WEBVTT - Selects: How Schoolhouse Rock Rocked: Featuring Bob Nastanovich of Pavement

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, everybody, Happy Saturday. And as promised in our Saturday

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<v Speaker 1>Morning Cartoons episode, which, by the way, I hope you

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<v Speaker 1>woke up this morning and went downstairs and at least

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<v Speaker 1>streamed some cartoons for nostalgia's sake. But as promised in

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<v Speaker 1>that episode, here is our past school House Rock app

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<v Speaker 1>that we recorded quite a number of years ago, and

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<v Speaker 1>we thought it was apropos that we put it out

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<v Speaker 1>the same week as the old Saturday Morning Cartoons up.

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<v Speaker 1>We really had a great time recording this episode. Schoolhouse

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<v Speaker 1>Rock was a fundamental source of learning men entertainment for

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<v Speaker 1>both of us growing up and for most of Gen X.

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<v Speaker 2>I would say, so, I hope you enjoy it all

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<v Speaker 2>over again.

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<v Speaker 1>Here we go with how school House Rock Rocked featuring

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<v Speaker 1>Bob Nistanovich Pavement.

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<v Speaker 3>Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 4>Let's say, because knowledge is power.

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<v Speaker 5>Hey, and welcome to the podcast.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm Josh Clark, There's Charles w Chuck Bryant, There's Jerry

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<v Speaker 4>and this is Stuff.

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<v Speaker 5>You Should Know. Chip off the block of your favorite schoolhouse.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that was h We just heard the theme song.

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<v Speaker 2>If you're between the ages of well, were you into it? Yes, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>so you're what forty one, I'm forty, dude, forty so

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<v Speaker 2>probably younger than you even a bit. Let's say if

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<v Speaker 2>you're between.

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<v Speaker 5>I was definitely toward the tail end of it.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, let's say thirty eight to fifty years old.

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<v Speaker 5>Actually, yeah, that's so true. So let's say it was

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<v Speaker 5>up to.

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<v Speaker 2>Eighty five, so our Schoolhouse Rock.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, so I would swear in that, let's say

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<v Speaker 4>thirty five to what fifty ish? All right, that's what

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<v Speaker 4>you agree on a little more fifty five maybe.

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<v Speaker 5>So that fifteen year period you were lucky.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Like if you just heard that theme song and

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<v Speaker 2>like something inside your body happened emotionally in your brain,

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<v Speaker 2>then that means that you grew up in the seventies

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<v Speaker 2>and eighties. I think the heyday of Saturday Morning cartoons personally,

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<v Speaker 2>as a fan of Schoolhouse Rock one of my favorite

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<v Speaker 2>favorite favorite things in the world.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, it was pretty great.

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<v Speaker 2>I still love it. Yeah, Like I still listen to

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<v Speaker 2>this stuff semi regularly.

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<v Speaker 5>Oh do you.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it'd been a little while.

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<v Speaker 4>When I went back to research this, I listened to

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<v Speaker 4>or watched a bunch of them.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and they all just came flooding back.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and the writer of this article actually interviewed, didn't

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<v Speaker 2>he Bob Doro?

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<v Speaker 5>It sounded that way unless he's a big fat liar.

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<v Speaker 5>In his author's note.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I just remember when this article went around, Like

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<v Speaker 2>the first thing we do when there's an article at

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<v Speaker 2>house thefforks is there's a email that goes around everyone

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<v Speaker 2>where people kind of suggest kind of questions you can

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<v Speaker 2>answer and stuff like that.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think we ever really talked about that, did we.

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<v Speaker 5>I don't think so.

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<v Speaker 2>Nine years in that's a secret and people say, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>you should think about this, you should do this, And

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<v Speaker 2>I said, somebody should try and interview Bob Doro. It's

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<v Speaker 2>like he's ninety three years old and you know, you

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<v Speaker 2>can still get in touch with the guy. I think,

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<v Speaker 2>and apparently this dude did. And sadly I think we

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<v Speaker 2>got was like one quote.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, well he was on his way to like a

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<v Speaker 4>jazz gig in London when he caught him.

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<v Speaker 2>I bet you that was more in there than this.

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<v Speaker 2>I was all disappointed. Oh you're saying I wanted like

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<v Speaker 2>more more select pull quotes from mister Doro.

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<v Speaker 4>He wanted like I called mister Doro. He answered, Hello,

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<v Speaker 4>said mister Doro.

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<v Speaker 2>We should have interviewed him for this.

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<v Speaker 5>I don't know why we didn't.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't either. Easy to get to uh and there's well,

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<v Speaker 2>I'll get to that. Never mind, should we get in

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<v Speaker 2>the way back machine?

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<v Speaker 4>Guess let's go back to the seventies, the greatest decade

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<v Speaker 4>in his true of humanity.

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<v Speaker 5>Probably, I'm not joking.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm a fan of the sixties, seventies, and eighties. It'd

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<v Speaker 2>be tough for me to decide.

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<v Speaker 4>The sixties were a little too hippie for me. Oh yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>love the seventies, though, I mean I had loved the seventies,

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<v Speaker 4>and not even as a Golden AIGs.

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<v Speaker 5>There was a lot wrong in the seventies.

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<v Speaker 4>Nixon was president during the seventies. Okay, Yeah, lots of

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<v Speaker 4>stuff were wrong in the seventies, But something about that

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<v Speaker 4>decade just hit.

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<v Speaker 5>All the boxes.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I just love it. I do too, And it

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<v Speaker 2>reminds me of my childhood, which is great, because you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I had a good childhood. It was fun. I've a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of We talked about that in the Nostalgia episode

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<v Speaker 2>on how nostalgia is the correct path life. Even though

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<v Speaker 2>John Hodgman doesn't think so.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>So early seventies, there's a gentleman named David McCall and

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<v Speaker 2>he was a He co owned an ad agency called

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<v Speaker 2>McCaffrey and McCall. And as the story goes, he was

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<v Speaker 2>on vacation with his family and he knew his son

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<v Speaker 2>was having some trouble in math, remembering specifically multiplication tables.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, no matter how much he yelled at him every night,

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<v Speaker 4>he couldn't get multiplication.

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<v Speaker 2>But they're in the car and this kid was singing,

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<v Speaker 2>as the story goes, rolling Stones, rolling Stone song, and

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<v Speaker 2>he was like, well, you know that, Why can't you

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<v Speaker 2>remember the other stuff? I don't think he was that cruff,

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<v Speaker 2>but it did hit him. He was like, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>my son remembered. He's no problem memorizing things. But there's

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<v Speaker 2>something about these multiplication tables. So I wonder if there's

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<v Speaker 2>something to sing song and turning learning into not only

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<v Speaker 2>just music, because that's not a new thing. People have

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<v Speaker 2>been doing that forever, but pop sounding music.

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<v Speaker 4>Right, and like pairing them with concepts to teach, right, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 4>to make kids understand difficult concepts right. And it's it's

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<v Speaker 4>so weird now, especially in the post school house rock

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<v Speaker 4>World that that, Yeah, of course people do that, Like

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<v Speaker 4>that's a technique that you use to teach kids, but

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<v Speaker 4>apparently no one else is doing this at the time.

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<v Speaker 4>Learning this was this was a pretty interesting idea, and

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<v Speaker 4>it really it germinated in just the right guy's mind.

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<v Speaker 4>Because this guy McCall was, like you said, he was

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<v Speaker 4>a partner in this advertising firm and they basically specialized

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<v Speaker 4>in in doing the same thing but get you getting

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<v Speaker 4>you to buy something. He was saying, maybe we could

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<v Speaker 4>do the same thing that we do to sell people stuff,

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<v Speaker 4>but to basically sell education to kids, to teach kids

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<v Speaker 4>using the same techniques that we an advertising.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Like they would see a jingle for a product

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<v Speaker 2>that would get lodged in someone's head and they would say,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, why can't we do that same thing, Like

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<v Speaker 2>it would get lodged in a kid's head and they

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<v Speaker 2>would have learned something instead of bought something.

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<v Speaker 4>Right, But you could also buy stuff. If you learn

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<v Speaker 4>enough stuff, you can buy even more stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>So he went to one of the I think he

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<v Speaker 2>was a creative director, a co creative director named George

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<v Speaker 2>Newell ran it by him. He said, great idea, get

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<v Speaker 2>someone on it and he threw a cigarette at him,

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<v Speaker 2>got out of the office and commissioned a one of

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<v Speaker 2>their writers. They had jingle writers on staff or at

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<v Speaker 2>least working with them, and they said, go write something.

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<v Speaker 2>It wasn't very good.

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<v Speaker 5>Didn't you feel bad for this person?

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<v Speaker 2>I did, But you know what, it could have died there, right,

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<v Speaker 2>he never would have had Schoolhouse Rock.

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<v Speaker 4>But this person went down in history is the contributor

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<v Speaker 4>to school House Rock.

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<v Speaker 5>Who didn't it didn't make it?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, say it? Or the person who almost old Schoolhouse Rock.

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<v Speaker 5>I guess so. But McCall was like, no, this idea

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<v Speaker 5>is too good for this.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, which is really, you know, a great thing and

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<v Speaker 2>a lesson in persistence. So he went Newell was a

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<v Speaker 2>jazz piano player, and he went to his buddy one

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<v Speaker 2>Bob Doro, one of my heroes, who was and is

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<v Speaker 2>a great bebop jazz pianist and composer, and said, you

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<v Speaker 2>can write a jingle too. Why don't you try this out?

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<v Speaker 2>And here's the one quote we might as well read

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<v Speaker 2>it from a ninety three year old mister Doro. I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know how I looked out. Apparently they tried other songwriters,

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<v Speaker 2>but most of them wrote down to kids. When I

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<v Speaker 2>met McCauley said, here's my idea. I give it a try,

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<v Speaker 2>but don't write down to the kids. And when he

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<v Speaker 2>said that, I got a chill. I have a high

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<v Speaker 2>opinion of children, And that was sort of the key

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<v Speaker 2>right there. They weren't songs like written in a remedial

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<v Speaker 2>way because it was children, right.

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<v Speaker 5>It'sy bitsy spider, give.

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<v Speaker 2>Me a break. Oh that's a classic. So but you're right.

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<v Speaker 4>But so this idea germinates in this right guy's head.

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<v Speaker 4>He happens to end up indirectly getting in touch with

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<v Speaker 4>this guy who has a high opinion of children, and

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<v Speaker 4>he happens to be a jazz composer. Yeah, things are

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<v Speaker 4>starting to like happen. There's basically the hand of the

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<v Speaker 4>Almighty at work here.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right. So Dora goes home, he has a daughter,

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<v Speaker 2>gets out of textbooks, and the first thing he comes

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<v Speaker 2>up with to me one.

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<v Speaker 5>Of the best man, it is far out.

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<v Speaker 2>Three is a magic number was the very first schoolhouse

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<v Speaker 2>song written because the first thing they wanted to tackle

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<v Speaker 2>was math. Because of McCall's son.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, this this composition that he came back with, Three

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<v Speaker 4>is a magic number. It's a I when I.

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<v Speaker 5>Hear it, it's super cool, but I don't.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm really surprised that everybody's like, this is, yes, figure

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<v Speaker 4>something out from this.

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<v Speaker 2>I loved it.

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<v Speaker 4>It is, it's cool, but it just doesn't seem like

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<v Speaker 4>the basis the keystone of Schoolhouse Rock to me.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm surprised.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, it's one of my favorites. That's great because it

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<v Speaker 2>dealt with multiplication. And not only that, but like you said,

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<v Speaker 2>got a little trippy with the symbolism faith, hope and charity,

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<v Speaker 2>heart and mind and body. Right, it was about and

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<v Speaker 2>I've wanted to do a podcast on three, the number three,

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<v Speaker 2>because it's very special. It is very special. It is.

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<v Speaker 5>We did one on zero. Why not three?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh man, I forgot about that. Remember, I think my

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<v Speaker 2>brain melted a bit there.

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<v Speaker 5>That's a good one. It's tough. Zero is tough.

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<v Speaker 2>It is tough and not at all magic, right, not

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<v Speaker 2>really so regardless, if you would have been working there,

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<v Speaker 2>you would have been like, eh, and everyone else enjoyed it.

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<v Speaker 2>You'd be like, I'm gonna go get a bagel.

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<v Speaker 5>I'm gonna go work on this process cheese account.

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<v Speaker 2>I did think of Madmen quite a bit when I

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<v Speaker 2>was researching this, it was sort of that same time

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<v Speaker 2>period or I guess towards No, Madmen didn't make it

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<v Speaker 2>into the seventies.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I thought he did, because wasn't he supposed to

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<v Speaker 5>be dB Cooper at the end, and that was the

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<v Speaker 5>right seventies?

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<v Speaker 2>True?

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, early, I guess it was seventy one.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it did crack into the seventies, not like

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<v Speaker 2>Boogie Knights did.

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<v Speaker 5>That was all seventies into the eighties.

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<v Speaker 2>No, that's right, it cracked into the eighties. Yeah with

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<v Speaker 2>that cheeze that that song you recorded. Well, no, I was, well, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>that for sure. But I was thinking about when when

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<v Speaker 2>the Party The New Year's e Party nineteen eighty with

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<v Speaker 2>Bill Macy. Oh yeah, man, what a great movie. That

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<v Speaker 2>was wonderful. Yeah, the movie's almost like twenty years old.

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<v Speaker 5>I believe it. We're old, Chuck.

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<v Speaker 2>I know. But those those pop culture references are the

0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:52.880
<v Speaker 2>ones that really hit home for me.

0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:55.560
<v Speaker 5>What the ones are in the seventies.

0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:57.600
<v Speaker 2>Well, when I think of like Boogie Nights, it's like, oh, yeah,

0:11:57.600 --> 0:12:00.480
<v Speaker 2>that was just like a few years ago, right, And

0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:03.280
<v Speaker 2>then someone says it's celebrating its twentieth anniversary and I'm like,

0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.559
<v Speaker 2>what or like when I see an athlete's son or daughter. Yeah,

0:12:07.600 --> 0:12:09.520
<v Speaker 2>it's weird to see them as playing the same sport.

0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:13.359
<v Speaker 5>The rookies are now like the old coaches and managers

0:12:13.440 --> 0:12:16.120
<v Speaker 5>in the sports now. Man, it's bizarre.

0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:21.920
<v Speaker 2>So everyone's impressed at McCaffrey and McCall. Then they did

0:12:21.920 --> 0:12:24.319
<v Speaker 2>a pretty smart thing. They went to McCall was on

0:12:24.360 --> 0:12:27.960
<v Speaker 2>the board of the Bank Street College of Education in

0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:29.560
<v Speaker 2>New York there and he took it to them and

0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:31.720
<v Speaker 2>it was just a song at this point, and said,

0:12:32.200 --> 0:12:35.200
<v Speaker 2>what do you think is a learning tool? They used it,

0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:37.160
<v Speaker 2>played it for the students and they were like, this

0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:41.840
<v Speaker 2>is awesome. Right they're responding again Little Josh.

