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Speaker 1: Welcome to Money Making Conversation. I am your host, Rushan McDonald.

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Speaker 1: I recognize that we all have different definitions of success.

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Speaker 1: For some, it's a sizeable paycheck. Mine is helping people

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Speaker 1: wake up and inspiring them to accomplish their goals and

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Speaker 1: live their very best life. These are my passions and

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Speaker 1: that's what I'm going to do for you. Please keep

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Speaker 1: listening to Money Making Conversations. I want you to stop

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Speaker 1: tripping over small challenges and prepare to rise above the

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Speaker 1: bigger obstacles that life will present to you. That's what

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Speaker 1: we do on Money Making Conversations. My next guest, and

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Speaker 1: Walker on Musa, is a black woman working in a

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Speaker 1: white man world dominated. She's a startup. I'm telling I've

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Speaker 1: done several interviews on Money Making Conversation and said you

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Speaker 1: gotta speak to and walcome. You got a big to him.

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Speaker 1: She's the next level, next level. So we're gonna find out.

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Speaker 1: She is the vice president and chief creator at the

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Speaker 1: Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Walker as a

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Speaker 1: music level, a contemporary bohemian with an old soul. I mean,

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Speaker 1: that's that's young people. You know you've ever been around

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Speaker 1: up coming room and go She teamed, but she talked

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Speaker 1: like she forty. That's that's you know, we'll talk to her.

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Speaker 1: We're talking like she like she Secily Tyson. That's what

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Speaker 1: we're actually gonna be interviewed Sicily Tyson on the show

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Speaker 1: to day. That's how soul. That's our spirited. She is

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Speaker 1: in the nameties at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame,

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Speaker 1: and Walker develops informative immersive exhibits celebrates the diversity of

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Speaker 1: musical expression during this period of civil unrest. Music has

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Speaker 1: this role, especially from a historical specter. Please welcome to

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Speaker 1: money making Conversations and Walker and Woosa Is that right? Yes,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what's Once you get past the name,

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Speaker 1: we're all good and mark up, come on the way.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I'm honored to me. This is crazy.

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Speaker 1: Just listening to the intro, I'm like, damn going up.

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Speaker 1: But I have been, like you know, and I've interviewed.

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Speaker 1: I've been fortunate and blessed with the show because I've

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Speaker 1: been doing it and interviewed a lot of great people.

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Speaker 1: And when the name starts popping up, if you didn't

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Speaker 1: be and walkome man, she on fire, that's okay, cool, okay,

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Speaker 1: But then everybody kept you know know she you know

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Speaker 1: she got that old spirit. You know she you know

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Speaker 1: she she's young when she talked like you about fitting,

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Speaker 1: you know, she tells about that old who soul and

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Speaker 1: this young body and talk about that and why people

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Speaker 1: why people are so engaged with your person. Now, I

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Speaker 1: know that's that's a lot to say, because you know,

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Speaker 1: your your spirit wasn't was designed to just talk about yourself.

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Speaker 1: But when people talk about you, you have to be

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Speaker 1: delivering something to them that made them excited and made

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Speaker 1: them respectful to make you a recommendation. That's all you

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Speaker 1: wanted life. You want people to recommend you to. That's

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Speaker 1: like a good that's like a credit reference, right, sore reference. Right.

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Speaker 1: So talk about it being the vice president chief curator,

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Speaker 1: because I'm that's a big word, curator. We're gonna get

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Speaker 1: to that word in a minute. But just tell me

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Speaker 1: what people think so much of it? Waka, oh my god.

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Speaker 1: Well I again honored um to be on this call

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Speaker 1: and to be speaking with you. Um, I you know what,

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna leave it as um. It's a guide

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Speaker 1: in me. I'm just gonna leave it as that because

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Speaker 1: I don't have the full answer for that. But UM,

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Speaker 1: I know I'm passionate about my work and I can

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Speaker 1: definitely blame that on my parents. UM, both my mom

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Speaker 1: and dad. UM hard workers, entrepreneurs, UM, very strong work ethic,

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Speaker 1: and that is what powers me. That's what feels me.

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Speaker 1: So you know, I'm all about the work and let's

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Speaker 1: just get it done. And UM having an opportunity to

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Speaker 1: curate and put out different, um, a number of different

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Speaker 1: exhibits with different varying topics. UM, you know, probably that's

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Speaker 1: what people are feeling. But definitely the passion. So I'm

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Speaker 1: sure that that's what folks are feeling. And music really

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Speaker 1: is about passion. I know that I didn't. I didn't

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Speaker 1: I couldn't read, but I knew that I knew my

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Speaker 1: mom's favorite music. That's born. You can't read, But you

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Speaker 1: know about Johnny Taylor because I knew that. I could

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Speaker 1: just see the words that they put on that. So

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Speaker 1: I didn't know that's sad, Johnny Taylor, but I knew

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Speaker 1: those are the words you put together. That was my

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Speaker 1: mom and dad's favorite music. And so because music plays

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Speaker 1: that role and it means so much to us, what

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Speaker 1: does it mean to you? Gosh, music is definitely a lifeline.

