Speaker 1: I met the straight cup recently and they were telling
Speaker 1: me how they met and they were both partnered at
Speaker 1: the time, and they were like, but we didn't cheat.
Speaker 1: We never hooked up, we never touched or did anything inappropriate.
Speaker 1: But we were texting every day and facetiming on our
Speaker 1: lunch breaks and going to movies together and like all
Speaker 1: these things. And for me, I was like, see, I
Speaker 1: could give a shit who he fucked, but if he
Speaker 1: was texting someone every day and facetiming them and going
Speaker 1: to movies, I would write, that's way more. That's way
Speaker 1: more of a violation to me.
Speaker 2: You know what, This is a safe space to talk
Speaker 2: about relationships, love and sex. Now, let me tell you
Speaker 2: something messy. This is my PSA. My PSA is every
Speaker 2: time you don't beg a hotie. I really do believe
Speaker 2: that it's a blessing from the ancestors, because oh am
Speaker 2: I gonna say this. I am going to say it.
Speaker 2: Sometimes they'd be pretty and also crazy. Okay, I just
Speaker 2: want to say, I don't know who it is. Sometimes
Speaker 2: y'all be going after that person who sound pretty, and
Speaker 2: a lot of times them pretty ones are all so crazy, okay,
Speaker 2: And I mean that respectfully, but it is true. Like
Speaker 2: I had a friend of mine who said I was
Speaker 2: being friendly with somebody and then my good friend said, huh,
Speaker 2: that one's a little shit and I was like, okay,
Speaker 2: say less and was that person also pretty absolute? Because
Speaker 2: there is a truth to this. Sometimes I think pretty people, wow,
Speaker 2: I don't know on this show, I really be ragging
Speaker 2: on the hotties, but they be thinking that they can
Speaker 2: get away with anything. Or it's because it is the
Speaker 2: same thing with the bad kissers. Right when I tell
Speaker 2: y'all how people can't kiss. If you've been ht your
Speaker 2: whole life, you don't have to kiss. It's the same
Speaker 2: thing if you been pretty your whole life, you be
Speaker 2: getting away with things. So people don't tell you, right,
Speaker 2: because people are in such shock with how beautiful you are,
Speaker 2: they don't be telling you. I did I tell you
Speaker 2: all about this? Well, there was I had a friend
Speaker 2: who was in this hot ass this hot like like
Speaker 2: fucking not a ten girl. It was like it was
Speaker 2: a ten thousand, Okay, this was not like you saw
Speaker 2: him and you were like, this is a walking sculpture,
Speaker 2: as if is it the David Michaelangelo he made the
Speaker 2: David if it was is if that David came to
Speaker 2: life that kind of pretty where you like me, like
Speaker 2: straight guys would be like, damn, that's it, that's it.
Speaker 2: That's an attractive man. Okay. So fine, and so we
Speaker 2: so we saw all the photos and then we finally
Speaker 2: met the dude, and the dude was dull. The dude
Speaker 2: was dull and had a and had a crazy look
Speaker 2: behind the eye. I'm telling you, I said to her,
Speaker 2: I said, get out. I said to my friend girl,
Speaker 2: get out, get out, get out, get out. I don't
Speaker 2: like the way his eyes are shifting. I know he's pretty,
Speaker 2: but he's a little little you know, a little just
Speaker 2: little's off. And I just I just want to tell
Speaker 2: you that when you were at the club or you
Speaker 2: at the bar, okay, and you see that pretty person
Speaker 2: and you're like trying to get up with them and
Speaker 2: they don't pay you any time of day, thank your ancestors,
Speaker 2: thank the lucky stars, because that person, nine times out
Speaker 2: of ten, that's a crazy that's a crazy math. But
Speaker 2: I don't have any evidence to back it up, but
Speaker 2: nine times out of ten crazy absolute that's insanity, okay.
Speaker 2: And I'm saying that respectfully and out of love and
Speaker 2: all the things. And if you are pretty worse in
Speaker 2: listening to this and you've been pretty all your life.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying somebody who's had transformation, because you you know,
Speaker 2: you understand what it is to be on the outside,
Speaker 2: to be a misfit, and you figured whatever and whatever.
Speaker 2: But if you have always been like, oh, that's a
Speaker 2: pretty baby, that's a pretty that's pretty, you know, pretty versave,
Speaker 2: that's pretty. You always were pretty, which is wild. If
Speaker 2: you you know, respect to you, please be in therapy, okay,
Speaker 2: if you have been pretty like that, if you if
Speaker 2: you were giving that, if you've always been like the
Speaker 2: face card has never ever declined, like that card puberty
Speaker 2: that never saw pimples twenties just jaw chisel thirties forties
Speaker 2: used to if that face card hain never ever declined.
Speaker 2: You know who you are, because this will also say
Speaker 2: pretty people know that they're pretty. They they they're not
Speaker 2: they know it, okay. The ones who don't know are
Speaker 2: the preeople who weren't always pretty, right that they like,
Speaker 2: you know, did their whatever and now they're like, oh
Speaker 2: now I address well and now whatever, and I got
Speaker 2: a little skin carefutine now, But the ones who've always
Speaker 2: really you know what fuck you are? Are you in therapy?
Speaker 2: Are you in therapy? Are you in therapy? If you
Speaker 2: not in therapy, this.
Speaker 3: Is yours sign. Okay, go to therapy because you know
Speaker 3: you're you are You're different. Oh okay, you're different.
Speaker 2: You're You're just different. You're different, You're different, you process
Speaker 2: things differently, and sometimes the way you process things is
Speaker 2: a little chaotic for the rest of us. And so
Speaker 2: do us a favor. Do us a favor and go
Speaker 2: to therapy. Okay, a group therapy, solo therapy, whatever, therapy.
Speaker 2: Find you a therapist. And if you can't find a
Speaker 2: therapist right now, find you It won't find you a podcast.
Speaker 2: It's not gonna be this podcast. This one is. I'm
Speaker 2: not gonna be able to help you with that. But
Speaker 2: but find you a nice little mental health podcast. Find
Speaker 2: you something that forces you to reflect, force you to
Speaker 2: think about how your actions affect others, how you impact
Speaker 2: others with your with your existence. You know what I'm saying. Okay, Okay, y'all,
Speaker 2: don't write me no messages. I'm not even gonna give
Speaker 2: you the email addressed to fright me. Don't worry me nothing.
Speaker 2: I know this is a controversial hot take, but I
Speaker 2: said what I said. By the way, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2: This is telling me something messy. I'm your host, Brandon
Speaker 2: called good man. Some people call me messy mom, but
Speaker 2: you can call me credit karma. Okay, cause your face
Speaker 2: card don't work here? Yes, what is your compassion score?
Speaker 2: Your curiosity score? What's your communication score? Your face card
Speaker 2: does not work here, bitch. Okay, let's get the jill started.
Speaker 2: You know what that means. It is time for I
Speaker 2: guess now, while they get situated, we will get our
Speaker 2: Messikiki started with a ho manifesto. Repeat after me aloud
Speaker 2: or in your head. Grant me the serenity to unpack
Speaker 2: my shame, the courage to heal, the wisdom to know
Speaker 2: that sex is not just about penetration, the audacity to
Speaker 2: advocate for my pleasure and boundaries. The strength to not
Speaker 2: call my ex that fuck boyfuck girl, or fuck bay,
Speaker 2: for it is better to masturbate by myself in peace
Speaker 2: than to let someone play in my motherfucking face. That
Speaker 2: the community say who lujah. Joe Kim Booster is a
Speaker 2: Chicago bred Los Angeles based stand up comedian, writer, and
Speaker 2: actor who's been named one of the queer young comics
Speaker 2: redefining American humor by The New York Times Get It Baby.
Speaker 2: He is best known for writing and starring in Searchlight
Speaker 2: Pictures Fire Island, Oh So Good, which, following its June
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two release, went on to land him two
Speaker 2: Emmy nomination along with a Best First Screenplay nom at
Speaker 2: the Independent Spirit Awards. His first hour long comedy special,
Speaker 2: Joel Kim Booster Psycho Sexual, exploring his experiences and observation
Speaker 2: as a gay Asian American male, with commentary on identity, sexuality,
Speaker 2: cultural expectations, and more, debut on Netflix in twenty twenty two.
Speaker 2: He co produced and wrote for Big Mouth and The
Speaker 2: Other Two, and as an actor has appeared on Loot, Shrill,
Speaker 2: Search Party, and Sunnyside. Y'all please help me. Welcome Joel
Speaker 2: Kim Booster.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, Hello Joel, Hello Brandon Kyle, good name.
Speaker 2: I'm so excited my full name saying my full fucking yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm so good.
Speaker 1: You know, with a name like Joelkim Booster, I feel
Speaker 1: everyone should be afforded the same. If you got a
Speaker 1: powerful three names.
Speaker 2: You gotta say the full three name.
Speaker 1: You gotta say that, you gotta say all three?
Speaker 2: Did you always? When did you decide that you were
Speaker 2: gonna go by the three names?
Speaker 1: You know? It's funny. In college, in theater school, they
Speaker 1: told me to drop the booster and just be jo
Speaker 1: and just be Joel cam And I remember printing like
Speaker 1: my first like headshot with my name on it, and
Speaker 1: it looked it just looked so weird without booster. It
Speaker 1: just like didn't fit, like it didn't have the same
Speaker 1: like visual sort of impact. And so I just was like, fuck,
Speaker 1: I'll keep it for now and maybe change it later.
Speaker 1: And I'm so glad I did, because I can't imagine
Speaker 1: not being Joel Kim Booster. I had this boy on
Speaker 1: the dance floor over like two weeks ago, asked me
Speaker 1: straight up. He was like, do I call you Joel
Speaker 1: or Joel Kim Booster? And I was like, I was like,
Speaker 1: which one seems more normal to you? Go away? Yeah? No,
Speaker 1: I was like, in what world would I want you
Speaker 1: to refer to me as my full name socially.
Speaker 2: Just on the dance for Koster?
Speaker 1: I did? I did? I was like, you know, we
Speaker 1: were flirty later on and I was like, I did
Speaker 1: do the I was like, it's droll in the day time,
Speaker 1: but when I'm dropping a load in you, So.
Speaker 2: That on a shirt, when I'm dropping a load in you,
Speaker 2: let's that's a perfect shirt I use. I don't know
Speaker 2: my full name. I decided in college. Somebody said it'd
Speaker 2: just be Brandon Goodman and I don't know the same thing.
Speaker 2: It just like didn't feel right. And I was like,
Speaker 2: if Sarahanisco Parker, if that white ladies could names, so
Speaker 2: let's go.
Speaker 1: She was a peer.
Speaker 2: I was like, y'all learn her name. Y'all will learn
Speaker 2: my full name. Okay, wait, before we get started, let
Speaker 2: me give you our messy mandates, so things get to
Speaker 2: be unprocessed. Any thoughts or opinion shared have the right
Speaker 2: to shift change today, tomorrow, or ten years from now.
