Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to the Bob Left Sets podcast. My
Speaker 1: guest this week is a man who needs no introduction,
Speaker 1: so I won't give one. We'll get the history. Le
Speaker 1: Or Cone, who's present gig after a long, illustrious career
Speaker 1: in the music business, is the global head of music
Speaker 1: for YouTube and Google. Le Or good to have you here.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Bob. I'm happy to be here. Let's start
Speaker 1: from the beginning. Now, you were born in New York,
Speaker 1: and that's correct, but you lived in Israel, right my
Speaker 1: first three years? Yes, okay, so you immediately moved to
Speaker 1: Israel only to age three, and then you moved to
Speaker 1: where I went, back to New York, back to York.
Speaker 1: What'd your father do for a living, Well, my dad
Speaker 1: is a was a child psychiatrist, child psychiatrist, and was
Speaker 1: there music in the house, enormous amounts of music. So
Speaker 1: from New York we moved to Los Feless on the
Speaker 1: East Side. And what year you moved to Las felis
Speaker 1: Las Feless and probably sixty six. And there's a lot
Speaker 1: of music because my father was the first person that
Speaker 1: connected the intercom system to his record player, and so
Speaker 1: he loved Dixieland jazz and and chamber music. So throughout
Speaker 1: the house all we heard was Dixie Land, jazz and
Speaker 1: chamber music. Now, but the mid sixties the heyday of
Speaker 1: music in Los Angeles. So were you an active record
Speaker 1: buyer radio listener? Was a little kid then little kid? Okay,
Speaker 1: so what do you remember? My brothers were My oldest
Speaker 1: brother was. My parents were very active, um, social people
Speaker 1: in uh. We attended all the love ins really, so
Speaker 1: they were hipsters. Um, they weren't hipsters, they're more hippies.
Speaker 1: My my father was instrumental with the classroom without walls,
Speaker 1: the community center, school and Antioch and all of that stuff.
Speaker 1: He's uh, you know. And my mother was a real
Speaker 1: active woman too. So we were surrounded by a lot
Speaker 1: of love and and we're politically active. We try to
Speaker 1: elect McGovern and attended all the love ins really, So
Speaker 1: what were those experiences like because you know a lot
Speaker 1: of people that was before the internet. People would only
Speaker 1: read about that they didn't actually have the experience. Well,
Speaker 1: it was very young, but um, a lot of people
Speaker 1: and I remember, I'm going some of the love ins
Speaker 1: happened at Griffith Park. I don't know if you know
Speaker 1: that I don't. Yeah, and uh, um it was just
Speaker 1: it was an extension. I actually grew up in the
Speaker 1: real hotel, California. My mother had what people would refer
Speaker 1: to as a salon where we had poetry readings, art exhibitions, UM,
Speaker 1: book fairs, uh anything, political rallies. The house was full
Speaker 1: of people all the time, and we used to house
Speaker 1: a lot of artists, find painters that stayed in our
Speaker 1: home sometimes upwards of a decade. So did you like
Speaker 1: that or not like that? I love that. It's the
Speaker 1: only thing I knew. I loved um the interaction between
Speaker 1: you know, all sorts of people. It was. It was
Speaker 1: strange at times, but um, you know, that's what I knew.
Speaker 1: So and then people always ask the children of psychiatrists,
Speaker 1: it's that's also all you knew. Do you have any
Speaker 1: feeling good, bad, insights not insights? Well, I think that
Speaker 1: I was very lucky because, uh, there was a lot
Speaker 1: of love in the house. My father was a very
Speaker 1: high intellect. Um still alive. No, Unfortunately we didn't actually
Speaker 1: um do sports together. So we're four boys, and where
Speaker 1: are you in the hierarchy? I'm number two and our father,
Speaker 1: um son's activity is more taking fits Is explained to
Speaker 1: my audience case, they don't know what that's a sauna?
Speaker 1: And um it was this in the Fairfax area. No,
Speaker 1: this was at the Jewish Community Center and lost Felis,
Speaker 1: and he would tell us stories Yiddish, mostly Yiddish stories.
Speaker 1: Do you speak Yiddish? I don't you understand it? Not?
Speaker 1: Not much, but it's very descriptive language, as you know.
Speaker 1: So um that was that was our the extent of
Speaker 1: the I don't know, we just um my father. My
Speaker 1: father would constantly tell stories which actually had a lesson
Speaker 1: or a moral. Was that the type of story your
Speaker 1: fine would tell? No, No, imaginative stories, long and lustrative stories,
Speaker 1: beautiful stories. He wasn't spending his days trying to educate us.
Speaker 1: You know, we were living life, and I think living
Speaker 1: life in a pretty awesome way. So you went to
Speaker 1: one of these schools without walls yourself. No, I was
Speaker 1: the black sheep of the family. I actually, um was
Speaker 1: the first uh test case of riddling. Um My dad
Speaker 1: signed me up for it, and that was a very
Speaker 1: hyperactive kid. And all my brothers went there. But I
Speaker 1: went to a more traditional school, thank god. And do
Speaker 1: you still take riddle into this day. I don't When
Speaker 1: did you stop taking the riddle in just before going
Speaker 1: to college and you think it helped? You think it
Speaker 1: was a big mistake. Oh no, I think definitely it helped. Okay,
Speaker 1: So you went to traditional school and this was in
Speaker 1: Las VELAs, correct, John Marshall High School. Okay, And when
Speaker 1: did you music really drove the culture back then? But
Speaker 1: when did you start a personal affinity with music? So
Speaker 1: what what's interesting is that all my brothers were huge
Speaker 1: record collectors and they had lots of posters on the wall.
Speaker 1: I never collected a record, nor did I have a
Speaker 1: poster on the wall. And but it was interesting because
Speaker 1: they were all locked in their rooms with a very
Speaker 1: particular style of music and they didn't cross pollinate. I
Speaker 1: was the one who was in each one each of
Speaker 1: my brother's rooms listening to all types of music, so
Speaker 1: I was open for the experience. They were, you know,
Speaker 1: always arguing which is the you know, best artist, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.
Speaker 1: And that was that just wasn't my thing. And what
Speaker 1: did you like back then? Do you remember um? I
Speaker 1: remember um being moved by the Delta Blues. My brother
Speaker 1: had a big thing going on with the Delta Blues, Um,
Speaker 1: Freddie King, I remember Janis chopping all all of that
Speaker 1: um stuff. I had my first kiss with Carol King Tapestry.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know. It was um, they're all
Speaker 1: over the place, and so you go to high school
Speaker 1: and you not what's your high school experience? Like? Um,
Speaker 1: My high school experience was pretty good. It's you know,
Speaker 1: Los Felis back then was a sleepy little village. It
Speaker 1: was the pre strip malls. You know, those four parking
Speaker 1: spots with the po box and the Chinese food which
Speaker 1: were all over Los Angeles. You haven't been to Los Angeles,
Speaker 1: don't know, but from one end of the spectrum, from
Speaker 1: the Valley Hallway, Orange Country, endless strip malls. What what
Speaker 1: a disaster of urban planning. But I fortunately grew up
Speaker 1: in Los Felis prior to um strip malls. It was
Speaker 1: a sleepy little village and you know, we lived basically
Speaker 1: in Griffith Park and I don't know, it was wonderful.
Speaker 1: Um upbringing, door always open. Um. Were you in on
Speaker 1: any athletic teams in high school? So? I was a
Speaker 1: quarterback and I lost my elbow? Really yeah, how did
Speaker 1: you lose your elbow? I went to throw a long
Speaker 1: pass and I got caught and had several surgeries. And we,
Speaker 1: of course, I said, lived in Griffith Park, and I
Speaker 1: had a cast on, and I picked up a set
Speaker 1: of three dollar clubs at a garage sale, and that
Speaker 1: summer played golf one with one arm, and then became Roosevelt. Um,
Speaker 1: not Roosevelt, it was Coolidge. I don't know if you
Speaker 1: remember Coolidge. It was considered the number one pitching put
Speaker 1: in the country. Where was it? It was? You know,
Speaker 1: a football field away from Roosevelt's. Roosevelt is a part
Speaker 1: three across street from the Greek Theater on one end
Speaker 1: of Griffith Park. I I ended up playing there, but
Speaker 1: that summer I played exclusively Coolidge. And um, I became
Speaker 1: a great golfer after that. How's your how's your elbow today?
Speaker 1: It's a gimp elbow doesn't straighten out, and UM, I
Speaker 1: don't know, probably helps my golf game, who knows. And
Speaker 1: so after high school you go to directly to college. Um,
Speaker 1: yes I did. And you went in Miami. Correct any
Speaker 1: specific reason why he went to Miami? Well, I uh
Speaker 1: was reacquainted with my biological father, who um insisted that
Speaker 1: if he were to pay for my college education. I
Speaker 1: had to go east of the Mississippi River. And it
Speaker 1: was three weeks before UM school was going to start,
Speaker 1: and he says, I'll get you into any college. At
Speaker 1: the time, he was living in Nigeria in Africa, And
Speaker 1: so I threw a dart and I hit Key West
Speaker 1: and three weeks later I was at the University of Miami.
Speaker 1: I was the only Southern California And it's like absurd
Speaker 1: who from southern California would ever think about going to
Speaker 1: the University of Miami. But man, did I pick the
Speaker 1: right time. My timing is always really good. Bum That's
Speaker 1: the thing, you know. I went during the cocaine cowboy
Speaker 1: era UM when they did the thirty on thirty at
Speaker 1: the U and we became national champions UM many years
Speaker 1: in a row, and it was just an extraordinary time
Speaker 1: to be in Miami. It was actually the only true
Speaker 1: trauma I had was it was the first time that
Speaker 1: I've ever bumped into a JAP And I remember, what
Speaker 1: do you explain to the audience, what you mean a
Speaker 1: JAP is a Jewish American prince or princess. And I
Speaker 1: remember calling it's funny because how do you feel as
Speaker 1: a Jew? And I'm a Jew. Two, you can use
Speaker 1: the word jap. How about if a non Jew uses
Speaker 1: the word term jab it doesn't matter, Okay, I think
Speaker 1: it's very descriptive. So I remember talking to my mother
Speaker 1: and I said, Um, there's these guys. They're a really
Speaker 1: fancy cars. They listened to a lot of Saturday Night
Speaker 1: Fever and they have uh star of David's on their chest.