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Speaker 1: Like what you said, you don't have to speak the

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Speaker 1: same language, you don't need to read. Um. Music is

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Speaker 1: just one of those things where you know you are

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Speaker 1: you are moved the power of music. We hear these slogans, um,

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Speaker 1: and it can found cheesy at times, but to truly

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Speaker 1: feel the power of music, I'm gonna makes you cry, dance, laugh,

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Speaker 1: I want to hit somebody. I mean, you got you

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Speaker 1: got all kinds of range of emotions. But music is

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Speaker 1: just so powerful and I love that that is truly

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Speaker 1: the universal language. It really is what connects us. It

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter where you from, what walk you're walking. Um,

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Speaker 1: that's what I love about music. I mean the messages

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Speaker 1: that are in the in the music, that's what it

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Speaker 1: is inspiring to me. You know. It was really interesting that,

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Speaker 1: you know, because I look at my life, you know,

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Speaker 1: and uh uh you know, I look at how music

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Speaker 1: has played a role, and I degrees in mathematics and

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Speaker 1: I can always remember a radio's important to me. And

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Speaker 1: and then as I was touring on the road and

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Speaker 1: stand up comic are certain song who just keep me awake,

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Speaker 1: you know, uh, keep me Bruce Hornsby's at that first

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Speaker 1: album put out, Graceland by Paul Side. You know those

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Speaker 1: those songs, uh, you know, And and now I got

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Speaker 1: my Pandora and I've just got if you listen to

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Speaker 1: my Pandora, I got from Kim to Kirk Franklin to

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Speaker 1: uh to uh to uh Bruce Springsteen, you know to

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Speaker 1: you know that that to me. And then I got

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Speaker 1: you know, flow Ride of My House. You know what

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Speaker 1: I'm saying. I got, you know, I Rise, you know

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Speaker 1: a d you know what I'm saying. So and so

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Speaker 1: that's to me. When I listened to my when I

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Speaker 1: when I go through that whole realm, I got Patty

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Speaker 1: on there and and I just go and I got

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Speaker 1: I got Willie Hut Show there. You know, it's just

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Speaker 1: it's just it's just it's just it's so important. And

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Speaker 1: then when you create a curator at the Rock and

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Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame, that's like the mecca where every everybody,

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Speaker 1: every artist who's done music wants to get there, like

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Speaker 1: the Basketball Hall of Fame, like the Hall of They

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Speaker 1: want to get there, right and you want to get

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Speaker 1: MP and the creator explain that, explain that role, and

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Speaker 1: then explain if there are pressure, what is the pressure

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Speaker 1: being that person. You know, I'm still pinching myself. So

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Speaker 1: this is a recent promotion that happens for me as

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Speaker 1: a rock hall. And again, just to be a curator

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Speaker 1: to your point where Sean as you were saying, just

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Speaker 1: to even work at the Rock and Roll Hall of

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Speaker 1: Fame and um be a curator there. Really, i'man was

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Speaker 1: a dream. I didn't even know I had UM to

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Speaker 1: be quite honest, you know, So to be there, I mean,

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Speaker 1: we are running the narratives. Were as curators what curators do,

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Speaker 1: We're writing the stories. We are the storytellers. You know,

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Speaker 1: you have filmmakers who are sharing stories, you have novelists

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Speaker 1: who are sharing stories. Will curators tell that story in

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Speaker 1: the physical space, regardless of it's an art museum to

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Speaker 1: a music museum. And so I'm happy to be there

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Speaker 1: to shift um the narratives to um provide even more

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Speaker 1: inclusion about amazing UM musicians and you know, and just

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Speaker 1: to do that work. So it really is my citadel.

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Speaker 1: I watched the Game of Thrones and I just really

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Speaker 1: I'm honored, like it's my I feel like I'm a

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Speaker 1: mister in the citadel. Like it's just such an honor.

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Speaker 1: The collection UM is just beyond dope. I mean going

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Speaker 1: over jeez, over thirty thou forty thousand different artifacts collected. UM.

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Speaker 1: They're so impactful of musical history, UM, to the fabrics

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Speaker 1: of who we are. I mean there's you know, I'm

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Speaker 1: kind of going all over the place. I'm just excited

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Speaker 1: about it. But the thing about it is that no,

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Speaker 1: you're not. Because when you when you walk in and

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Speaker 1: you and Heaven, you know, it's like it's like a

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Speaker 1: no different than I'm sure when they put the African

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Speaker 1: American Museum together. There's so many likes and it's something

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Speaker 1: made you cry, some made you emotional, some made you

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Speaker 1: I can't believe this. I didn't know. And that's why

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Speaker 1: I started our conversation just talking about music in general,

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Speaker 1: because you can't have this job being a singular thought person.

