WEBVTT - Elon Goes to China, X Has an Anniversary 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:11.160 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 0:00:14.240 --> 0:00:17.240 Well, Elon Musk is now the richest person on the planet. 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:20.319 More than half the satellites in space are owned and 0:00:20.440 --> 0:00:22.160 controlled by one man. 0:00:22.760 --> 0:00:25.759 Well, he's a legitimate super genius. I mean legitimate. 0:00:25.960 --> 0:00:28.600 He says he's always voted for Democrats, but this year 0:00:28.640 --> 0:00:29.400 it will be different. 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:30.400 He'll vote Republican. 0:00:30.680 --> 0:00:33.159 There is a reason the US government is so reliant 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:33.560 on him. 0:00:33.760 --> 0:00:36.440 Elon Musk is a scam artist and he's done nothing. 0:00:37.960 --> 0:00:51.559 Anything he does, he's fascinating the people. Welcome to Elaning 0:00:51.640 --> 0:00:55.920 Bloomberg Weekly podcast about Elon Musk. It's Tuesday, April thirtieth. 0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:59.440 I'm your host, David Papadopolis. This week we're talking about 0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:03.360 China and X. Elon took his jet to Beijing Sunday, 0:01:03.360 --> 0:01:05.399 where he cut a deal that will allow Tesla to 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:09.000 sell what it calls full self driving technology. So far 0:01:09.200 --> 0:01:12.440 the market approves. Tesla stock soared the most in three 0:01:12.520 --> 0:01:15.480 years on Monday, extending a rebound that began after last 0:01:15.520 --> 0:01:18.639 week's earnings call. Then we're going to go down memory 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:22.040 lane as we celebrate the two year anniversary of the 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:25.479 Twitter board accepting Musk's offer to buy the company. Oh, 0:01:25.520 --> 0:01:28.279 Elon's tried a lot of things these past two years, 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:31.040 and let's just say not all of them have quite 0:01:31.040 --> 0:01:36.080 worked out dating service anyone. But before all that, a 0:01:36.240 --> 0:01:39.480 quick programming note. We're hitting the road again. We'll be 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.040 in San Francisco next week to record a live episode 0:01:42.080 --> 0:01:45.760 at the Bloomberg Tech Summit. Come join us. We're going 0:01:45.840 --> 0:01:49.320 to start off with Tesla and for this, as always, 0:01:49.320 --> 0:01:55.120 we have Dana Hull, Bloomberg's Elon Reporter extraordinaire Ala Dana. Hey, Hey, 0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:59.400 And we have Max Chepkin, Bloomberg BusinessWeek's senior writer editor 0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:06.400 and ava fanatic of the New York Metropolitans. Hey, David, Hello, Max, Okay, Dana. 0:02:07.480 --> 0:02:11.640 So we wake up Sunday to find Elon is in Beijing. 0:02:12.120 --> 0:02:15.160 I'm not sure we knew that was going to happen. 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:19.239 He shows up out of the blue there to do 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:23.919 what exactly and does he achieve what he's trying to do? 0:02:24.919 --> 0:02:27.880 Well? I mean, if you follow his jet, which obviously 0:02:28.200 --> 0:02:30.679 those of us who follow Elon, no, I mean you 0:02:31.160 --> 0:02:34.240 knew that he was heading to China, but it wasn't 0:02:34.240 --> 0:02:36.639 an announced visit, if that's what you mean. But I 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:39.519 think what's interesting is, you know, to back up for 0:02:39.560 --> 0:02:41.760 a minute, Elon was supposed to go to India. He 0:02:41.800 --> 0:02:44.440 cancels the trip to India, says he's got pressing matters 0:02:44.440 --> 0:02:47.000 at Tesla. He has an earnings call where he basically 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:49.560 says the future of the company is all about autonomy. 0:02:50.520 --> 0:02:53.920 And then he pops up in Beijing, which is not 0:02:53.960 --> 0:02:56.160 where Tesla has its factory, but he meets with like 0:02:56.200 --> 0:02:59.560 the number two guy in China, and then basically they're 0:02:59.560 --> 0:03:02.760 trying to get permission to unroll what they call FSD 0:03:03.080 --> 0:03:06.560 in China, which is a huge undertaking because the mapping 0:03:06.639 --> 0:03:09.519 in China is very different than the road system in 0:03:09.560 --> 0:03:12.239 the United States that it's like a whole different regulatory regime. 0:03:12.280 --> 0:03:15.040 It's an enormous country. But this is like a big 0:03:15.080 --> 0:03:17.800 deal for Elon, and I think it just kind of 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:20.079 shows that, like, you know, love him or hate him, 0:03:20.120 --> 0:03:22.480 whatever you think about the guy, he is just like 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:26.440 operating on a level that is very different from the 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:29.480 way most other CEOs operate. And you know, so he's 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:32.480 in China and the stock goes up to its highest, 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:34.760 you know, has its highest gain in over three years. 