Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, Yeah, so I guess the question is how
Speaker 1: do you feel leveling up? You go, I don't think
Speaker 1: it's going anywhere. I'm never saying in different sportswether. There
Speaker 1: you got. I'm Francine Law in the London Studio and
Speaker 1: I'm David Merritt in the London Studio. And this is
Speaker 1: in the City Bloomberg's podcast that connects you to the
Speaker 1: stories at the heart of the City of London. Okay,
Speaker 1: so this week we are taking a look at the
Speaker 1: government's leveling up agenda. And for those who don't know
Speaker 1: what leveling up is, which is probably people that don't
Speaker 1: live in the UK, this is basically a pledge to
Speaker 1: revive large parts of the UK, I not London, that
Speaker 1: have been left behind, all those bits of Britain that
Speaker 1: have been forgotten supposedly over the years, slipping further behind
Speaker 1: the capital. And of course it was one of the
Speaker 1: big slogans, wasn't it the election in alongsize getting Brexits done.
Speaker 1: That Johnson got that huge majority. Yeah, you've got a huge, huge,
Speaker 1: resounding general election win. And then a little less than
Speaker 1: a year ago, at a speech and Coventry, the Prime
Speaker 1: Minister again focus on what he called the outrage of
Speaker 1: glaring regional inequalities. And it's the mission of this government
Speaker 1: to unite and level up across the whole UK, not
Speaker 1: just because that is morally right, but because if we fail,
Speaker 1: then we are simply squandering vast reserves of human capital,
Speaker 1: and we're failing to allow people to fulfill their potential
Speaker 1: and we are holding our country back. But what we're
Speaker 1: looking at now is the real data underneath the anecdotes
Speaker 1: or the hype or the government's spin. And we've been
Speaker 1: spending months crunching that data across twelve different metrics for
Speaker 1: every every constituency in the UK, and the outcome of
Speaker 1: that data crunching is pretty uncomfortable reading, probably for the government.
Speaker 1: So it's basically, David, most of the places that like
Speaker 1: behind London and the southeast of England and Johnson came
Speaker 1: to Parer that have seen little signs of better times.
Speaker 1: That's right. And you know it was supposed to narrow
Speaker 1: the gap between the farthest plung bits of Britain and
Speaker 1: London and actually the winner for the last few years
Speaker 1: has been at the Capitol. So we're going to hear
Speaker 1: in a bit from the Chief Executive Officer of Legal
Speaker 1: and General Nigel Wilson. Yeah, and he's Northerner. He really
Speaker 1: cares about this leveling up agenda. I remembered talking to him,
Speaker 1: as you know, three or four years back about this
Speaker 1: and why this should have been a priority for the government. First,
Speaker 1: we're going to speak to our man who's been on
Speaker 1: the ground across Britain and who is responsible for that
Speaker 1: digging into the data. Bloomberg's reporter Joe May's welcome. Joe, Hello,
Speaker 1: how's it going? Very good? So you just got back
Speaker 1: from traveling around the country. Tell us where you've been
Speaker 1: the Red Wall tour the Red Wall to I was
Speaker 1: up in sedge Field in Wakefield in Yorkshire. They went
Speaker 1: across to Rochdale near Manchester and down to Stoke which
Speaker 1: are kind of may regions that constitute the Red Wall,
Speaker 1: and I was meeting the Grace and the Goods to
Speaker 1: find out what they made of Boris Johnson's progress, and yeah,
Speaker 1: they weren't too impress, which talies with the data that
Speaker 1: we've pulled together and and just going back to the
Speaker 1: data that you've been mining for the last few months,
Speaker 1: so it tells this pretty bleak picture. Not only a
Speaker 1: thing's bad and the and the Gulf exists between London
Speaker 1: and these parts of Britain, but it's got worse, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: because lovely up is not a static thing. I think
Speaker 1: the government would like it that London stayed where it
Speaker 1: was and then the rest of the country could be
Speaker 1: kind of pushed along upwards towards London. But London is
Speaker 1: such a kind of phenomenon. Let's continued to grow and
Speaker 1: do so well in the last couple of years, it's
Speaker 1: call that econom momentum, and the rest of the country
Speaker 1: just simply has not done the same. So as you
Speaker 1: get that widening disparity in the country, and the fruits
Speaker 1: of the proceeds of economic growth in the UK just
Speaker 1: continue to accrue to London the Southeast and they are
Speaker 1: not being shared around. And that's what the government is
Speaker 1: trying to solve. But as our data shows, is just
Speaker 1: not happening. So what are they most worried about? So
Speaker 1: there was this kind of amazing moment where I was
Speaker 1: in sedge Field, so formally Tony Blair's seats the labor
Speaker 1: Prime Minister, but now one by Johnson, and there's this
Speaker 1: disused rail yard in a town called Ferry Hill, which
Speaker 1: the government wants to turn into an active rail yard,
Speaker 1: but it hasn't yet done so. And this is exactly
Speaker 1: kind of leveling up project you think they might achieve.
