Speaker 1: All right, bad Leban's going to join us in a moment.
Speaker 1: He's already checked in, so we'll get ready for him
Speaker 1: coming up. We have a lot to cover with the
Speaker 1: Minnesota Twinkies.
Speaker 2: When did he leave Minnesota? Got a look?
Speaker 1: I mean in the past six months or so, you
Speaker 1: can ask him about he's live, he's with us. Bad
Speaker 1: Lebin joining us. So hired by the Twins as SVP
Speaker 1: and GM in November twenty sixteen. Has a podcast called
Speaker 1: Rosters to Rings that you should check out and that
Speaker 1: AJ just asked, when officially did you leave? So we
Speaker 1: can do the chronological order of the career in our head.
Speaker 3: I left after last season, so this is my first
Speaker 3: season of being a free agent sabbatical. I've and joined
Speaker 3: the heck out of it.
Speaker 2: Oh I love that.
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, I want to start with the juice here,
Speaker 1: and I appreciate the time. The Twins are super popular
Speaker 1: right now over this last week they are selling. I
Speaker 1: know they've been competitive for a long period of time.
Speaker 1: They're going to take a step back right now. What
Speaker 1: have you seen? Just you're a free agent, you're on
Speaker 1: the outside, but you were in the thick with all
Speaker 1: of these players for a long period of time. Most
Speaker 1: of the guys moving you acquired. What do you think
Speaker 1: of what they've done so far?
Speaker 3: You know, I think we went into the season or
Speaker 3: they went into the season. I probably shouldn't say we and.
Speaker 2: We, well, we sorry about that.
Speaker 4: Agent.
Speaker 3: First of all, I should say this, like Scott, you
Speaker 3: do a great job as a point guard on the show.
Speaker 3: A tremendous watching you guys and Eric. You and I
Speaker 3: never crossed paths, but I always heard exceptional things about
Speaker 3: your chemistry, your culture, and your makeup.
Speaker 2: Thank you. I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you that I really appreciate that, and
Speaker 1: obviously great to have you on here for the first time.
Speaker 4: Miss Oh.
Speaker 1: He said, I hate the white socks. That's what he said.
Speaker 2: That's what he said. We're going to get into our
Speaker 2: history later. Let's focus on trade. First.
Speaker 4: He say something nice about you.
Speaker 1: First, he's got something.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So I also wanted to apologize for AJ when I
Speaker 3: worked for Texas before you were with Texas. I think
Speaker 3: Vicente hit you every time we played, and he should
Speaker 3: have apologized to you. But I'm certainly apologizing to you
Speaker 3: today for that.
Speaker 5: Well, you know, every time he didn't hit me, I
Speaker 5: went deep off of him, So it was either hit
Speaker 5: me or I was hitting a homer, So I can't.
Speaker 2: I know, you have to choose one or the other.
Speaker 3: I think the man had a little funny stuff in
Speaker 3: his hair that he may have used as an excuse
Speaker 3: for the ball slipping from time to time.
Speaker 5: I know he hit me twice in one game one time,
Speaker 5: and Hawk went down allegedly into the clubhouse after him.
Speaker 2: No security wouldn't let him in there. So yes, certain.
Speaker 3: Slightly funny story about him was that Kevin Millwood at
Speaker 3: one point said if he had his spikes on in
Speaker 3: the dugout he hit Kurt Suzuki when he was playing
Speaker 3: for the A's. He said he would have charged the
Speaker 3: mound to fight Pitty at that point, which would have
Speaker 3: been epic to have your own teammate charge the mound
Speaker 3: to fight.
Speaker 2: You about let me put my GM quarter zip on.
Speaker 1: Okay, well while you do it so that we don't.
Speaker 3: Mess up, tell you so I get getting back to
Speaker 3: to your actual question. You know, I think that the
Speaker 3: team went into the season with high expectations. They were
Speaker 3: hoping to contend and compete in the American League Central.
Speaker 3: The season hasn't gone quite to plan. I think they
Speaker 3: took a bold step here because they're still within fighting
Speaker 3: distance of the wild card. But they made an executive
Speaker 3: call here, which is they didn't want to straddle the fence.
