1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noll. They call 6 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined with our super producer Max 7 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: Freight Trade Williams. Most importantly, you are you. You are here, 8 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 1: and that makes this the stuff they don't want you 9 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:42,920 Speaker 1: to know. It is the top of the week, reaching 10 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: the very end of twenty two. Congratulations everybody, if you, 11 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 1: like so many, have had a tough year, just know 12 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 1: we're almost done with it. We're almost to the next one, 13 00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: and as always we have your back. So much stuff 14 00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: has happened. Uh, there are robots who are out to 15 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: get you. In San Francisco, black holes are going crazy. 16 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 1: Uh in entire monasteries or temples rather in Thailand are 17 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:15,040 Speaker 1: getting vacated because the monks just can't stop doing meth 18 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: and meth monks And uh yeah, that that might be 19 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: a show all its own in the futures, you guys. 20 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: But and like like our producers Moniker, the freight trains 21 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:33,319 Speaker 1: might be stopping soon, right right, uh, And that also 22 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:36,399 Speaker 1: that could that could be its own episode as well, 23 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: just the uh, the tricky things that Uncle Sam has 24 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 1: put in place for certain industries to prevent unions, not 25 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: just rails, but you know, the airlines as well. Before 26 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 1: all of that, though, there's something very important we want 27 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 1: to talk to you about that is going to be 28 00:01:55,400 --> 00:02:02,040 Speaker 1: of especial interest to anyone who actually anyone, whether you 29 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: use the Internet or not. And while it's of interest 30 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:09,079 Speaker 1: to everyone, it is going to be critical information if 31 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 1: you are one of our listeners who happens to reside 32 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: in the United States and pay taxes. Oh yeah, because 33 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 1: because you've gotta pay your taxes, and a lot of 34 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 1: Americans nowadays are using e filing services to do those 35 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: taxes rather than you know, going to somebody down the 36 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 1: street is going to do your taxes for you, having 37 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: an accountant the way I know my parents used to 38 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 1: do it until my dad did the accounting for us. 39 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,240 Speaker 1: But the filing is the thing now. It doesn't mean 40 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 1: every American does it, but they're around a hundred and 41 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:48,760 Speaker 1: fifty million Americans that file their taxes online nowadays. That's 42 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: a lot of us and a lot of US use 43 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: the same services. There are some very popular ones out there. 44 00:02:57,480 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 1: Tax Layer was a big one I used once or twice, 45 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:03,400 Speaker 1: I know for sure, because the name sounds cool, right, 46 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:05,359 Speaker 1: Like it comes to a point where you just picked 47 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,359 Speaker 1: the one that has the most sexy commercial right maybe, 48 00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:10,840 Speaker 1: But to do your taxes, I feel like there's a 49 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: different calculation there. Maybe I don't need the most metal name, 50 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:17,920 Speaker 1: Maybe I just need the one that seems the most reliable. 51 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 1: And yeah, you use tax Layer a couple of times, 52 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 1: just just putting it out there, just putting it out 53 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 1: There's also uh turbo tax that's a big one. Free tax. 54 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: There's tax Act, tax Act, which I think you mentioned, Matt. 55 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: There's also there's a ton of of these things that 56 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 1: have been I don't know, Like it's weird and it 57 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: it doesn't make sense that taxes should be so complicated 58 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: in the United States. But that's to the as we'll see, 59 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 1: a lot of that comes from these sweetheart deals historically 60 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 1: that have occurred between the government and private industry. That's why. 61 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 1: That's why, like if you go on i RS dot 62 00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 1: gov when it's time, when it's time to pay the taxman, 63 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:09,160 Speaker 1: then what you will what you'll see is that depending 64 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 1: on your state as well. If we're not talking federal taxes. Uh, 65 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:17,520 Speaker 1: it almost seamlessly leads you to a different thing that 66 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: is a private thing. Right, It's actually can it can 67 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:26,040 Speaker 1: actually be kind of a pain to navigate around not 68 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,119 Speaker 1: using those things now. And that as a matter of fact, 69 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,600 Speaker 1: I don't know if we get popped for saying this, 70 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 1: but companies like Turbo tax spend a lot of money 71 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:41,160 Speaker 1: lobbying to keep it that way because it's a business 72 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:45,839 Speaker 1: that has a steady like a steady demand every year. Yeah, 73 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 1: it does grow, it is growing. And we know a 74 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 1: lot about this because we worked for a company that 75 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: also owned tax Act for a while one uh and 76 00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 1: not anymore, just for a while there. So I think 77 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: it's a holding company that and they diversified and they 78 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 1: bought a podcast slash website company that was us UM. 79 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 1: But anyway, we um. The reason why we're talking about 80 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 1: this today is because when you have that interaction when 81 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:17,839 Speaker 1: you file your taxes, it's really between you and the government. Really, 82 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: those are the two major entities. All your financial information 83 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:24,119 Speaker 1: that you have to give to the government by law, 84 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 1: and then they have all that information and then they 85 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:30,560 Speaker 1: decide how many taxes you need to pay more or 86 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:32,720 Speaker 1: how much you need to get back from them because 87 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 1: you pay too much. When you bring an accountant into 88 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 1: the situation, that third party, in a way, but not 89 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: in the same way, acts like an attorney. Right, it's 90 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:45,160 Speaker 1: just a medium through which that information travels, but it 91 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 1: doesn't get disseminated anywhere. And you know, a lot of 92 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,919 Speaker 1: those services have little up up charge things that you 93 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: can do that will allow them or like give you 94 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,479 Speaker 1: the option of having them defend you in the event 95 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 1: of an audit, or there's some extra like not protection exactly, 96 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 1: but if you are audited, there's like a thing that 97 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,919 Speaker 1: you pay extra for where they will kind of interface 98 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:12,360 Speaker 1: with the I R S in the event of an audit. Oh, dudes, 99 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 1: please design nerds. Fellow conspiracy realist, talk to us about 100 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:21,080 Speaker 1: dark patterns in UX. That's a huge thing. There's a 101 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:25,480 Speaker 1: great pro publica article called inside Turbo Taxes twenty year 102 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:29,159 Speaker 1: fight to stop Americans from filing their taxes for free. 103 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: But that's only one part of the income stream. Well, yeah, 104 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 1: I feel like it's one of those things sort of 105 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: like buying extra extra insurance for a U haul or something, 106 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:41,479 Speaker 1: or like buying ticket protection for your ticket mask. You know, 107 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: it's like one of those things where if you're a 108 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:45,960 Speaker 1: little bit of a nervous nelly you might do that, 109 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: but typically don't need it, but what you might need 110 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 1: it better to have it in case you need it. 111 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:53,919 Speaker 1: But it's just a good way of having an extra 112 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: revenue stream for people that you know, maybe aren't as 113 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:00,520 Speaker 1: savvy and and not to derealist up, but I think 114 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: we're getting two revenue streams, right, Yes, that's exactly where 115 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:07,279 Speaker 1: we're going. We're getting to what information you give, your 116 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:10,920 Speaker 1: personal financial information, What you give and where it's supposed 117 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:13,680 Speaker 1: to go, right, that's the first thing. In order to 118 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:17,320 Speaker 1: get it there securely and safely, maybe you use tax 119 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: Act or tax Layer or h and R blocks online services, 120 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: and you trust that that information is going to get 121 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,840 Speaker 1: there accurately and safely to the government that is. And 122 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,440 Speaker 1: in order to do that, you have to pay them money. 