0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:46.280
<v Speaker 5>He's just sitting there with his arms, crusty, scowling. Never

0:12:46.320 --> 0:12:47.720
<v Speaker 5>seen him so mad before.

0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:54.120
<v Speaker 2>So the students liked it. The agency liked it, so

0:12:54.120 --> 0:12:56.600
<v Speaker 2>they knew they were onto something. They got their art

0:12:56.600 --> 0:13:00.080
<v Speaker 2>director Tom yo yo h e.

0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:04.360
<v Speaker 5>Oh you're going with yo, I'm going all out with YOHI.

0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:11.240
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Tom Yohee and said, put some animation to this,

0:13:11.559 --> 0:13:14.240
<v Speaker 2>draw out some storyboards because that was the beauty of

0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:18.160
<v Speaker 2>Schoolhouse Rock to me was it was a combination of everything.

0:13:18.200 --> 0:13:20.800
<v Speaker 2>It wasn't just the song, Like, the songs are great,

0:13:21.840 --> 0:13:23.679
<v Speaker 2>and we'll get more to the music here in a bit,

0:13:23.760 --> 0:13:28.000
<v Speaker 2>but it was the combination of the visuals with the song, yeah,

0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:30.000
<v Speaker 2>and the fact that you were learning something in such

0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:32.840
<v Speaker 2>a unique way. It was just like the perfect storm

0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:33.800
<v Speaker 2>of awesomeness.

0:13:33.880 --> 0:13:36.079
<v Speaker 5>Yeah. The songs on their own would have stood up

0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:36.640
<v Speaker 5>on their own.

0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:37.079
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah.

0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:40.200
<v Speaker 4>And initially, like they they planned to just release an

0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:43.120
<v Speaker 4>album of cool songs like this, Yeah, but it was

0:13:43.160 --> 0:13:47.240
<v Speaker 4>when YOHI started sitting there right like drawing some of.

0:13:47.200 --> 0:13:48.800
<v Speaker 5>This stuff out. Uh huh.

0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:51.400
<v Speaker 4>That's I mean. Schoolhouse Rock is not one or the other.

0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:53.720
<v Speaker 4>It's the combination of those two things, and they play

0:13:53.720 --> 0:13:54.280
<v Speaker 4>off each other.

0:13:54.400 --> 0:14:00.000
<v Speaker 2>So well, agreed. So they took Now they have these storyboards.

0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:02.960
<v Speaker 2>They take this to a guy named radford Stone. He

0:14:03.080 --> 0:14:08.720
<v Speaker 2>was their account supervisor, the VP for ABC, and they said,

0:14:08.720 --> 0:14:12.800
<v Speaker 2>there's this young upstart at ABC for their children's programming

0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:17.079
<v Speaker 2>named Michael Eisner. Doubt if he's ever going to go anywhere,

0:14:17.280 --> 0:14:19.480
<v Speaker 2>but right now he's running the kids shop over there,

0:14:20.360 --> 0:14:22.440
<v Speaker 2>and let's bring in because this guy knows a lot

0:14:22.440 --> 0:14:25.640
<v Speaker 2>about kids programming, Let's bring in Chuck Jones to the meeting,

0:14:26.400 --> 0:14:29.880
<v Speaker 2>shout out to our friend Jessica, granddaughter of mister Jones,

0:14:30.520 --> 0:14:34.400
<v Speaker 2>and sat down in a meeting, played the demo tape,

0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:37.680
<v Speaker 2>showed him the storyboard they helped. Turned to Chuck Jones.

0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:40.880
<v Speaker 2>So what do you think he said? Buy it bid?

0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:43.760
<v Speaker 5>That is how Chuck Jones taught.

0:14:43.600 --> 0:14:48.040
<v Speaker 2>How he didn't and Michael Eisner bought it and uh,

0:14:49.200 --> 0:14:51.920
<v Speaker 2>before you knew it, they're in business. We're gonna take

0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:54.480
<v Speaker 2>a break, I think we should. Josh is going to

0:14:54.560 --> 0:15:31.280
<v Speaker 2>go collect himself and we'll be right back. All right,

0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:42.320
<v Speaker 2>all right, we're back. So strange. So Schoolhouse Rocks started

0:15:42.360 --> 0:15:44.960
<v Speaker 2>on ABC Saturday morning. Is what they call an interstitial.

0:15:45.280 --> 0:15:46.840
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, we had some of this, Yeah, it was.

0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:52.120
<v Speaker 2>It was. It's programming between the programming that's not commercial.

0:15:51.920 --> 0:15:55.760
<v Speaker 4>Right, When the creators of the program you're actually watching

0:15:56.160 --> 0:15:59.320
<v Speaker 4>weren't good enough to make twenty two full minutes, you

0:15:59.480 --> 0:16:01.400
<v Speaker 4>round it out with the interstitial program.

0:16:01.720 --> 0:16:05.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly. This is January sixth and seventh, was the

0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:07.680
<v Speaker 2>first weekend in nineteen seventy three, So I was but

0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:08.600
<v Speaker 2>two years old?

0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:10.960
<v Speaker 5>Oh well negative three.

0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:17.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you were in the upper atmosphere playing my lyre coalescing,

0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:21.520
<v Speaker 2>waiting to be born, Flapping My Wings. And this was

0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:24.600
<v Speaker 2>before like, like you said, this is the original thing

0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:25.920
<v Speaker 2>was it was just going to be an album called

0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:30.640
<v Speaker 2>Multiplication Rock until they realized that the visuals were important

0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:33.000
<v Speaker 2>they could put it on television. And the first four

0:16:33.040 --> 0:16:36.520
<v Speaker 2>songs that first weekend were some of the greatest, aside

0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:39.480
<v Speaker 2>from three is the Magic Number, the four Legged Zoo, Elementary,

0:16:39.520 --> 0:16:42.000
<v Speaker 2>my Dear, and My Hero zero great song.

0:16:43.360 --> 0:16:47.320
<v Speaker 5>Zero again, Yeah, not magical, but it is a cool number.

0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:50.200
<v Speaker 2>Such a funny little hero. Yeah, so you came along.

0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:54.000
<v Speaker 2>They counted on their fingers.

0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:57.120
<v Speaker 5>So that when was that Chuck nineteen seventy three, Yes,

0:16:57.640 --> 0:17:00.960
<v Speaker 5>and I think that first one had quite so it

0:17:01.040 --> 0:17:04.280
<v Speaker 5>was up to there were thirteen episodes then if it

0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:05.880
<v Speaker 5>went from zero to twelve.

0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And I think what they settled on was almost

0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:12.639
<v Speaker 2>like seasons right themed season, so that the first season

0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:13.840
<v Speaker 2>was going to be math related.

0:17:14.280 --> 0:17:14.800
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:20.119
<v Speaker 4>So apparently Bob Doro had been off like coming up

0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:22.919
<v Speaker 4>with songs. Didn't realize that they wanted a song for

0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:27.960
<v Speaker 4>each number, and he had started to combine several numbers in.

0:17:27.920 --> 0:17:30.720
<v Speaker 2>A different song, so hitting get the mimo he didn't

0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:31.120
<v Speaker 2>and he.

0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:36.360
<v Speaker 4>Finally did, and he he was trying to figure out

0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:39.199
<v Speaker 4>how to like break the songs apart, and he came

0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:41.040
<v Speaker 4>up with one called the four Legged Zoo.

0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:42.280
<v Speaker 5>Have you heard that one?

0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:46.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? It's fine. Yeah, so so not one of my favorites,

0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:48.560
<v Speaker 2>but I mean they were all great. It's just some

0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:49.960
<v Speaker 2>stand out a little more than others.

0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:52.920
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, So what's your favorite of the multiplication rock?

0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:55.119
<v Speaker 2>Oh? Well, three is the magic number?

0:17:55.280 --> 0:17:55.600
<v Speaker 5>Okay?

0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:56.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

0:17:56.200 --> 0:17:58.760
<v Speaker 5>And that was something else I noticed about this. There

0:17:58.760 --> 0:18:04.280
<v Speaker 5>were for each season, there were at least one standout

0:18:04.320 --> 0:18:07.960
<v Speaker 5>song per season that just about everybody knows.

0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:09.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and I would guess.

0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:11.639
<v Speaker 5>Three is of magic numbers. Probably that one.

0:18:11.760 --> 0:18:13.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, or maybe my hero zero. That was a big one.

0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:16.680
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that was a hit, so much so that Bob

0:18:16.760 --> 0:18:21.400
<v Speaker 4>Dura was up for Grammy in nineteen seventy four.

0:18:21.800 --> 0:18:26.760
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, for I think the whole album.

0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:30.000
<v Speaker 2>Right, Yeah, but the jerks at Sesame Street one.

0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:34.320
<v Speaker 5>If you're gonna lose, lose to Sesame Street.

0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:37.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. And Doro is like writing and singing these initial

0:18:37.800 --> 0:18:38.719
<v Speaker 2>first few songs.

0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:41.680
<v Speaker 4>I think he's saying, yeah, all of them except two.

0:18:41.720 --> 0:18:45.080
<v Speaker 4>And he hired two other jazz musicians, Grady Tit and

0:18:45.160 --> 0:18:48.920
<v Speaker 4>Blossom Deary great name. Grady Tate sang Naughty number nine

0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:52.120
<v Speaker 4>and Blossom Deary sang figure eight, but all the rest

0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:56.520
<v Speaker 4>of them, the other eleven, Bob Dura sang and he

0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:59.720
<v Speaker 4>wrote all of them. So yeah, yeah, they really struck

0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:00.680
<v Speaker 4>gold with that guy.

0:19:00.880 --> 0:19:03.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean he was he was that initial genius

0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:04.000
<v Speaker 2>behind this whole thing.

0:19:04.119 --> 0:19:07.720
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, and this is another cool thing about Schoolhouse Rock

0:19:07.760 --> 0:19:12.160
<v Speaker 4>that I noticed the people involved stayed on for basically

0:19:12.200 --> 0:19:15.240
<v Speaker 4>the whole run. In the initial run from seventy three

0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:16.000
<v Speaker 4>to eighty five.

0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it seemed like a project that everyone enjoyed working on,

0:19:20.359 --> 0:19:23.080
<v Speaker 2>and that was highly collaborative, and it just seemed like

0:19:23.119 --> 0:19:25.119
<v Speaker 2>a good experience. I don't think there's like the VH

0:19:25.200 --> 0:19:28.160
<v Speaker 2>one special, like the Dark Side of the school House

0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:33.600
<v Speaker 2>Rock years. You know, so they move on to I

0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:35.879
<v Speaker 2>don't know which one is my favorite, Grammar Rock or History,

0:19:37.240 --> 0:19:39.679
<v Speaker 2>but they moved on to Grammar Rock next, Yes, And

0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:41.840
<v Speaker 2>that was yeah, seventy three to seventy four.

0:19:42.280 --> 0:19:44.320
<v Speaker 4>And we should say I don't think that these were

0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:47.760
<v Speaker 4>like I don't think there were breaks in the season.

0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:52.760
<v Speaker 4>I get the impression that from nineteen seventy three till

0:19:52.960 --> 0:19:56.160
<v Speaker 4>nineteen eighty five, when they had enough episodes, yeah, they

0:19:56.160 --> 0:19:58.960
<v Speaker 4>were just running them like every Saturday morning during cartoons.

0:19:59.000 --> 0:20:02.159
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I certainly don't remember like breaks, like it just

0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:06.080
<v Speaker 2>seems like every week they were there. Right, So seventy

0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:10.080
<v Speaker 2>three and seventy four you have Grammar Rock, which debuted.

0:20:10.880 --> 0:20:13.080
<v Speaker 2>Some people will probably say the biggest of all time

0:20:13.160 --> 0:20:14.040
<v Speaker 2>Conjunction Junction.

0:20:15.080 --> 0:20:16.200
<v Speaker 5>That's so what everybody knows.

0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:20.320
<v Speaker 2>It's a great, great song, a song as he sang

0:20:20.359 --> 0:20:22.840
<v Speaker 2>many others, including my all time favorite, which I'll get

0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:23.240
<v Speaker 2>to later.

0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:25.679
<v Speaker 5>Okay, but I know what it is.

0:20:25.840 --> 0:20:30.399
<v Speaker 2>I bet you don't. He was Merv Griffin's trumpet player,

0:20:30.760 --> 0:20:34.000
<v Speaker 2>Jack Sheldon, who just had this voice that's.

0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:35.760
<v Speaker 5>Just like it's the conjunction Junction.

0:20:35.960 --> 0:20:40.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's unbelievable. Yeah, very unique guy. And he kind

0:20:40.920 --> 0:20:43.399
<v Speaker 2>of looked like Will Ferrell to me, like he should

0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:46.399
<v Speaker 2>play him if they did a movie about they should

0:20:46.400 --> 0:20:48.160
<v Speaker 2>do a movie about the whole thing. If she asked

0:20:48.160 --> 0:20:49.640
<v Speaker 2>me about Schoolhouse Rock.

0:20:49.960 --> 0:20:52.720
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I think there's no controversy or conflict. It's just

0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:55.320
<v Speaker 4>two hours of everybody getting along doing great stuff.

0:20:55.440 --> 0:20:59.800
<v Speaker 2>He wants to see that, right, So Jack Sheldon came

0:20:59.800 --> 0:21:02.920
<v Speaker 2>at uh sang Conjunction Junction.

0:21:02.840 --> 0:21:04.760
<v Speaker 5>And did you go back and listen to that?

0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:07.240
<v Speaker 2>Like for this Oh yeah, I listened to a lot

0:21:07.280 --> 0:21:07.760
<v Speaker 2>of these.

0:21:07.720 --> 0:21:11.440
<v Speaker 4>So that is a sophisticated song. Yeah, if you listen

0:21:11.520 --> 0:21:14.239
<v Speaker 4>to like that we remember our poetry episode. Yeah, if

0:21:14.280 --> 0:21:19.000
<v Speaker 4>you listen to like the meter and the rhyming pattern,

0:21:19.080 --> 0:21:22.639
<v Speaker 4>the rhyme scheme and the slant rhymes they use, like

0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:25.360
<v Speaker 4>for something that's made for kids, it is not just.

0:21:25.440 --> 0:21:28.359
<v Speaker 5>Rhyme, rhyme, rhyme, rhyme, rhyme, rme me, rhyme, rhyme.

0:21:28.440 --> 0:21:32.119
<v Speaker 4>You know, like it's a sophisticated song and it's pretty

0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:32.760
<v Speaker 4>pretty cool.

0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:34.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I think that's I mean, I think that's why

0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:36.880
<v Speaker 2>it worked. That was a secret is.