Speaker 3: And I think from an executive standpoint, you always aspire
Speaker 3: to do one of two things. One is you're trying
Speaker 3: to build for the today. You know, to try to
Speaker 3: win today, and so you're buying, or you're trying to
Speaker 3: sell and try to win tomorrow. I think the toughest
Speaker 3: spot to be is that when you feel like you're
Speaker 3: standing still, because when you're standing still, I think people
Speaker 3: are running past you. So I give them a ton
Speaker 3: of credit. They're making real moves here, and I think
Speaker 3: the plan, originally, i'm sure, was to really focus on
Speaker 3: the guys who had expiring contracts with them, But as
Speaker 3: they made their calls, my guess is that that there
Speaker 3: was a lot of interest expressed in other players, and
Speaker 3: you've seen them trade two of them. Rock Stewart was
Speaker 3: traded very recently to the Dodgers. He has controlled beyond
Speaker 3: this year. And the bigger deal, of course, was John Durant,
Speaker 3: who they traded who has controlled through twenty twenty seven.
Speaker 3: Those deals usually take place because you may be calling
Speaker 3: another team and saying, hey, listen, we're open to talking
Speaker 3: about some of our guys with expiring contracts, and you
Speaker 3: know they have a few of those guys if you
Speaker 3: left to trade, probably Danny Coolom, Willie Castroid. Keep an
Speaker 3: eye on those two guys, for sure. But then Dave
Speaker 3: Dombrowski comes in calls and really gets aggressive on Joe
Speaker 3: on Duran. I don't know because I'm not there, but
Speaker 3: I do wonder if the unfortunate news that we heard
Speaker 3: about Emmanuel Klasse the other day. I'm sure that only
Speaker 3: intensified the interest in Joe on Duran. They probably didn't
Speaker 3: start this process with the intent of trading Joe on Durant.
Speaker 3: They probably weren't necessarily shopping him around, but I think
Speaker 3: teams started calling, they got super aggressive, and they got
Speaker 3: to a point where they required two top one hundred
Speaker 3: prospects for him, and I think that was just so
Speaker 3: far above the bar that they decided to press go.
Speaker 3: So I give him a lot of credit for, you know,
Speaker 3: not straddling the that's the easiest thing to do, I
Speaker 3: think would be to stand still and try to stay
Speaker 3: in this thing. I think they're making active steps to
Speaker 3: trying to help the team and then not so just
Speaker 3: at future. I would expect that they're going to hold
Speaker 3: on to most of the guys they could control beyond
Speaker 3: this year because I think they'll try to contend again
Speaker 3: as soon as next season.
Speaker 5: Okay, well, then the next question is how good are
Speaker 5: the prospects are getting back?
Speaker 2: And if I.
Speaker 5: Mean the Twins, listen, we know my feelings on the Twins.
Speaker 5: I love my time in Minnesota and I love what
Speaker 5: the Twins do well. I've always said that, but the
Speaker 5: Twins the last couple of years have kind of been
Speaker 5: the favorites to win this division. You were there for
Speaker 5: a couple last year, especially when it didn't happen. So
Speaker 5: why are they doing this now? And how good are
Speaker 5: the guys they are getting back and can they help
Speaker 5: them soon in the future to help Twins fans stop
Speaker 5: crying about how they never do anything.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and aj, I think we all have to be
Speaker 3: accountable to the decisions we made and the impact on
Speaker 3: the franchise. And I think you nailed it. You know,
Speaker 3: each of the last three seasons, the Twins were preseason
Speaker 3: picked to win the division, not by a huge margin,
Speaker 3: but they were picked to be the favorite in the division.
Speaker 3: They'll end up winning the division once. Last year, as
Speaker 3: you referenced, unfortunately, there was a really a bad end
Speaker 3: of the season. It was an epic decline. I think
Speaker 3: at some point in the season we had prohibitive favorites
Speaker 3: to make the playoffs and the team ultimately fell short
Speaker 3: of that, and then this season again fell short. And
Speaker 3: so I think you've got to really look yourself in
Speaker 3: the mirror and say, maybe the best laid plans here
Speaker 3: haven't worked out, and so the current constitution of this
Speaker 3: roster isn't taking us where we need to go. We
Speaker 3: have to look ourselves in the mirror. We have to
Speaker 3: hold ourselves accountable to that. We've got to make decisions
Speaker 3: that change rather than continue to do the same thing
Speaker 3: and expect some different outcomes. So, you know, I think
Speaker 3: a lot is made with the Twins about the fact
Speaker 3: that three of the most talented players on the team
Speaker 3: have unfortunately been snake bit with some injuries over.
Speaker 4: Their careers, Royce Lewis, Carlos Korey.
Speaker 3: And Byron Buxton. And you know, I think a lot
Speaker 3: there's a lot of levied criticism against us about Hey,
Speaker 3: how do you build a team around three guys that
Speaker 3: you just don't know are going to be on the
Speaker 3: field as much. It wasn't like that was plan a
Speaker 3: that we were planning on taking on such extreme health risk.
