Speaker 1: Look mad oh, I see you? Why why and look
Speaker 1: over there? How is that culture? Yes? Goodness, dot and
Speaker 1: damn did we elect a new president or what? I
Speaker 1: think we elected a new president? I have a feeling
Speaker 1: we actually went and did that, so snaps for us.
Speaker 1: We did that. We were the ones who organized in
Speaker 1: Georgia and Detroit's and oh my god, the biggest I think,
Speaker 1: so honey, to everyone in Georgia. I said that, I don't.
Speaker 1: I think that was the most moving part of this
Speaker 1: was everyone who stood in eleven hour lines to cast
Speaker 1: their vote in Georgia, everyone who registered this time for
Speaker 1: the for the first time ever, and Stacy Abrams and
Speaker 1: everyone that's working with Stacy Abrams in Georgia. Truly, I mean,
Speaker 1: they changed the whole voting landscape of this election, and
Speaker 1: it is it's just it's so inspiring. It's so inspiring.
Speaker 1: And let's just shout out the other women who were
Speaker 1: helped register a hundred thousand new Georgia voters Helen Butler
Speaker 1: and say you fought Deborah Scott and Tomika Atkins. Bravo, Bravo, Bravo, Bravo, Yes, bravo. Matt,
Speaker 1: how are you feeling in the wake of all of this,
Speaker 1: I have to say what a ride it was, because
Speaker 1: I thought, I mean, it really was giving me. It
Speaker 1: was giving me two thousand eighteen mid terms where it
Speaker 1: looked just so bad for the first few hours, and
Speaker 1: I was watching that election in New York. This time
Speaker 1: it was like watching from l A. It's like you're
Speaker 1: seeing all the all the sort of doom and gloom earlier,
Speaker 1: and it looked it just didn't look good. And then oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: in the daylight, that must be different to like get
Speaker 1: the returns in when it was still light out. Oh
Speaker 1: for Florida to be like pretty much like red red
Speaker 1: at like six pm was really it was like, this
Speaker 1: is happening so fast. It was so wild. But you know,
Speaker 1: with the mail and vote coming in late that that
Speaker 1: really turned exciting really fast. And of course obviously this
Speaker 1: with the caveat of it didn't exactly go as well
Speaker 1: as it should have gone in the House, in the
Speaker 1: Senate obviously, I mean, and there's a lot to still
Speaker 1: um engage in and still fight for um. First of
Speaker 1: which is, of course, on January five, the runoff elections
Speaker 1: in Georgia, um Warknock and us Off are still in
Speaker 1: this and that would be literally, I mean administration making
Speaker 1: for us to even out that's what's going down in
Speaker 1: the Senate. And um, you know, as of today, we're
Speaker 1: recording this on the ninth, This will be released on
Speaker 1: the eleventh. But you know, still no major Republican in
Speaker 1: the currently in the Senate or House has come out
Speaker 1: and said that Biden won the election. It's still kind
Speaker 1: of really dragging its feet. And um, Romney in the
Speaker 1: Senate that we do we count him that Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't really count Romney. I remember one time he really
Speaker 1: tried to he really tried to get on my side
Speaker 1: when I was in high school by saying his favorite
Speaker 1: television show was lost, and I was like, maybe maybe
Speaker 1: he's the book and I like And then I was like, no,
Speaker 1: I don't think I like a single one. Um, but
Speaker 1: but um, yeah, I mean for me, my perspective on
Speaker 1: it is like recount the votes. We'll go ahead like that.
Speaker 1: It'll be the same like Biden as the president elect,
Speaker 1: and we will starting now start that accountability process because
Speaker 1: as we've been saying on this podcast, you know, from
Speaker 1: when he was selected as the nominee, he was not
Speaker 1: our nominee of choice and now comes the work of
Speaker 1: making sure that we continue to hold him accountable and
Speaker 1: making sure that they, you know, involved some progressive voices
Speaker 1: in this, in this cabinet and in this administration, because
Speaker 1: the rumored picks are not it. Meg Whitman, excuse me
Speaker 1: your wounds after Quimby girl, okay, and speaking as a
Speaker 1: Quimby girl myself on behalf of Matt as well, who
Speaker 1: was also a Quimby girl, give it a rest for
Speaker 1: just a second, serve in this damn cabinet, no get away.
Speaker 1: I just feel like the failing up that is going
Speaker 1: on with that woman is I almost iconic, cathartic. It
Speaker 1: it's cathartic. So we for our for our new readers,
Speaker 1: for our new listeners, we have now interchangeably. We've we
Speaker 1: we've used the word cathartic to mean iconic when it
Speaker 1: clearly does not mean that. But it's a it's an
Speaker 1: interchangeable substitution, just to sort of you know, it's now
Speaker 1: words mean nothing, um, but they do, just not on
Speaker 1: this podcast anyway, speaking of meaning something, speaking of progressive voices,
Speaker 1: speaking of progressive and speaking of big elections upcoming. Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, this is I mean of course, all eyes
Speaker 1: are on the Georgia ran off on January five, But
Speaker 1: after that, the probably the most important race coming up
Speaker 1: in June is the race from Manhattan. D a our
Speaker 1: guest today. I'm so excited. I know Bone is so
Speaker 1: excited too, so so excited. She is a public defender
Speaker 1: in New York City. And our guest is also memorable
Speaker 1: for appearing on two seasons of Survivor, which this is
Speaker 1: actually how I learned of our guests today, because, as
Speaker 1: the readers know, Bowen and I did fall into a
Speaker 1: Survivor wormhole because of quarantine, so all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: I was very, very, very sort of infatuated with our
Speaker 1: guests because I see a lot of myself and her,
Speaker 1: which I'll tell her when when we bring her in.
Speaker 1: But she came in fourth place on Survivor Vanuatu, which
Speaker 1: is fucking pretty great, and made such a lasting impression
Speaker 1: that she was invited back for what many would consider
Speaker 1: to be the greatest season of Survivor of all time,
Speaker 1: which was the all Star season Micronesia season sixteen, which
Speaker 1: was one by friend of the show Parverty. Shallow also
Speaker 1: competed on the Amazing Race with iconic survivor villain Curran
Speaker 1: Kaplan just relentless survivor villain. I mean truly, her and
Speaker 1: our guests both have delivered iconic, insane tribal council speeches
Speaker 1: to the people on the up for the win. But
Speaker 1: more importantly, she is now a candidate for Manhattan d
Speaker 1: A and this race is coming up in June. And
Speaker 1: after representing over three thousand New Yorkers who wouldn't otherwise
Speaker 1: not be able to afford a lawyer, and just being
Speaker 1: an advocate for years for low income people, brown and
Speaker 1: black people in the City of New York who just
Speaker 1: face an insane racist criminal justice system, which is, as
Speaker 1: she says in her platform, doesn't need to be reformed,
Speaker 1: but transformed. And we're just so excited this race is
Speaker 1: coming up in June. She's running on a platform, like
Speaker 1: I said, criminal justice reform, social justice for all, especially
Speaker 1: those that are most vulnerable. And we're so so excited
Speaker 1: to welcome to the pod. Open up your ears for
Speaker 1: Eliza as welcome. What a welcome, what a welcome. It's
Speaker 1: so great to be here. I am such a big
Speaker 1: fan of the two of you, and this is just
Speaker 1: what a joy you deserve. An intro like that, thank you. Wait,
Speaker 1: okay a week very quickly, just touch on personal history
Speaker 1: because I need to know more about you. I feel
Speaker 1: like you have lived a truly cosmopolitan life born in
Speaker 1: New York, but then you like lived in Hong Kong
Speaker 1: with your family for years and years and years. A
Speaker 1: couple of years also lived in Beijing. Also, you know
Speaker 1: I have a Chinese sister, n n Ni Nally. Oh
Speaker 1: my god, I can only describe my face right now,
Speaker 1: as Eliza Orleans ask was dropped. Oh gosh, that is
Speaker 1: truthful that you have your tones down, you know the tones.
Speaker 1: Don't don't be bashful. This is incredible. Well, that's part
Speaker 1: of the Chinese culture, right. You don't accept a compliment
Speaker 1: under any circumstances. I know, like seventeen ways to say no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: like that is you say so the first time he said,
Speaker 1: you know, my Chinese was good, and I said, which
Speaker 1: means where where? Where? It's like, you're not supposed to
Speaker 1: accept to compliment. And then the second day I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: bug is like, don't flatter me. Don't you know all
Speaker 1: these different ways to not accept a compliment because the
Speaker 1: last thing you're supposed to do is just say like, oh,
Speaker 1: thank you, Like there really are a million ways to deflect.
Speaker 1: There really are. It's baked into the linguistic culture of
Speaker 1: of Mandarin. It's so funny. Um, that's I've always thought
Speaker 1: that was so cool. And UM, I don't know, I
Speaker 1: just think you've you've really been. You've been about that
Speaker 1: jet set life, your whole your whole life, and I
Speaker 1: feel like that absolutely set you up for success on
Speaker 1: Survivor in the Amazing Race. Anyway. I just wanted to
Speaker 1: I just wanted to Amazing Race. We did not We
Speaker 1: were not great. We should have been batter at Amazing Race.
Speaker 1: But such as life, such as what was it that
Speaker 1: had your family relocate to China? So my dad's worked
Speaker 1: in China my whole life. Um, he's you know, I
Speaker 1: mean he hasn't now been in a little while thanks
Speaker 1: to COVID, but he you know, he's worked there since
Speaker 1: before I was born. You know, speaks fluent Mandarin. Um.
Speaker 1: He's the president of the National Committee on US China Relations,
Speaker 1: so fostering the diplomatic relationship between the US and China,
Speaker 1: and it's always been a huge part of my life.
Speaker 1: When I was four, we went to Beijing adopted my
Speaker 1: sister when she was just a few days old. Uh,
Speaker 1: And so you know, China has just been a massive
Speaker 1: part of my life. I literally before all of this,
Speaker 1: Bowen and I talked so much about going because I
Speaker 1: want to go so badly. The reason why I was
Speaker 1: saying and I truly just did the Eliza face as
Speaker 1: this was all happening. The reason I said I kind
Speaker 1: of identified with you is because whenever I'm watching Survivor
Speaker 1: and there's tribal councils happening, and like ship's going down
Speaker 1: and people on the jury are just sort of stoic,
Speaker 1: I'm like a girl, my I would be acting the
Speaker 1: biggest fool. And so you sort of became an iconic meme,
Speaker 1: really before memes for Survivor fans, for reacting to the
Speaker 1: many blind sides that unfolded um mostly as a result
Speaker 1: of the Black Widow Brigade, which was miss Amanda Surrey
Speaker 1: and parv Um sort of getting all the guys out
Speaker 1: there that were huge threats for the win. So I
Speaker 1: was watching you reacted to this like and truly it
Speaker 1: was so like active and just live. You were living
Speaker 1: out loud. I mean, yes, there it is but I guess, like,
Speaker 1: were you even trying to hold back because you didn't
Speaker 1: want to like kind of disturb an outcome? Like what
Speaker 1: have you always been? Uh, not able to help yourself?
