1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Fellow Ridiculous Historians, we are returning to you with a 2 00:00:04,519 --> 00:00:06,040 Speaker 1: classic episode. 3 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:06,480 Speaker 2: Uh. 4 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:11,399 Speaker 1: Look, Nolan and I did use to party. Uh we 5 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 1: don't party as much anymore, but we are we do. 6 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 3: We like our booze non poisoned. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. 7 00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:21,760 Speaker 3: Tell us about this one. 8 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 4: Oh man, I remember that time that the government, the 9 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 4: federal government tried to poison people to keep them from 10 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:28,400 Speaker 4: drinking alcohol. 11 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 3: That was a good one, man. How that work out? 12 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 1: We'll see in this classic episode. 13 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:38,640 Speaker 3: Let's roll it. 14 00:00:38,800 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome to the 15 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:09,399 Speaker 1: show everyone, I'm Ben Nol. Have you ever seen a 16 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: moonshine still kind of. 17 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 3: Looks like a glorified sort of fancy teakettle kind of right. 18 00:01:14,840 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, it depends really on the parts that the bootleggers 19 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: or moonshiners are working with. They're pretty common. It's got 20 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 1: a curly cue part for distillation. They were more common 21 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 1: during the area of prohibition, but you can still see 22 00:01:29,160 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 1: a lot of old ones out in the mountains now. 23 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 1: They would use any available part to make us still. 24 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: For instance, car carburetors were used in moonshine distillation operations, 25 00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:47,279 Speaker 1: often to the detriment of the people who ultimately drank 26 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:48,040 Speaker 1: the shine. 27 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 3: I wonder where that is. Yeah, what I'm. 28 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: Saying here is that due to prohibition, a lot of 29 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 1: quality control just took a dive. 30 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 4: Wait a minute, So you're saying that totally ban and 31 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 4: outlawing a substance doesn't just make people automatically magically stop 32 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 4: wanting to consume said substance. 33 00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 1: I know it sounds like a broad brush, right, but 34 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: history has shown prohibition largely aside from any you know, 35 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: moral arguments, prohibition of a substance just doesn't work. 36 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:22,040 Speaker 3: Speak of history, we. 37 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: Have to give a shout out to one of our 38 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:29,399 Speaker 1: favorite parts of the show, super producer Casey pegram Casey. 39 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 3: Bootleg pegram Casey is history personified. 40 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 4: Yes, yeah to someone what you just said, though, Ben, 41 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 4: the heart wants what the heart wants. 42 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:41,239 Speaker 3: Sure, sure, and Uncle Sam can't stop the heart from wanting. Right. 43 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: Well, governments have very very little luck suppressing a chemical 44 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: substance of any sort, and alcohol is no different. Today's 45 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: story takes us to the world of prohibition, and I 46 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 1: think everybody across the planet and it is aware in 47 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: some vague way of the US's experiment with the Eighteenth 48 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 1: Amendment and the prohibition of alcohol. Right, people are vaguely 49 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:10,359 Speaker 1: aware of that. 50 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 4: I think they're vaguely aware of it. But let's make 51 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,959 Speaker 4: them intimately aware of it, shall we? 52 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 3: Ben sure? Sure? 53 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 1: So the eighteenth Amendment to the Constitution, which was ratified 54 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 1: in nineteen nineteen, said the following the manufacturer, sale, or 55 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: transportation of intoxicating liquors, within the importation thereof into or 56 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,959 Speaker 1: the exportation thereof from the United States, and all territory 57 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 1: subject to this jurisdiction thereof for beverage purposes. So it 58 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: prohibits all of that, and it goes into effect on 59 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 1: January seventeenth, nineteen twenty, and people thought the people who 60 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 1: thought this was a good idea were like, there's a 61 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:48,880 Speaker 1: brand new America on the way. 62 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 3: Yeah. 63 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:50,560 Speaker 4: I mean, there's no question that it was kind of 64 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 4: a puritanical way of looking at things, And it was 65 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 4: sort of this slightly misguided notion that getting rid of 66 00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 4: the devil's juice was going to all of a sudden 67 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 4: make everyone into good people. 68 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: Getting rid of Lucifer's sippons would make people inherently better 69 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: and prevent the dissolution of the nation's moral character and 70 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:17,880 Speaker 1: they would paint pictures of rampant crime, juke joints. I 71 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: don't know if they use the phrase juke joints at 72 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 1: that point, and alcoholism. They said, we will increase the 73 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 1: success of our economy, we will raise the moral character 74 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: of the nation, and will make the innocent people of 75 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:35,679 Speaker 1: the country safe again. 