Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Law Podcast. I'm June Grosso. Every
Speaker 1: day we bring you insight and analysis into the most
Speaker 1: important legal news of the day. You can find more
Speaker 1: episodes of the Bloomberg Law Podcast on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud
Speaker 1: and on Bloomberg dot com slash podcasts. President Trump won
Speaker 1: a legal round in his effort to undo Obamacare. A
Speaker 1: DC federal judge rules that the Trump administration can expand
Speaker 1: the sale of short term health insurance policies that don't
Speaker 1: meet the standards of the Affordable Care Act. Joining me
Speaker 1: as Timothy Jos, professor at Washington n Ley School of Law,
Speaker 1: explain what these short term health insurance policies are and
Speaker 1: why they don't meet the standards of Obamacare. The Health
Speaker 1: Insurance Portability and Accountability Act back in impose some regulations
Speaker 1: on the individual health insurance market, but excluded what it
Speaker 1: referred to a short term, limited duration health plans, and
Speaker 1: when the a c A was adopted in two thousand
Speaker 1: and ten, it carried over the definition of individual health
Speaker 1: insurance coverage and thus implicitly that exclusion of these plans.
Speaker 1: The Obama administration and two thousand and fifteen I believe
Speaker 1: adopted a regulation that would limit them to three months
Speaker 1: non renewable, and the Trump administration then last year expanded
Speaker 1: them so that they can now extend up to three
Speaker 1: and sixty four days or at least less than a year,
Speaker 1: and can be renewed for up to three years. And
Speaker 1: the reason for doing that, it explained, was to create
Speaker 1: an alternative to the individual health insurance market. And the
Speaker 1: plaintiffs in this case in the d C. District Court
Speaker 1: sued claiming that that's exactly what Congress didn't want. That
Speaker 1: they wanted to get all of individual health insurance coverage
Speaker 1: into the a C, A comply and more market with
Speaker 1: its consumer protections. So that's what the case was about.
Speaker 1: Did the federal judge, Judge Richard Leon Bases ruling on
Speaker 1: the impact of these policies on the whole of Obamacare. No,
Speaker 1: he simply held, and held it in a number of
Speaker 1: different ways, that the term short term limited duration was
Speaker 1: not defined in the law, and therefore the Department of
Speaker 1: Health and Human Services could define it anyway at once too,
Speaker 1: And so he said that they had acted within their
Speaker 1: discretion in defining it in this way. So what are
Speaker 1: the concerns of the plaintiffs about having these short term
Speaker 1: health insurance policies available. Well, I think there are two concerns.
Speaker 1: One is that the policies themselves have some very serious drawbacks.
Speaker 1: They don't cover pre existing conditions, they have annual in
Speaker 1: lifetime limits, which are prohibited under the Affordable Care Act,
Speaker 1: many of them have very high deductibles, and they don't
Speaker 1: offer much protection to consumers. A second problem is that
Speaker 1: the theory is that healthy people will purchase these policies
Speaker 1: and leave the individual health insurance market. And in fact,
Speaker 1: the Department admitted in its preface to the regulations that
Speaker 1: a million people could do that. It could be much
Speaker 1: more than that. And if healthy people leave the a
Speaker 1: regulated individual insurance market, that's going to drive up premiums
Speaker 1: for everyone left behind, those people with pre existing conditions.
Speaker 1: A third problem actually is the market any of these products.
Speaker 1: They are pushed very hard. People that are listeners may
Speaker 1: have gotten calls urging them to purchase these kinds of policies.
Speaker 1: They're pushed very hard by brokers, by websites, and it's
Speaker 1: often very unclear either they're a compliant or not, and
Speaker 1: people who are looking for a c a compliance policies
Speaker 1: are often steered to these products. So now other federal
Speaker 1: judges have rejected some of the Trump administration's sort of
Speaker 1: and runs around Obamacare, for example, the rule permitting small
Speaker 1: businesses to join together to offer plans exempt from the rules.
Speaker 1: So how much does this particular judges ruling advance the
Speaker 1: president's effort to undo Obamacare. Well, I think it is
Speaker 1: a very significant ruling. Of course, the biggest case pending
Speaker 1: right now is the case in New Orleans and the
Speaker 1: Fifth Circuit that would completely destroy the Affordable Care Act
Speaker 1: and all of its provisions. But I think this is
Speaker 1: a very important case because the short term limited duration plans,
Speaker 1: I think are for many people the most immediately available
Speaker 1: alternative to a see A compliant policies and will probably
Speaker 1: have the greatest impact on increasing premiums for people who
Speaker 1: have to remain in the a c A compliant market.
Speaker 1: We assume that the case you were talking about the
Speaker 1: Federal Appeals Court in New Orleans that will end up
Speaker 1: at the Supreme Court. Are these cases where the judges
Speaker 1: are ruling on certain rules that the Trump administration put forth,
Speaker 1: are they likely to end up at the Supreme Court
Speaker 1: as well? They could end up at the Supreme Court.
Speaker 1: I think that they're less likely to because they have
Speaker 1: less of an impact then the case in New Orleans,
Speaker 1: but they certainly could end up in the Supreme Court.
Speaker 1: Right now, they're both headed for the d C. Circuit
Speaker 1: Court of Appeals, and uh, I think that they could
Speaker 1: very likely end up there. We've talked before about that case.
Speaker 1: The Federal Appeals Court is considering weighing request to overrule
Speaker 1: a Texas judges decision late last year to strike down Obamacare,
Speaker 1: and it's entirely now that there have been oral arguments.
Speaker 1: Do you still feel that the Texas judge really was
Speaker 1: out of bounds in doing that? Oh? Absolutely, I mean,
Speaker 1: and people across the political spectrum, including for example, Senator Collins,
Speaker 1: have said that the decision was contrary to the law
Speaker 1: and often have said that it's absurd. But I've listened
Speaker 1: to the oral argument, and it's not at all clear
Speaker 1: that the majority of the judges and the Fifth Circuit
Speaker 1: will we'll go along with that. There's a chance that
Speaker 1: at least part of his ruling is going to be upheld.
Speaker 1: They were very enlightening, Thank you so much, as you
Speaker 1: are as well. That's Professor Timothy just of the Washington
Speaker 1: and Lee School of Law. Thanks for listening to the
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Law Podcast. You can subscribe and listen to the
Speaker 1: show on Apple pod podcast, SoundCloud, and on Bloomberg dot
Speaker 1: com slash podcast. I'm June Brosso. This is Bloomberg m