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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Brian Coberger is contesting his plea deal, renegging on some

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Speaker 2: of the orders in exchange for life over the death penalty.

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Speaker 2: Can the case now go to trial amidst a lifetime

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Speaker 2: Idaho four movie outrage, Good evening, a Nancy Grace, this

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Speaker 2: is Crime Stories.

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Speaker 3: I want to thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: Brian Coburger admitted pled guilty to four murders.

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Speaker 1: They were worse than murders.

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Speaker 2: They were slaughters of four innocent college students University of Idaho.

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Speaker 2: Straight out to Annie Eli's host of Seriously, Annie Coburger

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Speaker 2: is welching on a major tenet of his plea deal.

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Speaker 2: Under the law, I mean, Annie, that would be like

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Speaker 2: me sentencing you to twenty years on armed robbery and

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Speaker 2: and you have to elocute in court exactly what happened.

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Speaker 3: We do the deal, and then you refuse to eloquet. Okay,

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Speaker 3: deals off.

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Speaker 2: What is he contesting paying for funeral expenses?

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Speaker 4: It seems to me like it's all about back to control.

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Speaker 4: He doesn't seem to like any of the inconveniences that

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Speaker 4: are happening now that he's behind bars, whether it's what

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Speaker 4: he overhears the prisoner, saying about him the money that's

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Speaker 4: pouring in and having to possibly use that toward restitution.

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Speaker 4: I think the reality is now setting in for him

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Speaker 4: and there's starting to be some back pedaling happening.

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Speaker 2: It's my understanding to Dave Matt Crime Stories investigative reporter

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Speaker 2: that Coburger is bulking at paying for the victims earns

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Speaker 2: and other expenses.

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Speaker 5: Right exactly, Nancy. The shocking part of it is that

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Speaker 5: in that plea deal, all of this was already negotiated.

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Speaker 5: All of this was part of it so that he

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Speaker 5: could avoid going to try and avoid the needle or

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Speaker 5: the gun. And yet now they're going back in and saying, well,

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Speaker 5: we need to send this to the mathematicians that accounting

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Speaker 5: at the state to determine whether or not he's able

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Speaker 5: to pay for it, because he's in prison for the

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Speaker 5: rest of his life, and that actually is something that

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Speaker 5: he's not allowed to do. This plea bargain said he

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Speaker 5: could not go back later and appeal it, he couldn't

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Speaker 5: contest any aspect of it, and in so doing, Nancy,

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Speaker 5: I wonder why have they not already said, boom over,

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Speaker 5: you're going to trial.

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Speaker 2: Well, the judge seems to agree with you, Dave Matt

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Speaker 2: Listen to hip Hoar.

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Speaker 6: So you took advantage of the plea agreement to get

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Speaker 6: the benefit of the bargain regarding the state's dropping of

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Speaker 6: the death penalty. Why should you not be held to

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Speaker 6: the plea agreement to pay the victims the costs of

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Speaker 6: in turning their children?

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Speaker 2: I mean, for Pete's sake, does Judge Hippler have to

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Speaker 2: feed the prosecution with a silver spoon? Here's your way

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Speaker 2: out of this disastrous plea deal, out of all of

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Speaker 2: your lies and your secret deals. Coburger is contesting restitution

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Speaker 2: that was part of the deal. So deal is off.

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Speaker 2: I mean, can the judge make it any more clear?

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Speaker 3: Listen to Hippler.

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Speaker 6: What's the point of the plea agreement on restitution if

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Speaker 6: the defense is able to argue against the restitution called

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Speaker 6: for in the plea agreement itself.

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Speaker 2: And it's not an issue? Is it to any last

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Speaker 2: joining us from seriously, Annie, he's got at least a

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Speaker 2: five figure amount of money in his commissary account.

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Speaker 4: It's unbelievable. First and foremost, the fact that people are

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Speaker 4: sending an admitted quadruple murderer tens of thousands of dollars

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Speaker 4: then for him to be contesting payment the restitution that

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Speaker 4: is outlined And I'm sorry, but three thousand dollars for

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Speaker 4: the earns is that the going rate these days for

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Speaker 4: a life. It's just if he's afforded these comforts of ramen,

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Speaker 4: toilet trees, different treats with his commissary, why should he

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Speaker 4: get more comforts than the victims were ever afforded.

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Speaker 2: Brian Coburger has just been ordered by the judge to

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Speaker 2: fork over thirty grand from his slush fund. Fine, I'm

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Speaker 2: glad you did that, Judge, to pay the victims' families.

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Speaker 2: But the fact that Coburger has contested the deal stop

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Speaker 2: everything deals off joining me is a veteran trial lawyer

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Speaker 2: who will tell you the truth.

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Speaker 3: We may not like it, but the truth. Josh colesrud

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Speaker 3: is with us.

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Speaker 2: He is a veteran criminal defense attorney, former US attorney,

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Speaker 2: founder of Colesrood Law Offices. Josh, I know that now

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Speaker 2: in this incarnation of yourself you are a defense attorney.

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Speaker 2: But isn't it true that when a defendant, when a

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Speaker 2: defendant backs out of one of the tenants of the

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Speaker 2: plea deal, the deal is off.

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Speaker 7: Yes, So a plea agreement is a contract and it

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Speaker 7: has specific terms that need to be followed, and if

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Speaker 7: those terms are breached, then the plea agreement can be

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Speaker 7: undone and this case can be set for trial. One

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Speaker 7: of the ways that that could happen is a material

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Speaker 7: breach and not paying restitution.

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Speaker 8: So what does that.

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Speaker 7: Mean, Well, Brian Koberger agreed to have a fair dealing

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Speaker 7: with his finances, his money where it was going, and

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Speaker 7: to pay restitution. Now the state is saying that it

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Speaker 7: was their screw up that they didn't include the terms

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Speaker 7: in the plea agreement, But that's nonsense.

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Speaker 8: I'll tell you why.

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Speaker 7: Because the defendant, Brian Koberger, was levied a two hundred

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Speaker 7: and fifty thousand dollars fine, and that fine, the money

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Speaker 7: from that can can garnish his wages and that money

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Speaker 7: can be transferred into the victim compensation fund. So they

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Speaker 7: should be able to still go after the money. And

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Speaker 7: so what the prosecution is doing here, they're just being lazy.

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Speaker 7: They're not confident in what they're saying. The judge is

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Speaker 7: actually having to tell them and give them a roadmap

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Speaker 7: out of this, because honestly, they're incompetent. I have no

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Speaker 7: idea why they decided to actually plead this case out

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Speaker 7: when if there was ever a death penal deal, that's

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Speaker 7: a whole.

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Speaker 2: Nother can of worms coals rude you and me both.

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Speaker 2: Coburger argued last week he was refusing and unable to

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Speaker 2: pay twenty seven thousand dollars restitution to the families, the

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Speaker 2: families of students he butchered dead. The judge threw out

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Speaker 2: his complaint, his complaint of poverty, no voting that he

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Speaker 2: has gotten hundreds of dollars from supporters, totally nearly thirty

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars.

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Speaker 3: Now he's being ordered to pay restitution. That's will and good.

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Speaker 2: My point is he contested the deal. He hasn't paid it.

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Speaker 2: He's saying he doesn't want to pay it, that he's

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Speaker 2: unable to pay it, which is a lie because I

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Speaker 2: know about his five figures of money. He's got his

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Speaker 2: commissary account. To me, that's welching on a deal. Joe

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Speaker 2: Scott Morgan is joining me, Professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University.

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Speaker 2: He's the author of Blood Beneath My Feet. He's the

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Speaker 2: star of a hit podcast which is incredible Body bags

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Speaker 2: with Joe Scott Morgan, on and on. But for our purposes,

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Speaker 2: he is a veteran death investigator, thousands of death scene investigations,

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Speaker 2: every cod every mod cause of death, matter of death.

