1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:06,720 Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media. Hello, and welcome to cool People who 2 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:09,559 Speaker 1: did cool stuff. You're weekly reminder that whenever there are 3 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:12,799 Speaker 1: bad things happening, there are also cool people trying to 4 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:16,560 Speaker 1: stop those bad things, or morally complicated people trying to 5 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:19,599 Speaker 1: stop those bad things, or people I hate trying to 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:21,959 Speaker 1: stop those bad things. There's always people trying to stop 7 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:25,279 Speaker 1: the bad things. I am your host, Margaret Kiljoy, and 8 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 1: for this series I'm doing right now, it's just me 9 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: and you. You in this context is the microphone, but 10 00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: you're also the listener. Isn't that weird. I'm alone in 11 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 1: a closet that's been sound treated, and yet you're here 12 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: with me. It's so strange. I've been enjoying experimenting with 13 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:47,560 Speaker 1: these sort of scripted episodes as a way to break 14 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:50,800 Speaker 1: up the format, and I've like kind of had this 15 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: idea of doing a particular series, and this is that series. 16 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: It's the series that I wanted to do with no guest. 17 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 1: Of course, we still have producers like our producer Sophie 18 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: Lickterman and our audio engineer Eva hi Eva, and everyone 19 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: who's listening has to say hi to Eva. You're not 20 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 1: off the hook just because there's no guests saying it too. 21 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: Our theme music was written for us by unwoman. Our 22 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: topic these coming weeks is neoliberalism and the worldwide movement 23 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 1: that worked successfully to stem its spread. It's a bit 24 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: strange to think about nowadays because a core component of 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: neoliberalism was a series of free trade agreements that broke 26 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 1: down trade barriers between countries. Our problem right now, as 27 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:42,760 Speaker 1: I record this is essentially the opposite. The Trump administration 28 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 1: has embraced trade war as a core policy. Tariffs are 29 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: one of their primary weapons that they are using to 30 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:53,720 Speaker 1: make the rich richer. But you can also use free 31 00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: trade agreements to make the rich richer. It's really just 32 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: about how you want to do it. They have so 33 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 1: many options about green US All over, Neoliberalism seems well 34 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:08,280 Speaker 1: and truly dead, or at least taken a real long nap, 35 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 1: and you can go up and poke it with a 36 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 1: stick and be like, oh, it's totally just napping. And 37 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:16,639 Speaker 1: what was born from its corpse or you know, sleeping 38 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 1: body who swear I'll wake up. Don't worry. Don't worry, liberals, 39 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:24,120 Speaker 1: it'll come back. What was born from neoliberalism's corpse seems 40 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:28,359 Speaker 1: even worse because it's fascism spoiler alert. That's what grew 41 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: out of its corpse. It is easy then to look 42 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 1: back and assume all those free trade agreements were good 43 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:37,239 Speaker 1: things because the fascists want to get rid of them. 44 00:02:37,840 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 1: They were not good things. They did not help the 45 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:48,240 Speaker 1: poor of the developing nations or the developed nations. This 46 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 1: series of episodes is going to take us on a 47 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 1: winding course of their history that explains the horizontal shape 48 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: of the global left during the turn of the millennium, 49 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: and along the way we're going to talk mostly about 50 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: the Zapatista, the indigenous bottom up leftists in Chiappus, Mexico 51 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 1: who have carved out an impressive amount of autonomy from 52 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: the state, as well as the Alter Globalization movement that 53 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:12,640 Speaker 1: brought together a global movement of farmers and punks and 54 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:17,119 Speaker 1: a thousand other types of people besides and ended, through creative, 55 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:21,920 Speaker 1: mostly nonviolent direct action, the spread of a neoliberal world order. 56 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: These are some of the most successful movements in history 57 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,519 Speaker 1: and some of the most successful experiments with direct democracy 58 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 1: and history at scale, but since none of them seize 59 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:37,320 Speaker 1: state power, their accomplishments are often overlooked. It was the 60 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 1: Alter Globalization movement that swept me up into politics a 61 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: couple decades ago. And we'll see how much I do 62 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:48,040 Speaker 1: or don't weave my own story into these episodes. This 63 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 1: whole series is a bit ambitious, so I'm going to 64 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 1: have to start with maybe even more than my usual 65 00:03:53,840 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 1: fair share of content. We're going to start by talking 66 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 1: about neoliberalism. What the fuck is neoliberalism. It's a word 67 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 1: that gets tossed around a lot, which a lot of 68 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:12,560 Speaker 1: people assume they know it means. But many of the 69 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:15,920 Speaker 1: people who assume that they know what it means are 70 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: wrong and are using it wrong. First and foremost, just 71 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 1: think to yourself, neoliberalism has more or less nothing to 72 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 1: do with being a liberal. They both come from the 73 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:32,400 Speaker 1: same root economic and political concepts, but they're really just different. 74 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 1: It's a Venn diagram and not a circle. And they're 75 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,680 Speaker 1: not just different because one is neo, because one's the 76 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: new of it. It is important to understand that political 77 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:49,800 Speaker 1: terminology is and has always been a mess. If you 78 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: call yourself a Republican, for example, what you actually believe 79 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,800 Speaker 1: as a Republican depends on where and when you're living. 