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Speaker 1: It could happen. Here is the podcast that this is

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Speaker 1: right now, would you guys? When do you guys? Solo

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Speaker 1: intro this podcast? James Stout Mia Wong do y'all? Uh

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Speaker 1: do y'all just like shout a tonally? Ever? Have you

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Speaker 1: have y'all tried that yet?

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Speaker 2: I haven't.

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Speaker 3: I struggled with the intro. I just say hello everyone, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: You know James. Nope, No, that's your try, that's your

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Speaker 1: that's your East Coast Ivy League elitism. Uh coming through.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's correct for it.

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Speaker 3: Ever since I was born in Boston, I had, yeah,

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Speaker 3: growing up on a different side of the tracks to yourself,

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Speaker 3: also from Boston, New course.

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Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, yes, uh.

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Speaker 2: In trade tracks in Boston.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure I'm not allowed currently to do the accent.

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Speaker 3: Because Sophie for legal reasons.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I uh yeah, yeah, she's got some dirt

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Speaker 1: on me. Anyway, we are a podcast asked about things

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Speaker 1: falling apart, and you know what would make things fall

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Speaker 1: apart worse than they already are is if Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: won a second term. So today, true, we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk partly about that, and we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: the indictments against him. That's the big news, right, the

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Speaker 1: most recent big political news. Unless he's been indicted again

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Speaker 1: by the time this episode drops, not impossible.

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Speaker 2: Send another one ready to draw up.

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Speaker 1: But from my last kind, I think he's at like

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Speaker 1: seventy eight charges felony charges at the moment, So honestly,

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Speaker 1: he might get to triple digits. It's not he's not

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Speaker 1: all that far.

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Speaker 2: There's stuff like I didn't realize. Well, I guess I

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Speaker 2: knew intellectually that you could you could be charged with

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Speaker 2: conspiracy to do something and then also doing it, but

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Speaker 2: I don't think I know, Yeah, Like I don't think

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Speaker 2: I've ever seen a politician charged with both conspiracy and

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Speaker 2: the actual doing of the thing. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I hope at some point, assuming you know, we continue

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Speaker 1: to have some thing that resembles freedom of speech, we'll

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Speaker 1: get a good book about like how the whole process

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Speaker 1: of them had, like figuring out how and when and

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Speaker 1: weather to actually like go after him. I mean, obviously

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Speaker 1: we're talking about both, like the FEDS and the DA

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Speaker 1: in New York, But I am interested in both of

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Speaker 1: those stories because there has to be there have to

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Speaker 1: have been some real interesting conversations. But yeah, we are

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Speaker 1: right now, we're looking at him. He's about to be

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Speaker 1: arraigned as we talk about this, for inciting an insurrection

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Speaker 1: at the capitol. So that's pretty cool. Mia, you wanted

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Speaker 1: to to start us off here.

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Speaker 2: I think, yeah, yeah, And I think this is okay.

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Speaker 2: So this is an interesting indictment in that, like it

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Speaker 2: somehow took them about two years to like actually do

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Speaker 2: the indictment. That's like, hey, it's illegal to try to

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Speaker 2: overthrow the government point installing yourself as president.

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Speaker 1: And in fairness, they don't have a lot of experience

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Speaker 1: charging people with that one.

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Speaker 2: Well, and we should actually mention they should Bush. Well,

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Speaker 2: here's the thing, Bush Bush. Actually we're gonna talk about

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Speaker 2: this more later. But like Bush actually got away with

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Speaker 2: this right, Like the last time a court ruled on

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Speaker 2: whether a president can use the courts to instalve themselves

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Speaker 2: as president, the Supreme Court was like, yeah, that's fine,

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Speaker 2: that's like no problem, Like, yeah, it's fine, you could

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Speaker 2: you can have a mob show up and disrupt the

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Speaker 2: counting process and it's fine. But Trump like fucked up

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Speaker 2: and didn't do it the way you're supposed to. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and you know there's something sort of I don't know.

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Speaker 2: So there's something I was thinking about while I was

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Speaker 2: reading this, which is like the English languish, doesn't I

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Speaker 2: think part of the issue here is like we don't

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Speaker 2: I don't know. The English language doesn't even like have

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Speaker 2: a good word for like the kind of coup that

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Speaker 2: Trump was doing. Like there's a Spanish word which is

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Speaker 2: auto goulpe, which is like yeah, Spanish, Jam's got a

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Speaker 2: great one in English and translates the self coup, and

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Speaker 2: we're just like, ah, we're done. It's like no, No,

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Speaker 2: that sucks. That time sucks.

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Speaker 1: It's really I wish I had a better than Trump

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Speaker 1: voice because then I could do on a golpe.

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Speaker 2: What is that is that?

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Speaker 1: Like a like like at seven eleven the big sixty

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Speaker 1: four rounds Diet Coach get But I can't do it.

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Speaker 1: I can't do a good Trump. So that wasn't as

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Speaker 1: funny as it should have. Anyway, whatever, please continue with.

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Speaker 2: We had it, so you know, I think, you know,

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Speaker 2: I think it's worth kind of thinking a little bit,

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Speaker 2: and we're gonna sort of come back to this as

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Speaker 2: we go through this case, but I think it's worth

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Speaker 2: remembering that again, like everything Trump is doing in This

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Speaker 2: is based off of like is it is based off

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Speaker 2: of the sort of Bush thing into in two thousand

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Speaker 2: where he had a bunch of well, okay, so a

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Speaker 2: bunch of Bush's political operatives like stormed one of the

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Speaker 2: one of the places that was doing the recount in

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Speaker 2: Florida and stopped them from counting the votes and then

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Speaker 2: they just delayed and long enough that he was able

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Speaker 2: to get appointed.

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Speaker 1: Now the Brooks Brothers riot Roger Stone was a major

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Speaker 1: part of that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so we've we've done this, you know, we talked

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Speaker 2: about this on the show like the end of last year.

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Speaker 2: But but again, so the reason this worked though, right,

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Speaker 2: is that Bush made really really sure that there was

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Speaker 2: like a sound legal case sort of behind this entire

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Speaker 2: thing he made. He made really sure to like go

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Speaker 2: through all of the proper like checks and balances and

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Speaker 2: like blah blah blah blah. But Trump just like didn't

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Speaker 2: do this. And the result of this is that Jack Smith,

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Speaker 2: like finally two years later, Jack Smith, who's this guy?

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Speaker 2: He was, he was appointed by Merrick Garland to like

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Speaker 2: take over these two Justice Department cases about Trump has

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Speaker 2: just indicted him with this stuff he has so he's

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Speaker 2: been charged with with three counts of criminal conspiracy, and

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Speaker 2: I think is accounted obstruction. So I'm going to go

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Speaker 2: through what he's actually been charged.

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Speaker 1: I want to note something real quick, which is that

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Speaker 1: another reason why it worked for Bush and it didn't

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Speaker 1: for Trump is that with Bush, it was legitimately the

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Speaker 1: election came down to Florida, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, like it was.

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Speaker 1: It was extremely close. It was really just a couple

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Speaker 1: of counties in Florida. With Trump, he was not trying

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Speaker 1: to just sort of like jink jink part of a state.

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Speaker 1: It was like it was like Biden had a commanding lead. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: It was a big dub for Uncle Joe.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And and you know, so yeah, like obviously, like

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Speaker 2: Trump like just fails at this spectacularly, and the law

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Speaker 2: is finally coming after him. They so they're charging him

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Speaker 2: with conspiracy to defraud the United States, which again is

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Speaker 2: the thing I didn't know you could do.

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Speaker 3: And Lon Semstrong got that, didn't he did?

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Speaker 2: He?

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, because USPS was his sponsor, so he was

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Speaker 3: defrauding the federal government.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the don't yeah, don't don't. Don't you post out.

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Speaker 1: Trump's the first guy who's not rad to get charged

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Speaker 1: with that.

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Speaker 2: Sorry James, Okay, I didn't. I didn't. Yeah, sorry everyone,

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Speaker 2: I'm out. So this this one is, this is specifically

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Speaker 2: like impairing the election, like impairing like the the the

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Speaker 2: votes of the presidential election. The first one is mostly

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Speaker 2: we'll talk about this more in a bit, like the

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Speaker 2: illegitimate electors thing that he did. The second one is

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Speaker 2: just him being charged for They finally found a thing

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Speaker 2: the charge him for doing January sixth, which was they

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Speaker 2: charged him with like conspiracy to obstruct an official preceding,

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Speaker 2: and then they got him also with obstruction obstructing the

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Speaker 2: official proceeding, which again seems like a kind of like

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Speaker 2: this is, I don't know, it's not quite getting out

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Speaker 2: the pope for tax evasion, but like you'd think they'd

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Speaker 2: have something like more.

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Speaker 1: Powerful throw the government, attempting to make yourself a dictator, bonapartism.

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Speaker 1: Well it's not really bonapartism, but yeah.

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Speaker 3: Like seditions, right there, sedition that's a second choice, yeah,

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Speaker 3: right choice.

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Speaker 2: They they gut him on obstruction. Okay, sure, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: Like this is I feel like our our I don't know,

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Speaker 2: our legal system seems to be sort of woefully unprepared

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Speaker 2: for this.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, it's not. Again, in fairness, everyone has before.

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Speaker 1: Trump was willing to play the game, right like we are, Like,

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Speaker 1: obviously George W. Bush stole the fucking election, no argument there,

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Speaker 1: so did Nixon. But they did it with enough plausible deniability,

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Speaker 1: right that the elite were that there was not there

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Speaker 1: was not a fear among the quote unquote deep state

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Speaker 1: or you know, the people the elites in this country

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Speaker 1: that like this would obviously be someone overthrowing the government, right,

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Speaker 1: And Nixon's case, fucking LBJ like basically refused to go

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Speaker 1: after him for breaking the law and extended the Vietnam

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Speaker 1: War and committing treason because it would be bad in

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Speaker 1: his view for the country. Horrible mistake obviously. And with

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Speaker 1: George W. Bush, you know, he had he had the

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Speaker 1: court on his side, and it like so there was

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Speaker 1: there was enough plausible deniability that, you know, it was

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Speaker 1: not like it is with Trump where he was just

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Speaker 1: like I'm gonna have a mob, yeah, like a capital

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Speaker 1: you know, cat.