Speaker 2: And if during the key key something feels too personal
Speaker 2: or unintentionally offends, we use the safe word foosball, which
Speaker 2: gives us a chance to stop, pause, pivot, and address accordingly.
Speaker 2: Sounding Hey yeah, I love that. Okay, cool, So we're
Speaker 2: gonna sarty with a lube breaker. Today's game is fuck
Speaker 2: Mary Block. How you feel about it?
Speaker 1: I feel great about it. I'm ready to block.
Speaker 2: You're ready block some things, all right? So the first
Speaker 2: one is mary, block feet, nipples, pits.
Speaker 1: Wow, this is easy, block feet. Get those two through
Speaker 1: my mouth.
Speaker 2: Okay, absolutely not. No, a pit for sure.
Speaker 1: Now it's always icy. Have you ever actually.
Speaker 2: The pit?
Speaker 1: No? Not, that's that's maybe one area I haven't. But
Speaker 1: I you know, I do enjoy a good lick, you know,
Speaker 1: a good Yeah. I love the idea of the pheromones
Speaker 1: of it all, et cetera, et cetera. And it's not
Speaker 1: it's not it's it's like I'm sort of take it
Speaker 1: or leave it though, you know. And I am a
Speaker 1: deal wearer down, you know. So a lot of guys
Speaker 1: are with me when I wear deyodor in it because
Speaker 1: I want to and I and I will say to you,
Speaker 1: having licked an armpit that has deodoran on it is unpleasant.
Speaker 1: But I but the trade off for me is too great.
Speaker 2: What if I like to, I like to do it
Speaker 2: where like hour to do it usually, But like if
Speaker 2: I'm going to go out that night, I'll shower before
Speaker 2: so I know it sneeze nice and clean, and then
Speaker 2: I won't put dooda on on so that people can
Speaker 2: lick it because then it won't be It's not too crazy.
Speaker 1: My partner loves my the my natural smell, and I've
Speaker 1: heard it from others too. I just like, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm a classic O g old spice boy and I
Speaker 1: love I like that. I like the scent. I do.
Speaker 1: I do enjoy it. I enjoy it smelling that way.
Speaker 1: And then so of course marrying nipples. My nipples are
Speaker 1: so wired it's crazy. Yes, it is, there are like
Speaker 1: and I feel bad for people who don't have the
Speaker 1: same issue. Me too.
Speaker 2: I think that nipples being sensy is so Yeah.
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it really like makes me like, uh, like,
Speaker 1: goon the fuck out when you play with my nipples.
Speaker 1: And I was actually exiting a party going into the
Speaker 1: outside as this stranger was entering the party as I
Speaker 1: was exiting it, and I had my shirt up and
Speaker 1: he grabbed my nipple and didn't obviously didn't know me,
Speaker 1: didn't know how sensitive they were. And it wasn't a
Speaker 1: sexy reaction. It was a you know because like only
Speaker 1: in a sexual context. Am I ready for it? You know?
Speaker 1: Like yeah, and like he wasn't unattractive, but I think
Speaker 1: he thought it was a response to him, but I
Speaker 1: was like, no, you just you picked the wrong n.
Speaker 2: You picked the wrong baby. The buttons one that's more
Speaker 2: sensitive than the other, I don't think. So Okay, my
Speaker 2: pierced one is more. That's tracking. That's just science. I
Speaker 2: would So I'm I'm gonna. I'm gonna fuck feet just
Speaker 2: so you know. I'm gonna. I'm gonna put my dick
Speaker 2: between those toes and put in my mouth on my
Speaker 2: face and I'm put them on my nipples. I'm going
Speaker 2: to don't make that.
Speaker 1: I'm shaming. I'm not shaming, but I am king shaming.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna fuck those feet. Baby, I'm gonna marry nipples
Speaker 2: because that's just that's home base. And I with those feet,
Speaker 2: like I said, on my nipples. The other day, my
Speaker 2: partner put his feet on my face and I thought
Speaker 2: I was gonna just fall. I love it so much.
Speaker 2: I love it so much. It's a New York King
Speaker 2: for me. It's been a couple of months since discovering it,
Speaker 2: and I am obsessed and I'm going to you're so disgusted,
Speaker 2: I'm going to, Uh. I love a pit, but I'm
Speaker 2: out of the out of the three. I'll block for today.
Speaker 2: But I do love a pit.
Speaker 1: It's so funny, like I will like do these like
Speaker 1: I will meet up with guys to do like intense
Speaker 1: dombsub like role play, and I always have to specify before.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I got very few limits, babe, but like
Speaker 1: no fists, no blood, no ship and no feet and
Speaker 1: blood ship and it really, it really is a deal
Speaker 1: breaker for some of these people. They like really want
Speaker 1: you to like feet and I just cannot do it.
Speaker 1: I have done it. I have made exceptions.
Speaker 2: I have made exceptions, okay, but what made the exception
Speaker 2: was it like the guy was just like you were
Speaker 2: just like this is.
Speaker 1: Sort of like you know, right time, right place, right guy,
Speaker 1: right feet, you know because like you know, yah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know lately. But I don't think my Wiki feet
Speaker 1: score is very high, which is a bummer. I have
Speaker 1: flat feet. You know, there's very little arch there.
Speaker 2: I have flat feet too, there's no arch there. I'm
Speaker 2: not going to make no money with these feet. But
Speaker 2: but they're you know there, they stay pedicured. I was
Speaker 2: gonna ask, what's gonna ask about feet? I forget, but
Speaker 2: that's what Mary block places have sex rooftop steam room
Speaker 2: alley way behind a gay bar.
Speaker 1: Huh.
Speaker 2: And the that's one specific Yeah.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna marry rooftop. I think, okay, there,
Speaker 1: like God, you're closer to Jesus when you're doing it
Speaker 1: up there, and there is a personal private sort of
Speaker 1: like I was actually on the rooftop recently. I was
Speaker 1: just remembering that. But like there is but there is
Speaker 1: like the chance of being caught, but the but it's
Speaker 1: very it's very like it's still very little, you know,
Speaker 1: like you're there, but like also you're pretty secluded, you know,
Speaker 1: like there's there's a pretty good chance that you you
Speaker 1: can get away with it. And then I will fuck
Speaker 1: a steam room, you know. And I famously have closed
Speaker 1: out my special tail from a steam room and I
Speaker 1: enjoy them. I enjoy the sort of it's it's sort
Speaker 1: of a throwback like that kind of cruising, you know, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's and and there is an element of we are
Speaker 1: honoring our forefathers by doing it. Still, I have been
Speaker 1: literally hosed down in a steam room before they came
Speaker 1: in with and started to quote unquote clean. But it
Speaker 1: was just literally they were like hosing the gaze because
Speaker 1: we were getting too frisky in the steam room, you know,
Speaker 1: well within their right. Well we were breaking the rules.
Speaker 1: You know, got our ips. We who crunches steamer room,
Speaker 1: which they put up the most condescensie Like you guys
Speaker 1: could you were You couldn't handle it, You don't, you
Speaker 1: were not, But you went to the responsibility of a
Speaker 1: steam room, you fucking gaze And yeah, and so I'm
Speaker 1: gonna block the sex and the alley. I've never done that,
Speaker 1: and I think like for me, like I probably would
Speaker 1: have in my twenties, back when I had roommates it
Speaker 1: was hard to host and we were all sort of
Speaker 1: on that level. But now that just screams like, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I in this climate, it's the last thing
Speaker 1: I need to be doing out in the public.
Speaker 2: You know, like yeah, yeah, no, same, same, same I
Speaker 2: mean I did it in my thirties, but I did
Speaker 2: like twice, but same same thing. Not never, no, no more.
Speaker 2: It's not what I would choose. It was not my preference,
Speaker 2: it was not, but it happened, you know, it happens.
Speaker 2: I would, uh, I would, I would, you know, I
Speaker 2: would marry the rooftop because that's classy to me, that's
Speaker 2: just classy. So I'm gonna marry the rooftop. I'm a
Speaker 2: fucking the steam room because that's what the steam room
Speaker 2: is for. I don't care what I'll say, that is
Speaker 2: what it's there for. And I'll block the alleyway because honestly,
Speaker 2: like the arets and things like it was, it's not
Speaker 2: my preference. If it's the last resort, go ahead, but
Speaker 2: it's not my preference.
Speaker 1: You know, in New York, that's not even really an
Speaker 1: option because there's only like one alleyway in New York.
Speaker 2: That's really true, I guess unless they're in the burrows, right,
Speaker 2: if you're on like a mae.
Speaker 1: But the reason Chicago has the only reason Chicago has
Speaker 1: alleys is because of it burned the fuck down and
Speaker 1: no one had a place to go. So they were like,
Speaker 1: let's think about this, and New York let's blessedly avoided
Speaker 1: any sort of fire situation. But if they did, if
Speaker 1: it happened.
Speaker 2: She's thinking, or the city thinking, so, you know, fucking underwater.
Speaker 2: I guess, Joe, you won the game. Conditional baby. If
Speaker 2: y'all have any prompts, you can email me at tell
Speaker 2: Me Something Messy at gmail dot com speaking of which, Joel,
Speaker 2: can you tell me something messy?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't tell you something messy.
Speaker 2: I mean already started.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've already said several messy things I think on
Speaker 1: this podcast. Like that is fully on brand for me.
Speaker 1: This past weekend, like at an after party, took a
Speaker 1: guy into my my friend's office to eat his ass
Speaker 1: and do other things. And I didn't realize that we
Speaker 1: had chosen the exact moment when the party was basically
Speaker 1: ending and we were in the office, no one knew
Speaker 1: where we were and they were kicking everyone out my
Speaker 1: part or could not find me, and it was really
Speaker 1: embarrassing to like step out of his work from home
Speaker 1: space and he was like, I'm going to fucking bed you.
Speaker 1: We need to get out of my house.
Speaker 2: Whoa.
Speaker 1: And it was not you know, there's certainly messier things
Speaker 1: that we can get into later on in the podcast,
Speaker 1: but that's the most recent messy thing I've done that.
Speaker 2: I went to an afters and we found what we
Speaker 2: just thought was a random room to fucking turned out
Speaker 2: it was like the owner's bedroom that we were just
Speaker 2: like fucking in and then they walked in and then
Speaker 2: they kind of walked back out. But it was one
Speaker 2: of those like, oh shit, probably not the We just
Speaker 2: thought this was a random.
Speaker 1: Tricky with after parties, like because like I went to
Speaker 1: I was in London on tour and I went I
Speaker 1: had a night out where I went to three different
Speaker 1: after parties and it was a Goldilocks situation because the
Speaker 1: first one, like lots of hot guys, but no one
Speaker 1: even really had their clothes off, and it was very
Speaker 1: like yeah, we were yeah and like and I like
Speaker 1: took this guy into a bedroom and again ate his
Speaker 1: ass and then wanted to fuck him. And he was like, wait, wait, wait,
Speaker 1: I know the owners, I don't know if they want
Speaker 1: this to be that kind of party. And I was like, well,
Speaker 1: then what are we doing what We're walking around like
Speaker 1: like without my clothes. So it was so strange. And
Speaker 1: then we went to a second afters which was a
Speaker 1: mistake and we were we were asked to leave about
Speaker 1: forty minutes in because the host wanted it to just
Speaker 1: be his close inner circle of friends at the party
Speaker 1: at that point. And then we went to a third
Speaker 1: after party, and this party, this was we should have
Speaker 1: gone there first.