80 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: If you're a Republican in Ireland, you might be a 81 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 1: militant socialist. If you're a republican in nineteen thirty Spain, 82 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 1: you might be one of the most diehard anti fascists 83 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: to ever live. If you're a Republican in the US, well, 84 00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: in a nineteenth century you were vaguely progressive. During most 85 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: of the twentieth century you were a conservative, and in 86 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: the present era you're something closer to a fascist than 87 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:25,479 Speaker 1: you are to a traditional conservative. You simply cannot look 88 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 1: at a political group and judge them based on the 89 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 1: labels they use, or you'll wind up with nonsense, like 90 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 1: the people who believe the National Socialist Party was leftist. 91 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 1: Part of the problem is that world politics don't actually 92 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 1: map well to a simple left right to dichotomy. Anarchists 93 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:48,480 Speaker 1: and stalinists are both leftists but believe in fundamentally opposing things. 94 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: The nationalist right and the pro globalization right are fundamentally 95 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,080 Speaker 1: different things, as we're seeing now that the nationalist right 96 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: is ascendant over the neoliberal right. Classical liberalism, which is, 97 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:07,080 Speaker 1: you know, sort of the origin of the word liberalism. 98 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 1: It's an old timey belief structure that basically says we 99 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: should be free from government interference in most things, including 100 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:19,280 Speaker 1: our business dealings, and I'm not trying to downplay it 101 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: is it is the belief structure that brings us capitalism. 102 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:27,520 Speaker 1: But when people talk about being a liberal in the 103 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 1: US these days, they usually mean it in contrast to conservative, 104 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:33,520 Speaker 1: or if you're far enough left, they mean it in 105 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:39,400 Speaker 1: contrast to you know, progressive or leftist or radical. But 106 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: in general it's liberal versus conservative, and so a liberal 107 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 1: will tend towards believing in social liberty the freedom to 108 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:51,359 Speaker 1: have or not have a religion, for example, and is 109 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:55,559 Speaker 1: less specifically concerned about the economic stuff in capitalism. Though 110 00:06:55,839 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 1: most liberals have been generally supportive of capitalism, that starting 111 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 1: to change as well. The Cold War has been gone 112 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:08,040 Speaker 1: long enough that people are starting to actually have breathing 113 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 1: room to critique capitalism, which is very nice neoliberal in 114 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 1: contrast to being a liberal. It's the capitalism side of 115 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: liberalism without any real thought given one way or another, 116 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 1: to the personal side of it. Neoliberalism would ostensibly be like, sure, 117 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 1: you can be gay or not believe in God, or 118 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 1: believe in God or whatever. I guess, but that's not 119 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: what neoliberalism is about at all. It is about capitalism. 120 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:40,120 Speaker 1: Neoliberalism is an ideology built around the spread of free 121 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: market capitalism and how that needs to spread around the world, 122 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: and not just in like a nice way, like hey, 123 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 1: I have some beans, would you like to buy them? 124 00:07:48,880 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: We should set it up so that you can buy 125 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: the beans. You know. It's not a like Timu utopia. 126 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 1: Maybe it is, but Timu is probably actually a dystopian. Instead, 127 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: neoliberal is around using aggressive programs to gut the social 128 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:09,680 Speaker 1: services of various countries and specifically force places to privatize everything. 129 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 1: Many many cultures around the world have ancient histories of 130 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: keeping many things in public ownership. We've talked about this 131 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: a lot on the show. It's almost like you find 132 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: a place and you will find that the traditional structure 133 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:27,560 Speaker 1: for people to you know, work the land or whatever 134 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:34,280 Speaker 1: is essentially communal, and neoliberalism is like, nope, none of that. 135 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: Everything's a business now. And look, I know it's a 136 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: little early for an ad break, but how can I 137 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 1: not use that as a transition to an ad break 138 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:48,559 Speaker 1: Because one of the things that's a business is this 139 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:53,200 Speaker 1: very podcast, and we are in the business of selling 140 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:58,800 Speaker 1: advertisers the time on our show, and here is that 141 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: happening everyone feels great, everyone's having a good time, and 142 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:15,839 Speaker 1: we're back. Neoliberalism is absolutely not the only version of capitalism. 143 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: It presents itself as the only version of capitalism. And 144 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 1: I'm not even like trying to defend old timey capitalism, 145 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 1: but like neoliberalism is, like, this is what capitalism is, 146 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 1: and it's just not. It's only in the past fifty 147 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: years or so that neoliberalism has gained much traction at all. 148 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 1: Around the end of World War Two, as the world 149 00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:42,400 Speaker 1: really decided to get settled into a nice, long, cozy 150 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 1: cold war with proxy wars that are not cold, the 151 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: dominant strain of capitalist politics was Knesyan politics. Kaynesyan politics 152 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:55,000 Speaker 1: comes from a nineteen thirty six book written by this 153 00:09:55,040 --> 00:10:00,040 Speaker 1: British guy, John Maynard Keynes. The book is called so 154 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 1: the General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money. And I 155 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 1: will be honest with you, I am not an economist. 