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Speaker 1: You know, I just like country, I just like a rock,

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Speaker 1: I just like rap. You have to have a palette

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Speaker 1: of music. That's like I was talking about, you know,

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Speaker 1: like I said, I'm a toopod guy. You know what

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Speaker 1: I'm saying. You know, but I listened to Snoop too,

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Speaker 1: you know, I know, like I said, a great Sleight album.

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Speaker 1: You know, you can call me al. I can just

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Speaker 1: remember that video with Chevy Chase and Paul Simon like

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Speaker 1: it's playing on TV right now today. You know, you've

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Speaker 1: got to be born in the USA, you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: you got to be able to understand that's just some

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Speaker 1: of the songs, but it's even deeper than that, and

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Speaker 1: so that's what you've been. You know, a person of color.

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Speaker 1: People can question whether you should be in that position. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: you know, I will I mean a number of experiences, um,

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Speaker 1: but one of them rings out so plainly for me.

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Speaker 1: I've started my career, my curating career, UM, a museum

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Speaker 1: career for that fact, at the Grammy Museum in Los Angeles,

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Speaker 1: and UM, you know there was an exhibit specifically, I

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Speaker 1: remember it right now, what's called the Sounds of Laurel Canyon,

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Speaker 1: California Dreaming and that's you know, you're talking about Buffalo,

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Speaker 1: Springfield and Johnny Mitchell, and I mean you're hitting on

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Speaker 1: all of these really phenomenal bands, UM, predominantly white bands, UM.

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Speaker 1: And you know, doing my research knowing the photographers no

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Speaker 1: were the key players with this movement. But I remember,

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Speaker 1: I will not forget there was a writer who came

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Speaker 1: in and like, you know, number one, they were looking

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Speaker 1: for Waker. My name is kind of ambiguous, so like

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Speaker 1: who is Waka? Where is she? I remember looking for

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Speaker 1: a Japanese woman one, So that was already that was like, okay,

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Speaker 1: now I be black, um, and why not know him

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Speaker 1: as Japanese. Gotta be Japanese. That's close. So hey, we

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Speaker 1: all connected from the continent. So we're looking for a

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Speaker 1: Japanese woman, um, and they find out that I'm black,

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Speaker 1: and so the feedback was just like damn um whole

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Speaker 1: And so even to your intro, like, Waka, you've curated

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Speaker 1: this Laurel cay and exhibit and you're black. And I

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Speaker 1: was about thirty or twenty nine or something at that point. Okay,

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Speaker 1: there we go fifty and spirit and that's when that

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Speaker 1: came out, and that's how that was manifested. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's just you know, I like, I like

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Speaker 1: I like having an ambiguous name. I like if people

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Speaker 1: can't tell if I'm a male or female or you know,

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Speaker 1: like I love that. Um. Just let's the work speak

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Speaker 1: for it. Though. So they came not knowing, oh I

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Speaker 1: was a black woman. Um. They came because hey, this

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Speaker 1: is a dope topic and it's timely for that time,

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Speaker 1: you know, for that period. Um, but let's just check

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Speaker 1: it out. But yeah, yeah, let's just check it out

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Speaker 1: because this is interesting. It's really amazing when I you know,

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Speaker 1: when I say that, I find so much fun. You know,

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Speaker 1: first of all your energy and you came so you know,

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Speaker 1: so I know the people I talked to that they

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Speaker 1: have personalities and they're very opinionated people. When they say, man,

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Speaker 1: you need talk to you. She's your son. We just

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Speaker 1: we just stocked. Can we take interviewing you? I gotta

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Speaker 1: hit it all that out, okay. And so yeah, so

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Speaker 1: when when I look at when I look at her,

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Speaker 1: you said, you started the Grammy Museum. Okay, tell us

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Speaker 1: about your you know, because people want to know how

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Speaker 1: you get these gigs. You know, what did you? Can

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Speaker 1: you sing? Your your spoken word? Artist? Can you play

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Speaker 1: an instrument? You degree? When did you go to college?

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Speaker 1: Major in music or art? One of those key things

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Speaker 1: that got you in this position at the Grammy Museum

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Speaker 1: and now at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

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Speaker 1: as the vice president and curate chief. Give me chief.

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Speaker 1: She's a c c at the Rock and Roll Hall

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Speaker 1: of Fame. Just keep people just see see her. Who's that? No?