0:21:37.640 --> 0:21:40.000
<v Speaker 5>I guess it's that not not talking down to kids.

0:21:40.359 --> 0:21:43.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And like the music was was good, right, Like

0:21:43.520 --> 0:21:46.760
<v Speaker 2>if you listen to I mean, those are a little

0:21:46.760 --> 0:21:49.920
<v Speaker 2>sing songy, but like some of them were like pop

0:21:50.000 --> 0:21:52.520
<v Speaker 2>music at the time, Like the Verb song. That's one

0:21:52.520 --> 0:21:56.920
<v Speaker 2>of the funkiest songs I've ever heard. Verb, That's What's Happening. Yeah,

0:21:57.200 --> 0:21:59.800
<v Speaker 2>and especially that one, Like I read this great blog

0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:02.800
<v Speaker 2>pot by this African American guy that was talking about

0:22:02.840 --> 0:22:06.320
<v Speaker 2>how Verb was like meant so much to him because

0:22:06.359 --> 0:22:08.040
<v Speaker 2>at the time, you know, they didn't have a lot

0:22:08.040 --> 0:22:11.160
<v Speaker 2>of like cartoons and stuff that but addressed the black

0:22:11.160 --> 0:22:13.480
<v Speaker 2>community at all. And so all of a sudden, you

0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:17.080
<v Speaker 2>get this cartoon. It's got this super funky music and

0:22:17.119 --> 0:22:21.240
<v Speaker 2>this kid that looked like him, right, having this great

0:22:21.280 --> 0:22:25.280
<v Speaker 2>adventure in the city, and it just kind of it's

0:22:25.280 --> 0:22:26.720
<v Speaker 2>a pretty pretty neat thing, I think.

0:22:26.840 --> 0:22:29.520
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that was season two. It was Grammar, right, Yes,

0:22:29.840 --> 0:22:33.000
<v Speaker 4>So apparently in that same season, a lady named Lynn

0:22:33.040 --> 0:22:39.119
<v Speaker 4>Aaron's was a She was a copy copy department secretary.

0:22:39.600 --> 0:22:41.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is where it reminded me of Madmen, like

0:22:41.760 --> 0:22:48.200
<v Speaker 2>basically took Peggy's journey from like secretary to superstar.

0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:49.400
<v Speaker 5>I've never seen mad Ben.

0:22:50.160 --> 0:22:52.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah it's good. I'm rewatching it right now.

0:22:52.359 --> 0:22:53.960
<v Speaker 5>Oh really, yeah, it's that good.

0:22:54.200 --> 0:22:54.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:22:55.040 --> 0:23:00.000
<v Speaker 4>So Lynn was she was a secretary at the advertise

0:23:00.280 --> 0:23:03.639
<v Speaker 4>agency and apparently she was playing her guitar on lunch break.

0:23:03.840 --> 0:23:05.400
<v Speaker 5>Another reason the seventies.

0:23:05.000 --> 0:23:06.080
<v Speaker 2>Were great exactly.

0:23:06.359 --> 0:23:12.280
<v Speaker 5>And who was it that founder Newell, the creative director guy.

0:23:12.359 --> 0:23:14.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like in the movie, he's just walking down the

0:23:14.240 --> 0:23:17.159
<v Speaker 2>hall and hears this beautiful music and stops. It's like,

0:23:17.160 --> 0:23:18.440
<v Speaker 2>what in the world's going on in there?

0:23:19.040 --> 0:23:19.240
<v Speaker 5>Right?

0:23:19.920 --> 0:23:22.400
<v Speaker 4>And it was Lynn Aerond's And so they took her

0:23:22.440 --> 0:23:26.320
<v Speaker 4>and put her on I guess, part time on the project,

0:23:26.560 --> 0:23:31.440
<v Speaker 4>and they I guess eventually made her a full time songwriter,

0:23:31.600 --> 0:23:32.520
<v Speaker 4>which is pretty cool.

0:23:32.840 --> 0:23:35.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that was her gig. Fifteen of the songs, right,

0:23:35.520 --> 0:23:38.159
<v Speaker 2>including some of the biggest ones. A noun as a

0:23:38.160 --> 0:23:42.440
<v Speaker 2>person plays her thing, great song, InterPlaNet Janet interjections to

0:23:42.440 --> 0:23:44.760
<v Speaker 2>a good one, a victim of gravity about Isaac Newton.

0:23:44.840 --> 0:23:48.440
<v Speaker 4>InterPlaNet Janet sounds like Rocky Horror if you go back

0:23:48.480 --> 0:23:49.960
<v Speaker 4>and listen to it, Yeah, it kind of does. It

0:23:49.960 --> 0:23:51.719
<v Speaker 4>bears a real resemblance to it.

0:23:51.840 --> 0:23:53.720
<v Speaker 2>Or Rocky Horror sounded like InterPlaNet Janet.

0:23:53.720 --> 0:23:55.880
<v Speaker 5>Well, I went and looked. Rocky Horror was three years

0:23:55.920 --> 0:23:58.040
<v Speaker 5>before in A Planet Janet the movie or the play

0:23:58.240 --> 0:23:58.800
<v Speaker 5>the movie?

0:23:59.040 --> 0:24:00.560
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so the play was he before that?

0:24:00.920 --> 0:24:01.800
<v Speaker 5>Was it a play first?

0:24:01.880 --> 0:24:06.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, Meatloaf was even in the play. Oh yeah

0:24:06.280 --> 0:24:10.600
<v Speaker 2>before the movie right, and not a play I guess, musical?

0:24:10.960 --> 0:24:14.560
<v Speaker 5>Sure, he played with songs and dancing.

0:24:17.480 --> 0:24:19.920
<v Speaker 2>So the next one to come along was America Rock

0:24:20.000 --> 0:24:23.920
<v Speaker 2>or History Rock, which kind of vised for the best

0:24:24.440 --> 0:24:26.000
<v Speaker 2>to me with Grammar.

0:24:25.720 --> 0:24:27.960
<v Speaker 5>Rock, and that one tied into the by centennial.

0:24:28.480 --> 0:24:30.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah that was a big deal, which you don't remember,

0:24:30.840 --> 0:24:33.280
<v Speaker 2>but I remember being a little kid, being five years old,

0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:37.520
<v Speaker 2>and it took over the country for you know, that

0:24:37.720 --> 0:24:38.160
<v Speaker 2>entire year.

0:24:38.240 --> 0:24:42.000
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I know, there was like a resurgence in colonial

0:24:42.119 --> 0:24:44.359
<v Speaker 4>emblems and stuff like that. You know that if you

0:24:44.440 --> 0:24:48.840
<v Speaker 4>ever walked past like a very very old person's house today,

0:24:49.200 --> 0:24:54.280
<v Speaker 4>you might see like a flagholder that's a black metal eagle, yeah,

0:24:54.320 --> 0:24:57.560
<v Speaker 4>holding like some arrows maybe or something like that. That

0:24:57.640 --> 0:25:01.200
<v Speaker 4>is from nineteen seventy six. Still there like a resurgence

0:25:01.240 --> 0:25:04.920
<v Speaker 4>in Betsy Ross and colonial like nick knacks and stuff.

0:25:05.080 --> 0:25:05.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:25:05.600 --> 0:25:07.920
<v Speaker 4>I was I was just born, but it was there

0:25:08.000 --> 0:25:10.320
<v Speaker 4>was a it created like a high water mark that

0:25:10.400 --> 0:25:12.760
<v Speaker 4>I was able to see even you know, four five

0:25:12.800 --> 0:25:13.639
<v Speaker 4>six years later.

0:25:14.400 --> 0:25:20.199
<v Speaker 2>So History Rock or America Rock featured some of the

0:25:20.200 --> 0:25:25.119
<v Speaker 2>best songs Mother Necessity, Shot Herd Around the World and

0:25:25.160 --> 0:25:30.840
<v Speaker 2>No More Kings, which is maybe my second all time favorite. Yeah, yeah,

0:25:30.840 --> 0:25:34.040
<v Speaker 2>and that's the one that There was an album that

0:25:34.160 --> 0:25:36.960
<v Speaker 2>came out in like ninety five ninety six called Schoolhouse

0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:41.480
<v Speaker 2>Rocks Rocks. I think Schoolhouse Rock Rocks where they got

0:25:41.520 --> 0:25:45.600
<v Speaker 2>contemporary artists to cover these songs. And did you ever

0:25:45.680 --> 0:25:46.119
<v Speaker 2>listen to that?

0:25:46.720 --> 0:25:48.680
<v Speaker 5>I listened to the Pavement one of the day.

0:25:49.000 --> 0:25:54.520
<v Speaker 2>Man so I emailed Bob Nistanovich today from Pavement because,

0:25:54.800 --> 0:25:57.159
<v Speaker 2>as I said in the previous episode, I tricked him

0:25:57.160 --> 0:26:01.879
<v Speaker 2>into being my email friend, and I said, Hey, dude,

0:26:02.240 --> 0:26:04.320
<v Speaker 2>I would love to hear if you have any thoughts

0:26:04.680 --> 0:26:08.000
<v Speaker 2>on them, more kings, how you guys were approached, if

0:26:08.000 --> 0:26:10.760
<v Speaker 2>there are any stories, what it meant to you, what

0:26:10.840 --> 0:26:14.080
<v Speaker 2>it didn't mean, whatever, let me know. Crickets No, no, no,

0:26:14.119 --> 0:26:17.040
<v Speaker 2>He emailed back, and then I said, I'll call you

0:26:17.080 --> 0:26:20.520
<v Speaker 2>on my way to work. Called him the way to work. Crickets, Yeah,

0:26:20.600 --> 0:26:23.000
<v Speaker 2>got his voicemail, and then as I was coming in

0:26:23.040 --> 0:26:25.000
<v Speaker 2>the studio, he called and left the voicemail saying he

0:26:25.080 --> 0:26:27.239
<v Speaker 2>was in his minivan rocking out and he didn't hear

0:26:27.240 --> 0:26:29.439
<v Speaker 2>the phone ring. Oh that's funny, which is very funny

0:26:29.440 --> 0:26:32.440
<v Speaker 2>to me. But I told him I'd like to hear

0:26:32.440 --> 0:26:34.000
<v Speaker 2>what he has to say, because he said he has

0:26:34.119 --> 0:26:36.159
<v Speaker 2>a tale to tell about that experience.

0:26:36.320 --> 0:26:39.120
<v Speaker 5>Man, we're going to have to record it after.

0:26:38.840 --> 0:26:42.320
<v Speaker 2>This, well, yeah, or if it could be like a

0:26:42.359 --> 0:26:46.920
<v Speaker 2>listener mail, Yeah, like if I can get him on tape,

0:26:47.160 --> 0:26:49.560
<v Speaker 2>then we'll tag it at the end. Okay, if not,

0:26:49.680 --> 0:26:51.600
<v Speaker 2>if it ends up being an email version or something,

0:26:51.640 --> 0:26:56.080
<v Speaker 2>I'll just maybe recount it in my own dumb words.

0:26:56.000 --> 0:26:57.720
<v Speaker 5>Or you could ask him if we could read the

0:26:57.760 --> 0:26:59.640
<v Speaker 5>email and make a listener mail.

0:27:00.080 --> 0:27:03.320
<v Speaker 2>Oh for real, Yeah, like a real listener mail. It's

0:27:03.359 --> 0:27:06.159
<v Speaker 2>not about idea. So anyway, so listen up for the

0:27:06.240 --> 0:27:09.800
<v Speaker 2>end for Bob Nistanovitch's story about No More Kings, because

0:27:09.800 --> 0:27:13.280
<v Speaker 2>if you listen to that CD, it's like the Lemonheads

0:27:13.359 --> 0:27:15.119
<v Speaker 2>and Ween this.

0:27:15.200 --> 0:27:16.400
<v Speaker 5>Is super ninety CD.

0:27:16.720 --> 0:27:19.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Moby and they're all most of them are pretty

0:27:19.840 --> 0:27:22.720
<v Speaker 2>straight ahead, and so you get to the Pavement song

0:27:23.440 --> 0:27:26.920
<v Speaker 2>and it's just all pavement, Like Malcolm's changed his words.

0:27:26.960 --> 0:27:31.040
<v Speaker 2>He there's like laser guns at the end, and it's

0:27:31.160 --> 0:27:35.720
<v Speaker 2>just wonderfully pavement, like quintessentially pavement. Yeah, like leave it

0:27:35.760 --> 0:27:37.560
<v Speaker 2>to them to just kind of throw it all out

0:27:37.560 --> 0:27:39.040
<v Speaker 2>the window and do their own thing.

0:27:39.160 --> 0:27:39.720
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

0:27:39.800 --> 0:27:43.240
<v Speaker 2>I liked it a lot. Three Ring Government. I didn't

0:27:43.240 --> 0:27:44.080
<v Speaker 2>really know that one.

0:27:44.240 --> 0:27:48.320
<v Speaker 4>That was good and apparently they so it basically talks

0:27:48.320 --> 0:27:50.720
<v Speaker 4>about the different branches of the government. Yeah, but puts

0:27:50.720 --> 0:27:55.960
<v Speaker 4>in the context of a three ring circus, and it's

0:27:56.000 --> 0:27:58.720
<v Speaker 4>really I mean, aside from the fact that it compares

0:27:58.800 --> 0:28:02.000
<v Speaker 4>the government to a three ring circus, it's not at

0:28:02.000 --> 0:28:02.600
<v Speaker 4>all offensive.

0:28:02.720 --> 0:28:02.880
<v Speaker 2>Right.

0:28:02.880 --> 0:28:05.960
<v Speaker 5>Apparently they sat on that one for years and didn't

0:28:05.960 --> 0:28:08.600
<v Speaker 5>release it until like nineteen seventy nine because they were

0:28:08.600 --> 0:28:12.960
<v Speaker 5>worried about offending the government, which is a strange thing

0:28:13.000 --> 0:28:13.679
<v Speaker 5>to worry.

0:28:13.440 --> 0:28:15.720
<v Speaker 2>About, yeah, through today's lens.

0:28:16.000 --> 0:28:18.560
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, but even still, I mean, this is like post Watergate.

0:28:18.640 --> 0:28:21.679
<v Speaker 4>It's not like everybody was like, oh right, right, you know,

0:28:22.280 --> 0:28:25.119
<v Speaker 4>we couldn't possibly call the government a three ring circus.

0:28:25.480 --> 0:28:27.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's true. That is weird. It seems like that

0:28:27.280 --> 0:28:30.200
<v Speaker 2>would have been a good time to do it. Yeah,

0:28:30.280 --> 0:28:34.600
<v Speaker 2>you know, but the most famous song from that year

0:28:35.920 --> 0:28:39.480
<v Speaker 2>by far was Sheldon's on Just a Bill?

0:28:40.600 --> 0:28:41.400
<v Speaker 5>Is that your favorite?

