WEBVTT - Businessweek Extra- Melissa Korn

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<v Speaker 1>This is Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. Hello, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>Jason Kelly and I'm Carol Master. Welcome to the Bloomberg

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<v Speaker 1>Business Week Extra. It's our weekly podcast, bring you an

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<v Speaker 1>in depth interview you will not hear anywhere else. And

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<v Speaker 1>this one we were so looking forward to because it's

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<v Speaker 1>like a year year and a half ago that we

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<v Speaker 1>were all talking about the Varsity Blue scandal, because that's

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<v Speaker 1>when it broke in March of last year, and there's

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<v Speaker 1>a new book out about it, and we were thrilled

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<v Speaker 1>to have with us Melissa Corn she's a writer at

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<v Speaker 1>the Wall Street Journal. She co wrote this book, Carol,

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<v Speaker 1>with Jennifer Levitt's and it's called Unacceptable Privilege, Deceit and

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<v Speaker 1>the Making of the College Admission Scandal. Check it out.

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<v Speaker 1>This was just such a wild story took for the

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<v Speaker 1>Journal and show the book and my colleague and co

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<v Speaker 1>author Jennifer Levice and I we were really blown away

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<v Speaker 1>by so many things. Honestly, the scope, the breath, the

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<v Speaker 1>sophistication of this scheme that the mastermind Rick Singer put together,

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<v Speaker 1>but also what it says about our society and parents

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<v Speaker 1>obsession with prestige and brand name schools, and it was

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<v Speaker 1>often really the parents more so than their teens who

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<v Speaker 1>were striving for these particular institutions, and they were the

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<v Speaker 1>ones driving driving the whole process. So Melissa take us back,

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<v Speaker 1>because this was something as Carol just alluded to, that

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<v Speaker 1>landed and all of us across the journalistic world, the

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<v Speaker 1>parental world, especially Carol and I both have juniors in

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<v Speaker 1>high school, so we pay very close attention to all

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<v Speaker 1>of these things, as many do. Remind us what Operation

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<v Speaker 1>Varsity Blues Laid bare. Yes, So in March of twenty nineteen,

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<v Speaker 1>which does seem like forever ago harkens back to a

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<v Speaker 1>simpler time, UH showed that there was this college admissions counselor,

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<v Speaker 1>Rick Singer, who had managed to find and exploit a

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<v Speaker 1>few real weaknesses in the selective college admissions process, both

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<v Speaker 1>in terms of standardized tests where he had paid off

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<v Speaker 1>test site administrators and a proctor UH to fudge and cheat,

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<v Speaker 1>fudge scores and cheat and improve the results for a

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<v Speaker 1>number of clients. UH. He also found weaknesses in athletic

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<v Speaker 1>recruiting and these special slots that are given to recruited

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<v Speaker 1>athletes in the admissions process, and he arranged to bribe

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<v Speaker 1>a number of college coaches and uh others who flag

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<v Speaker 1>individuals as recruited athletes even when they didn't play a sport,

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<v Speaker 1>and there was nobody checked. That was one of the

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<v Speaker 1>big things that was really made clear here was that

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<v Speaker 1>nobody was checking them a half. Nobody was testing, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>auditing these applications in any way, because nobody ever thought

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<v Speaker 1>that a coach would choose somebody who wasn't going to

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<v Speaker 1>actually help the team, but if the price tag was

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<v Speaker 1>high enough, clearly they did. It's amazing, Melissa, because I

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<v Speaker 1>think you know, we've all understood I think safe to

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<v Speaker 1>say that there's understandings that there are legacies and families

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<v Speaker 1>that have been at schools and you know, you donations,

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<v Speaker 1>You know that things happened, But this was just on

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<v Speaker 1>a whole other level, right. So we have a whole

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<v Speaker 1>chapter in the book called the Gray Area, which gets

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<v Speaker 1>at the legacies, donations, those v I P lists of applicants,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think everybody knows that that goes on. This