76 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:38,359 Speaker 4: Because we were also just getting out of a war, 77 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 4: and there was a sense that society may well be 78 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 4: on the brink of utter chaos. So you know, let's 79 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 4: let's get rid of people's thing that kind of makes 80 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:52,360 Speaker 4: them feel better, right, right, So I'm not trying to 81 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 4: advocate for using alcoholic to numb yourself against the pains 82 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 4: of the world, but man, the world was full of 83 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 4: some pain around this time. 84 00:04:58,480 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 3: Things were pretty rough. 85 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 4: A lot of poverty and a lot of divide between classes, 86 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:10,279 Speaker 4: and the topic of today's story specifically affects the lower 87 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 4: classes almost exclusively. 88 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is a story of victimization and socioeconomic divides. 89 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: It's also a story wherein Uncle Sam is probably the 90 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 1: bad guy, the closest thing we have and to an antagonist. 91 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:31,200 Speaker 3: Right, uncle Sam is such a jerk. 92 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 1: So here we are in prohibition. We found this excellent 93 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 1: article on Vox. I don't know if we should do 94 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: the title yet because it might be a little bit 95 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 1: of a spoiler by German Lopez. So in this article, 96 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 1: Deborah Bloom, the author of the Poisoner's Handbook, Murdering the 97 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: Birth of forensic Medicine and jazz Age New York, explains 98 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 1: how even before Prohibition, the government had some particular requirements 99 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:00,919 Speaker 1: for industrial alcohol manufacturers. 100 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, this is pretty cool. 101 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 4: It was actually a regulation that required these additives to 102 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 4: make this industrial alcohol unpotable, but it also separated them 103 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:18,599 Speaker 4: from the potable alcohols, which were taxed differently. So I 104 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 4: think originally it was just an additive called methanol, which 105 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 4: is a wood alcohol that is, you know, in certain 106 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 4: doses toxic when consumed by humans. 107 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, absolutely, And we see I think you did 108 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: a great job outlining this. We see a couple of 109 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 1: concurrent motivations for this. Right, let's make sure that we 110 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 1: still get paid and we can separate the different types 111 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:49,920 Speaker 1: of alcohol. But as prohibition was enacted and continued, First off, 112 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 1: the people who argued in favor for prohibition were completely wrong. 113 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 1: At least in this case, the economy was not helped 114 00:06:57,160 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: in any shape fashion. 115 00:06:58,480 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 3: Or form. 116 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,360 Speaker 1: I'm sure law enforcement received some more money as they 117 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 1: were trying this impossible war on drugs mission, but the 118 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: moral character didn't exactly improve either because people kept drinking. 119 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 4: Well, not only did it not improve, it just kind 120 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 4: of fed the monster that is organized crime and all 121 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 4: of these underground distilleries and speakeasies and. 122 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 3: Just pure outright thievery. 123 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 4: Because that industrial alcohol we were talking about, that was 124 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 4: the stuff he needed to make the bootleg booze. So 125 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 4: you know, people were actively pulling off heists to get 126 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 4: this stuff. And here's the thing that's so cool, Ben, 127 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:41,560 Speaker 4: this is something I didn't know. They call this this 128 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 4: topic of today's episode, the chemists wore, and it's for 129 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 4: good reason. It's because the methanol that was in that 130 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 4: industrial alcohol could actually be slightly removed or it could be. 131 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 3: Like redistilled, mitigating, mitigated. 132 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 4: And so that's what the chemists that the bootleggers or 133 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 4: the gangsters hired we're doing. And obviously they would pay 134 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 4: their chemist way better than the government chemist, so they 135 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 4: might attract better talent. 136 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. 137 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: Absolutely, And we know there was this huge industry of 138 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: illegal alcohol manufacturing, transportation, and sale. 139 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 3: It booms very. 140 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: Very quickly after prohibition, and what we find is kind 141 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:28,320 Speaker 1: of this proto breaking bad situation. This really is a 142 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 1: chemist war. In an essay written in the twenties called 143 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: Our Essay in Extermination by a doctor named Charles Norris, 144 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 1: who was a Chief Medical Examiner of New York City 145 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: at the time, he details the size of this trade. 