0:28:41.920 --> 0:28:42.040
<v Speaker 2>No?

0:28:42.600 --> 0:28:42.959
<v Speaker 5>Okay?

0:28:43.680 --> 0:28:46.720
<v Speaker 2>That was composed not by mister Doro but by a

0:28:46.720 --> 0:28:51.280
<v Speaker 2>man named Dave Frishburg. And I mean that one was

0:28:51.360 --> 0:28:54.560
<v Speaker 2>just a mega hit, straight to number one on the

0:28:54.560 --> 0:28:57.080
<v Speaker 2>Billboard charts.

0:28:56.840 --> 0:28:59.880
<v Speaker 4>It's like, as far as Schoolhouse Rocks goes, that's the

0:29:01.000 --> 0:29:06.560
<v Speaker 4>that's the that's the cultural icon that signifies the whole thing.

0:29:06.640 --> 0:29:10.200
<v Speaker 4>I think close close second would be conjunction junction. Maybe

0:29:10.200 --> 0:29:12.240
<v Speaker 4>they're tired, I don't know, but I just feel like

0:29:12.320 --> 0:29:16.360
<v Speaker 4>I'm just a Bill is the most readily recognizable one.

0:29:16.680 --> 0:29:18.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And it's just amazing when you look back, though,

0:29:19.000 --> 0:29:22.080
<v Speaker 2>like the learning that was going on and the teaching

0:29:22.120 --> 0:29:25.640
<v Speaker 2>that was happening. Yeah, these kids, us, we were learning

0:29:25.880 --> 0:29:28.400
<v Speaker 2>how a bill becomes a law right in the in

0:29:28.440 --> 0:29:31.520
<v Speaker 2>the best way possible, like better than any well, not

0:29:31.600 --> 0:29:33.840
<v Speaker 2>any teacher. There were great teachers back then, I want

0:29:33.880 --> 0:29:35.880
<v Speaker 2>to say, like any dumb teacher that's boring their kids.

0:29:36.360 --> 0:29:40.200
<v Speaker 2>But it definitely struck a chord with me. Sure, you know, yeah,

0:29:40.240 --> 0:29:42.000
<v Speaker 2>And that's how I remember a lot of this stuff.

0:29:42.200 --> 0:29:45.520
<v Speaker 4>And apparently two adults were also noticing Schoolhouse Rock at

0:29:45.560 --> 0:29:50.200
<v Speaker 4>the time. Supposedly there were plenty of orders. This was

0:29:50.880 --> 0:29:55.960
<v Speaker 4>before video cassettes. Yeah, before they were widely available, I

0:29:56.000 --> 0:29:59.120
<v Speaker 4>guess in the home. I'm trying to think of how

0:29:59.120 --> 0:30:01.880
<v Speaker 4>they would have played them if they didn't have video cassettes.

0:30:01.920 --> 0:30:06.920
<v Speaker 4>But anyway, apparently lobbyists and legislators would get in touch

0:30:06.920 --> 0:30:08.600
<v Speaker 4>with ABC and be like, you got to get me

0:30:08.640 --> 0:30:10.440
<v Speaker 4>a copy of that I'm a bill thing.

0:30:10.360 --> 0:30:12.880
<v Speaker 2>Give me a Beta Max because I want.

0:30:12.680 --> 0:30:14.920
<v Speaker 5>To show it to my staff to train them on

0:30:14.960 --> 0:30:15.880
<v Speaker 5>this kind of stuff.

0:30:16.200 --> 0:30:18.440
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think they asked for cassettes, at least, at

0:30:18.440 --> 0:30:20.080
<v Speaker 2>the very least so they could play in the music.

0:30:20.200 --> 0:30:24.400
<v Speaker 5>I see. Maybe that's what they meant, probably okay.

0:30:24.200 --> 0:30:28.680
<v Speaker 2>An eight track. Yeah, And then there was Science Rock

0:30:28.760 --> 0:30:30.240
<v Speaker 2>was the year after that. That was seventy eight and

0:30:30.280 --> 0:30:35.760
<v Speaker 2>seventy nine, which is pretty good. InterPlaNet Janet victiogravity one, yeah,

0:30:35.840 --> 0:30:38.720
<v Speaker 2>is so weird? What InterPlaNet Janet? Yeah, Yeah, it's a

0:30:38.760 --> 0:30:42.280
<v Speaker 2>good one. And then the telegraph Line song, which I

0:30:42.360 --> 0:30:47.040
<v Speaker 2>think that was written by Urns too, I think, oh yeah,

0:30:47.080 --> 0:30:50.440
<v Speaker 2>And that one was really like, I mean it was

0:30:51.160 --> 0:30:53.880
<v Speaker 2>you literally learned about the nervous system and how the

0:30:53.960 --> 0:30:58.360
<v Speaker 2>body communicates to the brain by listening to that song.

0:30:58.480 --> 0:31:00.680
<v Speaker 2>That's one that they've wanted to play for medicine students. Yeah,

0:31:00.720 --> 0:31:03.680
<v Speaker 2>and they did amazing some of them. All right, well

0:31:03.720 --> 0:31:09.360
<v Speaker 2>let's take another break, and jeez, we'll cover the sad

0:31:09.480 --> 0:31:11.560
<v Speaker 2>last season of Schoolhouse Rock after.

0:31:11.480 --> 0:31:44.720
<v Speaker 5>This, so chuck.

0:31:44.960 --> 0:31:48.520
<v Speaker 4>Schoolhouse Rock for the first four seasons was the epitome

0:31:49.040 --> 0:31:53.040
<v Speaker 4>of creativity. Even their process was creative, Like the songwriters

0:31:53.080 --> 0:31:56.160
<v Speaker 4>would I guess they would say, this season, our theme is,

0:31:56.880 --> 0:31:59.280
<v Speaker 4>you know, it's gonna be science or gonna be grammar

0:31:59.360 --> 0:32:02.240
<v Speaker 4>or whatever, so go forth and figure this out. The

0:32:02.360 --> 0:32:05.080
<v Speaker 4>songwriters would come up with songs and they'd pitch them

0:32:05.480 --> 0:32:09.560
<v Speaker 4>to the creative team. And so there was this process

0:32:09.640 --> 0:32:13.320
<v Speaker 4>of creativity and it started with the creatives. That's the

0:32:13.440 --> 0:32:16.880
<v Speaker 4>key here. Yeah, that's what made it just so legitimate

0:32:17.040 --> 0:32:20.120
<v Speaker 4>and so wonderfully creative this whole time.

0:32:20.280 --> 0:32:22.520
<v Speaker 5>It started with the creatives, right.

0:32:22.680 --> 0:32:24.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and they would pretty cool. They would get them

0:32:24.680 --> 0:32:28.240
<v Speaker 2>vetted by that Bank Street School of Education, so they

0:32:28.280 --> 0:32:30.240
<v Speaker 2>would get make sure everything was like, you know, it

0:32:30.360 --> 0:32:31.160
<v Speaker 2>was right yeah, and.

0:32:31.160 --> 0:32:33.240
<v Speaker 4>Then ABC would be like, let me say it, and

0:32:33.320 --> 0:32:36.160
<v Speaker 4>then they'd say, oh, I guess it's fine, and then

0:32:36.200 --> 0:32:38.680
<v Speaker 4>they'd start to storyboard it once they had the lyrics

0:32:38.720 --> 0:32:41.920
<v Speaker 4>set in stone, right. That was the first four seasons.

0:32:42.400 --> 0:32:46.000
<v Speaker 4>The fifth season they said die, creativity Die, and they

0:32:46.120 --> 0:32:50.320
<v Speaker 4>reversed the process and they said, hey, songwriters, here are

0:32:50.360 --> 0:32:54.280
<v Speaker 4>your assignments. Now we think kids should know more about computers,

0:32:54.760 --> 0:32:57.080
<v Speaker 4>so we're going to just screw this whole thing up.

0:32:57.120 --> 0:32:58.720
<v Speaker 2>Okay, yeah, this is the part I don't get it,

0:32:58.800 --> 0:33:03.640
<v Speaker 2>says the ABC program exec Squire Rushnell commissioned this because

0:33:04.400 --> 0:33:06.840
<v Speaker 2>that was the idea that children were afraid of computers.

0:33:07.840 --> 0:33:10.440
<v Speaker 2>I can't I don't remember anything, but they're being like

0:33:10.680 --> 0:33:14.160
<v Speaker 2>excitement about computers. I don't remember any kids being like,

0:33:14.320 --> 0:33:15.280
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to go near that.

0:33:15.520 --> 0:33:15.720
<v Speaker 5>Yeah.

0:33:15.920 --> 0:33:17.640
<v Speaker 2>I remember kids being like, oh that's cool, let me

0:33:17.760 --> 0:33:18.360
<v Speaker 2>sit down.

0:33:18.240 --> 0:33:20.680
<v Speaker 5>And usually it was the parents that were afraid of computers.

0:33:20.800 --> 0:33:24.240
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think herein lies the problem. Yeah, with season five.

0:33:24.480 --> 0:33:26.000
<v Speaker 5>So we should say season five too.

0:33:26.000 --> 0:33:28.360
<v Speaker 4>If you notice we jumped quite a bit from nineteen

0:33:28.440 --> 0:33:31.760
<v Speaker 4>seventy nine to nineteen eighty five, Schoolhouse Rock was running

0:33:32.160 --> 0:33:33.880
<v Speaker 4>all those years on Saturday mornings.

0:33:33.960 --> 0:33:35.800
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, they just weren't any new ones. They were the

0:33:35.880 --> 0:33:37.720
<v Speaker 5>same ones they were re running.

0:33:37.800 --> 0:33:41.280
<v Speaker 4>U Yeah, the class nineteen eighty five, Squire Rushnal says,

0:33:42.000 --> 0:33:43.880
<v Speaker 4>give me, give me four episodes or six?

0:33:44.200 --> 0:33:46.400
<v Speaker 5>Is it four or six? On computers?

0:33:46.800 --> 0:33:49.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and we're gonna call the season a scooter computer.

0:33:49.520 --> 0:33:50.800
<v Speaker 2>And mister Chips, what do you think of that?

0:33:51.120 --> 0:33:54.240
<v Speaker 4>So it's what like a computer with a bag of chips.

0:33:54.680 --> 0:33:56.880
<v Speaker 4>It's like, no, mister Chips is a computer? Well what

0:33:57.000 --> 0:33:57.800
<v Speaker 4>scooter computer?

0:33:58.000 --> 0:33:58.760
<v Speaker 5>He's a kid.

0:34:00.400 --> 0:34:03.280
<v Speaker 2>And they said, well what about the goodbye? Mister Chips said,

0:34:03.280 --> 0:34:05.200
<v Speaker 2>great book? And no one's ever read that.

0:34:05.400 --> 0:34:05.960
<v Speaker 5>What's a book?

0:34:07.920 --> 0:34:11.480
<v Speaker 2>So it was a little confusing.

0:34:11.640 --> 0:34:12.879
<v Speaker 5>We have disdain for him.

0:34:12.960 --> 0:34:15.080
<v Speaker 2>It's a little weird. I know, I feel bad if

0:34:15.120 --> 0:34:17.680
<v Speaker 2>that's not really how it went down. But it sounds

0:34:17.760 --> 0:34:20.120
<v Speaker 2>kind of like that classic story, you know, like an

0:34:20.160 --> 0:34:22.880
<v Speaker 2>executive takes over the creative and it just goes downhill.

0:34:23.000 --> 0:34:24.160
<v Speaker 5>That's usually how it happens.

0:34:25.080 --> 0:34:26.800
<v Speaker 2>And I do feel a little bit bad because, you know,

0:34:26.880 --> 0:34:29.319
<v Speaker 2>the originals were still involved. They got mister Doro back

0:34:29.360 --> 0:34:32.279
<v Speaker 2>on board. Yeah, and I think they did the best

0:34:32.320 --> 0:34:34.239
<v Speaker 2>they could. But I think one of the issues is

0:34:35.640 --> 0:34:38.600
<v Speaker 2>all the other seasons, you know, math and science and history.

0:34:39.280 --> 0:34:42.040
<v Speaker 2>It's all civics. It's all baked in like that stuff

0:34:42.160 --> 0:34:44.960
<v Speaker 2>is classic and didn't change when you're writing songs about

0:34:46.760 --> 0:34:52.200
<v Speaker 2>data processing and basic computer language a couple of years later, Like, no,

0:34:52.400 --> 0:34:55.359
<v Speaker 2>it's not relevant anymore, right, you know. So it's sort

0:34:55.400 --> 0:34:56.759
<v Speaker 2>of that's why no one's ever heard of it.

0:34:56.960 --> 0:34:59.680
<v Speaker 4>Plus again they were like, so wait, Scooter computers, the

0:35:00.000 --> 0:35:02.759
<v Speaker 4>oh you're the computer he's hanging out with, right, And

0:35:02.840 --> 0:35:04.680
<v Speaker 4>why is the computer on roller skates?

0:35:05.080 --> 0:35:06.719
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, just stuff like that, you know.

0:35:06.880 --> 0:35:11.000
<v Speaker 4>It was. It was an undignified end to something really great. Agreed,

0:35:11.280 --> 0:35:12.920
<v Speaker 4>and so they pulled the plug on the whole thing.

0:35:12.960 --> 0:35:16.000
<v Speaker 4>In nineteen eighty five, they said, Hey, this Mary lou

0:35:16.040 --> 0:35:16.719
<v Speaker 4>Retton lady.

0:35:17.280 --> 0:35:17.839
<v Speaker 2>We like her.

0:35:18.160 --> 0:35:21.960
<v Speaker 5>She's got gumption, she's got apple Pie coming out of

0:35:22.080 --> 0:35:22.640
<v Speaker 5>her ears.

0:35:22.920 --> 0:35:23.240
<v Speaker 2>Gs.

0:35:24.600 --> 0:35:26.439
<v Speaker 5>We love her and we want to put her on TV,

0:35:26.640 --> 0:35:28.920
<v Speaker 5>so they put her interstitials.

0:35:28.239 --> 0:35:29.840
<v Speaker 2>On Yeah, ABC, Funfit.

0:35:31.640 --> 0:35:34.959
<v Speaker 4>I'll bet that was the same time when Reagan made

0:35:35.200 --> 0:35:38.279
<v Speaker 4>Arnold Schwarzenegger is like fitnesses are remember that?

0:35:38.480 --> 0:35:42.160
<v Speaker 2>Huh totally remember that the presidential fitness test, right?

0:35:42.480 --> 0:35:45.360
<v Speaker 5>Yeah? Man, I failed that so many times.

0:35:46.440 --> 0:35:48.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think I was always sick that day. It's

0:35:48.560 --> 0:35:49.560
<v Speaker 2>like I gotta climb a rope.

