879
Speaker 34: Do you think that you demonized immigrants? Not this election

3824
03:40:41,280 --> 03:40:41,640
Speaker 34: to try.

3825
03:40:41,680 --> 03:40:42,240
Speaker 10: I want them.

3826
03:40:42,280 --> 03:40:44,080
Speaker 20: I want them to come into the country, but they

3827
03:40:44,120 --> 03:40:45,000
Speaker 20: have to come in legally.

3828
03:40:45,040 --> 03:40:46,240
Speaker 23: You know, they have to come in Jim.

3829
03:40:46,160 --> 03:40:47,040
Speaker 20: Through a process.

3830
03:40:47,360 --> 03:40:49,480
Speaker 31: I want it to be a process, and I want

3831
03:40:49,520 --> 03:40:50,280
Speaker 31: people to come in.

3832
03:40:50,320 --> 03:40:51,120
Speaker 1: And we need the people.

3833
03:40:51,200 --> 03:40:53,960
Speaker 34: Your campaign, your campaign.

3834
03:40:53,160 --> 03:40:54,680
Speaker 23: You know why we need the people, does you?

3835
03:40:55,080 --> 03:40:57,200
Speaker 20: Because we have hundreds of companies moving in.

3836
03:40:57,320 --> 03:40:58,240
Speaker 23: We need the people.

3837
03:40:58,800 --> 03:41:01,520
Speaker 7: Trump, as you had a clip, used a migrant caravan

3838
03:41:01,520 --> 03:41:03,840
Speaker 7: as a prop for his racist and bigoted midterm campaign.

3839
03:41:04,400 --> 03:41:06,800
Speaker 7: It didn't work and he lost control of the House,

3840
03:41:06,920 --> 03:41:08,920
Speaker 7: but he did succeed in forcing these people to spend

3841
03:41:08,959 --> 03:41:12,120
Speaker 7: months in the cold, first in a sports stadium and

3842
03:41:12,120 --> 03:41:15,199
Speaker 7: then in an old nightclub, even as a migrant gradually

3843
03:41:15,200 --> 03:41:17,680
Speaker 7: reduced in number, with many finding work and new life

3844
03:41:17,680 --> 03:41:21,359
Speaker 7: in Mexico, some finding their way north. The long legacy

3845
03:41:21,360 --> 03:41:24,320
Speaker 7: of that caravan was only just starting. In the months

3846
03:41:24,320 --> 03:41:27,000
Speaker 7: have followed journalists who'd covered the caravan, as well as

3847
03:41:27,040 --> 03:41:30,000
Speaker 7: those who offered assistant to caravan members, so they felt

3848
03:41:30,000 --> 03:41:33,400
Speaker 7: they'd become targets of intense inspections of scrutiny by border officials.

3849
03:41:34,560 --> 03:41:36,840
Speaker 7: I got pulled into secondarily once during this time, and

3850
03:41:36,879 --> 03:41:39,160
Speaker 7: that was entering Mexaco. The worst I got was a

3851
03:41:39,240 --> 03:41:41,640
Speaker 7: chance to inspect my nineteen eighty pickup trucks oil pen.

3852
03:41:42,160 --> 03:41:46,200
Speaker 7: But for others, things weren't so easy. Homeland Security Investigation

3853
03:41:46,280 --> 03:41:51,000
Speaker 7: special agent turned whistleblower Wesley Peternak helped NBC to document that,

3854
03:41:51,879 --> 03:41:54,080
Speaker 7: under the umbrella of what was called Operation Secure Line,

3855
03:41:54,120 --> 03:41:57,760
Speaker 7: the Department of Homeland Security created a database of activists, journalists,

3856
03:41:57,800 --> 03:42:01,280
Speaker 7: and social media influences tied to the migrant cart When

3857
03:42:01,320 --> 03:42:04,160
Speaker 7: they crossed the border. Individuals in that database were often

3858
03:42:04,160 --> 03:42:07,120
Speaker 7: subjected to hours long screenings and in some cases had

3859
03:42:07,120 --> 03:42:11,400
Speaker 7: flagspaced on their passports. A PowerPoint slideshow which Peternac leaked