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Speaker 2: You know, I was thinking about this, like the last

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Speaker 2: time someone actually did something like this, I think it

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Speaker 2: was the Corrupt Bargain in like eighteen seventy three, were

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Speaker 2: just like like they there was this argument or the

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Speaker 2: like Wilmington, Yeah, well I mean I mean like yeah,

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Speaker 2: but like like on on on the presidential level of

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Speaker 2: like literally someone like like Ruthero Behayes famously, like they

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Speaker 2: had basically this incredible thing where like both parties were

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Speaker 2: like they couldn't decide who was supposed to count the

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Speaker 2: votes and which whichever like part of the two parties

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Speaker 2: counted the votes was going to declare it they won

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Speaker 2: the that they won the election. And so they worked

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Speaker 2: out this like incredibly basically they worked out this compromise

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Speaker 2: where like the Republicans got Rutherford Behayes like in office,

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Speaker 2: but they also ended reconstruction. But that but and that

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Speaker 2: that that was a period that was long ago enough

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Speaker 2: that like you could do that shit without like involving

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Speaker 2: the courts or involving this sort of like massive state apparatus.

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Speaker 2: And you kind of like can't, I don't know, you

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Speaker 2: can't outside of like Illinois, you can't really be that

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Speaker 2: corrupt anymore.

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Speaker 3: You have to sort of like the reason Sandvea Goes

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Speaker 3: called en run by the sea Maya.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, look, you have to you have to respect

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Speaker 1: you know, local culture with these kinds of things and Illinois,

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Speaker 1: it would actually be like an act of genocide to

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Speaker 1: try to make Illinois politics not incredibly Oh yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean right, that's the destruction of a people.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Like like one of the most hated political figures

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Speaker 2: in like the entire history of Illinois was this like

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Speaker 2: state senator who went down for corruption, but went down

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Speaker 2: for like one hundred dollars of corruption and despise like

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Speaker 2: one of the most hated political figures in Illinois because

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Speaker 2: he only went down for you only did one hundred

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Speaker 2: dollars of crimes, whereas like our current governor did like

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Speaker 2: a bunch of really funny fraud and everyone loves him

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Speaker 2: because it's hilarious where he like he like he like

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Speaker 2: took all of the bathrooms out of one of his

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Speaker 2: houses so it wouldn't be classified the house.

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Speaker 3: That's kind of That's that's the guy you want in

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Speaker 3: judge your legatives.

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Speaker 1: When he sees a loophole, that's the guy. If we

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Speaker 1: ever have a corruption Olympics, that's our only chance at

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Speaker 1: beating the Russians. Iis is gonna be our dream team.

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Speaker 2: Like Prinsker is the least corrupt governor I've had in

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Speaker 2: my lifetime. This is the least corrupt guy. He is, like,

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Speaker 2: like he is corrupt, but like yeah, it's I don't know,

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Speaker 2: always something amazing. We should probably get back to this stuff.

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Speaker 2: And so the last thing he got was they got

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Speaker 2: him of like conspiracy against rights, so like a conspiracy

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Speaker 2: against the right to vote and have your vote counted,

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Speaker 2: which sure, yeah, do a bad thing to do.

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Speaker 1: I think conspiracy.

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Speaker 2: I mean it's not good, like all of the things

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Speaker 2: that he like they're accusing of, like he pretty he

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Speaker 2: clearly did. Yeah. Yeah. So I want to also talk

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Speaker 2: about the way this has been being talked about in

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Speaker 2: the media because one of the things is happening here,

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Speaker 2: and this is this is sort of a trend with

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Speaker 2: all forms of like things that are in the written language,

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Speaker 2: is that everyone only reads the first like maybe one

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Speaker 2: chapter or like especially the first couple of pages of

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Speaker 2: something from any like written document. So this is why

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Speaker 2: like all the like you know, the like abandon all

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Speaker 2: hope you you enter here from Dante's Inferno. That's that's

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Speaker 2: that's the reason, that's the line everyone knows because it's

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Speaker 2: in like the first couple of chapters and in this one,

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Speaker 2: with this case, The thing that everyone got to was

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Speaker 2: there's this very early part in the indictment where the

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Speaker 2: guy's like, well, yeah, so like it is legal to

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Speaker 2: like lie about the election, like you have the free

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Speaker 2: speech right to do that. But then also Trump knowingly

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Speaker 2: lied about the election and use it to try to

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Speaker 2: like fraud do fraud. And everyone's getting really hung up

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Speaker 2: on this thing about like trying to like the court

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Speaker 2: having to prove that he knew he was lying, which

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Speaker 2: is kind of like an incidental thing to the act

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Speaker 2: actual like like the actual stuff he's getting charged for.

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Speaker 2: We'll get into it, but like like it's not just

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Speaker 2: that he was lying, that he was like actively trying

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Speaker 2: to get a bunch of state officials to appoint him. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: but but this is this has led to some just

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Speaker 2: like absolutely hilarious shit from Republicans who are like, none

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Speaker 2: of you can prove that Trump knew he was lying,

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Speaker 2: Like there's there's no way to know Trump is Trump

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Speaker 2: is so Trump that like you can't you can't, you

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Speaker 2: can't convict him lying because he maybe maybe you just

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Speaker 2: didn't know.

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Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, guys, that may not be the defense

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Speaker 1: you think it is. No, this motherfucker is so dumb.

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Speaker 1: You can't like this guy didn't even know if he's

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Speaker 1: full of shit?

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Speaker 2: So good.

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Speaker 1: It's like it's like arguing that somebody who shoots two

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Speaker 1: or three people to death is not guilty because he

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Speaker 1: had his eyes closed, was pulling the trigger, he didn't

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Speaker 1: know where he was shooting.

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Speaker 2: That's not a crime. The other one, the only one

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Speaker 2: they'd been pulling, is the old like he didn't know

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Speaker 2: it was illegal, which.

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Speaker 1: I or that is absolutely not how the law works.

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Speaker 1: But this is you know who that not how the

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Speaker 1: law works, by.

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Speaker 2: The way, This is this how you can tell that

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Speaker 2: like none of these people have ever like had to

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Speaker 2: deal with the legal system at all ever except for Baby,

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Speaker 2: Like I don't know, like what are two of these

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Speaker 2: guys like probably caught weird charges for like unregulated securities

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Speaker 2: selling or some shit, but like no whom amongst us?

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Speaker 2: You know? Yeah yeah, but yeah, so so the Republican

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Speaker 2: side of it's been very funny. Okay, So before we

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Speaker 2: get into what like specific things they're going after Trump for,

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Speaker 2: I want to like talk about what his actual what

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Speaker 2: Trump's actual plan was, because I think a lot of

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Speaker 2: it's kind of been forgotten. So the first plan and

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Speaker 2: this is the part that is that's not actually in

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Speaker 2: this trial at all, right, like not really like there's

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Speaker 2: his initial plan to steal the election was that. Okay.

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Speaker 2: So one of the things that happened in twenty sixteen

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Speaker 2: was that like absentee voters like over like not a woman,

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Speaker 2: absentee voters like swung enormously Democrat, right, And that was

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Speaker 2: one of the things Trump had been using to prove

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Speaker 2: there was like voter fraud or whatever. And then you know,

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Speaker 2: COVID happened, and so Trump had this, like you know,

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Speaker 2: had had a plan which was like on a what

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Speaker 2: He's like, okay, so on election night, it's going to

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Speaker 2: look like I won because they're only going to have counted,

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Speaker 2: like they're only gonna have counted the votes that were

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Speaker 2: like done in person, and those are overwhelmingly Trump. And

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Speaker 2: I remember like that night, like having to tell all

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Speaker 2: my friends, like no, no, no, these are not the

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Speaker 2: real results. This is this is this is just the

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Speaker 2: in person votes. The absente votes are coming.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And his initial plan was to try to just like

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Speaker 2: declare victory that night, basically try to declare victory immediately

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Speaker 2: and then get everyone to stop counting and that didn't work,

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Speaker 2: Like even like even Fox News would have eventually like

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Speaker 2: stopped playing along with it, Like this got to make

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Speaker 2: a huge trouble with Trump because they like called Arizona.

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Speaker 1: Yeah he's still pissed that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, now and again like this this didn't work, so

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Speaker 2: they didn't like he's not being tried for that, even

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Speaker 2: though that was also very blatantly steal the election. What

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Speaker 2: they are charging him for was so after after, so

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Speaker 2: there was like that stuff, and there was all these

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Speaker 2: like stop the vote mobs that kept showing up in places, yes,

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Speaker 2: stop the count right, yeah, yeah, it's it's not the count,

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Speaker 2: but then also in some places they are like we

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Speaker 2: need to count more and yeah, yeah, it was like

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Speaker 2: it was a it was a whole thing. But you

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Speaker 2: know what, once that fails, right, Trump and his coup

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Speaker 2: plotters are like legal people are just sort of like

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Speaker 2: freestyling it. And that's the part where you get to

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Speaker 2: the actual conspiracies that he's being charged with here. But

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Speaker 2: before before we get to those conspiracies, do you know

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Speaker 2: what else is a conspiracy?

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Speaker 3: The existence of products and services which you think will

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Speaker 3: improve your life.

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Speaker 2: How cheap they are, that's the conspiracy they've lowered the

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Speaker 2: price so much it is illegal of all products and services.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that's defacial news. Incredible news. We're back and uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've got some good news for you. We are all

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Speaker 1: sponsored this week by three shipping crates of illegal contraband

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Speaker 1: Marlboro cigarettes that are Buddy Jimmy over at the Docks

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Speaker 1: managed to get so six bucks a pack, guys, six

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Speaker 1: bucks a pack, just you know, send them to Jimmy

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Speaker 1: at ProtonMail dot com. He'll he'll mail you cigarettes. You

347
00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:29,240
Speaker 1: know you've venmo him the cash, He'll send you some cigarettes.