Speaker 1: You make a train station in a new area, bring jobs,
Speaker 1: allow him just to access work in nearby towns. And
Speaker 1: I went into the fish and chip shop in the
Speaker 1: town and I spoke to the owner, Colin Myers, and
Speaker 1: he told me that he came to this town because
Speaker 1: of the promise of a railway station four decades ago,
Speaker 1: and it still hasn't happened. And for decades, yes, he'd
Speaker 1: been there since nine eight. And he said, I came
Speaker 1: here and they said there will be a new railway station.
Speaker 1: It still hasn't happened. And he said to me, as
Speaker 1: if the government doesn't even know we are here, and
Speaker 1: it was holding out hope. He is, I mean speaking
Speaker 1: to the local MP, and the local MP is trying
Speaker 1: to get this railway station to be built, but there's
Speaker 1: no sign of happening, no sign happening yet. So he
Speaker 1: was great and his his colleague Caroline was saying to
Speaker 1: me that this places on the bottom and they'll never
Speaker 1: level up around here. You know. It was really quite
Speaker 1: striking how much it's effectively despair about whether the gun
Speaker 1: will ever has it and that has this phrase stuck
Speaker 1: though that it's got some recognition. People say, we're never
Speaker 1: going to level up around here. They've heard Boris Johnson
Speaker 1: say this, right. They would only say that once I'd
Speaker 1: introduced that, right, so they don't even know what it
Speaker 1: brought this plan. That was the most common reply I had,
Speaker 1: which is, well, what is this leveling up you're talking about?
Speaker 1: I certainly haven't heard about it. And I explained what
Speaker 1: it means, you know, spreading wealth and prosperity. They're like,
Speaker 1: all right, okay, weird, that's not happening, and we don't
Speaker 1: see any sign of it happening. I don't think no improvement, however,
Speaker 1: there's nothing there yet, nothing, there's no guarantee of any improvements.
Speaker 1: Still a changing the time I've been here four or
Speaker 1: four years. Yeah, it's got worse than that change. So, David,
Speaker 1: what's amazing in this is that actually people feel forgotten,
Speaker 1: they feel left behind, and yet they love the Prime Minister.
Speaker 1: I think Boris generally has not a brilliant job, absolutely brilliant.
Speaker 1: I can't not the guy. The most striking finding often
Speaker 1: was that that, oh, yeah, Boris, he's doing a great job.
Speaker 1: You feel very sorry for him. Did well with the pandemic. Sorry,
Speaker 1: sorry for what well? They think they didn't mean, dealt
Speaker 1: with a rough hand, and you can see that to
Speaker 1: be prime minister in a global pandemic and to have
Speaker 1: to deal with all of that. So there's still a
Speaker 1: lot of sympathy out there. And the kind of corollary
Speaker 1: is they don't feel much love for the labor leader
Speaker 1: kiss Stunt and they feel, like many were saying, we
Speaker 1: don't understand him, we don't know what his policies are,
Speaker 1: he doesn't enthuse us. And therefore, even though the leadling
Speaker 1: updata is bad, you can see why it's not a
Speaker 1: game over for Boris Shunson. But is this about spending
Speaker 1: more money in the regions to regenerate and attract talent?
Speaker 1: Like what can the government actually do? It's about doing
Speaker 1: lots of things all at once. So public policy experts
Speaker 1: would say, yes, you can spend money in areas, but
Speaker 1: if you don't also improve the local council, reduce crime,
Speaker 1: improve the town center, provide more jobs, and do all
Speaker 1: these things at once, then you'll never actually really see
Speaker 1: a meaningful kind of leveling up effect in an area.