Speaker 1: Like me? It's like it's so funny. Yes, we're the same,
Speaker 1: Like I wear my emotions on my face, like I
Speaker 1: have to work extremely hard not to roll my eyes
Speaker 1: at things or like drop my jaw at things when
Speaker 1: I am surprised by them. And people who know me
Speaker 1: in real life were like, oh, yeah, that's just her,
Speaker 1: Like you should see her sitting on her couch watching
Speaker 1: Survivor at home like oh my god, like screaming at
Speaker 1: the TV. But when it's happening on Survivor and you're
Speaker 1: sitting on the jury, you know you haven't seen all
Speaker 1: the things that have led up to that tribal council.
Speaker 1: So you at home and watching, and even even people
Speaker 1: at home can be shocked, but you've just watched all
Speaker 1: the strategizing, everything that's gone down in those three days.
Speaker 1: As a juror, you're brought in completely blind, and so
Speaker 1: you're watching it and you think you know what's happening
Speaker 1: because you only left a few days earlier. You heard
Speaker 1: from someone, but then it's like just shocks you out
Speaker 1: of the blue, and I'm just a very expressive person. Yeah.
Speaker 1: This first season you did was season nine, so this
Speaker 1: was very early, very early on. So something we talked
Speaker 1: to ParvE a lot about was what was it like,
Speaker 1: as a huge fan of the show to then watch
Speaker 1: your season and see yourself as an edited character? Because
Speaker 1: Bone and I talk a lot about, you know, the
Speaker 1: dissonance of seeing yourself being represented in a way that
Speaker 1: is slightly off what your own personal truth is. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean talk about that experience. Well, I mean I
Speaker 1: think I got just a great deal of enjoyment out
Speaker 1: of it. Some people hate watching themselves back, and for me,
Speaker 1: it was like so exciting because there I was like
Speaker 1: living out my dream. You know, I loved Survivor from
Speaker 1: episode one of season one of the show. I watched
Speaker 1: the first season of Survivor and I turned to my
Speaker 1: mom and I was like, I'm going to be on
Speaker 1: that show. And she was like, of course you are,
Speaker 1: sweet heart. And now she says, be careful what you
Speaker 1: tell your kids because they all believe you. And and
Speaker 1: I you know, what's so funny, are you guys too
Speaker 1: young to have had a o L instant messenger. Okay,
Speaker 1: so I had so obviously aim was like a big
Speaker 1: thing back then. And on my aim bio, I wrote
Speaker 1: Future Survivor nine Contestant nine because that was gonna be
Speaker 1: the first season I'd be eligible to apply for because
Speaker 1: I would turn twenty one and that was the minimum age.
Speaker 1: I turned twenty one a month before applications were due,
Speaker 1: and I was like, i'll be twenty one, I'll be
Speaker 1: on season nine. I calculated it's two per season. Da
Speaker 1: da da, and I realized that season. So I was
Speaker 1: manifesting before it was cool. I like had it in
Speaker 1: my bio Future Survivor nine Contestant and then I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I'm actually interviewing. I better take it
Speaker 1: off because they'll think that I'm like spoiling I'm like
Speaker 1: in violation of my contract. But I had it up
Speaker 1: there for years. That's the secret, yees. So then I
Speaker 1: like went on the show, and so even watching it
Speaker 1: back and just being like, oh my god, like I
Speaker 1: got to do this thing that I had like set
Speaker 1: my sights on for years like that. I loved that
Speaker 1: I wanted to do so badly that even when I
Speaker 1: got a terrible edit and got all this like what
Speaker 1: they call negative SPV if you were ever an EDGIC
Speaker 1: fan second person visibility, so meaning everyone was saying bad
Speaker 1: things about me, right, Yeah, you kind of got that
Speaker 1: reputation of like, oh, she talks too much, She's like
Speaker 1: I do go, She's like, you know, over achieve verse.
Speaker 1: I think the word annoying might have been thrown around,
Speaker 1: which I gotta say that they say about me too. Um.
Speaker 1: But you know, so watching that, was it bothering you
Speaker 1: or you kind of just like, no, I get it.
Speaker 1: I mostly found it funny, like I think, even and
Speaker 1: my mom was there, like I won the family visit.
Speaker 1: My mom was there and I was like and I
Speaker 1: was cracking up with her, and you see like a
Speaker 1: small clip of it, I'm like, Mom, everyone thinks I'm annoying.
Speaker 1: And we were like laughing because you know, I'm like
Speaker 1: allowed you from New York, like compared to all these
Speaker 1: people who were like, oh, I mean at you once,
Speaker 1: she was real nice. You were there with a lot
Speaker 1: of like a lot of Southern characters. Yeah, especially towards
Speaker 1: the end there it was you and Miss Twila and
Speaker 1: Scout their names for Twila and scout y'all. Harperly could never.
Speaker 1: Well she literally did name one of her characters, but
Speaker 1: she could never. But she could never. It's actually a
Speaker 1: really culture number thirty eight. Harper could never. So then
Speaker 1: so then you get then you get the call to Micronesia,
Speaker 1: and then you were on the favorite Tribe. Yes, and
Speaker 1: how does it so? Then now you're there with like
Speaker 1: all stars who you probably are a fan of. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm there with like Seree and Aussie and you know,
Speaker 1: Johnny freaking fair Play and all these these superstars. Penner.
Speaker 1: It was. It was pretty intimidating. And I know, I
Speaker 1: know my love and it. You know, I caught a
Speaker 1: couple of unlucky breaks for sure, not that much. I
Speaker 1: really think I could have done differently. But it was
Speaker 1: still a great experience. I mean I got to be
Speaker 1: on I got to have my stick line, I got
Speaker 1: to be on the jury. Like it was still a
Speaker 1: really fun stick line. What I mean, I think you
Speaker 1: have a couple iconic lines because of course, and when
Speaker 1: so you placed fourth in Vanuatsu. So not only are
Speaker 1: you like on the show, but you do great and
Speaker 1: it's it was just sort of a blind side of
Speaker 1: you at the Top four because Chris, who ultimately won
Speaker 1: this season, was sort of running the game at that
Speaker 1: point and it just he just got you. And then
Speaker 1: when you get up there for the Travelic Council, you
Speaker 1: call them both deceptive, lying bitches, and to have your
Speaker 1: reality TV moment and then you get to say you
Speaker 1: are a dece active, lying bitch has to feel pretty good.
Speaker 1: I mean, sitting at Ponderosa writing out my speech being
Speaker 1: like and then I deliver it and I'm all, you know,
Speaker 1: with my arms and Top was great too. I was
Speaker 1: like one years old in my little tube Top. So
Speaker 1: basically she goes, my question is not really a question,
Speaker 1: it's a comment, and she says that the languages and
Speaker 1: she goes, I want an apology phenomenal to come in
Speaker 1: with a demand a question final tribal counseling. So great,
Speaker 1: And so then you're on Micronesia and we can see
Speaker 1: sort of you know, it's an incredible season of television.
Speaker 1: I mean, even even if even for a non winner,
Speaker 1: you have to admit and be proud of being a
Speaker 1: part of that because it's like so so crazy. But
Speaker 1: a friend of the show PARV and you like, there
Speaker 1: was a little bit of like it felt like there
Speaker 1: could only be one Highlander like on that season. Oh listen,
Speaker 1: we had it. We both had it out for each
Speaker 1: other from day one, and then I ultimately ended up
Speaker 1: being the vote that gave her the million dollars like
Speaker 1: poetic Yeah, yeah, I remember she talked about that too,
Speaker 1: like um, in retrospect, looking back, it's like, oh, had
Speaker 1: she heard even a little bit of how me and
Speaker 1: I was being like, then maybe she wouldn't have voted
Speaker 1: for me for the million. So interesting how things work out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Poverty is like the ultimate mean girl, but she makes
Speaker 1: it look good on Survivor for sure. She's a phenomenal
Speaker 1: Survivor player. Phenomenal. Yeah. I also and this is this
Speaker 1: is just meant in total earnest, Like I love the
Speaker 1: fact that she has transitioned from mean girl into like
Speaker 1: yoga mom and like wonderful, wonderful, wonderful yoga mom. I
Speaker 1: just I just love thinking about Survivor just being this
Speaker 1: like frozen and Amber moment for people, and then like
Speaker 1: they like move on to do amazing things like write
Speaker 1: children's books about meditation or like in your case, you're
Speaker 1: a public defender with legal aid society, and then now
Speaker 1: you're running for Manhattan d A. It's like, oh, this
Speaker 1: is a lovely like not many reality shows have this
Speaker 1: sort of long term narrative that we can all follow
Speaker 1: and track, and I feel like this is a very
Speaker 1: I don't know, it's just very cool to see what
Speaker 1: you're doing now. Um. And you send in interviews how
Speaker 1: being on these shows has helped you deal with people
Speaker 1: that you don't like, work with people you don't like,
Speaker 1: and even just withstand some weird negative assault on your
Speaker 1: character or aspersions that are being cast upon you. Definitely,
Speaker 1: And I do think like there are so many people
Speaker 1: in the Survivor alumni community who are just phenomenal humans
Speaker 1: who are out there doing incredible things changing the world,
Speaker 1: fighting against injustice, you know, who have really shown up
Speaker 1: and supported me in my campaign and been there for
Speaker 1: and like just really stepped up in like such major ways. Um.
Speaker 1: And it's incredible to be connected with this group of humans.
Speaker 1: That it's all because I went on this reality TV
Speaker 1: show and I was trying you one years old, Like
Speaker 1: that's wild, and it did prepare me in some ways,
Speaker 1: because I think there are so many things that running
Speaker 1: for office has also taught me. And I think that people,
Speaker 1: you know, you're just like reality TV. You're really putting
Speaker 1: yourself out there, and you're like, these are the things
Speaker 1: that I'm going to say, these are the things I believe.
Speaker 1: This is who I am authentically, and even if they
Speaker 1: don't see all of you, like you're the things that
Speaker 1: are put out or are the real things about you.
Speaker 1: And so someone pulls like one little quote from something
Speaker 1: and that's what and you have to deal with it.
Speaker 1: And then you know, I think that you know, I've
Speaker 1: been getting rape and death threats in my inboxes for
Speaker 1: for you know, a decade and a half, so it's
Speaker 1: nothing new. Um, it's so funny. I like put out
Speaker 1: something recently, like some I just was unhappy one morning
Speaker 1: or something, and I like screenshot at like three d
Speaker 1: m s I'd gotten in the last like thirty minutes.
Speaker 1: And it was just like a random Tuesday morning, and
Speaker 1: I put the three of them up and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is, by the way, just in case you were
Speaker 1: wondering what women, women, candidates, women go through in general
Speaker 1: on social media, this is just what I've gotten this pint.
Speaker 1: And people were like, oh my god, this is so terrible, Like, oh,
Speaker 1: I can't believe this. This is awful that you're doing.