123 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,440 Speaker 1: That's one of the primary ways that these companies, these 124 00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:37,280 Speaker 1: third party tax filers make money. You pay dollars to 125 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: a hundred dollars, sometimes more, depending on which package you choose, 126 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 1: because they've all got different packages of what you get, 127 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 1: and when you do that again, the company is making 128 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 1: money every time somebody files taxes. And again we're talking 129 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 1: about a D fifty million plus individual returns that are filed. 130 00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 1: That's a lot of moolah. But one of the other 131 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: things you can do another revenue stream that you could 132 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 1: get for this. It's kind of roundabout. It's a little 133 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: weird because it's not necessarily a revenue stream. At first. 134 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 1: It's a way to get your name out as a 135 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: company that wants to file your taxes, and that is 136 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:18,200 Speaker 1: to put out Facebook ads or meta ads, I guess, 137 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:22,680 Speaker 1: but on Facebook and Instagram and all their other platforms. 138 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:26,280 Speaker 1: So a company like tax Act, let's say, would would 139 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: pay Facebook slash Meta money to put tax Act all 140 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: over the place so that people would know, oh, I 141 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: can file my taxes through this company. What Meta also 142 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 1: offers Facebook first and then it became Meta, is this 143 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: thing called the pixel. Everybody, everybody joining at home. I 144 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 1: don't care if you're in the car boom. The track 145 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: is very bad. It is a tracking thing. It's called 146 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: Meta pixel was known as Facebook pixel. It's a piece 147 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: of code that you can add into or website, your app, 148 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 1: whatever it is, that is the landing place for that 149 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: Facebook ad that you posted right on Meta one of 150 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:12,599 Speaker 1: Meta's platforms. So somebody clicks on an ad within Facebook, 151 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 1: they get sent to the tax Act website. Now pixel 152 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 1: knows if it's on if it's on the Tax Act website, 153 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: it knows who that person is, and it follows how 154 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 1: they interact with your website. That's really what it does. 155 00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 1: It's an analytics machine for people who buy Facebook ads. 156 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 1: So it's like a more elaborate cookie kind of kind 157 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:39,960 Speaker 1: of yeah yeah, cookie, you know, just being the the 158 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: nifty little thing that tracks your Internet activity for advertising 159 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 1: or more sinister purposes. Uh. The meta pixel is like 160 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 1: a very very advanced version of that and much more ubiquitous. 161 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 1: Think of like a cookie cake store for anybody who 162 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: ever did those Uh there, it's not average chips ahoy, 163 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:03,360 Speaker 1: is what I'm saying. And it's uh darn near ubiquitous. Uh. 164 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:07,480 Speaker 1: It is also completely legal for me to point out 165 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 1: that there are a number of great extensions you can 166 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: get on your browser's choice to throw that, to throw 167 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 1: that pixel off your trail, and I think it's worth 168 00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: the time. Oh yeah, So so they're a couple of this. 169 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 1: This is a bit complicated. We just gotta dive in 170 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: a little bit further here. This is how meta pixel 171 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: is described by Digital Trends in a post that was 172 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:35,320 Speaker 1: made not long ago. Quote. Once installed, this code shows 173 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: you how people react to your Facebook ads and keeps 174 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 1: track of the interactions your customers or prospective customers have 175 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: with your websites, such as buying a product on your site. 176 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: You can then use this information to target your ads 177 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: towards the perspective customers that are more likely to be 178 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 1: interested in your ads and your products in the future. 179 00:10:57,120 --> 00:10:59,960 Speaker 1: So really, it's just a tool for anybody who has 180 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 1: website that's gonna be giving Facebook slash Meta money for 181 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 1: advertisements and not illegal, not illegal at all. And the 182 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:09,000 Speaker 1: other thing to note here is that this code you 183 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:12,679 Speaker 1: can go right now and download the necessary code and 184 00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: install it on your website and you don't have to 185 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: pay Meta a thing. It's free. It's any that data right. Well, 186 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: theoretically you are using it and benefiting from it because 187 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 1: you get to see the analytics of the stuff you're 188 00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:31,920 Speaker 1: paying for your ads. The question is what does the 189 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:35,200 Speaker 1: stream look like in the other direction, what goes to 190 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: meta right? Well, we have an answer at least from 191 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 1: these e filing tax services. According to the markup dot org, 192 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: it's an article that was written with the Verge. Uh. 193 00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 1: It's by Simon Fundie Titler, Angie Walker and Colin Lecture 194 00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: Ellie or Lecture. Perhaps the title is tax filing websites 195 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: have been sending users financial information to Facebook and it 196 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:10,600 Speaker 1: was published not long ago on November. I highly recommend 197 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:13,160 Speaker 1: you read this article, or you read the Verge article 198 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,080 Speaker 1: that also came out, and there's there's quite a bit 199 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: of coverage on this in other places, but I would 200 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:23,960 Speaker 1: start probably with the Markup article. You should learn about this. Yeah, Matt, 201 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 1: this gave me some questions because without spoiling the the 202 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: big turn here, oh what what I think we can 203 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 1: agree we're seeing is a precedent. And just to set 204 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:40,559 Speaker 1: you up here, I'm sure many of us remember how, uh, 205 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,800 Speaker 1: several years ago, a while ago now, something strange started 206 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: happening with Facebook. People would finally bite the bullet, succumbed 207 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: to the peer pressure and start their first Facebook account, 208 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 1: only to learn there was always already a shadow accounts 209 00:12:57,640 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 1: waiting for them based on the activities and information of 210 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: people they knew in the real world or texted or 211 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 1: interacted with in some other non Facebook way, which was 212 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 1: spooky but definitely a precedent. Yeah, it is weird. You 213 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 1: don't even have to. It doesn't even have to be 214 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: a like, you know, quote shadow account kind of thing 215 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 1: if you sign up for meta like right now, if 216 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 1: you've got an oculust or something and you sign up 217 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:25,880 Speaker 1: for one of those accounts, it already has your friends 218 00:13:25,920 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 1: loaded up in there because it knows stuff