Speaker 1: And it just I can't figure out what planet they
Speaker 1: came from. And she couldn't help me either, because we
Speaker 1: came from California. All our friends were basically hippie Jewish
Speaker 1: families and so um, that was an interesting dynamic for
Speaker 1: me to witness that at that stage of my life.
Speaker 1: And and and and I don't know, it was well,
Speaker 1: I know the similar experience. I grew up in the
Speaker 1: suburbs fifty miles from New York City in Connecticut, and
Speaker 1: I went to college where uh the people were prep
Speaker 1: school and you had these very rich non Jews. It
Speaker 1: was very I never ran into people like that before.
Speaker 1: So being out irrelevant makes you more worldly. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: you know it was interesting what what I say it was?
Speaker 1: You know, for me, it was a culture shock. Um,
Speaker 1: But I actually became very very close friends with many
Speaker 1: of the Latin American Jewish um Um kids that sent
Speaker 1: there from South America and Central America. And when pure
Speaker 1: serendipity or there was an affinity or why there's a
Speaker 1: there was a huge community. Um. Many of the Jewish
Speaker 1: families from Central and South America sent their kids to
Speaker 1: the University of Miami. So, you know, I went to
Speaker 1: the hill Hel you know, I met other people. So
Speaker 1: UM we became very close friends and you maintain those relationships.
Speaker 1: Not really no odd okay, but just going back to
Speaker 1: the agree you're comfortable talking about. You said your biological father. Sure,
Speaker 1: can you explain what was going on there? So my
Speaker 1: parents UM divorced when I was an infant. UM. My
Speaker 1: parents met liberating Israel, and my father was one of
Speaker 1: the commanders of the Battle of Haral, which is the
Speaker 1: hills leading up to Jerusalem. My mother comes from a
Speaker 1: very very famous family. My great grandfather is one of
Speaker 1: the signers, one of the pioneer families. Um was the
Speaker 1: founder of Bank Mizrachi. He was Rabbi Cook's assistant. Uh.
Speaker 1: He went to he was invited before immigrating to Palestine.
Speaker 1: Um to the Basil conference with Hertzel. Um he witnessed
Speaker 1: Hertzel and invited him to his factory in Poland. He
Speaker 1: Um Hertzel came to the factory, gave an incredible speech,
Speaker 1: and the very next day my um great great grandfather
Speaker 1: sold the business and moved from a home that had
Speaker 1: fifty five bedrooms to barracks style living in Jerusalem. Where
Speaker 1: was Where was the home with fifty bedrooms in Poland?
Speaker 1: And was the epicenter of the Golden era of Jewish
Speaker 1: life which was in Poland. Um in the fifteen hundreds,
Speaker 1: the Um Polish king decided that he was going to
Speaker 1: create a society that was free of religious persecution and
Speaker 1: everybody was able to practice. That's why UM Poland was
Speaker 1: such an epicenter for Jewish culture. And Um, you know
Speaker 1: that last couple hundred years. And what year did your
Speaker 1: grandfather then moved to Jerusalem around nineteen fourteen fifteen, very
Speaker 1: early on? Okay, And you were telling the story of
Speaker 1: your biological thoughts. So my biological father, UM was didn't
Speaker 1: come from such an incredible family, very nice family, but
Speaker 1: UM not distinguished like UM my mother's family. And she
Speaker 1: didn't want him to be in the UM have a
Speaker 1: career in the army. So she encouraged him to get
Speaker 1: out of the pressure cooker and go and study engineering
Speaker 1: in New York City. And they had a very difficult
Speaker 1: life together. He really wanted to continue his career in
Speaker 1: the military. He was a security guard, a janitor, all
Speaker 1: while going to school. A lot of pressure in the
Speaker 1: house and he was very physical and um my mother
Speaker 1: just couldn't take it anymore. So I decided to get
Speaker 1: a divorce and that's how it happened. I didn't see
Speaker 1: him for many many years. He became a uh AN
Speaker 1: engineer and then a specialist in building huge infrastructure, primarily
Speaker 1: in third world countries, and went on to have this big,
Speaker 1: very big career. And though of the four kids in
Speaker 1: the family, he's the father of how many, um my
Speaker 1: eldest and myself. And did he get married again and
Speaker 1: have children again? He did? And so you have step brothers, sisters.
Speaker 1: I considered them all brothers and sisters. I don't like
Speaker 1: that step thing. And you have regular contact with them, yes,
Speaker 1: And so he ultimately had his second family where um
Speaker 1: they started in Nigeria, then went to Switzerland. Um and
Speaker 1: then to Israel. Okay, so he was financially successful and
Speaker 1: your ultimate feeling about him, you tell the story of
Speaker 1: him paying for college. You did you have how much
Speaker 1: contact with you and you feel good about No? No, no,
Speaker 1: very little contact. Um and a very rough guy. And
Speaker 1: he always dangled money. Um the rabbi they countant the home.
Speaker 1: He had all sorts of rules of how you were
Speaker 1: able to inherit his money. And I didn't play by
Speaker 1: any of the rules. And I was the one only
Speaker 1: one cut out of the will. Really did you know
Speaker 1: in advance of his death that you were cut out
Speaker 1: of the will? I didn't know in advance, but I
Speaker 1: had no interest in it either. It would it would.
Speaker 1: It was better for um my brother and sister, my
Speaker 1: two brothers and sister then and I was fine with that. Okay.
Speaker 1: So you go to the University of Miami. You involved
Speaker 1: in music at all there? Yeah? I was the director,
Speaker 1: the student organizer of of concerts. So okay, you say
Speaker 1: you listen to music in your brother's rooms. What motivated
Speaker 1: you to do that? And you know I'm active, and
Speaker 1: you know I don't actually know the story, sorry, and
Speaker 1: so who do you remember some of the acts you brought. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I brought Loggins and Messina and I'm drawing a blank.
Speaker 1: But I had a pretty good run there. Now, University
Speaker 1: of Miami, even to this day is has a very
Speaker 1: famous music school. Were you involved with that at all?
Speaker 1: Not at all? Okay, So then you graduate from University
Speaker 1: of Miami. I do after after the traditional four years,
Speaker 1: and then what was the next step, I believe it
Speaker 1: or not. The next step was I thought that I
Speaker 1: could be a shrimp farmer in Ecuador. And what did
Speaker 1: you know, somebody was a shrimp farmer in Ecuador. So
Speaker 1: my roommate was the grandson of the president of Equador.
Speaker 1: He didn't speak a lick of English. And I remember
Speaker 1: one year is English started improving, he told me about
Speaker 1: his uncle that loved shrimps, and he dug a ditch
Speaker 1: in his backyard and and made some very good shrimps.
Speaker 1: And another time he came back, he said that little
Speaker 1: ditch in the backyard is a couple of miles wide.
Speaker 1: And that was the beginning of the shrimp farming industry.
Speaker 1: And I thought, because the University of Miami had a
Speaker 1: big marine biology, you know center, so I thought that
Speaker 1: I could actually do business in Ecuador and you know,
Speaker 1: be on the front end of that. But that didn't
Speaker 1: work out very well. Did you actually go to Ecuador
Speaker 1: and try I did? How long did that last? Um?
Speaker 1: That last about nine months? And it didn't work out because, uh,
Speaker 1: just political situations. It got funky down there. Okay, So
Speaker 1: you leave Equador and then you go where I go
Speaker 1: to Los Angeles, back to my parents home, and my
Speaker 1: mother helped organize me to work for the National Bank
Speaker 1: of Israel in Beverly Hills and uh that's called bank Leumi.
Speaker 1: And what did you do for Bankleyumi? I was a
Speaker 1: financial analyst. I basically counted uh, Persian money because the
Speaker 1: shaw had just fallen and they were racing to Beverly Hills.
Speaker 1: So the job sucked. I didn't have a window and
Speaker 1: there was no finance being done. It was just a
Speaker 1: horrible job for me. And you did that for how long?
Speaker 1: I did that for six months? And you're living in
Speaker 1: your parents house. I know, I had my own crib
Speaker 1: in Beechwood or somewhere, and that's that's a canyon up
Speaker 1: by Griffith Park. So okay, so you're frustrated with that,
Speaker 1: what's your next move? Well, my friends were throwing lots
Speaker 1: of parties, and this was the beginning of there's some
Speaker 1: very famous clubs, power Tools and Radio Radio actually being
Speaker 1: the first one. And they were throwing parties and they
Speaker 1: were trying to encourage me to come in and work
Speaker 1: with them. They were having so much fun um, and
Speaker 1: I just felt like I shouldn't bounce around. My mother
Speaker 1: got me this job. I was just going to focus,
Speaker 1: and but I was miserable and that ran its course.
Speaker 1: I just couldn't do it anymore. So I said I
Speaker 1: joined them, but I to think of some other spend,
Speaker 1: some something that I could do to add value. I
Speaker 1: just didn't want to ride along them. So and this
Speaker 1: was a full time business for them. I wouldn't say
Speaker 1: it's a full time business. It wasn't for it. They
Speaker 1: did parties sporadically um, but they were making a lot
Speaker 1: of money at the time. And I remember that I
Speaker 1: was driving by the Stardust Ballroom and I pulled over,
Speaker 1: where's the Stardust Ballroom. It's an iconic place. It's not
Speaker 1: there any longer, but it was on Sunset and Western.
Speaker 1: It was one of the most important venues in Los Angeles.
Speaker 1: It's actually where the beginning of the punk scene started.
Speaker 1: So what happened was the owners were umbought its sight
Speaker 1: unseen from Korea. They're very, um fabulously wealthy, and they're
Speaker 1: trying to leave and they got sold the bill of goods.
Speaker 1: You know, Hollywood Um nightclub on Sunset Boulevard. It was
Speaker 1: a seed is the wrong side of the freeway. It
Speaker 1: wasn't the wrong side of the freeway. So I said
Speaker 1: to them, Hey, maybe I could you know, paint and
Speaker 1: and and put some shows in here. And they said
Speaker 1: there they would be thrilled. And so that's how we started.