146 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: He says the federal government admits that while eighty million 147 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:53,920 Speaker 1: gallons of grain alcohol are manufactured yearly under permit, only 148 00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: about seventy million gallons of it turn up again in 149 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 1: legally manufactured products. That means ten million gallons estimated per 150 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:06,000 Speaker 1: year are being taken by these groups of gangsters, handed 151 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:10,160 Speaker 1: to their like evil wizard chemists, and they're cleaning it 152 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: out or making it less lethal hopefully, and then they're 153 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:16,640 Speaker 1: selling it, you know, in the back rooms as speakeasies 154 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 1: across the nation. 155 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's the thing too, Like, if you were 156 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 4: just an average workaday Joe trying to get your boose 157 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:24,199 Speaker 4: fix on going one of these speakeasies, you didn't know 158 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 4: where it was coming from. 159 00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:26,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, you didn't know what. 160 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 4: The It's like buying illegal street drugs today, Like, you know, 161 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 4: you have no idea what additives or impurities are in it. 162 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 4: You are trusting in your supplier to not kill you. 163 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:40,439 Speaker 3: Right, And even before. 164 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 4: The craziness let's loose that we're about to get into, 165 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 4: people were dying from alcohol poisoning because sometimes those chemists 166 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 4: didn't do a good enough job of getting this stuff 167 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 4: out of there, and it was always impure even if 168 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 4: they did do a decent job. 169 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 1: Absolutely, absolutely, And when we say the effected people's health, 170 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 1: we're talking about very dark stuff. People died, people encountered paralysis. 171 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,360 Speaker 1: You know that old trope about drinking moonshine and going blind. 172 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: Some people did go blind. Yeah, not a whole ton, 173 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 1: but we have some spooky numbers for you. 174 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:16,719 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's crazy that I found this article or some 175 00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:19,079 Speaker 4: blog post about something called ginger jake. 176 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:22,040 Speaker 3: Ginger Jake was a medicine. 177 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 4: It was actually got around prohibition because it was sold 178 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 4: as a medicine and it had something in it called 179 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:34,040 Speaker 4: tricrestal phosphate that actually helped kind of trick the government's 180 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 4: tests into, you know, seeing it as being a pure 181 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 4: alcohol or you know, having no medicinal value whatsoever. But 182 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:45,960 Speaker 4: essentially it was just ginger flavored alcohol. But apparently this 183 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:50,720 Speaker 4: additive they used, unbeknownst to the company, I imagine, was 184 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 4: a very very slow acting neurotoxin, so it took time 185 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,000 Speaker 4: for it to take hold, and then eventually it actually 186 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 4: started to cause all kinds of leg muscular pains and weakness, 187 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 4: and it caused a type of paralysis. According to this uh, 188 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 4: this post would actually have a very distinctive walk associated 189 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:15,559 Speaker 4: it with it where people would have to like lift 190 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 4: their legs up entirely, sort of like the Ministry of 191 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:22,079 Speaker 4: Silly Walks from the Monty Python Show, you know, the Jakewalk, 192 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 4: the Jake Walk exactly, and we actually have a song. 193 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 4: The interesting thing about this is it was apparently baffling 194 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 4: to doctors and toxicologists in the US, but it was 195 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 4: actually a couple of blues singers who identified the source 196 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 4: of this in two different songs, one by Isham Bracy 197 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 4: called Jake Liquor Blues. 198 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:45,240 Speaker 3: Hear a little clip of that. 199 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 2: Money. 200 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:20,400 Speaker 4: And then we also have Tommy Johnson who kind of 201 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 4: figured out the source of this condition in his Tongue 202 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 4: Alcohol and Jake Blues. 203 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 3: When do a clip of that? Yes, please nog ho. 204 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 1: Y do no. 205 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 2: Fill? Let me that b Martin no home look you man, 206 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 2: let it one man, Oh, don't kid. 207 00:12:53,640 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 1: No. So they're part They're not neurologists, obviously, but they 208 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 1: are part of the community where the people encounter this 209 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:09,520 Speaker 1: stuff on a regular basis. 210 00:13:09,559 --> 00:13:12,439 Speaker 4: That's right, Because you know, the rich, the swells, the 211 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 4: high society types, who weren't these kind of Bible thumping 212 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 4: prohibition pushers, they were able to get imported booze from 213 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:26,359 Speaker 4: places like Europe or the Caribbean. You can get rum, 214 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,079 Speaker 4: very expensive. You had to know people, but it could 215 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:32,719 Speaker 4: be done. But the lower class had to rely on 216 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 4: this super cheap, dangerous street bootleg stuff. 