1 00:00:03,720 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: I remember this so clearly. I was in my powder 2 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:10,600 Speaker 1: blue pajamas and I came out and I said something 3 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: to him, I go, what are you involved in? Are 4 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: you being investigated by the FBI? And he looked at 5 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,760 Speaker 1: me so coldly, like he never knew me, and he said, 6 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 1: if I go down, I'm taking you with me. 7 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:44,680 Speaker 2: I'm Andrea Gunning. And this is Betrayal, a show about 8 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:47,919 Speaker 2: the people we trust the most and the deceptions that 9 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 2: change everything. Recently, we got in touch with a group 10 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:57,040 Speaker 2: called the White Collar Wives Project. It's a support group 11 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 2: for women who were blindsided by their husband's finance crimes. 12 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 2: Their mission is to help guide women through the fallout legally, 13 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:09,320 Speaker 2: financially and emotionally. For members, it's a place where they 14 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:13,839 Speaker 2: can feel supported and most importantly, believed, a place where 15 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 2: no one is asking the ever present question he didn't know. 16 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 2: That's Libby Henry. She was one of the first members 17 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 2: of the White Collar Wives and like all the women 18 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 2: in the group, she was in the dark about what 19 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:29,560 Speaker 2: her husband was really doing at work. 20 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:32,759 Speaker 1: I didn't say, oh, honey, dinner's writing. And by the way, 21 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:33,639 Speaker 1: did you commit fraud? 22 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 2: Libby grew up in Louisville, Kentucky, or as the locals 23 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:41,200 Speaker 2: call it, Lousvoe. 24 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,040 Speaker 1: It's almost like you've got something caught in your throat. 25 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 1: We automatically know if you're not from here. If you're 26 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: saying Louisville or Louisville. 27 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 2: Well, I'm not from there. So for this episode, I'm 28 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 2: going to be saying Louisville. Early on, Libby knew her 29 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 2: family was like others. Her mother didn't get along with 30 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 2: most people. 31 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 1: She had an undiagnosed personality disorder. Today they call this 32 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:15,080 Speaker 1: borderline personality disorder. That at the time I didn't know 33 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 1: what was wrong with her because there wasn't the Internet 34 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: and nobody was talking about mental health back then. 35 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 2: Because of her mom's mental illness, life at home was 36 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:26,680 Speaker 2: an emotional roller coaster. 37 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 1: As I entered the ninth grade, I was pretty much 38 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: trying to spend the night out all the time because 39 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 1: she had such a problem controlling her emotions. I just 40 00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: tried to get away. 41 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 2: She spent a lot of time at friends' houses, and 42 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 2: by the time she graduated high school, she had one 43 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:52,359 Speaker 2: goal for her future. It was heartbreakingly simple. 44 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:56,280 Speaker 1: What I saw around meet my friend's houses. I wanted 45 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 1: for myself. I just wanted to have a normal home 46 00:03:00,520 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 1: because I didn't come from one. That was my big plan. 47 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: That was it. 48 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 2: She started college at the University of Kentucky. It's in Lexington, 49 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 2: the horse racing capital of the world. 50 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 1: Oh gosh, Lexington, beautiful play surrounded by these beautiful horse farms, 51 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 1: rolling fields. When I got there, the first thing I 52 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: thought is that I had some freedom. 53 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:29,120 Speaker 2: It was the eighties. Libby was carefree. She joined a 54 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:31,080 Speaker 2: sorority and quickly made friends. 55 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 1: There were a lot of fraternity parties. They could have 56 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 1: all these cag parties. You would go from one house 57 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:41,480 Speaker 1: to the next house. Lots of bands were always playing. 58 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 1: That was a lot of fun. 59 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:46,560 Speaker 2: Her junior year, she went to the first kickoff game 60 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 2: of the football season, and of course it was a 61 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 2: big party. 62 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: My friend came up to me and said, do you 63 00:03:55,280 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 1: know Ted House. 64 00:03:56,840 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 2: Ted House was in one of her history classes, caught 65 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 2: her eye before, but they didn't really know each other. 66 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: He was undeniably good looking, you know that, tall, dark, 67 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: and handsome. He was all those things. She goes, well, 68 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 1: he wants to go out with you, and I'm like, 69 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 1: oh wow, okay. So later that same night he approached 70 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 1: me and started talking to me, but he started talking 71 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:27,279 Speaker 1: about the history syllabus, and I think he was nervous 72 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 1: because talking about the history syllabus was kind of boring. 73 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:33,880 Speaker 2: Livy left the party underwhelmed. 74 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: But two days later my friend called me and she said, 75 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 1: we need a double date. He really wants to go 76 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: out with you, and I'm like, okay, And we go 77 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,279 Speaker 1: on a double date to this French restaurant and he 78 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 1: was an entirely different human being. He was charming and 79 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:52,640 Speaker 1: funny and much more relaxed. 80 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:55,720 Speaker 2: It was like she was really seeing him for the 81 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 2: first time. 82 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:01,159 Speaker 1: I thought, Gosh, this guy's so fun. Wow, you know, 83 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:06,440 Speaker 1: I like this guy. And two days after that he 84 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 1: asked me out again, and we just kept rolling and 85 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:12,720 Speaker 1: kept going out, and it wasn't long before we were 86 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:13,920 Speaker 1: an exclusive couple. 87 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:18,599 Speaker 2: Lebby felt like herself around Ted. He was the first 88 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:19,960 Speaker 2: guy to make her feel that way. 89 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:24,159 Speaker 1: I was really comfortable with who I was with Ted, 90 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: like I was always laughing. He liked that about me. 91 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:28,520 Speaker 1: He liked the humor. 92 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 2: But it quickly became clear that she and Ted came 93 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:36,359 Speaker 2: from different backgrounds. To borrow a term from the horse world, 94 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:41,360 Speaker 2: he had pedigree private boarding schools, country clubs and summer 95 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 2: trips abroad, but he wasn't pretentious about it. 96 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: Ted didn't seem to care that I didn't have any money. 97 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 1: That didn't seem to bother him. 98 00:05:50,920 --> 00:05:54,760 Speaker 2: The difference in their upbringing meant nothing. They just wanted 99 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 2: to be together. 