Speaker 1: Money is one thing. And even on money, I was
Speaker 1: speaking to the head of the Stokes County Council, which
Speaker 1: has been one of the biggest recipients of leveling up funding,
Speaker 1: and names Abby Brown, and she was saying, I just
Speaker 1: don't have the people to spend the money that I've
Speaker 1: been given. I think there's always a challenge around needing
Speaker 1: more resource, so you know, having to have conversations with
Speaker 1: the government to explain to them that, for example, we
Speaker 1: only have one personal transport policy for authority were quarter
Speaker 1: of a million people were really well geographically placed and
Speaker 1: we know that we have some industry come see because
Speaker 1: of our geographic location, what we have one person who
Speaker 1: is responsible for any transport policy. But your your analysis Joe's,
Speaker 1: showed that public spending per capital has actually fallen behind
Speaker 1: London in most places have written stuff, hasn't it. So
Speaker 1: even if the government's saying they're going to put more
Speaker 1: money in, it's not flowing in to the extent that
Speaker 1: it needs to to actually close that gap with the capital. Yes,
Speaker 1: and it's a director lever that the government could be
Speaker 1: pulling but which our data shows that they're not. And
Speaker 1: it seems like there's a mindset in Whiteshall in the
Speaker 1: Treasury which leans towards spending where they think they get
Speaker 1: the best return for money. And often historically if you
Speaker 1: do a spreadsheet calculation at will show London comes up
Speaker 1: best because the return of investment is high, and they
Speaker 1: need to get away from that mindset, I think, And
Speaker 1: that was something that the council leaders were telling were
Speaker 1: telling me. Joe, thank you so much for that reporting
Speaker 1: and for coming on air to talk about Thank you,
Speaker 1: and thank you for your amazing data analysis as well,
Speaker 1: and looking forward to the next the next revisiting of
Speaker 1: the data in a few months time. Thank you very much.
Speaker 1: So it's striking how Joe, I think, was talking about
Speaker 1: the government promising to pay all this money to level
Speaker 1: up and it's not actually happening. But you know, the
Speaker 1: other side of the coin is is corporate Britain right
Speaker 1: and having to have some private investment into these areas. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it's maybe up to some of the private companies
Speaker 1: to actually sure that they're all over the country and
Speaker 1: trying to level up. So we spoke to a very
Speaker 1: interesting chief executive he's legal in general. I mean I
Speaker 1: was going to say, what do they do, but what
Speaker 1: don't they do? Dave Right. They do pensions, they do
Speaker 1: investment schimes, they do insurance obviously, but they also see
Speaker 1: themselves as one of the big sort of agents or
Speaker 1: engines of leveling up across the country with investments in
Speaker 1: a ton of regenerations schemes across Britain. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: they've invested over thirty billion pounds and leveling up regional
Speaker 1: UK economies with a further like millions pledged. And Nigel Wilson,
Speaker 1: the CEO, is a Northerner and a proud Northerner himself
Speaker 1: and is very passionate about this subject and we're delighted
Speaker 1: for him to join us. But really, Nigel, you're much
Speaker 1: more than that. You've been really one of the most
Speaker 1: vocal chief executives when it comes to leveling up and
Speaker 1: making sure that everybody gets a fair chance in the UK. Yes,
Speaker 1: and I'd just like to say thank you to you
Speaker 1: guys for doing outstanding pieces of research, because you need
Speaker 1: to hold the government to account and actually measure what
Speaker 1: the outcomes. So we're very appreciative that. I think the
Speaker 1: cool thing with this, with this tracker is that we're
Speaker 1: going to come back to every three months, you know,
Speaker 1: And it's about proper accountability, isn't it. They're going to
Speaker 1: try and do one themselves, but it needs to be
Speaker 1: intellectually honors. And you know the problem is the government's
Speaker 1: managing by sound bite at the moment and not by
Speaker 1: policy outcomes and outcomes. And we're all about outcomes. We're
Speaker 1: about investing, you know, real money and in the real economy,
Speaker 1: delivering real jobs. And I guess the problem that it's
Speaker 1: it's a very easy excuse when you have inflation through
Speaker 1: the roof. I don't think it's an excuse at all.