Speaker 3: I think the only one of.
Speaker 4: Those three guys who really we knew.
Speaker 3: Had significant health risk was Byron. The other two guys
Speaker 3: kind of it's somewhat manifested after we invested in them.
Speaker 3: But by the same token, they have tremendous upside talent.
Speaker 3: But nonetheless, here's where the franchise is, which is in
Speaker 3: three consecutive years, they had probably slightly higher expectations in
Speaker 3: what were meant two years ago. They ended up winning
Speaker 3: a playoff series at home, which was really important for
Speaker 3: the franchise after losing as many playoff games in a
Speaker 3: row as they had. But they have fallen short and aggregate,
Speaker 3: and so they're making changes. They're making substantive changes. How
Speaker 3: good those players are who they've acquired, you know, I
Speaker 3: think I'm sure that the scouts would tell you that
Speaker 3: they're great. I do know that a lot of them
Speaker 3: are pretty young, so they're going to be a couple
Speaker 3: of years away. The farm system itself is a very
Speaker 3: solid farm system, so it's adding to that and maybe
Speaker 3: giving them opportunities to spend some of that prospect capital
Speaker 3: to go buy and buy as soon as this offseason potentially.
Speaker 3: But you know, another factor involved with the Twins right
Speaker 3: now is that they're up for sale, and so I'm
Speaker 3: not sure how much pressure is being levied behind closed
Speaker 3: doors right now that could be impacting some of these
Speaker 3: decisions about getting a little bit more aggressive about selling
Speaker 3: today just due to the fact that the team's up
Speaker 3: for sale. That's something I don't know, But those are
Speaker 3: things that you know, the GM and the President of
Speaker 3: Baseball Operations over there would never say publicly, but those
Speaker 3: are things that we had to deal with. You know,
Speaker 3: when you're in those seats, those are some of the
Speaker 3: pressures and factors that go into some of your decisions
Speaker 3: that you wouldn't have otherwise expected when.
Speaker 6: You're sitting in that GMC, when you're sitting there and
Speaker 6: there's discussions about building your team, whether it's analytically, I
Speaker 6: like this guy for the clubhouse, Roco has a connection.
Speaker 6: Are the words world series discussed or the world? Are
Speaker 6: the words playoffs? Because the al Central is kind of
Speaker 6: mess so we're just going to make sure we get
Speaker 6: a little bit better than everybody else to make the playoffs,
Speaker 6: and then hey, see what happens.
Speaker 3: Eric, I think it's a great philosophical question about how
Speaker 3: we approach decision making because I remember, you know, you
Speaker 3: would always do these offseason speaking engagements at the local
Speaker 3: Kiwanis club or whatever, and they'd say how many games
Speaker 3: are your team going to win? And I would always
Speaker 3: answer it, our goal is to win at least one
Speaker 3: more than the team in second place, because we wanted
Speaker 3: to win our division. We wanted to somewhat control our
Speaker 3: own destiny. Especially with today's playoff format, you want to
Speaker 3: play home playoff games. But I'm not sure I've ever
Speaker 3: perfectly subscribed to the theory that once you get to
Speaker 3: the playoffs anything can happen. You know, I think you
Speaker 3: need to be very talented. I think you need to
Speaker 3: be healthy. I do think you need to be a
Speaker 3: little bit lucky at times when you're playing in the playoffs,
Speaker 3: because at that point every team is exceptionally talented. But
Speaker 3: I don't think you want to walk into the playoffs
Speaker 3: as the least talented group and expect great outcomes. So
Speaker 3: I would say that philosophically, I wanted to win, you know.
Speaker 3: I wanted to be in the in an opportunity to
Speaker 3: win and to prevail and to be a prohibitive favorite
Speaker 3: when it came to the playoffs. I always felt like
Speaker 3: the best time to make a sign magnificant acquisition at
Speaker 3: the deadline was when you were going to win your division,
Speaker 3: and now you're setting your team up to succeed and
Speaker 3: excel and extend a playoff front. I don't want to
Speaker 3: try to buy my way into the playoffs and limp
Speaker 3: in and have a chance to maybe get knocked out
Speaker 3: in the first round. When it says ninety percent playoff
Speaker 3: chances next to my team's name come July thirty, first,
Speaker 3: I want to add a stud to that group so
Speaker 3: that we can really vault our chances forward to win
Speaker 3: when we're in the playoffs and ultimately get a chance
Speaker 3: to play in the World Series. So that would be
Speaker 3: the approach I would want to take. I do understand
Speaker 3: the theory about, hey, once you get in the playoffs,
Speaker 3: anything can happen. You do sometimes see teams you know
Speaker 3: extend themselves in the playoffs who maybe weren't quite as talented,
Speaker 3: and you all of sudden find them. Maybe in the
Speaker 3: World Series, but more often than not, the best teams
Speaker 3: are winning once they get in the playoffs. I want
Speaker 3: to be the general manager of the team that is
Speaker 3: the most talented.