156 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: I spent way too long this week trying to and 157 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:16,959 Speaker 1: even sometimes succeeding, at learning the difference between mercantile capitalism 158 00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 1: versus classical economics versus Kenzian understandings versus neo classical versus 159 00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: neoliberal and I still could not tell you everything about 160 00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 1: the difference between classical and Knesy and understandings of like 161 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:34,559 Speaker 1: long run aggregate supply or whatever the fuck. I can 162 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: tell you that Knesy and economics, the economics that was 163 00:10:38,640 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: dominant during the World War two and afterwards for several decades, 164 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 1: is pretty into government intervention in the markets. It's pretty 165 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 1: much like, well, we want markets, and we want capitalism, 166 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: but we want them to do what we want to do. 167 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,439 Speaker 1: We want the government to be in charge of capitalism, 168 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:02,440 Speaker 1: and so it would have more of an attempt to 169 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 1: fight unemployment and things like that. Neoliberalism was the underdog 170 00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:11,760 Speaker 1: ideology back then for decades. It took a really long 171 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 1: time for it to gain popularity. They present this as 172 00:11:15,679 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 1: this like natural evolution, where people just figured out it's better, 173 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 1: but they did not luck their way onto the world stage. Instead, 174 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 1: they spent all kinds of money. I read the transcript 175 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:28,360 Speaker 1: of a speech from someone pointing out that they spent 176 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: hundreds of millions of dollars developing think tanks and institutions 177 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:36,319 Speaker 1: and foundations and shit. To present the idea of neoliberalism 178 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 1: as like the natural world order. They claim that unfettered 179 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:43,960 Speaker 1: capitalism is the natural way for humans to interact, and 180 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,920 Speaker 1: that indeed, the only moral way for people to act 181 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:50,360 Speaker 1: is in fierce competition with each other. This has been 182 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 1: a key component of neoliberalism since probably the start, not 183 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:57,280 Speaker 1: just the competition thing, but that this is the natural thing. 184 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: It's like, honestly kind of religious. It's really easy to 185 00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:03,800 Speaker 1: point to an ideology don't like and be like, it's 186 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 1: basically religion, and I do it every now and then. 187 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 1: But that's because people structure their ideologies in similar ways 188 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:13,760 Speaker 1: as religion, and the two things are not as distinct 189 00:12:13,840 --> 00:12:19,520 Speaker 1: as atheistic ideological adherents of the right or the left 190 00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 1: wants you to believe. Neoliberalism says that the market is 191 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:29,839 Speaker 1: the ultimate decider of well everything. This is part of 192 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 1: why it's so at odds with any kind of nationalism. 193 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 1: It basically hates the concept of government outside of desiring 194 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:40,080 Speaker 1: for there to be systems that can use violence to 195 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:43,679 Speaker 1: defend the private property of the wealthy, like in an 196 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:50,240 Speaker 1: ideal neoliberal situation. Literally, the government exists just to make 197 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 1: sure that capitalism stays in charge, and that's the only 198 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,320 Speaker 1: thing it does. To quote the activist and author, the 199 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: one who's transcript, I was talking about earlier Susan George. 200 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 1: Neoliberalism says that quote, the economy should dictate its rules 201 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 1: to society, not the other way around. Neoliberalism really got 202 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 1: its start in England when returning villain of the Pod 203 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 1: Margaret Thatcher aka the only bad Margaret. There's probably other 204 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 1: bad Margarets too, but you know, she's the worst of them. 205 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: I actually feel pretty confident about that because she's kind 206 00:13:27,559 --> 00:13:31,320 Speaker 1: of one of the worst people who's ever lived in 207 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 1: terms of just sheer destruction of environment, traditional ways of living, work, 208 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: or protection people's lives. Bad Margaret just a real bad 209 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 1: one in contrast to the best Margaret. Margaret Thatcher stepped 210 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 1: onto the world stage in nineteen seventy one when she 211 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 1: became the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. If you 212 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 1: want to hear more about how she gutted the working 213 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 1: class of England, smash unions, started bullshit wars and accidentally 214 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:05,360 Speaker 1: engendered a pretty sick punk scene. Listen to our episodes 215 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:11,119 Speaker 1: about the band Crass, and there's actually in those episodes 216 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:15,720 Speaker 1: some origin to what's going to become the ultra globalization 217 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 1: movement that it's probably a thread we won't trace as 218 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: much again during this time, So it's probably worth going 219 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 1: and listening to whether or not you like the band Crass, 220 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: because that's the fun thing about history stuff, is that, like, 221 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: it's not me just listening to the band Crass, it's 222 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 1: talking about all of the things that happened during that 223 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:36,800 Speaker 1: time in place that is pretty fundamental because this is 224 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 1: where neoliberalism got its start. Anyway, Margaret Thatcher, her slogan 225 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: was Tina Ti na there is no alternative, because yeah, 226 00:14:48,720 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 1: neoliberals are not convinced that their way is the right way. 227 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: They're convinced it's literally the only way. Before she took power, 228 00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: ten percent of people in Britain lived low the poverty line. 229 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 1: By nineteen ninety six, it was one in four and 230 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 1: one in three children. It's got a little better in 231 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 1: the thirty five years since she left office. It is 232 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 1: one in five now. So you know, bully to that, 233 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 1: I don't know a bully to that means I'm trying 234 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:23,840 Speaker 1: to speak in British slang, but all I know is cheerio. 235 00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 1: I don't know anything British. Never mind, But don't worry. 