1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: today's best minds. And the GOP has proposed a four 4 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: point five trillion dollar tax giveaway, but only to. 5 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:15,760 Speaker 2: The very very rich. 6 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:20,800 Speaker 1: So that's something they're going to ransack foodstamps and medicare 7 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:23,799 Speaker 1: We have such a great show for you today, talking 8 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 1: points memos. Josh Marshall stops by to talk about how 9 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:34,519 Speaker 1: Republicans are taking a sledgehammer to our democracy. Then we 10 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 1: will talk to author Catherine Stewart on her new book 11 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:42,880 Speaker 1: Money Lies in God Inside the Movement to destroy American Democracy. 12 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 2: But first the news. 13 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 3: So, Mai, we're now in the philosophical stage of those schrodingers. 14 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 3: Don't Yeah, yeah, actually, like you know, like, is it 15 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:56,800 Speaker 3: a actual or formal authority? Is he a White House advisor? 16 00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 3: Is this so all bullshit to teenagers name big have 17 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:02,639 Speaker 3: a right to run through the government without clearance? 18 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:05,759 Speaker 2: Spoiler, they are so here it is. 19 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:09,400 Speaker 1: Musk is not a Dog's employee and has no formal 20 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: or actual authority, White House says, except for when he 21 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 1: goes into government agencies and fires all the people there. 22 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:20,640 Speaker 1: Elon Musk is not the administrator of DOGE, nor is 23 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 1: he an employee of the department that's overseeing massive cuts 24 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 1: to the federal workforce for no reason. Per a Monday 25 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 1: night White House Court filing. 26 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:30,960 Speaker 2: Why it matters. 27 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 1: It matters because they are taking a chainsaw to the 28 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: federal government and all of the programs they keep us safe. 29 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:43,399 Speaker 1: Trump describes Musk as the leader of the operation when 30 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: he announced the department in November, and now he is 31 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 1: changing his mind so that he can avoid accountability and transparency. 32 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 1: You'll be shot to know. They just want to end 33 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: fraud by committing something that looks quite a lot like fraud. 34 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: Soa they're making the case that Elon is the same 35 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:09,639 Speaker 1: as Anita Done. Anita Done gave out candy and advice 36 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,239 Speaker 1: straight face through that way, Biden, Right, she gave a 37 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: candy and advice to Biden. Elon Musk is in all 38 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 1: of our computers. Tell me if these two things are 39 00:02:21,080 --> 00:02:24,079 Speaker 1: the same, I do not think they are. And when 40 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 1: Anita Done starts knocking on the door of the Social 41 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 1: Security Office to try and get into the computers, then 42 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: I will consider them to be the same. 43 00:02:36,160 --> 00:02:38,960 Speaker 2: Expect fuckery and copious amounts. 44 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 3: I'll think it's the same when Anita Done is tweeting 45 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:46,359 Speaker 3: data where they can't even read data tables properly onto 46 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 3: fucking Twitter and saying, look at all these dead people 47 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 3: were collecting social Security when they clearly did not do 48 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:53,079 Speaker 3: the math right. 49 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 1: I'm telling you the good news is that Anita Done 50 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: and Elon Musk seem to know about the same amount about. 51 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 4: Coding good stuff. 52 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 3: Speaking of seeing numbers and them being not good numbers. 53 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 3: There's a lot of measles outbreaks in Texas. 54 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 1: Biggest measles outbreak in Texas. It's very contagious. I know 55 00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: you'll be shocked to hear. Luckily, the head of HHS 56 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: is a guy called RFK Junior, very into vaccines. 57 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:24,399 Speaker 2: Wait, just kidding. 58 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 1: Look, measles is stupid disease and you don't have to 59 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:32,359 Speaker 1: get it because there's very good vaccine. I was vaccinated 60 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: myself actually had to be vaccinated again because when I 61 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: was vaccinated, I was in that little window where the 62 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: vaccine wasn't working. But these are why we have vaccines. 63 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: Now we're going to see lots of people get sick, 64 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: some will maybe even die because people don't remember what 65 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 1: it was like before we had vaccines. So luckily we 66 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 1: got RFK Junior on the case. 67 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, that's what I was thinking. 68 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 3: Luckily, So we now have a top Social Security official 69 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:04,080 Speaker 3: exiting after they had a little uh tussle with Musk stoge. 70 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: Yes, you'll be shocked to know that Elon Musk is 71 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 1: basically just going to different departments with his merry band 72 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: of early twenty year olds who are completely vetted and 73 00:04:16,839 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 1: have had security checks. 74 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 2: Oh wait, they haven't. 75 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,279 Speaker 1: Maybe some of them had had a little bit of vetting, 76 00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:26,440 Speaker 1: but I would not assume anything. These guys are going 77 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:30,840 Speaker 1: to different government agencies, the acting commissioner. When someone says no, 78 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 1: you can't do that, they basically end up leaving because 79 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: you can't say that to the richest man in the world. 80 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 2: The acting commission of Social Security. 81 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 1: By the way, there's the acting So they haven't even 82 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: put someone in the job yet, and already that person 83 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:46,080 Speaker 1: has gone. She left her job this weekend after a clash. 84 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: By the way, this has happened in like every agency, 85 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 1: the clash with billionaire Elon Musk's US Doage service. He 86 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 1: wants sensitive government records, probably to go after Trump's enemies, 87 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:59,799 Speaker 1: which he did tweet this weekend, he sort of implied 88 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 1: that perhaps he would go after Adam Shiff, you know, 89 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: at retweeting a tweet from someone else that said, this 90 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: is what the. 91 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 2: Irs is for going after my enemy is. 92 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: Look, man, this is not how any of this is 93 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 1: supposed to work, and we should not be surprised. 94 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 3: My Recently we were introduced to a new character on 95 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 3: the show. Welco Minch McConnell I have a new one 96 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:24,240 Speaker 3: for you. Based Steve Bannon. 