Speaker 2: All right, I have two questions Forere you have to
Speaker 2: let you go.
Speaker 5: One, How handicapped were you the last two seasons because
Speaker 5: by the ownership with the Twins? Because twenty three you
Speaker 5: guys did nothing, still won the division, won your first
Speaker 5: playoff series in Forever. Last year, again you guys did nothing,
Speaker 5: and I hate to say this, but kind of collapse
Speaker 5: at the end after having a ninety percent chance to
Speaker 5: make the playoffs. How handicapped were you? Because you said,
Speaker 5: if you're a ninety percent chance, you want to make
Speaker 5: the big move. You guys did nothing. How handicapped are you?
Speaker 5: Buy ownership?
Speaker 3: So you know, I was told rumors that if you
Speaker 3: come on the show that AJ asked tough questions.
Speaker 2: Oh wait till the next one, Wait till the next one.
Speaker 4: Is the next one about the idea? Is there anything
Speaker 4: to do about Padita on the horizon? No?
Speaker 3: No, the quartership is bringing out the best in you
Speaker 3: here on the on the executive side of things. So hey, listen.
Speaker 3: I think I'm going to answer this as diplomatically but
Speaker 3: as also insightfully as I can, which is to say,
Speaker 3: when you enter a season, typically ownership gives you very
Speaker 3: clear understanding of what the payroll parameters are going to
Speaker 3: be for the season. It's then somewhat up to the
Speaker 3: front office group to determine how much do we want
Speaker 3: to leave in reserve for the trade deadline in the
Speaker 3: event that we're winning and we can add players. Now,
Speaker 3: the hope always is that if the team's doing well,
Speaker 3: you're going to be drawing attendance, maybe beyond what your
Speaker 3: expectations were, and maybe you'll have more money to spend
Speaker 3: than you even thought you would. You know, one thing
Speaker 3: that has happened in this marketplace is attendance hasn't necessarily climbed.
Speaker 3: It hasn't even necessarily held over the last couple of years,
Speaker 3: for reasons I'm not perfectly sure I can put my
Speaker 3: finger on. You know, I think we're far enough removed
Speaker 3: hopefully from COVID and the George Floyd incident, but there's still,
Speaker 3: you know, like a lack of resurgence of fan interest
Speaker 3: downtown to watch our games. So the revenue probably wasn't
Speaker 3: exactly what was projected. It left us at the trade
Speaker 3: deadline probably being a little bit more conservative.
Speaker 4: Than we otherwise would have been.
Speaker 3: But I also thinks there's a responsibility of honestly assessing
Speaker 3: where your team is and are you really poised to
Speaker 3: strike in the postseason, versus whether or not that you
Speaker 3: are that genuine one move away. I think we both
Speaker 3: did determined we didn't have the resources to necessarily make
Speaker 3: that move, but also that it wasn't necessarily the time
Speaker 3: to really push ownership into an uncomfortable position based upon
Speaker 3: our projections of how the team.
Speaker 4: Would do if it got into the playoffs at that time.
Speaker 2: Okay, the last one before you go.
Speaker 5: First of all, I think you should be in the
Speaker 5: game because I think you're good at your job, But
Speaker 5: you have one made. You've made one huge mistake in
Speaker 5: your career, and it wasn't bringing me back to Texas
Speaker 5: in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 2: So listen, we all can't be perfect.
Speaker 5: We all have our one miss and that was you
Speaker 5: not bringing me back in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 2: I don't know why, I don't care why, but that
Speaker 2: was your mistake.
Speaker 5: Then.
Speaker 3: Well, so AJL, I will say this one thing, We
Speaker 3: didn't know when we didn't bring you back, was that
Speaker 3: you were going to curse us, because I'm sure you
Speaker 3: didn't follow the twenty fourteen Rangers, but we led the
Speaker 3: major leagues and days on the AL we had, I
Speaker 3: think twenty one hundred days on the AL as a
Speaker 3: roster group. So I don't know what type of voodoo
Speaker 3: dolls you had somewhere, but you were sticking a lot
Speaker 3: of pins in and it was it worked against us dramatically.
