Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week Inside from the reporters and
Speaker 1: editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus
Speaker 1: global business, finance and tech news as it happened Sloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim
Speaker 1: Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Hi, everyone, Welcome to the weekend
Speaker 1: edition of Bloomberg Business Week. A hawkish round of FED speakers,
Speaker 1: including Chair J. Powell, created another round of volatility in
Speaker 1: financial markets as they concerned over the ongoing war in
Speaker 1: Ukraine and also COVID cases on an upswing because of
Speaker 1: the omencron b A two sub variant. All of that
Speaker 1: tim are backdrop this week, and on that last point,
Speaker 1: just about the latest variant coming up our story on
Speaker 1: our new state of uncertainty around vaccines, questioning their long
Speaker 1: term efficacy and which variance new boosters should target. We're
Speaker 1: all gonna get a lot more shots, aren't we. Yeah?
Speaker 1: I think so? All right, feels that way. It's also
Speaker 1: the equality issue of Bloomberg Business Week. We'll hear about
Speaker 1: efforts to end weight discrimination in the workplace and the
Speaker 1: wish from more diversity on Wall Street. All of that
Speaker 1: ahead We begin though, with our editors round table and
Speaker 1: the story of Silicon Valley's wealthiest Russian. You're A Milner
Speaker 1: is a venture capitalist who built a three point nine
Speaker 1: billion dollar fortune thanks to early funding from Kremlin connected sources,
Speaker 1: but he says that's all in the past. Business Week
Speaker 1: editor Joel Webber and Bloomberg News venture capital reporter Sarah
Speaker 1: McBride joining us to explain how Milner is working to
Speaker 1: distance himself from Vladimir Putin. You're A Milner is a
Speaker 1: huge name in the VC world, um, Airbnb, Ali Baba, Twitter, Facebook,
Speaker 1: Woll mentioned some mothers soon. These are huge companies. He
Speaker 1: was very early and basically helping build them, and that
Speaker 1: money was connected to m to the Kremlin, people close
Speaker 1: to the Kremlin, and Urie has been sort of like
Speaker 1: one of the main people that we've been wanting to
Speaker 1: talk to ever since Russia invaded Ukraine. And then Sarah
Speaker 1: got an amazing access to him and spent some time
Speaker 1: talking to him and would you learn so well. He
Speaker 1: is a little bit frustrated. He says he's never met
Speaker 1: President Putin. He cut pie for the Russia years ago.
Speaker 1: The biggest backer he had with the Magnet called Alisha
Speaker 1: usman Off and he says he hasn't even um met
Speaker 1: with him and at least five years. So he says
Speaker 1: he's doing what he can to put some distance between
Speaker 1: himself and uh, these Kremlin connected sources that in this
Speaker 1: kind of atmosphere where there's so much animosity toward Russia
Speaker 1: there behind this bloody war, any type of tie comes
Speaker 1: under scrutiny. So he's gonna touch position. And I asked
Speaker 1: him whether if he could go back in time, if
Speaker 1: he would still take that money. Just got him in
Speaker 1: so much hot water now And it was interesting. He's
Speaker 1: such a scientist, she said, I can't go back in time,
Speaker 1: haven't you, said, Albert, I'm seine, you can't get back.
Speaker 1: You can go forward only. And I was like, okay, okay,
Speaker 1: well what about if you could? And he was like, no, no,
Speaker 1: I can't kick the money. It's in the past, it's done.
Speaker 1: I've got to deal with it kind of thing. So
Speaker 1: his his chateau has always been the center of Silicon
Speaker 1: Valley action, um really memorable parties through the years. There's
Speaker 1: also a number of people in that world, in the
Speaker 1: VC world who are speaking up to back him up right,
Speaker 1: who are some of the people that you you heard from. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's got some very loyal friends. UM. Perhaps the most
Speaker 1: prominent is Mark and Jason, another venture capitalist who's also
Speaker 1: backed Facebook since early days, who had March first tweeted
Speaker 1: how how highly he thinks that Ury Milmer and and
Speaker 1: he thinks very moment is a very high integrity person. UM.
Speaker 1: There were other people who, once they reached out to
Speaker 1: him and asked, what do you think if you're a
Speaker 1: mimer sent me messages saying to say, also think he
Speaker 1: hasn't been anything wrong and how highly they can get
Speaker 1: his ethics. Among them, I spoke to Lyon Peterson, who
Speaker 1: learns a unicorn company called flex Sport. The just back
Speaker 1: Uri very very strongly. There's another Ukrainian um born entrepreneur.
Speaker 1: He learns a company called the firm, Max Lundin. Um.
Speaker 1: There were a lot of people who were willing to
Speaker 1: stand up for Urie. Sarah, you got incredible access to Urie.
Speaker 1: Can we say hours and hours on zoom? What was that?
Speaker 1: What was it like talking to him? I mean, give
Speaker 1: us an idea of the conversation, what he was like
Speaker 1: to take us into how the sausage was made. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've known him not well, but I have known him
Speaker 1: for a long time, and the first time I met him,
Speaker 1: he just sat down and talked about all his science initiatives,
Speaker 1: because definitely to being an incredibly savvy investor, used to
Speaker 1: study physics, and he has a deep interest in science,
Speaker 1: in particular outer space. Instead of building a rocket company,
Speaker 1: he's been fending off his basic science, in particular search
Speaker 1: to see if there's extra terrestrial life, which you know,
Speaker 1: to me just founded cookie, but he's taking it very
Speaker 1: seriously and he's got all these scientific endeavors to try
Speaker 1: to figure that out. So I think he saw that
Speaker 1: I was interested in that part of his work, and
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, that is what made him feel comfortable
Speaker 1: talking to me over the phone. That it wasn't entirely
Speaker 1: comfortable because I had to ask him all these uncomfortable
Speaker 1: questions about Russia, and if you know how they knew
Speaker 1: for sure there was no further Russian money and the
Speaker 1: funds than what they were doing to and comply with
Speaker 1: no your customer. But yeah, he was sitting in a
Speaker 1: hotel room in Dubai on zoom and you know, I
Speaker 1: was in the office one time, I was at home
Speaker 1: one time. You know, at different places in my apartment,
Speaker 1: and uh, it was just very interesting. And at first,
Speaker 1: you know, he wanted to keep it very um much
Speaker 1: by the facts. And then on a subsequent phone call,
Speaker 1: he pulled out a photograph of himself as a kid
Speaker 1: in Ukraine. And then I asked him as he could
Speaker 1: use that photograph in the article because it just spoke
Speaker 1: so powerfully. I had no idea, but apparently its father
Speaker 1: is from Ukraine, and so you're he spent a lot
Speaker 1: of time as a kid visiting relatives in Ukraine, and
Speaker 1: he was telling me how they still had family friends
Speaker 1: there that he was helping to rescue this recently, as
Speaker 1: over the weekend, that was Bloomberg News Venture Capital reporter
Speaker 1: Sarah McBride along with a Bloomberg Business Week editor Joel
Speaker 1: Weber coming up. Our editor's roundtable continues, taking us to
Speaker 1: Hong Kong and how it went from COVID zero to
Speaker 1: one of the world's deadliest outbreaks, plus how college athletes
Speaker 1: are making cash and what's becoming more than five million
Speaker 1: dollar business. That was quick. That was really quick. I
Speaker 1: mean we're talking within hours of that ruling, right, Isn't
Speaker 1: that amazing? Amazing? Makes you realize how much was like
Speaker 1: in the works just waiting. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week.
Speaker 1: It is marked madness too. Let's not forget this is Bloomberg.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Quick Takes Tim Stinovik from Bloomberg Radio. The city that
Speaker 1: had kept the pandemic at bay for nearly two years
Speaker 1: now finds itself with an unprecedented outbreak gathering pace and
Speaker 1: college athletes are finally getting to cash in. Two more
Speaker 1: stories we tackled in this week's editor's round Table. First up, though,
Speaker 1: we go to Hong Kong, which has seen over five
Speaker 1: thousand COVID fatality since the start of the year in
Speaker 1: what's being called one of the deadliest outbreaks the entire pandemics.
Speaker 1: Pretty amazing. For that story, we got more with Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week editor Joe Weber and the reporter who wrote it,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg News Senior Asia Government reporter Ian Marlowe. The situation
Speaker 1: in Hong Kong is in right now is even more
Speaker 1: stark because we basically have style outbreak happening in after
Speaker 1: two years of everything that the world has learned about
Speaker 1: the pandemic after you know, well over a year of
Speaker 1: being able to kind of roll out vaccines and again,
Speaker 1: Hong Kong in just the city, it's it's it's it's
Speaker 1: a big one, seven point four million roughly, but its
Speaker 1: vaccination rates were way lower than you know, large fully
Speaker 1: sized countries. And as the vaccination process unfolded, I think
Speaker 1: there was a feeling that it was going to take
Speaker 1: some kind of scary situation, some kind of outbreak for
Speaker 1: people to actually be frightened into getting the shot. And
Speaker 1: that was unfortunately what happened here. And you know, Hong
Speaker 1: Kong is ultra dense, a lot of high rises. It
Speaker 1: just raced again through this city and through a lot
Speaker 1: of the elderly care homes. So it's even more tragic.