0:35:49.880 --> 0:35:52.680
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, still to this day, I've never climbed a rope

0:35:52.680 --> 0:35:55.960
<v Speaker 5>in my life. No, made it this far. Yeah, I'm

0:35:56.000 --> 0:35:57.680
<v Speaker 5>going to be chased by a tiger on the way home.

0:35:57.680 --> 0:35:59.440
<v Speaker 2>I think I was going to say, that's how you're

0:35:59.440 --> 0:36:01.400
<v Speaker 2>going to meet your one day. It's gonna be like

0:36:01.440 --> 0:36:02.880
<v Speaker 2>a burning building in a rope. It's just going to

0:36:02.920 --> 0:36:08.759
<v Speaker 2>fall from the ceiling like a cartoon. Right. In the

0:36:08.960 --> 0:36:13.480
<v Speaker 2>late eighties, that was a student at Yukon Go Huskies

0:36:14.040 --> 0:36:15.840
<v Speaker 2>that said I want to bring Schoolhouse Rock back. They

0:36:15.920 --> 0:36:16.720
<v Speaker 2>started a petition.

0:36:17.000 --> 0:36:18.960
<v Speaker 4>I could not find this person's name for the life

0:36:19.000 --> 0:36:21.440
<v Speaker 4>of me. I couldn't either, Sorry, person.

0:36:21.320 --> 0:36:24.560
<v Speaker 2>But ABC said, you know what, people want this, and

0:36:24.680 --> 0:36:26.120
<v Speaker 2>I guess it took them a little while to get

0:36:26.160 --> 0:36:28.799
<v Speaker 2>around to it. But nineteen ninety three they brought it back,

0:36:29.640 --> 0:36:36.440
<v Speaker 2>rerunning all those classic tunes and cartoons and added some

0:36:36.560 --> 0:36:39.040
<v Speaker 2>new stuff. Yeah, by Bob Doro in the Gang.

0:36:39.239 --> 0:36:42.520
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, they brought back the originals and this this season

0:36:42.680 --> 0:36:47.000
<v Speaker 4>was called Money Rock, and they did a substantial number

0:36:47.080 --> 0:36:50.160
<v Speaker 4>of new episodes, but again written and performed by all

0:36:50.239 --> 0:36:54.799
<v Speaker 4>the original people. But a good starting or twenty years later. Yeah,

0:36:56.080 --> 0:36:59.239
<v Speaker 4>and they had things like seven to fifty once a week,

0:36:59.280 --> 0:37:03.160
<v Speaker 4>which is about maintaining your budget. Yeah, Tyrannosaurs Debt which

0:37:03.239 --> 0:37:07.359
<v Speaker 4>is about the national debt, and plenty of others.

0:37:07.440 --> 0:37:09.480
<v Speaker 2>I remember the Tale of Mister Morton. That was another

0:37:09.640 --> 0:37:10.600
<v Speaker 2>Lynen Erond's offering.

0:37:10.680 --> 0:37:11.439
<v Speaker 5>What was that one about.

0:37:12.160 --> 0:37:14.320
<v Speaker 2>I can't remember exactly. I didn't go back and rewatch it,

0:37:14.400 --> 0:37:15.359
<v Speaker 2>but I remember.

0:37:15.280 --> 0:37:17.840
<v Speaker 5>He's like, they'll saw his money on scratch offs or something.

0:37:17.960 --> 0:37:24.120
<v Speaker 2>I don't think so, but you know, again, the reason

0:37:24.160 --> 0:37:26.080
<v Speaker 2>why this was that it works so well is because

0:37:26.080 --> 0:37:29.520
<v Speaker 2>these were men and women who were used to selling

0:37:29.680 --> 0:37:31.840
<v Speaker 2>products for a living and it was just sort of

0:37:31.880 --> 0:37:35.279
<v Speaker 2>a natural, a natural thing for them to do. As

0:37:35.280 --> 0:37:37.560
<v Speaker 2>an ad agency, it seems weird at first when you're

0:37:37.560 --> 0:37:39.880
<v Speaker 2>like an ad agency came up with Schoolhouse Rock. It

0:37:39.960 --> 0:37:41.480
<v Speaker 2>kind of makes perfect sense when you think about it.

0:37:41.640 --> 0:37:46.280
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, I mean they they were selling these ideas

0:37:46.360 --> 0:37:50.279
<v Speaker 4>to children in ways that were comprehensible to children, that

0:37:50.320 --> 0:37:54.560
<v Speaker 4>were approachable by children, and they just kind of took

0:37:54.600 --> 0:37:58.120
<v Speaker 4>the kid's point of views and packaged it for them,

0:37:58.520 --> 0:37:59.800
<v Speaker 4>I think is a good way to put it.

0:38:00.320 --> 0:38:05.880
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So besides the Schoolhouse Rock Rocks CD, which I

0:38:05.960 --> 0:38:07.279
<v Speaker 2>still have, actually.

0:38:07.239 --> 0:38:09.840
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that nineties thing created a bit of a resurgence

0:38:09.880 --> 0:38:12.359
<v Speaker 4>of it. Yeah, the resurgence in popularity for sure.

0:38:12.480 --> 0:38:16.120
<v Speaker 2>Boy, that Blind Melon three is the Magic Number was great? Yeah? Yeah,

0:38:16.280 --> 0:38:18.040
<v Speaker 2>Shannon hear that one. Did you like them?

0:38:18.239 --> 0:38:18.439
<v Speaker 5>Yeah?

0:38:19.400 --> 0:38:21.560
<v Speaker 2>I think Soup, their second album, is one of the

0:38:21.640 --> 0:38:23.920
<v Speaker 2>great underrated records of the nineties.

0:38:24.760 --> 0:38:27.000
<v Speaker 4>I don't recall that one, man, it was good. I

0:38:27.000 --> 0:38:29.520
<v Speaker 4>think I only heard their first album, but they that's

0:38:29.560 --> 0:38:32.399
<v Speaker 4>good too. They I think they made like the pop

0:38:32.560 --> 0:38:34.560
<v Speaker 4>charts right out of the gate and just kind of

0:38:34.600 --> 0:38:37.719
<v Speaker 4>were unfairly labeled as a pop group even though they

0:38:37.800 --> 0:38:40.000
<v Speaker 4>really weren't. They were because a lot more to them.

0:38:40.000 --> 0:38:42.040
<v Speaker 2>No rain song and the catchy video with the little

0:38:42.080 --> 0:38:44.440
<v Speaker 2>girl and everything. Yeah, yeah, Soup was good, man. You

0:38:44.560 --> 0:38:47.520
<v Speaker 2>just check that out. Oh well, it's very good, very sad.

0:38:48.000 --> 0:38:48.719
<v Speaker 2>What happened to him?

0:38:49.200 --> 0:38:51.640
<v Speaker 5>Hey, odeed and they didn't find him for a while, right.

0:38:52.200 --> 0:38:54.680
<v Speaker 2>I don't remember that part, but maybe I think I.

0:38:54.719 --> 0:38:57.719
<v Speaker 5>Think they nobody missed him for a little while or

0:38:57.800 --> 0:38:58.320
<v Speaker 5>something like that.

0:38:59.040 --> 0:39:03.040
<v Speaker 2>But a waste. In nineteen ninety three, though, there was

0:39:03.040 --> 0:39:07.120
<v Speaker 2>another resurgence. I guess that was before the CD when

0:39:07.480 --> 0:39:10.799
<v Speaker 2>they took it to the stage was Schoolhouse Rock Live,

0:39:11.920 --> 0:39:16.520
<v Speaker 2>which kind of started out as most great theater like

0:39:16.600 --> 0:39:19.919
<v Speaker 2>this in a sort of a basement black box theater

0:39:19.960 --> 0:39:22.920
<v Speaker 2>in Chicago, and it just grew from there to eventually

0:39:23.040 --> 0:39:24.080
<v Speaker 2>an off Broadway run.

0:39:24.320 --> 0:39:26.719
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, not just that. It started in the basement theater

0:39:26.880 --> 0:39:30.560
<v Speaker 4>of a vegetarian restaurant in Chicago, just to add that

0:39:30.640 --> 0:39:32.120
<v Speaker 4>extra little dose to it.

0:39:32.320 --> 0:39:32.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, why not?

0:39:33.400 --> 0:39:35.040
<v Speaker 5>But yeah, it made it onto Off Broadway.

0:39:35.320 --> 0:39:37.120
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. It ran for four solid years and then they

0:39:37.120 --> 0:39:40.759
<v Speaker 2>had a touring version. I remember wanting to see it,

0:39:41.640 --> 0:39:45.080
<v Speaker 2>but and I think I was living in New Jersey

0:39:45.080 --> 0:39:47.120
<v Speaker 2>at the time. I should have gone and seen it.

0:39:47.520 --> 0:39:48.600
<v Speaker 2>I think I had no money at the time.

0:39:48.760 --> 0:39:50.880
<v Speaker 5>I think it's still you still might be able to

0:39:50.920 --> 0:39:53.200
<v Speaker 5>catch it. There's a group called the Theater Bomb Theater

0:39:53.280 --> 0:39:55.600
<v Speaker 5>Bam Chicago Theater.

0:39:55.480 --> 0:39:58.640
<v Speaker 2>BAM Chicago, and they're still doing shows.

0:39:58.719 --> 0:39:59.480
<v Speaker 5>There's still touring.

0:40:00.120 --> 0:40:03.120
<v Speaker 2>As far as I know, I need to do my

0:40:03.880 --> 0:40:05.799
<v Speaker 2>Free to Be You and Me live show. That's one

0:40:05.840 --> 0:40:07.800
<v Speaker 2>of my dreams. I've talked about that before.

0:40:08.120 --> 0:40:09.560
<v Speaker 5>The isn't that Rosie Greer one?

0:40:09.800 --> 0:40:10.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

0:40:11.360 --> 0:40:13.439
<v Speaker 5>Did he do the whole album or just that one song?

0:40:13.640 --> 0:40:16.240
<v Speaker 2>Just the one? It was conceived by Marlo Thomas.

0:40:16.400 --> 0:40:17.160
<v Speaker 5>That's pretty great.

0:40:17.640 --> 0:40:20.160
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, that was another like that one hits me

0:40:20.239 --> 0:40:22.840
<v Speaker 2>square in the face, still from childhood, right in the

0:40:22.880 --> 0:40:26.719
<v Speaker 2>bread basket, Right in the bread basket. In ninety seven,

0:40:26.840 --> 0:40:32.040
<v Speaker 2>they had a twenty fifth anniversary package of VHS tapes.

0:40:32.239 --> 0:40:34.480
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, so think about this like it goes off the

0:40:34.560 --> 0:40:37.160
<v Speaker 5>air in nineteen eighty five, nineteen eighty five, then all

0:40:37.160 --> 0:40:40.239
<v Speaker 5>of a sudden three ninety four, ninety six, ninety seven,

0:40:40.280 --> 0:40:42.600
<v Speaker 5>there's like Schoolhouse Rock everywhere.

0:40:42.840 --> 0:40:45.960
<v Speaker 2>It will never die, no, And I think like this.

0:40:46.440 --> 0:40:51.440
<v Speaker 4>Was one of the first instances because dude, admittedly, Generation

0:40:51.800 --> 0:40:55.480
<v Speaker 4>CTS is extremely nostalgic as far as generations go, Yeah,

0:40:56.000 --> 0:41:00.480
<v Speaker 4>very nostalgic. I would propose that Schoolhouse Rock was the

0:41:00.520 --> 0:41:02.600
<v Speaker 4>thing that kicked it off. Oh yeah, as far as

0:41:02.680 --> 0:41:04.319
<v Speaker 4>gen X nostalgia goes yep.

0:41:05.239 --> 0:41:07.879
<v Speaker 2>Well, it definitely was something that was so drilled into

0:41:07.960 --> 0:41:13.480
<v Speaker 2>our consciousness. It gets a touchstone, right, But resurgence of it,

0:41:13.560 --> 0:41:17.160
<v Speaker 2>I think, oh yeah, is the first example of just

0:41:17.280 --> 0:41:20.360
<v Speaker 2>how nostalgic as a generation generation exis.

0:41:20.560 --> 0:41:24.279
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, for sure, that's that's mine. You got Sharknado.

0:41:24.920 --> 0:41:27.840
<v Speaker 4>I'm predicting that that will be rooted out by historians

0:41:27.880 --> 0:41:28.840
<v Speaker 4>and years to come and.

0:41:28.920 --> 0:41:32.719
<v Speaker 2>Dig that one out of the vault, maybe at the

0:41:32.760 --> 0:41:34.759
<v Speaker 2>place of your death, like a plaque next to that

0:41:34.880 --> 0:41:40.759
<v Speaker 2>rope that you couldn't climb. It'll be a memorial. It'll

0:41:40.760 --> 0:41:45.160
<v Speaker 2>be like rope geez, you already forgot right. In twenty thirteen,

0:41:45.239 --> 0:41:48.799
<v Speaker 2>Kennedy Center had a sing along for their fortieth anniversary.

0:41:49.120 --> 0:41:52.960
<v Speaker 2>Two thousand people in attendance. Pretty amazing. I would have

0:41:53.000 --> 0:41:56.279
<v Speaker 2>done anything to have gone to that. And then it's

0:41:56.320 --> 0:42:00.880
<v Speaker 2>been parodied and homaged over the year and everything from

0:42:00.920 --> 0:42:03.160
<v Speaker 2>The Simpsons to Saturday Night Live.

0:42:03.360 --> 0:42:07.239
<v Speaker 5>Did you see Conspiracy Rock No Conspiracy Theory, Dude?

0:42:07.440 --> 0:42:09.480
<v Speaker 2>That was a TV funhouse bit right, yeah.

0:42:09.400 --> 0:42:12.319
<v Speaker 4>By Robert Smigel. It's one of the all time greats man.

0:42:12.400 --> 0:42:16.600
<v Speaker 4>He nails nails the conspiracy theory or nails The Schoolhouse Rock.

0:42:17.320 --> 0:42:20.880
<v Speaker 4>But it's all about how these major corporations like GE

0:42:21.080 --> 0:42:25.240
<v Speaker 4>and Westinghouse own the media they own like ABC, NBC,

0:42:25.440 --> 0:42:28.640
<v Speaker 4>all these media outlets, and how they can use it

0:42:28.760 --> 0:42:34.239
<v Speaker 4>to shape opinion and squash opinions that disagree with them

0:42:34.360 --> 0:42:37.120
<v Speaker 4>or their products, and choose what you report on.

0:42:37.560 --> 0:42:41.160
<v Speaker 5>It is so good. Go watch it right now. It's

0:42:41.200 --> 0:42:41.800
<v Speaker 5>on YouTube.

