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Speaker 1: The volume.

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Speaker 2: When it comes to college basketball in March Mania, one

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Speaker 2: thing is for sure.

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Speaker 1: Nothing's for sure.

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Speaker 2: Upsets, buzzer beaters, Cinderella is advancing top seeds, going home early.

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Speaker 2: the matchups, and pick a team to win. It's that simple.

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Speaker 2: I'm a big arizon A Wildcats fan, born and raised

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Speaker 2: here in Tucson, Arizona. I'm a little skeptical about them

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Speaker 2: on the offensive end of the floor, but they looked

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Speaker 2: really good on defense again last night against Kansas, so

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Speaker 2: I'll probably be betting on them this time around.

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Speaker 2: co slash audio. All right, wellcome to hoops tonight. You're

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Speaker 2: at the volume. Hay Friday, everybody. I hope all of

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Speaker 2: you guys have had a great week. We have a

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Speaker 2: very special guest today, my friend Sam's Fondiari, who covers

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Speaker 2: the Warriors with the Light Years podcast. They the Warriors

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Speaker 2: have played twenty games with Jimmy Butler. They have a

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Speaker 2: little bit of a break here before they play against

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Speaker 2: the New Orleans Pelicans tonight and I'm expecting Steph Curry

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Speaker 2: to make his return. But I thought it was a

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Speaker 2: great time for us to just kind of zoom out

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Speaker 2: and take a look at the early returns of Jimmy.

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Speaker 1: Butler with the Warriors.

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Speaker 2: I was talking about this on the radio the other day,

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Speaker 2: But the Warriors and the Lakers to me, have undergone

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Speaker 2: such complete turnover in their play style and what they're

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Speaker 2: capable of over the course of the time since the

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Speaker 2: deadline that we almost have to completely reevaluate them and

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Speaker 2: what they're capable of. And I could think of nobody

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Speaker 2: better than Sam. First of all, how are you, man?

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Speaker 2: It's been a long time since we've done a pod together,

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Speaker 2: but I'm looking forward to this. It's gonna be fun.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I'm good overall, good of recording this. After the

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Speaker 1: Heat game, that was an emotional game. I don't know

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Speaker 1: how else to put it. It felt like a big

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Speaker 1: one and then it felt pretty deflating. But overall, it's

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Speaker 1: been good in Warriors Land since they made the Jimmy

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Speaker 1: Butler trade. Technically twenty one games. He sat one of them,

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Speaker 1: but I'll take sixteen and five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. He did sit out one of them.

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Speaker 2: I was joking with you last night because I've watched

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Speaker 2: quite a bit of Heat lately, just because they've had

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Speaker 2: a few national TV games and we've covered him on

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Speaker 2: the show a little bit, and they've been so lifeless.

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Speaker 2: And then last night they just had it. They had

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Speaker 2: the verb and you said to me, and it's like

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Speaker 2: you and I every time we've talked about the game,

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Speaker 2: we've always been just drawn to just competitiveness and competitors

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Speaker 2: and that nasty streak, And like you were, like, you

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Speaker 2: know what, I got handed to the to the Heat.

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Speaker 2: They wanted it like they they they clearly this meant

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Speaker 2: something to them, and they went after they got it done.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean to me, if you don't understand how

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Speaker 1: good Bam out of Bio is, throw that game on.

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Speaker 1: He guarded Jimmy Butler, which like how many starting centers

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Speaker 1: can just you know, you can decide, you know from

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Speaker 1: opening tip, we're gonna have you guard the other team's

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Speaker 1: star wing. It's like him and Draymond and Lo and Behold,

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Speaker 1: those are two guys who tend to punch above their

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Speaker 1: weight in the playoffs. Every year they make the playoffs.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, you know, hat tip to them heat culture.

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Speaker 1: It's a real thing. Even if I was wondering if

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Speaker 1: it was a real thing after they went on a

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Speaker 1: losing streak when they lost Jimmy, It's still a real thing.

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Speaker 1: Kat Riley is a Hall of Famer for a reason.

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Speaker 2: So we've had twenty games. I you know, I think

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Speaker 2: the experience of being a true fan in basketball is

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Speaker 2: really unique. I've been kind of embracing it because I

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Speaker 2: know when Lebron retires, I'm going to struggle with that

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Speaker 2: because I like, I won't really have that type of

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Speaker 2: fanhood anymore because I live in twos on Arizona. I

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Speaker 2: don't really have a team, so to speak, And when

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Speaker 2: Lebron retires, I just won't have that kind of like

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Speaker 2: sentimental attachment to anything. And so rooting for Luka doncicch like,

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Speaker 2: actually rooting for Luka Doncicic has given me such a

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Speaker 2: unique experience, like learning about him as a basketball player.

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Speaker 2: I think, I think truly rooting for a player you

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Speaker 2: just learn so much. And so you've I've been truly

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Speaker 2: rooting for Jimmy Butler. Now for twenty games. What has

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Speaker 2: that experience been like? What have you been surprised by

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Speaker 2: what have you really loved about his game? Just talk

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Speaker 2: a little bit about what that's been like.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he was one of my favorite non Warriors

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Speaker 1: over the last decade. I always found myself rooting for

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Speaker 1: the Heat in the playoffs, you know, Eastern Conference. I

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Speaker 1: have no attachment to anyone, and I just love the

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Speaker 1: way they play, and you know, he's had some memorable

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Speaker 1: playoff modes, so I felt like I knew him. But

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Speaker 1: to your point, it's just not the same as when

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Speaker 1: you're watching every game opening tip to the end, and

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Speaker 1: so the things that jump out to me are like

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Speaker 1: I thought he would be a good fit on the

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Speaker 1: Warriors because there's such a premium on IQ and ball

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Speaker 1: movement in passing, and it's gone like five levels above

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Speaker 1: what I thought it would be. I thought there'd also

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Speaker 1: be a little friction because he's traditionally been a little

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Speaker 1: of an ISO player and the Warriors are traditionally not

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Speaker 1: that type of team, and it's been the complete opposite.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he's like essentially playing like Andrea Gudala, but

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Speaker 1: with the ability to get to the rim and the

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Speaker 1: free throw line. So that's been surprising. Other than that,

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Speaker 1: I don't know that the other aspects of it have

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Speaker 1: necessarily been that surprising. We've gone through kind of the

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Speaker 1: ebbs and flow of how he asserts himself. He's an

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Speaker 1: interesting player in the fact that he has a superstar

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Speaker 1: impact on the game, Like when you look at all

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Speaker 1: the advanced metrics, he always grades out as one of

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Speaker 1: the ten to fifteen best players just in terms of

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Speaker 1: impacting winning, But he's not really an offensive superstar. You

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Speaker 1: think of those playoff moments where he scored forty plus

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Speaker 1: and you think he's more of kind of your traditional

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go get a bucket type of guy, and

