1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 1: On the Bell Cast, the questions asked if movies have 2 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: women in um, are all their discussions just boyfriends and 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: husbands or do they have individualism? The patriarchy? Zef invest 4 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:17,960 Speaker 1: start changing it with the bec Del cast. Dude, dude, 5 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:23,560 Speaker 1: du dude, dude Due. Once upon a time there was 6 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: a podcast I'm bailing. I'm bailing on the bed. I'll 7 00:00:28,720 --> 00:00:36,200 Speaker 1: keep going in this podcast, dude, dude Due. This podcast 8 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:40,199 Speaker 1: was really was really mean to a lot of movies. 9 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 1: And one day a poor little movie walked into the 10 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: podcasts Castle and the and the poor little person said, 11 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: please don't hate my movie. I tried my best, do 12 00:00:55,800 --> 00:01:12,800 Speaker 1: do do? Okay, okay, like this amazing when ball and 13 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 1: orchestra can be anything? Where is this going? Okay? Sorry, 14 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: so twenty one I'm crying. The podcast was like, get 15 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:37,959 Speaker 1: away from here, go away. Your movie sucks and we're 16 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:48,240 Speaker 1: not going to give it a chance. And can you, um, 17 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 1: what's something about my beautiful music? No, that's amazing. Um 18 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: So anyway, this movie, this little movie was like, please 19 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: don't turn me away, Please give me a chance. In 20 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 1: the podcast is like, no, I cary to make it quieter. 21 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: Oh my god, I don't know what's happening anyway. So 22 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 1: the moral of the story is that the podcast was 23 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:24,960 Speaker 1: really mean and it had to learn well, I don't know, 24 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 1: didn't have to learn anything. What am you saying? Do 25 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:37,440 Speaker 1: do do do? Do? Do do? Get ready the next 26 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:44,079 Speaker 1: song starting do do Do Do Do? Do Do Do? 27 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: Do We do? Little Podcast isn't quiet podcast? Every episode 28 00:02:53,880 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 1: like the one people Good Self on the podcast Little 29 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: Hosts waking up to bachtel cast backtel Castel movies. There 30 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:22,519 Speaker 1: goes the whole movies. I know every line of dialogue 31 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 1: in this movie, Like it's so there's movies I could 32 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,120 Speaker 1: in a in a pinch, I could close my eyes 33 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 1: and basically watch, you know, because you've just seen them 34 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 1: so many times. I could probably do this with like 35 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 1: movies like Beauty and the Beast and like obviously some 36 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: d coms, just like movies that are just like whoop 37 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: just there forever Yes same. This and a few other 38 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:51,920 Speaker 1: Disney Renaissance movies are that for me as well. This 39 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 1: was one of the four main ones I watched on 40 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 1: repeat as a kid. Bell was my favorite because she 41 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 1: had brown hair and she could read, and I could 42 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: relate with those things which I think we said Okay, 43 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:09,160 Speaker 1: So first of all, Hi, this is the Bechtel Cast. 44 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: We'll be our podcast, be our podcast that doesn't make 45 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 1: make sense. This is the Bechtel Cast. My name is 46 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 1: Caitlin Darante, my name is Jamie Loftus, and this is 47 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: our show where we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, 48 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: using the Bechtel test merely as a jumping off point 49 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: to initiate a larger conversation about representation in cinema. This 50 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 1: is kind of a special episode for for us because 51 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:49,160 Speaker 1: we are redoing, revisiting, returning to four episodes throughout this year. 52 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 1: We haven't really decided when, but we thought this would 53 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 1: be a fun place to start. Yes, of episodes we 54 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:58,599 Speaker 1: did early in this series that we're like, we can do, 55 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 1: we can do better. We just it's been and it's 56 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:04,200 Speaker 1: because it has nothing to do with anything other than 57 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:07,320 Speaker 1: that they are four year old episodes and there's just 58 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:10,840 Speaker 1: kind of more to say now. Yeah, they were all 59 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:14,400 Speaker 1: episodes that like among the first like ten episodes we 60 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,720 Speaker 1: ever recorded and released and believed or not. It was 61 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 1: before we really knew what we were doing. So our 62 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 1: guests are and were amazing, and then we were just 63 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: like we we missed with the four movies, especially, we 64 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 1: just missed things that seem very obvious to us now 65 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: that we just van did not mention at the time. 66 00:05:35,040 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: So we're redoing them. And Beauty and the Beast is 67 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:42,040 Speaker 1: our first episode that we are redoing throughout the year. 68 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:44,040 Speaker 1: Later in the year, it's gonna be What's Matt Max 69 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 1: Fury Road The Matrix, which I will watch and people 70 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: will leave me alone about people. Ever, well, people will 71 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:56,479 Speaker 1: also riot that you people. I mean, I will be 72 00:05:56,480 --> 00:06:00,160 Speaker 1: a different person once I've actually seen The Matrix. Um, 73 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 1: I will be red pilled. Uh and then uh, and 74 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,039 Speaker 1: then it's killed Bill. We're gonna redo our first episode 75 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: ever So, but this is we're doing Beauty and the 76 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:13,479 Speaker 1: Beast to kick off the year. It's uh, it's a 77 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:16,560 Speaker 1: if not a fan favorite, a movie that everyone on 78 00:06:16,600 --> 00:06:19,719 Speaker 1: the face of the planet has basically seen, I think so. 79 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: And since we last covered it, there's been a really 80 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,799 Speaker 1: bad version of it. They came out almost four years 81 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:29,720 Speaker 1: ago at this point and made it was like that 82 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 1: whole Okay, we're gonna be talking about kind of a 83 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: Smartgese board of Beauty and the Beast adaptations. We're grounding 84 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:40,640 Speaker 1: it in the classic But um, I watched the two 85 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:44,039 Speaker 1: thousand seventeen one for the first time today and was 86 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:48,680 Speaker 1: just like, holy shit, a billion dollars can look like anything, 87 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:53,799 Speaker 1: you know, like how that movie made over a billion dollars? Wait? 88 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:59,520 Speaker 1: Did it? Yes? It made one point to Billiawn Dollard 89 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 1: made so much money, and and then you're Emma Watson 90 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:09,480 Speaker 1: goes like she sounds like tea pain, like she's so 91 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 1: auto tuned. You're like, what is going on? A billion dollars? 92 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 1: And that's why I feel pretty firmly convinced. Once Disney 93 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 1: did that, once bob Iger Boby Gare was like, oh, 94 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: we can make a billion dollars off of that. I 95 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: guess quality is not a problem. And and that's why 96 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: all the reboots are just like bad because they don't 97 00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 1: have to be good because they made a billion dollars 98 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:39,119 Speaker 1: with with the worst one that I've seen. I haven't 99 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 1: seen them all, but I've seen a couple of them 100 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: and impauty of the pieces. So yeah, it's yeah in theaters. 101 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 1: I saw it bravely. I saw in theaters I was 102 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: contributing to the billion other people. I'm kidding. It doesn't 103 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: caused a dollar to see a like a billion dollars. 104 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 1: That's so many dollars, so many dollars um the Disney reap. 105 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 1: I haven't seen the Dumbo one, nor the Cinderella one 106 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: from I think or I haven't seen Maleficent either, but 107 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: I've seen like a Laddin. Lion King is low key. 108 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,240 Speaker 1: I kind of liked. I have only seen the first Moleficent, 109 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 1: but I was like, the first Moleficent was kind of fun. 110 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 1: It was like diet wicked kind of. I have not 111 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 1: seen the Cinderella one and won't. And I did see Tumbo. Wow, 112 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:32,559 Speaker 1: thank you. It was a mess. It was a disaster. 113 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:34,720 Speaker 1: It was so bad. I haven't seen most of them. 114 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 1: I've seen. I have seen the Lion King. I've watched 115 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 1: the new Mulan once the paywall was brought down. Oh right, 116 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 1: I haven't seen that one either. It's fun, it's fine, 117 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:48,320 Speaker 1: it's but there's a lot of controversy around. I mean, 118 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:51,599 Speaker 1: that's a whole other we'll get to that one eventually. 119 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 1: There's you know, there's it's okay. They're all essentially none 120 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: of them are as good as the original, and they're 121 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: all like generally like not very but the Beauty, but 122 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: Beauty and the Beast was like about, like, holy sh it, 123 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:10,400 Speaker 1: what was what happened? Everything went wrong everything, and then 124 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:13,719 Speaker 1: they've made a billion dollar Like I just no one 125 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:17,840 Speaker 1: learned a damn thing. Well, you know what a damn thing. 126 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: Something I need to be reminded of often is that 127 00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:28,320 Speaker 1: nostalgia is a powerful emotion and people will make decisions 128 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:32,080 Speaker 1: strong enough. But I mean that explains I think that 129 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:35,320 Speaker 1: explains why a billion dollars was made. Yes, that's why 130 00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: a billion dollars worth of chances being taken. But like 131 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 1: I can't imagine. I mean, I'm curious in the future 132 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 1: when children who saw the reboot then process it later 133 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 1: they're like that, what was that? What was that all about? 134 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:57,080 Speaker 1: It was so it was wow, Wow, I love Luke Evans. 135 00:09:57,840 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 1: And then at the end, you know how like a 136 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 1: we're gonna get to one, the good one. But the 137 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:08,080 Speaker 1: there there was that huge show made of like Lafo 138 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:11,160 Speaker 1: Josh Gad's character is going to be the first out 139 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 1: gay character in all of Disney history, and then you're like, 140 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 1: when is that going to become clear? And then it 141 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: never does. But there's this shot at the end where 142 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 1: like La food dances with a man we don't know 143 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: for a second, and they're like, yeah, it had happened. 144 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 1: It was it. Wow. I mean so many parts of 145 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 1: the movie were a slap in the face, but that 146 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 1: was that was a special one. That was a special 147 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: slab one of many issues I can't And then I 148 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 1: also like, when The Beast came to life, I don't 149 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:50,480 Speaker 1: know who I thought that actor was going to be. 150 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:54,560 Speaker 1: But I had this flash of rage where I was like, 151 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 1: who the fuck is that there was at the end 152 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 1: where the whole cast is supposed to all of a 153 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 1: sudden be a very famous person at the end, Right, 154 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: you've got Emma Thompson, You've got Audre McDonald, You've got 155 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: you Greg, You've got McKellen mckellin, Stanley Stanley, oh my gosh, 156 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,320 Speaker 1: Stanley tu cheese and and then there and then like 157 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 1: and here's the Beast, and you're like, who that? Who 158 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: the funk is that? I don't know who even was 159 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 1: that man. I couldn't tell you. A bunch of people 160 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 1: are about to like swan dive into my mentions and 161 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,200 Speaker 1: be like, hey was in I didn't know who that 162 00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 1: man was. He wasn't famous enough to be in the movie. 163 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:42,679 Speaker 1: He wasn't famous enough. I can't. I don't know why 164 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 1: I can't say famous today. He was not famous enough 165 00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: to be in the movie. And that interpretation of the Beast, 166 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:53,480 Speaker 1: it was horrible. He was so mean, he was so 167 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 1: and he looked like shit. C in that movie was 168 00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 1: a zaster And oh my god, Bell's dress. I okay, wait, 169 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: I have to pull up a tap because I looked 170 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 1: up the costume designer for the movie, very like well 171 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:19,360 Speaker 1: regarded costume designer. Um, I will find what her name was. 172 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:21,959 Speaker 1: But it was the I think maybe the most I 173 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:27,640 Speaker 1: parti ist dress for Bell. Like her dress, I was like, 174 00:12:27,679 --> 00:12:30,080 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure I wore that in the like that 175 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 1: exact dress in like the second grade, Like what is 176 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 1: going on here? It was nominated for Best Costume Design 177 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 1: and seeing at the Academy Awards a billion dollars, I 178 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 1: don't even know what's going on. Absolutely Cosaster. Jacqueline Durant, 179 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 1: very well regarded costume designer, has done some of the 180 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:56,800 Speaker 1: most iconic Like she did she did a tone that 181 00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:59,959 Speaker 1: she said, some of the best costume designs of our lifetime, 182 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: I'm sure, and then she went to I party. I 183 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: just couldn't tell. You don't know. We don't m hmmm, 184 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:12,320 Speaker 1: did we? I don't think we've said what the Bechdel 185 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 1: test was yet the Bedel test, I guess the beck 186 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 1: Doel test. Do you want to say it or should? 187 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: I don't know why I'm so mad about it. I'm fine. 188 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 1: I'm happy to say it is. It's a mediametric created 189 00:13:31,440 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 1: by queer cartoonist Alison Bechdel that requires that two people 190 00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:40,800 Speaker 1: of any marginalized gender have to have names, have to 191 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 1: speak to each other, and they have to talk about 192 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:47,200 Speaker 1: something other than a man. Our standard is a two 193 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:51,959 Speaker 1: line exchange or more of dialogue. So that's a Becktel test, 194 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:57,160 Speaker 1: and then will determine if Beauting the Beast or other 195 00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 1: adaptations passes later on. The one definitely passes the Backdel test. 196 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 1: But it's just a perfect example of what a flawed 197 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:07,800 Speaker 1: metric it is, because you can just be talking in 198 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 1: the worst movie you've ever heard and it can pass 199 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 1: the Backtel So, okay, we are talking about Caitlin, what 200 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 1: is your history with Beauty and the Beast feature film? 201 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 1: Like I said, I just want I watched this movie 202 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 1: on repeat as a kid. It came out and when 203 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 1: I was. I was like five when it came out 204 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:35,800 Speaker 1: and perfect. So I've basically was watching it since we 205 00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: got it on like VHS that year or in ninety 206 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: two or whenever, um, and have been watching it ever since. UM. 207 00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: So yeah, So this is one of my favorite animated 208 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 1: Disney movies, or at least it was at you know, 209 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 1: the time. I have mixed feelings about it now, but 210 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: I deal. There's still a lot that I that I 211 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 1: appreciate about it, and I love, especially the score, which 212 00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: you so beautifully we're singing earlier. I mean it's like 213 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:09,880 Speaker 1: common Yes, Um, what's your history with it? I mean 214 00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 1: about the same. It came out before I was born, 215 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 1: but I literally don't remember a life before this movie. 216 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 1: I just it's It's always been the one. It was. 217 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 1: Belle was my favor because she was not like the 218 00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 1: other girls because she could read a book. So yeah, 219 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: I absolutely loved it. Watched it five trillion times, and 220 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 1: as I get older and then I started bringing in animation. 221 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: It's like some of the most beautiful animation ever. It's 222 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:47,840 Speaker 1: so like when I was in college, I think they released, um, 223 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 1: like a remaster of it in theaters. Um, and I 224 00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 1: went to see it in theaters like in imax, and 225 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: it's so beautiful and yeah, I just I I really, 226 00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:01,840 Speaker 1: I really uh love this movie and a lot of levels. 