Speaker 1: But our policymakers using it as an excuse, well, of
Speaker 1: course they are right, yeah, I mean yeah, but it's
Speaker 1: not an excuse. I mean, it has to be a
Speaker 1: legitimate excuse if we can continue to earn it. And
Speaker 1: as I don't think it's going to change our strategy
Speaker 1: because we're busy leveling up the best we can right
Speaker 1: across the country. But we need partners and people who
Speaker 1: want to work with us to help accelerate. And it's
Speaker 1: almost every area we're failing. Housing is failing transportation fair
Speaker 1: and health failing, education is failing, productivity is failing. And
Speaker 1: we've got structural under investment again in the UK, which
Speaker 1: is the problem we've had for the last thirty or
Speaker 1: forty years. And you know, very different from America, which
Speaker 1: is a much more dynamic get Gore place. So your
Speaker 1: your experience then as a as a business leader looking
Speaker 1: at all corners of the country that talies with the
Speaker 1: Bloomberg data findings that things are just actually getting worse. Yes,
Speaker 1: but but that's an aggregate number. There are pockets of
Speaker 1: real excitement across the UK and we're really excited about
Speaker 1: you know, working with a number of different partners in
Speaker 1: a number of different cities. But the theme that we
Speaker 1: had was the UK economy we would never be successful
Speaker 1: or grow if we didn't invest outside of London. London
Speaker 1: can be and it's probably the best city in the
Speaker 1: world to live in, but so why have we not?
Speaker 1: I mean in places like Manchester leads so many other
Speaker 1: places that have so much potential, why have we under invested? Look,
Speaker 1: I think Manchester has do being a pretty good job
Speaker 1: and leads as doing. We've picked on two of the
Speaker 1: two of the best one but they are the best,
Speaker 1: you know, and you know that isn't even a good
Speaker 1: benchmark in monsters. I think there can be much much better.
Speaker 1: We have a partnership with Manchester University. This is this
Speaker 1: is a great example of of something is that when
Speaker 1: you Mist closed down in two thousand and four, there
Speaker 1: was there was a site available to regenerate. You know,
Speaker 1: we won the competition for that site generation in two
Speaker 1: thousand and twenty one and mere seventeen years later. And
Speaker 1: the piece of change is just too slow and there
Speaker 1: are too many barriers to getting things done in the UK.
Speaker 1: Even London is a great example. You know. One of
Speaker 1: the reasons housing is so expensive in London is that
Speaker 1: just the shortage of supply. Typically it takes seven years
Speaker 1: between buying a site and putting a sped in the
Speaker 1: ground on a site in London at shocking. You said,
Speaker 1: London is one of the best cities to live in
Speaker 1: in the world, and our data shows that yes, the
Speaker 1: gap has widened despite the government saying they're going to
Speaker 1: try and redistribute wealth across the country and in fact
Speaker 1: the only areas where the gap had narrowed is because
Speaker 1: London had itself got worse. So it's not any leveling up,
Speaker 1: it's actually leveling down on things like life expectancy, which
Speaker 1: you can attribute to COVID nineteen. Do you think it's
Speaker 1: just inevitable that London is going to continue to outperform
Speaker 1: the rest of the country. It's just because of all
Speaker 1: those advantages it's got. No, that is the honest answer
Speaker 1: to that. You know, we have a four billion pound
Speaker 1: investment program with Oxford because Oxford dre invested in a
Speaker 1: wonderful university. But it needs to judge itself against sem
Speaker 1: I t in Harvard in terms of what we're doing.
Speaker 1: But Nigel, what about the North? I mean there must
Speaker 1: be places in the UK where people just will get
Speaker 1: the numbers and think, well, my, you know, I'm not
Speaker 1: making a decent living. Everything is hard. The government is
Speaker 1: not helping me and what I was promised when I
Speaker 1: voted for Brexit is not powering through. I don't know
Speaker 1: whether it's just a vote for breckfit around that. I
Speaker 1: think it's it's a it's a long term trend which
Speaker 1: we haven't stopped yet, and it's just insufficient in estiment
Speaker 1: gone into the economy and outside of London to stop
Speaker 1: that trend and you know, our job and our collective
Speaker 1: job is to work in partnership with central government, local
Speaker 1: government and need the universities across the UK and really
Speaker 1: step up and everybody has to step up otherwise in
Speaker 1: three months time you'll be telling me the same story everybody.
Speaker 1: You mean, corporate Britain as well as the government. I mean,
Speaker 1: whose fault is it that this investment isn't happening. It's
Speaker 1: a collective responsibility and and you know central government hasn't
Speaker 1: stepped up. It's it's pretty obvious that that's how it happened.
Speaker 1: But at a local level everybody has to step up
Speaker 1: as well and not just wait for central government to
Speaker 1: turn up. And that's never happened to thirty or forty years.