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Speaker 1: that's been the thing that watching him more, it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: there'll be moments he does it, but that's really not

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Speaker 1: his game at all. So I guess that's kind of

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Speaker 1: been the other surprising thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, it's fascinating because I think you could

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Speaker 2: make the case that the war are best equipped to

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Speaker 2: pull superstar level winning impact out of Jimmy Butler in

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Speaker 2: this phase of his career. You sent me some numbers earlier,

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Speaker 2: and we're gonna talk about it with uh with Jonathan

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Speaker 2: Kaminga here in a little bit, But just some of

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Speaker 2: the difference and on off numbers between him with kaminga

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Speaker 2: versus a guy like Gie Santos, where it's like crisp

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Speaker 2: quick decision making that all fits within the flow of

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Speaker 2: what they do in their five out offense, versus a

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Speaker 2: guy that like has more of a specific lane that

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Speaker 2: he thrives in and if things are operating in that lane,

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Speaker 2: then he looks super impactful. But when it gets outside

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Speaker 2: of that, he can struggle. And like I think with

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Speaker 2: Jimmy's versatility, there is a downside, and I think we

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Speaker 2: saw a little bit of it last night in the

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Speaker 2: sense that, like, if you with that without Steph, if

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Speaker 2: he's entirely out of the picture because he's injured, you're

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Speaker 2: not gonna get twenty five and eight from him every night.

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Speaker 2: That's not necessarily a level he can get to any more.

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Speaker 2: But within within the context of Steph being available, he's

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Speaker 2: more than capable of lifting these bench units. And they've

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Speaker 2: been really good this year with Steph off the floor

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Speaker 2: with Jimmy on like, they've been astonishingly good. I want

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Speaker 2: to say the net rating is almost plus twenty per

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Speaker 2: one hundred possessions. They're killing teams. In that context, it

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Speaker 2: is a little bit of a different journey, and I

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Speaker 2: think there's some like if I was playing Devil's advocate

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Speaker 2: on the trade, I would say, over the course of

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Speaker 2: the rest of this year and next year, when Steph

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Speaker 2: misses time, this team is going to look rough because

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Speaker 2: of the fact that Jimmy is not necessarily the guy

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Speaker 2: that can scale up in that specific ability. But ultimately

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Speaker 2: that doesn't matter because this team isn't accomplishing anything unless

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Speaker 2: Steph is healthy and available anyway, and in that context,

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Speaker 2: his versatility is a superstar trade and it does pull

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Speaker 2: everything together. You mentioned the Andre Gudala piece to me,

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Speaker 2: where you see so much of that is just like

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Speaker 2: his nose for the ball and his ability to make

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Speaker 2: reads in screening situations, when to slip or when to curl,

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Speaker 2: when to do all these little different things. One of

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Speaker 2: the things from watching Jimmy very closely with the Warriors

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Speaker 2: that stood out to me is he's one of the

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Speaker 2: best people in the league at high pointing the basketball.

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Speaker 2: So like in a lot of the switching that teams

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Speaker 2: use against Golden State, he'll end up with these like

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Speaker 2: inside seals and they'll float the ball up and he

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Speaker 2: just gets it every damn time. And that has allowed

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Speaker 2: him to kind of like manufacture pressure on the rim

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Speaker 2: off the ball, which has been a big part of

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Speaker 2: his like spacing alongside of Steph. And so think like

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Speaker 2: I think the part that is you mentioned it is

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Speaker 2: pressure to the rim, and that's really the key his

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Speaker 2: superstar trait offensively that he's bringing, and it's coming through

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Speaker 2: all these different things as a read and react player,

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Speaker 2: Ceiling posting, ISOs, all that kind of stuff. He applies

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Speaker 2: real consistent night to night rim pressure next to Steph,

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Speaker 2: and that is unlocking a lot of that offensive upside.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And and to your point on the IQ. The

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Speaker 1: game then also sticks in my mind from a defensive standpoint,

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Speaker 1: is the one against the Milwaukee Bucks. It's called a

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Speaker 1: week ago. Now, Steph sat that game. You know, they

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Speaker 1: just lost to the yokch list Nuggets, just an all

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Speaker 1: round bad loss, Like you shouldn't lose those games at home, right,

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Speaker 1: And then so then they go play Milwaukee and they

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Speaker 1: sit Steph because he's kind of banged up, and so

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Speaker 1: you know, you think it's gonna be lost, and it's

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Speaker 1: the opposite. And that was probably Draymond Green's like best

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Speaker 1: defensive game of the year. He took Jannis completely out

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Speaker 1: of it. And the first thing Draymond said in postgame

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Speaker 1: is it's easier for me to do that and ignore

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Speaker 1: help obligations when I have someone like Jimmy, who you know,

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Speaker 1: can just say I got you, I'll take care of that.

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Speaker 1: You just you meet him in half court, you take

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Speaker 1: them one on one, that sort of defensive stuff, and

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Speaker 1: that's something they've been missing for literally since they had

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Speaker 1: you know, Andre Goodal or Andrew Bogan and just like this,

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of embarrassment of riches and terms of

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Speaker 1: like high IQ defenders. They finally have someone who can

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Speaker 1: organize them and get them going in addition to Draymond,

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Speaker 1: and so yeah, to your point, like he does fit

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Speaker 1: exactly what the Warriors need and fits exactly perfectly next

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Speaker 1: to Steph and Draymond on both sides of the ball. Honestly, now,

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Speaker 1: it puts a lot of pressure on the other pieces

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Speaker 1: around them, because I like the way that three man

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Speaker 1: construct works. But I'm also not naive to the fact

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Speaker 1: that there are certain weaknesses that need to be masked

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Speaker 1: by younger legs, by shooting, by defense, some other things there.

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Speaker 1: And that's kind of really where my focus in the

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Speaker 1: Warrior season is for the rest of the way.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, we're going to talk about that concept

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Speaker 2: in a minute. But like there's a certain amount of

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Speaker 2: this with the Warriors that is theoretical. But what to

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Speaker 2: me is not theoretical is Steph, Jimmy and Draymond. Like

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Speaker 2: I know what I'm going to get out of the

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Speaker 2: three of them in the playoff context. It feels like

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Speaker 2: a like a known commodity to me. You know, I

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Speaker 2: remember when you're talking about the defense the I remember

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Speaker 2: a lot of that has tense he surrounding this deal

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Speaker 2: with Andrew Wiggins, and part of the reason why it

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Speaker 2: was like when they won the title, it was Andrew

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Speaker 2: Wiggins who was picking up Luca full court and applying

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Speaker 2: all that ball pressure. It was Andrew Wiggins who was

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Speaker 2: picking up Jason Tatum full court and playing him into

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Speaker 2: the tough series that he had in the NBA Finals.