217 00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 3: Right. 218 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 1: Absolutely. People would also buy things that were counterfeit spirits. 219 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:51,719 Speaker 1: They were advertised perhaps as whiskey or they were advertised 220 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 1: as vodka, but instead. 221 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 3: They were. 222 00:13:56,480 --> 00:14:01,679 Speaker 1: You know, they were tarted up industrial alcol products, and 223 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 1: they contained a lot of terrible stuff, not just the neurotoxins, 224 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 1: which this was a really interesting story about Jake. I 225 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:14,720 Speaker 1: think they didn't figure out the neurological damage it's capable 226 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: of until what the seventies. 227 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think it was even worse than they 228 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 4: originally had even thought. Turns out that it actually damaged 229 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 4: the movement control neurons in the brain or the upper 230 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 4: motor neurons. 231 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:29,760 Speaker 3: And thankfully, you know, this is about. 232 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 4: Fifty years later, but they had of course tracked down 233 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 4: all of the offending stuff and it was outlawed and gone. 234 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 4: But this is interesting because this is a company that's 235 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 4: doing this. This is a company that's trying to make 236 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 4: a buck by cheating the system during prohibition. 237 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:48,120 Speaker 1: Right, right, And they're not the only one. This also 238 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:51,960 Speaker 1: affects pharmacies. They were allowed to dispense whiskey with a prescription, 239 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 1: So who runs the prescription pad? Right? 240 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:55,400 Speaker 3: Interesting? 241 00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, And religious authorities that require or i should say 242 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: institute religious institutions that required alcohol or ceremonies also came 243 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: under the control of criminal organizations. And it was it's 244 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 1: similar to how when marijuana was legalized or decriminalized medically 245 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: first in California, a lot of people developed nebulous medical conditions. Yeah, 246 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: so they could get their prescriptions. 247 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 4: A hard time sleeping. Are you got you know, restless 248 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 4: leg syndrome or something? 249 00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:27,680 Speaker 1: And there were a lot more people claiming to be 250 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 1: adherents of certain churches or religious organizations. 251 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 3: People found Jesus, are you saying al Capone was running 252 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:35,600 Speaker 3: communion line. 253 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 1: My man people like him were involved for sure, and 254 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: this this was helpful because these were sources of alcohol 255 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 1: that was less likely to be contaminated. But while this 256 00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: was happening, the government realized that all the predictions they 257 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: had made were wrong. Turned out alcoholism and health problems 258 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 1: do true. Alcohol consumption were not going down, they were 259 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 1: going up, right, Like alcohol declined a little bit, but 260 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 1: a ton of restaurants closed because, as you know, many 261 00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 1: restaurants make their largest amount of profit off of spirit sales. Sure, 262 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: and then the markup right right because of the markup, 263 00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:23,120 Speaker 1: and then the government figured out that there was a 264 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: massive leak they could not plug somewhere along the production 265 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:34,360 Speaker 1: line of industrial alcohol manufacture and legal use, Like millions 266 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: of gallons were disappearing, and so they made a pretty brutal, 267 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 1: ruthless decision. 268 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 4: It really did ben So earlier we alluded to the 269 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 4: chemists War during Prohibition, and I would argue that's something 270 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 4: that was kind of ongoing even before this brutal move 271 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 4: we're about to talk about. But it really kicked in 272 00:16:56,440 --> 00:17:02,000 Speaker 4: the high gear when the US government decided to require 273 00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 4: these industries manufacturers of this industrial alcohol to start adding 274 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:13,200 Speaker 4: all kinds of horrible stuff to their product, and I guess, 275 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 4: to the government's credit, that's not really the right way 276 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:17,639 Speaker 4: to put it at all. But they were transparent about it. 277 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 4: They wanted people to know. It was in the papers. 