227 00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 1: It's not I mean, it's so it's so mired in 228 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:11,200 Speaker 1: a lot of shit, but I think of the Disney 229 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 1: um renaissance, it's not even close to like the worst 230 00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 1: disservice of a female character, which is not you know, 231 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 1: speaking super complimentary. The bar is on the floor. But yeah, 232 00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 1: rewatching it for for this and then also kind of 233 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:35,360 Speaker 1: watching the various attempts to update it. Um, I think 234 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: it holds up, you know, relatively wealth obviously. I mean 235 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: it's there's been so much discourse about this movie that 236 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 1: I don't even think I have any like new points 237 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 1: to bring to the table. The problems with the story 238 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: have been pretty well trodden, and we will trod it again. 239 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 1: But I still love the movie. I so to prepare 240 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 1: for this, I watched the two Disney versions. I love 241 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:07,120 Speaker 1: the original, hated the reboot, and then I also used 242 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:10,240 Speaker 1: to watch with my mom for some I don't know why. 243 00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 1: This was a Fourth of July tradition. Um On the 244 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 1: fourth of July, my mom and I used to watch. 245 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:20,560 Speaker 1: There was a TV series on CBS that was called 246 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:25,399 Speaker 1: Beauty and the Beast and it starred Linda Hamilton's as 247 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:30,120 Speaker 1: the Bell character, but she's called Catherine and the show 248 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:34,640 Speaker 1: and she's a high powered assistant d a problematic and 249 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 1: then the Beast is played by Ron Perlman in the 250 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:42,399 Speaker 1: most makeup You've ever seen in your entire life. But 251 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: even Ron Pearlman on like VHS quality CBS TV show 252 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:53,119 Speaker 1: in looks better than the c G I Beast with 253 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,240 Speaker 1: like whatever ten is balls all over his head. But yeah, 254 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,600 Speaker 1: so I watched a few episodes of that to prepare 255 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 1: as well, because I was like, well, let's find a 256 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:04,760 Speaker 1: midpoint and um, you know, the DC has a disaster. 257 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: George R. R. Martin wrote on that show of his 258 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: early credits, that's one of those things that I learned 259 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: about and then immediately forget and then relearn like six 260 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:17,199 Speaker 1: months later, and then immediately forget and then relearn, And 261 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 1: just like just because the second had appeared on screen, 262 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,600 Speaker 1: I was like, I've read that somewhere, even though I 263 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 1: don't even care, But yeah, this show was was fun. 264 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 1: The Beast lives in we know how It's like it's 265 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 1: almost like us, like empty tunnels. The Beast lives in 266 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 1: one of those tunnels. He lives in one of the 267 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 1: US tunnels, and Linda Hamilton's goes down to one of 268 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,680 Speaker 1: the US tunnels and then they I don't know, I 269 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 1: only watched the first three episodes, but it's like they 270 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:48,639 Speaker 1: agree in the pilot there like this can never be 271 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: because you're a d A and I'm the Beast. Like 272 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:56,160 Speaker 1: it's so weird because she's like very eighties and he's 273 00:18:56,200 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 1: still like the Beast and he lives in a subway tube. 274 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 1: That's I mean, that sounds a bit like Phantom of 275 00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 1: the Opera. It's extremely Phantom of the Opera to the 276 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 1: point where I'm like, why didn't they just do that? 277 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,639 Speaker 1: My my guess is Phantom of the Opera would have 278 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,760 Speaker 1: been a really popular Broadway show at this time, and 279 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:15,480 Speaker 1: they were like, how can we have Phantom of the 280 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 1: Opera without paying for the rights to it? I see, 281 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,360 Speaker 1: that's my guests because this was like seven so pre 282 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,800 Speaker 1: Disney making a good version of this, so we're like, 283 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 1: let's make a really bad version of it, and they did, Um, 284 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,199 Speaker 1: but I recommend it. I got CBS All Access for it, 285 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: and I'm not to unsign up. Now I just have it, 286 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 1: so now you haven't congratulations. Yeah, let me know if 287 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: you want my password, if you want to want the 288 00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: Good Fight? Is that the one with Christine Baranski, because 289 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: if I'll watch it? Hell yeah? Okay, well yeah, I 290 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: mean my notes mostly focused on I have a little 291 00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:57,359 Speaker 1: bit of like what the live action remake attempts to 292 00:19:57,440 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 1: do to like update stuff, but most of my notes 293 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 1: are on the animated version. Yeah. Yeah, no, let's let's 294 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 1: talk about the version. Um that is fun to talk about. Yes, okay, 295 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:15,880 Speaker 1: let's take a quick break and then we will come 296 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:25,440 Speaker 1: back and get into the recap. And we're back. So 297 00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: we get some backstory about the beast. Oh my god, 298 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,840 Speaker 1: I'm gonna pass my pants off again, but just imagine 299 00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: right right, So we get some backstory about the beast. Um. 300 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 1: He was horrible to this old beggar woman who shows 301 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 1: up at his castle. She turns out to be a 302 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 1: beautiful enchantress, so as punishment for him mistreating her, she 303 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 1: turns him into a beast and places a spell on 304 00:20:55,640 --> 00:21:00,080 Speaker 1: the entire castle, um which we will eventually learn that 305 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,919 Speaker 1: all of the occupants of the castle are turned into 306 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 1: like enchanted objects. Household objects. Yeah, so she says, this enchantress, 307 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:13,160 Speaker 1: if you can get someone to fall in love with you, 308 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:15,520 Speaker 1: if you fall in love with someone and get someone 309 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,200 Speaker 1: to fall in love with you back by the time 310 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:22,200 Speaker 1: the last pedal fells on this enchanted rose, this spell 311 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:26,439 Speaker 1: will be broken and your beast curse will be lifted. Right. 312 00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: So that's the backstory, very specific curse she's casting. But 313 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: I remember when I was very tiny. How in the 314 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: Stained Glass introduction, the I guess which or recalling her 315 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:44,200 Speaker 1: which she's an a sorceress, an enchantress? Is what an enchantress? 316 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: She's wearing this beautiful green dress that I was. I 317 00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:50,600 Speaker 1: was like, Oh, I wish that you actually saw her. Um, 318 00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:56,919 Speaker 1: like that. I just liked that dress to say, dude, 319 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:05,360 Speaker 1: that was not dude, it's a beautiful dress. Okay. Then 320 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,600 Speaker 1: we cut to Bell. She lives in a small French 321 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 1: town with her father, Maurice, who is an inventor. She 322 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:19,120 Speaker 1: loves to read. She is very beautiful, and those are 323 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:23,359 Speaker 1: the two most important things about her. Really. Um, she 324 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:28,240 Speaker 1: is so hot that the guy who owns and operates 325 00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:32,440 Speaker 1: a bookstore doesn't say anything when she treats the bookstore 326 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,600 Speaker 1: like it's a library. He never corrects her. He's never 327 00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 1: like you you have to pay for the books. So 328 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:42,000 Speaker 1: hot people can be very intimidating like that. That's why 329 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,160 Speaker 1: hot people are generally really rude and have no idea. 330 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: They're just like walking around because everyone's like h then 331 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: no one, no one ever tells them that, yeah she did, 332 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 1: that is true. She treats the whole damn plays like 333 00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: a library. And then he's like, actually, you can keep 334 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,399 Speaker 1: the book for free, and like you're doubling down on 335 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 1: not teaching this woman what a store is. Not only 336 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 1: are you letting her borrow books that you are trying 337 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 1: to sell for human money, you are giving them away 338 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:16,680 Speaker 1: now to this hot woman for free. So yeah, that's 339 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 1: how hot she is, and that's how much she loves 340 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 1: to read. I love. This is kind of like probably 341 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 1: the as a as a child of our generation. Um, 342 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:31,360 Speaker 1: this is probably the first like not like the other 343 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:35,879 Speaker 1: Girl's song that really gets like nailed, you know, into 344 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:38,359 Speaker 1: your head over and over. Like if you're hot and 345 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:43,200 Speaker 1: you can read a book, guess what you're gonna be 346 00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:46,639 Speaker 1: both very desired and you're gonna be very reviled, which 347 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 1: is like, I don't know what message. What the message 348 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 1: is the message? We don't know. But if you're hot 349 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 1: and you can read, look out, people are gonna have 350 00:23:54,440 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 1: strong takes one way or another. So that's Bells whole 351 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 1: thing is she also um, she wants more than this 352 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:07,199 Speaker 1: provincial life in this small French town. She sings about that. 353 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:12,520 Speaker 1: And then there's also the French Chad Gaston. Yes, he 354 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,280 Speaker 1: wants to marry Bell because she is hot, but she 355 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 1: has no interest in him because he's dripping with toxic masculinity. 356 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 1: Gaston also has a little sidekick, Lafu. So um, Bell's 357 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: father Maurice is working on this wood chopping invention to 358 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:35,000 Speaker 1: take to this fair uh and he sets off but 359 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 1: gets lost along the way and happens upon this dark 360 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 1: and scary castle, which is like, I think we talked 361 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,879 Speaker 1: about this the first time, but like didn't Does no 362 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: one know about the castle? How long has the castle 363 00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,120 Speaker 1: been there? Is the provincial town not aware that there's 364 00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: a gigantic castle? How long has the curse been going on? 365 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:57,920 Speaker 1: Because it seems like he's pretty young when the curses 366 00:24:57,960 --> 00:24:59,320 Speaker 1: put on him and they're like you haven till your 367 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:02,439 Speaker 1: twenty one bird days, You're like, okay, Max a couple 368 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: of years so did the monarchy fall a couple of 369 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,879 Speaker 1: years ago, but then everyone got like men in Black 370 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: like forget Ray and they forget that there was We've 371 00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 1: talked about this before. Yeah, and this is one of 372 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:19,159 Speaker 1: the things that UM the live action remake attempts to 373 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: address UM and I would recommend checking out. Lindsay Ellis 374 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:27,320 Speaker 1: does a really great video essay on this live action 375 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 1: remake and a friend of the cast, Friend of the cast, 376 00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: and how a lot of the problems with it are 377 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:40,160 Speaker 1: the movie trying to like address fan criticism over the years. 378 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,200 Speaker 1: It's like, my thing is, like I don't even super 379 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:47,639 Speaker 1: object to like a remake trying to address fan criticism, 380 00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:53,640 Speaker 1: but like almost every every way that this reboot chooses 381 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:58,879 Speaker 1: to address it is basically incoherent, Like right, there's a 382 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 1: there's a one cent Tin's way to address that criticism 383 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: that doesn't whatever. It's like a nod to the fact that, yes, 384 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:11,280 Speaker 1: the plot point doesn't super make sense, but it isn't 385 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:16,119 Speaker 1: like this whole like convoluted, Like every attempt to explain 386 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 1: anything in their reboot, You're like, what are you talking about? 387 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 1: It weakens the story for sure. On every occasion yeah, 388 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,159 Speaker 1: I feel like you can. You can nod to it 389 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:32,840 Speaker 1: without being like, oh, there's a whole like Pixar theory 390 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,159 Speaker 1: on your Like, it doesn't really matter. It's not that 391 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,679 Speaker 1: big a deal anyway. So Maurice shows up at this 392 00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:43,399 Speaker 1: castle and this is where the Beast lives, and the 393 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:47,680 Speaker 1: Beast takes Maurice as his prisoner. And then also, as 394 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,479 Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier, the prince who is now the Beast, 395 00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: his servants have been turned into these enchanted objects. So 396 00:26:56,600 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 1: we've got like, Lumier is a candlestick, cogs Were is 397 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 1: a clock, Mrs Potts is a tea pot, her son 398 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:07,520 Speaker 1: Chip is a little teacup. And these are all characters 399 00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:11,439 Speaker 1: that Maurice meets early on. They're all cute. They're cute. 400 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 1: So back in town, guest On is trying to force 401 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 1: Bell into a marriage. She's not having it. And then 402 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,600 Speaker 1: her horse shows back up without her dad, so she 403 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 1: goes looking for Maurice and also ends up at the 404 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:31,199 Speaker 1: castle where she comes upon her father, comes upon the 405 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:34,840 Speaker 1: beast and offers to take her father's place as the 406 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: Beast's prisoner, and the Beast is like, sounds good to me, 407 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:43,720 Speaker 1: here's yourself, And so like it would be so easy 408 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 1: to just be like, do I need a prisoner? You know? 409 00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:51,680 Speaker 1: But whatever I mean, we'll talk about. This is how 410 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:56,840 Speaker 1: the story goes. So Lumier, Cogsworth, et cetera see Bell 411 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:01,320 Speaker 1: being there as an opportunity for this spell to be lifted, 412 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:05,200 Speaker 1: and they basically try to orchestrate a romance between Bell 413 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: and the beast basically right away. But the beast has 414 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:15,080 Speaker 1: an awful temper and he's yelling. He's like, never fucking 415 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: go to the west wing of the castle. Here's a bedroom, 416 00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 1: but don't go to the west wing. Meanwhile, back in town, 417 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 1: Guston is singing about how awesome he is, and then 418 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:28,880 Speaker 1: Maurice comes into the tavern. He's like, hey, there's this 419 00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:33,440 Speaker 1: beast and he has taken Bell as prisoner, and everyone 420 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 1: thinks that Maurice is delusional, and then Guston sees this 421 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: as an opportunity to kind of use the possibility that 422 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:45,239 Speaker 1: Maurice could get locked up as leverage to try to 423 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:49,840 Speaker 1: get closer to marrying Bell, which is truly one of 424 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: the most evil ideas in all of Disney Cannon. Yes, 425 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 1: I feel like it's uh not discussed enough. What a 426 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 1: truly base and evil idea it is. Yeah, He's like, 427 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,880 Speaker 1: I'm going to lock your father up, Bell unless you 428 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:10,960 Speaker 1: marry me. Sound good? That was his plan? Okay? And yeah, 429 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:15,080 Speaker 1: So back at the castle, Beast has demanded that Bell 430 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: have dinner with him. She doesn't want to, and he 431 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,400 Speaker 1: screams at her and tells her to go ahead and starve. 432 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:26,000 Speaker 1: And then later that night, because this a lot of 433 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:28,320 Speaker 1: the recap so far has only taken has taken place 434 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 1: over the course of a single day, which I always forget. 