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Speaker 2: And like, I think there's a certain amount of like

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Speaker 2: Jimmy's not gonna be as good as Andrew at just

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Speaker 2: guarding the other team's best player every night. But I

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Speaker 2: think there's two elements to that that have kind of

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Speaker 2: allowed it to work anyway. One Moody's been more ready

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Speaker 2: for that than that. I think people realized, like you

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Speaker 2: talked about this a lot in the time leading up

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Speaker 2: to the trade, and you were spot on on this,

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Speaker 2: and like again, like there's a there was a lot

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Speaker 2: of negativity surrounding the Jimmy trade leading up to it,

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Speaker 2: and you were consistent, he's Jimmy fucking Butler. Just go

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Speaker 2: get him and we figure out the rest later. And

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Speaker 2: one of the things that you kept talking about at

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Speaker 2: the time was we need to clarify the rotation. And

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Speaker 2: it has an a lot of ways clarified the rotation

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Speaker 2: because Moses Moody has stepped into that role and it's

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Speaker 2: been consistent. He hasn't had to worry about getting his

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Speaker 2: minutes janked with he's had this role every single night.

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Speaker 2: He's taking that specific responsibility. And where Jimmy is better

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Speaker 2: than Andrew Wiggins on the defensive end of the floor

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Speaker 2: is playmaking just all of these like little things as

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Speaker 2: like peeling off and gambling and like making plays in

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Speaker 2: passing lanes where he's a little bit more of an

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Speaker 2: instinctual defensive playmaker than Andrew Wiggins. And the bottom line is, statistically,

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Speaker 2: the defense has been better. They've been the second best

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Speaker 2: defense in the league over a twenty one game span.

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Speaker 2: Now that's a fourth of the season, and so I

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Speaker 2: think that's relatively undeniable at this point. I want to

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Speaker 2: talk about these role players though for a minute, because

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Speaker 2: I agree with you, like we when we know what Steph,

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Speaker 2: Jimmy and Draymond are. Let's start really quickly before we

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Speaker 2: get into like kaminga. Are you happy and confident in

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Speaker 2: Pods and Moody as the two other guys in that lineup.

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Speaker 1: Throwing GP two as well? Yeah, it's look they were.

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Speaker 1: They were not particularly good against Miami and to a

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Speaker 1: lesser degree, Atlanta in these stephless games, but in general

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Speaker 1: they have kind of fit the bill when we've had Steph, Jimmy,

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Speaker 1: and Draymond operational where they have a scaled down roll

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Speaker 1: where their responsibility is really just to you know, in

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Speaker 1: Moody's case, pure three and D player, right, you're guarding

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Speaker 1: the ball. He's had some excellent games against like Jalen Brunson,

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Speaker 1: for example, who could be a very tough cover and

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Speaker 1: kind of your quit essential like, oh, if you can't

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Speaker 1: guard the ball, he's going to dice you up, right,

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Speaker 1: like that type of guy and then ability to hit shots.

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Speaker 1: Because they're young players, they're a little consistent as well

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Speaker 1: at that and that's for me, one of the bigger

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Speaker 1: concerns that the Warriors is shot making outside of Steph

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Speaker 1: Curry Moses Moody is I want to say, a thirty

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Speaker 1: eight percent three point shooter on the season. The shot

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Speaker 1: looks pretty, it looks like it's going in every time,

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Speaker 1: but you know, end of the day, he's not Klay Thompson.

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Speaker 1: So and very few players are, to be fair, but

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Speaker 1: it's like it is very much the young player thing

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Speaker 1: where it's four for six one night, zero for six

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Speaker 1: the next night, and that type of stuff in the

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Speaker 1: playoffs could be really scary, particularly with how much the

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Speaker 1: three point shot is, you know, important in a playoff context.

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Speaker 1: And let's be honest, like how little shooting from the

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Speaker 1: outside they're gonna get from Draymond and Jimmy. I know

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Speaker 1: Draymond's been a better three point shooter last year and

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Speaker 1: a half, but he's probably not gonna hit five threes

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Speaker 1: in a game. He's probably not gonna take ten threes.

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Speaker 1: Most of his threes are kind of you know, end

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Speaker 1: of shot clock bailout possession type of of threes. So

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of pressure on Moses Moody to fill.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to say the role Klay Thompson phil

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Speaker 1: because that's just unrealistic, but like to fill the role

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Speaker 1: that someone like a Harrison Barnes or Andrew Wiggins did

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Speaker 1: where if they're left alone in the corner, they hit it.

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Speaker 1: You know, if they're left you know, if you're if

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Speaker 1: you're sending two at the ball because you have Steph Curry,

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Speaker 1: Draymond's getting downhill, then you have a man shading towards

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Speaker 1: towards Jimmy someone's open, not someone who's open will be

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Speaker 1: Moses Moody or Brandon Pajemski. And this applies actually even

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Speaker 1: more so for Pods. He just does more things than

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Speaker 1: shoot the ball. They have to be able to hit

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Speaker 1: those shots. So that's kind of my number one worry

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Speaker 1: with them. But to your point on the defensive side,

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Speaker 1: I actually feel pretty comfortable with this team if they

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Speaker 1: have a healthy version of Draymond Green and Jimmy Butler

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Speaker 1: being able to get those young guys in position to succeed,

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Speaker 1: and I think they're ready for the moment.

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Speaker 2: Defensively, if someone asked me what the biggest swing factor

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Speaker 2: is for the Warriors and the postseason. It's just those

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Speaker 2: guys making shots. I mean, I thought the Bucks game

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Speaker 2: was such a perfect example that they put Brook Lopez

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Speaker 2: on Gary Payton down the stretch and he just sits

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Speaker 2: his ass right underneath basket and they're gapping off of

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Speaker 2: Pods and the two of them, Pods on the right

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Speaker 2: wing and Gary on the left wing, get two just

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Speaker 2: completely uncontested threes in crunch time. They make them both

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Speaker 2: and it ends up being a big part of how

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Speaker 2: they win. And like there's a certain amount of like

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Speaker 2: to your point, Like, even though Andre Gudala never had

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Speaker 2: the reputation of being like this knockdown shooter, it always

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Speaker 2: felt like he made the big ones that he needed

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Speaker 2: to make in that corner.

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Speaker 1: If it's a big game, it was going in.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, dude. And so like there's a certain amount

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Speaker 2: of like Draymond was kind of like the one guy

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Speaker 2: on the floor that you kind of had the ability

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Speaker 2: to really help off of and feel like you were

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Speaker 2: confident that he was going to miss more often than

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Speaker 2: he made. And it just like you start to add

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Speaker 2: that to two guys on the floor maybe a third

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Speaker 2: guy on the floor. That's where it can get a

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Speaker 2: little tricky. And so I do think that that's the

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Speaker 2: weakness there. That said, I think you could make that

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Speaker 2: same argument for some other teams around the league. I like, really,

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Speaker 2: I think the only team you the only time I

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Speaker 2: feel confident it is just going to make shots if

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Speaker 2: they're open, as Boston like, they're gonna make shots, yeah,

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Speaker 2: if they're open. But like I could see I see

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Speaker 2: Oklahoma City potentially losing a playoff series missing threes. I

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Speaker 2: see with like mediocre shooters getting left open. I see

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Speaker 2: Denver potentially losing a series with the mediocre players hitting threes.

