WEBVTT - Aaron | Betrayal Weekly

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<v Speaker 1>Hey everyone, just a note before we begin. This episode

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<v Speaker 1>discusses suicidal ideation. Please take care when listening. Betrayal Weekly

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<v Speaker 1>is officially back. This is season three, episode one. Each

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<v Speaker 1>episode tells a unique story of deception and broken trust,

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<v Speaker 1>and each storyteller has found their own path forward. Whether

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<v Speaker 1>you've been with us from the beginning or you're just

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<v Speaker 1>tuning in, welcome, We are starting this season with Aaron's story.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm at work, just plugging away, and I get an

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<v Speaker 2>email notification on my smartphone. I look down and it's

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<v Speaker 2>from the FBI ari information about Sabrina Taylor.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Andrea Gunning in This is Betrayal, a show about

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<v Speaker 1>the people we trust the most and the deceptions that

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<v Speaker 1>change everything.

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<v Speaker 2>My name is Aaron Ward. I'm a software engineer working

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<v Speaker 2>in video games.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron spent his whole career working on popular video games.

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<v Speaker 2>I worked on Halo Infinite, I worked on Minecraft. I've

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<v Speaker 2>worked on a bunch of little projects for Nintendo. One

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<v Speaker 2>of my minor claims to fame is I had the

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<v Speaker 2>number one played game on nick dot com in two

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<v Speaker 2>thousand and eight, which was SpongeBob SquarePants Refrumble.

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<v Speaker 1>Aarin's a third generation computer nerd. He grew up in

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<v Speaker 1>rural Ohio with his siblings and parents who worked in

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<v Speaker 1>computer science.

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<v Speaker 2>My parents were what I would call upper middle class,

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<v Speaker 2>both white collar, working professionals.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron's parents made enough money for their families to live comfortably,

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<v Speaker 1>but a lot of people in their community struggled to

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<v Speaker 1>make ends meet. His parents tried to give back wherever

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<v Speaker 1>they could.

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<v Speaker 2>My parents always volunteered a lot. They were very generous,

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<v Speaker 2>and they also helped lead a lot of local fundraisers.

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<v Speaker 1>His parents taught him to be generous with his money

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<v Speaker 1>and his time.

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<v Speaker 2>My parents were a lot about honesty and a lot

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<v Speaker 2>about trying to help people that needed it.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron spent most of his free time playing video games

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<v Speaker 1>or reading about them.

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<v Speaker 2>I was a really big Nintendo fan, and I had

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<v Speaker 2>a subscription to Nintendo Power.

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<v Speaker 1>Nintendo Power was a magazine all about Nintendo games. It

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<v Speaker 1>had comics, game reviews, and articles. Aaron read every issue,

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<v Speaker 1>and when he was in fifth grade, he read an

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<v Speaker 1>article that sparked his interest.

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<v Speaker 2>They mentioned the opening of the digit Campus.

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<v Speaker 1>Digitpen is a college near Seattle that specializes in video

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<v Speaker 1>game design. Even though Erin was only in fifth grade,

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<v Speaker 1>I knew.

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<v Speaker 2>Very early on. That's really what I wanted to do

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<v Speaker 2>with my life.

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<v Speaker 1>Getting into DigiPen became Aaron's life goal.

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<v Speaker 2>One of our freshman year activities when I was in

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<v Speaker 2>high school was writing three things that you wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>try to accomplish in your life. My three things were

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<v Speaker 2>working on a triple A video game title, graduating from DigiPen,

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<v Speaker 2>and being a Jeopardy Champion.

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<v Speaker 1>As of this recording, Aaron is not a Jeopardy Champion yet,

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<v Speaker 1>but he's accomplished his other two goals. His senior year

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<v Speaker 1>in high school, he was accepted into DigiPen. He left

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<v Speaker 1>the farms and factories of rural Ohio and jumped headfirst

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<v Speaker 1>into a world of video games. It was exciting and

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron learned a lot, but DigiPen had one big shortcoming.

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<v Speaker 2>DigiPen has a ninety five to five male to female ratio,

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<v Speaker 2>so DigiPen was four years of having almost no female socialization.

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<v Speaker 2>As someone who had mostly female friends in high school,

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<v Speaker 2>that was a big change for me.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron noticed how being in a male dominated environment was

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<v Speaker 1>impacting the people around him, and he didn't like what

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<v Speaker 1>he saw.

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<v Speaker 2>I had seen a lot of my peers at DigiPen

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<v Speaker 2>starting to go down that path of misogyny because they

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<v Speaker 2>weren't being around women in their day to day lives,

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<v Speaker 2>so the only women they were exposed to were actresses

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<v Speaker 2>or people in the media.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron didn't want to go down that path, so he

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<v Speaker 1>read books and worked with his therapist to learn what

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<v Speaker 1>healthy relationships really looked like.

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<v Speaker 2>One thing I learned is to try to not be

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<v Speaker 2>transactional in relationships. It's not about I do this for you,

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<v Speaker 2>do this thing for me. Relationships need to be about

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<v Speaker 2>the broader scope of caring for each other and being

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<v Speaker 2>there for each other when stuff is hard.

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<v Speaker 1>After graduating from college, Aaron and some friends moved into

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<v Speaker 1>an apartment together. He was working as a video game

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<v Speaker 1>programmer and loved the life he'd built. He felt ready

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<v Speaker 1>to meet someone and decided to give dating in Seattle

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<v Speaker 1>a try.

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<v Speaker 2>I was not super outgoing. I was not a go

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<v Speaker 2>out to the bars and meet someone kind of person,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's when I turned to internet dating. At the

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<v Speaker 2>time two thousand and seven, the iPhone is barely a thing.

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<v Speaker 2>There is no tender, so what I'm left with option

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<v Speaker 2>wise are Craiglist personals.

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<v Speaker 1>Craigslist personals was a subsection of Craigslist for people who

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<v Speaker 1>were looking for relationships, romantic connections, or friendships. You could

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<v Speaker 1>post an ad about yourself and what you were looking for.

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<v Speaker 2>I had noticed there was a glut of men looking

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<v Speaker 2>for women ads, so I mostly focused on responding to

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<v Speaker 2>the few women that had posted their ads up.

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<v Speaker 1>One day, while scrolling through Craigslist, Aaron saw an ad

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<v Speaker 1>that caught his attention.