435 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,000 Speaker 1: It is a lot of things to happen in a day, 436 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 1: and you have to keep in mind that when you 437 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,280 Speaker 1: take a step into the woods, it's immediately night, which 438 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 1: people don't remember, but the second you're in the shade, 439 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,320 Speaker 1: it's actually night. And that's just kind of how the 440 00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 1: visual works. Yeah, it's very jarring, and I feel like, 441 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: again just like one of the things that translates to 442 00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:56,640 Speaker 1: live action a little weirder right in the animated In 443 00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,800 Speaker 1: the animated version, I never I truly never noticed, but 444 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:02,760 Speaker 1: when you see it in live action, you're like, huh, 445 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 1: it truly is just a Tuesday for for this town. 446 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 1: So Beasts tells her to starve, but later that night 447 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: she does come out of her room for some food, 448 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 1: and this is when we get the br guest song. Beautiful, 449 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 1: some of the most beautiful animation ever. So good, so pretty, 450 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 1: Jerry Orbach, I'm iconic performance. It's just so good. What 451 00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:36,240 Speaker 1: I should have said earlier was back dull cast, back 452 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 1: to cast. That's way better than this. The seven minute 453 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:43,640 Speaker 1: tangent we went on at the beginning, I guess we 454 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:48,280 Speaker 1: have to let's start over. Welcome to the back Doel cast. 455 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 1: My name is your guest is so beautiful. I've also 456 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 1: remember now, I've also seen this the animated movie in 457 00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,080 Speaker 1: l a before, because you know, in the before times 458 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:02,200 Speaker 1: where they used to show old Disney movies at El 459 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:06,400 Speaker 1: Capitan Theater. Oh yeah, I went to see Beauty and 460 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:11,000 Speaker 1: the Beast when I was um by myself. Wait, I 461 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:13,320 Speaker 1: think I remember this, Yeah, I think when you did 462 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,640 Speaker 1: after a battal cast recording ones because it's close to 463 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: the studio. It was so nice. It's like when you 464 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:21,600 Speaker 1: get there, you're like, wow, this is a lot of 465 00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:25,000 Speaker 1: families and I am a single adult. But it was 466 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:27,760 Speaker 1: really beautiful. And they bring Bell out at the beginning, 467 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:32,000 Speaker 1: and she throws from fetty at the audience. Wow, classic 468 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: Bell and the kids love it. Um okay. So later 469 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: that night, because it's still the same day, just Tuesday, 470 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 1: it's just Tuesday, she sneaks into the West Wing where 471 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 1: the Beast had told her not to go, and she 472 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,680 Speaker 1: comes upon the Rose and she almost touches it, but 473 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:55,400 Speaker 1: the Beast stops her and he flips out. This is 474 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 1: another point in the in the U in the reboot, 475 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 1: where there's way too much backstory that no one wanted. 476 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 1: Where she goes to the West Wing and there she's like, oh, 477 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:06,680 Speaker 1: it's the story of the royal family and all the 478 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,239 Speaker 1: and there's like a whole family tree thing, and then 479 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: you're like huh. And then the Beast is like, no, 480 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 1: both of our moms are dead and that's why we're 481 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 1: and it's like, it turns out I didn't want it. 482 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:19,520 Speaker 1: Turns out I didn't want it. I didn't care. I 483 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 1: didn't care, And it's way easier. There's just an oil 484 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:24,880 Speaker 1: painting of a hot guy that she doesn't know as 485 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 1: the Beast, an allegedly hot guy. I contend, I too contend. 486 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: I also think that the Beast as a man looks 487 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:43,520 Speaker 1: exactly like Patrick Wilson does in phantom like dead Ringer. 488 00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:46,040 Speaker 1: I think that was part of why I was so 489 00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:48,760 Speaker 1: outraged at the end of the one. I'm like, they 490 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: should have just I mean, he the age gap between 491 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: Emma Watson and him would have been pretty large, but 492 00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 1: I was like, it should have just been they photo. 493 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 1: What what can you do? I mean? Anyways, So, yes, 494 00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:10,080 Speaker 1: she comes across the rose and the beast is. She 495 00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:14,720 Speaker 1: freaks out. He's throwing furniture around, he being a very 496 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 1: scary guy. Yes he is, and she is very frightened, understandably, 497 00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 1: and she runs out of the castle. She's like, I 498 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,040 Speaker 1: don't care what I said about agreeing to stay here. 499 00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 1: I'm leaving. And it's easy for her to do, which 500 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,800 Speaker 1: is it? And she does remember this because she does 501 00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:39,920 Speaker 1: it again later. Yeah, the doors aren't even locked. Um. 502 00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 1: One of my things is why does she accept her 503 00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 1: fate so quickly? Why doesn't she try to escape sooner? 504 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:50,320 Speaker 1: You know, we can talk about that. I mean, it's like, 505 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 1: I guess she is kind of like I guess I 506 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: can just kind of go whenever because anytime she wants 507 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,640 Speaker 1: to leave, which is a few different times. Um, it's 508 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 1: not a problem. Yes, the staff that not only is 509 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:07,760 Speaker 1: the beasts quote unquote staff very much on her side. 510 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 1: There's not enough of them to stop and their their candles. 511 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 1: What are they gonna do? What are they gonna do? Nothing? Nothing. 512 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,319 Speaker 1: If I was Bell, I would just be like, what 513 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 1: are you gonna do? Truly? What if you fall asleep? 514 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,480 Speaker 1: I could just at any moment not be here anymore. 515 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: But you know, what can you do? There's that big 516 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,839 Speaker 1: wardrobe maybe that would like fall over, try to fall 517 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:32,880 Speaker 1: over on her or something's like Bell's best friend. She's like, 518 00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:36,200 Speaker 1: you're so beautiful and great and I love you, and 519 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 1: she would never collapse on them. True, it would be 520 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:47,040 Speaker 1: funny if she tried. Um. So Bell leaves, but in 521 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:51,280 Speaker 1: the woods she gets attacked by wolves who we've already 522 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,239 Speaker 1: seen attack more use because apparently all the wolves in 523 00:34:54,239 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 1: this you know land are somebody got to feed these wolves. 524 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:05,200 Speaker 1: They seem like they might have rabies. I don't know, 525 00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,560 Speaker 1: but this is this is like super nitpicky, But it doesn't. 526 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:10,960 Speaker 1: It does make me a lot. It's winter in the woods. 527 00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,759 Speaker 1: It's winter at night in the woods at all times, 528 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 1: and but it's it's like fall. It's a different season nearby. 529 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,080 Speaker 1: It's not snowing. Another thing they like try to pass 530 00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:25,600 Speaker 1: off as a joke and try to explain in the remake, 531 00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:28,800 Speaker 1: which again, and it looks doesn't It looks so bad. 532 00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:32,280 Speaker 1: It's also just like trust that your audience can suspend 533 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:36,120 Speaker 1: their disbelief for some stuff fun to notice. It's fun 534 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,359 Speaker 1: to notice, and I didn't need Emma Watson to do 535 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: a Shakespearean monologue about it. But whatever. But I like 536 00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:49,399 Speaker 1: winter in the woods and the coyotes are starving. They're 537 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 1: so wolves and they try to kill Bell, but the 538 00:35:55,239 --> 00:36:00,239 Speaker 1: Beast swoops in and saves the day. He gets ittten 539 00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,239 Speaker 1: up by some of the wolves, and she has a 540 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 1: moment where she's like, am I going to leave and 541 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:08,680 Speaker 1: escape for good or not? And she decides not. She 542 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,880 Speaker 1: decides to take the beast back to the castle, return 543 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,480 Speaker 1: with him as his prisoner, and kind of nurse him 544 00:36:16,520 --> 00:36:21,520 Speaker 1: back to health. And this is when things start to change. Basically, 545 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:25,560 Speaker 1: he starts to become more caring and gentle than he 546 00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 1: was before. He shows her the castle's library and Bell 547 00:36:30,719 --> 00:36:35,759 Speaker 1: loves it because Bell loves books. Then that's all kind 548 00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: of happens really fast. But then there's like, then there's 549 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:41,680 Speaker 1: this a romantic evening where they basically have a ball, 550 00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:44,760 Speaker 1: but it's just the two of them and they both 551 00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:48,400 Speaker 1: get dressed up. Be very uncomfortable in real life, but 552 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:52,399 Speaker 1: it's beautiful in the movie to have like it's did. 553 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,880 Speaker 1: Just imagine like being dressed up in this huge crinoline 554 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:58,440 Speaker 1: dress and then here the clink clink clink of forks 555 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,960 Speaker 1: um with you and someone who's sitting really couldn't be 556 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:06,800 Speaker 1: sitting further away from you. Um. We're like like yummy, um. 557 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 1: But it is romantic the way it's presented, and it's 558 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,759 Speaker 1: so it's iconic. It's beautiful, and when they dance, it's 559 00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:14,880 Speaker 1: the first, like one of the I think it is 560 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:19,840 Speaker 1: like the first computer generated animated shot ever featured in 561 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,280 Speaker 1: a feature film. It's beauty. Yes, yeah, it's nice. And 562 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,719 Speaker 1: this is also where we get the song pod as 563 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:34,359 Speaker 1: old at time. It's nice. It's Angela Landsberry. And then 564 00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:36,680 Speaker 1: when Emma Thompson thinks that later, you're like, I love 565 00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:39,080 Speaker 1: Emma Thompson, but it's not fair that she had to. 566 00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:41,720 Speaker 1: You know, you're not going to do better than Angela 567 00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 1: Landsberry's Angela Landsberry. You know they shouldn't have tried, but 568 00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,080 Speaker 1: they made a billion dollars, so they had to write. 569 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: So they're having this romantic evening. They're having a nice time. 570 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,360 Speaker 1: But Bell is like, oh shucks, I miss my father, 571 00:37:58,000 --> 00:37:59,920 Speaker 1: and the Beast is like, well, here, look at him 572 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:04,720 Speaker 1: in my magic mirror. And she sees in the mirror 573 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:08,120 Speaker 1: that Maurice, who has been out looking for Bell, is 574 00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:12,600 Speaker 1: lost and alone and possibly dying. So she's like, hey, Beast, 575 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,880 Speaker 1: I need to leave, and he's like, okay, you can leave. 576 00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:19,680 Speaker 1: You are no longer my prisoner. So she leaves the 577 00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,799 Speaker 1: castle and finds Maurice, and then once they're back home, 578 00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:28,080 Speaker 1: Gaston is like, oh shoot, like, if there's this beast 579 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: out there, we have to we have to get rid 580 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:34,319 Speaker 1: of them. Gaston really as a villain, knows how to 581 00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,600 Speaker 1: think on his feet, because he goes in with a 582 00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:40,319 Speaker 1: game plan, and then he with a very evil game plan, 583 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:47,160 Speaker 1: which is too basically imprison Maury's with a cartoon character 584 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,120 Speaker 1: who terrified me as a child, the old man with 585 00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:55,640 Speaker 1: the scraggly hair, terrifying, terrifying, terrifying person. So his plan 586 00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 1: is to basically throw Maurice away in exchange for Bell's 587 00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,640 Speaker 1: hand in Mary. That's what he goes in thinking, and 588 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,520 Speaker 1: then he pivots and he's like, actually, we're going to 589 00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:10,480 Speaker 1: commit a murder right now, which is like galaxy brain 590 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:16,080 Speaker 1: villain activity. I didn't this time. I this watch, I 591 00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,239 Speaker 1: was like, Wow, he really thought in his feet there, 592 00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:20,640 Speaker 1: and if he was on the right side of history, 593 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:23,840 Speaker 1: imagine what we could have accomplished with Gaston because he 594 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,800 Speaker 1: just like changed the plan so quickly and got everyone 595 00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,279 Speaker 1: on his side. And I feel like one of my 596 00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:33,440 Speaker 1: opinions that maybe has sort of changed between um, when 597 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: we first did this episode and now is I feel 598 00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:40,759 Speaker 1: like I vaguely remember being like, it's mean to the 599 00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 1: townspeople to say that they would just you know, turn, 600 00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,439 Speaker 1: and they would be so gullible to have to turn 601 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,319 Speaker 1: like that. Um, I don't feel that way anymore because 602 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:52,160 Speaker 1: guess what, I've been alive for the past calendar year 603 00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:56,920 Speaker 1: and that happens all the fucking time. So now I'm like, wow, 604 00:39:56,960 --> 00:40:01,560 Speaker 1: that was hyper realistic. And I'm upset because especially because 605 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,880 Speaker 1: they are set up from the beginning as like being 606 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:11,360 Speaker 1: strong admirers of guests on they're like presentatives being just 607 00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:14,680 Speaker 1: kind of like sheeple who will go along with whatever 608 00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:20,279 Speaker 1: this like hunk Bully has to say, and so it 609 00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:24,280 Speaker 1: um it turns out they were right. I was naive 610 00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:29,120 Speaker 1: and this does happen. Um, It's basically just an anti 611 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,319 Speaker 1: mask riot going to you know, murder someone for no 612 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:37,680 Speaker 1: read These things happen, they happen. Yes, so yeah, Guston's like, 613 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:41,480 Speaker 1: come on, everyone, grab your pitchforks and let's go kill 614 00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:45,080 Speaker 1: the beast, which is also a great song. And they 615 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 1: attacked the castle, but the enchanted objects fight back, and 616 00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:54,719 Speaker 1: Belle and Maurice, who are still locked up somewhere I 617 00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:57,640 Speaker 1: think their basement or something. I don't know, Chip, who 618 00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:01,640 Speaker 1: has stowed away when Bell left, help them escape. Bell 619 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:05,000 Speaker 1: goes back to the castle and then Guston is about 620 00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,520 Speaker 1: to kill the beast. Uh, and there's an altercation there. 621 00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 1: Gaston stabs the beast, which would not be happening these days. 622 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:20,000 Speaker 1: We're not no longer would we have the main antagonist 623 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:24,680 Speaker 1: actively stabbing stabbing stabbing. But I do, I do, I do? 624 00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:29,080 Speaker 1: Like the guest on um dies, Yeah, well he does 625 00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:32,799 Speaker 1: the classic Disney simply kill that. Yeah, he falls into 626 00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: he falls into it in an infinity pit, but he 627 00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:38,799 Speaker 1: goes flat And I kind of miss when the villain 628 00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:41,279 Speaker 1: went splat. It made me miss nostalgic for when the 629 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:43,399 Speaker 1: villain used to go splat. I get why the villain 630 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:45,520 Speaker 1: no longer goes splat, and the villain you know, kind 631 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,040 Speaker 1: of learns, oh, I was wrong and I'm going to rehabilitate. 632 00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:50,799 Speaker 1: But I kind of miss when they went splat. Does 633 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:54,000 Speaker 1: that not happen in the remake? I feel like he 634 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 1: does to the remakes. The remakes all happen the same. 635 00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:01,319 Speaker 1: I'm talking about like New Original Disney story where I 636 00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:03,920 Speaker 1: feel like, more like maybe it's even like a Pixar thing, 637 00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:06,680 Speaker 1: but more often than not, like you get like a 638 00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:09,160 Speaker 1: Toy Story three thing where it's like, actually, the villain 639 00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: had a traumatic backstory and their villainous with context, and 640 00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:15,319 Speaker 1: now they're going to start un learning the traumatic things 641 00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:17,359 Speaker 1: that made them villains and they're gonna be nice, which 642 00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:23,800 Speaker 1: is beautiful, but I kind of miss when they went splat. Sure, yeah, right, Okay, 643 00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:27,640 Speaker 1: So Guston first shoots Beasts with the bow and arrow 644 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:30,040 Speaker 1: and then stabs him and like and then Beast is 645 00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:31,919 Speaker 1: like kind of ready to give up because he thinks 646 00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:34,000 Speaker 1: that Bell doesn't love him, but then Bell shows back 647 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:36,120 Speaker 1: up at the castle. He's like, wait a minute, Bell 648 00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:38,680 Speaker 1: is back, Maybe she does love me so he kind 649 00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,680 Speaker 1: of gets a second wind, and there's this whole altercation. 650 00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:46,840 Speaker 1: Guest On falls off into the ravine. Um beausy. He 651 00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:52,200 Speaker 1: goes splat. Beast is dying from the stab wound. But 652 00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:57,880 Speaker 1: Bell is like, Beast, I love you, and that heels 653 00:42:57,960 --> 00:43:04,880 Speaker 1: his artery. Yes, that undoes the internal bleeding that he 654 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:10,640 Speaker 1: is dying from, which is which is great for him, 655 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:15,080 Speaker 1: and the spell has been broken. The Beast turns back 656 00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:18,880 Speaker 1: into a human prince. All the enchanted objects in the 657 00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:23,080 Speaker 1: castle turned back into people, and they all live happily 658 00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:28,400 Speaker 1: ever after. Sure we're not so why not that's the story. 