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Speaker 3: You can imagine why why.

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Speaker 2: Should this have never been a sweet plea deal? Let's

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Speaker 2: just start with that. Why is this so inflammatory that

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Speaker 2: this was even allowed to be a plea? And he's

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Speaker 2: ordered to pay the family's restitution after butchering their children,

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Speaker 2: and now he's backing out of it. You know what, fine,

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Speaker 2: I'd be mad if you didn't. Let's go to trial.

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Speaker 1: Why is this so wrong?

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Speaker 3: Joe Scott.

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Speaker 9: In South we have a term that says, let the

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Speaker 9: hide come with a hair. My granddaddy used to say

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Speaker 9: that all the time. If he feels froggy, let's jump,

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Speaker 9: let's go to trial. Because now we have buckets and

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Speaker 9: buckets of evidence that have been revealed. Now, I got

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Speaker 9: to tell you, Nancy, give me a little rope here.

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Speaker 9: I know I'm not an attorney, I understand that, but

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Speaker 9: he's kind of got a point of leverage here. They

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Speaker 9: just released a tranche of twenty four hundred documents of

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Speaker 9: forensic evidence. Now, so if this thing did go to trial.

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Speaker 9: Everything has been reveal and you know, if you think

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Speaker 9: about from the perspective of taining the jury pool, perhaps

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Speaker 9: they've seen all of this stuff. We've got images that

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Speaker 9: are floating around out there.

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Speaker 8: Nancy.

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Speaker 9: They have flown and I'll say this directly to the prosecutor,

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Speaker 9: they have flown this case into the side.

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Speaker 8: Of the mountain from Jump Street. All right.

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Speaker 9: They got nobody to blame but themselves. I was an

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Speaker 9: advocate from the beginning to say that he, like you

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Speaker 9: had mentioned a second ago, he should have allocuted in

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Speaker 9: court to everything that he did instead of sitting there,

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Speaker 9: Instead of sitting there and not saying a damn word

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Speaker 9: other than yes, I did it.

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Speaker 8: You know, even BTK was compelled. Nancy. There are people

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Speaker 8: sitting on death rod.

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Speaker 9: Right now in Idaho that have done far less butchery

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Speaker 9: than he does. He's killed four people, slaughtered them, and

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Speaker 9: now he's complaining about having to pay the family money.

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Speaker 9: This is a gigantic mess.

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Speaker 3: Just got Morgan.

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Speaker 2: The nature of the murders was more akin to a

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Speaker 2: butchering a slaughtering. When I look at specifically, well, they're

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Speaker 2: all horrible. Ethan had his jugular vein slashed, which means

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Speaker 2: there was arterial bleeding, which means that coming from his neck.

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Speaker 2: Ethan's neck, it was like a water sprinkler in the

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Speaker 2: front yard, spurting his life's blood until.

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Speaker 3: He was dead.

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Speaker 2: The disfiguration of Kie Gonsalvius, for her face was stabbed

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Speaker 2: between twenty and thirty times.

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Speaker 3: Could not even identify her. He stabbed her teeth out of.

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Speaker 2: Her mouth and more. The other two Maddie and Xana

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Speaker 2: horribly horribly disfigured. Why is it that it is so

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Speaker 2: insulting it now he says he can't pay restitution. That

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Speaker 2: was part of the deal.

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Speaker 9: When you think about just Kaylee alone, Nancy, not only

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Speaker 9: was she stabbed, she had blunt force trauma to her face.

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Speaker 9: I actually believed that he took that k bar knife

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Speaker 9: and flipped it on the end of its handle. That

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Speaker 9: was driven into her multiple times too. You've got these

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Speaker 9: crushing injuries to her face. She's got severe maxial facial

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Speaker 9: facial damage. And then you know, you take this robust

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Speaker 9: knife blade and you drive it into her, and not

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Speaker 9: just her, but these other victims as well. You've got

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Speaker 9: Maddie laying there and she's been butchered as well. Nancy

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Speaker 9: this would have been a bloodbath contained to that, contained

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Speaker 9: to that bud, blood to the bed where they were killed.

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Speaker 9: And we've also got bloody deposition that's laying all over

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Speaker 9: the floor that appears to me, Nancy, that he was

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Speaker 9: standing there and probably gazing at the bodies as blood

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Speaker 9: is dripping and following away free form and striking the

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Speaker 9: ground directly below his feet. See this blood throughout the house.

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Speaker 9: The deposition that goes to this point that all of

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Speaker 9: this information now has been revealed, So you know, where

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Speaker 9: does the family turn at this point? In tom all

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Speaker 9: they're asking for is to show respect to their loved

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Speaker 9: ones that have been killed. Nancy, he must pay.

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Speaker 2: I don't understand what is wrong with the prosecutor. That's

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Speaker 2: been asked many many times. The judge is basically spoon

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Speaker 2: feeding him with a silver spoon away out of his

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Speaker 2: disastrous plea deal.

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Speaker 10: Listen to Hipler, isn't a reasonable interpretation of the plea

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Speaker 10: agreement that the defendant will not contest the states seeking

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Speaker 10: of restitution that is outlined in the plea Agreementwise, otherwise

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Speaker 10: why would it need to be in the plea agreement?

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Speaker 10: It seems to me it's the plea agreement. A reasonable

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Speaker 10: interpretation is the defendant is agreeing to pay restitution for

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Speaker 10: those items that are identified in the plea agreement, which includes.

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Speaker 6: Victims compensation apartment, which includes in this case, funeral expenses.

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Speaker 2: Joining us tonight to special guests, the parents of Killi Gonsolvas,

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Speaker 2: Christy and Steve Christian and Steve, thank you for being

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Speaker 2: with us first listen to this.

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Speaker 6: So you took advantage of the plea agreement to get

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Speaker 6: the benefit of the bargain regarding the state's dropping of

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Speaker 6: the death penalty. Why should you not be held to

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Speaker 6: the plea agreement to pay the victims the costs of

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Speaker 6: in turning their children?

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Speaker 7: Judge, I believe that our fleeting was clear, that we

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Speaker 7: understood that burns fell underneath of funeral.

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Speaker 4: Costs, but that once we have a hearing on this matter.

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Speaker 11: That doesn't eliminate the court's duty under nineteen fifty three

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Speaker 11: oh four to do the ability to pay analysis.

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Speaker 6: And that's why, well, are you in violation of the

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Speaker 6: plea agreement by arguing that your claient shouldn't have to.

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Speaker 3: Pay those and more from the judge.

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Speaker 6: What's the point of the plea agreement on restitution if

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Speaker 6: the defense is able to argue against the restitution called

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Speaker 6: for in the plea agreement itself.

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Speaker 2: At this hour, Coburger has been contesting paying funeral expenses

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Speaker 2: on the four students he murdered. That's bad enough, but

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Speaker 2: here's the question. If he's renigging on the deal, then

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Speaker 2: the deal is off and this case can go to

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Speaker 2: trial if the prosecutor has the backbone to do.

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Speaker 3: It, which I doubt.

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Speaker 2: Straight out to Christy and Steve Gonsalvez joining us, Christy,

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Speaker 2: you got a shocking letter from the prosecut Christy, could

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Speaker 2: you explain what the letter says?

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Speaker 11: Well, basically, it says that the travel expense part of

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Speaker 11: the restitution cannot be paid via the defendant's restitution, so

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Speaker 11: we can civilly sue him for it, which is just

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Speaker 11: you know, we're exhausted, you know, and now something is

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Speaker 11: just hard.

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Speaker 3: Christy?

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Speaker 2: Can I paraphrase what you just said? You can sue Coburger.

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Speaker 2: That's what the prosecution is offering.

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Speaker 3: The mother of a murdered girl.

