Speaker 1: And what was it called? And you know she clearly
Speaker 1: knows it is going to What is n l T
Speaker 1: stand for? That's my next question, stand for n not
Speaker 1: like them? Not like them? Yeah, okay, yep. All boy
Speaker 1: band names are good. That's the thing about boy bands.
Speaker 1: They all make sense and they're all good. Hi. My
Speaker 1: name is Jenna and I'm Kevin, and we are best friends.
Speaker 1: Give me a break. Hello everybody, it's me Brian Baumgartner here,
Speaker 1: and welcome back to another episode of Off the Beat.
Speaker 1: Today we have not one, No, we have two amazing guests,
Speaker 1: a threesome if you will. Kevin McHale and Jenna Ushkowitz
Speaker 1: will join me today. I am so excited to talk
Speaker 1: to them. They are both old friends of mine. You
Speaker 1: might know them from their time on Glee as Artie
Speaker 1: and Tina because correct me if I'm wrong here. But
Speaker 1: it is just one of those shows that everyone knows,
Speaker 1: whether it's for the crazy storylines, the incredible cast, or
Speaker 1: well that it came from genius Ryan Murphy. If you
Speaker 1: can dream it, it happened on Glee. I'm excited to
Speaker 1: jump right in here. We talk about their origins. Kevin's
Speaker 1: boy band, Jenna's Broadway career and how their friendship has
Speaker 1: led them to their new Rewatch podcast, and that's what
Speaker 1: you really missed. And most of all, you're gonna hear
Speaker 1: all about Kevin's role on the office. That's right. As
Speaker 1: a Kevin on the office myself, I think we just well,
Speaker 1: we just get each other. This is a fun one.
Speaker 1: Let's bring them on, Kevin and Jenna, everybody. Bubble and Squeak.
Speaker 1: I love it. Bubble and squeak on Bubble and Squeaker
Speaker 1: cookie every month, left over from the nut before. What's
Speaker 1: up you guys? How are you? I mean, it's been
Speaker 1: so long four years eighty four years. Wow, great to
Speaker 1: see both of you. You too immediately brings back memories. Good, yeah,
Speaker 1: really good ones. Um some of them we can't tell,
Speaker 1: but many, many good ones. So this is my first
Speaker 1: threesome by the way it is. It's usually one on
Speaker 1: one here, but we're going we're going threesome today more
Speaker 1: than Mary. So I'm going to spend most of the
Speaker 1: time talking about when you guys were reborn, when you
Speaker 1: were reborn, meeting the day the two of you met
Speaker 1: and started working together. But I did want to go
Speaker 1: back a little bit briefly individually. I guess ladies first, Jenna,
Speaker 1: your childhood, when did you start becoming interested in the arts? Well, um,
Speaker 1: I was always interested in the arts, I think, but
Speaker 1: I was put into the business when I was three.
Speaker 1: So I was doing commercials and print ads from three on.
Speaker 1: And my first commercial was like the Toys r US commercial,
Speaker 1: and then I started doing Sesame Street. And then right
Speaker 1: around the age of nine, I auditioned for my first
Speaker 1: Broadway musical. And I had done school plays and things
Speaker 1: like that before, and I had done, you know, some commercials,
Speaker 1: but like, this is a totally different caliber of work.
Speaker 1: So I auditioned for The King and I um revival
Speaker 1: with lou Diamond Phillips and Donna Murphy, and um, somehow
Speaker 1: I booked it. There were fifteen kids, and somehow I
Speaker 1: booked it. You did a number of shows on Broadway
Speaker 1: when you were very young, including Spring Awakening. Now was
Speaker 1: your future uh CO star involved at that time or no? Yes? Yes,
Speaker 1: so Lee was in the original LeeAnne Groff both were
Speaker 1: in the original cast of Spring Awakening, obviously, and then
Speaker 1: I joined at the tail end of their run and
Speaker 1: into the new cast. So basically I got a taste
Speaker 1: of both casts of Spring Awakening. But yes, I was
Speaker 1: there and Leah and I. Leo was on Broadway doing
Speaker 1: le Miss when I was doing The King, and I
Speaker 1: as well, so we had known each other since that time. Really, yes,
Speaker 1: a little young a zette. She went with her friends.
Speaker 1: She was old. It feels, you know, to feel appropriate
Speaker 1: for her character to be like I played because at
Speaker 1: the ripe age of eight. Wow, so you were on Broadway.
Speaker 1: Did you grow up in New York? Yeah, I grew
Speaker 1: up on Long Island, so I was very close to this,
Speaker 1: a straight shot to the city, if you will, right,
Speaker 1: And this was I mean, when you're three and you're
Speaker 1: put into things, this is not a choice, This is
Speaker 1: not a pass. Yet by the time you're nine, are
Speaker 1: you full? You're full? I am, I am in, I
Speaker 1: am locked and loaded. Um. Honestly, it was like the
Speaker 1: Broadway camaraderie and family experience of doing a show um
Speaker 1: of that size. It was like fifty two cast members
Speaker 1: or something crazy like that. I was in love. I
Speaker 1: was the My parents will tell you I was the
Speaker 1: one first one at the theater and the last one out.
Speaker 1: They'd be like, where is Jenna? Please? Let because they
Speaker 1: didn't let the parents backstage, so they waited at the
Speaker 1: stage door. For me, it was a three hour show,
Speaker 1: and they'd be like, can can she please come out
Speaker 1: and leave? They wouldn't let them backstage. Is brilliant, It
Speaker 1: is brilliant, brilliant that normal. And they can because we
Speaker 1: have wranglers a backstage that are hired to take care
Speaker 1: of us. So when the wranglers bring us to the door, okay,
Speaker 1: and they're like, keep these crazy stage parents away. Now.
Speaker 1: I haven't talked to anybody about this. I've talked to
Speaker 1: plenty of people who did see it or but not
Speaker 1: now are you are you schooling at this time as well? Well?
Speaker 1: So during rehearsals, during the six week rehearsal I was doing, Um,
Speaker 1: we were home schooled, were tutored on set basic set. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was nine, I was in fourth grade, and so
Speaker 1: I would go to school and then I would go
Speaker 1: do the show, except for Wednesdays when they let me
Speaker 1: my parents let me take off because I had a matinee.