97 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 2: Isn't based right wing now. 98 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 3: Now, based comes from this guy a little bee as 99 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:31,360 Speaker 3: a rapper, and he's queer. You can't take based away 100 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 3: from him. 101 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:36,599 Speaker 1: Oh all right, based, yes, based Steve Bannon. Steve Bannon, 102 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 1: as you may know him as someone who tends to. 103 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 2: Be pretty far right. Well, that guy he's. 104 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: Got some things to say about Elon Musk and his 105 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: efforts to really reduce the size of the federal government 106 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:50,719 Speaker 1: and gain more power in the US. Look, this is 107 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: one thing you have to remember about Steve Bannon. He 108 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 1: is smart and he knows that the people who are 109 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: getting hurt by Elon Musk's war on the federal government 110 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: are trumps of voters, right like you know, the people 111 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:06,160 Speaker 1: who benefit from a lot of these social programs are 112 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,960 Speaker 1: red state people, people who don't make a lot of money, 113 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 1: who have a social safety net, who need the social 114 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: safety net, Medicare, Medicaid, the kind of Obamacare, the kind 115 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: of social programs that keep people from being in the street. Okay, 116 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: So Elon is described by Steve Bannon as Musk is 117 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 1: a parasitic illegal immigrant. Now again, nobody is illegal, right, 118 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 1: This whole idea that we're calling people illegal, right, their 119 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 1: immigration status may be illegal. It's a civil crime being 120 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: in this country, not legally, it's not criminal. He wants 121 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 1: to impose his freak experiments and play act as god 122 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,279 Speaker 1: without any respect for the country's history traditional values. 123 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 3: Ironic considering the source. 124 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:56,040 Speaker 1: Yes, we have crossed the rubicon here and we are 125 00:06:56,160 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: now into a very weird world. A staunch populist. He 126 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 1: is a populist. This is a very populous view. Has 127 00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: used his War Room podcast to rail against the elite 128 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: in society. I think the richest man in the world 129 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: probably qualifies as an elite. We will break these guys, 130 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 1: ban And said during a recent episode of the podcast 131 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 1: centered on Musk metas CEO Mark Zuckerberg and the other 132 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 1: leading tech mobiles. Yeah, it's hard to pick a side here, 133 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 1: but I guess I will reluctantly side with Steve Bannon here. 134 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, strung agree. So here's a fight that is getting messy. 135 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 3: Transport Secretary Sean Duffy is trying to blame Mayor Pete 136 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,480 Speaker 3: for all the fuckery with the airlines that is going down. 137 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 1: Yes, Mayor Pete, who is actually not the Secretary of 138 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 1: Transportation anymore. Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy tried to ship the 139 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:53,240 Speaker 1: Blaye in for a string of recent air disasters to 140 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: his Democratic predecessor. Duffy, confirmed lead the Department of the 141 00:07:57,320 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: Senate last month, revealed on Monday that the Trump and 142 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: the station had fired less than four hundred of the 143 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 1: FAA's forty five thousand employees. He also claimed they were 144 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 1: serving probationary periods. Again, who the fuck knows, right, Like, 145 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 1: we don't know if that's true. We don't know if 146 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 1: they're lying, we don't know if they're just wrong. Nobody 147 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: knows anything here. 148 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 3: Probationary period just means also in the government jobs, that 149 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 3: you've been working there under three hundred and sixty five days. 150 00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:24,560 Speaker 3: That means there's new hires like there's turn in any staffing. 151 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: Listen, man, I wouldn't trust anything anyone is saying. Here 152 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:29,440 Speaker 2: is my top one. 153 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 1: By the way, one of my favorite things I saw 154 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:34,719 Speaker 1: on the internet this weekend was Elon is like we 155 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: must make air travels. Say that's a nonpartisan thing. And 156 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 1: then a data guy showed that there was like a 157 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 1: spike in Google searches for like trains. Like I just 158 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: think that Elon Musk has squandered any credibility he once had. 159 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 3: Well, especially since he says he's going to put the 160 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,559 Speaker 3: SpaceX egedeers in charge of it. It seems it's another 161 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 3: skip for him to get government money. 162 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's where we are. Josh Marshall is the 163 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 1: editor of Talking Points Memo. Welcome back to Fast Politics. 164 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:13,320 Speaker 4: Josh Marshall, thanks for having me. 165 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 1: I'm so happy to have you here, and I wanted 166 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: you to come on this podcast because of the just 167 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:25,679 Speaker 1: deluge of stupid that is killing our democracy. Though I 168 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 1: do think, I mean, I still think it's like sixty forty, 169 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 1: but I think we make it through this thing. 170 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 2: But man, it's not great. 171 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: You'll remember this is by design, right, It's meant to 172 00:09:36,520 --> 00:09:39,600 Speaker 1: be a shit storm of fuckery in the hopes that 173 00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 1: will miss a lot of the stuff. And in fact, 174 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 1: I would like to start by just talking about this 175 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: phrase that I saw on the internet, which is, if 176 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 1: Harris were president right now, the price of eggs, which 177 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,959 Speaker 1: is like about one thousand dollars an egg. I'm exaggerating 178 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 1: but not really would be a president c ending event 179 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 1: for her discuss. 180 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 5: It would be the big story kind of like, you know, 181 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 5: you slipped by after Biden inflation and now eggs are 182 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 5: fifty bucks a piece. You know, you go into the 183 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:16,679 Speaker 5: supermarket and it's like you have a one food pandemic, right, 184 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:18,440 Speaker 5: because remember at the beginning of the pandemic when you 185 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 5: had like, you know, the shelves were empty of like 186 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 5: toilet paper and stuff like this. And you go to 187 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:26,320 Speaker 5: like I go to like the little supermarket near my 188 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 5: near our apartment, and everything is you know, you've got 189 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:31,280 Speaker 5: a million different kinds of yogurt and all this kind 190 00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 5: of stuff, and you get to the eggs and it's 191 00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 5: like you're in like the Soviet Union in nineteen seventy nine, right, 192 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:41,160 Speaker 5: like what back. It's yeah, it's bad, it's bad, but 193 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:43,080 Speaker 5: it would be but you're right, it's and it is 194 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 5: true that you got so many other things. 195 00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:46,599 Speaker 4: I think sension people. 196 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 5: Are like whatever, I'll get back to eggs in a 197 00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 5: future presidency. 198 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 4: I got to focus on other stuff now. 199 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: Right, you can't because of the plane crashes. And again, 200 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: the one in Canada was in Canada, so hard to 201 00:10:58,040 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 1: blame Sean Duffy. 202 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 4: D in America though, yeah, and I mean Toronto. 203 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 5: It's not Guam, right, or Madagascar or something like that. 204 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 1: Mom was actually part of America. Just going to teach 205 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:12,160 Speaker 1: you a lesson. Despite that, you're fact that you're smarter 206 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 1: than I am. 207 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:15,440 Speaker 5: You know where I get that from my wife's family. 