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Speaker 1: There you go.

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Speaker 2: This is probably less illegal than anything we're talking about

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Speaker 2: right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, almost certainly. Look, it's not against the law to

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Speaker 1: sell cigarettes that that you don't pay taxes on. I

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Speaker 1: think we can all agree that that's fine.

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Speaker 2: Actually, no, you can use that apt I think you

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Speaker 2: legally can do that if you're selling it in an airport.

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Speaker 1: If you're selling it in an airport, yeah, if it's

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Speaker 1: duty free, right, And I, because I have such a

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Speaker 1: childlike imagination, the whole world is really my airport. Ergo,

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Speaker 1: we can always sell tax free cigarettes here at cool

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Speaker 1: Zone Media.

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Speaker 3: That's why we have the small plane that takes off

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Speaker 3: from Rob's house every day. It's like a remote control plane.

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Speaker 1: That's right, that's right from a text, it technically counts.

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Speaker 1: And we are also allowed to run those those Joe

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Speaker 1: camel ads again, so you know, everybody who's nineties nostalgic,

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Speaker 1: there you go once who made it all? Right?

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Speaker 2: So the first conspiracy thing that he's getting charged with

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Speaker 2: is the like fake electors thing. He also has like

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Speaker 2: six unnamed co conspirators, and we know we probably know

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Speaker 2: who like five of them are. So the first one,

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Speaker 2: obviously is Rudy Giuliotti, who is having the time of

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Speaker 2: his life question Mark he is he is like he

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Speaker 2: is melting so funny TV like it's The second one

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Speaker 2: is probably John Eastman. And this is interesting because Eastman

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Speaker 2: is the guy who he's like the legal mind behind

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Speaker 2: in January sixth. He's the guy who like thinks that

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Speaker 2: he's found a loophole in the law that allows like

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Speaker 2: the vice president to refuse to certify the election. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and so this is I don't want to make something

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Speaker 2: clear at the outset, like he does not have like

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Speaker 2: Pence does not have the power to do this.

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Speaker 1: You're not allowed to do that.

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Speaker 2: No, no, like you can't do this right, like, like

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Speaker 2: this is if Pence had gone along with this, that

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Speaker 2: would have been a coup, right like that.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I call this a coup.

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Speaker 1: Like there's not a clause in the constitution that says

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Speaker 1: unless this guy doesn't want to have an election. This

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Speaker 1: is not.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 3: It's seemed like admiralty flag ta legal conspiracy that yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: guaranteed it came from Reddit before he found it.

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Speaker 2: That's it's some it's some real bullshit like this somehow again,

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Speaker 2: this is the legal basis for what they were trying

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Speaker 2: to do in January sixth I I don't know. Words

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Speaker 2: words fail me, Like tragedy is farce of the Brooks

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Speaker 2: Brothers riot, I guess, but like this is like farst

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Speaker 2: number three at I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I think the first one. The first one was Nixon

400
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Speaker 1: extending the Vietnam War in order to uh win his election.

401
00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,000
Speaker 1: The farce was the Brooks Brothers riot. And now we're

402
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Speaker 1: at like lead poisoning, brain damage.

403
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Speaker 2: Yeah, like this is this is this is Marks failed

404
00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:30,800
Speaker 2: to consider that you could have a third or fourth farce,

405
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Speaker 2: like he only got to one. So speaking speaking of farce,

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Speaker 2: so the third the third cookes Buwag is probably Sidney Powell,

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Speaker 2: who apparently the last I heard about Sidney Powell, He's

408
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Speaker 2: currently like owns a bed and breakfast and spends all

409
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Speaker 2: of his time talking with his guest about the Trump administration.

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Speaker 2: So things are going great for Sidney Powell, who is

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Speaker 2: on a.

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Speaker 3: Trump's more or less what I would like him to do. Yeah, yeah,

413
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Speaker 3: I mean he can just keep sticking to doing that.

414
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Speaker 2: Yeah great. Yeah. So the fourth guy is Jeffrey Clark,

415
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Speaker 2: who doesn't really matter. The fifth guy I just want

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Speaker 2: to like, Okay, so I I partially there's only like

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Speaker 2: only really Giuliani Eastman in Powell matter. But the fifth

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Speaker 2: guy is named Kenneth Chelsea Bro, which.

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Speaker 1: Okay, now you're fucking with us. Now, that's not a name.

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Speaker 1: That's not a name.

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00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:26,800
Speaker 2: I got nothing. I don't know, Like that is not

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Speaker 2: a name they have like dug up members of like

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Speaker 2: the old Chela arisocracy that like I I got, I

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I've never never been this angry in my life. That's

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Speaker 1: not a naked ship now, like that's that.

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Speaker 3: Okay, it's not Cheese Bro, It's Chelsea Brow.

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Speaker 2: His name, no idea. It's it's c H E. S E.

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Speaker 2: Bro chesa Brow.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, there's no version of how you outside

431
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Speaker 1: of Boston. I know is he bro.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so we should also she's really that's so bad?

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Speaker 3: Yeah no, I know a guy from Central California with

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Speaker 3: that name.

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Speaker 2: That is that is viscerally upsetting. Okay, So just speaking

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Speaker 2: of viscerally upsetting. So we should remind everyone how we

437
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:30,440
Speaker 2: should mind everyone how American elections work, because it's it's

438
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:34,320
Speaker 2: really one of the worst systems anyone's ever developed. So okay, So, like,

439
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 2: as as most people probably know, you don't directly elect

440
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 2: the president. What you do instead is each each state

441
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:45,520
Speaker 2: like you vote, well, okay, so sorry, let's run this up.

442
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:49,760
Speaker 2: Each state selects electors. Now, there's nothing in the constitution

443
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 2: that says you have to select electors by like voting

444
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,840
Speaker 2: for them. It's just that every state chose to do that.

445
00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,040
Speaker 2: There's like a whole crank theory of Republican like the

446
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,119
Speaker 2: egal jurisprudence where they're trying to use that to be

447
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 2: able to just like not basically not have normal elections.

448
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 2: But you know, so because this is like dog shit, right,

449
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 2: like it's it's bad for a number of reasons. The

450
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:13,119
Speaker 2: first obvious one is that like this means you the

451
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,800
Speaker 2: US does not have one person, one vote at all,

452
00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 2: Like the entire American political system is just a giant

453
00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 2: violation of differences of one person, one vote because people's

454
00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:25,080
Speaker 2: votes are just worth more than others because of the electors.

455
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:28,159
Speaker 2: The second thing that's really bad, right is again like

456
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 2: those individual electors can technically vote like however they want to,

457
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:35,040
Speaker 2: So you could you could be an elector who's posted

458
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:36,680
Speaker 2: to vote for someone and then vote for someone else.

459
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 2: It's actually happened. Although I'm not mattering, but like one

460
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:43,240
Speaker 2: of Gore's electors I think defected to what's his name,

461
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 2: the third guy who ran I can't remember his.

462
00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:52,639
Speaker 3: Name, someone in twenty six the guy, yeah, someone did

463
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 3: in twenty sixteen as well, I think rogue election. Yeah,

464
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:58,680
Speaker 3: there's a little bit of like, I know, this is

465
00:23:58,680 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 3: a good time. I was going to talk about different

466
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 3: procedural and substantive democracy. I could talk about it now

467
00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:05,840
Speaker 3: or later, but I think it relates to what you're

468
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:06,359
Speaker 3: talking about.

469
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,159
Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, do it now.

470
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 3: But what out Yeah there were there were ten in

471
00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:16,159
Speaker 3: twenty sixteen. Wow face spotted Egle is the one I'm

472
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,600
Speaker 3: thinking of someone voted for face spotted eagle. But yeah, okay,

473
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 3: So one thing I wanted to talk about, like with

474
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 3: relation to what you're saying here, is like the difference

475
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 3: between procedural and substantive democracy, because I think it's really

476
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 3: important when we're looking at like what's happening in the US.

477
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,359
Speaker 3: So when we talk about like a lot of this

478
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,919
Speaker 3: language comes from the like nineteen nineties obsession with transitions

479
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:40,320
Speaker 3: to democracy that happened a lot in political science, right,

480
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:42,480
Speaker 3: like and history to an extent, where we were looking

481
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 3: at these like post Soviet countries and post colonial countries

482
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 3: and as they moved towards this like what's considered a

483
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 3: democracy in the kind of neoliberal frame, we talked about

484
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:57,360
Speaker 3: procedural and substantive democracy. So procedural democracy are things which

485
00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 3: have the institutions and procedures in place. You vote, there

486
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 3: are elections, the ballots are cast, and that results in

487
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 3: this case, the elector is going to electoral college and

488
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 3: the electoral college to delive as a president. And then

489
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 3: substantive democracy is where people have a substantive say, a

490
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 3: means of deciding who is in charge, right, who runs

491
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,200
Speaker 3: a state and the US is moving further and further

492
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:21,679
Speaker 3: from substantive democracy.

493
00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 2: Like it's been.

494
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:26,200
Speaker 3: Interesting to see people bringing that like because of course

495
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,800
Speaker 3: that nineteen nineties discourse was centered heavily in the US

496
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 3: right as like the paragon of democratic virtue, and then

497
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 3: it was used to condescend to other countries and be like, oh,

498
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:38,520
Speaker 3: you're not a fully consolidated democracy. At them, Lindzen Stepan.

499
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:40,120
Speaker 3: If people want to look up Linds and step Kind,

500
00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:42,399
Speaker 3: if they're reboard, they can. But they talk about like

501
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:46,200
Speaker 3: a consolidated democracy being one where democracy is the only

502
00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 3: game in town. And all of this stuff was heavily

503
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,800
Speaker 3: based on kind of aspiring to be the US right

504
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,240
Speaker 3: countries in Africa East when you're perspiring to be an

505
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:57,320
Speaker 3: American democracy. And it's very funny now to see that

506
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 3: the US doesn't fit most definitions a substantive democracy or

507
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 3: a consolidated one, like it's not the only game in

508
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 3: town for millions of Americans anymore.