Speaker 1: Were you were you doing all of them? Yeah? Time
Speaker 1: you didn't have a double cast. No, it's it's I
Speaker 1: think it's like six or seven that you can do it. Um,
Speaker 1: you can do the full show. So I was doing
Speaker 1: the full eight shows. My parents were driving me back
Speaker 1: and forth every day, and then I would go to
Speaker 1: school and then they picked me up and we drove
Speaker 1: to the city. Wow. Yeah that is insane. It's pretty
Speaker 1: feel so bad for your parents. Yeah, I know. I
Speaker 1: mean I was doing not to make this about me,
Speaker 1: but I was doing the eight shows a week thing
Speaker 1: as well. But when I was fully able to drive
Speaker 1: myself or get myself somewhere, I wasn't reliant on I
Speaker 1: mean that's significant. Yes, yeah, it's hard because a lot
Speaker 1: of parents kids were like, I want to do that,
Speaker 1: and a lot of parents would ask my parents like
Speaker 1: how do you do it? And my dad was able
Speaker 1: to work out of the offices when cell phones were
Speaker 1: just starting to like be a thing and um pagers.
Speaker 1: Remember if I would get a call back, my agent
Speaker 1: would page my dad and then we have to call
Speaker 1: them back. But like, you know, it was just one
Speaker 1: of those times where my my mom had stopped working
Speaker 1: when she had my brother and me and so like
Speaker 1: or when they adopted me. But like when you know,
Speaker 1: she was able to take me up to the auditions
Speaker 1: and my dad would wait in the car circle around
Speaker 1: or double park and like work while he was doing that.
Speaker 1: So it was a real commitment from both parties. Someone
Speaker 1: I just talked to brought something up to me. I've
Speaker 1: never thought of it this way before. This was his theory.
Speaker 1: Our education system is set up in a flawed manner
Speaker 1: in that we go to school with people exactly our
Speaker 1: same age, like within a twelve month period of time.
Speaker 1: And he talked to me about the arts in the theater.
Speaker 1: You are socially and in some ways in terms of
Speaker 1: even your real education, if you're doing set school or whatever,
Speaker 1: you have the experience and the perspective of people with
Speaker 1: such a wide range. And isn't that a much more
Speaker 1: natural way actually of being educated and growing up? Did
Speaker 1: you start to feel that and you were doing shows?
Speaker 1: I agree. I think that's an interesting point. It's um
Speaker 1: being surrounded by kids where I was somewhat they're elder
Speaker 1: and then also kids that were a little bit older
Speaker 1: than me. Um, but also being around adults, like being
Speaker 1: around cast members that kind of took us under their wing,
Speaker 1: that played our mothers that we're probably in their early
Speaker 1: twenties at that point, you know, mid twenties dancers and
Speaker 1: like I felt like I got I got a lot
Speaker 1: more world experience than the kids around me, and that
Speaker 1: I was going back to school with every day, and
Speaker 1: I felt like just my my world experience was bigger
Speaker 1: and more expansive. And I absolutely agree with you. I
Speaker 1: think it is a fascinating idea. And my husband was
Speaker 1: in education, he would love this, um but it's it's
Speaker 1: it's definitely something that I attest to. The groundedness that
Speaker 1: I learned at a young age, the humilia I learned
Speaker 1: at at a young age, the discipline I learned at
Speaker 1: that point. So I am a pent on board with that,
Speaker 1: and I think about that for like my daughter, like
Speaker 1: what what can I share with her through the arts
Speaker 1: or through these experiences that I had being around adults
Speaker 1: at a younger age more than like kids my own age.
Speaker 1: And I think like being around you know, of course
Speaker 1: we go to school with the kids because you're supposed
Speaker 1: to be in this developmental age where everything is everybody
Speaker 1: is developing at the same time. But that's not it.
Speaker 1: That's not it either, Like babies don't develop at the
Speaker 1: same time. You're one baby is you know, rolland and
Speaker 1: one baby isn't like it's not. It's the standardized testing
Speaker 1: bullshit that we you know, we have in our you know,
Speaker 1: us education system that's quite flawed. So right, No, but
Speaker 1: even what you say, like even just the valuable experience
Speaker 1: of dealing with kids who are younger. They're not teaching
Speaker 1: you algebra, but they're certainly teaching you, you know, and
Speaker 1: you're showing you the world like things right exactly, and
Speaker 1: and social interactions and yes, as you said, people who
Speaker 1: are older as well, and even adults who well, maybe
Speaker 1: sometimes they're not teaching you the right things to do,
Speaker 1: but at least you learn through failure and bad experience. Um. Fascinating.
Speaker 1: Kevin High, not Hot, not New York, but Texas you
Speaker 1: were born and raised. Talk to me a little bit
Speaker 1: about your introduction into the arts and at what age
Speaker 1: did you realize this is what you wanted to do.
Speaker 1: I don't really have a memory with me not being
Speaker 1: interested in the arts. I didn't realize until much later, though,
Speaker 1: that it was something that I could pursue as more
Speaker 1: than just a hobby or an interest. I don't know
Speaker 1: if it was just being from Texas or that I
Speaker 1: was just a little slow or something, but I was,
Speaker 1: like you know famous people do that like this is
Speaker 1: I. I I wanted to be a meteorologist or an architect.
Speaker 1: That was my plan. But I was always I was
Speaker 1: obsessed with MTV and music was my thing. Like I
Speaker 1: would always sing around the house. I would watch music
Speaker 1: videos and study. I would like I would learn all
Speaker 1: the dances, all the choreography, mimic their movements and how
Speaker 1: they performed. And I had I was the youngest of four.
