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Speaker 1: Joining us now to talk about the rapidly escalating economic

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Speaker 1: poly crisis. We have zab Amari, who is the editor

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Speaker 1: of Unheard.

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Speaker 2: Great to see Usora, good to see you man, Thank you,

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Speaker 2: thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, of course. So let's start with the picture with

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Speaker 1: regards to oil, which is not looking great. We can

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Speaker 1: put C four up on the screen here. So as

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Speaker 1: of this morning, right now in the markets, I think

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Speaker 1: WTI is at about one hundred and one dollars, Brent

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Speaker 1: is at whatsager like one point fifteen somewhere around there.

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Speaker 1: But we have this Bloomberg analysis where a lot of

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Speaker 1: analysts are saying this is going to get a lot worse.

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Speaker 1: That reality has not completely sunk in. So what they

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Speaker 1: say is the biggest oil supply shock in history has

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Speaker 1: reached the one month mark. Prices of surge, growth forecasts

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Speaker 1: are being cut worldwide. Shortages are emerging across Asia, Thailand

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Speaker 1: to Pakistan. But the energy industry is warning the crisis

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Speaker 1: is only beginning, and they float the possibility of oil

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Speaker 1: going to two one hundred dollars a barrel. So, you know,

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Speaker 1: are you in agreement with this analysis that we have

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Speaker 1: not even grappled yet with the reality of how bad

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Speaker 1: things are currently, let alone how bad things are going

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Speaker 1: to get.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I tend to agree with some more gloomy analysts

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Speaker 3: out there, the reason being that what's not taking into

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Speaker 3: account is the difference between this crisis and the nineteen

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Speaker 3: seventies oil crisis that followed the the Young Kippur War.

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Speaker 3: In that case, it was a matter of a political

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Speaker 3: decision by the Opek, the Arab OPEK members to shut

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Speaker 3: off or turn on the tap, right, That's all that

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Speaker 3: that was involved, and once they decided politically to turn

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Speaker 3: the tap back on, oil float again. In this case,

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Speaker 3: the reason why this could be much more severe than

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Speaker 3: the nineteen seventies poly crises that are related to oil

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Speaker 3: is the fact that even if the political decision were there,

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Speaker 3: if the political will were there to turn the tap

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Speaker 3: back on, there is damage to the entire ecosystem that

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Speaker 3: makes possible the flow of oil from the Persian Gulf

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Speaker 3: through the Strait of Hormuz and into the global markets.

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Speaker 3: You have severe damage to oil facilities in Obviously the

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Speaker 3: GCC states, to varying degrees, some Iranian strikes have hit

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Speaker 3: those in response to, I should say to Israeli attacks

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Speaker 3: on Iranian oil infrastructure. You have shut in fields in Iraq,

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Speaker 3: where you know, a country that in given day you

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Speaker 3: have like four point three million barrels is now down

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Speaker 3: to like one point six million barrels. And after a while,

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Speaker 3: when fields are shut in for a long time, it

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Speaker 3: takes a long time to turn them back on. So again,

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Speaker 3: even if Iran tomorrow were to capitulate, which doesn't look

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Speaker 3: likely at all, and we're to reopen the straits of Hormuz,

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Speaker 3: the fundamental structural problem, the damage, the fact that in

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Speaker 3: many of these cases, for example, and that this is

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Speaker 3: not oil with LNG, but the Qataris have called force

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Speaker 3: majure for three to five years. So that's all going

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Speaker 3: to take a long time to get back online. And

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Speaker 3: during that time, you're going to see price spikes. You're

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Speaker 3: going to see you know, right now, I just read

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Speaker 3: today in the New York Times that you know, two

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Speaker 3: Australian states, two of their provinces have made public transit

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Speaker 3: free and response, you're going to see more and more

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Speaker 3: of that. You're going to see fertilizer plants that rely

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Speaker 3: on petrochemical products go offline. That affects farming. I mean,

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Speaker 3: the the ramifications are huge and legitimately like mad Max

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Speaker 3: level terrifying. And the crazy thing is that it was

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Speaker 3: all a choice. It was a war of choice. It

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Speaker 3: was Donald Trump and his coterie deciding to do this,

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Speaker 3: not something that was imposed on the United States or

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Speaker 3: the world the way like the pandemic was, where it

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Speaker 3: was just this random freak event. And okay, whom can

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Speaker 3: you blame here? There is blame. It's like Bed and

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so crazy.

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Speaker 4: So let's put C two up there on the screen

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Speaker 4: actually to under you know, basically to underscore what you're saying.

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Speaker 4: This is from the Atlantic Welcome to a multi dimensional

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Speaker 4: economic disaster. And what they specifically tie here is the

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Speaker 4: AI boom to a lot of the cheap energy, and

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Speaker 4: of course the data center already build out and drain

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Speaker 4: that all of these AI data centers were already having

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Speaker 4: on our power grade. This does not at all reflect

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Speaker 4: a situation where you're going to have massive increases not

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Speaker 4: only an energy cross globally, but they also talk about

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Speaker 4: how the Gulf Arab States are basically the guaranteurs and

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Speaker 4: investors of some one hundred billions of dollars into these companies.

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Speaker 4: These AI companies are basically the backbone of the US

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Speaker 4: stock market, and SOB you and I, you know, we've

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Speaker 4: been deeply concerned about the US industrial base now for

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Speaker 4: quite some time. So we could have a financial crisis,

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Speaker 4: an energy shock, and we're already going through effectively an

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Speaker 4: industrialization or a reverse industrialization as a result already of

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Speaker 4: nearly the last year of policy. Like what does that

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Speaker 4: look like, not just for Trump's agenda, but for all

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Speaker 4: of us, as you're saying, in the health of our country.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So the one spot, as you said, at least

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Speaker 3: on equities markets, was were all these AI companies and

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Speaker 3: the whole AI revolution and the potential growth that was

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Speaker 3: that it was driving, even as it also threatened joblessness,

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Speaker 3: I should say. But that was in two ways dependent

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Speaker 3: on on cheap energy. One was, of course you mentioned

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Speaker 3: that you know, the data centers take enormous energy to run. Okay,

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Speaker 3: that's one. And second it was also dependent on just

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Speaker 3: oil flowings. And therefore these Arab states having money that

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Speaker 3: they can then invest in these projects, they're not going

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Speaker 3: to invest if they're not making money. I mean, it's

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Speaker 3: very it's as simple as that. So that's like a

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Speaker 3: double blow to the economy like one of the few

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Speaker 3: bright spots in the US and the US economy that

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Speaker 3: otherwise was lagging in other ways, that had been way

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Speaker 3: too much focused on services and and and kind of

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Speaker 3: low level services and high level financial services and so on. Okay,

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Speaker 3: but now we're we're at the cutting edge of the

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Speaker 3: AI revolution, or we were until this war was launched.

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Speaker 1: Well, I have my issues with the AI revolution, but

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Speaker 1: there's no doubt that if the bubble pops, it's going

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Speaker 1: to be extremely painful. And let me just read because

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Speaker 1: there's one other angle of the hit to AI here

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Speaker 1: that was not immediately apparent to me that the Atlantic

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Speaker 1: lays out in this piece. They say one of the

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Speaker 1: clearest examples of the problems are advanced memory and training chips,

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Speaker 1: which are among the most important are by far the

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Speaker 1: most expensive components of training any AI model. Currently, most

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Speaker 1: of these are produced by two companies in South Korea

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Speaker 1: and one in Taiwan, is something all of US have

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Speaker 1: focused a lot on. These countries in turn get a

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Speaker 1: large majority of their crude oil and much of their LNG,

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Speaker 1: which helped fuel semiconductor manufacturing from the Persian Gulf. The

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Speaker 1: chip companies also require helium, sulfur and bromine, three keyt

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Speaker 1: inputs to silicon wafers, largely sourced also from the region.

