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Speaker 1: a piece of cheese into your mouth, you're probably not

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Speaker 1: thinking about the environmental impact. But the people in the

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Speaker 2: And friends and families walking riding on passing the roads

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Speaker 2: every day. Remember they're real people with loved ones who

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Speaker 2: need them to.

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Speaker 1: Get home safely.

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Speaker 2: Protect our cyclists and pedestrians because they're people too, Go safely.

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Speaker 2: California from the California Office of Traffic Safety and Caltrans.

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Speaker 3: Hey, Daniel, when you think of physics, what images come

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Speaker 3: to mind for you?

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Speaker 1: I think of the cosmos, I think of planets. I

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Speaker 1: think of the fire inside the sun. I think of

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Speaker 1: crazy people with weird hair.

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Speaker 3: When you look in the mirror when you think of physics,

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Speaker 3: what's the difference? Well, what about a dance party.

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't say that's in the top one thousand associations

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Speaker 1: I have, maybe not even in the top five thousand.

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Speaker 3: Well, it turns out that physics and dance actually have

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Speaker 3: a lot in common. They have a lot of fun connections.

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Speaker 1: Is that right?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they can help us understand the topic of our

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Speaker 3: podc Est today.

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Speaker 1: That's right. Thinking about the way people dance and the

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Speaker 1: way they shake their booty can actually help you understand

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Speaker 1: the physics the crazy topic of today's podcast. So get

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Speaker 1: out there, shake your booty and get ready to download

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Speaker 1: some physics into your brain.

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Speaker 3: Get into the groove. It's time for physics. Hi am Jorge,

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Speaker 3: and I'm Daniel, Welcome to our podcast Dancing with Physicists.

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Speaker 1: How far can you get across the universe by just dancing?

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Speaker 3: No, we're just kidding. You're not the victim of clickbait.

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Speaker 3: This is the podcast Daniel and Jorge Explain the Universe.

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Speaker 1: In which we take something weird, something fascinating in the

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Speaker 1: universe and try to explain it to you, sometimes using dance.

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Speaker 3: Today on the podcast, we're going to talk about a

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Speaker 3: physics phenomenon that is everywhere. It's everywhere, and it's helping

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Speaker 3: make some of the greatest scientific experiments in the world.

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Speaker 1: That's right, it's really important, it's fascinating, it's weird, it's quantum,

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Speaker 1: and yet it's not really very well understood. And most important,

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Speaker 1: it's super that's right. And it conducts what it's conductive.

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Speaker 1: There you go, that's right.

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Speaker 3: The topic of today's podcast is super conductors. What are they?

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Speaker 3: Who are they? Who are they? Super?

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Speaker 1: No? Super Conductivity is a fascinating question, something behind a

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Speaker 1: lot of really interesting research in the last few decades,

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Speaker 1: and something we thought was worth getting into because there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of puzzles there.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was just thinking the first time I heard

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Speaker 3: about superconductors was in the eighties, right, and that's when

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Speaker 3: it sort of became this big buzz about it.

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Speaker 1: That's right. They had a lot of big advances in

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Speaker 1: the eighties. How old were you in the eighties.

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Speaker 3: Or I was old enough apparently to read about size news.

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Speaker 3: But you would always see a tie to this footage

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Speaker 3: of this little magnet floating on top of something.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's like a classic application of super conductivity.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so I think forever that's what people think of.

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Speaker 3: A lot of people think of when they think of superconductors,

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Speaker 3: like that one image.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's that. There's also the super conducting super collider

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Speaker 1: that they were going to build in Texas in the

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Speaker 1: nineties that was going to cost a huge amount of

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Speaker 1: money and that they canceled halfway through, and so a

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Speaker 1: lot of people connect those two phrases super conducting and

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Speaker 1: super colliding.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I didn't hear about that one in the eighties.

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Speaker 3: So it sort of seems like it's been out there

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Speaker 3: in the popular culture for a while. But we were

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Speaker 3: wondering how much people knew about.

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Speaker 1: It, and you know, it's part of the popular culture,

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Speaker 1: and that people maybe have heard about it or whatever. Strangely,

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Speaker 1: it hasn't really entered like, you know, comic books or

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Speaker 1: science fiction that much. You don't see like super conducting

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Speaker 1: technology all over the place in science fiction.

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Speaker 3: You mean, you haven't seen that comic book called The Superconductor.

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Speaker 1: Adventures of Crime Fighting super Conductors.

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Speaker 3: That's right. During the day, he's just a mild mannered,

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Speaker 3: regular bus conductor, but at night.

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Speaker 1: He's a super duper conductor. No, I haven't seen that,

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Speaker 1: and you don't see it, you know, playing a prominent

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Speaker 1: role in science fiction movies, like particle physics is everywhere

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Speaker 1: in science fiction movies. The Higgs boson explains everything and

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Speaker 1: causes problems, et cetera. But you don't see superconductivity used

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Speaker 1: and abused much in popular culture. Do you have I

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Speaker 1: missed it?

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Speaker 3: Mm, yeah, I don't know. I guess it's not flashy, right,

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Speaker 3: it's not. It's not a word that sounds as cool

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Speaker 3: as quantum or leasers.

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Speaker 1: Or Higgs boson. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, so I went around

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Speaker 1: campus and I asked people, do you know it's touper

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Speaker 1: conductivity is? Can you explain it? Do you understand it?

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Speaker 3: Here's what people had to say, what.

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Speaker 1: About super conductivity? Have you heard of that, Yes, can

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Speaker 1: you explain that now? Best?

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Speaker 4: Guess maybe it has two conductors and for some stuff.

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Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, I've also heard of it, but I also

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Speaker 1: have no idea either.

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Speaker 5: Okay, it's a phenomena that happens at very low temperatures

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Speaker 5: because electrons have very low resistance to movement due to

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Speaker 5: the very slow vibrations of the matrix of a metal

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Speaker 5: of the nucleus of the atoms, so the electrons have

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Speaker 5: a lot more space to move through.