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<v Speaker 2>The headline of it was about how white guys are

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<v Speaker 2>scared to date black women, and it intrigued me enough

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<v Speaker 2>to at least read it. In the ad, she talked

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<v Speaker 2>about how she was a nerdy black woman who grew

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<v Speaker 2>up in a largely white Midwestern area, and how the

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<v Speaker 2>white men of the Seattle area had never seemed to

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<v Speaker 2>approach her or approached her in very poor ways.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron responded to the ad, apologizing on behalf of the

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<v Speaker 1>white nerdy men of Seattle. The author of the post

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<v Speaker 1>thought his response was funny and wrote him back.

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<v Speaker 2>I found out her name was Sabrina. We exchanged pictures

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<v Speaker 2>over email and had a couple of email back and

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<v Speaker 2>forth before we decided to go out on a date

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<v Speaker 2>to the local off leash dog.

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<v Speaker 1>Park on the day of their date, Aaron headed to

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<v Speaker 1>the dog park feeling nervous but excited.

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<v Speaker 2>She showed up looking just like her pictures with her

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<v Speaker 2>pet Dalmatian Satchel, who was very sweet, and we ended

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<v Speaker 2>up taking a nice long hour plus walk where we

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<v Speaker 2>both went through our lives and the things we have

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<v Speaker 2>in common. She grew up in Iowa, I grew up

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<v Speaker 2>in Ohio, so we both grew up in the Midwest.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron immediately felt relaxed around Sabrina.

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<v Speaker 2>We also talked about all of our different nerdy interests,

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<v Speaker 2>video games, anime, television shows. We were both big Sailor

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<v Speaker 2>Moon fans. We had both played basically every Nintendo game

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<v Speaker 2>that had ever been made, Mario's, Zelda's Final Fantasies.

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<v Speaker 1>After their first date, Aaron couldn't wait to see Sabrina again.

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<v Speaker 1>He invited her to hang out with him and his

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<v Speaker 1>friends at a pub they liked on the east side

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<v Speaker 1>of Seattle. He was a little nervous with Sabrina click

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<v Speaker 1>with his friends, but as soon as she showed up,

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<v Speaker 1>his nerves melted away.

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<v Speaker 2>She got along with basically everybody. She is magnetic and

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<v Speaker 2>draws a lot of people around her to listen to

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<v Speaker 2>her talk about whatever she's talking about. She's definitely the

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<v Speaker 2>kind of person that can make friends very easily in

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<v Speaker 2>a crowd.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron loved hanging out with his friends with Sabrina by

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<v Speaker 1>his side.

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<v Speaker 2>The fact that she was so charismatic was excreefly attractive

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<v Speaker 2>to me. It really helped fill in some of my

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<v Speaker 2>gaps of getting conversations started and breaking the ice socially

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<v Speaker 2>with new people.

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<v Speaker 1>After that night at the pub, Aaron and Sabrina had

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<v Speaker 1>their first kiss.

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<v Speaker 2>We had great physical chemistry as well as having a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of things in common, so that really felt like

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<v Speaker 2>it was kind of a meant to be situation.

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<v Speaker 1>They started spending more and more time together. Soon they

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<v Speaker 1>were officially boyfriend and girlfriend. They had long conversations about

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<v Speaker 1>their backgrounds and dreams for the future.

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<v Speaker 2>She was an intern for the Bill and Melinda Gates

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<v Speaker 2>Foundation and she was finishing up her double bachelors in

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<v Speaker 2>public health and women's studies, with her end goal being

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<v Speaker 2>becoming a doctor. She had big plans for her life

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<v Speaker 2>going forward. That was something that was attractive to me.

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<v Speaker 2>In a possibly forever partner.

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<v Speaker 1>With Sabrina, the world felt big.

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<v Speaker 2>We went on a couple of little trips to the

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<v Speaker 2>coast and being with her just really got me out

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<v Speaker 2>of my shell and got me out of my apartment

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<v Speaker 2>with my roommates and out doing things, even if it

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<v Speaker 2>was just shopping or wandering around Pipe Place Market.

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<v Speaker 1>And of course they loved playing video games together.

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<v Speaker 2>She would have a game that she really liked the

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<v Speaker 2>story of wasn't quite dexterous enough to beat, and so

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<v Speaker 2>she'd get us started and I would do the later

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<v Speaker 2>harder levels for her so we could both see the

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<v Speaker 2>ending of the game.

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<v Speaker 1>They were on the same team.

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<v Speaker 2>Sabrina really made me feel seen and appreciated in a

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<v Speaker 2>way that I hadn't been for a while. She always

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<v Speaker 2>made me feel like I was a priority in her life,

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<v Speaker 2>and I tried to do the same.

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<v Speaker 1>They began to talk about their long term goals.

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<v Speaker 2>I wanted the stereotypical white picket fence wife, two and

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<v Speaker 2>a half kids, et cetera. She was looking toward medical school,

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<v Speaker 2>so kids and getting married and stuff that was down

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<v Speaker 2>the road a bit, and I was okay with that.

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<v Speaker 2>At this point, we're still early to mid twenties, so

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<v Speaker 2>we've got some time.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron and his friends moved into a new house together

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<v Speaker 1>in Seattle's Capitol Hill neighborhood.

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<v Speaker 2>A month after me and my roommates had moved into

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<v Speaker 2>the house, Sabrina comes to me and says that her

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<v Speaker 2>apartment is going condo. Obviously, she can't afford to buy it,

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<v Speaker 2>and she's not making a lot of money as an

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<v Speaker 2>intern at the Gates Foundation, and she's still trying to

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<v Speaker 2>finish up that last month or two of school. She

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<v Speaker 2>basically doesn't have anywhere to go.

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<v Speaker 1>So Sabrina moved in with them.

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<v Speaker 2>I was excited to move in with my girlfriend, even

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<v Speaker 2>if it was on a slightly faster schedule than I

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<v Speaker 2>was planning on in my head. I was happy to

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<v Speaker 2>have her with me every day, waking up with me,

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<v Speaker 2>going to bed with me, just beg here out all

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<v Speaker 2>the time.

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<v Speaker 1>In true Sabrina fashion, she made the transition easy. She

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<v Speaker 1>brought a lot of laughter and funded the house.

