WEBVTT - Yes, Your Commute Really Is Getting Worse 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:05.280 Most of the time, my workday starts with this sound 0:00:05.400 --> 0:00:11.680 clear of the door please. For many more Americans, it 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:21.360 sounds something like this. A few people like commuting, but 0:00:21.440 --> 0:00:23.400 have you ever thought about how your trip to work 0:00:23.480 --> 0:00:39.839 affects your job and your life? This is a game plan. Hi. 0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:43.640 I'm Francesco Leavie and I'm Rebecca Greenfield, and today we're 0:00:43.680 --> 0:00:47.960 talking about commuting. Becca, How was your commute this morning? 0:00:48.320 --> 0:00:51.880 It was a cliche of a bad New York City commute. 0:00:52.120 --> 0:00:54.680 Why don't you do the thing that everybody says you 0:00:54.680 --> 0:00:58.400 shouldn't do and tell me about how bad your commune was. Yeah, sorry, 0:00:58.400 --> 0:01:00.880 I'm gonna riot talk. You're gonna have to hear it. 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:04.400 I mean, it was like, got on my regular train, 0:01:04.880 --> 0:01:08.080 that train got out of service because I later learned 0:01:08.080 --> 0:01:10.520 there was a track fire, got into the other train, 0:01:10.560 --> 0:01:13.160 which is a much slower commute, and at every station 0:01:13.200 --> 0:01:16.200 stop it was like some mumbled reasoning of why we 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:18.440 were stopped and I don't know why, And like an 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:20.759 hour and fifteen minutes later I got to work, which 0:01:20.760 --> 0:01:22.880 is like double the time it normally takes me. So 0:01:23.480 --> 0:01:25.720 it was frustrating. It was bad. I did get a 0:01:25.720 --> 0:01:28.080 seat eventually, because I was on the train for so long. 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:32.319 But um, yeah, it was just I was knew I 0:01:32.360 --> 0:01:35.000 was coming in to talk about commuting, and I knew 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:36.880 you'd have a place to air those grievances. So thank 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:40.600 you for listening. How is your community? My community actually 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:43.880 was was okay this morning. Sorry I did. I left 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:45.800 a little early this morning. I'm glad I did because 0:01:45.840 --> 0:01:49.160 I came in and I came into like a page 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:51.360 of emails from people explaining how they were stuck on 0:01:51.400 --> 0:01:54.200 the train. And it's like, and this happens when I 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:56.800 have worked places um where I would have to drive, 0:01:56.840 --> 0:01:59.960 and the same thing happens you you have this night 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:02.440 were commute. You lose all this time that you wanted 0:02:02.440 --> 0:02:03.960 to spend out work getting stuff done, and then you 0:02:04.000 --> 0:02:06.520 lose more time when you get to work because you're 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:09.240 commiserating with your coworkers about how terrible the commute was 0:02:09.240 --> 0:02:12.200 because everyone else had the same experience. Commuting is just 0:02:12.200 --> 0:02:14.560 this universal thing that connects us all because we hate 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:16.600 it and it makes our life terrible. Yeah, And there've 0:02:16.600 --> 0:02:18.720 been a lot of articles about how in New York City, 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:21.919 specifically this summer, it's the summer of hell. There's a 0:02:22.000 --> 0:02:24.880 lot of repairs happening for commuters who come into New 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:27.360 York City. But then also the subway just happens to 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:30.880 be breaking down a lot, making things even worse. But 0:02:31.280 --> 0:02:33.160 commuting in general is not like a New York City 0:02:33.200 --> 0:02:37.320 specific frustration. No, and we have it bad, but the 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:39.919 whole country spends a lot of time getting to work, 0:02:40.120 --> 0:02:44.480 and the average Americans spends twenty five minutes getting to work, 0:02:44.919 --> 0:02:46.920 and most of those people are doing it in a 0:02:46.960 --> 0:02:50.240 car by themselves. So more than three quarters of people 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:54.480 around seventies six or seventy seven percent are driving solo 0:02:54.680 --> 0:02:58.200 to work, and then a little less than ten percent 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:02.280 car pool, five use public transportation, and then every other 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:05.799 way of getting to work from like not going anywhere 0:03:05.840 --> 0:03:08.960 because you work from home, to walking or biking, those 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:13.200 are all less than five percent each. I would argue 0:03:13.280 --> 0:03:17.280 that twenty five minutes in a car is equal to 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:22.240 or worse than forty minutes