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Speaker 2: The Lakers are another team that can put together groups

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Speaker 2: with Dorian Finney, Smith and Rui where all five guys

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Speaker 2: are shooters. But even then, it's like Austin Reeves is

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Speaker 2: not the best catch and shoot guy in the world.

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Speaker 2: Like there's a version of it where he can go cold.

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Speaker 2: And so I think there's a certain amount of it

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Speaker 2: where it's like, I think we can't overlook the fact

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Speaker 2: that they're going to be a great defense that gets

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Speaker 2: out in transition and that has Steph Curry and that yes,

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Speaker 2: these guys are gonna have to knock down shots, but

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Speaker 2: that's not necessarily a death sentence, if that makes sense. Now,

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Speaker 2: as we go deeper into the bench, the Jonathan Camena

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Speaker 2: experience I think has been uneven. I thought he was

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Speaker 2: really good in his first game back. What was that Sacramento?

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Speaker 2: If I remember correctly, I think it was He's really

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Speaker 2: good in that game where everything was with an advantage,

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Speaker 2: everything was towards the rim, everything was geared towards like

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Speaker 2: playing in the flow. But one of the big difference

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Speaker 2: difference is like when you sent me the numbers this

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Speaker 2: morning with him versus Gie Santos, to me, like Jonathan

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Speaker 2: Kaminga has the ability to make certain reads, particularly as

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Speaker 2: a cutter. When he sees like a lane open up,

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Speaker 2: he'll run to the front of the rim, and I

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Speaker 2: think there is some value in that as a play finisher.

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Speaker 2: But every other type of read and react situation on

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Speaker 2: the court, he sorely lacks behind his teammates, and I

388
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Speaker 2: think like there's a certain lack of ceiling with a

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Speaker 2: guy like Gi Santo's, but there's a certain predictability as

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Speaker 2: a catch and shoot guy and as a guy who

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Speaker 2: crashes the offensive glass every time and as a guy

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Speaker 2: who makes decisions in read and reacts situations and so like. Ultimately,

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Speaker 2: I think there's a version of this where Jonathan Kminga's

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Speaker 2: role could shrink considerably when they get into the postseason.

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Speaker 2: How have you felt about their early returns with cominga

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Speaker 2: alongside Jimmy and the crew, and how he fits both

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Speaker 2: in the short and long term.

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Speaker 1: I mean, and so two different questions. In the long term,

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Speaker 1: I'm more bullish on him figuring it out, and he

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Speaker 1: does do one specific thing that this older iteration of

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Speaker 1: the Warriors really needs, which is he gets to the

402
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,280
Speaker 1: rim and he's hyper athletic. Look, they're an older team.

403
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Speaker 1: Any any young player who can play above the rim

404
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,399
Speaker 1: and can beat their man with their first step is

405
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Speaker 1: welcome on this team. In theory, he should also be

406
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Speaker 1: a hyperactive defender that has not necessarily shown up. But

407
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Speaker 1: we've seen tons of young wings with his physical profile

408
00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,480
Speaker 1: who look lost defensively, and then around year five or six,

409
00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,920
Speaker 1: it just clicks. Andrew Wiggins probably the most obvious example.

410
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Speaker 1: He went from being kind of a you know, having

411
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Speaker 1: a terrible reputation defensively in Minnesota to almost making, you know,

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Speaker 1: an All NBA defensive teams, right, So it happens all

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Speaker 1: the time on that end. You can't discount the physical tools.

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Speaker 1: Now in the short term, month far less optimistic because

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Speaker 1: to your point, we're ten games away from the playoffs,

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Speaker 1: and you know, they don't have fifty games for him

417
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Speaker 1: to figure it out. And the thing that pops to

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Speaker 1: me when I watch him is he wants to occupy

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Speaker 1: all the same spots on the floor that Jimmy Butler is,

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Speaker 1: but Jimmy's better at him at everything, and so he

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Speaker 1: hasn't figured out how to adapt to that. And because

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Speaker 1: he's a young player, and to your point, I don't

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Speaker 1: want to say feel is lacking, but he's just far

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Speaker 1: less mature mentally in terms of reading the game than

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Speaker 1: the other guys on the team. You know, probably the

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Speaker 1: biggest advantage the Warriors have going into a playoff series

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Speaker 1: is Steph, Jimmy, and Draymond will be a step ahead

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Speaker 1: of almost every one of their opponents. That those are

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Speaker 1: three of the five to seven smartest players in the NBA.

430
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:52,760
Speaker 1: What they lack in foot speed, they make up for

431
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,400
Speaker 1: a mental processing speed. So it means the other two

432
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,080
Speaker 1: guys have to know how to play off of that

433
00:21:57,280 --> 00:22:02,159
Speaker 1: and kuminga combination of both being young and you know,

434
00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,080
Speaker 1: maybe not as developed as the Warriors would have liked

435
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:06,600
Speaker 1: him to be in here for and let's just be realistic,

436
00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:09,280
Speaker 1: he missed two plus months with an injury and he's

437
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:11,840
Speaker 1: trying to get integrated into a brand new team. That

438
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 1: puts him in a really rough position. Particularly since he's

439
00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:18,040
Speaker 1: not a shooter. You can't plug him in to Moses

440
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,600
Speaker 1: Moody's role where you know, Moses Moody offensively is essentially

441
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,120
Speaker 1: just gonna be, you know, standing in the corner. Most

442
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,639
Speaker 1: actions are finding him camping out in the weak side

443
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:28,680
Speaker 1: corner that if they help off of him, he gets

444
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,160
Speaker 1: a wide open three. That's not going to work for Kuminga.

445
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 1: So to your point, if he can read the game

446
00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:37,440
Speaker 1: at the speed the Warriors like to play, you could

447
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,439
Speaker 1: actually take advantage of them as a cutter, take advantage

448
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: of the athleticism, the ball move stuff we've seen Warriors

449
00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:44,679
Speaker 1: teams do for a decade. Right where you're just like,

450
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 1: how does honestly GP two master this? Right? He can't

451
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:50,280
Speaker 1: really shoot the ball, I know, shoot the ball well now,

452
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:52,480
Speaker 1: but nobody guards him like he's a shooter. But he

453
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,479
Speaker 1: knows exactly how to play off of Stephan Draimon, and

454
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 1: he always seems to find himself, you know, cutting baseline

455
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 1: for a wide open layup or dunk. In theory, that's

456
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,399
Speaker 1: how Kumenga can thrive with this team. It just hasn't

457
00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:07,600
Speaker 1: come to fruition. And I mean, maybe I'm a pessimist

458
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:11,240
Speaker 1: about it, but like ten games, and these are not

459
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:14,720
Speaker 1: games that they can just give him space either. They're

460
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 1: like a half game out of being in the play in,

461
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,240
Speaker 1: so they need to treat every game like it's a

462
00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 1: real game, which leads to scenarios like the Atlanta game

463
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 1: where he was playing poorly and he did not play

464
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:29,960
Speaker 1: more than four myths in the second half. How is

465
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 1: he going to figure it out if he only plays

466
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 1: four miss in the second half. But at the same time,

467
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 1: the Warriors have to win games, so he's just I

468
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 1: don't see how this solves itself in the short term.