3860
03:42:11,400 --> 03:42:15,240
Speaker 7: to NBC seven lists some of the people, some of

3861
03:42:15,240 --> 03:42:18,920
Speaker 7: them have been guests on this show. They include ten journalists,

3862
03:42:19,000 --> 03:42:22,800
Speaker 7: seven of whom are US citizens. A US attorney forty

3863
03:42:22,800 --> 03:42:24,800
Speaker 7: eight people from the US and other countries who are

3864
03:42:24,879 --> 03:42:30,480
Speaker 7: labeled as organizers, instigators, or having unknown roles. The target

3865
03:42:30,520 --> 03:42:33,760
Speaker 7: lists also includes organizers from groups like Border Angels and

3866
03:42:33,800 --> 03:42:37,240
Speaker 7: Pueblos in Froontella's I asked journalist brook Bin Cowsey to

3867
03:42:37,240 --> 03:42:40,199
Speaker 7: describe her experience of increased border scrutiny in twenty eighteen.

3868
03:42:40,640 --> 03:42:42,800
Speaker 40: If you don't have a pre approved card, you have

3869
03:42:42,879 --> 03:42:44,920
Speaker 40: to like go through wait and line, waiting this long

3870
03:42:45,000 --> 03:42:47,880
Speaker 40: ass line, and then you know, you go and get

3871
03:42:47,959 --> 03:42:51,000
Speaker 40: vetted by CDP. They ask you some questions or they

3872
03:42:51,040 --> 03:42:52,600
Speaker 40: just wave you through, depending on what kind of day

3873
03:42:52,600 --> 03:42:55,960
Speaker 40: they're having or whatever. So in my case, I started

3874
03:42:55,959 --> 03:42:58,879
Speaker 40: getting pulled into secondary inspection more and more. So they

3875
03:42:58,920 --> 03:43:01,560
Speaker 40: would wave my car over and then take me into

3876
03:43:01,560 --> 03:43:04,600
Speaker 40: this secondary place where it's sort of like this back

3877
03:43:04,920 --> 03:43:08,360
Speaker 40: it's like a Quonsett pet sort of, and in it

3878
03:43:08,520 --> 03:43:10,240
Speaker 40: like all these cars drive in and out, and they'll

3879
03:43:10,280 --> 03:43:13,199
Speaker 40: they'll go through your things, they'll get in your face,

3880
03:43:13,440 --> 03:43:16,960
Speaker 40: you know, they'll do all kinds of stuff. And I

3881
03:43:17,280 --> 03:43:19,480
Speaker 40: don't there have to be cameras in there somewhere, but

3882
03:43:19,520 --> 03:43:22,600
Speaker 40: I've never seen any. So I just kept getting pulled

3883
03:43:22,600 --> 03:43:24,440
Speaker 40: into secondary more and more, as though I was this

3884
03:43:24,640 --> 03:43:27,440
Speaker 40: suspicious person, as though I was suspected of something, and

3885
03:43:27,480 --> 03:43:28,959
Speaker 40: every time I asked, they'd be like, I don't know,

3886
03:43:29,200 --> 03:43:31,640
Speaker 40: it's just random, ma'am, and ma'am, it's just random. So

3887
03:43:31,640 --> 03:43:34,680
Speaker 40: actually this started about twenty fourteen for me, but it

3888
03:43:34,720 --> 03:43:37,760
Speaker 40: started to escalate in twenty eighteen. Twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen

3889
03:43:37,800 --> 03:43:40,160
Speaker 40: started to escalate, and I was like, a fucking Trump administration,

3890
03:43:40,240 --> 03:43:42,240
Speaker 40: of course going to escalate right on.

3891
03:43:42,320 --> 03:43:44,359
Speaker 7: The Trump she said, Things got worse.