on the subway. Yeah, well 0:03:22.639 --> 0:03:25.880 so there's yeah, And also remember like twenty five minutes 0:03:25.919 --> 0:03:27.760 of the average, which means a lot of people are 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:30.079 spending way more time, and then some people and then 0:03:30.080 --> 0:03:32.680 a lot of people are spending way less time. But yes, 0:03:32.760 --> 0:03:37.240 there are advantages and disadvantages to both. Like in the subway, 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:41.520 you could read a book or a newspaper, or on 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:44.400 your phone frantically emailing our colleagues are running late. Well 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:47.360 you if you have WiFi. True, but I feel like 0:03:47.480 --> 0:03:49.920 if you're in a car stuck in traffic, you could 0:03:49.920 --> 0:03:53.160 at least like get on a conference call. Maybe that 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:56.920 not around a bunch of other cranky people. Yes, you're 0:03:57.040 --> 0:03:59.400 you're in your own space, you have music, and like, 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:02.280 maybe there's more of a sense of control when I've 0:04:02.280 --> 0:04:05.400 been stuck in this summer of hell. I've been part 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:09.000 of a couple of severe delays where you're just trapped underground. 0:04:09.000 --> 0:04:12.160 You have that unique New York feeling of being in 0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:16.120 darkness with no explanation why in an aluminum can with 0:04:16.160 --> 0:04:19.240 a bunch of other people, and you just feel so 0:04:19.320 --> 0:04:22.000 helpless and out of control. At least you have some 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.400 illusion in a car of having some control because you 0:04:24.400 --> 0:04:28.520 can like move your car forward two feet every fifteen minutes. So, 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:30.960 if I were a person who really cared about commuting, 0:04:30.960 --> 0:04:33.240 it was like my number one thing for finding a job. 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:37.960 Are there places where it is better than other places? Yeah, 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:40.279 so counties in New York are unsurprisingly among the worst 0:04:40.279 --> 0:04:44.719 places for commuting, so are some counties in California, Los Angeles, 0:04:44.720 --> 0:04:46.320 in the Bay Area. And then all of the best 0:04:46.320 --> 0:04:50.560 places to commute are pretty far flung rural areas like 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:54.479 in Alaska, where the population density is really low, and 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:57.480 so basically people just aren't traveling that far to get 0:04:57.520 --> 0:05:02.640 to work. They're also arguably aren't as many jobs, and yeah, 0:05:02.800 --> 0:05:07.000 the solution to your commute is probably not moving to Alaska. Um. So, 0:05:07.040 --> 0:05:09.400 we all know commuting is annoying and it's fun to 0:05:09.440 --> 0:05:11.760 complain about what a bad commute you have, But there 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:14.840 are other bad things about commuting you might not even 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:18.200 think about. For one thing, it's actually bad for your health. 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:22.120 There was a UK study that showed that people who 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:24.440 spend more than a half hour getting to work are 0:05:24.440 --> 0:05:26.760 more likely to have depression, They're more likely to have 0:05:26.800 --> 0:05:32.520 financial problems and have more work related stress. But yeah, 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:34.840 you're it's affecting your life, and if you think about it, 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:37.440 it's not that crazy. I mean, this is a big 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:40.800 chunk of time. Even if you spend the average twenty 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:43.760 five minutes getting to work, that's almost an hour every 0:05:43.839 --> 0:05:46.000 day that you spend on your journey to and from work, 0:05:46.040 --> 0:05:48.040 and it's kind of dead time, and it's either like, 0:05:48.200 --> 0:05:51.360 at best it's neutral, you got to work without any problems, 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:53.480 but you kind of lost that time, and at worst, 0:05:53.600 --> 0:05:56.440 it's this nightmare that, like in your case today, gets 0:05:56.440 --> 0:06:00.719 you to work late and feeling pioed. Very I never 0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:03.880 really think of commuting as being bad for my health, 0:06:03.960 --> 0:06:06.880 but more I'm more annoyed in the way it affects 0:06:06.880 --> 0:06:10.040 my work day and how I have to shovel everything 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:12.960 around and sometimes I have to cancel meetings, and sometimes 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:16.599 people cancel on me. I read in a Bloomberg article 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:21.480 that the summer of health is costing Manhattan employers fortune 0:06:21.520 --> 0:06:25.680 point five million dollars for every hour train commuters are delayed. 