Speaker 1: And so the value you added to your friends was
Speaker 1: finding the venue the venue. But I also thought about
Speaker 1: because Bobby, I'm I'm basically a very curious person. So
Speaker 1: there was these posters all over Los Angeles, very big,
Speaker 1: big posters, and it was there were colorful and bright
Speaker 1: and Uncle Jam's Army. Have you ever heard of it? No?
Speaker 1: I didn't move to l A, you know, until after this. Okay,
Speaker 1: So Uncle Jam's Army was had poster boards all over
Speaker 1: the place, but I didn't know what it was at
Speaker 1: Sports Arena and they gave me the time, So I
Speaker 1: ended up going there and lo and behold. It was,
Speaker 1: you know, at the Civic Center, jam packed um full
Speaker 1: of kids from South central l a um listening to breakbeats.
Speaker 1: There weren't even rappers at the time, and it was
Speaker 1: exciting for me. And then I kept coming back to
Speaker 1: the parties, and then they started importing um rappers from
Speaker 1: New York um that had singles. But because it was
Speaker 1: a you know, city facility at eleven o'clock, they had
Speaker 1: to shut their party down and my party didn't get
Speaker 1: started till midnight. So I said, maybe I could hire
Speaker 1: some of the talent that they had to play a
Speaker 1: second gig in Hollywood, And that's how I started doing
Speaker 1: my thing. So what years this this was too So
Speaker 1: how often would you have a gig at the ballroom? Um?
Speaker 1: There was There was a period of time I had
Speaker 1: a regular weekend party Friday and Saturday in a little
Speaker 1: small part of the ballroom. And then every once in
Speaker 1: a while I'd imagine a show, and you know, so
Speaker 1: much bigger ones like concerts, not part I had parties
Speaker 1: and concerts, and so the concerts who were what was
Speaker 1: some of the talent for the concerts. So the one
Speaker 1: that that really changed my life was actually the first
Speaker 1: one and it was Social Distortion Circle, Jerks, fear fishbone Red,
Speaker 1: Hot Chili Peppers and run DMC's quite a bill. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well they're all unsigned. Um I borrowed like seven dollars
Speaker 1: from my mom. I made thirty six g s that night.
Speaker 1: How was the capacity? Um? Capacity was like, you know,
Speaker 1: it's been a long time, some thinking, three thousand people
Speaker 1: and it was really super cool bomb it was something
Speaker 1: just uh, I still haven't come down from that moment. So, okay,
Speaker 1: you make thirty six g's in retrospect, did you know
Speaker 1: what you're doing? Or you were just lucky? Just lucky
Speaker 1: because I put on the second show with Houdini. I
Speaker 1: don't know if you know. And um, I lost all
Speaker 1: that money and then some and I had already started
Speaker 1: spending that money. So I was really not in a
Speaker 1: good shape. And you were still at Bank Loomi or
Speaker 1: you're done. No, I was done. And you still have
Speaker 1: these partners. Your friends are just yourself. I know they're
Speaker 1: they're my partner. Okay, so how about security and all
Speaker 1: those other issues. I didn't know anything about any of
Speaker 1: that stuff. And did you have any bad experiences? And
Speaker 1: no bad experience, only love Okay, so you made the
Speaker 1: only bad experience. This was the fear that still drives
Speaker 1: me today when I sat outside the venue thinking that
Speaker 1: there was going to be a walk up like there
Speaker 1: was at the run dy m C show that never
Speaker 1: showed up. And it's a pain that's below the heart
Speaker 1: and above the stomach. And I still can feel like
Speaker 1: right the second I could feel that pain, and um,
Speaker 1: you know, I've been running away from that pain ever since.
Speaker 1: And at this late date, why did the Houdini show
Speaker 1: not work? I think it was hubrius that I didn't
Speaker 1: ever reflect on why the first show did and I
Speaker 1: think it was um much thinner it didn't. You know,
Speaker 1: the run d m C with those Hollywood bands was
Speaker 1: a statement. It was um a combination that was built
Speaker 1: to succeed, and then Houdini was I thought was going
Speaker 1: to draft off of that success and I didn't have
Speaker 1: really the package. Um that made sense? So, UM, you know,
Speaker 1: can I tell you? So you lost money? But did
Speaker 1: you continue to promote concerts? No? I was done. I
Speaker 1: just done promotion doing promotion. I have such a great
Speaker 1: respect for promoters because it's just really hard. It's hard
Speaker 1: on every level to do it right. It's it's really
Speaker 1: hard on every level. But with the run DMC show,
Speaker 1: the biggest issue I had that night was running U
Speaker 1: refused to perform, and I didn't understand exactly what was
Speaker 1: going on. He went on stage and then he left
Speaker 1: and I went to talk to him and I said,
Speaker 1: what's the story. He says, I'm sure you saw it.
Speaker 1: They don't like me and they're coming to attack me.
Speaker 1: And I didn't understand exactly what he was referring to.
Speaker 1: And then I realized all these kids that were stage diving.
Speaker 1: They come on the stage and they you know, dance
Speaker 1: around him and then fling themselves on And I said
Speaker 1: to him, listen, I know this sounds strange, but it's
Speaker 1: only a deep appreciation for what you do. And he
Speaker 1: absolutely looked at me and didn't believe me, and I
Speaker 1: kept talking and convincing him. I said, you have to
Speaker 1: you have to trust me that this is simply a
Speaker 1: an appreciation for what you do. He says, Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm going to give it a try. He went back
Speaker 1: on stage and for the rest of his set he
Speaker 1: helped fling little white boys off the stage, and it
Speaker 1: was cheer bliss for him. He had the best time,
Speaker 1: and that's the person who encouraged me to come to
Speaker 1: New York. Stay right here, we'll be back with more
Speaker 1: of my conversation with Lear Cone, head of music for
Speaker 1: YouTube and Google. Here on the Bob left Sets podcast.
Speaker 1: This is Bob left Sets. Had a great guest this week,
Speaker 1: Leo Cone, head of music for YouTube and Google. If
Speaker 1: you ever want to see the guests as opposed to
Speaker 1: just listening, or in the case of leor both he
Speaker 1: and me and his Porsche Targa, follow and tune in
Speaker 1: on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook for photos and videos. Now
Speaker 1: more with Lee or Cohen. Okay, so you're you're out
Speaker 1: of promotion. How long before you go to New York? Immediately?
Speaker 1: Bob immediately? And does he promised you a gig? Or
Speaker 1: you just you know? So he put me in touch
Speaker 1: with Um Russell, his brother, his brother, and Um Russell said,
Speaker 1: come to New York. And you know, Um, you know
Speaker 1: my brother, it speaks very highly of you and and
Speaker 1: let's get it on. So I sat in my parents
Speaker 1: kitchen table and I said to them, there is these
Speaker 1: people that talk instead of sing, and they want me
Speaker 1: to come to New York. And my father stroked his
Speaker 1: beard and said, son, there's an instrument called the contract.
Speaker 1: I'm certain you have no no need for it, but
Speaker 1: it's an instrument that when things don't go so well,
Speaker 1: you don't have to commit to memory what you agree to.
Speaker 1: And my mom cut him off and said, son, contract,
Speaker 1: no contract. I think you should go, and more importantly,
Speaker 1: I think you should try to avoid work. If you
Speaker 1: could find your passion, you would be a very rich man.
Speaker 1: And she wasn't referring to money. And since my mama's boy,
Speaker 1: I listened to my mom and I went and I've
Speaker 1: avoided work my whole life, thirty seven years in this business.
Speaker 1: And so how so what do you do you get
Speaker 1: to New York? My mom told me, please call me
Speaker 1: when you get to New York. At a friend that
Speaker 1: went to the you and transferred to Columbia University, and
Speaker 1: he invited me to sleep on his floor. He lived
Speaker 1: in a welfare hotel close to Columbia University. And I
Speaker 1: was so enthusiastic about being in the music business that
Speaker 1: I went straight to the office and I tounded the
Speaker 1: door open, thinking that there was going to be a
Speaker 1: marching band and I was going to meet Russell because
Speaker 1: I never met Russell. There was no marching band, there
Speaker 1: was no Russell. In fact, he never told anybody in
Speaker 1: the office, and all three of them, we're in deep depression.
Speaker 1: And the reason why they were troubled was run DMC
Speaker 1: was at JFK and they were supposed to go on
Speaker 1: their first European tour and their road manager was on
Speaker 1: Cocaine Binge and was the only one with the valid passport.
Speaker 1: And I said, well, I have a valid passport. They said, oh,
Speaker 1: can you get to JFK. So I literally, instead of
Speaker 1: calling my mom from New York, I called her from
Speaker 1: London and I said, Mom, you're just not going to
Speaker 1: believe this. And that's how I became the road manager
Speaker 1: for run d m C. Okay, you know nothing, zero
Speaker 1: road managers and guy's got up, stay up twenty hours
Speaker 1: a day. Here's all the problems. How did you do
Speaker 1: in that gig? First of all, these are the most
Speaker 1: amazing guys on the planet. They were enthusiastic about sharing
Speaker 1: what they had to with everybody. They were responsible and
Speaker 1: we were very ethan crew. You know, our our band
Speaker 1: was Jay's Needles and Records, and so you know, I
Speaker 1: didn't have to think about, you know, what what it
Speaker 1: meant to have a writer and technicians and everything like that.
Speaker 1: You know, we screwed the need on and had the
Speaker 1: records and and played gigs, and you know, I was
Speaker 1: I'm serious person, so I was focused and I wanted
Speaker 1: to um do a good job. And I was very
Speaker 1: fortunate and lucky. I told you my timing is pretty good.
Speaker 1: So how long was that European tour? That European tour
Speaker 1: was about a week and a half. And then you
Speaker 1: come back to New York and then what in fact,
Speaker 1: you know who picked me up and he was driving
Speaker 1: the van, Roger Rames. You're really for those people don't know.
Speaker 1: Rod Rames was a legendary record guy. He had London Records.