100 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:59,800 Speaker 1: The mundane things that you do by yourself that don't 101 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:03,480 Speaker 1: see being very fun or of course very fun when 102 00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: you are head over heels with someone, and we were. 103 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 2: Libby felt safe when she was with Ted. He had 104 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 2: that kind of confidence. 105 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 1: He's kind of like that protector, and things were taken 106 00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 1: care of. If I was having an issue, here was Ted. 107 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 1: He was taking care of everything. He was always that guy. 108 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 2: After a few months of dating, Ted took Libby to 109 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 2: meet his parents. They were in town for a fundraiser. 110 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 1: And I didn't really realize what I walked into. They 111 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 1: are a very politically connected family. The first time I 112 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:45,120 Speaker 1: met them, they were having a fundraiser for the governor 113 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 1: of Indiana. 114 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 2: Ted didn't really prepare her for this scene, and to 115 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:51,919 Speaker 2: be fair, he couldn't have. 116 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: I'll walk in the foyer of this absolutely beautiful home, 117 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,039 Speaker 1: and at first, you know, you're just so nervous because 118 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:04,600 Speaker 1: I'm like, what do I have to offer in this conversation? 119 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: What can I contribute? That is very intimidating for someone 120 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 1: like me who came from the background that I came from. 121 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 2: Lebby tried to stay quiet, smile and hide the run 122 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,920 Speaker 2: in her stockings, but above all, she wanted to make 123 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 2: a good first impression with Ted's parents. 124 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, do you remember wondering if Ted's mother thought maybe 125 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: I'm really not good enough first? 126 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:30,280 Speaker 2: Then? 127 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: But I got through it and his parents were very 128 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 1: nice to me. 129 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:39,120 Speaker 2: Ted's dad was a successful businessman and his mother was 130 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 2: a philanthropist, a patron of the arts type. The night 131 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:47,040 Speaker 2: of the fundraiser, Libby was just herself. She made them laugh, 132 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 2: and it turned out that was enough for the House family. 133 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 2: Pretty Soon, Libby became a regular fixture at Ted's family events. 134 00:07:58,720 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 2: They made her feel welcome. 135 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: They never seemed ostentatious to me. They weren't people that 136 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 1: bragged about money. They had money, but nobody was bragging 137 00:08:08,200 --> 00:08:11,880 Speaker 1: about it. They were very supportive, and they were interested 138 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 1: in me. Things just seemed so effortless with them. 139 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 2: Ted's family genuinely loved being around each other. 140 00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: So you can imagine when I'm with this family where 141 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 1: things are so easy, and there wasn't chaos. That's the word. 142 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 1: There was no chaos. I loved them, I truly did. 143 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 2: As they got more serious, she and Ted opened up 144 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,600 Speaker 2: about their flaws and tried to help each other grow. 145 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,200 Speaker 1: He was the kind of guy that would get really mad, 146 00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 1: but then he would be like, okay, I popped off. 147 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,320 Speaker 1: That was always his thing. But he does know that 148 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:53,920 Speaker 1: about himself. And I wasn't the best either, because the 149 00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:56,080 Speaker 1: one thing that I did not come out of my 150 00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: house with was coping skills. I came out of my 151 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,199 Speaker 1: house like a piece of Swiss cheese. I had a 152 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:03,880 Speaker 1: lot of holes. 153 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:09,680 Speaker 2: Ted and Libby started talking about their future. They both 154 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 2: knew they wanted to have kids and stay close to family. 155 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 1: It was within a year he asked me to marry him. 156 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 1: He was nervous, but it wasn't some big gesture. 157 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 2: He proposed in her living room with the ring behind 158 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:32,720 Speaker 2: his back. She remembers seeing his nerves. He was shaking. 159 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: He's like, you know, I'm not really good at this, 160 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: but I want you to marry me. It was sweet 161 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 1: and I liked it. 162 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 2: Ted had the ring custom made and it came with 163 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 2: a special meaning. 164 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: This woman named b Roth made all three of the 165 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: daughter in law's rings. My mother in law had a 166 00:09:56,600 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: sapphire and diamond emerald cut I had a sapphire and 167 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 1: diamond Marquis, but we all had the sapphire and diamond 168 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 1: to match our mother in law. I couldn't believe that 169 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: I was marrying someone like Ted, not because he came 170 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:20,560 Speaker 1: from money, but because I thought his family was so 171 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 1: close and they seemed like a cohesive unit. It was 172 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 1: like that dream I told you when I was young, 173 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 1: I'm getting married and I'm going to have that family. 174 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 1: I remember thinking it's all happening for me. 175 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:39,959 Speaker 2: Once they graduated college, Liby and Ted had a big 176 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 2: church wedding. They both took jobs working for the State 177 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 2: of Indiana, just over the border from Lexington. 178 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 1: I worked for the Department of Insurance. He was in 179 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:52,440 Speaker 1: land and acquisition, so he would go and talk to 180 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 1: people and they loved him. Ted could talk to anybody. 181 00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 1: I mean he could charm anybody, and they loved him. 182 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:02,600 Speaker 2: Ted was passionate about real estate, so he found them 183 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 2: the perfect home. Even though they both worked. Ted's family 184 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:09,960 Speaker 2: money helped them close on that first house. 185 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 1: I knew he had a trust fund, because that's how 186 00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 1: we bought our first house with his trust fund. Are 187 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 1: we trying to make our house a home? His mother 188 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: would always come over bringing gourmet goodies. 189 00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 2: That year, Libby got a special gift from her mother 190 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:31,000 Speaker 2: in law, something to symbolize their bond. 191 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: Tut's mother had a circle pennant made for each daughter 192 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:40,800 Speaker 1: in law with little pearls around it, and she said, 193 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:44,440 Speaker 1: this is a symbol of our circle, our family, and 194 00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 1: that you're in the circle. 195 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 2: Within the first year of their marriage, Libby found out 196 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:56,160 Speaker 2: she was pregnant with the baby girl. For a moment, 197 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 2: everything felt perfect. 198 00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:08,960 Speaker 1: About six months, I go to the doctor and there's 199 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 1: no heartbeat. 