Speaker 1: I think that they were unable to push through a
Speaker 1: profit vaccination program for this, and that they actually let
Speaker 1: a lot of politics, uh get in the way of
Speaker 1: that whole. I want to stick on the on the
Speaker 1: politics side of this end, because all of this happening,
Speaker 1: well in the background, we're seeing a massive transformation of
Speaker 1: Hong Kong. China's role in Hong Kong changing significantly in
Speaker 1: the last couple of years and I'm wondering how we
Speaker 1: should read into that at a time when the world
Speaker 1: is watching. Yeah, I mean, I think it's been an
Speaker 1: unprecedented period of volatility for Hong Kong, starting with sometimes
Speaker 1: violent democracy protests in twenty nineteen that captured the world's attention,
Speaker 1: and then was swiftly followed by both the pandemic and
Speaker 1: a gradual crackdown on Hong Kong that saw the National
Speaker 1: Security legislation put in place that basically effectively banned the
Speaker 1: sent Um and led to the arrest and jailing of
Speaker 1: the entire political opposition UH and then an overhaul of
Speaker 1: the city's elections which prevented anyone with anti government views
Speaker 1: from basically running for office. And so what you've had
Speaker 1: in Hong Kong is the sort of denuding of the
Speaker 1: political land, gif of any sort of person who can
Speaker 1: put their hand up and say things, aren't you going
Speaker 1: very well right now? I mean, China has come out
Speaker 1: and said, you know, the state broadcaster G, President G
Speaker 1: instructing officials to put people in life at the forefront.
Speaker 1: Will anything change? Will anything get better? Hong Kong just
Speaker 1: the other day relaxed a couple of rules. They said
Speaker 1: they're lifting a flight van on you know, Americans, Canadians
Speaker 1: and Brits, and they're reducing the two week mandatory quarantine
Speaker 1: to seven days. But in general it does not look
Speaker 1: like they are relaxing in any way that sort of
Speaker 1: broader COVID zero approach that mainland China has. So it's
Speaker 1: a huge powder keg. And I think Chinese officials are
Speaker 1: looking at Hong Kong and saying this is proof that
Speaker 1: we can't relax, and I think Hong Kong largely agrees
Speaker 1: with that, So I don't think there's going to be
Speaker 1: any major changes. That's Bloomberg News Senior Asia Government reporter
Speaker 1: Ian Marlowe Joe staying with us once again as we
Speaker 1: get to another Business Week story with a timely peg
Speaker 1: amid and seed ap a March madness. Well, college athletes
Speaker 1: are finally making cash from meeting greets and marketing deals.
Speaker 1: The n C double A lifting its athletes name, image
Speaker 1: and likeness restrictions just last June and since then the
Speaker 1: player deals well, they have created a more than five
Speaker 1: hundred million dollar business and counting. Bloomberg News Global Business
Speaker 1: reporter Ira Boudway wrote the story along with Bloomberg's kimbas
Speaker 1: seen Ira joined us along with Business Week editor Doole Weber.
Speaker 1: What's really interesting about this is that for the for
Speaker 1: some of the most prominent athletes who have massive social
Speaker 1: media following, that can actually mean a lot of money,
Speaker 1: but for everybody else it starts to look a little paltry,
Speaker 1: And I think that disparity is really interesting. Wait, are
Speaker 1: you going to make fun of the bloomen onion can
Speaker 1: onion which I was going to explain in a second.
Speaker 1: The other thing that it's created is this whole cottage
Speaker 1: industry that surrounds athletes from advisors and agents on down
Speaker 1: who are also you know, cashing in on it. So Ira,
Speaker 1: explain who you talk to and how many bloomen onions
Speaker 1: you while reporting the story. We talked to athletes, We
Speaker 1: talked to athletic directors, we talked to agents, We talked
Speaker 1: to this platform Open Doors, that's sort of a marketplace
Speaker 1: connecting athletes and brands. We talked to uh, the chief
Speaker 1: marketing officer of bloom and Brands. They have long done
Speaker 1: deals around March Madness. They created the three point bloomen
Speaker 1: onion for March Madness, and they were one of the
Speaker 1: first big brands to do a deal with a large
Speaker 1: group of players, first in football in the fall and
Speaker 1: now in basketball, and they created meals. So C. J.
Speaker 1: Strout of Ohio State had his special meal that included
Speaker 1: the Bloomin onion. But yeah, that is right. There's a
Speaker 1: huge disparity here from top to bottom in this market.
Speaker 1: As you were saying, if it really sort of there's
Speaker 1: football and there's everything else, and really there's SEC football
Speaker 1: and there's everything else. As we were reporting this, there
Speaker 1: was The Athletic had a story about a recruit coming
Speaker 1: into the University of Tennessee who was offered an eight
Speaker 1: million dollar package and that has got that is basically
Speaker 1: for a series of amitments, right to show up at events,
Speaker 1: meet and greets, to hand over all of his name,
Speaker 1: image likeness rights like his you know, they can use
Speaker 1: his face, his name on whatever they want for a
Speaker 1: limited time, I guess or wise. Yeah, So that deal
Speaker 1: is interesting because it pays out over years and and
Speaker 1: you're not allowed to stipulate in these contracts that they
Speaker 1: have to be at a certain school. So this one's
Speaker 1: from a donor collective, which is a group of boosters
Speaker 1: who get together, pool their money and try to make
Speaker 1: sure that the players at their favorite school have the
Speaker 1: sweetest n i L deals. But the problem is they
Speaker 1: can't officially say this is for coming to our school.
Speaker 1: So this is where it gets really murky, really fast
Speaker 1: sports for so long, right, the separation I feel like
Speaker 1: a church and state a little bit like keeping it
Speaker 1: pure if you're not a coach or the school making
Speaker 1: ten million bucks a year. And this is the problem, right,
Speaker 1: there's huge money in collegiate sports, So how do we
Speaker 1: make sure it kind of still stays clean? Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I think the thing to remember is that for most athletes,
Speaker 1: for the tens of thousands of athletes who are now
Speaker 1: able to make pocket money from this, it really doesn't
Speaker 1: change that sort of sense of amateurism impurity. They can
Speaker 1: now go and do entrepreneurial things like teach a class
Speaker 1: online and get money for it or give someone a
Speaker 1: shout out, which is great because a lot of these guys,
Speaker 1: and you putting your story like some of them were
Speaker 1: living on like no money. Right, if you're a player,
Speaker 1: you don't have resources. Remember top Ramen you right, And
Speaker 1: these guys they don't have time to have a side job.
Speaker 1: A lot of the time so they are doing their sport,
Speaker 1: they're doing school, and they're cash strapped, many of them.
Speaker 1: And this is a way to on a Saturday. You
Speaker 1: bang out four or five commitments, you send a TikTok
Speaker 1: whatever it is that you promised to do, and now
Speaker 1: you've got a few hundred, maybe a few thousand dollars
Speaker 1: in your pocket, which is a big deal for a
Speaker 1: college kid. Our thanks to the editor of Business Week,
Speaker 1: Joe Webber, along with Bloomberg News Global business reporter Ira Boudway,
Speaker 1: venture capital reporter sharaon McBride, and senior Asia government reporter
Speaker 1: Ian marlow Well Ian Marlowe's story covering the COVID surgeon
Speaker 1: Hong Kong in part because of that low vaccination rate
Speaker 1: there well. Speaking of vaccines, coming up next the Big
Speaker 1: Farmer Free for all when it comes to boosters until
Speaker 1: there's a universal vaccine, Get ready for more shots. This
Speaker 1: is Bloomberg broadcasting from the financial capital of the World,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven Frio in New York to Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: Bloomberg to Boston, Bloomberg one oh six one to San Francisco,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg nine sixty to the country. Sirius XM CHADO one
Speaker 1: nine team and around the globe, the Bloomberg Business app
Speaker 1: and Bloomberg Radio dot com. This is Bloomberg Business Week.
Speaker 1: But a third of US COVID cases are now attributed
Speaker 1: to the omicron BA to sub variant that from the
Speaker 1: U S c d C just this past week. And well,
Speaker 1: current vaccines are holding up pretty well against the latest strain.
Speaker 1: Figuring out which variants future COVID boosters should target and
Speaker 1: when the shots might be needed is a murky work
Speaker 1: in progress. Well, tim one thing for certain, get ready
Speaker 1: for more shots. We hear more from Business Week editor
Speaker 1: Joe Webber still with US and Bloomberg News healthcare reporter
Speaker 1: Bob Blaine Grave. So it's all really kind of complicated
Speaker 1: and confusing scenario there, and I think that's why the
Speaker 1: f DAY is having, you know, this meeting on April
Speaker 1: six is kind of hash out, kind of with their advisors,
Speaker 1: kind of just general strategy going forward of this meeting
Speaker 1: they're having, you know, isn't even like considering the five
Speaker 1: mgennals applications which they put in emergency approval of fourth
Speaker 1: shot for adults in the US. They're just like talk
Speaker 1: to the general freight American general strategy, who should get
Speaker 1: a fourth shot when? Potentially and then the other question
Speaker 1: they're going to look at it like when should you
Speaker 1: switch the composition of vaccine? When is it drifted and mutiated?