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Speaker 2: I'm not gonna handle it, but you know what, you

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Speaker 2: can go hire a lawyer, Christy, and you can pay.

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Speaker 3: The lawyer to sue Brian Coburger. Let's take a look

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Speaker 3: at this letter.

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Speaker 2: It says, and it says, dear gentlemen, he can't even

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Speaker 2: write your name. Attached is a copy of the court's

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Speaker 2: order on state's requests for restitution copies of restitution orders.

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Speaker 3: For your client's funeral related expenses.

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Speaker 2: It tells you to look at footnote one at the

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Speaker 2: bottom of page one. We were not able to pursue

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Speaker 2: travel expenses. We were not able to pursue Steve Gonzalez.

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Speaker 2: What does that mean when the prosecutor writes you basically

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Speaker 2: a form letter referring to you and your wife and

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Speaker 2: others as dear gentlemen.

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Speaker 3: When I get something like that, I assume it's a

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Speaker 3: bill collector.

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Speaker 2: The state, in other words, him was not able to

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Speaker 2: pursue your travel expenses where you had to leave your

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Speaker 2: job and your home and drive seven hours and hold

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Speaker 2: up in a hotel to be in court.

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Speaker 3: They were quote not.

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Speaker 2: Able to pursue that from you. Coburger has five figures

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Speaker 2: sitting in his commissary account. He will make a movie deal,

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Speaker 2: it's allowed under the.

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Speaker 3: Law in Idaho.

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Speaker 2: He will write a book. But they did not pursue

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Speaker 2: those expenses for you.

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Speaker 12: Steve now Right off the get go, we said that

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Speaker 12: this deal, the plea deal, could be done, but it

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Speaker 12: has to be done correctly, and I didn't think he

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Speaker 12: had the skill level to do it correctly. That's why

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Speaker 12: we pretty much demanded that the attorney's generals get involved.

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Speaker 13: And you know, that was the best option we could have.

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Speaker 13: But yeah, he.

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Speaker 12: Doesn't know what he's doing. I mean, he's over his head.

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Speaker 12: He's a boomer that's literally was trying to retire before

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Speaker 12: this case even happened, and he's mentally retired. So we're

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Speaker 12: the ones losing thousands of dollars, tens of thousands of

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Speaker 12: dollars to his mistakes. And it's embarrassing for the state

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Speaker 12: of Idaho. And I mean, we did everything for that

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Speaker 12: courtroom so that they could get the resource and they

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Speaker 12: can get the attention, and we just couldn't.

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Speaker 13: Get him out of that room.

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Speaker 12: And that's really, that really is what's hurting this case

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Speaker 12: is we have Thompson in there just dropping the ball

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Speaker 12: repeatedly over and over and literally omitting it like I

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Speaker 12: totally screwed up, not apologizing but just saying I screwed up.

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Speaker 12: I mean, because it's clearly obvious. The whole world's watching.

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Speaker 12: He can't get himself out of it. But we've been

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Speaker 12: bringing attention to this from the very beginning that there

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Speaker 12: was I mean, we talked about his office leaking information

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Speaker 12: because we knew where the information was coming from, but.

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Speaker 13: Nobody ever investigated it.

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Speaker 12: Nobody even came to our family and said, how did

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Speaker 12: you guys know that they were leaking information?

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Speaker 13: Even nobody's interviewed us to this day.

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Speaker 2: Can I ask you how you know it was the

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00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:50,399
Speaker 2: prosecutor's office that was leaking the info. Remember there was

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Speaker 2: going to be a big investigation and then it just disappeared.

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Speaker 12: There's a couple different ways, and I can't I won't

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Speaker 12: get into it on an open microphone like this, But

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Speaker 12: if you go and look how Anne knew to subpoena

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Speaker 12: my lawyer and our family and what we were discussing. Basically,

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Speaker 12: if you reverse that back, you're going to figure out

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Speaker 12: that somebody in that room told Anne that we were

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Speaker 12: talking about one of the witnesses and we knew information

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Speaker 12: about her. So she knew to subpoena our lawyer and

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Speaker 12: the conversations that we were having with just his office.

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Speaker 12: So how does Anne know how does she even know

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Speaker 12: that she should be requesting the communication from our personal

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00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:38,320
Speaker 12: lawyer to them what.

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Speaker 11: Christy emails she was requesting all emails from from our attorney,

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Speaker 11: Shannon Gray, our family regarding this witness.

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Speaker 2: And it was like, okay, and the only tom you

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Speaker 2: discussed that was with reps from the DA's office.

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Speaker 13: Exactly.

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Speaker 12: Those are the only people we communicated with officially, and

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Speaker 12: we didn't talk to anyone else about what we had

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Speaker 12: heard it. We had just heard it within probably forty

333
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Speaker 12: eight hours, and forget about it.

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Speaker 2: He says, and I'm quoting as we previously submitted response

335
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Speaker 2: to the court. We believe the crime actant's compensation would

336
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Speaker 2: be able to reimburse travel and accommodation expenses after the fact.

337
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Speaker 2: Then we learned that wasn't correct, So they entered into

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Speaker 2: a deal before they even knew whether you could get

339
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Speaker 2: reimbursed for all that.

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Speaker 12: That's what it sounds like to me on a Sunday

341
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Speaker 12: after like talking to us on Friday. I mean, these

342
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Speaker 12: guys didn't do much work at all, but now they're

343
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Speaker 12: working on their Sundays to basically throw the case away.

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Speaker 2: From crime Stories with Nancy Grace. But the last sentence

345
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Speaker 2: in this letter makes me just want to chew and

346
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Speaker 2: nail in half quote. At this point, it appears there

347
00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:08,080
Speaker 2: are no remaining outstanding legal issues in the criminal case

348
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Speaker 2: other than ongoing.

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Speaker 3: Review of previously sealed documents for.

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Speaker 2: Possible public release. Sincerely, William W. Thompson, Jr. No remaining issues.

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Speaker 11: I thought that was very weird.

352
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Speaker 2: Now I condolences, no sympathy, no empathy, no anything.

353
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Speaker 3: I mean, this is.

354
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Speaker 2: Basically a form letter covering his rear end.

355
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Speaker 11: I was very surprised to see how it When I

356
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 11: read that last sentence too, I was like, Wow, that's.

357
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Speaker 1: How we're going to end it.

358
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Speaker 11: No further problems. If you guys want to get a

359
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:52,560
Speaker 11: civil lawyer, you could sue them on your own separately.

360
00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:58,800
Speaker 2: But I'm very curious, why do you believe what could

361
00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 2: the possible motivate should be. I have a theory that

362
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,920
Speaker 2: someone in the prosecution's office that you were speaking with,

363
00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,439
Speaker 2: and I can only assume that you went straight to

364
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:14,120
Speaker 2: the top discussing issues with a trial witness, and then

365
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:19,640
Speaker 2: within hours the defense attorney suddenly wants to subpoena your

366
00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:26,880
Speaker 2: lawyer's documents about conversations regarding that witness. All I can

367
00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 2: think of is that the prosecution Thompson wanted to further

368
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:39,320
Speaker 2: along a plea deal by releasing potentially damning evidence on

369
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Speaker 2: a witness.

370
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Speaker 11: That's what we thought.

371
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Speaker 13: Yeah, yeah, if you connect the dots, you could see

372
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:50,040
Speaker 13: that because the information.

373
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Speaker 12: That we had for them was daming, was damning to

374
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:58,600
Speaker 12: be case. So certain things people want to leak to

375
00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,240
Speaker 12: scare people, to intimidate them, to let them think that

376
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 12: there's more going on than what is, or or just

377
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:07,880
Speaker 12: letting them know that you've got you've got some information

378
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:13,639
Speaker 12: that they're not completely pavy privy to. So obviously something

379
00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 12: was going on because she knew to ask for our communications,

380
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 12: and it just makes no sense how she would know that.