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Speaker 1: Something along those lines. Was that the one with the

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Speaker 1: magnets and they could float. That's about all I know

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Speaker 1: about that one.

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Speaker 3: Right, No, I guess. So the conductivity with like wires

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Speaker 3: for example, or like metal, so super conductive and then

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Speaker 3: it's a good conductor doesn't burn out.

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Speaker 6: Cool.

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Speaker 2: I would assume that it has something to do with

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Speaker 2: objects that are conductive.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So I like the person who said that it

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Speaker 3: has something to do with conductors and force and stuff.

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Speaker 1: That's right. And there's somebody out there who clearly is

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Speaker 1: reading the same magazine you were, because they're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it has to do with magnets that can float.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, do you know what you Clive? What I'm

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Speaker 3: talking about. I feel like they used the same clip

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Speaker 3: for years and years and years and years and years.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I totally know what you mean. A little black

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Speaker 1: magnet floating over a very cool surface with like liquid

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Speaker 1: hydrogen sublimating off of it. It's pretty cool looking.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and then somebody comes and pokes the magnet and

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Speaker 3: it just keeps floating there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly exactly. So people had some sense, you know,

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Speaker 1: they knew what it was. Nobody was like, I've never

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Speaker 1: heard that word before, what are you talking about? Right?

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Speaker 1: But nobody could explain it to me. Like some people

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Speaker 1: knew you had to be cold to be a superconductor,

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Speaker 1: but nobody could give me a solid explanation for what

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Speaker 1: it was and how it worked. Right.

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Speaker 3: I guess this one has something understandable, which is a conductor,

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Speaker 3: and you know, I guess people in high school figure

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Speaker 3: out that or learn that it's something that conducts electricity,

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Speaker 3: and so a superconductor must just be something that is

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Speaker 3: super added.

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Speaker 1: That's right, it's awesome at conducting.

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Speaker 3: That should be the next discovery.

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Speaker 1: Awesome conductors, that's right, superconductors last year, this year, awesome

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Speaker 1: conductors next year, uber conductors. But there is really something

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Speaker 1: special by superconductors, which is not just that they can

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Speaker 1: conduct a lot, but that they conduct with no resistance

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Speaker 1: at all. Right, you can't have anything better than a superconductor,

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Speaker 1: so it is pretty amazing.

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Speaker 3: And they are really important for things like particle physics, right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they have a lot of really cool applications.

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Speaker 3: So it's like a physics phenomenon that has really great

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Speaker 3: applications for important experiments like the Large Hadron collider.

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Speaker 1: That's right, And it's also a really fun physics puzzle.

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Speaker 1: You know. The kind of physics that I I do

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Speaker 1: personally is like take everything apart and understand the smallest bits.

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Speaker 1: That's totally worthwhile. Obviously it leads to deep insights. But

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Speaker 1: there's a whole different, other kind of way of doing

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Speaker 1: physics that's like can we put things together in a

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Speaker 1: weird way that makes weird materials? You know, we have

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Speaker 1: lots of materials around us on Earth that we're familiar with,

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Speaker 1: but you can think, like can we rearrange those bits

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Speaker 1: to make new kinds of stuff. So there's a whole

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Speaker 1: group of people out there in physics departments who's basically

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Speaker 1: all their job is is to make new kinds of goo, Right, like,

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Speaker 1: let's mix this together and add a little bit of

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Speaker 1: that and a little bit of this, and maybe if

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Speaker 1: we zap it with a laser, we'll get this weird

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Speaker 1: crystal with strange behaviors that like nothing anybody's ever seen before.

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Speaker 3: Are you talking about solid state physics?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? These days I think they call it condensed matter

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Speaker 1: physics condense man, But essentially, yeah, it's like, can we

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Speaker 1: build new kinds of stuff? It's like the properties of

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Speaker 1: bulk materials, you know, not individual particles, but like what

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Speaker 1: happens when you put all these different kinds of particles

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Speaker 1: together in a certain lattice, in a certain arrangement. Do

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Speaker 1: they behave in strange ways? And what can we learn

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Speaker 1: about you know, what solids can and cannot do.

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Speaker 3: Right, because they do different things, right, Like, you can

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Speaker 3: make things behave in a totally different and new way

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Speaker 3: just by the way you arrange them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, the periodic table is the first

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Speaker 1: lesson of that. Everything in the periodic table is made

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Speaker 1: out of the same bits, right, protons and neutrons and electrons,

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Speaker 1: but they're pretty different, right. Uranium is pretty different stuff

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Speaker 1: than lithium, for example, And so you can get an

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Speaker 1: incredible variety of behaviors just by rearranging the same stuff,

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Speaker 1: and so solid state physics, that whole field is just

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Speaker 1: taking that to an extreme. It's like, how can we

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Speaker 1: combine these elements and zap them and chill them and

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Speaker 1: heat them and do all sorts of crazy stuff. It's

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Speaker 1: basically like cooking, right, what kind of cakes can you

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Speaker 1: make with the same.

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Speaker 3: Ingredients right that tastes totally different.

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Speaker 1: Exactly and can float above your countertop? Right? Superconnecting cakes,

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Speaker 1: that's the next breakthrough.

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Speaker 3: This is just rename that department stuff physics Stuff, physics

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Speaker 3: of stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, the physics of stuff. Yeah, hey, stuff is

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Speaker 1: pretty interesting. Rights, the whole podcast called Stuff. You should

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Speaker 1: know how stuff works and.

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Speaker 3: We should join that podcast network.

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Speaker 1: I think there's stuff pretty full.

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Speaker 3: Cool. So let's get into it all right, and let's

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Speaker 3: break it down. So what's a superconductor. Let's start with

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Speaker 3: just the conductor part, digging a little bit into what

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Speaker 3: it means to be a conductor.