0:03:34.800 --> 0:03:37.640 The market is betting on this whole idea that the 0:03:37.680 --> 0:03:40.320 future of the company is not really about selling cars, 0:03:40.720 --> 0:03:41.840 it's about selling software. 0:03:42.040 --> 0:03:44.560 You know, Max, It's funny. For the longest time I've 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:46.800 been telling myself that, boy, we really need to talk 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:49.400 about China on this podcast. We have failed to Max 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:52.560 until now. China is pretty darn important for Tesla, is 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:52.800 it not. 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:57.080 Yeah, So, Tesla is a factory in China. As Dana hinted, 0:03:57.400 --> 0:04:00.360 China is also the biggest market for electric vehicle. It's 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:02.520 widely thought of as sort of the market with the 0:04:02.520 --> 0:04:05.520 most potential for electric vehicle sales. And you know that's 0:04:05.560 --> 0:04:07.960 because it's a huge country, of course, big economy, but 0:04:08.040 --> 0:04:11.440 also because the government, the Chinese government has invested and 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:15.000 promoted this industry in a huge way, and it actually 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:18.160 has made Elon Musk kind of a centerpiece of that. 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:22.160 The thing is, what's happened in the past couple of 0:04:22.200 --> 0:04:26.000 years is we've seen this new wave of Chinese car companies. 0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:30.279 We've talked on this podcast before about byd Jaomi, you know, 0:04:30.360 --> 0:04:33.080 better known as smartphone maker, is making cars. Lots of 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:37.000 Chinese companies are having lots of success making cars, which 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:38.680 was kind of the plan all along. I mean The 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:41.920 reason that China gave Elon Musk a bunch of sort 0:04:41.960 --> 0:04:45.240 of favorable policies and so on was because they wanted this. 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:47.120 They wanted him to kind of be at the center 0:04:47.320 --> 0:04:49.480 of their EV industry, and that's kind of what happened. 0:04:49.520 --> 0:04:52.159 And and Elon Musk is kind of still enjoying the 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:53.880 fruits of that relationship, right. 0:04:53.960 --> 0:04:56.919 So they did court him back in the day to 0:04:57.000 --> 0:05:00.400 help jump start their EV industry they needed in Then 0:05:01.040 --> 0:05:04.440 I get the sense that China doesn't quite need him 0:05:04.680 --> 0:05:07.279 as much now. He kind of needs China more than 0:05:07.360 --> 0:05:08.120 China needs him. 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:09.720 No, China doesn't need him. 0:05:09.880 --> 0:05:11.920 We were talking about India a couple of weeks ago, 0:05:12.120 --> 0:05:14.960 and I mentioned that, you know, it's a little risky 0:05:15.080 --> 0:05:17.640 to go to India and potentially announce a big investment 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:19.760 because China is not going to like that. And I 0:05:19.800 --> 0:05:23.000 don't think it's a coincidence that we had this cancelation 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:25.359 of the India trip and this trip to China. And 0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:28.919 when you look at the way that the Chinese media 0:05:28.960 --> 0:05:31.520 is playing it, you know they're mentioning, prominently mentioning the 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:32.760 cancelation of the India trip. 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:37.760 Now, Dana, this deal that he has apparently inked for 0:05:37.880 --> 0:05:42.520 full self driving, which we have described at length in 0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:46.000 previous episodes. You can you can just find those discussions 0:05:46.000 --> 0:05:49.200 there in the archive. But is this deal, Dana Hall, 0:05:49.440 --> 0:05:51.800 is it final or is it they still need to 0:05:51.839 --> 0:05:54.719 work out some other particular No, I don't. 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:58.080 Think it's final. I think it's like directionally positive that 0:05:58.200 --> 0:06:00.760 they got you know, he you know, so he was 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:04.239 in Beijing meeting with the Number two talking about FSD. 0:06:04.839 --> 0:06:07.920 He's got a relationship with Beadu to sort of underwrite 0:06:08.040 --> 0:06:11.080 or underpin a lot of the mapping that's needed. He 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.800 got some permission from not the military directly, but like 0:06:14.880 --> 0:06:19.000 some kind of military apparatus that will allow Tesla to 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:21.960 operate more easily in China. I mean a lot of 0:06:21.960 --> 0:06:26.479 things still have to happen, but it's all directionally very positive. 