236 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 1: We don't just stay in the UK. America got its 237 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 1: own neoliberal very shortly thereafter in Ronald Reagan and I 238 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 1: probably know the eighties America slang rad I don't know. 239 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 1: Under neoliberalism, money fled the public sector and poured into 240 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 1: the coffers of the wealthy. By design, public services were 241 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: gutted and privatized. Unions were attacked on every front and 242 00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: in many cases destroyed. The first time I spent any 243 00:15:57,320 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 1: time in West Virginia, I spent a lot of time 244 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 1: talking union coal miners who had, you know, fought during 245 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 1: the death of the coal mining unions in the eighties, 246 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:13,520 Speaker 1: and just like them describing how this culture that they 247 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 1: had built up, you know, for generations that you know, 248 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 1: coal mining's not the best thing that's ever happened for 249 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: anyone involved, but at least they had built these incredible 250 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:27,160 Speaker 1: unions after an incredible amount of conflict, and they were 251 00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:30,280 Speaker 1: just destroyed in the eighties. And it's so funny to 252 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:32,200 Speaker 1: me because then conservatives come in are like, well, we 253 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: care about the coal miners. The liberals are trying to 254 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: get rid of it, and you're like, motherfucker, all those 255 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:41,960 Speaker 1: coal miners used to be all liberal as hell, like 256 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: progressive as hell. It was one of the most heavily 257 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 1: unionized industries until you all destroyed it. Anyway, I'm not bitter. 258 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: I am bitter. Unions were attacked on every front and 259 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 1: in many cases destroyed. The strong welfare state that saw 260 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:01,720 Speaker 1: the West through the Cold War was beginning to disappear. 261 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: So in an odd way, it was the working classes 262 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:09,600 Speaker 1: of the US and the UK that were the first 263 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:14,000 Speaker 1: to suffer under neoliberalism, at least as I've been able 264 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 1: to track down. But don't worry. Soon it'll be destroying 265 00:17:17,440 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 1: the entire world. But first, all of history needs to 266 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 1: come to an end, at least if you ask the capitalists. 267 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 1: The other thing the capitalists will say if you ask 268 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:33,600 Speaker 1: them is that you should buy the stuff that advertises 269 00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: on this show. Although I talk all this shit, but 270 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:40,679 Speaker 1: sometimes we get advertisements for like genuinely good things like 271 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:44,880 Speaker 1: get your flu shot, or go outside or don't talk 272 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 1: to cops. So I don't know what if you had 273 00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: to use your own judgment instead of listening to what 274 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: I said, and decided how you felt about these things, 275 00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:05,639 Speaker 1: wouldn't that be wild? And we're back. I promised you 276 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: the end of history. See. The Cold War eventually ended famously. 277 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 1: It came to an end when the Western liberal democracies 278 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:15,240 Speaker 1: won in nineteen ninety one with the collapse of the 279 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: Soviet Union, or maybe in nineteen eighty nine with the 280 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: fall of the Berlin Wall, and that, according to a 281 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:27,440 Speaker 1: popular idea at the time, was the end of history. 282 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 1: There was this author and political scientist, an American named 283 00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:34,400 Speaker 1: Francis Fukuyama, who wrote an essay in nineteen eighty nine 284 00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:39,480 Speaker 1: called the End of History in an international relationships journal 285 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 1: put out by a think tank. The journal is called 286 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 1: The National Interest. Later, Fukiyama developed these ideas into a book, 287 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:52,520 Speaker 1: The End of History and the Last Man. And basically 288 00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: in this work he argues that, well, there's a one 289 00:18:56,600 --> 00:19:01,119 Speaker 1: sentence quote by him that sums it up. Well, what 290 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,399 Speaker 1: we may be witnessing is not just the end of 291 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: the Cold War or the passing of a particular period 292 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:10,639 Speaker 1: of history, but the end of history as such. That 293 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: is the endpoint of mankind's ideological evolution and the universalization 294 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 1: of Western liberal democracy as the final form of human government. 295 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:25,720 Speaker 1: You will not be surprised to know that Fukuyama was 296 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:28,439 Speaker 1: a Reagan advisor, and for a while he was one 297 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 1: of the principal theorists of neo conservativism. What's neoconservativism, You 298 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: might ask, Surely that would be the opposite of neoliberalism, right, 299 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:44,000 Speaker 1: it is not, To be honest, the easiest way to 300 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: understand neo conservativism is that it's sort of the militant 301 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:52,479 Speaker 1: wing of neoliberalism, or its militant cousin. This isn't quite true, 302 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:54,400 Speaker 1: and the two do have some differences, and there's people 303 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: who would identify with one and not the other. Neoconservativism 304 00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 1: is the idea that we should use military terry force 305 00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 1: to spread western capitalist democracy. I actually think that it 306 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,199 Speaker 1: maybe started just as like we should spread western capitalist democracy, 307 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: and the military force thing just sort of was a 308 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 1: very logical extension of that. But neoliberalism is more concerned 309 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 1: about spreading capitalism, but is more excited about free trade 310 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: agreements than bombing places into accepting democracy, and neo conservatives 311 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 1: are a bit more into strong government, specifically a strong 312 00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 1: defense sector, big government, guns and nothing else. All taxes 313 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 1: go towards guns, but not fun ones for you and 314 00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:44,360 Speaker 1: your friends. Does that sound familiar? It's because we live 315 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 1: in a world that was created by neo conservativism and neoliberalism. Anyway, 316 00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 1: our guy Fukiyama, who declared the end of history, was 317 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,680 Speaker 1: a theorist of neo conservativism, but he actually balked once 318 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 1: the second Bush started the Iraq War because he realized 319 00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:02,600 Speaker 1: that neo conservativism just led to unrestrained militarism. I think 320 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: he was kind of a true believer or biz. I 321 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: think he's alive, you know, in like Western democracy rather 322 00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:14,080 Speaker 1: than specifically like military supremacy. By two thousand and eight, 323 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 1: he endorsed Obama and believes in a strong welfare state 324 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:19,679 Speaker 1: as part of a liberal democracy. So he's actually not 325 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 1: a neoliby either. But this idea the end of history, 326 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 1: is more important to my story than its author's own 327 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 1: political arc. History was over after the end of the 328 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 1: Cold War. There was just this thing in the air 329 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:37,119 Speaker 1: that that's it, We're done. Nothing new is going to 330 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: happen politically, and for a few years that felt almost true. 331 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 1: The war was over and capitalism reigned over the field 332 00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 1: of the glorious dead soldiers of the Cold War. But 333 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 1: it's worth understanding that by and large, excepting the last 334 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,920 Speaker 1: decade or so of the war, the sort of liberal democracy, 335 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: the capitalist democracy that won the Cold War, was actually 336 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 1: a bit economically progressive. It certainly emphasized a strong welfare state. 