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Speaker 1: In addition, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the UAE, and other regional

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Speaker 1: petro states have become keaton backs in the American AI

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Speaker 1: firms that purchase most of those chips. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's a really important example. But I also think so

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Speaker 1: up that it just underscores. You know, it's almost impossible

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Speaker 1: to wrap your head around the disruptions here. I mean,

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Speaker 1: the best analog we can look to is our recent

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Speaker 1: past history history with the combination of the Russia Ukraine

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Speaker 1: War and COVID obviously, which just screwed up supply chains

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Speaker 1: in a million ways ways that even you know, experts

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Speaker 1: could not fully anticipate. How it would you create problems

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Speaker 1: and backlogs that would then go onto fuel inflation and

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Speaker 1: have all of these residual both real economic and political effects.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's so infuriating, this may scary, terrifying. I

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Speaker 3: don't know which objective to pick, but I read in

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Speaker 3: The Times also today that President Trump had said at

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Speaker 3: one point, well, I'm not worried about the oil because

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Speaker 3: it's really the Asian countries that are most dependent on

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Speaker 3: Persian gulf oil. And while that may be true, it

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Speaker 3: reveals such profound ignorance of what a fun jimal commodity

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Speaker 3: like oil is like. Right, if you pinch supply in

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Speaker 3: one corner of the world, prices rise everywhere else, and

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Speaker 3: and and and and and just in general that you

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Speaker 3: gum up the whole economy when you do that. So

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Speaker 3: unless you're willing to impose domestic for the US export

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Speaker 3: controls right where we don't, we don't we keep our

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Speaker 3: own oil for ourselves, and that could also cause all

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Speaker 3: sorts of problems unless we're willing to do that. The

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Speaker 3: fact that you know, this very important choke point in

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Speaker 3: the global economy is being squeezed is also bad for

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Speaker 3: the United States. It was just part of this broader

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Speaker 3: mentality where I think the the American right and the

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Speaker 3: Trumpeans got too high on their own supply. Yes, the

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Speaker 3: US is blessed in many many ways. We have we

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Speaker 3: became the world's largest energy exporter in the world. We

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Speaker 3: have these two oceans, you know, protecting us from any

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Speaker 3: kind of immediately enemy or anything like that. So there's

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Speaker 3: there's these natural advantages this natural bounty that the United

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Speaker 3: the United States has, and all Americans should be grateful

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Speaker 3: for it. But there are limits, right, we might want

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Speaker 3: to deglobalize, and I've never been a fan of the

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Speaker 3: kind of globalization that was that revealed its limits during COVID,

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Speaker 3: where suddenly realized that supply chains were way too far

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Speaker 3: flong and at the in position of the slightest straight

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Speaker 3: stress they would snap, and you know, we couldn't produce

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Speaker 3: our own mass or protective equipment and so on. That

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Speaker 3: was a problem, and we should move toward maybe a

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Speaker 3: less globalized world. I agree with that, but still we

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Speaker 3: are living in a globalized world to some extent, so

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Speaker 3: that you know, this attitude of oh well, beggar thy neighbor,

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Speaker 3: it's just going to be China's or India's problem if

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Speaker 3: oil stops flowing out of the Persian Gulf is stupid

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Speaker 3: and it's arrogant, and I think we're all going to

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Speaker 3: pay the consequences for it.

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Speaker 4: And to that point, I actually I think we have

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Speaker 4: a good piece here. Let's put C six up here

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Speaker 4: on the screen. How the Iran war has alreadyrippled across

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Speaker 4: the world. Now, as you said, look, it might be

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Speaker 4: China or India's problem. It might be South Korea's problem.

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Speaker 4: South Korea, by the way, is oh I don't know

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Speaker 4: a top ten trading partner, so as Japan last time

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Speaker 4: I checked. They're pointing out South Koreans are being told

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Speaker 4: by their president to take shorter showers. In Thailand another

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Speaker 4: actually vital ally in the region. They're saying, you need

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Speaker 4: to make sure that you're wearing short sleeves to work

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Speaker 4: so that we can cap air conditioner use. I'm we're

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Speaker 4: looking at news out of India where this is personally

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Speaker 4: tragic for me and for all the white tourists in

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Speaker 4: New Deli. Butter chicken has now disappeared from Indian menus

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Speaker 4: because they don't have the cooking gas to be able

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Speaker 4: to make it dosa. Apparently there's a huge shortage. I

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Speaker 4: talked to my family recently. They're rashing cooking gas and

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Speaker 4: they're looking at it. Their Sri Lanka is taking shortages

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Speaker 4: there as shortages, and they're actually encouraging the work week

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Speaker 4: to reduce and c seven. This is part of the

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Speaker 4: point of what you're talking about, is that the Asian

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Speaker 4: shortage has already hit because of the way the tankers

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Speaker 4: move across the globe. But what this map shows is

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Speaker 4: that actually we're about two weeks away from some of

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Speaker 4: the major impacts and closure simply because of length of

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Speaker 4: the tankers. Now, the big question, as you said earlier,

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Speaker 4: is about Donald Trump and his hubris by getting us

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Speaker 4: into this situation, but solving a crisis like this, from

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Speaker 4: what we saw during COVID not exactly his strong suit.

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Speaker 4: So what do you think that the actual impact of

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Speaker 4: this shortage will look like in terms of his administration,

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Speaker 4: who are clearly scrambling, like, realistically, what can they do

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Speaker 4: to get us out of this?

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Speaker 3: I really don't know, because what it comes down to

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Speaker 3: is recognizing, strategically speaking, that Iran has this had always

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Speaker 3: this potential to close the straits of horror moves, that

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Speaker 3: they were able to always do that, and now they've

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Speaker 3: exercised it, and there's no return, there's no easy return

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Speaker 3: to the status quo anti. In other words, the Iranians

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Speaker 3: will want as part of any negotiated settlement, they will

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Speaker 3: want some control over the state of home moves, and

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Speaker 3: we should try to negotiate that. But the point is

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Speaker 3: that that looks to the US An enormous strategic blow. Right,

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Speaker 3: we expended all this energy, and at the end of

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Speaker 3: the day you have to grant the Iranians what they

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Speaker 3: always possessed but now have decided to exercise in response

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Speaker 3: to this war. So that's a blow to US strategic prestige,

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Speaker 3: a really potent, incalculable blow. We can't even begin to

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Speaker 3: measure the scale of it. Otherwise you're going to be

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Speaker 3: facing obviously a blood bath in November in the in

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Speaker 3: the elections, you're still going to unface that. It's only

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Speaker 3: a question of how bloody the blood blood bath will be.

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Speaker 3: But if you think about it, there's a great tweet

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Speaker 3: this morning. I saw someone said the objective of the

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Speaker 3: war has become to restore the status goo anty before

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Speaker 3: the war. Dumbest war ever. It really is, like, what

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Speaker 3: is the point of this operation now? Is to open

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Speaker 3: the straight up harm moves which was opened before we

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Speaker 3: went in none of the other The regime hasn't collapsed,

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Speaker 3: its will has hardened. You know, it can still fire

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Speaker 3: ballistic missiles. As a front story in the New York

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Speaker 3: Times today basically saying the US keeps saying, you know,

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Speaker 3: five one hundred percent of Iran's capacity has been destroyed.

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Speaker 3: And that very evening, you know, an Iranian missile will

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Speaker 3: fall on some US facility in Saudi Arabia and destroy

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Speaker 3: a very kind of expensive command and control aircraft. So

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Speaker 3: what's the point anymore? And again, I think the endpoint

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Speaker 3: will be some capitulation, some recognition of Iran's ability to

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Speaker 3: control the straight of hornor moves. And that's like a

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Speaker 3: Vietnam level debacle in terms of a blow to US prestige,

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Speaker 3: which hurts me as an American to think that we'd

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Speaker 3: have to do that.

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Speaker 2: I would.

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Speaker 1: So I wanted to get your reaction to Trump's truth

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Speaker 1: this morning, which obviously directly relates to the war, it

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Speaker 1: also relates to the economic outlook. Appears to be another

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Speaker 1: yet another Trumpian blatant attempt at market manipulation. Here he

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Speaker 1: watches the treasury bond yields very closely. He watches obviously

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Speaker 1: the oil market, the stock market very closely. And so

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Speaker 1: this morning each waited out or truth down. The United

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Speaker 1: States of America is in serious discussions with a new

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Speaker 1: and more reasonable regime to end our military operations in Iran.

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Speaker 1: Great progress has been made, but if for any reason

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Speaker 1: a deal is not shortly reached, which it probably will be,

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Speaker 1: and if the Hornmonu Street is not immediately open for business,

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Speaker 1: we will conclude our lovely stay in Iran by blowing

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Speaker 1: up and completely obliterating all of their electric generating plants,

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Speaker 1: oil wells and carg island, and possibly all desalinization plants

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Speaker 1: which we have purposely yet not yet touched these. This

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Speaker 1: is him pre announcing war crimes. By the way, this

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Speaker 1: will be in retribution for our many soldiers and others

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Speaker 1: that Iran has butchered and killed over the old regime's

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Speaker 1: forty seven year reign of terror. Thank you for your

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Speaker 1: attention to this matter. I think people probably know you're

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Speaker 1: not a fan of the Iranian regime. You are quite

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Speaker 1: a viciferous critic of the current government in Iran. But

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Speaker 1: what do you make of what Trump is claiming here

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Speaker 1: about how there's a new more moderate regime in place

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Speaker 1: that he's totally working on a deal with.