Speaker 1: Was when of the virus drifted and mutated enough that
Speaker 1: we need to alter update the compositions of vaccine And
Speaker 1: that's a totally unsettled issue UH as well. So we
Speaker 1: have the potential that there could be some sort of
Speaker 1: emergency approval of a fourth shot of the existing five
Speaker 1: certain majournal vaccines in the US. Certainly we see you know,
Speaker 1: other countries starting to do that for older people, and
Speaker 1: that's already allowed in the US for immunecompromised people, and
Speaker 1: I think given the Fiser and Maderna applications, was potential
Speaker 1: of you know, for an expansion of that at least
Speaker 1: in some age groups. But then both fires and Maderna
Speaker 1: are also testing on the con specific UH vaccines UH,
Speaker 1: and results from that those could come in in a
Speaker 1: few weeks through a couple of months, and that could
Speaker 1: provide you know, yet another update and get another sound
Speaker 1: of application. So it's just a super complicated situation right now,
Speaker 1: and kind of the answers aren't totally clear, but Bobby,
Speaker 1: it also sounds like something that you're explaining is similar
Speaker 1: to what we see with a flu shot each and
Speaker 1: every year, and the way that a flu shot is
Speaker 1: developed and changed in order to go after whatever variant
Speaker 1: of the flu is expected. So couldn't it just be
Speaker 1: that we enter a world where every year we're getting
Speaker 1: some sort of booster. I mean, after all, it was
Speaker 1: you know, about a year ago when we got our
Speaker 1: first chronic vaccines to this. Yeah, that's kind of one
Speaker 1: scenario that's out there that both the drug companies uh
Speaker 1: A Visor and MA journals kind of been talking about.
Speaker 1: Is the kind of one sort of model for the
Speaker 1: way things will shake out. You know, what doesn't exist
Speaker 1: right now is any sort of consensus like there is
Speaker 1: with the flu shot of you know, how often shots
Speaker 1: should be updated and kind of with what there's no
Speaker 1: the flu we have that there's a World Health Organization
Speaker 1: body that analyzes flu strain from around the world and
Speaker 1: then twice a year that come together to kind of
Speaker 1: make some general recommendations what should be in the next
Speaker 1: year's flu shot, and then that's generally followed by the
Speaker 1: drug companies. Right now, there is no, you know, such
Speaker 1: consensus and the public health authorities. So it's kind of
Speaker 1: like a free for all by the drug companies trying
Speaker 1: to get ahead of things and figure out, you know,
Speaker 1: what what we might need and what they might be
Speaker 1: able to sell. I mean, Bob, that's the point, right,
Speaker 1: we don't even kind of know what it's going to be,
Speaker 1: right that we would need to vaccinate against. Right, is
Speaker 1: it a sub variant? Is it what? I mean, what
Speaker 1: is it? We just don't know exactly, you know, I
Speaker 1: just don't know. And so one of the things they are,
Speaker 1: both companies fising Majournal are testing the vaccine that would
Speaker 1: have a little bit of amicron in it, that strain
Speaker 1: specific vaccine against omicron, a little bit of the existing vaccine,
Speaker 1: kind of hybrid vaccine with the idea that we don't
Speaker 1: know what's going to be out there, so a little
Speaker 1: bit of bit old, a little bit of new. So
Speaker 1: that's a possible scenario that you could be getting that
Speaker 1: shot in the fall, and you know fall that raises
Speaker 1: that other question of like, you know, basically, how long
Speaker 1: is any of this going to take? Right, and by
Speaker 1: this time that fall comes there, if we've already seen
Speaker 1: you know, we're on our third vary in the last
Speaker 1: six months, Like who knows where it could be by
Speaker 1: the fall, right, Yeah, I mean exactly, No one knows
Speaker 1: what's going to be out there in the fall of
Speaker 1: the winter. Uh. And that's why there's definitely a very
Speaker 1: strong contingent researcher to say, you know, we're always going
Speaker 1: to be hindh going to be behind the eight ball
Speaker 1: chasing variants, and we really need to have a much
Speaker 1: more conservative effort, uh focused effort in coming up with,
Speaker 1: you know, a universal vaccine that would protect against you know,
Speaker 1: multiple coronavirus strains and multiple types of coronavirus. Is so
Speaker 1: you only need to get that one, so maybe twice,
Speaker 1: and we need to change our focus more to that.
Speaker 1: But it's still always off that kind of universal vaccine
Speaker 1: which we all want. Well, what what we do know
Speaker 1: is and I was struck by and I know the
Speaker 1: amount of money that these drug companies have read that
Speaker 1: and you said, wait a second viserder eight billion in
Speaker 1: sales for Visor's vaccine Maderna. I guess it was like
Speaker 1: almost eighteen billion. I mean it's a lot of money.
Speaker 1: We get it government support, Like this is all fueling it.
Speaker 1: It's big money for these guys. Oh yeah, it's enormous money.
Speaker 1: And there's a tremendous tremendous financial incentive for you know,
Speaker 1: coming up the model that they can sell round continuous
Speaker 1: rounds of new vaccines every you know, six months to
Speaker 1: a year. So they both companies have a tremendous tremendous
Speaker 1: financial incentive and convincing either people or at least governments
Speaker 1: that they need to continually buy more and more vaccines
Speaker 1: because right now these like the biggest selling products in
Speaker 1: the medical parts in the world and they want to
Speaker 1: keep it going. That was Business Week utor Joe Webber
Speaker 1: and Blueberg News healthcare reporter Bob Lingred. You're listening to
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Week. Still to come diversity on Wall Street
Speaker 1: or should we say a lack thereof? Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: you got something there, Operation Hopes CEO John Hope, Bryant
Speaker 1: Marcus Shaw, CEO of Alt Finance on their collective efforts.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with
Speaker 1: Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio,
Speaker 1: The curinash of Bloomberg Business we get a special double issue.
Speaker 1: It's the equality issue, and it coincides with this past
Speaker 1: week's Bloomberg Live Equality Summit. The dual shocks of the
Speaker 1: pandemic and a profound reckoning on race led to greater
Speaker 1: calls for racial and economic equity. Here we are two
Speaker 1: years later, So how are we doing and what more
Speaker 1: is needed when it comes to accountability and action. Well,
Speaker 1: based on a lot of those conversations at the summit,
Speaker 1: there's a lot more to be done. We tackled all
Speaker 1: of this at the summit where I caught up with
Speaker 1: Marcus Shawn he's the CEO AL Finance Corporation, and John
Speaker 1: Hope Ryan, founder chairman and CEO of Operation ho. We
Speaker 1: talked about efforts to boost diverse representation on Wall Street.
Speaker 1: Why are the board room sixty five year old white men?
Speaker 1: Because I went to school with that dude. I chase
Speaker 1: girls with that dude. It's not competence is trust, it's
Speaker 1: comfort zones, so you you hang out with your boys. Unfortunately,
Speaker 1: but by the way, black people do this too. We
Speaker 1: just unfortunately, if you hang around nine broke people, you'll
Speaker 1: be the tenth. So a lot of a lot of
Speaker 1: black poles to hang out in places where are not
Speaker 1: We're not. It's not creating wealth, but we hang out
Speaker 1: with each other, and we all need to get out
Speaker 1: of our comfort zones. Number two Bill Clinton. President Bill
Speaker 1: Clinton once said, it's hard to get somebody to agree
Speaker 1: to the truth when the lies paying their paycheck. And
Speaker 1: you know the big example that is a prime mortgage
Speaker 1: crisis two thousand nine. When the lies paying your paycheck,
Speaker 1: you rationalize, which is how rational lies. The lie is
Speaker 1: we have equality. The lie is that the opportunity is
Speaker 1: going around. It's you know, because it's working for you.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, okay, Marcus, come on in a decade,
Speaker 1: st Um, you were at one point the soul accrued
Speaker 1: for Bank of America. So yeah, it is a lonely feeling. Um.
Speaker 1: Wall Street has not had a tradition of building a
Speaker 1: lot of diversity in the workforce, particularly on the investment
Speaker 1: side of the business. Those things are changing, and so
Speaker 1: you have many of the leaders, the first people that
Speaker 1: were the first woman, the first black person, the first
Speaker 1: minority on their desk or in their department. Many of
Speaker 1: those people are only fourty or fifty years old in
Speaker 1: this business. When you ask about what's different is we
Speaker 1: are now entering, I believe a third wave of civil rights,
Speaker 1: which is being led really by the private sector. The
Speaker 1: government has done a lot and continues to do more.