337 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: One could even say, and it has been said, I 338 00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:12,359 Speaker 1: believe multiple people in my long source list, that it 339 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: was the welfare state that defeated the USSR. In a 340 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 1: welfare state, anyone who can do so is self sufficient. 341 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 1: Under capitalism, anyone who fails at that is kept from 342 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 1: falling to rock bottom by a strong social safety net. 343 00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 1: While some people in the West did complain here and 344 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: there about welfare being like halfway to socialism, the welfare 345 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:37,720 Speaker 1: state basically provided an essential pressure release valve that kept 346 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,240 Speaker 1: actual socialism, which involves workers owning the means of production, 347 00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:46,679 Speaker 1: from taking hold among the disenfranchised of society. With actual 348 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:50,959 Speaker 1: socialism and ideological threat like during the Cold War, the 349 00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:55,760 Speaker 1: welfare state did well as an alternative. You also have 350 00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,920 Speaker 1: the social democracies like those in Northern Europe, which combined 351 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 1: a strong welfare state with moderate attempts at actual public 352 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:07,280 Speaker 1: ownership of services. But after the Cold War, the welfare 353 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: state and social democracy started to fall out of favor because, well, 354 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:16,440 Speaker 1: to borrow from the capitalist view of things, when capitalism 355 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: itself had the ideological monopoly with no competition, it had 356 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,919 Speaker 1: no incentive to care for its customer citizen. When the 357 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:29,880 Speaker 1: Soviet States fell, capitalism and its roused and most corrupt 358 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:34,160 Speaker 1: form fled in to fill the vacuum. This is actually 359 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: pretty specific evidence of how this was not a democratic process, 360 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,719 Speaker 1: because that's not what people wanted in the former Soviet States. 361 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:45,639 Speaker 1: One of my favorite authors and one of my favorite 362 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,640 Speaker 1: people to quote on this show is the anthropologist David Graeber. 363 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,920 Speaker 1: His ethnography of the Alter Globalization movement, direct Action and Ethnography, 364 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,399 Speaker 1: is one of my main sources for these episodes, and 365 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 1: in that book he wrote quote, with st. Jallenism dead, 366 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: most Marxists expected to see a renaissance of more humane 367 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:08,560 Speaker 1: forms of Marxism. Social democrats believed that they had finally 368 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,919 Speaker 1: won the argument with the revolutionary left and expected to 369 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,160 Speaker 1: shepherd the former subjects of the Soviet Bloc into their fold. 370 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:20,119 Speaker 1: A reasonable expectation since when polled, most of the population 371 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:22,679 Speaker 1: of Central and Eastern Europe said that they wanted to 372 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:27,720 Speaker 1: model their new economies on Sweden. Instead, they got shock 373 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:32,959 Speaker 1: therapy and the most savage form of unrestricted capitalism. End. 374 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:36,159 Speaker 1: So the end of the Cold War wasn't the beginning 375 00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: of peace. And prosperity, but the beginning of capitalism developing 376 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,639 Speaker 1: into an even more evil beast. The end of history 377 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,720 Speaker 1: had been announced. Liberal democracy is the final form of 378 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,840 Speaker 1: human organization. All that was left was to mop up 379 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:51,960 Speaker 1: the pieces on the board and to do the work 380 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:57,440 Speaker 1: of spreading capitalism and one specific understanding of democracy all 381 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 1: over the globe. Co Of course, if you grew up 382 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:04,000 Speaker 1: entrenched in the winning side of the Cold War, you 383 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: grew up being told that democracy and capitalism are synonyms. 384 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:11,119 Speaker 1: But nothing could be further from the truth. If you 385 00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: want to listen to me talk about one of the many, 386 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:17,080 Speaker 1: many other origins of democracy, including influencing our legal structures today, 387 00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:20,520 Speaker 1: listen to my recent episode with kat Abogazala talking about 388 00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: the origins of English common law and the pre Roman 389 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 1: indigenous traditions of the Britonic speaking Celts. So that doesn't 390 00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:30,800 Speaker 1: mean that the USSR was a bastion of freedom or 391 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: anything either, just that more than one thing can be 392 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:39,000 Speaker 1: bad at once. So neoliberalism is all the rage among 393 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:40,840 Speaker 1: people who are rich and want to get richer. Now, 394 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 1: the version of capitalism the neoliberals wanted to push all 395 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:51,120 Speaker 1: over the world is something called the Washington Consensus, much 396 00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:53,640 Speaker 1: like how our End of History guy wound up distancing 397 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 1: himself from the neo conservative movement that he helped build. 398 00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:01,400 Speaker 1: The Washington Consensus, Guy John Williamson wound up pretty sad 399 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,359 Speaker 1: about how directly his ideas were tied to neoliberalism and 400 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:08,120 Speaker 1: economic imperialism and walked back a bunch of his own 401 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:11,159 Speaker 1: points in retrospect in a very defensive and kind of 402 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:16,200 Speaker 1: amusing way. Basically, he put together a list of ten 403 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 1: points to say, this is what Washington DC economists largely 404 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:24,520 Speaker 1: think is the plan for all countries. I e. It's 405 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:28,960 Speaker 1: the Washington Consensus, and it's a list of things like 406 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:36,159 Speaker 1: privatize everything and remove economic regulation, and poor countries have 407 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 1: to tighten their belts and be more fiscally responsible, and 408 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:45,440 Speaker 1: property rights must be enforced. The organizations most heavily involved 409 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:49,159 Speaker 1: in spreading neoliberalism are the International Monetary Fund in the 410 00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: World Bank, which both started back in the nineteen forties. 