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry, and I'm like, oh, like this is
Speaker 1: just a random thirty minute period on a Thursday morning,
Speaker 1: Like this is this is typical, Like this is hundreds
Speaker 1: of times a week, and like, yeah, we like make
Speaker 1: light of this stuff and like the horrible things that
Speaker 1: happened when like I've been zoom bombed recently and called
Speaker 1: terrible things and screamed at, and you know, it's like
Speaker 1: you try and make light of it, you try and
Speaker 1: tell the story. But also you have to be a
Speaker 1: resilient person. You have to have a pretty thick skin,
Speaker 1: um because otherwise when people tell you that they're gonna
Speaker 1: come kill you or that you should kill yourself, like
Speaker 1: maybe it would affect you, um in a in an
Speaker 1: intense way. Oh yeah, oh my gosh. Well I mean
Speaker 1: not to not to sort of like feigned disbelief women
Speaker 1: candidates going through venes, women in general going through this
Speaker 1: social media landscape. But I mean that is just it
Speaker 1: really takes some kind of like psychic fortitude to like really,
Speaker 1: I don't know, build up your walls high enough to
Speaker 1: know that like this is not relevant, that the threats
Speaker 1: are that most of the time, these threats are meant
Speaker 1: to be taken seriously and are just meant to intimidate you,
Speaker 1: scare you from, scare you from doing the great thing
Speaker 1: that you're doing right. And I think that part of
Speaker 1: being District Attorney is going to require like a pretty
Speaker 1: like intense resilience and the ability to be fearless in
Speaker 1: bringing prosecutions against those who are extremely powerful and well
Speaker 1: connected against holding the police accountable. You know, there there
Speaker 1: are people who will be out there who will seek
Speaker 1: to intimidate me, who will seek to threaten me and
Speaker 1: make it so that I don't act in a certain way.
Speaker 1: And that's just you know, I'm not susceptible to any
Speaker 1: of that. You know you bring up Um, obviously you're
Speaker 1: running for d A and not only are you running
Speaker 1: firm Manhattan d A, which would be a huge undertaking
Speaker 1: as is. Let's talk a little bit about Cyrus Evans,
Speaker 1: who's the current Manhattan d A. And I just want
Speaker 1: all the readers to listen up to some of the
Speaker 1: stuff that's gone down, Like as Cyrus Vance has held
Speaker 1: that office for the past a little bit over a decade,
Speaker 1: so this is this is just some stuff he declined
Speaker 1: to prosecute Harvey Weinstein in he dropped a fraud case
Speaker 1: against Ivanka and Don Jr. So I was just allowing
Speaker 1: with the wealthy and connected to get away with what
Speaker 1: they get what they do. He argued for leniency in
Speaker 1: the case against Jeffrey Epstein, who we all know how
Speaker 1: that ended up after he raped legions and legions of
Speaker 1: thirteen fourteen year old girls. And um, you know, just
Speaker 1: generally has allowed the wealthy and the connected and the
Speaker 1: white to get away with murder. You know something that
Speaker 1: really stuck out to me as I was researching this
Speaker 1: in the last ten years. I don't know if you
Speaker 1: know this poem, seventy people have been arrested in New
Speaker 1: York City for possession of what's called a gravity knife. Um,
Speaker 1: but Cyrus vans he'll just arrest seventy people because it's
Speaker 1: illegal to have this, but refuses to take action against
Speaker 1: the hardware stores that still sell this illegal product. And
Speaker 1: as of two thousand nineteen, it's no longer illegal. Because
Speaker 1: that was getting so fucking out of control, Cuomo finally
Speaker 1: did something about it. But I mean, this is a
Speaker 1: corrupt individual who currently holds the office of Manhattan d A.
Speaker 1: And it's important to say flat out he is a Democrat,
Speaker 1: and it's not this is not a Republican d A.
Speaker 1: This is a corrupt establishment Democrat. Well, it's he's a
Speaker 1: deeply entrenched incumbent who again, who has been in office
Speaker 1: for ten ten years. He hasn't is it true? He
Speaker 1: he hasn't officially announced that he will run for re election. Correct,
Speaker 1: he hasn't yet said whether he's running for re election.
Speaker 1: But he doesn't have to. And do you want to
Speaker 1: know why? Just another way in which these systems are
Speaker 1: built to maintain the status quo. Um, if you had
Speaker 1: wanted to give to Joe Biden or another candidate in
Speaker 1: the primary for president, you could donate a maximum of
Speaker 1: twenty hundred dollars and what's the limit for local action,
Speaker 1: like thirty something five thousand dollars are individual donor. So
Speaker 1: you know, in the first filing period we raised three
Speaker 1: thirty something thousand dollars from over thirty five hundred donations,
Speaker 1: which is amazing. And I'm so proud of the grassroots
Speaker 1: movement that we're building and like getting all these people
Speaker 1: who are supporting who are giving a dollar two dollars,
Speaker 1: five dollars, twenty dollars. It's amazing. But cive ants can
Speaker 1: spend an afternoon, he can call ten of his friends
Speaker 1: and say, hey, I need you to max out to
Speaker 1: me and raise three d fifty dollars from ten people
Speaker 1: in an afternoon. And this is how you know, this
Speaker 1: is why it's only ever been these very powerful people,
Speaker 1: powerful men, I should say, powerful white men, who have
Speaker 1: held this office. It has only ever been held by
Speaker 1: white men in the history of that office in the
Speaker 1: last in my lifetime, in our lifetime, it's been two
Speaker 1: white men. It's been Cyrus Fans for nearly twelve years,
Speaker 1: and Robert Morgan thought his predecessor for thirty six years,
Speaker 1: and four white men in the last century. Wow. Wow,
Speaker 1: And you, I think, are are? Are you the only
Speaker 1: public defender who's running for d A. And I've spent
Speaker 1: my career going up against that office, like going up
Speaker 1: against the pond S office, representing people who were charged
Speaker 1: by that office, who couldn't afford to hire a lawyer,
Speaker 1: who were, you know, charged with things as minor as
Speaker 1: jumping a turnstyle, you know, minor possession of marijuana, taking
Speaker 1: up two seats on the subway. Could you tell the
Speaker 1: story because this is what strikes This is what just
Speaker 1: really struck me. And you often referenced this the gentleman
Speaker 1: with the groceries. Yeah, I would love to hear I've
Speaker 1: so all the readers can hear about that for sure.
Speaker 1: So um, I think it's I think I represented him
Speaker 1: my first year as a public defender. For the purpose
Speaker 1: of the story, I'll call him John for John Doe.
Speaker 1: And John was an asistant manager at a Gristiis in
Speaker 1: Lower Manhattan. He'd worked at the same Gristiis for twenty
Speaker 1: five years, made his way up to assistant manager, and
Speaker 1: one night he was closing up the store at about
Speaker 1: eleven pm, he bought two bags of groceries with his
Speaker 1: employee discount, locked up the store, and walked over to
Speaker 1: the A train to head home to Upper Manhattan. And
Speaker 1: he got on the subway not crowded, put his bags
Speaker 1: on the seats next to him, and prepared for his
Speaker 1: long ride home. At the street stop, two uniformed NYPD
Speaker 1: officers got on the train, grabbed John's groceries, dumped them
Speaker 1: on the ground, and placed him in handcuffs, and proceeded
Speaker 1: to take him to jail for the night for the
Speaker 1: crime of occupying multiple seats on a transit facility. That's unbelievable.
Speaker 1: That and and he's how long was he taking up
Speaker 1: two seats on the train? Spent the next train, so
Speaker 1: then you were able to get him out the next day.
Speaker 1: But I got him out of jail the next day.
Speaker 1: But that's that doesn't Yeah, it doesn't change the fact
Speaker 1: and traumatized. All his family's groceries were thrown out, you know,
Speaker 1: he was he you know, didn't get to sleep at home,
Speaker 1: maybe he missed work the next day. Like it's all
Speaker 1: the things that happened to you from from being just arrested,
Speaker 1: even spending a day in jail is just it's horrifying.
Speaker 1: The amount of stories I've heard, just anecdotally, of people
Speaker 1: jumping turnstiles, who get like slammed up against a fucking wall.
Speaker 1: Like these are like women, I'm talking. I've heard stories
Speaker 1: from like elderly women who have been like slammed up
Speaker 1: against subway walls for like whatever fair evasion, I guess,
Speaker 1: but they just kind of like found themselves having to
Speaker 1: like do it. And that's not to like whatever, but
Speaker 1: I mean it's just like it none of it ever
Speaker 1: scales to the actual like like the victimless I mean,
Speaker 1: there's a distinction made to be made here about a
Speaker 1: victimless crime, right I mean? And then yes, exactly, But
Speaker 1: the thing is jumping a turnstyle isn't is class a misdemeanor.
Speaker 1: You face up to one year in jail for theft
Speaker 1: of services, So it's non infraction, even though like we
Speaker 1: think of it as being like you stole two dollars
Speaker 1: and seventy five cents, Like it should be an infraction.
Speaker 1: It should be a civil It should be something that
Speaker 1: is never ever ever punished by criminalization, by incarceration, by
Speaker 1: locking someone up in a cage like that. And also
Speaker 1: not to mention the cost to taxpayers, it costs nine
Speaker 1: and seventy five dollars to put someone on Riker's Island
Speaker 1: for one night, so like you could put someone in
Speaker 1: the nicest in New York City, like and it doesn't
Speaker 1: call you know, It's like when you think about the
Speaker 1: way in which we spend this money to to police,
Speaker 1: to surveil, to prosecute, to incarceerate people, when we could
Speaker 1: be investing that in in helping people, in investing in people,
Speaker 1: in addressing the underlying issues they're facing. It's just like
Speaker 1: we need to reimagine this, we need to think about
Speaker 1: transforming this system. And so I would imagine that you
Speaker 1: are in favor of defunding the police. Yes, we spend
Speaker 1: six billion dollars on policing like these. This is there
Speaker 1: is no there's no amount of like retraining that's going
Speaker 1: to fix the problem. We need to reallocate those resources
Speaker 1: into social services, into education and school and housing and
Speaker 1: food and everything. Yes, yes, very much. So I'm curious
Speaker 1: what your take is on the current um discussion that's
Speaker 1: happening in the Democratic Party about why those house seats
Speaker 1: were lost and why even why more house seats were lost.
Speaker 1: We have are we're we're in danger of being lost.