Speaker 1: We saw that the House just past the Crown Act, right,
Speaker 1: so things are changing in real time. But in order
Speaker 1: to accelerate that change, the private sector. You, I, everybody
Speaker 1: in the crowd is doing our part and putting pressure
Speaker 1: on private sector leaders to say we need to do
Speaker 1: more in order to actually understand and understand how we
Speaker 1: can make this a more equitable environment. What he said, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: this is a third reconstruction. But keep in mind we're
Speaker 1: sitting in a moment in history. But history does not
Speaker 1: feel historic when you're sitting in it. It just feels
Speaker 1: like another day. And please keep in mind that Dr
Speaker 1: King was in Atlanta for thirteen years, went to parent
Speaker 1: teacher Knight, went to the grocery store. You know, speeches,
Speaker 1: thirteen years, six million air miles. All you remember is
Speaker 1: the one speech eight minutes. I have a dream. That's
Speaker 1: all you remember, right, And so we dramatized and we
Speaker 1: want to romanticize this, but the reality was just him
Speaker 1: banging at the dang on door over and over again
Speaker 1: until it finally kicked open. So this is a new movement,
Speaker 1: but it's in the sweets, not the streets. This is
Speaker 1: about class and poverty, not raising the color line. And
Speaker 1: the new color is green, which helps all of us,
Speaker 1: by the way, because the economics are on our side,
Speaker 1: because because every profitable company and every profitable region is
Speaker 1: diverse and inclusive. I come from Atlanta, the moral capital
Speaker 1: of America. It also happens to be the tenth largess
Speaker 1: economy in the US. Hello, And it's because we made
Speaker 1: a decision in Atlanta, not to arguable who is going
Speaker 1: to go to a water fountain white or black, but
Speaker 1: who's going to get the contract? And we decided we
Speaker 1: were better together. Well, Marcus, because like the money, like
Speaker 1: the understanding that by excluding parts of our population, whether
Speaker 1: it's Black Americans, whether it's the Latin community, whether it's women,
Speaker 1: whether it's lgbt Q, you know, there's a't forgive me
Speaker 1: an economic, financial reason to be much more inclusive. But
Speaker 1: I'm I love Mackenzie, but I'm tired of reading the
Speaker 1: studies that tell me this is the thing to do.
Speaker 1: It makes more sense. So I mean, it's this simple, right,
Speaker 1: and I look at at this I'm a mathematician trained,
Speaker 1: engineer trained. I look at numbers and I'm comfortable there
Speaker 1: we're twenty plus trillion dollar economy. You've got call it
Speaker 1: thirty of the economy that is operating at a suboptimal
Speaker 1: level because of the constraints of inequity that are in
Speaker 1: the workplace. That means there's several trillion dollars that we
Speaker 1: can unlock if we can simply give people a greater
Speaker 1: level of confidence, greater access, education, exposure, experience to allow
Speaker 1: them to maximize their potential. So how do we do that? Again,
Speaker 1: You've got to give people value adding networks. You've got
Speaker 1: to give them opportunities to meet people in the world
Speaker 1: of Wall Street, wall streets and a printice driven model.
Speaker 1: For those that are in the crowd, how many people
Speaker 1: did not know anybody? For those that are investors, was
Speaker 1: there anybody that didn't know somebody at the firm the
Speaker 1: day that you stepped in there, we have one out
Speaker 1: of two people in the room. It is impossible to
Speaker 1: get into that business just on the merit of your
Speaker 1: own intellect, which means you have to know people. You
Speaker 1: have to build relationships with people. At the end of
Speaker 1: the day. None of our deals are empirically the best
Speaker 1: deal to the deal that we feel comfortable with because
Speaker 1: we did it with people that we trust. So how
Speaker 1: do you build networks where people can build more trust
Speaker 1: among each other. That that's exactly what we're working on,
Speaker 1: getting young men and young women to meet people in
Speaker 1: the business before they have to interview. John. I mean,
Speaker 1: you've come on Bloomberg a lot, and we've talked about,
Speaker 1: you know, money being the great divine. You're working on it,
Speaker 1: you know at a younger level. You know, you've been
Speaker 1: working at the set operation hope for a while. So
Speaker 1: what makes the difference that puts people into the pipeline
Speaker 1: gives them that opportunity? Those networks, it's relationship capital. You
Speaker 1: don't have to be a genius, could be in the
Speaker 1: right relationship, you know. All you know, all the university
Speaker 1: is it's net working. All country club is networking, private
Speaker 1: clubs it's networking. Again, nobody in here got your job
Speaker 1: from the phone book. You guys, you know what the
Speaker 1: phone book is, right, But you and I've also talked
Speaker 1: about having that seat at I remember when you came
Speaker 1: on after George Floyd on air and I think there
Speaker 1: was a younger individual I believe they were black, and
Speaker 1: they said, but John, you have a seat at the table.
Speaker 1: I don't have a seat at the table. I'm not
Speaker 1: being heard. You have seats at the table with CEOs boards,
Speaker 1: your board alone. What are they saying? Why does this
Speaker 1: take so long? No, that was really you're so good
Speaker 1: because almost made me cry. It was a young black
Speaker 1: man who was actually saying, I'm trying to get it
Speaker 1: up here. He's like, look, John, I don't have a
Speaker 1: seat at the table. They're not gonna listen to me.
Speaker 1: They're not gonna listen to my father, and they didn't
Speaker 1: listen to my grandfather. What I can do is make
Speaker 1: some no wise out in the street. What I can
Speaker 1: do is protests and maybe even tear some stuff up.
Speaker 1: And I know that's not leading anything, but maybe he
Speaker 1: gives enough attention for a minute for a guy like
Speaker 1: you to walk in and cut a deal. Right that
Speaker 1: then allows me to move from the streets of the sweets.
Speaker 1: And I felt I couldn't argue with them because here's
Speaker 1: the reality. If you're in Canada, they'll tell you by
Speaker 1: elementary school who the NHL Stars are Hockey League because
Speaker 1: the farm club you here in America, they'll tell you
Speaker 1: who the NFL, the NFL Stars, the NBA, NBA stars
Speaker 1: are what in middle school? Because we have a whole
Speaker 1: farm club system. Are you with me on this? But
Speaker 1: we leave corporate banking, finance, all the stuff that drives
Speaker 1: the economy, real estate, media, Please leave at the chance.
Speaker 1: So who gets those gigs? If you're sitting at the
Speaker 1: chair of your father and he's talking about real estate
Speaker 1: or mom's talking about stocks, and they introduce you, they
Speaker 1: take you to the they take you to the country club,
Speaker 1: they take you to the to to the alumni meeting.
Speaker 1: All of a sudden, now you've been creating relationship capital
Speaker 1: maybe with the sons or daughters of those who are successful.
Speaker 1: Who do you do business with those who you know? So? So,
Speaker 1: if you hang around nine broke people, I'll say it again,
Speaker 1: this is tweatable, You'll be the t You'll be the tent.
Speaker 1: Whatever you hang around, you will be why somebody want
Speaker 1: to be a rap start athlete or a drug dealer,
Speaker 1: because that's what you've seen. So what we have done
Speaker 1: an Operation Hope, one million Black Business Initiative, hundred thirty
Speaker 1: million dollar commitment for Shopify to create new black businesses
Speaker 1: through Corporate America. We were doing with financial literacy for
Speaker 1: all me and w Millan, CEO of Walmart, to get
Speaker 1: eight pm cent of the corporate fortune five hundred to
Speaker 1: make financial literacy the new healthcare embedded into the ethos
Speaker 1: of business model, not charity. Business soon corporate inclusion, getting
Speaker 1: Blacks on boards of directors. Well, I think John's point
Speaker 1: is critical, which is starting at the earliest state possible.
Speaker 1: And the work that they've done with Operation Hope has
Speaker 1: really started with people. I would almost say in utero right,
Speaker 1: starting with your parents, with creating financial literacy. They give
Speaker 1: that financial literacy, pass it onto their children. What we're
Speaker 1: doing at All Finance is the continuation of that at
Speaker 1: another place where you find density. You know, you talk
Speaker 1: about being around people, right, hbc US represent three percent
Speaker 1: of colleges and universities in this country. Ten of black
Speaker 1: college students are at HBCUs and of black graduates come
Speaker 1: from HBCUs. That is density, that is power, That is
Speaker 1: the dinner table of opportunity with people that are trying
Speaker 1: to create new opportunities for them and their family. And
Speaker 1: so if I'm a CEO at a company, and I'm
Speaker 1: looking to find great, talented, diverse people, people who are
Speaker 1: among nine other people that are doing phenomenal things at
Speaker 1: that table, and you want to find the tenth go
Speaker 1: to hbc US. Give me an intention that we should
Speaker 1: all be thinking about going forward. So the number one
Speaker 1: thing that we can do in the alternative investment community
Speaker 1: is think about how we create more networks and more
Speaker 1: access us for students. UH, particularly with what we're working
Speaker 1: with black and African American students to find pathways into
Speaker 1: the space. Be a mentor, create relationships, build internships, and
Speaker 1: be intentional about creating diverse opportunities in those internships very quickly.