200 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 2: The baby had died. At six months. Ted and his 201 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,960 Speaker 2: family surrounded Libby, helping her through the grief. The doctors 202 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:24,640 Speaker 2: recommended she wait to get pregnant again, but she didn't. 203 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:29,240 Speaker 1: I that's that baby in May, and I was pregnant 204 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: again in July, and then I had a healthy baby girl. 205 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:38,520 Speaker 2: At that point, it was a new beginning and they 206 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:42,319 Speaker 2: wanted a change of scenery to match. They started talking 207 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 2: about returning to Louisville, Libby's hometown. 208 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:51,439 Speaker 1: And then Ted comes home and says, I've got big news, 209 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: and I'm like, what kind of big news? And he said, well, 210 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,680 Speaker 1: I've got an offer to go into the mortgage business 211 00:12:57,679 --> 00:13:01,319 Speaker 1: in Louisville. So when he said we're moving, I was like, yay, 212 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:02,920 Speaker 1: you know, going home. 213 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 2: With their new baby. They packed up and started over. 214 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 1: And we both got full time jobs. At that point. 215 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: I worked for wait for it, a paging company, and 216 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: pagers were the things that was big technology back then, 217 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:25,319 Speaker 1: and he obviously was in the mortgage industry. He started 218 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 1: working for a friend and he was alone originator. 219 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 2: The job came naturally to him. Before long, he started 220 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 2: his own company, brokering mortgages. 221 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:38,680 Speaker 1: He liked it so much he started his own business. 222 00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:42,839 Speaker 1: They seemed to do so well. He had a lot 223 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:45,200 Speaker 1: of employees that started working for him, a lot of 224 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: them he knew. There were people that we knew, and 225 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:53,200 Speaker 1: it just seemed like this was just the absolute best job. 226 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:55,320 Speaker 1: He's got friends that work for him. 227 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:58,200 Speaker 2: The first few years in Louisville were like a dream. 228 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 2: Libby had the normal family she'd always wanted. The only 229 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 2: thing that wasn't going perfectly was Libby's health. When her 230 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 2: daughter was a toddler, Libby began having intense back pain. 231 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 2: She needed spinal surgery, but the pain persisted, so she 232 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:17,760 Speaker 2: and Ted sat down and decided that Libby should quit 233 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 2: her job, at least for the time being. 234 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: Ted said, you know, I'm making enough money, you don't 235 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: need to go back to work. So I didn't. I 236 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 1: would stay home for the next ten years. And that 237 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:35,440 Speaker 1: was a critical mistake for me. 238 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 2: Ted's new mortgage business in Louisville was doing well enough 239 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 2: for Libby to quit her job. That way she could 240 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 2: focus on her health and their daughter. 241 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 1: I did everything that stay at home moms do. You know, kids, playdates, 242 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,280 Speaker 1: everything they had to do with my daughter. You know, 243 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:17,040 Speaker 1: I was planning. 244 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,880 Speaker 2: It was Libby's job to handle their daughter's schedule, and 245 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 2: Ted's job was to handle the finances, which he'd already 246 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 2: been doing anyway. 247 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 1: And I mean, I'm dyslexic. It affects my numbers. And 248 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 1: Ted was like a human calculator. 249 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 2: They'd been in Louisville a few years when. 250 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 1: Ted came home and said that he had looked at 251 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:41,040 Speaker 1: this house in a neighborhood called Bridge Point, which was 252 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:44,680 Speaker 1: a very nice neighborhood, and that was a big leak 253 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 1: as far as cost and the homes. 254 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:51,680 Speaker 2: He wanted an upgrade, something to reflect his success. Libby 255 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 2: started drawing up renovation plans and interior designs. 256 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 1: I walked in and I redid the whole thing, the yard, 257 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 1: you name it. I did it. Everything that I conjured 258 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: up in my head I was able to execute. 259 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,640 Speaker 2: When it was done, the house was perfect. It was 260 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 2: going to be the forever home. 261 00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: Life seemed to be getting better and better and better. 262 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 1: I never thought that money was an issue in my 263 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: life at all. 264 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 2: But Ted still wasn't satisfied. He wanted to become a 265 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 2: Kentucky real estate tycoon, so he found new business partners 266 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 2: to start another venture, flipping houses. 267 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 1: Flipping homes in depressed parts of Louisville wasn't unusual back then, 268 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: because the timeframe of this is two thousand, two thousand 269 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 1: and one, two thousand and two, before the housing bubble burst. 270 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I knew so many people flipping houses. 271 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 2: One of Ted's new business partners was a real estate 272 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 2: consultant named Khalid. 273 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:07,359 Speaker 1: Khalid was a guy who grew up in a depressed 274 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:11,680 Speaker 1: part of Louisville, and Khalid had done well for himself 275 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 1: business wise, so they went into business together flipping homes 276 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 1: Khalid was from that area, and I think he knew 277 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: a lot of people in that area, which made him 278 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: a nice liaison. 279 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 2: Ted and Khaled's business proved more successful than either of 280 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 2: them imagined. The money was rolling in, and Ted really 281 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:34,000 Speaker 2: treated the family. 282 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:37,879 Speaker 1: We were able to do all of these things. For example, 283 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 1: we were in Costa Rica. We were able to take 284 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 1: our daughter to Bahamas, which was incredible. We were at 285 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 1: Martha's vineyard. We were doing all these things that I 286 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:51,880 Speaker 1: could have never done. Now he's used to think this 287 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 1: is great, you know, what a charmed life. I really 288 00:17:55,760 --> 00:18:03,560 Speaker 1: truly was grateful for everything. And then things started to change. 289 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:08,359 Speaker 2: Because Ted's attitude started to change. He had always been 290 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 2: quick to anger, but as Libby shared, he was quick 291 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:14,959 Speaker 2: to calm down. This time it was different. 292 00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 1: Like he would come home increasingly irritable, but I couldn't 293 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 1: understand why it was ongoing. And I would ask him 294 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:25,200 Speaker 1: and he's like, oh, it's work, stress, it's work stress. 