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:29.440 And there have been all these articles about people losing 0:06:29.520 --> 0:06:31.919 jobs and people missing job interviews, and there was that 0:06:32.279 --> 0:06:34.640 it was a feel good, viral new story about that 0:06:34.680 --> 0:06:37.360 guy who like they held a graduation ceremony for him 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:40.160 on the subway because he missed his graduation ceremony because 0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:43.039 of a delay. And that's your major life milestones on 0:06:43.080 --> 0:06:46.560 the subway. But that's that's happening regularly, and I think 0:06:46.560 --> 0:06:49.880 it's a big problem for not just employers, but people 0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:53.240 trying to do their jobs. Yeah, so these huge effects 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:56.240 of commuting seem like they would be top of mind 0:06:56.320 --> 0:06:58.479 when we were picking a new job or deciding where 0:06:58.480 --> 0:07:00.720 we're going to live. But I like most of us 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:04.320 just kind of accept our commute as a fact of life. 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:07.239 And if it takes you an hour to get to work, 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:09.400 or if it's a really frustrating forty five minutes on 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:11.160 the subway, that's just the way it has to be. 0:07:11.720 --> 0:07:14.440 But we wanted to find out how exactly things got 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:17.560 this way and what if anything can be done to 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:19.320 make it better. And that's what our guest is going 0:07:19.360 --> 0:07:24.960 to talk to us about. Richard Florida is an urban 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:28.800 studies theorist. He's a professor at the University of Toronto 0:07:29.040 --> 0:07:33.200 and author of many books, including The New Urban Crisis. 0:07:33.440 --> 0:07:37.240 Welcome Richard, it's great to be with you. Um let's 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:40.760 get started just by asking why does it take Americans 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:43.600 as long as it does to get to work? Well, 0:07:43.640 --> 0:07:47.600 you know, I think Americans have been fascinated with the 0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:53.200 idea of buying I guess a less expensive house on 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:58.920 the one hand, or a a home in the Bucolic suburbs. 0:07:59.000 --> 0:08:03.160 So you know, beginning I'm assuming sometime in the in 0:08:03.200 --> 0:08:05.480 the beginning of the twentieth century. This idea is that 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:08.800 that you could live far away from work and at 0:08:08.800 --> 0:08:11.000 that time take a subway or a train to work, 0:08:11.040 --> 0:08:13.760 or then more recently, drive your car to work, and 0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:17.560 that was something you did to have the suburban lifestyle 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:21.120 or the size of home that that you want. The 0:08:21.160 --> 0:08:24.640 point of fact is, though you know, according to nearly 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:27.080 every study of the subject I've read, and trust me, 0:08:27.120 --> 0:08:29.120 I've read a lot of them, the single thing you 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.360 can do to make yourself the most miserable is endure 0:08:32.360 --> 0:08:35.240 a long commute to and from work. So so maybe 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:38.720 we have to begin to rethink that. So has the 0:08:38.720 --> 0:08:44.360 American relationship to the car changed as commutes have gotten worse? Well, 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:48.000 I think so. You know, um, my father, who was 0:08:48.040 --> 0:08:51.720 born in the twenties, certainly saw the car, you know, 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:55.080 he talked to me a lot about that as his 0:08:55.280 --> 0:08:58.679 escape from Newark, New Jersey, is his escape from the 0:08:58.720 --> 0:09:02.079 old Italian village, you know, with grandma and grandpa and 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:04.800 aunts and uncles looking over their shoulder. You he didn't 0:09:04.800 --> 0:09:07.439 feel like he had freedom, and the car for him 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:09.680 as a young person, you know, as a young factory worker. 0:09:09.720 --> 0:09:11.360 Blue collar work was a way to have some fun. 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:13.320 Uh And then when he got married, you know, it 0:09:13.360 --> 0:09:16.120 was a way to move to a bedroom, working class 0:09:16.160 --> 0:09:20.000 bedroom suburb of Newark. Uh And and that raised his 0:09:20.040 --> 0:09:23.120 family the way he and my mom won't saw fit 0:09:23.720 --> 0:09:26.160 um And certainly for me and people of my generation, 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:29.520 you know, baby boomers, the car was also you know, 0:09:29.559 --> 0:09:31.760 I was so mad at myself when I was a 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:34.120 young person, I didn't have much money. I worked on 0:09:34.160 --> 0:09:36.199 my jobs. I had to help put myself through college. 