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Speaker 1: Right, So a conductor is something where electricity can move

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Speaker 1: through it, right, and you have to understand the electricity

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Speaker 1: moving through it. It's not necessarily the same as like

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Speaker 1: electrons flowing through it. You put the electricity on one

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Speaker 1: side of a wire and you get electricity on the

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Speaker 1: other side of the wire. It's tempting to think about

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Speaker 1: it like a hose, Like you put water on one

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Speaker 1: side and water comes out the other side.

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Speaker 3: Like a tube.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, like a tube. And you know what happens is

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Speaker 1: you put electrons in on one side, and the electrons

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Speaker 1: all sort of over like it's like a tube full

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Speaker 1: of water. You put a little bit of water in

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Speaker 1: the front, and a little bit of a different piece

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Speaker 1: of water that was already in there pushes out the side.

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Speaker 4: Oh.

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Speaker 3: It's kind of like if you have a two and

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Speaker 3: you blow in it. The air that comes out the

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Speaker 3: other end is not necessarily the air that came out

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Speaker 3: of your mouth. It's like it causes some sort of

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Speaker 3: It pushes all the air through, and the ones that

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Speaker 3: come out are the ones that were waiting closest to

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Speaker 3: the end exactly.

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Speaker 1: And that's only possible if the electrons can move, right,

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Speaker 1: And so a conductor is just any material where you

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Speaker 1: have electrons that can jump from atom to atom. Right,

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Speaker 1: think about a material and a microscopic scale. It's really

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Speaker 1: a bunch of atoms, right, And if it's simple or regular,

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Speaker 1: then it's like a lattice like a grid. It's like

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Speaker 1: regularly distributed atoms, and the electrons can jump from one

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Speaker 1: to the other. So if you blow on one side,

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Speaker 1: you like push in about some electrons on one side,

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Speaker 1: then all the electrons sort of hop over one slot

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Speaker 1: and you get some out the other side.

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Speaker 3: Oh, it's kind of like a like playing hot potato.

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Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. And the difference between something that can conduct

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Speaker 1: electricity a conductor, and something that can't an insulator, is

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Speaker 1: that conductors have enough electrons that can jump between atoms,

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Speaker 1: whereas insulators have all their electrons held really tight by

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Speaker 1: each of those atoms in the grid, so that there's

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Speaker 1: no way for the electrons to jump from one to

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Speaker 1: the other. So conductors have these free electrons that are

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Speaker 1: sort of just like floating around happily.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So something that is not a conductor doesn't have

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Speaker 3: kind of a spare electrons or they don't let electrons

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Speaker 3: fly around freely.

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Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. And so and you just you know, you

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Speaker 1: put electrons on one side and they just go nowhere, right,

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Speaker 1: So you can't get electrons through the.

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Speaker 3: Material, Okay, So why not? So I introduce an electron

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Speaker 3: in an insulator and something that doesn't conduct, what's going

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Speaker 3: to happen to the electron?

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Speaker 1: It won't go through, yeah, just it won't cause a current. Right,

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Speaker 1: You can't get a current through there. You can't get

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Speaker 1: all the electrons to jump over one atom for example.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so it's kind of like a conductor has a

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Speaker 3: bunch of atoms and everyone kind of has everyone's pretty

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Speaker 3: loose with their electrons.

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Speaker 1: That's right.

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Speaker 3: Heay, here's one. Oh, I'll take one, or I'll give

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Speaker 3: you another one. Oh. Electrons can just kind of flow

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Speaker 3: through from atom to atom.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's best to think of them really as

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Speaker 1: a lattice, because these atoms individually act a little different

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Speaker 1: than they do when they're together in a material, And

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Speaker 1: when they're together in a material, the electrons slosh easily

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Speaker 1: back and forth between them. For a conductor, for an insulator,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't happen. And then of course there's lots of

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Speaker 1: different kinds of conductors. There's things that are good conductors

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Speaker 1: and things that are bad conductors.

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Speaker 3: And by a lattice, you mean like like a grid

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Speaker 3: or like a like a rack, like the electrons are

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Speaker 3: arranged kind of like in rows and in columns.

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Speaker 1: Right, yeah, exactly. If you zoom in on a crystal,

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Speaker 1: for example, or a piece of metal, anything that has

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Speaker 1: a regular arrangement of the atoms, you'll see that they're

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Speaker 1: organized in this pattern. Right, they're built out of these

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Speaker 1: basic units, and that they're pretty regular. You know, there's

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Speaker 1: like lines of atoms. It's not just like a big

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Speaker 1: heaping mess. These solids, these metals, these things that are

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Speaker 1: conductors are pretty well organized, and so you'll see them

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Speaker 1: in rows. And that's what we mean by the lattice. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: just like a grid of atoms.

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Speaker 3: And so you're saying electrons can flow through or jump

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Speaker 3: freely between atoms, but not perfectly.

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Speaker 1: Right, that's right. And here's where the temperature comes in.

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Speaker 1: So the colder the material is. Think about what temperature

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Speaker 1: really is. What is temperature? It's how much the atoms

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Speaker 1: inside something are wiggling. The atoms inside liquid are wiggling

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Speaker 1: more than the atoms inside of solid, right, which is

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Speaker 1: why it's liquid, and the atoms inside of gas are

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Speaker 1: totally free and bouncing around everywhere. But even inside a solid,

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Speaker 1: even if it's solid, you have different temperatures. Right. You

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Speaker 1: can have a piece of metal that's hot or piece

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Speaker 1: of metal that's cold. What's happening there is that the

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Speaker 1: atoms are moving less, right, They're wiggling less, and as

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Speaker 1: it gets colder and colder, they wiggle less and less

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Speaker 1: and less. And this is important for the electron because

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Speaker 1: remember it's trying to jump from atom to atom. That's

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Speaker 1: easier when the atom are not wiggling around, when they're

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Speaker 1: like regularly spaced rows.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, like when they're frozen in place.

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Speaker 1: Yes, exactly. Here's where the dance analogy comes in. Right.

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Speaker 1: Imagine trying to walk through a crowd and everybody's like jumping.