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Speaker 3: I don't know where to begin it. That's such a

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Speaker 3: like a kind of stupidities, pile the top stupidies. I

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Speaker 3: don't know where to start. So first of all, I

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Speaker 3: watch Iranian state TV. You know, twenty four to seven.

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Speaker 3: Just to read the mood. There is no in the regime,

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Speaker 3: is there. It's called the Islamic Republic of Iran. It's

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Speaker 3: become more militarized. What's happened is all the restraining forces,

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Speaker 3: which believe it or not. As much as a fan

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Speaker 3: of I was not by him, he defined my life.

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Speaker 3: The course of my life would have been completely different

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Speaker 3: if he weren't around. By Iata Lahamine was a restraining

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Speaker 3: force relative to the kind of younger commanders that are

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Speaker 3: in the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. These are the people

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Speaker 3: who are in charge now. There is no indication. Yes,

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Speaker 3: they're taking heavy, heavy blows, but they think that they

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Speaker 3: have they to I'm going to use a polite word

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Speaker 3: for it, instead of what comes to mind. They think

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Speaker 3: that they have the United States in an economic and

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Speaker 3: energy vice script, and they're gonna squeeze and squeeze until

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Speaker 3: there is a kind of humiliating cry to uncle. And again, yes,

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Speaker 3: they're gonna take enormous hits. But this is a huge,

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Speaker 3: huge country of nine million people, four times the size

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Speaker 3: of Iraq. It's going to take a long time for

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Speaker 3: it to wear down. Long before that Trump with the

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Speaker 3: economic pain will be sort of too much for Trump.

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Speaker 3: So that's the first thing, is that his assertion that

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Speaker 3: Iran is you know, has the regime has changed, there's

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Speaker 3: just no sign of that. Second, the hitting of the

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Speaker 3: desalination plants. Actually, Iran relies very little on these kinds

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Speaker 3: of plants. It's America, is Gulf Allies and Israel that

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Speaker 3: are much more dependent on these sorts of facilities. And

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Speaker 3: as Iran has proved, it can hit those and create

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Speaker 3: calamitous effects for lots and lots of people who live

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Speaker 3: in those in those countries. And again same thing with

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Speaker 3: the electricity infrastructure, the power plants, they can they can

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Speaker 3: do that just as quickly, except Iran's electricity system and

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Speaker 3: the grid is far less centralized, so that if you

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Speaker 3: hit a single plant, it won't have the kind of

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Speaker 3: effect that it would have. For example, if you do

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Speaker 3: it did an analogous thing. If they did the analogous

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Speaker 3: thing to a country like Israel, whose you know, power

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Speaker 3: system is much more centralized, you hit one note and boom,

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Speaker 3: Israel goes into darkness. So, I mean, these threats aren't everyone.

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Speaker 3: This is not some secret intelligence it's all this all

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Speaker 3: in the public records. So it just this stuff that

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Speaker 3: he says, like it was funny when he was about

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Speaker 3: Rosie O'Donnell a decade ago. This kind of bluster, it's

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Speaker 3: really really depressing as scary when it's you know, the

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Speaker 3: world on the precipice of geopolitical and geoeconomic calamity, and.

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Speaker 1: You don't detect as you're watching Iranian state TV, you

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Speaker 1: don't detect any of their tends to sort of like

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Speaker 1: soften the line and create an opening to sell to

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Speaker 1: the public some sort of you don't see any of that,

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Speaker 1: not at all.

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Speaker 3: Every night it's about revenge, the Daughters of menab the

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Speaker 3: school that got hit early in the operation, you know,

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Speaker 3: and this is a culture that thrives on martyrdom Islam.

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Speaker 3: So every time you kill a commander, he creates like

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Speaker 3: a mini the only like the closest equivalent is a

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Speaker 3: Catholic cult to the Saints. Like it becomes some new

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Speaker 3: basis or it'll be you know, they killed actually they

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Speaker 3: hit a police station, the Israelis did, and they hit

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Speaker 3: a street sweeper, just a guy, like a random guy.

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Speaker 3: So of course he becomes like this, you know, his

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Speaker 3: coffin is laid out and people line up in huge

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Speaker 3: numbers to touch the coffin and then rub it on

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Speaker 3: their faces to get like a blessing from his active martyrdom.

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Speaker 3: That's the kind of people you're talking about. And again,

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Speaker 3: so much of the perception about what Iran is or

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Speaker 3: the kind of people is driven by this. You know,

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Speaker 3: I'm part of it, This Iranian diaspora, very secular, very embittered.

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Speaker 3: I understand the embitteredness about the regime. But they they

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Speaker 3: led us, I think they led us policymakers for years

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Speaker 3: to believe that that's how all Iranians are and forget that. No,

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Speaker 3: it's a scheite Muslim country. Lots and lots of people

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Speaker 3: are not cynical about their religion. When you hear when

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Speaker 3: they talk about you know, Imam Hussein and Martyrdom Carbala

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Speaker 3: and all this sort of iconography of bloodied saints who

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Speaker 3: give their lives for a greater cause, they like really

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Speaker 3: mean it. Yeah, I mean it.

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Speaker 1: That's a good transition to talk about what unfolded in

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Speaker 1: Jerusalem and this international religious crisis. And we brought you

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Speaker 1: in as a Catholic to explain some of these things

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Speaker 1: to us. So in any case, Israeli police blocked on

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Speaker 1: Palm Sunday, Cardinal Pizzabalah, who is the Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem,

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Speaker 1: from entering the Church of the Holy Sepulcher for Palm

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Speaker 1: Sunday services. Now because of the security situation. My understanding,

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Speaker 1: SOB is that he knew, you know, we're not going

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Speaker 1: to be able to do our normal thing here, but

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Speaker 1: we're going to come in, we're going to broadcast to

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Speaker 1: you know, to the world, to the global Catholic community,

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Speaker 1: and he was blocked from doing that. You know, they

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Speaker 1: expressed their outrage. We got a Huckabee statement, et cetera.

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Speaker 1: So first, if you could just if we could just

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Speaker 1: start there, these realis have now sort of like back down, apologizes,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. I'll get to that in a moment, but

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Speaker 1: if you could just explain why this was such a

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Speaker 1: significant thing for Catholics the world over.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, of course, it's because Church of the Holy Sepulcher,

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Speaker 3: where Chris, not just Catholics, whe Christians believe, you know, Jesus'

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Speaker 3: body was late to rest after his death, and so

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Speaker 3: that's very important. And Palm Sunday begins Holy Week, the

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Speaker 3: most the holiest week of the of the Catholic and

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Speaker 3: Christian liturgical calendar. And it's been centuries since the Latin

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Speaker 3: patriarch who represents the Catholic Church in the Holy Land

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Speaker 3: has been unable to access. I mean, through all the

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Speaker 3: vicissitudes of the centuries, all these wars and things like that,

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Speaker 3: he was still had been able to access the Church

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Speaker 3: of the Holy Sepulcher. So that's a very it's a

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Speaker 3: very very serious and grave thing. Now we can get

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Speaker 3: into it. My understanding, to be fair to this is

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Speaker 3: it sounds like some middling kind of middle level policemen

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Speaker 3: did something stupid. But the reason why I think it

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Speaker 3: touched off this wider outrage is if this were a

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Speaker 3: single incident on its own, you could sort of say, okay, well,

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Speaker 3: you know, it is what it is, but it's patched over.

