1 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:05,720 Speaker 1: Welcome to the fire Pit. Hi. I'm Less Garland, founder 2 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: of MTV Music Television and a proud Link Soul ambassador. 3 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:13,240 Speaker 1: As a listener of the fire Pit with Matt Jenella, 4 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: go to link Soul dot com and use promo code 5 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: Matty m A T T y G to enjoy a 6 00:00:23,079 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: discount on your next Link Soul order. In the meantime, 7 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:31,479 Speaker 1: make par war. And while you're at it, do you 8 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: mind throwing another log on the fire It's story time. 9 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:40,880 Speaker 1: So if you remember the Pennant Race, it was the Braise. 10 00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: The giants went down to the last day each one 11 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: like a d plus games. As Giants were ending the 12 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 1: last day of the season, they were playing in l A, 13 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 1: you know, trying to win the pen in. So I 14 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 1: went to the game and I'm sitting the stands Jazz 15 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 1: already losing like pace, like two home runs and says head, 16 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 1: but and I love, oh god, it's two o'clock. You know, 17 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 1: it's five o'clock in New York. And this is pre 18 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,840 Speaker 1: cell phone. I'm running around Dodgers. Dad, I'm trying to 19 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:11,320 Speaker 1: find a working pay phone. They're all busted, like like 20 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,319 Speaker 1: six phones in a row, Like I couldn't and I'm 21 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 1: freaking out, and so I finally find one and I 22 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 1: dial you know, I have my mom's like calling card 23 00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 1: number or whatever, and I'm just I'm not even into 24 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:22,680 Speaker 1: I just want to get back to the baseball game 25 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 1: because I know that Joan is going to answer, and 26 00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: I just like it's just a formality. So I'm like, 27 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:29,240 Speaker 1: I'm just listening to the game. You know, we're trying 28 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: to trying to watch the TV and mobile answers. It 29 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 1: was like Mark molloy and I said, what are you 30 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: doing this summer there? I said, when you come and 31 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: work for us, there's an intern they call me next 32 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,840 Speaker 1: week you will talk details. It was like it was 33 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: like a ninth second phone call on a pay phone 34 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 1: in Dodger Stadium and I'm standing there like my life 35 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:50,880 Speaker 1: just changed. I don't even know what what just happened. 36 00:01:53,240 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 1: We don't know the logo nobuddy, welcome back. I'm Matt 37 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:09,960 Speaker 1: Janella and I'm pretty excited about this episode of the 38 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: fire Pit. After last week's industry roundtable in the state 39 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 1: of the Game in the midst of this global pandemic, 40 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 1: We're back to telling a story. But before we get started, 41 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: I want to thank everyone who donated auction items, and 42 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 1: everyone who bid on those items for their generosity and support. 43 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: Together we raised over seventeen thousand dollars for Feeding America, 44 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: the nation's largest domestic hunger relief organization. The game of 45 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 1: golf never ceases to amaze me. And then there's Alan Schipnuk, 46 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 1: who's amazing in his own right. The story is about 47 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: how Alan got the job at Pebble Beach as a kid, 48 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 1: then Sports Illustrated as a kid, and how he chased 49 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:54,400 Speaker 1: down Ken Griffey Jr. To write what would be the 50 00:02:54,440 --> 00:02:58,120 Speaker 1: first of his twenty plus s I cover stories. I 51 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:02,600 Speaker 1: started at Sports Illustrated as in turn In and as 52 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 1: You're here today. Alan started as an intern in Two 53 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: years later in at the age of twenty one, Allen 54 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 1: became the youngest staff writer in the magazine's illustrious history. 55 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,519 Speaker 1: We both worked together covering golf, Alan providing the words 56 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: while I was helping produce and edit the pictures. We've 57 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: been all over the world together, chasing the game, the players, 58 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 1: the best narratives, and the contents of each other's wallets. 59 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:36,120 Speaker 1: From band into Ireland, Pebbled to pine Hurst the Old Course, 60 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 1: to New Zealand, we seem to always stand on the 61 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: eighteenth tea all square. In this episode, we're going back 62 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: to the first tea of Allen's days as a budding scribe. Yeah. 63 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: It starts really like in the early eighties. My dad 64 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 1: had a girl for d who was a Sports Illustrated subscriber, 65 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: and I'd already loved sports at that point, has a 66 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 1: big Giants and Warriors fan, grow up in northern California. 67 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 1: S I just kind of blew my mind, and he 68 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: was just just beautiful package. It would come every week 69 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: with you know, I'd cut out the photos of put 70 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:16,800 Speaker 1: on the wall. But I started to get into the 71 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 1: articles just as a fan. But at some point I 72 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:22,280 Speaker 1: started to think about them a little more deeply and 73 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 1: just kind of wondering intuitively, like how did they do that? 74 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:28,359 Speaker 1: You know, this story just absolutely uh enthralled me for 75 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 1: the last twenty minutes and kind of wondering why and how, 76 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: and that kind of I think sent me down the path. 77 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: I wanted to be a sports writer at an early age, so, 78 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: you know, and when I was a junior in high school, 79 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 1: I started writing for this thing is California and That, 80 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 1: which is pretty good local newspaper had about fift circulation, 81 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,919 Speaker 1: and um, I did that, you know, for two years, 82 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 1: and by the ends basically the number one writer. I 83 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 1: love sports and I loved writing, and honestly, it just 84 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: felt natural to me. By the time I was probably 85 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:58,359 Speaker 1: a sophomore in high school, I was very tuned into 86 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,120 Speaker 1: the byelines and the different writings dialed and I mean, 87 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 1: this is so, this is so nerdy. But I used 88 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:06,520 Speaker 1: to like make flow charts of the stories just to 89 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:08,960 Speaker 1: try and figure out, like you know, like it went 90 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 1: from here to there to there to there. They came 91 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:13,160 Speaker 1: in because like I knew stuff was going on, I 92 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: could quite crack the nut. You know. It was just 93 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 1: like and so I was really into the writing, and 94 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:21,440 Speaker 1: you know, at some point I stopped, Um, I stopped 95 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 1: cutting out the photos, and all I cared about was 96 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 1: was the articles. And then when so then I had 97 00:05:27,760 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: a decide where was going to go to college. And 98 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:32,240 Speaker 1: you know, back the Northwestern had the best journalism school. 99 00:05:32,320 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: So I got into Northwestern. I went back for a 100 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 1: visit and it was freezing. I got like, you know, 101 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,360 Speaker 1: basically a pneumonia in April. But more than that, their 102 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: school paper was this little pamphlet was like eight pages. 