469
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,840
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you brought up how much this sucks

470
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 2: for Jonathan, because it really does. You know, there was

471
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:49,160
Speaker 2: so much pessimism surrounding whether or not a deal would

472
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 2: actually get made at all in like late January, that

473
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,320
Speaker 2: it turned into a situation where it almost looked like, oh,

474
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 2: it's Jonathan's time now, like this is about to go

475
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,680
Speaker 2: the other direction, and this is going to go towards

476
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:04,679
Speaker 2: we're leaning towards the future. Here are the keys, Jonathan.

477
00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,400
Speaker 2: You're gonna get to do your thing for extended stretches

478
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:09,720
Speaker 2: of the game, have a long leash, get to make mistakes,

479
00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:14,760
Speaker 2: and it radically flipped to now you're coming back. There's

480
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 2: no way you have a starting spot. The only version

481
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:20,000
Speaker 2: of this where you contribute to the team is where

482
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:22,480
Speaker 2: you become this read and react player. And like I think,

483
00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 2: you know, I think you have to be good at

484
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,959
Speaker 2: one of two things to be a good offensive player

485
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:29,960
Speaker 2: around Steph, Jimmy and Raymond. You either have to be

486
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,000
Speaker 2: an excellent shooter or an excellent read and react player,

487
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,719
Speaker 2: and he's neither, and that just puts him into a

488
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,400
Speaker 2: really tough position accentuating his game. Because to your point

489
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 2: about occupying all the same spots on the floor, your

490
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,000
Speaker 2: value as a basketball player is unique to your team.

491
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:45,560
Speaker 2: It has nothing to do with what your talents are

492
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 2: in a vacuum. It's all theoretical in a vacuum on

493
00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 2: your team, it's what you can do within that group,

494
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 2: and there's no version of this where he's going to

495
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 2: be playing in the playoffs with neither of Jimmy or

496
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,359
Speaker 2: stuff on the floor, meaning the game is going to

497
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:02,679
Speaker 2: have to be predicated with him playing off of those guys,

498
00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,240
Speaker 2: and it's just gonna be like again, when Jimmy has

499
00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 2: had success offensively without Steph, it's been this whirling dervish

500
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:16,120
Speaker 2: of these read and react guys, relocating, cutting, screening, slipping,

501
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 2: all this kind of stuff around him, and that part

502
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 2: has worked, but it's just not gonna work that way

503
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:25,600
Speaker 2: like in the postseason context when Jonathan Kaming is out there,

504
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,360
Speaker 2: He's not gonna be able to have the same kinds

505
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 2: of opportunities he did before the deadline, And so it's

506
00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 2: just difficult, and honestly, I do feel bad for him,

507
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 2: and like I do wonder what this does look like

508
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 2: in the big picture, because Steph talked about it the

509
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 2: other day, it seems to me like there's been an

510
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:41,879
Speaker 2: organizational commitment that they're trying this next year too, right,

511
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 2: so it seems like this is a two year window,

512
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,239
Speaker 2: like we're going for it, We're gonna try to make

513
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,119
Speaker 2: this happen, and like you talk about ten games I

514
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 2: don't necessarily see a version of this where he blossoms

515
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 2: into that player next year either, And so I think

516
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:57,359
Speaker 2: this could be a challenging stretch for Jonathan in his career,

517
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,440
Speaker 2: and I'm really curious just to see how he adapts

518
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,919
Speaker 2: to it, because before the deadline he had leverage in

519
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 2: the sense that he could go to the media and

520
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:08,080
Speaker 2: be like, what the hell are we doing here? Like

521
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,280
Speaker 2: we're not very good? Why am I not getting an

522
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,880
Speaker 2: opportunity to show what I can do? Like what's the deal?

523
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 2: Whereas like, there is this clear, obvious championship ceiling with

524
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 2: the Warriors now, and Jonathan has to find a way

525
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 2: to kind of conform into that and it's just difficult.

526
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, he's kinda it's tough break. I don't

527
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 1: know what else to say. Like the pre trade deadline Warriors,

528
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 1: I love how you pointed out Jimmy Butler's defensive playmaking.

529
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: I would say the number one thing they lacked on

530
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:39,159
Speaker 1: both ends of the floor was playmaking pre trade, and

531
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 1: Jimmy addresses both those things. Now, he's not a perfect player,

532
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 1: you know, like the perfect edition would have been the

533
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 1: honest he also addresses both those things. Both it's literally

534
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:51,800
Speaker 1: higher ceiling, right. So but he you know now that

535
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 1: he takes care of your wing playmaker, a guy who

536
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 1: you can run a pick and roll for and ISO

537
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,320
Speaker 1: operate out of the post. Those were all the best

538
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: places that Kuminga was starting to find success. I don't

539
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:07,159
Speaker 1: gonna say he's found total successor that's what he was

540
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,840
Speaker 1: starting to develop. And he's just he's not equipped at

541
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: this point to be Harrison Barnes or Andrew Wiggins, who

542
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,640
Speaker 1: is who they need. Like in a perfect world, if

543
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,679
Speaker 1: he was ready to be the twenty fifteen Harrison Barnes

544
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,399
Speaker 1: who could hit open shots and knew how to play

545
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 1: off of staff Igudala, Draymond Clay or Andrew Wiggins who's

546
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: proven he could do that, and in many ways that

547
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 1: is his ideal role. I think he would be starting games,

548
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 1: and I know he would be closing games as that

549
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 1: third front court player. But the SHOT's not there. He's

550
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 1: also just a hesitant shooter. He's not three point sho

551
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 1: that's not really his game. And you know he's not

552
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,639
Speaker 1: there defensively either. He's just kind of in a rough spot.

553
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,240
Speaker 1: It's easier to play gis aantos because gist aantos is

554
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:54,360
Speaker 1: those things even if it's you know, with a lower ceiling.

555
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 2: The hesitance is almost like worse than the actual not

556
00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:00,159
Speaker 2: making of the shot, because like defenses prey on that

557
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 2: with short closeouts and they just bait on the fact

558
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:04,679
Speaker 2: that we don't even think you're gonna take it, like

559
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 2: let alone, let alone knock it down. But I mean,

560
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:09,840
Speaker 2: you know, I talked earlier about like the runways that

561
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 2: he operates on, like these gaps that appear around the

562
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 2: rim where he'll just jet to the front of the rim.