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Speaker 1: It's like a mosh pit, right, and they're going crazy

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Speaker 1: into pub concert or something. It's really hard to get

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Speaker 1: across a crowded room if everybody's jostling and bouncing and

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Speaker 1: moving around a lot, Right, It's much easier if they're calm,

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Speaker 1: if they're like, you know, slow dancing or something.

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Speaker 3: Oh, it's kind of like, yeah, you would. If it's

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Speaker 3: a mosh pit and everyone's moving and dancing, you would

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Speaker 3: just kind of lose a lot of energy just kind

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Speaker 3: of bumping against people and just trying to make it through.

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Speaker 1: Exactly. You would lose a lot of energy. That's exactly right.

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Speaker 1: It's the resistance, right. So electrical resistance is electrons losing

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Speaker 1: energy as they bump into the atoms that are wiggling around.

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Speaker 3: Because they're moving like. It's related to the kinetic motion

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Speaker 3: of the atoms.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, it's related to the kinetic motion of the atoms.

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Speaker 1: It makes it harder for the electrons to get through,

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Speaker 1: and as they get through, they lose some energy. Right.

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00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:06,080
Speaker 3: Okay, so that's resistance, right, that's vehicles, the resistance of

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Speaker 3: a wire or a conductor. That's what it is. It's

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Speaker 3: like electrons going through but sort of bumping too much

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Speaker 3: into the.

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Speaker 1: Atoms, that's right. And so things that are conductors have

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Speaker 1: a low resistance, and you want to use things that

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Speaker 1: have low resistance so that most of the energy you're

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Speaker 1: sending along a wire, for example, gets there. You know,

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Speaker 1: if you use something with low resistance, like copper or gold,

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Speaker 1: then most of the energy you put into a wire

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Speaker 1: will get to the other side. If you use something

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Speaker 1: with really bad resistance, with a lot of resistance, then

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Speaker 1: it'll heat up the wire. That energy from the electrons

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Speaker 1: will create resistance, which turns into heat and that's not good.

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Speaker 3: But sometimes you sort of want resistance, right, Like in circuits,

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Speaker 3: some resistors are sometimes good.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes you want resistance so you can put it

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Speaker 1: in on purpose. For example, a light bulb, that's a resistor. Right.

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00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,080
Speaker 1: What it does is it steals the energy from the

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Speaker 1: electrons and it heats of the material, which then glows

360
00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:57,720
Speaker 1: and gives you light. Awesome, if that's what you wanted, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: But you don't really want them wires in your house glowing.

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00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,200
Speaker 1: You want them to transmit that energy to your iPhone

363
00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,639
Speaker 1: or whatever it is you're ascending. And those power lines

364
00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:09,800
Speaker 1: along the road, right, we don't want those heating up

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00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:12,359
Speaker 1: and melting. We want those to transmit the energy from

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Speaker 1: the power station to your house without losing much energy.

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Speaker 3: Unless your house is a dance floor, that would be

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Speaker 3: pretty cool.

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Speaker 1: Well, how are you going to power those speakers without

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Speaker 1: the electron?

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Speaker 6: Right?

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Speaker 3: Well, the speakers would glow too.

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Speaker 1: Sounds like an awesome party. Send me an invite.

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Speaker 3: And I think that brings us to a cool point,

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Speaker 3: which is that the resistance of a conductor depends on

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Speaker 3: the temperature.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, So as it gets colder, the lattice, this

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00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:43,440
Speaker 1: grid of atoms gets more regular, and it gets easier

379
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Speaker 1: for the electrons to get through, and so the resistance

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Speaker 1: goes down with temperature.

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Speaker 3: So a hot wire is harder to get electrons through

382
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Speaker 3: it because all the apps are moving more, but a

383
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Speaker 3: cold wire lets the electrons flow more easy.

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Speaker 1: That's right, All right.

385
00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:02,679
Speaker 3: Cool, that's a conductor, not somebody who drives a bus

386
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:04,399
Speaker 3: or directs an orchestra.

387
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:05,920
Speaker 1: That person's also a conductor.

388
00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:08,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, But is he a superconductor?

389
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Speaker 1: Is he resistant?

390
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:12,240
Speaker 3: Does he glow?

391
00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:16,840
Speaker 1: Does he steal energy from innocent electrons?

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00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,080
Speaker 3: All right, that's a conductor, and now let's get into

393
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,439
Speaker 3: super conductors. But first, let's take a quick break.

394
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439
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440
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441
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:56,280
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442
00:21:56,320 --> 00:21:57,320
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443
00:21:57,119 --> 00:22:08,119
Speaker 3: Com all right, Daniel, So it fills in what is

444
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,360
Speaker 3: a super conductor and what is so super about them?

445
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,440
Speaker 1: Superconductors are really pretty super. The thing that makes them

446
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:18,199
Speaker 1: super is that they have zero resistance, not just like

447
00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:21,400
Speaker 1: very small, not like epsilon resistance, but.

448
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,400
Speaker 3: Zero, like zero points zero zero zero zero.

449
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 1: Keep going with the zeros there, man, because it's zero

450
00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,560
Speaker 1: all the way. Wow, Okay, Yeah, it's pretty crazy. It

451
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,520
Speaker 1: means that, for example, if you had a loop of

452
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 1: super conducting wire, you could put a current into it

453
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 1: and it would just zoom around it forever. It would

454
00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:41,080
Speaker 1: like never get used up. It's a pretty hard concept

455
00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 1: to imagine. It's like, it's like living in a world

456
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 1: without friction. You know. It's like imagine you had a

457
00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:49,320
Speaker 1: sheet of ice, you pushed a block on it, right, Yeah,

458
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:50,880
Speaker 1: you expect it to go for a while and then

459
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,959
Speaker 1: eventually slow down because every surface has some friction. But

460
00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,679
Speaker 1: what if you had a perfectly smooth surface with no

461
00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:00,720
Speaker 1: resistance and you pushed it, it would just go forever.