278 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 4: In fact, in the Vox article, the headline from a 279 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:27,720 Speaker 4: clipping reads government to double alcohol poison content and also 280 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 4: add benzene smell warns drinkers, So they knew. 281 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 3: What people are doing. Yeah, they wanted them. 282 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:37,679 Speaker 4: To know, we're gonna make this stuff even more poison 283 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,320 Speaker 4: than it already is. And the assumption there was that 284 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:42,359 Speaker 4: people were going to look out have some sort of 285 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:46,800 Speaker 4: self preservation instinct, not the case. People already were showing 286 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:49,399 Speaker 4: that they lacked that entirely when they were drinking this 287 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 4: stuff off the streets that was already very, very dangerous 288 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:53,640 Speaker 4: and adulterated. 289 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, this was in nineteen twenty six, and as you say, Noel, 290 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 1: to their credit, they were very public about this. But 291 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:03,080 Speaker 1: the reason we call this a brutal, ruthless thing is 292 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:08,560 Speaker 1: that it was clearly an indefensible, illogical statement. It was 293 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,199 Speaker 1: both trying to punish people for a moral decision and 294 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:17,600 Speaker 1: then also remove any perceived culpability from the inevitable consequences 295 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 1: of this terrible decision. Yeah, they put benzene in there. 296 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 1: They also put mercury in there, I. 297 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 3: Think a Canda Strych nine, I believe. 298 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 4: But the biggest one was that they doubled that methanol 299 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:32,160 Speaker 4: that was in there. And the reason that that one 300 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,239 Speaker 4: was the doozy is because it was so similar to 301 00:18:35,280 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 4: the alcohol itself atomically that it bonded with it in 302 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 4: a way that was very difficult for the chemists to 303 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 4: fully get rid of it by redistilling it or whatever. 304 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 4: I'm not an alcohol chemist, but whatever they went there 305 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 4: to do, it was hard. 306 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:57,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, because it was so closely intertwined with the drinking alcohol. Right. 307 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 1: And Charles Norris, who we mentioned earlier in that essay, 308 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: he and Alexander Gettler, who was the chief toxicologist of 309 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 1: New York at the time, they both told the government 310 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:13,440 Speaker 1: not to do it. The government did it, and instantly 311 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 1: people started dying. It was called this was called the 312 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: alcohol of the Country by Bloom because it was very 313 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,879 Speaker 1: easily accessible stuff. We have a lot of information about 314 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,479 Speaker 1: this in New York City especially, but we know that 315 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 1: at this time bootleggers had nationwide transit infrastructure. So this 316 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,400 Speaker 1: stuff was going everywhere. And the estimates for the deaths 317 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,880 Speaker 1: are a little bit fuzzy because some of the deaths 318 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,680 Speaker 1: were were just the result of alcoholism. But the problem 319 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:49,199 Speaker 1: is that at the time alcoholism like drinking oneself to 320 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: death from regular old alcohol that was listed as a 321 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 1: natural death in obituaries. This was something very different. This 322 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 1: was death by poison. 323 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:00,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, and this got Charles Norris, who you read from 324 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 4: his essay earlier, who was the chief medical Examiner in 325 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 4: New York City, was just wholesale against this. He's like, 326 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,640 Speaker 4: this is a really bad idea. Government, please don't do this. 327 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 4: And of course they didn't listen to him, and so 328 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:14,240 Speaker 4: he referred to this and actually ties in with the 329 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 4: title of that essay, he referred to this as quote 330 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 4: our national experiment in extermination. So it really is almost 331 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,679 Speaker 4: like this idea of like they call them souses, you know, 332 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,359 Speaker 4: the drunks or whatever. It's almost like the government actively 333 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 4: wanted to kill them. 334 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 2: And in this. 335 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:38,680 Speaker 4: Slate article, it describes an event that happened on Christmas 336 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 4: Eve of nineteen twenty six when a man goes into 337 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 4: Bellevue Hospital in New York and is terrified that Santa 338 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 4: Claus is coming after him to kill him with a 339 00:20:50,320 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 4: baseball bat. As it turns out, he was in fact 340 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 4: experiencing hallucination as a result of this poisonous stuff. 341 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 3: And again, you know the government knew, I mean, I 342 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 3: don't know. 343 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:05,600 Speaker 4: It just seems like so ill informed, Like obviously prohibition 344 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:06,160 Speaker 4: wasn't working. 345 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 3: They knew prohibition wasn't working. 