659 00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:31,880 Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break and come back to discuss. 660 00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:43,560 Speaker 1: And we're back. Where should we start? I guess? I mean, 661 00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:48,200 Speaker 1: do I just start baby talking about um Bell? Does 662 00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:52,080 Speaker 1: that make sense? That makes so much sense to get 663 00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,560 Speaker 1: a place as I need to start. Yeah, I mean 664 00:43:54,640 --> 00:44:00,319 Speaker 1: I feel like this is like, uh, a discord as 665 00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:06,759 Speaker 1: old as time, Jamie, thank you so much, Bell. I 666 00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:10,239 Speaker 1: feel I mean this again, this is not a super compliment. 667 00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:13,440 Speaker 1: The bar is low. I still feel like Bell is 668 00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:18,800 Speaker 1: among at least foundationally, one of the stronger of the 669 00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:23,640 Speaker 1: nineties disnease princesses. And how she's written we will get 670 00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,240 Speaker 1: to I guess I'll just say what I like about 671 00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:31,200 Speaker 1: her character at the top. I like that she is UM. 672 00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:33,440 Speaker 1: I guess we don't necessarily know that she's intelligent. We 673 00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:35,319 Speaker 1: really just know she can read. We don't know what 674 00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:39,520 Speaker 1: her comprehension level is really UM, I think we're meant to. 675 00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 1: I think like her loving to read is code for 676 00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 1: it was like she's smart can be as interpreted as yes, 677 00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:50,279 Speaker 1: she's very smart. I like that she is confident in that, 678 00:44:50,400 --> 00:44:53,360 Speaker 1: and even when people give her shit about it, she 679 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:58,120 Speaker 1: is still out there reading. I appreciate that. I appreciate 680 00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:02,960 Speaker 1: that her Unlike some you know, Disney family dynamics, her 681 00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:06,279 Speaker 1: dad UM is very supportive of the fact that she 682 00:45:06,320 --> 00:45:09,080 Speaker 1: loves to read. He is not actively trying to marry 683 00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:12,920 Speaker 1: her off to some random person. When Bell says that 684 00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:15,520 Speaker 1: she doesn't want to marry guests on, he respects that. 685 00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,080 Speaker 1: So I generally like the dynamic that they have. It 686 00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:25,040 Speaker 1: makes sense that this eccentric inventor would have a brainy daughter, 687 00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:27,800 Speaker 1: and he does, and he appreciates that, and they appreciate 688 00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:31,640 Speaker 1: each other. And I like that UM and I feel 689 00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:35,560 Speaker 1: like Bell is uh put In, and I guess this 690 00:45:35,640 --> 00:45:38,800 Speaker 1: is like an entryway to the rest of the conversation. 691 00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:43,280 Speaker 1: But she's put in a series of pretty impossible situations 692 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:50,799 Speaker 1: and is making active decisions pretty frequently. Right, The situations 693 00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:54,320 Speaker 1: she's being put in and the choices that she makes 694 00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:57,880 Speaker 1: are certainly up for debate. But she is not like 695 00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:03,640 Speaker 1: a sleeping beauty path passive character. She is making decisions 696 00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:09,120 Speaker 1: actively throughout just the bummer that they were not better 697 00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:15,080 Speaker 1: choices are options at her disposal and then related to that, 698 00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,640 Speaker 1: I think is and this is part of a larger 699 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:21,920 Speaker 1: conversation to be had also, But the Beast spends a 700 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:26,280 Speaker 1: great deal of the movie mistreating her, and she does 701 00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:30,240 Speaker 1: push back on it a lot of the time, which 702 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:35,160 Speaker 1: does which is good, which is good. So again, just 703 00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:41,280 Speaker 1: kind of a more maybe passive character or a less 704 00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:46,640 Speaker 1: thoughtfully written character would not have been characterized that way 705 00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:50,160 Speaker 1: to challenge the Beast in a lot of his behavior. 706 00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:54,040 Speaker 1: So I appreciated that that was like a nice thing 707 00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:57,040 Speaker 1: as a young person to see, especially to see like 708 00:46:57,640 --> 00:47:02,400 Speaker 1: a woman in a movie targeted word children to like 709 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:07,239 Speaker 1: challenge like a man being shitty. Yes, I especially, I 710 00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:12,239 Speaker 1: mean we have talked to death, how imperfect nineties Third 711 00:47:12,239 --> 00:47:14,759 Speaker 1: wave feminism is, and I feel like Belle is very 712 00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:20,759 Speaker 1: solidly a part of that discussion, where it's like she 713 00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:23,920 Speaker 1: is doing a lot, and she's speaking up more and 714 00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,680 Speaker 1: she's pushing back, and she like values her intelligence and 715 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:30,080 Speaker 1: her outcome is more or less the same as it 716 00:47:30,080 --> 00:47:32,200 Speaker 1: would be if she were not doing those things. So 717 00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:35,839 Speaker 1: that's not ideal, um, but I you know, it is definitely. 718 00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:38,120 Speaker 1: I feel like one of the things we lacked from 719 00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:42,319 Speaker 1: our first pass at this discussion was the context of 720 00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:45,400 Speaker 1: when this was coming out. And so when this was 721 00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:49,040 Speaker 1: coming out, the last Disney princess you had to compare 722 00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:52,280 Speaker 1: her against was Ariel, and so it's a step forward 723 00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:56,000 Speaker 1: in that regard. I also don't know how much we 724 00:47:56,040 --> 00:48:00,680 Speaker 1: talked about the screenwriter of this movie at the time. Um. 725 00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:05,880 Speaker 1: Linda Wolverton, who has kind of um even since we 726 00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:11,520 Speaker 1: last recorded, remained in this. I guess it's not I 727 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:14,799 Speaker 1: don't know what to call it. She's written Disney heroines 728 00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:20,880 Speaker 1: for almost thirty years now, where she wrote Beauty and 729 00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:24,560 Speaker 1: the Beast. She did work on a Labin, She was 730 00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:27,040 Speaker 1: has a co writing credit on The Lion King. She 731 00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:30,840 Speaker 1: did work on Mulan. She wrote the screenplays for the 732 00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:35,160 Speaker 1: Tim Burton Alice in Wonderland, she wrote Maleficent, she wrote 733 00:48:35,160 --> 00:48:38,239 Speaker 1: Alice through the Looking Glass, and she wrote the second Maleficent. 734 00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:43,799 Speaker 1: So she's been in it for a bit writing. I 735 00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:50,440 Speaker 1: think these pretty commercially successful commercial feminism characters. Yes, so 736 00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:55,360 Speaker 1: you did. The Bell was very much a woman of 737 00:48:55,360 --> 00:49:00,120 Speaker 1: her time and by her time, I mean. One of 738 00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:03,400 Speaker 1: the big things that and I think this might be 739 00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:07,120 Speaker 1: sort of me repeating myself from the first episode, and 740 00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:09,160 Speaker 1: there will be a little bit of that, but well, 741 00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:11,279 Speaker 1: no one can go back and check, so well, yeah, 742 00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:16,759 Speaker 1: and then certainly I wouldn't, but I took issue with it, 743 00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,600 Speaker 1: then I take issue with it now still that One 744 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:22,839 Speaker 1: of the big things that just strikes me about her 745 00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:25,799 Speaker 1: character in general is she is characterized in the very 746 00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:29,040 Speaker 1: beginning as her uh and this is so this is 747 00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:33,600 Speaker 1: a pretty standard thing for a lot of protagonists of 748 00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:37,320 Speaker 1: any story, where they are kind of equipped with a longing, 749 00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,000 Speaker 1: a desire, something that they want, some sort of like 750 00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:44,600 Speaker 1: empty void want Disney song, right, some some void in 751 00:49:44,640 --> 00:49:47,960 Speaker 1: their life that in theory will be fulfilled by the 752 00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:49,440 Speaker 1: end of the story, And a lot of times the 753 00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:53,440 Speaker 1: story is about how they go about filling that void 754 00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:56,879 Speaker 1: or whatever journey that they've gone on manages to fill 755 00:49:56,920 --> 00:50:02,319 Speaker 1: that void. So Bill's song her want is, and she 756 00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:05,560 Speaker 1: says it very explicitly in song form, I want much 757 00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,480 Speaker 1: more than this provincial life. I want adventure in the 758 00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:11,439 Speaker 1: great wide somewhere. So she's talking about I mean, well, 759 00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:15,320 Speaker 1: maybe she should have been more specific when she said somewhere, um, 760 00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:18,759 Speaker 1: but yes, yeah, she doesn't get what she wants right. 761 00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,600 Speaker 1: So she's talking about wanting to venture out into the 762 00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:26,160 Speaker 1: world and see what it has to offer, and rather 763 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:31,200 Speaker 1: than doing that, she ends up sacrificing her freedom, so 764 00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,640 Speaker 1: her ability to do that for a man, her father, 765 00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:38,000 Speaker 1: and then falls in love with a different man, the 766 00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:41,400 Speaker 1: Beast by the end of the movie. So she doesn't 767 00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:45,160 Speaker 1: get adventure in the great wide somewhere unless you count 768 00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,960 Speaker 1: the confines of this castle the great wide somewhere, which 769 00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:52,480 Speaker 1: it shouldn't be like. It's this is like one of 770 00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:58,799 Speaker 1: the many ways that it becomes like. It's kind of 771 00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:03,239 Speaker 1: an impossible not impossible. There's a way to update a 772 00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:06,880 Speaker 1: very old story to make it to have it have 773 00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:09,640 Speaker 1: the core message of the original and also have it 774 00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:12,880 Speaker 1: feel very modern. I always go to like Cluelist for 775 00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,000 Speaker 1: a really good example of like this is a Jane 776 00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:18,719 Speaker 1: Austen story, but it doesn't feel like it at all, 777 00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,920 Speaker 1: and and it feels very of the time it was released. 778 00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:25,200 Speaker 1: I feel like Beauty and the Beast. Maybe it doesn't 779 00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:30,240 Speaker 1: really retain those same qualities because the this is again 780 00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:35,120 Speaker 1: just like for So for Forever, Disney and a lot 781 00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:39,480 Speaker 1: of you know, heavily funded popular media does not take 782 00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:43,160 Speaker 1: chances on original stories very often, so we get these 783 00:51:43,239 --> 00:51:47,520 Speaker 1: old this is an old French story, and it follows 784 00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:50,879 Speaker 1: all the beats of that story and then tries to 785 00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:54,240 Speaker 1: insert all this modern sensibility into it. But the modern 786 00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,400 Speaker 1: sensibility is kind of chafe with the story they're adapting. 787 00:51:57,640 --> 00:52:00,880 Speaker 1: So it ends up like the modern things they're inserting 788 00:52:00,880 --> 00:52:03,360 Speaker 1: into this movie don't really end up paying off in 789 00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:05,799 Speaker 1: any meaningful way, because it still ends like it did 790 00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:09,400 Speaker 1: in the seventeen hundreds or the eighteen hundreds, and so 791 00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:11,880 Speaker 1: it's like it's not It ends up almost like making 792 00:52:11,880 --> 00:52:15,680 Speaker 1: you feel a little more bummed out because because Bell 793 00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:18,799 Speaker 1: doesn't get what she wants, and it's a very like 794 00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:22,279 Speaker 1: progressive thing to say, like, oh, and she wants so 795 00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:25,319 Speaker 1: much more, but that's unfortunately not how this story goes, 796 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,839 Speaker 1: and it's like, well, then why did you have what? 797 00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:30,600 Speaker 1: Then maybe why did you ever say it? Then you 798 00:52:30,600 --> 00:52:33,080 Speaker 1: know it? Or if if you want to write a 799 00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:36,040 Speaker 1: movie about a young woman who kind of feels trapped 800 00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:39,000 Speaker 1: in this kind of small town life and wants to 801 00:52:39,120 --> 00:52:41,960 Speaker 1: venture out and like go off on an adventure, then 802 00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:47,720 Speaker 1: don't adopt Beauty and the Beast story. Like the modern 803 00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:50,560 Speaker 1: stuff shapes with the source material and then it never 804 00:52:50,640 --> 00:52:53,560 Speaker 1: really I feel like it kind of fails to meet 805 00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:56,160 Speaker 1: in the middle in a way that doesn't you know, 806 00:52:56,360 --> 00:52:59,359 Speaker 1: that doesn't matter that much if you're like five years old, 807 00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:02,000 Speaker 1: I'm watching the But as an adult you're like, oh, 808 00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:05,200 Speaker 1: I mean, if we're even going from like the Disney 809 00:53:05,239 --> 00:53:09,239 Speaker 1: formula of like the main character singing about what they 810 00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:11,239 Speaker 1: want at the beginning of the movie, you know, at 811 00:53:11,320 --> 00:53:15,120 Speaker 1: least Aerial technically gets what she wanted, which was to 812 00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:19,120 Speaker 1: live above water, and she does get that by the 813 00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:23,160 Speaker 1: end of the movie, Um, she accomplishes that goal. Bells 814 00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:26,080 Speaker 1: Dulls song should have been about something different. She should 815 00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:29,200 Speaker 1: have like sung about like I want to have a 816 00:53:29,239 --> 00:53:35,440 Speaker 1: gigantic library because she gets that. Like if we if 817 00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:37,600 Speaker 1: we need the story to end with her living in 818 00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:41,160 Speaker 1: a castle, nearby. Then it's a bummer to have her 819 00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,160 Speaker 1: dream be like really not that at all or even 820 00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:47,719 Speaker 1: I mean, if she just wants like romantic love in 821 00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:51,080 Speaker 1: her life and that's like the thing that she longs 822 00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:55,040 Speaker 1: for and there's no suitable suitors in town, and even 823 00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:57,600 Speaker 1: like just like someone who it would even work if 824 00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:01,400 Speaker 1: it's like she wants to like a live in a 825 00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:05,080 Speaker 1: place where she feels understood, or like where she feels 826 00:54:05,080 --> 00:54:07,400 Speaker 1: like her interests are, like, it doesn't even need to 827 00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:10,239 Speaker 1: be necessarily a romantical she can just be like, I 828 00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:13,399 Speaker 1: want to feel understood by someone other than my weird dad. 829 00:54:13,880 --> 00:54:17,319 Speaker 1: Like that's a relatable goal to be, Like, I feel 830 00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:19,600 Speaker 1: misunderstood where I live. I want to live in a 831 00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:22,480 Speaker 1: community where people respect where I'm coming from and they 832 00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:26,000 Speaker 1: understand me regardless of the coordinates of where it is. 833 00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:28,880 Speaker 1: But that's not that's just not her goal. She's just like, 834 00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:31,600 Speaker 1: I want to live anywhere else, and then she doesn't, 835 00:54:32,040 --> 00:54:34,399 Speaker 1: And it's a bummer, Um, but I don't. I mean, 836 00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,759 Speaker 1: it's part of the I feel like part of the 837 00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:40,120 Speaker 1: fun of talking about this movie is nitpicking it. But yeah, 838 00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:42,839 Speaker 1: it is like that that is a really fundamental, like 839 00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:45,560 Speaker 1: she doesn't get what she wanted, and that makes me 840 00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:48,319 Speaker 1: I like to think they moved, you know, because all 841 00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:50,400 Speaker 1: that this whole movie takes place over the course of 842 00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:53,160 Speaker 1: a couple of days. Who knows what happens next week. 843 00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:56,560 Speaker 1: I like to think of the Straight to V just 844 00:54:56,719 --> 00:55:00,880 Speaker 1: stuff definitely not canon. They move, they move, even just 845 00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,560 Speaker 1: the fact that she says I want adventure, and again 846 00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:08,800 Speaker 1: like she doesn't unless you count being a prisoner. I guess, 847 00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:12,720 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess getting held prisoner is it's a venture. 848 00:55:12,840 --> 00:55:17,120 Speaker 1: I mean, that's a it's a it's a really shitty 849 00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:24,239 Speaker 1: the adventure. The adventure. Um, I think a movie that 850 00:55:24,520 --> 00:55:27,359 Speaker 1: obviously comes out much later but handles this way better 851 00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:30,839 Speaker 1: is mo Wanna, because she has a very standard like 852 00:55:31,120 --> 00:55:34,640 Speaker 1: I have this longing, this thing that I desire, and 853 00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:37,879 Speaker 1: it's to be out on the sea. She also wants 854 00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:40,600 Speaker 1: adventure in the great wide somewhere, which is the sea. 855 00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:45,800 Speaker 1: And then that's what the entire movie is about, adventure. 856 00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:48,759 Speaker 1: And then she finds a home within herself, and she 857 00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:51,680 Speaker 1: does in his whole journey, and it's like and Bell, 858 00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:55,880 Speaker 1: I mean, that's just especially where like Disney movies are 859 00:55:55,960 --> 00:55:58,279 Speaker 1: at it this time, I feel like and I want. 860 00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:01,240 Speaker 1: I mean, I would be so curious to hear what 861 00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:04,959 Speaker 1: the writing process of this movie was like in terms 862 00:56:04,960 --> 00:56:07,200 Speaker 1: of like what kind of notes would you be getting 863 00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:09,959 Speaker 1: back in the late eighties early nineties when when Linda 864 00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:13,680 Speaker 1: Wolverton was writing this thing. I'm sure it was messy 865 00:56:13,760 --> 00:56:16,080 Speaker 1: as hell. Like I would be so curious of like 866 00:56:16,160 --> 00:56:19,040 Speaker 1: what she tried to write in that didn't really get 867 00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:22,320 Speaker 1: there and like where is the line? I guess because 868 00:56:23,400 --> 00:56:26,319 Speaker 1: it's it's yeah, I mean, it's it's like movie the 869 00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:30,040 Speaker 1: even even Disney movies have come you know, reasonably far 870 00:56:30,920 --> 00:56:33,400 Speaker 1: um outside and again it's a kind of outside of 871 00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:37,200 Speaker 1: their reboot sphere. Their original stories have come pretty far. 872 00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:42,120 Speaker 1: But yeah, it's it's it's just weird. There's just a 873 00:56:42,160 --> 00:56:46,480 Speaker 1: little bit of dissonance watching it back as an adult 874 00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:50,680 Speaker 1: because it's just like the movie is ultimately not that 875 00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:56,200 Speaker 1: invested in what Bell's goals are, not at all, and 876 00:56:56,239 --> 00:57:00,600 Speaker 1: that that, yeah, brings me to a whole bel I have. 877 00:57:00,760 --> 00:57:02,560 Speaker 1: But just to kind of go back to what you're 878 00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:07,440 Speaker 1: just saying, there are let me count ten or leven 879 00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:12,880 Speaker 1: ten somewhere around their story by credits for this movie. 