Speaker 1: We have these more moderate Democrats saying that the messages
Speaker 1: of Green New Deal, of defund the police, these things
Speaker 1: drove voters away. And then you have sort of AOC
Speaker 1: coming with the receipts, which are here's everyone that supported
Speaker 1: Medicare for all and they all got elected to or
Speaker 1: they were they were all re elected and what this
Speaker 1: message is not entirely factual. I would imagine that you
Speaker 1: know you're off. I mean, I think that there are
Speaker 1: I think that there there has to be recognition that
Speaker 1: not all districts are the same, and that there are
Speaker 1: people who, you know, we were in safe districts and
Speaker 1: people who are in swing districts, and we need to
Speaker 1: address things differently within those districts, etcetera, etcetera. But like
Speaker 1: I really, yeah, I really obviously find myself much more
Speaker 1: on the progressive wing of the party in that, you know,
Speaker 1: I think that it really is important, especially in places
Speaker 1: where people are receptive to the messages, to not be
Speaker 1: afraid to call out the things that are happening, to
Speaker 1: call out you know, systemic racism and injustice and these
Speaker 1: these things that exist that continue to oppress and marginalize
Speaker 1: members of our communities. And so I think that that
Speaker 1: there really is no there's no world in which like
Speaker 1: I would not be calling those things out. But I
Speaker 1: think that, you know, we have to we have to
Speaker 1: recognize that, um, not all districts are the same, and
Speaker 1: that there are other things in play regarding how someone
Speaker 1: lost a district more than just oh they didn't support
Speaker 1: medicare for all. I think it's more nuanced and complicated
Speaker 1: than that, of course, and it's so it's I I
Speaker 1: always hate how you know that it gets funneled through
Speaker 1: the media and then all we can see is the
Speaker 1: argument and not the fact that like there really shouldn't
Speaker 1: be a fucking argument, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 1: the we have we're dealing with white supremacy in in
Speaker 1: our policing, like and it's it's it's that's how it's
Speaker 1: that's how it was created. And you know, just in
Speaker 1: terms of facts, you know, a mass incarceration is up
Speaker 1: five percent over the past forty years, and the crime
Speaker 1: rates are not higher. Correct, it's I mean, can you
Speaker 1: speak a little bit to that, Like it's just that
Speaker 1: should say at all? Well, I mean, we we continue
Speaker 1: to incarce rate people for things like drugs. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think like the war on drugs has been like
Speaker 1: the biggest failure. It's not been a war on drugs,
Speaker 1: It's been a war on people. And that's people of color,
Speaker 1: l g B, t Q, i A, folks, you know,
Speaker 1: people with disabilities. It has just served to marginalize and
Speaker 1: oppress people. And I think, like what we can take
Speaker 1: away from this most recent election, like one of the
Speaker 1: most positive things, I mean, aside from evicting the current
Speaker 1: occupant of the White House. Is that everywhere that drugs
Speaker 1: were on the ballot, we won. Everywhere criminal justice reform
Speaker 1: was on the ballot, we won. And people are finally
Speaker 1: coming around to understanding that criminalizing human beings is not
Speaker 1: the answer, and that we need to legalize marijuana, we
Speaker 1: need to decriminalize all drugs. We need to favor you know,
Speaker 1: rehabilitation and treatment over punishment. And because when we lock
Speaker 1: people up, we're doing nothing to address a substance used
Speaker 1: disorder that someone's facing, nothing to address mental health issues
Speaker 1: that someone's facing, and maybe someone's self medicating with with
Speaker 1: drugs or alcohol. But like that doesn't mean that locking
Speaker 1: them up is going to solve any of that. And
Speaker 1: so it was really heartening to see those measures pass
Speaker 1: um you know, in Oregon and other places where where
Speaker 1: that was on the ballot, because this is a really
Speaker 1: big element on your platform, which is to divert um
Speaker 1: any little level drug charge or offense to a treatment program.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's like a big sort of item on
Speaker 1: your on your platform, which I don't want to prosecute
Speaker 1: low level drug offenses at all. I mean, we haven't
Speaker 1: decriminalized um all drugs here in New York and hopefully
Speaker 1: in the next session they're going to legalize marijuana. But
Speaker 1: but I hope that one day legislatively they will fix
Speaker 1: that in New York. But until they do, we need
Speaker 1: to elect prosecutors like me who say it doesn't matter
Speaker 1: whether or not this laws on the books. I get
Speaker 1: to use my discretion as the elected district attorney, and
Speaker 1: I will not prosecute drug possession anymore personal use possession.
Speaker 1: We will not prosecute that because all we're doing is
Speaker 1: either criminalizing a substance used disorder or criminalizing someone using
Speaker 1: drugs for what, for their own enjoyment or something. I
Speaker 1: mean like, but either way, when we talk about victimless crimes,
Speaker 1: like we talk about things that all we are doing
Speaker 1: is hurting people, hurting individuals, hurting their families. You know,
Speaker 1: people people get so riled up and they talk about,
Speaker 1: oh my god, Donald Trump has a family separation policy,
Speaker 1: and he's separating families on our southern border, and yet
Speaker 1: there's a family separation policy in your backyard. The district
Speaker 1: attorney is acting in your name. They stand up in
Speaker 1: court every day and say on the behalf of the
Speaker 1: people of the state of New York, and they separate
Speaker 1: families because the people who are getting locked up are
Speaker 1: people's children. They're people's parents, there are people's spouses, Um,
Speaker 1: there are people's siblings. And these are people who are
Speaker 1: getting locked up for things like possessing drugs. And that's
Speaker 1: why it's crucial to change the d A because if
Speaker 1: the d A doesn't change, the d A is the
Speaker 1: person that decides whether or not to prosecute these things.
Speaker 1: So can anything really change in the city if we
Speaker 1: don't change the d A, I mean flat out not
Speaker 1: really right, No, it'll be extremely difficult. You know, like
Speaker 1: having a district attorney who is like Saivance, who's really
Speaker 1: like extremely punitive, extreme, you know, perpetuates this like lock
Speaker 1: them up throwing the key mentality when it pertains to
Speaker 1: the majority of people in this city, you know, low
Speaker 1: income folks, black and brown folks, etcetera. It really just
Speaker 1: it perpetuates mass incarceration. It um, it actually doesn't make
Speaker 1: our city safer. Um when people say, oh, well, what
Speaker 1: about like, oh, you're gonna be letting out people who
Speaker 1: are criminals or something, you know that there's like this
Speaker 1: this this US versus them mentality, and the the current
Speaker 1: yer's office is really you know, use this language, this
Speaker 1: dehumanizing language. Oh, people are criminals, spelons, inmates, bodies, prisoners.
Speaker 1: All the language they use is so that people associate, Oh,
Speaker 1: it's them, It's not me, it's them. But when I
Speaker 1: tell stories like that of John and someone's like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, Like I put my purse on the seat
Speaker 1: next to me all the time, a crime I would
Speaker 1: not have even known. You weren't supposed to do that.
Speaker 1: Laying down on a park bench as a crime, you know,
Speaker 1: it's literally called obstruction of a park bench. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: putting something down on the sidewalk like immovable object, like
Speaker 1: it's There are so many things that are that are
Speaker 1: crimes in this city, but that they're only criminalized if
Speaker 1: you are a person of color, if you are someone
Speaker 1: who's low income, if you are someone who's experiencing homelessness.
Speaker 1: You know. And so having a district attorney who thinks
Speaker 1: about these people as people, as people who truly humanizes
Speaker 1: every single person. And that all comes from my lived
Speaker 1: experience of being a public defender and representing thousands of
Speaker 1: people and hearing all of their stories and meeting their
Speaker 1: families and sitting at their kitchen tables, and and seeing
Speaker 1: what their families go through when they are locked up.
Speaker 1: And and the reality is like, it doesn't make us
Speaker 1: safer when we lock people up. You know, we're sold
Speaker 1: this false choice, but it's not what's keeping us safe now.
Speaker 1: Because another thing about this sort of criminalizing criminal language
Speaker 1: that people use, where you're saying that it creates this
Speaker 1: US versus the mentality, is that it also, on top
Speaker 1: of that, I think, just compartmentalizes our understanding of the
Speaker 1: actual criminal activity that's happening in our neighborhoods, which is
Speaker 1: predatory land predatory landlords, um wage theft, over policing of
Speaker 1: like neighborhood it's just in a blanket way exactly. That's
Speaker 1: it's it's it's it's letting those things sort of live
Speaker 1: very invisibly without people having this awareness of that thing
Speaker 1: actually being criminal. Like the way that your landlord is
Speaker 1: exploiting you is the actual criminal thing. That person is
Speaker 1: the actual criminal who has maybe never been on rikers,
Speaker 1: but is it owns your fucking building, right exactly. And
Speaker 1: when you talk about wage theft, like if you think
Speaker 1: about the fact that like I mean, I can't even
Speaker 1: tell you how many people I've represented who have been
Speaker 1: charged with theft crimes for going into a CBS and
Speaker 1: stealing you know, a pint of ice cream or a
Speaker 1: Snickers bar or something, you know, something that's truly worth
Speaker 1: like four dollars nine cents or less, and they get prosecuted,
Speaker 1: held in jail, sent to jail, you know, et cetera.
Speaker 1: And then the person who's committing wage theft to the
Speaker 1: tune of millions, maybe tens of millions, maybe hundreds of
Speaker 1: millions of dollars, that person is not prosecuted. If any
Speaker 1: reper questions even come to that person, they're usually just okay,
Speaker 1: a fine, civil penalties, you know. And it's like the
Speaker 1: same goes for for you know, people who are operating
Speaker 1: construction sites where where their workers are in danger, where
Speaker 1: their union laborers are in danger. Right, But how is
Speaker 1: that a civil thing and not a criminal thing? Is Well,
Speaker 1: for the most part, these things don't really get investigated.
Speaker 1: But if there are sometimes investigations by the Attorney General's office,
Speaker 1: like then they'll be civil penalties rather than um criminal
Speaker 1: got it? Okay? I have another maybe wonky question. It
Speaker 1: might not even be wanting, but I'm curious it seems
Speaker 1: like Manhattan DA has this special relationship with the nip
Speaker 1: D and maybe this is a civance thing, but like
Speaker 1: like NYPD gets to prosecute certain criminal cases out of
Speaker 1: their own legal sort of unit or bureau or whatever.
Speaker 1: Is that is that true? I mean, can you can
Speaker 1: you maybe break that down for someone like me who
Speaker 1: doesn't really know how that so? Yes, So the NYPD,
Speaker 1: I think recently, which we heard during the protests, moved
Speaker 1: They're they're people who sit in the Manhattan DA's office
Speaker 1: out when Van said he was going to dismiss some
Speaker 1: of the protesters cases in in protests themselves, they moved out.
Speaker 1: And it's like, what what the hell were they doing
Speaker 1: there in the first place? Like having the police in
Speaker 1: the d a's office and having this close relationship where
Speaker 1: they're you know, giving money or they're supporting or their whatever, like,
Speaker 1: it means that the d A is not independent, is
Speaker 1: not able to bring the cases necessary to hold them accountable.
Speaker 1: And so there's just misconduct is just rampant. It's rampant,
Speaker 1: and it's and and the misconduct that I talked about,
Speaker 1: it's not just um it's well, first of all, obviously,
Speaker 1: it's what we see on these videos. It's the the
Speaker 1: assaults and brutalization and harassment and terrorizing um and you know,
Speaker 1: harming the members of our communities first of all. But
Speaker 1: then it's there's more than that. There's the false arrests.