509
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 1: Now.

510
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:09,280
Speaker 3: It's highly amusing.

511
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:13,560
Speaker 1: My other amusings what I would call it absolutely James.

512
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's funny. It's just funny. Nothing that will happen,

513
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 3: it's fine.

514
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 2: Yeah. My other favorite example of like those of like

515
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:23,440
Speaker 2: how bullshit those like democracy theorists were was like every

516
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 2: single one of those people the moment that Zapetas the

517
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,399
Speaker 2: uprising happened, just like immediately shut the fuck up and

518
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:31,480
Speaker 2: never mentioned it ever, Like it just does not come

519
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 2: up like the thing.

520
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:36,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean a lot of the like, yeah, a

521
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:38,440
Speaker 3: lot of them really had a lot of them also

522
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 3: were like too busy looking at things, and like in Spain, right,

523
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 3: people looked at Spain's quote unquote transition as one of

524
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 3: the earlier models and then went on to model things

525
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:53,359
Speaker 3: off Spain. Spain is at best an incomplete transition now right,

526
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 3: people paying attention to the most recent elections will maybe

527
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 3: have noticed this, Like Spain is, Spain is not a

528
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 3: country where democracies any game in town. Right, they had

529
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:03,200
Speaker 3: an attempted to coup in nineteen eighty one, and so

530
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 3: like then they're kind of looking backwards off something because

531
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 3: Spain was satisfactorly democratic for them that it said he

532
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 3: wasn't for a lot of Spanish people.

533
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:14,479
Speaker 2: So yeah, not a big fan.

534
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I don't know about you guys, but I

535
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 1: think there's nothing wrong with the way we did side

536
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 1: things of democracies.

537
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 3: God gave it on the tablets to some old white

538
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:29,480
Speaker 3: men they had slaves, and that that is good.

539
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:31,360
Speaker 1: Great.

540
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's been funny also watching those people trying to

541
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 2: like actually go back and look at like at what

542
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 2: point the US became like a democracy in any real sense,

543
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 2: And it's like, really, like, if you're gonna do this seriously,

544
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 2: you cannot argue that it was a democracy until like

545
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 2: after Jim Crow, so like really like the sixties and

546
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,679
Speaker 2: even then, so like I don't know, like there's been

547
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 2: a lot of attempts to sort of make the stuff work.

548
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 2: But then also you have all of this bullshit where

549
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 2: again like because because it's based on this elector shit,

550
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 2: you can like this is how Trump was able to

551
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:06,159
Speaker 2: like to try to do all this very weird stuff.

552
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:10,440
Speaker 2: And this is the sort of you know, this is

553
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,320
Speaker 2: the part where we get into like Trump's second plan,

554
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,440
Speaker 2: which his plan, and this is the one he's actually

555
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 2: getting charged for. So his thing was he was trying

556
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 2: to get states to just like ignore the popular vote

557
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 2: and decertified. So there's this process where like there's a

558
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,200
Speaker 2: day on which like the electors that do the electoral

559
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 2: votes are like certified. And so his he was he

560
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 2: was trying to do a couple of things before that.

561
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 2: He was trying to like get the actual electors like

562
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 2: not certified and then have like another set of electors

563
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 2: and pointed that would vote for him, and then that

564
00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 2: didn't work, and so he was trying to get so

565
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 2: like on that same day, there were also a bunch

566
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 2: of slates of electors that like like did like a

567
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 2: fake appointment thing, basically like trying to claim they were

568
00:28:53,920 --> 00:29:00,520
Speaker 2: the real electors in a bunch of states. Yeah. Yeah,

569
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 2: And this one was funny too because like some of

570
00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 2: the people who were like who like were on these

571
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 2: slates like didn't know that they weren't the real electors,

572
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 2: Like they had just been told that they were the

573
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 2: real so they like unwittingly were like part of this

574
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 2: coup attempt. And so the indictment, So that's the second part,

575
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 2: and so that also was kind of falling apart, And

576
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 2: so then we get to the sort of third thing,

577
00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 2: which is this entire effort to get Mike Pence to

578
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 2: not certify the election or so that this trit version

579
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 2: of one was that he doesn't certify the election at all,

580
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:37,040
Speaker 2: and the second version of conspiracy was like so there

581
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 2: were these states set up where Trump had put like

582
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 2: a second slate of electors, and the plan was to

583
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 2: like have those are like contested states, and so the

584
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,920
Speaker 2: plan was to have Pence say that, like none of

585
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 2: those states had actually vowdly selected electors, so their votes

586
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 2: don't matter, and then just like say that Trump won

587
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 2: the election, and none of this makes anything. And the

588
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 2: reason this is like incomprehensible is like none of this

589
00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 2: makes any sense, right, Like this is all just gibberish bullshit. Yeah,

590
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 2: but but into this mess drops Danny Quail. Now I

591
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 2: think everyone, so you two know who Daddy Quail is.

592
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 2: I I'm realizing I was running into people when I

593
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 2: when I've been talking about this sort of story I'm

594
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 2: about to tell who don't know who Danny Quayle is.

595
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 2: And I I feel I have a moral obligation to

596
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 2: introduce this guy.

597
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, give the man his full name here, James Danforth Quail. God,

598
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 3: I didn't know his name was dan fourth Oh yeah,

599
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 3: oh yeah, no determinism and its finest.

600
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:36,720
Speaker 1: Yeah.

601
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 2: So Quail, I think, is probably most famous for she

602
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 2: was stee j W. Bush's vice president, right, And so okay,

603
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 2: so I want to tell the actual full So the

604
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 2: common version of the story that happens is that he

605
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 2: doesn't know he didn't know how his pew potato, and

606
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,240
Speaker 2: that's true, but the actual story is so much funnier

607
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 2: than that. So okay, Quail is so okay, Quail is

608
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:02,239
Speaker 2: is Georgie's Bush's vice president. Right, It's nineteen ninety two,

609
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 2: like the like they're on They're like starting to go

610
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,240
Speaker 2: into election season, yea. And Quail goes to like this

611
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:10,960
Speaker 2: spelling bee that's happening in this elementary school to like

612
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: promote some random.

613
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 1: I horrible idea.

614
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 2: Yeah and so so kid. He asked this kid to

615
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 2: spell potato and the kid walks up and the kid

616
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:25,000
Speaker 2: spells pano correctly. This kid is like eight right, this

617
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:32,840
Speaker 2: is like it is like mighty so and then I

618
00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:36,160
Speaker 2: Quail looks at it and looks at the Apparently they

619
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 2: had a card that was spelled wrong. But Quail doesn't

620
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:41,560
Speaker 2: realize that the card is spelled wrong, so he goes

621
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:43,040
Speaker 2: to the board. He looks at the kid and goes,

622
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 2: but you need to have someone to card and this

623
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 2: kid is just baffled because she spelled the hito correctly.

624
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:52,680
Speaker 1: Are you talking about the vice President of the United

625
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,040
Speaker 1: That kid's an anarchist.

626
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 2: Now, like, there's there's no way someone did all follow

627
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 2: up with him. Apparently he like he's like a small

628
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 2: business owner or something, and he just tell us the

629
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:05,560
Speaker 2: story all the time. Very funny, but okay, this was

630
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 2: a period of American history like this, like is one

631
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,239
Speaker 2: of the reasons that George H. W. Bush didn't win

632
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 2: re election Like this broke twelve unbroken years of Republicans

633
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 2: winning every single election.

634
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 3: Based he does seem like a plant. Like I don't

635
00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 3: know if you've got some of his other ridiculous Oh

636
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 3: I'm gona.

637
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 2: Of this quote. Okay, so less you think Quail just

638
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 2: had like one flub, Like, no, she's just like this.

639
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,320
Speaker 2: I'm gonna read a couple of So there's like a

640
00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 2: bunch of people who spent a bunch of time extensively

641
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 2: documenting Dan Quayle quotes because that's what you did on

642
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 2: the internet in the nineties. Yeah, okay, the Holocaust was

643
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 2: an obscene period in our nation's history, I mean this

644
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 2: century's history. But we all lived in this century. I

645
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 2: didn't live in this century.

646
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 1: I feel like I want to diagram that one, Like what, Yeah, well,

647
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 1: cocaine was really kicking in.

648
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 2: You know, she has this kind of in this same

649
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,240
Speaker 2: way that Trump has, like this cant in which he

650
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 2: does all of his incorportensiable things, Like Quail also has

651
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,560
Speaker 2: a can't like. He does this kind of thing where

652
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,479
Speaker 2: he does the like he says a sentence and then

653
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 2: he says, I mean something else, I mean something else,

654
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 2: and it does none of them follows from the other one,

655
00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 2: so he does one of the other famous ones. Hawaii

656
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,640
Speaker 2: has always been a pivotal a pivotal role in the Pacific.

657
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 2: It is in the Pacific. It is a part of

658
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 2: the United States. That is an island that is right there.

659
00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:27,040
Speaker 3: Wow.

660
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:32,160
Speaker 1: Fuck, that's very famously he went on to write large

661
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:34,920
Speaker 1: portions of Wikipedia, so that that makes a lot of sense.

662
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 2: It's so good. Yeah, quails are in.

663
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:43,160
Speaker 3: Wikipedia calls him an intellectual lightweight and incompetent individual Wells,

664
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:44,720
Speaker 3: which is not untrue.

665
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:46,160
Speaker 1: Pretty hard to argue about that.

666
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, Mars is essentially in the same orbit. Mars is

667
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 2: somewhat the same distance from the Sun, which is very important.

668
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 2: We have seen pictures where their canals, we believe and water.

669
00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: If there is water, that means there is oxygen. If

670
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 2: oxygen means we can breathe.

671
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 1: Oh good, Okay, Wow, there's a lot of science coming

672
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 1: out of that statements.