381
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:23,199
Speaker 12: This whole case has just been so hard to deal with.

382
00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:25,639
Speaker 12: I mean, and we always all we did was a

383
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 12: demand that whoever was in that courtroom that they they

384
00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,080
Speaker 12: just did their best job every single day. And I

385
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:34,640
Speaker 12: remember telling Thompson because I was warned that he wasn't

386
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,560
Speaker 12: the man who could get this job done. So I

387
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,160
Speaker 12: just said, hey, if you're not, if you're checked out,

388
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,400
Speaker 12: if you want to retire, I get it. I respect

389
00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:45,560
Speaker 12: you. You worked your whole life, you're seventy some years old.

390
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 12: You don't want it, step away, step away somebody.

391
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 13: We'll go get someone. But he wanted to fame, but

392
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 13: he didn't want the work.

393
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Speaker 3: Christy and Steve.

394
00:23:56,160 --> 00:24:03,399
Speaker 2: The fact that Coburger is contesting issues within the plea deal,

395
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 2: that's not the banner the important part of this. We

396
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 2: know he's contesting paying restitution. Could that and rescind renig.

397
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:18,640
Speaker 1: The plea deal?

398
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 2: Because if he is backing out of conditions of the

399
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:27,200
Speaker 2: plea deal, then the deal is off. Have you considered

400
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 2: this could take the case to trial if Coburger himself

401
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:35,200
Speaker 2: is refusing to pay restitution as ordered in the plea deal.

402
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 11: Well, when you bring it up to our attention like that,

403
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 11: you know, with with your knowledge of how a court is,

404
00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 11: how courtrooms run, and what has happened, I would love

405
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,240
Speaker 11: for that to happen. But I feel like it's all

406
00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:54,000
Speaker 11: just games and none of it is taken serious. Like, oh,

407
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,879
Speaker 11: he doesn't want to pay his restitution. Slap slap, slap,

408
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 11: You can't do that. Pay your restitution? Move gone not.

409
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:03,679
Speaker 11: You know, you did a huge thing. You violated the

410
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,560
Speaker 11: plea deal. There's no you know, second chances. We're going

411
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 11: to trial.

412
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 4: Just all game.

413
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 11: It's just all the defense game. I mean, it just

414
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 11: games all the way around. I just feel like it's

415
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 11: just never ending. And now we're left with well, you

416
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 11: could civily sue, and that's just so frustrating. It's like,

417
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 11: you know what, we're out, you know, a lot of

418
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,840
Speaker 11: money with everything. The last thing we want to do

419
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 11: is sue and just be drugging.

420
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 4: Did more and more court.

421
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 11: You know, we were just hoping that they could handle it,

422
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 11: the state could handle it on our behalf. So it

423
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:36,240
Speaker 11: would be nice to say you violated the plea deal.

424
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:37,879
Speaker 11: So we're going to trial.

425
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:42,719
Speaker 3: Well, this is what bills Dante Steve. Let's look at this.

426
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:44,560
Speaker 3: So I take a play deal.

427
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:49,520
Speaker 2: Twenty to serve, all right, and the definite thing goes, yeah,

428
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 2: I'm not.

429
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:50,480
Speaker 3: Going to do that.

430
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,880
Speaker 2: I'm not I'm not going to do twenty. Well, then

431
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:58,880
Speaker 2: the deal is off. Pay your restitution. It's an important

432
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 2: part of that deal. And if Coburger contests it, fine,

433
00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 2: I'd be mad if he didn't. Now let's go to trial.

434
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:12,440
Speaker 2: That is possible. He's nigging on the deal. That's on him.

435
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,119
Speaker 2: So what you'd have to do, what we would have

436
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 2: to do is get Thompson off this case.

437
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 3: He can't try this case.

438
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,239
Speaker 2: Someone else, an independent prosecutor, would have to try it,

439
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 2: which would be great.

440
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 12: I would love to see that. I would see that,

441
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 12: and for that lector, that letter. He doesn't respect the

442
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,720
Speaker 12: investigation that Hitler's doing. He didn't say that that was

443
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 12: still going on. He said, we're done, we're over. He

444
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 12: has no fear of Hitpler's investigation because he holds all

445
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 12: the cards, he has all the power. So really I

446
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,399
Speaker 12: would love for an independent person to come in and

447
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 12: look at it. And we're talking about this guy has

448
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 12: been trying to control the narrative, you know, pKa from

449
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 12: the very beginning, the Minuy he even got in prison,

450
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 12: he started writing up complaints and started doing formalities and saying,

451
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 12: you're gonna transferm me, You're gonna do this, You're gonna

452
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 12: do that. We got to just put our foot down

453
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 12: to these kind of psychopath killers and stop entertaining them

454
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:08,120
Speaker 12: and stop treating them with baby gloves.

455
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,159
Speaker 13: It's just it's just disgusting.

456
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,880
Speaker 12: And and and we're doing it all the way up

457
00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 12: three years later, we're still entertaining and.

458
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 2: Still question have either you or Christy reached out to

459
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,200
Speaker 2: the FEDS to take this case.

460
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 3: To them.

461
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 12: I have talked to this that it's been a while

462
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 12: since I have, but they're the ones that told me

463
00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 12: Thompson wasn't even ready for this.

464
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:36,840
Speaker 13: I don't go with this guy. This, this is not

465
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 13: gonna it's not get in well.

466
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,120
Speaker 12: But they also at the same time told me we're

467
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:41,680
Speaker 12: not going to give you the death penalty either.

468
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:43,840
Speaker 13: So I tried to pick the lesser of.

469
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 12: The two to two evils, and I was saying, well,

470
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 12: at least I get the death penalty in Idaho. And

471
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:51,880
Speaker 12: I had a lot of belief in the Idaho system.

472
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,399
Speaker 12: I was just let down by a prosecutor who just

473
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,200
Speaker 12: was already retired and I didn't know it.

474
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,920
Speaker 2: Steve and Christy Gomsolve was joining us to on top

475
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:06,719
Speaker 2: of these revelations in this cold blooded form letter from

476
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 2: the prosecutor to them saying, yeah, you're not going to

477
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:10,080
Speaker 2: ever get your money back.

478
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 3: That's insult to injury.

479
00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:16,400
Speaker 2: The money. Yeah, they're out a lot of money, thousands

480
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:21,679
Speaker 2: of dollars. They're out their daughter, they are out their daughter.

481
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 2: Their daughter was horribly murdered, and we didn't know the

482
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:30,120
Speaker 2: truth about what happened to Kiahy until after the secret

483
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:34,119
Speaker 2: Plea deal goes down and now they're getting another gut

484
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 2: punch from a maid for TV movie and this is

485
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 2: what their daughter, Olivia.

486
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 3: Has to say.

487
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 14: Hi, so that's not iconic. You're young, so maybe you

488
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 14: don't know. But I've looked at the past that you've done,

489
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 14: and I think you know. There is such a thing

490
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 14: as defamation, which can be crushing to a career. Not

491
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 14: that you really have one, but if you'd like one,

492
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 14: maybe you should just think about it. Maybe you should

493
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:11,520
Speaker 14: just think about if Kaylee was your sister. Maybe you

494
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 14: should just think about what you put out into the world,

495
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 14: like dancing around in between scenes. Maybe you should think

496
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 14: about the projects that you take on. Maybe you should

497
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 14: think that if you lay with dogs, you might get fleets.

498
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 14: So yeah, maybe you should just think you look like

499
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 14: you might be capable of it.

500
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: That's why I'm at Olivia Goon's office on TikTok, and

501
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:47,560
Speaker 2: ever since she first opened her mouth, I knew that

502
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 2: she's a champion.

503
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 3: What is she talking about?