346 00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 4: They wanted up the anty by doing this, But did 347 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:11,399 Speaker 4: they really think this. 348 00:21:11,359 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 3: Was going to stop people? They had to know people 349 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:14,919 Speaker 3: were going to drink it. 350 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:19,680 Speaker 1: The approach they appear to have taken here, or rather 351 00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:23,159 Speaker 1: the stance would be that you have to break a 352 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: few drunk eggs to make a sober omelet, or the 353 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 1: dangerous argument we've talked about before, the belief and the 354 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 1: greater good. But yeah, almost one hundred people died, as 355 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:37,879 Speaker 1: you said, in December nineteen twenty six, the week of Christmas, 356 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 1: due to this, the same year that the government passed 357 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:46,120 Speaker 1: these regulations, and hundreds would die in the following years. 358 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:52,879 Speaker 1: This had intentionally been rendered fatal, and Calvin Coolidge was 359 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:57,160 Speaker 1: the president at the time, and under his administration these 360 00:21:57,160 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 1: deaths were not seen as a problem. It was kind 361 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:04,080 Speaker 1: of like shrug, things happen, but overall it is getting 362 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: drunks off the streets. 363 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 4: Well, it's sort of like the is it the president 364 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 4: of the Philippines who basically advocates for murdering drug dealers 365 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 4: in the streets? 366 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 3: Similar vibe, only a little more roundabout way of doing it. 367 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 4: I mean, at least de Terte says what he means 368 00:22:18,520 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 4: and isn't trying to hide behind some kind of puritanical 369 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 4: curtain like these guys. 370 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,400 Speaker 3: You know, it's very, very troubling. 371 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 1: Norris is walking a thin line on this prohibition issue 372 00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:38,679 Speaker 1: at the time, you know, because he is the chief 373 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,679 Speaker 1: Medical Examiner, so he has street cred and he's I 374 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: think in a little bit of a safer place to 375 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: argue against prohibition. And he says that something must be 376 00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:52,440 Speaker 1: added to grain alcohol to prevent it being all drunk 377 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,200 Speaker 1: away and thereby deny it to legitimate industry and business. 378 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 1: So he says, Okay, we have to add some kind 379 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 1: of contaminate, but methanol. Seriously, that's going to kill people. 380 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:10,520 Speaker 1: He didn't really propose a different additive, or I couldn't 381 00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 1: find a different additive that he proposed. But he also 382 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 1: he also mentioned something that was really powerful and pressing 383 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:22,760 Speaker 1: it for his time. He revealed how the New York 384 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: administration of the twenties looked at certain populations as disposable alcoholics, 385 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: certain types of immigrants, the poor, as we mentioned at 386 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: the top of this episode, and there were a couple 387 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 1: of different rules, like two sets of rules, one for 388 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:43,080 Speaker 1: the wealthy people who are drinking a lot and one 389 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:46,159 Speaker 1: for the quote unquote degenerates. And Norris points out that 390 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:52,119 Speaker 1: private physicians will rarely expose their deceased customers to the 391 00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:55,879 Speaker 1: indignity of a post mortem examination, and then they'll just 392 00:23:55,920 --> 00:24:00,320 Speaker 1: call those deaths those alcohol related deaths deaths by some 393 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 1: sort of natural cause. They still look upright and respectable 394 00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:04,760 Speaker 1: even in the afterlife. 395 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, Ben, and I think there's this quote from the 396 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 4: Chicago Tribune that was cited in the Slay article. It 397 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 4: really sums up this whole problem that we're trying to 398 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 4: kind of wrap our heads around for nineteen twenty seven. 399 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,119 Speaker 4: It says, quote, normally, no American government would engage in 400 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 4: such business as poisoning its own citizens. It is only 401 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:27,120 Speaker 4: in the curious fanaticism of prohibition that any means, however barbarous, 402 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 4: are considered justified. So, I mean, I think that really 403 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 4: sums up the mindset of like this whole era some 404 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 4: moral crusade, a total moral crusade that did eventually come 405 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 4: to an end. 406 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:44,160 Speaker 1: Yes, luckily, luckily for everyone involved. Teetotalers and boos enthusiasts. 407 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:51,440 Speaker 1: A like, prohibition of alcohol was repealed in nineteen thirty three, 408 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:53,639 Speaker 1: so it didn't last that long, just a span of 409 00:24:53,680 --> 00:25:00,400 Speaker 1: about thirteen ridiculous years now were there were there plus 410 00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:05,080 Speaker 1: to alcohol prohibition. Sure, for certain parties, it was great 411 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:09,480 Speaker 1: for organized crime, right, Yeah, it was great for law enforcement, 412 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: that's job security because it's an unending war. But for 413 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:17,880 Speaker 1: the majority of the country, it was demonstrably a bad thing. 