Speaker 1: I am the youngest of four and we're all very
Speaker 1: spread out. So I also had a really um great
Speaker 1: education and diversity of music because all of my siblings
Speaker 1: listening to different things. And so I would go to
Speaker 1: school and I would know these artists that no going
Speaker 1: to sort of what you were just talking about, Jenna,
Speaker 1: Education about being around people different ages. I had this
Speaker 1: breadth of musical knowledge that no one else my age did,
Speaker 1: and I valued that really early on. But then my
Speaker 1: sister became an agent in Texas. She's sixteen years older
Speaker 1: than me. She became an acting agent, and I remember
Speaker 1: she was telling me they're auditioning for this movie. It
Speaker 1: was a sequel two, a movie that I had loved,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I want audition for it. What
Speaker 1: was the movie. It was they're making a sequel to
Speaker 1: Little Rascals. I don't think it ever got made, um,
Speaker 1: because they saw me like, you know, let's not even bother.
Speaker 1: This is five now, what do you mean a sequel?
Speaker 1: So the Little Rascals that came out when we were kids,
Speaker 1: and like in the nineties that Little Rascals. There was
Speaker 1: the reboot of the Little Rascals. Yeah, not o g.
Speaker 1: Little Rascal was like, like I was a huge fan
Speaker 1: of just got a facelift, he's got a lot of
Speaker 1: work done. Yeah, I look very good when you met me.
Speaker 1: I definitely was not seventeen um, And so I forced her.
Speaker 1: She was not like a children's agent either. She was,
Speaker 1: you know, an adult agent, and she I somehow wore
Speaker 1: her down and that they let me audition and then
Speaker 1: her agency signed me, you know, nepotism and ever then
Speaker 1: I started doing commercials in Dallas and things, and starting
Speaker 1: singing lessons and dance lessons, and then she sort of
Speaker 1: suggested to my parents that, you know, maybe take me
Speaker 1: out to l A to try it. And we came
Speaker 1: out to l A. I think it was thirteen the
Speaker 1: first time. Okay, what year is this? Uh? Where was
Speaker 1: I born. It was probably like two thou three. You
Speaker 1: were born on June. Yeah, so I think we started
Speaker 1: coming out here like two thousand two or two dozen three.
Speaker 1: I just remember we drove to l A from Dallas,
Speaker 1: and when we drove back entering Dallas, I started to
Speaker 1: cry because I didn't want to be there, and I
Speaker 1: just felt so at home in l A and that
Speaker 1: everything felt artistic. You know. Going back to middle school
Speaker 1: in Texas, it was just football and I didn't do
Speaker 1: anything extracurricular at school. Everything was outside of it. In
Speaker 1: l A. Everyone was already doing that. And so because
Speaker 1: I was the youngest, my parents and I we moved
Speaker 1: out here sort of with the opposite mindset of stage parents,
Speaker 1: where they were like, we want to get the hell
Speaker 1: out of Texas. You want to get the hell out
Speaker 1: of Texas. So it was just I'm gonna go to
Speaker 1: high school and l A and see what happens. And
Speaker 1: I go on auditions, but if it happens, it happens,
Speaker 1: and if it doesn't, it doesn't, and then you know,
Speaker 1: I got into a boy band and things. That's where
Speaker 1: we're going next. But I just I don't want to
Speaker 1: make this awkward you would have been three to seven
Speaker 1: years old. Were you aware of me? I went to
Speaker 1: SMU in Dallas. Were you aware of my you know,
Speaker 1: my prowess. I don't know what the word is. I'm
Speaker 1: looking for everybody. Did you feel the energy of me
Speaker 1: and for those few years? Yeah, maybe that's why you
Speaker 1: cried later on because I had left already. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: well he's not here, so what's the point. What is
Speaker 1: the point? Um? Yes, I was there for four years.
Speaker 1: SMME has turned out some greats. SMU has turned out
Speaker 1: some grades right now? Me? Um No, Cathy Bates, Cathy Bates.
Speaker 1: Of course we're garson. I think that's right. Some grades. Okay,
Speaker 1: boy band? So you go, Now do you leave school?
Speaker 1: You can't leave school. You have to still be going
Speaker 1: to school a thirteen, you have to. So you you
Speaker 1: go to school out in California. We end up moving
Speaker 1: to calif When when I was okay, it took a
Speaker 1: couple of years to decide, like what are we going
Speaker 1: to do? My brother, closest an age to me, you know,
Speaker 1: went to college and so we're like, okay, well now
Speaker 1: I'm basically an only child. What do you guys want
Speaker 1: to do? Ever since my dad lost his job in
Speaker 1: two thousand one, so he was sort of popping around,
Speaker 1: you know, when all that sort of like telecom thing
Speaker 1: he did sort of busted a little bit, and so
Speaker 1: everyone's looking for a change. I was obsessive boy bands,
Speaker 1: obsessive pop music, and there was a random audition. Um.
Speaker 1: I had a dance agent at the time, which is
Speaker 1: hilarious in hindsight because I'm not a dance agent. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't know those existed. Was to be a band artist,
Speaker 1: I don't think it was. I didn't think it was.
Speaker 1: Like again, boy bands like Instinct, Bactory boys were sort
Speaker 1: of like done. The craze was over. So I was
Speaker 1: like I missed the boat. And then someone held auditions
Speaker 1: and I showed up and got it, and then was
Speaker 1: in a boy band from like fourteen until nineteen basically,
Speaker 1: and what was it called and general? You know, she
Speaker 1: clearly knows it is going to What is n LT
Speaker 1: stand for? That's my next question. Does it stand for Ken?
Speaker 1: Not like Them? Not like them? Yea, m hmm, okay, yep.
Speaker 1: All boy band names are good. That's the thing about
Speaker 1: boy bands. They all make sense and they're all good.
Speaker 1: So okay, there's so much to want Packer. Well, your
Speaker 1: friend here is doing Broadway musicals. You're in a boy band.
Speaker 1: You love it though you always wanted to be in
Speaker 1: a boy band. We're loving boys. This is a dream
Speaker 1: for you, and you're in it for four or five years. Now,
Speaker 1: are you touring? We did. We eventually did a little
Speaker 1: touring when we were young. There wasn't that much going
Speaker 1: nowhere like internationally. It was just the Usum, yeah, a
Speaker 1: lot of that. We did two tours. The first tour
Speaker 1: we were in one eight hundred Cruise America r V.
Speaker 1: Following around we opened up for the Pussycat Dolls. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I've heard. I want to be very very clear, I
Speaker 1: am not making fun of Albuquerque. Okay, I want to.