103 00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 1: It was just it was nothing and then and then 104 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: this is this is ninety one and so back to 105 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 1: the Northwestern sports sucked. My sister was at u c 106 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:52,880 Speaker 1: l A. She's three years ahead of me, and so 107 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 1: I used to go down there a lot, and the 108 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 1: Daily Bruin was like this thick. I mean it was 109 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 1: a hundred pages a day. And you know, U c 110 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 1: l A. Sports was was going gangbusters there winning Rose Bowls, 111 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 1: The obandoned brothers were showing up on campus, and the 112 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 1: basketball team was ascendant, and uh so I just felt 113 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:12,440 Speaker 1: like for a lot of reasons, you say it was 114 00:06:12,839 --> 00:06:15,200 Speaker 1: the place for me, but mostly because of the school paper. 115 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: And uh you know, back then they had to rule 116 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,320 Speaker 1: you had to go to go through this whole like 117 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 1: a freshman year class orientation, and you really couldn't start 118 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,840 Speaker 1: write with the paper until you're a sophomore. But because 119 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 1: I had all these clips from this thing is Californian, 120 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: they looked at Sai, all right, this guy knows what 121 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 1: he's doing. So I started writing pretty much right away 122 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 1: as a freshman, and um, so that all those pieces 123 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:40,799 Speaker 1: were kind of in place. Concurrently, you know, I needed 124 00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: a job to pay for you silly, so I started 125 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:45,360 Speaker 1: working at golf courses. My first job, when I was 126 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,600 Speaker 1: sixteen was at Quail Lodge out in Carmel Valley. It 127 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 1: was an interesting place. Ben Doyle was teaching there. He's 128 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: a disciple of Homer Kelly, the golfing Machine, Bobby Clamp. 129 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: It was floating around. I mean, all this stuff was 130 00:06:57,120 --> 00:06:59,359 Speaker 1: way over my head. But it was a pretty cool 131 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,360 Speaker 1: little you universe, you know. But it was also sleepy. 132 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 1: There wasn't a lot of tips because the members were 133 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:05,840 Speaker 1: kind of old and cheap and whatever. I was looking 134 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 1: for more action, and so I wound up at this 135 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: brunch with Tom Oliver. He was the Pebble Beach Company president. 136 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: That a lot of people at the table because my 137 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: mom was a local politician so she knew him. He's like, so, well, 138 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 1: and what are your plans for for this summer. I 139 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: was like, well, Mr Oliver, I need a job, you know, 140 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 1: and and kind of he was. He was kind of 141 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 1: a schmoozy dude, like he picked up. He's like, well, 142 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 1: we'll take care of you know. It's been grandiose gesture 143 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 1: for all the table full of you know, swell people. 144 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 1: So that's how I wound up getting hired as a 145 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:38,320 Speaker 1: cardboy Pebble Beach. So Shipnuk is good, already understands the craft. 146 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 1: It's the early nineties. He's a teenager with dreams and 147 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 1: aspirations to write for the magazine he loves to read. 148 00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:47,920 Speaker 1: He's bound for college, but he's parking cards at Pebble Beach. 149 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 1: Next step getting end with s I Brass. It really 150 00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: starts before my freshman at u c l as that 151 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 1: summer before. So now I'm working full time as a 152 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 1: cart boy for June July August, trying, you know, put 153 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 1: away as much money as I can to pay for tuition. 154 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:05,680 Speaker 1: And because I was such an avid reader of Sports Illustrated, 155 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:08,320 Speaker 1: not only I know the byelines, but I knew the editors, 156 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 1: because Mark Bovoy was the top guy, so I knew 157 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: mo boy's name. And at Pebble in those days, um 158 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: maybe still, they would get this computerized print out of 159 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:22,280 Speaker 1: the next day's T sheet and I would always flip 160 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:24,560 Speaker 1: through it because oh, Michael Jordan's or you know whomever, 161 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 1: like it was Pebble Beach, but a lot of cool 162 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 1: people roll through there, and so I'm flipping through the names. 163 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 1: I see Mark Bolvoy like, oh my god. Of course, 164 00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 1: no one else in the pro shock had any idea 165 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: who this guy was. And so the next day, you know, 166 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:39,000 Speaker 1: I'm waiting for him on the first tea and he 167 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 1: comes out, and my old boss R. J. Harper, the 168 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:44,760 Speaker 1: late r. J. Harper, who was a legend. I told 169 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: him what was coming. So um, r J made this 170 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 1: big introduction and hyped me up. And I always appreciate 171 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:52,680 Speaker 1: that there's a little bit of a gumer pie. I 172 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 1: looked at Alan. He was sort of tall, lanky kid, 173 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 1: you know, a little longish neck, and very very well 174 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 1: spoil good. And he told me what he has done, 175 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:03,440 Speaker 1: and I said, well great, I said to me, your favorite. 176 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:06,840 Speaker 1: The great thing about assessing writers is somebody sends you something, 177 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: you read it, you say he can write, Oh my god, 178 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,600 Speaker 1: this is garbage. And so I told I said, Mr Mulvoy, 179 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: my dream in life is to write for your magazine. 180 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 1: I've been reading it since I was ten years old. 181 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: And he was gracious, but this guy runs the greatest 182 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 1: magazine on planet Earth. I'm an eighteen year old kid. 183 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 1: He has very little used for me, but he gives 184 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: me his card. He kind of pass me on my 185 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 1: head and sends me on my way, and you know, 186 00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:31,000 Speaker 1: he's like like a nice high draw down the first fairways. 187 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:33,559 Speaker 1: I'm sure he'll tell you about in great detail. And 188 00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 1: and every few months I would send him a letter 189 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: in New York because I had his card. You know, 190 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: dear Mr Mulvoy, I'm not covering you know, women's rugby 191 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: for the Daily Ruin and no response. But I kept 192 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: sending the letters. H I started covering football and basketball. 193 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: You know, those are big beats. I mean, the Daily 194 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,839 Speaker 1: Brewing in those days had an almost unlimited budget because 195 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 1: U c. L A surrounded by Westwood, Brentwood, Santa Monica, 196 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:58,959 Speaker 1: Beverly Hills and all those stores wanted to reach the students, 197 00:09:58,960 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 1: so they would all add ties in the brewin we 198 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: we had. I mean I would fly to football and 199 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: basketball games in Arizona and Washington and Oregon. It's getting 200 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 1: paid like a month. I mean it was crazy. He 201 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: was the greatest uh newspaper job you could ever have 202 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:14,960 Speaker 1: an undergraduate. And I was doing big stories. I mean 203 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: I wrote I wrote probably a three thousand words story 204 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 1: about the women's soccer teams battle to go from club 205 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:22,440 Speaker 1: status to Division one. And it was like the whole 206 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: back page of the Daily Bruin. I have that story too, 207 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: by the way, and UH like doing like legit journalism. 