Speaker 1: It's not suddenly going to change overnight. But the private
Speaker 1: sector has to to step up as well, right across
Speaker 1: the right, across the country and you know Leads, Manchester, Birmingham,
Speaker 1: they're also great cities. But the delta between those cities
Speaker 1: in London, it's is almost the largest in the world.
Speaker 1: Doesn't happen in America? America has you know, It's top
Speaker 1: cities are all very similar in terms of their their
Speaker 1: g d P and the standard of living. It's hugely
Speaker 1: different between London and everywhere else, and Germany is the same.
Speaker 1: Germany has you know that their top cities and in
Speaker 1: fact even in East Germany now Leipzig, Dresden, in Berlin's
Speaker 1: per capita income exceeds every city in England apart from London,
Speaker 1: and only Edinburgh is higher right across the UK, and
Speaker 1: that's real leveling up that we've seen in Germany. But
Speaker 1: it's a huge commitment by the government and the private
Speaker 1: sector to bring the East Germany up to being much
Speaker 1: closer to West Germany. So so what's happened in the
Speaker 1: UK is it historical reasons because of some manufacturing that
Speaker 1: happened in those places, and I guess the cost of
Speaker 1: living is just going to make these inequalities between the
Speaker 1: South and the North worst. Well, there's if you look
Speaker 1: at another headline number, there's one point eight million job
Speaker 1: vacancies in Britain. One point eight million. This is the
Speaker 1: high it's ever ever been and it's a very unusual
Speaker 1: occurrence that theres so many job vacancies and these jobs
Speaker 1: are not being taken. This is an under investment in
Speaker 1: education and training over thirty or forty years. America has
Speaker 1: a bit of that as well. I've joined a call
Speaker 1: with a number of American cres who are complaining about
Speaker 1: the same thing. They have lots of vacancies, they can't
Speaker 1: they can't fill them right now. And the economy is
Speaker 1: changing faster in terms of the demand for new solutions,
Speaker 1: and technology is leading that charge, and at the moment,
Speaker 1: the labor markets are lagging behind that that we haven't
Speaker 1: trained up enough people to work in those new, new,
Speaker 1: new areas, and therefore the premium on workers in those
Speaker 1: new areas is extraordinary high. All that's just going to
Speaker 1: feed back into the inflation ten percent forecast the end
Speaker 1: of this year. That's a that's a huge barrier to
Speaker 1: any any progress in leveling up, isn't it. I mean,
Speaker 1: the economy is looking very very shaky for the rest
Speaker 1: of this year, is and we're not. In fact, we're
Speaker 1: stepping up our leveling up investment because actually there's there's
Speaker 1: more opportunities now you are, there are others and why not,
Speaker 1: I don't know why not. It's one of those things
Speaker 1: where people have asked me that question, and you know,
Speaker 1: we've made a bit of great success of it. You know,
Speaker 1: our return and equities, which is very high for a
Speaker 1: financial services company. We've scaled up extraordinarily in lots of
Speaker 1: all the areas that I was talking about that are
Speaker 1: that are problems. But when we come with a solution
Speaker 1: to government, they're actually very supportive of that. But actually
Speaker 1: you're paying for it. We're paying for it that we're
Speaker 1: happy to pay for it, so we don't ask the government.
Speaker 1: We look for projects where we will finance the whole thing,
Speaker 1: but part of the core infrastructure needs to be provided
Speaker 1: by by the government. But are you pulling investment out
Speaker 1: of London to fund that or is it an add
Speaker 1: an additive thing. It's an additive things as well. Can
Speaker 1: I ask about financial services in the city specifically, Um,
Speaker 1: it's a huge part of the economy that the leveling
Speaker 1: up agenda is ignoring the strength of the city in
Speaker 1: a sense and not thinking about how do we speed
Speaker 1: things up as the city transitions postpract I mean, what's
Speaker 1: your what's your sense of the future here right in
Speaker 1: the square mile? Not the future is bright? I think
Speaker 1: here in the in the square mile, and it's great
Speaker 1: to see everybody back to work and there's great excitement
Speaker 1: across the city. There's so much innovation going on, there's
Speaker 1: so much investment required, and there's great clusters of that
Speaker 1: investment and that's why, you know, I'm very excited about
Speaker 1: the creativity and creative industries in and around London and
Speaker 1: those who will be financed by you know, financial firms
Speaker 1: like like our like ourselves, and so there's masses of
Speaker 1: new market opportunities or opening up a huge amount of
Speaker 1: investment required and that Golden triangle between Oxford, Cambridge and
Speaker 1: London is going to continue to attract massive amount of capital.