Speaker 1: I want that on the record here before anything, before anything.
Speaker 1: It's not New York City Broadway hashtag love Albuquerque. I
Speaker 1: was more saying, are you are you going to Paris
Speaker 1: or Mexico City or are we going to Albuquerque? Okay? Now,
Speaker 1: it was definitely very local. One Cruise America tells the
Speaker 1: story there, um okay. And then the second tour was
Speaker 1: what the second we had no we had proper tour
Speaker 1: buses and at that point, A couple of are people
Speaker 1: had ideas to put boy bands together. So we went
Speaker 1: on like a boy band tour the house of blues
Speaker 1: all around America. Yeah, it wasn't very successful. I think
Speaker 1: are there across there used to be a lot there was.
Speaker 1: It was a time there were pop ups too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was before they all started closing. But yeah, we
Speaker 1: went all over the place. That was a while. And
Speaker 1: I relate to what Jenna was saying about being around
Speaker 1: older people in that time because we were the youngest
Speaker 1: people around. The music business is way I don't know
Speaker 1: if I can cuss, but crappier you want. It's shittier
Speaker 1: than the acting business. There's no equity, there's no sag
Speaker 1: or after a it's just every man for themselves. And
Speaker 1: my parents are all of our parents and that at
Speaker 1: that time. We're all very aware of that and very protective.
Speaker 1: So they did a good job with that. But it's
Speaker 1: just like deals are bad, everyone's screwing you over. We had,
Speaker 1: you know, we'd go to New York audition for record labels,
Speaker 1: and so we had to learn as fifteen sixteen year
Speaker 1: olds how to be around these people and how to
Speaker 1: operate professionally. And be a performer. And in high school
Speaker 1: then I was during the daytime going to class, at
Speaker 1: nighttime going to the recording studio, going we got signed
Speaker 1: to Geffen, which was under Interscope, and so I remember
Speaker 1: there was a party we went and I met Stevie
Speaker 1: Nicks and Mary J. Blige. And then the next day
Speaker 1: going to school and no one has any idea that
Speaker 1: this is like what I'm doing at nighttime. That's crazy,
Speaker 1: But it was a very good. It was a really
Speaker 1: good education, especially with Glee coming because I did the
Speaker 1: touring and did the dance rehearsals, like recording studio, all
Speaker 1: of that. Don't don't take my tease, Damn. Are you
Speaker 1: a fan of Broadway musicals as a boy band member?
Speaker 1: Are you disdainful or dismissive or uninterested of that? I
Speaker 1: was probably mostly uninterested, uninterested. I grew up. My mom
Speaker 1: took me to every touring show that came through Dallas.
Speaker 1: I was obsessed with fan of the opera as a kid. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd put on shows in my living room. But besides that,
Speaker 1: I didn't nessarily have an interest um in keeping up
Speaker 1: with it what was happening on Broadway. I didn't really
Speaker 1: know that world. Yeah, there was not so much more
Speaker 1: of an indifference, I guess for the musical theater. Okay.
Speaker 1: And now the same token, Jenna, as you're someone who's
Speaker 1: performing on Broadway. Now are you a fan of boy
Speaker 1: bands at this time? Are you? Are you? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: didn't know an LT. I didn't do I did no
Speaker 1: Dream Street, okay, And I did know obviously in sinking
Speaker 1: back try boys? Who are they? No? I was kidding, Okay,
Speaker 1: So I wasn't big. I was able. Oh so you
Speaker 1: were a fan? Okay, definitely. It wasn't what I expected
Speaker 1: you to say, but actually both of you said when
Speaker 1: I didn't, which is why we asked the questions. I know.
Speaker 1: That's that's really interesting. So before we get to you, guys,
Speaker 1: is meeting you guys the time you guys met Kevin,
Speaker 1: I actually met you before. Jenna, you were a very
Speaker 1: significant guest star on the Office when you were seventeen
Speaker 1: ish years of age. How was that experience for you
Speaker 1: the delivery boy I believe it was your title pizza
Speaker 1: delivery boy from Alfredo's. What was that experience to like
Speaker 1: for you? And how much experience did you have at
Speaker 1: that time in film and television. It sounds like not
Speaker 1: a lot, not a lot. It was I think my
Speaker 1: second guest star thing ever. The other one was Zoe
Speaker 1: one on one on Nickelodeon. And yeah, it was a
Speaker 1: really really big thing for me. The audition process was
Speaker 1: unlike anything I'd ever experienced, where the callbacks we were
Speaker 1: in the room with Steve and he came in and
Speaker 1: read with us. You know, Steve Correll. I'll just say,
Speaker 1: Steve Um. I was dying. I was so terrified. Really
Speaker 1: were you? Were you a fan of the show. Oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was. And I was a fan of the the
Speaker 1: UK version, like I was all about it. And Alison Jones,
Speaker 1: the casting director, is probably the only reason why I've
Speaker 1: had any sort of career because she, when no one
Speaker 1: else did, kept giving me chances on everything. So I
Speaker 1: got really close and super bad she and then she
Speaker 1: just you know, as if you get on TV and
Speaker 1: you become semi recognizable, you get to skip a couple
Speaker 1: rounds of auditioning and you just get brought into the
Speaker 1: later rounds. I didn't have any reason to get brought
Speaker 1: into automatically too later rounds for things. She just started
Speaker 1: doing that for me because somehow she believed in me,
Speaker 1: and it I really took that to heart and made
Speaker 1: me feel better when I would go into these rooms
Speaker 1: that she would bring me into. But yeah, I went
Speaker 1: in an auditioned with Steve and got it and I
Speaker 1: screamed and was freaking out. And then all of you
Speaker 1: were just so so awful, no so nice. I mean
Speaker 1: I was. I was so intimidated obviously coming in there.