462
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:04,080
Speaker 3: It's like a perpetual motion machine.

463
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:05,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, sort of like that.

464
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:08,120
Speaker 3: Or is it kind of like if you if you're

465
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 3: in space and you start spinning something atop it's just

466
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:15,560
Speaker 3: going to keep spinning for a long time because there's

467
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,560
Speaker 3: nothing there's no air, no resistance, no nothing to stop

468
00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:20,280
Speaker 3: it from spinning.

469
00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 1: That's right, yeah, exactly. And so a superconductor is something

470
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:26,520
Speaker 1: that has zero resistance and so the electrons can just

471
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 1: flow right through it. It's pretty amazing, all right.

472
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:30,800
Speaker 3: So let's get into how that works. And I think

473
00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,880
Speaker 3: what's cool I heard is that physicists don't really know

474
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:36,000
Speaker 3: what's going on.

475
00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, well there's some There are different kinds of superconductors,

476
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:41,920
Speaker 1: and some of them are pretty well understood, the old

477
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: fashioned ones, the classic ones. But recently they've made a

478
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:48,720
Speaker 1: bunch of really strange superconductors that nobody really understands in

479
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,239
Speaker 1: great detail. I mean, we have some simulations we can

480
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 1: describe it, but a lot of it's just too complicated

481
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,880
Speaker 1: or like write down equations on paper that we can understand.

482
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 3: Okay, So there's different flavors of conductors.

483
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:03,240
Speaker 1: Yeah. The first thing they all have in common is

484
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 1: that you've got to get it cold. Like we were

485
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 1: saying earlier, you want to lower the resistance first, get

486
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 1: it cold, and so chill that thing down. And people

487
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:14,040
Speaker 1: built refrigerators to get things down to like really really

488
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,959
Speaker 1: really cold temperatures like ten or twenty degrees kelvin. You know,

489
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: that's like just above absolute zero.

490
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:24,719
Speaker 3: And the point is that when it gets colder that cold,

491
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 3: the grid in the material stops moving, it stops vibrating, right.

492
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 1: That's right, And you can't get anything down to actually

493
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,439
Speaker 1: absolute zero, but you can get it down really really cold,

494
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 1: and the grid stops vibrating, as you say, and then

495
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 1: it gets easier and easier for electrons to go through.

496
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,879
Speaker 1: And so that will bring you down to low resistance,

497
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:47,600
Speaker 1: even very low. Some might even say super low. But

498
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: it won't get you all the way down to zero resistance.

499
00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:52,960
Speaker 3: Oh, I see, if you just had a regular like

500
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:55,199
Speaker 3: if I took a copper wire and I froze it

501
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:59,360
Speaker 3: to almost zero kelvin, it would give me pretty low resistance,

502
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,520
Speaker 3: but not necessaricessarily zero resistance.

503
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:04,440
Speaker 1: I don't actually know if copper can become a superconductor,

504
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,199
Speaker 1: but I just mean that chilling it down is not

505
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: all the explanation. To explain how something loses its resistance.

506
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 1: You need more than just understanding that it gets colder

507
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 1: and therefore it's easier for the electrons to go through.

508
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: You need there's another piece of the explanation.

509
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:23,160
Speaker 3: There's some extra magic going on there, some extra dance magic.

510
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, because physics, if you just think about the temperature,

511
00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,640
Speaker 1: physics says you shouldn't have superconductors, but we do have them.

512
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,920
Speaker 1: It was in the early part of the twentieth century

513
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,920
Speaker 1: that people made superconductors and observed it, and people thought, what,

514
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 1: how is this even possible? And then the theorists spend

515
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 1: decades thinking about it and trying to come up with

516
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: explanations like we know this exists, right. This is one

517
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,159
Speaker 1: of my favorite things in science, when we have something

518
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:48,359
Speaker 1: we know it exists, but we don't know how it

519
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,360
Speaker 1: can work, Like it doesn't seem like it should be possible.

520
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:52,880
Speaker 1: Yet here we have one.

521
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 3: And then one night they went dancing and they figured

522
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:55,880
Speaker 3: it all out.

523
00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: That's right. They were getting knocked over in amash and

524
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 1: when they woke up from their concussion, they had a

525
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 1: brilliant idea.

526
00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 3: Well, that's kind of the analogy here, right, Like if

527
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,080
Speaker 3: you're this is a dance party and there's a mosh

528
00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:13,119
Speaker 3: bin and people are jumping and going crazy, it'd be

529
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:15,640
Speaker 3: really hard to go through it. But if you suddenly

530
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,879
Speaker 3: turn out the music and everyone did the manic and challenge.

531
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,119
Speaker 3: It would be a lot easier to walk through it,

532
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 3: but it wouldn't be perfectly easy to go through it.

533
00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 3: You still might bump into people, rub against people, and

534
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 3: so the resistance would be low, but not zero.

535
00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:34,400
Speaker 1: That's right. So to get down to zero and took

536
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: a really clever bit of thinking by theorists to explain

537
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 1: how this could work. And it comes down to a

538
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 1: concept called Cooper Pears. And the short version of the

539
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 1: explanation is that electrons don't go through individually. They gather

540
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 1: together into pairs, like you know, like pair dancing, like

541
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 1: you know, square dancing or waltzing or whatever.

542
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:54,919
Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, the dance analogies don't stop.

543
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 1: Why should they, Right, it's a dance party to the

544
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,919
Speaker 1: end of time, and going through in pairs they can

545
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 1: accomplish actually zero resistance.

546
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 3: Okay, So it's sort of related to some quantum effects, right, Like,

547
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 3: at some point to get to zero resistance, you need

548
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,880
Speaker 3: that sort of quantum magic to make it happen.