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:39.840 But you know, people had these you know, camaros and 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:43.080 can tell him the kid from New Jersey, Thunderbirds and 0:09:43.080 --> 0:09:44.600 and all of this kind of thing. And I felt 0:09:44.640 --> 0:09:46.800 so bad and inadequate because I couldn't afford a car. 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.280 In fact, I couldn't afford a car until I graduated 0:09:49.400 --> 0:09:51.560 and got my pH d. And at that point all 0:09:51.600 --> 0:09:54.760 I could afford was a little measly Toyota Tersell, and 0:09:54.800 --> 0:09:57.560 I guess I felt inadequate. But but today, you know, 0:09:58.160 --> 0:10:01.240 the people I teaching, the people I teach in university, 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:03.520 they don't want a car. And I think that's the 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:06.080 big change, you know, And and they say, you know, 0:10:06.240 --> 0:10:08.560 for them, a car is just a part. It's a 0:10:08.559 --> 0:10:10.559 financial burden. And anyway, you know, if they want to 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:11.880 go out and have fun at night, what kind of 0:10:11.960 --> 0:10:14.360 lunatic would drive a car. Then they want to ride 0:10:14.360 --> 0:10:17.080 their bicycle or live close enough to walk or or 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:20.960 take transit. So I do think, you know, the shift 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:25.080 isn't is in the majority. You know, look, percent of 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:28.520 Americans still drive a car to work alone by themselves. 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:31.280 And of course those numbers are very different in the 0:10:31.320 --> 0:10:34.120 New York metropolitan area than anywhere else where. Many more 0:10:34.120 --> 0:10:38.400 people walk a bicycle and certainly, um, you know a 0:10:38.640 --> 0:10:41.400 large share of people take transit of one sort of 0:10:41.440 --> 0:10:44.160 another go to work. But but it's very interesting when 0:10:44.160 --> 0:10:47.240 you look at it the people who who who take 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:52.280 transit or bicycle to work, it's actually very bifurcated. They're 0:10:52.360 --> 0:10:58.480 they're either relatively affluent people or they're not affluent people, 0:10:58.520 --> 0:11:01.920 their economically disadvant And where it really strikes me is 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:04.640 so interesting, is that's particularly true of people who bike 0:11:04.760 --> 0:11:07.160 to work. You know, the image the image of people 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:12.200 biking to work are you know, young millennials and yuppies 0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:15.080 with a scarf around their neck and and you know, 0:11:15.160 --> 0:11:18.040 a saddle bag, a leather saddle bag, riding a Dutch bike, 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:21.600 you know, one of these handcrafted Dutch bicycles to their 0:11:21.760 --> 0:11:25.360 graphic design job. And certainly that's true. You know, you 0:11:25.440 --> 0:11:27.679 have a greater percentage of people making over a hundred 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:30.720 thousand dollars a year biking to work. But but but 0:11:31.000 --> 0:11:33.880 there's also a great percentage of people making under ten 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:38.080 thousand dollars a year biking to work. So so the 0:11:38.200 --> 0:11:41.120 very interesting thing that that that these alternative modes of 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:45.480 transportation are something that either the very affluent use or 0:11:45.559 --> 0:11:50.520 the very poor use. You've talked about changing preferences. How 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:54.439 the younger people you teach are they want to take transit. 0:11:54.600 --> 0:11:59.800 Our city is changing to accommodate these preferences. Um, not 0:12:00.040 --> 0:12:02.760 fast enough. I mean we we really in the United 0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:06.360 States have have not invested in our transit infrastructure for 0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:08.360 a century. One of the things I point out in 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:12.600 my book The New Urban Crisis. The reason why real 0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:17.040 estate around transit stops close into the city center, of course, 0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:20.640 but around transit subs, around subway stops, around rail hubs 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:24.440 is becoming so valuable is because there's so few of them. Um. 0:12:24.600 --> 0:12:27.679 And you know, according to really recent and important research 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.079 what what what is really driving people back to cities. 