WEBVTT - Jenny Wren / Blackbird

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<v Speaker 1>Pushkin.

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<v Speaker 2>Look, there's a beautiful bird.

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<v Speaker 3>I loved bird watching when I was a kid.

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<v Speaker 2>How can you tell one bird from another?

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<v Speaker 4>So I like to be able to get out of

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<v Speaker 4>the normal stream of life. We were about a mile

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<v Speaker 4>away from quite deep countryside, so I used to just

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<v Speaker 4>go on my own, just being away from the normal stuff, school,

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<v Speaker 4>family life. Appearance is one way to identify birds.

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<v Speaker 5>How does it look?

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<v Speaker 4>I had a little bird book, the Observers Book of Birds.

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<v Speaker 4>In yards or in pipes, wherever people are, you are

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<v Speaker 4>likely to find another small bird with a beautiful song.

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<v Speaker 4>The wren was a great favorite because you wouldn't see

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<v Speaker 4>that often, just suddenly see it flit from one little

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<v Speaker 4>push to another.

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<v Speaker 2>This small brownish bird is a wren.

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<v Speaker 3>And singing as it goes.

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<v Speaker 5>We can learn to know ren's by their sounds.

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<v Speaker 3>So I loved birds.

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<v Speaker 4>Because of that, I started being able to recognize the birds.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Paul Monteaux and I've been fortunate to spend time

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<v Speaker 2>with one of the greatest songwriters of the era.

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<v Speaker 3>And will you look at me?

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<v Speaker 5>I'm going on too.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm actually a.

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<v Speaker 2>Performer, that is Sir Paul McCartney. We worked together on

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<v Speaker 2>a book Looking at the lyrics of more than one

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<v Speaker 2>hundred and fifty of his songs, and we recorded many

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<v Speaker 2>hours of our conversations.

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<v Speaker 3>Songwriter, my God, well, that crypt homie.

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<v Speaker 2>This is McCartney, A life in lyrics, a masterclass, a memoir,

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<v Speaker 2>and an improvised journey with one of the most iconic

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<v Speaker 2>figures in popular music. In this episode, Jenny Wren, The.

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<v Speaker 6>Girls, Jenny Wren to King, she could See.

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<v Speaker 5>And'sche Way.

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<v Speaker 2>Paul McCartney has been a nature lover and birdwatcher since childhood.

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<v Speaker 2>His song catalog is teeming with feathered friends. There's single

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<v Speaker 2>Pigeon from nineteen seventy three.

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<v Speaker 7>Single Pigeon through the railent did she throw you out?

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<v Speaker 2>There's Bluebird from the same year.

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<v Speaker 7>Night Window, WILLI p DoD blind.

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<v Speaker 4>Your don't?

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<v Speaker 5>And you know what love this?

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<v Speaker 7>I'm a blue bed.

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<v Speaker 2>And there are a couple from the Beatles era.

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<v Speaker 1>I am a rabbit ornithologist. I like my birds say.

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<v Speaker 2>When Paul McCartney went off bird watching as a kid,

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<v Speaker 2>he was trying to escape the daily grind of school, errands,

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<v Speaker 2>work and other people. Even though when he's looking for

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<v Speaker 2>a location to buckle down and write songs, here's the

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<v Speaker 2>same impulse.

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<v Speaker 4>When you're writing something as embarrassing, as potentially embarrassing as

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<v Speaker 4>a love song, it's best to hide away in the

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<v Speaker 4>furthest corner cupboard you can find so that no one

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<v Speaker 4>can hear you.

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<v Speaker 1>Do this process.

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<v Speaker 4>So I will often literally try and get away so

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<v Speaker 4>that nobody can hear me do this, because this is

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<v Speaker 4>like very private.

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<v Speaker 1>It's got to just be me and this guitar.

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<v Speaker 4>Then I can touch this sort of inner place where

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<v Speaker 4>I am the troubado wandering around in the forest thinking

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<v Speaker 4>of love, thinking of the beauty of it, the mystery

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<v Speaker 4>of it, and the strength of it. You know.

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<v Speaker 1>But I say it's potentially embarrassing because you know, someone.