880 00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:16,000 Speaker 1: So there's a screenwriter who wrote the screenplay, but then 881 00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:21,800 Speaker 1: there are additional like ten story by credits, and that 882 00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:25,800 Speaker 1: doesn't always mean that like ten people worked equally on 883 00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:28,840 Speaker 1: the story together. You know, some people get story by 884 00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:32,120 Speaker 1: credits because they wrote like two lines of dialogue kind 885 00:57:32,120 --> 00:57:33,919 Speaker 1: of like you know, just like weird things like that. 886 00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:37,720 Speaker 1: The industry is weird sometimes. But um, it seems like 887 00:57:37,720 --> 00:57:39,280 Speaker 1: there were a lot of people and a lot of 888 00:57:39,320 --> 00:57:42,720 Speaker 1: just kind of like two many I mean, when too many, 889 00:57:42,760 --> 00:57:45,440 Speaker 1: too many cooks in the kitchen. Yeah, but it's like 890 00:57:45,480 --> 00:57:48,840 Speaker 1: this is how these Disney movies go where, Like it's 891 00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:52,440 Speaker 1: so it's always so interesting to hear when someone is 892 00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:55,480 Speaker 1: a little bit outside of that Disney machine and they 893 00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,280 Speaker 1: speak more frankly about like these are the kind of 894 00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:01,880 Speaker 1: notes I was getting. This is like what the conversations 895 00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:04,760 Speaker 1: actually were, because like a story by credit could mean 896 00:58:05,240 --> 00:58:10,040 Speaker 1: kind of anything, especially in animation, Like it's so vague 897 00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:14,160 Speaker 1: what would constitute a story by credit. And there are 898 00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:19,720 Speaker 1: there's there's one woman on this team. There's one woman 899 00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:22,000 Speaker 1: on the story by team. And then the screenplay credit 900 00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:28,160 Speaker 1: is also a woman, but that's not that's not proportionate, 901 00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:34,040 Speaker 1: and it shows there's a man named Kelly. Oh yeah, okay, 902 00:58:34,080 --> 00:58:35,960 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's it's weird. I mean, I feel like 903 00:58:36,040 --> 00:58:39,680 Speaker 1: this is unfortunately we are still in the era of 904 00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:43,080 Speaker 1: Disney movies with empty feminism. We're not We're not out 905 00:58:43,120 --> 00:58:46,400 Speaker 1: of it. There's a few exceptions, but for the most part, 906 00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:50,960 Speaker 1: we're still not out of the empty feminist capitalism movement. 907 00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:53,880 Speaker 1: But but this, but a lot of the foundation is 908 00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:56,920 Speaker 1: kind of being laid during the Disney renaissance of like 909 00:58:57,200 --> 00:58:59,880 Speaker 1: we're going to give a nod to all the ladies 910 00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,160 Speaker 1: out there, but guess what, honey, You're still going to 911 00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:08,600 Speaker 1: marry the emotionally abusive guy at the end. And that's 912 00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:11,919 Speaker 1: something I know that It's like again, it's like part 913 00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:16,120 Speaker 1: of this is criticizing the source material. And ultimately it's like, 914 00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:20,080 Speaker 1: if you don't want these story problems, don't adapt these 915 00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:24,640 Speaker 1: old ask stories like centuries old. The best way to 916 00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:29,640 Speaker 1: combat uh and like prejudice shit is not to adapt 917 00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:32,320 Speaker 1: the oldest story you can possibly find. It's a great 918 00:59:32,320 --> 00:59:35,040 Speaker 1: way to do it. But the same way where like 919 00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:37,840 Speaker 1: with the with the relationship with Bell and the Beast, 920 00:59:37,920 --> 00:59:40,840 Speaker 1: where there's a lot to talk about here and a 921 00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:44,320 Speaker 1: lot of it is like kind of boring discussion. But 922 00:59:44,480 --> 00:59:47,840 Speaker 1: I do feel like, ultimately, you know, the burden of 923 00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:54,040 Speaker 1: forgiveness lays on Bell in a way that is not fair, 924 00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,680 Speaker 1: like in a way that is expecting a lot. It 925 00:59:58,840 --> 01:00:02,280 Speaker 1: is very And I don't think that he really you know, 926 01:00:02,320 --> 01:00:07,160 Speaker 1: I think that the beast certainly demonstrates growth throughout the story. 927 01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:10,960 Speaker 1: Sure would I would I, you know, were I in 928 01:00:11,040 --> 01:00:14,960 Speaker 1: her shoes? Would I feel he has earned forgiveness? Maybe 929 01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:17,760 Speaker 1: not for me, No, I think maybe he's you know, 930 01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:21,240 Speaker 1: he's also he's been on this journey for two days, 931 01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:25,840 Speaker 1: like let's let's see some more results. Um. Yeah. And 932 01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:28,480 Speaker 1: and the but the burden of forgiveness very much laze 933 01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:32,080 Speaker 1: on Bell or the story can't resolve exactly. And that 934 01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:34,200 Speaker 1: brings me to a little segment I would like to 935 01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:43,520 Speaker 1: call the expectations of women's expectations. But but but hit 936 01:00:43,600 --> 01:00:45,400 Speaker 1: it is that a song from the movie or is 937 01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:47,320 Speaker 1: that just your own song? Um? That was the Price 938 01:00:47,440 --> 01:00:54,160 Speaker 1: is Right theme song? Okay, good, Okay. So I think 939 01:00:54,200 --> 01:00:57,120 Speaker 1: that this is a thing that's true in real life, 940 01:00:57,200 --> 01:00:59,680 Speaker 1: and I think it's reflected in media where when it 941 01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:04,840 Speaker 1: comes to hetero romance, women tend to be expected to 942 01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:09,600 Speaker 1: have low standards for men. Uh, in a bunch of 943 01:01:09,600 --> 01:01:17,880 Speaker 1: different areas, areas like personality, emotional intelligence, emotional maturity, hygiene, 944 01:01:18,080 --> 01:01:20,800 Speaker 1: et cetera amount of ship you will put up with 945 01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:24,560 Speaker 1: before bailing, yes, And a lot of that comes from 946 01:01:24,840 --> 01:01:27,800 Speaker 1: the boys will be boys mentality, where you know, all 947 01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:30,040 Speaker 1: men are just gonna sunk up there. This is just 948 01:01:30,080 --> 01:01:32,200 Speaker 1: how they are. They don't know how to be people, 949 01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:35,400 Speaker 1: and we just have to forgive them, which plays very 950 01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:40,160 Speaker 1: much into male redemption arcs. And this, to me, is 951 01:01:40,200 --> 01:01:44,720 Speaker 1: a story that is largely about the beast getting to 952 01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:49,480 Speaker 1: redeem himself. And you know there's other kind of thematic 953 01:01:49,520 --> 01:01:51,520 Speaker 1: things happening, but that's a big part of the story. 954 01:01:51,560 --> 01:01:53,840 Speaker 1: In the reboot, they managed to make it a story 955 01:01:53,840 --> 01:01:59,480 Speaker 1: about fathers and sons, which I hated. Not any animated 956 01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:05,200 Speaker 1: one is simply a man who needs redeeming, like needs redeeming, 957 01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:08,880 Speaker 1: and then like being allowed and like everyone like giving 958 01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:11,440 Speaker 1: him the space to be able to redeem himself. And 959 01:02:11,480 --> 01:02:15,480 Speaker 1: I've stated in other episodes how I'm generally not thrilled 960 01:02:15,560 --> 01:02:18,760 Speaker 1: with a lot of redemption like male redemption stories. And 961 01:02:18,800 --> 01:02:21,240 Speaker 1: it's not also how low the bar is that you 962 01:02:21,280 --> 01:02:25,600 Speaker 1: need to clear in order to warrant a redemption redemption, 963 01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:30,640 Speaker 1: which is like, yeah, like stop holding a woman prisoner 964 01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:34,920 Speaker 1: is a very low bar you have to clear for 965 01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:38,560 Speaker 1: only a couple of hours before immediately being like, you 966 01:02:38,600 --> 01:02:45,040 Speaker 1: know what I have, I'm back right, okay, bleak, And 967 01:02:45,080 --> 01:02:46,760 Speaker 1: I want to be clear, it's not that I think 968 01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:50,920 Speaker 1: that people and men in particular don't deserve second chances 969 01:02:51,040 --> 01:02:54,440 Speaker 1: and shots at redemption. I'm not saying that. I think 970 01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:57,520 Speaker 1: it's a very like case by case basis, you know, 971 01:02:57,560 --> 01:03:00,440 Speaker 1: what did you do and and do you observe a 972 01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:03,520 Speaker 1: shot at redemption is very generous a scenario by scenario, 973 01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:08,160 Speaker 1: thank you so much. But so many cinematic stories are 974 01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:12,720 Speaker 1: about male redemption because like, people are just conditioned to 975 01:03:12,800 --> 01:03:17,480 Speaker 1: be way more tolerant of men's mistakes and just expect 976 01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:20,200 Speaker 1: that men will make a bunch of mistakes and be 977 01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:23,680 Speaker 1: perfectly willing to give them second chances. But on the 978 01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:27,000 Speaker 1: flip side of that, which is this double standard of 979 01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:30,800 Speaker 1: women just kind of being expected to be perfect from 980 01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:34,280 Speaker 1: the start, we don't really tolerate a woman's redemption because 981 01:03:34,280 --> 01:03:39,200 Speaker 1: we don't tolerate anything besides a woman being There shouldn't 982 01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:41,439 Speaker 1: be a need for a woman's redemption, because a woman 983 01:03:41,480 --> 01:03:44,000 Speaker 1: should have just like done everything right from the beginning, 984 01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:47,240 Speaker 1: which and also the and also I feel like in 985 01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:51,520 Speaker 1: these sorts of stories, specifically, women are not given enough 986 01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:55,480 Speaker 1: narrative space to even make a mistake, Like they're mostly 987 01:03:55,520 --> 01:03:58,640 Speaker 1: just cleaning up after the men that they are beholden 988 01:03:58,680 --> 01:04:01,840 Speaker 1: to stuff for like, Bell gets into this whole situation 989 01:04:01,880 --> 01:04:05,600 Speaker 1: because Maurice didn't turn his GPS on right like he 990 01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:09,640 Speaker 1: he gets lost. She's cleaning up his she's rescuing him, 991 01:04:09,720 --> 01:04:13,200 Speaker 1: which is good. She's rescuing him. That is an active decision. 992 01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:19,840 Speaker 1: That's like, I don't dislike the Maurice Bell relationship. You know, 993 01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:24,240 Speaker 1: it's like we've all cleaned up after a parent. But 994 01:04:24,240 --> 01:04:26,560 Speaker 1: but it's like, you know, she doesn't really have the 995 01:04:26,600 --> 01:04:29,360 Speaker 1: space to make a mistake because Gaston's coming at her 996 01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:32,080 Speaker 1: from one end. Maurice is sucking up over here now 997 01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,120 Speaker 1: the beast is holding her prisoner. When is she She's, yeah, 998 01:04:35,160 --> 01:04:36,880 Speaker 1: she didn't have any space to to do and she 999 01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:40,000 Speaker 1: hasn't no a woman, you know. So it's just nor 1000 01:04:40,120 --> 01:04:42,960 Speaker 1: is she written to be a character who would make 1001 01:04:43,000 --> 01:04:46,360 Speaker 1: a mistake, because she's basically written to be perfect, even 1002 01:04:46,360 --> 01:04:49,680 Speaker 1: though the the town thinks she's weird. But we are 1003 01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:52,760 Speaker 1: not meant to root for the townspeople. But yeah, it's 1004 01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:56,440 Speaker 1: like they hate her because she is the nineties ideal 1005 01:04:56,680 --> 01:05:01,120 Speaker 1: of what a woman is, which is right, completely hot, perfect, 1006 01:05:01,160 --> 01:05:04,600 Speaker 1: Western beauty standards ten and a genius. She's a hot 1007 01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:08,680 Speaker 1: genius and in eighteen something France, people are like, what's 1008 01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:10,920 Speaker 1: going on, But it's like that's, you know, whatever the 1009 01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:14,640 Speaker 1: cultural ideal is to be a hot genius. The townspeople 1010 01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:17,000 Speaker 1: are presented as you know, anyone. They're not they're not 1011 01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:20,480 Speaker 1: going to appreciate creativity or innovation or anything that's like 1012 01:05:20,520 --> 01:05:22,160 Speaker 1: new or different. You know. They are the type of 1013 01:05:22,160 --> 01:05:24,120 Speaker 1: people who know, and they're they're also they also fall 1014 01:05:24,680 --> 01:05:29,600 Speaker 1: victim to have just like animation stuff of like they're 1015 01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:34,440 Speaker 1: drawn to look poor and Bell is you know, of 1016 01:05:34,480 --> 01:05:39,520 Speaker 1: their class, but she's drawn to look not like them. 1017 01:05:39,520 --> 01:05:42,640 Speaker 1: Her her character design is something we've talked about, you know, 1018 01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:46,000 Speaker 1: to death, but like she's designed to be a woman, yeah, 1019 01:05:46,200 --> 01:05:49,600 Speaker 1: and not just human woman, but like Western beauty standards 1020 01:05:49,680 --> 01:05:52,720 Speaker 1: beautiful human woman. Yeah, Like she's drawn to look like 1021 01:05:52,760 --> 01:05:58,080 Speaker 1: an algorithm, you know, image of like the perfect is 1022 01:05:58,080 --> 01:06:00,640 Speaker 1: what she's drawn like, and everyone else is a literal 1023 01:06:00,720 --> 01:06:06,760 Speaker 1: cartoon because it's a cartoon. Yes. So, so Bell is, 1024 01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:09,720 Speaker 1: like we said, she's a genius. She's very smart, she's 1025 01:06:09,800 --> 01:06:14,760 Speaker 1: well read, she's beautiful. Her name is literally means beautiful. 1026 01:06:15,200 --> 01:06:18,160 Speaker 1: She's ambitious, even though she never gets to realize any 1027 01:06:18,200 --> 01:06:22,400 Speaker 1: of her ambitions. She's this like perfect character without any flaws, 1028 01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:26,120 Speaker 1: although I would argue that she is too forgiving of 1029 01:06:26,280 --> 01:06:29,560 Speaker 1: people who mistreat her um, but that's not that was 1030 01:06:29,560 --> 01:06:32,160 Speaker 1: considered a flaw exactly. Well that that's also not what 1031 01:06:32,200 --> 01:06:34,880 Speaker 1: the movie wants you to think. This is just what 1032 01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:38,320 Speaker 1: I think about it. They're like, oh, no, forgiving the 1033 01:06:38,920 --> 01:06:40,440 Speaker 1: Like I think that the movie is like, oh no, 1034 01:06:40,560 --> 01:06:44,160 Speaker 1: forgiving the Beast is what a beautiful genius would do. Like, 1035 01:06:44,400 --> 01:06:47,120 Speaker 1: I think that's where we're supposed to get. It's hard 1036 01:06:47,160 --> 01:06:50,040 Speaker 1: to get there these days, but like, I think that 1037 01:06:50,040 --> 01:06:53,760 Speaker 1: that's where you were supposed to get. Because so, I 1038 01:06:53,800 --> 01:06:58,240 Speaker 1: think this story would be way more interesting if Bell 1039 01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:02,960 Speaker 1: had a flaw and also had character growth and a 1040 01:07:03,080 --> 01:07:06,920 Speaker 1: character arc, much like the Beast does. But she is 1041 01:07:06,920 --> 01:07:10,600 Speaker 1: presented as someone who from the very start has the 1042 01:07:10,640 --> 01:07:16,000 Speaker 1: capacity to look beyond someone's external appearance and see beauty 1043 01:07:16,080 --> 01:07:18,360 Speaker 1: from within. Because this story wants to be about like, 1044 01:07:18,840 --> 01:07:23,040 Speaker 1: can someone possibly fall in love with a beast someone 1045 01:07:23,080 --> 01:07:26,960 Speaker 1: who's so hideous on the outside. But Belle is presented 1046 01:07:27,000 --> 01:07:29,760 Speaker 1: as someone who would always have the capacity to be 1047 01:07:29,800 --> 01:07:33,760 Speaker 1: able to do that. So there's no arc there, there's 1048 01:07:33,800 --> 01:07:37,200 Speaker 1: no She's just like flat from the start. Yeah, it's 1049 01:07:37,200 --> 01:07:40,520 Speaker 1: like she doesn't really change, Like she mostly is just 1050 01:07:40,600 --> 01:07:45,240 Speaker 1: kind of managing a lot of situations that want she's 1051 01:07:45,520 --> 01:07:48,400 Speaker 1: doing it all, but she basically remains the same person 1052 01:07:49,200 --> 01:07:52,120 Speaker 1: fundamentally because it's like she is because even when she's 1053 01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:55,240 Speaker 1: afraid of him, it makes sense that she would be 1054 01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:59,120 Speaker 1: afraid of him. He is threatening her with imprisoned with 1055 01:07:59,120 --> 01:08:03,480 Speaker 1: with Like it's never it's never that she Like I 1056 01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:06,000 Speaker 1: think that that's like another thing where I kind of get, like, 1057 01:08:06,560 --> 01:08:09,760 Speaker 1: what happened? What is what is happening here? With the 1058 01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:15,360 Speaker 1: like nineties sensibility being inserted into this centuries old story 1059 01:08:15,400 --> 01:08:19,000 Speaker 1: where a Belle really never never judges the beast for 1060 01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:23,120 Speaker 1: being other, you know, like she never really judges him 1061 01:08:23,120 --> 01:08:25,400 Speaker 1: for looking different than her. She really only gets upset 1062 01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:32,320 Speaker 1: with him when he's mean violence, Like, so I agree 1063 01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:35,680 Speaker 1: with that. So it's like it's she doesn't really have 1064 01:08:35,720 --> 01:08:37,640 Speaker 1: an art from being like I judged him based on 1065 01:08:37,760 --> 01:08:42,559 Speaker 1: his appearance too. Now I have learned that there's no 1066 01:08:42,640 --> 01:08:45,439 Speaker 1: way to live your life. But that's never a problem 1067 01:08:45,479 --> 01:08:47,439 Speaker 1: for her. She never judges him based on his appearance. 1068 01:08:47,520 --> 01:08:50,799 Speaker 1: She judges him strictly based on how he behaves towards 1069 01:08:50,800 --> 01:08:54,560 Speaker 1: her right and the whole curse that the Enchantress and 1070 01:08:55,479 --> 01:09:01,000 Speaker 1: cannot say this word Enchantress puts on the beast. The 1071 01:09:01,040 --> 01:09:04,679 Speaker 1: Prince at the beginning is like, oh, you're good luck 1072 01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:08,360 Speaker 1: finding someone who's going to love you because you're a 1073 01:09:08,360 --> 01:09:11,559 Speaker 1: beast now and it's all about, you know, finding beauty 1074 01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:14,799 Speaker 1: with his problem as he was an asshole, right, but yeah, 1075 01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:20,519 Speaker 1: what beauty within? This guy sucks. He's so mean an 1076 01:09:20,600 --> 01:09:24,040 Speaker 1: awful and he treats Bell if something like just to 1077 01:09:24,160 --> 01:09:27,160 Speaker 1: run through everything he does. On the first night alone, 1078 01:09:27,960 --> 01:09:31,200 Speaker 1: he imprisons her and takes away all of her freedom 1079 01:09:31,400 --> 01:09:36,479 Speaker 1: for the flimsiest reason imaginable. He demands that Bell joined 1080 01:09:36,560 --> 01:09:39,160 Speaker 1: him for dinner. He screams at her while doing this, 1081 01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:42,080 Speaker 1: He threatens her saying come out or I'll break down 1082 01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:45,800 Speaker 1: the door. He then tells her to starve. Then he 1083 01:09:45,880 --> 01:09:49,759 Speaker 1: invades her privacy by spying on her through the magic mirror. 1084 01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:52,639 Speaker 1: Later that night, after she's gone into the west wing, 1085 01:09:53,160 --> 01:09:58,640 Speaker 1: he screams at her again. He violently throws furniture around. 