411 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:56,159 Speaker 1: They both exist to try and keep international trade flowing, 412 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 1: and both ostensibly work to help their member nations become 413 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:04,120 Speaker 1: more economically active and wealthier, and the difference between them 414 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:08,120 Speaker 1: is annoying. I'll just say that I have read many 415 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: articles about the difference between them, and they work hand 416 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: in hand. Is honestly the easiest way to think about it. 417 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:20,119 Speaker 1: To skip ahead a little, I was a teenager living 418 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: near DC during some of the protests against the World 419 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,439 Speaker 1: Bank and the IMF in the year two thousand and 420 00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:27,520 Speaker 1: I had no idea what any of that shit was. 421 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:30,640 Speaker 1: I remember I was on the Metro in DC, where 422 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,320 Speaker 1: I've been off to a youth Pride day. I thought 423 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 1: I was straight and I was just a good ally. 424 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:40,399 Speaker 1: I spent most of my time organizing LGBT stuff. What 425 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,119 Speaker 1: a surprise. Anyway, I took the Metro into DC to 426 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 1: go to youth Pride Day and it was the same 427 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,400 Speaker 1: day as a sixteen, the April sixteenth protests in DC 428 00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 1: against all this shit, all the neoliberal world order, and 429 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 1: the train car was full of alter globalization protesters, and 430 00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: there's this woman dressed up like a faery and she 431 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,800 Speaker 1: comes over and it's like, hey, are you kids going 432 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,440 Speaker 1: to the protest against the IMF? And I was like, no, 433 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,920 Speaker 1: what's that? And at least as I remember it, what 434 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,439 Speaker 1: she said was they loan money to developing nations, but 435 00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 1: it's bad. And I remember I was like sixteen. I 436 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 1: remember just thinking like, man, fuck off, lady, Like that's 437 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:24,800 Speaker 1: not a like. I was not convinced by this argument. 438 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,160 Speaker 1: Two years later, I would get arrested at a protest 439 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:33,199 Speaker 1: in DC against the IMF and the World Bank. I 440 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,159 Speaker 1: think how we talk about these things matters because you 441 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 1: can tell a version of the IMF and the World Bank, 442 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 1: and you still can. They're still around. You can go 443 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: to their websites and read their history like I did 444 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,400 Speaker 1: while researching this episode, and they're just like, oh, we're 445 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,880 Speaker 1: like saviors of the poor. Basically the world exists because 446 00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:54,360 Speaker 1: of us. But that's not true, right, And so I 447 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: don't want to just tell you the IMF loans money 448 00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,360 Speaker 1: to developing nations and it's bad. Though, in all fairness 449 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 1: to the fairy on the Metro, it is factually correct. 450 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 1: They do loan money to developing nations, and it is bad. 451 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:10,400 Speaker 1: The IMF loans money to developing nations the same way 452 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 1: the mafia loans you money to start a business, except 453 00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: actually the mafia is probably a lot nicer because I think, 454 00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 1: as long as you pay on time, it probably works 455 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 1: out alright. Obviously, I've seen a lot of movies where 456 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 1: it doesn't work out all right, But you know, loans 457 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 1: from the IMF actually look an awful lot more like 458 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,360 Speaker 1: every bit of folklore you've ever read about making a 459 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 1: deal with a literal devil at a crossroads somewhere. In 460 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,880 Speaker 1: order to pay back these loans, countries are forced to 461 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:42,719 Speaker 1: restructure themselves and to be more economically productive, but not 462 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 1: productive for themselves, but for the purpose of paying back 463 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,360 Speaker 1: these predatory loans. It's more like, Oh, you want to 464 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: pay me back, You're gonna have to work how many 465 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 1: hours a day? Well, how many you got? And social services, 466 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 1: environmental protections, and labor rights all gone austerity measures for everyone. 467 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: These were called structural adjustment programs, so they didn't even 468 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 1: have to elect neoliberals. With these new democracies that they're 469 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:17,120 Speaker 1: blowing people up into having, right, they literally can force 470 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:22,680 Speaker 1: all kinds of even sort of socialist politicians into accepting 471 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,640 Speaker 1: these structural adjustment programs. I don't know whether we're going 472 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:27,040 Speaker 1: to get into that more on the show or not, 473 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 1: but that's happened time and time again. It's actually one 474 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 1: of the major problems with using electoral politics and developing 475 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 1: nations to confront these issues is that the issues actually 476 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:43,360 Speaker 1: aren't coming from the developing nations, and there are examples 477 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:47,320 Speaker 1: of people successfully defaulting on loans and things like that. 478 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,880 Speaker 1: But overall, basically all of these people would get voted 479 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:55,280 Speaker 1: into office on a like to hell with the IMF, 480 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,840 Speaker 1: we want economic prosperity for ourselves and no structural adjustment programs, 481 00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 1: and then like within a year they're all like, well, 482 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:05,960 Speaker 1: the rest of the world has a really big stick, 483 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:11,240 Speaker 1: and so austerity for everyone. This is comparable to the 484 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 1: system that has left Haiti one of the poorest countries 485 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 1: on Earth after the Haitian Revolution throughout the slavers and 486 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 1: broke the country off from France. Listen to our episodes 487 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,600 Speaker 1: about that the Western powers impose so much