208 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 5: They're immigrants and they have this thing whenever something's far, 209 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:20,680 Speaker 5: they're like, yeah, I might as well be in Guam. 210 00:11:20,960 --> 00:11:22,240 Speaker 4: And where did you guys get that? 211 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 5: It came up with their own little phrasing based on 212 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 5: being immigrants and not kind of like what are the 213 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 5: what are the idioms here? We're going to do this 214 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 5: Guam thing and now they've like they've foisted it onto me. 215 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 5: So yeah, humiliated, might as well be Guam. 216 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:41,200 Speaker 1: Yes, might as well be Guam or American Samoa also 217 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 1: in America. Let's just talk this through inflation. Yes, eggs Russia. Correct. 218 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:51,760 Speaker 1: Now this weekend, I'm reminded of Harris. I'm going to 219 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:53,920 Speaker 1: just bring this up again. So Harris was when I 220 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 1: interviewed her. Her people were so proud of what she 221 00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: had done at the Munich Security Conference. They were like, 222 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 1: you need to know about how she did at the 223 00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: Munich Security Conference. And I'm like, I really don't, and 224 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 1: they're like, no, no, you have no idea. Her speech 225 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 1: was so good. Everyone was so excited. They welcomed her 226 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 1: on the world stage. Okay, JD Van's Munich Security Conference discuss. 227 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:19,079 Speaker 5: Yeah, well, you know that's the you know, he thinks 228 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 5: they think he did great. He went there and basically said, 229 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:25,440 Speaker 5: you guys are the problem and in this kind of 230 00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 5: it's the fifth column in your hearts. The serious thing 231 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 5: is the combination of that and this this stuff they 232 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 5: are doing with Ukraine right now. The Europeans see this 233 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 5: as a turning point crisis that they need to you know, 234 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:43,839 Speaker 5: they're not talking about leaving NATO, but they need an 235 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:48,079 Speaker 5: alternative security plan besides NATO. So it's you know that 236 00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 5: that is the continuity of the sort of the North 237 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 5: Atlantic Alliance has been talked about forever. It reached a 238 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:58,840 Speaker 5: real turning point right now, that stuff is real. They 239 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:01,560 Speaker 5: were shocked by that, by that speech. In some ways, 240 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 5: I'm shocked they were as shocked as they as they were, 241 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:05,559 Speaker 5: but yeah, they were shocked. 242 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,040 Speaker 2: That was my take too. I was shocked. 243 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: They were like I was like, if you guys not 244 00:13:09,559 --> 00:13:12,920 Speaker 1: been paying attention this whole time? They love Russia, Like, 245 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 1: here's this speech that's basically like, stop punishing the far 246 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:22,719 Speaker 1: right for having been involved, involved for running the Holocaust? Right, 247 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 1: they're good people and besides, that's us. That was pretty 248 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 1: much the net net of it, And like, how dare 249 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:35,400 Speaker 1: you try to prevent this from happening? We are very offended, right, 250 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:37,240 Speaker 1: I mean that isn't that basically this. 251 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 5: Speech basically Yeah, there's the part of the speech that 252 00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 5: got played in the headlines. And I went back and 253 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 5: read the speech. And one of the interesting things there. 254 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 2: Isside those speeches. 255 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: When you read those speeches, by the way, like as 256 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 1: a writer, what they do to the English language is 257 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:55,040 Speaker 1: a shanda. 258 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:57,440 Speaker 4: Okay, go on, yeah, no it is pretty bad. 259 00:13:57,640 --> 00:14:00,720 Speaker 5: But the thing I was struck by is he made 260 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 5: a very big point of you know, there was this 261 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:05,680 Speaker 5: election in Romania. I don't know, a few months ago, 262 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:10,319 Speaker 5: and the idea was that Russia did a bunch of 263 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 5: stuff on TikTok, and the Romanian authorities basically decided that 264 00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 5: the election had been sabotaged by this kind of Russian interference. 265 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 5: They canceled the results of the election, and we're going 266 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 5: to do it again. And that was pretty shocking to 267 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 5: a lot of people. I think that kind of foreign 268 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:30,960 Speaker 5: intervention is a big deal, but there's got to be 269 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 5: a pretty high bar for that, right just saying Okay, 270 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 5: we're going to do that over. But he made a 271 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 5: very big point of that, basically wrapping that together with 272 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,360 Speaker 5: his line about free speech, and he makes this point, 273 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 5: if you can't respect the results of the elections, you're 274 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,240 Speaker 5: just you're much worse than Russia. And I was thinking, like, dude, 275 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 5: are we in a time warp pier? Like really, this 276 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 5: is a thing that MAGA does that even people who 277 00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 5: are not at all friendly to MAGA and are very 278 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 5: attuned to their reality distortion field. I remember just being 279 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,680 Speaker 5: shocked kind of like, yeah, you got a point on 280 00:15:05,720 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 5: that Romania thing, But do you remember when you tried 281 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 5: to like literally overthrow the government because Trump lost? 282 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 4: Like what was that. 283 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 5: Four years ago, Are you kidding, dude? So, yeah, it 284 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:19,520 Speaker 5: was pretty out there, and certainly to the Europeans, it 285 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:23,440 Speaker 5: was really shocking. I think they were holding on to 286 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 5: this sense that a lot of that stuff is for 287 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 5: domestic consumption within the United States. It's going to suck 288 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,680 Speaker 5: to be in America, but that's not really going to 289 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 5: change things fundamentally with our relationship. And they realized, I 290 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:38,760 Speaker 5: think in the last few days, that that's not the case, 291 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 5: that they're really serious about this stuff. 292 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly now they are in Saudi Arabia. I mean, 293 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: it's funny because it's like, I really do feel in 294 00:15:48,520 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 1: hindsight that there were so many places where the Biden 295 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: administration struggled. Now, obviously I'm not president. If I were president, 296 00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:01,200 Speaker 1: I would probably struggle to times more, But there were 297 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 1: certain places, like, for example, the one I'm thinking of 298 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 1: that strikes me as sort of where they did the 299 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,520 Speaker 1: worst was foreign policy, and where they did the best 300 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 1: was passing amazing domestic legislation. And I think that it 301 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: would be hard to argue with that right Inflation Reduction Act, 302 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: huge blockbuster legislation, brings manufacturing back to America. Foreign policy, 303 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 1: you had Afghanistan, which you know, obviously Trump got us 304 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,240 Speaker 1: in there. Trump made a deal to get us out. 305 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: The way the getting out was was not good, I 306 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: think we can all agree. And then the Middle East, 307 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 1: which has just been the clusterfuck to end all clusterfucks. 