Speaker 1: There is the um, the perjury. You know, their their
Speaker 1: their police offic So they walk into the court, do
Speaker 1: you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and
Speaker 1: nothing but the truth? I do, And then that person
Speaker 1: lies under oath, either in front of a judge, in
Speaker 1: front of a jury, in front of a grand jury,
Speaker 1: and there are zero repercussions, none, and oftentimes defense counsel
Speaker 1: can't even find out about it. You know, their misconduct
Speaker 1: is shielded by the d a's office, and so the
Speaker 1: Manhattan DA has just been absolutely complicit in this, you know,
Speaker 1: completely repetitive and awful misconduct by the NYPD. And so
Speaker 1: you know, it's just past time that we that we
Speaker 1: hold them accountable for these harms. And they know right
Speaker 1: now that they're not gonna be held accountable, and so
Speaker 1: they really just operate with impunity. And this is why,
Speaker 1: this is really why I think it's important to let
Speaker 1: people know that you're the only I feel like it's
Speaker 1: to have a public defender be district attorney, would would
Speaker 1: actually be the most impactful means of not just forming
Speaker 1: but yeah, like, as you say, transforming that office in
Speaker 1: a way that actually benefits everybody, not even self, you know, yeah,
Speaker 1: for anyone moved right now while this is happening. If
Speaker 1: you're if you're getting angry about the state of things,
Speaker 1: you can go to Aliza Orleans dot com and make
Speaker 1: a donation. I'm a proud donor. And um uh well,
Speaker 1: I'll remind you again at the end of the episode.
Speaker 1: But um, I wanted to ask um just specifically about
Speaker 1: um all of this in relation to the pandemic, which
Speaker 1: is ongoing. Even though we have some promising news about
Speaker 1: potentially a vaccine that's out this week. We will see
Speaker 1: our fingers are crossed. But I wanted to ask you
Speaker 1: from your view, has the incarceration rates slowed or decreased
Speaker 1: in any way as a response to the prison system
Speaker 1: being a breeding ground for this virus or do you
Speaker 1: still see a concerning rate with which this is all happening.
Speaker 1: It is incredibly concerning. Actually we're being right now. I
Speaker 1: think data was just released in the last couple of
Speaker 1: days that we're seeing an increase in the number of
Speaker 1: people at Rikers Island in the capacity there. And I
Speaker 1: think that it is so dangerous to be holding people
Speaker 1: in jails and prisons, especially during a pandemic. I mean,
Speaker 1: what we saw is that the rates of infection in
Speaker 1: our jails and prisons were more than ten times that
Speaker 1: of New York City, even when New York City was
Speaker 1: at its worst back in in March April. And I
Speaker 1: mean it makes you know, if you think about it,
Speaker 1: It's like people entering our jails in prisons are already
Speaker 1: some of the most vulnerable in our society, and during incarceration,
Speaker 1: that vulnerability is just exacerbated by tightly confined spaces, inadequate
Speaker 1: access to medical care, unsanitary conditions. You know, no soap, um,
Speaker 1: you know, no no toilet paper, thirty to forty people
Speaker 1: sharing a toilet, mess halls where you're sitting shoulder to
Speaker 1: shoulder with people eating off of dirty trays um. You know,
Speaker 1: hand sanitizer is literally contraband when you are in jail,
Speaker 1: there's certainly no ability to social distance. They were telling people, oh,
Speaker 1: sleephead to foot instead of both heads facing the same
Speaker 1: direction when the beds are eighteen inches apart. That is
Speaker 1: not social distancing. You know, jails are incubators and there's
Speaker 1: no way to keep disease from spreading. So this is
Speaker 1: you know, and and said vance during the pandemic, instead
Speaker 1: of decarcerating, instead of releasing as many people as he
Speaker 1: possibly could, he was still actively sending people to Rikers Island,
Speaker 1: actively asking for bail on people. You know, a fifty
Speaker 1: three year old man died um who was incarcerated on
Speaker 1: a technical parole violation, which for those who don't know,
Speaker 1: means he missed a curfew or missed a meeting, or
Speaker 1: had dirty urine for smoking marijuana. Like this is a
Speaker 1: person who was sentenced to death because of this. And
Speaker 1: so you know, this just means that that the d
Speaker 1: a's policies have more of an imp act on this
Speaker 1: than ever and and this is just completely urgent, as
Speaker 1: COVID once again surges, Yeah, this this actually reminds me
Speaker 1: of something else. That's because it's also part of your
Speaker 1: platform to close Rikers and UM make sure that there's
Speaker 1: no more new prisons UM developed built in the state
Speaker 1: City New York statewide. Like that's that's part of what
Speaker 1: you're doing. And I also was really struck by UM.
Speaker 1: Currently in place in Manhattan is the conviction Integrity program
Speaker 1: U s d A would establish a conviction review unit.
Speaker 1: Can you talk about the difference between what you're proposing
Speaker 1: UM in terms of UM what what exists currently? Definitely
Speaker 1: and and the the current conviction integrity unit has no integrity.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's window dressing. And it's just it's like
Speaker 1: the idea that we should be not thinking about reviewing
Speaker 1: cases where we know that officers our UM people who
Speaker 1: have committed misconduct and yet their testimony served as the
Speaker 1: soul basis for someone to end up incarcerated, serving decades
Speaker 1: or serving life. Uh, you know, it's it's completely outrageous.
Speaker 1: So I think that you know, we need to be
Speaker 1: reviewing We need to not only be reviewing for for
Speaker 1: innocence claims, but we also need to be reviewing sentences.
Speaker 1: We need to be reviewing cases where someone's detained pre trial. UM.
Speaker 1: We need to be thinking about those things. And especially
Speaker 1: in terms of a wrongful conviction unit, you know, it
Speaker 1: needs to be completely overhauled and it needs to be
Speaker 1: fully staffed. There need to be people who are working
Speaker 1: in conjunction with an Innocence Commission to screen cases to
Speaker 1: make sure that we're avoiding future wrongful convictions. And you know,
Speaker 1: I think all of doing all of those things will hopefully,
Speaker 1: you know, restore public trust in in this system. Yeah. Absolutely.
Speaker 1: And also I just all readers should should remember and
Speaker 1: know that you know, choke holds have been illegal in
Speaker 1: New York for decades, and that you know, we still
Speaker 1: saw what happened to Eric Garner, and so these that's
Speaker 1: what we talked about when we talk about misconduct, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, It's not just like someone not
Speaker 1: doing their due diligence here and there. It's things that
Speaker 1: result in the loss of human life. So that's um,
Speaker 1: it's just important to say out loud. Um, I think
Speaker 1: we should probably take a quick break, yes, and then
Speaker 1: come back and ask the question, Oh, okay, we're back
Speaker 1: with the Lives of Orleans. If you, like me, UM,
Speaker 1: are very motivated by everything she's saying on this episode,
Speaker 1: I would encourage you to donate lines of Orleans dot com.
Speaker 1: I'm going to donate as soon as we get off
Speaker 1: this zoom, and you better trust and believe I will.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna maybe think about maxing out to the um
Speaker 1: perhaps honestly, and just remember that Civans can call up
Speaker 1: his damn friend and they're going to write a damn check,
Speaker 1: So we should all be writing the same check. Max
Speaker 1: out max out for Eliza title of up mat, I
Speaker 1: think you should ask the question. Okay, so Eliza Um.
Speaker 1: On every episode of Last Cultures, we ask a question
Speaker 1: of our guests, and that question is what was the
Speaker 1: culture that made you say culture was for you? So
Speaker 1: this is that thing that happened that a young developmental
Speaker 1: age could be in the pop culture, could be the
Speaker 1: culture surrounding you that you look back and say, wow,
Speaker 1: that made me. Eliza Orleans, well, I think we already
Speaker 1: kind of covered it, but I swear it was summer
Speaker 1: two thousand. It was the first ever season Survivors. Like
Speaker 1: it made me me. I was like, oh, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: go beyond that show, Like I'm gonna I'm going on
Speaker 1: that show. Like I watched Richard Hatchet along with fifty
Speaker 1: million other people made that million dollars, and I like,
Speaker 1: watch that rat and Snake speech, you know, Sue Hawk,
Speaker 1: And I was like, you you knew you were going
Speaker 1: to get your Sue Hawk speech one day and damn well,
Speaker 1: Like like where would you did you did you have
Speaker 1: an awareness of like where this ambition was being placed before,
Speaker 1: like pre Survivor, Like what were you Like, Like I
Speaker 1: feel like once you once you see something like Survivor
Speaker 1: and you're like, I'm gonna be on that show. I
Speaker 1: feel like that implies that you had some sort of
Speaker 1: like you're a goal oriented person. But then like what
Speaker 1: were your goals before that? Well, so this is so funny.
Speaker 1: This is a funny. It's a I guess it's a
Speaker 1: thing that everybody does, like goal setting. Right. I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm going to learn Mandarin. I like, you know, I
Speaker 1: spoke when I was a kid, so like the tonal
Speaker 1: stuff was kind of in the back of my head.
Speaker 1: So I minored in Mandarin in college. I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm going to run a marathon. I ran a marathon.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm gonna, you know, take my l
Speaker 1: SATs and go to law school and and you know,
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, I'm gonna go on Survivor
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna be a public defender and so like
Speaker 1: these are just gold and now I'm like I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be the next Manhattan DA. So you are I urg
Speaker 1: around this and I know that the deck is so
Speaker 1: it can feel so stacked, but I mean, I just
Speaker 1: have so much belief that people, that real people can
Speaker 1: figure out that this is something that would make a
Speaker 1: huge difference. And you know, when people talk about caring
Speaker 1: about local politics as much as we do national politics,
Speaker 1: this is what we're talking about. This is what it is.
Speaker 1: And if there can be anything positive taken from the
Speaker 1: Trump administration, it's that I know, and I know so
Speaker 1: many people that know that we will never feel complacent
Speaker 1: again in our lifetimes. Because how could you I mean,
Speaker 1: like you were saying, like in terms of how things
Speaker 1: shook out with the legalization of drugs around the country,
Speaker 1: I mean we did. We did have an amazing um
Speaker 1: increasing of the squad in in the House, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. I'm so excited for Corey Bush and
Speaker 1: you know everyone, Jamal Bowman, you know, I mean, it's
Speaker 1: so many people that are going to you know, become
Speaker 1: a part of that voice in the House. And yes,
Speaker 1: we did, quoe unquote, lose some seats, but we what
Speaker 1: we gained in the in that vocal minority in the
Speaker 1: House right now, which is really speaking for us the
Speaker 1: people so it really is. It's just so exciting. I'm
Speaker 1: so excited for you. I really do. I'm excited too,
Speaker 1: and like, I really know we can do this. I
Speaker 1: know we can do this, and it's gonna be it's
Speaker 1: gonna be a tough fight, but I know that we
Speaker 1: can get a public defender to the Manhattan DA's office
Speaker 1: and truly like bring this bold transformational change that the
Speaker 1: whole rest of the country will look at and be like, wow,
Speaker 1: we can do it too. We can do that. That's
Speaker 1: how we can have justice. That's what equity and justice,
Speaker 1: that's what it looks like. Yeah, and I think I
Speaker 1: have I have thinking to myself. I was thinking to myself, like,
Speaker 1: if only you had um sort of positively manifested winning
Speaker 1: survivor and not just being on Survivor, may I nothing,
Speaker 1: but you got damn clue. I saved it to the
Speaker 1: Manhattan DA race my winning manifestation. I do want to ask,
Speaker 1: and I always actually we talked a lot with part
Speaker 1: of about Edge of Extinction, but and how what a
Speaker 1: miserable physical experience that is and and so demoralizing and everything.