0:42:42.600 --> 0:42:45.280
<v Speaker 4>But apparently there's a bit of a conspiracy theory around

0:42:45.440 --> 0:42:49.200
<v Speaker 4>it as well, because it aired on the actual Saturday

0:42:49.239 --> 0:42:51.520
<v Speaker 4>Night Live episode, but then when they re ran it

0:42:51.560 --> 0:42:54.600
<v Speaker 4>and I think released that episode on DVD, it wasn't there.

0:42:54.760 --> 0:43:00.840
<v Speaker 4>They edited it out, and supposedly it was just because

0:43:01.120 --> 0:43:02.760
<v Speaker 4>Lauren Michaels didn't think it was funny.

0:43:03.560 --> 0:43:05.840
<v Speaker 5>There's just no way. Yeah, that that's all it was.

0:43:06.000 --> 0:43:07.719
<v Speaker 2>It was so I'm thinking, no.

0:43:08.760 --> 0:43:12.720
<v Speaker 5>It was such a smack in the face to NBC

0:43:12.960 --> 0:43:14.279
<v Speaker 5>and like all the other ones.

0:43:14.400 --> 0:43:17.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, well, and they just had one a couple

0:43:17.800 --> 0:43:20.520
<v Speaker 2>of years ago on that was an homage time just

0:43:20.560 --> 0:43:21.600
<v Speaker 2>a build that was pretty great too.

0:43:21.760 --> 0:43:24.759
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, this was better. You gotta see it, man.

0:43:24.960 --> 0:43:26.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I have a feeling I have and I just

0:43:26.480 --> 0:43:26.920
<v Speaker 2>don't know it.

0:43:28.320 --> 0:43:29.000
<v Speaker 5>He nailed it.

0:43:29.080 --> 0:43:30.520
<v Speaker 2>I'll let you know I'll text you and say I

0:43:30.640 --> 0:43:33.439
<v Speaker 2>have seen it, and you'll say, who's this? I don't

0:43:33.480 --> 0:43:34.080
<v Speaker 2>have your number.

0:43:36.280 --> 0:43:40.399
<v Speaker 4>So I actually ran across a little bit as great

0:43:40.440 --> 0:43:43.680
<v Speaker 4>as Schoolhouse Rock is, I actually ran across criticism of it.

0:43:44.000 --> 0:43:48.160
<v Speaker 2>What yeah, boy, are you gonna shout to leave the room?

0:43:48.560 --> 0:43:49.680
<v Speaker 2>Maybe about to get angry?

0:43:49.719 --> 0:43:54.480
<v Speaker 5>You might want to, all right. So they were teaching.

0:43:55.920 --> 0:43:59.520
<v Speaker 4>Very broad concepts to kids, okay, in ways that kids

0:43:59.560 --> 0:44:04.319
<v Speaker 4>could under stand, and when you're coming when you're coming

0:44:04.400 --> 0:44:10.640
<v Speaker 4>at them with multiplication or grammar whatever. But apparently especially

0:44:10.760 --> 0:44:14.440
<v Speaker 4>with the History Rocks or America Rock Season, depending on

0:44:14.520 --> 0:44:16.880
<v Speaker 4>what you want to call it, that's where the criticism

0:44:17.000 --> 0:44:17.600
<v Speaker 4>tends to come out.

0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:20.279
<v Speaker 5>So there's one called elbow Room. Did you remember that one?

0:44:20.520 --> 0:44:22.880
<v Speaker 2>Got got to get you some elbow room where.

0:44:22.719 --> 0:44:25.640
<v Speaker 4>It's about there's so many white settlers that we just

0:44:25.760 --> 0:44:27.279
<v Speaker 4>got to spread westward.

0:44:27.560 --> 0:44:28.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, I see where this is going.

0:44:29.080 --> 0:44:33.200
<v Speaker 4>Not a single Native American has shown in this westward spread.

0:44:33.760 --> 0:44:37.720
<v Speaker 4>They actually mentioned that it's God's will manifest destiny.

0:44:37.960 --> 0:44:38.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:44:38.760 --> 0:44:41.120
<v Speaker 4>So the whole thing kind of I don't want to

0:44:41.120 --> 0:44:43.400
<v Speaker 4>say it came under fire because it's not like everybody's like,

0:44:43.480 --> 0:44:47.600
<v Speaker 4>oh yeah, elbow room forget Schoolhouse Rock. Very few people are,

0:44:47.760 --> 0:44:50.720
<v Speaker 4>but there's criticism of Schoolhouse Rock in that it really

0:44:50.880 --> 0:44:57.280
<v Speaker 4>kind of fed American children the popular line on things,

0:44:57.680 --> 0:44:59.879
<v Speaker 4>and it was just exactly the kind of stuff where

0:45:00.320 --> 0:45:02.960
<v Speaker 4>when you grow up you're like, wow, I was really misled.

0:45:03.440 --> 0:45:05.360
<v Speaker 4>This was first explained to me as a child.

0:45:05.520 --> 0:45:08.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah. So while we talk about that a lot too,

0:45:08.400 --> 0:45:12.000
<v Speaker 2>about how schools, especially in like the seventies and eighties,

0:45:15.160 --> 0:45:18.040
<v Speaker 2>whitewashed a lot of stuff. Yeah, so this was part

0:45:18.080 --> 0:45:19.360
<v Speaker 2>of that. I can see that. I mean it was

0:45:20.080 --> 0:45:22.440
<v Speaker 2>and I'm not justifying it, but it was definitely of

0:45:22.560 --> 0:45:24.160
<v Speaker 2>the times for.

0:45:24.239 --> 0:45:26.520
<v Speaker 4>Sure, you know, which is why you know, I think

0:45:26.600 --> 0:45:28.920
<v Speaker 4>that they that these creatives were like, we can't say

0:45:28.960 --> 0:45:30.160
<v Speaker 4>this to kids, right, you know.

0:45:30.280 --> 0:45:32.440
<v Speaker 5>I think that there's definitely been more of an awakening

0:45:32.480 --> 0:45:33.640
<v Speaker 5>in recent years.

0:45:33.480 --> 0:45:36.359
<v Speaker 2>But I wasn't in a trail of tear song, right. Yeah.

0:45:36.520 --> 0:45:38.520
<v Speaker 4>And this is another name for what they were talking about,

0:45:38.600 --> 0:45:41.000
<v Speaker 4>like forced removal was turned into get you got to

0:45:41.040 --> 0:45:46.719
<v Speaker 4>get you some elbow root. I want to know, Chuck,

0:45:46.800 --> 0:45:48.719
<v Speaker 4>because I'm not in school, and I don't have a

0:45:48.960 --> 0:45:49.920
<v Speaker 4>child in school.

0:45:50.320 --> 0:45:51.800
<v Speaker 5>I don't have a child at all. Well, I have

0:45:51.840 --> 0:45:52.799
<v Speaker 5>a four leg good child.

0:45:53.360 --> 0:46:00.120
<v Speaker 4>But are they still misleading kids like they did when

0:46:00.160 --> 0:46:02.719
<v Speaker 4>we were young? Do we just assume now that we

0:46:02.920 --> 0:46:05.880
<v Speaker 4>know the deal that they don't do that any longer?

0:46:06.200 --> 0:46:09.000
<v Speaker 4>Or are they still doing it? So any history teachers

0:46:09.120 --> 0:46:11.640
<v Speaker 4>out there that are like fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth grade,

0:46:12.239 --> 0:46:15.360
<v Speaker 4>because that's what I remember really being just overtly lied to.

0:46:15.560 --> 0:46:17.920
<v Speaker 4>And then as we got a little past that, they

0:46:18.000 --> 0:46:21.080
<v Speaker 4>started to be like, well maybe the Native Americans didn't

0:46:21.120 --> 0:46:23.480
<v Speaker 4>really want to leave, right, and then it just got

0:46:23.560 --> 0:46:26.920
<v Speaker 4>a little more legitimate. So I want to know teachers

0:46:26.960 --> 0:46:27.759
<v Speaker 4>out there let us know.

0:46:28.440 --> 0:46:31.200
<v Speaker 2>I bet the answer will get is that we've come

0:46:31.280 --> 0:46:34.520
<v Speaker 2>a long way, and it probably depends on your district.

0:46:35.440 --> 0:46:37.240
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, and maybe even your teacher.

0:46:37.400 --> 0:46:38.120
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, I can see that.

0:46:39.520 --> 0:46:41.759
<v Speaker 2>I bet there's not like a one sweeping answer for

0:46:41.840 --> 0:46:44.400
<v Speaker 2>that one, but there's definitely been progress.

0:46:44.200 --> 0:46:46.360
<v Speaker 5>You know, I would guess. Yeah, who'd let us know

0:46:46.480 --> 0:46:47.200
<v Speaker 5>is Tyler Murphy?

0:46:47.640 --> 0:46:49.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Murphy would let us know. Well, I know what

0:46:49.520 --> 0:46:51.000
<v Speaker 2>he's doing. He's doing all the right things.

0:46:51.080 --> 0:46:54.120
<v Speaker 4>Oh yeah, he's up on the desk. Yeah yeah, opening minds,

0:46:55.080 --> 0:46:55.680
<v Speaker 4>great stuff.

0:46:56.440 --> 0:46:58.000
<v Speaker 2>So you ready for my favorite? Yes?

0:46:58.120 --> 0:46:58.400
<v Speaker 5>Please?

0:46:59.120 --> 0:47:04.000
<v Speaker 2>Rufus Xavier Sasparilla. What was that one about pronouns. Oh yeah,

0:47:06.640 --> 0:47:09.480
<v Speaker 2>I have a hard time expressing how much joy this

0:47:09.600 --> 0:47:14.120
<v Speaker 2>song brings me. Still, I listen to it a lot

0:47:15.239 --> 0:47:18.040
<v Speaker 2>if I'm ever down. That's the song that's pretty great.

0:47:18.400 --> 0:47:23.560
<v Speaker 2>It's amazing. It's the word play is unbelievable. And it's

0:47:23.560 --> 0:47:27.440
<v Speaker 2>another Sheldon song, like how it's it's very fast? How

0:47:27.480 --> 0:47:30.439
<v Speaker 2>he like every I looked up to see if people

0:47:30.440 --> 0:47:32.759
<v Speaker 2>did it live and stuff, and everyone always slows it

0:47:32.840 --> 0:47:34.399
<v Speaker 2>down because nobody can.

0:47:34.719 --> 0:47:35.520
<v Speaker 5>Oh is that fast?

0:47:36.200 --> 0:47:39.320
<v Speaker 2>Well, it's just very complex, And the whole idea of

0:47:39.360 --> 0:47:42.640
<v Speaker 2>the song is is the complexity of all these nouns

0:47:42.840 --> 0:47:45.680
<v Speaker 2>that you can replace with pronouns. I got a friend

0:47:45.760 --> 0:47:49.680
<v Speaker 2>named Rufus Xavier Sasparilla, and you know, they go to

0:47:49.719 --> 0:47:51.960
<v Speaker 2>the zoo and there's an ardvark in an armadillo and

0:47:52.000 --> 0:47:54.000
<v Speaker 2>all these big words. He's like, I could say that,

0:47:54.400 --> 0:47:56.400
<v Speaker 2>or could say he did this and we did that

0:47:56.880 --> 0:48:01.120
<v Speaker 2>and she said this nice. Yeah, it's a word that

0:48:01.200 --> 0:48:04.200
<v Speaker 2>takes the place of a noun like kangaroo.

0:48:04.360 --> 0:48:04.960
<v Speaker 5>Can we play it?

0:48:05.160 --> 0:48:08.720
<v Speaker 2>You know what? We wouldn't because of law. They should

0:48:08.719 --> 0:48:11.400
<v Speaker 2>make a actually one about copyright infringement.

0:48:12.400 --> 0:48:13.520
<v Speaker 5>It was sorted out as a bill.

0:48:13.880 --> 0:48:16.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so we probably can't play enough of it to

0:48:16.120 --> 0:48:18.960
<v Speaker 2>do with justice. So I just say go and listen

0:48:19.239 --> 0:48:22.560
<v Speaker 2>to that song in full, because it's delightful.

0:48:22.680 --> 0:48:23.480
<v Speaker 5>All right, I'll do that.

0:48:23.800 --> 0:48:23.960
<v Speaker 4>Man.

0:48:24.120 --> 0:48:26.800
<v Speaker 2>They go to the zoo, there's animals, they'll pile on

0:48:26.880 --> 0:48:32.000
<v Speaker 2>a bus. They yeah, this girl and Rufus Xavier's Asperrilla.

0:48:31.680 --> 0:48:33.120
<v Speaker 5>They yeah, exactly.

0:48:33.200 --> 0:48:34.040
<v Speaker 2>It takes a place for it.

0:48:34.120 --> 0:48:35.879
<v Speaker 5>Now you got anything else?

0:48:36.320 --> 0:48:38.960
<v Speaker 2>No, but there probably will be a tag on this

0:48:39.080 --> 0:48:42.080
<v Speaker 2>one with mister and Astanovich, or or with me just

0:48:42.200 --> 0:48:44.360
<v Speaker 2>recounting his tale of No More Kings.

0:48:44.640 --> 0:48:48.200
<v Speaker 4>So if you want to know more about Schoolhouse Rock,

0:48:48.280 --> 0:48:51.120
<v Speaker 4>go read this article on HowStuffWorks dot com. And since

0:48:51.160 --> 0:48:54.000
<v Speaker 4>I said that, it may be time for listener mail

0:48:54.080 --> 0:48:55.239
<v Speaker 4>with Bob Nistanovich.

0:48:56.400 --> 0:49:01.360
<v Speaker 2>All right, So now, as promised or as fully promised,

0:49:01.400 --> 0:49:06.359
<v Speaker 2>we have via telephone in the studio mister Bob Nistanovich,

0:49:06.520 --> 0:49:10.160
<v Speaker 2>who is actually a member of two of my favorite

0:49:10.200 --> 0:49:14.440
<v Speaker 2>bands of all time, both Pavement and Silver Jews. And

0:49:15.280 --> 0:49:17.000
<v Speaker 2>it's a real treat to have you here, Bob. We

0:49:17.080 --> 0:49:20.759
<v Speaker 2>did a show on Schoolhouse Rock and talked kind of

0:49:20.800 --> 0:49:25.279
<v Speaker 2>at length about pavements efforts towards that I guess late

0:49:25.400 --> 0:49:29.800
<v Speaker 2>nineties CD and got in touch with you, and you

0:49:29.840 --> 0:49:31.600
<v Speaker 2>said you had a couple of stories to tell.

0:49:31.880 --> 0:49:34.560
<v Speaker 6>It was a We were in Memphis, we were supposed

0:49:34.600 --> 0:49:39.000
<v Speaker 6>to be making a Silver Jews record, and the singer

0:49:39.120 --> 0:49:41.800
<v Speaker 6>of Silver Jews, David Berman, who decided he did not

0:49:41.920 --> 0:49:45.239
<v Speaker 6>want to make the record and he went home, and

0:49:45.440 --> 0:49:48.960
<v Speaker 6>we'd already booked a week of studio time Silver Jews

0:49:49.000 --> 0:49:54.399
<v Speaker 6>had and then subsequently were Steven and myself and Steve

0:49:54.480 --> 0:49:59.799
<v Speaker 6>West were unceremoniously fired from Silver Juice. That's beside the point.