504
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 11: Christy Well, one of the actresses, I think it was

505
00:29:56,920 --> 00:30:00,880
Speaker 11: the one portraying Kaylee had to TikTok and they were

506
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 11: her and Matt her and Maddie were dressed up, they

507
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:09,480
Speaker 11: were bleeding, and they were dancing with the defendant and

508
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:11,520
Speaker 11: the three of them were dancing and laughing and hoot

509
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 11: and hollering and whatnot and carrying on. And she posted

510
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 11: it on TikTok something about you know, loving your job

511
00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,320
Speaker 11: or something, and it was like they were just appalled.

512
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 11: We were like, Okay, have fun with your coworkers after work,

513
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 11: but I mean, do you have to, you know, be

514
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:29,440
Speaker 11: dancing around.

515
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 2: And you were seeing this from Haley Hanson on TikTok. Christy,

516
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 2: when you discovered that this was going on, how did

517
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 2: that make you feel? Because even this many years later

518
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 2: after my fiance was murdered, when people write about it

519
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 2: and make negative comments about it, it never goes away

520
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 2: the pain from that much less someone dancing around on

521
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 2: TikTok talk in the middle of portraying Kiley.

522
00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 1: It's very hard. It makes you sick.

523
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 11: It makes you literally sick to your stomach. And there

524
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 11: there were others where she is dressed up, you know,

525
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 11: with a lot of blood on her and stuff and

526
00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 11: and smiling and saying you know, oh, I'm all you know,

527
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 11: ready for my, my, my scene. It's just it's disgusting

528
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 11: and it hurts and it makes you just it makes

529
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 11: you ill that that somebody would actually take a role

530
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 11: to portray somebody that died in such a horrific way

531
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 11: and take make light of it, make light of it

532
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 11: and and have it to have fun doing it, you know,

533
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 11: like not even somber or like, gosh, this is really hard.

534
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,880
Speaker 11: But no, you know, let's have a dance party after

535
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,720
Speaker 11: and let's make tiktoks in between scenes.

536
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 2: It's hard.

537
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 3: Stayle solvice.

538
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 2: I know that you guys have much bigger issues than

539
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 2: some actress Haley Hanson dancing around in fake blood during

540
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 2: an outtake of during a break from the movie. You

541
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 2: have a lot more on your plate than that. But

542
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 2: how did that strike you? Because I can see how

543
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 2: upset Olivia is about it.

544
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 12: I look at the bigger picture and it feels like

545
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 12: every time I turn on the TV, I see some

546
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:35,760
Speaker 12: like shooting, killing, mass murder, and I think to myself,

547
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 12: we have.

548
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 13: Multiple problems, but one of them.

549
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 12: Is kids who think they can do TikTok dances after

550
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,120
Speaker 12: you know, as being part of this messaging, is part

551
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 12: of this narrative, is part of this corrective measure. If

552
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 12: you want to say that's what they're trying to do,

553
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 12: because I want to refuse to think that it's entertainment.

554
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 12: But clearly that organization doesn't understand what they're trying to represent,

555
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 12: and they don't have a clear message, and they're not

556
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 12: trying to help society get better and figure out. You know,

557
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 12: when these people put out these red flags, that we

558
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 12: do something about it. Part of that could be a

559
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 12: documentation or a document on it and say, you know,

560
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 12: these are the red flags, and if you see these

561
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 12: things in your community, you know, put your foot down

562
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 12: and make sure that somebody takes action. But when you

563
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 12: see kids dancing and doing stuff like that and making

564
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 12: light of the whole situation, you know that do the

565
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 12: exact same thing to somebody else's child and somebody else's school,

566
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 12: shooting some of somebody else's you know, tragedy, And you're like,

567
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 12: we're just going to use this all over again if

568
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 12: we don't, if we don't learn from from these people

569
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 12: and from these these cowards, we got to put some action,

570
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 12: and we got to put some action behind our words.

571
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 2: Joining us tonight, Christy and Steve go, thank you for

572
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 2: being with us. I know that every time you have

573
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,360
Speaker 2: to talk about this, It just brings it all up again.

574
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,960
Speaker 2: If you could have wish, which of course would be

575
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 2: to have Kelly back, what would be your wish now.

576
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 3: Regarding this feuror.

577
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 2: And Coberger refusing to pay restitution and this ridiculous movie,

578
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:24,239
Speaker 2: what is your wish Christy?

579
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 11: You know, I mean the wish of wanting Kayley back

580
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:31,479
Speaker 11: is obviously that that's not possible. So my only other

581
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 11: wish would be for him to hurry up and take

582
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 11: a sauce breath and just we could be done. We

583
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:41,359
Speaker 11: can never have to talk about him again. And as

584
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 11: far as movies go and and books, you know, you

585
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 11: just got to roll with the punches. I mean, you

586
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 11: can't fight them all, you just can't. But him being

587
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 11: dead would be great. I'd be my way me.

588
00:34:57,400 --> 00:34:59,200
Speaker 12: I would try to make something positive out of it

589
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 12: as much as you poss we can. And I feel

590
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,319
Speaker 12: like that's what me, Livy and the family's doing is

591
00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 12: we're trying to put some actions.

592
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,880
Speaker 13: We're trying to put We're trying to rally around anyone.

593
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,279
Speaker 12: Who who sees something disgusting and puts their foot down

594
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 12: and says, all right, I've had enough.

595
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 13: I think that's that's the best we can do.

596
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 12: And if we can take this murder and all the

597
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,439
Speaker 12: people's attention on it and say, hey, there's no point

598
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:21,960
Speaker 12: of having.

599
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:23,719
Speaker 13: Red flags if we're not doing something about it.

600
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 12: And we see all these killers, and we look back

601
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 12: at their past behaviors and there's all these red flags,

602
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:34,360
Speaker 12: but just not enough action behind them. People just dodging

603
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,960
Speaker 12: the bullets, just saying we didn't know he was a

604
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 12: normal person.

605
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:40,800
Speaker 13: No, you did know. There was things there. There was

606
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 13: girls making complaints all around this individual, over and over,

607
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 13: and you just refuse to listen to them. You just

608
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 13: refuse to do something when they were crying out for help.

609
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 13: And it's happening all the way to today. We're going

610
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,880
Speaker 13: to lose tens of thousand dollars because a prosecutor refused

611
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:57,800
Speaker 13: to help us. If he couldn't do it, he didn't,

612
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 13: whatever the reason, he failed us, and it's just happening

613
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,359
Speaker 13: over and over and over, and we just we need

614
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:07,720
Speaker 13: some accountability. And this family's all about, you know, doing

615
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 13: whatever we can for these girls, these victims, to make

616
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,680
Speaker 13: sure that something comes out of it that changes society

617
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:19,440
Speaker 13: and helps, you know, reduce this type of type of crime. Ever, again,

618
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 13: that's the best I can hope for.

619
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 2: Kelly Gonsolvis didn't get to pick her mode of death.

620
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 3: She didn't get to pick whether she lived or died.

621
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 2: Neither did Maddie, neither did Ethan, neither did Sanna. To

622
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 2: any Alasta joining us in addition to furor over the

623
00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:44,040
Speaker 2: Lifetime movie where the actors and actresses are actually doing

624
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 2: TikTok dancing, some of them still in their bloody clothing,

625
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 2: portraying Kelly and others and posting that that's a whole

626
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 2: other can of worms. Can I talk about what matters,

627
00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:02,680
Speaker 2: and that is the trial and Coberger's refusal to pay restitution.

628
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:04,560
Speaker 3: As was ordered in the plea agreement.

629
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 1: Name Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

630
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 2: Anny Alice joining me the star of a true crime podcast. Seriously,

631
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: she's been on this case from the very beginning. Annie,

632
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us tonight. Annie. I'm just curious.

633
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:32,240
Speaker 2: I know that Coburger's family sent him a lot of money,

634
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,360
Speaker 2: but other people are donating.