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<v Speaker 2>She got along really well with my roommates. She integrated

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<v Speaker 2>very quickly into the friend group. It was just a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of fun to have everybody living together. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>we all played rock band together, and we could kind

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<v Speaker 2>of be loud and crazy because we weren't sharing a

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<v Speaker 2>wall with anybody, but.

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<v Speaker 1>Living in the same house also meant seeing each other's

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<v Speaker 1>daily struggles up close. Sabrina had been dealing with chronic

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<v Speaker 1>back pain. Aaron saw just how much of a toll

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<v Speaker 1>it was taking on her.

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<v Speaker 2>It had gotten bad enough that she had to call

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<v Speaker 2>out of work a couple of days for it. So

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<v Speaker 2>I encouraged her to go to the doctor and, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>kind of get this checked out.

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<v Speaker 1>Sabrina agreed. The day of her appointment arrived, and when

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron came home from work, he was anxious to hear

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<v Speaker 1>how it went.

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<v Speaker 2>I come home and she's seated on the couch, looking

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<v Speaker 2>very defeated. So I sit down and I hold her hand,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's when she tells me her doctor had diagnosed

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<v Speaker 2>her as having multiple sclerosis.

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<v Speaker 1>When Aarin and his girlfriend, Sabrina moved in together, Aaron

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<v Speaker 1>realized how much her chronic back pain was impacting her

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<v Speaker 1>day to day life. He encouraged her to go to

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<v Speaker 1>the doctor's and she did. When she came back from

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<v Speaker 1>her appointment, Erin could tell right away that something was wrong.

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<v Speaker 2>So I sit down and I hold her hand and

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<v Speaker 2>I asked her what happened that day, and that's when

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<v Speaker 2>she tells me that her doctor had diagnosed her as

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<v Speaker 2>having multiple sclerosis.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron held her close as Sabrina began to cry.

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<v Speaker 2>She started talking about all the things that she might

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<v Speaker 2>not be able to do, and I tried to come

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<v Speaker 2>for her the best I could.

0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:06.760
<v Speaker 1>Aaron was in shock. His grandfather, Harlan, had died of

0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:11.400
<v Speaker 1>multiple sclerosis, so Aaron knew how difficult MS could be.

0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:15.960
<v Speaker 2>I heard the horror stories from my dad about how

0:14:16.000 --> 0:14:21.000
<v Speaker 2>bad it was for Harlan. I had known a couple

0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:24.400
<v Speaker 2>of friends that had an MS and had their lives

0:14:24.400 --> 0:14:27.640
<v Speaker 2>cut pretty short. I had a thumb in the air

0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.280
<v Speaker 2>guess of her life expectancy being somewhere in the fifties,

0:14:30.320 --> 0:14:35.160
<v Speaker 2>maybe if she was already diagnosed before we had turned thirty.

0:14:35.280 --> 0:14:36.840
<v Speaker 2>I was just devastated.

0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:42.200
<v Speaker 1>Their shared dreams for the future, house kids, growing old

0:14:42.240 --> 0:14:44.880
<v Speaker 1>together crumbled in front of his eyes.

0:14:46.120 --> 0:14:49.840
<v Speaker 2>I didn't know what to do besides just hold her

0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:53.040
<v Speaker 2>and tell her. I promised to help her through whatever

0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:55.800
<v Speaker 2>came up. I was going to do whatever it took.

0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:03.440
<v Speaker 1>Though it only been dating a year, Aaron was committed

0:15:03.480 --> 0:15:06.600
<v Speaker 1>to staying by her side whatever their future held.

0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:10.600
<v Speaker 2>I never had the thought of not committing to it.

0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:12.840
<v Speaker 2>It didn't scare me off. I was in for the

0:15:12.880 --> 0:15:15.080
<v Speaker 2>long haul at this point. I wanted to be there

0:15:15.080 --> 0:15:19.000
<v Speaker 2>for her. This is the reality now, so let's figure

0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:20.440
<v Speaker 2>it out. Let's do what we can.

0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:25.560
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina had an undergraduate degree in public health, so I.

0:15:25.560 --> 0:15:27.800
<v Speaker 2>Kind of let her take the driver's seat as far

0:15:27.840 --> 0:15:31.640
<v Speaker 2>as learning about the disease and letting me know what

0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:34.479
<v Speaker 2>she needed from me to assist.

0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:39.480
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's first symptom was back pain, but over time she

0:15:39.600 --> 0:15:42.120
<v Speaker 1>started experiencing other symptoms as.

0:15:42.040 --> 0:15:48.360
<v Speaker 2>Well, generalized soreness and limb pain, and casual exercise from

0:15:48.440 --> 0:15:51.080
<v Speaker 2>like walking the dog was starting to bother her. So

0:15:51.680 --> 0:15:54.160
<v Speaker 2>walking the dog became entirely by responsibility.

0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:58.640
<v Speaker 1>Then standing at all became a challenge.

0:15:58.640 --> 0:16:01.640
<v Speaker 2>So I took over a larger share of the housework

0:16:01.920 --> 0:16:05.360
<v Speaker 2>and basically all the cooking. It was a little exhausting.

0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.520
<v Speaker 2>Quite frankly, it's kind of just lucky I was still

0:16:08.520 --> 0:16:10.280
<v Speaker 2>in my late twenties and I kind of still had

0:16:10.320 --> 0:16:13.000
<v Speaker 2>the energy to do all of that. A lot of caffeine,

0:16:13.320 --> 0:16:14.080
<v Speaker 2>a lot of sugar.

0:16:16.200 --> 0:16:19.400
<v Speaker 1>Aarin did everything he could to make Sabrina as happy

0:16:19.440 --> 0:16:22.400
<v Speaker 1>as possible during this incredibly challenging time.

0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:26.080
<v Speaker 2>I was paying for a lot of makeup a lot

0:16:26.120 --> 0:16:31.320
<v Speaker 2>of clothes. She had very particular tastes. As my dad

0:16:31.400 --> 0:16:34.120
<v Speaker 2>liked to say, she has champagne taste in a beer pocketbook.

0:16:34.600 --> 0:16:38.560
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina was working at a nonprofit, but her symptoms quickly

0:16:38.640 --> 0:16:40.520
<v Speaker 1>began interfering with her job.