0:12:31.880 --> 0:12:33.480 There's a better you know, there's a lot of good 0:12:33.559 --> 0:12:36.240 job opportunities there, and there's fun to be had, and 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:39.280 there's great restaurants and great amenity. But one of the 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:41.760 big things is to keep their commute short and to 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:44.040 stay out of a car. So when they have a 0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:46.600 more enjoyable life, they get more done. But but more importantly, 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:48.840 they get more time to spend with their friends and family, 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:51.440 which is very valuable. So they want to keep their 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:53.800 commute short. And if they can't walk close enough to 0:12:53.840 --> 0:12:55.200 work to be able to walk to work, they want 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:57.520 to be near transit so they don't have to endure 0:12:57.679 --> 0:13:03.319 long and again very painful, psychally painful car commute. How 0:13:03.320 --> 0:13:06.880 does commuting affect not only the decisions people make about 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:12.520 where they work, but their jobs overall. Well, company after 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:14.840 company that I talked to tell me they're moving out 0:13:14.840 --> 0:13:19.000 of suburb X in x y Z metropolitan area back 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:21.120 to the urban center, not only because there are more 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:24.000 people living in downtown and more things to do downtown, 0:13:24.679 --> 0:13:27.960 because it's an easier to commute. There's much more transit connectivity. 0:13:28.000 --> 0:13:30.199 People can take a train or a bus and they 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:32.280 can get there from any part of their city or 0:13:32.280 --> 0:13:36.040 metropolitan region. So I think we're seeing a big movement. 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:38.520 You know, in my own research, I've documented that now 0:13:38.760 --> 0:13:42.439 well more than half of all tech startups, which used 0:13:42.480 --> 0:13:46.360 to be completely and entirely located in suburban offices complex 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:48.199 as you know, the so called nerdos stands where the 0:13:48.240 --> 0:13:51.319 high tech engineers wanted to drive their fancy sports cars 0:13:51.320 --> 0:13:54.040 are hepped up SUVs. Now more than half of those 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:56.680 startups are in urban centers like Lower Manhattan or the 0:13:56.720 --> 0:13:59.720 downtown parts of San Francisco. So I think you've seen 0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:02.400 a big shift over the over the past years. That 0:14:02.480 --> 0:14:06.240 the problem is there really is a class divide here. Um. 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:08.920 The people who are most likely to be able to 0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:12.400 walk to work or or or take a quick one 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:15.440 stop transit ride to work, you know, under a half 0:14:15.440 --> 0:14:18.480 an hour, under twenty minutes, tend to be affluent, highly 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:22.360 educated people, um, you know. And then the middle class, 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:24.560 if you will, and the middle class and smaller metrists 0:14:24.640 --> 0:14:27.360 drive their car now. And the people who are stuck 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:31.000 with these heinous and horrendous transit commute you know, like 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:34.000 two buses, a train, a subway, and a long walk 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:37.440 are the less advantaged, and the and the disadvantaged and 0:14:37.480 --> 0:14:39.720 the poor. And you know, I also hear this all 0:14:39.760 --> 0:14:43.200 across the country. You know, the people who are working 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:45.600 in our schools, the people who are working as firefighters 0:14:45.640 --> 0:14:47.120 and e m t S. The people are working in 0:14:47.160 --> 0:14:51.440 retail shops and restaurants. They're enduring h two and three 0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:55.480 hour commutes. Are there any companies or cities or communities 0:14:55.600 --> 0:14:59.880 doing anything to make communing more egalitarian. Well, you know, 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:02.760 this is something I'm actually writing about now because I 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:06.240 really believe that as we've revived our cities, in our communities, 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:10.160 we've created a prosperity which is winner take all, and 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:15.480 that has benefited the advantaged third um of knowledge workers, professionals, 0:15:15.560 --> 0:15:18.240 highly educated people in our society, with sixty six being 0:15:18.320 --> 0:15:21.120 left further behind. And one of the cases I'm trying 0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:23.280 to make is that it's it's it's really incumbent upon 0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:29.920 anchor institutions, medical centers, hospitals, universities, but also high tech companies, 0:15:29.960 --> 0:15:33.080 high tech companies and real estate development companies to to 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:35.680 to engage in this. And you know, in in San Francisco, 0:15:36.760 --> 0:15:41.520 UM really people got very upset with the tech companies 0:15:41.560 --> 0:15:44.240 and and tech is not only colonizing downtown but then 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:49.080 running their private shuttle buses UH to the corporate complexes 0:15:49.120 --> 0:15:51.960 of Yahoo in Google and Apple in the Silicon Valley. 