0:06:26.800 --> 0:06:29.159 And Tesla hasn't announced anything. I mean, there's been no 0:06:29.839 --> 0:06:33.640 announcement or filing from Tesla whatsoever saying that they're now 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:37.279 rolling out FSD in China. But that's certainly what the 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:38.719 market is excited about. 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:39.880 I mean, there's no deal. 0:06:39.920 --> 0:06:43.680 They're on a list of like qualified car companies to 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:46.760 conceivably along with like dozens of others. I think I 0:06:46.800 --> 0:06:50.360 think some seventy or eighty other car models are on 0:06:50.360 --> 0:06:55.080 this list that give them the right to conceivably launch this, 0:06:55.200 --> 0:06:58.120 and they're all of these issues. So China, of course 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:01.560 is very concerned learned about AI. You know this, this 0:07:01.640 --> 0:07:04.960 is not a liberal democracy as a country that regulates 0:07:04.960 --> 0:07:08.360 its technology very closely that you know, wants certain access 0:07:08.400 --> 0:07:11.720 to data and that's very important with you know, any 0:07:11.760 --> 0:07:14.720 kind of software and especially with a data collection scheme 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:18.000 like a quote unquote Robotaxi. And the other thing is 0:07:18.120 --> 0:07:21.920 China has been very adamant about ensuring that local partners 0:07:22.160 --> 0:07:24.240 are playing a role, so that's why they had this this. 0:07:24.760 --> 0:07:27.160 The other part of this is this announcement of a 0:07:27.320 --> 0:07:29.720 deal with Baidu, which Tesla already had you know, a 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:33.440 relationship with before. But it's it's essentially like little breadcrumbs 0:07:33.680 --> 0:07:37.520 that point in a somewhat promising direction. And that coupled 0:07:37.520 --> 0:07:40.560 with Elon Musk saying last week that he thought, you know, 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:44.560 full self driving quote unquote could happen in China, that 0:07:44.600 --> 0:07:46.320 the people are taking that as a positive sign. 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:49.239 Yeah, and we're going to go back to that earnings call. 0:07:49.480 --> 0:07:53.720 Actually now, you know, Dana whether the market reaction this 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:57.240 week when the stock short fifteen percent on Monday, is 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:02.000 an overreaction or not. It comes on the heels of 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:04.640 a big rebound in the stock last week as well. 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:06.640 The stock, of course, had been tanking all year, and 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:10.640 now it's it's bounced back over thirty percent, even though 0:08:10.640 --> 0:08:13.679 I think it's it opened up down a bit today. 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.560 I suppose to a certain degree, you kind of got 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:18.680 to give it to Musk. He sort of pulled a 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:21.360 rabbit out of his hat here, turning around a stock 0:08:21.400 --> 0:08:23.400 that had been essentially in free fall. 0:08:24.440 --> 0:08:24.680 Yeah. 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:26.840 I mean he changed the narrative, and he's very good 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:28.520 at that. I mean, this is a guy who's been 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:31.160 the CEO since two thousand and eight. He has been 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:35.079 through cycles before and and he kind of he understands 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:38.080 Wall Street psychology, which is like what is the long 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:40.280 term future of the company. And you know, so the 0:08:40.320 --> 0:08:42.920 whole year has been crappy, the stock has been down. 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:45.920 He seemed distracted. He seemed to be focusing on all 0:08:45.920 --> 0:08:48.080 of his other companies and not on Tesla, which is 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:51.600 the key to his wealth. You had the layoffs, you 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:55.720 had sagging sales, like all this like negative negative, negative, negative, 0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:57.720 so he comes into the earnings call and like he 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:00.360 knows that he's got to turn it around, so he 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:01.400 like plants a flag. 0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:04.160 Yeah, what exactly did he say on that call? Because 0:09:04.320 --> 0:09:07.520 just shortly before he gets on that call, the earnings 0:09:07.559 --> 0:09:09.840 came out, the first quarter earnings, and they were about 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:12.320 a disappointing or maybe even more disappointing than everybody had 0:09:12.360 --> 0:09:15.400 thought they'd be. He opens his mouth though on the call, 0:09:15.480 --> 0:09:17.560 and then the stock just starts going up and up 0:09:17.600 --> 0:09:21.760 and up. What was it in particular that that investors 0:09:21.800 --> 0:09:22.360 latched onto. 0:09:23.280 --> 0:09:26.680 Well, he basically planted a very strong flag and talked 0:09:26.720 --> 0:09:29.000 about autonomy. And I think we have tape on that. 