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Speaker 1: The chief creator? Okay, oh my god. Well the longest

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Speaker 1: short um is essentially I just will say it is

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Speaker 1: my title. Thing is just definitely out of your comfort zone. Um.

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Speaker 1: I had no idea. Again, I'm a daughter of an

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Speaker 1: immigrant mother from the South, like I had no idea

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Speaker 1: of what a curator was. So that was not my

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Speaker 1: initial aspiration. Nor did I truly understand the the impact

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Speaker 1: of museum. Um. You know, at a younger age for

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Speaker 1: someone to say, hey, you know, I'm going in as

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Speaker 1: a back you know, as an undergrad with museum studies,

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Speaker 1: it was not. That was not me um. So again

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Speaker 1: my passion just for music in general, not having access

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Speaker 1: to it because I grew up in a very Pentecostal

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Speaker 1: home where we were only listening to gospel music. I

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Speaker 1: mean maybe some maybe some James Brown, you know, some obviously,

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Speaker 1: some Supremes, a lot of motown um in general. So

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Speaker 1: I was able to at least be introduced to these

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Speaker 1: foundational musicians in our music. Come on, you know my dad,

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Speaker 1: look cut my dad. Being Nigerian, we got to Bob

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Speaker 1: Marley of course and say line all of these you know, yeah,

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Speaker 1: because we're gonna do it like a name that tune

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Speaker 1: in a minute. You know what I'm saying, I might hurt,

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Speaker 1: You might get yourself hurt. Don't don't hurt read um.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I'm just truly stepping out of my

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Speaker 1: comfort zone. Is how I got started at the Grammy Museum,

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Speaker 1: from you know, stepping up to volunteering myself to curate

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Speaker 1: my first exhibit, which is called hip Hop a Cultural Odyssey,

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Speaker 1: and just to really launch out and reach and connect

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Speaker 1: different artists and uh managers and public that this is

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Speaker 1: a whole business. When you're working in a music museum,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting because you know, your foot is in the

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Speaker 1: music industry to an extent, in your foot is in

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Speaker 1: the museum world. Um so. So I love that that

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Speaker 1: makes things so interesting. Um So to grow in that

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Speaker 1: and just learn and working with such a prominent organization

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Speaker 1: like they're Recording Academy. Um definitely. You know now looking

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Speaker 1: at it, I mean because I did write this script, um,

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Speaker 1: but looking at it now, to be at the Rocket

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Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame is such an honorable um progression

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Speaker 1: in my career and I'm just look, I started out

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Speaker 1: in the box topice, working part time okay, um, I okay,

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Speaker 1: so that's the real you know, the real deal. And

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Speaker 1: I was like, damn, okay, so I can. I can

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Speaker 1: do this and love music as much as I do.

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Speaker 1: Like so yes, I do think play a mean old tambourine.

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Speaker 1: Don't have any come on you on your show and

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Speaker 1: do that. You have to ruing me onside that ass, right,

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Speaker 1: But you know, starting out just taking chances. I I

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Speaker 1: had no idea what the Grammy Museum had to offer,

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Speaker 1: but again put it in the work, starting from the bottom,

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Speaker 1: hustling and growing and seeing how how the institution works,

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Speaker 1: how it's built, UM, and seeing that from the doors. UM,

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Speaker 1: I think I had the best of you in that

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Speaker 1: institution from um from being a ticket takers so that

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Speaker 1: was really interesting. Like I had the ticketmaster background and

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Speaker 1: knew how to build shows and all of that. So

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Speaker 1: again just utilizing all of my talents, then my passion

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Speaker 1: for the music, passion for education, UM, all of those

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Speaker 1: things were able to be UM used in one place.

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Speaker 1: And that's why I was like, Wow, this is this

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Speaker 1: is the thing, this is it for me. All of

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Speaker 1: the other ideas that I thought I had for myself,

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Speaker 1: UM kind of went up the window. You know, I

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Speaker 1: wanted to be an attorney. I wanted to be an

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Speaker 1: entertainment lawyer. And I'm like, I still get to deal

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Speaker 1: with um lawyers and attorneys all the time, with the

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Speaker 1: states and dealing with contracts. So I get to you know,

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Speaker 1: scratch that itch, you know. UM. The music part again,

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Speaker 1: that's daily. UM. But there's just so much that I

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Speaker 1: get to do in this role, and I'm honored and

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Speaker 1: really in the education component of it, was excited to

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Speaker 1: share my path and my journey with youth to know that,

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Speaker 1: you know, you don't have to know everything, you don't

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Speaker 1: know need to know what you want to be leaving college,

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Speaker 1: leaving right out of high school or whatever it is,

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Speaker 1: and especially in today's climate, but to know that you

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Speaker 1: can find a career in a museum or um. You know,