Speaker 1: It's like, these are these professional adults and they're all
Speaker 1: talented and funny, and I felt like, you know, severe
Speaker 1: case of imposter syndrome. And everyone went out of their
Speaker 1: way to make me feel comfortable, to make me feel
Speaker 1: like I deserve to be there, every one of you,
Speaker 1: and um, it was just really really great. And also
Speaker 1: what a great gig you guys had, because I mean, Jennet,
Speaker 1: those sets were pre lit, like, oh my god, the
Speaker 1: way they could set up something so quickly. They were
Speaker 1: on their own, they had their own stage. Oh god,
Speaker 1: it was the dream. So you ruined it for anything
Speaker 1: else because I feel like you also gotten still. Oh,
Speaker 1: I get recognized so often from that one episode, and
Speaker 1: it's it's absolutely I don't know how you go anywhere
Speaker 1: because I was in one episode and you still do.
Speaker 1: I can't, by the way, but you still do. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, that's a lot crazy because I went back
Speaker 1: and looked at those pictures and you do look quite different. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean you are older, let's be clear. So am I.
Speaker 1: I guess that's how time works. I'll explain it to
Speaker 1: you later. Wow, well that is very very interesting. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would I don't know that I would have thought
Speaker 1: that with with everything that's coming after. Still, so you guys,
Speaker 1: just say the least you have a very diverse training
Speaker 1: and backgrounds. Talk to me about Glee. How did the
Speaker 1: opportunities come up for both of you? Um? Were these
Speaker 1: just auditions first off? Yes? Regular? Okay? And what did
Speaker 1: you have to do? Obviously? Did you have to dance
Speaker 1: as well as sing as well? As you? Did? Not know?
Speaker 1: And they realized that was probably a mistake later on,
Speaker 1: how to bring in some people who could dance, like
Speaker 1: nobody can dance, not one, not even everybody can sing
Speaker 1: that we um. No, I was in the Spring. I
Speaker 1: was in Spring Awakening. At the time. It was the
Speaker 1: same casting director Jim Carnahan in New York who cast
Speaker 1: Spring Awakening was also casting the New York side of Glee,
Speaker 1: and so we had it was all a buzz in
Speaker 1: theater and they were like, Oh, there's this new musical
Speaker 1: theater TV show that's coming out, and everybody got brought
Speaker 1: in for it because the pilot also was like some
Speaker 1: of these characters like Argentina were pretty non specific, and
Speaker 1: so I went in and um, everybody went in and
Speaker 1: we didn't have to sing for our first audition because
Speaker 1: they were like, I guess you're on Broadway. I guess
Speaker 1: you can sing. So I didn't have to sing in
Speaker 1: my first call. Um, I just went on PA and
Speaker 1: just read, just read lines like any other show. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And literally Tina's only line was a stutter and she said, uh,
Speaker 1: and that's it. That was my entire audition first Underson, God,
Speaker 1: that's all you did. They didn't give you anything else.
Speaker 1: That that's it. That was it. Wow. I'm not going
Speaker 1: to say anything bad but that they've got to be
Speaker 1: more creative than that. This is poor people, Okay, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean literally, by a weird stutter on one day,
Speaker 1: your entire life could be changed. Sliding Doors. Check out
Speaker 1: the movie, So Kevin, what about you? Well know you're
Speaker 1: in a boy band. That's right, does that mean that
Speaker 1: they knew that you could sing or did you have
Speaker 1: to sing? They sure did not know I could say,
Speaker 1: so we had to sing, you'd prepare a song. I
Speaker 1: read the script before. I remember I brought two friends
Speaker 1: with me. I was like, Oh, this show shoots in
Speaker 1: New York. I don't know why I thought that. Um, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know why. I hadn't probably mixed up with
Speaker 1: something else. And I went in an audition and it
Speaker 1: wasn't an audition room. It was in Robert Rick, who
Speaker 1: casted its like in his office, and I just sat
Speaker 1: on the other side of the desk from him, and
Speaker 1: it was one of those places where the walls are
Speaker 1: really thin, so you can hear what everybody is doing.
Speaker 1: Is this what you're talking about? Yeah, Oh my god,
Speaker 1: those walls are really thin there, and so so awkward. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just awkward on a good day when there's no
Speaker 1: singing singing. And that's how I felt, because I a
Speaker 1: one have terrible nerves auditioning, hate auditioning, and then having
Speaker 1: to sing. Like the first thing to like go when
Speaker 1: you get nervous is your voice, Like vocal cords just
Speaker 1: freeze up and then you can hear what everybody's doing.
Speaker 1: It's just so embarrassing, mortifying. So I went in there.
Speaker 1: I sang let it be. I've never heard of it.
Speaker 1: Let it be. It's a new song the artists. I
Speaker 1: intentionally only prepared like a verse and a chorus because
Speaker 1: the song is so slow, so I was like, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to board them to death. Let me just
Speaker 1: do this. Then I get to the end of the
Speaker 1: chorus and Robert goes like, keep going, keep crying. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I'm a fake fan. I don't know the second verson this,
Speaker 1: and so I don't know what I did. I think
Speaker 1: I sort of stumbled through saying singing this verse verse
Speaker 1: again and then went into the chorse again because I
Speaker 1: knew that um. And then I did the scenes and
Speaker 1: then immediately which also never happen, and he's like, okay,
Speaker 1: so when you come back and started talking about the
Speaker 1: next audition, I was like, what's nice? Okay, great? And
Speaker 1: then I went back two days later to Ryan's office
Speaker 1: at Paramount, and it was it went from being at
Speaker 1: Robert's desk too a boardroom. Basically, it was a full
Speaker 1: table of fifteen people, right, you know, in this gigantic room.