308 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:38,120 Speaker 1: And then the war in Ukraine, which continues to raid. 309 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: So there are three really big, major things that were 310 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 1: real problems for the Biden administration. The Trump administration has 311 00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:49,240 Speaker 1: made them catastrophes discuss. 312 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 5: I have a slightly different take on Biden's foreign policy 313 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:57,520 Speaker 5: with Okay, good the situation in Israel and Gaza, I agree, 314 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 5: both from a substantive point of view and a and 315 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:02,440 Speaker 5: a domestic political point of view, you know, kind of 316 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:07,399 Speaker 5: all downsides. I think with Ukraine, Biden did very well 317 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:10,479 Speaker 5: at sort of you know, summoning this international coalition. I 318 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 5: see that the Ukraine thing they did pretty much got 319 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:17,600 Speaker 5: all of that right now. Having said that, in general, 320 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:19,680 Speaker 5: people don't want there to be a lot of wars, 321 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:24,080 Speaker 5: so saying I'm managing that war fantastically, you only get 322 00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 5: so far with that. But certainly, all together those were 323 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 5: a weight on Biden. But to your point, I mean, 324 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 5: Trump has made those two much much worse in pretty 325 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 5: short order, and he's you know, what he's trying to 326 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 5: do now in Ukraine looks a lot like what so 327 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:44,200 Speaker 5: the Union and Nazi Germany did with Poland, where the 328 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 5: great powers get together and say, all right, you take 329 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 5: this part. I'll take this part right. You know, we'll 330 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:51,399 Speaker 5: go back to being frenemies. We'll each get our chunk 331 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:53,399 Speaker 5: and we'll move on. That's kind of what they're what 332 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 5: they're talking about. 333 00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:57,880 Speaker 1: One of the things that is amazing that Trump has 334 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:02,520 Speaker 1: said is that he wants some of Ukraine's minerals. That's 335 00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 1: not how any of this fucking works. That's like the 336 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 1: Greenland thing too, right, We're gonna take Greenland, will be 337 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 1: welcomed as liberators. I mean, my favorite was Ted Cruz 338 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: telling us exactly what was going on when he said 339 00:18:16,760 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: everything is for sale, and I was like, you are 340 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 1: for sale. 341 00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:23,159 Speaker 2: Your colleagues are for sale. 342 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: You know, I'm sure like Exon will take you at 343 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:30,520 Speaker 1: Firsteak dinner tonight, but technically Greenland still not for sale. 344 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:34,439 Speaker 5: Yes, And you kind of see that this is an 345 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:37,399 Speaker 5: earlier kind of great power way of running the world. 346 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:39,440 Speaker 5: You've got a handful of great powers and they kind 347 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 5: of they fight, sometimes they divvy other people up and 348 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 5: stuff like that, you know, and it's also just Trump 349 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 5: sees everything in transactional terms, and that is you know, 350 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,359 Speaker 5: that is people say, well, there's no kind of governing ideology. 351 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 5: There actually is, which is kind of you dominate and 352 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 5: you take things. And the idea that the whole point 353 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,919 Speaker 5: of sort of multi at all security arrangements, which has 354 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 5: been the US's sort of guiding framework for the last 355 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 5: eighty years. It's interesting to think about because what that 356 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:11,600 Speaker 5: does is it is basically saying that this is something 357 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 5: that will survive over time because everybody's getting something out 358 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 5: of it. There's a shared in shared security. Everybody is 359 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:21,399 Speaker 5: getting something out of it. But really Trump's way of 360 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:25,720 Speaker 5: thinking about things is I get everything and you answer 361 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 5: to me. And that is inherently not that stable an arrangement, 362 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,119 Speaker 5: but it is one that makes sense if you are 363 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:34,639 Speaker 5: the strong man. Right that Trump's way of thinking of 364 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:38,119 Speaker 5: things doesn't necessarily outlast him, right. But the whole point 365 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 5: of these alliances is that it's something that can perpetuate 366 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 5: itself beyond one individual leader. And they're sort of you know, 367 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 5: hunger for dominance and stuff like that. As bad as 368 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 5: the things that are going on inside the United States are. 369 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 5: With Trump, it's always been his effect on the international 370 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:59,320 Speaker 5: system that has worried me more and most because to 371 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:01,879 Speaker 5: a certain ext end, at least in theory, we can 372 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 5: get together and say, all right, that thing we did, 373 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,879 Speaker 5: we're just going to undo it right inside the United States. 374 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 5: But once things get out of hand internationally, you can't 375 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:13,959 Speaker 5: do that. The US isn't that strong, so, you know, 376 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:17,800 Speaker 5: and you get into a more high fear rather than 377 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:22,680 Speaker 5: high trust international environment, and things can, things can slip 378 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 5: out of control very quickly, and things get dangerous, the 379 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 5: key point being we cannot easily undo them in the 380 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:33,200 Speaker 5: way that, again, at least in theory, we can undo 381 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 5: things that we do stupidly at home. 382 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 4: We hope, we hope. 383 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,120 Speaker 5: I mean, I'm not saying I guess. My point is 384 00:20:39,119 --> 00:20:41,960 Speaker 5: is that sure, it might not happen, because we might 385 00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:44,560 Speaker 5: still be in the same stalemate that we've been in 386 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 5: for the last twenty years, might keep going. But the 387 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 5: political community, the American political community, if it so chose, 388 00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:52,920 Speaker 5: could undo a lot of things that happen in the 389 00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:55,439 Speaker 5: United States because it's our territory, we're in control of it. 390 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 5: We don't control the entire world. We are a big 391 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 5: player in it, we do not control everything that's different. 392 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 2: That is a good point. 393 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:06,680 Speaker 1: One of the things that we have going on right 394 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 1: now is that Elon Musk is trying desperately to get 395 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:14,160 Speaker 1: into Social Security so that he. 396 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 2: Can find fraud. 397 00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:18,240 Speaker 1: By the way, his definition of fraud is things he 398 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 1: doesn't agree with. 399 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 4: Basically, Yeah, yeah, I keep waiting at some point. 400 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 5: Someone is going to social programs. Can you show us 401 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 5: one example of your fraud? I mean, it shows the 402 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:30,560 Speaker 5: power of his owning Twitter, right, he can just spin 403 00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 5: up these alternative realities. 404 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:32,439 Speaker 4: Yeah. 405 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:35,600 Speaker 1: In the Oval office, he said, yeah, you know, we 406 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: found fraud, and Trump goes, yeah, Elon, what'd you find? 407 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:41,280 Speaker 1: And Elon says what he says, we found a person. 