Speaker 1: But for you on your first season, y'all experienced an earthquake,
Speaker 1: crazy storms. What was the hardest thing about being on Survivor?
Speaker 1: I mean, I've never been so hungry in my life.
Speaker 1: It is like this. It is all consuming. I mean
Speaker 1: to the point where every time you stand up, you
Speaker 1: like go black behind your eyes because you're eating like
Speaker 1: a couple of hundred calories a day. I lost like
Speaker 1: more than a fifth of my body weight, Like I
Speaker 1: was like down to bones, Like it was really bad. Um,
Speaker 1: I was truly starving, and like my hair was falling
Speaker 1: out in clumps like it was. It was rough. And
Speaker 1: I guess my question is, so you get onto the
Speaker 1: get on the beach, and you're probably like we spoke
Speaker 1: on the phone a couple of months ago and you
Speaker 1: described it as a shit eating grin that you were
Speaker 1: wearing while and then then you go through that experience
Speaker 1: what they do on some seasons of Okay, here's a
Speaker 1: map and carry all your ship and find the camp.
Speaker 1: How quickly does it set in? How quickly does it
Speaker 1: go from I'm on my favorite show to funk, I'm
Speaker 1: a human being in the on an island, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Ten minutes, Like the first ten minutes,
Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, did you we're on the show, and
Speaker 1: then it's like, oh my god, it's getting dark. We
Speaker 1: have to And then half the people are like, we
Speaker 1: should just hunker down here for the night, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know what, what do you nuts? Like, we're gonna
Speaker 1: go find our camp like anyhow, It's just yeah, it's
Speaker 1: a total it's a disaster. It's like immediate. And then
Speaker 1: you forget the cameras are on. You're exhausted and paranoid
Speaker 1: and starving and just just trying to survive, So you
Speaker 1: do genuinely forget that the cameras are there. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's not that you forget, it's just that you stopped caring. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you understand them to be part of the environment,
Speaker 1: like a natural part of the environment, almost right, But
Speaker 1: if you had wanted to present some polished version of
Speaker 1: yourself when you are that depleted and starving and emotional
Speaker 1: and you don't sleep and everyone's trying to vote you out,
Speaker 1: like you can't even if you wanted to, Like, I mean,
Speaker 1: I've gone thirty days without seeing my mom before um,
Speaker 1: they told us that we were playing for a video
Speaker 1: chat with our loved one. And then after I won
Speaker 1: the challenge, Jeff was like, well, Leza, wouldn't it be
Speaker 1: better if your mom were here? Susan come on out?
Speaker 1: And I'm like, bad, oh my god, I always cry.
Speaker 1: I always cry, like sobbing, like sobbing crying like my
Speaker 1: mom's coming out. I mean, it was just it's just hysterical.
Speaker 1: But you're so emotionally drained and just so starved for
Speaker 1: like someone you love and trust, and it's it's yeah,
Speaker 1: it's tough. Well then, because I feel like I can
Speaker 1: barely follow the forty chest that's being played from home.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, if I am physically drained, emotionally drained,
Speaker 1: mentally drained, I don't have it in me to like
Speaker 1: plot certain blind sides or like checking on my alliances.
Speaker 1: I'm like that's the part of the the the entire
Speaker 1: game of Survivor that like really confounds me. And I'm
Speaker 1: so amazed by it that the people are able to
Speaker 1: operate in this very like hyper aware way and like
Speaker 1: be very nuanced and they're thinking, and I'm just like,
Speaker 1: I can't even do that when I'm like fully fed,
Speaker 1: fully sheltered. Any of that. Fields is a witch. She
Speaker 1: has something going on in her brain that is she
Speaker 1: should be president of the United States because because for me,
Speaker 1: it's just like you're talking about all this stuff and
Speaker 1: you're saying ten minutes and you're already like fuck. I mean,
Speaker 1: well that's like days and weeks into the show and
Speaker 1: she's able to engineer this thing that gets as out.
Speaker 1: I mean, they all just so brilliant. She's so brilliant.
Speaker 1: She's got a should be she should be like a hospital.
Speaker 1: She should be like a hospital ad in or something like.
Speaker 1: She she's a nurse, she's been a nurse for all
Speaker 1: these years, and she's she's incredible, but she should she
Speaker 1: has like the like the the experience to like lead
Speaker 1: a whole fucking operation. I mean also like then it's
Speaker 1: just it's just crazy to me, just like you you
Speaker 1: watching it, I think we're this is so insane to say,
Speaker 1: but she was all of us, Like I say, we
Speaker 1: were going to bring back the expression Aliza is all
Speaker 1: of us right now. Um, but like in watching it,
Speaker 1: like it's so shocking, and then are you like well
Speaker 1: fed when you're at Ponderosa, which is where you go,
Speaker 1: so you you you're then you're just chilling and like party.
Speaker 1: So wait, funny story. So in my first twenty four
Speaker 1: hours after getting voted out, so I had lost twenty
Speaker 1: pounds and and in the first twenty four hours after
Speaker 1: I got voted out, I gained seven pounds. Are you kidding?
Speaker 1: But like my finger were like sausages like like every
Speaker 1: because like I hadn't had any salt or anything, so
Speaker 1: like I had cankles, like everything was. I was like
Speaker 1: retaining water. It was. I was a mess, and I
Speaker 1: had a parasite. I was super sick for a very
Speaker 1: long time. Yeah. See that's the whole other thing of
Speaker 1: it all, is it like what is happening to your
Speaker 1: your digestional system. Not to get crazy here, but every time,
Speaker 1: like I was watching one of the seasons during my binge,
Speaker 1: and I believe it was Caraman or something, and it
Speaker 1: was they were all competing for cookies and milk, and
Speaker 1: so they win and they're like shoving down these cookies
Speaker 1: and milk, and someone on the other team just goes,
Speaker 1: you don't want that. It's just diarrhea. You're competing. It's
Speaker 1: insane that there and the coffee and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: Of course, in the moment, I was like, oh, you're
Speaker 1: not gonna do I like ever, like hold back and
Speaker 1: not eat the thing or drink the coffee or do
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, you do, and then it just
Speaker 1: makes you horribly ill, like you're not gonna not eat
Speaker 1: or drink anything they give you. But of course it
Speaker 1: makes you so sick because you won one of those
Speaker 1: big um you want to challenge which and this is whenever,
Speaker 1: like we were so um we were watching uh this
Speaker 1: season China and it was like so frustrating when PG
Speaker 1: was just she didn't win a single thing. And then
Speaker 1: they all got to have this experience. Like I'm always
Speaker 1: so bummed out when people don't get to have like
Speaker 1: the cultural experience for whatever as they're going. And you
Speaker 1: actually won the challenge in Vanuatu and you got to
Speaker 1: have that experience. Could you talk a little bit about
Speaker 1: like just getting to experience like that culture. It was
Speaker 1: so incredible, Like we got included in this feast and
Speaker 1: we met the children and we got to like spend
Speaker 1: the night there and participate in their ceremonies and cooking
Speaker 1: and everything, and like it was so incredible, like really
Speaker 1: truly like a once in a lifetime opportunity. And so yeah,
Speaker 1: it's really sad for the people who miss out on that,
Speaker 1: not just for like a night of decent sleep or meal.
Speaker 1: It's like the cultural experience is so so so important. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I just remember my heart broke for her in that
Speaker 1: moment when she was like, I'm being excluded from everything,
Speaker 1: and you could tell that was that was the Great
Speaker 1: Wall trip. That was the Great Wall trip pg PG
Speaker 1: want the challenge where the where she did win the
Speaker 1: cultural she did get she did when the Great Wall
Speaker 1: thing happened. I was like, because I remember the first
Speaker 1: episode because she was she was so touched to be
Speaker 1: there because like it's it's you know, like it's her
Speaker 1: culture and like you know, it meant so much to her.
Speaker 1: And then when she didn't get to go to the
Speaker 1: Great Wall, I was like, fuck everyone else. I was like,
Speaker 1: I hate this, but you truly did win that experience
Speaker 1: and I was gonna I get here from the digestion
Speaker 1: of it all because you were like not holding back
Speaker 1: on that food and I'm like, girl, I don't know,
Speaker 1: like I get like the impulse control is that a zero?
Speaker 1: Because you need to eat? But then I keep thinking
Speaker 1: their stomachs are so so shrunk, like your body is
Speaker 1: probably acting a fool. And I won the I won
Speaker 1: the car. You won the car. She came with a
Speaker 1: big dinner, which made us very sick. That was a
Speaker 1: challenge to I know, I know that, and the loved
Speaker 1: ones visit. Yeah, I know, my god, Eliza Orleans, everybody.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I don't think so Honey is
Speaker 1: related to it. But what are your broad impressions of
Speaker 1: what's gone down in the last week, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? I want to hear from you, like where
Speaker 1: where were you? What's your experience with all of this
Speaker 1: before we get out and think so Honey, Oh my gosh, um,
Speaker 1: it's like hard to even believe that it's real. Like
Speaker 1: I think it's still sinking in for me that we
Speaker 1: that we beat Trump. But I think, you know, election
Speaker 1: night was tough, Like like you both were saying at
Speaker 1: the beginning, this was this was hard and it was
Speaker 1: not a referendum on Trump and the rest of the GOP,
Speaker 1: which has been completely complicit with all of the horrors
Speaker 1: that he's perpetrated over these last four years. So I
Speaker 1: think that was pretty devastating to witness and to be like, wow,
Speaker 1: seventy million people and even if we win, like seventy
Speaker 1: million people in this country voted for him, like agree
Speaker 1: with all of these horrible things that he's done. Um.
Speaker 1: But then of course when it was announced, I met
Speaker 1: up with people and we danced in the streets and
Speaker 1: we cheered and we chanted USA, and it was like
Speaker 1: we can be like proud to be American again. You know.
Speaker 1: It's like it's like, let's let's take back the Americans,
Speaker 1: let's take back patriotism, let's take that. You know. So
Speaker 1: that's and then and then the next day I was like, so,
Speaker 1: do we get to start protesting Joe Biden yet or
Speaker 1: to because I I spoke with you right after he
Speaker 1: announced comalass VP and I asked how you were feeling
Speaker 1: and you were like not great, You're feeling great, yeah,
Speaker 1: but honestly. But then of course I got down to
Speaker 1: business and I was like, all right, now got win.