1086 01:09:59,040 --> 01:10:03,400 Speaker 1: Just his actions are very alarming and it's scary and 1087 01:10:03,640 --> 01:10:06,240 Speaker 1: to the point where she runs away for her dear 1088 01:10:06,320 --> 01:10:10,439 Speaker 1: life kind of thing. And and the whole thing is like, oh, 1089 01:10:10,520 --> 01:10:13,120 Speaker 1: he just needs to learn to control his temper, right, 1090 01:10:13,160 --> 01:10:16,200 Speaker 1: But it's I mean, it's like, yeah, but which is 1091 01:10:16,320 --> 01:10:18,040 Speaker 1: which is true? He does need to learn how to 1092 01:10:18,040 --> 01:10:21,200 Speaker 1: control this temperature. But that doesn't mean that whatever. The 1093 01:10:21,240 --> 01:10:24,240 Speaker 1: burden of forgiveness thing always bugs me in any story 1094 01:10:24,360 --> 01:10:28,200 Speaker 1: because it's like, if someone behaves horribly towards you, you 1095 01:10:28,280 --> 01:10:31,960 Speaker 1: are not obligated to forgive them like they hopefully they 1096 01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:34,800 Speaker 1: will work in themselves and not perpetuate that behavior to 1097 01:10:34,800 --> 01:10:36,800 Speaker 1: other people. But that doesn't mean that you have to 1098 01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:40,640 Speaker 1: personally be like I forgive you. That's not always guaranteed 1099 01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:44,800 Speaker 1: in the way that like, not everyone's going to be 1100 01:10:44,840 --> 01:10:48,160 Speaker 1: able to forgive that behavior. And that makes a lot 1101 01:10:48,200 --> 01:10:51,280 Speaker 1: of sense went others furtituate you. You know that is 1102 01:10:51,280 --> 01:10:53,759 Speaker 1: going to take more than two days to forgive. And 1103 01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:56,200 Speaker 1: that's the other thing too, is I always forget how 1104 01:10:56,520 --> 01:10:59,959 Speaker 1: little time is spent on screen in this movie, developing 1105 01:11:00,040 --> 01:11:07,080 Speaker 1: their romance because basically be sall for though so sometimes 1106 01:11:07,080 --> 01:11:09,600 Speaker 1: been like in the Twee thousands, Okay, this is like 1107 01:11:09,960 --> 01:11:13,759 Speaker 1: a super nippic In the they have a little snowball 1108 01:11:13,800 --> 01:11:15,880 Speaker 1: fight and it's kind of cute and you're like, Oh, 1109 01:11:16,120 --> 01:11:19,439 Speaker 1: they're starting to get along. That's nice. One he like 1110 01:11:19,720 --> 01:11:23,360 Speaker 1: throws a huge snowball at her head and like knocks 1111 01:11:23,400 --> 01:11:27,880 Speaker 1: her with intent to kill. Um, that doesn't happen. I 1112 01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:31,400 Speaker 1: had to go back to, Oh, he doesn't throw anything 1113 01:11:31,400 --> 01:11:34,040 Speaker 1: at her. No, it's in terms of snow it's her 1114 01:11:34,120 --> 01:11:36,479 Speaker 1: throwing a bunch of snowballs at him, and then he 1115 01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:38,479 Speaker 1: gets a snowball together, but then he doesn't throw it 1116 01:11:38,520 --> 01:11:41,120 Speaker 1: at her. He's like te heat because because he would 1117 01:11:41,200 --> 01:11:44,200 Speaker 1: hurt her, because he would do my killer. Because she 1118 01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:46,880 Speaker 1: throws a snowball at him and he has like the 1119 01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:49,760 Speaker 1: big one lifted over his head, but then it like 1120 01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:52,879 Speaker 1: falls onto his head also, so he just gets pelted 1121 01:11:52,920 --> 01:11:57,160 Speaker 1: with her snowballs his own snowballs. Yeah, it's very very 1122 01:11:57,160 --> 01:12:00,960 Speaker 1: fun and flirty. Um, it's a very already snowball fight. 1123 01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:04,559 Speaker 1: You know, like, has he really earned the snowball fight? 1124 01:12:04,600 --> 01:12:06,559 Speaker 1: I guess that that's certainly up for debate, but like 1125 01:12:06,800 --> 01:12:11,360 Speaker 1: it's not a violent, violent altercation. And Emma Wattson gets 1126 01:12:11,439 --> 01:12:16,640 Speaker 1: like like Kama Kazi with a snowball. It's yeah, she 1127 01:12:16,680 --> 01:12:19,240 Speaker 1: falls down and then he laughs about it. It's horrifying. 1128 01:12:19,360 --> 01:12:23,799 Speaker 1: Also in the I do think that the live action 1129 01:12:23,880 --> 01:12:29,400 Speaker 1: remake does attempt to draw out they're developing romance more, 1130 01:12:30,240 --> 01:12:33,679 Speaker 1: but they don't do it well because of that scary 1131 01:12:33,720 --> 01:12:38,479 Speaker 1: snowball fight and the beast just like neg spell a bunch. 1132 01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:41,479 Speaker 1: He's like, oh, you like Romeo and Juliet typical that 1133 01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:45,680 Speaker 1: you'd love that romantic drivels just all like it's not 1134 01:12:45,880 --> 01:12:49,160 Speaker 1: very sweet. Um. And then it doesn't help that the 1135 01:12:49,479 --> 01:12:53,680 Speaker 1: that the two actors have like no chemistry whatsoever, like 1136 01:12:53,920 --> 01:12:56,640 Speaker 1: the most chemistry I feel. And I am not a 1137 01:12:56,720 --> 01:13:00,800 Speaker 1: Josh Gad fan, as listeners know, I find him to 1138 01:13:00,840 --> 01:13:04,559 Speaker 1: be a very frustrating person. But I felt like Luke 1139 01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:08,320 Speaker 1: Evans and Josh Gad had the best chemistry between two 1140 01:13:08,320 --> 01:13:11,360 Speaker 1: actors in the entire movie because they were like, we 1141 01:13:11,439 --> 01:13:14,680 Speaker 1: can actually sing, so let's just hang out and have 1142 01:13:14,720 --> 01:13:18,519 Speaker 1: a good time. But no one else, I mean, my god, 1143 01:13:18,920 --> 01:13:22,639 Speaker 1: the yeah, like Emma Watson and that pile of tennis 1144 01:13:22,640 --> 01:13:26,040 Speaker 1: balls did not have They kept nagging her, did not 1145 01:13:26,120 --> 01:13:29,760 Speaker 1: have any chemistry. It just didn't. I you know, it's 1146 01:13:29,800 --> 01:13:34,120 Speaker 1: like I appreciate, but again it's like I think, watching 1147 01:13:34,160 --> 01:13:37,040 Speaker 1: these two right in a row, it's clear which one 1148 01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:43,839 Speaker 1: is superior. But even so, like seeing one sensibilities plugged 1149 01:13:43,880 --> 01:13:47,759 Speaker 1: into an old as story with the Disney formula didn't 1150 01:13:48,360 --> 01:13:51,240 Speaker 1: really logistically work if you think about it, and then 1151 01:13:51,280 --> 01:13:56,120 Speaker 1: seeing the same thing be attempted in doesn't work because 1152 01:13:56,160 --> 01:13:58,920 Speaker 1: now the values are even further apart than they were, 1153 01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:02,000 Speaker 1: you know, fifty years ago, and so it makes even 1154 01:14:02,240 --> 01:14:04,519 Speaker 1: less sense that they would end up together at the end. 1155 01:14:04,600 --> 01:14:07,240 Speaker 1: If we're going to make this with values, they would 1156 01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:11,320 Speaker 1: not end up together right the end. It's make a 1157 01:14:11,360 --> 01:14:13,720 Speaker 1: different movie. But they can't. They can't do that. They 1158 01:14:13,800 --> 01:14:17,080 Speaker 1: need a billion dollars literally so badly, so they have 1159 01:14:17,160 --> 01:14:21,600 Speaker 1: to do it. I also just wonder, so oh so, 1160 01:14:21,680 --> 01:14:24,080 Speaker 1: what I was saying is that so little screen time 1161 01:14:24,160 --> 01:14:28,040 Speaker 1: is spent in the ninety one version developing the romance, 1162 01:14:28,080 --> 01:14:31,400 Speaker 1: which just like he shows her a library and suddenly 1163 01:14:31,400 --> 01:14:34,040 Speaker 1: she's like he's not so bad, Like he was just 1164 01:14:34,080 --> 01:14:36,479 Speaker 1: screaming at you and nearly killing you. To be fair, 1165 01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:42,120 Speaker 1: Bell wants free books really bad. She's been conning her 1166 01:14:42,120 --> 01:14:45,760 Speaker 1: way into free books for a long time, and so 1167 01:14:45,920 --> 01:14:48,599 Speaker 1: this is actually a big opportunity for her. She could 1168 01:14:48,600 --> 01:14:53,080 Speaker 1: maybe like start flipping these books. They look antique, they 1169 01:14:53,160 --> 01:14:56,160 Speaker 1: look so if she's in it for the free books, 1170 01:14:56,840 --> 01:15:01,120 Speaker 1: oh my god boy, and she right, man, that's such 1171 01:15:01,160 --> 01:15:04,080 Speaker 1: a more interesting story to me. If she's like, yeah, 1172 01:15:04,120 --> 01:15:06,559 Speaker 1: I'll pretend to be in love with this guy and 1173 01:15:06,600 --> 01:15:08,320 Speaker 1: like make a life with him just so I can 1174 01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:11,439 Speaker 1: have access to these millions of books in his library. 1175 01:15:11,720 --> 01:15:14,400 Speaker 1: It seems like there's only one guy to get them 1176 01:15:14,439 --> 01:15:18,479 Speaker 1: from in her entire zip code. And she seems like, 1177 01:15:18,520 --> 01:15:20,519 Speaker 1: you know, it's a small shop. He never has any 1178 01:15:20,520 --> 01:15:22,240 Speaker 1: new books in. She's like, do you have anything new? 1179 01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:25,439 Speaker 1: And he's like no, and she's like, oh my god, 1180 01:15:25,920 --> 01:15:29,240 Speaker 1: Like so I see that, you know, based on the 1181 01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:37,080 Speaker 1: scarcity of of literary works in this area, maybe that's 1182 01:15:37,120 --> 01:15:40,400 Speaker 1: a reason to hang out. But but it's also like, 1183 01:15:41,200 --> 01:15:43,880 Speaker 1: I don't know, I just it's such a it's such 1184 01:15:43,920 --> 01:15:47,599 Speaker 1: a mess. This whole relationship is such as I really, 1185 01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:49,960 Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like the most and this is 1186 01:15:49,960 --> 01:15:52,599 Speaker 1: like addressed in a different Lindsay Hollis video. But the 1187 01:15:52,640 --> 01:15:57,680 Speaker 1: most popular criticism of the Bell Beast relationship is that 1188 01:15:57,760 --> 01:16:01,640 Speaker 1: she has Stockholm syndrome, which is just like just a 1189 01:16:01,680 --> 01:16:05,800 Speaker 1: fun little history lesson for everybody. That Stockholm syndrome is 1190 01:16:05,840 --> 01:16:09,519 Speaker 1: like whatever, it's I feel like the popular interpretation of 1191 01:16:09,520 --> 01:16:12,040 Speaker 1: it is it's like when you begin to feel empathy 1192 01:16:12,160 --> 01:16:14,920 Speaker 1: for someone who is your captor who is not treating 1193 01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:18,360 Speaker 1: you all. But it's like a false it's just kind 1194 01:16:18,400 --> 01:16:23,120 Speaker 1: of a false premise for any sort of like psychological 1195 01:16:23,160 --> 01:16:26,559 Speaker 1: reaction to a situation, because the whole thing of Stockholm 1196 01:16:26,600 --> 01:16:30,000 Speaker 1: syndrome was that there was a group of people who 1197 01:16:30,040 --> 01:16:34,400 Speaker 1: were taken hostage in a bank, and the reason that 1198 01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:38,080 Speaker 1: they began to empathize with their captors is because they 1199 01:16:38,080 --> 01:16:41,720 Speaker 1: were terrified of the police, who were probably going to 1200 01:16:41,800 --> 01:16:44,479 Speaker 1: kill them if they walked outside. So it kind of 1201 01:16:44,479 --> 01:16:48,880 Speaker 1: has like, really, there's a lot that's been written about it, 1202 01:16:48,920 --> 01:16:51,519 Speaker 1: but it has very little to do with like, oh, 1203 01:16:51,680 --> 01:16:54,760 Speaker 1: now I love my captor. My captor is amazing. It's like, no, 1204 01:16:54,920 --> 01:16:58,040 Speaker 1: I feel like my captor is less likely to kill 1205 01:16:58,120 --> 01:17:01,280 Speaker 1: me and has a less vested interest in killing me 1206 01:17:01,680 --> 01:17:07,240 Speaker 1: then a cop. So, um, it's not as far as 1207 01:17:07,280 --> 01:17:10,320 Speaker 1: I know, there's no cops in Bell's neighborhood, which is amazing, 1208 01:17:11,080 --> 01:17:16,559 Speaker 1: I mean, utopia, it's good. So so the whole Stockholm 1209 01:17:16,600 --> 01:17:20,080 Speaker 1: syndrome thing is just like a nonstarter in terms of 1210 01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:24,880 Speaker 1: any sort of meaningful discussion. I do I do think 1211 01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:27,719 Speaker 1: that it's like there's a pressure put on that character 1212 01:17:27,880 --> 01:17:34,960 Speaker 1: to really do some empathy gymnastics and forgiveness gymnastics in 1213 01:17:35,000 --> 01:17:38,439 Speaker 1: a way that doesn't really match up with the character 1214 01:17:38,520 --> 01:17:41,080 Speaker 1: that we've been introduced to. I mean, even though it's 1215 01:17:41,080 --> 01:17:45,000 Speaker 1: like she she clearly has a big capacity for empathy 1216 01:17:45,040 --> 01:17:48,200 Speaker 1: and understanding because she is a hot genius who is 1217 01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:52,559 Speaker 1: perfect um, but we're also told that the Beast doesn't 1218 01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:56,680 Speaker 1: really come into like what her goals are, and and 1219 01:17:56,880 --> 01:17:59,080 Speaker 1: we learned so early in the movie that it's really 1220 01:17:59,080 --> 01:18:01,000 Speaker 1: easy for her to get away from him if she 1221 01:18:01,080 --> 01:18:05,000 Speaker 1: wants to, um, right, And why wouldn't she want to 1222 01:18:05,439 --> 01:18:10,040 Speaker 1: because he's horribly mistreating her. Yeah, it's again just like 1223 01:18:10,240 --> 01:18:13,200 Speaker 1: the values of the stories are chafing with each other 1224 01:18:13,280 --> 01:18:16,040 Speaker 1: in a way that's kind of like, you know, if 1225 01:18:16,360 --> 01:18:18,040 Speaker 1: if you look, if you if you squint at it 1226 01:18:18,080 --> 01:18:19,840 Speaker 1: a little bit, you're like, oh, I guess that doesn't 1227 01:18:19,880 --> 01:18:23,639 Speaker 1: really make sense. It's yeah, what I feel like is 1228 01:18:25,120 --> 01:18:27,160 Speaker 1: I don't know, this is okay, here's my heart tick 1229 01:18:27,200 --> 01:18:31,599 Speaker 1: of the episode. Please. The ending of this movie really 1230 01:18:31,640 --> 01:18:39,880 Speaker 1: made me appreciate the ending of Shrek, because Shrek Shrek 1231 01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:43,160 Speaker 1: was going to come up today, you know, for Jeffrey Katzenberg. 1232 01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:45,320 Speaker 1: You text. I woke up to a text about Shrek 1233 01:18:45,400 --> 01:18:50,240 Speaker 1: from you. Oh can I read it? Yes? Please? I said, sorry, 1234 01:18:50,320 --> 01:18:52,719 Speaker 1: let me find it here. Also, I got my email 1235 01:18:52,760 --> 01:18:56,439 Speaker 1: today saying my Shrek three laundres on the way. Oh 1236 01:18:56,479 --> 01:19:01,720 Speaker 1: my good news at a sign I can't fun. We 1237 01:19:01,840 --> 01:19:04,280 Speaker 1: just text too much, it's too far back, but we 1238 01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:10,240 Speaker 1: simply have too healthier friendship. Wait where wait? Yes, you said, um, 1239 01:19:10,400 --> 01:19:12,680 Speaker 1: look all I'm saying as we should cover Shrek to 1240 01:19:12,840 --> 01:19:17,519 Speaker 1: this year, and are you wrong? Certainly not, certainly not. 1241 01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:22,760 Speaker 1: I'm actually very right. But the ending of Shrek right, 1242 01:19:22,840 --> 01:19:28,559 Speaker 1: So the So these are two katzenberg um masterpieces we're 1243 01:19:28,560 --> 01:19:32,400 Speaker 1: talking about, you know, our I p quilby all of that. 1244 01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:35,640 Speaker 1: I'm also seeing, as it relates to Jeffrey Katzenberg and 1245 01:19:35,680 --> 01:19:38,280 Speaker 1: Beauty and the Beast, that the reason there are so 1246 01:19:38,320 --> 01:19:40,320 Speaker 1: many story by credits on this movie is because of 1247 01:19:40,400 --> 01:19:44,320 Speaker 1: Jeffrey Katzenberg. He had the entire first draft of this movie, 1248 01:19:44,320 --> 01:19:49,080 Speaker 1: which was non musical, scrapped and we've written as a musical. 1249 01:19:49,120 --> 01:19:50,600 Speaker 1: So that is part of the reason why there's so 1250 01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:53,519 Speaker 1: many storybis is because there's just a ton of different 1251 01:19:53,600 --> 01:19:57,800 Speaker 1: versions of it. Um. But the ending where I feel 1252 01:19:57,840 --> 01:20:00,840 Speaker 1: like the ending of Shrek is a bit more impactful, 1253 01:20:01,160 --> 01:20:05,920 Speaker 1: and here's why, is because, um, Shrek at the end. 1254 01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:07,519 Speaker 1: First of all, we have like a lot of like 1255 01:20:07,720 --> 01:20:12,080 Speaker 1: beauty normative issues in this movie right where there's a 1256 01:20:12,240 --> 01:20:18,759 Speaker 1: very like rigid binary of like good equals Western beauty 1257 01:20:18,760 --> 01:20:24,080 Speaker 1: standards of whatever the movies year released into standards, um 1258 01:20:24,240 --> 01:20:29,400 Speaker 1: bad equals literally anything else, and this movie definitely subscribes 1259 01:20:29,439 --> 01:20:32,759 Speaker 1: to that kind of thing, I guess with the exception 1260 01:20:32,800 --> 01:20:37,000 Speaker 1: of guest On, but Shrek, you know, at the end, 1261 01:20:37,439 --> 01:20:42,040 Speaker 1: Fiona goes out of the Western beauty standards character and 1262 01:20:42,200 --> 01:20:45,760 Speaker 1: becomes a person or an ogre rather who she's more 1263 01:20:45,840 --> 01:20:49,760 Speaker 1: comfortable as and feels more fully herself. And that's the 1264 01:20:49,760 --> 01:20:53,679 Speaker 1: happy ending, as they are both like just feeling their 1265 01:20:53,760 --> 01:20:57,519 Speaker 1: truest selves and they don't care what anyone thinks. Whereas 1266 01:20:58,040 --> 01:20:59,920 Speaker 1: the way this movie ends and the way that men 1267 01:21:00,240 --> 01:21:04,000 Speaker 1: movies end is like the the Beast is designed to 1268 01:21:04,040 --> 01:21:07,200 Speaker 1: be this other character and it's like he's not even 1269 01:21:07,320 --> 01:21:09,960 Speaker 1: like they somehow managed to make the Beast kind of 1270 01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:13,360 Speaker 1: hot I stand by to this day. But you know, 1271 01:21:13,479 --> 01:21:18,120 Speaker 1: he's he's this other character and then he's a monster, right, 1272 01:21:18,160 --> 01:21:21,320 Speaker 1: and then at the end he's he looks like Patrick 1273 01:21:21,400 --> 01:21:23,880 Speaker 1: Wilson and Phantom of the Opera. He is, you know, 1274 01:21:24,000 --> 01:21:27,800 Speaker 1: a rich white guy with longish hair, and this is 1275 01:21:27,960 --> 01:21:31,679 Speaker 1: his quote unquote reward for two days of working on himself. 1276 01:21:32,280 --> 01:21:33,960 Speaker 1: And that's just like kind of a very that's a 1277 01:21:34,040 --> 01:21:39,840 Speaker 1: very like you know, simple hollow ending and just again 1278 01:21:39,960 --> 01:21:46,200 Speaker 1: kind of enforces that rigid beauty binary that exists in 1279 01:21:47,080 --> 01:21:50,679 Speaker 1: you know, everything to this day, but in this movie 1280 01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:53,920 Speaker 1: it's pretty egregious because it's a fairy tale where things 1281 01:21:53,920 --> 01:21:56,960 Speaker 1: tend to be very rigid, and it's also kind of 1282 01:21:57,040 --> 01:22:02,639 Speaker 1: validating that rigidity by inserted all this nineties mentality into 1283 01:22:02,680 --> 01:22:04,720 Speaker 1: it and kind of like validates it in a way 1284 01:22:04,720 --> 01:22:11,120 Speaker 1: that I feel like doesn't work super well. I agree. Yeah, Yeah, 1285 01:22:11,160 --> 01:22:15,639 Speaker 1: we could talk about Monster other ring characters all day long, 1286 01:22:15,680 --> 01:22:17,719 Speaker 1: and we've we've talked about it in in other episodes 1287 01:22:17,760 --> 01:22:20,040 Speaker 1: as well, But yeah, that I mean, that's I feel 1288 01:22:20,080 --> 01:22:24,479 Speaker 1: like one of the more egregious elements of movies like this. Again, 1289 01:22:24,560 --> 01:22:27,280 Speaker 1: I guess I would say with the exception of Gaston, 1290 01:22:27,479 --> 01:22:29,320 Speaker 1: who I guess is there to be like even if 1291 01:22:29,400 --> 01:22:32,559 Speaker 1: someone is you know, I think I think we're supposed 1292 01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:34,679 Speaker 1: to think, you know, Gaston, he's like at this man's 1293 01:22:34,760 --> 01:22:38,400 Speaker 1: man and he's you know, the masculine ideal, but it's 1294 01:22:38,520 --> 01:22:41,680 Speaker 1: very toxic and it's so I guess it kind of 1295 01:22:41,680 --> 01:22:44,479 Speaker 1: succeeds in the Gaston area, But then with the main 1296 01:22:44,760 --> 01:22:48,120 Speaker 1: with the movies two title characters, it's just kind of 1297 01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:52,519 Speaker 1: like fart noise for me, you know, right, because with Guston, 1298 01:22:53,400 --> 01:22:57,800 Speaker 1: he is the embodiment of toxic masculinity. And I appreciate 1299 01:22:57,960 --> 01:23:03,120 Speaker 1: that his toxic masculine, his fragile male ego, his misogyny 1300 01:23:03,200 --> 01:23:07,120 Speaker 1: are all vilified. Like these are traits that he is 1301 01:23:07,160 --> 01:23:11,040 Speaker 1: openly displaying and the movie is showing you, look how 1302 01:23:11,080 --> 01:23:13,599 Speaker 1: bad this is. And I feel like the modern elements 1303 01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:16,920 Speaker 1: and started into that are some of them more like 1304 01:23:17,120 --> 01:23:21,680 Speaker 1: more effective ones in this adaptation, like the way that Gaston, 1305 01:23:21,920 --> 01:23:26,120 Speaker 1: the way that we're told that Gaston is a bad guy, 1306 01:23:26,520 --> 01:23:29,280 Speaker 1: and also the ways that we understand why people think 1307 01:23:29,320 --> 01:23:31,040 Speaker 1: he's a good guy. I feel like it kind of. 1308 01:23:31,120 --> 01:23:34,880 Speaker 1: It's still pretty much works for me, right, except for 1309 01:23:34,920 --> 01:23:38,240 Speaker 1: this one little thing. So, like the movie is like 1310 01:23:38,479 --> 01:23:42,160 Speaker 1: beauties in the eye of the beholder. You have to 1311 01:23:42,240 --> 01:23:45,920 Speaker 1: see someone's interviewed to a woman unless you and you 1312 01:23:46,040 --> 01:23:50,280 Speaker 1: better beautiful the whole damn time. So the reason that 1313 01:23:50,439 --> 01:23:55,960 Speaker 1: Gaston is designed to be like traditionally classically handsome is that, like, 1314 01:23:56,280 --> 01:23:58,439 Speaker 1: even though all the other towns people kind of fall 1315 01:23:58,560 --> 01:24:01,479 Speaker 1: under his like, oh what a handsome popular, like you know, 1316 01:24:02,200 --> 01:24:05,240 Speaker 1: quarterback of the football team kind of guy, but we 1317 01:24:05,400 --> 01:24:09,519 Speaker 1: all love even though he's horribly toxic, Bell doesn't fall 1318 01:24:09,600 --> 01:24:14,880 Speaker 1: for that because she sees that he has no inner beauty. Right, 1319 01:24:15,160 --> 01:24:19,160 Speaker 1: But it makes me wonder why does she not put 1320 01:24:19,280 --> 01:24:24,720 Speaker 1: up with Gaston's mistreatment of you know, her and the 1321 01:24:24,760 --> 01:24:29,760 Speaker 1: other people around, but she she does tolerate it In 1322 01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:33,040 Speaker 1: the beast, I like that. I mean, my guess is 1323 01:24:33,080 --> 01:24:36,800 Speaker 1: that goes back to the fairytale logic of Again, it's 1324 01:24:36,840 --> 01:24:39,479 Speaker 1: like whatever these stories are, so it doesn't work when 1325 01:24:39,479 --> 01:24:41,680 Speaker 1: you stretch it out for an hour and a half. 1326 01:24:42,280 --> 01:24:46,479 Speaker 1: But my guests would be that the beast with this 1327 01:24:46,479 --> 01:24:48,880 Speaker 1: story logic the Beast does two or three things to 1328 01:24:48,960 --> 01:24:52,080 Speaker 1: indicate that he could possibly change down the line, whereas 1329 01:24:52,080 --> 01:24:54,600 Speaker 1: Gaston does zero things and he doubles down in his 1330 01:24:54,680 --> 01:24:58,599 Speaker 1: negative qualities. That would be my guess, But it's I mean, 1331 01:24:58,640 --> 01:25:03,000 Speaker 1: it's still like it's a very simplistic way of approaching it. 1332 01:25:03,080 --> 01:25:06,400 Speaker 1: But I'm pretty sure that that's the vibe they're trying 1333 01:25:06,479 --> 01:25:09,840 Speaker 1: to strike there, and I don't know they're also it's 1334 01:25:09,840 --> 01:25:11,759 Speaker 1: so and then and then we haven't even talked about 1335 01:25:12,120 --> 01:25:14,920 Speaker 1: the staff. That's another fun thing where it's like you 1336 01:25:14,960 --> 01:25:19,920 Speaker 1: would think, you would think and maybe we even said 1337 01:25:19,960 --> 01:25:23,040 Speaker 1: this in our first past at this episode, oh, I 1338 01:25:23,080 --> 01:25:26,200 Speaker 1: want to know more about the lives of the working 1339 01:25:26,320 --> 01:25:31,479 Speaker 1: class you know, servants working in this castle. But again, 1340 01:25:31,600 --> 01:25:35,519 Speaker 1: if you want that sort of examination and discussion, you 1341 01:25:35,600 --> 01:25:38,960 Speaker 1: really just it can't be this story because if you 1342 01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:41,800 Speaker 1: add in. I found the way that they attempted to 1343 01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:48,640 Speaker 1: mitigate that issue in and adaptation to be horrifying and 1344 01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:53,000 Speaker 1: pretty jarring and like kind of upsetting to have to watch, 1345 01:25:53,560 --> 01:25:56,000 Speaker 1: because you know, it's like again it's like, whatever, this 1346 01:25:56,120 --> 01:26:00,679 Speaker 1: is the story. The story does frame all of the 1347 01:26:01,040 --> 01:26:04,120 Speaker 1: you know, household objects that used to be servants as 1348 01:26:04,360 --> 01:26:07,880 Speaker 1: side characters and sidekicks, and there is something to be 1349 01:26:07,920 --> 01:26:11,160 Speaker 1: said about, like, well, you know, why are are we 1350 01:26:11,320 --> 01:26:15,120 Speaker 1: making anyone who is poor very much a side character, 1351 01:26:15,840 --> 01:26:18,280 Speaker 1: except for I guess technically Bell, who doesn't seem like 1352 01:26:18,360 --> 01:26:22,960 Speaker 1: she's extremely well off because her father hasn't invented anything yet, right, 1353 01:26:23,840 --> 01:26:26,720 Speaker 1: But in any case, like, I think that there is 1354 01:26:26,800 --> 01:26:28,960 Speaker 1: something to be said for kind of the way that 1355 01:26:29,120 --> 01:26:31,880 Speaker 1: people of different classes are stylized in the way their 1356 01:26:31,920 --> 01:26:36,840 Speaker 1: stories are treated. But then in the movie they try 1357 01:26:36,840 --> 01:26:39,800 Speaker 1: to give like Loomire and Cogsworth backstories, but then it 1358 01:26:39,880 --> 01:26:43,840 Speaker 1: just becomes like so sad, it becomes really really upsetting 1359 01:26:43,960 --> 01:26:46,880 Speaker 1: because you just are constantly thinking about how their lives 1360 01:26:46,880 --> 01:26:51,160 Speaker 1: are on the line based on whether Bell tolerates abuse 1361 01:26:51,240 --> 01:26:55,160 Speaker 1: or not. And that's just kind of Ten Miles of 1362 01:26:55,320 --> 01:27:00,280 Speaker 1: Bad Road narratively, where it's like, oh, this woman who 1363 01:27:00,280 --> 01:27:02,800 Speaker 1: we know does not you know, she said at the 1364 01:27:02,800 --> 01:27:04,280 Speaker 1: beginning of the movie she doesn't want to be here, 1365 01:27:04,640 --> 01:27:08,479 Speaker 1: but now if she doesn't stay here, the like people 1366 01:27:08,520 --> 01:27:14,000 Speaker 1: are gonna die. In thee when we're at the end, 1367 01:27:14,040 --> 01:27:16,839 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, where they like are They're all dying, 1368 01:27:17,160 --> 01:27:20,200 Speaker 1: Like they're like their faces are disappearing they're like turning 1369 01:27:20,240 --> 01:27:23,040 Speaker 1: to stone and you're like, this is not how I 1370 01:27:23,120 --> 01:27:26,040 Speaker 1: want Like, I guess I didn't want this. I guess 1371 01:27:26,040 --> 01:27:28,599 Speaker 1: I didn't want this. I want this, I didn't want it. 1372 01:27:28,600 --> 01:27:31,439 Speaker 1: It's really scary to look at and think about, and 1373 01:27:31,840 --> 01:27:36,760 Speaker 1: um and and again. It's by trying to address that, 1374 01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:42,479 Speaker 1: it puts more narrative pressure on Bell too theoretically act 1375 01:27:42,520 --> 01:27:45,679 Speaker 1: against her own interests of what she said she wanted, like, well, 1376 01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:47,519 Speaker 1: now she has to go back to the beast, whether 1377 01:27:47,560 --> 01:27:49,880 Speaker 1: he improves or not, or all of her friends are 1378 01:27:49,880 --> 01:27:55,160 Speaker 1: going to die. Like that's not a good vibe to 1379 01:27:55,320 --> 01:28:00,640 Speaker 1: bring into the chat. That's a huge sacrifice. Cartoons. She 1380 01:28:00,960 --> 01:28:04,040 Speaker 1: wasn't dealing with that little dark cloud over her head. 1381 01:28:04,520 --> 01:28:06,719 Speaker 1: That was really upsetting. At the end, I'm like, Emma Watson, 1382 01:28:06,720 --> 01:28:11,280 Speaker 1: you gotta get back there. Yeah, is dusting in that castle. 