about you. 219 00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: You don't you have to have an account yet, which 220 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: is really creepy. God, So let me jump into this 221 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:39,240 Speaker 1: this article from the markup, because I'm just gonna read 222 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,559 Speaker 1: a couple of things here verbatim and we can get 223 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: into it. Quote. Major tax filing services such as H 224 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: and R, Block, tax Act and tax Slayer have been 225 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 1: quietly transmitting sensitive financial information to Facebook when Americans file 226 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 1: their taxes online. The data sent through widely used code 227 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:01,080 Speaker 1: called the meta pixel, includes not only information like names 228 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 1: and email addresses, but often even more detailed information, including 229 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:10,960 Speaker 1: data on users income, filing status, refund amounts, and dependence 230 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 1: college scholarship amounts. Dude, that's like serious data. I mean 231 00:14:17,920 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: that that stuff is not publicly available, right, like people's 232 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: filing status, is it No if you're an individual, if 233 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 1: you're a corporation, but not if you're an individual. Well, 234 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: your marriage status is in a way like this public 235 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 1: knowledge because of the forms you fill out with the 236 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: county where you're registered and all that stuff. Like you know, 237 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,640 Speaker 1: Trump not giving up his tax documents was a big 238 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: deal because that stuffs like private. Well, it was is 239 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:47,560 Speaker 1: a that was a big deal because uh, first he 240 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 1: was almost certainly doing sketchy things. But then secondly there's 241 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: sort of this uh, for lack of a better term, 242 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: in gentleman's agreement that preceding presidents had it was heure 243 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 1: to look more trustworthy by uh by sharing that publicly. 244 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,480 Speaker 1: But you know, it's a it's a bad precedent to break. 245 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 1: It makes you look really sketchy. Not you know, not 246 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 1: to go with that precedent because it should be harmless. 247 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 1: This to the point is uh, this is dangerous. It's 248 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 1: way beyond metadata. Some of it is publicly available, or 249 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 1: you can dig into things like if you find public figures, 250 00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 1: there are any number of bought or AI assisted sites 251 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:33,640 Speaker 1: that will estimate that person's net worth. Right, those aren't reliable, 252 00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 1: but they're not illegal. Either what's what's the danger of 253 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 1: this information other than you know, the gross ethical violations, right, Well, 254 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 1: I mean, I guess there are there are a couple 255 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 1: of dangers we can get into. I think it's more 256 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 1: just an icky thing, right if you if Meta has 257 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 1: all that information, what does it do to you? Nothing? Really, 258 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 1: because what Meta is using that information for is to 259 00:16:00,360 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: further strengthen its algorithms for its ads that these companies 260 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 1: are already buying. Right. Ultimately, it becomes, in a way, 261 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:13,560 Speaker 1: uh uh, strengthening of their primary or one of their 262 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: primary revenue streams over at Meta, and it makes their 263 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: ecosystem more attractive to potential advertisers. It makes you become 264 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: even more of the product for these companies, right, and 265 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 1: you provide the service by using their services that are 266 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 1: usually free or you know, pretty low to file your 267 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: taxes over at tax Layer. I'm gonna read one more 268 00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:40,000 Speaker 1: short paragraph from this article because this is very important. 269 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 1: It speaks to what you just said earlier about having 270 00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: an account ben uh quote. The information set to Facebook 271 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 1: can be used by the company to power it's advertising algorithms, 272 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 1: and is gathered regardless of whether the person using the 273 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 1: tax filing service has an account on Facebook or other 274 00:16:57,560 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: platforms operated by meta m hm, So it doesn't matter, 275 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. There will make you a citizen without 276 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:07,479 Speaker 1: your ascent is another is another way to think of it, 277 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,639 Speaker 1: you know, like the reasons some people of Iranian descent 278 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:14,640 Speaker 1: are hesitant to travel to Iran because that government might 279 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 1: still just consider them a citizen even if they don't 280 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:22,360 Speaker 1: agree to that definition. So if you use these services, 281 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:27,199 Speaker 1: the idea is then you are not gonna be in 282 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 1: control of that information. Matt. I thought it was so 283 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:33,399 Speaker 1: interesting the way these different companies did react. Some change 284 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: their policies, some made some slick statements. If I could 285 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: just double back to clarify, then you're saying you would 286 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:44,919 Speaker 1: be beholden to the rules and regulations and perhaps taxation 287 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,400 Speaker 1: of that country, whether you want to or not. Yeah, 288 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:52,880 Speaker 1: it's uh, it's even a little bit more extreme because 289 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 1: they will physically detain you. Got it story for another day, 290 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:03,919 Speaker 1: but yeah, uh yeah, that's a scary comparison. Facebook is 291 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 1: not going to arrest you, I think not yet. The 292 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:12,560 Speaker 1: meta police are not here yet. Very soon they'll have 293 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:15,640 Speaker 1: explodable robots, I guess. I don't know. Well, we'll talk 294 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 1: about it futures. Now, Um, all right, guys, we we 295 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 1: I don't want to go too much deeper into this, 296 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:27,239 Speaker 1: just to state that you should be aware of this 297 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:30,399 Speaker 1: as a consumer if you're using one of these services 298 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: to file your taxes, because it's not just meta that 299 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: the companies are giving data to. They're also giving similar data, 300 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 1: not all the same stuff, but giving it to Google. 301 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 1: Because remember Google is the the other major player when 302 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,959 Speaker 1: it comes to online advertising. Google and Facebook, those are 303 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,239 Speaker 1: the two. But Facebook is kind of like, you know, 304 00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: waning a bit in terms of its supremacy, so I 305 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 1: would think Google would be more so. Yeah, and and 306 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,479 Speaker 1: in Google's at least, what the markup own is that 307 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:04,639 Speaker 1: in the case of Google, tax Act was also sending 308 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,679 Speaker 1: information to them, but it didn't have names attached, so 309 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,399 Speaker 1: it was just like individual that makes this much money 310 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 1: and you know, with this dependent or whatever. It's still 311 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:16,840 Speaker 1: super creepy. You can read a ton more about it. 312 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,919 Speaker 1: Highly recommend reading the articles because there's a lot and 313 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 1: they have been saying different things. A block had an 314 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: interesting response, but for now, Hey, if you want that information, 315 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 1: go and find it. It's there. Read the whole thing, 316 00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 1: take your take the time, and I guess we'll all 317 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,439 Speaker 1: just get ready to do our taxes in a different 318 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 1: way next year. Somehow I'm not. I can't wait till 319 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 1: I'm a billionaire so I don't have to pay taxes 320 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:47,160 Speaker 1: such a hassle. All right, Well, we'll take a quick 321 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 1: break and consult with our accountants and see you in 322 00:19:50,480 --> 00:20:02,119 Speaker 1: just a few and we have returned. We're stayed in 323 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 1: the US for this one. This story will take us 324 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 1: over to the West coast, to the beautiful, terrifyingly expensive 325 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: land of San Francisco. Also want to give a special 326 00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: shout out to fellow conspiracy realist Rage Cage. Uh, Rage Cage, 327 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 1: you had Uh we were, We were chatting earlier, and 328 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:32,000 Speaker 1: Rage has the Today's Award for Best Spooky Ist timing 329 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: because Rage was writing about this story honestly, as I was, 330 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 1: as I was reading stuff about it. So here's the issue. 