549
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:17,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is really awesome because it's really fun when

550
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 1: quantum mechanics it's not just like hidden under the rug,

551
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,920
Speaker 1: some tiny little effect that only affects tiny particles. When

552
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 1: it actually gives you a macroscopic thing that you can measure,

553
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,800
Speaker 1: that you can see, you can prove. Look, quantum mechanics

554
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 1: is real, and this is an example of that. And

555
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 1: to understand it, the little bit of quantum mechanics you

556
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,359
Speaker 1: need to know is just that electrons are a certain

557
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:38,959
Speaker 1: kind of particle we call them fermions, and that kind

558
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: of particle doesn't like to share. It doesn't like to

559
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 1: be in the same state as another kind of particle.

560
00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:47,640
Speaker 1: So you can't have two electrons both occupying, for example,

561
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 1: the lowest rung on the energy ladder of an atom.

562
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:51,760
Speaker 1: They don't like to be in the same one. So

563
00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: if there's one already there, the next one will feel

564
00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:55,919
Speaker 1: the second rung and the next one will fill the

565
00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 1: third rung. They don't all like to hang out together

566
00:27:57,880 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: in the bottom rung, right.

567
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 3: Usually they like to dance Solu.

568
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: That's right, exactly. They all think they're the best dancer ever,

569
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:06,880
Speaker 1: and they just dance by themselves on the dance floor.

570
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 1: But what happens when you get two of them together

571
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: is that they act like the other kind of quantum

572
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 1: particle we call those bosons. And bosons are totally happy

573
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 1: to pile up on top of each other. They can

574
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 1: occupy the same state, no big deal. Maybe you've heard

575
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: of a Bose Einstein condensate. That's an example of a

576
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 1: bunch of bosons getting really really cold and all sitting

577
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,720
Speaker 1: in exactly the same quantum state, the lowest energy state,

578
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,120
Speaker 1: and then they all act together and do really weird

579
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 1: quantum effects. We should do a whole podcast on the

580
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: bosee Einstein condensate. That's pretty cool stuff.

581
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 3: But there's something going on because normally electrons don't like

582
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 3: to pair up like this, but when you cool down

583
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 3: a superconductor, suddenly it becomes possible and even preferable for

584
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:50,640
Speaker 3: them to pair up.

585
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, electrons are both negatively charged, right, and so

586
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 1: they don't like to hang out with each other. They

587
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,240
Speaker 1: repel each other quite a bit, but you only need

588
00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 1: a very slight attraction. These Cooper pairs are not like,

589
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 1: they're not like really bound tightly together. They're just sort

590
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:06,760
Speaker 1: of like loosely associated. You know, they're like two people

591
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 1: eyeing each other across the dance floor, sending signals back

592
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: and forth.

593
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 3: So can you describe the effect here, Like, why do

594
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 3: they pair up and how that helps him flow through

595
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:16,000
Speaker 3: the material.

596
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: The reason they pair up is that they essentially they

597
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: deform the lattice in this in the same way, so

598
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 1: like they're moving through the lattice together. There's grid of atoms.

599
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 1: And you know, think of the lattice like you might

600
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: think of like a mattress, right, like on your bed.

601
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:32,680
Speaker 1: If you sit down on the mattress, it makes a

602
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 1: depression in it. Right. If somebody else sits on the mattress,

603
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 1: it also makes a depression. And which way are you

604
00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:40,080
Speaker 1: most likely to roll? Right? If there's a depression on

605
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,360
Speaker 1: the mattress another one next to it, you're going to

606
00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: lean in towards the center, right, unless you have like

607
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 1: a really awesome, very expensive mattress. But making one depression

608
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 1: makes it makes you attracted to the next depression, right, mmm.

609
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,240
Speaker 3: And so that's what kind of brings the electronics together.

610
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 1: Mm hmmm exactly. They sort of shake the lattice in

611
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:03,080
Speaker 1: this way that makes them more likely to be closer

612
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:04,480
Speaker 1: to each other than further apart.

613
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 3: And it has to be cold, because if the whole

614
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 3: bed is shaking and moving, you know this effect is

615
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 3: not going to matter.

616
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 1: Be careful pretty soon we're going to be doing analogies

617
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: involving dancing and beds and you know where that's going

618
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: to go?

619
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:18,440
Speaker 3: Dirty dancing.

620
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, keep your dancing one hundred percent vertical here.

621
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 3: Folks, I see where are you going with that?

622
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:38,280
Speaker 1: So the electrons are moving through the lattice and they

623
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: like to stay together. There's a very small attractive force

624
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: that keeps them in pairs. You know, it doesn't they

625
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 1: don't like touch. It's not like they're you know, it's

626
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:48,520
Speaker 1: a new particle with a minus two charge or anything.

627
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 1: They're just sort of like grouped together as they move

628
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 1: through the lattice. And because the electrons by themselves are fermions,

629
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 1: things that don't like to share states, but together they're boson,

630
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 1: then they act differently. If you heard, for example, of

631
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 1: liquid helium. Liquid helium is a superfluid. It's something that

632
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: can flow without any resistance. And the reason is that

633
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 1: helium is a boson, right, The atom itself is a boson,

634
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 1: and when it gets really really cold, it can flow

635
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:19,719
Speaker 1: without resistance. And so electrons are kind of like that.

636
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:21,920
Speaker 1: When they get really really cold, they pair up, and

637
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,000
Speaker 1: these cooper pairs are bosons, so they can share states

638
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 1: just like liquid helium atoms, and they can then they

639
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,080
Speaker 1: can slide through the lattice with basically zero resistance. It's

640
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: sort of incredible.

641
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 3: It's kind of like, individually, this whole mess of atoms

642
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 3: blocking their way. But once they pair up, it's almost

643
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 3: like the loss of physics. They're operating under a different

644
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 3: set of laws of physics almost, And so then suddenly

645
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 3: the highway opens up in front of them.

646
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, It's like following somebody through a dance floor

647
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: is easier than going through the dance floor yourself, right,

648
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: And so two people moving through the dance floor together

649
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 1: sort of orbiting around each other a little bit, just

650
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: sort of make the other dancers move out of their

651
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 1: way just the right way for them to slip through

652
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 1: without feeling any resistance.