673
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 2: Man was vice president of the United States. We have

674
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:14,880
Speaker 2: a firm commitment to NATO. We are a part of NATO.

675
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:16,800
Speaker 2: We have a firm commitment to Europe. We are a

676
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 2: part of Europe.

677
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, he's so good. Well now you see, Maya,

678
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,600
Speaker 1: you just you you were not you are not up

679
00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:27,840
Speaker 1: on your your geographic history because the mountain ranges in

680
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:31,880
Speaker 1: Scotland are the same mountain range as the Appellachians, so

681
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 1: technically we are in Europe.

682
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 2: In many ways. Damn, I've been styled on by Dan Quayle.

683
00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 2: There you go, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, now okay, other

684
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 2: than the fact that it's really funny, you like, why

685
00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 2: why am I talking about Danny Quayle, And the answer

686
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 2: is that. Okay. So remember Trump needs for his like

687
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 2: completely nonsense thing to like even kind of go to

688
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:58,359
Speaker 2: the next step of failing. He needs to convince Mike

689
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:01,400
Speaker 2: Pence and not certify the election. And Pence is like

690
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 2: legitimately going back and forward on this. He's like he's

691
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 2: having this like moral dilemma and like he like wants

692
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 2: to do it, but he's he's having problems making decisions,

693
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,840
Speaker 2: and so he calls his old friend Danny Quail. And

694
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:15,960
Speaker 2: I think this is a really fascinating moment of sort

695
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,320
Speaker 2: of you know, like this, I think it's really fascinating

696
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 2: indication of like how off the rails everything has gotten

697
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 2: since we released in twenty sixteen, but like twenty twenty

698
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:28,879
Speaker 2: sort of just like accelerates the magnitude of this, which

699
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,719
Speaker 2: is that like Quail is like the human symbol of

700
00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,360
Speaker 2: the decrepitness of American politics in the eighties and nineties, right,

701
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,280
Speaker 2: like this is a guy who makes like senile regular

702
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 2: look like a genius, and in twenty twenty and twenty

703
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:42,640
Speaker 2: twenty one, like Pence is supposed to be one of

704
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 2: the like quote unquote adults in the room in twenty twenty,

705
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 2: and Pence goes to Quail and is like, what I

706
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 2: need to do this coup? Like I don't have a

707
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 2: choice of under so much pressure, And Danny Quail, the

708
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:56,800
Speaker 2: man who can't spell potato, instantly is like, no, what

709
00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 2: are you talking about, Like you can't do this coup,

710
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 2: like obviously can't do this, and and Pence Pence just.

711
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:05,319
Speaker 4: Like argues with him.

712
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 2: He's like no, no, Like he keeps arguing with him,

713
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:07,840
Speaker 2: like no, I have to do what I have to

714
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:10,360
Speaker 2: do it, and Quails like what are you talking about?

715
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:13,320
Speaker 2: Like of course you can't like not certify the election,

716
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 2: Like what what are you doing? And this actually works

717
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 2: and this convinces Pence not to actually certify the election,

718
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,239
Speaker 2: and so you know, we we have reached a point

719
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 2: in history where like you can make an argument I

720
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,280
Speaker 2: don't think it's correct, but you can make an argument

721
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 2: that Danny fucking Quail saved the American Republic.

722
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 3: They say, just from two Republican presidents.

723
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 2: I just I don't know. I can't get over this.

724
00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 2: It's just like Danny Quail is the voice of reason

725
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:52,480
Speaker 2: and moderation and like, oh god, I don't know this country.

726
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 3: It's bizarre.

727
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:57,240
Speaker 2: The whole thing is is bizarre. Yeah, it's it's bleak.

728
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 2: We should do it, ad Brick, I don't have a

729
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:01,560
Speaker 2: pivot there.

730
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:08,800
Speaker 1: Speaking of auto golpe gulp down these products automatic magic cool.

731
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 4: And we are back to a bit more fraud.

732
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 2: So okay, the other thing is being yeah, this is

733
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 2: actually wait, this is actually fraud. No, I guess this

734
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:30,719
Speaker 2: is the fraud one it's still a technically a fraud one.

735
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:32,399
Speaker 1: So that's part of it at least.

736
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:37,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, So so we've reached the like third and fourth indictments.

737
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 2: It's actually really funny if you go read the thing,

738
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,000
Speaker 2: all of the actual texts of the indictment with the

739
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:45,320
Speaker 2: evidence and stuff is all under the first indictment, and

740
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:47,520
Speaker 2: then the second, third, and fourth ones are like, yeah,

741
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 2: go refer to ex paragraphs as like the first one.

742
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 2: So there's the second, third, and fourth like charges are

743
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 2: like like one paragraph long. But basically this is about

744
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:00,360
Speaker 2: the January sixth stuff. They spend much time listening like

745
00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 2: all of the random stuff that Trump said about the

746
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:05,440
Speaker 2: election that was not true. They also have a very

747
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:07,440
Speaker 2: funny list of all of the people who told him

748
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 2: that like this stuff wasn't true, which includes Mike Pence,

749
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 2: the leadership of the Justice Department, the Director of National Intelligence,

750
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:18,479
Speaker 2: the head of SISA, which is the Department of Homeland

751
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:22,200
Speaker 2: Security Cybersecurity Agency, a bunch of White House attorneys like

752
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 2: his own staff, and all of his politicians was backing.

753
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 2: He's like every single person was like this is not real,

754
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 2: and Trump was like no, no, no, hold on, we

755
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:35,279
Speaker 2: can still win the election. You know, Okay. So there's

756
00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,440
Speaker 2: like that stuff, and then there's the stuff that like

757
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:41,799
Speaker 2: he like specifically did to like try to pressure these

758
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:47,560
Speaker 2: state politicians into like certifying him as president. So like

759
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 2: they he had a bunch of calls and like his

760
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 2: like staff people had a bunch of calls. We were

761
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 2: like they tried to get like that the Speaker of

762
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 2: the House in Arizona to do this by saying they're

763
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:01,640
Speaker 2: voting fraud. And the Speaker of the House was like, Okay,

764
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 2: there's no we haven't found any fraud. I'm gonna I'm

765
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 2: gonna read from the thing co conspirator to you concluded

766
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:10,759
Speaker 2: that he quote didn't know enough about the facts on

767
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:13,279
Speaker 2: the ground in Arizona, but nonetheless told the Speaker of

768
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,879
Speaker 2: the House to decertify and quote let the court sort

769
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 2: it out. Sort it out. So again, this is this

770
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,560
Speaker 2: is this is the Roger Stone strategy, but done like yes,

771
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 2: so unbelievably poorly. Yeah. Yeah, So and there's a bunch

772
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 2: of sort of like lists. There's like all this list

773
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 2: of like this like Trump does like identical stuff in

774
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:35,920
Speaker 2: like Michigan and Pennsylvania. There's like that phone call in

775
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:39,879
Speaker 2: Georgia he gets in trouble for some from Wisconsin. There's

776
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 2: another thing he tried to do, which I actually hadn't

777
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 2: heard about this one. I don't know. It's either I

778
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 2: just forgot it or I just never ran into it,

779
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 2: where he was trying to like use Justice Department letterhead

780
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,360
Speaker 2: and like the signature of the acting Attorney General to

781
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 2: like send the fate, like pretend to send a letter

782
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 2: from the Justice Departments to a bunch of states to

783
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 2: tell them there was fraud and get them to like.

784
00:40:00,640 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 3: Amazing, Yeah, since I'm sick and I can't come to school. Yeah.

785
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 2: And the funny thing is the problem is that.

786
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 1: They so they try to there's a lot that's funny

787
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:11,319
Speaker 1: about that. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna see it. Yeah,

788
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:13,320
Speaker 1: we gotta plaralize that fucker.

789
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:17,120
Speaker 2: It's so good. And the scheme falls apart because again

790
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 2: the guy Trump appoints it as the acting Attorney General

791
00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 2: is like, no, like, you cannot just department, and they

792
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 2: keep trying to argue with him, and it keeps not working.

793
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:31,800
Speaker 2: And this is where we get to another part of

794
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 2: this whole thing that I this has been getting a

795
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 2: lot of press attention and it's interesting, but I think

796
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 2: there's more to the story that people haven't been talking about,

797
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,759
Speaker 2: which is so the guy who's probably Jeffrey Clark, like

798
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 2: gets into an argument with the Deputy White House Council

799
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 2: and the w White House Council is you know, is

800
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:51,560
Speaker 2: telling is telling Jeffrey Clark, who thinks one of Trumps

801
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:53,919
Speaker 2: lawyers is telling him like like Trump can't stay in office,

802
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 2: Like there's no version of this where Trump stays in

803
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:59,279
Speaker 2: office after like January twentieth, and he says, quote, they

804
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,239
Speaker 2: would be right, it's in every major American city. And

805
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,920
Speaker 2: then the guy who's probably Clark says, quote, well, Deputy

806
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:09,320
Speaker 2: White House Counsel, that's why there's an insurrection Act. And

807
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 2: this is where we need to get to another a

808
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:12,960
Speaker 2: couple of interesting parts of the story.

809
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 1: One, you know, one clear, when you're saying that's why

810
00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:20,320
Speaker 1: we have an insurrection Act, you're saying we can just

811
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 1: shoot those people, yeah, in the streets, Like that is

812
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 1: what that statement means. Yeah, and that is what the

813
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 1: stakes were. Everybody was out in the streets in twenty

814
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: twenty was aware of this.

815
00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah, you know, this is the thing I

816
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 2: kind of want to talk about, which is that like

817
00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 2: part of the reason this coup fails is that so

818
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:41,960
Speaker 2: Trump is talking about doing the Insurrection Act twice in

819
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 2: twenty twenty. Well, I guess once in twenty twenty. I

820
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:45,440
Speaker 2: think this might have been the second time. I've been

821
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:47,800
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, but like in that last year, she

822
00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:51,080
Speaker 2: tries to use the Insurrection Act against the uprising in

823
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:55,360
Speaker 2: twenty twenty, and his like his chief of staff like

824
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 2: like a bunch of like a bunch of generals, and

825
00:41:56,960 --> 00:41:58,799
Speaker 2: his own chief of staff like tell them the fuck off.