0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:43.400
<v Speaker 2>She's been calling out of work a couple times a

0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:46.920
<v Speaker 2>month at this point. One day she calls me up

0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:49.280
<v Speaker 2>and says, well, I got fired.

0:16:50.320 --> 0:16:53.320
<v Speaker 1>Aaron was immediately defensive of Sabrina.

0:16:53.280 --> 0:16:56.000
<v Speaker 2>What the hell happened? They can't just fire you if

0:16:56.000 --> 0:16:56.480
<v Speaker 2>you're sick.

0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:01.240
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina explained that she had called out of work because

0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:04.439
<v Speaker 1>she was having a high pain day, but then she

0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:08.000
<v Speaker 1>had to run an errand that couldn't wait, and while

0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:11.240
<v Speaker 1>she was out, she ran into her boss.

0:17:11.720 --> 0:17:16.080
<v Speaker 2>Her boss had seen her out shopping on a day

0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:18.480
<v Speaker 2>when she was supposedly in so much pain she couldn't

0:17:18.480 --> 0:17:19.080
<v Speaker 2>get out of bed.

0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:21.480
<v Speaker 1>Aarin was frustrated.

0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:23.359
<v Speaker 2>If you're calling out, you need to stay home.

0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:26.400
<v Speaker 1>He told her to just let him handle the errand

0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:27.320
<v Speaker 1>next time.

0:17:27.520 --> 0:17:31.800
<v Speaker 2>After she's fired from her job, she's basically stuck at home.

0:17:32.800 --> 0:17:36.840
<v Speaker 2>She talks about going back to medical school. I'm very

0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:39.960
<v Speaker 2>encouraging of this because she needs to have a job.

0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:44.680
<v Speaker 2>For us to function as a unit. I don't make

0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:47.280
<v Speaker 2>enough money to support us both forever.

0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:53.159
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina still needed a few more college credits before she

0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:56.639
<v Speaker 1>could apply to medical school, so she enrolled in community

0:17:56.680 --> 0:18:00.880
<v Speaker 1>college classes. Arin was now the sole per for both

0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:05.680
<v Speaker 1>of them, but Sabrina's spending habits didn't slow down. Aaron

0:18:05.800 --> 0:18:07.840
<v Speaker 1>was left scrambling to cover the costs.

0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:13.200
<v Speaker 2>I end up getting paiday loans and spending a good

0:18:13.240 --> 0:18:16.359
<v Speaker 2>chunk of every payday going to each payday loan place

0:18:16.640 --> 0:18:18.919
<v Speaker 2>to pay the loan off, and then immediately loan the

0:18:18.920 --> 0:18:19.560
<v Speaker 2>money again.

0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:23.679
<v Speaker 1>He watched his credit card bills stack up. Sabrina was

0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:27.000
<v Speaker 1>still spending money on luxury items like make up and

0:18:27.040 --> 0:18:30.600
<v Speaker 1>clothes while they were struggling to make ends meet. It

0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:36.000
<v Speaker 1>was unsustainable and stressful. Aaron confronted Sabrina about her spending

0:18:36.040 --> 0:18:37.520
<v Speaker 1>habits a few times.

0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:43.000
<v Speaker 2>It usually broke down into a lot of tears and

0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:47.240
<v Speaker 2>promising to do better and saying I should be able

0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:48.760
<v Speaker 2>to live comfortably.

0:18:52.040 --> 0:18:55.320
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's symptoms were progressing, and she wanted to make the

0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:57.679
<v Speaker 1>most of the years where her quality of life was

0:18:57.720 --> 0:19:01.840
<v Speaker 1>still relatively good. I want to experience the world and

0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:05.200
<v Speaker 1>fill her days with things that brought her joy. Aaron

0:19:05.320 --> 0:19:09.200
<v Speaker 1>wanted that too, but the financial pressure on him was mounting.

0:19:09.760 --> 0:19:13.119
<v Speaker 1>He was also paying for all of Sabrina's medications.

0:19:13.680 --> 0:19:18.639
<v Speaker 2>After losing her job with the nonprofit, Sabrina struggled to

0:19:18.720 --> 0:19:22.720
<v Speaker 2>maintain insurance. She would tell me that, oh, I've got

0:19:22.760 --> 0:19:24.800
<v Speaker 2>my insurance set up. It's fine, you can go in.

0:19:24.920 --> 0:19:26.080
<v Speaker 2>It won't cost that much.

0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:29.200
<v Speaker 1>But when Aaron went to the pharmacy and they ran

0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:32.280
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's insurance, it often didn't go through.

0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:37.359
<v Speaker 2>So it goes from twenty thirty bucks to three hundred

0:19:37.400 --> 0:19:41.399
<v Speaker 2>four hundred bucks. That was several hundred dollars that I

0:19:41.600 --> 0:19:44.800
<v Speaker 2>usually didn't have every month. But I have to have

0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:48.280
<v Speaker 2>the medication today because we're out. Medication is not something

0:19:48.320 --> 0:19:49.080
<v Speaker 2>you can live without.

0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:52.680
<v Speaker 1>So Aaron did whatever had to be done to make

0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:55.359
<v Speaker 1>sure Sabrina got her medications on time.

0:19:56.040 --> 0:20:00.280
<v Speaker 2>It often came down to borrowing money from people, or

0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:04.520
<v Speaker 2>paying bills late, or the internet get shut off for

0:20:04.520 --> 0:20:07.520
<v Speaker 2>a few days, having the rent check bounce, just to

0:20:07.560 --> 0:20:09.760
<v Speaker 2>make sure that the medications were filled on the day

0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:10.760
<v Speaker 2>they needed to be filled.

0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:17.359
<v Speaker 1>As the months went on, Sabrina's MS symptoms worsened. She

0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:21.240
<v Speaker 1>began using a cane for walking assistance. It was harder

0:20:21.280 --> 0:20:24.800
<v Speaker 1>for her to keep her balance, and she began fainting frequently.

0:20:25.480 --> 0:20:28.400
<v Speaker 1>Her soreness and limb pain became more severe.

0:20:29.160 --> 0:20:30.800
<v Speaker 2>Because of all the pain, she was having a lot

0:20:30.800 --> 0:20:33.960
<v Speaker 2>of trouble keeping her energy level up. Seeing her struggles

0:20:34.040 --> 0:20:37.840
<v Speaker 2>with the illness was definitely a major challenge for me.