Speaker 2: I knew what we were doing.
Speaker 1: I don't know what we were doing just the sea
Speaker 1: of hot guys, and I talked to one of them
Speaker 1: for the first hour that we were there, just like
Speaker 1: both in our jock straps, just like talking, touching as
Speaker 1: you doing the little lights shoulder touches. South African basketball player.
Speaker 1: Oh wait, at the end of it, he just said
Speaker 1: and I and like, literally there's fucking happening like three
Speaker 1: feet away from us as we're having And I was like,
Speaker 1: that's gonna be me in a second. And then he said,
Speaker 1: you were so fun and interesting to talk to, kissed
Speaker 1: me on the cheek, and then walked away. No, and
Speaker 1: I and listen, no one owes you sex, just because
Speaker 1: I understand that. But that's pregame behavior. You thought. The
Speaker 1: vibe is nine am, and I am naked at this
Speaker 1: at this man's apartment.
Speaker 2: At nine am and naked I could have been.
Speaker 1: And I spent for an hour telling you about my
Speaker 1: childhood when I could have been talking around the.
Speaker 2: Different rooms you could have been then.
Speaker 1: So it was and it was even more frustrating that
Speaker 1: I did continue to talk to him for like periodically
Speaker 1: for the rest of the time that we were I
Speaker 1: was there until like.
Speaker 2: Two Wait, I'm sorry you were in the afters until
Speaker 2: two pm the next pm. Oh yes, right, because this
Speaker 2: is they did that in Madrid, Madrid Pride. My friends
Speaker 2: were at these afters that started at nine and went
Speaker 2: until like two three and then we were back at
Speaker 2: dinner a couple.
Speaker 1: I mean again, in Europe, especially London, they go hard
Speaker 1: and I have fully had a weekend there where I
Speaker 1: left on Friday night and didn't get back to my
Speaker 1: hotel until Sunday morning.
Speaker 2: Like I'm stressed.
Speaker 1: It's it's a little your teeth.
Speaker 2: Where are you taking a ship? Like where are you?
Speaker 2: What's you feel?
Speaker 1: Kindness of strangers? Baby? You hear community, community, community. But
Speaker 1: the older I get, the harder it becomes uh to
Speaker 1: do to push through and like because like when the
Speaker 1: light like I have been in an I went to
Speaker 1: an afters once blackout curtains are so important if you're
Speaker 1: planning and after going into the daylight out, we talking
Speaker 1: about it because I went to Brookland and the sun
Speaker 1: was starting to come up, and he knew that would
Speaker 1: shift the vibe in a way that you know, we
Speaker 1: would not realize. We were cracked demons and we didn't
Speaker 1: want that. We didn't want to see ourselves in that light. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so he in a just a fit and flurry
Speaker 1: was duct taping sheets onto his windows.
Speaker 2: Love love the sound of the duct tape du.
Speaker 1: To keep the party alive.
Speaker 2: Hero, Yeah, I guess that sounded really fucking me up.
Speaker 2: Though the duct tate like that would really on the sheets.
Speaker 2: They wouldn't fall that anyways. Good on him building a fort,
Speaker 2: building a fort for the guys. I love it. I
Speaker 2: love that so much. Okay, should we do some messy mail. Yeah,
Speaker 2: let's do it. As always, your submissions remain anonymous. This
Speaker 2: one says, my friends with benefits has been tearing my
Speaker 2: ass up. Drool emoji? Any tips for taking it longer?
Speaker 2: Sometimes I tap out sad emoji as somebody who'd be
Speaker 2: fucking how can people?
Speaker 1: I don't to know if he's meaning, like, is he
Speaker 1: literally being torn apart?
Speaker 2: It was a drool emoji. I think it's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I got it. You don't do the emoji with a
Speaker 2: fisher No, no, no, no, no, no that's not because that's
Speaker 2: not fun. Yeah.
Speaker 1: No, I have the same problem. Honestly, I am not
Speaker 1: a long session kind of bottom. Like when I got him,
Speaker 1: I like, like, I'm not a long session guy as
Speaker 1: a bottom or top. I don't have the cardio as
Speaker 1: a top, and I don't have the stamina as a
Speaker 1: bottom apparently, so I don't know that I have like
Speaker 1: a great recommendation for him. I guess I would say,
Speaker 1: like it doesn't like I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: have the mentality around sex that once the penetration occurs,
Speaker 1: it's penetration, yes, till the end, it's not, you know,
Speaker 1: And I think, like what you can do is you
Speaker 1: you can pull out and like flow around and mess
Speaker 1: around in different ways, give your stuff a little bit
Speaker 1: of a breather, and then that's what I agreed, like
Speaker 1: return to the foreplay for a moment, and then you know,
Speaker 1: because I'm sure he needs a break too, unless he's
Speaker 1: a long distance runner, you know.
Speaker 2: I mean I think every top would like a break
Speaker 2: because you know, when you be fucking fuck it, it
Speaker 2: is cardio, it is you're trying to last and say
Speaker 2: I'm gonna.
Speaker 1: No, I mean, listen, the work for the bottom is all, yeah,
Speaker 1: before the sex, and then the work for the top
Speaker 1: all happens during sex.
Speaker 2: During the sex. I mean, yes, and that bottom, depending
Speaker 2: on depending on that dick and the size, is doing
Speaker 2: something right.
Speaker 1: No, I don't want to discount. Don't want to discount, but.
Speaker 2: You know we were working. But yes, it is, Yes,
Speaker 2: it's the preparation, which is why I guess you want
Speaker 2: You might just want to take it longer. Like for me,
Speaker 2: I always say it takes me at like forty five
Speaker 2: minutes for an hour to douce, and so like I'm
Speaker 2: trying to Yeah, I know it takes me a minute.
Speaker 2: Why it is, I don't know. I'm not the only one.
Speaker 2: I thought it was weird. I know about it.
Speaker 1: This is true, but I think I think what you're
Speaker 1: what's happening is you're actually going too deep and triggering
Speaker 1: a second bowel movement?
Speaker 2: Do you think because I I let's get into it.
Speaker 2: I thought that was the case, and like I've tried
Speaker 2: to do the less water but like it does it?
Speaker 1: Yeah, you half bull and my always three half bulbs clear,
Speaker 1: I'm good to go. And then I do a little
Speaker 1: dipstick test with a dilda.
Speaker 2: Now I think I will add this to the my hour,
Speaker 2: which is that I am stoned and scrolling on my
Speaker 2: phone and so I am. I am sitting on the
Speaker 2: toilet and I'm not like going back and forth, but
Speaker 2: I do have a friend who will literally take a
Speaker 2: water bottle and go into the bathroom and be and
Speaker 2: come out and be like, wait, I mean, and I'm
Speaker 2: just like that. I I don't. I'm not blessed like that.
Speaker 2: I'm just not.
Speaker 1: I know, it's a devil's bargain douching because I learned
Speaker 1: recently that like, unfortunately, like I could. I remember in
Speaker 1: my early twenties when I was first starting to bottom,
Speaker 1: I was not prepping and was fine. I was just
Speaker 1: sitting on dicks all over Chicago and Brooklyn, and like
Speaker 1: it did not every was a problem. I was a
Speaker 1: know my body kind of girl. And then around twenty
Speaker 1: seven I started douching, and I found out that once
Speaker 1: you start doushing your body, actually you can't requires it
Speaker 1: more so, Oh wow, because you're stripping the inner lining
Speaker 1: of the mucus in your anus.
Speaker 2: Oh wow. So because I was in my twenties fucking
Speaker 2: sitting on dicks, I knew Friday night, eat the pizza
Speaker 2: earlier after and then I was I was just bouncing
Speaker 2: on dicks. It was fine, And then it.
Speaker 1: Was so joyous and I was really I was like
Speaker 1: I hooked up with a twenty seven year old in
Speaker 1: Chicago who was like, yeah, I just recently started douching,
Speaker 1: And I said, baby, don't don't wait as long as
Speaker 1: you can wait as long as you can wait as
Speaker 1: long as wait until you get a reputation for painting.
Speaker 4: And then you know, because wait until you get a reputation,
Speaker 4: it's too late.
Speaker 2: You had a most cities. That's so funny. Wait until
Speaker 2: you're known for.
Speaker 1: Stay away from those fucking shower attachments. Man, those really,
Speaker 1: Oh those will go deep, those will fuck.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean that's I feel like I've heard those
Speaker 2: are like really for fisting. Like if you if you're
Speaker 2: trying to like yeah, then you might shower attached. Yeah.
Speaker 2: For this anyway, for this person, I would say, uh,
Speaker 2: play with toys honestly and like like you know, so
Speaker 2: that you can build your your stamina. And also it
Speaker 2: depends on the position. Like sometimes if you're fucking me
Speaker 2: on my back, that's too intense, But if you fuck
Speaker 2: me on my stomach, you can go all night and
Speaker 2: I'm fine. So you can also play with like what
Speaker 2: position you're fucking you in. And then sometimes you just
Speaker 2: have to know that like a bigger you know, sometimes
Speaker 2: if it's like you know, you're dealing with a fourteen
Speaker 2: inch penis. That's gonna be a different your face. This
Speaker 2: is gonna be a different battle, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: So you may not be able to sustain that all night,
Speaker 2: and that's okay. I think it's like, you know, it's
Speaker 2: like you're training your whole the same way that, like
Speaker 2: as the top, you would train to you know, to
Speaker 2: last longer. It's the same way I think as a
Speaker 2: bottom that you can train to also take it longer,
Speaker 2: which is that like you don't have to be the
Speaker 2: gold medalist from the start. You can start to build
Speaker 2: and practice and whatnot and that.
Speaker 1: And I would talk to him about it. I would.
Speaker 1: I would communicate this. I make sure you're communicating this
Speaker 1: to him because maybe it's a note for him too,
Speaker 1: Like again, oh yes, just because he's got a big
Speaker 1: old dick does not mean he knows how to use
Speaker 1: it properly. Period Like periodication, communicate some of your this
Speaker 1: discomfort when it's in the moment, when it's happening before
Speaker 1: the sex. And uh yeah, I think people are it's
Speaker 1: so strange, like I will let someone into my asshole,
Speaker 1: but I feel too uncomfortable to tell them when I
Speaker 1: like need something different. You know, it's a dichotomy.
Speaker 2: You framing it like that. I've never thought about that.
Speaker 2: It's true because it's like why is communication always so hard?
Speaker 2: And you're like, well, you are letting somebody inside you.