826
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 2: And that's like part of the reason why this didn't happen,

827
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,040
Speaker 2: which which is interesting because like I don't know, like

828
00:42:07,200 --> 00:42:10,279
Speaker 2: there there have been, like there have been times where

829
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 2: the US Army like has been deployed against like riots

830
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:15,240
Speaker 2: like this, right, like this this happened in the nineties.

831
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 2: But in this situation, the army just like absolutely completely

832
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 2: refuse to play ball. And we've we've gotten some really

833
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,359
Speaker 2: kind of interesting So the other thing that's happening here

834
00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:30,880
Speaker 2: is like just the complete hollowing out of journalism as

835
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:33,759
Speaker 2: an institution where all of these people know all of

836
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:36,280
Speaker 2: the all these journalists like know a bunch of incredibly

837
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 2: important stuff and they won't tell anyone because they they're

838
00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:41,640
Speaker 2: saving it for their books, yep. And you know, and

839
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:43,879
Speaker 2: it's like among the things that we sort of learned

840
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 2: in this period is like there there's basically this like

841
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:49,359
Speaker 2: I don't know what you call it, Like you could

842
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 2: either call it like a quad um for it basically,

843
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,080
Speaker 2: or you could call it like a national unity government

844
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 2: which is in power for two weeks basically where Pelosi Miley,

845
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:03,640
Speaker 2: who uh the chief of Staff who is a general

846
00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:07,319
Speaker 2: like Mike Pence, Chuck Schumer and Mitch McConnell basically are

847
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 2: like running the government for two weeks because they've successfully

848
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 2: put together this counter coup where like the military has

849
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,960
Speaker 2: refused to like go along with Trump like trying to

850
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:21,759
Speaker 2: overthrow the government. And this is very deeply I don't know,

851
00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:24,120
Speaker 2: there's some very deeply interesting stuff here where there's there's

852
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,719
Speaker 2: a there's a book called Iolone Can Fix It, which

853
00:43:26,719 --> 00:43:28,799
Speaker 2: a couple of journalists are coming out with and there's

854
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 2: some interesting quotes from it from specifically General Mike Miley,

855
00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:34,799
Speaker 2: who's like the chairman of the Joint chiefs of Staff,

856
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,320
Speaker 2: who was appointed by Trump. By the way, this this

857
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 2: is this is an important thing because like Trump, there's

858
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,840
Speaker 2: like seven guys who are like absolute ghouls, like Mike Pompeo,

859
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 2: like Cia ghoul who are just like look at this

860
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 2: coup and are like no, and Miley stuff is wild.

861
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:52,880
Speaker 2: Like Miley directly can like in meetings, is comparing Trump

862
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 2: to Hitler. He says, quote, Yeah, this is a Reichstag moment.

863
00:43:56,200 --> 00:44:00,360
Speaker 2: Miley told aids the Gospel of the Fearer, like and.

864
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 1: There's there's a I talked about this a little bit

865
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,680
Speaker 1: ahead of earlier. There are some unconfirmed reports that Miley

866
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: and a number of other like US military high ranking officers,

867
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:11,920
Speaker 1: basically had like a book club, and one of the

868
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:14,719
Speaker 1: books they went through in twenty twenty was a book

869
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 1: about the Nazis' rise to power in Germany. I kind

870
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,600
Speaker 1: of suspect it might have been Death of a Democracy

871
00:44:19,640 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 1: because that was big at the time. But it would

872
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:25,440
Speaker 1: make sense because he's talking in substantial detail about like

873
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 1: he's very you can tell he's very focused in this

874
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 1: period on Nazis taking over the government, Like he talks

875
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:32,239
Speaker 1: about it a lot.

876
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I'm gonna read a couple other quotes from him.

877
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:37,319
Speaker 2: He has this thing where I think I think he's

878
00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:39,640
Speaker 2: talking about payoh. Here where he's talking about like this coup,

879
00:44:39,680 --> 00:44:42,239
Speaker 2: and he says they may try, but they're not going

880
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:44,200
Speaker 2: to fucking succeed. He told them, you can't do this

881
00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 2: without the military. You can't do this without the CIA

882
00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:48,600
Speaker 2: and the FBI. We're the guys with the guns. And

883
00:44:48,680 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 2: he's right about this. And this is a really crucial

884
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 2: thing that Trump fucks up about how to do a

885
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:57,160
Speaker 2: fascist coup is that you can't actually, like fascist coups

886
00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:00,319
Speaker 2: don't work without the at least passive acquiescence of the state.

887
00:45:00,960 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 2: Like if the state triest, if the army tries to

888
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 2: stop you, your coup is not going to work, right like,

889
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:09,360
Speaker 2: unless you're someone like Franco who like has control of

890
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:11,719
Speaker 2: a huge portion of the army, if you try to

891
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,560
Speaker 2: do one of these sort of weird paramilitary things and

892
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 2: the army just says no, like you're screwed. And this, this,

893
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 2: I think was always part of trump sort of problem,

894
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:23,839
Speaker 2: was that, like, you know, if he'd sort of spent

895
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 2: his time consolidating the kind of like fascist institutions the

896
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:29,359
Speaker 2: neo cons set up, right like, if he'd spent his time,

897
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 2: like you know, actually like actually developing loyalty in the FBI,

898
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 2: and the CIA and like going through and like turning

899
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:39,919
Speaker 2: Department Homeland Security, like you know, into like an even

900
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:42,080
Speaker 2: more fascist organization. He might have been able to do this,

901
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 2: but like at the very end, like you have Miley

902
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 2: saying this is this is on h right, this is

903
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:53,640
Speaker 2: on exercises right before the inauguration. He says, quote, here's

904
00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 2: the deal, guys, these guys are the Notre Nazis. They're

905
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 2: bugalou boys, they're proud boys. These are the same people

906
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:02,000
Speaker 2: we fought in Woodwar too. Miley told them everyone in

907
00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:04,440
Speaker 2: this room, whether you're a cop, whether you're a soldier,

908
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:06,560
Speaker 2: we're going to stop these guys to make sure we

909
00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:08,800
Speaker 2: have a peaceful transfer of power. We're gonna put a

910
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:13,560
Speaker 2: steel ring around the city and the Nazis aren't getting in, Like.

911
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:17,920
Speaker 1: You know what credit where That's a pretty cool thing

912
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:18,919
Speaker 1: to get to have said.

913
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, so something like some basically him and zookep. Yeah,

914
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 2: it's like like all of like suddenly, like the all

915
00:46:31,120 --> 00:46:33,280
Speaker 2: of like the senior command of the American Army suddenly

916
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 2: turned into like nineteen forty two American generals.

917
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't know, I guess again, I try

918
00:46:40,120 --> 00:46:41,680
Speaker 1: to say this, I try to bring this up a

919
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 1: lot to like more radical folks when you if you

920
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 1: want to get a lot of like the centrist lib

921
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:49,080
Speaker 1: types on your side, you could do a lot worse

922
00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:51,239
Speaker 1: than Hearkening back to that whole World War two thing,

923
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 1: there's a lot of propaganda invested in getting guys like

924
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,160
Speaker 1: Millie to want to feel like that.

925
00:46:56,520 --> 00:46:58,280
Speaker 2: So and in this case it works.

926
00:46:58,120 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 3: Out for it.

927
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:02,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, apparently don't know, Live Live, Antifa has poor has

928
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:03,680
Speaker 2: pulled one out.

929
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:08,279
Speaker 1: I guess it's certainly better than if the head of

930
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:11,640
Speaker 1: the military had been like, I guess I'm fine with this,

931
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:15,840
Speaker 1: so yeah, whatever, I don't know. Yeah, I have no

932
00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:20,719
Speaker 1: complaints are his performance in that specific moment, uh, other

933
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 1: than that they did actually get in so you know whatever,

934
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 1: Like that was.

935
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 2: When they were drilling for the inauguration.

936
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,480
Speaker 3: When they stuffed the capital with National God soldiers like

937
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:34,160
Speaker 3: a sausage.

938
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:36,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was just I guess it worked.

939
00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:36,920
Speaker 4: I don't know.

940
00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 2: My other conclusion from this though, is when when you

941
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 2: have reached the position of like you're you're trying to

942
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:46,560
Speaker 2: figure like your top generals are trying to figure out

943
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 2: who has enough guns to figure out whether a coup

944
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:52,000
Speaker 2: can happen like things are things are not good. This

945
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:55,759
Speaker 2: is a this is a a bad sign TM for.

946
00:47:56,160 --> 00:47:59,360
Speaker 1: No, it's it's good, like as nice as it is

947
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:03,279
Speaker 1: to here that Milly understood the stakes, which is good.

948
00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:06,040
Speaker 1: It's good that he understood the stakes given his position.

949
00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:09,520
Speaker 1: It's not good that like so much came down to

950
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 1: the fact that a couple dudes didn't suck in this

951
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 1: specific way. Like, that's not a great sign for stability

952
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:23,200
Speaker 1: of democracy. Yeah, because no one voted for Miley, like right, Yeah,

953
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 1: that's unsettling. Yeah, the whole democratic system was more or

954
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:28,920
Speaker 1: less of the edge of failing. And a dude who

955
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:30,640
Speaker 1: was good at war step ten and was like, here, okay,

956
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:31,840
Speaker 1: we can't I don't want to do this.

957
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:34,759
Speaker 2: One of those things, right, we know what this looks like.

958
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:37,600
Speaker 2: With Bush, We're like, if you actually know how to

959
00:48:37,680 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 2: press the buttons of the system, right, you can't do this.

960
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:44,080
Speaker 2: But Trump just like didn't have enough control of the

961
00:48:44,080 --> 00:48:46,239
Speaker 2: state apparatus and tried to sort of replicate it with

962
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 2: true viles, and that just didn't work. Trump's problems here

963
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,120
Speaker 2: are twofold. One of them is that he is not

964
00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:56,759
Speaker 2: capable of loyalty to anyone or anything else.