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Speaker 1: in these odd odd places, in these unique jobs. There's

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Speaker 1: there's work to be done. And now with COVID, we're

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Speaker 1: learning that there's so much to be done. UM, we're

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Speaker 1: just evolving the way we create at this point. So UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's really amazing. UM when our when our

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Speaker 1: interview people are I look at my life, you know,

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Speaker 1: because it starts someplace why these people forces need to

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Speaker 1: be heard. And my minor in college, my degree is

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Speaker 1: in mathematics. My mind was in sociology, sociology, and I

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Speaker 1: always tell people that sociology changed my life, you know,

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Speaker 1: because of the fact that it made me realize what

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Speaker 1: why we're all fighting right now, that so much was

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Speaker 1: denied educationally in my high school, real my middle school

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Speaker 1: with they just stopped, you know, they know when they

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Speaker 1: brought us over his slave, they freed us and then

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Speaker 1: he swung forward to Brown versus a board of education.

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Speaker 1: Then they went to mar Luther King. He got assassinated.

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Speaker 1: That was it. That was our black history. And that's

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Speaker 1: how that was our black participation in this country according

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Speaker 1: to the people who allowed that information to y'all because

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Speaker 1: they didn't want to let anybody know how we were mistreated.

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Speaker 1: Like and that's what the that's why I respect about

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Speaker 1: the Jewish community. They got their story, told the Jewish people,

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Speaker 1: they're telling their story that they letting everybody know what

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Speaker 1: the Germans did. And with the Holocaust world, don't you

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Speaker 1: don't you try to bask this. Y'all did this to us.

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Speaker 1: And so when it's happening with the blacks in America.

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Speaker 1: And when you when I took this tote, it brought

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Speaker 1: me the tears. I realized I didn't know. I didn't

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Speaker 1: know because nobody allowed that information to be shared with me.

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Speaker 1: So whenever I meet a fellow sociology major minor person,

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Speaker 1: it's a certain because guess what, you know what I know.

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Speaker 1: You know the pain that I'm talking about, you know

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Speaker 1: the anger. Then I'm talking about the disappointment I have

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Speaker 1: to say in the American educational system denying information. Come

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Speaker 1: on now, and that's true. And then and then when

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Speaker 1: you look at it too, I'm like, the role that

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Speaker 1: we play and what we do in society is really

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Speaker 1: to just be truth tellers, to really break the truth

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Speaker 1: and whatever it is I mean, I mean, it's the

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Speaker 1: most quote to be, to be a reflection of the times.

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Speaker 1: And that's why I love you. And we can break it.

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Speaker 1: Let's do it. You can't have the wine with it,

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Speaker 1: but you know, and and it's and it's so true.

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Speaker 1: I mean, whatever your career path is, be be an

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Speaker 1: activist in that. And that's where I's like, hey, we

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Speaker 1: can change the narrator. We can share stories that have

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Speaker 1: never been told, or highlight musicians whose stories aren't out there,

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Speaker 1: the Laverne Bakers of the world. I mean, let's share

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Speaker 1: those stories, let's talk about those stories. And to be

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Speaker 1: able to do that, like you're doing through your show,

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Speaker 1: to do that in a museum like the Rock and

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Speaker 1: Roll Hall of Fame or the Grammy Museum or whoever,

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Speaker 1: the Smithsonian, it's an honor to write that history that

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Speaker 1: people can then go back and have another and a

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Speaker 1: fresh perspective based on something that you were able to

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Speaker 1: to introduce. I think that's powerful. Well, talking to you

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Speaker 1: is powerful. We're talking to you. Know why why I

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Speaker 1: started this show. Every interview I go, I get more relaxed,

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Speaker 1: I get more honest about because you know, started an idea.

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Speaker 1: Everything starts with that idea. You don't know if people

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Speaker 1: are buying too and people and you know, I remember

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Speaker 1: I first started the show. You know, I didn't know

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Speaker 1: if they was calling me because they know I knew

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Speaker 1: famous people like Steve Harvey. I was managing them, or

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Speaker 1: the calling because Rushan McDonald. They wanted to hear if

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Speaker 1: they want to buy into what I was trying to say.

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Speaker 1: And so now there's changed that people are understanding my

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Speaker 1: message is about them. You know, you're the star, you know,

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Speaker 1: but you know, but it's a start in different lane

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Speaker 1: because everybody used to stars and on television and the

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Speaker 1: favor But the stars of the entrepreneurs stars are the

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Speaker 1: people of the machines, the people who we call the movies,

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Speaker 1: and the shakers of this business who sometimes imply private planes,

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Speaker 1: and the people who you consider the star still on

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Speaker 1: first class, you know. And that's how businesses. And I'm

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Speaker 1: talking to Reset to Stay, I'm talking to the vice

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Speaker 1: president and chief Career Curator I call u c C

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Speaker 1: at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Cleveland.