208 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 1: Um so anyway, so fast forward now to the summer 209 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:33,080 Speaker 1: of ninety three. It's my third summer at Pebble Beats, 210 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 1: and once again I'm flipping through the t seets Mark 211 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:37,679 Speaker 1: Bolvoy and my first emotions I can't look at to 212 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 1: tell me he was coming. You know, I'm like hurt, 213 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 1: but uh, not really anyway, So I see his name 214 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:44,080 Speaker 1: and actually wasn't even supposed to work the next day 215 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:46,400 Speaker 1: by switched shifts so I could be there and he 216 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,920 Speaker 1: he comes out and as as your listeners will hear, 217 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 1: I'm always got this great Boston accent. So I run 218 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:52,840 Speaker 1: up to him and I'm I'm like humping his leg 219 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 1: and uh and I I can't do Boston. But he's like, yeah, 220 00:10:57,960 --> 00:10:59,760 Speaker 1: you're a little ship. Asked he sent me those letters, 221 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: and I was like, yeah, that's me. And so I 222 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: said to me, a favous send me a bunch of 223 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 1: the stuff you've written. Is what I've written for the 224 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: local magazine and some things like that. It lived in 225 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: one of the local towns out there. I forget which one. 226 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 1: I later came to find out it was this nice 227 00:11:13,160 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 1: old la named Joan Rasiski, who you know, Matt. She 228 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,079 Speaker 1: was Moboy secretary. Joan was the one who would open 229 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:20,600 Speaker 1: my letters and read them. And I don't think Mobile 230 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: ever saw them, but he was maybe vaguely where they existed. 231 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: This is now, I think August of ninety three and 232 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: U s I was about to launch something called Golf Plus, 233 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 1: which was a debut in January of it was it 234 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 1: was a very small idea. It was gonna be like 235 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 1: four or six editorial pages that one rider dedicated with 236 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 1: high medias. But Mulboy was realizing they could probably use 237 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 1: an intern so he said, He's like, yeah, okay, UM, 238 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:46,200 Speaker 1: send me some more clips and you know, a more 239 00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: formal introduction, and UH might have might have something for you. 240 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,199 Speaker 1: So of course I go home and I poured through 241 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:56,440 Speaker 1: all my stuff and create this whole package. Um and 242 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:59,679 Speaker 1: he says, he says, call me on Sunday at five 243 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 1: o'clock lock mark Murevoy's office. No, he stepped away, may 244 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 1: take a message. Uh probably he'd probably be back within 245 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 1: the hour. Can I say, who's calling? Alan ship nuk okay? 246 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,400 Speaker 1: Spell that please? I'm a little discouraged by No, he's 247 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 1: a busy guy. And so now the school year started 248 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:22,640 Speaker 1: at u C l A. So now now I'm down 249 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 1: us l A doing this call again. I can't talk 250 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:31,719 Speaker 1: right now. I can't reach him Mark Muvoy's office. He 251 00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: stepped away, May take, May take a message? Please? Oh 252 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:42,199 Speaker 1: Mr ship Knook again, I can't reach him. Hello, he 253 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,280 Speaker 1: can't talk right, can't talk right now? Can I call 254 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: you back? Thanks? So, if you remember the Pennant Race, 255 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 1: he was the Braves and the Giants went down to 256 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 1: the last day each one, like a hundred plus games, 257 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:56,880 Speaker 1: um in Atlanta, being in the n L West back 258 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,839 Speaker 1: in those days. To make it, he said, yeah, so 259 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:04,679 Speaker 1: my cousin has season tickets the Dodgers. The Giants were 260 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:07,400 Speaker 1: ending the last day of the season. They were playing 261 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:09,760 Speaker 1: in l A, you know, trying to win the pen in. 262 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:12,880 Speaker 1: So I went to the game and I'm sitting in 263 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:16,400 Speaker 1: the stands, Giants already losing like Piazce like two home runs. 264 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: It's so sad. But and oh my god, it's two o'clock. 265 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: You know, it's five o'clock in New York. And this 266 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 1: is pre cell phone, this is I'm running around Dodgers 267 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:29,040 Speaker 1: Dave trying to find a working pay phone. They're all busted, 268 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 1: like like six phones in a row like I could, 269 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 1: and I'm freaking out. And so I finally find one 270 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 1: and I dial you know, I have my mom's like 271 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: calling card number or whatever, and I'm just I'm not 272 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:41,199 Speaker 1: even into I just want to get back to the 273 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: baseball game because I know that Joan is going to answer, 274 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 1: and I just was like, it's just a formality. So 275 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm just listening to the game. You know, 276 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: we're trying to trying to watch the TV and mobile answers. 277 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:52,360 Speaker 1: He's like Mark Maloy and I said, what are you 278 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: doing this summer? So when you come and work for 279 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,079 Speaker 1: us as an intern, call me next week and we'll 280 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 1: talk details. It was like as got nine second phone 281 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,040 Speaker 1: call on a pay phone in Dodger Stadium and I'm 282 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: standing there like, I think my life just changed. I 283 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 1: don't even know what just happened. We get too later, 284 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:13,800 Speaker 1: excuse me, we get too later. This kid comes in 285 00:14:13,880 --> 00:14:16,760 Speaker 1: to see me and he walks in and he's got 286 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,280 Speaker 1: a pair of flip clubs on and get a goofy 287 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:21,760 Speaker 1: shirt that's hanging out and his hairs all over the place. 288 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: But we had an intern program. They didn't pay people. 289 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 1: We paid all and we got him a place to 290 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:28,400 Speaker 1: stay in a dormitory room. Done it then, why you 291 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:31,120 Speaker 1: had a free room. And I know that somehow in 292 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 1: those days, you can do a lot of things. We 293 00:14:32,760 --> 00:14:35,320 Speaker 1: flew them back and forth. You know, you can do 294 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 1: a lot of things. You can't do those things now. 295 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:41,640 Speaker 1: I show up on January two in a blizzard, and 296 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: Golf Plus turned out to be an absolute home run 297 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: because this was like right when the big birth of 298 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: Driver had launched and had set off this whole equipment war, 299 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 1: and all all the manufacturers wanted to advertise in Golf Plus, 300 00:14:56,040 --> 00:14:58,320 Speaker 1: and so the ad money is pouring in and they 301 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 1: literally cannot fill the pages. And you pour high ideas. 302 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:03,680 Speaker 1: Who we know is one of one of the greatest 303 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: golf mines ever. Uh and absolutely legend and I love 304 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: him and he was a really important mentor and he's 305 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 1: still a friend. But it's not the fastest rite. We 306 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: all know, admit that, right, it's not a deadline that 307 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: was given to him me that wasn't absolutely blown through 308 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:24,800 Speaker 1: by days months. So um, and they have they have 309 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 1: this guy Rick Lipsey, who's kind of helping helping behind me, 310 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: you know, Rick and Rick one of the nicest human 311 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: beings who's ever lived, but also not like a prolific 312 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: deadline writer. And so they're they're literally having trouble feeling 313 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 1: the pages, so that they sent me out to like 314 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:43,520 Speaker 1: the Honda Classic to help hire me, and um, he's like, yeah, 315 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: I'm overwhelmed. He's like, maybe you can make some phone 316 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 1: calls because um, Philip Micholson had just broken his legs 317 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 1: skiing and Fred Couples had just blown out his back 318 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:56,080 Speaker 1: at dal and like all these guys were going down. 319 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 1: He's like, see