331 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,920 Speaker 1: We talked about San Francisco a bit in the past. Uh. 332 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:49,440 Speaker 1: It is regardless of whether you love it or hate it, 333 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: it is home to some of the biggest innovations in 334 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: recent history, especially in the world at tech. They love 335 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,080 Speaker 1: tech over there. It's also a place with a lot 336 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,160 Speaker 1: of problems. Is anybody who who can afford to live. 337 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:05,880 Speaker 1: There can a test or, as anybody who has visited 338 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:12,920 Speaker 1: Canada tests, there's a there's an ongoing controversy about unhoused people. Uh. 339 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 1: There was also an issue quite recently during the pandemic 340 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 1: with refusal to prosecute shoplifters right, and this was seen 341 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 1: as as dangerous to a lot of businesses. More importantly, 342 00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 1: the people who work at those businesses and got threatened. 343 00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 1: So there's a new wrinkle that's just happening. Give you 344 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,160 Speaker 1: the big headline. Now there are a couple of articles 345 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:41,800 Speaker 1: want to recommend. Let's go to al Jazeerra first, just 346 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:46,080 Speaker 1: to shake things up a bit. San Francisco Police Department 347 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:52,879 Speaker 1: Now officially, as of today November two, as we record, 348 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:57,080 Speaker 1: they have officially voted to give the San Francisco p 349 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 1: D the power to use killer robots. This is not hyperbole. 350 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:06,119 Speaker 1: Potentially lethal remote controlled robots. Is this like the plot 351 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 1: of RoboCop that you're describing here? Almost not not near 352 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 1: as cool because I'm scene though, where they're like they're 353 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,680 Speaker 1: like demoing the killer robots in the boardroom and then 354 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 1: it goes nuts and murders everybody. That's what I picture here. 355 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:26,600 Speaker 1: It's uh, it's pretty crazy. Let's so let's get into 356 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 1: it this. These robots are, first off, they're not armed 357 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 1: with guns. They're not like the DARPA dog that we 358 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 1: correctly predicted would get a gun strapped to it at 359 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:45,959 Speaker 1: some point. They are going to carry explosive charges. So 360 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:49,400 Speaker 1: no guns, but they will have explosives and the ideas 361 00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 1: they can use these explosives to quote, contact, incapacitate, or 362 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: disorient violent, armed or dangerous suspects. That is per the 363 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: s of p D spokesperson Alison Maxie in an earlier 364 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 1: statement today or wait, in earlier statement a few days ago, 365 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 1: and they said, you know, these are only gonna be 366 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:15,639 Speaker 1: used in extreme circumstances to save or prevent further loss 367 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,879 Speaker 1: of life. The officers are only gonna be able to 368 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 1: call out to kill robots after they have quote exhausted 369 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 1: alternative force or de escalation tactics. Uh. And right now 370 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,440 Speaker 1: they already have robots. So you're saying the future is now. 371 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,360 Speaker 1: They're already like a Baker's dozen ground robots that go 372 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 1: in and um, you've seen it in countless action films. 373 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:41,199 Speaker 1: They send in the bomb robot, right and there's a 374 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 1: guy with a really big looking controller. Uh, these giant right, 375 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 1: and and that's how it starts. You know. We we 376 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 1: talked about this a little bit in um Our X 377 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,879 Speaker 1: thirty seven B series. When we talk about precedent, it 378 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 1: starts with surveillance. It always starts with surveillance before it 379 00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:03,720 Speaker 1: goes a f So if you are a person who 380 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:09,560 Speaker 1: is inherently skeptical of of giving this sort of power 381 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: two authorities, then this seems pretty dystopian. But before we 382 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,879 Speaker 1: go into more details, I'm gonna pause and ask ask 383 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 1: you guys, just off the information you got here, it's happening, 384 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: This isn't this isn't a plan. Now it's approved. Uh 385 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,760 Speaker 1: does this seem like a good idea or a bad idea? 386 00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 1: Bad idea? Well, here's something that I just I feel 387 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: like I have to point out and I only know 388 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: this from my video game experience um explosions. Explosions almost 389 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:46,639 Speaker 1: always come with a very often handy, but in this case, 390 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: probably not so great feature, which is splash damage. You 391 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:56,439 Speaker 1: don't Yeah, they're not really targeted so much. So I 392 00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 1: wonder if we're talking about flash bang loans, are we 393 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: talking about C four? Are we I have no idea. 394 00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:07,400 Speaker 1: There's so many possibilities there when you say a robot 395 00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 1: with explosives. Yeah. Yeah, though, okay, so we've got so 396 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:16,720 Speaker 1: we've got one healthy concern and then we've got one 397 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:20,639 Speaker 1: I think it's a bad idea, and I feel like 398 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:22,879 Speaker 1: that's I don't feel like it's a hot take for 399 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,920 Speaker 1: us to say the concerns about this stuff are valid. 400 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:31,920 Speaker 1: We know that Oakland's police department, on the other side 401 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: of the Bay, they were also thinking of doing something similar. Um. 402 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:44,199 Speaker 1: The the council though, get this, the the officials of 403 00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 1: the committee that voted on this, they voted in eight 404 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:52,280 Speaker 1: in favor, three opposed, So only three people said, hey guys, 405 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,480 Speaker 1: I'm worried about the splashback damage. Yeah. The other ones 406 00:25:56,520 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 1: clearly don't play video games. I know more gamers in office, 407 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:03,399 Speaker 1: that's what need. This also is restricted to a quote 408 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: limited number of high ranking officers. So these aren't a 409 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: I powered, These are remote controlled? Yeah, correct, at this 410 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: point they are. There are a lot more like a 411 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:22,760 Speaker 1: early UA V than they are. Um, then there are 412 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:26,960 Speaker 1: a RoboCop level thing they're looking at, something that's specifically 413 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 1: called a remote tech F five A. This is one 414 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,879 Speaker 1: that can be it's a bomb disposal robot and it 415 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,679 Speaker 1: can be weaponized. You can give it a load of 416 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:42,479 Speaker 1: shotgun shells to destroy explosives. And then there's the Connecticut Talent. 