563
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 2: And the truth of the matter is is as the

564
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 2: defenses get better, those runways just don't appear very often,

565
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 2: and it becomes about playing in tight space and it

566
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:24,159
Speaker 2: becomes about making those decisions and split second processing speed

567
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 2: and all that kind of stuff, and it's just it's

568
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,160
Speaker 2: just tough. Let's get zoom out a little bit more.

569
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 1: Okay, So.

570
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 2: Sixteen and four with Jimmy, we know that there have

571
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 2: been a handful of impressive wins in there, but that

572
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 2: they've played a relatively light schedule. Sure, as we go

573
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 2: down the stretch of the season, they do have some

574
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 2: big games, Like I know they have one against the Lakers,

575
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 2: Do I think do they won more against the Thunder.

576
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 2: I think they played. I think they played.

577
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,440
Speaker 1: They do not play the Thunder again. That they do

578
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 1: have Denver at least one more time, and I think

579
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: it gets they might. Yeah, I feel like they've played Houston.

580
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:04,719
Speaker 1: They do, actually, right, it's one of their last games.

581
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,240
Speaker 1: I swear they've played Houston four times this year. I

582
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 1: felt like they played Houston three times. Yeah, there you go.

583
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 1: They also have the Clippers at the end of the season,

584
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 1: last game of the season. There's a very realistic chance

585
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: that will literally decide you know, the seventh seed, six,

586
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: six to seven, whatever it may be. So, yeah, they

587
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 1: have a you know what sucks about this Steph injury

588
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 1: is Atlanta and Miami looked like easy wins with Steph

589
00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 1: Curry and they drop both of those. Like this road

590
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,720
Speaker 1: trip really should have been where they picked up the

591
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 1: easy wins. You got the Pelicans tonight, you got the Spurs,

592
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 1: you got a reeling Grizzlies team. These are theoretically all

593
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:45,480
Speaker 1: very winnable games for the Warriors before they get into

594
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 1: a tougher stretch of Lakers, Nuggets, Rockets, Sons who have

595
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 1: life again, and Clippers and those type of teams.

596
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like the Suns Clippers games are gonna be

597
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 2: the tougher ones because just having routed, I mean, we're

598
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 2: familiar with rooting for playing team Sam, We've done it

599
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 2: over the course of years.

600
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: Nobody knows the playing better than you and me.

601
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 2: We we like know that like those games against the

602
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 2: higher leverage teams, who the hell knows who's gonna play

603
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,720
Speaker 2: in those games or the level of intensity, and like,

604
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 2: it could end up being that those Sons, Clippers, the

605
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 2: other play in type of teams are the ones that

606
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 2: end up giving the tougher fights. But the point is,

607
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 2: the bottom line is we're not gonna get to see

608
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 2: this team play a good amount of you know, high

609
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 2: leverage basketball before they're actually in the high leverage basketball.

610
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:32,720
Speaker 2: And so there's a certain amount of this that is

611
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 2: theoretical just with what this team can or cannot do.

612
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 2: So given that we're gonna take that and set it

613
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 2: to the side that we all agree that a certain

614
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:44,000
Speaker 2: amount of this is conjecture. And I mean, I'm here's

615
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 2: the thing. It's conjecture for every team in the league,

616
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 2: but just a little bit more so for the Warriors

617
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,479
Speaker 2: because of the stuff that's gone down with the schedule

618
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 2: and with Steph's injuries. So with the amount of information

619
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 2: that you have, how are you feeling right now in

620
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:00,040
Speaker 2: terms of your level of optimism for this team a

621
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 2: potential playoff run.

622
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: Barely optimistic somewhere. I feel like they have a puncher's

623
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: chance to get out of the West. I did not

624
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 1: feel like they had a realistic chance to do anything

625
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 1: the last two years. So they you know, are they

626
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: the odds on favorite? No? Do I think the Vegas odds,

627
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 1: which has somewhere like third or fourth most like it

628
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: come out of the West, is accurate. Yeah, I think

629
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:27,440
Speaker 1: they really could. I actually think the twenty or so

630
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: games they've played with Jimmy are indicative of the type

631
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 1: of team they are. They have the best defense in

632
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 1: that span. I'm not gonna say they have the best

633
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: defense in the league, but I do think they have

634
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 1: a top five defense with Jimmy Butler, and I think

635
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:42,120
Speaker 1: that will translate in the playoffs. And they've been the

636
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: ninth best offense. I would actually say that's probably even

637
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:49,280
Speaker 1: a little on the high side. I think they're somewhere

638
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 1: around the tenth to twelfth best offense in the league,

639
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:53,719
Speaker 1: and so that's the kind of team you're talking about here.

640
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: I think they can defend. They can keep themselves in

641
00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 1: most every matchup in the playoffs, and it really comes

642
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: down to do they get enough shot making around Steph Curry.

643
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 1: They've been they get a bunch of open threes for

644
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: Moses Moody, for Brandon Pajemski, for Gary Payton, the second

645
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 1: who looks reborn by the way, just overall as a player,

646
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: he looks like he did during the title run, both

647
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:20,720
Speaker 1: defensively and offensively. For Kuminga, you know he's gonna get

648
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 1: if the shot comes around in the next month, like

649
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 1: they will give him wide open shots because of the

650
00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:29,480
Speaker 1: way that they guard the Warriors, And so yeah, my

651
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 1: question is do they have enough shot making? And then

652
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 1: if the shot making does not come around, the size question,

653
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: because they're gonna play small. They play well small, but

654
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: like Moses Moody at power forward is very small, you

655
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Like they're playing Jimmy and Draymond

656
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 1: and Moses Moody and Brandon Pajemski and Steph Curry. That's

657
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 1: their best lineup right now. That's significantly smaller than their

658
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: famous death lineups. Their death lineup was small because Draymond's

659
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: too small to play center. But if you just accept

660
00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: that he's an anomaly of a human, they actually were

661
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: not small. They had six seven guys with seven plus

662
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: foot wingspans all across the perimeter. In some ways, it's

663
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 1: like the makeup that the Lakers have where you're like, okay,

664
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 1: there's no real center here. But I would not call

665
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: them a small team. They're large across the perimeter. It's

666
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,360
Speaker 1: just a question if they can piece meal the center position.

667
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 1: And so you know, like Denver, Denver is gonna be

668
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: a rough matchup for them because Aaron Gordon's huge for

669
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: a wing and he kind of takes away that wing

670
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: advantage that they have. And then Jokic is Jokic, right, Like,

671
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:40,719
Speaker 1: those are my question marks for them, But like on

672
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: the flip side, as great as Okac is now, the

673
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:46,800
Speaker 1: size isn't really as big of an issue. Okay, so

674
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: he plays the same size guys. Obviously they're excellent. They

675
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 1: had their record says it. So I don't know. I

676
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 1: think they have a real they have a realistic chance.