408 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: I think it's meant to be Samantha Power. He doesn't 409 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,919 Speaker 1: say who, who worked for USAID, who now has thirty 410 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,720 Speaker 1: million dollars, So, which means that how did that happen? 411 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 2: How does he know that? Right? Number one? 412 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:56,720 Speaker 1: And almost like, you know, maybe she came from money, 413 00:21:56,760 --> 00:21:59,120 Speaker 1: maybe her husband had money. Maybe she wrote a book 414 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 1: that was hugely successful. I mean, and by the way, 415 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,000 Speaker 1: you know much money Elon has. 416 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,840 Speaker 5: Yeah, his money has racked up in recent years. You know, 417 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 5: I think on Twitter he did explicitly mention Samantha power. 418 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:11,159 Speaker 5: I mean, in a lot of these cases, you know, 419 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 5: the go to thing is like, how did he know 420 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,119 Speaker 5: she has so much money? He must they must have 421 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 5: looked at her IRS records. In most cases, it turns 422 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:19,919 Speaker 5: out that even the premise isn't even true. I mean, 423 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:21,960 Speaker 5: maybe she is worth thirty million dollars, she could have 424 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 5: gotten it in various ways, but in a lot of 425 00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,680 Speaker 5: cases even that thing is just false. He has accused 426 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 5: people of the USA idea taking kickbacks and it is 427 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:30,159 Speaker 5: all made up. 428 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:32,080 Speaker 1: He said something the effect of like I'm going to 429 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:32,879 Speaker 1: get stuff wrong. 430 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 2: I think was the what he said. 431 00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:38,440 Speaker 5: Okay, yeah, thanks for telling us. In politicals, philosophy and 432 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:41,119 Speaker 5: political science, going back a long long time, there is 433 00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:45,120 Speaker 5: a consistent theme that certain people can become too powerful 434 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 5: to exist within the political community, too powerful than the state. 435 00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 5: You can't have that right because then everybody else ceases 436 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:55,359 Speaker 5: to be free because they become that powerful. We have 437 00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:59,720 Speaker 5: been in a what Elon Musk has put together with 438 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:02,920 Speaker 5: mix of what he's worth, you know, four hundred billion 439 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 5: dollars or something he controls one of the key communications 440 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:10,440 Speaker 5: platforms in the entire world. He now has some sort 441 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 5: of you know situationship running the running the federal government. 442 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 5: No one else can be free as long as someone 443 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:22,760 Speaker 5: like that exists with all that power in an untrammeled way. 444 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 5: It's a really serious situation that I don't know what 445 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,280 Speaker 5: the solution is, but he's a threat to everybody else's 446 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 5: freedom because he is so powerful. 447 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 2: I think the solution is just to give him more power. 448 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,119 Speaker 1: But also the other thing is that some of the 449 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 1: people who are advising him, like Pizza Jack, these are 450 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:44,680 Speaker 1: not people for whom there has been any security clearance. 451 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,679 Speaker 2: Like the way his circle. 452 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: I mean basically what we saw this weekend with his 453 00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:53,000 Speaker 1: you know, he may have had this thirteenth kid with 454 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 1: someone who he met on Twitter, is there is a 455 00:23:56,160 --> 00:24:00,840 Speaker 1: sense in which, like Elon, he is very accessible. Two 456 00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: And this was like Trump too, He's very accessible to 457 00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:08,360 Speaker 1: people who want him and who may or may not 458 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 1: have the best interests of American security or America at all. 459 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:16,040 Speaker 5: Yeah, I think the common thing there is with Trump, 460 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:20,640 Speaker 5: if you have someone who is severely emotionally stunted and 461 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 5: deeply narcissistic, people who like, Hey, Elon, I love you 462 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:29,720 Speaker 5: so much, anybody who wants to be a fanboy, the 463 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 5: kind of the doors open. And in some ways that's 464 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,600 Speaker 5: how Trump. Obviously Trump had a lot of bad ideas 465 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:38,560 Speaker 5: and motivations before he got into politics, but in a 466 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,800 Speaker 5: lot of ways that's how he went down the sort 467 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:45,199 Speaker 5: of the white supremacist alt right rabbit hole is that 468 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 5: those are the people who were kind of who were 469 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,920 Speaker 5: fluffing him on Twitter. And if you fluff him, you're 470 00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 5: on the right track, right, And so he kind of 471 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,680 Speaker 5: gravitates sorts and you see something similar with Musk. It's 472 00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 5: the same set of tendencies. 473 00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 2: Correct. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. 474 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 4: Josh Marshall, thanks for having me. 475 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:09,159 Speaker 1: Catherine Stewart is the author of Money, Lies and God 476 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:14,159 Speaker 1: Inside the Movement to Destroy American Democracy. Catherine, Welcome to 477 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:15,399 Speaker 1: Fast Politics. 478 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,080 Speaker 6: Great to be here. Thanks for speaking with me today. 479 00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 1: So let's talk about this book. You've been on this 480 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 1: podcast before. Talk to me about how you got here, 481 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 1: what this book is about, and also the larger implications 482 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: because it very much is about what matters right now. 483 00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 6: Yeah. I titled the book Money Lies in God because first, 484 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:36,199 Speaker 6: money is a huge part of the story. I mean 485 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:41,080 Speaker 6: that huge concentrations of wealth have destabilized the political system 486 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 6: to say the least. I mean we see this playing 487 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:47,879 Speaker 6: out before our eyes. Second, lies or conscious disinformation, is 488 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,680 Speaker 6: a really huge feature for this movement. And number three God, 489 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:55,720 Speaker 6: because the most important ideological framework for the largest part 490 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 6: of this movement is Christian nationalism. So first, in Money, 491 00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:02,439 Speaker 6: Life and God, I pay very close attention to the 492 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:06,399 Speaker 6: money people, a group that I call the funders. For years, 493 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,520 Speaker 6: religious right leaders in the US have preached that unregulated 494 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 6: capitalism as God's model. They're restructuring our economy in significant 495 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:17,320 Speaker 6: ways that impoverish the poor, haulow out the middle class, 496 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:22,080 Speaker 6: and funnel and increasing share of our national wealth to 497 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 6: the very few at the very top. I also shine 498 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 6: a light on a group, frankly of intellectuals that I 499 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 6: call the thinkers, many of whom are affiliated with the 500 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:32,440 Speaker 6: movement called the New Right. 501 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,439 Speaker 1: What is their connection to the Five pillars or the 502 00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 1: five mountains, whatever. 