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:31.439 Yes we do. You're right, let's listen to it. 0:09:31.480 --> 0:09:34.160 Really, we should be thought of as an AI robotics company. 0:09:34.559 --> 0:09:38.079 If you value tells it as just like an order company, 0:09:38.640 --> 0:09:41.880 you would just have to fundamentally just the wrong framework 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:44.600 then will come to be. If you ask the wrong question, 0:09:45.520 --> 0:09:48.439 then the right answer is impossible. I mean, if somebody 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:50.880 doesn't believe tell is going to solve autonomy, I think 0:09:50.880 --> 0:09:53.560 they should not be an investor in the company. 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:57.120 If you just value Tessel's an auto company. Max Chafkin 0:09:57.160 --> 0:10:00.680 you're a loser. But listen, Dana. But here's the thing. 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:04.679 Is it actually the autonomous part that drove the stock 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:07.840 up so much or was it more about him talking about, Hey, no, 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:11.559 we have actually haven't given up on this affordable tessel 0:10:11.720 --> 0:10:12.440 model idea. 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:15.720 I mean, I think it was both. They basically said 0:10:15.840 --> 0:10:17.800 it was sort of like they split the you know, 0:10:17.880 --> 0:10:19.839 split the baby in half, or however you want to 0:10:19.880 --> 0:10:22.360 call it. It was like, Oh, don't worry, we still 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:25.240 are going to make affordable cars. Ish, they're gonna be 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:28.080 this kind of like Frankenstein hybrid model where we're going 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:31.400 to take some of the new car and marry it 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:34.720 with some of the next generation unboxed assembly process, and 0:10:34.760 --> 0:10:37.800 we're going to have a cheaper model maybe by the 0:10:37.880 --> 0:10:38.440 end of this year. 0:10:38.679 --> 0:10:41.079 Then actually, let's let's let's listen to the tape on 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:42.040 that as well. Hold on. 0:10:42.440 --> 0:10:45.160 We've updated our future vehicle lineup to accelerate the launch 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:48.439 of new models. Head previously mentioned start production in the 0:10:48.480 --> 0:10:51.080 second half of twenty twenty five, so we expect it 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:53.960 to be more like the early twenty twenty five, if. 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:54.640 Not late this year. 0:10:55.160 --> 0:10:58.800 These new vehicles, including more affordable models, will use aspects 0:10:58.800 --> 0:11:01.400 of the next generation platform as well as aspects of 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:04.360 our current platforms, and we'll be able to produce on 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:06.800 the same manufacturing lenes as like currentfig. 0:11:06.520 --> 0:11:09.599 Lineup, all of which means what mister chaff. 0:11:09.480 --> 0:11:10.400 It means nothing. 0:11:10.600 --> 0:11:14.800 I mean, it's kind of amazing that we went into 0:11:14.840 --> 0:11:17.000 this saying is he going to what is he going 0:11:17.080 --> 0:11:19.800 to say about the model to this cheaper car? And 0:11:20.040 --> 0:11:22.640 that clip that you played that was it, I mean 0:11:22.840 --> 0:11:25.080 during that because it raises all these questions, like so 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:28.319 he said that the car would be made on the 0:11:29.520 --> 0:11:31.680 more affordable car will be made on the same production lines. 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:33.640 Kind of raises a question, so are we talking about 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:35.560 a new model or we talking about a cheaper version 0:11:35.600 --> 0:11:38.199 of a current model, which an analyst asked and Elon 0:11:38.320 --> 0:11:41.080 Musk said, ooh, no comment. We've said all we will 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:44.040 on this back to the Robotaxi, and this happened several 0:11:44.040 --> 0:11:46.320 times during the call. An analyst would ask kind of 0:11:46.360 --> 0:11:49.679 like a reasonable question about these new models and or 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:53.000 supposed new models, and Elon Musk would say, never mind, robotaxi. 