3892
03:43:44,520 --> 03:43:46,800
Speaker 40: From twenty seventeen through twenty eighteen. It kind of worked

3893
03:43:46,840 --> 03:43:48,440
Speaker 40: where you push back and I'd be like, you need

3894
03:43:48,440 --> 03:43:51,440
Speaker 40: to let me fucking go. You know, I'm century, I'm

3895
03:43:51,480 --> 03:43:54,280
Speaker 40: already pre checked. If you think that there's something wrong

3896
03:43:54,320 --> 03:43:56,520
Speaker 40: that I'm doing, and take my fucking century away, and

3897
03:43:56,600 --> 03:43:58,440
Speaker 40: I want to talk to your manager type stuff, right,

3898
03:43:58,480 --> 03:44:01,480
Speaker 40: So I was doing that that were until twenty eighteen,

3899
03:44:01,520 --> 03:44:02,840
Speaker 40: and then it started to get really gnarly.

3900
03:44:03,320 --> 03:44:05,520
Speaker 7: Eventually things came to a head the day before the

3901
03:44:05,560 --> 03:44:07,920
Speaker 7: migrants of the caravan were tea guessed. And I've seen

3902
03:44:07,959 --> 03:44:10,000
Speaker 7: most people remember from twenty eighteen.

3903
03:44:10,240 --> 03:44:14,080
Speaker 40: So but on that night, as I was coming back,

3904
03:44:14,959 --> 03:44:17,600
Speaker 40: I drove through and I did this century thing, you know,

3905
03:44:17,680 --> 03:44:20,560
Speaker 40: the usual stuff, and got pulled into secondary and this

3906
03:44:20,680 --> 03:44:24,400
Speaker 40: time it was really like gnarly. The time before that

3907
03:44:24,400 --> 03:44:27,000
Speaker 40: had also been really gnarly, like nobody hurt me, nobody

3908
03:44:27,000 --> 03:44:29,400
Speaker 40: did anything. But they got really close to my face,

3909
03:44:29,680 --> 03:44:32,760
Speaker 40: like brighten my face, you know, and started screaming at me,

3910
03:44:32,840 --> 03:44:33,800
Speaker 40: like screaming over me.

3911
03:44:33,840 --> 03:44:36,720
Speaker 5: And I kept going, I'd like to speak to.

3912
03:44:36,640 --> 03:44:39,600
Speaker 40: Your manager, you know, sir, like please, please get out

3913
03:44:39,640 --> 03:44:45,199
Speaker 40: of my face, sir. And it was it was gross,

3914
03:44:45,280 --> 03:44:47,119
Speaker 40: and they were going through my shit and that was gross.

3915
03:44:47,160 --> 03:44:50,880
Speaker 40: Like they didn't find anything, but it was just an invasive, hostile,

3916
03:44:51,000 --> 03:44:53,800
Speaker 40: disgusting thing. And that was when so I said, can

3917
03:44:53,840 --> 03:44:58,280
Speaker 40: I speak to your manager? Which is a magic phrase

3918
03:44:58,320 --> 03:45:01,000
Speaker 40: when you're a middle aged white woman. So I say this,

3919
03:45:01,640 --> 03:45:04,960
Speaker 40: and they bring over some guy and he goes, ma'am,

3920
03:45:04,959 --> 03:45:05,480
Speaker 40: can I help you?

3921
03:45:05,520 --> 03:45:06,640
Speaker 5: I'm like, yeah, what the fuck?

3922
03:45:07,000 --> 03:45:09,360
Speaker 40: You know, why are you treating me this way? Why

3923
03:45:10,080 --> 03:45:12,039
Speaker 40: did any of this happen? And he goes, oh, yeah,

3924
03:45:12,240 --> 03:45:14,160
Speaker 40: I'm sorry. Your name's on a list somewhere. You've been

3925
03:45:14,160 --> 03:45:17,520
Speaker 40: flat And I'm like, so every time I've crossed, I've

3926
03:45:17,520 --> 03:45:20,280
Speaker 40: been flagged. He's like yeah, and yeah, you've been there's

3927
03:45:20,280 --> 03:45:22,680
Speaker 40: a flag on your passport or against your name and

3928
03:45:22,720 --> 03:45:25,680
Speaker 40: that's why. And I said, well, why is there a

3929
03:45:25,760 --> 03:45:28,280
Speaker 40: flag against my name? And he goes, I don't know,

3930
03:45:28,320 --> 03:45:30,240
Speaker 40: You're going to have to do a Freedom of Information

3931
03:45:30,320 --> 03:45:31,320
Speaker 40: Act request or something.