Speaker 2: You should know you should be able to free to
Speaker 2: be like, hey, let's fix this up a little bit.
Speaker 2: It is your whole. You only get one, so make
Speaker 2: sure they treating them right. This one says, I feel
Speaker 2: like I'm settling waiting for a man to become financially secure.
Speaker 2: I'm so curious about what you think about people's uh,
Speaker 2: what they desire or the traits that they need in
Speaker 2: a partner, and if finances should be something that we're
Speaker 2: weighing as like a thing like like should we care
Speaker 2: about the person also being like financially I guess not irresponsible,
Speaker 2: but like do you need the person to be rich
Speaker 2: in order to date them? Or like should they have.
Speaker 1: You know, it is one of those things that I
Speaker 1: feel like and you know this, and I know this
Speaker 1: because we've both been in long term partnerships, your yours
Speaker 1: much longer than mine. The money don't matter when you're
Speaker 1: falling in love. That's easy that's easy, and that's like
Speaker 1: out of your control almost, but if it is, it
Speaker 1: can be a relationship killer if the stress becomes to
Speaker 1: to you know, insurmount, you know, because like, yeah, being
Speaker 1: maintaining falling in love is very quick and dirty and easy.
Speaker 1: Staying in love is very difficult and requires a lot
Speaker 1: of work and a lot and and if that is
Speaker 1: a huge sort of you know, pressure, pressure point for you,
Speaker 1: then it might not be a good idea. And if
Speaker 1: you don't think you can work through that, you know,
Speaker 1: adds another layer. You just have to know going in
Speaker 1: that it's gonna be even harder and that it will
Speaker 1: require more work from you. But physically, like and emotionally.
Speaker 2: That's tee.
Speaker 1: But and you have to weigh the way that option
Speaker 1: because like I am of the belief that if you
Speaker 1: find somebody that you are excited to see that makes
Speaker 1: you feel good, that there shouldn't like, don't don't waste
Speaker 1: the opportunity because of something like money. Yeah, but understand
Speaker 1: the implications and the and the pressure that you'll be
Speaker 1: under when you're in a relationship with this person long term.
Speaker 2: I agree with that. Yeah, it's something you know what
Speaker 2: I would also I would maybe look more at not
Speaker 2: how much money they have, but like, are they somebody
Speaker 2: that you can build with and are they going to
Speaker 2: be ambitious? Like if you're dealing with somebody who's like
Speaker 2: I never want to make money and I don't ever
Speaker 2: want to whatever, and you're somebody who does, then you
Speaker 2: might not be aligned long term in terms of building together.
Speaker 2: Because right in the long term partnerships, we're now building
Speaker 2: our life together. But if you are aligned as to
Speaker 2: how you both want to live and where you want
Speaker 2: to live and they don't have as much money as
Speaker 2: you or you don't have as much money as them,
Speaker 2: that to me is an easy not an easy but
Speaker 2: that's that's a that's something that you can grow into, right,
Speaker 2: Like it's like, yeah, I have goals and aspirations. I
Speaker 2: don't have to be there now. I'm at the beginning
Speaker 2: of that journey and here you are joining me, and
Speaker 2: quite honestly, in some ways I don't know. And we're
Speaker 2: in this industry. In some ways, it's like meeting somebody
Speaker 2: and the both of us are like in similar financials
Speaker 2: are near is a lot easier than like one of
Speaker 2: us being all the way there. And then you have
Speaker 2: to like catch up like that becomes a little trickier sometimes.
Speaker 2: So I don't know, Yeah, I don't know. It's not
Speaker 2: a deal breaker. I think I would look at the heart.
Speaker 1: Because like there was a huge disparity when I met
Speaker 1: my partner in what we made because he had just
Speaker 1: taken a job where he took a pay cut. And
Speaker 1: I don't know, like it just we didn't make it
Speaker 1: an issue, like it just made sense for me to
Speaker 1: pay for a lot of things. Yeah, Like I don't.
Speaker 1: I'm not like keeping a tally, you know, like that's
Speaker 1: other thing you have to figure out about yourself and
Speaker 1: about your partner. Is I like, if listen, there are
Speaker 1: some people who are fully supporting their partners and they're
Speaker 1: doing other things, domestic things to you know, pick up
Speaker 1: the slack and make that that worthwhile a worthwhile exchange.
Speaker 1: You just have to know yourself, are you going to
Speaker 1: resent this person?
Speaker 2: Sure?
Speaker 1: And are you keeping that tally in your head of
Speaker 1: like oh I paid for dinner again?
Speaker 2: Yes? Again that's it's and.
Speaker 1: That that is not my vibe, And so I would
Speaker 1: you know it just like I was, like, I make
Speaker 1: more money, it makes more sense for me to pay
Speaker 1: for this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, my partner went to school, and so I was
Speaker 2: supporting us for all of that time, and I was
Speaker 2: we're building this thing together. Like it doesn't like I
Speaker 2: don't care about that because we're we are building our
Speaker 2: life together. And so if I have to pay for this,
Speaker 2: it is what it is. And like I know that,
Speaker 2: like if the tables were turned, that he would do
Speaker 2: it for me. That's what I always kind of I
Speaker 2: think that's where I always go is like if the
Speaker 2: tables were turned, earned would you support me in this way?
Speaker 2: And it's like, oh yeah, we would, so like we
Speaker 2: are in this partnership as opposed to if you are
Speaker 2: with somebody that you know, if the tables will turn,
Speaker 2: they would leave you to dry then. And so I
Speaker 2: think again it's about like who is the person you're
Speaker 2: talking to, not how much money is in their bank account,
Speaker 2: but like who are they? What are their values? How
Speaker 2: do they feel about you? And if they are loving
Speaker 2: you and are down to love you, Money's not the
Speaker 2: only way that they can show their love. I'm far
Speaker 2: more concerned about somebody how they talk to me, treat me,
Speaker 2: how they show love to me, than how much money's
Speaker 2: in their account. Because you know, somebody have a lot
Speaker 2: of money in their account, and then that also I've
Speaker 2: seen the opposite right where somebody has a lot of
Speaker 2: money in their account and so they treat you like
Speaker 2: shit because they feel like they have the power. And
Speaker 2: it's like, I don't want to be in that relationship either.
Speaker 2: So it really is about the quality of the person.
Speaker 2: So you're not settling. Oh well, I guess I feel
Speaker 2: like I'm settling waiting for a man to become financially
Speaker 2: secure as don't wait, like, don't let that. Maybe take
Speaker 2: that off the table, maybe focus more on the heart
Speaker 2: of the man that you want to be with as
Speaker 2: opposed to their financial security. I mean, don't you know,
Speaker 2: like I wouldn't be with somebody who is financially irresponsible
Speaker 2: because that then puts you, you know, like all these people.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you're watching my lotus right now,
Speaker 2: but you know, like you know, don't be you know,
Speaker 2: the scamming and now I'm not telling me we own
Speaker 2: this expensive asterisk, you know, like I want't want that partner,
Speaker 2: but you know, somebody getting their shit together work. This
Speaker 2: one says I fucked around with a coworker and now
Speaker 2: waiting A couple of days to take a pregnancy test.
Speaker 2: I don't really have a question about that.
Speaker 1: There was just yeah, I know, that's intense. God speed
Speaker 1: to you.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: I hope you're in a blue state. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: or or maybe you want this, Maybe you want.
Speaker 2: It, maybe you want to keep it. Maybe it's a
Speaker 2: little office baby. Yeah, that's cute.
Speaker 1: Yeah, in the.
Speaker 2: We work, do you know if you want kids or
Speaker 2: you talked about.
Speaker 1: It, We are pretty certain that we want to have kids.
Speaker 1: Today it's up in it's up in the air, only
Speaker 1: in the sense of like, look around, sweetheart, what are
Speaker 1: we bringing someone into this world? And that's tough. That's
Speaker 1: really tough to sure to justify. So yeah, I don't know,
Speaker 1: but we want to We want a girl and a
Speaker 1: boy at the same time. We want twins, and you know,
Speaker 1: whether adopted or otherwise, you know, maybe they're not blood related,
Speaker 1: but we just want to get one of each and
Speaker 1: get it out of the way. Yeah, you know, movie
Speaker 1: might as well just do two babies. It's just it's
Speaker 1: like everyone I've talked to you who has twins is
Speaker 1: like and had as previously just one child is like,
Speaker 1: it's not that much harder. It's like the same amount
Speaker 1: of work and yeah, you might, and you get two kids.
Speaker 2: I can't I listen. I can't tell you because I don't.
Speaker 2: I see one kid and like that's a lot of work,
Speaker 2: but two sounds like more. No, But he said it's
Speaker 2: the twin parents are saying.
Speaker 1: I I think they're What they're saying, is that like
Speaker 1: up the same amount of a night, you know, and
Speaker 1: do you want to spread that out over you know,
Speaker 1: eight years too kids, you know, as they grew up
Speaker 1: or just like get it on to two years of
Speaker 1: like constantly waking up two babies, you know, and then
Speaker 1: you're over that hump and they're in school and suddenly
Speaker 1: it's like.
Speaker 2: Yeah, then you're yeah, that makes sense, that makes sense.
Speaker 2: I would need no matter what I don't, I would need. Yes,
Speaker 2: I need a lot to help, no matter what, no
Speaker 2: matter what, the night nurse, the day nurse, the midday nurse,
Speaker 2: the afternoon, like I need, I need all the nurses.
Speaker 2: This one is asking, which this is an old school question,
Speaker 2: but like who knows? This is advice for coming out
Speaker 2: to family, which there are so many ways to talk
Speaker 2: about this, but I figured I thought this was a
Speaker 2: really I would imagine if you're asking this question. There's
Speaker 2: a lot of tension that you're feeling, and so I
Speaker 2: figured let's take the time to why not answer it.
Speaker 2: So advice for coming out to family it.
Speaker 1: Is, I go watch Love Simon with them.
Speaker 2: There you.
Speaker 1: Pull up Love Simon and and be like, there's no
Speaker 1: reason why this is my pick? Did you feel about that?
Speaker 2: What do you think about?
Speaker 1: How my thing is is? It's so hard without a
Speaker 1: lot of contexture to know how this person what to do,
Speaker 1: because like it's so easy to say, like just tell them,
Speaker 1: just be honest, be yourself. They're your parents, they'll love
Speaker 1: you no matter what. But we know that's not the case.