interest bearing 488 00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,120 Speaker 1: debt onto the place that its wealth has poured out 489 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 1: of the country ever since. You basically always have to 490 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:35,440 Speaker 1: remember that when communities or nations are poor, it is 491 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 1: not because they don't produce wealth, but because that wealth 492 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:43,720 Speaker 1: is extracted. It is for this reason that neoliberalism is 493 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:48,320 Speaker 1: seen as a fundamentally colonial enterprise, a neo colonialism, if 494 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,280 Speaker 1: you will. In poor communities here in the States, you 495 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 1: can physically see the institutions that extract value from them 496 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: like take a chain start. If you go and spend 497 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:04,280 Speaker 1: your money at a McDonald's or whatever, whatever community you're in, 498 00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 1: that money now leaves that community unless the people at 499 00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: the very top also live in that community, because like, yeah, 500 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: it makes jobs, but literally it wouldn't be worth it 501 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 1: for the chain store if people working those jobs didn't 502 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:19,960 Speaker 1: produce more value, then you give them, right. This is 503 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 1: the sort of basis of well Marxist understandings of the world. 504 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:26,040 Speaker 1: But also just like the way that the modern capitalist 505 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: system works is that like, if you make two dollars 506 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:31,920 Speaker 1: worth of stuff an hour, the boss can give you 507 00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:33,920 Speaker 1: a dollar and you go home with a dollar, and 508 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: the boss goes home with a dollar, and so the 509 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: boss gets a dollar or the owner really is a 510 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:41,000 Speaker 1: better way to think of this than the boss, you know. 511 00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:42,680 Speaker 1: And then if you have ten employees, the boss is 512 00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 1: now making ten dollars and et cetera. Right, And so 513 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 1: chain stores extract wealth no matter how many jobs they 514 00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 1: put into an area, they extract wealth from an area. 515 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: You can also see other institutions that extract value from 516 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:02,400 Speaker 1: poor neighborhood. It's like ones that keep people trapped in 517 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,640 Speaker 1: a cycle of debt, like payday loan sharks and the 518 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:10,640 Speaker 1: cash bail system of the prison industrial complex. And when 519 00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 1: you've stripped away a regent's social safety net, and I 520 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: could be talking about a country, or I could be 521 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 1: talking about an impoverish neighborhood in America, people become desperate. 522 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:25,320 Speaker 1: And that's where soft power comes in the USAID, which 523 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 1: is because in the news a lot I now know 524 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 1: it's called USAID. I would have called it USAID because 525 00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:32,479 Speaker 1: it looks like USAID and it's AID. But anyway, whatever, 526 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:36,120 Speaker 1: the USAID that is currently being stripped away was a 527 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,160 Speaker 1: big part of this soft power, as were a ton 528 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:43,400 Speaker 1: of other non governmental organizations or NGOs within the States. 529 00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:45,880 Speaker 1: You could talk about nonprofits doing the same thing in 530 00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 1: poor neighborhoods. Not all NGOs and nonprofits participate in soft power, 531 00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 1: but plenty you do. Because when you remove a country's 532 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:57,440 Speaker 1: ability to be economically productive internally and force them to 533 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,480 Speaker 1: provide you with things instead, you can show up and 534 00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 1: be their savior and make them reliant on you simply 535 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:08,480 Speaker 1: by keeping them from starving to death. Whereas actual economic 536 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:14,839 Speaker 1: justice is about reversing the flows of economic extraction. And 537 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 1: if you want to see a really sweet example that 538 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: I've actually never done episodes about directly here in the 539 00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:23,759 Speaker 1: United States. I want to push people towards it's technically 540 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,279 Speaker 1: a nonprofit, I believe. I want to push people to 541 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,800 Speaker 1: look towards something called Seed Commons, which I think we 542 00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:30,719 Speaker 1: talked about. Actually we did talk about this a bit 543 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 1: in the Argentinian Worker Cooperative episode. Basically, a lot of 544 00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:39,360 Speaker 1: what I understand about reversing economic extraction comes from some 545 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,480 Speaker 1: of the thinkers who work at this organization called Seed 546 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:47,799 Speaker 1: Commons that helps build worker cooperatives in all kinds of 547 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 1: places and does so specifically to say, like our communities, 548 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,719 Speaker 1: you know, it's largely run by people of color. Our 549 00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: communities create wealth and then that wealth is extracted from us. 550 00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:05,399 Speaker 1: But by creating worker cooperatives, we not only build workplace democracy, 551 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,360 Speaker 1: but we also keep money and what we produce within 552 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 1: our own neighborhoods and we enrich that and we stop 553 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,960 Speaker 1: economic extraction. And it's not even about like isolation either. 554 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:21,040 Speaker 1: It's just literally about not getting ripped off. And so yeah, 555 00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:25,960 Speaker 1: you should go watch their videos and learn more about them. Anyway, 556 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 1: this economic extractive process, the idea that like, oh well, 557 00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:34,279 Speaker 1: sure you could produce wealth for yourself, but instead you 558 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 1: have to produce wealth for us. Is exactly what genocided 559 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 1: the Irish in the nineteenth century in the so called 560 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:43,719 Speaker 1: potato famine. There was no potato famin. I mean, yes, 561 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:47,400 Speaker 1: there was a potato blight that happened, right. I actually 562 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:50,520 Speaker 1: managed to recreate the potato famine that sounds really bad 563 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,200 Speaker 1: at my own house last year because I grew a 564 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,000 Speaker 1: lot of potatoes and they all got the potato blight 565 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:56,320 Speaker 1: that I think my friend was explaining is the actual 566 00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:59,360 Speaker 1: potato blite of what destroyed everything like these all my 567 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:01,600 Speaker 1: potatoes came out bad, with like bugs in them and stuff. 