Speaker 1: We've been the in Araam, etcetera. Then went to I
Speaker 1: think the chairman of and then he ultimately was the
Speaker 1: chairman of Warner And if you see the movie twenty
Speaker 1: four Hour Party people, there's a great scene where he's
Speaker 1: trying to buy the assets of Factory Records. I never
Speaker 1: I never knew Roger was driving to Bay. I'll have
Speaker 1: to tell him that the next time. He is an
Speaker 1: amazing record man from Trinidad, from Trinidad. And remember Rundy
Speaker 1: m C was licensed by London Records, so that's that. Okay,
Speaker 1: So you're a week and a half and you're back
Speaker 1: in New York. Yes, and you're now you're back in
Speaker 1: the office. So they have worked for you. Oh no,
Speaker 1: we were gigging all the time, so you're now a
Speaker 1: road manage I'm a road manager, but we're gigging on
Speaker 1: the weekends. So I worked in the office, um during
Speaker 1: the week doing what well. We also represented Curtis Blow Um.
Speaker 1: I don't know. We're just you know, it's a long
Speaker 1: time ago bomb, I'm old. Okay, okay, So you're doing this.
Speaker 1: How long do you play the role of road manager?
Speaker 1: Three and a half years road manager. Never missed a gig.
Speaker 1: We never missed a gig, and once we did five
Speaker 1: gigs in the night in three different states. Never about that.
Speaker 1: Never never missed a gig. We were so mobile, unlike
Speaker 1: all the kids these days that need their whole block
Speaker 1: to join them. We were run DMC, jam Master j
Speaker 1: rest in Peace miss him every day, Runny Ray and myself.
Speaker 1: We all carried our own luggage. There was no high posting,
Speaker 1: and we got it done and we we felt so
Speaker 1: blessed and so fortunate and lucky. Where were those five gigs?
Speaker 1: What three states were they? They're like Virginia, d c Um,
Speaker 1: Carolina Area. That are okay? So after those years you
Speaker 1: and you were the road manager only for run DMC
Speaker 1: or for Curtis Blow and these other people. Uh no,
Speaker 1: I did um for the Beastie Boys. Ended up I
Speaker 1: ended up managing the Beastie Boys. Um. Was this during
Speaker 1: the license to Ill period or before or after that?
Speaker 1: This was before and after and and and during two
Speaker 1: and yes during too? Okay, dude, you have now that
Speaker 1: was six licensed ill was like there was a certain
Speaker 1: amount of buzz, but that was a gargantuan record, far
Speaker 1: exceeding anybody's expectations. Did you have a belief that it
Speaker 1: would be as big as it was? Not? At all?
Speaker 1: Not at all. I had no vision, zero vision. I
Speaker 1: was the in in the group of people. I was
Speaker 1: the operator. So I think the vision Rick had and
Speaker 1: Russell had, and then their heads were cast it forwards.
Speaker 1: My head was straight down. The Beastie Boys first tour,
Speaker 1: I started them in Seattle and four hundred seaters by
Speaker 1: the time they got all the way down California and
Speaker 1: to Texas. Um they were an arena, so I switched.
Speaker 1: I had to switch the venues that that fast started four.
Speaker 1: And then just to understand the business arrangement, this was
Speaker 1: deaf Jam at the time, and this was rush management
Speaker 1: and def Jam were you know, so when you were
Speaker 1: the manager, you were ultimately working for Russell. You're working separately, No, no,
Speaker 1: I was working for Russell. Okay, so you do that,
Speaker 1: you have the great success, and then def Jam has
Speaker 1: a deal with Columbia correct, and then um UM. You know,
Speaker 1: there weren't too many people to put records out, so
Speaker 1: um Rick and Russell Um decided to start a record
Speaker 1: company so they could put out records that they wanted
Speaker 1: to put out. I thought the sexier side of the
Speaker 1: business was managing and so um. Ironically to a degree
Speaker 1: it is. Again it's a service business. You say that
Speaker 1: with some drove me out of the business. It's it's
Speaker 1: a license to starve to boot for many people. So
Speaker 1: in any event, they start this record company, and your
Speaker 1: role in the record company is I was a manager.
Speaker 1: The record company was Russo and Wreck. So what point
Speaker 1: do you move to the record company. Well, remember Rick
Speaker 1: Leaves and Rick leaves and starts right, so it's like
Speaker 1: really short time. And then Russell actually moved to California
Speaker 1: to make movies, so you know, I just ended up
Speaker 1: having to do it, so you ended up being It
Speaker 1: was scary. It was very scary, don't don't get it twisted.
Speaker 1: To be the person that was guiding a cultural brand
Speaker 1: like Deaf Chaan, especially with Rick on and then Russell
Speaker 1: in Hollywood, was scary. It was really really scary. You
Speaker 1: remember how many acts you had on the label? Um,
Speaker 1: we didn't have that many acts. Um. I started signing
Speaker 1: acts and I signed one stiff after another. I mean
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I couldn't, honestly, I couldn't sign an act
Speaker 1: that would sell. And I was fortunately it was like
Speaker 1: a little side in print that I was signing this too.
Speaker 1: Um it was r L Russia associated label until Rick
Speaker 1: and Russell unwound their their situation. But man, it was
Speaker 1: so scary. I honestly could not sign worse acts. It was.
Speaker 1: It was really, um, a very difficult time in my life.
Speaker 1: And then when does Russell come back and get involved? Well,
Speaker 1: Russell comes back a few years later, but at that
Speaker 1: moment I caught my breath, and I really had a
Speaker 1: much tighter aperture of what was needed um to be
Speaker 1: successful and to write the ship and to get started again.
Speaker 1: And the you know, my vision was blurry and and
Speaker 1: with the Beasties leaving Rick, leaving Russell, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of um and I just needed a tighter aperture. And
Speaker 1: thank god that Red Man came in the door and
Speaker 1: we signed him and time for some action happened, and
Speaker 1: it was the re birth of Deaf Jam recordings. And
Speaker 1: the interesting news is that we also had Public Enemy
Speaker 1: and Slick Rick in that transitional period. So while I
Speaker 1: was signing stiffs and you know, cold his ice, um,
Speaker 1: they still kept um the shine of the label very
Speaker 1: important and help me find my breath and and gave
Speaker 1: me cover. And at the time, are you making any money? No? No,
Speaker 1: I had roommates that I was thirty three years old, okay,
Speaker 1: and so how does I was the mayor of Alphabet City.
Speaker 1: The first bit of money that we made was one
Speaker 1: numbers okay, do you remember? I remember so so um.
Speaker 1: By then I also had a huge stable of artists.
Speaker 1: I was E. P. M. D s Manager, Eric b
Speaker 1: and Rock Kim's manager, Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince's manager.
Speaker 1: Um it goes on and on, Steta Sonic, Big Daddy Cane,
Speaker 1: you know, really goes. There's no there was nothing moving
Speaker 1: like I made the cold chilling deal. There's nothing moving
Speaker 1: in wrap that I wasn't wasn't a part of at
Speaker 1: that time. But still it wasn't enough money for me
Speaker 1: to move out. It was still nascent business. And then
Speaker 1: one came along and uh, Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh
Speaker 1: Prince started printing money, like we'll explain what the deal?
Speaker 1: What is the person who's called is charged? So what
Speaker 1: was the offer? The offers? You could speak to the
Speaker 1: act and they would leave messages. And there was months
Speaker 1: that Jazz Jeff and the Fresh Prince we were making
Speaker 1: north of four d thousand dollars a month. Wow. So
Speaker 1: it was the key to constantly change the message or
Speaker 1: to keep people on the line. Constantly change the message,
Speaker 1: get people to call every day, and what might the
Speaker 1: message be, I'm old bomb. Okay, we'll have to go
Speaker 1: back into the archives. So that's how you make some
Speaker 1: real money. You get to move out De Jam's at Colombia.
Speaker 1: It ends up being purchased by PolyGram tell us that story.
Speaker 1: You have to understand that there was a beautiful incubation
Speaker 1: period for us at def Jam. What I mean by
Speaker 1: that is there was much more demand, didn't supply. The
Speaker 1: major labels actually didn't get into signing wrap backs because
Speaker 1: the bosses of those labels made their success through rock
Speaker 1: and roll, and their kids were too young, and so
Speaker 1: as far as rap was concerned, it was just noisy
Speaker 1: music um or noise, and they didn't want to invent.
Speaker 1: They thought it was a fad. They wanted no part
Speaker 1: of it, and we started, you know, building a real business.
Speaker 1: What I mean by incubation is we had no cloud
Speaker 1: we had no money, we had no experience, and Russell
Speaker 1: and I like getting high, and just any one of
Speaker 1: those was enough not to be able to build a business.
Speaker 1: But because the majors were so arrogant, all they had
Speaker 1: to do was drive fifty blocks and they would have
Speaker 1: seen that the demand was blowing the roof off of
Speaker 1: all the clubs uptown. So, you know, seven years goes
Speaker 1: by and now we get a little bit of money,
Speaker 1: we get a little experience, some clouds. Getting high is
Speaker 1: not that important anymore, and their kids are now starting
Speaker 1: to grow up and Donnie Einer's kid actually preferred going
Speaker 1: to a public enemy show than the Bruce Springsteen show.
Speaker 1: And that's when Donnie said, oh my god, I'm out
Speaker 1: of position. And so I had a very fragile group.
Speaker 1: They were called third Base. You ever heard of them,
Speaker 1: of course, Okay, So they didn't really like each other
Speaker 1: that much, and they were very, very fragile. UM Search
Speaker 1: is a very inquisitive person and very tasty person and
Speaker 1: Donnie can vinced them to start a production company. And
Speaker 1: that's put too much tension on the group. And that
Speaker 1: was behind my back. That's my partner and at Columbia
Speaker 1: Columbia Records, and so that's how NAS got signed to
Speaker 1: Columbia Records through MC search. Oh yeah yeah, so um
Speaker 1: that put a lot of search and it was Pete
Speaker 1: and Pete writes about baseball or something these days, and
Speaker 1: it put a lot of tension on the band, put
Speaker 1: a lot of tension on me. And you know, because
Speaker 1: of our deal structure, we were deeply in the red
Speaker 1: and to the tune of nineteen million dollars, but it
Speaker 1: was used to it was at a joint venture or
Speaker 1: you still own your assets or you know, no No,
Speaker 1: we didn't own our assets. They actually owned the assets. Um.