635
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:37,239
Speaker 3: To Brian Coburger.

636
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 2: Why aren't they donating to the families of the victims

637
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 2: on their gofundmes? Who are these people?

638
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:49,439
Speaker 4: Nancy? It is so unnerving when you really break it down,

639
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 4: because nearly thirty thousand dollars has now poured into his account.

640
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 4: And you know what, we've seen this before, the strange

641
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 4: fan base, the dark celebrity treatment we saw with Chris

642
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 4: Watts as well. But what the motivation is here? I

643
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 4: don't know if it's that people truly believe he's innocent,

644
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 4: if it's women who think they can fix him. But

645
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:11,000
Speaker 4: let's be clear, these people are sending money to an

646
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:15,880
Speaker 4: admitted quadruple murderer. They need to rethink what they're actually

647
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:16,840
Speaker 4: supporting here.

648
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 2: You know, any Elise, it reminds me of Luigi Magngioni,

649
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 2: and much was made of the fact that about forty

650
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 2: thousand dollars at the get go had been funneled into

651
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 2: his commissary account. Same with Coburger. It's five figures we

652
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 2: now believe to be over thirty thousand dollars.

653
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 3: Are they lovelorn women? I mean, I don't understand who is.

654
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 2: Trying to support Coburger, But you're right, Annie Online, I

655
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 2: see it all the time. People actually angry when I

656
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,840
Speaker 2: discuss his guilt. He pled guilty? Did I just dreamed

657
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:58,840
Speaker 2: that whole thing? He pled guilty in court. Annie, No,

658
00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 2: you are absolutely right.

659
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:03,440
Speaker 4: There's a group out there that actually call themselves the

660
00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:07,400
Speaker 4: pro Burgers, where they are advocating for his innocence, saying

661
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 4: that it's all a setup, that it's all a cover,

662
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 4: and I argue with them as well. You know, he

663
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 4: admitted to what he did, not in the way that

664
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 4: I think a lot of us hoped he would with

665
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 4: full allocution, but he did admit to butchering these four students.

666
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 4: So for them to now be sending him money still

667
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,560
Speaker 4: advocating for him, they need there needs to be some

668
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 4: sort of recalibration here. It does not make any sense

669
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:32,759
Speaker 4: what they're supporting.

670
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,880
Speaker 2: Any Elise Also tonight there is an uproar and I

671
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 2: think it's justified regarding a lifetime movie about Brian Coburger's

672
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 2: butchering these four students, and one of the first people

673
00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:50,560
Speaker 2: to speak out is Kihlee Gonsovus's sister.

674
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 14: Listen and I love to do iconic, Hi, so that's

675
00:39:57,239 --> 00:40:00,520
Speaker 14: not iconic. You're young, so maybe you don't know, but

676
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:02,400
Speaker 14: I've looked at the past if you've done, and I

677
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 14: think you know, there is such a thing as defamation,

678
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 14: which can be crushing to a career, not that you

679
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 14: really have one, but if you'd like one, maybe you

680
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,439
Speaker 14: should just think about it. Maybe you should just think

681
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 14: about if Kaylee was your sister. Maybe you should just

682
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 14: think about what you put out into the world, like

683
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 14: dancing around in between scenes. Maybe you should think about

684
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 14: the projects that you take on. Maybe you should think

685
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 14: that if you lay with dogs, you might get fleets.

686
00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:53,080
Speaker 14: So yeah, maybe you should just think you look like

687
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 14: you might be capable of it.

688
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 2: There you see Kaylee's sister taking to the airways on

689
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:04,240
Speaker 2: TikTok with outrage against this movie, but more so about

690
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:05,840
Speaker 2: this Listen, why.

691
00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:09,000
Speaker 15: This was even a concept that was pitched. I can't

692
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:11,760
Speaker 15: begin to understand. I don't think anyone wants to see

693
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 15: a dramatized version of how these four young people were

694
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:18,000
Speaker 15: killed in their home.

695
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:20,440
Speaker 8: Mind you, the.

696
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 15: Trial for the murderer was only a few months ago.

697
00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,399
Speaker 15: I hope and pray Lifetime decides to pull this from

698
00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:31,319
Speaker 15: production and never continue, never ever, ever.

699
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:34,160
Speaker 16: If you sit back and you look at the loved

700
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 16: ones perspectives for just a second, because no one can

701
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:39,799
Speaker 16: imagine what it's like to walk in their shoes, but

702
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 16: to see an entire movie being made about their lives,

703
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:48,520
Speaker 16: casting actresses to play them and they're not even involved

704
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 16: in this, and they really have no say of stopping in.

705
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 13: This just feels.

706
00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 16: Really unsettling.

707
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,360
Speaker 2: Not only has Kaylee's sister spoken out, I gat about

708
00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 2: not just the movie, but the actress and actresses doing

709
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 2: a bloody dance scene sequence where they actually are still

710
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:15,120
Speaker 2: in costume covered in blood.

711
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:16,720
Speaker 3: What happened?

712
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,799
Speaker 4: So I think that's where the outrage is here. Everybody

713
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:24,920
Speaker 4: expects that Lifetime and other networks will make movies and

714
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,320
Speaker 4: react to real life cases, but the way in which

715
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 4: the actors are handling this, that's what's not landing.

716
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:32,359
Speaker 17: Well.

717
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:36,120
Speaker 4: Not only are they recreating dance scenes and little catchy

718
00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:40,719
Speaker 4: voiceovers to these moves between takes, but there's also been

719
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:44,000
Speaker 4: times in which they are still in wardrobe, there is

720
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 4: blood on them, and they are offset in their trailer

721
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:50,760
Speaker 4: or wherever they are, and they're doing these viral dance

722
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 4: moves and it is just classless, tactless, and of course

723
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,520
Speaker 4: has upset a lot of the family members. Kaylee's sister,

724
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 4: as you mentioned, has been very outspoken about this. I

725
00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 4: did reach out to her and chatted with her briefly

726
00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:05,279
Speaker 4: about it, because not only is she upset that they

727
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:08,240
Speaker 4: didn't consult the family before moving forward with this film,

728
00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:12,240
Speaker 4: but also because of the behavior that is happening during filming,

729
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:16,520
Speaker 4: just the disregard for the reality and the brutality of

730
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 4: this being a real life situation that this family went through,

731
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:21,239
Speaker 4: you know too.

732
00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 2: Chris McDonald and joining me director Cole Case Foundation, former

733
00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 2: homicide detective who has been on the case from the beginning.

734
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 2: He and I going to the scene and investigating. You

735
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 2: can find him on YouTube at the interview room.

736
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 3: Chris.

737
00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 2: Obviously, the guys at Lifetime and these actresses, actresses and

738
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 2: actress have never been to an actual crime scene, or

739
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 2: they would not be making light of it.

740
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 18: Yeah, one hundred percent. And you know, let's remember when

741
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:54,800
Speaker 18: you make a deal with the devil, he's going to

742
00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:58,240
Speaker 18: come collecting, and it looks like he's collecting right now,

743
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,280
Speaker 18: like what Doc Morgan was talking about just a minute ago. Nancy,

744
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 18: Let's not forget that there's evidence of aspiration blood, meaning

745
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:13,000
Speaker 18: while Brian Kolberger is stabbing these individuals so brutally, they

746
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:17,799
Speaker 18: are trying to breathe, And this is what we're dealing with.

747
00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 18: And if our culture thinks that's a good thing. We

748
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 18: need to take a hard look in the mirror.

749
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 2: J Scott, you heard what Chris mcdunnag just said. He's

750
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:33,120
Speaker 2: the expert. He's been to thousands of crime scenes. Obviously,

751
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:37,759
Speaker 2: the actresses and actors and the producers at Lifetime have

752
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 2: never been to an actual crime scene. Could you explain

753
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 2: what this crime scene was really like, Joe Scott.