0:15:52.320 --> 0:15:56.000 And there were very virulent protests over those and in fact, 0:15:56.040 --> 0:15:58.600 there was a ballot measure that fortunately was defeated because 0:15:58.640 --> 0:16:01.480 it was it was not not a good thing to 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:03.520 to go after high tech companies that are so innovative 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:06.160 and so important to creating jobs and wealth. But a 0:16:06.160 --> 0:16:09.120 ballot menasum that wanted to prohibit high tech companies from 0:16:09.160 --> 0:16:12.280 locating in the downtown areas of San Francisco and so. 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:14.320 But so it's it's in common, I think on these 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:17.840 companies to stop the you know that people view private 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:21.960 shuttle buses as selfish because they are the better thing 0:16:22.000 --> 0:16:24.400 to do in Google is now considering a new campus 0:16:24.400 --> 0:16:28.120 in downtown San Jose near a transit hub UH and 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:30.480 and also providing affordable housing is part of that, and 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:33.240 workforce housing is part of that. But but really I 0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:35.680 think the key here is is for these companies to 0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:38.160 see two being beginning to think that they're going to 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:41.720 have to invest in transit options that are publicly shared, 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:44.640 to work with state and local government and where you 0:16:44.760 --> 0:16:48.280 still possibly can federal agencies to make sure that you 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:50.960 have the public transit infrastructure you need that not only 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:55.440 serves your employees, but but but serves people broadly. So 0:16:55.840 --> 0:16:59.280 I think this is a slow, a slow dawning awareness. 0:16:59.360 --> 0:17:01.360 But but I and see, you know, I can see 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:06.120 the wheels ticking with companies, communities, anchor institutions now saying 0:17:06.160 --> 0:17:08.640 we all have to buck up, um to do things 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:12.359 to one provide housing, more affordable housing, and workforce housing 0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:15.480 closure to where people work, to provide better jobs on 0:17:15.520 --> 0:17:18.080 these sites for service workers, but also to work to 0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:22.679 ways to make public transit UH work better. In Miami Beach, 0:17:23.320 --> 0:17:27.280 where this problem has kind of reached ahead with terrible 0:17:27.359 --> 0:17:29.920 traffic in South Florida, you know, the mayor of Miami 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:34.640 Beach actually created a trolley service because they couldn't get 0:17:34.640 --> 0:17:38.040 the line, you know, across the bay from Miami. The governor, 0:17:38.160 --> 0:17:40.360 the darn governor didn't want the high speed rail which 0:17:40.400 --> 0:17:43.520 is now being built by by private sector investors, but 0:17:43.560 --> 0:17:45.480 he actually put in place. It wasn't a trolley. It's 0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:48.840 like a little bus that looks like a trolley. And um, 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:51.600 the people who work in the service industries use that 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:54.119 trolley like crazy as a way to get up and 0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:56.800 down Miami Beach to go from an apartment or if 0:17:56.840 --> 0:17:59.880 they take other transit onto the beach. I think it's cents. 