677
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: They do have exploitable flaws, but I think that's true

678
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 1: of every team in the West. It's a very it's

679
00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 1: a very good Western conference. I'm not sure there's a

680
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: great team in this conference.

681
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, or they're all great teams. That's the like relative

682
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 2: Like that's the other thing too, is like you know,

683
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 2: I was looking at it too, like like Oklahoma City

684
00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 2: might get Minnesota in the first round. What a shit

685
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 2: end of the stick for going sixty to twelve to

686
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:17,399
Speaker 2: start the season. I was like, such a huge pain

687
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 2: of the ass. The Yeah, I love the part the

688
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 2: point you made about the size because like like just

689
00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 2: basically Andre Guidala is a bigger and more imposing athlete

690
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:26,280
Speaker 2: than either of Jimmy Butler.

691
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:26,719
Speaker 1: And Moses Moody.

692
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,480
Speaker 2: Just to give you an idea of like the difference

693
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 2: in the physical profile of those teams. Like add Kevin

694
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 2: Durant to the picture. It's an entirely different stratosphere of

695
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:35,840
Speaker 2: a play.

696
00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:38,399
Speaker 1: Is the same size as Jimmy Butler, Clay played the two.

697
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: Jimmy's kind of the four, you know, like that's what

698
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:42,359
Speaker 1: you need to know. Right there they were, they were

699
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: big across the perimeter, and then Draymond's just kind of

700
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:47,400
Speaker 1: you know, it's once in a generation sixty six you

701
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:49,280
Speaker 1: could play a center. Dude.

702
00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 2: I this ultimately is why I view them as a

703
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 2: legitimate puncher's chance threat. First of all, I like phase one,

704
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,120
Speaker 2: don't overthink it. It's Jimmy at step as Draymond put

705
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 2: them in a playoff series. You mentioned the processing speed,

706
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 2: even just the experience, the confidence, the level of comfortability

707
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:12,160
Speaker 2: they're gonna experience in those environments. You mentioned the defense

708
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,480
Speaker 2: to me, like like to me, the Lakers with the

709
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:17,520
Speaker 2: number one defense in the league for a few months,

710
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 2: and they are a good defense. But with Luca, I

711
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,759
Speaker 2: look at them at their best as somewhere in that

712
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 2: six to ten range as a defense, Like I don't

713
00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:31,839
Speaker 2: actually think they have the level of imposition athletically that

714
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:35,200
Speaker 2: they can cause problems for teams at the level of

715
00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:37,839
Speaker 2: a top five defense. I think Golden State does have

716
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 2: that level of defense. That level of defense, to your point,

717
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 2: will keep you in every game, and if you're in

718
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 2: every game, there's a certain amount of like, if this

719
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 2: guy makes a couple of shots, we end up winning it,

720
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 2: you know, And as long as they generate enough quality ones,

721
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:51,880
Speaker 2: they've got a good chance. I'm glad you brought up

722
00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 2: the size. Ironically, I'm actually more worried, like I think

723
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:59,120
Speaker 2: Denver and the Lakers present different issues for Golden State

724
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 2: with size, the Lakers with their just massive forwards that

725
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:04,399
Speaker 2: are just going to be picking on smalls all over

726
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 2: the place in Denver with the Jokic problem. But I

727
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 2: could also flip that around and I can go one

728
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 2: of the most impressive teams against OKC and Boston this

729
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:16,320
Speaker 2: year has been Golden State. They've looked good at times

730
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,440
Speaker 2: in those matchups and have caused them real problems before

731
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 2: Jimmy Butler came to town. And so when I look

732
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:26,520
Speaker 2: at it, like a big part of their punchers chance

733
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:28,279
Speaker 2: is like to me, they match up well with the

734
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:31,040
Speaker 2: top teams in the league, and there's a certain amount

735
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:33,319
Speaker 2: of this like with matchups they might not have to

736
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 2: face both Denver and LA They might not have to

737
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,359
Speaker 2: face either of them. If things go a certain way,

738
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:39,040
Speaker 2: like you don't know how this could end up shaking out,

739
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 2: like they could end up catching it.

740
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 1: A dream scenario for the Warriors would be Lakers in

741
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,879
Speaker 1: Denver getting stuck together round one, just so it's right

742
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 1: off the bat, one of them are eliminated.

743
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:52,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly exactly, And that's the wildcard with the Western Conference.

744
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 2: It's always so difficult the factor in. But like you mentioned,

745
00:36:55,200 --> 00:36:57,399
Speaker 2: like to me, all the teams have flaws. I think

746
00:36:57,400 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 2: we can all agree that the Thunder and the Celtics

747
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 2: are a level above to a certain extent. I think

748
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 2: it's a smaller level above than some other people think.

749
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:07,440
Speaker 2: Like I've I talked to people who think, and I'm

750
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 2: sure you do too, that that think, Okay, Oklahoma City

751
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 2: is just a runaway Western Conference favorite. I don't see

752
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 2: it that way. I view them as a slight Western

753
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 2: Conference favorite. I think that when you've got a rotation

754
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 2: full of dudes who are twenty six and younger, they're

755
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 2: gonna win a shit ton of games, like especially when

756
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 2: they're talented, because they're just so young and so you know,

757
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:26,200
Speaker 2: indomitable as athletes in the regular sas.

758
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: They don't come out looking tired on the third game

759
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: and four nights the way the Warriors are Lakers might exactly.

760
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 2: And by the way, even the Celtics have a certain

761
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: amount of like age and fatigue in their in their rotation.

762
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:39,360
Speaker 2: That I think that that I think factors in. But

763
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 2: but ultimately, ultimately all of these teams have exploitable flaws.

764
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 2: All of them, to me, are beatable and so like.

765
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 2: That's why I don't think it makes a ton of

766
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 2: sense to hyper focus on any team's flaw, whether it's

767
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 2: the Lakers in their center, if it's Denver in their

768
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 2: lack of defense, or it's Golden State and their lack

769
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 2: of shot making. It just I think I think all

770
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:58,399
Speaker 2: of these teams have a certain amount of law. So, okay,

771
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:00,879
Speaker 2: we have a couple more minutes, really quick, what does

772
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 2: this summer look like? Let's just say, because I think

773
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 2: there's a version of this where they get their ass

774
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 2: kicked in the first round, where it could be a

775
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 2: little bit more complicated. But let's say that they make

776
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:14,400
Speaker 2: a run to at least the second or third round,

777
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:16,400
Speaker 2: and they put up a really good fight and they

778
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:18,480
Speaker 2: end up losing. What does this summer look like for

779
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 2: the Warriors in your opinion?

780
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: I mean, the first decision is Jonathan Kuminga and then

781
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:27,960
Speaker 1: it's Domino's from there. I think if you are committed

782
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: to Steph, Jimmy and Draymond, you have to use the

783
00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 1: summer to optimize the roster around their strengths and weaknesses.