Speaker 1: And I'm really impressed by a number of the vice
Speaker 1: chancellors across the UK right now who will reaching out
Speaker 1: and saying, actually, we've got to be part of this.
Speaker 1: We can't just be an academic institution. We have to
Speaker 1: step up and be more like the best in class
Speaker 1: in the world, which are the m I t S,
Speaker 1: the Harvards, and understand that how long do you think
Speaker 1: if the right investment got to the right places, does
Speaker 1: this leveling up take. It's a ten to twenty year project.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's the thing you have to
Speaker 1: do is recognized that it's a ten to twenty which
Speaker 1: is what we've done is you know, whether it's in
Speaker 1: Newcastle or Sunderland, every every city you go to. If
Speaker 1: you went and sold the senior people, they would say, well, actually,
Speaker 1: here's here's a whole bunch of projects. Three years have
Speaker 1: passed and we've gone backwards. So you know it's three
Speaker 1: of the three of the ten have gone already. Are
Speaker 1: we actually going to make that deadline? No, your data
Speaker 1: is not going to say we're going to make the
Speaker 1: deadline until we have real concrete action in support of
Speaker 1: leveling up from the government, which is which, but also
Speaker 1: the local governments as well, having to step up and
Speaker 1: getting rid of political views to a certain extent and
Speaker 1: focus on place, because place, some people should come first
Speaker 1: and politics should be second. If you had a magic
Speaker 1: wand to level up easier and better than what would
Speaker 1: you do. I've changed the planning regulations pretty much run
Speaker 1: right across the UK very quickly. I would empower local
Speaker 1: people to make decisions a lot more quicker. I'd reallocate
Speaker 1: the budget to spend more on interest city transport rather
Speaker 1: than intercity transport, because you know, everybody's saving ten ten
Speaker 1: minutes a day traveling to and from work, getting rid
Speaker 1: of all the pollution it exists at the city city
Speaker 1: level is much more important than you know, taking ten
Speaker 1: minutes off the time it tooks to get to Birmingham
Speaker 1: by two. The right way to level up is also
Speaker 1: focusing on healthcare. And you've done huge studies on this
Speaker 1: health inequalities increasing and you know, in leveling up, it
Speaker 1: is absolutely going backwards right now, right across the country.
Speaker 1: And this government, you know, it fought the election about
Speaker 1: building new hospitals, massive investment that they just put up
Speaker 1: national insurance to pay for more funding with the health
Speaker 1: care system. But is that feeding through at all or
Speaker 1: is it all just spin? But it's not feeding through
Speaker 1: And I think the again, you need somebody who takes
Speaker 1: accountability and responsibility. You know, there was a great talk
Speaker 1: about the forty one hospital. Where are they? You know,
Speaker 1: I don't think you know, none of them have been
Speaker 1: built so far, and I think five are in planning
Speaker 1: so far, and it's just too slow. Going back to
Speaker 1: that earlier theme, Americans, get it done. We need to
Speaker 1: get that mentality over here, get on it. Who's responsible,
Speaker 1: who's accountable, who's going to deliver on this? Because it's
Speaker 1: so important that we modernize and use technology to deliver
Speaker 1: better solutions for health in the UK because there are
Speaker 1: healthy life expectancies just going backwards. That you're sounding Niger
Speaker 1: when you go around the country. The people in these
Speaker 1: constituencies who were promised all of this, they must be
Speaker 1: noticing now is that does get angry. They are angry
Speaker 1: and they're disappointed. What are they doing about it? But
Speaker 1: they don't know what to do, you see, because they
Speaker 1: don't feel as though they have any any levers to
Speaker 1: pull right now. At that sort of level, this is
Speaker 1: the rule of the states in a modern economy and
Speaker 1: that the state has to step up. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I'm Francie Laqua and I'm David Merritt. And that's it
Speaker 1: for this week's episode of In the City. We will
Speaker 1: be back next week and in the meantime, if you
Speaker 1: like the show, please first of all rate it. Also
Speaker 1: check out the bloom The UK website for more news
Speaker 1: and views. This episode was produced by Sammasati. Special thanks
Speaker 1: to our guests Joe May's and Nigel Wilson. Ahead of
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Podcast. Is Francesco leaving? All right? Bye Gang Bye.