1383 01:28:11,640 --> 01:28:14,800 Speaker 1: You're gonna go save him. You're gonna let Audre McDonald die. 1384 01:28:15,000 --> 01:28:17,800 Speaker 1: I don't think, so go back to that pilot tennis ball. 1385 01:28:18,960 --> 01:28:22,200 Speaker 1: Stanley Tucci's keys aren't going to be able to play themselves. 1386 01:28:22,200 --> 01:28:26,639 Speaker 1: Any life is on the line here. Well, here's something 1387 01:28:26,680 --> 01:28:30,040 Speaker 1: I didn't pick up on in our first rendition of 1388 01:28:30,040 --> 01:28:35,320 Speaker 1: this episode that I find extremely troubling. No, some of 1389 01:28:35,320 --> 01:28:38,160 Speaker 1: the in fact, many of the lyrics to one of 1390 01:28:38,200 --> 01:28:41,240 Speaker 1: the best songs in the movie be Our Guest, are 1391 01:28:41,360 --> 01:28:43,640 Speaker 1: very fucked up because the lyrics are all about how 1392 01:28:43,680 --> 01:28:48,479 Speaker 1: the servants actually love being servants to the ruling class, 1393 01:28:48,840 --> 01:28:52,080 Speaker 1: and if they're not being servants to the ruling class, 1394 01:28:52,120 --> 01:28:56,479 Speaker 1: then their lives are actually pointless. And yes, I find 1395 01:28:56,520 --> 01:28:59,840 Speaker 1: that which is it's kind of like I was thinking 1396 01:28:59,840 --> 01:29:01,559 Speaker 1: for too. I just think that that's like a funny 1397 01:29:01,760 --> 01:29:03,920 Speaker 1: premise to try to update, because that would be kind 1398 01:29:03,960 --> 01:29:09,680 Speaker 1: of the cultural equivalent of like a barista thinking about like, 1399 01:29:09,760 --> 01:29:12,880 Speaker 1: if I'm not frothing up milk, I might as well 1400 01:29:12,920 --> 01:29:16,480 Speaker 1: be dead. Like that is kind of because it's like 1401 01:29:16,479 --> 01:29:19,320 Speaker 1: like they're they're working job, like no one is like 1402 01:29:19,479 --> 01:29:23,200 Speaker 1: if I can't froth milk, I wish to die. Like 1403 01:29:23,720 --> 01:29:26,280 Speaker 1: no one feels that way about their job. No one 1404 01:29:26,320 --> 01:29:28,400 Speaker 1: feels that way. What do we feel that way? Are we? 1405 01:29:28,520 --> 01:29:30,960 Speaker 1: Like if I can't pod, I might as well roll 1406 01:29:31,000 --> 01:29:35,360 Speaker 1: over and die. I do feel that way, Oh my god, 1407 01:29:34,960 --> 01:29:38,920 Speaker 1: my god. But like just I mean, I just also 1408 01:29:38,960 --> 01:29:41,559 Speaker 1: find it especially weird. I don't know when this story 1409 01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:45,680 Speaker 1: takes place in relation to the French Revolution, but like 1410 01:29:45,760 --> 01:29:48,160 Speaker 1: it's just so weird for this like French story to 1411 01:29:48,200 --> 01:29:53,080 Speaker 1: be like, yes, we the proletariat actually love serving the 1412 01:29:53,120 --> 01:29:57,320 Speaker 1: bourgeois class and if we can't do it, then we 1413 01:29:58,720 --> 01:30:02,320 Speaker 1: what are the lyrics? It's like life is so unnerving 1414 01:30:02,520 --> 01:30:06,000 Speaker 1: for a servant who's not serving, he's not whole without 1415 01:30:06,000 --> 01:30:10,800 Speaker 1: a soul to wait upon, like when especially when we 1416 01:30:10,880 --> 01:30:13,800 Speaker 1: know that like that that was an amazing point with 1417 01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:17,400 Speaker 1: like the especially in France in the eight hundreds. This 1418 01:30:17,479 --> 01:30:20,599 Speaker 1: is a weird vibe to be, you know, taking on. 1419 01:30:21,400 --> 01:30:23,120 Speaker 1: It's like, I mean, it's like having a bunch of 1420 01:30:23,120 --> 01:30:26,360 Speaker 1: people being like Jeff Bezos and he awesome, especially, but 1421 01:30:26,439 --> 01:30:31,080 Speaker 1: we know that their boss specifically is not nice to them, 1422 01:30:31,120 --> 01:30:37,080 Speaker 1: like really really mean to them, and we also it 1423 01:30:37,160 --> 01:30:39,960 Speaker 1: also is just like another I don't know the music 1424 01:30:40,120 --> 01:30:43,880 Speaker 1: and this movie is so beautiful, and it's also like 1425 01:30:44,120 --> 01:30:47,559 Speaker 1: some of Howard Ashman's like final work, and he's such 1426 01:30:47,600 --> 01:30:50,160 Speaker 1: an icon and this movie is dedicated to his memory 1427 01:30:50,200 --> 01:30:52,320 Speaker 1: because he I believe he passed away before it came out, 1428 01:30:52,320 --> 01:30:56,120 Speaker 1: and like he's just so amazing, and it feels like 1429 01:30:56,720 --> 01:31:00,679 Speaker 1: the lyrics from Howard Ashman and the screenplay are often 1430 01:31:00,880 --> 01:31:05,840 Speaker 1: in conflict because it's like Howard Ashman's lyrics say Bell 1431 01:31:05,960 --> 01:31:09,360 Speaker 1: wants more than this story says, actually, no, she doesn't. 1432 01:31:09,680 --> 01:31:14,080 Speaker 1: Lyrics say we love being members of the proletariat a 1433 01:31:14,160 --> 01:31:21,160 Speaker 1: fucking rocks, But the screenplay says that they really desperately 1434 01:31:21,160 --> 01:31:25,320 Speaker 1: want to be people again, so like they don't want 1435 01:31:25,320 --> 01:31:29,479 Speaker 1: to be dishes, which makes sense right, Like it's so 1436 01:31:29,560 --> 01:31:31,200 Speaker 1: there's a little bit of calm, I mean whatever, it's 1437 01:31:31,200 --> 01:31:35,439 Speaker 1: a kids movie, but there's definitely there's definitely conflict there. Yeah. 1438 01:31:36,439 --> 01:31:39,320 Speaker 1: Here's also something that we I think we talked we 1439 01:31:39,400 --> 01:31:43,280 Speaker 1: touched on this in the first episode, but um of 1440 01:31:43,320 --> 01:31:48,200 Speaker 1: the enchanted objects, the quote female objects a k a. 1441 01:31:48,840 --> 01:31:52,839 Speaker 1: The characters who are voiced by voice actors who are women, 1442 01:31:53,479 --> 01:32:01,040 Speaker 1: tend to be traditionally like feminine objects. For example, feather dust, yes, 1443 01:32:01,680 --> 01:32:07,200 Speaker 1: cleaning supplies, cooking supplies, women a wardrobe because women be 1444 01:32:07,479 --> 01:32:10,880 Speaker 1: trying on clothes, you know, not like telling time that's 1445 01:32:10,880 --> 01:32:15,880 Speaker 1: a man that's job. Yes, yeah, yeah, like traditionally feminine. 1446 01:32:15,920 --> 01:32:19,760 Speaker 1: And that was another thing that the reboots sucked at, 1447 01:32:19,800 --> 01:32:22,599 Speaker 1: where they're like, Okay, we gotta make Bell a feminist icon. 1448 01:32:22,680 --> 01:32:24,160 Speaker 1: How do we do this? And then I heard that 1449 01:32:24,200 --> 01:32:26,559 Speaker 1: this was Emma Watson's idea, and I laughed and laughed 1450 01:32:26,560 --> 01:32:32,240 Speaker 1: and laughed, um until I cried. The like in the movie, 1451 01:32:32,400 --> 01:32:36,360 Speaker 1: Bell is also an inventor, but she invents laundry things, 1452 01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:41,760 Speaker 1: and that was Emma Watson's idea. She's like wow. She 1453 01:32:41,920 --> 01:32:44,040 Speaker 1: was like out here in interviews being like I told 1454 01:32:44,080 --> 01:32:46,519 Speaker 1: them Bell's got to make a laundry machine. And I 1455 01:32:46,600 --> 01:32:52,240 Speaker 1: was like, okay, all right, if you insist they did it. Um, 1456 01:32:52,280 --> 01:32:54,880 Speaker 1: it was weird, but they did it. Um. Yeah. But yeah, 1457 01:32:54,880 --> 01:33:04,240 Speaker 1: the like equating female voices with traditionally like female caretaking tasks. 1458 01:33:05,000 --> 01:33:07,760 Speaker 1: Another thing about the br guest song, and this has 1459 01:33:07,800 --> 01:33:11,920 Speaker 1: always bugged me. But so Belle skips dinner with the 1460 01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:14,880 Speaker 1: bast because he is uh, he wants her to starve 1461 01:33:14,960 --> 01:33:19,240 Speaker 1: and die. But then she doesn't eat. She goes downstairs 1462 01:33:19,320 --> 01:33:22,320 Speaker 1: because she's hungry. A bunch of food gets made and 1463 01:33:22,400 --> 01:33:25,720 Speaker 1: brought out, but she never we never see her eat 1464 01:33:25,760 --> 01:33:28,639 Speaker 1: any of it, except for like getting just like little 1465 01:33:28,680 --> 01:33:32,320 Speaker 1: tiny tastes of stuff. Thank you of her a doggy bag. 1466 01:33:32,439 --> 01:33:36,559 Speaker 1: I just I hope. So, but like, why are movies 1467 01:33:36,840 --> 01:33:41,960 Speaker 1: so against letting us see women eat on screen? Okay, yeah, 1468 01:33:42,000 --> 01:33:44,479 Speaker 1: I do see that to the point where the same 1469 01:33:44,479 --> 01:33:49,639 Speaker 1: thing happens in remake and if they fade the black, 1470 01:33:49,720 --> 01:33:51,960 Speaker 1: like like does she have sex with the pudding? Like 1471 01:33:51,960 --> 01:33:54,120 Speaker 1: why are we fading the black? What is this? They 1472 01:33:54,200 --> 01:33:56,160 Speaker 1: kind of make it a joke like where she is 1473 01:33:56,280 --> 01:33:59,439 Speaker 1: very desperately trying to like grab food to eat, but 1474 01:33:59,479 --> 01:34:02,519 Speaker 1: that keeps like prancing away because it's like dishes who 1475 01:34:02,600 --> 01:34:07,200 Speaker 1: have personalities or whatever. I hate that damn movie. I'm 1476 01:34:07,280 --> 01:34:09,519 Speaker 1: just like, well, then do it, do it or don't 1477 01:34:09,560 --> 01:34:11,760 Speaker 1: do it. Don't be a cute with me. Let us 1478 01:34:11,800 --> 01:34:16,559 Speaker 1: see bell eat. That's my main issue with this movie. No, 1479 01:34:16,800 --> 01:34:19,759 Speaker 1: but we don't really. Yeah, I mean she she drinks 1480 01:34:19,760 --> 01:34:24,120 Speaker 1: soup later on, yeah the fu Yeah that's her first 1481 01:34:24,160 --> 01:34:27,160 Speaker 1: meal is three days later she drinks she finally gets 1482 01:34:27,200 --> 01:34:30,559 Speaker 1: to eat some porridge. So that's too bad. Yeah that 1483 01:34:31,479 --> 01:34:33,960 Speaker 1: but that the animation and that scene is so beautiful, 1484 01:34:34,360 --> 01:34:38,479 Speaker 1: so good. It's so good. It's such a fun movie. 1485 01:34:38,520 --> 01:34:43,519 Speaker 1: I just I love it. Um yeah, So I'm trying 1486 01:34:43,560 --> 01:34:47,200 Speaker 1: to think of what else we got here. Um yeah, 1487 01:34:47,200 --> 01:34:50,799 Speaker 1: I guess just going back into like we we've basically 1488 01:34:50,840 --> 01:34:54,240 Speaker 1: touched on this, but just the kind of inherent like 1489 01:34:54,360 --> 01:34:58,400 Speaker 1: I I felt almost like, uh, this is the wrong 1490 01:34:58,439 --> 01:35:00,760 Speaker 1: movie to equate it with, but the general energy of 1491 01:35:00,840 --> 01:35:03,680 Speaker 1: like a Revenge of the Nerds kind of redemption are 1492 01:35:03,840 --> 01:35:05,679 Speaker 1: going on with The Beast, where I feel like it's 1493 01:35:05,720 --> 01:35:11,040 Speaker 1: kind of pretty common in movies for a character that 1494 01:35:11,200 --> 01:35:15,479 Speaker 1: is treating a woman shitty at the beginning to um 1495 01:35:15,960 --> 01:35:20,760 Speaker 1: very intentionally say hey, if I do A B and C, like, 1496 01:35:20,920 --> 01:35:24,439 Speaker 1: I will have demonstrated enough growth to earn this woman 1497 01:35:24,520 --> 01:35:26,160 Speaker 1: and then I will have her and then she will 1498 01:35:26,200 --> 01:35:29,479 Speaker 1: be mine as my prize. Yeah, right, And I think 1499 01:35:29,479 --> 01:35:33,479 Speaker 1: that that is kind of how the Beasts storyline plays out, 1500 01:35:33,479 --> 01:35:35,719 Speaker 1: as he does one or two things to demonstrate growth, 1501 01:35:35,840 --> 01:35:37,639 Speaker 1: which is good, We're going in the right direction here, 1502 01:35:37,800 --> 01:35:42,560 Speaker 1: But then he's immediately quote unquote rewarded with the unconditional 1503 01:35:42,640 --> 01:35:46,880 Speaker 1: love of a woman whose forgiveness he has not necessarily earned, right, 1504 01:35:46,960 --> 01:35:50,040 Speaker 1: And I feel like that is like just kind of 1505 01:35:50,040 --> 01:35:53,639 Speaker 1: a thing that we see play out in real life 1506 01:35:54,120 --> 01:35:56,519 Speaker 1: over and over and over of like why did this thing? 1507 01:35:57,240 --> 01:35:59,559 Speaker 1: Why do you not? Why are you not my bride? 1508 01:35:59,640 --> 01:36:02,719 Speaker 1: It's like, know, that's just how like people who aren't 1509 01:36:02,760 --> 01:36:07,800 Speaker 1: assholes act like there isn't necessarily a prize in demonstrating 1510 01:36:07,840 --> 01:36:12,280 Speaker 1: personal growth. UM. Sometimes that is the prize is that 1511 01:36:12,320 --> 01:36:15,439 Speaker 1: you suck less. That's the prize is you're less of 1512 01:36:15,439 --> 01:36:20,280 Speaker 1: an asshole. Now you don't get something right, Beasts goes 1513 01:36:20,360 --> 01:36:27,519 Speaker 1: from being violent, abusive, scary too, just like being bare 1514 01:36:27,560 --> 01:36:32,080 Speaker 1: minimum decent. Like he nothing gets even established about why 1515 01:36:32,120 --> 01:36:37,440 Speaker 1: they might be compatible romantic partners. He just goes from 1516 01:36:37,520 --> 01:36:41,200 Speaker 1: being frightening to no longer being frightening. I feel like 1517 01:36:41,200 --> 01:36:44,640 Speaker 1: it's like we see like a little I I definitely 1518 01:36:44,720 --> 01:36:48,120 Speaker 1: see in the definitely not much of my own teen one, 1519 01:36:48,360 --> 01:36:51,920 Speaker 1: but the I see a capacity for growth. I don't 1520 01:36:51,960 --> 01:36:55,680 Speaker 1: think that he earns the love, the eternal love and 1521 01:36:55,720 --> 01:36:57,720 Speaker 1: trust of someone. Inside of a couple of days, it 1522 01:36:57,760 --> 01:37:00,360 Speaker 1: seems like he is on an arc towards being a 1523 01:37:00,360 --> 01:37:05,880 Speaker 1: better person, and in kind of more concrete ways, he's 1524 01:37:05,960 --> 01:37:09,600 Speaker 1: like having to challenge his own entitlement to people. And 1525 01:37:09,600 --> 01:37:11,599 Speaker 1: it's like, that's the message we're supposed to get when 1526 01:37:11,640 --> 01:37:14,080 Speaker 1: he quote unquote let's Bell go, even though she can 1527 01:37:14,080 --> 01:37:18,240 Speaker 1: technically whenever she wants whatever, um, when he lets her go, 1528 01:37:18,439 --> 01:37:20,960 Speaker 1: that's like an unselfish act that he does that we're 1529 01:37:20,960 --> 01:37:24,800 Speaker 1: supposed to be like, oh, okay, so he's behaving less 1530 01:37:25,040 --> 01:37:28,960 Speaker 1: entitled to access to people and access to people's time 1531 01:37:29,120 --> 01:37:33,800 Speaker 1: and attention, and like putting others someone's, someone else's interest 1532 01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:37,240 Speaker 1: before his own. That is as certainly a step, that's 1533 01:37:37,240 --> 01:37:39,920 Speaker 1: a step in the right direction. Great, sure, but yeah 1534 01:37:40,000 --> 01:37:45,479 Speaker 1: it's like but then immediately rewarding that one that one thing, um, 1535 01:37:45,560 --> 01:37:48,040 Speaker 1: but I mean in that that's not good, right? And 1536 01:37:48,080 --> 01:37:51,960 Speaker 1: I agree that he definitely demonstrates more capacity for growth 1537 01:37:52,280 --> 01:37:56,719 Speaker 1: than the other, the live action version and just in general. 1538 01:37:56,920 --> 01:38:01,160 Speaker 1: But even so, where's the compatibilit city between them, even 1539 01:38:01,200 --> 01:38:04,960 Speaker 1: if he grows and becomes a kind gentle person, what 1540 01:38:05,000 --> 01:38:10,480 Speaker 1: are they compatible about? Snowball snowballs? They both like throwing snowballs. 1541 01:38:10,720 --> 01:38:13,400 Speaker 1: They like to throw snowballs at each other, and they 1542 01:38:13,479 --> 01:38:16,960 Speaker 1: like to save each other from wolves, and thus is 1543 01:38:17,040 --> 01:38:19,960 Speaker 1: kind of and so I think if you can find 1544 01:38:19,960 --> 01:38:22,240 Speaker 1: someone like that, we really can't let him go. That's 1545 01:38:22,280 --> 01:38:26,800 Speaker 1: what I mean, a matchmate in heaven. I That's what 1546 01:38:26,960 --> 01:38:30,800 Speaker 1: really bothers me about a lot of romantic stories is 1547 01:38:30,920 --> 01:38:33,080 Speaker 1: that we've talked about this before. It's like, well, why 1548 01:38:33,120 --> 01:38:35,040 Speaker 1: do they like each other? Oh, because they're both hot 1549 01:38:35,120 --> 01:38:37,800 Speaker 1: and they're near each other. In this movie, it's one 1550 01:38:37,800 --> 01:38:40,000 Speaker 1: of them is hot and they're near each other, and 1551 01:38:40,120 --> 01:38:42,479 Speaker 1: well it's like even like yeah, and it's like and 1552 01:38:42,520 --> 01:38:45,200 Speaker 1: then they end up together because one is no longer 1553 01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:48,240 Speaker 1: being actively antagonistic, which is honestly more than we get 1554 01:38:48,280 --> 01:38:50,880 Speaker 1: in some movies, Like there are some romantic movies that 1555 01:38:51,040 --> 01:38:53,799 Speaker 1: end with one of the hot parties still being actively 1556 01:38:53,840 --> 01:39:00,679 Speaker 1: antagonistic to the other. True, but now it's cute because reasons. Um. Yeah, 1557 01:39:00,800 --> 01:39:04,960 Speaker 1: I just I think compatibility gets skipped over a lot, 1558 01:39:05,520 --> 01:39:09,840 Speaker 1: and I think that romantic movies need to pay more 1559 01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:12,600 Speaker 1: attention to it. Well yeah, and it's again, that's like 1560 01:39:14,240 --> 01:39:17,800 Speaker 1: another thing that makes sense in the context of the 1561 01:39:17,840 --> 01:39:22,160 Speaker 1: fairy tale, where like everyone is like marriage was not 1562 01:39:22,320 --> 01:39:26,320 Speaker 1: necessarily a love game, but when they're applying the nineties 1563 01:39:26,400 --> 01:39:29,720 Speaker 1: values of marriage is very much a love game. Um. 1564 01:39:29,760 --> 01:39:32,519 Speaker 1: In an individual choice, the end game of the story 1565 01:39:33,080 --> 01:39:36,720 Speaker 1: ceases to make sense. Um, which is why they just 1566 01:39:36,880 --> 01:39:40,120 Speaker 1: write and just let them write an original story. Then yeah, 1567 01:39:40,240 --> 01:39:43,720 Speaker 1: I just I feel like, especially as time goes on, 1568 01:39:44,240 --> 01:39:46,320 Speaker 1: not that Disney is ever going to stop cashing this 1569 01:39:46,720 --> 01:39:53,200 Speaker 1: check for a billion dollars, it's just whatever, Like mindful adaptation. 1570 01:39:53,360 --> 01:39:58,400 Speaker 1: It's not impossible to adapt an old story with contemporary values, 1571 01:39:58,439 --> 01:40:00,320 Speaker 1: but you can't just kind of copy pay them in 1572 01:40:00,360 --> 01:40:03,880 Speaker 1: where it suits you, Like, there has to be meaningful 1573 01:40:04,080 --> 01:40:08,400 Speaker 1: adaptation choices made, or any level of scrutiny is going 1574 01:40:08,439 --> 01:40:10,120 Speaker 1: to cause the whole thing to kind of fall apart. 1575 01:40:10,160 --> 01:40:12,680 Speaker 1: And yeah, like that's definitely an example of where it 1576 01:40:12,760 --> 01:40:15,160 Speaker 1: falls apart. Here is like if we're coming at this 1577 01:40:15,240 --> 01:40:18,520 Speaker 1: from the like you marry for love, not for survival, 1578 01:40:19,520 --> 01:40:22,400 Speaker 1: um this the ending to this story makes no sense 1579 01:40:22,400 --> 01:40:25,320 Speaker 1: because they're not compatible. In the fairy tale, that probably 1580 01:40:26,000 --> 01:40:31,360 Speaker 1: mattered less, but in the theoretically that should that did matter? 1581 01:40:31,560 --> 01:40:35,720 Speaker 1: I did. I don't know. The movie is really good, 1582 01:40:35,840 --> 01:40:38,719 Speaker 1: but it's a mess. Does it pass the victal test? 1583 01:40:39,360 --> 01:40:42,240 Speaker 1: I think we decided that it's like sort of between 1584 01:40:42,320 --> 01:40:45,599 Speaker 1: her and the wardrobe, right, that was that was? Yes? 1585 01:40:46,040 --> 01:40:49,719 Speaker 1: I think maybe they or her and Bell and Mrs Potts, 1586 01:40:49,760 --> 01:40:51,800 Speaker 1: but I think it was like sort of kind of 1587 01:40:51,840 --> 01:40:53,280 Speaker 1: maybe sometimes. I think it's one of those things where 1588 01:40:53,280 --> 01:40:56,040 Speaker 1: it's like, even if they have a two line exchange 1589 01:40:56,439 --> 01:40:59,599 Speaker 1: where a man does not get explicitly mentioned, I think 1590 01:40:59,640 --> 01:41:04,120 Speaker 1: the text of every conversation is still about preventing the 1591 01:41:04,160 --> 01:41:08,639 Speaker 1: beast from murdering me today. Yeah, so I think either 1592 01:41:08,720 --> 01:41:13,920 Speaker 1: the beast or like Maurice is the context of every conversation. Sure, 1593 01:41:14,120 --> 01:41:17,160 Speaker 1: so I would say, considering context, I would give it 1594 01:41:17,520 --> 01:41:21,160 Speaker 1: a knot. I'm gonna give it a not. The nineteen 1595 01:41:22,600 --> 01:41:26,559 Speaker 1: one does pass the Bechtel test, but it's maybe the 1596 01:41:26,640 --> 01:41:28,439 Speaker 1: weirdest TV show I've ever watched in my life, the 1597 01:41:28,520 --> 01:41:32,439 Speaker 1: Linda Hamilton's one. Yeah, Yeah, Thelenda Hamilton's one. You gotta 1598 01:41:32,520 --> 01:41:36,439 Speaker 1: watch it. I'll give you my CBS all access password. Um, 1599 01:41:36,520 --> 01:41:40,280 Speaker 1: and then you can watch Picard. But yeah, I would, 1600 01:41:40,360 --> 01:41:42,519 Speaker 1: I would. I would recommend watching an upisode of it 1601 01:41:42,520 --> 01:41:45,599 Speaker 1: because it's so eighties. And also Ron Perlman is like 1602 01:41:46,040 --> 01:41:49,880 Speaker 1: acting through the makeup, and I'm like, whoever the funk 1603 01:41:49,920 --> 01:41:53,880 Speaker 1: is in? Did you not watch Ron Perlman? He transcended 1604 01:41:53,880 --> 01:41:57,639 Speaker 1: the makeup, Jim Carrey transcends the Grinch makeup. Why can't 1605 01:41:57,640 --> 01:42:02,120 Speaker 1: you transcend the makeup? Whoever you are? It's just strange. 1606 01:42:03,080 --> 01:42:06,200 Speaker 1: So yeah, and then I think that the adaptation does 1607 01:42:06,240 --> 01:42:09,679 Speaker 1: pass the Bactel test, but it's still, um, sucks, so bad, 1608 01:42:10,000 --> 01:42:16,439 Speaker 1: so flawed. Metro movie. Also, The Thing Went does one 1609 01:42:16,479 --> 01:42:19,720 Speaker 1: of my least favorite tropes on movies that are like 1610 01:42:20,040 --> 01:42:22,439 Speaker 1: trying to be feminist but actually very much or not 1611 01:42:22,920 --> 01:42:25,720 Speaker 1: um where they're like, the patriarchy is one guy. Look 1612 01:42:25,720 --> 01:42:29,000 Speaker 1: at him, he's not nice. Like, it's just one guy 1613 01:42:29,080 --> 01:42:31,839 Speaker 1: who's mean, and it has not there's no systemic anything. 