0:11:53.360 --> 0:11:56.480 And so it's pretty clear to me anyway that there 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:58.839 are two things going on. One is they're going to 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:02.760 launch this Robotaxi, and by launch I mean have a 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:05.520 car that looks Robotaxi ish and lift a sheet off 0:12:05.520 --> 0:12:09.120 of it in August. And they are trying very aggressively 0:12:09.160 --> 0:12:11.679 to lower the prices of the Model three and the 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:15.640 Model Why Elon Musk hasn't specifically said that there isn't 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:17.600 going to be a Model too, but it really when 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:20.040 you look at what he's saying, how he's saying it, 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:21.960 it seems pretty clear. You have two things. You have 0:12:22.000 --> 0:12:24.840 the Robotaxi, and you have an effort to keep get 0:12:24.840 --> 0:12:27.880 the prices on the current lineup as low as possible 0:12:28.040 --> 0:12:31.600 and maybe do whatever you can to refresh that lineup. 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:35.559 And that is that is a huge departure from everything, 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:37.760 not everything, but for many of the things that Elon 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:40.200 Musk has been signaling and saying and so on over 0:12:40.240 --> 0:12:42.240 the last year or so. 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.560 Okay, so Dan Max is from what I glean here 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:53.400 feels like the market perhaps is irrationally exuberant about mister 0:12:53.480 --> 0:12:57.120 Musk's comments. Nonetheless, the stock is way back up for 0:12:57.240 --> 0:12:59.960 the moment and things are at least looking slightly less 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:02.960 hour there. But the layoffs continue, do they not? 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:06.320 Just to be super clear, the news from this morning 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:11.320 is that two more key executives are gone fired or 0:13:11.360 --> 0:13:15.160 dismissed or however it actually went down, and their entire 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:18.400 divisions are also closing. So and that's the new Car 0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:21.520 division and as Dana is saying, that the Supercharger division. 0:13:21.679 --> 0:13:23.160 So it's not like you have to like be a 0:13:23.200 --> 0:13:25.960 close reader of the things that Elon Musk says during 0:13:26.000 --> 0:13:28.160 his earnings call to figure out what's going on with 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:28.800 the new models. 0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:31.520 He just dismissed the entire new model team. 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:34.640 Yeah, I mean, so's Ed Ludlow and I reported Musk 0:13:34.720 --> 0:13:38.240 wanted to cut twenty percent, and then when they announced 0:13:38.280 --> 0:13:42.040 the layoffs, the email from him said more than ten percent. 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:44.600 So like, what is that? Is that nineteen percent? Is 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:46.880 that eighteen percent? Like we've never gotten like a very 0:13:46.880 --> 0:13:49.400 clear number. But the layoffs have been happening in waves, 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:52.960 and just overnight a lot of people on the Supercharging 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.800 team were impacted, and you're starting to see people post 0:13:55.840 --> 0:13:58.560 on LinkedIn and Twitter and elsewhere about how, yeah, my 0:13:58.679 --> 0:14:01.079 team and I were wiped out. And this comes at 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:04.400 like a really pivotal time for the company because you know, 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:07.520 the big news of twenty twenty three was that Tesla 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:10.720 was finally opening at supercharger network to other automakers, So 0:14:10.720 --> 0:14:14.120 if you own like a Ford or a GM electric vehicle, 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:17.480 you can now go to superchargers. And the whole integration 0:14:17.840 --> 0:14:22.280 of supercharging with other automakers is a big theme of 0:14:22.320 --> 0:14:24.640 like the summer of twenty twenty four. Now all of 0:14:24.680 --> 0:14:27.800 the people that were in charge of kind of you know, 0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:31.160 inking those deals and leading those partnerships are gone and 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:33.480 all of this is happening in the broader context of 0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:36.360 Elon wants his pay package, so he's very much leaning 0:14:36.360 --> 0:14:39.520 into this like I'm back in the saddle, I'm in charge, 0:14:39.560 --> 0:14:42.000 I'm making tough decisions, I'm laying people off, I'm going 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:44.840 to China. Like he's doing all this stuff to kind 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:48.760 of prove to his shareholders that he is still very 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:51.440 much the CEO and he deserves that big pay. 