295 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: Then he started waking up in the middle of the 296 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: night like he was in a panic. But it was 297 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 1: every night like clockwork, and I never can understand it. 298 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 1: I'm like, what in the world, why do you wake 299 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 1: up like this? Oh, I've just got a lot on 300 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:45,920 Speaker 1: my mind. I just thought, okay, well, there's stress. 301 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,439 Speaker 2: She knew his job could be intense. He was always 302 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:53,200 Speaker 2: managing multiple sales and home renovations, each had their own 303 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:58,439 Speaker 2: deadlines and expenses. But as the year went on, Ted's 304 00:18:58,440 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 2: stress only mounted. 305 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 1: But I kept asking and he kept getting a little 306 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 1: bit short with me, and I was thought, gosh, what 307 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 1: is the problem. 308 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 2: Ted never shared details about his business with Libby. He 309 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,679 Speaker 2: kept it all inside, except for this. One day in 310 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 2: two thousand and two. She walked into their bathroom to 311 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 2: find Ted leaning over the sink and. 312 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 1: I thought he was sick. And I said what's wrong? 313 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:29,880 Speaker 1: And his reaction was so unusual. He actually did have 314 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:33,840 Speaker 1: tears in his eyes and he said, it's that f 315 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: N Khalid, And I said, what are we talking about? 316 00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: What's wrong with Khalid? 317 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:46,600 Speaker 2: Libby had met Khalid once or twice. He had always 318 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:47,400 Speaker 2: been polite to her. 319 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 1: He's so angry, and he's saying, you know this, f 320 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:58,720 Speaker 1: and Khalid he screwed me over, He's gonna screw me. 321 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 1: He just kept saying that over and our again. I go, 322 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: I don't know what we're talking about. What are we 323 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,239 Speaker 1: talking about? And why are you angry with Khalid? And 324 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,680 Speaker 1: he said he's gonna screw me and he may kill you. 325 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 1: He may kill our daughter. What those aren't words you 326 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 1: expect to hear from your husband about a business associate. Ever, 327 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 1: I was paralyzed for a second. I felt my chest 328 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:30,560 Speaker 1: tighten up because I thought, what do you mean kill? 329 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:34,800 Speaker 1: He's like, well, there's a business deal that's gone bad, 330 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:38,320 Speaker 1: and I don't know what that mf or will do. 331 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 2: Libby wanted to go to the police, but when she 332 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:47,879 Speaker 2: said that, Ted quickly backtracked. He shook it off and 333 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:51,440 Speaker 2: told Libby to forget he ever said anything. But that 334 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,560 Speaker 2: wasn't going to happen. Her mind was racing. Was Khalid 335 00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:59,160 Speaker 2: really threatening her and her daughter? Why would Ted say 336 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,920 Speaker 2: that to her? She got in the car and left 337 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 2: the house. 338 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: I start crying all that stress. I just start crying 339 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,120 Speaker 1: because I could not make sense of it. 340 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 2: But when Libby returned home to ask more questions, Ted 341 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:13,679 Speaker 2: was gone. 342 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 1: So I waited and waited and didn't come back. Well, 343 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:22,119 Speaker 1: I gathered myself together and I thought, I'm going to 344 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:25,000 Speaker 1: call his dad. I'm going to cause parents, and I 345 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 1: can still remember his mother saying they were outside by 346 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:33,399 Speaker 1: the pool, and they absorbed all that information, but it 347 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,280 Speaker 1: wasn't like they were panicked like I was. 348 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 2: A little while later, Ted's mom called back. Apparently they'd 349 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,280 Speaker 2: talked to Ted and he'd given them the full story. 350 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,199 Speaker 1: And they said, Teddy got a little spooped, and I 351 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 1: thought a little spooped. You know, I didn't feel satisfied 352 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:58,879 Speaker 1: with that answer. She said, well, Ted's realized that Khalid 353 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:02,320 Speaker 1: might not be the most savory person. He's a little 354 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: bit unsavory, and he's not going to consort with him anymore, 355 00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 1: do business with him. And I said, well, he said 356 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 1: kill she goes he's just overreacted. I said, this seems 357 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:18,720 Speaker 1: a lot more serious than that, and she said, Libby, 358 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 1: it's okay. He's not going to do business with him anymore. 359 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,520 Speaker 1: His dad's talked to him. And you know what, I 360 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:34,720 Speaker 1: believed that because his dad was telling me this businessman, stockbroker, 361 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:42,120 Speaker 1: graduate school educated man, highly respected, no nonsense man. If 362 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:47,679 Speaker 1: they thought that that was true, they just reassured me. 363 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 2: They also advised Libby not to go around telling anyone 364 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 2: about that conversation with Ted. She trusted his parents, but 365 00:22:57,400 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 2: she was still unsettled. 366 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:04,119 Speaker 1: So that was not even a ragged flag. It was 367 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:04,879 Speaker 1: a red flare. 368 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,680 Speaker 2: When Ted finally came home, he didn't want to talk 369 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:13,719 Speaker 2: about it. He wouldn't talk about it. The house was 370 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 2: filled with tension. 371 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: And during that time things really started to go sideways. 372 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 1: Ted's moods were so awful. 373 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 2: Every day Ted was on edge. The days turned into weeks. 374 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,479 Speaker 1: So not only is he waking up at three o'clock 375 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,399 Speaker 1: in the morning, but I'm also waking up to the 376 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaker 1: glow of the laptop. It's like he slept with that 377 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 1: computer all the time. 378 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 2: One night, Libby was home alone watching TV and she 379 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 2: saw something that would change her life. 380 00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:57,120 Speaker 1: I don't know if it was date lone. I don't 381 00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,280 Speaker 1: know if it was sixty minutes, but it was a 382 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 1: woman on TV and her husband died and she didn't 383 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 1: know anything about her finances, nothing, and apparently she owed 384 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 1: thousands of dollars to the IRASID. Of course she's on 385 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 1: the hook because she signed those tax returns and she 386 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:22,639 Speaker 1: lost everything. And I was like, she is me, that 387 00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 1: is me. 388 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,880 Speaker 2: Since the beginning of their marriage, Ted had paid all 389 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:32,240 Speaker 2: their bills, paid off the credit cards, and managed their savings. 