Speaker 1: So crime is up and you like the idea of
Speaker 1: having a gun in your home or carrying a gun,
Speaker 1: but you don't like all the aspects of the whole
Speaker 1: gun thing. Ah, we got something for you, Armstrong and
Speaker 1: Getty extra Large.
Speaker 2: Because four hours simply.
Speaker 3: This is Armstrong and Getty extra Large. You may have
Speaker 3: heard us doing commercials for the Berna Launcher. It's a
Speaker 3: self protection device very much like a gun, but it
Speaker 3: won't kill somebody. It will repel them in a big hurry.
Speaker 3: It's a terrific product, and we can get into some
Speaker 3: of the particulars of it. But the reason we're doing
Speaker 3: this podcast is in some of the behind the scenes
Speaker 3: discussions with folks involved with Berna, We've had some really
Speaker 3: really interesting chats about the Second Amendment in the use
Speaker 3: of deadly force and the psychology of it, and it's
Speaker 3: just really interesting.
Speaker 1: So, and I'm a gun owner, I'm pro Second Amendment.
Speaker 1: I own several guns and everything like that, but there
Speaker 1: are a lot of legal problems with bringing out the
Speaker 1: gun if somebody brings into breaks into your home, whether
Speaker 1: you like it or not.
Speaker 3: Yeah, depending on where you live, especially. But we're joined
Speaker 3: by Luan fam who's the chief revenue and marketing officer
Speaker 3: for Berna and is really up on these issues. Lan,
Speaker 3: How are you good?
Speaker 2: How are you guys?
Speaker 3: We're terrific. Thanks. So let's talk about, you know, the
Speaker 3: advantages and disadvantages of deadly force as opposed to less
Speaker 3: than deadly forced. Because I know you're an expert in this.
Speaker 2: Thank you, you know so full transparency. I am also
Speaker 2: a gun advocate, I am a gun practitioner. I support
Speaker 2: the Second Amendment, but also believe in the strategic self
Speaker 2: defense strategies that every American should take because, as you
Speaker 2: as we believe, one bullet can ruin two lives and
Speaker 2: in many states, and the laws are gray. And then
Speaker 2: you over apply deadly force, you can find yourself in
Speaker 2: hot water really quick. You risk your freedom, you risk
Speaker 2: losing your assets, and you have to be extremely strategic
Speaker 2: in how you approach the use of force when someone
Speaker 2: is attacking you.
Speaker 1: So I'm laying in bed, for instance, I hear a noise,
Speaker 1: then I hear you know, I get the idea somebody
Speaker 1: is in my home. I grab my actual gun, I
Speaker 1: go out there. You know, there's no shooting somebody. You know,
Speaker 1: It's not like the old Western movies. I mean, there's
Speaker 1: no like shooting. I'm gonna shoot them in the leg
Speaker 1: and just wound them or whatever. I mean. I'm applying
Speaker 1: deadly voice force if I pull the trigger and then
Speaker 1: I and then I'm in all kinds of legal program problems,
Speaker 1: even if they broke into my house.
Speaker 2: Yes, and then, as you guys stated earlier, it depends
Speaker 2: on where you live. But in general, if you who
Speaker 2: apply deadly force, there are so many different is that
Speaker 2: faces the homeowner. Right if that person, that intruder is unarmed,
Speaker 2: God forbid, if the intruder is friendly, you are responsible
Speaker 2: for that bullet once you pull the trigger. So you
Speaker 2: have to be extremely careful in how you approach the
Speaker 2: threat or analyze the situation. I would come out of
Speaker 2: my bedroom with my burna less lethal launcher packed with
Speaker 2: not only kinetic AMMO but chemical irritants consisting of pure
Speaker 2: gas and pepper, and then supported by my nine millimeter.
Speaker 2: And so as you think about you know you're in bed,
Speaker 2: you wake up, you don't have all of your faculties.