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:02.440 And the other thing that they're doing in Miami Beach 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:05.520 that I think is really fascinating is there there's a 0:18:05.600 --> 0:18:07.879 proposal now to convert many of the city owned parking 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:10.840 garages into affordable housing. That that does not mean living 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:13.280 in a parking stall. What they're going to do is 0:18:13.280 --> 0:18:15.320 build on top of the garages and they're going to 0:18:15.400 --> 0:18:17.320 add you know, they're going to have parking, and then 0:18:17.400 --> 0:18:20.960 add on top of the garages affordable housing units. So 0:18:21.160 --> 0:18:24.040 you can see in city after city people beginning to 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:26.639 think about what we can do small steps first, but 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:30.680 to begin to grapple with some of these problems. So 0:18:31.080 --> 0:18:33.160 we've heard from you a little bit about what cities 0:18:33.720 --> 0:18:35.879 have done and can do more of, and what individual 0:18:35.880 --> 0:18:38.719 companies can do. Is there anything that as an individual 0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:42.080 worker you can do to make your commute better, especially 0:18:42.080 --> 0:18:45.280 if you are not graced with a really high income. Well, 0:18:45.320 --> 0:18:48.520 I wrote a whole book on this called Who's Your City? 0:18:48.680 --> 0:18:50.600 And the theme of that book was that you know, 0:18:50.800 --> 0:18:53.160 it's up to you to pick the best place for 0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:55.520 you to live and work. And most of us don't, 0:18:55.640 --> 0:18:59.520 you know. Most they call it drive to you qualify. Oh, 0:18:59.600 --> 0:19:01.720 I want a house and it has to have a yard, 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:04.919 and I'm going to drive far because it's more affordable 0:19:04.920 --> 0:19:07.280 the further I get from the city center, or we 0:19:07.320 --> 0:19:09.720 go visit a friend or a cousin. Oh it looks 0:19:09.800 --> 0:19:12.360 nice here. The park was okay, my friend lived here. 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:15.840 I liked it. And no one really does this calculation. 0:19:15.920 --> 0:19:18.760 I should. Very few people do this calculation of you know, 0:19:18.800 --> 0:19:21.240 when I locate myself, when I pick a city to 0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:24.159 live in, or a neighborhood within a city, what is 0:19:24.160 --> 0:19:26.199 that going to cost me? How long is my commute 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:27.960 going to be? What's it going to be like in 0:19:28.000 --> 0:19:31.240 a daily basis? And I noticed recently someone wrote an 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:34.080 article in New York Times as a young woman living 0:19:34.119 --> 0:19:35.639 in New York City and said, you know, I'm going 0:19:35.680 --> 0:19:39.320 to go test drive a few suburbs. It's exactly the 0:19:39.359 --> 0:19:41.680 phrase I used in this book, Who's Your City? I said, 0:19:41.720 --> 0:19:45.280 before you spend all of this money on a home 0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:48.080 or a new rental, you know, moving all of your 0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:50.800 goods in a moving van, setting up a house that 0:19:50.880 --> 0:19:53.000 you're you're kind of stuck in whether you rent it 0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:54.240 for at least a year, but if you own it 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:58.920 longer than that, go test drive the darn place. See 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:01.720 if you like the neighborhood. Try to commute a couple 0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:05.160 of times and not you know, at at eleven o'clock 0:20:05.200 --> 0:20:07.640 in the morning. Try it during rush hour and see 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:09.560 what it's like. You know, people drive out there in 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:11.200 the middle of the day on a Saturday and they, oh, 0:20:11.200 --> 0:20:13.800 it's great, I love it. And then Monday morning comes 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:15.800 and they're stuck in traffic for an hour and a half. 0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:18.760 So I think we owe it to ourselves. I actually 0:20:18.800 --> 0:20:20.960 think it's the most important decision we make. You know, 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:23.080 It's as important as the job and career we do. 0:20:23.119 --> 0:20:25.160 It's as important as the person we take as our 0:20:25.200 --> 0:20:27.960 life partner. We give those two things at least a 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:30.280 measure of thought. We get very little thought. We just 0:20:30.320 --> 0:20:32.600 make snap decisions when it comes to where we live. 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:35.320 So that's what I think, and really think about it, 0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:37.240 you know, and try it, don't you know, maybe if 0:20:37.240 --> 0:20:40.040 you think about it, it's one thing, go try the 0:20:40.119 --> 0:20:42.880 darn commute, and and that goes with a car, and 0:20:43.200 --> 0:20:45.920 you know, I remember a couple of times thinking, you know, 0:20:46.040 --> 0:20:47.840 I lived in a place where I could take transit 0:20:47.880 --> 0:20:50.040 and I wouldn't have to drive, And then I want 0:20:50.160 --> 0:20:52.280 and try it out the transit, you know, after I 0:20:52.320 --> 0:20:54.359 had moved, and it was like two and a half 0:20:54.400 --> 0:20:56.800 hours because the subway didn't connect to the bus, the 0:20:56.800 --> 0:20:59.840 bus didn't connect to the subway, something else was delayed. So, 0:21:00.200 --> 0:21:03.119