Speaker 1: You wanna every year judge yourself by your about us page,
Speaker 1: Look at your board, look at your management team, look
Speaker 1: at your structure. Every year you're about us page and
Speaker 1: your corporation, what does it look like? Does it look
Speaker 1: like America? Right? Uh? Number two, do something. Don't make
Speaker 1: the perfect the death of the good. It's like a
Speaker 1: software of grade. Do something and then do something a
Speaker 1: little bit better tomorrow, and keep at it until you
Speaker 1: change somebody's life. Number three, understand that we're not at
Speaker 1: war with each other. This is not about black or
Speaker 1: white or rare or blue, Republican or Democratic Party. We're
Speaker 1: at war. China wants to be us. Be clear. Russia
Speaker 1: would like the bs, the two smaller irrelevant. They're in
Speaker 1: irritant in the world. But these folks want to be us.
Speaker 1: They want our way in the world. But everybody wants
Speaker 1: to be an American except Americans. We keep fighting with
Speaker 1: each other. Well, we're stupids. We are better together. Two
Speaker 1: plus two equals six. Why this because this is how
Speaker 1: we win. That's Marcus Shaw, CEO of Ault Finance Corporation,
Speaker 1: and John Hope Bryant, Founder, chairman and CEO of Operation Hope.
Speaker 1: Check out Bloomberg Live dot com for the full conversation
Speaker 1: and many more rich discussions from the Equality Summit. And
Speaker 1: that wraps up our first hour of the weekend edition
Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Carol Masser
Speaker 1: and I'm Tim Stinebeck. Ahead in our next hour, we
Speaker 1: hear from Land's End CEO Jerome Griffith about the company's
Speaker 1: moved towards comfort in the latest undertaking, from celebrity chef
Speaker 1: Backed about refarming and up next reforms against weight based
Speaker 1: discrimination in the workplace. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week inside from the reporters and editors who bring
Speaker 1: you America's most trusted business magazine, plus global business, finance
Speaker 1: and tech news. As it happened, Bloomberg Business Week with
Speaker 1: Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 1: Hi am Carol Masser and I'm Tim st Plenty ahead
Speaker 1: in our second hour of the weekend edition of Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week, including guess what you can actually be fired
Speaker 1: for being fat? Yeah, I did not know that. I
Speaker 1: didn't either. Plus lands end on tapping into all shapes
Speaker 1: and sizes and making sure we are comfy in the process,
Speaker 1: are exclusive with the company CEO. Gotta say, I really
Speaker 1: love my comfy clothes, yoga pants, jeans, whatever the heck
Speaker 1: it is. Yes, So do I your sweatpant kind of guy?
Speaker 1: Uh well, Carol, these days they're called joggers, okay, So
Speaker 1: behind the times, all right. Also on a more serious note,
Speaker 1: amid the Ukraine War, our Russians heading for the exit.
Speaker 1: When it comes to high end real estate, and we
Speaker 1: talked the future of farming. It may just be vertical
Speaker 1: and happening in cities across the country. Look up and
Speaker 1: down right? Yeah, I guess all right. Let's get going, though,
Speaker 1: first with one of the stories from the current issue
Speaker 1: special double issue of Bloomberg Business Week. It is the
Speaker 1: equality issue, and the story in question comes from Bloomberg
Speaker 1: News legal reporter Josh Idolson. It discusses the weight based
Speaker 1: discrimination that many face in the workplace, even get fired
Speaker 1: for it. It's unbelievable. Reform is coming, though, thanks to
Speaker 1: bills in two states and Josh joining us alongside is
Speaker 1: This Week editor Jill Weber. Weight based discrimination is for real,
Speaker 1: especially is true in the retail sector, as I think
Speaker 1: Josh will explain to us. But the bias is just
Speaker 1: intense here. People are who are overweight are hired less,
Speaker 1: promoted less, and paid less, as Josh writes. But there
Speaker 1: are some reforms under way that could change some of that. Um, Josh,
Speaker 1: what's happening? So activists see the best opportunity in decades
Speaker 1: now to extend statewide protections against weight discrimination. In New
Speaker 1: York and or in Massachusetts. Either would be the first
Speaker 1: state to protect people directly against discrimination based on weight
Speaker 1: in around half a century since Michigan became the first,
Speaker 1: so far only state to say you can't fire someone
Speaker 1: or discriminate against them because you think they're fat. So
Speaker 1: let's talk about actions being taken. I mean, it's it's
Speaker 1: pretty remarkable. Although we've we were just talking before we
Speaker 1: got going about different companies or CEOs or executives who
Speaker 1: have said things about weight, whether it pertains to their
Speaker 1: products or whether it pertains to who they hire to
Speaker 1: be in their stores. Like, it's certainly been out there,
Speaker 1: so legally, like, what's the case or how do you
Speaker 1: move the law forward so that these individuals are included?
Speaker 1: Because as you got as you report, Josh, you know,
Speaker 1: we think weight is controllable, but science and genetics shows
Speaker 1: us it not necessarily is. So the big picture here
Speaker 1: is most US workers, as I've written about before for
Speaker 1: Business Week, are considered at will employees, meaning you can
Speaker 1: be fired for almost any reason or no reason. There
Speaker 1: are important exceptions to that in the law, including civil
Speaker 1: rights laws that provide protects against discrimination based on categories
Speaker 1: like race and sex and religion. So there are efforts
Speaker 1: afoot to add weight and in some cases height, as
Speaker 1: the state of Michigan in a number of cities have
Speaker 1: done and say these are also categories that it should
Speaker 1: be illegal to discriminate against people Because of there have
Speaker 1: been efforts by people with obesity to find protection under
Speaker 1: existing laws, such as gender law when weight requirements are
Speaker 1: being applied differently to men and women, and the Americans
Speaker 1: with Disabilities Act, since the a d A protects against
Speaker 1: discrimination based on physical impairments that restrict major life activities,
Speaker 1: but courts have been pretty hesitant to find that obesity
Speaker 1: qualifies as a disability in and of itself under the
Speaker 1: a d A. And that's one of the reasons why
Speaker 1: there's a sense of urgency among advocates to explicitly put
Speaker 1: weight into civil rights laws. Well how does it get there, though?
Speaker 1: How do the the activists make this become law, make
Speaker 1: it included in the a d So in New York,
Speaker 1: there is a legislative campaign gearing up, as we first reported,
Speaker 1: led by legislators including the chair of the Senate Judiciary
Speaker 1: Committee and the prominent retail union based in New York,
Speaker 1: the r w DSU, which in particular is calling attention
Speaker 1: to the indignities and unequal treatment that workers experience in retail,
Speaker 1: like being assessed in part on a photo that you
Speaker 1: submit with a resume, and then if you gain weight,
Speaker 1: being moved into the storeroom rather than dealing with customers
Speaker 1: or being passed over because you don't quote unquote fit
Speaker 1: the image. They believe that they have a real chance
Speaker 1: this year to pass that law, which would amend existing
Speaker 1: civil rights law in New York to include weight and height.
Speaker 1: And there's a similar effort underway in Massachusetts. In Massachusetts,
Speaker 1: in fact, versions of a bill to do this have
Speaker 1: been introduced for a couple of decades now without too
Speaker 1: much success. But a bill there did advance past the
Speaker 1: Judiciary Committee, and the likely next governor of the state
Speaker 1: told me in a statement that she supports efforts to
Speaker 1: create these protections there. Josh, you you mentioned how retail
Speaker 1: as a sector is um sort of an especially bad
Speaker 1: bad actor here. I'm curious about other other sectors and
Speaker 1: then also just employers in general, right because um, as
Speaker 1: you write, like, nobody would really speak up and oppose
Speaker 1: oppose this, but there or speak up you know, in
Speaker 1: favor of weight discrimination. Obviously, so there are examples of
Speaker 1: alleged weight discrimination in all sorts of sectors. I talked,
Speaker 1: for example, to an advocate who had represented a cable
Speaker 1: installer who she said was in the position Shoon of
Speaker 1: ending up getting risky weight loss surgery because his company
Speaker 1: told him that he couldn't come back to work unless
Speaker 1: he lost around a hundred pounds because they didn't think
Speaker 1: that he could use their ladder, and they didn't want
Speaker 1: to get a different ladder did. They wanted an employee
Speaker 1: with a different body. There has not been much vocal
Speaker 1: defense from the business lobby of the exclusion of overweight people.
Speaker 1: That was Bloomberg News Legal reporter Josh Idolsen along with
Speaker 1: Business Week editor Joel Webber. You're listening to Bloomberg business
Speaker 1: Week coming up getting comfy. Lands End is all in
Speaker 1: on that. We catch up with the CEO, Jerome Griffith.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol
Speaker 1: Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stenovin from Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 1: Shares of LANs End have definitely been bouncing around a lot.