390 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 2: When it came to their personal finances. She only knew 391 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 2: what Ted told her, and as for his businesses, she 392 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:42,119 Speaker 2: was completely in the dark. 393 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 1: So I went to him and I'm like, I want 394 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: to fold her. And I wanted a fold her that 395 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,679 Speaker 1: showed me what happens if anything happened to him. I 396 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: didn't know what would happen with the company, would his 397 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 1: business partner buy me out? I mean, these were maybe 398 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,880 Speaker 1: even silly questions. I just didn't know anything. So when 399 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:09,159 Speaker 1: I started asking, he started pushing back, and I remember thinking, 400 00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:15,159 Speaker 1: you know, that's not normal. Why is he defensive? 401 00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 2: The more Ted pushed back, the more insistent Liddy became. 402 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,840 Speaker 2: She needed to know everything. She wanted hard copies. 403 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 1: I mean, every time I asked, got madder and matter 404 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,600 Speaker 1: and matter and matter, to the point we were having 405 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:38,800 Speaker 1: really big fights, but I'm still asking about that Faulder. 406 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,879 Speaker 1: Our arguments kept escalating because I thought, well, does he 407 00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,120 Speaker 1: think I'm not smart enough to understand? Does he think 408 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:48,640 Speaker 1: he just needs to be controlling and he's the one 409 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:52,280 Speaker 1: that needs to be able to do at all. Never 410 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,920 Speaker 1: would I have thought he was involved anything that was 411 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 1: an a fairies never didn't even occur to me. 412 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 2: Libby never got that folder of financial documents because A 413 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:07,479 Speaker 2: few weeks later, Ted sat her down and in a 414 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 2: calm voice, he told her the truth, or at least 415 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:13,080 Speaker 2: a sliver of it. 416 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:21,119 Speaker 1: Three days before Christmas, he tells me, we're bankrupt. We 417 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 1: need to file bankruptcy. And I don't just mean any bankruptcy, 418 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:30,360 Speaker 1: I mean Chapter seven complete liquidation, bankrupt. 419 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 2: Libby had spent a year begging Ted for financial transparency. 420 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:39,120 Speaker 2: The entire time, he never made any indication that they 421 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 2: were in debt. Now, out of the blue, he told 422 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 2: her they were bankrupt. It didn't add up. 423 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,199 Speaker 1: I thought that can't be right. I mean, it just 424 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:55,240 Speaker 1: can't be right, because you have this company, You've purchased 425 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,679 Speaker 1: this beautiful home, We've lived this life. How would we 426 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:02,080 Speaker 1: be bankrupt. I couldn't make sense of it, and I 427 00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:03,440 Speaker 1: didn't even get a good answer. 428 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,320 Speaker 2: When Ted tried to explain how it happened, it was 429 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 2: just word salad about business deals gone bad. She needed space. 430 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:18,639 Speaker 1: I thought something's really wrong. We really should be separated. 431 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 2: She told him to move out, and he did. Before 432 00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,040 Speaker 2: he left, he set up a meeting with a bankruptcy attorney. 433 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:28,800 Speaker 1: And I'm listening, but I'm still like in shock because 434 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,760 Speaker 1: I couldn't make sense of it. I'm like, well, how 435 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 1: are we bankrupt? Like, why are we bankrupt? Where is 436 00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:34,399 Speaker 1: the money? 437 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:37,960 Speaker 2: He told Libby this meeting would give her answers, but 438 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:42,199 Speaker 2: it didn't. The next day he came to her with 439 00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:42,960 Speaker 2: a new plan. 440 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,600 Speaker 1: He comes back and says, I think we could have 441 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: just you file bankruptcy and not me. The house was 442 00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:55,760 Speaker 1: solely in my name. I had no idea why he 443 00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:00,239 Speaker 1: wanted to do that. I just knew that. I was like, 444 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: you need to leave because I thought he wants to 445 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 1: saddle me with all of that. And he comes out 446 00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:10,919 Speaker 1: of that unscathed. It was enough for me to be like, 447 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,320 Speaker 1: I'm done. 448 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:19,920 Speaker 2: She couldn't stay in the marriage. She wanted a divorce. 449 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,399 Speaker 1: And it was like a race down to our attorneys. 450 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 2: They had both arrived at their separate attorney's offices at 451 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:30,240 Speaker 2: the same time. 452 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,359 Speaker 1: I was at my attorneys, he was at his attorneys. Well. 453 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: He wanted to make sure that he was the petitioner. 454 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 1: That was so important. Attack he needed to feel like 455 00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 1: he's the one that was divorcing me. 456 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 2: They started the process, but before any papers were signed, 457 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 2: Ted tried to take back control. 458 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: So as we're moving along in this divorce. I came 459 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 1: home and he's standing in our kitchen saying, I've called 460 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 1: the divorce off. That's exactly how he said it. I've 461 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,640 Speaker 1: called the divorce off. I'm like, okay, have you You've 462 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: called it off? And he said, and I've written this 463 00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 1: letter and I want you to read it. And the 464 00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 1: letter stated all the things that he had done to 465 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 1: me that were very unkind admitting everything. And then he says, 466 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,560 Speaker 1: I know you don't know anything about my business practices, 467 00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 1: but that will change, Like I'm going to let you 468 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:33,720 Speaker 1: in now on everything. But I still wasn't swayed by it, 469 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 1: because I thought, well, why was he resistant in the 470 00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:36,960 Speaker 1: first place. 471 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 2: The letter didn't change her mind. One line stood out, 472 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:46,280 Speaker 2: though I know you don't know anything about my business practices, 473 00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:51,120 Speaker 2: but that will change. It sounded like he was finally 474 00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 2: giving her what she wanted, transparency. The only problem he 475 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:02,360 Speaker 2: failed to mention the moment most important detail in. 476 00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: That letter I should point out he never says, by 477 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 1: the way, I've been committing mortgage fraud in your life's 478 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: about to implode. 479 00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 2: A few weeks after Libby and Ted began their divorce, 480 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,560 Speaker 2: Ted wanted to repair the relationship He wrote her a 481 00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 2: letter apologizing, promising to come clean about their finances, but 482 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,840 Speaker 2: Libby didn't trust it. She had a hunt that Ted 483 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:47,280 Speaker 2: was still hiding something, so she decided to turn to 484 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 2: the Louisville rumor mill. Libby knew her town well. If 485 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,320 Speaker 2: Ted was up to something, someone had to know. 486 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:00,680 Speaker 1: I would find out by a friends has There was 487 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: an attorney. He said that Ted was being investigated by 488 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,320 Speaker 1: the FBI. I was like what. 489 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 2: Ted was being investigated for? A complex mortgage fraud scheme 490 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 2: built on forged documents and phony buyers. Ted Khalid and 491 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 2: his coworkers were all in on it. 492 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 1: They found these straw buyers to buy these homes in 493 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 1: a dilapidated area of Louisville. 