Speaker 1: We had a UM some action. UM, it's embarrassing to
Speaker 1: tell you what that action is. It's it's less than
Speaker 1: what bands are getting signed for today. But were they
Speaker 1: made you were nineteen million of the red Have they
Speaker 1: made money on the deal? Oh, of course they made money.
Speaker 1: But UM, they wanted to go full tilt boogie in
Speaker 1: wrap and they thought they can do it themselves. And
Speaker 1: they thought that the only barrier was their focus and money.
Speaker 1: And they're both focused and they're going to invest. And UM.
Speaker 1: They gave me the option to um by the red
Speaker 1: balance back and then get out of the building. And
Speaker 1: it wasn't really an option. They were they were flinging
Speaker 1: us out of the building. And it was scary because
Speaker 1: I didn't let anybody at at the company know because
Speaker 1: there would have been hugely distracting and difficult for people.
Speaker 1: So I remember every going trying to find record companies
Speaker 1: to partner with, and um the only one was Alan
Speaker 1: Levy and PolyGram and actually he gave us six million
Speaker 1: for that piece, and UM, so we gave them nineteen
Speaker 1: And it was the first little bit of capital that
Speaker 1: Russell and I got and um we actually was again
Speaker 1: very good timing. I actually shipped Regulate at Columbia and
Speaker 1: they weren't paying attention and that went on to sell
Speaker 1: four million albums. So my first def Jam PolyGram experience
Speaker 1: was warranty Regulated sold four million albums, very very thrilled
Speaker 1: and a lone Leavi was thrilled and excited, and we
Speaker 1: had a very interesting deal with him, very very good deal,
Speaker 1: very forward looking deal because he believed that rap catalog
Speaker 1: was going to be a huge, huge opportunity nitty, especially
Speaker 1: in the multiple of of the CD business. So um,
Speaker 1: it was really great timing for us and it was
Speaker 1: beautiful and at that time def GM is operating in
Speaker 1: what part of PolyGram Island Island and then they ultimately
Speaker 1: roll it up into I D j um No it
Speaker 1: was p L g Um with Rick Dabas and Johnny Barbs,
Speaker 1: um Um Peter cup Key and then it was really
Speaker 1: a difficult time because Alan Levy wanted to buy the
Speaker 1: business and Russell wanted to sell and offered fifty million
Speaker 1: dollars and I said I'm not interested in that, and
Speaker 1: I had a block on it, and Russell was very
Speaker 1: upset and he was our lawyer was making him very
Speaker 1: scared debt because of me blocking UM. He wasn't going
Speaker 1: to end up with any money. And it was a
Speaker 1: very stressful period for the two of us. And I
Speaker 1: just believed that we could um improved the multiple. And
Speaker 1: I remember that Russell was pounding me so hard. And
Speaker 1: it was actually Danny Goldberg that went around my back
Speaker 1: to my my company and told him that I'm selling
Speaker 1: the company. This is what he's running Mercury when he
Speaker 1: was running Mercury, but he was very close to a
Speaker 1: lone Livy and I fell into depression and I UM
Speaker 1: at the time, my wife said, your health is much
Speaker 1: more important than you know this type of stuff. Just
Speaker 1: sell the company. And I agreed to sell it. And
Speaker 1: then four days later the board rejected UM that fifty
Speaker 1: million dollar deal. And UM they rejected because two days
Speaker 1: earlier they met secretly, this guy from Philip s met
Speaker 1: secretly with Edgar Broffman and because of that they didn't
Speaker 1: want any transactions to happen. So again great timing, and
Speaker 1: they were talking about buying the Universe Emerging with Universal
Speaker 1: assets and no they're no Universal was was buying PolyGram.
Speaker 1: Now remember the reason why Phillips was selling PolyGram as
Speaker 1: they invented the CD. So they're the reasons why they
Speaker 1: gave the green light to Alan Levy because they discovered
Speaker 1: that the CD was a powerful opportunity, but it was
Speaker 1: also the perfect master, so they rode the upside. They
Speaker 1: allowed him to buy Island UM and UM motown. I
Speaker 1: mean hundreds and hundreds of UM hundreds of millions of dollars,
Speaker 1: you know, massive. No one's ever seen prices like that
Speaker 1: because they knew the conversion from tape to CD was
Speaker 1: going to be a windfall. But they also knew that
Speaker 1: it was the perfect master. So they allowed Allan to
Speaker 1: build this over a decade and then sold it from
Speaker 1: underneath him. You were do you believe they were totally
Speaker 1: conscious that the Internet was coming and they had a
Speaker 1: perfect They made a fortune. They sold to Edgar for
Speaker 1: you know, coasted twelve billion dollars And the only problem
Speaker 1: is that Edgar Universal bought PolyGram, but the largest market
Speaker 1: share in North America was a little company called Death
Speaker 1: Chamber Recordings, and that deal didn't go through, and so
Speaker 1: Doug had bought Doug Morris. Doug Morris had bought this
Speaker 1: UM was brought along UM by Edgar and we had
Speaker 1: just dropped UM Job Rule, DMX and jay z All
Speaker 1: in the month of December. Everybody told me, you can
Speaker 1: never release a record in December. Thecember is off limits
Speaker 1: because the retailers are too focused on stocking. It's taboo
Speaker 1: to do that. And I felt like UM parents started
Speaker 1: becoming less and less under UM a knowledgeable of what
Speaker 1: to give as a gift of music to their children,
Speaker 1: so they gave them cash. And the closure I got
Speaker 1: to Christmas, UM, the better I was going to fare.
Speaker 1: So you literally delayed the release knowing that the kids
Speaker 1: would blow the cash. And it was all during the
Speaker 1: transition and the due diligence of PolyGram and the Universal merger.
Speaker 1: So remember Island, Mercury, A and M. All of those
Speaker 1: executives were frozen because they didn't know what was happening.
Speaker 1: Everybody was frozen. But I was driving my multiple and
Speaker 1: so all of PolyGram was frozen. Who's going to be
Speaker 1: the boss? Who's going to survive all that swirl is happening?
Speaker 1: And I dropped three very important and influential albums that
Speaker 1: I'm proud of UM in the month of December at
Speaker 1: that moment, and it was UM a stunning moment. Okay,
Speaker 1: so the deal goes through it where does that leave
Speaker 1: Jeff Jam? Um? That leaves def Jam in the catbird seat?
Speaker 1: And unfortunately, UM, we have a natural clock on our
Speaker 1: deal and there was time for for UM the deal
Speaker 1: to two. I tried to fight it even then. Thank
Speaker 1: god I didn't fight it because the UM the month
Speaker 1: that we sold was the first month of the decline
Speaker 1: for the last eighteen years. Okay, so what was that price?
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's public a big number. It was three
Speaker 1: million dollars for the total and Russia and I owned UM,
Speaker 1: so that's a good paycheck. It was fabulous. It was
Speaker 1: just it was amazing. It was amazing. Listen, UM, you
Speaker 1: know it's that type of that type of money has
Speaker 1: no context to me because I don't live like that.
Speaker 1: So UM, So where is the money today? Um? The
Speaker 1: money is with my ex wife, UM, Um with me.
Speaker 1: It's I mean, it's invested. Yeah, it's an investors certainly.
Speaker 1: How much is real assets? How much the stock market?
Speaker 1: For most stock I would say, UM, real assets are
Speaker 1: UM and is UM more in the equities? And then
Speaker 1: is is more UM liquid and stuff like that? And
Speaker 1: how active are you in managing that money? I'm not
Speaker 1: very active. I suck at I suck at that. You
Speaker 1: hired people, yes, and you're smart, smarter people than myself.
Speaker 1: So how do you end that's by away. That's the
Speaker 1: secret of my success is surround yourself with super dough people,
Speaker 1: give them a lot of sunlight and water and just
Speaker 1: hug it out. So how do you end up running?
Speaker 1: I d J Well? I had the most insane month. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I sold the company for a big number
Speaker 1: and part of that um, when you sell a company,
Speaker 1: you're obliged to work for them, um, and I was
Speaker 1: obliged to work for them. So they asked me to
Speaker 1: look over Mercury Island and left cham and I remember,
Speaker 1: you know, on a white board playing around with the names,
Speaker 1: and I didn't know who. I couldn't trace the steps
Speaker 1: back to someone with Mercury, so I couldn't find the
Speaker 1: heartbeat there and I was but I was able to
Speaker 1: find Chris Blackwell and the heartbeat there that's island records.
Speaker 1: So I decided to call it island def jam, and I, um,
Speaker 1: def jam island doesn't sound as good as Island def jam,
Speaker 1: and the I d J sounds really dope. Okay, And
Speaker 1: to what because black Well ultimately leaves. But when you
Speaker 1: start how involved is Blackwell? Blackwell has already left the building.
Speaker 1: So now you're many many many years okay, you're you're
Speaker 1: running at lock Stock and Barrel Well. I told you
Speaker 1: I surround myself with super dope people. Okay. So in
Speaker 1: your tenure at I d J, sir, what what did
Speaker 1: you learn? I learned that the entrepreneurialism of rap music
Speaker 1: and the co mingling of of artists and the UM
Speaker 1: determination to mind audiences and connect them with the artists
Speaker 1: is very, very powerful. And just that, you know, I
Speaker 1: felt like I could do anything. And that runs its course,
Speaker 1: and you ultimately end up at Warner, but even in
Speaker 1: a bigger position, bigger title, And what do you learn
Speaker 1: in your tenure at White at Warner? My tenure at
Speaker 1: Warner is that it was the first time I've ever
Speaker 1: come across or had an experience with private equity people.
Speaker 1: So I had no context that they bought and sold,
Speaker 1: and I hadn't simply no context that they bought and
Speaker 1: had a four year horizon. So had I known that,
Speaker 1: I probably wouldn't have left UM to take the job
Speaker 1: to take the job because it was too distracting. I
Speaker 1: don't want I didn't like change in that type of way.
Speaker 1: I like change in other types of way, but not
Speaker 1: in that type of way. You mean in terms of
Speaker 1: the ultimate sale point, Yeah, I don't. I don't like
Speaker 1: I don't like change, financial change. I like structural change.
Speaker 1: I like change, but not um um financial change. People.