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<v Speaker 1>is kind of at the far end of the spectrum

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<v Speaker 1>and obviously a little bit too far that in illegal territory,

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<v Speaker 1>but it really does highlight some of the existing inequities

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<v Speaker 1>in the system, and I think it is a good

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<v Speaker 1>reminder that even those people who aren't doing things like that,

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<v Speaker 1>or even people who aren't legacies or donating hundreds of

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<v Speaker 1>thousands or millions of dollars, many of them have an

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<v Speaker 1>edge too. If you're hiring a private essay t tutor

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<v Speaker 1>or essay coach, or sending your kid to a regional

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<v Speaker 1>club soccer team that costs ten thousand dollars a year,

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<v Speaker 1>those are not experiences that every student has. So, Melissa,

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<v Speaker 1>one of the amazing things about this book, because this

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<v Speaker 1>is of course the scandal that has been written about

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<v Speaker 1>and talked about, is you and your co author got

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<v Speaker 1>some amazing access. You've got to people that basically no

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<v Speaker 1>one else has gotten to tell us about that. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>we were really fortunate in being able to speak to

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of the principal players in this whole story,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think a part of it was we made

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<v Speaker 1>clear that they were going to be in the book

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<v Speaker 1>whether they wanted to or not, and they could help

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<v Speaker 1>make sure that it was accurate or try to hide

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<v Speaker 1>from it, and a lot decided it was better to engage. So,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, we we can't say who exactly we spoke with,

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<v Speaker 1>and we make really clear that don't assume that just

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<v Speaker 1>because there's a scene from one person's point of view,

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<v Speaker 1>that that was the person that we got the information from.

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<v Speaker 1>Of course, as we protect our sources, but we really

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<v Speaker 1>did try to get inside their heads and explain a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit about why they engaged a singer, why singer

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<v Speaker 1>was the way he was, why the prosecutors took the

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<v Speaker 1>approach they did, because I think there's nobody is it's

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<v Speaker 1>really hard for any individual to be painted, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>black and white, good guy, bad guy here because even

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<v Speaker 1>the parents who committed felonies ultimately worked in some twisted

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<v Speaker 1>way trying to help their kids. And me, that's relatable.

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<v Speaker 1>What I read a little excerpt, I think it was

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<v Speaker 1>in people um online, and you talk about one Devin

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<v Speaker 1>Sloan who asked his son to pose for photos in

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<v Speaker 1>the family pool wearing full water polo gear and didn't

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<v Speaker 1>really give him a reason why, and the sun did

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<v Speaker 1>it even though he didn't play the sport like. It's

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<v Speaker 1>just amazing kind of some of the steps that parents

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<v Speaker 1>went to and kept their kids in the dark. It

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<v Speaker 1>really was. And I think you know with that, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>excerpt in that that the anecdote with the son Matteo.

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<v Speaker 1>He was really thoughtful about the whole thing, and afterwards

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<v Speaker 1>and said, you know, I was really mad at my dad,

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<v Speaker 1>but then I kind of felt bad for him that

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<v Speaker 1>he thought that he needed to do this to make

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<v Speaker 1>me successful. Um. You know, this is a team who

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<v Speaker 1>would have been just fine on his own, and he

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<v Speaker 1>would have landed at a perfectly good school. Um without

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<v Speaker 1>that extra all of the extra bells and whistles and

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<v Speaker 1>costumes and poaching and things like that. And his dad

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<v Speaker 1>was sentenced to four months in prison, but he got

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<v Speaker 1>to stay at the school. Correct, Right, He's one of

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<v Speaker 1>the students who was not kicked out. Every university, every

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<v Speaker 1>college did it, did their reviews a little bit differently. Um,

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<v Speaker 1>Some expelled or rescinded the admission offers for students, others

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<v Speaker 1>allowed the student to continue. It really was case by

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<v Speaker 1>case at a lot of these places. Well, let's tell

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<v Speaker 1>us more about the parents in this case. And we're

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<v Speaker 1>speaking with most of Corn reporter at the Wall Street

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<v Speaker 1>Journal and co author of the new book Unacceptable Privileged

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<v Speaker 1>Deceit and the Making of the College Admissions Scandal, tell

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<v Speaker 1>us about the parents, because what you just said, I

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<v Speaker 1>think resonated throughout this story. Uh that in many cases

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<v Speaker 1>at least, this is I think how I read it.