what you can find out. And so 320 00:15:58,040 --> 00:15:59,600 Speaker 1: it was his first thing he ever wrote for supports 321 00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 1: phils for pretty sure it was. It was a thing 322 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: on Fred Couples and it was about a Fred Couple's 323 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: cut out. And I remember, I mean it was well 324 00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 1: crafted right off the bat. I mean he could write 325 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 1: right off the bat. And I said, let me just 326 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 1: look at it. And I was just going to change 327 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: one word, and because he repeated a word, I think 328 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: he might have two hands in there. And I remember 329 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 1: Ship not went like, oh, you know, don't touch it. 330 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 1: It's like a fucking Picasso, you know. So he had 331 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: real pride. That's a good sign, you know. I mean, 332 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 1: I'm Alan doesn't need any coaching for me, but you know, 333 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 1: right away you could tell he had high standards. So 334 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 1: now they sent me out to start doing stories. And 335 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: I'm not an employee. I'm just interned. So I don't 336 00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: have a business card. I don't have a corporate m X, 337 00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 1: like I literally have my my U c L a 338 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: visa card that has a limit of like four dollars. 339 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 1: And so I'm I'm trying to check out hotels and 340 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 1: I'm getting turned down. I'm not on even twenty one, 341 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 1: so i can't rent cars. I'm taking cabs everywhere. I've 342 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: got this loner laptop. It's like the first generation computer 343 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: ever built practically that it's always breaking on me um 344 00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:05,200 Speaker 1: and it was just it was nutty. But for whatever reason, 345 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 1: I felt like I could do it. And so I 346 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:10,239 Speaker 1: started turning these stories in and they kept and they 347 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:11,960 Speaker 1: were like, Okay, this is pretty good, let's give another one. 348 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: The stories kept getting bigger. I went down to the 349 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:18,240 Speaker 1: Masters for the first time. It just started to snowball. You. 350 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: So you're twenty Yeah, I'm twenty I turned twenty one 351 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:23,440 Speaker 1: at the end of May. Yeah, I did one quarter 352 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: of my junior year and the fall of ninety three 353 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 1: and then um, and then I dropped out. It's me 354 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 1: eight month internship. I was always gonna go back at 355 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: the end of August and so um. And it was 356 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 1: just a crazy time because again this is pre internet. 357 00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:39,919 Speaker 1: So um. I mean, people are paying four thousand dollars 358 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:41,919 Speaker 1: for a one page ad in Sports Illustrated back in 359 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 1: those days, like they had they were printing money, and 360 00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:47,879 Speaker 1: we had what was called the bullpen, you know that 361 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 1: Matt Like, it was all kind of the the young 362 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:54,720 Speaker 1: aspiring writers, but the primary job was to fact check 363 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:57,440 Speaker 1: and maybe write small things. And there was so much talent. 364 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 1: I mean, it was like, you know John Walter's and 365 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 1: him Cruther's and Marty Chats, Yeah, Marty Birds, Chad Millman, 366 00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: who you know has gone to a great career as 367 00:18:06,600 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: a David Fleming, my Michael Jaffee, you know, he's a 368 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 1: successful novelists, like all these guys, and they're just dying 369 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 1: to get any assignment and get out of the bullpen. 370 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:20,160 Speaker 1: And all of a sudden, I'm like I'm traveling every week, 371 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,679 Speaker 1: I'm I'm writing six page features and this is actually 372 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 1: so funny. So Michael Jaffee his his by, He goes 373 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,320 Speaker 1: by Michael Grant Jaffee and one of his one of 374 00:18:29,320 --> 00:18:33,240 Speaker 1: his novels became a Hollywood movie. And he was he 375 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:36,480 Speaker 1: was like college like hockey player. He was a big dude. 376 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:41,679 Speaker 1: He's probably six four, gravelly voice, and he loved haze 377 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:43,719 Speaker 1: me like. I was just this this little, you know, 378 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 1: irritating intern for a while, and all of a sudden 379 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:49,639 Speaker 1: out writing stories. And so you'd file the story and 380 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: again this is pretty cell phone too, you'd have I'd 381 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 1: call in and say, talk to the editors and um, 382 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 1: and this woman named Bambi Wolf kind of oversaw all 383 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 1: these youngest firing writers in the Wolf and and she 384 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:03,639 Speaker 1: would she would parcel out the fact check assignments. And 385 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: so I call in and she said, yeah, Jaffee's your 386 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 1: fact checker. I was like, oh God. So I called Jaffee. 387 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,879 Speaker 1: I was say, hey, Michael, talent show. And there's this 388 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 1: long pause, I mean like five seconds was an eternity. 389 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,560 Speaker 1: And he says, the gods must be mocking me, and 390 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 1: I just I was just going with it. I was 391 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 1: just trying to stay above the fray and and so 392 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:39,520 Speaker 1: by you know, after the US Open really at Oakmont, 393 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:42,159 Speaker 1: which was incredible open. You know that that was Arnie's 394 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,199 Speaker 1: last Open, and that was that was the playoff with 395 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 1: Els and Monty and it was, it was, it was, 396 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 1: It was what an introduction to the National Championship. After that, 397 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:55,520 Speaker 1: Mobile calls me down to his office and and he says, 398 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 1: he's like, hey, kid, you've done a great job. You 399 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: know we're gonna hire you. Don't worry about it. But 400 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:05,159 Speaker 1: you know I'd hire you right now, but your parents 401 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:06,840 Speaker 1: would hate me. You know. You know you need to 402 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:09,160 Speaker 1: go back to school and get your degree. But before 403 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 1: you go, I want you to do one story for me. 404 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 1: And was the year that Ken Griffe Jr. Absolutely blew up. 405 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: You know, I had thirty five home runs at the 406 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 1: All Star break. He signed with Nike and they were 407 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: pumping out all these cool ads, and um, they wanted 408 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,399 Speaker 1: to do a big story on Junior. So it was 409 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,439 Speaker 1: that summer and all of a sudden, I worked in 410 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,199 Speaker 1: one Thursday and I said my baseball editor, Steve hool If, 411 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 1: I said, you know, we're gonna do a story in 412 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,359 Speaker 1: Ken Griffey. He said, both film rights on vacation and 413 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 1: I said, I know so, And so I said, you know, 414 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 1: you're talking about a lot of fifty year old and 415 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:42,600 Speaker 1: sixty year old guys, and do we really want them 416 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:44,480 Speaker 1: to be writing about a nineteen year old kid? Why 417 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 1: don't we have ship Nick? Do it? Well? The look 418 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,400 Speaker 1: at Steve's face so more boy. You know, he calls 419 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:51,720 Speaker 1: me down his big corner office and he's like, um, 420 00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:54,160 Speaker 1: it's like why, He's like, you guys at the same age, 421 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 1: why don't you want you even get the story? Go 422 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 1: to the All Star Game in Pittsburgh and just make 423 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,680 Speaker 1: your pitch and see what happens. It's like, okay, I 424 00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:02,399 Speaker 1: go to the All Star Game and it's great. And 425 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: my my only job was just get like ten seconds 426 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:07,399 Speaker 1: with with Griffy. But of course everybody wants him. And 427 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:09,880 Speaker 1: for three days, basically I can't even I can't even 428 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: like catch a glimpse of him. And I finally cral 429 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 1: him after the All Star Game and and and tell him, 430 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:19,239 Speaker 1: you know what, I what I want to do, and 431 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 1: he's like, he's not you know, he's got people coming 432 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:24,959 Speaker 1: at him left or right. He's like, okay, maybe if 433 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,720 Speaker 1: you come to Seattle maybe we can work something out. 434 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: I was like, great, We'll go to Seattle. And so 435 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:31,439 Speaker 1: this is actually a funny piece of it. So again 436 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,080 Speaker 1: I'm just traveling like I don't even know what I'm doing, 437 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:39,639 Speaker 1: really um, and so I check your So I go 438 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 1: to I fly in the Tech Airport and I just 439 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 1: take the first little like motel by the airport and 440 00:21:46,119 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 1: I check in and again no cell phone. So I 441 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 1: call Mike Bevans, who was their baseball guy, and he 442 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 1: was just really scary, old school guy. People were lived 443 00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:57,880 Speaker 1: in fear of Mike Bevans. I'm still afraid of him. 444 00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 1: If you showed at my front door, I would, I would. 445 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,919 Speaker 1: So I called. I called Bevan's and he's a little 446 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:07,639 Speaker 1: he's a little um amused that I've even gotten this assignment. 447 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 1: And so it's like he's like he's like, how do 448 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,000 Speaker 1: I reach you? Where are you stay? And I'm like, oh, 449 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:16,360 Speaker 1: I'm at the Seattle Airport motor in and and there's 450 00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:18,880 Speaker 1: again there's like this pregnant pause. He's like, check out 451 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 1: immediately and go check into the four seasons. He's like, 452 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:28,680 Speaker 1: s I writers will stay at the Seattle Motor when 453 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:30,879 Speaker 1: the sun is shining in Seattle. There's nowhere nicer. And 454 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: I'm having a great time. I'm down on the field 455 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:35,200 Speaker 1: for batting practice, and I know, I'm just a baseball fan. 456 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 1: It's so cool. And um, I really hadn't covered baseball 457 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: at that point. And um, but Griffy, it looks at 458 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:42,880 Speaker 1: me like I doesn't even know me. When I when 459 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,320 Speaker 1: I reintroduced myself, and he's like, it's it's bad. It's 460 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 1: a bad week. I got all these other commitments. It's 461 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 1: just like, wow, Okay, Kennery, you know, told me in 462 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:51,159 Speaker 1: Pittsburgh to come out. He's like, yeah, sorry, dude. And 463 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:54,119 Speaker 1: so for two or three days, I'm just watching baseball 464 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:55,880 Speaker 1: and hanging out. And every day I have to call 465 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,439 Speaker 1: it Bevan. He's like, how's the story coming? Like it's coming, 466 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,239 Speaker 1: you know, I Cameron, this is camera. Oh this is 467 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: the whole thing is that I've got nothing for this story. 468 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 1: Um except at the All Star Game. Um, Reggie Jackson 469 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,080 Speaker 1: pulled pulled Griffy side and had this long heart to 470 00:23:13,119 --> 00:23:15,199 Speaker 1: heart with him and there weren't many people around, and 471 00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 1: I saw it and I just kind of registered to 472 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,800 Speaker 1: me yet um and I went up to him afterwards, 473 00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: and you know, Mr Jackson, What did you tell Ken Griffin? 474 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:25,920 Speaker 1: He looks at Me's like, that's private. Son. The kid 475 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:30,120 Speaker 1: was never in our of anybody, never overwhelmed by any situation. 476 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: But he was nineteen going on. But that was just 477 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:36,440 Speaker 1: a little moment I got from the All Star game. 478 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,159 Speaker 1: And so now I'm getting desperate. So in those days, 479 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: and I don't know if it's still the same, but uh, 480 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: but where there was a clubhouse entrance where all the 481 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 1: family and friends would kind of wait for the players 482 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 1: after the games, and it was kind of a fun scene. 483 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,600 Speaker 1: Everyone's happy if they won, and everyone knows each other. 484 00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:54,760 Speaker 1: There's a lot of very beautiful women and all that, 485 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,119 Speaker 1: and so, um, I'm hanging out and Griffy, you know, 486 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:00,159 Speaker 1: he's twenty years old. He's living in a man with 487 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:02,400 Speaker 1: some of his high school friends. And there's one guy's name, 488 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:04,240 Speaker 1: I don't know his real name. His name was Jojo, 489 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 1: and um, so I started chatting him up. And this 490 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 1: guy loved to talk, and so he's he's telling me 491 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 1: all kinds of great stuff, and it was like, in 492 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 1: twenty minutes, I had so much good material. And so 493 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 1: Junior comes out now and and Jojo is like, yeah, man, 494 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:25,679 Speaker 1: we had like ten girls in a limo and persist 495 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:27,440 Speaker 1: and his eyes get big because he's like, now this 496 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 1: corporate property, right, and he doesn't want all this stuff out. 497 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 1: In fact, he's and he's also dating the woman he's 498 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 1: gonna wind up marrying, and so he literally puts his 499 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 1: arm around my shoulders and he steers me away and 500 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 1: he's like, he's like, yeah, man, I can't have you 501 00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:44,879 Speaker 1: talking at Jojo. And I said, well, ken, uh, you know, 502 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,640 Speaker 1: I'm here to do a job just like you are, 503 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: and you've blown me off, you know, four days in 504 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,000 Speaker 1: a row. So I've just got to get my information. However, 505 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: I can. You know, I'm sorry, but I gotta talk 506 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:56,720 Speaker 1: to Jojo. He's like yeah, I mean, it's like what 507 00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:58,720 Speaker 1: I have to lose. He's already blowing me off. He's 508 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: like he's like, fine, beat my law here tomorrow at 509 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,200 Speaker 1: ten am and we'll talk. It's like great, so show up. 510 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 1: We talked for like an hour. It's really good. He 511 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:08,840 Speaker 1: jumps up. He's like, nice to meet you. I gotta 512 00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:13,480 Speaker 1: go hit. I was like, you know, I just I 513 00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: just don't have quite enough form, like a big, long story. 514 00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,360 Speaker 1: I'd hate to have to go back to Jojo. He's 515 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 1: like he's like, it's like, motherfucker, be here tomorrow at ten. 516 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:26,280 Speaker 1: And that's it. So the next day, um, you know, 517 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: get like another hour. And so now I've got incredible 518 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,399 Speaker 1: amount of interview time. But I'm still I mean, I 519 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: basically extored the interview, right, it was fantastic, and uh, 520 00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:40,080 Speaker 1: but I'm still I still don't have like the framework 521 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: for the story in my mind. And so then that 522 00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:48,240 Speaker 1: day batting practice, Reggie Jackson is there, and uh, you know, 523 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:50,399 Speaker 1: he's got some special position with the Yankees and with 524 00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:54,399 Speaker 1: Major League Baseball and he kind of travels around and so, um, 525 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,720 Speaker 1: I button holed him and and I say, you know, 526 00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:01,160 Speaker 1: Mr Jackson, we met in Pittsburgh, which it doesn't even remember. 