Speaker 1: So when you're at Warner, to what degree in the
Speaker 1: back of your mind are you here? Are you feeling
Speaker 1: that pressure? Hey, I gotta make the numbers. We're gonna do,
Speaker 1: We're gonna sell I I um. I didn't pay attention
Speaker 1: to that. I was focused in other things. And the
Speaker 1: only time where it crested against me was when they
Speaker 1: decided to sell it, and I had to meet with
Speaker 1: the thirty odd bidders over and over and over and
Speaker 1: over again, and I got further and further away from
Speaker 1: the music and further away from the artist, and I
Speaker 1: felt like we were doing a stunning job. I mean two,
Speaker 1: you know it, Lectura and Atlantic were in really tough positions.
Speaker 1: Warner was living on its past, and so I felt
Speaker 1: merging um a lecture in Atlantic. Together we found our
Speaker 1: heartbeat and and then I was working on on the
Speaker 1: Warner Brothers situation, and you know, we we I think
Speaker 1: really started the three sixty business. That was a very
Speaker 1: important part of my strategy and I was very proud
Speaker 1: of it. So and you know, and then to get
Speaker 1: sit swiped into having to talk to financial people about
Speaker 1: you know, a transaction was a buzz kill. It was
Speaker 1: very difficult for me. We'll return to this conversation with
Speaker 1: Lear Cone, head of music for YouTube and Google. Right
Speaker 1: after this. This is Bob left Sett. Do you like
Speaker 1: hearing from the heavies. I love talking to them. And
Speaker 1: that's exactly what I'll be doing at my Music Media
Speaker 1: Summit in Santa Barbara at the end of April. Take
Speaker 1: your Wallflower roll to the next level by actually meeting
Speaker 1: the players, maneuvering, manipulating the chessboard. Go to Music Media
Speaker 1: Summit dot comfert tickets and more information and now more
Speaker 1: with Lee your Cone. So it ends and you start
Speaker 1: three hundred, Yes, and you have a big hit with
Speaker 1: Feddiwab Yes. So what you learn at three hundred? I
Speaker 1: learned at three hundred that the barrier of entry I
Speaker 1: had a hunch at Warner between subscription and advertising that
Speaker 1: there is going to be a huge sea change. The
Speaker 1: ability to build audience and to identify an audience UM
Speaker 1: without having to go through the expense of a physical
Speaker 1: product was a liberation for UM young people to start
Speaker 1: lay bules and to start getting into the game. And
Speaker 1: I had a hunch that they couldn't keep me out
Speaker 1: of the party, and so I cobbled together a little
Speaker 1: bit of money and I went to work, and lo
Speaker 1: and behold, I realized that the true remaining barrier entry
Speaker 1: is simply a little bit of capital, not a lot
Speaker 1: of it. And you could actually make a lot of hay.
Speaker 1: So if someone were to start today, how much capital
Speaker 1: do they need? It's all different. It all depends. I
Speaker 1: started with fifteen million, a little little sum of money.
Speaker 1: I heard that l a just raise sent you know,
Speaker 1: it was a different thing, I believe you know, we
Speaker 1: have a three hundred over thirty employees now, UM, but
Speaker 1: you're you're not involved with three hundred anymore. But I'm
Speaker 1: the largest shareholder, so you're still a shareholder. Yes, okay,
Speaker 1: So you have the success with fiftie rop. Can you
Speaker 1: tell us any more about that? What do you want
Speaker 1: to know? How do you find that HiT's HiT's beautiful
Speaker 1: he was, so did you find him? The record was
Speaker 1: already done. The record was already done. Um. He is
Speaker 1: a very interesting melodic rapper, UM and it was just
Speaker 1: his time and we signed him. So that's a music
Speaker 1: business bomb. Okay, So you know today where there's so
Speaker 1: much noise in the channel. Although the success of his
Speaker 1: records a couple of years back, what made he What
Speaker 1: did you do to make the record successful? He certainly
Speaker 1: had to hit record Without that you're dead in the water. Well,
Speaker 1: we engaged an audience. We UM went to our friends
Speaker 1: at Spotify, they supported us. When to our friends at
Speaker 1: Apple they supported us. What did that support look like
Speaker 1: to support whether it's UM real Estate and app or
Speaker 1: real Estate and Playlists, or or video UM at YouTube,
Speaker 1: UM the dsp s or the these platforms. UM were
Speaker 1: happy to see us, and they were happy to support
Speaker 1: an independent label and independent artist. And we also, you know,
Speaker 1: got the record on the radio. And so what can
Speaker 1: I tell you? It's not really it's not magical. It's
Speaker 1: a lot of hard work, it's a lot of talking
Speaker 1: to people, it's a lot of saying, like what you
Speaker 1: do every once in a while you go out on
Speaker 1: the limb and say this artist is really incredible, and
Speaker 1: you put your reputation on the line and you shoot
Speaker 1: the flare up and people, um pay attention, give it
Speaker 1: a shot, and when they give it a shot, it
Speaker 1: starts working. And and that's how well I guess one
Speaker 1: of the I agree with everything you're saying. But one
Speaker 1: of the fascinating things is there was a record two
Speaker 1: Christmases ago. The end of it was a hit everywhere
Speaker 1: in the world. Rag and Bone Man Human never made
Speaker 1: it in America, and I have to, I mean, my
Speaker 1: fault with the label let the record down. Do you
Speaker 1: have any ideas why I don't want to um um
Speaker 1: a Pine on something I'm not an expert at so
Speaker 1: I don't know whether he was focused on Australia at
Speaker 1: the time when they needed him to show up in places.
Speaker 1: You know, Um, when you have a worldwide hit. The
Speaker 1: interesting thing is you can't clone yourself and you need
Speaker 1: physical support of a record. So um, I couldn't. I
Speaker 1: couldn't the Pine on it. I I don't know. You know,
Speaker 1: Colombia is a really good label. Okay, So let's go
Speaker 1: back to three. Three D is still active at this point,
Speaker 1: very active Okay, how do you end up at YouTube?
Speaker 1: I ended up at YouTube because um Robert Kinson called
Speaker 1: me up and asked me if I could He's he's
Speaker 1: the big boss YouTube, and he asked if I could
Speaker 1: surface him some candidates to be the head of music
Speaker 1: and that it was time for that category to have
Speaker 1: someone that woke up every day specifically focused on building
Speaker 1: that business. And I surfaced him a couple of people
Speaker 1: over the you know, four months spanning. Then he calls
Speaker 1: me out of the blue and says, you know, he
Speaker 1: used this expression, you're my You're my Dick. I had
Speaker 1: no idea what he meant. He's I said what he says,
Speaker 1: Dick Cheney, and I still didn't don't to this day,
Speaker 1: I don't really know what he's referring to, but the
Speaker 1: he says, I love the candidates, but I prefer you
Speaker 1: doing the job. And I told him I have zero
Speaker 1: interest in the job, and I was having too much
Speaker 1: fun at three hundred. I think three hundred's going to
Speaker 1: be worth you know, half a billion dollars in five years.
Speaker 1: I really believe that this is the era. Just mark
Speaker 1: my words, this is going to be the biggest gold
Speaker 1: rush ever in media and it's going to be around
Speaker 1: recorded music. It can never be activated until the Impressario
Speaker 1: rooms again. And that's the critical gating factor. All everything
Speaker 1: is ready for them, and then Impressario is the unemployable.
Speaker 1: The Chris Blackwells of this generation, deomrtiganst those that um,
Speaker 1: you know, have a very specific point of view who
Speaker 1: know how to um engage with talent and they could
Speaker 1: build huge businesses. Once again, I think the environment is
Speaker 1: right for that. But going back to YouTube, I really,
Speaker 1: you know, I was having hits and I had no
Speaker 1: interest in doing the job. It's like, um, it wasn't
Speaker 1: the right time, and they kept being persistent and kept
Speaker 1: asking me. And then it was my partner Kevin Laws
Speaker 1: who said to me, you know, you always talk about
Speaker 1: your biggest fear about the music business is the high
Speaker 1: concentration of distribution. So if you actually were worked with
Speaker 1: Google and YouTube and help them work with the labels
Speaker 1: and help build another distribution channel that's healthy and another player, um,
Speaker 1: you will bring diversity to distribution and you could be
Speaker 1: a great gift back to an industry that you really
Speaker 1: love and that really resonated to me. So um, this
Speaker 1: is my gift back to the industry. If I could
Speaker 1: get Google and YouTube to help bring diversity to distribution,
Speaker 1: I think with four the contributors, the value of the
Speaker 1: business will creep back to the labels and to the artists.
Speaker 1: If it's only two, we're in really bad shape. It
Speaker 1: would be a very bad day for creation. So okay,
Speaker 1: so what is the vision for you to now that
Speaker 1: you have this job. The vision is to work very
Speaker 1: closely with the labels. So prior to me getting there,
Speaker 1: they were mostly in negotiating entity. They negotiated with the
Speaker 1: corporate centers and they would go away and come back
Speaker 1: and negotiate three years later. And there is no infrastructure
Speaker 1: of people facing off with the labels. The people that
Speaker 1: actually signed the acts, marketing and delivered the acts. They
Speaker 1: were only facing off with the corporate people. And you know,
Speaker 1: in the last twenty years, what do you do get
Speaker 1: rid of a corporate person or any in our person
Speaker 1: and our person corporate person, sorry, corporate. The corporate entities
Speaker 1: of all these companies shrunk massively. Um. The the true
Speaker 1: power is with the labels. Okay, everybody knows that that,
Speaker 1: um Um. The labels are the ones with the power.
Speaker 1: But not only the power, they're they're the ones that
Speaker 1: are in the trenches. And so what's happened in the
Speaker 1: past is you know when YouTube or Google were went
Speaker 1: to negotiate, you know, it was their Super Bowl to Oh,
Speaker 1: they're going to negotiate against the Google team, and I'm
Speaker 1: not really that interested in that. I actually want to
Speaker 1: go back to back with the companies, with the labels.
Speaker 1: So we built an infrastructure UM to understand what the
Speaker 1: labels priorities are and to help break acts. And to me,
Speaker 1: that's one of the most important things that we could
Speaker 1: do at YouTube and Google is to understand what's important
Speaker 1: to the labels and and to the artist and to
Speaker 1: the management community, and to help UM break some acts.