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<v Speaker 1>For the parents, This was as much about them as

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<v Speaker 1>it was about their kids. Absolutely, And we talked a

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<v Speaker 1>lot about that culture that was really prevalent in some

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<v Speaker 1>of these pockets of southern California and the Bay Area

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<v Speaker 1>and New York and that your kids are a reflection

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<v Speaker 1>of you. So if your kids are succeeding by certain

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<v Speaker 1>kind of predetermined measures, you as a parent are therefore succeeding.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's beyond you know, are they walking and talking

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<v Speaker 1>when they're supposed to? Is are they getting into this

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<v Speaker 1>particular school because this particular school is one that you

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<v Speaker 1>can boast about at a cocktail party. Well, that school

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<v Speaker 1>that's perfectly good, but perhaps not as well known. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>nobody wants to hear hear about that over orders. So

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<v Speaker 1>these parents really did get very caught up in that

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<v Speaker 1>and in this sense that my kid needs to succeed

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<v Speaker 1>because of a way of showing that I am doing

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<v Speaker 1>a good job as a parent. So what's happened as

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<v Speaker 1>a result of this? And I wonder in terms of

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<v Speaker 1>admissions I mean, I feel like I have to say,

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<v Speaker 1>I do remember when it broke in our Jason and

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<v Speaker 1>Ireneo New York studio, and we're just like, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>and especially because there are a lot of names beyond

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<v Speaker 1>the celebrity names that we knew UM, whether in the

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<v Speaker 1>financial community. But I do wonder if, like all colleges

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<v Speaker 1>kind of went and it was like, okay, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>like let's do you know, a deep dive to find

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<v Speaker 1>out our process and make sure we're doing it the

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<v Speaker 1>right way. Like what's what's happened as a result of it,

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<v Speaker 1>what's maybe gotten better at colleges and universities when it

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<v Speaker 1>comes to the admissions process, if anything. Yea early on

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<v Speaker 1>last spring and summer, there were these hints that there

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<v Speaker 1>was going to be change and these moments of reflection

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<v Speaker 1>and introspection and okay, yeah, maybe we should audit our

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<v Speaker 1>application or if somebody gets in as a recruited athlete,

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<v Speaker 1>let's make sure they actually joined the team. And you know,

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<v Speaker 1>a number of schools came out and said they would

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<v Speaker 1>do that. California UM actually passed some legislation at the

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<v Speaker 1>state level that schools needed to be more transparent about

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<v Speaker 1>things like legacy admissions. But at the end of the day,

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<v Speaker 1>there wasn't dramatic change. It's not like schools are saying

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<v Speaker 1>no to donations that happened to come from families that are, um,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, a couple of years off from college, and

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<v Speaker 1>I don't see that stopping. I also think that with

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<v Speaker 1>the pandemic and a lot of schools really facing major

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<v Speaker 1>budget crunches, it's really hard for them to look away

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<v Speaker 1>from the dollar bills when when they're dangled right now, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I need the financial pressures mhm, exactly, some of those

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<v Speaker 1>reforms maybe kind of put on the back burner for

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<v Speaker 1>a little while. So most I want to go back briefly,

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<v Speaker 1>we can't to something that that Carol mentioned, which is

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<v Speaker 1>the celebrity aspect of this. And you know, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the elements I think that really pushed this into the

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<v Speaker 1>public consciousness was that this wasn't just about rich bankers,

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<v Speaker 1>a rich private with the executives who certainly were caught

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<v Speaker 1>up in this. And as Carol alluded to, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>folks well known to a Bluebird audience or a Wall

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<v Speaker 1>Street Journal audience, but you know, maybe less out in

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<v Speaker 1>the public world. But we're talking about actresses, and most

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<v Speaker 1>notably I think because she and her husband fought it

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<v Speaker 1>for so long. Laurie Laughlin tell us about that part

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<v Speaker 1>of the story because it's when you dig into in

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<v Speaker 1>the book. We do, because it's the story of Larry

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<v Speaker 1>Laughlin and her husband, Masam Giauli and their two daughters.