568 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:04,759 Speaker 1: My sweet potatoes came out okay, because actually the thing 569 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:07,200 Speaker 1: that solves this is growing a diversity of crops. And 570 00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 1: the Irish were quite capable of growing non potato food, 571 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,000 Speaker 1: but the English were forcing them to export that stuff 572 00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 1: because it was a colony. And the soft power that 573 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,760 Speaker 1: England sent in return was like nearly an edible corn 574 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:23,279 Speaker 1: and shit like that. And Ireland still doesn't have the 575 00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 1: same population it did before this genocide. So I don't 576 00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:32,399 Speaker 1: like the system of economic extraction very much. You might 577 00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:36,840 Speaker 1: have figured that out by now. So history has ended 578 00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 1: and neoliberalism is sweeping the globe, and country after country 579 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:44,400 Speaker 1: is watching its public sector privatized and its labor rights demolished, 580 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:47,400 Speaker 1: and its natural resources extracted and shipped off to the 581 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 1: global North. But people didn't like that. And some of 582 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:55,480 Speaker 1: those people, well, they'd been fighting regular colonialism for about 583 00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,319 Speaker 1: five hundred years, so they knew a thing or two 584 00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:01,879 Speaker 1: about fighting this neo colonialism them too, And they lived 585 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:05,240 Speaker 1: in Chiappus, Mexico. And they are going to rip open 586 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:09,000 Speaker 1: a wound in neoliberalism for everyone to see and for 587 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,480 Speaker 1: everyone to pour through. And they're called the Zapatistas. And 588 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:18,799 Speaker 1: we'll start talking about them on Wednesday. That's my cliffhanger. 589 00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,360 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the whoops All Context episode. But 590 00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:25,640 Speaker 1: don't worry. It's not a whopsal context series. It's just 591 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:30,200 Speaker 1: a whipsal context episode. And I don't know if I 592 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 1: have any plugs. I might just plug seed comments again. 593 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:37,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna plug worker cooperatives. Like people when they think 594 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 1: of cooperatives, they're like, oh, you know, they often think 595 00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,400 Speaker 1: of customer cooperatives, right, like when you go to a 596 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:45,960 Speaker 1: grocery store and it costs too much money, which actually 597 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,560 Speaker 1: doesn't even need to be the way that that kind 598 00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:49,520 Speaker 1: of cooperative works either that. We did a whole series 599 00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:52,640 Speaker 1: of those with food historian Ren Awrye talking about the 600 00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:56,920 Speaker 1: history of food cooperatives. But fire your boss, or if 601 00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,560 Speaker 1: you're the boss, sell your business to your employees and 602 00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:04,040 Speaker 1: become one equal with them. Worker cooperatives are they even 603 00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,319 Speaker 1: are fairly competitive economically, But that's like kind of less 604 00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 1: the important thing. We get told every day of our 605 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:13,920 Speaker 1: life that we're supposedly, you know, in the liberal world order, 606 00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:16,560 Speaker 1: we're in charge of ourselves, but we are not. Because 607 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:21,120 Speaker 1: we go to work and democracy stops at the door 608 00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 1: to your office, and you have a boss, and you 609 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:27,440 Speaker 1: have an obligation to produce more value for your boss 610 00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:32,600 Speaker 1: than they give you back. You are personally economically extracted 611 00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:38,480 Speaker 1: from and that sucks. And one of the ways to 612 00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:42,839 Speaker 1: stop that is by building worker cooperatives. And building it 613 00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 1: is a fantastic way to build worker power. Unions are great, 614 00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:50,240 Speaker 1: but I am far more interested in creating our own things. 615 00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:54,160 Speaker 1: So that's my pitch for worker cooperatives. Oh, I could 616 00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:56,120 Speaker 1: turn that into a pitch for my own worker cooperative. 617 00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 1: I am part of an anarchist publishing cooperative called Strangers 618 00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,000 Speaker 1: in a Tangle Wilderness, and we put out a bunch 619 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,319 Speaker 1: of stuff, books and zines. We mail out a zine 620 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:07,600 Speaker 1: every single month to our Patreon backers at ten dollars 621 00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: or more a month, and it could be all kinds 622 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:11,640 Speaker 1: of things. The most recent one that I got in 623 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,360 Speaker 1: the mail from us I'm not in charge of this part, 624 00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:17,600 Speaker 1: is called I Don't Know. It's about how to throw 625 00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,440 Speaker 1: DIY parties and shows and stuff. But we also do 626 00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:22,920 Speaker 1: like fiction, and we do poetry, and we do all 627 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:25,200 Speaker 1: kinds of how to's and fun things. And we have 628 00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: a bunch of different podcasts. We have one that I 629 00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:29,799 Speaker 1: am a co host of called Live Like the World 630 00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:32,440 Speaker 1: Is Dying about individual and community preparedness. We have one 631 00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:35,680 Speaker 1: called The Spectacle, which is for people who love movies 632 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,680 Speaker 1: and hate cops. And we have one called Strangers and 633 00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,400 Speaker 1: Entangled Wlderness, which is actually the monthly zine read to 634 00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:43,279 Speaker 1: you by a voice actor and then an interview with 635 00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:45,520 Speaker 1: the person who creates it. And so you can check 636 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:47,720 Speaker 1: out all that stuff. Almost everything we do is available 637 00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:52,400 Speaker 1: for free as well. Books we make available digitally as 638 00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:54,960 Speaker 1: cheap as we can. We have some audio books and 639 00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:59,680 Speaker 1: including some of my own books, Strangers, Entangled, Wilderness, That's 640 00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:07,760 Speaker 1: My Plug, a Order Cooperative, and see you Wednesday. Cool 641 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,239 Speaker 1: People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of cool 642 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:13,520 Speaker 1: Zone Media. For more podcasts and cool Zone Media, visit 643 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,799 Speaker 1: our website coolzonmedia dot com, or check us out on 644 00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:21,359 Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.