527 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,400 Speaker 1: Of course, I said, I said, this is a potential 528 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: cover story for Sports Illustrated, which I didn't even know 529 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,680 Speaker 1: that to be true, but I knew that Reggie had 530 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:09,399 Speaker 1: like an ego and like that would kind of puff 531 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 1: him up. And so and so he we here recreates 532 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 1: this whole conversation he had with Griffy and and about 533 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:21,000 Speaker 1: all the platforms of stardom, and you know, like he said, 534 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:23,600 Speaker 1: I was King Griffey Jr. When you know, before King 535 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: Griffey Juniors Junior like, and he gives me all this 536 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,120 Speaker 1: great stuff. So I realized, like, there's this whole little thing, 537 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,120 Speaker 1: you know, this passing of the mantle, not necessarily from 538 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,119 Speaker 1: from for Reggie, but just Junior is like this new 539 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: star and generational, generational talent and how everything that's that's 540 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 1: coming his way. And so I kind of used like 541 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 1: the conversation with Rady Jackson to frame the story. Do 542 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:50,480 Speaker 1: you write this in Seattle? Are you you know, are 543 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:52,879 Speaker 1: you a note taker by notebook? Or is this are 544 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:57,119 Speaker 1: you transcribing a video audio recorder? Like what's this form 545 00:26:57,119 --> 00:26:59,760 Speaker 1: of both? I'm recording, I'm taking notes and I'm just 546 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 1: you know, that's all I'm doing while I'm there is 547 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: I'm so focused on this. I'm transcribing, I'm interviewing, and 548 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,440 Speaker 1: I'm talking to other players on both teams. I've got 549 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,679 Speaker 1: so much material. And now, if you remember, was the 550 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,560 Speaker 1: season they got truncated by the strike, Ye, Frank Thomas 551 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:19,159 Speaker 1: is hitting, Griffy's got a chance to hit sixty home 552 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 1: row and the Exposed are unbeatable. It's so so now 553 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:28,640 Speaker 1: we're like in late July, and I thought I had time. 554 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: You know, they basically said, take a couple of weeks 555 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 1: right the story. But Bevan's is like, listen, strike might 556 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:35,880 Speaker 1: be coming. We've gotta get that. We want this story 557 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,159 Speaker 1: to run as soon as possible. You know, this is 558 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:40,680 Speaker 1: like maybe like a Thursday, like can you file Sunday morning. 559 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, And so I just stayed. I stayed 560 00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 1: in the four seasons and I'm good room service. It 561 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:53,040 Speaker 1: was fantastic, and I wrote the story and um meanwhile, 562 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,679 Speaker 1: they got Walter Yost to take an incredible portrait of 563 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,960 Speaker 1: Frank Thomas and Ken Griffe Jr. I shot them separately 564 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:03,200 Speaker 1: on the field before the game, and then I shot 565 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:06,600 Speaker 1: them together in an auxiliary locker room for the cover 566 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:11,400 Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated. So before the game, I had a batt 567 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:14,679 Speaker 1: impact practice picture throw tennis balls and I laid on 568 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:18,000 Speaker 1: the ground and they would hit balls over me. So 569 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: you had the sun and in the middle of the summer, 570 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 1: Comiskey above him in a strobe and you know, I'm 571 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,720 Speaker 1: laying on the ground with no shirt on shirt, you know, 572 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:32,080 Speaker 1: like it was hot out there. The best part of 573 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,159 Speaker 1: it was, you know, I got to meet Griffin in 574 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 1: the long run out of this story, so that to 575 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:41,600 Speaker 1: me was the most important. Thomas was going a little tricky. 576 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 1: So this is the cover. Yeah yeah, check this out. 577 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:51,880 Speaker 1: This is the original like press pass, I've always held 578 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,720 Speaker 1: onto your hand written, because I mean, that's the whole 579 00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 1: other thing is like the pr guy from the Mariners. 580 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 1: When I show up in Seattle, he pulls me aside. 581 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 1: He's like, he's so miffed because I didn't go through 582 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,000 Speaker 1: any of the proper channels. I just went to Griffy 583 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:08,480 Speaker 1: sold it to him. He's like, this is not how 584 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 1: we do things major League Baseball. He's like, I need 585 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 1: to I need to contact for your editor. Like he's 586 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 1: totally piste off at me, and I was just another 587 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:18,880 Speaker 1: thing that was hurting my cause. So he goes all, 588 00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 1: spends ten days with Griffy good knows where Seattle, wherever 589 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: the hell they were playing, turns in this story and 590 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 1: I'm looking at and I said, oh my god. Steve 591 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: comes into me and says, oh my gosh. And every repeater, Currey, everybody, 592 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 1: you know, my assistance, everybody who would read those things, 593 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 1: they said it was a home run. It was the 594 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:38,160 Speaker 1: one and it was a perfect match of people to 595 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,720 Speaker 1: nineteen year olds. So yeah, so that that comes out 596 00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 1: and then the strike hits. But it's such a it's 597 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,880 Speaker 1: like a powerful cover, you know, it's the lighting is 598 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 1: beautiful and they both looked like total badasses. And what 599 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 1: do you do you remember anything about that cover shoot? Uh? Yeah, 600 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: I kept teasing Frank and you know, don't known Frank 601 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,000 Speaker 1: for a while. I just kept saying it was the 602 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: beauty and the beast, me being the beauty. Uh. But 603 00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 1: in Chicago, Uh, weather went bad. Um, but it was 604 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,440 Speaker 1: you know, to me, it was a typical photo shoot. 605 00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:17,040 Speaker 1: You know. I was like, hey, you want to do this. Yeah, 606 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 1: you're gonna be on the coverage sports. Yeah, alright, let's go. Um. 607 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:23,800 Speaker 1: Which I tried to limit my access uh as much 608 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: as I could, but I know there were certain things 609 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 1: that um I had to do. Uh. So that story 610 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 1: comes out, and it's right at the end of my internship, 611 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 1: you know, I'm about to go back to school and 612 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,400 Speaker 1: Mulva calls me down to his office. He's like, kid, 613 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 1: I'm so proud of you. Uh. And he's like he's like, listen, 614 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:43,280 Speaker 1: you go back to school, get your degree. Like we 615 00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: talked about, when you graduate, we'll make your staff writers 616 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,080 Speaker 1: could be the youngest staff writer in the history of 617 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,320 Speaker 1: the magazine. And that was sort of the start of 618 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,520 Speaker 1: his career. And I mean he had a job, the 619 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: full time job at Sports Illustrated the day he finished 620 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:58,920 Speaker 1: up in U C. L a UM. But he's like, 621 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 1: but don't He's like, but when you graduate, I want 622 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: you to I want you to come back to New York. 623 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 1: I think it's important your work out of the office. 