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<v Speaker 1>Our hopes illustrate just kind of how the athletic recruiting

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<v Speaker 1>scheme worked very well. Um the two girls at various

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<v Speaker 1>points posed on an ERG in their home gym, and

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<v Speaker 1>the photos were sent to Rick Singer's team, and they

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<v Speaker 1>ended up not being used in the final application. The

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<v Speaker 1>one of his um deputies used a different different pictures,

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<v Speaker 1>but it just showed how easy it was and how

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<v Speaker 1>kind of murky some of the discussions were about exactly

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<v Speaker 1>what was happening here. So we get into it in

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<v Speaker 1>the book of what their defense was. You know, what

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<v Speaker 1>they say Singer told them was actually going on. And no,

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<v Speaker 1>it's totally fine. You're giving financial support to the to

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<v Speaker 1>the crew team. It's fine that they don't play that

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<v Speaker 1>they're you know that they're not rollers or cox swins.

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<v Speaker 1>This happens all the time, totally closer versus Yes, I

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<v Speaker 1>am fully aware I am making a bribe so that

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<v Speaker 1>my kids can get into school pretending to be an

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<v Speaker 1>athlete and not being an athlete. Um, I mean yes.

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<v Speaker 1>So they pleaded guilty right around the time the book

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<v Speaker 1>was going to the printer, So we tweaked a couple

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<v Speaker 1>of things. Feel pass in there, kept us on our

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<v Speaker 1>toes for all the very last minute. Yeah, it's kind

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<v Speaker 1>of touch and go. It felt like, um, what was

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<v Speaker 1>the most surprising thing in this process and all the

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<v Speaker 1>reporting that you guys did and then eventually putting it

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<v Speaker 1>into this book. So I think, um, you guys alluded

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<v Speaker 1>to this a little bit before, but that there is

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<v Speaker 1>something a little bit relatable for somebody with some of

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<v Speaker 1>these families. Some of these parents right on My parents

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<v Speaker 1>two and my daughter's much younger. But you want what's

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<v Speaker 1>best for your kid, and obviously their approach is here,

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<v Speaker 1>we're quite misguided. But you can kind of see that,

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<v Speaker 1>you can feel that, you can you can relate to

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<v Speaker 1>that that they in some guests, a lot of this

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<v Speaker 1>is about their own ego, but they also did try

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<v Speaker 1>to help their kid, and you also would try to

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<v Speaker 1>help your kids. Might not go this far, but I think,

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<v Speaker 1>um that the fact that some of these parents I

0:12:26.360 --> 0:12:28.679
<v Speaker 1>could see myself and some of them, but that surprised

0:12:28.679 --> 0:12:32.040
<v Speaker 1>me personally. It is also very interesting dynamic to explore

0:12:32.040 --> 0:12:34.040
<v Speaker 1>in the book. Well don't you feel, specially because you're

0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:36.080
<v Speaker 1>based in New York right because you're here at the Journal,

0:12:36.520 --> 0:12:39.480
<v Speaker 1>you know, New York Metro, Like it's just a whole

0:12:39.480 --> 0:12:43.600
<v Speaker 1>other world and everybody is so aware of where people work,

0:12:43.600 --> 0:12:45.600
<v Speaker 1>where they live, where they vacation, where their kids go

0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:50.600
<v Speaker 1>to school, Like it's it's unfortunately, that's this world. It is,

0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:52.640
<v Speaker 1>it is, and it's it's one that I'm kind of