Speaker 1: Brad Ellis, who ended up being on the show and
Speaker 1: playing the piano. He was there. We went early to
Speaker 1: practice our songs with him, and I prepared two songs
Speaker 1: this time, ended up still doing Let It Be. And Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was a full crazy I learned the words. I
Speaker 1: was prepared this time. Yeah, I and again I was
Speaker 1: So it wasn't that I was just I don't think
Speaker 1: I was good at playing the character. I was just
Speaker 1: so nervous that that's what already became. Because I did
Speaker 1: the song. The nerves were already and then I literally
Speaker 1: ran in out of the room and that was it,
Speaker 1: Like I think Ian Brennan, who was runing the creators
Speaker 1: of the show, later he told me he was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: we knew from that immediately we wanted you, but I
Speaker 1: had to wait seven weeks of test because they hadn't
Speaker 1: found anybody else yet. Oh my god. Wow. Then I
Speaker 1: met Jen and I met in l A on the test. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so before we get there. Apparently you just love name
Speaker 1: dropping single first names of famous people. So Steve, for now,
Speaker 1: it's Ryan. Ryan Murphy is who he's talking about, the
Speaker 1: creator of Glee and many other shows. It's as hard
Speaker 1: when you know so many famous people. Brian just call
Speaker 1: me be from now. Well, I was just talking to
Speaker 1: be Um Yeah, and it's not Beyonce. What Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess did she take it first? Impressions are too
Speaker 1: soon at that point, you're you're nervous around a board
Speaker 1: table of of Ryan Murphy and co. Yeah. I don't.
Speaker 1: I just sort of looked like the Last Supper to me,
Speaker 1: where it was a lot of people. I didn't really
Speaker 1: know much about Ryan, I know who he is in
Speaker 1: that in that famous it was it was like it
Speaker 1: did look like the Last Suffer. Okay, stop, that's crazy. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: So you guys test and you meet friendly right away.
Speaker 1: Do you remember meeting each other at the test later on? Yeah,
Speaker 1: we weren't necessarily. I think we were all nervous talking.
Speaker 1: It's one of those things. It's also weird because you're
Speaker 1: in the room with the person you're testing against. Right.
Speaker 1: So there was Chris Colefir, who was testing against himself
Speaker 1: basically for Kurt Hummel, and then there was um Me
Speaker 1: and another girl who tested for Tina, both from New York.
Speaker 1: And then there was Kevin and another person from New
Speaker 1: York also testing for Artie so there are five of
Speaker 1: us in the room. We all arrive. This is our
Speaker 1: first network test ever, all of us for the studio test.
Speaker 1: So we're sitting there in silence, like this is the
Speaker 1: weirdest thing ever. And they're like, and by the way,
Speaker 1: you can't leave until everybody finishes their auditions. You're like,
Speaker 1: what is this jail? And so like it was really weird. Um,
Speaker 1: And then we're all sitting there pretty silently. I had
Speaker 1: just literally flown in on a red eye from a
Speaker 1: show the night before. So I had flown in on
Speaker 1: a red eye. They put me up at the Innercontinental.
Speaker 1: They let me shower, and then I had to walk
Speaker 1: my ass to Fox and get in that room. And
Speaker 1: we're sitting there and all of a sudden you hear like, oh,
Speaker 1: gust of wind, and like Ryan Murphy walks in and
Speaker 1: he's like, hey, guys, are you nervous? Don't be nervous.
Speaker 1: We just want you to be. I feel happy and excited.
Speaker 1: We're nervous as you are. And then like walks away
Speaker 1: and you're like, okay, um, that didn't help. It's in
Speaker 1: and in some weird way it did. He like broke
Speaker 1: the ice a little bit and then we all I
Speaker 1: kind of smiled and laughed at each other and that
Speaker 1: was that is that? Yeah, acknowledging the elephant in the room,
Speaker 1: like this is a good luck so weird, it is
Speaker 1: a weird situation. Anytime I tell I don't even know
Speaker 1: if I've talked about it on this anytime I tell
Speaker 1: people who are not in our industry about that experience,
Speaker 1: which is essentially, you have prenegotiated your life away for
Speaker 1: seven years. Sorry, you have pre negotiated your life away
Speaker 1: potentially for seven years, and it's done as long as
Speaker 1: they signed. Basically, you've signed it away, right, done right,
Speaker 1: They're just hanging on to that piece of paper. And
Speaker 1: if not, you have literally put yourself through a torture
Speaker 1: for no reason. Yeah, you know how much money you'll
Speaker 1: be making. You And for us, we signed included touring
Speaker 1: and albums, merchandizing, really and we were nobody's so we
Speaker 1: had no I no concept. They're like, are you sure
Speaker 1: you want to sign this? I'm like, are you joking?
Speaker 1: Of course I'm going to sign this. You know, prenegotiated
Speaker 1: your tour rights and merchandise because high school musical had
Speaker 1: happened a couple of years before, and they weren't their
Speaker 1: first tour, they weren't locked into a deal, and so
Speaker 1: High School Musical ended up. Those kids made a lot
Speaker 1: of money on tour well, and Fox also had American Idol,
Speaker 1: which they had also like some experience in this like
Speaker 1: this realm, So it was like three sixty Yeah, wow,
Speaker 1: spoiler alert, you both get it. How many years were
Speaker 1: you working together? Six? I mean it was seven years,
Speaker 1: but six seasons because we how we shot it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: six and a half years for a long time, and
Speaker 1: you the two of you close from the beginning or
Speaker 1: was this a relationship that needed time to cook. Close
Speaker 1: from the beginning? Yeah, immediately we were close. There was Chris,
Speaker 1: me Amber and Kevin had been brought together to start
Speaker 1: rehearsing some of the music very early on. We were
Speaker 1: brought out to shoot the pilot, but we were brought out.
Speaker 1: I was brought out from New York weeks before to
Speaker 1: rehearse for the pilot. So it's not like a normal
Speaker 1: TV show where you, you know, have a table read
Speaker 1: and then you show up on the day and you
Speaker 1: start shooting like the pilot. It was like weeks of
Speaker 1: rehearsal before we started this show. So like, don't stop believing.
Speaker 1: There were like five different versions of this song that
Speaker 1: we had rehearsed, and every time Ryan would come in
Speaker 1: and be like not right, and then me and um, yeah.
Speaker 1: And you know, Chris and I had come from Chris
Speaker 1: came from Clovis, California. He like, he drove down and
Speaker 1: stayed in l A. And I had flown out from
Speaker 1: New York. And so we we spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time together, the four of us, because we didn't have
Speaker 1: a lot of friends or anybody in l A. We
Speaker 1: were here solely for Glee. Okay, by the way, I
Speaker 1: have heard stories from some of your crew, how do
Speaker 1: you get these musical numbers done in the number of
Speaker 1: days you have to shoot? We did? How is this achieved?