624 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,200 Speaker 1: You have the resources of of of the library and 625 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 1: get to know the editors. I said, okay, so I 626 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: go back to school. I have five quarters. I pretty 627 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:15,600 Speaker 1: much stopped right with the Daily Bruin and and kept 628 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 1: riding for Astie. They made me a special contributor. So 629 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 1: I used to cut classes and like fly off to 630 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,440 Speaker 1: the stories and then come back and and it's funny, 631 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,680 Speaker 1: actually had a journalism class, and like I was such 632 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 1: it was kind of a cocky move. I remember going 633 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 1: out to the press room like like slapping a magazine 634 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 1: under desk. I just like submit this story for my 635 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 1: right aout original words. You know, I read the story 636 00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:50,040 Speaker 1: this morning because I was trying to transport myself back 637 00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:54,320 Speaker 1: into the early nineties. The headline of your story is 638 00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:58,560 Speaker 1: junior comes of age. He's the straw that stirs the game, 639 00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:03,920 Speaker 1: and you're a dotes of Reggie to junior. Uh, you know, 640 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 1: in talking about how he would deal with the pressure 641 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,640 Speaker 1: and expectations, Reggie was marveling a sort of I mean, 642 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:16,000 Speaker 1: you're living the story you're writing. Did you ever at 643 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:20,040 Speaker 1: some point have that sense you were also sort of 644 00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 1: basically kind of writing your own story. Yeah, that's a 645 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 1: good question. That's pretty meta really when you think about it. 646 00:32:26,160 --> 00:32:29,959 Speaker 1: But in a small way. Obviously you didn't know that 647 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 1: at that time, But I didn't know that this was 648 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 1: like like a monumental opportunity for obviously to get this assignment. 649 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:43,920 Speaker 1: And as you know, like Devins and David Bower, Rob Flaeder, 650 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 1: like all the top editors, Peter, they all love baseball. 651 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,120 Speaker 1: They were baseball nerds and junkies, like that was the 652 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 1: sport they cared about the most that I don't know 653 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 1: why that's so, but there was just a period in 654 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: s I where all the guys pretty much Random Magazine 655 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,320 Speaker 1: were obsessed with baseball. And so to you know, plant 656 00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:04,040 Speaker 1: your flag in that beat, get it on the cover, 657 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 1: you know, share the cover with with Rick Riley. I 658 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 1: mean it was all the all those things were meaningful, 659 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,320 Speaker 1: so I knew it was a huge opportunity. Um, so 660 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 1: you're twenty one when that cover story came out. You're 661 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:19,040 Speaker 1: twenty one year old. You know, you were still at 662 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,960 Speaker 1: U c l A, still a junior basics, still in 663 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,680 Speaker 1: the in the process of trying to get your degree. Yeah, 664 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 1: that's that's yeah, that was that was cool. And and 665 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 1: I just remember, you know, back then, like walking around 666 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,719 Speaker 1: New York and seeing that magazine on the newsstands and 667 00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:38,960 Speaker 1: like that was that was neat. And um, do you 668 00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:45,200 Speaker 1: have like a hundred copies box somewhere? I have a couple, like, um, 669 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 1: I'm not even sure we're there. But it's so funny 670 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:49,479 Speaker 1: because a guy on Twitter just reached out to me. 671 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:51,480 Speaker 1: He said, I was cleaning my garage and look what 672 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:53,880 Speaker 1: I found and it was that cover and he said, 673 00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:55,320 Speaker 1: can I send it to you? Will you sign it? 674 00:33:55,360 --> 00:34:02,680 Speaker 1: I said, well, I might actually just keep it. What 675 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:07,600 Speaker 1: happened with your relationship with Junior after that cover story 676 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,960 Speaker 1: had do you ever cross paths? The follow up note? 677 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,080 Speaker 1: You know how it is that you rarely get that. 678 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:15,359 Speaker 1: I mean, actually this just came in the mail. This 679 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 1: is a letter from Ben Crunch and like the New 680 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 1: Golf magazine, I have a big feature on band like 681 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,839 Speaker 1: it's very rare to get the handwritten note of course, 682 00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:28,719 Speaker 1: so classy I pumped into too junior. God, it was like, 683 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 1: I mean, literally fifteen years later, he's at the end 684 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:33,200 Speaker 1: of his career. I was. I was living in southern California, 685 00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:34,840 Speaker 1: so every now and then s I would ask me 686 00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,640 Speaker 1: to do some Dodgers stuff. And so he was playing 687 00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:39,279 Speaker 1: for the Reds, you know, he'd gone back to the 688 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,680 Speaker 1: Reds like late in his career, and I was out 689 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:45,000 Speaker 1: there doing a feature and and so I just walked 690 00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:47,879 Speaker 1: up to him and said, hey, Ken, I'm I doubt 691 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:50,359 Speaker 1: you even remember this, but way back at ninety four, 692 00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,360 Speaker 1: you're on the cover of Frank Thomas. Like I was. 693 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:54,640 Speaker 1: I was a young kid. I wrote that story. I 694 00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 1: remember that cover. Man. That was cool and we had 695 00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:59,360 Speaker 1: you know, we had a fun little I'm sure you 696 00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 1: remember the photo. I doubt he even never ever read 697 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: the story, right, but this is a memorable photo. First 698 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:05,719 Speaker 1: time I asked on the cover, So that was kind 699 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 1: of fun. I'll end on this note because my kids 700 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:10,719 Speaker 1: every now and that I've been asked to be a 701 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:14,520 Speaker 1: speaker at you know, the Carmel Middle School career day, 702 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:18,800 Speaker 1: and so kids come out because you know, all the 703 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:20,399 Speaker 1: boys wanted to think they want to be sports writers. 704 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 1: They don't know that the most important thing is to 705 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:23,640 Speaker 1: be a writer, not to be a sports fan. But 706 00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 1: they all show up and I tell the story about 707 00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:28,920 Speaker 1: sending them the letters to mulboy because I did have 708 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,720 Speaker 1: some natural ability to write. But the most important part 709 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,720 Speaker 1: of the whole tale is that you know, the dog 710 00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,320 Speaker 1: and determination to send him those letters, to be waiting 711 00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 1: from on the tea, to keep following up, Like I 712 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:42,880 Speaker 1: basically forced the guy to give me an internship, and 713 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,000 Speaker 1: that was where it all began. So I tell the 714 00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,120 Speaker 1: story to kids, like it's not enough to be good 715 00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:49,440 Speaker 1: at something, like you have to really want it, and 716 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,759 Speaker 1: you have to really follow up, and you have to 717 00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:57,919 Speaker 1: be really dogging. Over the years of you know, watching him, 718 00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:02,719 Speaker 1: working with him report, you know, next to him, there's 719 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:06,279 Speaker 1: not many people who who report. I mean, you can 720 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:08,360 Speaker 1: have a great writer, and you can have a great reporter, 721 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 1: and sometimes you have a great reporter who also is 722 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,880 Speaker 1: a great writer, which I think Alan is because I 723 00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:15,440 Speaker 1: don't think he gets enough credit for his reporting, which 724 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:19,080 Speaker 1: ultimately leads to his great writing. Funny thing. Man, it's 725 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:21,680 Speaker 1: an interesting point you bring up. For instance, I looked 726 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:24,759 Speaker 1: at people and I qualified that quantify them as I 727 00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:26,840 Speaker 1: was a far better reporter, for instance, than I was 728 00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 1: a writer. I also wrote twelve books that I wrote 729 00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,879 Speaker 1: yet really cover stories for Sports Illustrated, Curry Kirkpatrick was 730 00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 1: fine a reporter writer combination as you'd find anywhere. And 731 