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Speaker 3: But it comes in this larger context of an Israeli

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Speaker 3: society where this kind of sectarian chauvinism to which the

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Speaker 3: Jews themselves had long been subjected, you know, elsewhere, has

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Speaker 3: now become increasingly prevalent. You know, the sort of the

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Speaker 3: youths who go around roughing up Catholic owned Christian owned

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Speaker 3: businesses that attempts to squeeze out the Armenian Quarter, the

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Speaker 3: spitting on Christian evangelizers and this kind of stuff. So

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Speaker 3: it comes within this wider context that's much more febrile

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Speaker 3: in the Old City than it had been. It comes

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Speaker 3: in a context in which the police forces, ultimately the

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Speaker 3: domestic security forces in Israel are led by Minister ben Vier,

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Speaker 3: who is this convicted even byder Israel's own law, is

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Speaker 3: a convicted felon and a kind of really nasty ethno

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Speaker 3: chauvinist figure. He is basically kind of like an Israeli

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Speaker 3: equivalent of a kind of Serbian, you know, national chauvinist

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Speaker 3: that's from the nineteen nineties. And it comes against the

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Speaker 3: context of of course that during the Gaza War, the

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Speaker 3: shelling of the Holy Family Church, the Catholic parish in Gaza,

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Speaker 3: and the attacks on the West Bank on all. By

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Speaker 3: the way, I should say, one of the things that

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Speaker 3: bothers me as a Catholic is the way sometimes people

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Speaker 3: speak up for people for Palestinians in the West Bank,

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Speaker 3: but only emphasize the Christians. It's like whatever horror is

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Speaker 3: visited upon the Muslim Arabs, it's like, oh, well, you know,

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Speaker 3: but don't do this to the Christian and of course

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Speaker 3: I have a degree of extra solidarity as a Christian

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Speaker 3: with fellow Christians.

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Speaker 2: However, you know, the.

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Speaker 3: Rising kind of settler aggression in the West Bank effects

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Speaker 3: not just Christians but others as well. So sorry that

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Speaker 3: was a long answer. But the piece against the backdrop

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Speaker 3: of all of this, then that single incident of a

432
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 3: policeman probably just doing something stupid, stands.

433
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 2: Out in a way that wouldn't have otherwise. Probably.

434
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,640
Speaker 1: Well, I appreciate you making that point because I think

435
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 1: it's a really important one about how Look, I think

436
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 1: we can all be honest. There's a lot of Islamophobia

437
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:17,840
Speaker 1: in this country in general, and there's a lot of

438
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 1: Islamophobia specifically within the Republican Party. They sometimes I mean,

439
00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:25,000
Speaker 1: you ask Laura Lumri, she'll tell you outright, not shy

440
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:27,680
Speaker 1: about it. And so to me, when you see an

441
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:30,399
Speaker 1: incident like this, you know, I'm a secular person, but

442
00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 1: I believe everybody should be able to practice their faith.

443
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 1: I believe in basic human rights being you know, applied

444
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,720
Speaker 1: equally regardless of your faith, or your color, or your greed.

445
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 1: And so to me, part of what you get from

446
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:46,359
Speaker 1: this is, oh, you think they're just going to attack

447
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:49,159
Speaker 1: or hate like the fake people you've otherwised as like

448
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:52,439
Speaker 1: a bad guy. No, no, no, this applies across the

449
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 1: board once you have this ethno supremacist ideology and culture.

450
00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I look, I think I became much

451
00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 3: more I'll be honest, I became much more vocal about

452
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 3: what was happening in Gaza in the wake of the

453
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 3: Holy Family shelling. But I think I'm not alone in that.

454
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 3: Lots of lots of concerned right of center Christians and

455
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 3: Catholics then started to feel like, well, they can also,

456
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,440
Speaker 3: they should, They can and should speak up for civilians

457
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 3: in Gaza generally, rather than just merely our own coreligionists. Because,

458
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:32,119
Speaker 3: after all, the whole parable of the Good Samaritan is

459
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:34,840
Speaker 3: a reminder that, you know, the idea of who my

460
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 3: neighbor is should be uncomfortable for Christians. You should not

461
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:42,560
Speaker 3: be just merely my kin. That would be easy to

462
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:48,640
Speaker 3: count my own either bloodkin or religious fellow kin as

463
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 3: my neighbor. It's much more the Christian challenge to see

464
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:57,200
Speaker 3: the other who is different from me also as belonging

465
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 3: to God ultimately being made in the image of Gonzagar.

466
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,399
Speaker 1: From what I can tell this cardinal has exemplified that

467
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:07,600
Speaker 1: spirit of Christianity as well.

468
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:09,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was talking to Chrysol earlier. I mean he

469
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 4: offered himself. I know he was being attacked yesterday. Storre

470
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 4: of you noted this, I think by Laura Lumer for

471
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 4: wearing a cafea. He literally offered himself in exchange for

472
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 4: in Israeli hostage. And after many of those strikes, took

473
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 4: great aims to actually I think he went to Gaza

474
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 4: right and actually in the ruins of this church which

475
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:30,840
Speaker 4: was struck, just to make sure that these people were

476
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,960
Speaker 4: religiously ministered to. So this is somebody who genuinely does

477
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:35,800
Speaker 4: live up to that. Now to your point, let's put

478
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 4: D two up there on the screen. The Israelis are

479
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:43,040
Speaker 4: now saying that the Israel temporarily asked worshippers from all

480
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 4: fates not to worship at the holy sites to protect them.

481
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,400
Speaker 4: They have since reversed that policy. For the next one

482
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,000
Speaker 4: guy's D three Prime Minister net and Yahoo saying that

483
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 4: I have instructed the relevant authorities that he'd be granted

484
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 4: full and immediate access. But to the point, overall point

485
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,159
Speaker 4: of what you are making from what I saw nowhere

486
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 4: at this time was any rabbi or Jewish worshiper told

487
00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 4: that they could not go to some of the holier

488
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:13,440
Speaker 4: sites for in Jerusalem. And that kind of demonstrates the problems,

489
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 4: like you said, with the police force and with many

490
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 4: of the other people who are genuinely in charge and

491
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:22,199
Speaker 4: empowered in Israel, even including Ben Gavie Smotritz and some

492
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:26,200
Speaker 4: of these like full blown Serbian style ethno nationalists. Now,

493
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 4: I guess bigger picture, and I think this is what

494
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 4: matters more than anything. What I want to continue on

495
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 4: strategically is this invasion of Lebanon. Guys, let's put the

496
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,040
Speaker 4: next one up there on the screen. We have the

497
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:40,160
Speaker 4: Prime Minister just yesterday this is basically nowhere in terms

498
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,880
Speaker 4: of its coverage in the US has ordered the military

499
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 4: now to expand the invasion of southern Lebanon to include

500
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 4: all the way up to a further porter that would

501
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:53,120
Speaker 4: put some one million people, one million people who will

502
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,360
Speaker 4: be displaced, and they're even saying internally in the country

503
00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:59,800
Speaker 4: they can never be allowed to return. Chrystal said earlier,

504
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 4: so that this is actually larger square footage actually in

505
00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:05,200
Speaker 4: terms of land than Russia did whenever in its current

506
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 4: invasion of Ukraine or occupation of elements of Ukraine, and

507
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 4: yet there is silence actually not only from Western media

508
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 4: but really from Western governments around the globe. What do

509
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 4: you think the lasting impacts of this occupation and probably

510
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 4: annexation of Lebanon will be.

511
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, look, I think that of all people,

512
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 3: the Jewish people should be uncomfortable with population transfers. I mean,

513
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:34,919
Speaker 3: you know, look at Israel's founding, there was a massive,

514
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:39,360
Speaker 3: obviously population transfer that happened. It's because the Arab States

515
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,640
Speaker 3: rejected Israel's creation and wage war and they lost that war.

516
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:45,920
Speaker 3: And in that time, in the aftermath of World War Two,

517
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 3: it was quite common to move populations around en mass

518
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:52,919
Speaker 3: in order to create new nation states. So therefore, I

519
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 3: don't actually, you guys might disagree, but I don't blame

520
00:27:56,600 --> 00:28:00,639
Speaker 3: Israel uniquely as being at because that happened when Israel,

521
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,120
Speaker 3: when India and Pakistan were separated from each other. That

522
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 3: happened of course to lots of German speaking populations across

523
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 3: Europe in the wake of World War Two. It's why

524
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 3: the city of Dunzick, the German city of Duncik, became

525
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 3: the poly city of Gadunsk. So that is a in

526
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 3: the nineteen forties. As recently as the nineteen forties, the

527
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:22,760
Speaker 3: mid twentieth century, it was still like a norm, a terrible,

528
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:27,080
Speaker 3: terrible norm. But we were supposed to have then since then,

529
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 3: to have learned from that and think that moving populations

530
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 3: around willy nilly, and it's kind of suffering that that

531
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 3: imposes is not something we do because, for one thing,

532
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 3: for Israel's own security, it breeds another generation of Lebanese

533
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 3: or Godsans who are on the move or have been

534
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 3: forced into camps and so on, and are extremely embittered.

535
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 3: So tactically it's bad, but also morally again, I think

536
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 3: that if there's one of the lessons of the Jewish

537
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 3: twentieth century is not to move populations around in this

538
00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 3: way and just you know, to openly talk about it.