494 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 2: On paper, those buyers looked great. They had jobs, income, 495 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 2: and enough credit to qualify, but none of it was real. 496 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:42,880 Speaker 1: They made up their employment so they didn't make the 497 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 1: money that they said they did, so that would induce 498 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,680 Speaker 1: a lender to give them a loan when they shouldn't 499 00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: have had it in the first place. 500 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 2: But in the moment, Libby didn't know any of these details. 501 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 2: All she knew was that they were bankrupt and that 502 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,560 Speaker 2: her husband was being in investigated by the FBI. So 503 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 2: the next time Ted came over to the house, Libby 504 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 2: met him in the driveway to demand answers. 505 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:13,320 Speaker 1: And I remember this so clearly. I was in my 506 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 1: powder blue pajamas and I came out and I said, 507 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 1: what are you involved in? He knew at that point 508 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:24,920 Speaker 1: that I'm aware that something's wrong. And I said, are 509 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:31,640 Speaker 1: you being investigated by the FBI? And he looked at 510 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: me so coldly, like he never knew me, and he said, 511 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:41,200 Speaker 1: if I go down, I'm taking you with me. I 512 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:46,959 Speaker 1: go You owe me more of an explanation, And he said, verbatim, 513 00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:51,120 Speaker 1: I don't owe you anything, bitch. That's what he said 514 00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 1: to me. I don't owe you anything, bitch. 515 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,720 Speaker 2: The man she'd fallen in love with a decade ago 516 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:03,480 Speaker 2: was gone. Ted wasn't trying to protect her anymore. He 517 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 2: was trying to pull her down right alongside him. But 518 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 2: she wasn't about to let that happen. She made an 519 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:14,560 Speaker 2: appointment to speak with the authorities herself. A few days later, 520 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 2: Libby found herself walking into a federal building, her heart pounding. 521 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: And this is surreal to me. I mean, what minute, 522 00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 1: I'm married a stay at home mom and the next minute, 523 00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 1: I need to go and speak with the FBI. And 524 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:37,800 Speaker 1: so I get there and there were three agents and 525 00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: they're talking to me, asking me, you know, general questions. 526 00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:47,560 Speaker 2: Libby sat there trying to recall every conversation, every detail, 527 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,600 Speaker 2: every red flag she ignored about her husband. She wanted 528 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:54,120 Speaker 2: to help their case and show them she was innocent. 529 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 2: The agents left the room, Libby waited and waited. 530 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:04,960 Speaker 1: He comes back in and he said, the only thing 531 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:10,600 Speaker 1: you're guilty of is trusting your husband. That's all you're 532 00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:11,160 Speaker 1: guilty of. 533 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,040 Speaker 2: While the FBI built their case, Libby still had to 534 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 2: manage the divorce and bankruptcy filings. They short sold the 535 00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:22,200 Speaker 2: house and nearly everything they owned. 536 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:27,919 Speaker 1: I think my first real taste of what I would 537 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,280 Speaker 1: have to endare it was going to the grocery store 538 00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:35,440 Speaker 1: thinking that I had money, and I shopped you for 539 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 1: an hour, went to buy the groceries and there was 540 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,279 Speaker 1: no money, you know, no funds, and they had to 541 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:45,279 Speaker 1: pull my cart aside. And that's embarrassing. And I could 542 00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,920 Speaker 1: feel the sweat beating up and that was my first indication. 543 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,360 Speaker 1: I was like, this is bad. There's no money. 544 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,719 Speaker 2: In a matter of weeks, she went from never having 545 00:34:56,760 --> 00:35:00,120 Speaker 2: to think about money, to not having enough for groceries 546 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 2: to make matters worse, Ted became erratic. He knew the 547 00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:07,120 Speaker 2: FEDS were closing in on him. 548 00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:12,879 Speaker 1: Ted got really, really unruly. He would show up at 549 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 1: my house, hide behind a tree. It'd be like late 550 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 1: at night, and I would sit on the back of 551 00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:22,560 Speaker 1: my steps and he would come and yell at me. 552 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,319 Speaker 1: He would say the oddest things to me. He would 553 00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,719 Speaker 1: say things like, I will never be found guilty. I 554 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,360 Speaker 1: will be found innocent in a court of lot. And 555 00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:37,360 Speaker 1: he named himself Teflne Ted because the charges don't stick. 556 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:45,719 Speaker 2: But Ted's nickname didn't hold up. He was indicted and 557 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 2: the charges were serious mortgage fraud, bang fraud, wire fraud, 558 00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:55,560 Speaker 2: totaling millions of dollars. Ted was one of four men 559 00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 2: named in the indictment, along with Khalid and two other 560 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 2: men lived had never heard of. They'd been inflating the 561 00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,719 Speaker 2: value of homes, flipping them to each other at ballooned prices, 562 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:08,280 Speaker 2: and pocketing the difference. 563 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:14,040 Speaker 1: The scheme worked for a while, but then they started 564 00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,839 Speaker 1: to defall on these loans, and you know, someone's left 565 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: holding the bag. 566 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 2: The house of cards collapsed and Libby was the one 567 00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:27,800 Speaker 2: left trying to make sense of the wreckage After the indictment, 568 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,760 Speaker 2: It was another four years of hearings and negotiations before 569 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:35,600 Speaker 2: Ted was sentenced to prison. Libby tried her best to 570 00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:39,440 Speaker 2: co parent with him during this tense waiting period. He 571 00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 2: was ordered to pay one hundred and forty nine dollars 572 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:46,239 Speaker 2: a month in child support, practically nothing. As part of 573 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,920 Speaker 2: the divorce agreement, Libby and her daughter could stay in 574 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:52,840 Speaker 2: a condo owned by Ted's parents, but only for two years. 575 00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:55,640 Speaker 2: After that she would be on her own. 576 00:36:56,760 --> 00:37:00,239 Speaker 1: That's not a long time. When you don't have a job, 577 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:02,520 Speaker 1: you don't know if you have to go back to school, 578 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:06,840 Speaker 1: that goes by very quickly. My daughter was ten years old, 579 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 1: and that scared me a great deal. And what scared 580 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 1: me more is Ted defaulted on every single thing, so 581 00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 1: I had to go to court. 