0:12:52.679 --> 0:12:54.720
<v Speaker 1>at the early stages of with my own kid. But

0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:57.560
<v Speaker 1>you know, people were joking about greasing the palms of

0:12:57.600 --> 0:13:00.360
<v Speaker 1>a parent coordinator to get your kids off the pre

0:13:00.480 --> 0:13:03.160
<v Speaker 1>k waitlist. Um, and I don't know how much they

0:13:03.160 --> 0:13:08.280
<v Speaker 1>were really joking or serious people have Yeah, well, and

0:13:08.320 --> 0:13:11.800
<v Speaker 1>to that point, Melissa, it's it's interesting because you know,

0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:14.480
<v Speaker 1>you talked about how well we'll sort of see and

0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:16.880
<v Speaker 1>and maybe we're all a little bit cynical given what

0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:20.600
<v Speaker 1>we've seen or not seen from the higher ed perspective.

0:13:21.040 --> 0:13:24.120
<v Speaker 1>Do you think and do you sense that behavior has

0:13:24.240 --> 0:13:27.280
<v Speaker 1>markedly changed on the part of parents. Are they just

0:13:27.400 --> 0:13:31.160
<v Speaker 1>more careful about, you know, the parts of the gray

0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:34.800
<v Speaker 1>area that they're operating in. Yeah, I don't see them

0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:37.840
<v Speaker 1>completely turning away from the gray area. I remember talking

0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:41.760
<v Speaker 1>to one person um when reporting the book, who said,

0:13:42.080 --> 0:13:45.679
<v Speaker 1>you know, from Orange County, California, very very well, so

0:13:45.800 --> 0:13:48.320
<v Speaker 1>you very well connected, and saying, you know, my kids

0:13:48.360 --> 0:13:51.560
<v Speaker 1>heading down in the down down this task going through

0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:53.880
<v Speaker 1>the process next year, and we were going to hire

0:13:53.880 --> 0:13:56.600
<v Speaker 1>a private counselor, but now I'm afraid to just because

0:13:56.640 --> 0:14:01.200
<v Speaker 1>of the uh, the connotations and these siations of oh,

0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:04.000
<v Speaker 1>use someone private, you know, did you what kind of

0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:06.760
<v Speaker 1>person did you use? I think there's some more skepticism

0:14:06.800 --> 0:14:11.000
<v Speaker 1>or cynicism, and not always lawranted, because most do follow

0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:14.160
<v Speaker 1>the rules and everything, but I think people are going

0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:18.720
<v Speaker 1>to be a little more cautious who they let play

0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:21.720
<v Speaker 1>around and tinker with the application. Right, And what a

0:14:21.760 --> 0:14:24.840
<v Speaker 1>wacky year I'm thinking about just right now between the

0:14:24.920 --> 0:14:28.240
<v Speaker 1>virus and I know we're looking at both Jason and

0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:30.840
<v Speaker 1>I have rising seniors, and it's just you know, you're

0:14:30.880 --> 0:14:33.880
<v Speaker 1>doing the process virtually, but then also the backdrop of

0:14:34.040 --> 0:14:38.120
<v Speaker 1>you know, this scandal and just I don't know, you know,

0:14:38.840 --> 0:14:41.920
<v Speaker 1>the tone that it kind of puts on this whole process.

0:14:41.960 --> 0:14:43.680
<v Speaker 1>I have to ask you remind us what happened to

0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.640
<v Speaker 1>Rick Singer. He's in jail, right, he is not, He

0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:50.800
<v Speaker 1>is awaiting sentencing. He out he is actually taking some

0:14:50.960 --> 0:14:52.920
<v Speaker 1>class has been taking some classes to try to finish

0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:55.600
<v Speaker 1>up his PhD that he started almost twenty years ago,

0:14:55.680 --> 0:14:58.320
<v Speaker 1>or about twenty years ago. The story just gets more interesting,

0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:02.400
<v Speaker 1>right I know. Um, yeah, he's out about and his

0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:05.360
<v Speaker 1>sentencing won't come likely until after some of the trials

0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.840
<v Speaker 1>which will go into next year. And what is the

0:15:08.960 --> 0:15:13.440
<v Speaker 1>defense ultimately for those Because there there's fewer and fewer people, um.