3932
03:45:31,480 --> 03:45:32,640
Speaker 5: I don't even know if he knew I was a.

3933
03:45:32,600 --> 03:45:36,160
Speaker 7: Journalist sadly broke Glass Crossing twenty eighteen, and since I

3934
03:45:36,240 --> 03:45:39,400
Speaker 7: photographed those Cumi folks in ceremony near Camper, the border

3935
03:45:39,400 --> 03:45:42,120
Speaker 7: wall has only got longer. Every mile it stretches out

3936
03:45:42,200 --> 03:45:44,320
Speaker 7: means another mile into the desert people have to walk,

3937
03:45:44,640 --> 03:45:46,480
Speaker 7: and that means that more people won't walk out of

3938
03:45:46,480 --> 03:45:49,560
Speaker 7: that desert, Those people who lost their lives, and an

3939
03:45:49,560 --> 03:45:52,160
Speaker 7: attempt to save them. A mark with little red dots

3940
03:45:52,200 --> 03:45:54,760
Speaker 7: on the various maps, at attempt to put the humanitarian

3941
03:45:54,800 --> 03:45:58,640
Speaker 7: crisis into a visual form. Those dots begin in South

3942
03:45:58,640 --> 03:46:02,359
Speaker 7: America's people die traveling north, but they're sparse and isolated.

3943
03:46:03,160 --> 03:46:05,840
Speaker 7: Where that changes is the places I've been driving all week,

3944
03:46:06,560 --> 03:46:11,480
Speaker 7: Eastern California, southern Arizona. Places I know from years of hiking, climbing,

3945
03:46:11,480 --> 03:46:15,600
Speaker 7: and cycling. Places when one mistake can be fatal. I

3946
03:46:15,640 --> 03:46:18,040
Speaker 7: know from my friends who spend time resupplying water caches

3947
03:46:18,040 --> 03:46:20,480
Speaker 7: and searching for missing people, that you don't have to

3948
03:46:20,480 --> 03:46:23,120
Speaker 7: make any mistakes to die in the desert, especially if

3949
03:46:23,120 --> 03:46:26,360
Speaker 7: you're young or old, or sick or afraid to ask

3950
03:46:26,400 --> 03:46:29,959
Speaker 7: for help. These are the places we force people to

3951
03:46:29,959 --> 03:46:32,600
Speaker 7: travel through on foot to come here and create a

3952
03:46:32,600 --> 03:46:37,720
Speaker 7: better future for themselves. Dehydration, exposure, and drowning or rank

3953
03:46:37,800 --> 03:46:40,960
Speaker 7: highly as caused a death along the border. Last year

3954
03:46:41,120 --> 03:46:43,880
Speaker 7: saw a record for border death, and with Biden attempting

3955
03:46:43,920 --> 03:46:45,880
Speaker 7: to take a hard line going into twenty twenty four,

3956
03:46:46,600 --> 03:46:49,760
Speaker 7: and climate change and instability continuing to drive migrants north

3957
03:46:50,160 --> 03:46:52,199
Speaker 7: to the place that causes so much of that climate

3958
03:46:52,320 --> 03:46:55,039
Speaker 7: change and instability, there's no reason to believe things will

3959
03:46:55,040 --> 03:46:58,640
Speaker 7: get better. I want to point to one tragic loss,

3960
03:46:59,080 --> 03:47:01,600
Speaker 7: one of thousands, that happened not far from where I live.

3961
03:47:02,400 --> 03:47:06,519
Speaker 7: In February of twenty twenty, Juana Margarita and Paula Santosarthe

3962
03:47:06,640 --> 03:47:09,280
Speaker 7: were traveling by foot from Wahaka to their future in

3963
03:47:09,320 --> 03:47:12,080
Speaker 7: the United States along a trail sometimes known as the

3964
03:47:12,160 --> 03:47:15,280
Speaker 7: Shrine Trail. Their family told media back home that they

3965
03:47:15,320 --> 03:47:18,280
Speaker 7: were searching for us. When you are Americano, the American dream.

3966
03:47:19,080 --> 03:47:22,440
Speaker 7: Along their route is a small religious shrine which marks

3967
03:47:22,440 --> 03:47:24,279
Speaker 7: the last point from which you can see in Mexico.