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:52.040 You know. 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:54.960 The other thing is it seems that he has closed 0:14:54.960 --> 0:14:58.240 the policy division, which again is kind of a curious 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:02.520 choice when you're trying to laun a heavily regulated likely 0:15:02.560 --> 0:15:05.480 to be controversial, you know, I think regulators are gonna 0:15:05.480 --> 0:15:07.680 have something to say about releasing car without a steering wheel, 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:10.240 And it seems like at least, the current policy team 0:15:10.640 --> 0:15:13.840 is going to be replaced with some new arrangement that 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:17.400 hopefully won't just be like an emoji like the NITSA 0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:21.280 regulator send an email to to Elon Musk and they 0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:22.680 get a poop back or something. 0:15:23.400 --> 0:15:26.560 Yeah, no, that well, it's distinctly possible. We've we've had 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:28.800 a lot of poop emojis sent our way over these 0:15:28.880 --> 0:15:32.680 last couple of years. But Dan, so, just to finish 0:15:32.720 --> 0:15:34.760 up for a second on the earnings call, because of 0:15:34.760 --> 0:15:38.600 course before the earnings call, we put out in front 0:15:38.600 --> 0:15:42.840 of the world again our Tesla Bingo card, our earnings 0:15:42.880 --> 0:15:46.680 Bingo card, and did we get bingo or not? 0:15:47.480 --> 0:15:50.080 Once again? You know, Max and I worked really hard 0:15:50.120 --> 0:15:52.280 to kind of try to create a create a Bingo 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:54.880 Bingo card. That's that was going to do it for us. 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:58.120 We were one short because even though he said a 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:00.720 lot of things that were on our card, he never 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:02.880 said the word interest rates, and then we would have 0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:04.520 gotten it. We would have gotten it if he'd said 0:16:04.520 --> 0:16:05.080 interest rates. 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:11.400 Yeah, Row one going across Robotax, Saxey regulatory approval, next 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:12.880 gen and Horse. 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:14.240 Actually he said horse twice. 0:16:14.240 --> 0:16:17.720 Okay, very good. Well, we'll be back with another new 0:16:17.760 --> 0:16:25.320 and improved Bingos Bingo card. Come come second quarter earnings. Okay, 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:29.280 So now we're gonna talk about the two year anniversary 0:16:29.400 --> 0:16:33.040 of Elon Musk's purchase of Twitter now X and to 0:16:33.120 --> 0:16:37.600 do that we have joining us Kurt Wagner, Bloomberg technology 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:40.760 reporter and author of the book Battle for the Bird. 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:44.600 Welcome, Kurt, hey, Thank you for having me appreciate it. 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:47.480 It's been a while since we've talked about how things 0:16:47.520 --> 0:16:51.200 are going at X and the current state of finances there. 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:53.040 How is it going well. 0:16:53.040 --> 0:16:56.440 We don't have many updates from the last time we 0:16:56.520 --> 0:16:59.240 all chatted. We know that things were not going well 0:16:59.320 --> 0:17:01.960 at the end of the lastlast year, not only because 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.679 there was the lingering effects of the advertising you know, 0:17:06.040 --> 0:17:08.240 issues that the company had had, but as you all 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:11.120 remember very well, Elon then went on stage at the 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:13.359 deal Book conference and I believe it was early December 0:17:13.400 --> 0:17:15.840 and told advertisers to go f themselves, right. So he 0:17:15.960 --> 0:17:19.400 sort of ended twenty twenty three, came into twenty twenty 0:17:19.400 --> 0:17:22.240 four on a very sour note, and as we've talked 0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:26.560 about historically, like his behavior on X. In my opinion 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:28.159 and from the conversations i've had with a lot of 0:17:28.160 --> 0:17:31.000 marketers is the biggest turnoff and the biggest hurdle to 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:34.000 their entire business, and we've seen that that's continued to 0:17:34.119 --> 0:17:36.560 this day. You know, he tweets things that are incredibly 0:17:36.640 --> 0:17:39.639 inappropriate regardless of who you are, but especially as the 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:42.840 CEO and face of this company. And so we don't 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:44.840 have numbers because they're not publicly traded, they don't have 0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:47.879 to report earnings, but we just I don't think anything 0:17:47.920 --> 0:17:50.600 has really improved since we talked about this a couple 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:52.959 of months ago, when things were really in a downward spiral. 