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<v Speaker 4>Could walk in and go, oh god, you know, and

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<v Speaker 4>that would be the worst thing.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm gonna be very hidden away.

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<v Speaker 4>So but once I get on that trail, I really

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<v Speaker 4>like it.

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<v Speaker 8>Your impulse to get into that coboard. Yeah, to get

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<v Speaker 8>into that little place to work. Yeah, it's a kind

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<v Speaker 8>of nesting impulse.

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<v Speaker 1>I think.

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<v Speaker 8>Is it partly.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, maybe I think it's mainly privacy. I think it's

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<v Speaker 3>mainly to not be overheard.

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<v Speaker 2>For privacy, one can head either to the tiniest cupboard

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<v Speaker 2>or to the great outdoors, as McCartney did when he

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<v Speaker 2>wrote Jenny Wren.

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<v Speaker 4>I was in Los Angeles and there's a canyon that

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<v Speaker 4>I particularly like to go walking in, and you have

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<v Speaker 4>to drive there, so I'd gone on my own. I

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<v Speaker 4>just found a little quiet parking space along the side

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<v Speaker 4>of the road, and it was very rural area. I'd

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<v Speaker 4>taken my guitar unusually, so I meant to go and

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<v Speaker 4>write a song, but again, this was my outdoors cupboard.

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<v Speaker 6>Like so many girls, Jenny Wren could sing bird.

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<v Speaker 5>Talker so away, Like so many.

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<v Speaker 6>Girls, Jenny Wren good sing bud.

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<v Speaker 5>Talker, song away.

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<v Speaker 4>I remember just sitting there thinking, yeah, just said. The

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<v Speaker 4>idea of the story was she could sing. Well, something

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<v Speaker 4>had happened, we don't know what.

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<v Speaker 2>The protagonist of the song, Jenny Wren, is halfway between

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<v Speaker 2>bird and human, singing and taking wing like the other.

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<v Speaker 6>Girls, lightly the girls, Jenny Wren tooking.

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<v Speaker 5>She could see the world.

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<v Speaker 6>AND's nge way.

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<v Speaker 2>In fact, McCartney may have derived the name from a

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<v Speaker 2>character in Charles Dickens's eighteen sixty five novel Our Mutual Friend. Here.

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<v Speaker 2>Jenny Wren is a dressmaker for dolls she's a teenage

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<v Speaker 2>girl who was born with a crooked spine and underdeveloped legs.

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<v Speaker 9>Something sparkled down among the fair hair, resting on the

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<v Speaker 9>dark hair, and if it were not a star, which

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<v Speaker 9>it couldn't be, it was an eye.

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<v Speaker 2>Despite her struggles, Jenny Wren has a sunny outlook and

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<v Speaker 2>keen powers of observation.

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<v Speaker 9>And if it were an eye, it was Jenny Wren's eye,

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<v Speaker 9>bright and watchful as the birds. Whose name she it taken.

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<v Speaker 8>I mean, it's the name is has currency beyond that.

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<v Speaker 8>Jenny Wren was a term we used, perhaps you used

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<v Speaker 8>when you were not in the fields, outside the estate,

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<v Speaker 8>just about the regular the little wren.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, exactly, which is often think it's probably my

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<v Speaker 4>favorite bird.

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<v Speaker 2>Mm hmmm.

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<v Speaker 4>So it's very little, very private, very sweet little thing.

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<v Speaker 3>So in other words, because she doesn't sing, but she

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<v Speaker 3>can see the world in its foolish ways, how we

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<v Speaker 3>spend our days. Cassin love society. You can see the

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<v Speaker 3>reality of the situation.

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<v Speaker 10>Spay, you can see all these sad things happening.

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<v Speaker 5>Side of life.

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<v Speaker 11>Dab No, that broken world is not unreminiscent of the

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<v Speaker 11>broken wings of that other singer.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's right. Blackbirds singing in the dead.

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<v Speaker 7>Nd take these broken wings and learn to fly. All

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<v Speaker 7>your life you were only waiting for this moment to arrive.

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<v Speaker 11>Which I think again.

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<v Speaker 8>Songs being in conversation with songs from the tradition, but

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<v Speaker 8>also within your own work.