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Speaker 1: You know, see, I will just tell you all this.

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Speaker 1: I'm just catching that on the on the on the

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Speaker 1: on the ride, on the ride, because you know, she

385
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Speaker 1: was just she was. Cleveland just did a big spread

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Speaker 1: on her a few days ago. She said, yes, you're right.

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Speaker 1: How you know all that stuff? How you know that?

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Speaker 1: Because Sai, I know we can see you all. I'm

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Speaker 1: not the pertinent proclaiming you as the next big star

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Speaker 1: in this, in this, in this what when I say

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Speaker 1: a perfect time. She's black, she's beautiful, she's informative, she

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Speaker 1: has a resume. You know, I always hear people you

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Speaker 1: know the next step is president, face President. You're not

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Speaker 1: down there, you know, You're not down there selling tickets

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Speaker 1: no more, you know what I'm saying. And I like

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Speaker 1: her because she got two titles. You know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 1: She walked around just cause she get bored of being

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Speaker 1: the VP. Can just be a chief creator? Right? Que

399
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Speaker 1: what you doing over here? Chief creators in the room.

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Speaker 1: So so let's let's tell everybody what her chief creator.

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Speaker 1: It's not something some some contraption in your kitchen to

402
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Speaker 1: make break. Okay, it's not a blender if you get

403
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 1: buy on late night TV. Okay, what is a It's

404
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Speaker 1: not a vita mix? Uh juicer? What is the chief creator?

405
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Speaker 1: Oh my god? Yes? But essentially, the website dictionary term

406
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Speaker 1: for curator is truly just the keeper of the collection

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Speaker 1: or the custodian of the museum. So I'm overseeing the

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Speaker 1: entire territorial Affairs division. And so that's from our library

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Speaker 1: and archives UM into our collections, into our curators and preparators,

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Speaker 1: and I mean it's a it's a team that makes

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Speaker 1: all of this move and work. So UM I advantaging

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Speaker 1: that team, overseer of that UM and making sure that

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Speaker 1: you know the narratives and the stories the artifacts that

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Speaker 1: we collect UM are relevant, are powerful UM and are

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Speaker 1: making sure that we're keeping the museum UM moving forward,

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Speaker 1: keeping the community moving forward, keeping our perspectives moving forward.

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Speaker 1: So I'm again honored to be in the role, like

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Speaker 1: to be a gatekeeper, even it's just an honor. So

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Speaker 1: so yeah, that's that's my job as chief curators. How

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Speaker 1: I would would it now that even came down You

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Speaker 1: got me cackling over here. I need for water like water. Okay, Uh,

422
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:27,719
Speaker 1: your latest exhibit has been said all alone has been

423
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:31,200
Speaker 1: said along with voices of rage, hope, and empowerment. Share

424
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:33,879
Speaker 1: with us you know what that is about and what

425
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:36,560
Speaker 1: it's important because when when we we we started out

426
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,080
Speaker 1: talking about the importance of music, and and you was

427
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,719
Speaker 1: like you said, walking in, how do you get the information?

428
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,360
Speaker 1: How do you how does information come to you? Our

429
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 1: records come to you, or guitars coming to you or

430
00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,160
Speaker 1: jackets coming to you. Because all this is a part

431
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 1: of the process of what should be in the in

432
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:55,480
Speaker 1: the museum and why it's important to put in the

433
00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 1: museum because aren't you kind of like limited on your

434
00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:01,880
Speaker 1: space because the building is a in size and then

435
00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 1: what do I what I put it? I just put

436
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 1: it on video. Now how do you continue to grow

437
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:13,879
Speaker 1: your brand? Right? UM, you're completely like thousand percent correct

438
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: that we have a finite space of what we can

439
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 1: you know, exhibit in the museum, UM, a finite number

440
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: of galleries in the museum and a growing collection, which

441
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: is absolutely beautiful to have a you know, a solid

442
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,200
Speaker 1: permanent collection that can help to tell tell a story

443
00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 1: like it's been set all along. UM. I was really

444
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: grateful to be able to just pull artifacts from our

445
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 1: collection that have either never been on display before UM

446
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:48,720
Speaker 1: or to you know, go out and look for a

447
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 1: new artifacts to help UM further the conversation with newer

448
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:56,360
Speaker 1: artists who are making music now and who are are

449
00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:00,680
Speaker 1: new UM cooners and culture shifters of today, UM, and

450
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:04,000
Speaker 1: to continue to tell that story. So, you know, in

451
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: this world, in this pope, curating through COVID, as I

452
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: call it UM, which is something that we're all doing.