784
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: They kind of put this together on the fly. We've

785
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 1: learned some things. This He's like, we've learned, Like this

786
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:43,880
Speaker 1: is exactly what they needed to turn Moses Moody into

787
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 1: a real rotation player. You know, Brandon Pajemski looks really

788
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 1: good next to him. He's probably back next year. Kuminga.

789
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,840
Speaker 1: I could see them coming away from the playoffs being like,

790
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,600
Speaker 1: he started figuring it out towards the end of it,

791
00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:00,440
Speaker 1: and we really need his legs because Jimmy gonna miss

792
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 1: twenty games, Steph's gonna miss twenty games, and it's just

793
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:06,799
Speaker 1: gonna be nice to have someone who can carry the

794
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 1: load in November December those times. I could also see

795
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:13,640
Speaker 1: them being like, you know what, it's not happening. Let's

796
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,520
Speaker 1: see what sign and trade possibilities are out there. So

797
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 1: I think it's all on the table right now. I

798
00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:21,160
Speaker 1: think if you were to talk to them off the record,

799
00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:23,680
Speaker 1: they would probably say the same thing. Their best case

800
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,839
Speaker 1: scenario is Kumika figures it out because it's one less complication.

801
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 1: It's always easier to just keep someone in house than

802
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 1: have to go out there and try to make a deal.

803
00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: So I think that's I think that's the first thing

804
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 1: they have to figure out. From there. It's scaling the

805
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: market for players who are probably under thirty, because you

806
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,760
Speaker 1: have an older core looking for more shot making, looking

807
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 1: for more front court shot making. Specifically, Quinton Post has

808
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 1: been an amazing find for them. I don't know how

809
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 1: much he's gonna play in the playoffs, just because young

810
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,439
Speaker 1: big who doesn't really profile as a defender anyway. Hard

811
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:01,280
Speaker 1: to play those guys in the playoff. Finding another piece

812
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:03,360
Speaker 1: like that, I think that's where they go. There is

813
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 1: also the you know, insane scenario where a Supermax player

814
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 1: becomes available and they trade Jimmy because now they have

815
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 1: the contract to match it. I do not think that'll happen,

816
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:16,960
Speaker 1: but I do think they would do it if they

817
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:17,720
Speaker 1: could get Giannis.

818
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,440
Speaker 2: So yeah, Giannis is the wild card that I could

819
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 2: see him coming available this year.

820
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 1: I'm just not betting on anything like that happening because

821
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 1: it's so unlikely. But hey, I didn't have Luka Doncic

822
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: getting moved at the dead of night on February first

823
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 1: happening either, so I cannot rule anything out anymore. Yeah.

824
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 2: One of the rare examples in NBA or in anything

825
00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 2: where the conspiracy theories make more sense than the reality

826
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:45,880
Speaker 2: of what happened exactly. This is my last question for you,

827
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:51,560
Speaker 2: mid level exception this summer, under the circumstances that we

828
00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 2: laid out, would you rather have a big that let's

829
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:01,439
Speaker 2: call it a versatile big that can does something really well,

830
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 2: whether it's shoot the ball or protect the rims super well,

831
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:06,319
Speaker 2: something like that. Like let's just say, like, let's just

832
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:08,120
Speaker 2: take like a Miles Turner for example. Let's say like

833
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:10,000
Speaker 2: a guy like Miles Turner was available for the MLLE,

834
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: which by the way, he might not be he probably

835
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:16,200
Speaker 2: won't be, or a shot creating like a perimeter ball

836
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:18,200
Speaker 2: handler type. What do you think is more important?

837
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:23,600
Speaker 1: Uh, give me a guy with positional size who can

838
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 1: drain threes. Because I do agree with you. The Warriors

839
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,120
Speaker 1: have for years kind of like turn their nose up

840
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:34,880
Speaker 1: at like the sixth man bucket getter type, and I

841
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:37,439
Speaker 1: think on the net aggregate, they're right, those guys tend

842
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:41,239
Speaker 1: to be overvalued and overpaid. But games where Steph doesn't play,

843
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: You're like, man, it'd be really nice to have. It'd

844
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 1: be really nice to have like a you know, like

845
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,520
Speaker 1: a Lou Williams or someone like that, that type of player, Right,

846
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,399
Speaker 1: I do think it's more realistic for them to find

847
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,000
Speaker 1: like a Shake Milton or someone like that on a

848
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 1: veteran minimum than an mL, whereas Mlee, I'm shooting for

849
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:02,160
Speaker 1: someone who's in my eight man playoff rotation. It's not

850
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:06,439
Speaker 1: someone who's spelling STEP's legs. So he plays sixty five

851
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:09,399
Speaker 1: games a year in a perfect world to get both.

852
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 2: But yeah, I think I think the way you laid

853
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:13,840
Speaker 2: it out is perfect. I think ultimately, if you're spending

854
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 2: you know, twelve million dollars on a player, it needs

855
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:17,280
Speaker 2: to be someone that's in your playoff rotation.

856
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:21,759
Speaker 1: Like this is perfect, a perfect example. I was gonna say,

857
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:24,320
Speaker 1: like Danthony Melton was a perfect example of that because

858
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:26,960
Speaker 1: you know, great defender and he can hit open shots.

859
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: But you know, didn't happen.

860
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,399
Speaker 2: Dude, do you think that it'd be interesting to see

861
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 2: if he came back at some point because I think

862
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,799
Speaker 2: he was a really good fit h during the short

863
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 2: bit that we got to see him. Sam, this is

864
00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:42,280
Speaker 2: all all we have time for today. I sincerely appreciate

865
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:45,760
Speaker 2: you joining us. It's been awesome to hear your close

866
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 2: perspective on the team. Will you just shout out light

867
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:49,800
Speaker 2: years tell everybody where they can find your stuff?

868
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, pretty simple. Search light Years any place you get

869
00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 1: a podcast, Apple, Spotify, YouTube, whatever it is. We are

870
00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 1: live after basically every game, additional content at outside of

871
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:03,600
Speaker 1: those postgame shows. Just check us out there and subscribe.

872
00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:05,319
Speaker 2: It was good to see you, man, I'm looking forward

873
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:07,040
Speaker 2: to next time. Thank you all for supporting us and

874
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,200
Speaker 2: for supporting the show. I hope all of you guys

875
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,040
Speaker 2: have an incredible weekend and we will see you on Monday.

876
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 1: What's up guys?

877
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:18,799
Speaker 2: As always, I appreciate you for listening to and supporting

878
00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:21,440
Speaker 2: OOPS tonight. It would actually be really helpful for us

879
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:23,359
Speaker 2: if you guys would take a second and leave a

880
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 2: rating and a review. As always, I appreciate you guys

881
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 2: supporting us, but if you could take a minute to

882
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 2: do that

883
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 1: I'd really appreciate it.