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<v Speaker 1>They're talking to each other. Yeah, and that's a good thing.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. I think.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, when you're sitting down with an acoustic guitar,

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<v Speaker 4>there's a few ways you can go. And with black

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<v Speaker 4>Bet it's a little part. It's a guitar part that

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<v Speaker 4>you sing against rather than strumming chords, and so I

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<v Speaker 4>think this has the same kind of thing. This is

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<v Speaker 4>a little part rather than just chords. So I mean,

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<v Speaker 4>I think I was probably intentionally writing another blackbird.

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<v Speaker 7>Black bird lie, black bird line.

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<v Speaker 6>Into the line of a dark black line.

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<v Speaker 2>If the guitar part of Jenny Wren echoes McCartney's Blackbird,

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<v Speaker 2>then it carries within it another echo, one from the

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<v Speaker 2>classical genre. Bach's Burret in e minor.

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<v Speaker 4>A little guitar part which is so much a part

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<v Speaker 4>of it was something that George and I it was

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<v Speaker 4>a party piece of us when we were kids, and

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<v Speaker 4>it's it's box, it's do do do do do do

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<v Speaker 4>do do do do do do do do do do

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<v Speaker 4>do do do do.

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<v Speaker 1>Do do do do.

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<v Speaker 4>And we knew the tune, liked the tune, and but

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<v Speaker 4>particularly liked the counterpart, because well do do.

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<v Speaker 3>Do do do do do do do.

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<v Speaker 1>Do do do there's a bassline h.

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<v Speaker 5>Mm hmmm.

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<v Speaker 1>So with this bark piece, George and I learned.

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<v Speaker 4>Do do do do do do do you do do

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<v Speaker 4>do do as the melody, and then do you do

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<v Speaker 4>do do do do do do do do do do,

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<v Speaker 4>And then we kind of ran out. We didn't know

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<v Speaker 4>how it went, so we made up the rest of

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<v Speaker 4>the door. So so we have our own little version

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<v Speaker 4>of this backgo which become a party piece. And I

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<v Speaker 4>know that I've been fascinated with it and its structure.

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<v Speaker 3>Do you do do do do do do.

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<v Speaker 4>Do do do do that little bit, do do do

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<v Speaker 4>do that little thing. I just switched it around a bit,

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<v Speaker 4>made it my own, but I knew where I was

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<v Speaker 4>coming from.

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<v Speaker 1>Handy with that became the blackbird singing in the dad

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<v Speaker 1>of night.

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<v Speaker 5>Black bird singing in the dead n.

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<v Speaker 7>Take these broken wings and learn to fly.

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<v Speaker 5>All your life.

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<v Speaker 4>So I had that, and then I just I don't

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<v Speaker 4>know really, I think it was in Scotland the time

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<v Speaker 4>or the break I got this idea of a blackbird

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<v Speaker 4>singing the dead and eyes and so it's just an

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<v Speaker 4>image of a silhouette of a blackbird silhouetted in the

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<v Speaker 4>dead of night in a sort of forest somewhere as

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<v Speaker 4>being this lonely sort of image blackbird line.

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<v Speaker 5>Into the light of a dull black light.

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<v Speaker 2>The loneliness of the blackbird is reflected in the simple

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<v Speaker 2>instrumentation of that famous song no orchestration, justin McCartney and

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<v Speaker 2>his guitar and the terps of the bird. He's singing about.

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<v Speaker 7>Blackbird singing in the Dendam take the broken Wings and

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<v Speaker 7>learned fly.

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<v Speaker 5>On your line.

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<v Speaker 4>And I there's such an all encompassing record company of

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<v Speaker 4>the old variety that they had a sound like. So

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<v Speaker 4>if I wanted the sound of blackbirds singing, I could

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<v Speaker 4>just sort of look it up on a large most

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<v Speaker 4>birds blackbird and you would get you know, you can

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<v Speaker 4>look it up and get someone will go up and

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<v Speaker 4>get the lack.

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<v Speaker 7>You were only waiting for this moment do a rise.

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<v Speaker 7>You were only waiting for this moment to ride.

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<v Speaker 4>You were only waiting for.

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<v Speaker 5>This moment, do a ride.