Speaker 1: It did include a rally in the last week or
Speaker 1: so that took the stock up more than keep in
Speaker 1: mind they are still down about six from a high
Speaker 1: back in July. The e commerce company has been developing
Speaker 1: its own third party marketplace, really leaning into the home
Speaker 1: and then going all in on well. I think something
Speaker 1: a lot of us can relate to over the past
Speaker 1: few years being comfy. Yeah. Absolutely. Land and CEO Jerome
Speaker 1: Griffith talked with me and w BBM anchor Ciscocado as
Speaker 1: part of our Decision Makers series jointly produced by Odyssey,
Speaker 1: which owns many all news radio stations around the country,
Speaker 1: and the Blueberg Radio Network, which of course provides business
Speaker 1: news for Odyssey's radio stations. One of the things I've
Speaker 1: tried to do is work at great companies and places
Speaker 1: that have really great brand names. And what it seems
Speaker 1: is that I've ended up doing over the course of
Speaker 1: the years is going to these companies either where they
Speaker 1: have divisions that aren't working well or the company is
Speaker 1: not working well. I remember when I took over to
Speaker 1: me and the two thousand and eight, it was really
Speaker 1: at the height of the crisis and the company was
Speaker 1: valued at next to nothing. So it's fun working someplace
Speaker 1: where you actually have an affinity for the product and
Speaker 1: you actually like it um And one of the things
Speaker 1: that I wanted to do is make it, you know,
Speaker 1: a fun place to work. We have really great Uh,
Speaker 1: really great product because the consumer is so loyal. You know,
Speaker 1: our average customer on our database stays with us for
Speaker 1: seventeen years, so they like what you're buying. It's a
Speaker 1: very good value for them. Um, but you know, you
Speaker 1: wanted to give the customer what it is that they want.
Speaker 1: I think I when I came into the company, they
Speaker 1: had gone on a for right to try and attract
Speaker 1: a newer, a different type of customer, and it really
Speaker 1: didn't work. So, you know, we got a group of
Speaker 1: designers together and they all talked about loving your customer
Speaker 1: and designing for your customer. And as we were coming
Speaker 1: out of eighteen and I said, you know, we've got
Speaker 1: to do a better job of elevating or marketing and
Speaker 1: elevating the brand. What's something that we can really grip
Speaker 1: onto and and make sure that what our messages is
Speaker 1: something that the customer sees us for and and talking
Speaker 1: about the customer. Talking to the customer, we found that
Speaker 1: they really care about comfort the most, you know, does
Speaker 1: it fit and is it comfortable? So we came up
Speaker 1: with a slogan, Let's get Comfy, and we launched that
Speaker 1: in nineteen and you can imagine as you come out
Speaker 1: of nineteen and into the pandemic. In the beginning of
Speaker 1: talk about timing, right, talk about timing that, you guys
Speaker 1: were already doing that. Better to be lucky than smart,
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, it just hit at the right time.
Speaker 1: And comforts. But you know a big thing for us,
Speaker 1: and we're not really walking away from what I know.
Speaker 1: People aren't buying sweatpants like they used doing, not buying
Speaker 1: sweatshirts like they did. But regardless of what they're doing,
Speaker 1: they still want to be comfortable. And we think the
Speaker 1: casualization of the workforce is something that is definitely continuing.
Speaker 1: You know, probably five years anybody in my position would
Speaker 1: come on the show and a suit and tie, and
Speaker 1: that's just not how people are addressing today. They want
Speaker 1: to have comfort, they want to they want to work
Speaker 1: when they when they need to work, they want to
Speaker 1: do it on their own time. They want to have
Speaker 1: the you know, a comfortable lifestyle. Uh, and that extends
Speaker 1: from work to home. Yeah, you say, better lucky good.
Speaker 1: I mean there's so much planning that goes into this,
Speaker 1: from the design to the manufacturer. I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: to be ready for this well and ahead of time.
Speaker 1: It really is a stroke of luck, and yet do
Speaker 1: you feel it positions you best as people are continuing
Speaker 1: to want that comfortable clothing, whether it's in the workplace
Speaker 1: or working from home. I've got to tell you, you know,
Speaker 1: when when this happens, you know, we were in the
Speaker 1: middle of designing a line now that's very you know,
Speaker 1: tactile and hands on, and our design group had to
Speaker 1: in a matter of a couple of months go from
Speaker 1: doing everything in person to everything online. Now, luckily we
Speaker 1: had already bought a three D design program that where
Speaker 1: we were implementing, and the implementation career was going to
Speaker 1: be over a year. Got it done in a couple
Speaker 1: of months. And one of the things you would worry
Speaker 1: about is your ability to fit and make sure that
Speaker 1: the fit is good. The guys did a phenomenal job
Speaker 1: doing it online and today I don't know if you
Speaker 1: know what truth it is. The truth that's an online
Speaker 1: fit um app that many websites have on it. Were
Speaker 1: the number one ranked uh fit for customers fifty five
Speaker 1: to sixty four, and we're number six overall in their
Speaker 1: whole portfolio. So we spend a lot of time making
Speaker 1: sure that people are going to be comfortable, and they're
Speaker 1: going to be consistent fits with the product that they're buying,
Speaker 1: so they understand really what the brand's going to give them.
Speaker 1: I do a lot of stuff online and it really
Speaker 1: frustrates me when the sizing is like all over the place.
Speaker 1: I want to ask you, Jerome, who is the lands
Speaker 1: and customer? You talk about customers being really loyal, So
Speaker 1: who is the lands in and customer today? And I'm
Speaker 1: curious which of the demos are you seeing the most growth.
Speaker 1: Our customer today is either a baby boomer or a
Speaker 1: gen X or she's female. She lives in suburbia, she
Speaker 1: has kids, the kids still live with her. Uh. They
Speaker 1: have a relatively affluent income over a hundred grand over
Speaker 1: grands um. But they're very frugal and they're cautious about
Speaker 1: how they spend uh. There they work, Um, they are
Speaker 1: very tech savvy. Most of our traffic is done on
Speaker 1: a on a mobile phone. A lot of our our
Speaker 1: business is done on a mobile phone. And they're they're
Speaker 1: prudent with how they spend their money, so they're very
Speaker 1: cautious about who's going to get their consumer dollars. They
Speaker 1: are very loyal and what we're seeing is that our
Speaker 1: new customer is that gen x or they're they're not
Speaker 1: in their fifties, they're in their forties, but their demographics
Speaker 1: are all the same. It's again, they live in suburbia,
Speaker 1: they're working, they're married, they have kids. Uh and and
Speaker 1: their idea of working out isn't necessarily gone to the
Speaker 1: gym and pounding out for two hours. Their idea of
Speaker 1: working out is being active and living in active lifestyle.
Speaker 1: And you know, one of the things that that they
Speaker 1: want to do is they want to feel comfortable in
Speaker 1: everything that they're doing. And we, you know, we just
Speaker 1: love that customer. In fact, she's buying all of her
Speaker 1: husband's clothes. We've got about two thirds of everything we
Speaker 1: sell for men is actually about by women for their husbands.
Speaker 1: So they're they're big influencers as well. In the family.
Speaker 1: Well i'd imagine it's probably their children too. Write that
Speaker 1: there's that natural a if it works for me and
Speaker 1: if it works for the husband, that works for the
Speaker 1: kids too. But a lot of it with kids. They
Speaker 1: know us from school uniforms. We have a pretty large
Speaker 1: school uniform business. And many people that I meet is like, oh, Lanson,
Speaker 1: I know that I had your school uniforms. When I
Speaker 1: was a kid, I've bought a few school uniforms from
Speaker 1: you guys. Definitely over the years. Hey, does brick and
Speaker 1: mortar matter anymore? I mean you guys are you know
Speaker 1: most of what you do right your revenues are e commerce,
Speaker 1: but you do have a few stores. Doesn't matter anymore?
Speaker 1: And and if it does, do you plan to expanding
Speaker 1: it all? It does. What we've actually found is that
Speaker 1: our online business with Coals has gotten better as we
Speaker 1: expand in Coals. So we started out with a hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty stores with Coals a little over a year ago,
Speaker 1: about a year and a half ago. Then this year
Speaker 1: we've moved to three hundred stores. By the back part
Speaker 1: of this year will be at five hundred stores, and
Speaker 1: then we're adding on swimwear in warm weather areas, so
Speaker 1: it will be I think well over six hundred stores
Speaker 1: by the time we finished this year. What we've what
Speaker 1: we're seeing is as we add stores, our online business
Speaker 1: gets better. So it's more you're relevant because you're there
Speaker 1: with our own stores. Our businesses coming back. It's not
Speaker 1: back to the levels that it was in twenty nineteen.
Speaker 1: From a traffic standpoint, We're keeping a really close eye
Speaker 1: on what the traffic looks like in stores, but I
Speaker 1: can say with third party it's working very well. That's
Speaker 1: lands End CEO Jerome Griffith and w bbm anchor Ciscocato
Speaker 1: as part of our Decision Makers series jointly produced by
Speaker 1: Odyssey and Bloomberg Radio, and you can find that full
Speaker 1: conversation just head to Odyssey, A U, D, A C
Speaker 1: Y dot com. Still to come on Bloomberg Business Week.
Speaker 1: Russian oligarchs racing against global sanctions. What does that mean
Speaker 1: for their luxury real estate holdings? That's coming up next.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Broadcasting from the financial capital of the World,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Eleve in Frio in New York to Washington, d C.