0:20:38.520 --> 0:20:41.520
<v Speaker 2>I didn't want to see her in pain. I wanted

0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:43.840
<v Speaker 2>to try and make her life as easy as possible,

0:20:44.080 --> 0:20:47.480
<v Speaker 2>because I knew that this was going to be a

0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:48.640
<v Speaker 2>pretty rough ride for her.

0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:52.960
<v Speaker 1>He offered to support her by coming to doctor's appointments

0:20:53.000 --> 0:20:57.000
<v Speaker 1>with her, but the scheduling never worked out. In the

0:20:57.040 --> 0:21:00.719
<v Speaker 1>middle of a very challenging time, there was a bright spot.

0:21:01.400 --> 0:21:03.240
<v Speaker 1>Aaron got his dream job.

0:21:04.320 --> 0:21:07.400
<v Speaker 2>I got a job as a software engineer at Nintendo.

0:21:08.240 --> 0:21:10.840
<v Speaker 2>This is my dream company. I got business cards that

0:21:10.920 --> 0:21:13.879
<v Speaker 2>say Nintendo and my name. It's a huge deal to me.

0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:17.199
<v Speaker 1>Aaron and Sabrina had moved out of the house with

0:21:17.240 --> 0:21:20.439
<v Speaker 1>his friends and into an apartment of their own. On

0:21:20.520 --> 0:21:24.000
<v Speaker 1>top of starting his new job, Aarin was spending hours

0:21:24.040 --> 0:21:27.600
<v Speaker 1>each day taking care of Sabrina. It was difficult.

0:21:28.520 --> 0:21:32.200
<v Speaker 2>By this point, We're much less romantic partners and much

0:21:32.240 --> 0:21:36.879
<v Speaker 2>more caregiver and receiver. I did all the dishes, I

0:21:36.920 --> 0:21:41.000
<v Speaker 2>did all the cooking. We don't really have that romantical

0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:45.199
<v Speaker 2>relationship anymore. We're always broke. We're not going out on dates.

0:21:46.320 --> 0:21:50.000
<v Speaker 1>Aarin was caring for Sabrina financially and handling their household

0:21:50.080 --> 0:21:54.480
<v Speaker 1>tours because her MS symptoms made physical labor painful. But

0:21:54.520 --> 0:21:57.199
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's quality of life was still good enough for her

0:21:57.240 --> 0:22:00.720
<v Speaker 1>to spend time with friends and have independents, and so

0:22:01.200 --> 0:22:03.120
<v Speaker 1>her personal spending never slowed.

0:22:04.040 --> 0:22:07.600
<v Speaker 2>She was going out with friends and often spending money

0:22:07.600 --> 0:22:10.639
<v Speaker 2>we didn't have. She's buying new clothes all the time,

0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:13.880
<v Speaker 2>spending one hundred plus bucks a month at the map

0:22:13.960 --> 0:22:18.520
<v Speaker 2>counter and Sephora packages from different delivery companies somehow magically

0:22:18.560 --> 0:22:21.640
<v Speaker 2>getting paid for. And this is on top of all

0:22:21.680 --> 0:22:22.480
<v Speaker 2>the medications.

0:22:25.520 --> 0:22:29.680
<v Speaker 1>Aaron felt powerless to stop Sabrina's spending. As her MS

0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:34.320
<v Speaker 1>symptoms worsened, so did her mental health. She began struggling

0:22:34.400 --> 0:22:35.760
<v Speaker 1>with suicidal ideation.

0:22:36.720 --> 0:22:39.679
<v Speaker 2>At first, it was, well, if we can't refill my

0:22:39.720 --> 0:22:41.560
<v Speaker 2>meds on time and I have to go without a

0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:43.720
<v Speaker 2>couple of days, maybe I should just kill myself so

0:22:43.720 --> 0:22:46.680
<v Speaker 2>I don't have to experience the pain for that week

0:22:46.880 --> 0:22:48.240
<v Speaker 2>until a paycheck shows up.

0:22:49.160 --> 0:22:52.840
<v Speaker 1>It felt like all of Sabrina's safety and stability rested

0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:55.879
<v Speaker 1>on Aarin. He worked hard to cover all of her

0:22:55.920 --> 0:22:59.680
<v Speaker 1>medication costs, but his paychecks weren't enough and he was

0:22:59.760 --> 0:23:04.679
<v Speaker 1>going into debt to afford everything. Then, Sabrina began calling

0:23:04.720 --> 0:23:08.159
<v Speaker 1>Aaron while he was at work. Usually there was something

0:23:08.200 --> 0:23:09.479
<v Speaker 1>specific that she needed.

0:23:10.200 --> 0:23:14.160
<v Speaker 2>Often it was medication related, but it started to expand

0:23:14.200 --> 0:23:19.080
<v Speaker 2>beyond that. There was an occasion where suicide was threatened

0:23:19.160 --> 0:23:22.000
<v Speaker 2>if I couldn't come up with five hundred dollars to

0:23:22.080 --> 0:23:26.240
<v Speaker 2>buy a custom cosplay outfit for convention.

0:23:27.480 --> 0:23:30.880
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's calls began taking up more and more of his workday.

0:23:31.440 --> 0:23:34.639
<v Speaker 1>She was in such a delicate mental state he felt

0:23:34.640 --> 0:23:37.560
<v Speaker 1>like it was unsafe to leave her alone.

0:23:38.080 --> 0:23:40.440
<v Speaker 2>All of this basically just drove me into a level

0:23:40.440 --> 0:23:46.439
<v Speaker 2>of depression and exhaustion that I became unrecognizable to a

0:23:46.480 --> 0:23:50.360
<v Speaker 2>lot of friends and family. I was always eating cheap garbage.

0:23:50.880 --> 0:23:53.720
<v Speaker 2>There were a lot of times where I skipped lunch

0:23:53.760 --> 0:23:57.119
<v Speaker 2>at work for a week or more because I didn't

0:23:57.200 --> 0:24:00.359
<v Speaker 2>have the five bucks I needed to go get lunch.

0:24:01.240 --> 0:24:05.240
<v Speaker 1>The cost of Sabrina's MS medications was impossible to keep

0:24:05.320 --> 0:24:07.720
<v Speaker 1>up with. Aarin tried everything.