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<v Speaker 2>The song may have started out as a simple image

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<v Speaker 2>of nature, the silhouette of a lonely bird crying out

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<v Speaker 2>into the dark, but when McCartney wrote the song in

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<v Speaker 2>the spring of nineteen sixty eight, he was also speaking

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<v Speaker 2>to the turbulence of the American civil rights movement, including

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<v Speaker 2>the enforced desegregation of schools.

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<v Speaker 4>Then it started to be about arising. Yeah, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>black said to take these broken wings.

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<v Speaker 12>So in others I was writing about the civil rights

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<v Speaker 12>disturbances in the Little Rock, particularly that we've been hearing

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<v Speaker 12>about segregation and stuff that shocked us so.

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<v Speaker 13>Much, the right of color children to attend, that all

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<v Speaker 13>white schools have been upheld by the United States, have

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<v Speaker 13>been caught city and state police had cordened off the school,

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<v Speaker 13>and many table makers were taken it a custody.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, your broken wings, sunken eyes, seeing broken wings flying,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, this is your moment to arise and be free.

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<v Speaker 1>And yeah, then I realized I was sending.

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<v Speaker 4>It in that direction. Who now wasn't just ornithological piece.

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<v Speaker 4>It was now to do with sort of politics and

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<v Speaker 4>to do with freedom.

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<v Speaker 6>Really, she saw pity breaking up Home Wooded Warriors Took

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<v Speaker 6>a Song Away.

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<v Speaker 2>The Blackbird, McCartney writes about is singing and protest and

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<v Speaker 2>Jenny Wren. However, the bird's protest comes in the form

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<v Speaker 2>of silence. Instead of selecting a chirping bird to accompany

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<v Speaker 2>this song, McCartney included a du duc An Armenian woodwind

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<v Speaker 2>instrument with a haunting sound.

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<v Speaker 4>The minute I'm talking about Jenny Wren, I'm seeing the bird,

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<v Speaker 4>and then I'm seeing a person. And then in this story,

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<v Speaker 4>for no apparent reason, she just doesn't sing anymore. But

0:17:41.904 --> 0:17:45.544
<v Speaker 4>she could sing. She's a great singer, and she doesn't

0:17:45.544 --> 0:17:51.944
<v Speaker 4>sing anymore. And it turns out that it's because of

0:17:51.984 --> 0:17:58.744
<v Speaker 4>all our foolish ways, like a protest, and so then

0:17:58.784 --> 0:18:03.304
<v Speaker 4>it just becomes a bit reflective about our society, how

0:18:03.344 --> 0:18:07.424
<v Speaker 4>we screw things up and everything, and so now we

0:18:07.584 --> 0:18:12.424
<v Speaker 4>sympathize with the person new protests. Oh, she's even lost

0:18:12.424 --> 0:18:18.184
<v Speaker 4>her voice over this, like the.

0:18:16.984 --> 0:18:21.344
<v Speaker 6>Other girls Jenny Wren took Queen.

0:18:22.544 --> 0:18:24.384
<v Speaker 5>She could see.

0:18:26.824 --> 0:18:33.904
<v Speaker 6>And it's ways.

0:18:32.304 --> 0:18:34.384
<v Speaker 3>What did Jenny Wren see?

0:18:34.824 --> 0:18:36.224
<v Speaker 11>You saw who we are?

0:18:37.304 --> 0:18:40.184
<v Speaker 3>Yeah? What did she see? Who are we?

0:18:41.344 --> 0:18:46.784
<v Speaker 4>She saw our foolish ways and the way we cast

0:18:46.864 --> 0:18:53.464
<v Speaker 4>love aside the way we lose sight of life. So

0:18:54.424 --> 0:18:57.824
<v Speaker 4>we are we have poverty, breaks.

0:18:57.544 --> 0:19:06.424
<v Speaker 3>Up homes regular and we wounded warriors.

0:19:05.344 --> 0:19:07.504
<v Speaker 5>Took a song away.

0:19:10.784 --> 0:19:21.864
<v Speaker 3>She saw, sure the screw up that society is. And

0:19:21.904 --> 0:19:25.744
<v Speaker 3>you know, like everyone, we're just looking for that better way.