754
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:51,720
Speaker 9: As Chris had mentioned, there was aspiration of this blood

755
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:53,720
Speaker 9: and kind of let me give you a for instance

756
00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:56,800
Speaker 9: for this. So if a lung is penetrated and airway

757
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,040
Speaker 9: is penetrated, you aspirate that blood, which means you you

758
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,880
Speaker 9: draw in and then you expiated nancy. So it's literally

759
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:08,760
Speaker 9: blown out like this. So you can see the blood

760
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 9: deposited on various surfaces, and it looks different than say

761
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 9: standard like blood splatter where you see something driven or

762
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,120
Speaker 9: struck into an area. It's kind of got an air

763
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:21,399
Speaker 9: rated appearance to it. It's almost sometimes you'll even see

764
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:24,160
Speaker 9: air bubbles in it. And that really lets you know

765
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:28,160
Speaker 9: about these final moments that they have just screaming for life,

766
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,839
Speaker 9: screaming for air because their brain is screaming out they

767
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 9: can no longer breathe, and that's the brutality that's involved,

768
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:37,719
Speaker 9: and these people that live in this fantasy world like this,

769
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 9: that try to make a buck off of these poor people.

770
00:45:42,280 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 9: It's beyond the pale, Nancy. I wish, just for once

771
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 9: they could come and let me take them to an autopsy.

772
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,319
Speaker 9: Let them see what that's like. Let them hear the

773
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:53,719
Speaker 9: screams and the wails of the family. I bet they

774
00:45:53,719 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 9: won't want to do this again.

775
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:59,799
Speaker 2: Scott, the brutality inflicted on Kelly gonna solve us alone.

776
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 3: Can you describe what happened to her face?

777
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:06,279
Speaker 2: And now these actresses, this actress covered in blood is

778
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:09,040
Speaker 2: doing a dance tik talk about it, still covered in

779
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:09,720
Speaker 2: fake blood.

780
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:10,719
Speaker 8: Yeah.

781
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 9: He's taking a heavy steel blade and driving it through

782
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 9: her face. And I still contend that he took it

783
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:19,960
Speaker 9: around because there were other abrasions on her face. Took

784
00:46:19,960 --> 00:46:23,160
Speaker 9: it around and began to pummel her with the handle

785
00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 9: like this, and probably inverted the handle and began to

786
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 9: do this as well, driving it almost like the head

787
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,520
Speaker 9: of a hanner into her face, over and over and

788
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:35,000
Speaker 9: over again. Nancy, she had so many wounds that dig

789
00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 9: this had so many wounds that they were cross communicating

790
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 9: and overlying one another. It was hard to delineate between

791
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,080
Speaker 9: these wounds because of the inflicted trauma, where you've got

792
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:48,480
Speaker 9: this overlapping that occurs that happens a lot in cases,

793
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:52,400
Speaker 9: but here you had it happen with multiple people, just

794
00:46:53,360 --> 00:46:57,080
Speaker 9: Maddie as well, that happened with her as well, where

795
00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 9: you had these cross communications of injury with her as well.

796
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:04,359
Speaker 9: So this was a level of brutality that I think

797
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:07,239
Speaker 9: that probably for those crime Sene investigators that were out

798
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 9: there that seen none of them had ever borne witness

799
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 9: to anything like this before.

800
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:15,480
Speaker 2: Could you describe a scene of arterial bleeding such as

801
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 2: what Ethan suffered.

802
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:21,960
Speaker 9: Yeah, So every time a vessel is clipped and the

803
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 9: heart is still beating, and remember just because you have

804
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,040
Speaker 9: a vessel that has been clipped in your neck doesn't

805
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 9: mean that you die. He eventually dies of what's referred

806
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 9: to as exanguination, which means you're bleeding out. The loss

807
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 9: of blood is incompatible with life, and so the blood

808
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:43,800
Speaker 9: is literally depositing itself as it's spraying out from the injuries.

809
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,799
Speaker 9: Every time that heart beats, it pulses, it contracts. That

810
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:50,640
Speaker 9: blood is driven out through that open wound and it

811
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:54,239
Speaker 9: deposits on any of the adjacent surfaces, and you could

812
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 9: see this. Sometimes you'll see it in kind of this

813
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,959
Speaker 9: histamine like spray that kind of arcs over a wall.

814
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:02,960
Speaker 9: I've seen this multiple times, it seems, and it almost

815
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:06,319
Speaker 9: looks like a bloody rainbow, layer upon layer, and the

816
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:09,919
Speaker 9: person's writhing in pain. And so that pattern is going

817
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 9: to change every time that blood spurts out. And that

818
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 9: would have told the tale with any of these investigators

819
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 9: that were out there, born witness to what Ethan had

820
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 9: had gone through. And here's the thing, Nancy, Nobody in

821
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 9: court's ever going to see that, are they He's going

822
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:26,279
Speaker 9: to get there. This guy is going to be able

823
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:28,799
Speaker 9: just to say, yeah, yeah, well I did it, But

824
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:30,759
Speaker 9: no one's ever going to be able to see the

825
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 9: horror that he actually inflicted on these people. And that's

826
00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 9: why he's got three hots in the cot. Now, doesn't he.

827
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:43,520
Speaker 19: Trying on a location of the emergency? You don't know

828
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 19: what what is there of the emergency? What is the

829
00:48:54,560 --> 00:49:00,440
Speaker 19: rest of the address. Okay, and there's the house for

830
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 19: an apartment? It's the house. Can you repeat theadress to

831
00:49:04,640 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 19: make sure that I have it right.

832
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 1: I'll talk to you guys.

833
00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 2: We're we live at the lights cover next to them.

834
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:15,880
Speaker 19: I need someone to repeat theadress for raterification. The address

835
00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 19: one one to two King Drugs.

836
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 17: Hailey Hanson plays Kayleie Gonzovez in the new Lifetime movie

837
00:49:22,200 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 17: The Idaho Murders and uploads of video to TikTok dancing

838
00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 17: with the actors playing Maddie Mogan and Brian Coberger as

839
00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 17: all three are dressed in character. The video has upset

840
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:36,760
Speaker 17: family and friends who see the portrayal as disrespectful. Hailey

841
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:38,320
Speaker 17: Hansen took the video down.

842
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 2: Joining us now doctor John Delatorre. He is a licensed

843
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 2: psychologist and he specializes in forensic psychology. You have worked

844
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:51,440
Speaker 2: with so many crime victims. You've got, on one hand,

845
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:57,200
Speaker 2: Coburger refusing to pay restitution for the earns of his

846
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 2: victims that he butchered. Then you've got a Lifetime movie

847
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 2: where the actresses and actors are doing dance tiktoks covered

848
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:14,320
Speaker 2: in fake blood. I mean, this family, these four families

849
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:18,400
Speaker 2: have been through hell and back. They've got a prosecutor

850
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:21,200
Speaker 2: that writes them a form letter explaining why, oh yeah,

851
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:23,399
Speaker 2: if you want anything more, you Consie Civilly, why don't

852
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,200
Speaker 2: you go hire a lawyer. Will it never end for

853
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:28,000
Speaker 2: these people?

854
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:30,399
Speaker 15: No?

855
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:33,280
Speaker 20: Probably not. I mean when then all of these wounds

856
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 20: are going to be reopened once this movie actually comes out.

857
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:40,600
Speaker 20: Because here's the nefarious thing. I highly doubt that this

858
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:43,239
Speaker 20: movie is really going to take the crime victims right

859
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 20: where they're really going to look at the lives of

860
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 20: these young lives, These young, beautiful lives are really going

861
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:51,640
Speaker 20: to be taken center stage. I imagine everything is going

862
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:55,360
Speaker 20: to be focused on Brian Coberger because that's where people

863
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:58,920
Speaker 20: think that they're interested live. But these four people deserve

864
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:01,359
Speaker 20: to have a life. If they needed a movie, they

865
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:03,680
Speaker 20: should be the focus, and instead they're probably going to

866
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:07,920
Speaker 20: just be relegated to the four victims in Brian Coberger's massacre.