965
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,960
Speaker 1: Whereas a guy like George W. Bush, which means he's

966
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:04,359
Speaker 1: capable of getting teams together who are willing to take

967
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 1: some of like who are willing to go out on

968
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:09,720
Speaker 1: a limb for him to some extent. And Bush also

969
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:12,440
Speaker 1: is system loyal. Now that doesn't mean he's not willing

970
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:14,920
Speaker 1: to fuck with the system for his own benefit, but

971
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: he has a vested interest in the system continuing more

972
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:21,640
Speaker 1: or less the way that it has right as opposed

973
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:27,080
Speaker 1: to breaking it specifically forever for his own like power.

974
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 1: You know, he was not a guy who was interested

975
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:31,200
Speaker 1: in staying in office for it. I don't say this

976
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 1: to defend the man. He killed hundreds of thousands of

977
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 1: people minimum, But because he was willing, he had a

978
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 1: degree of loyalty to the system as it was seen

979
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:44,840
Speaker 1: by most people. There was not this kind of rebellion

980
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:47,239
Speaker 1: from sort of within it, right like, in fact, that

981
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 1: deep state was largely sympathetic with him. They were willing

982
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:52,960
Speaker 1: to go with like the fucking around with the election

983
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:56,640
Speaker 1: as long as, you know, the broader structures that had

984
00:49:56,719 --> 00:50:01,440
Speaker 1: given them a place to exert power and influence remained intact.

985
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:04,440
Speaker 1: And Trump was basically saying, if Millie had gone with this.

986
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 1: If everyone had gone with this, what you are accepting

987
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:11,239
Speaker 1: is that nothing matters but this guy's opinion, right, there's

988
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: not actually any sort of power in the system that

989
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:16,839
Speaker 1: you have risen to the top of. There's not any

990
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:20,200
Speaker 1: sort of power in these unelected structures within the system

991
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:24,120
Speaker 1: that you clearly think are important because they are how

992
00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: you why like where you have seen success right like?

993
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 1: And frankly, you know people aren't willing to do that

994
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:35,839
Speaker 1: sort of thing. And also you're fighting against a lot

995
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:40,440
Speaker 1: of people who want to whatever fucked up things they

996
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:43,680
Speaker 1: are willing to do. They have a lot emotionally invested

997
00:50:43,719 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 1: in the idea that they serve a democracy. Now is

998
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 1: that a morally flawless idea? Are they always? In fact? Like? No,

999
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:55,880
Speaker 1: of course not like everyone. They're hypocrites to certain extents,

1000
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:59,759
Speaker 1: But you can't push them that far like Bush pushed

1001
00:50:59,760 --> 00:51:01,880
Speaker 1: them about as far as you can push people like that,

1002
00:51:02,200 --> 00:51:07,120
Speaker 1: right this. Trump didn't have any respect for making it,

1003
00:51:07,719 --> 00:51:10,040
Speaker 1: for dressing it up right, and he didn't have any

1004
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:12,960
Speaker 1: respect for the thing that they were a part of,

1005
00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:14,800
Speaker 1: and so of course a lot of them didn't go

1006
00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:15,200
Speaker 1: with him.

1007
00:51:15,600 --> 00:51:17,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think this gets back to something I've

1008
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:20,799
Speaker 2: talked about a bit with with what what the neocons

1009
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:23,640
Speaker 2: were doing, which that the neocons are about like the

1010
00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:25,920
Speaker 2: state of exception, right, they're about this, like you know,

1011
00:51:25,960 --> 00:51:27,560
Speaker 2: we've had the war, we now have the war on terror.

1012
00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 2: We've had nine to eleven. And that means the countries

1013
00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:31,320
Speaker 2: in this state were like, we have the power to

1014
00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 2: be like the people inside the system who are outbound

1015
00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:35,040
Speaker 2: by it, you could do whatever you want. And like

1016
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:38,440
Speaker 2: that is descriptively right, like this is you know, both

1017
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:40,960
Speaker 2: Carl Schmidt, the like Nazi jurists like that that was

1018
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:43,200
Speaker 2: explicitly like his model of how you do fascism, right,

1019
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:46,320
Speaker 2: and it's also like something you know, but but the

1020
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:50,080
Speaker 2: thing is again like that's a very different thing than

1021
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 2: what Trump was doing, right, Like Trump wasn't doing like

1022
00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:56,279
Speaker 2: Trump wasn't doing this thing where he like you know,

1023
00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:58,520
Speaker 2: uses the apparatus of the state. He was he was

1024
00:51:58,600 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 2: doing a different, like different kind of one of them.

1025
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 1: This is what a lot of people don't understand about

1026
00:52:04,360 --> 00:52:07,800
Speaker 1: the Nazis is that whin Hitler took power and for

1027
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:11,720
Speaker 1: the first half to two thirds of his time in power,

1028
00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:17,640
Speaker 1: he was very much concerned about the military and constantly

1029
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:22,840
Speaker 1: making exceptions and altering and moderating aspects of his policy

1030
00:52:22,920 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 1: in order to keep the military on his side. And

1031
00:52:25,600 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 1: that continued, depending on kind of where you want to

1032
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:31,080
Speaker 1: put it, either up until the Anschlusser, up until the

1033
00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:36,439
Speaker 1: invasion of Poland. Really to a significant extent he would

1034
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:39,800
Speaker 1: whereas Trump did not. Again, there's no sort of he

1035
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:42,360
Speaker 1: has no sort of respect. And I'm not saying like

1036
00:52:42,480 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 1: you should have respect for the military, but I'm saying

1037
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:49,439
Speaker 1: that because he did not like power. Yeah, the fact

1038
00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:51,959
Speaker 1: that he did not, or the FBI for that matter,

1039
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:54,680
Speaker 1: is one of the reasons why this didn't work for him.

1040
00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this was always kind of a problem that

1041
00:52:57,040 --> 00:52:58,640
Speaker 2: he has ideologically, which is like one of the things

1042
00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:00,520
Speaker 2: that makes it popular is he was running like against

1043
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 2: the deep state, right and like yeah, like yeah, like

1044
00:53:02,239 --> 00:53:03,520
Speaker 2: I know lots of people you like, I don't like

1045
00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 2: the intelligence Agency's, Like the intelligence's can fuck off. The

1046
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 2: fact that like the fact that the intelligence agency's finally

1047
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:11,239
Speaker 2: found a coup they wouldn't support, Like it's not as

1048
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:13,880
Speaker 2: something they're good, but the pretended Yeah. But like the

1049
00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:15,480
Speaker 2: problem with this is like Trump is you know, he

1050
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:19,759
Speaker 2: wins the primary like very explicitly by running against a

1051
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:23,040
Speaker 2: lot of the like like by Nay running against neo conservatives,

1052
00:53:23,080 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 2: you can argue the extent to which he actually broke

1053
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:26,759
Speaker 2: with it in terms of like appointing like Gena, he

1054
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:28,920
Speaker 2: puts a bunch of neo Kon Grugles like back in power, right,

1055
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:32,600
Speaker 2: but like like nominally he's running against that specific thing.

1056
00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 2: And it turns out that like if if you if

1057
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:38,040
Speaker 2: your appeal is you know, being like a nominally anti

1058
00:53:38,080 --> 00:53:40,120
Speaker 2: systemic force, and then you have to try to use

1059
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:41,960
Speaker 2: the as system to stay in power. It's like, well,

1060
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:44,920
Speaker 2: you know this, this happens like now you are getting

1061
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 2: charged by Jack Smith and you have like seventy eight

1062
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 2: counts against you instead of you are now the fearer.

1063
00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:57,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of it is you know, first off,

1064
00:53:58,000 --> 00:54:00,760
Speaker 1: people want to be able to believe now things about

1065
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:03,360
Speaker 1: themselves and Trump didn't really give them the option of

1066
00:54:03,440 --> 00:54:07,400
Speaker 1: doing that. And second of all, people who are achieved

1067
00:54:07,440 --> 00:54:10,719
Speaker 1: this kind of level within the system want you to

1068
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:13,600
Speaker 1: treat the system. They've succeeded in this if it matters,

1069
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 1: Like it's that simple. I think in a lot of yas.

1070
00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 3: They want I feel validated and valued, And he was

1071
00:54:20,600 --> 00:54:22,120
Speaker 3: just like no, fuck you all I'm doing my gu

1072
00:54:22,239 --> 00:54:24,920
Speaker 3: and with genuinely shock where people like, well, we ain't coming.

1073
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:27,840
Speaker 1: With you for you're I don't I really feel no

1074
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 1: no desire or no uh no impetus to move with you. Yeah, anyway,

1075
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:33,600
Speaker 1: this is a good idea.

1076
00:54:34,040 --> 00:54:35,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I don't know, we'll we'll, we'll see what

1077
00:54:36,120 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 2: happens with these indictments. I don't know. I I genuine

1078
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:42,840
Speaker 2: this is the importance. Yeah, this is the one that,

1079
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:45,200
Speaker 2: like all the indictments, this is the one that matters.

1080
00:54:45,400 --> 00:54:45,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know.

1081
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:49,239
Speaker 2: We'll, we'll see if this actually substantively plays a role

1082
00:54:49,400 --> 00:54:51,399
Speaker 2: in the election. I mean, I I don't think there's

1083
00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:54,799
Speaker 2: a possibility that I can cost Trump the primary, like.

1084
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,880
Speaker 1: But no, no, no, no, yeah, nothing nothing but like

1085
00:54:58,960 --> 00:55:04,160
Speaker 1: a heart attack could do that. But it is I

1086
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:06,200
Speaker 1: will say I had some other stuff prepared that I

1087
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:08,200
Speaker 1: think we'll move to another episode just because of how

1088
00:55:08,239 --> 00:55:09,880
Speaker 1: this has gone. But I do want to note I

1089
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:11,279
Speaker 1: want to talk a little bit at the end here

1090
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:15,839
Speaker 1: about is this going to matter like electorally for Trump?