417 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,040 Speaker 1: This is a military robot that can be equipped with 418 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:50,480 Speaker 1: a machine gun. Again, at this point, nobody, nobody in 419 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: the police department side to say, We're gonna give them 420 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:57,359 Speaker 1: some semiautos, you know, and just see how that helps 421 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:00,119 Speaker 1: get cats out of trees. But they are going to 422 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:05,880 Speaker 1: have that possibility. This hasn't happened yet. There hasn't been 423 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,160 Speaker 1: a death because this literally just the vote went through 424 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:11,840 Speaker 1: today as we record, uh, and we hope by the 425 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,880 Speaker 1: time you hear this there still will not have been 426 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:20,080 Speaker 1: any any deaths or violence on this. But it's part 427 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: of a larger pattern, I would imagine, you know, That's 428 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:27,280 Speaker 1: what I think. There's another great Daily Beast article from yesterday, 429 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:31,399 Speaker 1: from November twenty nine by Tony ho Tran, right before 430 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 1: this thing got passed, And in this the journalist talks 431 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:40,800 Speaker 1: about the It talks about the earlier precedents and other 432 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:45,639 Speaker 1: parts of the country, you know, like there are cases 433 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: where cops in Dallas used a robot armed with C 434 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 1: four to kill the guys suspected of targeting police officers 435 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:58,200 Speaker 1: with a sniper rifle. That was that was the first 436 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:03,119 Speaker 1: recorded incident of UM law enforcement using a robot or 437 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,080 Speaker 1: cops specifically using a robot to kill a human being. 438 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,920 Speaker 1: But it doesn't sound like it's going to be the last. Yeah, 439 00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: that's a horrible city. Look, that's crazy to break down 440 00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,919 Speaker 1: a person suspected of targeting officers with a sniper rifle. 441 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: Like I can see in that instance why you might 442 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:25,040 Speaker 1: send a robot and take that person out, But that 443 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:29,879 Speaker 1: takes away all chance to fully prove that person was 444 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: the one doing it that well, does it? Though? I 445 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 1: mean good detective work you know was certainly you know, 446 00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,560 Speaker 1: make make sure you knew you were getting the right person. 447 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:42,680 Speaker 1: But you gotta stop that person, right, That's what I mean. 448 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:44,760 Speaker 1: I agree, you gotta stop that person. Whatever you gotta, 449 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,480 Speaker 1: you know, do what you gotta do. Stop that prevent 450 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: the loss of life, you know, for an officer. So yeah, 451 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: you know, for me, I'm only I'm more freaked out 452 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: if this was like AI controlled and it was some 453 00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:01,160 Speaker 1: algorithm making an assessment and then you know, meeting deadly force. 454 00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: But if there is an operator and it just removes 455 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,160 Speaker 1: the operator from the equation and they are trained. But again, 456 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 1: we don't necessarily have the most faith in in the 457 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:13,040 Speaker 1: training of of law enforcement all the time. But it's 458 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 1: certainly better than like an algorithm and some sort of 459 00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 1: like you know, AI generated decision making engine. I mean, 460 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: maybe just to step back, there's there there are a 461 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: couple of things here that you know, some of us 462 00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: listening along need to hear about this. The suspect in 463 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 1: those sixteen shootings is this a guy named Micah Xavier Johnson. 464 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: And when you're working the world a journalism, you have 465 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 1: to be you have to be careful right about suspected, 466 00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 1: alleged all that stuff, because as you said, he got killed. 467 00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 1: He was he was taken down by this robot, and 468 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,440 Speaker 1: that means that he would never go to a corps 469 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 1: of law. He did kill five police officers, he injured 470 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,680 Speaker 1: nine other uh and two civilians got the splashback. This 471 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: was during um This is during one of the waves 472 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,920 Speaker 1: of protests amid the pandemic. But then here's the bigger thing. 473 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: Go back further right. This is technology that is coming 474 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:17,720 Speaker 1: home to roost. It has been active abroad since two 475 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 1: thousand and one. You know what I mean this again, 476 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: These things don't come out of vacuums. And the other 477 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 1: thing is all technology eventually, no matter how people try 478 00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 1: to suppress it, all technology that gets out at all 479 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 1: and can be seen by the public becomes democratized. Right, 480 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 1: it spreads and just like fire, it doesn't question who 481 00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:45,440 Speaker 1: is using it. Right, the gun at this point does 482 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 1: not ask the shooter if a person deserves to be 483 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,479 Speaker 1: shot at. And like the same way you're fire, you 484 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 1: start a fire, and it doesn't say, hey, are we 485 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,600 Speaker 1: grilling burgers? Are we burning the orphanage because it can't 486 00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:01,240 Speaker 1: make a decision, It us what you tell it to do. 487 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,480 Speaker 1: And this means that whatever the good intentions are from 488 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,160 Speaker 1: law enforcement, who are you know, to your point and 489 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,320 Speaker 1: old trying to prevent the loss of officer life as 490 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 1: well as civilian life, it means that that same technology 491 00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,720 Speaker 1: can and in my opinion, will inevitably end up in 492 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,240 Speaker 1: the hands of terrorist groups. Well that that argument is 493 00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,880 Speaker 1: also a very interesting slippery slope that like gun lobbyists 494 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,640 Speaker 1: use saying it's not the gun's fault, the gun is 495 00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,880 Speaker 1: just a tool. It's it's these bad people, is these 496 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 1: bad actors And in order to counteract them, we need 497 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: good actors with guns. Well, that second part I would 498 00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: say is where is where you see bad faith arguments there? 499 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,480 Speaker 1: I mean, you could take any piece of technology and 500 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 1: take the same thing we just said, and it would 501 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 1: apply just the same. A microwave doesn't ask you what 502 00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,200 Speaker 1: you're putting in it and why you know. And truly 503 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 1: humans are a part of the problem, but another piece 504 00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,760 Speaker 1: of the problem that people don't talk about is the 505 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:02,800 Speaker 1: availability of the technology. And so to go past guns 506 00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: and return to the idea of remote controlled killing machines, 507 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: which these things are, then we know that there will be, uh, 508 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 1: there will be very intelligence but not very ethical, criminal 509 00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 1: organizations who will use this right, so all armies around 510 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:31,239 Speaker 1: the world that can do this are doing it right. 511 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: Domestic law enforcement will be the next step, because law 512 00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 1: enforcement is increasingly becoming militarized across the world. It's becoming 513 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:46,479 Speaker 1: the secondary market for all the toys theyre and so 514 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 1: the next step then is going to be, in my opinion, 515 00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 1: is going to be the dystopian future we're describing. It's 516 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: going to be artificial intelligence. Uh, these things operating as 517 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:02,840 Speaker 1: some kind kind of judge jury and executioner with a 518 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:06,000 Speaker 1: cloud server, right like a cloud connection, and a set 519 00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 1: of directives that says, think this way, if A, then 520 00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:13,800 Speaker 1: B zero one zero, just like an autonomous car deciding 521 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:17,920 Speaker 1: which person should be hit or injured in the accident, 522 00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 1: right if whether if you can't dodge both so and 523 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:26,240 Speaker 1: that's not a deing on autonomous cart uh technology. It's 524 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 1: it's really like nobody in these situations sees themselves as 525 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:34,360 Speaker 1: the bad guy, and they're trying to do the right 526 00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:38,800 Speaker 1: thing from their perspective. But this is such a Pandora's jar. 527 00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 1: It's already been opened. The killer robots or already greenlits, 528 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,480 Speaker 1: they're on the way. It reminds me of I rewatched 529 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:52,160 Speaker 1: uh Elysium. Uh yeah, And this made me think of 530 00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:57,840 Speaker 1: Elysium because there are there are AI law enforcement drones 531 00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:01,960 Speaker 1: in Elysium. And without too many spoilers, the logline is 532 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:07,640 Speaker 1: the consequences of civilization of caught up with Earth. Ninety 533 00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:12,719 Speaker 1: something percent of the world is poor, miserable, ridden with 534 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 1: disease and malnutrition, kept in surf like conditions under the 535 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,800 Speaker 1: thumb of the small five percent or one percent or whatever. 