3968
03:47:25,360 --> 03:47:28,800
Speaker 7: It's well inside the US, along a dry creek bed

3969
03:47:28,840 --> 03:47:31,760
Speaker 7: in the Laguna Mountains. It can be hot in the

3970
03:47:31,800 --> 03:47:35,280
Speaker 7: summer and cold in the winter. Last November I camped

3971
03:47:35,280 --> 03:47:37,600
Speaker 7: out there, and even with thousands of dollars in gear,

3972
03:47:37,840 --> 03:47:41,360
Speaker 7: I was dangerously close to cold injury. I've also rescued

3973
03:47:41,400 --> 03:47:45,680
Speaker 7: hikers with dehydration symptoms near here. The desert and the

3974
03:47:45,720 --> 03:47:48,760
Speaker 7: weather might be part of the story, but the desert

3975
03:47:48,760 --> 03:47:51,360
Speaker 7: doesn't kill people on its own. It's the border that

3976
03:47:51,440 --> 03:47:54,560
Speaker 7: forces people deep into the desert that kills them. The

3977
03:47:54,600 --> 03:47:56,680
Speaker 7: desert is just a tool for a system that uses

3978
03:47:56,720 --> 03:47:59,960
Speaker 7: death of a torrent. When the girls cross the border

3979
03:48:00,200 --> 03:48:03,400
Speaker 7: camp on the ninth of February, it was raining. As

3980
03:48:03,400 --> 03:48:06,560
Speaker 7: they climbed the Lagoona mountains, it started to snow. They

3981
03:48:06,600 --> 03:48:08,680
Speaker 7: huddled under a bolder for warmth, and the two men

3982
03:48:08,720 --> 03:48:10,920
Speaker 7: smuggling them across struck out to get Star reception and

3983
03:48:10,920 --> 03:48:14,320
Speaker 7: call nine to one one. By the time boor Star

3984
03:48:14,879 --> 03:48:18,120
Speaker 7: Border Patrol Search Trauma and Rescue team arrived, two of

3985
03:48:18,160 --> 03:48:20,959
Speaker 7: the girls had died as they tried to save Juana.

3986
03:48:21,280 --> 03:48:23,959
Speaker 7: Their request for air support was declined, and she died

3987
03:48:24,000 --> 03:48:25,920
Speaker 7: with one of the agents jack kits wrapped around her

3988
03:48:26,280 --> 03:48:30,279
Speaker 7: and another agent's beanie on her head. For some reason,

3989
03:48:30,560 --> 03:48:32,960
Speaker 7: the girl's remains were not recovered right away, and they

3990
03:48:32,959 --> 03:48:36,160
Speaker 7: were not rewarmed, and so they last their last chance

3991
03:48:36,160 --> 03:48:40,600
Speaker 7: at the American dream and not life. Today, their final

3992
03:48:40,680 --> 03:48:42,800
Speaker 7: resting place is marked by three crosses and a cash

3993
03:48:42,800 --> 03:48:46,920
Speaker 7: of supplies placed there by volunteers at the time I'm

3994
03:48:46,920 --> 03:48:49,360
Speaker 7: recording this, we don't know where all the folks we

3995
03:48:49,400 --> 03:48:51,760
Speaker 7: met at the border are now. Then we might never know.

3996
03:48:52,959 --> 03:48:55,320
Speaker 7: Not being able to follow stories is a sad part

3997
03:48:55,360 --> 03:48:57,840
Speaker 7: of this reporting. Sometimes you know its people all have

3998
03:48:57,840 --> 03:48:59,680
Speaker 7: my phone number, but they might not. Only more have

3999
03:48:59,760 --> 03:49:02,879
Speaker 7: their phones or the scrap of paper are wrote it on.

4000
03:49:03,720 --> 03:49:06,760
Speaker 7: Often these things can be taken for them in custody.