Speaker 1: And so like on one side, if I'm being really prescriptive,
Speaker 1: I would say, get ready, are you financially stable? Do
Speaker 1: you depend on your family to live? If so, like
Speaker 1: be really sure what how they're going to react to
Speaker 1: this before you tell them, And that's be ready, you
Speaker 1: know too, because like I had my parents found out
Speaker 1: I was gay, and I was out like figuring shit
Speaker 1: out at seventeen. You know, I haven't taken a dime
Speaker 1: of my parents mony since I was seventeen, and like
Speaker 1: it it was obviously like it worked out for me,
Speaker 1: but not ideal, you know, And so like figure out
Speaker 1: what the safety net is first before even addressing like
Speaker 1: the how and why and where, and then do it
Speaker 1: in a place and a way that seems safe, you know,
Speaker 1: like whether that's like in person or maybe just on
Speaker 1: the family group chat. You know, like if that's if
Speaker 1: that's the same, if that feels safer to you and
Speaker 1: less like scary to you, then that's okay. Like there's
Speaker 1: no like, it's not like proposing where like you know,
Speaker 1: you don't want to there's a ceremony to it or
Speaker 1: anything like that. Like it's just a part of life, babe,
Speaker 1: and like you can you can pull the trigger you
Speaker 1: know on an Instagram DM. Yeah you know, but yeah,
Speaker 1: just just know your contingency plan beforehand and do it
Speaker 1: safely and in a way that feels where you feel
Speaker 1: safe doing it.
Speaker 2: I love that as the priority. Your safety is a priority.
Speaker 2: And so like considering who your family is and you
Speaker 2: know them better than anyone else, especially if you're queer
Speaker 2: inside of a family that's not queer. You you know
Speaker 2: how they respond and react to things. So considering your
Speaker 2: safety and considering your options if you know that it
Speaker 2: might go left and so like who are your safety
Speaker 2: nets or what are your resources, and having that all
Speaker 2: kind of laid out, I think is a really important thing.
Speaker 2: And then I think also your advice of it doesn't
Speaker 2: have to be in person. I love that, right, Like, yeah,
Speaker 2: it's for you, and it sucks that we have to
Speaker 2: come out at all. So if for you it's easier
Speaker 2: to do it in a letter or a text or whatever,
Speaker 2: and then do that, like, you're not gonna get extra brownie.
Speaker 2: You're not gayer because you came out at the family Thanksgiving, right,
Speaker 2: So whatever feels safest for you because it is your
Speaker 2: you're stepping into your truth, and so whatever makes you
Speaker 2: feel safe, I think is such solid advice. I'm glad
Speaker 2: we answer that. That's such I didn't. I never considered
Speaker 2: if I could go back to money.
Speaker 1: We've both been professionally gay. Professionally it's get paid, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, And I don't know many people that
Speaker 1: are freshly out anymore because my community is so like
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, elders.
Speaker 2: Now, Okay, So this is my messy pick, which is
Speaker 2: not based off anyone's submissions, But I've just been seeing
Speaker 2: a lot of these conversations in the media with people
Speaker 2: talking to people who are with journalists or or podcast
Speaker 2: hosts or radio hosts talking to people who are polyamorous
Speaker 2: or not monogamous and relationships, and usually it's like they're
Speaker 2: the person asking question is monogamous and they're asking somebody
Speaker 2: else who is not, and it all the conversations always
Speaker 2: feel very so and flat. Oftentimes too, they're asking like
Speaker 2: a guy who's dating like four girls, and they never
Speaker 2: talk about like, you know, if the girls have freedom
Speaker 2: or what their relationship inside of the non monogamy is
Speaker 2: all which to say, I would like us to have
Speaker 2: like a full you and I have like a full
Speaker 2: a full combo full key key because we're both non monogamous.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think for us, like first of all, like
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I want to specify that, like because people
Speaker 1: always feel so attact when you talk about non monogamy.
Speaker 1: People feel I feel like, I know, like when you
Speaker 1: when you add when you talk about your positive experience
Speaker 1: with non monogamy, you're somehow degrading their experience with monogamy.
Speaker 1: And that's not the case. I don't think non monogamy
Speaker 1: is better than monogamy and any way, shape or form,
Speaker 1: I think it is all dependent on what works for
Speaker 1: you and you're a partner. But I will say this,
Speaker 1: I met this straight up recently and they were telling
Speaker 1: me how they met and they were both partnered at
Speaker 1: the time, and they were like, but we didn't cheat.
Speaker 1: We never hooked up, We never touched or did anything inappropriate.
Speaker 1: But we were texting every day and facetiming on our
Speaker 1: lunch breaks and going to movies together and like all
Speaker 1: these things. And for me, I was like, see, I
Speaker 1: could give a shit who he fucks, but if he
Speaker 1: was texting someone every day and facetiming them.
Speaker 2: And going to movies, I would ride.
Speaker 1: That's way more. That's way more of a violation of
Speaker 1: trust than to me as someone who whose relationship to
Speaker 1: sex is much more casual than I know a lot
Speaker 1: of people's relationship to sex is. Yeah, and that's fine.
Speaker 1: But like, it's so funny that I know so many
Speaker 1: monogamous couples that just have this one line that they're like,
Speaker 1: if we don't cross this one line, you know, and
Speaker 1: they have three sixty pov on the totality of the
Speaker 1: health of their relationship, you know, And being open requires
Speaker 1: a lot of communication that I don't think is happening
Speaker 1: in a lot of monogamous relationships. Kudos to those of
Speaker 1: you who do are managed to about it. But like,
Speaker 1: we're constantly resetting levels, we're constantly checking in, We're constantly
Speaker 1: like you know, and being able to like tell your
Speaker 1: partner like, oh that guy, I think that guy's really hot,
Speaker 1: like and not have it be a thing or an
Speaker 1: issue is like is so powerful and I think, like,
Speaker 1: you know, you should be able to do that in
Speaker 1: a monogamous relationship too, Like the exist, Like I feel
Speaker 1: like the problem sometimes with monogamous relationships that I see
Speaker 1: is that they pretend like, Okay, you've made this commitment
Speaker 1: to someone else. That's great, And I think that's you're
Speaker 1: doing the work to maintain that connection. And you value
Speaker 1: sex in a different way than I do, and so
Speaker 1: you want to keep that just between you and your partner,
Speaker 1: and I think that's amazing. But to pretend like you
Speaker 1: will never be attracted to someone else, or pretend like
Speaker 1: you will never have, you know, sexual feelings toward anyone else.
Speaker 1: They want to keep those that idea alive so much
Speaker 1: that they never even talk about little crushes or like
Speaker 1: things like that that they're they're they're experiencing, And I
Speaker 1: think like that is when a cheating does happen a
Speaker 1: lot yes time, you know, And I think like like
Speaker 1: being able to openly communicate about like that kind of
Speaker 1: stuff is really like a centerpiece of like the health
Speaker 1: of our relationship.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that I'm gonna echo what you said
Speaker 2: because I know that we're walking into territory that you know,
Speaker 2: if somebody is monogamous, it can be triggering, which is
Speaker 2: that there's nothing wrong with monogamy. If it works for you,
Speaker 2: it works for you, and if not monogamy works for you, great,
Speaker 2: Like whatever, I think, everyone is allowed to do what
Speaker 2: works for them and their partner. It is your relationships.
Speaker 2: So whatever y'all agree to is what it is. But
Speaker 2: I do think that with like traditional monogamy, the monogamy
Speaker 2: that we've grown up with seeing on TV, movies and
Speaker 2: maybe even in our own household, there is a fantasy
Speaker 2: that's at play, which is the fantasy of what we're
Speaker 2: talking about, which is that you're not ever going to
Speaker 2: be attracted to anyone else, that you are the only
Speaker 2: person that I have eyes for. And it's like that
Speaker 2: isn't I may you only love you? That can be real,
Speaker 2: but I do think that you're you didn't just meet
Speaker 2: this person and stop being attractive to everybody else? Yeah right,
Speaker 2: Like that's not real. You didn't just meet this person
Speaker 2: and stop having sexual fantasies. If so, why you know
Speaker 2: you're watching porn? Like you know, like you clearly there
Speaker 2: are your sex drive is still there, or your desire
Speaker 2: for others is still there. Whether or not you act
Speaker 2: on it is irrelevant. It's relevant, but you don't have to,
Speaker 2: but doesn't mean it's not there just because you're not
Speaker 2: acting on it. And so there seems to be I
Speaker 2: think a missed opportunity in terms of deepening our relationship
Speaker 2: if we're monogamous and being able to share that. I'm
Speaker 2: not saying I got to tell you about all my
Speaker 2: desires and like this is what I want to do
Speaker 2: that other person, but us just being able to acknowledge
Speaker 2: I think that they're cute or I think that whatever,
Speaker 2: oh yeah she is cute, Like just like it's a
Speaker 2: missed opportunity to bond I think.
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, I mean I always say I'm my partner's
Speaker 1: best wing man. Yeah, uh, because I am really turned
Speaker 1: on when he is like getting hit on and like same,
Speaker 1: and like you know, like I am because I when
Speaker 1: he's feeling himself, because he's getting that boost, he is
Speaker 1: never sexier to me and than those moments, which I
Speaker 1: do recognize that that's not everybody, Like my husband does
Speaker 1: not like to see it. He can hear about it,
Speaker 1: but doesn't like necessarily see it. So I recognized.
Speaker 2: But I am turned on by by by it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, our general rule of thumb too, Like I don't mind,
Speaker 1: like I've seen him make out with other people. I've
Speaker 1: seen him get fucked by other people. It does it.
Speaker 1: It's all you know, gravy wavy. It's fine when I'm
Speaker 1: gone out of town or traveling, touring, whatever. And like
Speaker 1: he has a hookup, that's just a run of the
Speaker 1: mill good, average to good or great even hookup. I
Speaker 1: don't need to hear about it. Yeah, I don't need
Speaker 1: to know about every little thing. But if it's something
Speaker 1: funny happened.
Speaker 2: Or something or.
Speaker 1: They did something weird, I need to know.
Speaker 2: I want to know about it.
Speaker 1: If there's a story there, share it. If the story
Speaker 1: is we had sex, we both came and then he left.
Speaker 2: I don't care. I don't care. I don't care about that,
Speaker 2: but if there's something if there's meat and potatoes.
Speaker 1: There, yes, then I want to know in the same.
Speaker 2: Way, yeah, I want to know, yeah, Or if there's
Speaker 2: something you're trying to process, because that's also where I
Speaker 2: think I show up as a partner, like something you
Speaker 2: experience and you're like, I have a question about this
Speaker 2: or or I wanted to ask about whatever, Then I'm like,
Speaker 2: I'm down to like have that. But if it's just
Speaker 2: to tell me that you you got fucked and came
Speaker 2: like I don't I don't care. Yeah, yeah, yeah, how
Speaker 2: do y'all? How have you navigated the emotional part of
Speaker 2: being open? Right like that? Because being open I think
Speaker 2: successfully or being no monogamous successfully requires heightening your emotional
Speaker 2: intelligence because we have to be able to communicate with
Speaker 2: each other in a way that I'm anogmos's relationship. You
Speaker 2: should be able to, but you don't necessarily have to
Speaker 2: because there is unspoken like I'm your spouse and that's
Speaker 2: what this is and that and we just like leave
Speaker 2: it be. Whereas if you're if you are introducing more
Speaker 2: people or other people, there has to be for it
Speaker 2: to stay emotionally safe, there has to be more conversation.