00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,200 Speaker 1: if you're I mean, if you're a great reporter, you 732 00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 1: can survive as a writer. But if you're a writer 733 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:46,640 Speaker 1: who can't report, you have a hard time surviving. Alan 734 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 1: had that perfect blend. He he asked the right questions, 735 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: He was very imprescient, he was knowledgeable, he looked around, 736 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,680 Speaker 1: he talked to people, and uh, and then he wrote, 737 00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:00,760 Speaker 1: I mean, when you have the dual talents that he had. Uh. 738 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:05,080 Speaker 1: It was brilliant. First impressions about well, I could tell 739 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:09,279 Speaker 1: how enthusiastic he was and but also a real confidence, 740 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,799 Speaker 1: borring on cockiness, because he just I think knew he 741 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,880 Speaker 1: was sort of destined for something and he wasn't. I 742 00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,399 Speaker 1: didn't think odd by being a Sports Illustrated I mean 743 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 1: he basically I think I felt like, you know, Okay, 744 00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,799 Speaker 1: I got here through some fortune, but this is where 745 00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:25,359 Speaker 1: I was gonna end up, one way or the other. 746 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 1: And you know, I think he was comfortable with the task, 747 00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: and I think he knew, you know, the traditions of 748 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:33,680 Speaker 1: the writing there, and I think he thought he could 749 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,640 Speaker 1: meet them, and uh, you know, not without you know, 750 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,360 Speaker 1: he wasn't at all obnoxious about it, but he just 751 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 1: carried himself with an assurance that was you know, very 752 00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,240 Speaker 1: evident and not off footing. It was more like, Okay, 753 00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 1: you know, this kid's gonna go someplace, and you know, 754 00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:54,960 Speaker 1: just don't don't act like he's got to pay all 755 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,000 Speaker 1: these dues. He's already you know, at a high level 756 00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,919 Speaker 1: at that time before he's obviously that was the strike year, 757 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:06,239 Speaker 1: but Thomas is having a thunders here and Griffy might 758 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,480 Speaker 1: hit sixty home runs. Do you kind of what's your 759 00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:12,520 Speaker 1: recollection of sort of his status. Well, I've never met 760 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:16,480 Speaker 1: either of them before. I mean, Griffy, it was one 761 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:18,959 Speaker 1: of my favorite players of all time, you know, maybe 762 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,840 Speaker 1: the sweetest swinging up there with the Maggio and the 763 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 1: history of the game and did everything magically. So maybe 764 00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,560 Speaker 1: I spent fifteen minutes with the portraits and as he had. 765 00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 1: You know, I had some polaroids I shot and Griffy 766 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,560 Speaker 1: is sitting around. I said, like, don't you want to leave? 767 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:41,520 Speaker 1: He said, no, I like photography. You want to take 768 00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 1: some more pictures. When do you get that opportunity? So 769 00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 1: he sat there and we just took photographs for the 770 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:50,959 Speaker 1: like fifteen or twenty minutes. I mean, Griffy's got more 771 00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:55,840 Speaker 1: camera gear I've had the last like twenty years. He 772 00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:01,919 Speaker 1: loves photography. And we became acquainted that day and we've 773 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:03,839 Speaker 1: become friends ever since. You know, I did a book 774 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:07,799 Speaker 1: of Griffy. You know, he's a terrific person, a great 775 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:13,359 Speaker 1: family man. Um. I love Griffy. So to to go 776 00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:19,400 Speaker 1: back to Walter for a second in that cover shoot 777 00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:23,800 Speaker 1: Frank Thomas that year, Alan Schipner, do you have any 778 00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:27,319 Speaker 1: recollection of this twenty one year old kid trying to 779 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,440 Speaker 1: wrangle you in Pittsburgh at the All Star Game and 780 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:34,279 Speaker 1: then Seattle and trying to trying to trying to get 781 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:36,319 Speaker 1: time with you as he was trying to Do you 782 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:42,480 Speaker 1: have any recollection of this at all? No? Um, you 783 00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,959 Speaker 1: know I do remember going to the photo shoot because 784 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,680 Speaker 1: I was like, why am I? They don't want my 785 00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 1: jersey on. This is not normal and Walter, you know, 786 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: to me, it was one of those things that you 787 00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,759 Speaker 1: know that was twenty four there's one of those things 788 00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:03,120 Speaker 1: that you gotta do Sports Illustrated and I just said, okay, 789 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:06,759 Speaker 1: here we go. Me. I mean, I do remember that 790 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,520 Speaker 1: the interview was a little longer then it should have been. 791 00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:26,640 Speaker 1: All good stuff out obviously, thanks again. Tradition here on 792 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,920 Speaker 1: the fire pit is to ask all of our guests 793 00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:32,799 Speaker 1: what is your favorite firement? I mean, I grew up 794 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:35,799 Speaker 1: backpacking with my dad in the Sierra and sitting around 795 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 1: those campfires in the middle of nowhere where it's pitch 796 00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:41,960 Speaker 1: black and more stars. You could ever imagine that that 797 00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:44,560 Speaker 1: would be an early memory. But in a golf context, 798 00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:47,640 Speaker 1: it has to be up abandoned dudes. At the end 799 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:52,960 Speaker 1: of a long, taxing Uncle Tony Invitational, there's always a 800 00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:57,319 Speaker 1: lot of camaraderie. Everyone's emotional because it's been such a 801 00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:00,279 Speaker 1: fun time and often back to our real lives. People 802 00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:02,919 Speaker 1: are drinking out the trophy, not me, but that's gonna 803 00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:07,040 Speaker 1: happen soon. Um. You know, Joe Horrowitz is drumming the guitar. 804 00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:11,399 Speaker 1: You're surrounded by those towering trees, and it's just such 805 00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:15,440 Speaker 1: an evocative setting and it would be beautiful, uh if 806 00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:19,319 Speaker 1: you're there by yourself, but the camaraderie and the group 807 00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:22,560 Speaker 1: of guys we have at the communal experience of haven't 808 00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:24,960 Speaker 1: played the tournament. Now this is kind of the end 809 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,200 Speaker 1: of it. That's definitely my favorite firepit fun feeling to 810 00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:33,719 Speaker 1: hear this this story and uh and and again for 811 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:37,680 Speaker 1: bits and pieces throughout our relationship and friendship and travels 812 00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:39,680 Speaker 1: all over the world, but to hear it all in 813 00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:43,480 Speaker 1: one sort of narrative arc was was it treat? So 814 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:47,520 Speaker 1: thanks again for the time, Thanks again for sharing, and 815 00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:50,439 Speaker 1: and I'm sure I'll see you at a fire pitson hopefully. Yeah, 816 00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 1: I look forward to Thanks for having me a thank 817 00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:56,880 Speaker 1: you for listening to the Firepit. This podcast is produced 818 00:41:56,920 --> 00:42:00,879 Speaker 1: by alex Or Peggy, edited by Rex Linked. Theme song 819 00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:04,520 Speaker 1: and music by Joe Horns. Please rate and review on 820 00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:07,520 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts and you might find your review featured in 821 00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:10,360 Speaker 1: a future episode. I got a question, comment, or a 822 00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: story for us to track down. You can find me 823 00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:16,319 Speaker 1: on Twitter at Matt Janella or on Instagram at Matt 824 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:20,759 Speaker 1: Underscore Jenelle. A condensed visual cut of this podcast is 825 00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:24,239 Speaker 1: also available on the fire Pit with Mattenella YouTube chin 826 00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:27,840 Speaker 1: and if you haven't done so already, please subscribe to 827 00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:31,040 Speaker 1: the fire Pit on iTunes, Spotify, or a stitcher.