536 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:26,680 Speaker 1: Through the use of these robo drones and if you 537 00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,799 Speaker 1: watch that movie, which is not you know, I think 538 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 1: a lot of people don't. Don't call it the perfect movie, 539 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:36,439 Speaker 1: but if you watch it, it's illuminating to see how 540 00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:41,080 Speaker 1: encounters with those drones go. And science fiction again, is 541 00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:45,760 Speaker 1: only fiction for a certain amount of time. And speaking 542 00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,040 Speaker 1: of time, then no, hold on you just you just 543 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:49,799 Speaker 1: painted a picture in my head and I don't think 544 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,040 Speaker 1: you meant to. I just envisioned something called the g 545 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:57,680 Speaker 1: Force and it's the Google version of that, right, But 546 00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:01,600 Speaker 1: they're just drones that fly around and they just they 547 00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:03,439 Speaker 1: have a little speaker on them and they just go, 548 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:14,279 Speaker 1: do not be evil, Do not be Yeah, they will 549 00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:19,000 Speaker 1: be executed. You have a legally downloaded ad blocking software 550 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 1: into your implant citizen that your you will be shut 551 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:31,000 Speaker 1: down for your safety relinquished. Yea, yeah exactly. Or you 552 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:34,480 Speaker 1: know that's like the next version would be a world where, 553 00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:37,480 Speaker 1: oh like in cyberpunk, where if you lose your job, 554 00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,719 Speaker 1: then the cybernetics that have been installed in you can 555 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:47,680 Speaker 1: get shut down as well. I started playing Cyberpunk back up. 556 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 1: I thought it didn't get fixed playing dong in or 557 00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:56,239 Speaker 1: dong out. I don't. It's like Gadaga rules. I don't 558 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,760 Speaker 1: save stuff for the swim back. But speaking of getting 559 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,360 Speaker 1: to you, folks, we're gonna pause for word from our sponsors, 560 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: give you a chance to see what your local law 561 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 1: is saying about killer robots, and we'll be back with 562 00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 1: one more piece of strange news. And we returned, and 563 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna start this one off with a little song, 564 00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:30,440 Speaker 1: black hole Sun, Won't you come and shine with the 565 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:33,839 Speaker 1: light of a thousand trillion sons to wash away the rain. 566 00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:38,480 Speaker 1: That's a thing that was discovered by yeah this zwiki 567 00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:44,920 Speaker 1: transient facility in California, which this past February, according to 568 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,400 Speaker 1: a fabulous article on Motherboard, was experiencing some outages and 569 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: then went back online, and right as it went back online, 570 00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:58,919 Speaker 1: it spotted an eruption of light and energy far far 571 00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:05,640 Speaker 1: far away that was absolutely unprecedented. So the astronomers there, 572 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,239 Speaker 1: you know, went on their slack because astronomers apparently you 573 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,879 Speaker 1: slack as well. And somebody said something like, are we 574 00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:16,680 Speaker 1: restarting with the bang? Igor Andreoni, an astronomer at the 575 00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:22,239 Speaker 1: University of Maryland who participates in this, uh this facility's research. Yeah, 576 00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:26,480 Speaker 1: it's uh, it's pretty wild. They they saw what essentially 577 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:33,880 Speaker 1: was a black hole related gravitational wave acceleration, let's call 578 00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,719 Speaker 1: and I'm no uh, I'm no black hole scientists here, 579 00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:42,080 Speaker 1: and I'm relying heavily on this Becky Ferrierira article on Motherboard. 580 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:45,400 Speaker 1: But this is well and the headline. I have to say, though, Uh, 581 00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:47,160 Speaker 1: it made me think it was much more of an 582 00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:49,960 Speaker 1: end of the world scenario than it actually is. Scientists 583 00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 1: spot black hole energy beam as bright as when thousand 584 00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 1: trillion sons and here's the kicker pointed at Earth and 585 00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:58,799 Speaker 1: the fact that it was pointed at Earth is what 586 00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:02,239 Speaker 1: made it visible and what what made them able to 587 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: kind of hone in on it. And like a lot 588 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:09,840 Speaker 1: of astrological discoveries, it was kind of an accident. So 589 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:14,200 Speaker 1: let's see. Um, here's a quote. Engineers worked without stopping 590 00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 1: weekends included day and night to make the camera operational again. 591 00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,000 Speaker 1: And literally the first night it was operational, there was 592 00:38:21,120 --> 00:38:25,920 Speaker 1: this detection. Andreoni, who I mentioned, and also Michael Coughlin, 593 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:31,160 Speaker 1: who's an astronomer at the University of Minnesota, reported this. 594 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 1: I guess you could call an anomaly. Um, let's call 595 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:37,759 Speaker 1: it a mysterious flash like Motherboard did. So what it 596 00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:43,279 Speaker 1: actually was was an incredibly powerful beam of energy, an 597 00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:48,520 Speaker 1: energetic jet made of ultra fast particles, and like the 598 00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:52,919 Speaker 1: headline said, pointed at Earth and it was fueled by 599 00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:57,799 Speaker 1: a black hole eating star, which is scary sounding. That 600 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:01,399 Speaker 1: is billions of light years away from our planet, so 601 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:05,160 Speaker 1: we don't necessarily have to worry about getting fried by 602 00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:11,280 Speaker 1: this ultra beam uh energy particle field yet. But apparently 603 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:15,759 Speaker 1: this type of cosmic you know, anomaly or phenomenon I 604 00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:20,000 Speaker 1: guess uh, is what's called a title disruption event or 605 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 1: t d E. And it's actually got a name because 606 00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 1: they name all these kinds of things not particularly sexy, 607 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,799 Speaker 1: but it's a T two O two two c m 608 00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,680 Speaker 1: C and they're describing it as the furthest jetted t 609 00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:36,440 Speaker 1: d E discovered so far and the only one for 610 00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:40,879 Speaker 1: which it was possible to observe a complex optical lightcurve 611 00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:45,360 Speaker 1: that transitions from a fast red component into a blue plateau. 612 00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:49,680 Speaker 1: And they published the study in uh the journal Nature, 613 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,319 Speaker 1: in addition to a companion study that was published in 614 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:57,200 Speaker 1: Nature Astronomy at the same time, and gave kind of 615 00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,800 Speaker 1: a detailed breakdown of how such a power full beam 616 00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:05,440 Speaker 1: like this can be birthed. It's really fascinating. There's some 617 00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:08,160 Speaker 1: some other great quotes from this article. Um, they describe 618 00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,640 Speaker 1: it as reaffirming the necessity to have truly eyes wide 619 00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:16,080 Speaker 1: open searches of these vastly growing astronomical data sets that 620 00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:19,560 Speaker 1: we have. And uh, it's a source we didn't really 621 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:23,200 Speaker 1: think hard about until it was discovered because it's so rare. 622 00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:26,760 Speaker 1: This is from Andreoni. Uh, it's not quite the first 623 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,720 Speaker 1: thing you think about an event that is detected once 624 00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:32,840 Speaker 1: every ten years if that, and that has never been 625 00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:37,239 Speaker 1: discovered before in the optical wavelengths in other words, you know, 626 00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:41,800 Speaker 1: wavelengths that you can actually see. This is unprecedented. So 627 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,920 Speaker 1: can I just jump here fast? We talked about the 628 00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:47,719 Speaker 1: distances in space, and that's one of the major reasons 629 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:51,080 Speaker 1: why even though statistically there's other life in the universe, 630 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:53,920 Speaker 1: we probably won't ever encounter it, right because of that distance. 