1614 01:42:31,880 --> 01:42:34,960 Speaker 1: It's just one guy. It's like, well, then kill that guy. 1615 01:42:35,000 --> 01:42:37,280 Speaker 1: If we're that easy, we would just kill that guy. 1616 01:42:37,320 --> 01:42:40,439 Speaker 1: To be perfectly honest, that guy would simply be killed. 1617 01:42:40,640 --> 01:42:43,880 Speaker 1: But that's not how you can throw him into a ravine. Yeah. Yeah, 1618 01:42:43,920 --> 01:42:47,439 Speaker 1: it's like, oh, Gaston and that guy are the only 1619 01:42:47,600 --> 01:42:51,599 Speaker 1: misogynists in France, Well let's get rid of them. Like, 1620 01:42:52,000 --> 01:42:54,879 Speaker 1: but that's just not how. But whatever, that's movie logic. 1621 01:42:56,080 --> 01:43:02,679 Speaker 1: I love Luke Evans where I've Evans, Mr Guston. He's great. 1622 01:43:02,880 --> 01:43:06,720 Speaker 1: He can sing, he can dance. After all, this this 1623 01:43:06,880 --> 01:43:12,240 Speaker 1: is France, it's true. He's also in Fast and Furious six, 1624 01:43:13,120 --> 01:43:16,519 Speaker 1: he was in ma He's in a lot of fun movies. Wow, 1625 01:43:16,680 --> 01:43:19,799 Speaker 1: I still have to see ma. Um he got a Sea. 1626 01:43:20,280 --> 01:43:23,160 Speaker 1: I'm looking through just to see if I have any 1627 01:43:23,200 --> 01:43:26,559 Speaker 1: funnel things. Um do me? I mean, it's almost hardly 1628 01:43:26,560 --> 01:43:32,479 Speaker 1: worth mentioning. But Bells mom is not lie. She's dead. 1629 01:43:32,960 --> 01:43:35,599 Speaker 1: And then in the movie they give context for it, 1630 01:43:35,680 --> 01:43:39,400 Speaker 1: and it's like why it doesn't have anything to do 1631 01:43:39,439 --> 01:43:42,479 Speaker 1: with anything. It doesn't go anywhere. It's and again it's 1632 01:43:42,520 --> 01:43:46,000 Speaker 1: just like copy paste adaptation brain of like, oh this 1633 01:43:46,080 --> 01:43:49,559 Speaker 1: was the problem, let's just paste in an explanation for 1634 01:43:49,600 --> 01:43:51,640 Speaker 1: it and people will be satisfied. It's like, no, you 1635 01:43:51,640 --> 01:43:54,519 Speaker 1: need to build it up from the bank. Like I 1636 01:43:54,560 --> 01:43:59,080 Speaker 1: don't even object to adding a storyline with a mother 1637 01:43:59,120 --> 01:44:01,040 Speaker 1: as a backstory for help, but you can't just be like, 1638 01:44:01,520 --> 01:44:04,040 Speaker 1: here it is, here's the worst song you've ever heard 1639 01:44:04,040 --> 01:44:09,759 Speaker 1: in your wife, So uh, like you can't just paste 1640 01:44:09,800 --> 01:44:11,519 Speaker 1: it and you need to like go back to like 1641 01:44:11,720 --> 01:44:14,120 Speaker 1: build the story from the ground up with that as 1642 01:44:14,160 --> 01:44:16,200 Speaker 1: an integral part of it. You can just add it 1643 01:44:16,280 --> 01:44:19,320 Speaker 1: at the end or it doesn't work. So I kind 1644 01:44:19,320 --> 01:44:23,320 Speaker 1: of like slightly object to like the whole like, oh, 1645 01:44:23,400 --> 01:44:26,320 Speaker 1: don't change anything when you're updating to the live adaptation. 1646 01:44:26,560 --> 01:44:30,880 Speaker 1: Of course, you know, change things, but you can't just 1647 01:44:30,920 --> 01:44:33,280 Speaker 1: like add it as a little flourish and like a 1648 01:44:33,280 --> 01:44:34,880 Speaker 1: wink and a nod at the end. It needs to 1649 01:44:34,880 --> 01:44:38,680 Speaker 1: actually have like a meaningful like if you whatever, it's 1650 01:44:38,680 --> 01:44:40,760 Speaker 1: just like basic writing, Like if you took it out 1651 01:44:40,760 --> 01:44:43,400 Speaker 1: of the story and nothing changes, then you need to 1652 01:44:43,400 --> 01:44:47,240 Speaker 1: go back and have it matter, like, yes, that's all, 1653 01:44:47,479 --> 01:44:52,360 Speaker 1: that's all it is. Yeah. Yeah. The live action remake 1654 01:44:53,160 --> 01:44:57,320 Speaker 1: does something kind of similar with clearly like Disney got 1655 01:44:57,360 --> 01:45:01,320 Speaker 1: the note, has been getting the note, Hey, maybe not 1656 01:45:01,640 --> 01:45:05,200 Speaker 1: have so many just only white people in your story. 1657 01:45:05,280 --> 01:45:08,400 Speaker 1: So they do seem to make an attempt to include 1658 01:45:08,439 --> 01:45:12,000 Speaker 1: some more diversity because there now are some black people 1659 01:45:12,040 --> 01:45:15,040 Speaker 1: in the town, there are some black actors voicing some 1660 01:45:15,080 --> 01:45:17,920 Speaker 1: of the enchanted objects, but it's the same kind of 1661 01:45:17,920 --> 01:45:24,839 Speaker 1: thing where the characters are pretty secondary or tertiary. They 1662 01:45:24,880 --> 01:45:29,160 Speaker 1: are not important, they're not among like the core cast. 1663 01:45:30,200 --> 01:45:34,519 Speaker 1: So I think my main takeaway from watching the ninety 1664 01:45:34,520 --> 01:45:38,720 Speaker 1: one and I feel like, even though the ninety one 1665 01:45:38,760 --> 01:45:42,160 Speaker 1: movie in terms of like quality is vastly superior, you 1666 01:45:42,320 --> 01:45:46,160 Speaker 1: kind of see like the same types of mistakes made 1667 01:45:46,240 --> 01:45:49,280 Speaker 1: in both where they just kind of like take an 1668 01:45:49,320 --> 01:45:53,839 Speaker 1: old story and then put like the Instagram filter lens 1669 01:45:53,880 --> 01:45:56,080 Speaker 1: of the year it's coming out on top of it 1670 01:45:56,320 --> 01:46:01,280 Speaker 1: without meaningfully building in those values into their rewrite of 1671 01:46:01,320 --> 01:46:07,280 Speaker 1: the story. And I think probably is even worse because 1672 01:46:07,280 --> 01:46:10,519 Speaker 1: it's like a rewrite of a rewrite and so it 1673 01:46:10,560 --> 01:46:16,160 Speaker 1: just gets even more like chaos. But it's yeah, it's 1674 01:46:16,200 --> 01:46:20,680 Speaker 1: just it's I don't know, there's such a dearth of 1675 01:46:20,760 --> 01:46:24,880 Speaker 1: like good adaptations that like consider the context of the 1676 01:46:24,920 --> 01:46:27,720 Speaker 1: time is being released into into it coming out, and 1677 01:46:27,760 --> 01:46:31,519 Speaker 1: it's like either adapt an old as story with and 1678 01:46:31,600 --> 01:46:34,960 Speaker 1: just do it and have it have you know, old 1679 01:46:35,040 --> 01:46:36,600 Speaker 1: values that kind of speak to no one and just 1680 01:46:36,680 --> 01:46:41,240 Speaker 1: do that, or you know, try try a little harder, 1681 01:46:41,960 --> 01:46:46,559 Speaker 1: a little harder. Yeah, the reveal that like Lafu is 1682 01:46:46,720 --> 01:46:49,839 Speaker 1: gay at the end because he dances for one second 1683 01:46:49,920 --> 01:46:53,640 Speaker 1: with a man, it's not that's like but that's like 1684 01:46:53,640 --> 01:46:57,160 Speaker 1: a perfect example of that, like the Instagram filter of 1685 01:46:57,200 --> 01:47:01,160 Speaker 1: like updated right, because we did these two things with 1686 01:47:01,360 --> 01:47:05,840 Speaker 1: like barely that's good enough, right, And it's like, no, Disney, 1687 01:47:06,000 --> 01:47:10,040 Speaker 1: it's not. It isn't it distant And it's not like 1688 01:47:10,240 --> 01:47:15,200 Speaker 1: there couldn't be a gay character meaningfully included in this story. 1689 01:47:15,439 --> 01:47:18,600 Speaker 1: There's like it's a broad enough story that there's a 1690 01:47:18,680 --> 01:47:23,160 Speaker 1: room to do that, like, but but they just didn't. 1691 01:47:23,320 --> 01:47:25,439 Speaker 1: So they just I mean, and that's I mean, I 1692 01:47:25,439 --> 01:47:28,200 Speaker 1: guess I'm just kind of like done expecting them at 1693 01:47:28,240 --> 01:47:32,000 Speaker 1: Disney adaptation, especially at Disney adaptation of a Disney adaptation, right, 1694 01:47:32,520 --> 01:47:38,639 Speaker 1: is going to do anything um super meaningful sometimes they do. 1695 01:47:39,479 --> 01:47:41,240 Speaker 1: Most of the time they don't. I don't go and 1696 01:47:41,360 --> 01:47:44,400 Speaker 1: expecting them that they will. That said, though, I would 1697 01:47:44,400 --> 01:47:48,040 Speaker 1: say that this ninety one version is is a good 1698 01:47:48,040 --> 01:47:53,479 Speaker 1: example of being a stepping stone movie almost that allows 1699 01:47:53,560 --> 01:47:58,640 Speaker 1: us to track specifically like disney Fairytale animated movie progress, 1700 01:47:59,080 --> 01:48:03,880 Speaker 1: where like Beauty and the Beast is more feminist than say, 1701 01:48:04,080 --> 01:48:08,760 Speaker 1: snow White, which came out several decades before Beauty and 1702 01:48:08,800 --> 01:48:12,599 Speaker 1: the Beast, but it is also like less feminist than 1703 01:48:13,439 --> 01:48:17,479 Speaker 1: something like Moana, which came out years after ninety one 1704 01:48:17,479 --> 01:48:20,120 Speaker 1: Beauty and the Beast, And even Moanna has things in 1705 01:48:20,160 --> 01:48:22,600 Speaker 1: it now that it's like, you know, I don't know 1706 01:48:22,640 --> 01:48:25,639 Speaker 1: if I would give Moanna five nipples if we covered 1707 01:48:25,640 --> 01:48:27,519 Speaker 1: it now instead of four years ago. I feel like 1708 01:48:27,560 --> 01:48:33,759 Speaker 1: it's with Dinny, It's always going to be a commerce 1709 01:48:33,800 --> 01:48:37,519 Speaker 1: game in a way that it is, like, even though 1710 01:48:37,520 --> 01:48:40,320 Speaker 1: it's sometimes frustrating to consume, I feel like it's an 1711 01:48:40,400 --> 01:48:44,280 Speaker 1: interesting historical yardstick because Disney is never not going to 1712 01:48:44,439 --> 01:48:47,240 Speaker 1: do what's going to make them like. They're always going 1713 01:48:47,320 --> 01:48:49,400 Speaker 1: to do what's going to make them the most money, 1714 01:48:49,439 --> 01:48:52,880 Speaker 1: and they're going to play to whatever they need to 1715 01:48:52,880 --> 01:48:55,160 Speaker 1: to cast the widest that they can to get the 1716 01:48:55,200 --> 01:48:57,880 Speaker 1: most people's money that they can, and so any movie 1717 01:48:57,920 --> 01:49:02,760 Speaker 1: that comes out is going to reflect that, and so 1718 01:49:03,120 --> 01:49:07,559 Speaker 1: they so become products of their time. And so it's like, 1719 01:49:08,400 --> 01:49:12,880 Speaker 1: you know, snow White is reflecting nineteen thirty or ninety 1720 01:49:12,960 --> 01:49:18,320 Speaker 1: seven values. You need the beasts reflecting values in the 1721 01:49:18,360 --> 01:49:23,320 Speaker 1: most commercial sense. Moanna is going to reflect values and 1722 01:49:23,360 --> 01:49:26,160 Speaker 1: the most commercial sense possible. They're never not going to 1723 01:49:26,280 --> 01:49:28,840 Speaker 1: do what's not going to make them the most billions 1724 01:49:28,880 --> 01:49:33,840 Speaker 1: of dollars. And then and it just sometimes it's going 1725 01:49:33,880 --> 01:49:36,800 Speaker 1: to be done in a good faith, beautiful artistic way, 1726 01:49:36,960 --> 01:49:39,479 Speaker 1: as I feel like it is in the movie at 1727 01:49:39,479 --> 01:49:43,800 Speaker 1: many times, at many moments. And then you're just going 1728 01:49:43,840 --> 01:49:50,240 Speaker 1: to get some real farts and boy, it's been two hours. 1729 01:49:50,320 --> 01:50:02,559 Speaker 1: Let's d do do do do do um? What would 1730 01:50:02,600 --> 01:50:06,720 Speaker 1: you rate this on our nipple scale, our scale of 1731 01:50:07,120 --> 01:50:10,639 Speaker 1: zero to five nipples based on how the movie fares 1732 01:50:10,720 --> 01:50:15,519 Speaker 1: looking at it from an intersectional feminist lens, um, I 1733 01:50:15,600 --> 01:50:20,519 Speaker 1: don't know one or one and a half. Yeah, I 1734 01:50:20,520 --> 01:50:22,639 Speaker 1: guess maybe maybe one. I mean I guess I would 1735 01:50:22,640 --> 01:50:26,000 Speaker 1: say it's weird because it's like I still I'm trying 1736 01:50:26,000 --> 01:50:30,479 Speaker 1: not to come in with a nostalgia opinion here. I 1737 01:50:30,479 --> 01:50:33,720 Speaker 1: guess I'll go one and half. I think that the 1738 01:50:33,920 --> 01:50:38,560 Speaker 1: issues with this movie are very much rooted in adaptation. 1739 01:50:38,960 --> 01:50:42,920 Speaker 1: I like Bell. I'm rooting for Bell. I think she 1740 01:50:43,120 --> 01:50:46,800 Speaker 1: is a very strongly motivated character whose agency is kind 1741 01:50:46,800 --> 01:50:48,880 Speaker 1: of pulled back and back and back as the movie 1742 01:50:48,920 --> 01:50:51,960 Speaker 1: goes on, and I want more for her. But it's like, 1743 01:50:52,280 --> 01:50:55,880 Speaker 1: I don't know, I feel like this Bell in particular. 1744 01:50:56,000 --> 01:50:59,960 Speaker 1: It's like people really clung to her for a reason, 1745 01:51:00,000 --> 01:51:03,560 Speaker 1: and which is that she like expressed such a universal 1746 01:51:03,600 --> 01:51:08,040 Speaker 1: sentiment of like wanting more in the world, And um, 1747 01:51:08,080 --> 01:51:10,320 Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, I guess I'm I'm kind of 1748 01:51:10,360 --> 01:51:12,240 Speaker 1: stuck on a one and a half. Where are you at? 1749 01:51:12,520 --> 01:51:15,360 Speaker 1: I'm prepared to give it even a little higher. I 1750 01:51:15,400 --> 01:51:19,479 Speaker 1: was going to come in with a two. Nice even 1751 01:51:19,560 --> 01:51:22,960 Speaker 1: if you know, does the movie deserve it? I'm not 1752 01:51:23,040 --> 01:51:28,080 Speaker 1: sure does the Beast deserve to be forgiven by bellserve 1753 01:51:28,479 --> 01:51:31,679 Speaker 1: Bell's I just I want, I like I just I'm 1754 01:51:31,720 --> 01:51:34,880 Speaker 1: always rooting about Also, I think it's worth mentioning that 1755 01:51:34,920 --> 01:51:38,000 Speaker 1: Bell is kind of the first Disney princess who is 1756 01:51:38,040 --> 01:51:42,400 Speaker 1: like definitively an adult, which is kind of nice. There's 1757 01:51:42,960 --> 01:51:45,280 Speaker 1: that that was like a discussion that comes up in 1758 01:51:45,880 --> 01:51:49,519 Speaker 1: Disney princess discourse as well. It's like, for the most part, um, 1759 01:51:49,640 --> 01:51:54,240 Speaker 1: Disney princesses are teenagers. Um it is. I don't know 1760 01:51:54,280 --> 01:51:56,160 Speaker 1: if it's ever explicitly stated in the movie, but I 1761 01:51:56,200 --> 01:52:02,040 Speaker 1: guess canonically Bell is an adult woman, which I feel 1762 01:52:02,080 --> 01:52:06,240 Speaker 1: it gives good. Yes, that is good, um to not 1763 01:52:06,280 --> 01:52:09,320 Speaker 1: be releasing movies where teenagers are getting married off in 1764 01:52:11,120 --> 01:52:14,479 Speaker 1: century that seems generally positive. So I appreciate that she 1765 01:52:14,600 --> 01:52:19,360 Speaker 1: is an adult woman making decisions in an impossible world. 1766 01:52:19,400 --> 01:52:22,439 Speaker 1: I just yeah, I guess I'll go one and a 1767 01:52:22,439 --> 01:52:25,479 Speaker 1: half this time. But I just I love her. I 1768 01:52:25,600 --> 01:52:28,840 Speaker 1: want more for her. I wish that this movie was 1769 01:52:29,680 --> 01:52:32,240 Speaker 1: couldn't make up its mind of where it wants to be. 1770 01:52:32,360 --> 01:52:35,120 Speaker 1: Like I like a lot of the I don't know, 1771 01:52:35,200 --> 01:52:40,000 Speaker 1: it just it clashes so much the the beauty binary 1772 01:52:40,120 --> 01:52:44,840 Speaker 1: rigidity comes. It doesn't hold up in certainly not in 1773 01:52:44,840 --> 01:52:48,920 Speaker 1: a feature length twentieth century format. Um. It made me 1774 01:52:48,960 --> 01:52:54,000 Speaker 1: miss Shrek. So take from that what you will. Um. 1775 01:52:54,200 --> 01:52:58,080 Speaker 1: And I was like thinking about Shrek so much. Um, 1776 01:52:58,200 --> 01:53:02,599 Speaker 1: And well, I mean we must ever forget Shreck, right, 1777 01:53:02,800 --> 01:53:05,320 Speaker 1: It's well, we will never forget Shrek. We're always thinking 1778 01:53:05,320 --> 01:53:09,240 Speaker 1: about where's the T shirt? Never forget Shrek. There's it's 1779 01:53:09,240 --> 01:53:11,479 Speaker 1: got to be we have, you know, I'm saying, are 1780 01:53:11,840 --> 01:53:13,720 Speaker 1: we have? You have to make it? You have to 1781 01:53:13,760 --> 01:53:16,120 Speaker 1: make it. Oh my god, what I'm saying. I've done 1782 01:53:16,200 --> 01:53:20,000 Speaker 1: enough Shrek. I've done enough Shrek art in this lifetime. Um. 1783 01:53:20,080 --> 01:53:23,680 Speaker 1: But yeah, I I guess. I it's almost frustrating that 1784 01:53:23,720 --> 01:53:27,240 Speaker 1: we have kind of a Rarety and Disney cannon where 1785 01:53:27,320 --> 01:53:32,600 Speaker 1: we have a strong, lee motivated female character who is 1786 01:53:32,760 --> 01:53:35,760 Speaker 1: intelligent and knows her values at the core of the story. 1787 01:53:35,920 --> 01:53:38,000 Speaker 1: We're normally we kind of don't have that. We kind 1788 01:53:38,000 --> 01:53:41,160 Speaker 1: of have like a young woman who has an idea 1789 01:53:41,160 --> 01:53:44,320 Speaker 1: of what she wants, but like it's it's usually connected 1790 01:53:44,320 --> 01:53:46,559 Speaker 1: to romantic love. That's not bellt goal. She has goals 1791 01:53:46,600 --> 01:53:49,320 Speaker 1: beyond that. But then she gets the same endgame as 1792 01:53:49,360 --> 01:53:51,160 Speaker 1: anyone else would. So I feel like she's just kind 1793 01:53:51,160 --> 01:53:53,800 Speaker 1: of cheated out of the ending that you would want 1794 01:53:53,880 --> 01:53:57,840 Speaker 1: for her. I love her, And this movie is so 1795 01:53:58,880 --> 01:54:04,000 Speaker 1: beautiful and iconic in its way, you know, shout out 1796 01:54:04,200 --> 01:54:10,519 Speaker 1: to absolute legend Howard Ashman Forever. Yeah, I guess And 1797 01:54:10,520 --> 01:54:14,360 Speaker 1: and then but but it's like the dynamics of the 1798 01:54:14,880 --> 01:54:17,720 Speaker 1: Bell Beast relationship are never gonna sit well with me. 1799 01:54:18,160 --> 01:54:20,720 Speaker 1: I am all for a story about forgiveness. I think 1800 01:54:20,720 --> 01:54:23,600 Speaker 1: that that, especially now, could be like a really impactful 1801 01:54:24,600 --> 01:54:26,760 Speaker 1: narrative to present, But this just kind of isn't the 1802 01:54:26,800 --> 01:54:29,000 Speaker 1: one where you feel like someone has really earned it 1803 01:54:29,000 --> 01:54:34,000 Speaker 1: by the end of the story. Yes, so yeah, yeah, yeah, 1804 01:54:34,600 --> 01:54:40,200 Speaker 1: one and a half. Oh go everything you said, And 1805 01:54:40,440 --> 01:54:43,120 Speaker 1: that as much as I like Bell, I wish she 1806 01:54:43,200 --> 01:54:47,320 Speaker 1: had been characterized a little bit differently, just in that 1807 01:54:47,560 --> 01:54:51,160 Speaker 1: she could have been given an area of growth or 1808 01:54:51,240 --> 01:54:53,560 Speaker 1: like potential growth that we I would have liked to 1809 01:54:53,600 --> 01:54:57,160 Speaker 1: have seen, so that it's there's not so much of 1810 01:54:57,200 --> 01:55:02,080 Speaker 1: a burden on her to just like except mediocrity all 1811 01:55:02,120 --> 01:55:06,480 Speaker 1: around her and like not even me, like verbal abuse 1812 01:55:06,760 --> 01:55:11,600 Speaker 1: and like the beast throwing furniture around all like she 1813 01:55:11,720 --> 01:55:15,400 Speaker 1: just tolerates so much. And I like you said that 1814 01:55:15,400 --> 01:55:21,560 Speaker 1: that dynamic even if he stops being abusive, like that's 1815 01:55:21,600 --> 01:55:27,080 Speaker 1: not enough to warrant a romance, a like loving relationship, right, 1816 01:55:27,200 --> 01:55:30,080 Speaker 1: there's even a way to like if they need that, 1817 01:55:31,240 --> 01:55:33,640 Speaker 1: I don't know, like even if they need Belle and 1818 01:55:33,680 --> 01:55:35,760 Speaker 1: the Beast to end up together at the end, there's 1819 01:55:35,800 --> 01:55:38,160 Speaker 1: a way to say, like and now they're on a 1820 01:55:38,200 --> 01:55:41,760 Speaker 1: path towards forgiveness, versus like and now I am married 1821 01:55:41,800 --> 01:55:43,680 Speaker 1: to you, and we are married today and I love 1822 01:55:43,680 --> 01:55:47,360 Speaker 1: you forever. Like there's a there if they're going with 1823 01:55:47,440 --> 01:55:51,000 Speaker 1: these nineties values, maybe you know, ended by having it 1824 01:55:51,000 --> 01:55:53,840 Speaker 1: seemed like and things might actually work out here. I 1825 01:55:53,840 --> 01:55:55,560 Speaker 1: guess we'll see she's gonna because I feel like it's 1826 01:55:55,560 --> 01:55:58,720 Speaker 1: it's a satisfying enough arc to have her give him 1827 01:55:58,760 --> 01:56:02,800 Speaker 1: a second chance. Period. He hasn't even really earned a 1828 01:56:02,840 --> 01:56:06,560 Speaker 1: second chance, much less eternal love, you know, but it's 1829 01:56:06,600 --> 01:56:09,320 Speaker 1: like a second chance would at least be a more 1830 01:56:09,520 --> 01:56:14,760 Speaker 1: palatable end game than right, especially like it's the whole 1831 01:56:15,360 --> 01:56:17,480 Speaker 1: you know, the fairy tale. Like it's like, well, what 1832 01:56:17,520 --> 01:56:19,200 Speaker 1: do you expect. It's a fairy tale. This is how 1833 01:56:19,240 --> 01:56:21,160 Speaker 1: fairy tales are you you fall in love and you 1834 01:56:21,200 --> 01:56:23,440 Speaker 1: live happily ever after, and you don't have to see 1835 01:56:23,480 --> 01:56:26,040 Speaker 1: that they're compatible. They're just they're near each other, so 1836 01:56:26,120 --> 01:56:28,720 Speaker 1: they're in love. But it's like, well, yeah, but when 1837 01:56:28,760 --> 01:56:32,000 Speaker 1: you're adapting a fairy tale in the late twentieth century 1838 01:56:32,520 --> 01:56:36,680 Speaker 1: and then again in the early twenty one century, like 1839 01:56:36,880 --> 01:56:41,720 Speaker 1: our cultural values have progressed a little bit beyond you know, uh, 1840 01:56:41,880 --> 01:56:46,120 Speaker 1: fairy tale values. So it can't have it. You just 1841 01:56:46,200 --> 01:56:49,520 Speaker 1: can't have it always. But they're never going to stop. 1842 01:56:49,680 --> 01:56:51,160 Speaker 1: But again, it's like I guess they can't because they 1843 01:56:51,160 --> 01:56:54,240 Speaker 1: have a billion dollars show that they showed us in 1844 01:56:54,320 --> 01:56:58,080 Speaker 1: another I bet in another like thirty years, they're going 1845 01:56:58,120 --> 01:57:01,040 Speaker 1: to re adapt it, and it's just gonna be a 1846 01:57:01,280 --> 01:57:06,880 Speaker 1: cycle of shitty adaptation after shifty adaptation. I do love 1847 01:57:06,880 --> 01:57:09,400 Speaker 1: this movie, Um, I know I love it, So I 1848 01:57:09,520 --> 01:57:12,400 Speaker 1: like the nine one one in spite of all the 1849 01:57:12,400 --> 01:57:14,120 Speaker 1: flaws we've been talking about for two hours, is a 1850 01:57:14,120 --> 01:57:18,080 Speaker 1: perfect movie. So I don't make the rules. Just is 1851 01:57:18,120 --> 01:57:21,760 Speaker 1: what it is. Yeah, I'll stick with my too, even 1852 01:57:21,800 --> 01:57:24,960 Speaker 1: though I think I'm being a little too generous. Two nips, 1853 01:57:25,240 --> 01:57:27,360 Speaker 1: I love it. I'm giving them. I'm giving them to 1854 01:57:27,520 --> 01:57:30,600 Speaker 1: I'm giving one to Bell. I'm giving want half a 1855 01:57:30,680 --> 01:57:33,520 Speaker 1: nip to one of those hungry wolves. So we're trying 1856 01:57:33,560 --> 01:57:36,480 Speaker 1: to just fed those wolves and feed that wolf. Happen nipple. 1857 01:57:38,480 --> 01:57:42,560 Speaker 1: I'm gonna give both of my nipples to Stanley Tucci 1858 01:57:42,840 --> 01:57:47,360 Speaker 1: in the live action remake. I love it. There you go, Stanley, 1859 01:57:47,600 --> 01:57:51,640 Speaker 1: There you go. Family, hope you're happy. Happy now, Stanley, 1860 01:57:54,560 --> 01:57:57,200 Speaker 1: all right, well there we there you go. So we 1861 01:57:57,240 --> 01:58:00,320 Speaker 1: did it. We've reckoned with our past and fully a 1862 01:58:00,400 --> 01:58:06,200 Speaker 1: more nuanced conversation than we had. You'll never know. So yeah, 1863 01:58:06,240 --> 01:58:09,480 Speaker 1: welcome to We have a bunch of exciting episodes planned 1864 01:58:10,400 --> 01:58:13,920 Speaker 1: and thanks for being here. You can always follow us 1865 01:58:14,240 --> 01:58:17,840 Speaker 1: on line. You can follow us at batl Cast on 1866 01:58:17,880 --> 01:58:21,600 Speaker 1: Twitter or Instagram. Follow your heart can also uh. You 1867 01:58:21,680 --> 01:58:24,680 Speaker 1: can also sign up for our Patreon aka Matreon, where 1868 01:58:24,920 --> 01:58:28,240 Speaker 1: each and every month you can get two additional bonus 1869 01:58:28,280 --> 01:58:31,960 Speaker 1: episodes for a mere five additional dollars out of your life. 1870 01:58:32,480 --> 01:58:35,560 Speaker 1: And you can check out our merch store at t 1871 01:58:35,760 --> 01:58:39,160 Speaker 1: public dot com slash the effectel Cast, where you know 1872 01:58:39,560 --> 01:58:44,160 Speaker 1: there is a noticeable absence of Shrek merch, but Wow 1873 01:58:44,600 --> 01:58:48,960 Speaker 1: literally bullied into making Shrek merch. You're gonna regret. You're 1874 01:58:48,960 --> 01:58:51,640 Speaker 1: gonna rue the day that I post my Shrek lingerie 1875 01:58:51,680 --> 01:58:57,640 Speaker 1: to our Instagram without warning. I very talk. I won't 1876 01:58:58,040 --> 01:59:02,520 Speaker 1: the day I will. You will rule the day. I 1877 01:59:02,680 --> 01:59:06,960 Speaker 1: love it? Um anyway, Yeah, you can find us there, 1878 01:59:07,240 --> 01:59:10,560 Speaker 1: and you know what, give us a little rate and 1879 01:59:10,600 --> 01:59:15,040 Speaker 1: review on iTunes. Why don't you? Hey, hey, couldn't hurt. 1880 01:59:14,640 --> 01:59:18,080 Speaker 1: Could It won't hurt you a bit. It won't hurt, 1881 01:59:18,080 --> 01:59:22,360 Speaker 1: It'll make you feel good. And um on that note, 1882 01:59:23,440 --> 01:59:29,560 Speaker 1: do do do do do Do Do Do Do Do Do 1883 01:59:29,560 --> 01:59:34,800 Speaker 1: do do do do by do by bye,