503 00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:37,199 Speaker 2: That thing is? 504 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 6: Oh, the seven mountains seven mountains. Yes, I would have 505 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 6: to say that the seven Mountains dominionism is to a 506 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 6: feature of the God. Part of the title Christian nationalism, 507 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:53,040 Speaker 6: I think is the driving the largest ideological part of 508 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,480 Speaker 6: this movement. It's a way of sort of organizing the 509 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,199 Speaker 6: rank and file and getting them on board. Religion in 510 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 6: America has never been static. It's always changing, and even 511 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 6: as some of the more moderate and liberal forms of 512 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:07,960 Speaker 6: religion are sort of fading away, the harder and harder 513 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:12,000 Speaker 6: forms of religion are on the rise, including movements like 514 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 6: neo charismatic, independent movements and Pentecostalism, which are themselves very diverse, 515 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,679 Speaker 6: but are also very easily given over to sort of 516 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:28,160 Speaker 6: hard right politics. Many of these movements see spiritual battles 517 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 6: playing out in our politics today and they tell their 518 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,560 Speaker 6: congregants that they have a role to play. And among 519 00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:40,399 Speaker 6: some of the independent charismatic movements, there's something called Seven 520 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:46,440 Speaker 6: Mountains dominionism, which has sort of become increasingly widespread within 521 00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:49,879 Speaker 6: the larger movement. It sort of started more in a 522 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,679 Speaker 6: sector of the neo charismatic movement called the New Apostolic Reformation, 523 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 6: but it's sort of spread throughout and it's the idea 524 00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:00,400 Speaker 6: that only Christians of a certain variety should dine dominate 525 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,159 Speaker 6: all the key features of government and society, you know, 526 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,439 Speaker 6: the government, education, media, and entertainment. The sort of seven 527 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 6: the law, you know, seven key features of government, and 528 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,520 Speaker 6: this idea of seven mountains dominionism is actually spreading into 529 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:21,520 Speaker 6: areas of the Christian broader, Christian nationalist movement and Christian 530 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 6: rights that have never been remotely sort of charismatic or pentecostal. 531 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,199 Speaker 6: They don't speak in tongues, but this idea of the 532 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,840 Speaker 6: seven mountains is very appealing to them. So the kind 533 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 6: of language and style of what I call a spirit 534 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 6: warrior type of religion is really spreading throughout the movement. 535 00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 6: And you can see this when you go to right 536 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 6: wing sort of religious conferences and strategy gatherings. In the book, 537 00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,720 Speaker 6: I focus on a group of intellectuals that I call 538 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 6: the Thinkers, many of which are affiliated with the New Right. Technically, 539 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 6: many of them are quite what you'd call Christian nationalists. 540 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:58,880 Speaker 6: Some seem frankly very nehilistic. Many draw inspiration from a 541 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,239 Speaker 6: Nazi political theory cal Schmidt, who came up with this 542 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 6: sort of idea that we're facing a permanent emergency and 543 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 6: we need to smash the institutions of government in order 544 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 6: to save us from the absolute apocalypse of democracy. You know, 545 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:17,440 Speaker 6: they really abhor equality, They abhor pluralism, and they abhor 546 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 6: the idea of rational governance. And we're seeing representatives of 547 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 6: this movement actually you know, smash our institutions as we speak. 548 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,800 Speaker 6: They call it destroying the administrative state, and what they 549 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 6: really mean by this is deconstructing the vital functions of government. 550 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,800 Speaker 6: And what they're really after is franklyly delusional. They often 551 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 6: talk about a return to some imagined, glorious past that 552 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:44,920 Speaker 6: really only exists in their fantasies. 553 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 1: Well, this is the Project Twined twenty five agenda, right, 554 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: This idea that you will dismantle the administrative state. I 555 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: think of it as sort of the undoing of the 556 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 1: FDR progress, like a kind of dismantling of all of 557 00:29:58,360 --> 00:29:59,800 Speaker 1: the modern social program. 558 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 6: Absolutely, you know, Project twenty twenty five is the ideological 559 00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:07,880 Speaker 6: backbone of the movement and the new administration. Trump's promises 560 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 6: on the campaign trail that he would not implement Project 561 00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 6: twenty twenty five they were total lies. I mean that 562 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 6: anybody believed him given his track record is absurd. It 563 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,560 Speaker 6: represents a real fusion of Christian naturalist ideology with New 564 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 6: Right ideology. But right now, the most important working elements 565 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 6: that we're seeing play out are on the side of 566 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,080 Speaker 6: the new Right. It's the part of the program that's 567 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,480 Speaker 6: having the biggest impact now in its first phase, is 568 00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 6: really the deconstruction of what they call the deconstruction of 569 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:43,280 Speaker 6: the administrative state. You know, it's political performance at the 570 00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 6: expense of actual governance. They're not making anything better, they're 571 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,320 Speaker 6: just tearing stuff down. And unfortunately, the bill for this 572 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,480 Speaker 6: kind of destruction is going to come do over time. 573 00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 6: In the meantime, there's going to be a whole lot 574 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 6: of suffering. So why does somebody like russ Vote, who 575 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:01,800 Speaker 6: is the head of the Office of Management and Budget 576 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 6: in the new Trump administration and is a self described 577 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:08,760 Speaker 6: Christian nationalist, a key architect of Project twenty twenty five, 578 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:13,040 Speaker 6: why does he want to destroy the administrative apparatus that 579 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:17,760 Speaker 6: holds in place everything from air traffic control to national parks, 580 00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:22,280 Speaker 6: to VA suicide hotlines to research grants. I mean again, 581 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:27,280 Speaker 6: it's it's the hatred of expertise. It's deeply usional. Expertise 582 00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,360 Speaker 6: and rational governance are what stand in the way of autocrats. 583 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 6: And they don't believe democracy. They've been telling us for 584 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,640 Speaker 6: a long time that they don't believe in democracy. They 585 00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 6: prefer an autocrat. Sometimes he's referred to as a it's 586 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 6: always a he, a red Caesar. 587 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 2: Right, all right. 588 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:49,080 Speaker 1: And this is the problem with this tech bro worldview too, 589 00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 1: is that there is some higher level thinking that is 590 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:57,400 Speaker 1: the sort of where this comes from. Right, they're implementing 591 00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 1: the ideas of these very right ways tech you know, 592 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:06,840 Speaker 1: tech oligarchs, and they are and the idea here is 593 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,880 Speaker 1: a sort of monarchy, right. And we saw this talked 594 00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: about by what's his. 595 00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,000 Speaker 2: Name, Mobius Mobog whose. 596 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 6: Real name is Curtis Jarvin. 