0:17:53.080 --> 0:17:56.800 Yeah, Now, Kurt on his behavior on X, he's actually 0:17:57.200 --> 0:18:00.080 been trying to remove what is essentially something of a 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:03.840 gag order on him on X, not as it's related 0:18:04.000 --> 0:18:07.720 to the company X, but as related to Tesla. This 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:11.520 is the fame Twitter sitter. Explain what's transpired. 0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:16.399 Yeah, so quick backstory, But basically, after he promised to 0:18:16.680 --> 0:18:19.159 or pledge to take Tesla private at four hundred and 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:22.320 twenty dollars per share, which he ultimately did not you know, 0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:25.040 have the money to do, the sec came to a 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:29.720 settlement agreement with Elon where his posts on Twitter or 0:18:29.800 --> 0:18:32.480 now X that are related to Tesla need to be 0:18:32.520 --> 0:18:36.160 approved or at least vetted by a company lawyer, and 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:38.880 so he has been trying to get rid of this 0:18:39.040 --> 0:18:42.119 Twitter sitter as it's called, and you know, saying that 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:44.119 this is an infringement on his free speech. He was 0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:47.119 hoping that the Supreme Court would actually take up this 0:18:47.280 --> 0:18:50.359 case and determine whether this was violation of his free speech. 0:18:50.400 --> 0:18:52.679 But the Supreme Court said, no, we're not. You know, 0:18:52.720 --> 0:18:55.320 we have other things going on that we should probably 0:18:55.400 --> 0:18:58.440 be putting more attention to, so they sort of chose 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.320 not to take that case. But I mean, honestly, honestly, 0:19:02.680 --> 0:19:06.840 I cannot believe that there is a lawyer who already 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:10.000 reviews his Tesla tweets and approves of them, because it 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:13.399 seems crazy that any of this stuff is vetted. Certainly, 0:19:13.400 --> 0:19:15.959 everything that's unrelated to Tesla is clearly not vetted. And 0:19:16.000 --> 0:19:18.639 even the Tesla stuff, as you guys can probably attest to, 0:19:18.760 --> 0:19:21.760 sometimes seems quite borderline to me. So I'm not sure 0:19:21.800 --> 0:19:23.920 how much this really matters. 0:19:24.240 --> 0:19:25.600 So to back up for a minute, I mean, there 0:19:25.640 --> 0:19:27.800 really was a Twitter sitter. We knew their name at 0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:30.119 one point. It was in like a filing in between 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:32.600 like the sec and MUSC and his lawyers. But then 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:35.199 there's been so much turnover in Tesla's legal department that 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.520 I actually don't know who has the job right now. 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:41.680 But it's like the Designated Securities Council, like it has 0:19:41.720 --> 0:19:43.720 like a name, And a lot of people were like, 0:19:43.840 --> 0:19:45.800 you're just making this up. There is no Twitter sitter, 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:47.399 and I was like, no, no, there really is. 0:19:47.720 --> 0:19:51.359 I guess I'm curious, Dana. You followed Elon as close 0:19:51.359 --> 0:19:54.920 as anybody. Do you really think he's composing a tweet, 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:57.399 taking the time to email it over to some lawyer, 0:19:57.440 --> 0:19:59.879 waiting for approval before posting it. I just have no 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:02.160 impossible time imagining. 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:06.440 How dare you suggest that when Elon Musk tweets a 0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:09.560 picture of one dog placing its testicles on another dog, 0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:12.879 that he is not vetting that with Tesla's compliance department. 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:15.000 Well, you don't know what was what was you know 0:20:15.160 --> 0:20:17.080 what the original Yeah, that's true. 0:20:17.119 --> 0:20:19.159 You're right. The compliance department might have been like, we 0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:20.480 got to dial this one back. 0:20:20.600 --> 0:20:22.800