582 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:19,080 Speaker 2: Ted left behind a trail of defaulted debt, some of 583 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:23,440 Speaker 2: it in Libby's name through forged signatures, and I. 584 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:26,239 Speaker 1: Knew whose signature it was. It was my husband's. I 585 00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 1: recognized his paintwriting. 586 00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,399 Speaker 2: She tried to call the debt collectors, but as soon 587 00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 2: as she said Ted was her ex husband, they're tone shifted. 588 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 1: If you say it's somebody you don't know, then their alarm. 589 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 1: You say it's your husband. Uh, like we're one person. 590 00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:48,000 Speaker 1: It really was like I saw my identity over at 591 00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:48,440 Speaker 1: the altar. 592 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:54,000 Speaker 2: Her credit was wrecked and her sense of safety was gone. 593 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:57,080 Speaker 2: After those two years were up, she had to find 594 00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:00,680 Speaker 2: a new home. With nowhere to go, she and her 595 00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,320 Speaker 2: daughter moved into a Rundown apartment. 596 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 1: Pretty dilapidated place, roaches awful, but I needed a place 597 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:10,839 Speaker 1: to live. 598 00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 2: Because of her bankruptcy filing, she couldn't even get the 599 00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:16,560 Speaker 2: lights turned on in her name. 600 00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: They wouldn't even let me get electric in money without 601 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 1: a co center. And I'm like, well, am I just 602 00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:25,800 Speaker 1: going to freeze to death. 603 00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 2: One of the last times she saw Ted, she asked 604 00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:31,680 Speaker 2: him why he did. 605 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:35,319 Speaker 1: It it is answer was because I can't That's what 606 00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:38,359 Speaker 1: he said to me after all those years. And I said, 607 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: you bankrupted me. His answer was I bankrupted myself. It's 608 00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:45,840 Speaker 1: almost like he didn't care how that affected me. 609 00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,320 Speaker 2: One day, when Libby was at a particularly low point, 610 00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:52,520 Speaker 2: she decided to reach out to Ted's mother. 611 00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:57,400 Speaker 1: I asked his mom, I begged, and I said, we 612 00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:00,799 Speaker 1: need money. I said, do you realize that Ted only 613 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:04,000 Speaker 1: Patty's one hundred and forty nine dollars a month, and 614 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 1: her exact words were, that's what the courts say. 615 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,440 Speaker 2: This woman had welcomed her into their family and even 616 00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 2: given her that circle necklace to represent their bond. But 617 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,680 Speaker 2: Ted's parents wouldn't give her a cent, not even for 618 00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:21,200 Speaker 2: their granddaughter's education. 619 00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 1: And I couldn't believe it because I adored them. I mean, 620 00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:29,960 Speaker 1: they had so much. I couldn't understand why they wouldn't 621 00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:34,919 Speaker 1: be generous. They never gave me a dollar more. 622 00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 2: It was heartbreaking because she respected them and she thought 623 00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:43,440 Speaker 2: she was in their circle, but when she was drowning, 624 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,800 Speaker 2: they looked the other way. In the end, their loyalty 625 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,120 Speaker 2: was never to her, it was to Ted. 626 00:39:51,239 --> 00:39:54,040 Speaker 1: I felt like his parents thought I'd betrayed him by 627 00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:57,120 Speaker 1: not standing by my man. In quotes, if you will 628 00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,400 Speaker 1: it is, that's sort of I think they wanted me 629 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:03,400 Speaker 1: to do. But their son betrayed me. 630 00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:09,840 Speaker 2: Finally, Ted pled guilty. There was no trial, no courtroom showdown, 631 00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,640 Speaker 2: no witness stand where Libby could testify to what she'd lost. 632 00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:17,520 Speaker 2: In a way, Libby wanted to hear it all out 633 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:18,160 Speaker 2: in the open. 634 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,279 Speaker 1: If there's a trial you get to watch and you 635 00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,560 Speaker 1: can see what happened to your life. I wanted to 636 00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:26,920 Speaker 1: know what really happened. 637 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:30,960 Speaker 2: He was sentenced to eighteen months in federal prison and 638 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:36,080 Speaker 2: ordered to pay three million dollars in restitution. After the sentencing, 639 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:38,799 Speaker 2: Libby decided to go look for answers on her own. 640 00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:42,719 Speaker 1: I decided I wanted to do an archaeological dig on myself. 641 00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:47,759 Speaker 2: She called up an acquaintance who worked in the mortgage business. 642 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:51,000 Speaker 1: And I asked her, do you know what happened? Because 643 00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:54,640 Speaker 1: I thought she did, And she said, you know, Libby, 644 00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:57,439 Speaker 1: let me tell you something. You need to get on 645 00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:01,000 Speaker 1: online deed records. She goes, you might find yourself there. 646 00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:03,360 Speaker 1: I go, what do you mean, I've never been on 647 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,880 Speaker 1: that ever. She said, just take my advice and go look. 648 00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:12,280 Speaker 2: So Lebby did and what she found made her stomach turn. 649 00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:15,800 Speaker 1: Well, I go look at those deeds and there my 650 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,600 Speaker 1: name was. They had forged my name in that freud schime. 651 00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:22,200 Speaker 1: When I found that out, I sent a text message 652 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,920 Speaker 1: to my ex husband that I knew what he had 653 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:28,479 Speaker 1: done to me. You used me in your floud ski. 654 00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 1: I mean, what happens if the FBI would have thought 655 00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:33,880 Speaker 1: that I really was a part of that, and I 656 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:38,239 Speaker 1: was sitting in prison. He put my freedom in jeopardy 657 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:41,520 Speaker 1: and I never spoke a war to him again. 658 00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:47,040 Speaker 2: Libby took the forged documents to the police station to 659 00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:48,440 Speaker 2: try and press charges. 660 00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:52,640 Speaker 1: This detective called me and goes, you know, I was 661 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:57,120 Speaker 1: interested in your case. Here's the thing. Your husband's already 662 00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:01,480 Speaker 1: gone to prison. This case has been a unicated, so 663 00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:05,080 Speaker 1: there's nothing that we can do for you. And I thought, 664 00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,640 Speaker 1: why not? How come I can't do something for me? 665 00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,800 Speaker 1: I mean, it looks like I help facilitate that fraud. 666 00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:15,520 Speaker 1: But he said there was nothing that could be done. 667 00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:19,440 Speaker 2: If she couldn't get justice, she at least wanted to 668 00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:20,640 Speaker 2: set the record straight. 669 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,920 Speaker 1: I said, well, I want my name off those dats. 670 00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:27,160 Speaker 1: I didn't care if they sat there for ten years. 671 00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:32,040 Speaker 1: I did not want for generations it to look like 672 00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:33,640 Speaker 1: I committed that fraud. 673 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:37,719 Speaker 2: After eight years of back and forth, she got the 674 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:38,760 Speaker 2: documents amended. 675 00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:43,759 Speaker 1: It finally says on online deed records, my name was 676 00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:48,560 Speaker 1: obtained forged ex husband or others. It officially says that 677 00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:52,680 Speaker 1: now there's proof, and now I can set that rumor straight. 