597 00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:18,360 Speaker 2: Curtis Jarvin, Yeah, talk about that. 598 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:22,959 Speaker 6: Curtis Jarvin is affiliated with the Claremont Institute. It's one 599 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 6: of the very influential think tanks that is influencing leaders 600 00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 6: of the New Right. He identified this idea of a 601 00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 6: kind of the cathedral or you know, representatives of the 602 00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 6: quote unquote administrative state. We're talking about civil servants and 603 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 6: experts who are just doing their job. He calls us 604 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,360 Speaker 6: a sort of like as though it's a demonic borg. 605 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,040 Speaker 6: I mean, this is a cadre of people who have 606 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 6: projected their own anxieties and frustrations and fears over the 607 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 6: culture and the idea of equality. Onto this supposedly demonic borg. 608 00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,960 Speaker 6: They've convinced themselves that they need to slay the beast. 609 00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:06,160 Speaker 6: So they basically just treat government as a synonym for 610 00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 6: oppressive bureaucracy, and their ideology is valorizing pure, unreasoned exercises 611 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:17,360 Speaker 6: of what they see as masculine power. You know, it's 612 00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 6: when you really dig into the writings of some of 613 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 6: these folks, it's astonishing the degree to which they hate women. 614 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:27,240 Speaker 6: It simply does leaves or a professional, accountable government that 615 00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:31,000 Speaker 6: a modern democracy needs. But here's something important about those 616 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,000 Speaker 6: tech bros. I think the important thing to realize is 617 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:38,080 Speaker 6: that the deeper motivations of them is not always reasonable 618 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 6: or irrational. Sometimes in our culture we valorize these people 619 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 6: who are extremely rich, and we think they're smarter than everyone. 620 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,720 Speaker 6: But I think that this process is actually making them 621 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 6: less reasonable in many instances. Like they're driving motivation is fear, 622 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:57,720 Speaker 6: because here's the thing. These folks live in extreme wealth 623 00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,440 Speaker 6: bubbles or islands, but they can actually kind of here 624 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 6: over the walls the cries of critics who are saying, 625 00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:08,319 Speaker 6: you actually don't deserve all the money that you have 626 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,880 Speaker 6: for monopolistic features that are impoverishing so many sectors of society, 627 00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,799 Speaker 6: and they're really upset by them. They're really afraid that 628 00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:18,279 Speaker 6: the rank and file are going to come after them 629 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:22,279 Speaker 6: one day with proverbial pitchforks, and so they want to 630 00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 6: validate their power and yanke the power from the rest 631 00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 6: of us. 632 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,480 Speaker 4: I mean, the idea is deeply un American. 633 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:32,520 Speaker 1: It is interesting because we do see there is this 634 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:37,720 Speaker 1: hunger for populism, probably because of wealth and equality, likely 635 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: because the middle class has been under attack. And unfortunately 636 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:47,120 Speaker 1: the populism that Trump is offering is not really populism, 637 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,359 Speaker 1: it's faux populism. So we see all these people who 638 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:54,520 Speaker 1: voted because they're feeling that they are not being taken 639 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:56,839 Speaker 1: care of, that they're not happy with the status quo, 640 00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:01,400 Speaker 1: which I completely understand, but now they are getting something 641 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: that is going to be much worse for them. One 642 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,160 Speaker 1: of the things that keeps me up at night, which 643 00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,239 Speaker 1: I think is perhaps not something you've been asked to 644 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:12,800 Speaker 1: talk about, but I'm hoping you will, is the consequences, 645 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,239 Speaker 1: the sort of unforeseen consequences. Right, you have all these 646 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 1: Americans who voted for someone to burn down the system 647 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:24,640 Speaker 1: because they thought it was the system that wasn't taking 648 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,160 Speaker 1: care of them. Now, I wonder if you could talk 649 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,560 Speaker 1: about the worry here. You don't have to predict the future, 650 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 1: but what happens when these people don't get what they 651 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 1: think they want or get what they think they're going 652 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:39,839 Speaker 1: to get, you know, just sort of talk me through 653 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:41,080 Speaker 1: where you think this is going. 654 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:43,480 Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, I think a lot of the rank 655 00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:45,680 Speaker 6: and file, when you meet them, a lot of them 656 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:49,439 Speaker 6: aren't bad people. They love their ways, they care about 657 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,839 Speaker 6: their neighborhoods. They many of them really truly believe they're 658 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,319 Speaker 6: doing what's best for us society. But they have been 659 00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 6: colossally misinformed. They've been the target of disinformation operation. In 660 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 6: my book Money Lies in God, I you know, Lies 661 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:08,200 Speaker 6: in Theres precisely refers to the disinformation operations and propaganda 662 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,440 Speaker 6: operations that they've been subject to. You know, in one chapter, 663 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,000 Speaker 6: I go to well, I've been to a few stops 664 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:18,000 Speaker 6: on the Reawaken America tour. Reawaken America is a pro 665 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,920 Speaker 6: MAGA traveling road show put on by Mike Lynn and 666 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,000 Speaker 6: his allies and usually one of the trump Son speaks 667 00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:27,800 Speaker 6: and they hold them in mega churches around the country. 668 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:31,040 Speaker 6: Each one draws thousands. But in those spaces there are 669 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,480 Speaker 6: a lot of podcasters and you know, people with YouTube channels, 670 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:38,160 Speaker 6: et cetera, and they're creating all of this content that's 671 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:41,960 Speaker 6: getting funneled into people's phones and their computers, and every 672 00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:47,760 Speaker 6: imaginable conspiracy. JFK is still alive. He's been hidden somewhere. 673 00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:50,320 Speaker 6: And Trump is a really great guy. He's a white 674 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,120 Speaker 6: hat battling the black hats. And they, you know, the 675 00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 6: GLO globalist borg is going to control every dime you own. 676 00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:58,480 Speaker 6: And your kids are going to go off to school 677 00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:00,719 Speaker 6: at nine am, to the public school by two. They're 678 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:03,320 Speaker 6: going to come back a different gender. I mean, every 679 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:07,680 Speaker 6: single crazy conspiracy is there. And you know, you get 680 00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:10,200 Speaker 6: people to believe a lot of little lies, you can 681 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:12,440 Speaker 6: get them to believe a big lie, you know, the 682 00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,080 Speaker 6: big lie that the twenty twenty election is stolen, that 683 00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:18,080 Speaker 6: Trump is perfect and never did anything wrong, that God's 684 00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:21,919 Speaker 6: hand is on his side. That is many criminal convictions 685 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 6: are political witch hunt. So they will find a way 686 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,360 Speaker 6: to blame, you know, that tragedies. They're all in for Trump. 687 00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:34,320 Speaker 6: They think he's fantastic. Look what other presidentever would blame 688 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 6: an airline tragedy resulting in dozens of tragic deaths on 689 00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:43,920 Speaker 6: quote unquote DEI. I mean, it really beggars belief. So 690 00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:47,800 Speaker 6: they'll find a way to blame the Wope on everything. 691 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,680 Speaker 1: So one of the things I'm doing, because I covered 692 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:56,640 Speaker 1: this first administration I use the term administration in scare quotes, 693 00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:01,800 Speaker 1: is I am trying to separate the signal from the noise. 