539
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 3: I mean, I saw an op ed in the Jerusalem Puss. Again,

540
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 3: it's not even the newspaper's view, to be fair, it's

541
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:09,240
Speaker 3: just the single op ed, but it was like, well,

542
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 3: you know, we really need to move people out of Gaza.

543
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 3: Was basically upshot again, like this kind of talk has

544
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 3: become completely normalized, is.

545
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean this yeah, I saw that op ed

546
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 1: that was just outright calling for ethnic cleansing. And they say, oh, well,

547
00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 1: if we don't want to be the oppressors forever, then

548
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 1: I guess we just have to get rid of the people.

549
00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 1: As if that's as exactly as if that's a moral

550
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: or ethical approach. Last question I have for you, so

551
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:38,479
Speaker 1: if we could actually just go back to the net

552
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:43,000
Speaker 1: Yaho tweet here about you know him basically saying like, okay,

553
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 1: we've we've changed your mind, but I wanted to linger

554
00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 1: on the on a piece of this. He says. Over

555
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 1: the past several days, Iran has repeatedly targeted the holy

556
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:55,479
Speaker 1: sites of all three monotheistic religions in Jerusalem with ballistic missiles.

557
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 1: In one strike, missile fragments crash meters from the Church

558
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 1: of the Holy Sepulcher. I've heard him mention this a

559
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 1: number of times. It makes me very uncomfortable. There was

560
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 1: previously a rabbi who floated, hey, we could do a

561
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 1: false flag, we could bomb Alexa Mosque, and then we

562
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:12,840
Speaker 1: could you know, use that as our excuse. First of all,

563
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 1: then all the you know Muslim countries, all the Arabs

564
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: are going to fight against Iran, they're going to be

565
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: so mad that Iran did this. That will help solve

566
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: the problem. And then second of all, you know, that

567
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 1: opens it up for their own sort of like you know,

568
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: views of rebuilding the Temple, which important both to Christians

569
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 1: and to Jews. But if you could just speak to

570
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 1: how combustible this situation is, and you know, it's something

571
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,240
Speaker 1: that I kind of have a hard time as a

572
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 1: secular person, have a little bit of a hard time

573
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: wrapping my head around. I feel like it's a bit

574
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 1: of a blind spot for myself because you're right, like

575
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: people in Iran genuinely hold their faith, right Christian evangelicals,

576
00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 1: they really mean the things that they believe, you know,

577
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 1: the you know, the especially more fanatical Jews in Israel,

578
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 1: like they have certain ideas about how they're going to

579
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: bring about their own end times fantasies. So could you

580
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 1: speak a little bit to that peace as well?

581
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 3: Well? I think look, does does does the Iranian regime

582
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,680
Speaker 3: fly some missiles, like including ones with submunitions that are

583
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 3: not always accurate and could like a fragment could have

584
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 3: hit the Old City, Yes, And so that's like I

585
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,840
Speaker 3: don't I'm not inclined to think there's some uh, you know,

586
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 3: bb attempt to create a false flag. BB is still

587
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 3: has although he has nutters in his orbit, he himself,

588
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 3: I think has his head on straight enough to know

589
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:33,360
Speaker 3: and not to mess with things like that. That's my belief. However,

590
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 3: I think to your to your larger point, that that

591
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 3: this is a moment of extreme danger for the world,

592
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 3: in part because of the energy and economic issues that

593
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 3: we talked about, and then you layer on top of that,

594
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 3: or maybe it's the fundament the deep theological issues, which

595
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 3: is why I think it's just so irresponsible for the

596
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 3: Trump administration to get into this war that basically every

597
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 3: other predecessor had had resisted, right because again, you you

598
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,960
Speaker 3: open up this whole world of potential consequences that are

599
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 3: very it's very hard to put you know, these in

600
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 3: these these these these creatures of Pandora's box. Back inside

601
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 3: you have the economic dimension, you have the energy dimension,

602
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 3: and then you have the religious dimension of potential harm

603
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,160
Speaker 3: to holy sides. Whoever does it, however does it, whether

604
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:35,480
Speaker 3: it's on purpose or accidental. Just this is why you know,

605
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 3: George W. Bush wasn't inclined to do this war. This

606
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,480
Speaker 3: is why Trump himself in his first term was this

607
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 3: inclined to do this war. So the fact that this

608
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 3: second time around he sort of threw the dice and said,

609
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 3: you only live once with the most sensitive region in

610
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 3: the world, basically is is something from each I can't

611
00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 3: forgive the Republican Party ever again, like all the other issues,

612
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,920
Speaker 3: the world can go to hell, right, compared to being

613
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 3: responsible stewards of that region and not like messing with

614
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 3: the world in that way. Yeah, the Republican Party, the

615
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 3: fact that it could not prevent a president coming to

616
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 3: power who would be this irresponsible needs to go away

617
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 3: for a long time and meditate. And that's what we

618
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 3: will do, I think. I mean, every poll seems to

619
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 3: suggest that the midterms are going to be brutal. Probably

620
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 3: twenty twenty eight is going to be brutal. It's just

621
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 3: the party is irreformably irresponsible.

622
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 2: All right, Well, share you more so.

623
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 1: I'm great to see you. Thank you so much. It's

624
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: great to have your insights on all these issues.

625
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:43,960
Speaker 2: Thanks man. Be well.

626
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:48,840
Speaker 4: Now, we also didn't want to keep our eye off

627
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,960
Speaker 4: of a very strange story that's happening here on us soil.

628
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 4: We have multiple missing scientists. We have mysterious drone swarms

629
00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:59,240
Speaker 4: over us basis. We have a few congressmen which are

630
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 4: asking big questions is about this. One of them is

631
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 4: Representative Eric Burlson, and here is what he had to say.

632
00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 5: General McCasland apparently walked out of his home, left all

633
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:13,400
Speaker 5: of his devices and never came back. And Monica Reza,

634
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:17,799
Speaker 5: she was on a hike as well and mysteriously disappeared.

635
00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 2: And I've heard of others.

636
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 5: We've already sent a letter. When I first came in,

637
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 5: I heard of another gentleman, and I'll keep that name

638
00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:30,319
Speaker 5: to my out of respect. I sent a letter to

639
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 5: the FBI investigating the suspicious suicide of another individual who

640
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:40,440
Speaker 5: had worked alongside you know, other whistleblowers like David Grush

641
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 5: and Jake Barber who had come forward so their colleague

642
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:47,640
Speaker 5: is mysteriously committed suicide. We've already sent the letter to

643
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,440
Speaker 5: the FBI to investigate that, and that is an ongoing investigation.

644
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:53,120
Speaker 4: So to catch everybody up on top of this drone store,

645
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:55,319
Speaker 4: we have all these missing scientists, right and now let's

646
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 4: put this one up here on the screen.

647
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 2: This is E two.

648
00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 4: This was a married mother who vanished last year. Could

649
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 4: potentially have actually been tied to these missing and dead

650
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 4: US scientists. This fills in some of the gaps that

651
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 4: Representative Burlson was saying big picture for those who haven't

652
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 4: tuned into the story at all, we have about five

653
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:16,520
Speaker 4: missing scientists all across the nation. NASA engineers major figures

654
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 4: at the Air Force Research Laboratory. Many of them were

655
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:24,280
Speaker 4: actually overseeing like futuristic metal for rocket engines in terms

656
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 4: of their projects. One of them, obviously, is this retired

657
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:32,840
Speaker 4: General William mcclaskin. Now, his disappearance is really strange because

658
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 4: we had previous incidents involving Wright Patterson Air Force Base,

659
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 4: and the tying of all these things together has had

660
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 4: a lot of people in the UFO community really concerned about, like,

661
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 4: what exactly is happening here we were talking. I mean,

662
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:46,280
Speaker 4: your mind immediately starts to go to like three.

663
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:48,560
Speaker 2: Body Problem if you've ever had that book.

664
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 4: But I mean, look, I don't know how crazy that

665
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 4: is because now we're also in a time of war,

666
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:55,760
Speaker 4: and in that time of war, what we've actually seen

667
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 4: are all of these drones that have just been hovering

668
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 4: apparently over a US Air Force base. Can we skip

669
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 4: ahead to E five, please, because in the midst of

670
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 4: this missing scientists wave, we have quote multiple waves of

671
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:11,640
Speaker 4: unauthorized drones recently spotted over a strategic US Air Force base.