1091
00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:16,080
Speaker 2: Right?

1092
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:18,840
Speaker 1: Is this going to have an impact on his chances

1093
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,520
Speaker 1: of winning the general? I think we're all agreed it's

1094
00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:23,440
Speaker 1: not really worth talking about the primary. He's going to

1095
00:55:23,480 --> 00:55:26,759
Speaker 1: win the primary barring and act of God and that's

1096
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 1: where what Yeah, anyway, so there's some infoll on this. Basically,

1097
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:34,680
Speaker 1: on March twenty ninth, he was averaging about forty five

1098
00:55:34,760 --> 00:55:39,200
Speaker 1: percent in national primary polls, which I'm bringing up here

1099
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:41,399
Speaker 1: because they help show the impact of the indictment because

1100
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:43,279
Speaker 1: you don't have a lot of national polls from that time,

1101
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:48,160
Speaker 1: a national general election polls. So forty five percent in March.

1102
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 1: After his first set of indictments in April, he was

1103
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:54,600
Speaker 1: up to fifty four percent, So that first set of

1104
00:55:54,640 --> 00:55:59,120
Speaker 1: indictments did not harm him, may have helped him consolidate power,

1105
00:55:59,239 --> 00:56:02,880
Speaker 1: may have like activated a chunk of his base. The

1106
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:05,640
Speaker 1: second indictment did not work the same way though. After

1107
00:56:05,760 --> 00:56:08,200
Speaker 1: June eighth, when it was reported that he was being

1108
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 1: indicted for the classified document shit and obstructing justice and

1109
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:17,080
Speaker 1: getting them back yea, his average support in the primary

1110
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:20,520
Speaker 1: fell not by a massive amount, by a couple of

1111
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 1: percentage points, as did his average net favorable rating. So

1112
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:27,360
Speaker 1: you saw at least a he hit a wall and

1113
00:56:27,520 --> 00:56:31,280
Speaker 1: bounced back a little bit, not massive, not a sea change,

1114
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:34,439
Speaker 1: but enough to show that it's not accurate to say

1115
00:56:34,640 --> 00:56:37,120
Speaker 1: voters don't care. It's more accurate to say, based on

1116
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 1: what we've seen so far, voters seem to care differently

1117
00:56:40,120 --> 00:56:43,919
Speaker 1: about different indictments, and I want to read a quote

1118
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:46,600
Speaker 1: from a five point thirty eight article about his indictment

1119
00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:49,120
Speaker 1: poles here. Although we can't prove that all these shifts

1120
00:56:49,160 --> 00:56:51,400
Speaker 1: happen because of the indictments, the difference in reaction at

1121
00:56:51,480 --> 00:56:54,400
Speaker 1: least suggests that Americans are drawing distinctions between Trump's various

1122
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:57,279
Speaker 1: legal troubles and other polling backs that up. According to

1123
00:56:57,360 --> 00:57:00,760
Speaker 1: a Yugov Yahoo News poll from July thirteenth through seventeenth,

1124
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:04,480
Speaker 1: fifty percent of registered voters considered falsifying business records to

1125
00:57:04,520 --> 00:57:06,759
Speaker 1: conceal hush money payments to a porn star to be

1126
00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:09,840
Speaker 1: a serious crime, but sixty four percent of registered voters

1127
00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:12,800
Speaker 1: consider it a serious crime to take highly classified documents

1128
00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:15,719
Speaker 1: from the White House and obstruct efforts to retrieve them. Similarly,

1129
00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:17,920
Speaker 1: a June twenty second to twenty sixth poll from the

1130
00:57:17,960 --> 00:57:21,680
Speaker 1: Associated Press NRC Center for Public Affairs Research found that

1131
00:57:21,760 --> 00:57:24,160
Speaker 1: only thirty five percent of US adults thought Trump did

1132
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:26,400
Speaker 1: something illegal when it came to the hush money payments.

1133
00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:28,880
Speaker 1: But fifty three percent thought he did something illegal with

1134
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:32,520
Speaker 1: regards to classified documents founded his Maroologu resort in Florida.

1135
00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 1: By this logic, this third indictment could be even more

1136
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 1: damaging to Trump than the one involving classified documents. According

1137
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:41,240
Speaker 1: to the same Yuga of Yahoo News poll, sixty nine

1138
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:44,560
Speaker 1: percent of registered voters considered it a serious crime to

1139
00:57:44,600 --> 00:57:47,720
Speaker 1: attempt to obstruct the certification of a presidential election, and

1140
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:50,560
Speaker 1: seventy one percent said the same about conspiring to overturn

1141
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:53,560
Speaker 1: the results of a presidential election. So gonna take us

1142
00:57:53,600 --> 00:57:56,160
Speaker 1: troubling you low number, but yeah, yeah, I wish it

1143
00:57:56,200 --> 00:57:57,160
Speaker 1: way it should be high.

1144
00:57:57,840 --> 00:57:58,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah.

1145
00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:03,360
Speaker 1: Thing that does suggest that this could do him some damage,

1146
00:58:03,840 --> 00:58:06,600
Speaker 1: and especially since all of this is going to keep

1147
00:58:06,640 --> 00:58:10,240
Speaker 1: getting litigated, right like fucking people who get who have

1148
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:12,760
Speaker 1: a decent lawyer and get arrested for like a duy

1149
00:58:13,000 --> 00:58:14,479
Speaker 1: can drag a court case out.

1150
00:58:14,440 --> 00:58:16,560
Speaker 2: For a year. This will be going on during the election.

1151
00:58:17,320 --> 00:58:18,440
Speaker 2: It may hurt him.

1152
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 1: You know again, I'm not willing to like say, oh,

1153
00:58:22,120 --> 00:58:24,200
Speaker 1: this is going to fuck the election, make it impossible

1154
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:27,000
Speaker 1: from begause, I don't think the data suggests that, but

1155
00:58:27,120 --> 00:58:29,840
Speaker 1: it there's I think a pretty good chance that this

1156
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:31,920
Speaker 1: is a net negative for him in terms of you know,

1157
00:58:32,120 --> 00:58:37,560
Speaker 1: the election and broadly speaking, you know, we gave the

1158
00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:40,360
Speaker 1: Dims a lot of shit for a couple of years

1159
00:58:40,480 --> 00:58:44,800
Speaker 1: for not doing enough to actually seriously strike back at

1160
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:48,800
Speaker 1: the Republican authoritarian outreach, and so it would be unfair

1161
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:52,280
Speaker 1: of me to not say it's good that they're doing this,

1162
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:56,120
Speaker 1: Like it's good that he's facing legal trouble for what

1163
00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:59,520
Speaker 1: he's done. That's not enough to stop him, that's not

1164
00:58:59,640 --> 00:59:02,600
Speaker 1: enough to stop the Republican Party, but it is good

1165
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:03,640
Speaker 1: that this has been done.

1166
00:59:04,080 --> 00:59:11,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, progress. Shame wasn't earlier, should have been earlier.

1167
00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:14,200
Speaker 3: You know, h happening during the election is a major

1168
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:15,880
Speaker 3: l in terms of how he can spin this.

1169
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:20,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I think that was probably a strategic error, but.

1170
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:21,520
Speaker 2: Grand juries take forever.

1171
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:21,920
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1172
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:23,960
Speaker 2: Yeah. And the other thing that's happens is like there's

1173
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:26,240
Speaker 2: been all of this time for sort of Republican pr

1174
00:59:26,360 --> 00:59:28,960
Speaker 2: machine to like spin all of the stuff that happened,

1175
00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:31,240
Speaker 2: and we've you know, and I think like part of

1176
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:33,440
Speaker 2: wasn't happening the last three years is like everyone kind

1177
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 2: of just like collectively forgetting what actually happened during twenty

1178
00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:40,400
Speaker 2: twenty and how absolutely nuts it was, and everyone sort

1179
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:42,440
Speaker 2: of going back and pretending that like things are sort

1180
00:59:42,440 --> 00:59:45,520
Speaker 2: of like normal now, and it's like, no, no, we're

1181
00:59:45,520 --> 00:59:47,880
Speaker 2: still we're still living in the eternal twenty twenty and

1182
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 2: everything is still absolutely nuts. But I don't know, It's

1183
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:56,880
Speaker 2: like there's been this incredible sort of like normalization effort,

1184
00:59:56,920 --> 00:59:59,400
Speaker 2: both both by Biden and also like by the Republicans

1185
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:02,080
Speaker 2: to make it seemed like this was like a normal

1186
01:00:02,200 --> 01:00:05,440
Speaker 2: thing that happened, as opposed to like the immediate wake it,

1187
01:00:05,480 --> 01:00:10,760
Speaker 2: where everyone was like what the fuck? So hopefully not

1188
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:18,520
Speaker 2: too little, too late, hopefully this does something. But she'll see.

1189
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:25,600
Speaker 1: Yes, indeed, all right, well everybody, uh you know, I

1190
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:28,800
Speaker 1: guess go back to pay in rent and stuff. Uh,

1191
01:00:29,600 --> 01:00:31,520
Speaker 1: I'm sure twenty twenty four will be fine.

1192
01:00:32,720 --> 01:00:33,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, it wouldn't be any problem.

1193
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:41,320
Speaker 2: There's fifteen more months of this. By the way, it

1194
01:00:41,360 --> 01:00:43,600
Speaker 2: could happen here as a production of cool Zone Media.

1195
01:00:43,840 --> 01:00:46,480
Speaker 2: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

1196
01:00:46,560 --> 01:00:48,720
Speaker 2: cool zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the

1197
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:52,160
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

1198
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:54,880
Speaker 2: You can find sources for it could happen here, updated

1199
01:00:55,000 --> 01:00:58,439
Speaker 2: monthly at cool Zone media dot com, slash sources, Thanks

1200
01:00:58,480 --> 01:00:59,000
Speaker 2: for listening.