453
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 1: UM is recurating how we reach people. So to do

454
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:19,879
Speaker 1: things virtually now virtual exhibits, you know, was something that

455
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 1: museums played with, but it's now something that we're having

456
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 1: to rely more heavily on just because you know, tourism

457
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: is down. Museums are closed UM permanently or you know, temporarily.

458
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:35,520
Speaker 1: So we have to find new ways of reaching our audience.

459
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: So to go beyond the gallery space, to go beyond

460
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:42,400
Speaker 1: ten thousand square feet or seven thousand square feet UM

461
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 1: and make it virtual where the globe can see the

462
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 1: work and and learn from it and be inspired and

463
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: moved by it. That's really powerful. So we are shipped

464
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 1: into a more digital UM experience that we create for

465
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:59,760
Speaker 1: our visitors. UM. But you did ask me about It's

466
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 1: been said all along voices of rage, hope and empowerment,

467
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,720
Speaker 1: and that really was birth out of I'm calling it

468
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,639
Speaker 1: is our civil rights of this new millennium, you know,

469
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: with the civil rights movement of UM, where you know,

470
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 1: the killing the murders of of you know, black bodies.

471
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 1: Let's just call it what is UM, you know, the

472
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 1: murders of black bodies. The musicians who have risen to

473
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:26,720
Speaker 1: the occasion to lend their voice and put their bodies

474
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 1: on the line UM musically, UM, putting their careers on

475
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,960
Speaker 1: the line by speaking up and speaking out during such

476
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 1: a critical time UM, and to continue to pass on

477
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: those messages and narratives that inspired this new generation because

478
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,920
Speaker 1: when you look at it historically, in every war, going

479
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,679
Speaker 1: back to the Civil Wars, revolutionary, the musicians, the bands

480
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: always went out first. Those trumpets and those horns were

481
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,399
Speaker 1: facing the soldiers, those people who are on the front line.

482
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:58,639
Speaker 1: The music was always a part of the narrative. It

483
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 1: is a part of our cultural shifts, like every revolution

484
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:05,919
Speaker 1: has a soundtrack. So from Martin Luther King having marching

485
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: arm and are with Navid Staples or the Staples singers

486
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 1: or you know, either Caves being in the mix or

487
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 1: whoever I mean from the music is gag wonder come on,

488
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: I mean, the whole thing. Um music has always played

489
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: a curst So to anyone who I say, who wants

490
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,200
Speaker 1: to diminish that, um, you gotta be blind and disillusions.

491
00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 1: I mean. So that's why this exhibit is called It's

492
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:39,560
Speaker 1: been Dead all along, highlighting black voices who have been

493
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 1: speaking out about injustice and inequality and for equal rights.

494
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,479
Speaker 1: One of the things that I love about managing our

495
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 1: collection and being so new to Cleveland into the Rock Hall,

496
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 1: is that I'm discovering things maybe that um the staff

497
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 1: may have forgotten about, or you know, they may have

498
00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 1: seen it, so it's fresh to me. UM. So that's

499
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: really nice to pull out these things that are in

500
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 1: our vault. UM. We have these beautiful lyrics written by

501
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:10,640
Speaker 1: James Brown. We always typically hear you know, say it

502
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 1: lot on black and I'm proud. We don't hear the

503
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: other anthem, don't open up the door for me, or

504
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: you know, I don't need nobody to open up the door.

505
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: I don't get it myself. You know, we have the lyrics,

506
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 1: we have the I don't mean nobody, I don't need

507
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 1: you to do this for me. So, I mean we

508
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:35,800
Speaker 1: have those lyrics that those are affirmations. Those are messages

509
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: of of um, strength, of rage, of hope, empowerment, and

510
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 1: so that's where I wanted us to. You know, we

511
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: go through these transitions of rage, hope, and empowerment and

512
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 1: still come out resilient. UM. The photos that are even

513
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 1: on display in this exhibit are primarily from black photographers, UM,

514
00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 1: some who people may know, some who they may not,

515
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 1: including Chuck Stewart UM, who is phenomenal, who shot the

516
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 1: album cover for Gil Scott Hearing and for that single

517
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 1: the Revolution will not be televised. I mean the girl

518
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 1: come on now. Just you make me mad, girl, I

519
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: wanted just follow your roses. Won't be like, oh, you're

520
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: a little bit black man on your show. You're just

521
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 1: walking about HRC. Turn right, turn right, girl, girl, who

522
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 1: are you talking? Nobody's nobody don't. I can't let you

523
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: in here. They find out you on my shoulder, They're

524
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 1: gonna knock you off because every time you talk, I'm

525
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 1: just oh that song, I'm just dropping the word a lyric.

526
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 1: Oh year, because girl, that that's that is a beautiful

527
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 1: thing to be part of history, living history and being

528
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: able to history. Right, No, it's it's absolutely beautiful. So

529
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 1: it is. It is, you know, a celebration of the past.