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Speaker 1: the Hampton's Manhattan, South Florida. They have long been popular
Speaker 1: destinations for Russian cash, often in the form of real
Speaker 1: estate purchases. For a view on how that has changed
Speaker 1: since Russia's invasion of Ukraine, and an update on overall
Speaker 1: sales in luxury real estate, We caught up with Aaron Sykes,
Speaker 1: chief economist and licensed real estate broker at the global
Speaker 1: real estate brokerage nest Seekers International. We were found about
Speaker 1: twenty years ago, right after nine eleven, in the heart
Speaker 1: of downtown Manhattan, and we have a number of offices
Speaker 1: throughout the Northeast, particularly in the city and also at
Speaker 1: in the Hampton's, and we have recently expanded to South Florida, Miami,
Speaker 1: pomp Beach, all of the great vacation locations, in Aspen, Colorado,
Speaker 1: all of the Colorado locations, so many, we've got thirty
Speaker 1: offices now, so taking over plus we have a large
Speaker 1: media component in selling the Hampton's a couple other different shows. Well,
Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about the volume of property
Speaker 1: sales that you've dealt with, for example, or or that
Speaker 1: the firm is dealt with in the last twelve months,
Speaker 1: which is a great indicator of kind of what's going
Speaker 1: on in the global economy and just kind of the
Speaker 1: volume you're seeing. Sure, so we as nest Seekers are
Speaker 1: a boutique firm and had over five billion dollars in
Speaker 1: sales last year, which is double what we had the
Speaker 1: year prior. And of course this is not match up
Speaker 1: with the larger public companies like Compass an Element. However,
Speaker 1: for a boutique firm still privately owned five billion dollars
Speaker 1: and yearly sales is acts, it's incredible. So now what
Speaker 1: we're seeing throughout the Palm Beach and Miami markets is
Speaker 1: not any cooling at all. There's still significantly more demand
Speaker 1: than there are properties available, Still a lot of bidding
Speaker 1: wars going on, and we haven't really seen any impact
Speaker 1: from that quarter of a point rate hike because most
Speaker 1: of our buyers are high net worth looking to kind
Speaker 1: of taking out year fixed rate mortgages. Right there, well exactly,
Speaker 1: well who's buying because we do want to get to um,
Speaker 1: you know inter of Russian buying. My understanding, it's you know,
Speaker 1: Russian money coming into us real estates, certainly the high end.
Speaker 1: It's a very very small part of some of the
Speaker 1: markets like Manhattan overall, But tell us about what was
Speaker 1: the trend and what is the trend today when it
Speaker 1: comes to Russian buying of especially luxury properties in the US. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so if you look at Central Park South, we we
Speaker 1: often call it the most expensive safe deposit box because
Speaker 1: a lot of unstable countries, UM, they're large, high network
Speaker 1: and worth individuals have purchased Central Park South, Central Park West,
Speaker 1: Central Park East, UM and then also down in Sunny Aisles,
Speaker 1: particularly with Russians and also Palm Beach, you know, places
Speaker 1: where the value maintains it's very stable or you'll see
Speaker 1: appreciation over the years. Uh, not risky investments for international
Speaker 1: investors overall. Uh. Now that said, we have seen some
Speaker 1: uptick in the movement, uh in market movement in those
Speaker 1: areas that are highly invested by Russians. However, it's not
Speaker 1: this you know, wham bam slap it up on MLS
Speaker 1: that most people have been depicting. Um. It's mostly quiet
Speaker 1: off market sales or um smaller sales. Not the fifty
Speaker 1: billion dollar apartments that we almost want it to be
Speaker 1: because that's a better story, right. It's a couple million,
Speaker 1: five million dollar apartments that maybe those investors of Russian
Speaker 1: nationality are getting a little bit nervous. But frankly, those
Speaker 1: who have investments twenty fifty million dollar properties and above
Speaker 1: they already well long ago moved those into irrevocable trusts
Speaker 1: so they cannot be seized. So it's it's not as
Speaker 1: cut and dry as you know, all of Russians are
Speaker 1: just trying to liquidate all of their assets. That's not
Speaker 1: exactly what's going on. That's really it's interesting to hear, um,
Speaker 1: give us some some color on what's going on in
Speaker 1: the Hampton's right now. Uh, you know, in addition to
Speaker 1: happening we've heard so much about South Florida, we've heard
Speaker 1: a lot about Manhattan in the real estate just rising
Speaker 1: so much there. Um, what's happening in the Hampton's. Hampton's
Speaker 1: has been very stable. I mean, we obviously saw a
Speaker 1: lot of movement there and a lot of price appreciation
Speaker 1: over the last couple of years. And what we've seen
Speaker 1: since about the summer until now is just complete stability.
Speaker 1: Prices are not sting up and down. Inventory is still
Speaker 1: relatively low. There's been a little bit more coming on.
Speaker 1: People are already locking in those rentals for the summer.
Speaker 1: So still a very strong market. Well, that's interesting. Are
Speaker 1: we at pre pandemic levels or even above it potentially? Well,
Speaker 1: we're well above pre pandemic levels in terms of um
Speaker 1: or in terms of availability well below, in terms of
Speaker 1: pricing well above. So we're still in that, you know,
Speaker 1: high demand type of situation in the Hampton's. People have
Speaker 1: often shifted their residences, which we've all you know, just
Speaker 1: been discussing for a couple of years now. So they're
Speaker 1: sticking it out in the Hampton's. Uh, their kids are
Speaker 1: in school out there. I think that's the bigger story
Speaker 1: at this point is how can the Hampton's infrastructure support
Speaker 1: this new wave of full time residents that did not leave.
Speaker 1: That's Aaron Syke's chief economist and licensed real estate broker
Speaker 1: with Nest Seekers International. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week,
Speaker 1: still ahead a vertical farm with a very big undertaking.
Speaker 1: See what I did there? I did? Do you like it? Yeah?
Speaker 1: That's pretty good. I've heard worse. No, it's okay, okay, Um,
Speaker 1: you know the story that was pretty cool and especially
Speaker 1: the folks behind it. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes.
Speaker 1: Tim Stinovik from Bloomberg Radio, like me would want to
Speaker 1: not only know but didn't want to be followed. The
Speaker 1: action he's important and about indoor farming, is this opportunity
Speaker 1: to really understand the possibilities that we have in the use.
Speaker 1: Now we'll give the endoor. That's the voice of celebrity
Speaker 1: chef Jose Andreas, who is a backer of Barry Farming
Speaker 1: that was founded by Irving Fine. Barry Farming has had
Speaker 1: success with salad, greens and herbs and is now tackling strawberries.
Speaker 1: It's all in a recent story by Bloomberg Pursuits Food
Speaker 1: editor Kate Crater. Kate joined us with more and gave
Speaker 1: us an update on the restaurant industry's efforts to help
Speaker 1: those in Ukraine and those who have fled, including work
Speaker 1: being done by World Central Kitchen. Bloomberg Philanthropies, which along
Speaker 1: with Bloomberg LP is owned by Michael Bloomberg, helps fund
Speaker 1: World's Central Kitchen. We'll get to that in just a moment.
Speaker 1: First up, though, Kate's visit to New Jersey Barry It
Speaker 1: was already a big name in the vertical farming world.
Speaker 1: They are the biggest vertical farm in the country. They've
Speaker 1: raised a lot of money um and they but what
Speaker 1: they have traditionally grown is green, not money, but but
Speaker 1: salad greens like lettuces and herbs, and those are the
Speaker 1: easiest things to grow if you've got a vertical fall arm,
Speaker 1: because you can maximize the amount of produce that you grow.
Speaker 1: It doesn't take that much time to grow, so you
Speaker 1: can get it into markets really quickly. But they've decided
Speaker 1: to do something really innovative, which is gross strawberries and um.
Speaker 1: And that's that. It sounds kind of boring to say
Speaker 1: strawberries are growing in New Jersey, but it's actually very
Speaker 1: exciting in the vertical farming. I'm very excited living in
Speaker 1: New Jersey and loving strawberries. I'm very excited to say.
Speaker 1: Just a little clip, just a little clip that we
Speaker 1: showed on on You'll see it on YouTube and you
Speaker 1: can check it out on bluebirg quicktake is really really
Speaker 1: cool and it certainly intrigued me. I want to take
Speaker 1: a step back, though, because I don't think everyone's familiar
Speaker 1: with vertical farming, and increasingly we are trying to understand
Speaker 1: where our food comes from and what that supply chain
Speaker 1: looks like, and what that journey looks like. What is
Speaker 1: vertical farming and what are the promises that are associated
Speaker 1: with vertical farming. So vertical what an excellent question, tim.
Speaker 1: Vertical farming is growing growing um crops mostly hydroponically indoors,
Speaker 1: so you don't need you need a fraction of the land,
Speaker 1: a fraction of the water, you don't have to worry
Speaker 1: about um climate change issues as you do in so
Speaker 1: many places. And you can also set up vertical farms
Speaker 1: very close to urban areas. So for instance, Bowery is
Speaker 1: located in Kearney, New Jersey, which is basically right next
Speaker 1: to New York Airport and um about thirty New York City.