Speaker 1: That's one thing. The second thing is to convert our funnel.
Speaker 1: So really the YouTube Google people have been very raw.
Speaker 1: They don't understand why they're so vilified, and they felt
Speaker 1: like they built this incredible ecosystem on a global scale
Speaker 1: UM to have people engaged with media and pay with
Speaker 1: their eyeballs, and instead of getting a pad in the back,
Speaker 1: they got vilified because that was in their UM the
Speaker 1: industry's mind, siphoning opportunity from subscription, which was still nascent UM.
Speaker 1: But growing. And so one of the things that I
Speaker 1: told um them and it didn't take a lot of convincing.
Speaker 1: They were already believing that so um, that their funnel
Speaker 1: can convert into subscription. There are people in that funnel
Speaker 1: that have a job that are leaned into music that
Speaker 1: should pay a subscription um um. And and that's what
Speaker 1: will happen. So between promotion and helping the labels and
Speaker 1: the artist community um break artists, and then converting our funnels.
Speaker 1: So it's simply not just advertising that it's also so
Speaker 1: your goal is to make it a subscription business. No, No,
Speaker 1: my goal is to add a subscription business on top
Speaker 1: of an advertising business, um bob. This industries growth is
Speaker 1: going to come from both advertising and subscription. I know
Speaker 1: everybody's drunk on subscription and it's really a nice thing
Speaker 1: and it's great, but when you talk about the world,
Speaker 1: they're gonna be way more many more people paying with
Speaker 1: their eyeballs than paying is a monthly subscription. Okay, that's
Speaker 1: going to be fact um. And so we want to
Speaker 1: play in both. Um. Okay. Since you brought up industry criticism,
Speaker 1: what do you say to the industry that says the
Speaker 1: split is not good enough on YouTube. The split is great,
Speaker 1: the pie will grow. It's just it's the same argument
Speaker 1: with spot that they had with Spotify at the beginning.
Speaker 1: Everybody was screaming about Spotify. Wasn't the split as you
Speaker 1: could see um from their public filing that the split
Speaker 1: is actually enormous. It was the size of the pie.
Speaker 1: And so um, you know, we're talking about hundreds and
Speaker 1: hundreds of billions of dollars that is still stuck in
Speaker 1: traditional media. That will flow to the digital um players,
Speaker 1: and that and that money will create to the labels
Speaker 1: and as the as more and more countries come online, um,
Speaker 1: that probably will be getting bigger. The growth in advertising
Speaker 1: is out of control, Bob, out of control. Okay, so
Speaker 1: before they blink, I know everybody's all geeked over subscription,
Speaker 1: but don't forget how much money is going to be
Speaker 1: made in advertising. So when you say the money stuck
Speaker 1: in traditional media, can you amplify that a little bit
Speaker 1: like television and radio. So you're talking about advertising advertising money.
Speaker 1: The Levy broke in America, but in other countries it's
Speaker 1: still they're still stuck in traditional media, but it's starting
Speaker 1: to break there too. I mean, everybody has kids. They
Speaker 1: see how they they digest media. They don't digest media
Speaker 1: on an appointment, you know, on um you know, a
Speaker 1: regular way. It's on demand. So the other complaint that
Speaker 1: people have in the industry is about takedown notices, that
Speaker 1: they can't issue one takedown notice, but they're constantly playing
Speaker 1: whack a mole with videos on YouTube. Bob, I invite
Speaker 1: all of those people on my dime to go to
Speaker 1: Zurich to our campus um that is dedicated to content
Speaker 1: i D. Bob, when I tell you they've built a
Speaker 1: world class content i D system that is um um
Speaker 1: um failed proof that's the case. Please, who's ever listening,
Speaker 1: you yourself, come to Zurich and please meet all the
Speaker 1: engineers that have built a first class content I D system.
Speaker 1: So you think at this point in time, if I
Speaker 1: issue one takedown notice, that should take down all the
Speaker 1: pirate copies of the song. It's correct, Okay, it's correct.
Speaker 1: So you think it's the purpose the people who are saying,
Speaker 1: oh I have to constantly issue takedown notices. You don't
Speaker 1: think that's true. No, No, at least it's not as
Speaker 1: true as it used to be. So you don't believe
Speaker 1: the law needs to be changed that this is a
Speaker 1: business solution. Oh, absolutely, this is a business solution. Okay,
Speaker 1: let's go back to how you're going to help the labels.
Speaker 1: What have you done and what can you do to
Speaker 1: help a label promote a record? So, Bob, did you
Speaker 1: know that eight of all of watch time on YouTube
Speaker 1: is internal recommendation? Engine? I did not know that. Shocking,
Speaker 1: isn't that? When I first started, I thought it was
Speaker 1: absolutely the reverse was searched, and then maybe some other
Speaker 1: remnant was um promoted. But no, of all of watch time,
Speaker 1: billions of hours of watch time is internal recommendation. You
Speaker 1: get lost in YouTube. I wouldn't say I get lost.
Speaker 1: I'm on YouTube constantly, but but you don't. You don't go,
Speaker 1: you don't um um dial something up. And then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, the next thing they first of all,
Speaker 1: I'm sophisticate enough to know I switched off auto play,
Speaker 1: and I got much more email and recommendations of people.
Speaker 1: So I'm on YouTube many times a day. I'm not
Speaker 1: the average person. Well, if you were the average person,
Speaker 1: you would realize that it would start to get to
Speaker 1: know you and start servicing serving you um entertainment that
Speaker 1: you're most likely going to appreciate. I certainly get some
Speaker 1: of that on the right hand side. So yeah, so
Speaker 1: I'm so if I could surface to the um UM
Speaker 1: the priorities of the labels as an input to the algorithm, UM,
Speaker 1: I could probably do a really good service. Is that
Speaker 1: active today? That's sacred? Okay, So you you go to
Speaker 1: a label, they have a priority, you believe the priority
Speaker 1: is valid, and you will get into the YouTube system
Speaker 1: to make sure it's put in front of X number
Speaker 1: of eyeballs. That's sacred. Now it's in other streaming services.
Speaker 1: They look at issues of save, they look at how
Speaker 1: how long. All of that is important. And so you
Speaker 1: look at all that data. All of that is important. Yes,
Speaker 1: all of that well, okay, so the biggest YouTube hit
Speaker 1: of the last year, one of the biggest is the Desposito.
Speaker 1: Was that purely organic? Or did YouTube help know you?
Speaker 1: You want to hear something really interesting? I try to
Speaker 1: reverse engineer that. And the beginning of that party was
Speaker 1: that the manager bought a hundred thousand dollars worth of
Speaker 1: true view ads. Explain to my audience what those are.
Speaker 1: A true view add is a new format of advertising there.
Speaker 1: You know, Google is constantly iterating um at around advertising,
Speaker 1: and the um UM that actually got the right eyeballs engaged,
Speaker 1: and the right eyeballs started um affecting the algorithm, and
Speaker 1: then it spread like wildfire. Okay, a little slower. He
Speaker 1: bought the ads, and the ads translated into view and
Speaker 1: then obviously the ads were highly targeted, and once he
Speaker 1: got people engaged, it started building a wildfire. And that's
Speaker 1: what happened. Okay, So if someone had a do you
Speaker 1: think that's replicable at this point in time? UM? I
Speaker 1: don't you know. Desposito was a fabulous um record and
Speaker 1: video record and video, But I do believe that the
Speaker 1: digital world allows you to be way more targeted in
Speaker 1: your audience. UM. We are learning a lot. Like, for example,
Speaker 1: we are now thinking about related artists and how we
Speaker 1: could help the labels surface their content UM by them
Speaker 1: choosing what the related artists would be, that audience would
Speaker 1: be and putting that that content after those artists. Is
Speaker 1: that a personal choice or algorithmic? Um, it's both. It's
Speaker 1: both now, it's inputs. If we go back a couple
Speaker 1: of years, it was not uncommon for a hit track
Speaker 1: on YouTube to have many more views than streams on
Speaker 1: Spotify frequently, that's the reverse. Now, Okay, so what is
Speaker 1: the future of video? I a YouTube clip and how
Speaker 1: importan and there's that breaking an act. I think, um,
Speaker 1: context is I think we're in an audio visual world. Actually,
Speaker 1: Chuck d is the one who says this perfectly. Uh
Speaker 1: who I encourage you. He's got an incredible story. He
Speaker 1: would be a great person to do a podcast with.
Speaker 1: But we used to be in an audio only world,
Speaker 1: and I think we're in an audio visual world. So
Speaker 1: I think video brings context, and I think we're searching
Speaker 1: for context. You know, the Levy broke, right there used
Speaker 1: to be very tightly curated ways that you were touched
Speaker 1: by music, and now, um, the Levy broke, and now
Speaker 1: there's many, many, many many bands. So now we need
Speaker 1: a certain amount of curation and some more context. I
Speaker 1: couldn't agree more. It's a charity of choice. And yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think that the you know, three point four
Speaker 1: point oh version of the Internet, we would start seeing
Speaker 1: more curation and video is important to help provide context
Speaker 1: as well. Okay, now we live in an era where
Speaker 1: tracks are less dominant in the culture than they ever
Speaker 1: were before. It's really spread out. You know, you go
Speaker 1: back to when we grew up. The hit track literally
Speaker 1: everybody in society now where if we talk about the
Speaker 1: number one track, a fewer people know that. But I'm
Speaker 1: leading up to something different. Why is hip hop the
Speaker 1: most dominant sound today? You know, I've been watching you
Speaker 1: raised the banner of hip hop. I don't think it
Speaker 1: was always you weren't a flag bearer of of hip hop.
Speaker 1: I've always thought that hip hop was big for the
Speaker 1: last you know, but it's fantic twenty years. It was
Speaker 1: gigantic then too. I mean, I mean, you know, I
Speaker 1: don't actually know. I guess maybe I live in my
Speaker 1: own little bubble. I I remember Eminem selling ten million
Speaker 1: plus albums. I mean that was and Chop Liver. I've
Speaker 1: been feeling hip hop's dominance for a long time. It's
Speaker 1: scary too, because you know, it's now multigenerational it's used
Speaker 1: to be. I was always worried about the multi generational aspect.