4001
03:49:06,960 --> 03:49:09,240
Speaker 7: What we do know is that on May eighteenth, exactly

4002
03:49:09,280 --> 03:49:12,440
Speaker 7: one week after Title forty two ended, Immigration and Customs

4003
03:49:12,560 --> 03:49:15,920
Speaker 7: Enforcement also known as ICE, tweeted a video of Customs

4004
03:49:15,960 --> 03:49:19,640
Speaker 7: Enforcement and Removal Operations agents walking down the corridor of

4005
03:49:19,680 --> 03:49:23,880
Speaker 7: a flight full of mass people. The caption read ICE

4006
03:49:23,880 --> 03:49:28,480
Speaker 7: conducted multiple removal flights, including Ecuador, Guatemala, and Honduras as

4007
03:49:28,520 --> 03:49:31,640
Speaker 7: part of dozens flights conducted each week. On the wall

4008
03:49:31,640 --> 03:49:34,240
Speaker 7: of my office, they write this. There are several propaganda

4009
03:49:34,280 --> 03:49:38,200
Speaker 7: posters from the Spanish Second Republic. One is as simple

4010
03:49:38,200 --> 03:49:41,240
Speaker 7: as it is heartbreaking. The poster depicts a squadron of

4011
03:49:41,280 --> 03:49:45,000
Speaker 7: fascist bombers and the dead body of a child. The

4012
03:49:45,040 --> 03:49:48,520
Speaker 7: slogan underneath reads, if you tolerate this, then your children

4013
03:49:48,560 --> 03:49:52,560
Speaker 7: will be next. The poster was, of course correct. It

4014
03:49:52,680 --> 03:49:54,360
Speaker 7: was the inspiration for songs for the Clash and the

4015
03:49:54,360 --> 03:49:56,840
Speaker 7: Man Three Preachers, which are what, in turn made me

4016
03:49:56,880 --> 03:49:59,720
Speaker 7: want to learn about the Spanish Civil War. The slogan,

4017
03:50:00,080 --> 03:50:02,920
Speaker 7: coined in nineteen thirty seven, feels as relevant today as

4018
03:50:02,960 --> 03:50:05,640
Speaker 7: it does then. It was one that folks on the

4019
03:50:05,640 --> 03:50:08,400
Speaker 7: border might as well have been screaming by twenty eighteen,

4020
03:50:09,320 --> 03:50:11,440
Speaker 7: but one that went ignored, just as it did in

4021
03:50:11,480 --> 03:50:15,480
Speaker 7: nineteen thirty seven. In twenty twenty, folks began to realize

4022
03:50:15,480 --> 03:50:18,080
Speaker 7: what it meant when border patrol drones circled the skies

4023
03:50:18,120 --> 03:50:21,520
Speaker 7: around Minneapolis and cell phone signal interceptors tracked citizens all

4024
03:50:21,520 --> 03:50:24,040
Speaker 7: over the US. When they came together to demand that

4025
03:50:24,040 --> 03:50:27,240
Speaker 7: the police stop murdering people. It became more real in

4026
03:50:27,280 --> 03:50:30,840
Speaker 7: twenty twenty three, when under DeSantis, Florida began the process

4027
03:50:30,840 --> 03:50:34,040
Speaker 7: of legalizing state kidnapping of trans and gender nonperforming kids

4028
03:50:34,040 --> 03:50:37,800
Speaker 7: from their loving families. But that all began when the

4029
03:50:37,800 --> 03:50:40,440
Speaker 7: state ripped Indigenous children for their families in nineteenth and

4030
03:50:40,480 --> 03:50:43,520
Speaker 7: twentieth centuries, who tried to destroy their culture by punishing

4031
03:50:43,520 --> 03:50:45,720
Speaker 7: them for wearing their clothes, speaking their languages, or using

4032
03:50:45,760 --> 03:50:48,960
Speaker 7: their names. Wasn't a big leap from there to Trump's

4033
03:50:48,960 --> 03:50:51,840
Speaker 7: family separation policy, which detained kids on their own, away

4034
03:50:51,840 --> 03:50:55,040
Speaker 7: from their families as a means of punishing the deterring migrants,

4035
03:50:55,560 --> 03:50:59,400
Speaker 7: and it's reached its obvious endpoint in Florida because despite

4036
03:50:59,400 --> 03:51:01,240
Speaker 7: all the people I think about kids in courages in

4037
03:51:01,280 --> 03:51:05,240
Speaker 7: twenty twenty, it's almost universal bipartisan agreement on treating people

4038
03:51:05,320 --> 03:51:08,720
Speaker 7: of our southern border like humans without rights. And because

4039
03:51:08,760 --> 03:51:11,920
Speaker 7: for two decades we've allowed the border surveillance industrial complex

4040
03:51:11,960 --> 03:51:14,520
Speaker 7: to grow to an unprecedented and uncontrollable scale. But what

4041
03:51:14,640 --> 03:51:18,520
Speaker 7: you us all changing things now will be very difficult.