631 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:56,279 Speaker 1: And you know, when you think about the speed of 632 00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:00,759 Speaker 1: light and how ridiculously fast that is, but and how 633 00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:04,480 Speaker 1: much distance that light has to travel to actually reach 634 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:09,239 Speaker 1: the Earth, it's crazy to think that this thing we're 635 00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:13,319 Speaker 1: observing happened only it's what did it say, only a 636 00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:16,560 Speaker 1: couple of billion years after the universe was formed. At 637 00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:20,440 Speaker 1: least that's the theory. Yeah, it's eight point five billion 638 00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:24,360 Speaker 1: light years away, but it's so then it's just traveling. 639 00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,000 Speaker 1: That light has been traveling four billions of years towards 640 00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:31,440 Speaker 1: the Earth. We catch it just in this chance happening. 641 00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:35,000 Speaker 1: When this thing turns back on, my mind goes to 642 00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:38,719 Speaker 1: then all the light that's coming off of you know, 643 00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:43,239 Speaker 1: our star and stars near us in in where the 644 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,840 Speaker 1: universe is, and then that light traveling back in the 645 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,800 Speaker 1: other direction, and just what time. I'm sorry, you're blowing 646 00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:51,920 Speaker 1: my mind. I'm not high, but I'm just thinking about 647 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:55,080 Speaker 1: time in the sense of distance and light, and it 648 00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:58,239 Speaker 1: is kind of hurting me a little bit. It's I mean, 649 00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:00,560 Speaker 1: it's such a cool thing, isn't it Like when you 650 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:04,960 Speaker 1: I find that idea can take people in one of 651 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 1: two philosophical directions. It can be immensely depressing, or it 652 00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,520 Speaker 1: can be immensely inspiring. As a matter of fact, three directions, 653 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:14,960 Speaker 1: because it can be both. It's a nice mixture of 654 00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:19,080 Speaker 1: some kind of meta cosmics. Saunder for anybody who likes 655 00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:23,360 Speaker 1: the Dictionary of Uncounted Sorrows or whatever it's called Counted Sorrows. 656 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:27,480 Speaker 1: I can't remember but the the idea is the idea 657 00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: reminds me of like, imagine you are in the largest 658 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,960 Speaker 1: train station ever a very or a crowded airport, right 659 00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:40,240 Speaker 1: the largest one that could ever exist, and somehow, way 660 00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:45,120 Speaker 1: across the terminal, you make eye contact right with someone 661 00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:48,440 Speaker 1: you've never met, never see again, and it's really intense, 662 00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:51,160 Speaker 1: and it's just for a second, and it changes your life, 663 00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:54,680 Speaker 1: you know. Uh, Like that's that's a poetic way. It's 664 00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,040 Speaker 1: kind of poetic, right, and that's happened to people. But 665 00:42:57,239 --> 00:43:02,600 Speaker 1: the the thing that really I think is inspiring. If 666 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:06,799 Speaker 1: this saves you from uh, if this saves you from 667 00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:11,040 Speaker 1: nihilism and a feeling of being lost in the universe, No, 668 00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:13,560 Speaker 1: I think you hit on the most important part. And 669 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:16,879 Speaker 1: I'm so glad you mentioned this. Where these are these 670 00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:22,120 Speaker 1: astronomers are saying to the lay folk, you don't understand 671 00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:26,400 Speaker 1: what an amazing coincidence this is. We just happened to 672 00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:28,839 Speaker 1: be at the right place at the right time, when 673 00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:32,120 Speaker 1: this thing happened to have pointed this, and the light 674 00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:34,480 Speaker 1: happened to be at the right speed. I mean, there 675 00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:38,200 Speaker 1: is so much out there to see, you know, and 676 00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,440 Speaker 1: human beings I don't I mean correct me if I'm 677 00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,120 Speaker 1: wrong on this all. But I think, uh, astronomers still 678 00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: have like very we we have very little visibility right 679 00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:52,799 Speaker 1: of the visible universe, like what the satellites can cover. Yeah, 680 00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:56,520 Speaker 1: that's my understanding as well. And another thing Andreoni said 681 00:43:56,640 --> 00:44:00,520 Speaker 1: was how it tells us about the time scale of 682 00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:04,000 Speaker 1: the formation of the jet as compared to the disc 683 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:07,440 Speaker 1: of material around the black hole that occreates and keeps 684 00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:10,720 Speaker 1: pumping out energy that we can observe. In other words, 685 00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:14,719 Speaker 1: it really tells us about the environment surrounding this black hole. 686 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,560 Speaker 1: So it's almost like a cosmic ice core or something, 687 00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,640 Speaker 1: you know, Like it's a way of understanding something that 688 00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:24,480 Speaker 1: we could never possibly reach, um and understanding like kind 689 00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:28,719 Speaker 1: of cosmic history and the formation of even our universe, 690 00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:30,960 Speaker 1: you know, and and and uh life as we know it. 691 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:34,520 Speaker 1: Perhaps I think that whole little inside astronomer to joke 692 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,480 Speaker 1: on Slack about are we restarting with a bang? I 693 00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:40,359 Speaker 1: think that's sort of a reference to the Big Bang thing. 694 00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:45,320 Speaker 1: Maybe I'm misreading that, but that's my understanding. I mean, really, 695 00:44:46,160 --> 00:44:49,200 Speaker 1: since we were going through some cosmic emotions here for 696 00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:53,200 Speaker 1: for people who are a motive think about this, you 697 00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:56,000 Speaker 1: could also look at this as a shot across the bowl, 698 00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:58,400 Speaker 1: because what if that was a gamma ray burst instead 699 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:02,280 Speaker 1: by you can reach out and all of our stuff, 700 00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:05,680 Speaker 1: right it was yeah, fry all of the people and 701 00:45:05,719 --> 00:45:11,160 Speaker 1: all of their stuff. It would fundamentally change Earth's atmosphere. 702 00:45:11,160 --> 00:45:16,120 Speaker 1: It's one of those, uh extinction level events. I think 703 00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:19,920 Speaker 1: it was. Was it called did it cause the I 704 00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:22,400 Speaker 1: wonder if it caused one of the great extinctions? But anyway, 705 00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:26,040 Speaker 1: what I'm saying is that's something that's also very difficult 706 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:29,600 Speaker 1: to predict because of the size of the universe versus 707 00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:33,960 Speaker 1: the size Earth. Are cute little Kauai rock or being 708 00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:38,239 Speaker 1: our cute little Kauai son. Uh, it's unlikely that these 709 00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:41,239 Speaker 1: things will hit us, but it's also impossible to predict it. Well. 710 00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,600 Speaker 1: And I haven't read the actual studies, um, but I 711 00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,520 Speaker 1: have noticed and you probably will notice this as well. 712 00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,720 Speaker 1: Scientists and astronomers and the like, they don't really speak 713 00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:54,640 Speaker 1: in like apocalyptic doomsday terms. Usually they're very measured, you know, 714 00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:56,440 Speaker 1: in the way they describe these things. So Ben, you 715 00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,040 Speaker 1: pointed something out there really isn't even reference to any 716 00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:01,359 Speaker 1: of the quotes from these folks. But then they kind 717 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:05,040 Speaker 1: of end the article, the Vice article with one last 718 00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,600 Speaker 1: quote from from one of these um lead astronomers. We 719 00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:09,640 Speaker 1: just need to observe more and deeper. I think we'll 720 00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,120 Speaker 1: get much closer to understanding why they're so rare and 721 00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,080 Speaker 1: the astrophysics of these events. So, in other words, like 722 00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:17,799 Speaker 1: we need to pay attention to this stuff because it 723 00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:21,080 Speaker 1: could be a bad thing that when you know one time, 724 00:46:21,200 --> 00:46:23,560 Speaker 1: you know, like and the fact that this happened and 725 00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,600 Speaker 1: that we caught it means that there are other things 726 00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:30,200 Speaker 1: like this that who knows, you know. I mean, it's 727 00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:32,880 Speaker 1: a little bit of mind mind boggling because I'm just 728 00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:38,400 Speaker 1: learning about Blazers or Blazers a hyper pop DJ or 729 00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:41,920 Speaker 1: something like a bad guy in the New Thor movies. 