Speaker 2: It probably come out of deep sleep, and starting with
Speaker 2: less lethal from my perspective, allows you to get your
Speaker 2: mind in order. And then hopefully address the threat using
Speaker 2: less lethal force and essentially stopping that threat without having
Speaker 2: to resort to what we call the nuclear mode where
Speaker 2: you have to transition to your firearm. And well, it
Speaker 2: was that way, so go ahead.
Speaker 3: I was just going to say, that's one of the
Speaker 3: more interesting conversations we've had. I remember when we first
Speaker 3: chatted about how many people will have deadly force or nothing,
Speaker 3: and when it comes down to that moment to pull
Speaker 3: the trigger, they realize I can't take a life. I'm
Speaker 3: just not made like that, and then they're defenseless.
Speaker 2: That's correct, And what firearms owners, I think there's a
Speaker 2: phenomenon of trigger hesitancy is extremely real, and you are
Speaker 2: facing that situation and you pull your weapon with the
Speaker 2: intention to fire it. It's how we're taught that a
Speaker 2: lot of things run through your head, and lots of
Speaker 2: it is you know, dealing Can I take a life?
Speaker 2: And I opening a box of complexities that will require
Speaker 2: legal representation and law enforcement and then potentially jail. So
Speaker 2: when these things rush your head, you will hesitate, and
Speaker 2: when you hesitate, it becomes very dangerous situations for you.
Speaker 2: So what our products provide its users is it eliminates trigger.
Speaker 2: Heasmans to be because you know that you're not going
Speaker 2: to take a life, and you're going to de escalate
Speaker 2: the threat by incapacitating the attacker for thirty to forty minutes.
Speaker 2: And should you accidentally shoot a friendly or someone is
Speaker 2: in your house that you've forgotten, you invited them, they
Speaker 2: have the key. You know, the results are much better
Speaker 2: than if you applied lethal force in a situation where
Speaker 2: a you know efernally is involved.
Speaker 1: And so I've got I've got one of these burn
Speaker 1: of guns. I've got it in my bedroom and it
Speaker 1: looks and feels and loads just like a glock or whatever.
Speaker 1: And I go out into the living room with that,
Speaker 1: and there is a bad guy there. What is the
Speaker 1: burned gun going to do to them?
Speaker 2: So, if you're shooting the chemical irritants consisting of tear
Speaker 2: gas and pepper, upon impact, it will essentially neutralize your
Speaker 2: sential nervous system. Your respiratory system will be attacked, your
Speaker 2: lungs feel like they're collapsing. Any areas of exposed skin
Speaker 2: will feel like it's on fire, your nose runs uncontrollably,
Speaker 2: and you will not want to open your eyes because
Speaker 2: it's that painful, and these effects last for thirty to
Speaker 2: forty minutes, giving you the opportunity to escape. Moreover, if
Speaker 2: you miss the chemical round will let's say you miss
Speaker 2: the attacker and you hit the back wall, it will
Speaker 2: create a six foot dispersion cloud that any person within
Speaker 2: six feet will be affected. So even misshots can be
Speaker 2: very effective, you know, within close quarters.
Speaker 3: Well, and it's not a single shot deal either. It
Speaker 3: can squeeze off a couple. What about the so called
Speaker 3: kinetic rounds that don't have the chemical aspect to them.
Speaker 2: Sure, the kinetic rounds consist of one a solid sixty
Speaker 2: eight projectile made of high end polymer like very strong
Speaker 2: plastic that is capable of breaking side autoglass from thirty
Speaker 2: feet away. So when you get hit with this with
Speaker 2: that round, it's going to feel like you've been shot,
Speaker 2: and it's extremely painful. And so it really the escalates
Speaker 2: the situation using the force less people forced, and in
Speaker 2: combination the round could be. Using combination, you could have
Speaker 2: kinetic rounds and chemical rounds in your magazine and in
Speaker 2: our With our product, the launchers have an effective range
Speaker 2: of sixty feet and on a CO two you can
Speaker 2: shoot up to twenty rounds off an eight gram CO
Speaker 2: two and the gun is or the launcher is as
Speaker 2: they're ready, so are We have a proprietary technology that's
Speaker 2: called pull Pierce where you can have the launcher loaded
Speaker 2: with the CO two inside and they can be stored indefinitely.