0:24:08.560 --> 0:24:12.360
<v Speaker 2>I filled up several credit cards trying to cover everything.

0:24:13.200 --> 0:24:16.760
<v Speaker 2>I basically sold everything I owned. I had a video

0:24:16.800 --> 0:24:21.160
<v Speaker 2>game collection that in today's dollars probably would be worth

0:24:21.200 --> 0:24:26.159
<v Speaker 2>twenty five to thirty thousand dollars, and I was selling

0:24:26.200 --> 0:24:29.439
<v Speaker 2>it for pennies on the dollar because there was something

0:24:29.480 --> 0:24:33.520
<v Speaker 2>we needed now. It was always I need a couple

0:24:33.640 --> 0:24:37.919
<v Speaker 2>hundred bucks. Now, I need to buy medication tomorrow. I

0:24:38.000 --> 0:24:40.240
<v Speaker 2>need to make sure the rent check doesn't bounce again.

0:24:41.680 --> 0:24:44.960
<v Speaker 1>Aarin was living in a survival state, always trying to

0:24:45.040 --> 0:24:49.280
<v Speaker 1>keep up with the most urgent need. Then, after Aaron

0:24:49.320 --> 0:24:52.600
<v Speaker 1>had been racking up medical debt for a year, Sabrina

0:24:52.680 --> 0:24:55.639
<v Speaker 1>heard about a new treatment from her doctor. It was

0:24:55.680 --> 0:24:56.760
<v Speaker 1>a glimmer of hope.

0:24:57.520 --> 0:25:03.080
<v Speaker 2>The experimental intervenous treatment for MS came up. The first

0:25:03.119 --> 0:25:06.560
<v Speaker 2>time the medication was called interferon.

0:25:07.320 --> 0:25:09.639
<v Speaker 1>It was the early two thousands and there weren't as

0:25:09.680 --> 0:25:12.959
<v Speaker 1>many treatment options available for MS as there are today.

0:25:13.760 --> 0:25:17.840
<v Speaker 1>For the first time in months, Sabrina seemed optimistic this

0:25:17.960 --> 0:25:20.480
<v Speaker 1>treatment could be the key to getting their lives back

0:25:20.520 --> 0:25:24.239
<v Speaker 1>on track. Instead of the weekly and monthly payments, this

0:25:24.320 --> 0:25:27.760
<v Speaker 1>treatment lasted a few months. Her doctors were hopeful that

0:25:27.880 --> 0:25:31.600
<v Speaker 1>interferon could help manage all of her symptoms instead of

0:25:31.640 --> 0:25:36.240
<v Speaker 1>needing multiple prescriptions. It had the possibility to majorly improve

0:25:36.320 --> 0:25:38.280
<v Speaker 1>her quality of life.

0:25:38.320 --> 0:25:41.480
<v Speaker 2>If I could pay seven or eight hundred dollars every

0:25:41.520 --> 0:25:45.320
<v Speaker 2>couple months, then we wouldn't need to be buying all

0:25:45.400 --> 0:25:49.679
<v Speaker 2>these other medications. This experimental treatment would be able to

0:25:50.080 --> 0:25:53.679
<v Speaker 2>cover everything, or at least make a significant difference in

0:25:53.720 --> 0:25:56.560
<v Speaker 2>her well being, possibly to the point where she might

0:25:56.560 --> 0:25:59.119
<v Speaker 2>even be able to go back to work. It felt

0:25:59.119 --> 0:26:01.680
<v Speaker 2>like a god said the possibility that we could actually

0:26:01.720 --> 0:26:04.919
<v Speaker 2>start moving forward as equal partners again, and instead of

0:26:05.119 --> 0:26:07.000
<v Speaker 2>just me taking care for all the time.

0:26:07.640 --> 0:26:11.320
<v Speaker 1>The way they were living was unsustainable, so Aarin was

0:26:11.320 --> 0:26:12.400
<v Speaker 1>willing to take a risk.

0:26:13.400 --> 0:26:16.399
<v Speaker 2>I decided to move forward with it. I got some

0:26:16.480 --> 0:26:20.520
<v Speaker 2>help from my parents to help start the initial treatments.

0:26:21.160 --> 0:26:24.600
<v Speaker 1>He kept offering to attend Sabrina's appointments with her, but

0:26:24.680 --> 0:26:26.200
<v Speaker 1>it never worked out.

0:26:26.520 --> 0:26:29.200
<v Speaker 2>They were always scheduled in the middle of the morning

0:26:29.400 --> 0:26:31.639
<v Speaker 2>or in the middle of the afternoon on a workday.

0:26:32.520 --> 0:26:34.560
<v Speaker 2>I took time off to try and join her appointment.

0:26:34.960 --> 0:26:37.399
<v Speaker 2>Oh they had to cancel and reschedule.

0:26:37.840 --> 0:26:40.439
<v Speaker 1>Aaron had put everything he had on the line to

0:26:40.520 --> 0:26:44.520
<v Speaker 1>help Sabrina access this treatment. It was becoming more and

0:26:44.600 --> 0:26:47.320
<v Speaker 1>more concerning to him that he'd never spoken to a

0:26:47.400 --> 0:26:51.880
<v Speaker 1>doctor about it directly. Every medical update he heard came

0:26:51.920 --> 0:26:52.680
<v Speaker 1>through Sabrina.

0:26:53.600 --> 0:26:57.080
<v Speaker 2>I had been talking to my dad about it, and

0:26:57.160 --> 0:27:00.240
<v Speaker 2>he told me that I should start asking for receiptet

0:27:00.600 --> 0:27:02.560
<v Speaker 2>since I could never make it to an appointment.

0:27:03.200 --> 0:27:05.840
<v Speaker 1>So Aaron asked Sabrina to see a receipt for one

0:27:05.840 --> 0:27:09.959
<v Speaker 1>of her interfere on treatments, and when he did, something

0:27:10.040 --> 0:27:10.919
<v Speaker 1>strange happened.

0:27:11.720 --> 0:27:13.399
<v Speaker 2>I could kind of see panic on her face for

0:27:13.440 --> 0:27:15.560
<v Speaker 2>about a half a second, but the.

0:27:15.520 --> 0:27:19.280
<v Speaker 1>Panic quickly disappeared and she told him.