530
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 1: But while we are off so looking at the musicians,

531
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: the songwriters, the creators of the future UM to you know,

532
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 1: be inspired by their work as well. So that's you know,

533
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 1: essentially what that exhibit is. But it was it was

534
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 1: such a powerful thing to do UM you know, during

535
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,000
Speaker 1: that time, and it's a great way again to to

536
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: make sure that these artists are continued to be talked

537
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,959
Speaker 1: about in these institutions, in in the Rock and Roll

538
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame UM again, holding holding voices and holding

539
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 1: leaders accountable. I mean, these stories and narratives should always exist,

540
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: um within our institutions. So UM, I'm doing my due

541
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 1: diligence as as CC people who don't know, the people

542
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 1: who don't know, but to make sure that these stories

543
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 1: are are always in the narrative. Because the important thing

544
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: that you said, like as you said, not knowing about

545
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 1: um these important moments in our history and learning about

546
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 1: them at school and your undergrading your sociology and your

547
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: acro studies and Marco, you know what we're talking about.

548
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: When you started, you going for real for it was

549
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:14,800
Speaker 1: like it was like it was it was, it was.

550
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:19,000
Speaker 1: It was tragic information for me because I was one

551
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: of these guys who were read smart, one of know

552
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,880
Speaker 1: at all guys. And I'm like, you kidding me. You

553
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: got to be kidding. You just gotta be a lot

554
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 1: just can't be. So it is so much information that

555
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: is denied of everybody, White people, Hispanics, blacks especially that

556
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,840
Speaker 1: when you here being told to you go or this

557
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: some black stuff, listen, some made up some faith news.

558
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: Ain't know way black people did all this and you

559
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: we did, we did, we did. And to see that

560
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 1: I have a beautiful as they said Black Queen up there,

561
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:59,320
Speaker 1: the vice president a k a c. C. Creator at

562
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. If Cleveland, I

563
00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 1: know you've been to Slimmers. I gotta go to Slimmers

564
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:10,160
Speaker 1: and get you some sandwiches up there clean. That's what

565
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 1: I mean. You gonna get low. See what I'm saying.

566
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:14,680
Speaker 1: That's what i mean. But as soon as this pandemic,

567
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get on. I'm apply Cleveland too much together

568
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: to do with that, but I'm gonna get up there

569
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 1: in the Cleveland. But now now the weather, now the

570
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 1: weather is taking a turn. Follows up. But no, no, no, no,

571
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 1: I love cold weather. I lived in Chicago five years.

572
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:34,600
Speaker 1: I got closed that I can't. I'm in Atlanta now

573
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: I got closed. They just sit They're just sitting like

574
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:40,480
Speaker 1: they just sitting in my closet because I have no

575
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 1: reason to put them on right now because the weather.

576
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, but to Cleveland. I stepped on the plane.

577
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: People look at me like, I'm oh, he's just he's ready,

578
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 1: he ready, he ready for everything, He ready for everything.

579
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 1: But you know, the beauty of why I brought you

580
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 1: on the show is to let the world know about

581
00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: you because you are a riding and star. You are

582
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 1: a representative of what we need, people who are willing

583
00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 1: to share the information, but more importantly respected not because

584
00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:08,319
Speaker 1: of the color your skin, but who you are. Because

585
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:10,920
Speaker 1: the color your stink would have stopped you. Who you

586
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 1: are got you your job. And that's what that we

587
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:16,719
Speaker 1: need to understand. That's the narrative that's being discussed on

588
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 1: money making conversation today. I want to thank you. You know,

589
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:21,320
Speaker 1: it's thirty more minutes. We got to stop talking. So

590
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 1: I don't know why people come in to the show.

591
00:34:22,880 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: I'll tell him. I'll tell him twenty man, they be

592
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 1: said talking to your talking, just talking, and we can

593
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:30,439
Speaker 1: talking this thirty too. I ain't taking no blame for this, y'all.

594
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: And can talk. That's when she got the job. But

595
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:35,359
Speaker 1: guy don't know how to stop talking. She'll not talk

596
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 1: talking people. They're probably walking around with ear plugs on

597
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 1: the pably probably probably you. Thank you so much for

598
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 1: having me though, truly honored for you recognizing me and

599
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 1: um and just for all those voices who are who

600
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:54,240
Speaker 1: are rooting for me as well. Thank you. I'm rooting

601
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: and you stay safe. We talked soon. Bye bye. If

602
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:00,560
Speaker 1: you want to hear more money Man cover say interviews

603
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:04,040
Speaker 1: please go to Moneymaking Conversation dot com. I'm Rashan McDonald.

604
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 1: I'm your host, H