730 00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:47,640 Speaker 1: It's something trademarks by chef Blaze. We we know, we love. 731 00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:53,120 Speaker 1: These things are are powerful light beams, similar to what 732 00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,640 Speaker 1: you're talking about here in this story, Noel. But there's 733 00:46:55,640 --> 00:46:59,640 Speaker 1: this there's another Vice article written by Becky Uh. They 734 00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:01,319 Speaker 1: were men and here I think you were there the 735 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,399 Speaker 1: article you were talking about, and she's just talking about 736 00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:08,480 Speaker 1: these things. I don't understand them yet, but they look incredible. 737 00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:11,880 Speaker 1: It looks like mass effect to me. They also just 738 00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:14,920 Speaker 1: the name. It's got a lot of gravity to get gravity. 739 00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:20,759 Speaker 1: It's it's it's a cool name, Blazers, cooler than and 740 00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:24,120 Speaker 1: it's strange because you know, we've got some astronomers in 741 00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:28,239 Speaker 1: the crowd with us today and I would love, we'd 742 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:31,279 Speaker 1: love to hear your take on this stuff, especially at 743 00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:36,359 Speaker 1: point about maybe being alarmist, right or or in any 744 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:40,560 Speaker 1: way hyperbolic. We want to be very measured as well 745 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:45,440 Speaker 1: when we talk about these sorts of events, these movements 746 00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:51,280 Speaker 1: in the ancient heavens. I just I one line also, 747 00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:53,239 Speaker 1: I was just looking at this as we were talking 748 00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:56,040 Speaker 1: about one line stood out to me from M I. T. News. 749 00:47:56,600 --> 00:47:59,920 Speaker 1: They had a statement where they were talking about how 750 00:48:01,239 --> 00:48:05,680 Speaker 1: there's one supermassive black hole per galaxy and they form 751 00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:10,080 Speaker 1: very quickly after you know, what humans call the universe starts. 752 00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:15,000 Speaker 1: And then this guy says, Matteo Luccini says, that tells 753 00:48:15,080 --> 00:48:17,719 Speaker 1: us they feed very fast. That we don't know how 754 00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:23,520 Speaker 1: that feeding process works, feeding exactly exactly, And I mean 755 00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:27,400 Speaker 1: that's not scientifically inaccurate, but it also immediately makes my 756 00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:30,279 Speaker 1: mind go to eldritch places when I think, what are 757 00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:34,880 Speaker 1: these just like the spirited away no face hungry boys 758 00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:37,640 Speaker 1: of space, eater of worlds. That's what I think of. 759 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:40,680 Speaker 1: Love it. Yeah, I don't know. It feels like they're 760 00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:46,120 Speaker 1: just some kind of I don't know. It's think about 761 00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:49,719 Speaker 1: it as a computer. It's something. It's where it's like 762 00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:52,960 Speaker 1: the recycling bin. That's what the supermassive black holes are. 763 00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:57,279 Speaker 1: That's where the trash goes and it gets turned into 764 00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:02,080 Speaker 1: other materials to be repurposed in the next stimulated. And 765 00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,359 Speaker 1: it's the same as the gun argument. You know, it's 766 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:07,839 Speaker 1: like the fire argument. It's not it doesn't it's not 767 00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:10,680 Speaker 1: like it isn't. It doesn't differentiate, you know, it's just 768 00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 1: it just is. And it is a greater energy and 769 00:49:15,000 --> 00:49:18,640 Speaker 1: a greater power than anything. And it's in its wake 770 00:49:18,880 --> 00:49:21,160 Speaker 1: and its path and it's just gonna do what it 771 00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:24,279 Speaker 1: do and just pass right through it. You know. There 772 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:28,440 Speaker 1: are no vegan black holes, right, there are no allergens 773 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:32,239 Speaker 1: or dietary restrictions. It's just it's just particles. Man, It's 774 00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:35,440 Speaker 1: just energy, and like universes and all you can eat 775 00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:39,799 Speaker 1: buffet cop it is. Indeed, let's let's put a pin 776 00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:45,640 Speaker 1: in this one for now. I mean, sweet dreams, everybody, 777 00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:48,160 Speaker 1: sweet dreams out there out there in the ink. I 778 00:49:48,239 --> 00:49:52,399 Speaker 1: can't wait, so we go to space. You know. It's uh, 779 00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,160 Speaker 1: you know that It reminds me of those questions where 780 00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:59,040 Speaker 1: people would say, what do you have rather fight one 781 00:49:59,200 --> 00:50:03,720 Speaker 1: horse sized duck or a hundred you know, duck sized horses, 782 00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:11,759 Speaker 1: things like that, Right, Um, how what are people going 783 00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:13,959 Speaker 1: to do to try to deal with a black hole 784 00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:18,719 Speaker 1: when one of these things finally becomes not just some distant, 785 00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:22,680 Speaker 1: mysterious observable phenomenon. Yeah, what are we gonna do? Cern? 786 00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:28,080 Speaker 1: What are we gonna do? No, I'm just choking. We would, 787 00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:31,960 Speaker 1: we would solve it, but we're busy podcasting. We'll get 788 00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:35,520 Speaker 1: to it after we do uh the next episode. Yeah, yeah, no, no, 789 00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:39,000 Speaker 1: good good note, good note. Uh. I guess we'll call 790 00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,640 Speaker 1: it there. So we've gone from uh, let's see, we've 791 00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:46,160 Speaker 1: gone all the way from your computer and your taxes 792 00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:50,799 Speaker 1: to the edges of ancient space. And thank you for 793 00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:54,080 Speaker 1: taking this ride with us. We can't wait to get 794 00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:56,200 Speaker 1: back to it. We've been having a little bit of 795 00:50:56,200 --> 00:51:00,760 Speaker 1: a space theme in in recent uh in recent conversations, 796 00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:04,360 Speaker 1: and maybe that will continue in the future. In the meantime, 797 00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:07,000 Speaker 1: we can't wait to hear what everybody else thinks about this. 798 00:51:07,160 --> 00:51:11,400 Speaker 1: Astronomers in the audience, please be kind. Yeah, we're sorry. 799 00:51:13,920 --> 00:51:16,319 Speaker 1: You can wait. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. 800 00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:20,680 Speaker 1: Is rage is rage Cage a Tenacious D reference? Yes 801 00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:22,279 Speaker 1: it is. Yeah, I was gonna bring that up. Yeah, 802 00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:24,640 Speaker 1: of course it is. Okay, I don't know why that 803 00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,479 Speaker 1: just hit, but there we go. Okay, it's different. Um, 804 00:51:28,520 --> 00:51:30,840 Speaker 1: but yeah, if you want to do those things, you know, um, 805 00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:35,360 Speaker 1: for us or against us, astro astrologically, you can find 806 00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,880 Speaker 1: us on the internet. We are conspiracy stuff on Facebook, 807 00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:43,359 Speaker 1: YouTube and Twitter, Conspiracy Stuff show on Instagram. That's right. 808 00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:45,719 Speaker 1: We have a phone number that you can call one 809 00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:49,880 Speaker 1: eight three three std w y t K. It's a 810 00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,080 Speaker 1: voicemail system. Leave your name, which in this case is 811 00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:55,200 Speaker 1: not your real name. It's a moniker. We don't care 812 00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:57,680 Speaker 1: what it is. Just make it awesome. We can't wait 813 00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:00,200 Speaker 1: to hear what you what you call yourself. You got 814 00:52:00,239 --> 00:52:02,640 Speaker 1: three minutes to talk, and within that three minutes, let 815 00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:04,200 Speaker 1: us know if we can use your name end voice 816 00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,359 Speaker 1: on one of our listener mail episodes. If you don't 817 00:52:07,400 --> 00:52:09,520 Speaker 1: like talking on the phone to anybody, we get it. 818 00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:12,239 Speaker 1: That's totally fine. You can instead send us a good 819 00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:16,400 Speaker 1: old fashioned email. We are conspiracy at i heart radio 820 00:52:16,640 --> 00:52:39,640 Speaker 1: dot com. Stuff they don't want you to know. Is 821 00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:42,719 Speaker 1: a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts from 822 00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:45,800 Speaker 1: my heart Radio, visit the i heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, 823 00:52:45,880 --> 00:52:47,720 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.