0:19:27.544 --> 0:19:32.024
<v Speaker 4>So it's kind of nice that someone spotted the change

0:19:32.704 --> 0:19:37.584
<v Speaker 4>needs to happen. I think, you know, it's it's a

0:19:37.584 --> 0:19:38.264
<v Speaker 4>good old.

0:19:38.064 --> 0:19:41.184
<v Speaker 3>World, really, and I do think we screw it up.

0:19:41.264 --> 0:19:45.304
<v Speaker 4>You know, that's it's it's highly obvious with the ocean

0:19:45.344 --> 0:19:50.384
<v Speaker 4>filled with plastic, it didn't get there by itself, and

0:19:50.464 --> 0:19:53.264
<v Speaker 4>so you could say we screwed that up.

0:20:01.424 --> 0:20:05.424
<v Speaker 2>In typical McCartney fashion, he ends the song on a

0:20:05.464 --> 0:20:10.144
<v Speaker 2>note of hope rather than despair. By taking the protests

0:20:10.144 --> 0:20:13.584
<v Speaker 2>of Jenny Wren as a warning sign, he builds a

0:20:13.624 --> 0:20:18.384
<v Speaker 2>world in which she may sing again, but.

0:20:18.584 --> 0:20:21.024
<v Speaker 4>The day will come. There you go, it's going to

0:20:21.064 --> 0:20:25.584
<v Speaker 4>be a great day. Jenny Wren will sing, but.

0:20:26.384 --> 0:20:27.744
<v Speaker 6>It will come.

0:20:29.544 --> 0:20:38.904
<v Speaker 5>Jenny will sing when the spoken word, when's it's foolish.

0:20:38.464 --> 0:20:48.984
<v Speaker 6>Ways we spend.

0:20:49.104 --> 0:21:00.384
<v Speaker 5>Ca uh couser, Jenny?

0:21:02.784 --> 0:21:08.944
<v Speaker 8>Where can you hear a little bird singing? At the moment?

0:21:09.144 --> 0:21:13.224
<v Speaker 3>Yes, that's a rain? Is it really yes it is.

0:21:13.464 --> 0:21:15.784
<v Speaker 1>It's a house rain. Wow.

0:21:16.344 --> 0:21:18.984
<v Speaker 8>The Indian name for it, I happen to know is

0:21:19.264 --> 0:21:21.544
<v Speaker 8>a little bird with a big voice and that's it.

0:21:22.264 --> 0:21:31.184
<v Speaker 3>Wow. Well that is pretty cool. Oh I love that

0:21:31.264 --> 0:21:37.304
<v Speaker 3>little Journy Wren. J Yeah, it's so beautiful. Now now

0:21:37.344 --> 0:21:38.824
<v Speaker 3>why is that so beautiful?

0:21:52.224 --> 0:21:54.704
<v Speaker 8>But also, you know what that gives one faith that

0:21:54.784 --> 0:21:57.664
<v Speaker 8>everything comes together is connected?

0:21:58.144 --> 0:21:58.864
<v Speaker 4>I think so.

0:21:58.984 --> 0:22:31.304
<v Speaker 14>Too, Jenny Wren from Chaos and Creation in the Backyard,

0:22:31.664 --> 0:22:33.744
<v Speaker 14>released in two thousand and five.

0:22:36.544 --> 0:22:39.344
<v Speaker 2>In the next episode, an argument through song.

0:22:47.304 --> 0:22:48.464
<v Speaker 3>Now again.

0:22:50.984 --> 0:22:54.904
<v Speaker 4>It was at a time when John was firing missiles

0:22:54.944 --> 0:22:59.264
<v Speaker 4>at me with his songs. I don't know what he

0:22:59.344 --> 0:23:03.464
<v Speaker 4>hoped again, other than punching me in the face. And

0:23:04.144 --> 0:23:09.184
<v Speaker 4>this kind of annoyed me. Obviously, I suddenly decided I

0:23:09.224 --> 0:23:38.584
<v Speaker 4>did to turn my missiles on him.

0:23:38.944 --> 0:23:43.984
<v Speaker 2>McCartney. A Life in Lyrics is a co production between iHeartMedia,

0:23:44.504 --> 0:23:47.264
<v Speaker 2>n p L and Pushkin Industries