0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:17.280
<v Speaker 1>And you mentioned Laurie Laughlin pleading guilty and her husband. Um.

0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:19.640
<v Speaker 1>But there are still some people out there, Bill mcglashin,

0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:23.600
<v Speaker 1>I believe, notably former TPG partner at the Rise Fund

0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:26.800
<v Speaker 1>and TPG growth. He is continuing to fight on what

0:15:27.040 --> 0:15:31.400
<v Speaker 1>ultimately is their defense. Right. So, yeah, there are a

0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:34.800
<v Speaker 1>number that are still um proceeding and have created guilty

0:15:34.840 --> 0:15:38.000
<v Speaker 1>and are maintaining their innocence, and they're mostly saying, you know,

0:15:38.080 --> 0:15:41.600
<v Speaker 1>Rick Singer misled them, that he was very selective and

0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:44.560
<v Speaker 1>what information he shared and while he might have done

0:15:44.600 --> 0:15:49.360
<v Speaker 1>these bad he didn't necessarily explain it to them that way. Uh,

0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:51.640
<v Speaker 1>So that's a big, big part of it. They've already

0:15:51.680 --> 0:15:55.760
<v Speaker 1>exhausted a number of efforts to get the charges dismissed

0:15:55.760 --> 0:15:58.560
<v Speaker 1>because of venue, or trying to sever the cases, saying

0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:00.680
<v Speaker 1>we shouldn't all be tried together. We weren't part of

0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:03.640
<v Speaker 1>a single conspiracy. The judge has dismissed all of the

0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:06.240
<v Speaker 1>or has kind of shot all those down and said no,

0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:11.080
<v Speaker 1>this is going forward. So um, there is exhausted most

0:16:11.120 --> 0:16:13.920
<v Speaker 1>of those options, and you know, maybe we'll see some

0:16:14.000 --> 0:16:17.600
<v Speaker 1>more played. We don't know, uh, whether parents or coaches,

0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:21.280
<v Speaker 1>but they're essentially saying, you know, this is Singer's thing.

0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:23.800
<v Speaker 1>We were just parents here kind of going along for

0:16:23.840 --> 0:16:27.800
<v Speaker 1>the ride, not realizing exactly what was happening around us. Yeah,

0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:33.240
<v Speaker 1>hard to write the book. It was chaotic, hectic fifteen months,

0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:36.360
<v Speaker 1>last the nights and weekend because Jennifer and I were

0:16:36.400 --> 0:16:40.000
<v Speaker 1>both doing our day job at the journal as well. Yeah. Right,

0:16:40.040 --> 0:16:42.520
<v Speaker 1>as a story continued to evolve, right, because it's not over,

0:16:42.600 --> 0:16:46.040
<v Speaker 1>as you said, right, I was just you know, there's

0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:48.600
<v Speaker 1>another parent being sentenced next week, and the former CEO

0:16:48.640 --> 0:16:51.960
<v Speaker 1>of a publicly traded company and Uh, Lara Laughlin and

0:16:52.040 --> 0:16:55.080
<v Speaker 1>Massamuli are scheduled till later this summer. So yeah, this

0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:57.440
<v Speaker 1>is far from over. So Melissa, I do want to

0:16:57.480 --> 0:16:59.640
<v Speaker 1>ask you, maybe you know one more question is that

0:17:00.040 --> 0:17:03.120
<v Speaker 1>then hadn't been some high profile people involved, I wonder

0:17:03.160 --> 0:17:05.080
<v Speaker 1>how we would have looked at it, Like if it

0:17:05.119 --> 0:17:06.200
<v Speaker 1>was a lant of names, were like, I don't know

0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:08.280
<v Speaker 1>who these people are, you know what you mean? Versus

0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:12.600
<v Speaker 1>actresses and big name Wall Street folks. Um, would it

0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:17.280
<v Speaker 1>would we be talking about it as much? Probably not? Um.