4042
03:51:19,400 --> 03:51:23,280
Speaker 7: DHS aren't numbers many nations armies, and it's considerably better equipped.

4043
03:51:24,160 --> 03:51:26,360
Speaker 7: But unless people show up and take action, things are

4044
03:51:26,400 --> 03:51:29,800
Speaker 7: going to get considerably worse, regardless of who you vote

4045
03:51:29,840 --> 03:51:31,280
Speaker 7: for or what they say in order to get you

4046
03:51:31,320 --> 03:51:34,760
Speaker 7: to vote for them. As Katie said, little things can

4047
03:51:34,880 --> 03:51:37,720
Speaker 7: make a difference, and if you listen this far, I

4048
03:51:37,760 --> 03:51:39,280
Speaker 7: hope you'll take the time to try and do those

4049
03:51:39,320 --> 03:51:42,360
Speaker 7: little things. Before we go, I want to update you

4050
03:51:42,400 --> 03:51:44,280
Speaker 7: on what's happened in the week we've been publishing this.

4051
03:51:45,720 --> 03:51:47,440
Speaker 7: Although there are no longer people held out in the

4052
03:51:47,440 --> 03:51:50,120
Speaker 7: open in ho Goomba and sant Asedra, there are still

4053
03:51:50,160 --> 03:51:52,480
Speaker 7: many people trying to present themselves at the sant Asedra

4054
03:51:52,560 --> 03:51:55,080
Speaker 7: border to claim asylum. Today I was told they are

4055
03:51:55,080 --> 03:51:58,040
Speaker 7: about one hundred of them. They're waiting there, often for days.

4056
03:51:58,720 --> 03:52:01,720
Speaker 7: Most of them are getting turned away. They're all frustrated

4057
03:52:01,720 --> 03:52:04,400
Speaker 7: with CVP one which continues to be buggy, offer no

4058
03:52:04,480 --> 03:52:08,400
Speaker 7: appointments and struggle to photograph black faces. I also wanted

4059
03:52:08,440 --> 03:52:10,680
Speaker 7: to mention some of the organizations you can find and

4060
03:52:10,720 --> 03:52:13,720
Speaker 7: donate to if you'd like to support their efforts. They

4061
03:52:13,760 --> 03:52:19,240
Speaker 7: are the Asian Solidarity Collective, Alo Trolao, the American Friends

4062
03:52:19,320 --> 03:52:25,040
Speaker 7: Service Committee, Border Kindness border Lands Relief Collective, the Haitian

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03:52:25,040 --> 03:52:29,440
Speaker 7: Bridge Alliance, the Partnership for the Advancement of New Americans

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03:52:30,080 --> 03:52:36,960
Speaker 7: and PREVENKASA pr e v E NCASA. I'd also like

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03:52:37,040 --> 03:52:41,080
Speaker 7: to thank Joe Oriana his Twitter is at Joe or

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Speaker 7: Photo for his reporting which very much contributed to this series.

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Speaker 2: Hey, We'll be back Monday with more episodes every week

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Speaker 2: from now until the heat death of the Universe.

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03:52:52,200 --> 03:52:54,680
Speaker 41: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.

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03:52:54,880 --> 03:52:57,960
Speaker 41: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

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03:52:58,000 --> 03:53:01,560
Speaker 41: coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

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03:53:01,640 --> 03:53:03,520
Speaker 41: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you.

4073
03:53:03,520 --> 03:53:04,640
Speaker 5: Listen to podcasts.

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03:53:04,960 --> 03:53:06,920
Speaker 41: You can now find sources for it Could Happen Here,

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03:53:06,920 --> 03:53:09,920
Speaker 41: listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.