Speaker 1: It's not that pretty. Sorry, it's not that pretty. Um
Speaker 1: you know what, it's not that pretty. It looks like
Speaker 1: a lot of warehouses carols from New Jersey. So she's
Speaker 1: not just saying that. Okay, yeah, no, no Kearneys. Kearney
Speaker 1: is not where you go to sightsee, that's for sure,
Speaker 1: it's not. But it's so cool right that they could
Speaker 1: do the vertical farming there and just outside New York City.
Speaker 1: It's so smart. It's so smart because you really cut
Speaker 1: down I mean, not only are you cutting down on
Speaker 1: transportation anyway, but you're literally about thirty minutes from New
Speaker 1: York if you're delivering these greens to markets right across
Speaker 1: the Hudson Okay, why are why are straw Why strawberries?
Speaker 1: Why is it such a challenge? And why are they
Speaker 1: so full of pesticides? As I think we just heard
Speaker 1: from Josan Andrew's right, they are because they grow if
Speaker 1: you think about up them, Um, if you think about
Speaker 1: the most they You know, people want strawberries all year round,
Speaker 1: every day of the year, but there are super seasonal fruit.
Speaker 1: They grow, you know, mostly in June. Maybe you're lucky
Speaker 1: and you get some in May or July, but otherwise
Speaker 1: they're probably growing in California, and the growers want to
Speaker 1: figure out how to make your strawberries look best when
Speaker 1: they hit shelves in New York City, so they're covered
Speaker 1: with pesticides to keep them free from bugs. I should
Speaker 1: say for the most part, they're covered with pesticides. They've
Speaker 1: been labeled the top produce and the Dirty dozen, i e.
Speaker 1: The most ecologically unfriendly produced that you can find. And
Speaker 1: they also travel a lot of miles to get to
Speaker 1: your to get to your table, so they're burning up
Speaker 1: a lot of fuel to get there. They're covered with
Speaker 1: pesticides and so UM Irving Irving Fine and Bowery Farming
Speaker 1: sea an opportunity. They just spent money buying a company
Speaker 1: called Traptick, which uses AI and robotic arms to pick strawberries,
Speaker 1: and um, that's one reason why they are able to
Speaker 1: launch his pretty exciting initiative. So, Kate, is it working?
Speaker 1: Like are they able to do to make the strawberries
Speaker 1: and and do what they want to do here? Well?
Speaker 1: I got to taste them with Jose. It was really exciting.
Speaker 1: Right before as I know you've seen and we get
Speaker 1: to talk about Jose is in the Jose Andreas, the
Speaker 1: founder of World Central Kitchen, is in the Ukraine right
Speaker 1: now or on the border of the Ukraine feeding refugees.
Speaker 1: But UM, a couple of weeks before that, he's an
Speaker 1: investor in Bowery Farm and also UM and also a
Speaker 1: chef who wants those strawberries. So I got to go
Speaker 1: taste them with him, and um, they are pretty delicious.
Speaker 1: The thing, the maybe slightly ironic thing is they are
Speaker 1: selling two kinds UM, one called garden and one called wild.
Speaker 1: And think about wild like air quote wild strawberry growing
Speaker 1: in UM. You know in a warehouse in New Jersey.
Speaker 1: It's about as far away from that you can get.
Speaker 1: But the flavor is kind of the flavor is amazing,
Speaker 1: like we both have to taste, and it does have
Speaker 1: that kind of beautiful like just came out of a
Speaker 1: sunny field, Jammy Strawberry. So I am curious. You talked
Speaker 1: to so many different people you look at how food
Speaker 1: is produced. Do you think vertical for me at some
Speaker 1: point becomes you know, the way a lot of food
Speaker 1: is produced. Um, going forward? Is that even possible? It's
Speaker 1: a really good question, and it's very possible. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of money pouring into it. Witness Starry, which has
Speaker 1: six hundred and fifty million dollars behind it and it
Speaker 1: just started a couple of years ago. Um, it's very
Speaker 1: easy to attract money to this because it seems like
Speaker 1: a very viable way to grow to grow greens especially,
Speaker 1: but you can also figure out how to grow food
Speaker 1: that will help satisfy or help solve like the hunger
Speaker 1: issue that's happening, that's you know, continues to happen all
Speaker 1: over the world. That's happening here. Um, it's happening everywhere.
Speaker 1: And Jose Andreas actually made a big point of saying
Speaker 1: he believes that companies like Bowery can help can work
Speaker 1: with World Central Kitchen to help to help feed people
Speaker 1: in emergencies. Like if you build these vertical farms in
Speaker 1: emergency prone areas before a hurricane strikes or a drought happens,
Speaker 1: then you have then you have a place that's growing
Speaker 1: food that you can easily and quickly hand out to
Speaker 1: people who are in terrible situations. I feel like Jose
Speaker 1: Andreas is like the Elon Musk of food, right, Like
Speaker 1: he just right, He's just said, I don't care how
Speaker 1: he used to do it, like we can do it differently,
Speaker 1: and he just does it Kate with less trolling tweets. No,
Speaker 1: he's he's very much though in that just do it.
Speaker 1: Like he said that before, people have asked him, how
Speaker 1: did you start this? Because you know there were so
Speaker 1: many there's so many hunger organizations out there, and he
Speaker 1: just like walked in and changed the game. You know,
Speaker 1: it's kind of amazing. He just started I think in
Speaker 1: two thousand ten, two thousand nine in Haiti, and since
Speaker 1: then he showed up in almost every disaster you can
Speaker 1: think of, and it seems almost single handedly, with help
Speaker 1: from local chefs and food people, just got down to
Speaker 1: business and fed people. And another thing that he does
Speaker 1: which is great is he serves them on hot meals.
Speaker 1: You know, there's all these like crappy m r E's
Speaker 1: that right? Or I think that means ready to eat
Speaker 1: meals to look like they've gone to space, you know. Um,
Speaker 1: and these Jos Andreas really believes not just in what
Speaker 1: a hot meal means nourished, you know, in terms of nourishment,
Speaker 1: but also just the message that it sends like someone's
Speaker 1: thinking about you and cares about you, and it cares
Speaker 1: enough to give you a warm meal. He has a
Speaker 1: level of respect exactly right. So bring us to Ukraine
Speaker 1: now and what Jos Andrea's in World Central Kitchen have
Speaker 1: been doing in Ukraine and and and look they were
Speaker 1: there relatively early to help with this refugee cry as. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the Friday. Um, I'm not sure what the date was,
Speaker 1: but I think I think the invasion started on a Friday,
Speaker 1: and within hours World Central Kitchen had set up on
Speaker 1: the border in Poland and was starting to feed refugees
Speaker 1: um who are fleeing. And within a couple of days
Speaker 1: they've fed like forty five thousand refugees. They you know,
Speaker 1: they're now I think they're up to feating like thirty
Speaker 1: thousand a day. They had eight or ten camps before.
Speaker 1: Now they definitely have double digit camps. UM. And they
Speaker 1: were even going into Ukraine to try and supply people
Speaker 1: who insisted on staying with food in the means to
Speaker 1: cook food. So they're I mean, they're nothing short of heroes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: As of as of yesterday, according to Jacob sober Off
Speaker 1: who's at MSNBC, they've distributed a million meals since the
Speaker 1: war began. I mean, think about that. It's just like
Speaker 1: it's I mean, it seems like it's gone on forever, right,
Speaker 1: but it's, um, it's it's like three weeks. It's it's
Speaker 1: really in its fourth week, right to feed a million people,
Speaker 1: and just to be able to make that happen so quickly,
Speaker 1: you know, they activated food trucks that were a couple
Speaker 1: hours away in places like Poland. UM like love my
Speaker 1: Ram and I think was one of them. Some one
Speaker 1: of them had a terrific name, UM. And they had
Speaker 1: people out there who know how to make food, and
Speaker 1: they get all these products delivered and they start serving
Speaker 1: foods people like, it's fantastic. Hey, Kate, have you have
Speaker 1: you seen the restaurant community coalesced around something at such
Speaker 1: scale as we're seeing now? Have you ever seen this
Speaker 1: ever before in your really? I mean I really, I
Speaker 1: really can't think of that. Like, you know, after nine eleven,
Speaker 1: there was definitely a big coming together, But then that
Speaker 1: was also sort of different because some of those restaurants
Speaker 1: were so immediately impacted. That felt like you were really
Speaker 1: immediately helping your neighbors, you know, And I think it
Speaker 1: doesn't often happen that you feel like this is the
Speaker 1: right thing to do, And I think, um, but you know, Tim,
Speaker 1: it's a good question. I can't think that I've seen
Speaker 1: something like this, certainly outside the that hasn't impacted the
Speaker 1: immediate rest New York restaurant community. Bloomberg Pursuits editor Kate Creator.
Speaker 1: She talked all about World Central Kitchen, which receives funding
Speaker 1: from Bloomberg Philanthropies along with Bloomberg LP. They're owned by
Speaker 1: Michael Bloomberg. And that wraps up the weekend edition to
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. Thanks so much for
Speaker 1: joining us. I'm Carol Masser and I'm Tim Stanivik. Be
Speaker 1: sure to tune into Bloomberg Business Week Monday through Friday.
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Speaker 1: Have a great weekend. Stay safe everyone. This is Bloomberg.