Speaker 2: So when there's a threat, you pull your weapon, you
Speaker 2: pull the trigger. It punctures the CO two and sends
Speaker 2: the first round instantaneously, so at the same time and
Speaker 2: we have five round magazines, we have seven round magazines,
Speaker 2: so that'll gives you that opportunity to have multiple shots
Speaker 2: at a safe distance up to sixty feet and you
Speaker 2: can address and assess the situation and determine if that
Speaker 2: situation requires an escalation of force and use of force.
Speaker 2: And most of the time that's not the case, but
Speaker 2: if it is the case, then you have to do
Speaker 2: what you have to do to protect yourself and your family.
Speaker 1: So the Burner launcher again, which you know it's like
Speaker 1: having a glock in your hand, but it's not a
Speaker 1: glock in your hand. What are the law because like,
Speaker 1: my guns are locked up, and I understand why I've
Speaker 1: got kids in the house and everything like that. The laws,
Speaker 1: the practicality of safety and everything like that. But I've
Speaker 1: always thought, Man, if somebody breaks into my house, I'm
Speaker 1: you know, half asleep like you're talking about. I got
Speaker 1: to go get the key, then come unlock it, then
Speaker 1: low and you know all the stuff, the steps I
Speaker 1: gotta take. What are the laws around having this burn
Speaker 1: a launcher handy or can I have it in my car?
Speaker 1: Can I be out and about with it?
Speaker 2: That's a great question. The burner launcher is legal in
Speaker 2: all fifty states. It doesn't require a background check to
Speaker 2: own one or to purchase one. That doesn't require a
Speaker 2: permit to own one. It's not classified by the ATF
Speaker 2: as a firearm. It's essentially an air launcher in the past.
Speaker 2: To ATF is the client of ours and we service
Speaker 2: many government agencies and hundreds and hundreds of police departments,
Speaker 2: and so you can have it in your car. Again,
Speaker 2: we would recommend that you check your local laws just
Speaker 2: for to ensure that the product is faith to transport,
Speaker 2: But in general we say, is lego mpp S fake,
Speaker 2: You can have it in your car. I'm here in
Speaker 2: Las Vegas. The car, my vehicle is considered an extension
Speaker 2: of my home, so I can have that launcher in
Speaker 2: the car. If I were to carry it around town,
Speaker 2: i am concealed, I would need to have a concealed
Speaker 2: carry permit. And again each city and its local laws
Speaker 2: are different. So we just recommend ours to our customers
Speaker 2: that check and then confirm and then know what the
Speaker 2: usage and bandwidth is with regards to your home, that's
Speaker 2: your domain. You could have it anywhere you want. You
Speaker 2: have young children, we highly recommend that you treat our
Speaker 2: product as a weapon, and it is a weapon, and
Speaker 2: so make sure you have all these safety precautions in
Speaker 2: place where young children don't have easy access to the
Speaker 2: product or to the device and use it accordingly.
Speaker 3: I'm glad you mentioned that hundreds of police agencies use this.
Speaker 3: That's what sold me and made me a customer. Honestly,
Speaker 3: I thought, wow, if they're using this as less than
Speaker 3: lethal force, that's a good recommendation. So professionals and FEDS
Speaker 3: are using it. Cops and also doctor Jen Stankis, who's
Speaker 3: an emergency medicine physician, is a fan of the Berna launcher,
Speaker 3: and doctor Jen joins us, now, how are you.
Speaker 4: I'm doing great, Thanks for having me on the show.
Speaker 3: Well, it's our pleasure. What convinced you that this was
Speaker 3: a product for you?
Speaker 4: Well, first I should give you a little bit more background,
Speaker 4: former law enforcement, former military times too, including being a
Speaker 4: JAG officer and part time military judge, and now as
Speaker 4: an emergency physician. I also do a lot of expert
Speaker 4: witness work and I've helped you defend people who have
Speaker 4: quite frankly you self defense appropriately and still go to jail.