0:27:18.720 --> 0:27:22.600
<v Speaker 2>Sure, I'll get you on. That became a week or more,

0:27:23.760 --> 0:27:28.920
<v Speaker 2>and then over a month into oh, it's time for

0:27:28.960 --> 0:27:29.720
<v Speaker 2>the next treatment.

0:27:30.560 --> 0:27:33.520
<v Speaker 1>Aaron knew something wasn't right, but he was starting to

0:27:33.560 --> 0:27:35.520
<v Speaker 1>lose the will to argue with Sabrina.

0:27:36.320 --> 0:27:38.600
<v Speaker 2>I think at this point I had just been beaten

0:27:38.680 --> 0:27:44.880
<v Speaker 2>down emotionally so badly that I kind of just stopped caring.

0:27:46.240 --> 0:27:48.600
<v Speaker 2>I didn't even have the strength to fight and argue

0:27:48.800 --> 0:27:50.960
<v Speaker 2>about just basic information.

0:27:51.040 --> 0:27:54.920
<v Speaker 1>At this point, Aaron and Sabrina had been together for

0:27:54.960 --> 0:27:58.159
<v Speaker 1>five years, and it had been four years since she

0:27:58.240 --> 0:28:02.040
<v Speaker 1>was diagnosed with MS. Paying for her m's treatments for

0:28:02.160 --> 0:28:05.240
<v Speaker 1>years had been a huge strain on Erin. He was

0:28:05.359 --> 0:28:08.399
<v Speaker 1>racking up debt and his mental health was getting worse.

0:28:09.000 --> 0:28:12.240
<v Speaker 1>But Erin knew that having MS was a much bigger nightmare.

0:28:13.560 --> 0:28:16.760
<v Speaker 1>He had watched Sabrina suffer for years, and the idea

0:28:16.840 --> 0:28:20.680
<v Speaker 1>of doubting any part of her experience made Aaron feel guilty.

0:28:21.200 --> 0:28:23.280
<v Speaker 2>Who lies about being this sick?

0:28:24.600 --> 0:28:27.400
<v Speaker 1>One day, Sabrina approached Arin and told him that her

0:28:27.440 --> 0:28:30.639
<v Speaker 1>doctors were recommending she'd start a new version of interfere on,

0:28:31.119 --> 0:28:34.240
<v Speaker 1>one that she'd only need every six to nine months.

0:28:34.800 --> 0:28:38.000
<v Speaker 1>But there was a catch. It cost eight thousand dollars

0:28:38.040 --> 0:28:41.240
<v Speaker 1>for each treatment. She was planning to ask a mutual

0:28:41.280 --> 0:28:44.880
<v Speaker 1>friend of theirs for help. Up until now, Erin had

0:28:44.920 --> 0:28:47.560
<v Speaker 1>been paying for all the interfere on treatments himself.

0:28:48.360 --> 0:28:50.880
<v Speaker 2>Not having to panic about it at this point was

0:28:51.480 --> 0:28:54.520
<v Speaker 2>such a priority that I agreed to go along with it.

0:28:55.400 --> 0:28:58.000
<v Speaker 1>Arin and Sabrina went to their friend's house to ask

0:28:58.040 --> 0:28:59.360
<v Speaker 1>for his financial support.

0:29:00.160 --> 0:29:02.400
<v Speaker 2>The friend brings up, okay, so you want to borrow

0:29:02.520 --> 0:29:06.400
<v Speaker 2>fifteen thousand dollars and I had to hide the shock

0:29:06.480 --> 0:29:11.600
<v Speaker 2>on my face because suddenly the number had changed. I

0:29:11.680 --> 0:29:15.960
<v Speaker 2>didn't want to mess it up by confronting Sabrina about

0:29:15.960 --> 0:29:19.280
<v Speaker 2>it in front of him, So after we leave, I

0:29:19.360 --> 0:29:21.840
<v Speaker 2>confront her in the car about what's this extra seven

0:29:21.880 --> 0:29:26.360
<v Speaker 2>thousand dollars for? And she tells me, well, I want

0:29:26.400 --> 0:29:29.080
<v Speaker 2>to start school up again. There's a couple thousand bucks

0:29:29.080 --> 0:29:31.960
<v Speaker 2>for that. I need to replace my computer, and you

0:29:32.040 --> 0:29:34.840
<v Speaker 2>know I can only take a top of the line MacBook,

0:29:35.360 --> 0:29:38.200
<v Speaker 2>so that's another three or four thousand dollars.

0:29:39.040 --> 0:29:42.240
<v Speaker 1>By this point, Aaron did not trust Sabrina to handle

0:29:42.360 --> 0:29:43.360
<v Speaker 1>money responsibly.

0:29:44.200 --> 0:29:46.440
<v Speaker 2>The first thing I told her was, I know how

0:29:46.480 --> 0:29:49.160
<v Speaker 2>you are about spending money. If you're going to do this,

0:29:49.800 --> 0:29:53.600
<v Speaker 2>go do the medical treatment first. Don't go buy the MacBook,

0:29:54.080 --> 0:29:57.680
<v Speaker 2>don't pay for school stuff. You go do the medical

0:29:57.680 --> 0:30:00.560
<v Speaker 2>treatment first. She said, yes, yes, of course, of course,

0:30:00.560 --> 0:30:01.840
<v Speaker 2>I'll do the baking treatment first.

0:30:02.920 --> 0:30:06.280
<v Speaker 1>But Erin didn't feel comfortable just taking Sabrina's word for it.

0:30:06.760 --> 0:30:09.720
<v Speaker 1>He needed to see for himself how she was spending

0:30:09.760 --> 0:30:10.240
<v Speaker 1>this money.

0:30:11.200 --> 0:30:13.800
<v Speaker 2>Her computer was broken, so she had been doing some

0:30:13.840 --> 0:30:16.800
<v Speaker 2>of her work on my computer. That meant that she

0:30:16.960 --> 0:30:21.400
<v Speaker 2>had saved her bank log in on my computer. So

0:30:22.560 --> 0:30:26.560
<v Speaker 2>after she deposited the check, I started watching the balance

0:30:26.600 --> 0:30:27.600
<v Speaker 2>of the account.

0:30:28.640 --> 0:30:30.640
<v Speaker 1>Every day he checked to see if she had made

0:30:30.680 --> 0:30:33.000
<v Speaker 1>the eight thousand dollars payment for interfere On.