0:50:00.719 --> 0:50:03.600
<v Speaker 6>We were kind of like at all the studio time

0:50:04.480 --> 0:50:09.239
<v Speaker 6>that David was supposed to pay for, sort of bail

0:50:09.280 --> 0:50:14.800
<v Speaker 6>him out, pavements, sort of took that and made a record.

0:50:14.880 --> 0:50:19.839
<v Speaker 6>So Stephen Stephen thankfully had three songs and we made

0:50:19.880 --> 0:50:24.840
<v Speaker 6>a specific trimy p But I guess most significantly in

0:50:25.520 --> 0:50:28.919
<v Speaker 6>regards to this project, Jackie Ferriot, dear friend of ours,

0:50:29.600 --> 0:50:35.160
<v Speaker 6>was supervising the Schoolhouse Rock oblation, and she gave us

0:50:35.200 --> 0:50:39.080
<v Speaker 6>our choice of songs, and it was fairly obvious to

0:50:39.239 --> 0:50:44.400
<v Speaker 6>us that No More Kings, you know, had a lot

0:50:44.480 --> 0:50:47.240
<v Speaker 6>of appeal. It's always our favorite one. We were kids

0:50:47.600 --> 0:50:52.360
<v Speaker 6>Boston tea party theme kind of we were able to

0:50:52.480 --> 0:50:55.440
<v Speaker 6>use the vocal stylings of Steve West to our advantage,

0:50:55.440 --> 0:50:59.320
<v Speaker 6>I believe, for the first time in band history for

0:50:59.480 --> 0:51:03.400
<v Speaker 6>that song, and it all turned out to be. We

0:51:03.480 --> 0:51:05.640
<v Speaker 6>were very pleased with it. In fact, we're very pleased

0:51:05.719 --> 0:51:11.080
<v Speaker 6>with all of it, and I think that it's an

0:51:11.120 --> 0:51:15.240
<v Speaker 6>outstanding compilation and it's one of those things in Pavements

0:51:15.360 --> 0:51:18.080
<v Speaker 6>time that I feel like we actually did a good

0:51:18.160 --> 0:51:18.480
<v Speaker 6>job on.

0:51:19.080 --> 0:51:21.440
<v Speaker 2>Now, what what did Steve West do for that one?

0:51:22.719 --> 0:51:27.080
<v Speaker 6>He played drums and then all the deep voice rambling

0:51:27.160 --> 0:51:31.960
<v Speaker 6>in the background. Ah, mostly him. He's got an incredible

0:51:32.120 --> 0:51:35.880
<v Speaker 6>voice speaking voice. He's one of the people that you

0:51:35.960 --> 0:51:40.320
<v Speaker 6>can hear from one hundred and fifty feet away with

0:51:40.400 --> 0:51:46.040
<v Speaker 6>a win. We've got a beautiful deep voice. So he's

0:51:46.160 --> 0:51:52.040
<v Speaker 6>doing all like the ranting and raving. It was all

0:51:52.080 --> 0:51:53.600
<v Speaker 6>pretty jubilant. We had a good time. It was the

0:51:53.640 --> 0:51:57.440
<v Speaker 6>only time the three of us ever recorded together ass Pavement,

0:51:57.560 --> 0:52:02.960
<v Speaker 6>and I feel like we made a good choice and

0:52:03.200 --> 0:52:04.359
<v Speaker 6>we just loved that song.

0:52:04.960 --> 0:52:07.040
<v Speaker 2>It was one take, oh really.

0:52:07.080 --> 0:52:11.880
<v Speaker 6>Overdub yeah, one take on the instrumental and just some

0:52:12.080 --> 0:52:16.680
<v Speaker 6>vocal dubbing. Probably took eight minutes, wow, And it was

0:52:16.760 --> 0:52:20.360
<v Speaker 6>just the three of you. Oh yeah, yeah, just the

0:52:20.400 --> 0:52:21.960
<v Speaker 6>three of us were the only ones there because we

0:52:22.000 --> 0:52:24.800
<v Speaker 6>thought it was gonna be Silver Chews and Silver Cheese,

0:52:25.840 --> 0:52:31.719
<v Speaker 6>so Camber again Eye Bowled were at home and I

0:52:31.760 --> 0:52:33.440
<v Speaker 6>don't even know if they were contacted. We made that

0:52:33.480 --> 0:52:37.480
<v Speaker 6>specific trim EP that song Give It a Day during

0:52:37.560 --> 0:52:41.160
<v Speaker 6>the same session, and a couple other songs are on

0:52:41.239 --> 0:52:44.279
<v Speaker 6>the B side of that thing. But now the School

0:52:44.320 --> 0:52:48.680
<v Speaker 6>ass Rock was this kind of thing popping in mind, like, well,

0:52:48.760 --> 0:52:50.360
<v Speaker 6>do we have anything to do and seems like I

0:52:50.440 --> 0:52:51.880
<v Speaker 6>got this one song. It's like, well, we have to

0:52:51.960 --> 0:52:53.360
<v Speaker 6>do this thing for Jackie. We have to do this

0:52:53.400 --> 0:52:55.359
<v Speaker 6>thing for Jackie. We probably sort of planning on doing

0:52:55.360 --> 0:52:58.279
<v Speaker 6>it anyways. But Jackie at the time was a VJ

0:52:58.440 --> 0:53:05.440
<v Speaker 6>at MTV and she later became our So she was

0:53:05.480 --> 0:53:11.000
<v Speaker 6>the nanny for Courtney and Kurt, for Francis Bean Cobain,

0:53:11.760 --> 0:53:15.680
<v Speaker 6>and then she was a tour manager for payment. In fact,

0:53:15.760 --> 0:53:20.520
<v Speaker 6>she has she's been battling cancer for over a decade.

0:53:22.680 --> 0:53:27.360
<v Speaker 6>But one interesting artifact that she owns is the actual

0:53:28.760 --> 0:53:34.879
<v Speaker 6>cardigan Cardigan's button up cardigan sweater that Kurt Cobain wore

0:53:34.960 --> 0:53:39.640
<v Speaker 6>in the famous MTV Unplugged performance.

0:53:41.200 --> 0:53:41.719
<v Speaker 2>Holy Cow.

0:53:42.160 --> 0:53:47.000
<v Speaker 6>So yeah, she's quite a character, but it was it

0:53:47.160 --> 0:53:52.520
<v Speaker 6>was her project, and you know, she was a good

0:53:52.600 --> 0:53:56.239
<v Speaker 6>friend and we want to do the best we could

0:53:56.320 --> 0:53:59.360
<v Speaker 6>for her. I didn't really care about anything else. We

0:53:59.400 --> 0:54:01.759
<v Speaker 6>didn't even really we didn't know whether there was a

0:54:01.800 --> 0:54:04.719
<v Speaker 6>good tiny thing like a limited edition of like two

0:54:04.800 --> 0:54:07.840
<v Speaker 6>hundred or whatever. But yeah, funnily enough, my wife, that

0:54:07.960 --> 0:54:10.479
<v Speaker 6>was the first Payment song she ever heard because her sister,

0:54:10.920 --> 0:54:14.759
<v Speaker 6>Oh really, yeah, her sister bought the school Loss rock

0:54:14.880 --> 0:54:19.319
<v Speaker 6>thing when her sister was like fourteen, and my wife

0:54:19.400 --> 0:54:23.920
<v Speaker 6>went would have been about ten, and she heard that.

0:54:24.040 --> 0:54:25.360
<v Speaker 6>It's the first time she ever heard Payment.

0:54:26.000 --> 0:54:26.760
<v Speaker 2>That's pretty funny.

0:54:27.600 --> 0:54:28.560
<v Speaker 6>So yeah, she likes it.

0:54:28.800 --> 0:54:31.680
<v Speaker 2>We were talking a little bit about just your take

0:54:31.719 --> 0:54:33.960
<v Speaker 2>and kind of just the different takes of all the

0:54:34.160 --> 0:54:36.400
<v Speaker 2>artists on that compilation, and a lot of them were

0:54:36.480 --> 0:54:40.520
<v Speaker 2>pretty straightforward, and I think I really like the Pavement

0:54:40.600 --> 0:54:44.359
<v Speaker 2>one the most because it was, uh, it was kind

0:54:44.360 --> 0:54:47.360
<v Speaker 2>of the perfect mix of very straightforward at times and

0:54:47.480 --> 0:54:51.280
<v Speaker 2>then just totally pavement pavementized at times.

0:54:52.880 --> 0:54:57.160
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, it's very we don't I mean we straightforward. I

0:54:57.200 --> 0:54:59.400
<v Speaker 6>don't think we're kind of good enough to do things straightforward.

0:54:59.520 --> 0:55:02.400
<v Speaker 6>Like I think it's like you think of like a

0:55:02.480 --> 0:55:05.560
<v Speaker 6>band like Nickel Creek covering our song spitting on a stranger.

0:55:05.680 --> 0:55:08.759
<v Speaker 6>They can and they kind of American at it or whatever.

0:55:08.880 --> 0:55:11.760
<v Speaker 6>But sure like in order to do like straight things,

0:55:11.800 --> 0:55:15.160
<v Speaker 6>you gotta be you gotta be good or else you're

0:55:15.200 --> 0:55:18.040
<v Speaker 6>going to come of humiliate yourself. Like for example, like

0:55:19.120 --> 0:55:21.520
<v Speaker 6>r Em doing like Pylon's Crazy. They could do that

0:55:21.640 --> 0:55:25.200
<v Speaker 6>pretty straight, right because they have that sound, so they

0:55:25.320 --> 0:55:27.640
<v Speaker 6>just you know, but I think that, like I've heard

0:55:27.640 --> 0:55:30.600
<v Speaker 6>a lot of cover songs where it's like a great

0:55:30.719 --> 0:55:34.000
<v Speaker 6>song and like a somebody with a great voice, you know,

0:55:34.200 --> 0:55:37.120
<v Speaker 6>usually like a female will we'll sing it pretty straight.

0:55:37.200 --> 0:55:39.600
<v Speaker 6>And just the fact that it's a somebody with a

0:55:39.640 --> 0:55:42.960
<v Speaker 6>gorgeous voice, you know, bring a class. It sort of works.

0:55:43.000 --> 0:55:46.200
<v Speaker 6>But now we're none of us are none of us

0:55:46.200 --> 0:55:47.480
<v Speaker 6>are good enough to do that. We had to we

0:55:47.560 --> 0:55:49.040
<v Speaker 6>had to devise our own take on it.

0:55:49.120 --> 0:55:49.279
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:55:49.880 --> 0:55:52.719
<v Speaker 2>Well, I thought it totally worked. Was the Schoolhouse Rock?

0:55:54.160 --> 0:55:56.240
<v Speaker 2>I mean, was that something that you guys were into

0:55:56.520 --> 0:55:59.040
<v Speaker 2>or was there much decision? I mean, besides the fact

0:55:59.040 --> 0:56:02.040
<v Speaker 2>that it was your friend asking was it something that

0:56:02.120 --> 0:56:05.879
<v Speaker 2>you thought was kind of cool or did you feel

0:56:05.880 --> 0:56:06.400
<v Speaker 2>like you should do it?

0:56:06.520 --> 0:56:08.279
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, I thought it was a great idea. At the time,

0:56:08.360 --> 0:56:10.880
<v Speaker 6>we thought it was a great idea, and at that

0:56:11.000 --> 0:56:16.319
<v Speaker 6>point in our lives, I'm guessing it was like ninety six,

0:56:16.480 --> 0:56:22.040
<v Speaker 6>ninety seven somewhere in there. Yeah, yeah, we've forgotten, you know,

0:56:22.120 --> 0:56:25.680
<v Speaker 6>you like that point where you know that we hadn't

0:56:26.040 --> 0:56:28.520
<v Speaker 6>seen or heard any of that. The only one I

0:56:28.560 --> 0:56:30.160
<v Speaker 6>could really remember off the top of my head at

0:56:30.200 --> 0:56:32.719
<v Speaker 6>the time was that conjunction Junction you know, yeah, of course,

0:56:33.600 --> 0:56:35.360
<v Speaker 6>what's your function? But like you know, those are some

0:56:35.480 --> 0:56:37.879
<v Speaker 6>of the first songs when we were a little kids,

0:56:37.960 --> 0:56:40.520
<v Speaker 6>like under ten years old that got stuck in our head. Yeah,

0:56:40.640 --> 0:56:44.799
<v Speaker 6>because so yeah, I just thought it was I mean,

0:56:45.040 --> 0:56:48.279
<v Speaker 6>if anything, I the only negative. I thought it might

0:56:48.320 --> 0:56:54.040
<v Speaker 6>be a little bit childish and corny. But you know,

0:56:54.200 --> 0:56:57.440
<v Speaker 6>the as that came together, it just seemed like a

0:56:58.440 --> 0:57:03.280
<v Speaker 6>very worthwhile to me. And you know, she was pretty

0:57:03.600 --> 0:57:08.160
<v Speaker 6>earnest Jackie, and and I'm happy it all worked out.

0:57:08.200 --> 0:57:10.399
<v Speaker 6>I kind of I think it's actually become like sort

0:57:10.440 --> 0:57:13.320
<v Speaker 6>of a one of the more significant things that Pavement

0:57:13.360 --> 0:57:15.400
<v Speaker 6>ever did, sort of outside the realm of Pavement.

0:57:15.920 --> 0:57:17.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, for sure, I'll.

0:57:17.600 --> 0:57:20.800
<v Speaker 6>Still being Pavement, Like you know, I don't even know.

0:57:21.200 --> 0:57:23.040
<v Speaker 6>I'm the kind of person in regards to that band

0:57:23.080 --> 0:57:25.920
<v Speaker 6>that would find out about things to last. So I

0:57:25.960 --> 0:57:28.080
<v Speaker 6>lived in Louisville, and I was always at the racetrack,

0:57:28.160 --> 0:57:31.160
<v Speaker 6>and and you know, people would say, hey, you know what,

0:57:31.240 --> 0:57:32.919
<v Speaker 6>you're going to be making a new album like two months.