0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:20.400
<v Speaker 1>I think people know that college admissions are not quite

0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:23.400
<v Speaker 1>as pure and meritocratic as we'd all hope they are.

0:17:24.119 --> 0:17:28.480
<v Speaker 1>But it really does take something quite so shocking, quite

0:17:28.520 --> 0:17:32.600
<v Speaker 1>so big, quite so high profile, to really get people

0:17:32.680 --> 0:17:35.440
<v Speaker 1>talking about what where the fault lines are and how

0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:37.760
<v Speaker 1>they could perhaps be short up. You know, if it

0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.159
<v Speaker 1>was I think Bloomberg in Wall Street Journal would have

0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:44.040
<v Speaker 1>been talking about some of it, uh, with some of

0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:47.520
<v Speaker 1>these names. Um. But yeah, I don't know that it

0:17:47.520 --> 0:17:51.120
<v Speaker 1>would have captured the public, the international audience the way

0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:53.680
<v Speaker 1>it has. You know, when he's got tabloid reporters sitting

0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:56.040
<v Speaker 1>in the courtroom in Boston to cover this. If it

0:17:56.119 --> 0:17:58.359
<v Speaker 1>hadn't been for a couple of those names. In particular,

0:17:58.640 --> 0:18:01.160
<v Speaker 1>that was most of corn who allow with Jennifer Levitt's

0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:03.679
<v Speaker 1>of the Wall Street Journal, they wrote the book that

0:18:03.800 --> 0:18:07.000
<v Speaker 1>just came out this week. The book is entitled Unacceptable,

0:18:07.160 --> 0:18:10.400
<v Speaker 1>Privileged to Sit and the Making of the College Admission Scandal.

0:18:11.000 --> 0:18:13.879
<v Speaker 1>And Jason great to catch up with her. You know,

0:18:13.960 --> 0:18:15.600
<v Speaker 1>she said, you know, right off the top, she was

0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:18.600
<v Speaker 1>dumbfounded and blown away by the scope of this, the

0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:21.840
<v Speaker 1>breath and sophistication of the scheme, but also about what

0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:26.359
<v Speaker 1>some parents would go to to get their kids into school. Yeah,

0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:28.920
<v Speaker 1>and I think it's a story that's much bigger than

0:18:28.960 --> 0:18:32.840
<v Speaker 1>these families, in so far as it says a lot

0:18:32.840 --> 0:18:37.159
<v Speaker 1>about our society, what we value, how we interact with

0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:40.480
<v Speaker 1>our kids, how we interact with institutions, how institutions interact

0:18:40.520 --> 0:18:43.680
<v Speaker 1>with us, the role that money plays. I mean, there's

0:18:43.880 --> 0:18:47.000
<v Speaker 1>so much. There's a text, there's a subtext in all

0:18:47.040 --> 0:18:49.960
<v Speaker 1>of this, And I really enjoyed that conversation. Wide ranging,

0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:51.719
<v Speaker 1>to say the least. Well, she said it was as

0:18:51.800 --> 0:18:54.600
<v Speaker 1>much about the parents as it was about the kids. Totally.

0:18:54.720 --> 0:18:56.840
<v Speaker 1>I think more so, I would argue more so, all right,

0:18:56.880 --> 0:19:00.080
<v Speaker 1>you've been listening to Bloomberg Business Week Extra Stitude to

0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:02.760
<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Business Week Radio live Monday through Friday at two

0:19:02.800 --> 0:19:04.880
<v Speaker 1>bim Wall Street Time on Bloomberg Radio. Have a great

0:19:04.880 --> 0:19:07.520
<v Speaker 1>weekend at Tral Masser and I'm Jason Kelly. This is

0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:10.920
<v Speaker 1>Bloodburn m