Speaker 1: Just blood and sweat and tears. The show was always
Speaker 1: scheduled to I mean, our show was normally scheduled to
Speaker 1: shoot for eight days, That's right. I think maybe we
Speaker 1: made eight days a handful of times. Never in those
Speaker 1: six years, I think realistically what ten? Probably ten? Yeah, probably,
Speaker 1: so we would start doubling up on episodes. But the
Speaker 1: musical numbers they had to basically any time the you
Speaker 1: know quotes, the adults Matt Morrison or Jane Lynch anytime
Speaker 1: they were filming, and then we weren't with them. We
Speaker 1: were in dance rehearsal or the recording studio. Like sometimes,
Speaker 1: you know, your lunch break involves you getting in a
Speaker 1: car and eating all the way to the recording studio,
Speaker 1: putting down a song for a half hour, turning around
Speaker 1: and getting back into touch ups to go back to set.
Speaker 1: So it was intent they didn't you didn't have a
Speaker 1: recording studio on you that would have really actually helped,
Speaker 1: but very expensive. They're very expensive, and we didn't spend
Speaker 1: a ton of time at their recording studio. You'd be
Speaker 1: pretty unless you were doing like a you know, a
Speaker 1: massive solo song like you were, you were in and
Speaker 1: out pretty the beginning. You spent more time there was,
Speaker 1: for some reason, more time. So as it got going,
Speaker 1: we would later on as the years and by that's
Speaker 1: when we'd have like those very quick lunch break turn
Speaker 1: around things. But the first thirteen episodes of the first season,
Speaker 1: we were sometimes in the recording studio for like half
Speaker 1: a day because everyone was still figuring out the formula
Speaker 1: was right. Yeah, So you know, once we got through
Speaker 1: that then there were demo singers who were doing each
Speaker 1: of our parts, and all that was planned out before
Speaker 1: we ever entered, so we were just going in and
Speaker 1: copying somebody to save time. But those early days, Adamanders
Speaker 1: who was the music producer, and yeah, Ryan would be
Speaker 1: there and they're figuring out our voices, what can our
Speaker 1: voices do, who sounds best together? That sort of thing.
Speaker 1: So the musical numbers essentially like logistically as you as
Speaker 1: we got into them, they they built the stage to
Speaker 1: scale from the stages we shot on the auditorium that
Speaker 1: we shot on in Long Beach, because the first season
Speaker 1: we were driving back and forth the Long Beach in
Speaker 1: order to do musical numbers and we were exhausted. And
Speaker 1: so was the second season or back now yeah, it
Speaker 1: was no. They had finished it like four or five
Speaker 1: episodes into season two. They built us the stages, thank god,
Speaker 1: the auditorium, and essentially, as guest directors would come in
Speaker 1: new ones that weren't returning, they would have to kind
Speaker 1: of learn the formula of how to get this done.
Speaker 1: And it was very much like a pain by numbers
Speaker 1: at that point, like camera new you go, you start
Speaker 1: from the back, you get the crane. If you want it,
Speaker 1: you move up. You get the two on the side,
Speaker 1: We get the dolly, we get the steady, we bring
Speaker 1: the steadicam on stage. You turn it around, you get
Speaker 1: their reactions, you get behind our legs and our feet,
Speaker 1: and then you're out and it. It essentially started to
Speaker 1: take like a seven eight hour day scene to do
Speaker 1: a musical number versus Don't Stop. That took like a
Speaker 1: day and a half. Yeah, I remember. The goal was
Speaker 1: always a try to finish one of those big musical
Speaker 1: numbers by lunch, but we'd always have to come back
Speaker 1: and do turn Around. Yeah, turn around or something like that. Yeah. Wow. Um,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of but there's a lot of talk
Speaker 1: on Reddit. What would you say is the craziest Glee
Speaker 1: storyline of all time? Kevin as an STD Yeah to
Speaker 1: me talking about STDs um um, the you know, I
Speaker 1: have to say, I mean in the very beginning, like
Speaker 1: the hysterical pregnancy was pretty crazy, like that was that
Speaker 1: was a wild story. And then plotting to steal a
Speaker 1: student's baby, like you know, that happened immediately, like there
Speaker 1: was no time. That's just part of Glee. That's just baked,
Speaker 1: baked in this is a pretty wild one. What about
Speaker 1: Quinn getting in a car accident that was going to
Speaker 1: be my second one and then being in a wheelchair
Speaker 1: for a while, so like her and already got some
Speaker 1: time together and then she magically healed and was okay,
Speaker 1: and I'm saying I'm still standing, which was very uncomfortable
Speaker 1: and cringe e. That was a really weird one. That
Speaker 1: was that was weird. Um, I have I have a quiz. Well,
Speaker 1: we're going to fail, so we're definitely gonna fail Glee Pilot.
Speaker 1: Addition to Truth and a Lie, actually pilot, we know,
Speaker 1: I think all right? To Truths and a Lie. Number one,
Speaker 1: Emma's parents were Ginger supremacists. To fail Will Schuster belly
Speaker 1: danced in the library. Three there was a school riot
Speaker 1: about a tater top band in the cafeteria. To truth
Speaker 1: and a lie. What's the lie? I think? I have
Speaker 1: a guess, Jenna, do you have a guess? I'll think
Speaker 1: The second one, um belly dancing. The belly dancing was
Speaker 1: you're saying the belly dancing never happened? Yeah, sorry, that
Speaker 1: wasn't just in my imagination? Correct, you win really embarrassed? No,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't have been I would fail many many A quizzes,
Speaker 1: but that was fun. I gotta bring that back. Great
Speaker 1: job producers coming up with that one. I like the
Speaker 1: looks on your faces, your care and shock. Um, you
Speaker 1: guys are going back. You're going back to school. It's right,
Speaker 1: there was a transition. We're massochists. We are listen, listen
Speaker 1: now I do this. Uh, you're going back to school
Speaker 1: and that's what you really missed. New podcast. Are you
Speaker 1: having fun? You're back together, So that's good, which is great.
Speaker 1: It's always great. It's easy with each other, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: now we are, We're enjoying it. We're enjoying the podcast.