653
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 3: It's like crowdsurfing exactly.

654
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: It's like crowdsurfing, and it's a subtle effect, you know.

655
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 1: This attraction between the electrons is small, and so it

656
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 1: took people a long time to understand this. There were

657
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 1: a lot of crazy ideas people had to explain superconductivity,

658
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 1: most of which were wrong, and this one crazy idea

659
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: which turned out to be true.

660
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 3: And so that's why they have to be cold so

661
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 3: that there's sort of room for these electrons to get together.

662
00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:36,720
Speaker 1: That's right. Superconductivity was discovered in materials like ten or

663
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 1: twenty degrees kelvin, and as we said, that's necessary to

664
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: have the regular lattice and to have this thing happen.

665
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:46,280
Speaker 1: And also, this attraction between the electrons is very fragile,

666
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 1: and so if things are too hot, then that attraction

667
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,280
Speaker 1: is really is hard to make. And so for a

668
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 1: long time people thought, well, superconductors are cool, they have

669
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: cool applications, but geese, if you've got to be twenty

670
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 1: degrees calvin, that's not very practical. You know, you're not

671
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: going to have the wires in your house being twenty

672
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 1: degrees kelvin. That's super cold.

673
00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 3: Okay, let's get into the different flavors as superconductors, but

674
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 3: first let's take another break.

675
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,600
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676
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:18,840
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677
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:22,920
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678
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:25,600
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679
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680
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681
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682
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683
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684
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685
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694
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Speaker 3: All right. So, Daniel, you were telling me that there

713
00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 3: are different flavors of superconductors, like super duper conductors.

714
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,240
Speaker 1: Well, they are all superconductors, but they're made in different ways,

715
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 1: different kinds of materials. So for like fifty years, there

716
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:21,759
Speaker 1: are only a few superconductors that were known. But then

717
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,839
Speaker 1: in the eighties, probably described by this magazine article you read,

718
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 1: there was a breakthrough. People found superconductors that could work

719
00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: at relatively high temperatures, you know, up to like maybe

720
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: between thirty and one hundred degrees Calvin. That's still super cold.

721
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I think parts of Canada might be

722
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 1: one hundred degrees calen right now.

723
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:42,160
Speaker 3: And these are like metals or I think I read

724
00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 3: they're ceramics, right, They're not just all metals there. Some

725
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 3: of them are ceramics.

726
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,800
Speaker 1: Yes, some of them are ceramics exactly, which really surprised people.

727
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:54,440
Speaker 1: But they can do super conductivity at fairly high temperatures,

728
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 1: you know, versus thirty degrees and then fifty degrees and

729
00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: the sixty degrees, and these days they're up above one

730
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 1: hundred degree use Calvin, which is still pretty cold, but

731
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,920
Speaker 1: it's it's getting closer to like the liquid nitrogen level,

732
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 1: where you can get something cold pretty cheaply. If you

733
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 1: need something down like ten degrees Calvin, you have to

734
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 1: have superworld class refrigeration and liquid helium, which is all

735
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: very hard. You only need something pretty cold. You can

736
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,319
Speaker 1: use liquid nitrogen, which is cheap and easily available and

737
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 1: so maybe practical.

738
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:22,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can just go down to the store and

739
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 3: pop open a bottle of liquid nitrogen.

740
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 1: That's right. And this is a pretty exciting field because

741
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: every few years, like a new kind of materials discovered

742
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 1: that can do superconductivity at a higher temperature. So like

743
00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: every five years, i'd's like, hey, look I zapp this

744
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 1: with this new kind of goo and nicemeared peanut butter

745
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,839
Speaker 1: on it and dunked it in liquid nitrogen and fried

746
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 1: in the microwave, and look now it's a superconductor.

747
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 3: I think your colleagues are probably regretting having talked to

748
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 3: you at this point.

749
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,120
Speaker 1: Probably, I mean not literally, they're not actually using peanut butter,

750
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,759
Speaker 1: but they are just exploring wacky stuff and sometimes they're surprised,

751
00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 1: like there's an amazing kind of superconductor that uses these

752
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 1: graphs fiend sheets, right, this really weird arrangement of carbon.

753
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 1: If you take two of them, two sheets, and you

754
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: twist one at just the right angle, then the sheets

755
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:10,719
Speaker 1: together can act like a superconductor.

756
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:15,120
Speaker 3: And you were saying that these high temperature superconductors, they're

757
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 3: the ones that we don't really understand.

758
00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:21,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, because remember, to have superconducting materials, you need these

759
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 1: cooper pairs to move through the materials, so you need

760
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:27,040
Speaker 1: their electrons to be attracted to each other somehow. But

761
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 1: that attraction is very, very very low, and so if

762
00:37:30,239 --> 00:37:33,280
Speaker 1: the material's hot, then that attraction is basically nothing compared

763
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 1: to the energy of the electrons and the energy of

764
00:37:35,239 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: the lattice, and so it's hard to understand how that works.

765
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: And there are a lot of smart people working right

766
00:37:40,719 --> 00:37:43,960
Speaker 1: now on theories of high temperature superconductors, and you know,

767
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: they have some tools that have good simulations that can

768
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 1: describe this and describe that, but it's not as far

769
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:51,799
Speaker 1: advanced as the theories of low temperature superconductors. And that's

770
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: important because we'd like to predict, like, hey, will this

771
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 1: material be a superconductor or what materials should we make

772
00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: in order to have superconductors that work at room temperature.

773
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 1: That's the final goal.

774
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 3: And so nobody really understands how these works been and

775
00:38:05,719 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 3: it's kind of hard because you can't just sort of

776
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 3: like poke it right. You can't just sort of open

777
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 3: it up and look at what's going on. You have

778
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 3: to kind of use theory in simulations.

779
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. It's a complicated problem, but it's really interesting.