0:57:32.920 --> 0:57:34.480
<v Speaker 6>I wouldn't have anything about her, Like you know, you're

0:57:34.480 --> 0:57:36.480
<v Speaker 6>going on tour, You're starting in London, I would like

0:57:37.560 --> 0:57:39.560
<v Speaker 6>you know, I just wouldn't even know. And like so

0:57:39.680 --> 0:57:43.080
<v Speaker 6>anything that rolled through the door there, like request to

0:57:43.240 --> 0:57:47.120
<v Speaker 6>do stuff, I never knew about him, you know, unless

0:57:47.120 --> 0:57:51.760
<v Speaker 6>you were gonna do them, you know. So right, you

0:57:51.800 --> 0:57:54.040
<v Speaker 6>can see where I was on the Pavement, the Pavement

0:57:54.120 --> 0:57:54.760
<v Speaker 6>Totem poll.

0:57:56.640 --> 0:57:59.560
<v Speaker 2>Well man, I always call you Pavement's secret weapon.

0:58:00.400 --> 0:58:01.439
<v Speaker 6>Uh yeah, yeah.

0:58:02.600 --> 0:58:04.560
<v Speaker 2>I think there was something about your addition to the

0:58:04.600 --> 0:58:08.080
<v Speaker 2>band that really just sort of mixed everything up. Whether

0:58:08.200 --> 0:58:11.000
<v Speaker 2>it was you know, the percussive elements, are just you

0:58:11.160 --> 0:58:15.400
<v Speaker 2>coming in with your your unique take on backing vocals.

0:58:17.080 --> 0:58:23.160
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, no, I I think I presented the element really

0:58:23.280 --> 0:58:26.840
<v Speaker 6>not entirely knowing what I was doing, and that was true.

0:58:26.880 --> 0:58:30.040
<v Speaker 6>And the funny thing about it is like, even at

0:58:30.080 --> 0:58:32.120
<v Speaker 6>this point in my life and people who are completely

0:58:32.200 --> 0:58:36.440
<v Speaker 6>unaware of Pavement mostly from this industry, the horse racing industry.

0:58:36.600 --> 0:58:39.880
<v Speaker 6>Like heard I was I was in a band, even

0:58:39.920 --> 0:58:42.680
<v Speaker 6>a successful band that can't even they just doesn't make

0:58:42.680 --> 0:58:48.560
<v Speaker 6>any sense to them. And then they'll also, you know,

0:58:48.680 --> 0:58:50.360
<v Speaker 6>they'll have to like look it up on Google or

0:58:50.400 --> 0:58:52.960
<v Speaker 6>whatever to realize that, yeah, we were actually like a

0:58:53.040 --> 0:58:58.200
<v Speaker 6>band that made records and stuff. And then and then

0:58:59.160 --> 0:59:02.600
<v Speaker 6>the funny thing is he'll always ask me to you know,

0:59:02.720 --> 0:59:06.240
<v Speaker 6>if it's musotypes or something. I'm like, one thing I'm

0:59:06.280 --> 0:59:11.320
<v Speaker 6>really sort of unaware of in the human race. I

0:59:11.400 --> 0:59:13.640
<v Speaker 6>have no feel for people that like kind of collect

0:59:15.000 --> 0:59:18.640
<v Speaker 6>musical gear and take music really really seriously and like

0:59:18.720 --> 0:59:22.600
<v Speaker 6>playing music really seriously and like jam and like or

0:59:22.720 --> 0:59:25.560
<v Speaker 6>just really like have this incredibly dry approach to like

0:59:26.520 --> 0:59:29.240
<v Speaker 6>like gear heads who like are really really serious and

0:59:29.360 --> 0:59:33.840
<v Speaker 6>like people ask me to jam and I don't. I

0:59:33.920 --> 0:59:36.880
<v Speaker 6>mean my idea of I don't. I don't jam. I

0:59:36.920 --> 0:59:40.280
<v Speaker 6>mean I can't imagine jamming, Like what does that even mean?

0:59:40.480 --> 0:59:47.200
<v Speaker 6>Like really awkward, Like it's always awkward, Like people ask

0:59:47.240 --> 0:59:50.200
<v Speaker 6>me to do something and then I'll be like, oh, man,

0:59:50.480 --> 0:59:53.080
<v Speaker 6>like uh, you know, like I got to figure out

0:59:53.080 --> 0:59:54.680
<v Speaker 6>a way to get out of this, you know, because

0:59:54.760 --> 0:59:58.520
<v Speaker 6>like a my skills, Like they're not going to really

0:59:58.600 --> 1:00:00.400
<v Speaker 6>not gonna believe them in a band, Like once I

1:00:00.480 --> 1:00:03.000
<v Speaker 6>show up with like whatever, I have two drums or

1:00:03.040 --> 1:00:04.560
<v Speaker 6>whatever and start hitting and they're gonna be like, there's

1:00:04.640 --> 1:00:06.200
<v Speaker 6>no way this guy was in a band, Like this

1:00:06.320 --> 1:00:11.000
<v Speaker 6>is a fake, you know, so very strange, very strange.

1:00:11.240 --> 1:00:12.560
<v Speaker 2>Well you just got to say, now, man, I'm the

1:00:12.600 --> 1:00:14.600
<v Speaker 2>secret weapon, and the secret weapon.

1:00:14.400 --> 1:00:18.320
<v Speaker 6>Doesn't m yeah, like this like the spice and like

1:00:18.440 --> 1:00:22.120
<v Speaker 6>some sort of bowl of brigo or something. I don't

1:00:22.120 --> 1:00:25.120
<v Speaker 6>even know. It was just like the whole experience was

1:00:26.880 --> 1:00:31.439
<v Speaker 6>pretty magical. It still doesn't really make that much sense

1:00:31.520 --> 1:00:35.880
<v Speaker 6>to me, you know, Yeah, I just I really enjoyed

1:00:35.920 --> 1:00:39.480
<v Speaker 6>it for sure. But in regards to that specific project,

1:00:39.520 --> 1:00:42.080
<v Speaker 6>that's something that went like really smoothly, like it never

1:00:42.240 --> 1:00:46.200
<v Speaker 6>got to the point. I mean it was literally like Stephen,

1:00:46.240 --> 1:00:49.959
<v Speaker 6>I'm sure probably worked on it that morning or something.

1:00:50.000 --> 1:00:53.040
<v Speaker 6>But when when they press record on that School as

1:00:53.200 --> 1:00:54.920
<v Speaker 6>Rock thing, that thing was a humdinger. It was in

1:00:55.000 --> 1:00:56.880
<v Speaker 6>and out the door, Doug Easy. It's like that's good,

1:00:57.000 --> 1:00:58.640
<v Speaker 6>you know, like, yeah, that's.

1:00:58.520 --> 1:01:00.600
<v Speaker 2>Probably a good approach for something like that because you

1:01:00.640 --> 1:01:03.120
<v Speaker 2>don't want to overthink it. And then it becomes a

1:01:03.240 --> 1:01:07.360
<v Speaker 2>thing and it's stressful perhaps, so I think that approach

1:01:07.440 --> 1:01:09.080
<v Speaker 2>to just get in there and like knock it out

1:01:09.200 --> 1:01:11.200
<v Speaker 2>was probably the way to go. It certainly worked out

1:01:11.360 --> 1:01:11.959
<v Speaker 2>in this case.

1:01:13.080 --> 1:01:15.000
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, and it's a song that has no history within

1:01:15.080 --> 1:01:17.200
<v Speaker 6>the context of the band. You know, it's not like

1:01:17.560 --> 1:01:19.400
<v Speaker 6>something that we've been working on or something that have

1:01:19.480 --> 1:01:21.400
<v Speaker 6>been sitting there, or something that have been played live

1:01:21.560 --> 1:01:24.360
<v Speaker 6>or Yeah, you know, I mean I think that we

1:01:24.560 --> 1:01:28.680
<v Speaker 6>had to you know, pavementize it and give it a

1:01:28.720 --> 1:01:32.320
<v Speaker 6>bit of an original spin because that's the only way

1:01:32.360 --> 1:01:34.840
<v Speaker 6>that we can really do it. I mean, like, you know,

1:01:35.480 --> 1:01:37.240
<v Speaker 6>like we were talking about with a straight thing, you know,

1:01:37.320 --> 1:01:42.320
<v Speaker 6>you can't. You got to have significance. Yeah, not that like,

1:01:42.520 --> 1:01:44.600
<v Speaker 6>you know, Steve and Steve West aren't talented. I'm not

1:01:44.640 --> 1:01:47.200
<v Speaker 6>gonna like those guys are great, but like in fact,

1:01:47.240 --> 1:01:51.040
<v Speaker 6>the fact they're able to like throw improvise right something

1:01:51.120 --> 1:01:55.600
<v Speaker 6>like that's pretty cool. So but I remember being really

1:01:55.640 --> 1:02:00.640
<v Speaker 6>really happy that Steve West, who never really been used

1:02:03.000 --> 1:02:06.680
<v Speaker 6>in Pavement outside of just playing drums, that he was

1:02:07.760 --> 1:02:11.120
<v Speaker 6>that he sort of fit fantastically on that, Yeah, that recording.

1:02:11.160 --> 1:02:13.200
<v Speaker 6>So I sort of love that about No Markings. I

1:02:13.280 --> 1:02:14.240
<v Speaker 6>love hearing him in there.

1:02:14.800 --> 1:02:18.720
<v Speaker 2>Nice all right, Well, thanks, Bob. I appreciate your telling

1:02:18.840 --> 1:02:21.480
<v Speaker 2>us these stories, and I'm going to think of about

1:02:21.560 --> 1:02:23.760
<v Speaker 2>one hundred more reasons to have you on in the future.

1:02:24.040 --> 1:02:24.760
<v Speaker 6>Yeah, anytime.

1:02:27.760 --> 1:02:33.840
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to call this one sad yet happy email.

1:02:34.560 --> 1:02:35.920
<v Speaker 2>Hey guys, my name is Sam. I want to send

1:02:35.960 --> 1:02:39.160
<v Speaker 2>you an email thanking you for your show. The podcast

1:02:39.240 --> 1:02:41.200
<v Speaker 2>is actually a rediscovery for me. My dad used to

1:02:41.240 --> 1:02:44.440
<v Speaker 2>play it back in two thousand and nine and we

1:02:44.480 --> 1:02:48.080
<v Speaker 2>would drive up to the mountain to go skiing. Very

1:02:48.120 --> 1:02:50.200
<v Speaker 2>fond memories of laughing and nerding out with my dad

1:02:50.240 --> 1:02:52.480
<v Speaker 2>and brothers after a great day on the slopes. Can't

1:02:52.520 --> 1:02:54.760
<v Speaker 2>believe you guys are still going strong after eight plus years.

1:02:55.120 --> 1:02:57.400
<v Speaker 2>There is a little more to my rediscovery of your show, though,

1:02:57.440 --> 1:02:59.280
<v Speaker 2>that I wanted to share. It's been four and a

1:02:59.320 --> 1:03:00.960
<v Speaker 2>half years since one of my brothers, who was an

1:03:01.000 --> 1:03:05.600
<v Speaker 2>amazing skier, died tragically to suicide. Since I was in

1:03:05.720 --> 1:03:07.920
<v Speaker 2>college at the time, it didn't have enough time to

1:03:08.080 --> 1:03:11.360
<v Speaker 2>properly grieve. Recently, I've been mulling through many painful memories

1:03:11.760 --> 1:03:14.760
<v Speaker 2>that I ignored in those first three years. However, your

1:03:14.800 --> 1:03:19.000
<v Speaker 2>show unexpectedly brought back really happy ones. It is reminded

1:03:19.040 --> 1:03:21.919
<v Speaker 2>me the fun adventure in learning our family enjoyed while

1:03:21.960 --> 1:03:24.280
<v Speaker 2>listening to your show when we are skiing. I remember

1:03:24.440 --> 1:03:27.080
<v Speaker 2>laughing hysterically with my family your jokes, rolling my eyes

1:03:27.120 --> 1:03:29.360
<v Speaker 2>when my brothers and dad would try to comment on

1:03:29.400 --> 1:03:31.880
<v Speaker 2>your show to sound smart because it was so creepy.

1:03:31.960 --> 1:03:35.000
<v Speaker 2>One of your favorite episodes of ours was the one

1:03:35.080 --> 1:03:37.800
<v Speaker 2>on cannibalism. Being a high schooler at the time, I

1:03:37.880 --> 1:03:39.960
<v Speaker 2>also really liked the show on flirting, so I thought

1:03:40.000 --> 1:03:42.360
<v Speaker 2>I could put it into practice. Needless to say, it

1:03:42.440 --> 1:03:46.200
<v Speaker 2>didn't really work. What This month, I went home for

1:03:46.240 --> 1:03:47.720
<v Speaker 2>a week to visit my parents, and I went skiing

1:03:47.800 --> 1:03:49.880
<v Speaker 2>with my mom and dad for the first time since

1:03:49.960 --> 1:03:54.440
<v Speaker 2>my brother died. It was very painful, but also unimaginably special.

1:03:55.440 --> 1:03:57.040
<v Speaker 2>When my family and I are on the mountain, I

1:03:57.120 --> 1:03:59.680
<v Speaker 2>feel like I can encounter my brother as he was.

1:04:00.120 --> 1:04:02.320
<v Speaker 2>He was healthy and full of life. I could picture

1:04:02.400 --> 1:04:04.960
<v Speaker 2>him diving down a slope that was way too steep

1:04:05.360 --> 1:04:08.000
<v Speaker 2>with the most enormous grin on his eager face. All

1:04:08.080 --> 1:04:09.600
<v Speaker 2>in all, it was a great day. So I just

1:04:09.640 --> 1:04:11.600
<v Speaker 2>want to say thank you with the hard work and

1:04:11.640 --> 1:04:14.680
<v Speaker 2>providing interesting topics to fill my time. Making me laugh,

1:04:15.120 --> 1:04:18.040
<v Speaker 2>but also inadvertently helping me cherish a special time in

1:04:18.120 --> 1:04:24.160
<v Speaker 2>my life. Man, guys, heavy that is from Sam and

1:04:24.280 --> 1:04:25.280
<v Speaker 2>she sends hugs.

1:04:25.680 --> 1:04:28.240
<v Speaker 4>Sam, that is fantastic. Very thank you very much for

1:04:28.400 --> 1:04:32.400
<v Speaker 4>letting us know. We appreciate that and our best to

1:04:32.520 --> 1:04:33.240
<v Speaker 4>your whole family.

1:04:33.440 --> 1:04:33.960
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely.

1:04:34.520 --> 1:04:36.600
<v Speaker 4>If you want to get in touch with this like

1:04:36.720 --> 1:04:39.720
<v Speaker 4>Sam did and just lay one honest, we appreciate it.

1:04:40.680 --> 1:04:43.360
<v Speaker 4>Lay it honest, send us an email to Stuff podcast

1:04:43.520 --> 1:04:44.880
<v Speaker 4>at iHeartRadio dot com.

1:04:48.600 --> 1:04:51.440
<v Speaker 3>Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For

1:04:51.560 --> 1:04:55.680
<v Speaker 3>more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1:04:55.840 --> 1:04:57.640
<v Speaker 3>or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.