414 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:19,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, sure sounds like it to me. But I don't 415 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:21,640 Speaker 3: really see too much of a silver lining here. 416 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 4: So, and it's interesting the way we're seeing this kind 417 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 4: of repeat with marijuana prohibition and the way the tide 418 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,359 Speaker 4: is turning with that. It's really interesting to kind of 419 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,160 Speaker 4: be quite a time to be alive just to see 420 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:36,119 Speaker 4: these things kind of change and see the kind of 421 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:40,440 Speaker 4: puritanical attitudes kind of making their way out of fashion. 422 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:45,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, which is strange because in the current situation regarding marijuana, 423 00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:49,159 Speaker 1: especially in the US. There's some states where it's completely legal, 424 00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 1: and there are some states where it's still a very 425 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:56,120 Speaker 1: serious offense to what possess it carried around grow it. 426 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: And one of the huge factors in the turning tide 427 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 1: regarding marijuana legislation has honestly been not so much the 428 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:12,639 Speaker 1: science behind the substance itself, but the economic benefit to 429 00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,280 Speaker 1: governments and businesses of making it legal. 430 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:16,680 Speaker 3: Oh for sure, I mean that's certainly. 431 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:21,320 Speaker 4: You see dollar signs in some of these formerly teetotalin officials, 432 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 4: right and yeah, And you would think that with all 433 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 4: this concern about the economy with this original prohibition, that 434 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,919 Speaker 4: would have been a little bit more on people's minds 435 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 4: instead of just funneling all that money into the. 436 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,440 Speaker 3: Abyss that is the black market, you know. 437 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:43,199 Speaker 1: Right, right. And after prohibition on alcohol ended on the 438 00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 1: federal level in December fifth of thirty three, some states 439 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: decided to stay dry states for up to a third 440 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:53,960 Speaker 1: of a century longer. 441 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:57,080 Speaker 3: Well, we still have dry counties in the US. 442 00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:00,640 Speaker 4: I know Blue Ridge, Georgia, which is a there's really 443 00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,679 Speaker 4: beautiful mountain cabins you can rent there. 444 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,320 Speaker 3: That is a dry county. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah, 445 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 3: and it's interesting too. 446 00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:07,960 Speaker 4: I want to point out there's something that I noticed 447 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 4: as a correction in one of these articles. I think 448 00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 4: it was in the Slate article. They mischaracterized the eighteenth 449 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:16,360 Speaker 4: Amendment as prohibiting the consumption of. 450 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,680 Speaker 3: Alcohol that was not illegal. 451 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, it was just the manufacturer, manufacturing, and distribution, right, 452 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 1: import exports. 453 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 3: It's an interesting distinction there. 454 00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, right, it's kind of like the pursuit of happiness. 455 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 3: That's right, you can go after it. Yeah. 456 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:34,560 Speaker 1: Currently, as we record here in the US, there are 457 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 1: still hundreds of dry counties across the country. About ten 458 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 1: percent of the country is still what would be considered dry, 459 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:46,960 Speaker 1: and about eighteen million people or so live live in 460 00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:47,560 Speaker 1: that area. 461 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 3: Nobody knows how dry I am, Ben, No one. 462 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:52,200 Speaker 1: Knows the dryness you've seen. 463 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 4: Isn't it weird that the always see drunk people singing 464 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 4: that song? I know I'm talking about like in cartoons. 465 00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:17,080 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, nobody nobody. 466 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:19,720 Speaker 2: Right, don't story yourself, sir, Lari. 467 00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 1: And on that note, feel free to send us your 468 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:29,760 Speaker 1: favorite drunken single longs if you find them online. We 469 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: want to thank you so much for taking this strange 470 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: journey with us. If you would like to learn more, 471 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: we can recommend reading Charles Norris's essay and Extermination in full. 472 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:45,720 Speaker 1: Deborah Blooms Poisonous Handbook is a great thing, and it's 473 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:50,680 Speaker 1: not just about prohibition. Sure, if you liked our arsenic episode, 474 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: you'll also love Poisoner's Handbook absolutely. 475 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 4: And we would of course like to thank our super 476 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 4: producer Casey Pegram, Alex Williams, who composed our theme, our 477 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 4: research associate Christopher Hasiotis, who hiped us to today's topic. 478 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,720 Speaker 3: And I want to thank you right well, you Ben, 479 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 3: I'm looking at you. 480 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:08,080 Speaker 1: Oh, and thank you Noel. 481 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:09,120 Speaker 3: See you next time. 482 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 4: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 483 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:23,600 Speaker 4: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.