672
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 4: This was the US Air Force base at Barksdale in Louisiana,

673
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 4: and it was quote under a shelter in place order

674
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 4: on March ninth, so nine days after the US Iran

675
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:26,160
Speaker 4: war launched a report of unmanned aerial systems operating over

676
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:29,560
Speaker 4: the installations. This is the same Air Force base which

677
00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:33,440
Speaker 4: houses those B fifty two bombers and plays a critical

678
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 4: role in the command and control of the Air Force

679
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 4: nuclear defense capabilities. I will note on this one I

680
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:43,080
Speaker 4: could see it both ways as a UFO person. Drone

681
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 4: swarms over nuclear bases is like UFO like it goes

682
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,880
Speaker 4: back for decades. This has happened multiple times a strategic

683
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 4: Air command, specifically the nuclear arsenal, seems to be monitored.

684
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 4: But when you combine all these things together, in fact

685
00:36:57,880 --> 00:36:59,480
Speaker 4: that we're at a time of war, you also have

686
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:03,080
Speaker 4: to ask the main reason why normal national security officials,

687
00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 4: who are not UFO people at all ever got involved

688
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,760
Speaker 4: in the story people like Rubio and others, is people

689
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 4: in the Air Force and in the Army kept coming

690
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 4: to them and go, no, you don't get it, Like

691
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 4: there are drones hovering over our bases. There are things

692
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 4: that are just monitoring what we're doing, and they're like,

693
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:21,360
Speaker 4: oh my god, this could be Russia or China.

694
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: Now the more they dig, it's not Russia or China.

695
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:24,240
Speaker 2: This one.

696
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:27,600
Speaker 4: I actually could see a situation where this one is Rushao,

697
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,600
Speaker 4: China specifically, also because they're the ones who are helping Iran.

698
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:33,960
Speaker 4: Remember the whole Chinese weather balloon situation. It's not like

699
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 4: you would put this out character for all of them,

700
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,720
Speaker 4: but if you put it all together, it's very mysterious

701
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 4: and it's scary. And for those who think I'm a kook,

702
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,040
Speaker 4: it doesn't just have to be UFO related. Do you

703
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 4: know how many nuclear scientists that we've killed in Iran

704
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 4: with the Israelis. The Israelis are black bragging about it

705
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 4: right now, how they've killed two missing nuclear scientists already.

706
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 4: Didn't I just read earlier in the A Bloc we

707
00:37:56,280 --> 00:38:00,319
Speaker 4: hit a specific part of Tehran University. What do you

708
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:03,920
Speaker 4: think that's for? It's from military related nuclear related research.

709
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:07,479
Speaker 4: So this is a campaign, which I mean is very

710
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 4: Manhattan Project kind of Oppenheimer where it could be UFO related.

711
00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 4: It also could be related here to the war with

712
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 4: Iron the scientists, though, I should clarify this has been

713
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:19,920
Speaker 4: a month long, if a year long thing, so is

714
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 4: somewhat disconnected.

715
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:22,240
Speaker 2: But I do think the stories are linked.

716
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think there's three obvious possibilities. One

717
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,439
Speaker 1: is the connection to the UFO stuff. And by the way,

718
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 1: part of what really raised eyebrows is the one of

719
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: these scientists who this one disappeared was the general, Major

720
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:44,799
Speaker 1: General William McCasland. And his disappearance occurs shortly after Trump

721
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 1: announces like, Okay, we're going to release all of this

722
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:50,879
Speaker 1: like UAP material and let you know what's going on there.

723
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:52,439
Speaker 1: Not that we have I think a lot of hope

724
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,960
Speaker 1: about just how transparent that will be. But that was

725
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 1: part of what raised eyebrows. And his is first of all,

726
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: the circumstances are very range. Okay, he left Albuquerque on foot,

727
00:39:03,719 --> 00:39:06,880
Speaker 1: like left his home on foot, didn't have his phone,

728
00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:11,799
Speaker 1: there was clothing found again coming right in proximity to

729
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:15,080
Speaker 1: this UAP directive coming out. He was actually in the

730
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 1: Podesta the twenty sixteen Podesta WikiLeaks emails, as someone who

731
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:23,879
Speaker 1: quote had firsthand knowledge of UAPs. He oversees this classified

732
00:39:23,920 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: space weapons program at right Patterson. Saga, correct me if

733
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 1: I'm wrong, But that's where the supposed New Mexico. Yes,

734
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:35,280
Speaker 1: there's that's that's the idea in the UFO conspiracy community

735
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 1: is that the craft was taken to this right Patterson airbase.

736
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:40,360
Speaker 1: It's the subject of a lot of the sort of

737
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 1: the conspiracies in the space. So when he goes missing

738
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:45,799
Speaker 1: in these weird, this weird way, it's very eyebrow raising.

739
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 1: The other one that is the most eyebrow raising is

740
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 1: Monica Jacinto Reza, who worked under him under his program.

741
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:58,359
Speaker 1: She's the one who was studying this you know, very

742
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:02,360
Speaker 1: advanced nickel alloy. And again the circumstances are really weird.

743
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 1: She was hiking with a group of people, not alone,

744
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:09,480
Speaker 1: hiking with a group of people. Vanishes they were, you know,

745
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:12,040
Speaker 1: she was some thirty feet away from her companions, and

746
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 1: then she's just gone and they've found no sign of

747
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:21,000
Speaker 1: her whatsoever. Extensive search volunteers, dogs, helicopters, the works, no

748
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:24,279
Speaker 1: sign of her whatsoever. So look like I was saying

749
00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:26,440
Speaker 1: three possibilities. One is some sort of relation to the

750
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 1: UP program, perhaps you know, wanting to silence them, etc.

751
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 1: That's one possibility. The other is foreign intelligence. The other

752
00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: is just a coincidence. You know, it's a violent country. Unfortunately,

753
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,520
Speaker 1: weird and bad things happen all the time. It's certainly

754
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:41,719
Speaker 1: not on the realm of possibility that this is all

755
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,319
Speaker 1: just coincidences. So you've got those two, and then you've

756
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,719
Speaker 1: got about three others. Some of them are more or

757
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,480
Speaker 1: less sort of tangentially related. Certainly some of them. I

758
00:40:50,480 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 1: think it's probably like people trying to put pieces together

759
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:57,240
Speaker 1: that don't totally fit. But it's enough that a former

760
00:40:57,560 --> 00:41:00,480
Speaker 1: assistant director the FBI, Swecker, was inner by the New

761
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 1: York Post, said hey, these should really be investigated in

762
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:07,400
Speaker 1: connection with each other, Like these shouldn't be separate investigations.

763
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: They should at least be looked at, which tells you

764
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:12,920
Speaker 1: it's not just cookery. There's at least enough here. And

765
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: Osaga said it certainly wouldn't be the first time that's

766
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 1: high level scientists at like the the bleeding edge of

767
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,960
Speaker 1: you know, nuclear or you know, physical sciences that they

768
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,279
Speaker 1: would be targeted. And so I think that's why it's

769
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:27,479
Speaker 1: at least significant enough to kind of flag here without

770
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:28,759
Speaker 1: fully hitting our tinfoil hats off.

771
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 4: Whether it's Russia, well, my hat's on my hat.

772
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 1: I don't think you need the tinfoil hat to look

773
00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:40,400
Speaker 1: at this and be like this at least bears looking

774
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 1: into whether it's lagging, looking into et cetera.

775
00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,839
Speaker 4: Whether it's Russia, whether it's China, whether it's Tri Solarens.

776
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 4: Everybody has an as an interest in killing scientists, right,

777
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,480
Speaker 4: everybody has an interest in killing I.

778
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:56,120
Speaker 1: Literally just read Three Body Problems, so yeah, So reading

779
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 1: that and then seeing this, of course I instantly was like, oh,

780
00:41:58,719 --> 00:41:59,399
Speaker 1: what's going on here?

781
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 2: The show is.

782
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,720
Speaker 4: It's not the greatest thing ever.

783
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 2: Made, but it was okay.

784
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 1: It was okay, but we started watching it.

785
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:09,279
Speaker 2: I like it so far. It's all right, it's you guys.

786
00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 1: The book is always better, right.

787
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:17,120
Speaker 4: Apparently there's a Chinese version. They did a well in China, obviously, yeah,

788
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:19,960
Speaker 4: Chinese book. So I think China did like a multi

789
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:24,360
Speaker 4: episode series where it's like akin to like an HBO

790
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 4: style prestige show that's supposed to be good. So if

791
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:28,799
Speaker 4: I don't even knows where I could watch it, I'll

792
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:30,279
Speaker 4: watch it as long as I have subtitles I'd be

793
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:30,799
Speaker 4: happy to watch.