Speaker 1: Obviously we've done this before, so it's um an interesting idea,
Speaker 1: but we're grateful to be reimagining and rebranding. And this
Speaker 1: take is a bit more intentional and a bit more
Speaker 1: honest and raw and open about people's experiences on the show.
Speaker 1: And you know, we're just kind of taking a deeper dive.
Speaker 1: So it's definitely, yes, we are enjoying ourselves. And you're
Speaker 1: you're doing a benefit. I understand raising fund and awareness. Well,
Speaker 1: you had a cast mate, do you want to talk
Speaker 1: about Nya Rivera a little bit yeah, cast mate Nay Rivera,
Speaker 1: who passed away a couple of years ago. She was
Speaker 1: a big supporter of Alexandria House, which is an incredible
Speaker 1: um local l a organization that helps women and children
Speaker 1: who are in need of transitional housing. And after she
Speaker 1: passed away, we you know, we're looking for anything to
Speaker 1: do to do good and also sort of honor her
Speaker 1: memory amongst us, you know, her co workers and friends.
Speaker 1: And she used to throw these crazy, amazing Christmas parties
Speaker 1: called Snicks because her nickname was Snacks and they were
Speaker 1: like extravagant she did every year. After all the crew
Speaker 1: and cast like carol ers at the front, there was
Speaker 1: Sandy's lay, There was like the DJ was in a
Speaker 1: tower at one point, like they made it dance studio
Speaker 1: of the dance floor like it was. She I was like,
Speaker 1: when did who negotiated your contract? Because truly, I think
Speaker 1: I'm gonna spend this much more. I was like, why nobody?
Speaker 1: She loved hosting a part. Okay, so snakes Moss was
Speaker 1: an annual event, and so we thought, what better way
Speaker 1: than for the Holidays to raise funds for Alexandria House,
Speaker 1: keep nives memory alive and keep snick Smiths alive. UM
Speaker 1: and so yeah, yeah, it's and it's it's their third
Speaker 1: which I can't believe we're already at our third. Snick
Speaker 1: smith and this year, you know, I heard has been
Speaker 1: incredibly generous to allow us to use their theater in
Speaker 1: Burbank and we are doing our first in person event
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles on December six and then December eighth,
Speaker 1: where it's going to be live stream for those who
Speaker 1: can't make it, UM and all the live streamers who
Speaker 1: have been there with us over zoom the last couple
Speaker 1: of years as well. Like this is really a grassroots operation,
Speaker 1: is what we call it. There's no donation that is
Speaker 1: too small. UM. I think the first year we raised
Speaker 1: over a hundred thousand dollars and the average donation amount
Speaker 1: was probably ten dollars, so it was pretty UM. That's incredible. Yeah,
Speaker 1: pretty mind blowing. So we're really excited about it. December
Speaker 1: the six, seven o'clock the I Heart Theater there in
Speaker 1: what is Johnny Carson used to say, beautiful downtown Burbank. Um. Congratulations,
Speaker 1: thanks you guys for doing that. I'm excited for you.
Speaker 1: Everyone's talking about the podcast. Congratulations on that I'm glad
Speaker 1: you guys are back together and doing it's really it's
Speaker 1: really fun and it's great to see both of you again.
Speaker 1: Let's do it. Let's do it more often. Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1: Thanks for having us, So we should have you know,
Speaker 1: there was an episode of the Office where they referenced
Speaker 1: my character on Glee. Yeah, maybe we need to have
Speaker 1: you come on to our show and we can talk
Speaker 1: about that episode. Now he's crossed over. Is that the
Speaker 1: viewing party where we have a blue viewing party? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I love it. Yeah, it was really meta and I
Speaker 1: loved it and I appreciated it. All I can remember
Speaker 1: right now is I think that's where I ate pigs
Speaker 1: and a blanket and a blanket. Yeah, that sounds familiar
Speaker 1: to me. Yeah, and you know, and thank you again.
Speaker 1: Like you you were also so great to me when
Speaker 1: I was on that show, and it really helped me
Speaker 1: and informed me how when I became a regular on
Speaker 1: a show too, hopefully be you know, a fraction as
Speaker 1: accommodating and welcoming as you guys were to meet so well,
Speaker 1: thanks for that. No, and you know, I could make
Speaker 1: a joke right now, but I but I won't because
Speaker 1: I think it's no, no, because I think, honest to God, look,
Speaker 1: we were we were a cast of grown ups, if
Speaker 1: you will. And I guess what I mean by that
Speaker 1: is so many of us had failed pilots or had
Speaker 1: been in the theater, and so everybody felt grateful and
Speaker 1: lucky to be there, and a lot of us had
Speaker 1: been on the other side of it and knew how
Speaker 1: that felt. And it's like, I know, this is what
Speaker 1: I always says. It takes just as much energy to
Speaker 1: be nice as it does to be an asshole, So
Speaker 1: why not choose that? And ultimately it's a better work environment, right,
Speaker 1: So thank you for saying that. Congrats you guys, thank
Speaker 1: you for doing this Nick Smith stuff. And uh, happy
Speaker 1: holidays you too. See you in the new year. Thank you.
Speaker 1: Thanks Jenna Kevin, thank you so much for joining me today.
Speaker 1: It was great catching up. You're awesome. I can't wait
Speaker 1: to listen to your new podcast. And thank you for
Speaker 1: keeping the snick s Mus spirit alive Mary snicks Mus Everyone, listeners,
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoyed the episode. I'm gonna see you
Speaker 1: next week for another interview on Off the Beat. It's
Speaker 1: going to be a good one. More stories, more laughs,
Speaker 1: more of everything. I'll catch you. Then we're coming into
Speaker 1: the holiday season. Who could it be? Maybe Santa Off.
Speaker 1: The Beat is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner,
Speaker 1: alongside our executive producer Langley. Our senior producer is Diego Tapia.
Speaker 1: Our producers are Liz Hayes, Hannah Harris, and Emily Carr.
Speaker 1: Our talent producer is Ryan Papa Zachary, and our intern
Speaker 1: is Sammy Cats. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed
Speaker 1: by the one and only Creed Bratton M