Speaker 2: So how did you navigate building that emotional intelligence?
Speaker 1: I mean we're both talkers, you know, and that is
Speaker 1: a huge part of it. And I think like we
Speaker 1: we had rules, like a pretty like specific set of
Speaker 1: rules at the beginning of the relationship when we were open.
Speaker 1: But the thing about rules is that it's so being
Speaker 1: in an open relationship. It's so contact spased, you know,
Speaker 1: because there are nights when like I could be popping
Speaker 1: around the party second dick whatever, and he's like, thank god,
Speaker 1: so he's off my hands. I don't have to deal
Speaker 1: with him right now. Yeah, And then there are nights
Speaker 1: where like the same conditions, same people, same party, same weather,
Speaker 1: you know, everything is the same, and he just needs
Speaker 1: me to be his boyfriend and stand by and like that.
Speaker 1: And and rules don't always account for those changes in
Speaker 1: like mood and like where you're at that day, you know,
Speaker 1: like we sometimes we are just closed for that day
Speaker 1: because like one of us needs that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And like.
Speaker 1: It's all about communicating and checking in like constantly. It's
Speaker 1: it's it's like before the hookup, we talk, during the hookup,
Speaker 1: we talk, after the hookup, we talk, you know, smart everything,
Speaker 1: and like are constantly resetting, and like I think for us,
Speaker 1: like we realized that rules just like we we couldn't
Speaker 1: rely on them to keep us like copasetic. We had
Speaker 1: to just talk it out every single time. And that's
Speaker 1: what we do, and like it's been really powerful, I think,
Speaker 1: because like the vulnerability you have to be able to
Speaker 1: have to talk about like some of the more like
Speaker 1: embarrassing or problematic parts of like sex that comes up
Speaker 1: is like it's so like it's so fulfilling to be
Speaker 1: able to talk to my best friend and life partner
Speaker 1: about that, you know, and I I have like I
Speaker 1: don't know, like I've really changed my relationship to sex
Speaker 1: through our open relationship because of that communication and because
Speaker 1: of the way I'm able to process some of those
Speaker 1: solo experiences with him.
Speaker 2: What was it before and what is that? How did
Speaker 2: it transform?
Speaker 1: I think there was a real need for validation, and
Speaker 1: I would do things that I didn't necessarily even want
Speaker 1: to do sure because I needed that validation. And I
Speaker 1: think that that is it is moved into a more
Speaker 1: like especially because I like I just have the best
Speaker 1: one right now, so I don't require the validation from
Speaker 1: other people, you know, and so what's changed my relationships
Speaker 1: with sex in a huge way, because like there are times,
Speaker 1: like you know, when I'm on the road where I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is my chance, I'm in the pocket, let's go.
Speaker 1: And then there are times when it's like, oh wait, no,
Speaker 1: actually now, like because it used to be like when
Speaker 1: I traveled, when I was in a new city, if
Speaker 1: I didn't get fuck, I felt like I like messed
Speaker 1: up or like waste an opportunity. And now I'm like,
Speaker 1: sometimes it's cool to just chill in the hotel room,
Speaker 1: order take out and watch Bravo, Like, yes, talk on
Speaker 1: that week, babe, Like so it's so great and yeah,
Speaker 1: and so it really has like lessened the important like
Speaker 1: it has sort of severed my connection to like and
Speaker 1: let's be clear, Like I'm sure it's still there to
Speaker 1: some degree. You know, everybody wants to feel good about
Speaker 1: themselves and like, but I've just this sex is not
Speaker 1: the number one thing that makes me feel good about myself.
Speaker 1: Oh and now I'm a much happier person.
Speaker 2: For I think that that's so liberating. Because I think
Speaker 2: that and I'll say that I probably have the same
Speaker 2: experience where sex was a way to feel my worth.
Speaker 2: And then as we became open, which then you know,
Speaker 2: morphed into Polly. There was so much conversation happening between us,
Speaker 2: but it also I had to also have conversations with myself,
Speaker 2: because in order for me to show up in that
Speaker 2: conversation with him, I got to know what I'm feeling
Speaker 2: and what I'm thinking, even if I don't know right like,
Speaker 2: I have to start to question why am I doing
Speaker 2: certain things, or why do I want to be in
Speaker 2: certain places, or why do I want to be fucked
Speaker 2: certain ways, and then get really clear about if that's
Speaker 2: actually what I want. And then that really revealed all
Speaker 2: of the validation that I was seeking and how much,
Speaker 2: how most of my sex was for validation and not
Speaker 2: for pleasure and not for you know, for my own whatever.
Speaker 1: You should leave every encounter feeling good.
Speaker 2: Yes, oh my god. That should be a rule of thumb. Yes,
Speaker 2: not like so so like you should feel like, oh
Speaker 2: that was good. I'm not saying it has to be
Speaker 2: the joy.
Speaker 1: Joy, satisfaction, et cetera, like all of it.
Speaker 2: And being able to to I think the talking also
Speaker 2: is able. You're able to articulate more what you want,
Speaker 2: which is I think such a gift. So I'm team
Speaker 2: open relationships.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like it's funny when we got when I
Speaker 1: got when I proposed, a lot of people were like,
Speaker 1: what's the point, Like you are sleeping with other people,
Speaker 1: Like what does like marriage even mean at this point?
Speaker 1: And to me that it's like you're telling on yourself
Speaker 1: when you say yeah, because it's like, is that do
Speaker 1: you think that that sex is the thing that makes
Speaker 1: or take something from friendship to relationship?
Speaker 2: Come on, talk about it, because that's that's just not
Speaker 2: the case marriage. It's not just about sex. It's not
Speaker 2: even building I'm building a life with this person.
Speaker 1: Yes, he is my best friend, yeah, but like it's
Speaker 1: it's much deeper than that, of course, and like and
Speaker 1: our sex life has very little to do with that,
Speaker 1: and like honoring that connection and working on that connection,
Speaker 1: and you know is why we're getting married. Yea. We
Speaker 1: want to do that make you feel promised each other,
Speaker 1: to do that work in front of our friends, Like
Speaker 1: he is that thing of like when you tell your
Speaker 1: friend you're writing a book and it's like, well, fuck
Speaker 1: now I have to write the book because and look,
Speaker 1: that is the wedding for us. It's like we are
Speaker 1: promising each other to do the work to maintain this relationship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're doing it in front of all of the most
Speaker 1: important people in our lives, and you know, and we're
Speaker 1: doing it so that they can help keep us accountable
Speaker 1: to that.
Speaker 2: What does it make you feel like when people do
Speaker 2: say that to you, when it's like, what's the point
Speaker 2: of getting married? You're open or whatever? Like, what does
Speaker 2: that feel like when you for you?
Speaker 1: I give people a lot of grace because I think
Speaker 1: we are all so fucked in the heads about sex
Speaker 1: in this country. It's so like the way we're socialized,
Speaker 1: the way we're a lack education, the way you know,
Speaker 1: it's just like in many places just not spoken about,
Speaker 1: never you know, touched upon, and like certainly like in
Speaker 1: the media, like they care way more about sex than
Speaker 1: they do about violence, you know, and and so and
Speaker 1: and so. I give people a lot of grace because
Speaker 1: I do think that, like, if your relationshipship to sex
Speaker 1: is put on that kind of pedestal that you need
Speaker 1: it to be just between you and one other person,
Speaker 1: then like I get why looking at my relationship must
Speaker 1: feel like the t violights Now sure, you know, I
Speaker 1: just have a different relationship to it than you do.
Speaker 1: It's like and that's okay. And I think like it's
Speaker 1: like connecting like personal choices to morality is really like
Speaker 1: it's really uh, it can get dicey for like if
Speaker 1: you start doing that, because where does it end? You know,
Speaker 1: like because monogamy it does not look the same for
Speaker 1: every couple either. So let's be clear. I see behavior
Speaker 1: and I see other behavior in monogamous couples that to
Speaker 1: me would be cheating, and to other monogamous couples would
Speaker 1: be cheating.
Speaker 2: You know, you talk about your friend who was they
Speaker 2: were they didn't they didn't fuck, but they were going
Speaker 2: to movies and first time and like that for me
Speaker 2: would be not monogamous.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And so I just think, and it's always
Speaker 1: so funny. They love to point out the failures in
Speaker 1: open relationship, huh. They love to point out like, well,
Speaker 1: they're they're gonna end up leaving you for one of
Speaker 1: these other guys that they're fucking, And it's like, Babe,
Speaker 1: that would have happened either way. You can happen every day.
Speaker 2: Monymous. That's what's always crazy to me.
Speaker 1: It's called cheating. Yeah, it happens.
Speaker 2: And like people get divorced.
Speaker 1: Sometimes the cheating is meaningless and just because they wanted
Speaker 1: to have sex, and sometimes it's meaningful. Yeah, and it's
Speaker 1: because they have fallen in love with someone else, and
Speaker 1: that can happen regardless if they're acting on those urges
Speaker 1: or not. Yeah, and it does not make it like
Speaker 1: I don't know, we don't have the data on the
Speaker 1: success rate of.
Speaker 2: Well because well, I mean, we don't put money in
Speaker 2: studying sex, let alone these relationships. But I think that
Speaker 2: what is why I thank you for having this comma
Speaker 2: with me, because I think people make open relationships polymorate
Speaker 2: non monogamy all about sex and completely negate the humanity
Speaker 2: that's actually at play, the relationship that's actually at play,
Speaker 2: that it's not Sex is a component, but it's not
Speaker 2: the entirety, like that you're not choosing to be open
Speaker 2: just for because Yeah, I thought there is this.
Speaker 1: Weird assumption too that like we don't have sex with
Speaker 1: each other anymore, which is not the case. Like I
Speaker 1: love having sex with him, yeah, passion, and it's connected
Speaker 1: and it's wonderful and like I love Like the other night,
Speaker 1: I like we had people over watch drag Race and
Speaker 1: a bunch of people stuck around before, you know, pregaming
Speaker 1: and whatnot. And I like went downstairs and took a
Speaker 1: viagra and then like came upstairs and John Michael wasn't
Speaker 1: it in the room, And I was like, you guys
Speaker 1: have about thirty minutes and then I'm kicking you out
Speaker 1: because the pill's gonna kick and uh, yeah, I'll need
Speaker 1: you to call your ubers. I'm like, but it's it
Speaker 1: is a different kind of sex. Yeah, like having sex
Speaker 1: with the person that knows you better than anyone in
Speaker 1: the different. Yeah, it hits different. Yeah, and it's and
Speaker 1: it's great, but also sometimes I just want to be
Speaker 1: a fucking whore and like and like it's either you know,
Speaker 1: and like it's like he doesn't need to always be
Speaker 1: involved in that.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's just you getting to experience. It's
Speaker 2: your expanding yourself. You get to experience this and you
Speaker 2: get to experience this other thing. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was invited to an orgy and the guy who
Speaker 1: invited me, yeah, you know, at the beginning of the night,
Speaker 1: he was like, Savior, looad for me, Savior, looad for me, Like,
Speaker 1: don't don't bust anybody else. And I was like okay,
Speaker 1: and you know, by the I was like getting ready
Speaker 1: to go, and I was like, okay, now's the time,
Speaker 1: like are you ready? And he had already taken like
Speaker 1: one or two loads at this point, and I had
Speaker 1: been doing some substances that made it difficult. I mean,
Speaker 1: thank god I was able to get hard, let alone
Speaker 1: like the thought of coming. At a certain point, I
Speaker 1: was like, it's never going to happen. But I knew
Speaker 1: that he had two loads in him already, and I
Speaker 1: was like, and so I did, I for the first
Speaker 1: time in my life as a man, an orgasm because
Speaker 1: I was like, how's he going to know? Is he
Speaker 1: going to do forensics?