Speaker 1: It all costs, Like we have to win this, um,
Speaker 1: and we can push for the progressive policies that need
Speaker 1: to happen, we can push to end things, but like
Speaker 1: we had to get them. We had to get them
Speaker 1: a win um. And it is historic. I mean when
Speaker 1: I watched her speak, I cried, and you know I
Speaker 1: cried watching him speak. I was like he wasn't even
Speaker 1: in my top five. Like and I'm crying speaking, It's
Speaker 1: like this just this emotional emotional build up over over
Speaker 1: four years of really fighting back and resisting and pushing
Speaker 1: for for change. So it's it's definitely historic. And I'm
Speaker 1: I'm certainly you know, happy ish with the results and
Speaker 1: and we'll keep But you know the problem is, I
Speaker 1: think some people are like, Okay, cool, now what are
Speaker 1: you guys all gonna do with all your mental space
Speaker 1: and energy. I'm like, whoa, whoa. Work is not done.
Speaker 1: It's just needs to work even harder, Like this is
Speaker 1: the beginning exactly. And you know, like, like I said
Speaker 1: at the top of the app um, these leaks about
Speaker 1: what the what the cabinet choices might be, are not
Speaker 1: it you guys, And I mean we need to be
Speaker 1: really really um stride and vocal about that. I know
Speaker 1: you referred to yourself proudly as a Warren Democrat. Do
Speaker 1: you see any role for her and that administration? Or
Speaker 1: you think she's good where she is in the Senate.
Speaker 1: She should be in the administration. You know, she should
Speaker 1: be wherever she wants. And if that's Treasury secretary, she
Speaker 1: should be Treasury secretary. She would be incredible, incredible in
Speaker 1: the administration. Have you met her? Yes, three times? That's
Speaker 1: the cool. Have you seen the pictures of me from
Speaker 1: the first time I met her? I was actually I
Speaker 1: was kind of just asking. I didn't know you knew that.
Speaker 1: So I was walking with a friend, actually the friend
Speaker 1: that I was celebrating with on the streets on Saturday. Um.
Speaker 1: We were walking from Union Square up UM. I think
Speaker 1: we were walking up Park Avenue South, and I was
Speaker 1: we were talking about Elizabeth Warren because I'm like, I
Speaker 1: was like always talking about this is when she was
Speaker 1: still running obviously, and I was and I was like,
Speaker 1: I really truly believe. I think she's gonna be our
Speaker 1: next president. Like she's so amazing. And I go, oh
Speaker 1: my god, there she is. My friend goes what and
Speaker 1: I go, there's Elizabeth Warren. And then I took off
Speaker 1: and I ran across the street and she It was
Speaker 1: the night of the CNN Climate town hall, so she
Speaker 1: was just walking because that's what she does. She walks
Speaker 1: like ten miles a day. She's like, you know, and
Speaker 1: she's very recognizable in her card again and her Oh
Speaker 1: my god. And I was like and She's standing there
Speaker 1: and she's got a few people around, and I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god. I was like, can I say hi?
Speaker 1: Can I? Is it okay if I say hied her?
Speaker 1: And they were like, give us your phone. So they
Speaker 1: just started snapping pictures of me, and I am doing
Speaker 1: my Eliza things of being like like my my like
Speaker 1: neck tendons or like bulgeit. I'm like freaking out. I'm
Speaker 1: so excited. I'm like, I was just talking about you.
Speaker 1: I love your criminal justice reform plan. Thank you for
Speaker 1: mentioning public defenders. I mean, I'm just like gushing, like
Speaker 1: embarrassing me. I was shaking, and I like, I've met
Speaker 1: like legit celebrities. I've met like super Bowl winning athletes.
Speaker 1: I have met like rock stars, like top number one
Speaker 1: on the charts, top musicians, and I'm like, Hi, nice
Speaker 1: to meet you on and like the only meltdown I've
Speaker 1: ever had over anyone like that that was embarrassing Shan
Speaker 1: Girling was Elizabeth worn I gotta say, We're being at
Speaker 1: SNL on the last show before Lockdown. Everybody at that show,
Speaker 1: including our very good friend, our best friend, Sudie Green,
Speaker 1: who's worked at that show for six seasons, never get starstruck,
Speaker 1: knows what the boundaries are. She was like, it was
Speaker 1: the first time you've ever seen her nervous around someone.
Speaker 1: She's like, I'm nervous. I was like, that's her hero,
Speaker 1: and like I was so, so, so nervous to meet her.
Speaker 1: And it was just such a seamless, natural, warm interaction
Speaker 1: where she was like would you like a picture? Immediately
Speaker 1: just was like would you like a picture? And we
Speaker 1: were like yes, Um yeah, just like what if? What if? What? What?
Speaker 1: What if? What a figure? I mean, like her and
Speaker 1: Bernie just kind of really shifted my whole definite view
Speaker 1: of what can be done, of what a candidate could be. Um,
Speaker 1: that's that's amazing. That's amazing that you've gotten, that you've
Speaker 1: gotten to meet her. You know, she's incredible. I mean
Speaker 1: I idolized her. The party better too, because like the
Speaker 1: Democratic Party, like sometimes it's annoying how big of attent
Speaker 1: it is because you feel like you're screaming to be heard.
Speaker 1: But it really was kind of inspiring to see there
Speaker 1: was there was like a lot of exchange of very
Speaker 1: different ideas all throughout our debate process and our primary process,
Speaker 1: and I know a lot of people were frustrated with
Speaker 1: the primary process. But I actually thought, you know, at
Speaker 1: least all of these things are being spoken out loud
Speaker 1: on a on a world stage. I mean, now they
Speaker 1: are saying things like medicare for all. It's like part
Speaker 1: of people's everyday language, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 1: defund the police is it has traction and like everyone everyone,
Speaker 1: you know, if you're on the right side of things,
Speaker 1: you're behind it. Like so these things, I mean, we've
Speaker 1: shifted the overton window on a lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of topics where you know, people were not talking about
Speaker 1: these I mean even even on criminal justice issues, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean Joe Biden is the first president elected in
Speaker 1: our country who says categorically we should abolish the death penalty. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a big deal, big deal, you know. He says
Speaker 1: things like we should end cash bail, we should abolish
Speaker 1: like it is. I mean, listen, is he as progressive
Speaker 1: as as as any of us want? No? Probably not.
Speaker 1: But like the fact that these things are being said,
Speaker 1: and the fact that that there are people within our
Speaker 1: party who just continue to push for those things, is
Speaker 1: is a really big deal, really big deal, especially those
Speaker 1: who were on the national stage, people like Elizabeth Warren
Speaker 1: and Bernie Sanders and Julian Castro, like who really pushed
Speaker 1: these things? Absolutely, And you know Biden's only saying these
Speaker 1: things because they were pushed so hard by these individuals
Speaker 1: or else else. You better, you better bet your bottom
Speaker 1: dollar they would not being said. Um so, and you
Speaker 1: know that's because the man's inclination is to float Meg
Speaker 1: Whitman for the cat. So that's that's that's kind of
Speaker 1: where there's a rub um. But anyway, Yeah, I just
Speaker 1: wanted to want it to get And just before we
Speaker 1: move on, what do you think about, um, the legal challenges?
Speaker 1: Just as obviously someone in the legal profession, what do
Speaker 1: you think about what he is doing? Is it just
Speaker 1: sort of like he's within his rights to check that
Speaker 1: the election was I guess, quote unquote fair. Um, do
Speaker 1: you think there's any validity to to this? Like, what's
Speaker 1: your feedback, um to all of us who's watching this
Speaker 1: sort of happen as Trump disputes the result, Um that
Speaker 1: these are completely baseless. He's gone over ten and he
Speaker 1: will continue to be defeated in the courts because even
Speaker 1: Republican judges are going to uphold the rule of law.
Speaker 1: And this is an absolute ridiculous you know, grasping at
Speaker 1: Straw's effort. Very sassy week for the judiciary, very much
Speaker 1: that very that. Um. Okay, so um, I'm gonna have
Speaker 1: to have a sassy week for the judiciary on that,
Speaker 1: on that one. Okay. So now to move on to
Speaker 1: I don't think so honey. Um. There's just so much too.
Speaker 1: I think so honey, And I don't think so honey.
Speaker 1: But I have narrowed down to something. It is not political, um,
Speaker 1: but might be for some m hmm. Okay. Do you
Speaker 1: think I'm really interested to see what this is? This
Speaker 1: is Matt Rodgers, I don't think so, honey. As time
Speaker 1: starts now, I don't think so honey. When you're things
Speaker 1: are freezing in the frigerator, okay, I'm sorry, honey, but
Speaker 1: the last I checked, thing's supposed to freeze and the freezer, mama.
Speaker 1: And if I'm going to my refrigerator and I'm looking
Speaker 1: at the settings and everything seems copasetic, why is my
Speaker 1: lacroix frozen in the fridge? I don't think so, honey.
Speaker 1: This is a bullshit, because I'll tell you what happens
Speaker 1: when a liquid is frozen, Honey, it's much more difficult
Speaker 1: to drink. And I if I'm going to the fridge
Speaker 1: to pull out of something, a can of something, then
Speaker 1: I better be able to drink it, because if I
Speaker 1: wanted it to be frozen, it would be in the fridge.
Speaker 1: It's like Nicki Minaj said, if I wanted to be
Speaker 1: drinking the pickle juice, I'll drinking pickle juice right now.
Speaker 1: But anyway, I have a very similar situation between my
Speaker 1: fridge and my freezer. Someone, please reader with knowledge on
Speaker 1: the situation. If you are an expert on fridges five
Speaker 1: the way that allies is an expert on our legal system,
Speaker 1: then please reach out to me and to make me
Speaker 1: understand why this is happening, because until then I don't
Speaker 1: think so, honey, And that's woman. Can I say something?
Speaker 1: I am, You can say whatever you want. I'm experiencing
Speaker 1: the same exact issue my the other stuff, my Blomberg fridge.
Speaker 1: It's missing an oh. First of all, that's pathetic. B
Speaker 1: L O M B E R G like hello at
Speaker 1: an extra O. And then make me question whether or
Speaker 1: not this is from a billionaire. But my fridge and
Speaker 1: I'm and I'm like turning it up to like the
Speaker 1: highest temperature setting, but it's still freezes my ship. I
Speaker 1: don't know what crazy is going on. And then I have,
Speaker 1: and then I'm an idiot. I'm like, because if you
Speaker 1: can't get your fridge to keep your stuff cold, I
Speaker 1: really hate when I pull out a can of Seltzer
Speaker 1: and it's like not cold enough. I'm like, what that
Speaker 1: is so New York. That is so New York fridge. No,
Speaker 1: I'm experiencing it. It's these ship New York fridges and
Speaker 1: these New York appliances that don't work. And that's another
Speaker 1: reason why I say, go West, young man, binary friends,
Speaker 1: come out West, come to Los Angeles. I used to
Speaker 1: be you. I used to say, no, it's okay. I'll
Speaker 1: deal with the cold winters and the fridges that are
Speaker 1: that keep my beverages too warm and don't don't cool anything.