678 00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:58,440 Speaker 1: But words rumors really truly can harm you forever. 679 00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:03,000 Speaker 2: Even after she got the records fixed, she still hears 680 00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:06,319 Speaker 2: whispers rumors about her being in on it. 681 00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:10,560 Speaker 1: And people love it when people that they see as 682 00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:14,800 Speaker 1: being affluent, living the life, belonging to country clubs fall 683 00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:19,239 Speaker 1: I didn't grow up with all that. I appreciated it, 684 00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:22,080 Speaker 1: but a lot of people just assume, Oh, they deserve it, 685 00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:28,120 Speaker 1: they need I didn't know. I was financially illiterate, and 686 00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:32,200 Speaker 1: that I tell people, do not be that. If your 687 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:36,280 Speaker 1: significant other is push them back, that's a red flag. 688 00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:41,799 Speaker 2: It's a lesson. She learned the hardest way possible, but 689 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:46,839 Speaker 2: unlike the bankruptcy and the deeds, some consequences could never 690 00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:47,960 Speaker 2: be expunged. 691 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:53,720 Speaker 1: It affected my relationship with my daughter. A young girl 692 00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:58,759 Speaker 1: had this beautiful life and all of a sudden, it's 693 00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:03,200 Speaker 1: food stamps. People at school aren't being nice to her 694 00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:08,600 Speaker 1: because her dad's in prison. She was so upset in 695 00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:12,320 Speaker 1: here her father's going to prison. She just wanted to 696 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,879 Speaker 1: see him, and he got mad at her and sent 697 00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:19,440 Speaker 1: her an email from prison saying, don't be like your mother. 698 00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:25,040 Speaker 1: You won't do well in life from prison, and I thought, Wow, 699 00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:28,400 Speaker 1: what a statement to make. You're in a federal prison. 700 00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,680 Speaker 1: Telling you know, your daughter not to be like her mother. 701 00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,799 Speaker 2: Ted was released from prison in twenty ten. He never 702 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:39,319 Speaker 2: reached out to Libby. 703 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:43,120 Speaker 1: And then he got to transition right back into another 704 00:44:43,200 --> 00:44:46,279 Speaker 1: home and a condo that his parents owned. Was never 705 00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:49,920 Speaker 1: like that for me. I applied for affordable housing twice, 706 00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,280 Speaker 1: never could get it. 707 00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:55,520 Speaker 2: It's hard for Libby to stomach watching Ted end up 708 00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:59,320 Speaker 2: with a soft landing. She's had to fight tooth and 709 00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:02,759 Speaker 2: nail to reach build her life and regain financial stability. 710 00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:10,120 Speaker 2: Plus there's still big unanswered questions. Did Khalid really threaten 711 00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:14,480 Speaker 2: to kill her? What was really going on there to. 712 00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,759 Speaker 1: This day, I don't really know if that's true or not. 713 00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:21,120 Speaker 1: Maybe a fear tached I don't know. I don't know 714 00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:26,759 Speaker 1: if Ted was lying to me. Only Ted would know that. 715 00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:33,960 Speaker 2: She's had to come to terms with being in the 716 00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:38,360 Speaker 2: dark and not knowing everything about the crimes that destroyed 717 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:39,000 Speaker 2: her life. 718 00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:45,120 Speaker 1: I have to just live with never knowing, because maybe 719 00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:47,880 Speaker 1: somebody will come out of the woodwork to talk to 720 00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:51,360 Speaker 1: me and tell me they haven't yet. But you never know, 721 00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:55,080 Speaker 1: You never know what could happen. You're supposed to forgive 722 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:58,960 Speaker 1: people for yourself. I have a really hard time with that, 723 00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:03,840 Speaker 1: but I don't want to be bitter because that just 724 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:04,680 Speaker 1: eats you at. 725 00:46:07,120 --> 00:46:11,000 Speaker 2: We end every episode with the same question, why did 726 00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:13,839 Speaker 2: you want to tell your story? 727 00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:17,920 Speaker 1: I always warn that I didn't get the life that 728 00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:20,880 Speaker 1: I set out to have because I grew up with 729 00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:24,719 Speaker 1: such dysfunction. My dream was to be married to someone 730 00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,120 Speaker 1: who loved me. I know, it's silly with that house 731 00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:31,960 Speaker 1: and white picket fence and a nice family because I 732 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:37,960 Speaker 1: didn't have it. In the end, it's also a cautionary tale. 733 00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:42,000 Speaker 1: There's a lot in there that I would never do again. 734 00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:45,120 Speaker 1: I had a bake of kille and he put many 735 00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:47,680 Speaker 1: in it, and I was okay with that. He paid 736 00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:50,359 Speaker 1: all the credit cards, he did all of it, and 737 00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: I was clueless. You know, don't do that. Don't let 738 00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,839 Speaker 1: that happen to you. Some small things that I could 739 00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:00,760 Speaker 1: have done could have changed the course of my life. 740 00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:05,640 Speaker 1: And I mean literally, here I am today and while 741 00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:10,680 Speaker 1: life imploded, and I'm like, why did that happen? Maybe 742 00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:15,000 Speaker 1: to help other people, Maybe that's just as simple as that. 743 00:47:17,719 --> 00:47:22,240 Speaker 2: Next week on Betrayal Weekly, She's doing so many lives, 744 00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:24,520 Speaker 2: broken so many hearts. 745 00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:29,040 Speaker 1: It's just left me wondering, did she. 746 00:47:29,400 --> 00:47:41,759 Speaker 2: Ever have any love for any of us. If you 747 00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:43,800 Speaker 2: would like to reach out to the Betrayal team or 748 00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:46,600 Speaker 2: want to tell us your Betrayal story, email us at 749 00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:51,600 Speaker 2: betrayalpod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal pod at gmail 750 00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:55,360 Speaker 2: dot com. We're grateful for your support. One way to 751 00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:58,560 Speaker 2: show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts, 752 00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,920 Speaker 2: and don't forget to rate and Betrayal. Five star reviews 753 00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:04,680 Speaker 2: go a long way. A big thank you to all 754 00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:08,520 Speaker 2: of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, 755 00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:12,120 Speaker 2: a division of Glass Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. 756 00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,640 Speaker 2: The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason, 757 00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:20,240 Speaker 2: hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced 758 00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:25,200 Speaker 2: by Monique Leboard, also produced by Ben Fetterman. Associate producers 759 00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:28,920 Speaker 2: are Kristin Mercury and Caitlin Golden. Our iHeart team is 760 00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:33,000 Speaker 2: Ali Perry and Jessica Krincheck. Audio editing and mixing by 761 00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:38,560 Speaker 2: Matt Delvecchio, additional editing support from Tanner Robbins. Betrayal's theme 762 00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:43,320 Speaker 2: composed by Oliver Bains. Music library provided by my Music 763 00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:47,160 Speaker 2: and for more podcasts from iHeart, Visit the iHeartRadio app, 764 00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:51,000 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts from.