Speaker 2: Like he was one?
Speaker 1: Like I was like, oh, you know, and he was
Speaker 1: like I can feel it. I can feel it. And
Speaker 1: I was like, you certainly cannot. It was like theater
Speaker 1: on both sides.
Speaker 2: Wow, I love it.
Speaker 1: And that's and so that so now we get to
Speaker 1: end on something that is like keeping.
Speaker 2: Well, so he didn't get he didn't earn the Kim
Speaker 2: Booster full name load. Actually I love that story. Thank
Speaker 2: you so much. I'm missing story for the road perfect.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Joel, Thank you. One more bit of homekeeping
Speaker 2: don't forget to rate, review and subscribe to this podcast.
Speaker 1: Baby.
Speaker 2: We're trying to get two hundred and sixty reviews by
Speaker 2: the end of April. We're like one hundred and sixty
Speaker 2: right now, and so I know we can get there.
Speaker 2: I know we can get there. Okay, well, you know
Speaker 2: we're host here, but hose with hearts before we go,
Speaker 2: let me speak to yours. I think we say that
Speaker 2: at this point every week, would just say it, because
Speaker 2: it's in the whole manifesto, but this idea that sex
Speaker 2: is not about penetration, So that person who was asking
Speaker 2: about how to last longer, it's, you know, just not
Speaker 2: relying on the penetration. You know, can you go back,
Speaker 2: as Joel said, to foreplay, which you know, I think
Speaker 2: that anything that we classify as for play, I would
Speaker 2: just say is so you know, whether that's going back
Speaker 2: to your fingers, to your mouth, to massaging, to talking
Speaker 2: some sexy talk, some dirty talk, like you know you
Speaker 2: don't have to you don't have to take the dick
Speaker 2: without a break and feel like, oh my goodness, I've
Speaker 2: stopped the momentum or I've stopped the energy. And also
Speaker 2: a reminder it might just be about changing positions. You know,
Speaker 2: our bodies are different, and some people being on their
Speaker 2: back feels more comfortable being on there, something feels more
Speaker 2: comfortable being on their side, and so don't be afraid
Speaker 2: to check in. And I love this thing that Joel said.
Speaker 2: I would let someone into my asshole, but I'm too
Speaker 2: afraid to tell them I need something different, And.
Speaker 1: Is so true.
Speaker 2: We love people inside of us, our assholes, our revolvas,
Speaker 2: our mouths. I mean, we need something different we are
Speaker 2: afraid of. I don't know. It could be that we're
Speaker 2: afraid of losing being rejected, losing their attention, losing their love,
Speaker 2: losing their desire if we ask for something. So we
Speaker 2: try to be amicable, amiable. I think this is obviously
Speaker 2: very prep in women, in queer folks. That is how
Speaker 2: we've learned to what'sort I'm looking for, That's how we
Speaker 2: learned to feel our worth is by being agreeable, and
Speaker 2: also sometimes our safety we've learned to maintain by being agreeable,
Speaker 2: not sometimes all the time. And so just a reminder
Speaker 2: that that is an old way of operating in your system,
Speaker 2: and so we just update it, which is that like
Speaker 2: if I am giving a head or if I'm taken,
Speaker 2: dick or whatever, it is, like I have the full
Speaker 2: right and permission to ask for something different. This person
Speaker 2: is inside me, and there's a way that I need
Speaker 2: them to be inside me. They're not going to know
Speaker 2: if I don't tell them, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 2: So don't be afraid to ask. I love this about
Speaker 2: money in partnerships. And by the way, I recognize that
Speaker 2: Joel and I are two male bodies talking about money
Speaker 2: inside of a relationship. And when you bring in a
Speaker 2: cis heterosexual, dynamic man woman, there are you know, socialization
Speaker 2: hiccups if you will, that come into play. There's a
Speaker 2: lot of masculinity that comes into play, and who should
Speaker 2: be making the money and who shouldn't. And like I've
Speaker 2: been seeing all these things on like TikTok and Instagram,
Speaker 2: where like guys are like if she makes more money
Speaker 2: than me, then like she's out, Like I don't, I don't,
Speaker 2: I don't bugger her. And that is just such a
Speaker 2: level of insecurity that I do not have a lot
Speaker 2: of patients for, you know, And that's probably a deeper
Speaker 2: conversation about the the kind of patriarchal misogyny that's wrapped
Speaker 2: inside of the man needs to make the most money.
Speaker 2: I'll say, very like candidly. Matthew and I had a
Speaker 2: little bit of that in the very beginning, which I
Speaker 2: recognize a full socialization as a man, like he has
Speaker 2: been raised as a man to feel like he has
Speaker 2: to be the one to make the more money or
Speaker 2: to whatever. And there was a moment where I booked
Speaker 2: a job. This is again like ten years ago, so
Speaker 2: when we first got together, I booked a job that
Speaker 2: would have potentially paid me astronomically more than he was
Speaker 2: making as a teacher. And it kicked up some gook
Speaker 2: which was not which is so funny because it wasn't.
Speaker 2: It was unrecognizable to the partner that he is like,
Speaker 2: it's not his stuff like that, just he doesn't respond
Speaker 2: in that way. And so we were both like, what
Speaker 2: is this response? And it was like, oh, right, you've
Speaker 2: been socialized as a man to think that you your
Speaker 2: worth as a man is rooted to how much money
Speaker 2: you make, and that you have to make as much,
Speaker 2: if not more than your partner. And if your partner
Speaker 2: is making more than you, than that means you are
Speaker 2: less than That means that you're weak, which is not true, right,
Speaker 2: But that's how you're socialized, and so when you recognize it,
Speaker 2: when you see it, you have to address it, You
Speaker 2: have to talk about you have to pull it so
Speaker 2: that you can update the operating system, which is that
Speaker 2: who gives a fuck, we're in a partnership together. Who
Speaker 2: gives a fuck who makes more money? We're in this together,
Speaker 2: We're building this life together. And so you know, you know,
Speaker 2: what's yours is mind, what's mine is yours. Vibes, they're
Speaker 2: obviously guard to that if this is a second marriage
Speaker 2: or you know, all those things, but in essence and
Speaker 2: it's purest it's like we are building together. So I
Speaker 2: don't really care who makes more or less, because money
Speaker 2: is not the only defining factor of our relationship, or
Speaker 2: is the only or the only way to be taken
Speaker 2: care of or to take care of somebody. There are
Speaker 2: so many other elements to caring for each other in
Speaker 2: a relationship that goes outside of money. And if we're
Speaker 2: basing it all around money, the relationship is going to
Speaker 2: be empty as fuck. Okay, So I again, focus on
Speaker 2: the heart of the person, focus on the integrity of
Speaker 2: the person. Obviously you want to I think you want
Speaker 2: to be with somebody who knows how to talk about money,
Speaker 2: because listen, we can't deny the business of being in relationship,
Speaker 2: the business of existing in a capitalist country. Like you know,
Speaker 2: you got to know what's going on with your with
Speaker 2: your bills, with your money, and with your partner's money,
Speaker 2: and vice versa. So you want to be with somebody
Speaker 2: who wants who's able to talk about it, or who's
Speaker 2: willing to work on being able to talk about it.
Speaker 2: But you don't need to be with somebody who is
Speaker 2: fully financially secure in this moment to to have or
Speaker 2: build a relationship. You know, I'm less worried about your
Speaker 2: credit score. I am worried about it. I do want
Speaker 2: to know, But I'm more worried about your you know,
Speaker 2: your compassionate score, your curiosity score, your communication score like
Speaker 2: that that you know, that is what I'm interested in.
Speaker 2: That is that deserves just as much weight. Because credit
Speaker 2: score we can build, Okay, we can build that back up.
Speaker 2: We can get you on your little budget and forget
Speaker 2: it out. But if you're a dick, if you're a
Speaker 2: fucking asshole, we don't have time for it. We don't
Speaker 2: have time for it coming out safely. I'm glad we
Speaker 2: answered that question because I you know, as Joel said,
Speaker 2: we've been out professionally for so long that you take
Speaker 2: for granted that this is still a thing that many
Speaker 2: people have to do and having to consider your safety
Speaker 2: when you do it. And so I really think that
Speaker 2: it's so smart to consider what is your financial secure
Speaker 2: what are your resources? If you know this is not
Speaker 2: going to go well, or you feel like there's a
Speaker 2: potential that your that your relationship with your family could
Speaker 2: be compromised if you come out, then yeah, consider what
Speaker 2: what are your what is your what are your guardrails,
Speaker 2: what is your safety? What is your contingency plan? I
Speaker 2: think Joel said, know your contingency plan, and then also
Speaker 2: how you do it. You don't get more brownie points
Speaker 2: for coming out at Thanksgiving dinner. You don't get more
Speaker 2: brownie points for coming out you know, at you know,
Speaker 2: at the family function. If it's safer for you to
Speaker 2: do it over text, to write a letter, to send
Speaker 2: an email. This is about you in this moment. You
Speaker 2: are the vulnerable one here, and so what is going
Speaker 2: to take care of you? Is the is the choice
Speaker 2: that you should make? Ah, I also really love when
Speaker 2: Joel said, I don't require validation from other people anymore
Speaker 2: when it comes to sex, right, because we we don't
Speaker 2: talk about it enough. But you know, we talked about
Speaker 2: here some a little bit. But you know, a lot
Speaker 2: of our a lot of our sex is rooted in validation.
Speaker 2: In wanting to feel desirable and wanting to feel attractive,
Speaker 2: and wanting to feel loved. We pursue sex and it
Speaker 2: becomes this like bottomless pit or this bottomless well where
Speaker 2: you know there's just never enough and that sometimes we're
Speaker 2: not Sometimes a lot of people are chasing these physical
Speaker 2: interactions so that we can feel like we're worthy, so
Speaker 2: we can feel like we're a whole. And when you
Speaker 2: learn how to validate yourself and belong to and by
Speaker 2: the way, I'm not saying that's easy, but you know,
Speaker 2: when you do learn it, when you commit to that,
Speaker 2: then suddenly sex doesn't have to be about the chase.
Speaker 2: Sex doesn't have to be about you filling your cup anymore.