Speaker 4: You know what, one thing, Age, I've been listening to
Speaker 4: your show pretty religiously over the last week or so,
Speaker 4: just because I find you guys very informative and you
Speaker 4: bring a great insight from a player's perspective, and you know,
Speaker 4: as I said, Scott, I think asked a ton of
Speaker 4: great questions, has great insight for both you and Eric
Speaker 4: and some of the crew you bring on.
Speaker 2: One thing that I.
Speaker 3: Thought you guys were talking about the other day that
Speaker 3: I just wanted to comment on, was, you know, I
Speaker 3: do think the way negotiations have taken place have changed
Speaker 3: in my tenure, and one of the biggest changes was,
Speaker 3: you know, when Aja, you guys, you and Eric started
Speaker 3: your career, the average general manager was a little bit
Speaker 3: more like Kevin Towers and Jim Hendry and Omar and
Speaker 3: I and guys like that. They were very open when
Speaker 3: you called them. They would tell you exactly what they
Speaker 3: were looking for, exactly what they were prepared to do
Speaker 3: to acquire those players, and they were pretty damn aggressive.
Speaker 3: Today's GM is a little bit different, you know. Negotiations
Speaker 3: have changed dramatically now. I think you have to assess
Speaker 3: is somebody seeking the best deal they can get, and
Speaker 3: when they do that, they tend not to share a
Speaker 3: lot of information with you. They have a long list
Speaker 3: of players that could satisfy their needs, are very judicious
Speaker 3: about it versus the GM who's hunting a good player.
Speaker 3: And that's the guy who gets on the phone with you.
Speaker 3: It's Dave Dombrowski and he says, he I want John
Speaker 3: duranm That's who I want. What does it take to
Speaker 3: get him? And he's going to negotiate with you until
Speaker 3: he gets the player. It's just changed very dramatically, and
Speaker 3: I think it ties into the question you just asked me,
Speaker 3: Aja about how much you go for it at the deadline.
Speaker 3: I'm looking at some of the teams out there right now,
Speaker 3: and saying, you know, are they taking aggressive steps towards
Speaker 3: winning or are they taking steps towards just making prudent
Speaker 3: trades that won't hurt them in the future. I think
Speaker 3: now's the time. If you have the talent, if you
Speaker 3: have the odds, it's time to go for it rather
Speaker 3: than necessarily making just prudent moves that help you on
Speaker 3: the margins. You want guys who can help you get
Speaker 3: to the playoffs, but you ideally want guys who can
Speaker 3: help you when you.
Speaker 4: Do get to the playoffs. The best players do both,
Speaker 4: but I.
Speaker 3: Think now's not the time to just get players who
Speaker 3: help you get there. You want players who can help
Speaker 3: you win once you do.
Speaker 1: It's a great call, and I'd love to get into
Speaker 1: it more. Why said he regrets it and have a
Speaker 1: n not.
Speaker 2: Because of the It's fine. I get it. It's fine.
Speaker 2: I get it. It's fine, we get it. We have
Speaker 2: to go to break I get it. It's cool. We'll
Speaker 2: talk off record, we'll get the real then I'll come
Speaker 2: on here and I'll tell this.
Speaker 1: Well, why why they didn't bring you back?
Speaker 2: The reason I was told was beat us. But that's fine.
Speaker 1: Wait, you don't want to wait?
Speaker 2: We don't have time. We gotta go. He knows the reason.
Speaker 3: I can come back for a segment later where you
Speaker 3: can grill me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we know.
Speaker 1: Was it something gucy or it's like.
Speaker 5: Well, I don't know. I mean, I know why. I'm
Speaker 5: pretty sure I know why, but we have to go
Speaker 5: hunt Dad.
Speaker 2: You know, I love you. You know I think you're
Speaker 2: great at your job.
Speaker 5: So I hope you get back in baseball soon, and
Speaker 5: when you do, you can hire Crats to be your
Speaker 5: assistant bullpen catcher.
Speaker 3: Do his knee still have it in him? It was
Speaker 3: great being on the show with you, guys. I really
Speaker 3: appreciate what you guys do. Enjoyed listening was it was
Speaker 3: a pleasure being on with you guys.
Speaker 2: Bad thank you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this was great. We'd love to have you back,
Speaker 1: so we'll work on booking you again. And in the meantime,
Speaker 1: for everyone that's check this out, make sure you listen
Speaker 1: to what Dad's got with his pod as well. Give
Speaker 1: it a look and a listen. I'm sure you can
Speaker 1: find it wherever you get your pods.
Speaker 2: Dad will catch you soon.
Speaker 3: Look forward to it, guys,