694 00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:06,800 Speaker 1: So you've studied this, You've gone to these megachurches, you've 695 00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:12,440 Speaker 1: seen you know, what's the signal? Like, what's the really 696 00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: important takeaway from this? What are the things that we 697 00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 1: should be watching that maybe they don't want us to 698 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:22,920 Speaker 1: be watching. And by day I mean that sort of technocrats, 699 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:23,520 Speaker 1: this crew. 700 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:28,759 Speaker 6: They don't want us to recognize the fact that the 701 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:33,200 Speaker 6: policies of the Trump administration are going to benefit wealth 702 00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:36,960 Speaker 6: at the tippy top, that they're going to destroy our democracy, 703 00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,839 Speaker 6: the functions of our government, that they're going to impoverish, 704 00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:45,680 Speaker 6: the consequences of the trade wars, the destabilization of our 705 00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 6: alliances that have ensured sort of post war prosperity for decades. 706 00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:53,280 Speaker 6: They don't want us to look at those big picture things. 707 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 6: They want us to be thinking about this. Oh, there's 708 00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,440 Speaker 6: a trans woman over there, and there's you know, someone 709 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:02,239 Speaker 6: who got a job they didn't deserve, and some you 710 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,040 Speaker 6: know college over there. Like they're really trying to get 711 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:07,799 Speaker 6: us distracted by all this culture war stuff, and they're 712 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:10,440 Speaker 6: not afraid to lie to do it. So, for instance, 713 00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:13,239 Speaker 6: you know, there's a sector of the Christian Nationalist movement 714 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 6: that votes on abortion. They've become single issue voters because 715 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,120 Speaker 6: movement leaders know if you can get people to vote 716 00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,799 Speaker 6: on a single issue, you can control the vote. So 717 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:24,880 Speaker 6: they started promoting the lie that babers are being aborted 718 00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:28,360 Speaker 6: after birth. This does not happen. This is simply not 719 00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:29,560 Speaker 6: happening at all. 720 00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 2: Yeah it's not a real thing. 721 00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,560 Speaker 6: Yeah it's not a real thing. But they repeat it 722 00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:37,920 Speaker 6: at every conference or every breakout session or every speaker 723 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:41,120 Speaker 6: who deals with abortion will repeat this lie. And it's 724 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:45,480 Speaker 6: just a massive distraction from the fact our rights are 725 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,479 Speaker 6: being stripped from us birth control. Some of the most 726 00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:52,280 Speaker 6: popular and effective forms of birth control they consider abortion, 727 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,120 Speaker 6: and we're losing our rights on like a massive scale. 728 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:59,000 Speaker 6: So that's just one example. In December is that America Fest, 729 00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:02,720 Speaker 6: which is put every year by Charlie Kirk's Turning Point 730 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:09,320 Speaker 6: USA and twenty thousand hardcore Mega members there, and almost 731 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:12,839 Speaker 6: every single speaker spoke about the issue of trans women 732 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,160 Speaker 6: playing on women's sports teams. Why is just like the 733 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,080 Speaker 6: issue of our time. Absolutely not to get bread and butter. 734 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,000 Speaker 6: It gets people upset. So people need to like cut 735 00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,960 Speaker 6: through that, not walk into the traps that they're setting 736 00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,960 Speaker 6: for us, and focus on bigger picture. We need a 737 00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,319 Speaker 6: broad based movement. We need to speak to the concerns 738 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:36,439 Speaker 6: of everyday people who want, you know, to live their 739 00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:41,560 Speaker 6: lives with dignity, to have economic security, et cetera, et cetera. 740 00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:44,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, really good point. 741 00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:47,040 Speaker 6: In the coming weeks, we're going to hear some voices 742 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:51,040 Speaker 6: in the opposition calling for working across the political aisle. 743 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:55,319 Speaker 6: I think we should ignore them because the anti democratic 744 00:40:55,400 --> 00:41:00,640 Speaker 6: movement is not interested in compromise. They're not remotely interesting compromise. 745 00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,080 Speaker 6: I think concessions now are going to consolidate the powers 746 00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:08,080 Speaker 6: of a lawless presidency. They want to entrench a new kleptocratic, 747 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:12,000 Speaker 6: authoritarian form of government in the United States. They want 748 00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:17,239 Speaker 6: to replace our democracy with authoritarianism and kleptocracy, a sort 749 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:21,400 Speaker 6: of authoritarian kleptocracy with Christian nationalist features. 750 00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:24,839 Speaker 1: Thank you Catherine, thank you, thank you. I hope you'll 751 00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:26,120 Speaker 1: come back all right. 752 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:27,600 Speaker 6: Likewise, thank you so much. 753 00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 1: Mollie Nod, Jesse Cannon by John Fast So I'm going 754 00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:37,200 Speaker 1: to shock you. 755 00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:42,120 Speaker 3: There seems to be this correlation between things Elon is 756 00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 3: shutting down and people investigating them. 757 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:45,920 Speaker 4: Who would have thunk. 758 00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:50,600 Speaker 2: Nah, certainly not me. I would not have thought this. 759 00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:53,840 Speaker 1: The Food and Drug Administration reviewing Elon most bright and 760 00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:57,160 Speaker 1: planted company, Neuralink. We're fired over the weekend as part 761 00:41:57,200 --> 00:41:59,640 Speaker 1: of a broader burge of the federal workforce. If no 762 00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:03,960 Speaker 1: one works in government, then these tech bros don't have 763 00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:07,319 Speaker 1: to worry about any government regulation. I feel like that 764 00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:10,680 Speaker 1: should be a meme, right. The cut includes twenty people 765 00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:16,120 Speaker 1: in the FDA's Office of Neurological and Physical Medical Devices, 766 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:20,120 Speaker 1: probably several of whom worked on Neuralink. But you know, 767 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:24,920 Speaker 1: I mean, really, it's probably just a coincidence. The loss 768 00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:27,960 Speaker 1: of roughly twenty employees will hamper it the agency's ability 769 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:32,319 Speaker 1: to quickly and safely process medical device applications of all sorts. Wait, 770 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:37,080 Speaker 1: should we be processing medical device applications? I mean, technically yes, 771 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:39,920 Speaker 1: but maybe not. Maybe we should just let everything go 772 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:45,839 Speaker 1: so anyway, here we are not surprising but very fucked up, 773 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,200 Speaker 1: and that is why it is our moment of fucker. 774 00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:51,520 Speaker 3: Just keep thinking back to when Elon did that interview 775 00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:53,960 Speaker 3: with Tucker and he said Trump better went or else, 776 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:56,239 Speaker 3: I'm going to go to jail, and things like this. 777 00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:01,960 Speaker 2: Probably nothing, Probably fine, it's nothing. 778 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:07,479 Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in 779 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:13,240 Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday to hear the best 780 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:17,640 Speaker 1: minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If 781 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:20,720 Speaker 1: you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend 782 00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:22,760 Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going. 783 00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:24,360 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.