Speaker 2: You do it enjoy, you do it for pleasure, You
Speaker 2: do it when you feel like it. You know, I'm saying,
Speaker 2: you do it when you want to it. It doesn't
Speaker 2: it doesn't have stakes on it, it gets to be
Speaker 2: a little more fun. Because if your validation you're worth,
Speaker 2: your belonging, your acceptance comes from your sex, that I
Speaker 2: imagine the sex that you're pursuing has some high stakes
Speaker 2: to it, because feeling like you're worthy of existing are
Speaker 2: high stakes, right, And so now you're putting that on
Speaker 2: this physical interaction, you're putting that on the other person,
Speaker 2: you're putting on yourself, and those are just like, it's
Speaker 2: just a really high fucking bar. And I don't think
Speaker 2: that your sex should be attached to your worth. I
Speaker 2: would just you know, encourage you to do the work
Speaker 2: to detangle your worth from your sex so that sex
Speaker 2: can be in joy, so it can be in pleasure.
Speaker 2: You should leave, As Joel said, every encounter feeling good.
Speaker 2: It may not be the best sex ever, right, it
Speaker 2: may not blow your mind, but do you feel good
Speaker 2: about that interaction? That's the goal, right. The goal is
Speaker 2: that every you know, sexual encounter that you have, you
Speaker 2: feel good about it because you know why you were there.
Speaker 2: You were able to advocate for yourself. You're able to
Speaker 2: communicate if the dick was dicking too hard, you were
Speaker 2: able to say, oh my goodness, you a little slower,
Speaker 2: a little softer, whatever it is, you were able to
Speaker 2: ask for what you need, and so it was it
Speaker 2: was able to be a good time, a good interaction,
Speaker 2: and that's what we want. This question, what's the point
Speaker 2: of getting married if you're open? Is such a wild
Speaker 2: question that I have received, you know, Joel has received.
Speaker 2: As we were talking about. I think it's just so
Speaker 2: beautiful that Joel, you know, it reminded me because I
Speaker 2: was like that those questions make me want to fight.
Speaker 2: I want to, like ye swing, but you know, giving grace,
Speaker 2: as Joel was saying, you know, because he knows how
Speaker 2: we're raised and a lack of education around sex. It's
Speaker 2: why we're doing this podcast to bring raise awareness, to
Speaker 2: have these conversations but understanding. I think sometimes I take
Speaker 2: for granted because I'm constantly having these kinds of conversations,
Speaker 2: that that's not the norm, right, that a lot of
Speaker 2: people aren't necessarily talking about that, and certainly not every
Speaker 2: single day all the time. And so there is a
Speaker 2: naivete or an ignorance around parts of sex, including and
Speaker 2: especially non monogamy, polyamory, open relationships. I would like to
Speaker 2: remind you or just reimpress that it's not just about sex.
Speaker 2: That people are polly or they're open, or they're non
Speaker 2: monogamous for more reasons than just fucking. Also, your marriage
Speaker 2: is not just about about sex. I don't think that
Speaker 2: your marriage will be successful if you are building it
Speaker 2: around the temple of sex. Sex can be a component
Speaker 2: of your marriage. Of course, it might be a very
Speaker 2: important component. It might also not be And that's O
Speaker 2: Kate too. Shout out to the girlies who are married
Speaker 2: and like, sex is just not a concern for you.
Speaker 2: You're like, you're not pressed about it. It's not the
Speaker 2: thing you're craving, whether your sex drive is low or
Speaker 2: you are open, and you're just like, that's not That's
Speaker 2: not why I'm in this partnership. I'm in this partnership
Speaker 2: for a lot of other reasons. And like, shout out
Speaker 2: to you your your reasons are just as valid. But
Speaker 2: you know, again, I understand that how we're socialized and
Speaker 2: how we're raised, and the lack of information around sex
Speaker 2: in general, let alone, you know, relationships that aren't monogamous
Speaker 2: might make you, as Joel say, look at the relationships
Speaker 2: at like it's the twilight zone. It's not it's just
Speaker 2: something different, and so let's you know, say, open hearted
Speaker 2: and curious. It may not work for you, and that's
Speaker 2: totally fine. No one is saying that polyamory are not
Speaker 2: monogamy or OLP relationships are better than monogamy. Absolutely not.
Speaker 2: But you have the right to know what your options
Speaker 2: are so you can advocate for yourself and you can say, oh,
Speaker 2: this is what I'm looking for, or I think I
Speaker 2: do want to try some of this, or I want
Speaker 2: a bit of this, or like, you know, I'm actually
Speaker 2: okay with with the texting, but I don't want anything
Speaker 2: physical to happen, or actually I don't love the texting,
Speaker 2: but the physical doesn't bother me. Can you can you
Speaker 2: be brave enough, you know, to ask yourself the questions
Speaker 2: and to ask them, you know, periodically. You know, at
Speaker 2: the top of our relationship Matthew and I, he was like,
Speaker 2: I will never be open. I do not want to
Speaker 2: be open. That's not my vibe. And I was kind
Speaker 2: of like, all right, cool. Five years into the relationship
Speaker 2: he was like, you know what, I'm actually curious about this,
Speaker 2: and that's okay, you know what I'm saying. We get
Speaker 2: to evolve and shift and in five years you might
Speaker 2: be like, I'm not doing it anymore, and we'll have
Speaker 2: those conversations. But you know, don't deny yourself evolution. Oh,
Speaker 2: don't deny yourself growth and expansion just because you're afraid
Speaker 2: to ask the question. Ask the fucking questions. And then finally,
Speaker 2: I love that you know, open relationship doesn't mean that
Speaker 2: the original relationship is sexless. There's this, you know, misconception
Speaker 2: that if a couple is non monogamous, or if they're
Speaker 2: open or the polly, that they're no longer having sex.
Speaker 2: That is not true. It can actually very much make
Speaker 2: their sex that much hotter, that much more exciting, that
Speaker 2: much more intimate, that much more special. Something. I think
Speaker 2: there's a common misconception that if you're having sex with
Speaker 2: more than just your what let's call it your anchor partner,
Speaker 2: the partner that you might cohabitate with or is your
Speaker 2: original partner, that it detracts. And it's like that it
Speaker 2: doesn't actually detract. It can actually, you know, if those
Speaker 2: partners are in communication and talking, you can actually enhance,
Speaker 2: you know, it can actually make it that much sweeter,
Speaker 2: that much more important, that much more special. Also, I
Speaker 2: think redefining or expanding what your definition of sex is.
Speaker 2: A couple may not have penetration, and that's not sex
Speaker 2: for them, but sex for them might be you know
Speaker 2: what will demus for play might just be side energy.
Speaker 2: Sex for them might be massages and cuddles. And you know,
Speaker 2: sex doesn't just have to be about penetration. And a
Speaker 2: couple gets to define what sex is for themselves. You
Speaker 2: get to define what sex is for yourself. Don't ever
Speaker 2: forget that. Oh also, I have to tell you about
Speaker 2: my substack, which I know a lot of you know,
Speaker 2: but we've been revamping Brandon Coogodman dot substack dot com
Speaker 2: and every Monday, every Monday night, I will be going
Speaker 2: live Messy Mondays at night six pm Pacific, nine pm
Speaker 2: Eastern sixty nine. Okay, you get it, and I'll have
Speaker 2: guests and wiki ki, I'll read more submissions and it's
Speaker 2: such a vibe. This past Monday, Eric William's, host of
Speaker 2: That's a Gay As Podcast, who is also a friend
Speaker 2: to tell me something Messy, was on the show and
Speaker 2: we talked about First Gate kisses. We talked about one
Speaker 2: of y'all submitted something about fucking in a park on
Speaker 2: a slide, So we talked about that, we talked about
Speaker 2: mood lighting and turn ons. It was a really really
Speaker 2: awesome conversation, so you can check that out. Also, if
Speaker 2: you're a paid subscriber, which is five dollars a month,
Speaker 2: we need access to more goodies like monthly essays from
Speaker 2: my whole journal, or get access to the group chats
Speaker 2: and you can reach me directly through those chats. And
Speaker 2: then also my weekly Hey Everybody podcast, which is a
Speaker 2: mini pod where I recap the week, tell you what's
Speaker 2: going on, catch you up on some things that are
Speaker 2: happening personally and professionally, give you even more messy stories,
Speaker 2: and also tell you more about what's going on on
Speaker 2: our podcast. So we might dive into some deeper conversations there.
Speaker 2: So here's a little clip from the most recent Hey Everybody.
Speaker 2: Check it out. We were just messaging about us fucking
Speaker 2: and now you're talking about one and fuck my best ye. Interesting, interesting,
Speaker 2: interesting pivot here, But uh huh, I'm like, well, you know, uh,
Speaker 2: he's my best dye and he knows about us, and
Speaker 2: he knows about like, you know, the time we spent together,
Speaker 2: Like a's a leapd amount of time. No we weren't
Speaker 2: dating or whatever, but you and I were hanging out
Speaker 2: for a signific amount of time. So you know he's
Speaker 2: being respectful. Y'all are doubts. You can do whatever you want,
Speaker 2: but I think he's being respectful. He responds to me.
Speaker 2: The guy goes, it's not like like you own me
Speaker 2: or something. I was like, listen, uh, the story is
Speaker 2: juicy and wild and a lot of things, and I
Speaker 2: would love your take. I was like, is this messy?
Speaker 2: Is it too messy? I would love your take. So
Speaker 2: check out Brandon call Goodman dot substack dot com. I
Speaker 2: love you. You can find me on Instagram as well
Speaker 2: at Brandon Kyle Goodman. You can find our podcast at
Speaker 2: tell Me Something Messy, and you can join our community
Speaker 2: on the Messy Monday's Substack. When you subscribe, you'll get
Speaker 2: weekly posts, recommendations on sex and self and so much more. Also,
Speaker 2: I want to hear from you, so send your topic ideas,
Speaker 2: your messy stories, your submissions, your game ideas to tell
Speaker 2: Me Something Messy at gmail dot com. You can also
Speaker 2: call us at six six nine sixty nine Messy That
Speaker 2: is six six nine six ninety six three seven seven
Speaker 2: nine Rate review and Share this podcast with all your
Speaker 2: hoe and aspiring hoe friends really really helps the show out.
Speaker 1: All right.
Speaker 2: Until next time, ask about the politics of that dick
Speaker 2: before you make it spit, make sure they eat the
Speaker 2: kitty buffore day, beat the kitty before fuckation or succation. Communication.
Speaker 2: And in case you haven't heard it yet, today you
Speaker 2: are so deeply loved. I love you ye, thank you
Speaker 2: so much for listening to tell Me Something Messy. If
Speaker 2: you all enjoyed the show, send me episode to someone
Speaker 2: else who like it. Tell Me Something Messy was executive
Speaker 2: produced by Ali Perry, Gabrielle Collins, and Yours Truly. Our
Speaker 2: producer and editor is Vince Dejohnny. For more podcasts from
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Speaker 2: anywhere you subscribe to your favorite shows.