867
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:11,919
Speaker 2: You know what, delatory, who is going to profit off

868
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:15,360
Speaker 2: this movie other than lifetime. If they were telling the

869
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 2: stories of the victims' families, they would probably profit. But

870
00:51:21,960 --> 00:51:24,360
Speaker 2: I doubt very seriously that that's the way it's going

871
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 2: to go.

872
00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:27,400
Speaker 8: No, of course not.

873
00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:29,240
Speaker 20: Of course, that's not going to be the thing because

874
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:32,400
Speaker 20: in their mind, right, the producers of this movie, in

875
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:34,640
Speaker 20: their mind, the idea is that we're going to bring

876
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:37,799
Speaker 20: in all the eyeballs because people want to understand the

877
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:42,319
Speaker 20: complexities of Brian Coberger. Brian Coberger is not complex. He's

878
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 20: not even that interesting.

879
00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:46,120
Speaker 2: Complexities of Brian Coberger.

880
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 20: I don't think he's I don't think he's complex. That's

881
00:51:50,239 --> 00:51:54,160
Speaker 20: what the producers think. I think and those people, people

882
00:51:54,280 --> 00:51:58,320
Speaker 20: like me that actually care about humanity, who actually have empathy,

883
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:01,080
Speaker 20: want to hear the stories, want to hear the stories

884
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:03,040
Speaker 20: of these victims. Want to hear about the lives of

885
00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,600
Speaker 20: these victims and the traumas that they had to face

886
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 20: and their family members have to experience. Now, we don't

887
00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:10,840
Speaker 20: want to see a movie about Brian Colberger. I know

888
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:12,719
Speaker 20: I don't want to see it. I want to hear

889
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 20: about these stories of these young lives loss, these young

890
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:16,600
Speaker 20: beautiful lives loss.

891
00:52:16,840 --> 00:52:17,479
Speaker 13: That's what I.

892
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:17,839
Speaker 8: Want to hear.

893
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:20,880
Speaker 20: But producers don't think that people will watch that.

894
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:26,920
Speaker 2: Chris mcdona, you and I have investigated and tried hundreds

895
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:31,440
Speaker 2: thousands of cases at this point. Who wants to go

896
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:35,600
Speaker 2: into the mind of Brian Coburger and do a dramatization

897
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 2: of him.

898
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:41,279
Speaker 18: That's a great question, Nancy, I mean, and isn't that

899
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:45,000
Speaker 18: the big the big problem here in our society as

900
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:47,680
Speaker 18: a whole in terms of, you know, the access to

901
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:51,120
Speaker 18: social media where we get instant gratification and we think

902
00:52:51,120 --> 00:52:54,319
Speaker 18: in bits and bites anymore. But we forget this one

903
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,080
Speaker 18: point and you just raised it a couple of minutes ago.

904
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 18: You know this guy sat in that room post mortem,

905
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:06,000
Speaker 18: experimenting on those bodies. Why is that important for the

906
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:09,680
Speaker 18: public to know? In terms of let's make a movie

907
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:13,000
Speaker 18: about this. It's crazy. We've lost our minds.

908
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:16,640
Speaker 2: You know, Josh Cole's rude. I'm trying to think. I'm

909
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 2: an alternative. If you're like me, my mind is already

910
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:26,680
Speaker 2: raced for about twenty steps. What's the best alternative? Is

911
00:53:26,760 --> 00:53:31,759
Speaker 2: there a way to throw out the play deal? I mean,

912
00:53:32,080 --> 00:53:35,680
Speaker 2: the Lifetime movie and the actresses dancing around covered in

913
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:41,319
Speaker 2: blood is disgusting. I'm thinking about a way to make

914
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:46,680
Speaker 2: actual change, to do something. The only thing I can

915
00:53:46,719 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 2: think of is to try to reneg the deal, to.

916
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:53,920
Speaker 3: Void the deal.

917
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 2: A you can't have that prosecution's office in on it.

918
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:02,719
Speaker 2: That that's impossible. Even if there aren't good lawyers within

919
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 2: the office, it's too late. They're tainted by their leader.

920
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:08,600
Speaker 2: It'll have to be a fed or a special prosecutor.

921
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:13,640
Speaker 2: But is there a hope. Is there a way Josh

922
00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:16,040
Speaker 2: to get the play deal voided?

923
00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:18,920
Speaker 8: Yes, there is.

924
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 7: There's two ways. You just mentioned one which is a

925
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:27,360
Speaker 7: federal action, but there's a much more simple way, and

926
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:32,720
Speaker 7: that is through victims' rights. Now, in Idaho, the prosecution

927
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:38,200
Speaker 7: is required to go over and make sure that the

928
00:54:38,280 --> 00:54:42,160
Speaker 7: victims understand the plea agreement and that they've conferred with

929
00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:47,040
Speaker 7: the victims. And here it's very obvious that that process

930
00:54:47,239 --> 00:54:51,040
Speaker 7: did not happen in full because during the restitution hearing,

931
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:55,799
Speaker 7: the prosecution admitted on the record that it was their

932
00:54:56,080 --> 00:54:59,880
Speaker 7: fault that the proper restitution terms were not in the

933
00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:03,480
Speaker 7: the agreement. So that tells me that the victims' rights

934
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:06,800
Speaker 7: were violated. So the victims on their own, through their attorney,

935
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 7: can file a special action with the court demanding that

936
00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:16,360
Speaker 7: the pre agreement be unraveled and the case be set

937
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:20,400
Speaker 7: for trial because of the material misrepresentations by the prosecution

938
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 7: and now by the defendant Coburger by not being honest

939
00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:27,399
Speaker 7: about his finances and not having good faith about paying

940
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:28,840
Speaker 7: the restitution that they deserve.

941
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 2: Guys, I don't always like what Col's root has to

942
00:55:32,560 --> 00:55:38,960
Speaker 2: say because he's typically defending someone, but He's right. There

943
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:43,120
Speaker 2: could be a way around this deal with the devil?

944
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:49,320
Speaker 2: But now will it happen? I am begging the FEDS

945
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:54,319
Speaker 2: to intervene. I am begging a court to investigate this

946
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:59,560
Speaker 2: and appoint an independent prosecutor. How can we stand by

947
00:56:00,320 --> 00:56:06,440
Speaker 2: and hear these families pain and do nothing? The current

948
00:56:07,040 --> 00:56:10,839
Speaker 2: US Attorney for the Idaho District is Bart M.

949
00:56:11,320 --> 00:56:15,000
Speaker 3: Davis. Repeat, Bart M. Davis.

950
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 2: The number two zero eight three three four one two

951
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:23,320
Speaker 2: one one two zero eight three three four.

952
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:25,879
Speaker 3: One two one one.

953
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:31,200
Speaker 2: You have the knowledge, use it? Is there a way

954
00:56:31,440 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 2: out of this deal with the devil? The local prosecutor

955
00:56:35,160 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 2: struck with Brian Coburger. Can we get Coburger to trial? Now,

956
00:56:42,080 --> 00:56:46,360
Speaker 2: we remember an American hero Border Patrol Agent, Freddie Ortiz,

957
00:56:46,840 --> 00:56:50,320
Speaker 2: US Department Homeland Security, killed in the line of duty

958
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:56,240
Speaker 2: after thirteen years serving and protecting. Leaving behind is grieving

959
00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:04,120
Speaker 2: mother American hero Patrol Agent Freddie is Nancy Grace signing

960
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:06,080
Speaker 2: off goodbye friend.