Speaker 1: Does my son really want to share his records with me?
Speaker 1: Where is the battle cry? That isn't the debate between
Speaker 1: father and son about that is not music. That's just
Speaker 1: a bunch of crap. We're bumping the same music right now.
Speaker 1: My son's twenty three. Okay, what does he do? He's
Speaker 1: in an R three. He's a really remarkable music person. Okay,
Speaker 1: But getting back to this hip hop thing. I don't
Speaker 1: want to say that hip hop wasn't big. But if
Speaker 1: you go on Spotify, which I believe is the most
Speaker 1: accurate chart today because of consumption, out of the Spotify
Speaker 1: Top fifty in the United States, thirty five or forty
Speaker 1: tracks or hip hop tracks, I don't really pay attention
Speaker 1: to things like that bomb. I mean, if you look,
Speaker 1: I don't. Honestly, I don't pay attention to it. I
Speaker 1: remember when I was invited to the first World Congress
Speaker 1: of PolyGram or something like that, and I was flying
Speaker 1: from London to Seville and I was next to the
Speaker 1: head lawyer of PolyGram and he said, so, where is
Speaker 1: hip hop going? I said, I don't know. He says, what,
Speaker 1: what do we pay you millions millions of dollars for?
Speaker 1: And I said, I hope you don't pay me millions
Speaker 1: of dollars. I've never weather veined music. I never made
Speaker 1: any declarations you that's for you to do. I hope
Speaker 1: that I've created an environment that some kid aspires to
Speaker 1: be on my label, that will be the person that
Speaker 1: will ultimately change your direction as safe place for an
Speaker 1: artist to change the world. And so when you talk
Speaker 1: about hip hop dominance and that you're just making, you're
Speaker 1: just it's you're calling its end right now, you're you know,
Speaker 1: and after something is big, something gets small. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I just I don't pay attention to talk about some
Speaker 1: of these issues. I believe rock is dead. Now, you're
Speaker 1: not predicting the future. You want to weigh in on
Speaker 1: that until it isn't, Bob, until it isn't about jazz?
Speaker 1: Is jazz dead? No? Hell no, are you kidding me?
Speaker 1: Jazz is dead. No people say jazz is dead, Bob, Bob.
Speaker 1: Only only people that are trying to weather vane and
Speaker 1: put numbers two things, um that need to declare something
Speaker 1: like I said, that's your gig. I don't think I've
Speaker 1: never been a part of that. I go to jazz
Speaker 1: clubs right now. Okay, So how much do you play music? Now?
Speaker 1: Me play music a lot, and you play old stuff,
Speaker 1: new stuff, all stuff new stuff. And if you you know,
Speaker 1: the old Desert Island question had to take two or
Speaker 1: three records or albums to the Desert Island. What were
Speaker 1: the You have to be a Zeppelin record for you
Speaker 1: have to why I thought it would be a hip
Speaker 1: hop record? I just honest, Well, you said I get
Speaker 1: two or three? Man, of course Zeppelin, which was on Atlantic.
Speaker 1: Where do you have a specific Zeppelin record you want
Speaker 1: to weigh in on too? Okay, led Zeppelin too, Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 1: Living Loving, Thank you a whole lot of Okay, two
Speaker 1: more records. I would say, they have to be a
Speaker 1: public enemy record for me. Okay, can Chuck? Do you
Speaker 1: have another hit? For sure? For sure? But the definition
Speaker 1: of a hit is something that I've always had trouble with.
Speaker 1: What is a hit? It allows you to go on
Speaker 1: tour and engage ring the bell and engage your audience,
Speaker 1: and it allows you to have enough um fanfare for
Speaker 1: people to go and put their hard earned money to
Speaker 1: see you live and to bring a community together. I
Speaker 1: don't know what the definition of a hit is these days. Well,
Speaker 1: I would say there's two types of hit. What is
Speaker 1: a hit The track is fantastic, whether it's spreads or not.
Speaker 1: Then there's the commercial hit where it has some level
Speaker 1: of ubiquity. Yeah, So that's what I what I mean
Speaker 1: you meant you meant the ladder, yes, and the other
Speaker 1: the ladder most likely not because Chuck has never woke
Speaker 1: He never woke up trying to do that. You have
Speaker 1: to wake up sometimes trying to do that right to
Speaker 1: get ubiquity. Um, Chuck never woke up. Do you How
Speaker 1: big a factor you believe agism is in hip hop?
Speaker 1: Of course ages has something to do with it, but
Speaker 1: it's more about a little bit of a secret. The
Speaker 1: moment from obscurity to celebrity has the highest velocity. That's
Speaker 1: where the most hey can get made. At a certain moment,
Speaker 1: after a certain period of time, there's a certain expectation.
Speaker 1: You don't get any dap from your friends, turning them
Speaker 1: onto another jay Z Right. So the velocity is much
Speaker 1: big earlier on a career, which has nothing to do
Speaker 1: with age. It's the little secret that becomes a much
Speaker 1: bigger secret. Period of time of velocity I think is
Speaker 1: And since we're playing this game, what's the third album?
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to get back to you, Bob. That's
Speaker 1: fine with me. It's a very dear album. Okay, So
Speaker 1: at this point in time, what about you, Bump, Well,
Speaker 1: I always say if I was in a desert island,
Speaker 1: I would bring and this is kind of a humorous thing.
Speaker 1: I would say a C d C Back in Black
Speaker 1: and Joni Mitchell Blue and one is a very noisy record,
Speaker 1: and one is a very quiet record, illustrating that my
Speaker 1: taste are somewhat broad. Now it's funny because taste were broad,
Speaker 1: then they narrowed, and then in the Internet era they
Speaker 1: broadened again. Beautiful, okay, which I think is great. I
Speaker 1: mean especially I think one of the most fascinating things
Speaker 1: is the amount of hip hop there is in country music.
Speaker 1: Even people brought up in you know, rural areas, are
Speaker 1: are you know, as opposed to urban areas. Well. Luke
Speaker 1: Lewis and I started a company called Lost high Way.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you're fantastic. So the reason why
Speaker 1: we founded that record um company was that we believed
Speaker 1: that the society of country was so rigid. But these kids,
Speaker 1: even though they respected the great songwriting and culture of country,
Speaker 1: they also loved Chris Cobain and Public Enemy, and we
Speaker 1: were interested in those artists. We didn't get all the
Speaker 1: way to our mission, but we had, you know, Ryan
Speaker 1: Adams and Lucinda and Brother where Art Dow and stuff
Speaker 1: like that. But we were going to get to the
Speaker 1: hip hop country flavored was Jamie Johnson on the Lost Hollyby. Okay,
Speaker 1: So in the time you have left on the planet,
Speaker 1: what would you like to achieve? Oh? Wow, that's a
Speaker 1: beautiful question. UM. I would love to continue, you know,
Speaker 1: parenting and being a great father to my children and
Speaker 1: great husband to my wife. Um uh, contributor to my community. UM.
Speaker 1: I feel in the middle of my mission of bring
Speaker 1: diversity to distribution, and and helping the labels and and
Speaker 1: and Google and YouTube collaborate and work together. UM signed
Speaker 1: some more dope bass acts that changed the world, and
Speaker 1: and UM i'd like to keep contributing UM in a
Speaker 1: very positive way. I don't know. I think we've really
Speaker 1: covered it here. We've got your history to your president.
Speaker 1: Is there anything that we didn't discuss that you feel
Speaker 1: a need to go to a shipload of things we
Speaker 1: didn't discuss, But UM, I appreciate your time. You know,
Speaker 1: this has been wonderful. You've been very open. I certainly
Speaker 1: learned things about you that I don't know, and I
Speaker 1: think we've humanized you for people who just know you.
Speaker 1: There's maybe a art board, they make fun of you
Speaker 1: and Hits magazine. You're working at YouTube. This has been
Speaker 1: absolutely wonderful. Thank you. You're so welcome. You know, I
Speaker 1: wake up every morning and I know who I am.
Speaker 1: You know, and the people who actually know me know
Speaker 1: who I am. And I never really concentrated or really
Speaker 1: cared too much about what other people thought about me,
Speaker 1: especially those that don't know who I am so well.
Speaker 1: I know from previous discussions when there have been people
Speaker 1: shooting arrows at you, you you managed to compartmentalize that,
Speaker 1: not let that bother you. It's always stuck with me
Speaker 1: because so many people are saying, oh, saying but not you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you stayed with the mission. No I want to You know,
Speaker 1: I remember when I was in elementary school and because
Speaker 1: of my funky name and my accent. Where does the
Speaker 1: accent come from? It's a it's a guttural m Hebrew
Speaker 1: accent mixed with speech therapy. They try to get rid
Speaker 1: of my art. You know, I literally walked around this
Speaker 1: earth without an are four year and a half Webbitt
Speaker 1: won in elementary school. They thought that some you know,
Speaker 1: well funded during the Reagan era or something like that.
Speaker 1: Um every Wednesday, they came in and got me for
Speaker 1: speech therapy, and they thought they could fix my Hebrew
Speaker 1: are I kept telling them it's a Hebrew accent. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, it's not only lived in Israel for three years.
Speaker 1: But if you if you understand Hebrew, it's a gut
Speaker 1: or r and that's the hardest thing to change. So anyhow,
Speaker 1: I remember um wanting to play baseball after school, and
Speaker 1: because of my name and because of my accent, they
Speaker 1: always picked me last. And I never got mad, but
Speaker 1: I chased down every fucking ball. Um that I just
Speaker 1: like converting people based on my work, not by you know,
Speaker 1: all that stuff. So one of the many lessons you've
Speaker 1: gotten from New York calling today. Once again, thanks for
Speaker 1: being on the Bob left Sets podcast. Good luck, Bob,
Speaker 1: thank you. That wraps up this week's episode of the
Speaker 1: Bob left Sets podcast, recorded at the tune In studios
Speaker 1: here in Venice, California. I hope you like listening to
Speaker 1: this conversation with le Or. I thought it was phenomenal.
Speaker 1: I'd love to get your feedback and know if the
Speaker 1: same is true for you. Email me at Bob at
Speaker 1: left sets dot com. Until next time, I'm Bob left sets,