794
00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 1: That's cool. Yeah, I would check that out too.

795
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 4: Okay, we've got focus and standing by. Let's get to it.

796
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 1: So for more on the Iran War, of are very

797
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,560
Speaker 1: fortunate to be joined this morning by Lawrence Wilkerson. He's

798
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 1: a retired US Army colonel. He was former chief of

799
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 1: staff to a Secretary of State cole in pal Vietnam

800
00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 1: veteran and also former faculty member at the US Naval

801
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:55,359
Speaker 1: War College, and was a prominent critic of the Iraq War.

802
00:42:55,719 --> 00:42:58,359
Speaker 1: Genuinely one of my heroes. Certainly, great to meet you, sir,

803
00:42:58,360 --> 00:43:00,759
Speaker 1: and great to have you one just you, sir, could

804
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 1: be waiting, yes, of course. So let's go ahead and

805
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 1: start with some of the latest Here recent interview that

806
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:08,960
Speaker 1: President Trump gave to Financial Times, we can put some

807
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:10,960
Speaker 1: of the highlights, if you want to call them that,

808
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,160
Speaker 1: up on the screen here. He told the Financial Times

809
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,359
Speaker 1: he quote wants to seize Iran's oil.

810
00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:16,719
Speaker 2: Quote.

811
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:19,000
Speaker 1: To be honest with you, my favorite thing is to

812
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:23,880
Speaker 1: take the oil in Iran, specifically considering taking carg Island.

813
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:26,600
Speaker 1: He compares it to Venezuela, saying the US could control

814
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:31,480
Speaker 1: oil there indefinitely. Also claims Iran has no real defense. Quote.

815
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 1: I don't think they have any defense. We could take

816
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 1: it very easily. Acknowledges that carg Island would require a

817
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 1: lengthy occupation. He also says we've bombed thirteen thousand targets,

818
00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,680
Speaker 1: We've got about three thousand targets left, and claims that

819
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: regime change has effectively already happened. So your reaction to

820
00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 1: some of what President Trump is claiming here in this interview.

821
00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 6: I think we're seeing Donald Trump do his best to

822
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 6: create an aura around this decision to go to war

823
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:06,880
Speaker 6: and neron that looks successful, and he's having great difficulty

824
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:11,000
Speaker 6: doing it, whether marshaling forces to show the American people

825
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 6: that he can do that, or whether it's actually describing

826
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:18,920
Speaker 6: the situation in Iran. I bring it to my group's attention,

827
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:22,960
Speaker 6: and most of them know what I'm talking about. That

828
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 6: when I used to be on the game floor in

829
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,760
Speaker 6: some of the biggest simulations of war games, the United

830
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:32,720
Speaker 6: States played Global for example at the Naval War College,

831
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 6: where former Secretaries of Defense or in one case, sitting

832
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 6: Secretaries of Defense would play the president in the game.

833
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:44,560
Speaker 6: These were very serious games, and one of the things

834
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 6: I would always ask the people on the game floor,

835
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:51,239
Speaker 6: is how are you doing or some question like that.

836
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 6: And if a Navy captain or an Army colonel came

837
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 6: back to me and said, we're accomplish our objectives, I'd

838
00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:01,960
Speaker 6: take him in the corner and chew his butt out

839
00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:05,560
Speaker 6: and I would say, that's not what I asked you.

840
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:10,320
Speaker 6: Are you accomplishing your mission? You can bomb the hell

841
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:15,360
Speaker 6: out of the world and accomplish your objectives so many bombs,

842
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:19,719
Speaker 6: so many targets, so many airplanes, and not be accomplishing

843
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,600
Speaker 6: your mission, and they would look back at me with

844
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 6: some amazement Ooh oh, is that right, sir? Okay, let

845
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:29,840
Speaker 6: me get back to you. That's what I would say here.

846
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 6: You can drop all the bombs in the world, you

847
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:35,319
Speaker 6: can be accomplishing your plans and all that, but if

848
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 6: they aren't leading you to accomplishing your mission, it's nonsense.

849
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 6: And that's what's happening here, partly because no one has

850
00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 6: articulated the mission.

851
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 4: Sir. I'm actually really curious, considering your experience in the

852
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 4: Bush administration. The current plan is now to go in,

853
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:55,480
Speaker 4: or at least one floated plan is to go in

854
00:45:56,000 --> 00:46:00,120
Speaker 4: use US ground troops to seize one thousand pounds of

855
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:03,560
Speaker 4: uranium somehow just be on the ground for days or weeks,

856
00:46:03,960 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 4: be able to take that without taking any casualties or

857
00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:09,719
Speaker 4: minimal casualties, potentially with the eighty second Airborne that would

858
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:13,720
Speaker 4: be surrounding them from a military strategic level, also genuinely

859
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 4: as somebody was engaged, probably in similar conversations there at

860
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:20,080
Speaker 4: the time. I mean, how fantastical of a plan is that.

861
00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 4: What are the realities of being able to successfully be

862
00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:24,760
Speaker 4: able to pull that off, not only just to extract

863
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 4: the uranium, but also to make sure that there's minimal

864
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:28,040
Speaker 4: US casualties.

865
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:31,200
Speaker 6: First of all, I don't think General Keen, and I

866
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:33,680
Speaker 6: don't know him that well, but I've seen a little

867
00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:36,200
Speaker 6: bit of his activities, and I know something of his

868
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:40,600
Speaker 6: objections to this entire process. They weren't heated, of course,

869
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:43,719
Speaker 6: but I don't think anyone is going to give the

870
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:47,719
Speaker 6: real evidence or facts of what's going to happen. I

871
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 6: see forces moving from Naha and Okinawa the fifteenth MEW,

872
00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 6: I believe the forward deployed MEW. I see forces moving

873
00:46:56,520 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 6: from southern California, from Washington State, from Fort Kentucky, from Ramstein.

874
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:08,360
Speaker 6: Of course, all manner of forces moving toward or supposedly towards.

875
00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 6: Some of them haven't even received a warning order yet.

876
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:15,480
Speaker 6: If you can believe that the area, what that means

877
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,919
Speaker 6: in terms of what's been stated, I think is very

878
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 6: difficult to ascertain. I hope, probably because the military is

879
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:27,640
Speaker 6: obfuscating it and doesn't want anybody, including the enemy, to

880
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 6: know what we're going to do. But I think you're

881
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:33,840
Speaker 6: right in terms of the array of forces being put down,

882
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 6: it looks as if we're going to have some more

883
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:40,080
Speaker 6: or less conventional forces to protect as well. They can

884
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:43,440
Speaker 6: those special operators who are going in to try and

885
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:47,239
Speaker 6: find something that we want, and for what doctor Ted

886
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 6: Postal has told me up at Ameriatus, Professor Mit, the

887
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:55,359
Speaker 6: most serious thing is and I think Ted's right on this.

888
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:58,919
Speaker 6: He thinks, as the North Koreans did and fooled us

889
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:01,239
Speaker 6: in two thousand and two. I was there when they

890
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 6: did it. They have the capability to match the enriched

891
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:10,720
Speaker 6: uranium to the warhead to the crumbshaw or whatever missile

892
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:14,840
Speaker 6: and send a new crew weapon at Israel. And they're

893
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:19,440
Speaker 6: fast perfecting that deep underground in a laboratory that they

894
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:23,279
Speaker 6: built especially for this purpose. If that's the case, I

895
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:27,279
Speaker 6: suspect that's principally what we're after. I don't know, but

896
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 6: I would say that's probably the main target we're after,

897
00:48:31,120 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 6: and I think we have less than a fifty percent

898
00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 6: chance of achieving success.

899
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:39,920
Speaker 1: So you believe that decision may have already been made.

900
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,359
Speaker 1: And how does how does that change the game? You know,

901
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 1: obviously Iran has talked a lot about their goal in

902
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 1: this war is to establish some level of deterrence, so

903
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:50,920
Speaker 1: they're not constantly being you know, threatened and bombed by

904
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:54,240
Speaker 1: the US and by Israelis. So how does the strategic

905
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 1: calculus change for US if Iran has decided like, Okay, well,

906
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:00,399
Speaker 1: I guess we're off to the race here.