Speaker 4: And for me, having been in law enforcement and think
Speaker 4: about self defense a lot, constantly reviewing what my options are.
Speaker 4: And I learned about this product maybe a couple of
Speaker 4: years ago, and I had no idea what it was.
Speaker 4: And when one of our neighbors, who's a huge pro
Speaker 4: two a guy always has a can field carry with him,
Speaker 4: told me that he was going to this, it really
Speaker 4: perked my interest and I looked into it. And the
Speaker 4: more I've learned, the more of a proponent I am
Speaker 4: of it, and now being great friends with Luan and
Speaker 4: I do scenario training with it at home. It's just
Speaker 4: it's my go to self defense.
Speaker 2: Tool.
Speaker 3: I would say, so do I understand correctly? And I
Speaker 3: think we all did, because you spoke quite plainly you
Speaker 3: were in law enforcement, a JAG officer and now you're
Speaker 3: an emergency physician.
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: Well thanks for making us all feel so bad about ourselves. Wow,
Speaker 3: what next astronomy we're going on?
Speaker 1: Being an astronaut?
Speaker 4: I would love to be an astronautor right now, I
Speaker 4: just apply airplane.
Speaker 3: So wow, fantastic. H So there you go, there you go,
Speaker 3: and that expert testimony. Oh, that's got to be so
Speaker 3: troubling when you see somebody who was in good conscience
Speaker 3: trying to do the right things protect themselves and their family,
Speaker 3: and all of a sudden their life is upended and
Speaker 3: perhaps ruined.
Speaker 4: It's actually quite terrifying to see. And as Luan pointed out,
Speaker 4: it really depends on the jurisdiction where you are, from
Speaker 4: city to county to state, it really varies. And just
Speaker 4: having the feeling safe, I think is one of the
Speaker 4: most important things for people in terms of being able
Speaker 4: to go about their business and having a tool that
Speaker 4: really will protect you in every way legally and physically,
Speaker 4: I think is really important.
Speaker 3: Doctor Jenstankis Salon fam from Burna b y r NA
Speaker 3: dot com. B y r NA dot com. Interesting stuff.
Speaker 3: Thanks for the time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I could really see this be in the future,
Speaker 1: couldn't you. It fills in. I mean, it just it
Speaker 1: checks so many boxes.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah. And obviously if you've been following the news,
Speaker 3: you know that there's real interest in police not overusing force,
Speaker 3: which is great, it's proper in a free society. And
Speaker 3: the fact that they're by the hundreds of agencies turning
Speaker 3: to this sort of thing. Yeah, it's big.
Speaker 2: It's important.
Speaker 1: You know, you don't know about trigger hesitancy until you're
Speaker 1: ever in that situation. But I think I would have
Speaker 1: no trouble shooting somebody if I thought they were threat
Speaker 1: I would hesitate on has this gone far enough that
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna end up in jail over That's that
Speaker 1: I know. I would have hesitantzy about that.
Speaker 3: Yes, at what point in this scenario is it justified
Speaker 3: right as judged by twelve dopes in some trial?
Speaker 1: Maybe right anyway, And the fact that Berna, you know,
Speaker 1: I had that conversation with my son the other day,
Speaker 1: the whole Uh, rather be judged by twelve than carried
Speaker 1: by six? Well, you know, if it comes down to
Speaker 1: carried by six, yeah, I would take that choice. But
Speaker 1: being judged by twelve would be no walk in the
Speaker 1: park either.
Speaker 3: No, no, indeed, better to send a purp to his
Speaker 3: knees crying or squealing and running.
Speaker 1: Away, right, And you get out of there and call
Speaker 1: the police, and you're not gonna, you know, have to
Speaker 1: hire a lawyer and defend yourself as a murderer or something.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, right, interesting stuff.
Speaker 3: Horrible