Speaker 1: Now I'm over it. But then again, here I am
Speaker 1: in a Los Angeles apartment in the the lacroix are frozen.
Speaker 1: So I don't know what to say. But someone reach
Speaker 1: out to Matt. If you're if you're an expert on
Speaker 1: l A fridge operations, please someone. One of the cultures
Speaker 1: is out there that knows fridge culture. It's so disappointing.
Speaker 1: I tried to make myself a little drink before this,
Speaker 1: because you know, the Lost cultures have been getting a
Speaker 1: little loose on the episodes. Um, this is our first
Speaker 1: episode with a guest in four episodes. Yes, and we're
Speaker 1: so honored that. I'm um. Anyway, I'll continue to keep
Speaker 1: the world updated on my fridge maladies. But in the meantime,
Speaker 1: let's have Bowen Yang's. I don't think so, honey. What
Speaker 1: do you say I have. I have a huge one.
Speaker 1: I think. I think it's hot. Hot, it's going to
Speaker 1: start a movement. Okay, I love whenever we preemptively declare
Speaker 1: a movement will start because of I don't think so honey.
Speaker 1: Because this happened a couple weeks ago when I said
Speaker 1: I don't think so honey, and then it was the
Speaker 1: people protesting outside of Disneyland that had to stop that.
Speaker 1: Counter protests even it was really ridiculous, and I just
Speaker 1: want to say they have not been successful. Disneyland is
Speaker 1: still right fully closed to the city of Anaheim and
Speaker 1: the County of Orange. Um. Okay, so this is Bowen Yang's.
Speaker 1: I don't think so any and his time begins now.
Speaker 1: I don't think so, honey, A five G get new
Speaker 1: PR because no one knows what the hell your deal is.
Speaker 1: You have people saying, oh my god, it's it's you know,
Speaker 1: COVID happened because people are setting up five G towers,
Speaker 1: or you have or you have me. I don't believe
Speaker 1: those conspiracies. But I'm all over here, like, what the
Speaker 1: hell is ultra wide band? I don't know. You're not
Speaker 1: communicating effectively what you even are. I cannot align myself
Speaker 1: with whether or not I like you five G if
Speaker 1: I support you five because I don't know what the
Speaker 1: hell you are. I thought I had five G LT
Speaker 1: this whole damn time on my iPhone eleven Pro, and
Speaker 1: then I upgrade to it to A twelve and it's
Speaker 1: still and it's I still get the same L T
Speaker 1: E A T and T is has not upgraded to
Speaker 1: ultra wide band. But and yet I don't know what
Speaker 1: ultra wide band is. I don't know five G as
Speaker 1: an overall concept. Five G. You have to just present
Speaker 1: yourself better. You have not had the debut Tom five
Speaker 1: for us to know who you are you are not.
Speaker 1: You have not introduced yourself rightly into high society and
Speaker 1: that one minute. And I just want to say, when
Speaker 1: you started going off about ultra wide, five G, etcetera,
Speaker 1: you might as well have been speaking Mandarin as if
Speaker 1: you were at the beginning of this episode. Because I
Speaker 1: don't know what any of this is five G. I
Speaker 1: don't know what. I'm pretty good at parsing out all
Speaker 1: of this technical stuff I have, no I cannot really too.
Speaker 1: I don't even know what the hell is going on
Speaker 1: with this five G. Okay, now it's time for Alis
Speaker 1: the Orleans. I don't think so. I'm like nervous. I've
Speaker 1: been like thinking about this all day because I wanted
Speaker 1: to be pop culture but like kind of like Clase
Speaker 1: I related. You guys have no idea, like obsessed about it. Okay,
Speaker 1: I think I nailed it. I think I got a
Speaker 1: good one that is a really good overlap between my
Speaker 1: my platforms and pop culture. Here we go, bo yango,
Speaker 1: are you gonna count it down? Yes, this is a
Speaker 1: Liz of Orleans. I don't think somebody her time starts now. Okay,
Speaker 1: I don't think so, honey. Copaganda, heroical depictions of the police.
Speaker 1: It is a widespread tactic by the police and the media.
Speaker 1: And I don't think Sonny the air TVs and movies
Speaker 1: that portray cops as heroes. They do performative displays of solidarity,
Speaker 1: sometimes moments for tear gassing innocent protesters. I hate turning
Speaker 1: on my TV and seeing these shows that are making
Speaker 1: millions of dollars which glorifies and justifies and normalizes the
Speaker 1: systemic violence and making heroes out of police and prosecutors.
Speaker 1: As a public defender for my whole career, I know
Speaker 1: that this is not the reality. And yet these shows
Speaker 1: employ former police officers as their consultants and downplay the
Speaker 1: presence of police violence against last people, and they normalize
Speaker 1: police misconduct and violent crime is down, and yet most
Speaker 1: Americans believe crime is going up because of this, and
Speaker 1: it makes it harder for us to push the systemic change.
Speaker 1: And as someone who is going to change these things,
Speaker 1: I need them to stop this straight up capaganda. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's one minute. That was one of the best
Speaker 1: ones we've had in months. Oh my gosh, so right.
Speaker 1: That is the definition of I don't think so, honey.
Speaker 1: That is exactly right, and especially in the current sort
Speaker 1: of way that we all consume media, which is just
Speaker 1: like through like a little um recorded deo on social
Speaker 1: media or something where it's like this woman crying, this
Speaker 1: female cop crying because she wasn't served McDonald's properly or
Speaker 1: something like remember remember that from like June. I was
Speaker 1: just like wait a minute, like we're really just like
Speaker 1: playing to like our I mean, but they think they're
Speaker 1: being like very calculating in the way that they're trying
Speaker 1: to like drum up sympathy in a way that is
Speaker 1: like very transparent. And it was also like almost comical
Speaker 1: because it's like I don't care that this cop wasn't
Speaker 1: given McDonald's, Like they funk up my order all the time,
Speaker 1: Like this is but it's like seeing these things where
Speaker 1: they're like like even um, you know at Washington Square
Speaker 1: Park when they had like the them linking arms of
Speaker 1: the protesters or kneeling with the protesters, yet every other
Speaker 1: day they pepper pepper spraying like batoning, you know, and
Speaker 1: and like kettling crowds. Like it's like, you know, come on,
Speaker 1: come on. It's like it's like it's like the cops
Speaker 1: who took a knee in one picture, but then they
Speaker 1: literally zoom in on the back and then they find
Speaker 1: that cop like literally beating protesters with with with a
Speaker 1: stick like the next day, it's like, you guys, this
Speaker 1: is so transparent and honestly, just like I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know what the right word is, craving. It's
Speaker 1: just like so dumb to me that, like you think
Speaker 1: that this is something that we all fall and some
Speaker 1: people do. Unfortunately, they stunt during the day and then
Speaker 1: they show up as themselves when the cameras aren't there
Speaker 1: at night and when when they know when they know
Speaker 1: it's not going to be as easy to be um
Speaker 1: to manipulate everyone into thinking that they're like actually on
Speaker 1: their side but just doing their job, like no, fuck you.
Speaker 1: And it's also the way that they're portrayed in TV
Speaker 1: and movies and how like the bad guy is always
Speaker 1: the person who's accused of a crime and the good
Speaker 1: guy is always like the police and the prosecutor. And
Speaker 1: it kind of shows this like it's contemporary, you know,
Speaker 1: pop culture really like displays that police officers are acting
Speaker 1: in this way that they know what they're doing. They're
Speaker 1: always extremely competent, they're always is like doing the right
Speaker 1: thing and fighting on the side of justice and that's
Speaker 1: not the reality. Thank you for thank you for bringing
Speaker 1: up these consultants by because that's where that's the source
Speaker 1: of it all. And I did hear that on some shows.
Speaker 1: I won't say which, but like that that that that
Speaker 1: I have friends that right for some of these shows,
Speaker 1: and that there's going to be changes in the way
Speaker 1: that they tell their stories and as as some of
Speaker 1: them wrap up their series, that that they're going to
Speaker 1: respond to the moment. We'll see how well. But um,
Speaker 1: it's true, it's on. They're on every network and they
Speaker 1: have been really since the since the you know, musty
Speaker 1: TV days, you know what I mean, Like it was
Speaker 1: we had NYPD Blue and all these shows, and it's
Speaker 1: just become such a not for nothing but um, you know,
Speaker 1: easy container to fill with narrative that they do it
Speaker 1: because it's very easy to be cyclical with it in
Speaker 1: terms of the storytelling, in terms of like the narrative,
Speaker 1: because you have your built in characters, that you have
Speaker 1: your heroes and your villains for whatever it's worth, and um,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's it's crazy. And I've been really happy
Speaker 1: over the past several months to see that discussed and
Speaker 1: I'm certainly happy to see it. I don't think so
Speaker 1: honeyed so expertly now, Thank you, thank you hot damn.
Speaker 1: I have to say, I was like, I know, I've
Speaker 1: got a lot of pressure on myself for that. I
Speaker 1: was like, okay, I have to get you did it
Speaker 1: and if if anything, if if anything else, that has
Speaker 1: to earn at least a ten dollar donation from you
Speaker 1: reader to Eliza Orleans dot com to help get Eliza
Speaker 1: in office as the Manhattan d A and make our
Speaker 1: city better. And I just want to say, as someone
Speaker 1: who's living in Los Angeles and just saw Nitthia Rahman elected,
Speaker 1: you can make your city better. You can, and let's
Speaker 1: get talking about it and let's start making it happen
Speaker 1: and start making the change because telling you like it
Speaker 1: is real, it can happen. And you know the fact
Speaker 1: that he's being so complacent right now and not even
Speaker 1: campaigning or announcing a campaign. Let him be complacent. Let's
Speaker 1: get let's build that ground support, let's get it happening exactly.
Speaker 1: Thank you. Thank you. Max out for Eliza, as we say,
Speaker 1: mats out for Eliza. It's not if you can't max
Speaker 1: out with your wallet, max out with your enthusiasm, your support,
Speaker 1: spread the message. I mean this, I mean the thing
Speaker 1: that distinguishes you from any other Canada rights not even
Speaker 1: right now, just overall, is that you are a public defender.
Speaker 1: We imagine that the impact that has to get a
Speaker 1: public defender in the District Attorney's office in Manhattan. Huge, huge, huge,
Speaker 1: huge huge, Eliza, thank you so much for coming on.
Speaker 1: It's been our honor. Oh my god, no, it was
Speaker 1: so great to be here. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1: This is so much fun. We love it. Okay, so,
Speaker 1: as you know readers, we do end every episode with
Speaker 1: a song. Bowen Yang. What are you thinking? I think
Speaker 1: you take the lead on this one. I can't think
Speaker 1: of anything. Okay, here we go. God, it's sing the
Speaker 1: song again, sat beside, make a choice, make a choice
Speaker 1: through the niline line. And if you want to hear
Speaker 1: that song sung, well go look up Celindion's version or something. Bye.
Speaker 1: By