780
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 1: You know, people love making new kinds of stuff and

781
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,320
Speaker 1: trying to get it to do weird things and understanding

782
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 1: these mysteries. I think it's really fun. These guys have

783
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,040
Speaker 1: a lot of fun building these simulations and thinking about it. Yeah,

784
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:30,960
Speaker 1: and you know, I asked them like, do you think

785
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 1: there will ever be room temperature superconductors? And nobody wants

786
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,279
Speaker 1: to say yes, because that's predicting the future. But there

787
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 1: is a lot of confidence because every few years we

788
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:42,440
Speaker 1: get a new kind of superconductor that's warmer than any

789
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:45,160
Speaker 1: of the others. And so if that continues, you know,

790
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 1: in another few decades, we might get superconductors that are at

791
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 1: fairly warm temperatures.

792
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 3: It's all about finding the right recipe exactly.

793
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:54,800
Speaker 1: It's finding the right recipe, the right kind of ingredients,

794
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 1: mix them in the right kind of way, zap them

795
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:58,800
Speaker 1: with the right kind of laser, all this kind of stuff.

796
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 3: Do a dance a certain way.

797
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 1: Exactly, you got to do the dance. Okay.

798
00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 3: So that's super conductorance and how they work. But sort

799
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 3: of their biggest application is kind of not really in

800
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:21,040
Speaker 3: conducting electricity. It's more in magnets, right, and making super magnets.

801
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: That's right. Of course, there's a connection because how do

802
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 1: you bank an electromagnet?

803
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:25,480
Speaker 7: Right?

804
00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:27,239
Speaker 1: How do you make a magnet that you can turn

805
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 1: on and off? But you do that by having something

806
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,279
Speaker 1: which conducts electricity, you make a loop of current, because

807
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:35,759
Speaker 1: a loop of current will make a magnet. And so

808
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:39,920
Speaker 1: if you have something which can do super conducting electronics,

809
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 1: then you can have current flowing through at a really

810
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 1: high rate and it doesn't heat up and break down

811
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:48,440
Speaker 1: or anything. And so you can get really strong magnets.

812
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 3: Oh it lets you make magnets that you can turn

813
00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:56,800
Speaker 3: on and off. It's like a yes, electric magnets.

814
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, electromagnets. You can turn them on and off. You

815
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:01,279
Speaker 1: can dial their strength up and down, which is really

816
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:02,800
Speaker 1: important for a particle collider.

817
00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 3: And if you use superconductors then you can there's no

818
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:09,680
Speaker 3: resistance and so you can really get really strong magnets.

819
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:12,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And you want really strong magnets that are

820
00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 1: pretty small that don't take you know, that aren't like

821
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,239
Speaker 1: the size of a school bus or something. So you

822
00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:19,360
Speaker 1: want them to be powerful, you want them to be small,

823
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:21,719
Speaker 1: and that's what we need at the particle collider. And

824
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,400
Speaker 1: also you want super strong magnets for other things like

825
00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:27,800
Speaker 1: who doesn't want to ride in a magnetically levitating train

826
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 1: that would be awesome, right.

827
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:32,600
Speaker 3: The others are the magnev ones in Japan.

828
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, exactly, And so the stronger the magnets, the

829
00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:39,279
Speaker 1: easier that technology is, the more practical that technology is. Right,

830
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,120
Speaker 1: and so superconductors play a lot of role in making

831
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,160
Speaker 1: really strong magnets. But then also very directly, you know

832
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,799
Speaker 1: you want superconductivity, Well, it would be great to have

833
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 1: in your transmission lines. Like we were saying earlier, your

834
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,440
Speaker 1: electricity would be cheaper if you could get it straight

835
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 1: from the power station without losing any energy. Right, they

836
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:00,640
Speaker 1: lose a significant fraction of the energy they generate just

837
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:01,839
Speaker 1: in sending it to us.

838
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,360
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, So if you can, Yeah, if you

839
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:08,440
Speaker 3: find a recipe for a room temperature superconductor, you would

840
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:10,360
Speaker 3: revolutionize everything.

841
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,360
Speaker 1: Right, you would be a zillionaire and you could just

842
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: dance all night and not have to worry about anything.

843
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 1: Ever again, seriously, that would be a zillion dollar invention temperature.

844
00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 3: Superconductors, like you would you would haven't liked a grid

845
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:26,240
Speaker 3: with no loss like your you know, your phone wouldn't

846
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 3: heat up and lose energy.

847
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,280
Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, Plus it would be a fascinating mystery of physics,

848
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: like how does that happen? How is it possible? I

849
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,280
Speaker 1: love when we can create stuff if we don't understand

850
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:41,799
Speaker 1: because It gives us like a concrete hook into some

851
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:44,840
Speaker 1: mystery of the universe, something that says, there's something here

852
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,359
Speaker 1: that will teach you a lesson. There's some insight here

853
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:49,960
Speaker 1: waiting for you to discover. And of course there could

854
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 1: be insights anywhere, you never know. But when you have

855
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: something physical that you don't understand, you know there's an

856
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 1: insight there. There's like a concrete clue you can follow up,

857
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 1: you know. So to me, that's very exciting. Wow.

858
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:04,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, Well, I think that we can safely

859
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 3: conclude that superconductors have to do with conductors and force

860
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:10,840
Speaker 3: and stuff.

861
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 1: And dance and dancing. So we have danced our way

862
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: through this topic, and we hope that you enjoyed it

863
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 1: and that you now understand a little bit more about superconductivity.

864
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,520
Speaker 3: So go out there and find a pair to dance with.

865
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:24,960
Speaker 3: And they don't necessarily have to be called.

866
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:28,399
Speaker 1: Cooper, that's right, And they even can have the same charge. Right.

867
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:31,640
Speaker 1: Sometimes opposites attract, sometimes electrons attract.

868
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, how many times can we dance around

869
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:35,520
Speaker 3: this pun?

870
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:42,040
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think we're breaking down. We'll break dancing.

871
00:42:44,000 --> 00:42:48,239
Speaker 3: We brooke to dance, all right, guys, thanks for joining us.

872
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