907
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,879
Speaker 6: That's a very good question one a group of US

908
00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 6: were pondering until the wee hours last night. And I

909
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:11,560
Speaker 6: think there's another dimension here that is crucial. We have

910
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 6: seen devastating accuracy based on truly excellent intelligence all through

911
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:24,040
Speaker 6: the region by Iran, from Erbil and Kurdistan to our

912
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:28,400
Speaker 6: own embassy in Baghdad to the two aircraft that crashed

913
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:31,360
Speaker 6: over Iraq. By the way, one of those aircraft, we

914
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 6: have it from good authority, was actually hit by a

915
00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 6: shoulder fired missile. It wasn't an accident. It actually was

916
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:41,120
Speaker 6: hit by a missile and went down to other things

917
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:44,640
Speaker 6: that they've done in countries like Bahrain where they destroyed

918
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 6: our entire fifth fleet capability and cutter and Saudi Arabia.

919
00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:53,480
Speaker 6: Now think of this for a moment. We know that

920
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 6: Iran has a second set of targets in countries in

921
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:01,239
Speaker 6: the region. It is waiting to see which of those

922
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 6: countries actually support materially support these actions that are supposedly

923
00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:11,200
Speaker 6: coming up by these ground forces from the United States

924
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 6: and perhaps Britain. They are then going to execute that

925
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:18,680
Speaker 6: second and if they execute that second target list with

926
00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:23,080
Speaker 6: a devastating effect that they did the first, the global

927
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 6: economy is going to go into depression because it will

928
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:31,439
Speaker 6: take out almost all the capacity. Whether it gets through

929
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:34,160
Speaker 6: the strait or not will be irrelevant because it will

930
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:38,040
Speaker 6: be destroyed. This is significant, and we're not even paying

931
00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 6: any attention to it.

932
00:50:39,160 --> 00:50:39,399
Speaker 2: Sir.

933
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:41,640
Speaker 4: How worried are you about the use of nuclear weapons

934
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,680
Speaker 4: by Israel, by Iran, by the United States.

935
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:48,520
Speaker 6: Very especially Israel. I would put the order of probability

936
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:53,160
Speaker 6: in that order, Israel first, Iran possibly second. If Ted's right,

937
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 6: and I don't think I don't even think Donald Trump.

938
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 6: I hope I phrased that properly. I don't even think

939
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 6: Donald Trump would resort to nuclear weapons.

940
00:51:02,560 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 4: Tell us about that with Israel. Then you've dealt with

941
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:06,680
Speaker 4: the Israelis, You've studied them for a long time. Why

942
00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:07,600
Speaker 4: are you so worried about it?

943
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 6: I remember in seventy three, if it hadn't been for

944
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:16,240
Speaker 6: the Soviets and US and Henry Kishener to a certain extent,

945
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 6: bringing the pressure that both capitals brought on Israel, go

946
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 6: to my heir at the time. I think they had

947
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,040
Speaker 6: already uploaded one or two bombs and were going to

948
00:51:26,080 --> 00:51:28,760
Speaker 6: drop it on the Egyptian Third Army, which was putting

949
00:51:28,760 --> 00:51:32,439
Speaker 6: them in peril at that moment. What really saw that

950
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:36,720
Speaker 6: was the Israelis managed to flank that army and didn't

951
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:39,080
Speaker 6: need the nukear weapon. But go to my air at

952
00:51:39,080 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 6: the time, maybe it was for public consumption. Told a

953
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,680
Speaker 6: BBC reporter and it was on the top front page

954
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 6: above the foal of one of the London papers the

955
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 6: next morning that in response to his question, would you

956
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:55,359
Speaker 6: use a nuker weapon? She didn't bat an eye.

957
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:58,360
Speaker 1: She said, yes, you were telling us before the segment started,

958
00:51:58,360 --> 00:52:00,600
Speaker 1: there were some headlines jumping out at U this morning

959
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 1: is really priss, in particular about Jade Vance potentially looking

960
00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:07,200
Speaker 1: for an off ramp and wanting to put Israel's interest

961
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 1: to the side, which would be necessary in order to

962
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 1: even begin to explore an off ramp. Do you put

963
00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 1: any credence in that reporting? And what OFFERMP exists for

964
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:18,080
Speaker 1: the US at this point?

965
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:22,640
Speaker 6: I think we should declare victory and quit. That's what

966
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:25,440
Speaker 6: I think. And Trump's a genius said lying about it,

967
00:52:25,560 --> 00:52:28,640
Speaker 6: So I think with the MAGA base at least, although

968
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 6: it's becoming even more fragmented than he thought, probably by

969
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:36,319
Speaker 6: this time, I think still he'd have enough core there

970
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 6: that would believe him no matter what fantastic lies he

971
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:43,120
Speaker 6: told about it. But declare victory and quit and tell

972
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:46,319
Speaker 6: Nata Yahoo he's on his own. The only problem with

973
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:49,800
Speaker 6: that is what we just discussed. Wouldn't Natanya, who being

974
00:52:49,840 --> 00:52:53,560
Speaker 6: on his own, seeing the Jewish state of Israel disappearing

975
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:57,520
Speaker 6: under his feet to be credited to him in history?

976
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:00,600
Speaker 6: Would he not use a nuclear weaponr too, and as

977
00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 6: a military professional, he wouldn't use one. He'd have to

978
00:53:04,200 --> 00:53:06,840
Speaker 6: use quite a few to have any impact on a

979
00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:09,960
Speaker 6: vast country like Iran, ninety three million people, the size

980
00:53:09,960 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 6: of Western Europe. One nuclear weapon of the kilotonage that

981
00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:16,920
Speaker 6: israel Is would not do very much. If he dropped

982
00:53:16,920 --> 00:53:19,000
Speaker 6: it on to run, of course, it would be bloody,

983
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:23,400
Speaker 6: it would be terrible, be horrible, Eroshima Nagasaki. But I

984
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:25,160
Speaker 6: don't think he would do that. He'd drop it on

985
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:29,040
Speaker 6: these military targets. They're significantly underground, and that's not going

986
00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:31,279
Speaker 6: to do very much. So he'd have to use many

987
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:34,040
Speaker 6: of them, and then the genie is truly out of

988
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:34,560
Speaker 6: the bottle.

989
00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, last question for you, sir, you served in Vietnam.

990
00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:40,680
Speaker 4: We were reading a quote from General Westmoreland this morning

991
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:43,640
Speaker 4: from nineteen sixty five. He said, there's no scenario where

992
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:46,360
Speaker 4: US Marines would ever engage with the Vietnamese in the

993
00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 4: very first weeks of the war. DC parallels here with

994
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:50,799
Speaker 4: some of these deployments.

995
00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:51,600
Speaker 2: Tell us about I do.

996
00:53:52,200 --> 00:53:55,640
Speaker 6: The major parallel I see is we went in I think,

997
00:53:55,760 --> 00:54:00,160
Speaker 6: with reasonably good intentions, and we ruined it all and

998
00:54:00,200 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 6: we didn't recognize it for fifty nine thousand plus casualties later. Now,

999
00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:09,360
Speaker 6: there were other reasons Johnson committing that huge amount of troops.

1000
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:12,800
Speaker 6: He did. I think President Johnson knew. He knew George

1001
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,200
Speaker 6: Ball had told him. This is a case study I

1002
00:54:15,320 --> 00:54:18,160
Speaker 6: taught at Women Mary that it wasn't going to do

1003
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:21,799
Speaker 6: any good. And LBJ actually said, and I quote, oh

1004
00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:26,279
Speaker 6: ho ain't going to be moved by no bombs. That's

1005
00:54:26,320 --> 00:54:29,480
Speaker 6: a direct quote from LBJ. And he knew it. But

1006
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:32,240
Speaker 6: he knew also that if he cut and ran from Vietnam,

1007
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:35,000
Speaker 6: he would lose the election. And so he didn't, and

1008
00:54:35,239 --> 00:54:38,440
Speaker 6: some thirty thousand added to that fifty nine thousand killed

1009
00:54:38,520 --> 00:54:43,319
Speaker 6: later we finally left. This is a similar situation and

1010
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:47,560
Speaker 6: with a much different administration which I don't think even

1011
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,080
Speaker 6: knows how to make national security decisions.

1012
00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:53,279
Speaker 1: Well, Retired Colonel Lawrence Wilkerson, thank you so much for

1013
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:54,840
Speaker 1: your time this morning. We got a lot on it.

1014
00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:56,239
Speaker 1: This We hope you'll consider coming back.

1015
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:57,440
Speaker 2: Thank you, sir. We appreciate it.

1016
00:54:57,480 --> 00:54:58,480
Speaker 6: Thank you, take care.

1017
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:01,200
Speaker 2: Thank you guys to watching. We appreciate it. We'll have

1018
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:02,759
Speaker 2: a great show for you all tomorrow. We'll see you then.