0:30:34.000 --> 0:30:38.080
<v Speaker 2>And every day I would open the bank account and

0:30:38.360 --> 0:30:42.200
<v Speaker 2>see a couple hundred bucks get nibbled away, and then

0:30:42.480 --> 0:30:46.040
<v Speaker 2>big purchase at the max. Dore went to the mall

0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:49.840
<v Speaker 2>and spent fifteen hundred dollars on clothes and makeup.

0:30:50.680 --> 0:30:54.280
<v Speaker 1>Aaron watched in horror as the bank account slowly drained.

0:30:54.920 --> 0:30:57.360
<v Speaker 1>There was still some part of him that expected her

0:30:57.400 --> 0:31:00.640
<v Speaker 1>to pay for the treatment. For a while. Well, there

0:31:00.680 --> 0:31:04.200
<v Speaker 1>was still enough in the account eight thousand dollars to

0:31:04.320 --> 0:31:05.720
<v Speaker 1>afford it.

0:31:05.720 --> 0:31:08.800
<v Speaker 2>It's getting smaller and smaller. I'm not seeing the big

0:31:08.840 --> 0:31:12.959
<v Speaker 2>expenditure for the treatment. And then one day we've passed

0:31:12.960 --> 0:31:16.440
<v Speaker 2>below the line of what the treatment costs. That was

0:31:16.480 --> 0:31:18.720
<v Speaker 2>the whole reason we were supposed to borrow this money

0:31:18.720 --> 0:31:22.520
<v Speaker 2>in the first place. And she's spending two hundred bucks

0:31:22.520 --> 0:31:25.440
<v Speaker 2>a week on my little pony phone game micro transactions.

0:31:26.480 --> 0:31:28.840
<v Speaker 2>It gets below half of what she supposedly needed for

0:31:28.840 --> 0:31:32.520
<v Speaker 2>this treatment. And then it finally gets below a thousand dollars,

0:31:33.520 --> 0:31:36.400
<v Speaker 2>and that was the day, I kind of snapped.

0:31:38.240 --> 0:31:41.680
<v Speaker 1>Aaron had woken up before Sabrina to walk the dogs.

0:31:41.920 --> 0:31:44.600
<v Speaker 2>I went in the kitchen. I grabbed a bunch of

0:31:44.680 --> 0:31:48.200
<v Speaker 2>black garriage bags from under the sink. She was still

0:31:48.240 --> 0:31:48.680
<v Speaker 2>in bed.

0:31:49.400 --> 0:31:52.240
<v Speaker 1>He woke her up, handed her the trash bags, and

0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:54.360
<v Speaker 1>told her to start packing her things.

0:31:55.080 --> 0:31:58.160
<v Speaker 2>At first, she tried to deny that she had spent

0:31:58.200 --> 0:32:01.640
<v Speaker 2>the money, and that's when I revealed that no, I

0:32:01.680 --> 0:32:05.240
<v Speaker 2>had actually been watching her bank account. And that's when

0:32:05.680 --> 0:32:08.760
<v Speaker 2>the whopper to end all whoppers comes out of her mouth.

0:32:10.720 --> 0:32:14.120
<v Speaker 2>She tells me that she's been working the day shift

0:32:14.160 --> 0:32:18.960
<v Speaker 2>at a strip club while I've been at work at Nintendo.

0:32:19.200 --> 0:32:21.120
<v Speaker 2>She doesn't have a receipt for it, but she did

0:32:21.120 --> 0:32:24.000
<v Speaker 2>get the treatment, and that's what she spent her stripper

0:32:24.080 --> 0:32:24.479
<v Speaker 2>money on.

0:32:25.440 --> 0:32:26.880
<v Speaker 1>Aarin wasn't buying it.

0:32:27.680 --> 0:32:29.760
<v Speaker 2>Honestly, I think this was the last time I ever

0:32:29.800 --> 0:32:32.760
<v Speaker 2>believed a word she said. She managed to get me

0:32:32.960 --> 0:32:37.200
<v Speaker 2>to not throw her out with crocodile tears, claiming she

0:32:37.200 --> 0:32:38.280
<v Speaker 2>would get me receipts.

0:32:39.000 --> 0:32:42.320
<v Speaker 1>Aaron knew he should walk away from the relationship, but

0:32:42.360 --> 0:32:44.560
<v Speaker 1>the reality was a lot more complicated.

0:32:45.400 --> 0:32:49.160
<v Speaker 2>An emotionally abusive relationship is like a cult of two people.

0:32:50.000 --> 0:32:53.000
<v Speaker 2>The cult leader no longer had control over me, but

0:32:53.840 --> 0:32:59.280
<v Speaker 2>I also didn't have the emotional and financial strength to leave.

0:32:59.320 --> 0:33:03.880
<v Speaker 1>At this point, Sabrina suggested opening their relationship and seeing

0:33:03.920 --> 0:33:08.920
<v Speaker 1>other people. Arin agreed. In the months that followed, Sabrina

0:33:08.960 --> 0:33:11.560
<v Speaker 1>was still adamant that she had paid for the interfere

0:33:11.560 --> 0:33:12.120
<v Speaker 1>on treatment.

0:33:12.960 --> 0:33:17.920
<v Speaker 2>I could never get documented proof of it. No receipts,

0:33:18.240 --> 0:33:21.320
<v Speaker 2>no information from the doctor, no nothing.

0:33:22.200 --> 0:33:25.000
<v Speaker 1>Erin was trying to find a way to leave the relationship,

0:33:25.520 --> 0:33:27.840
<v Speaker 1>but he was worried about what would happen to Sabrina

0:33:27.880 --> 0:33:30.840
<v Speaker 1>when he left. She had been dependent on him for

0:33:30.920 --> 0:33:31.920
<v Speaker 1>six years. Now.

0:33:32.680 --> 0:33:36.320
<v Speaker 2>I still believe that she had MS, but that she

0:33:36.600 --> 0:33:39.840
<v Speaker 2>just wasn't nearly as bad as what she led on

0:33:40.760 --> 0:33:46.440
<v Speaker 2>because I had seen enough visual indicators to convince me

0:33:46.520 --> 0:33:50.360
<v Speaker 2>that she was at least impaired. Somehow, it felt like

0:33:50.480 --> 0:33:53.840
<v Speaker 2>she was just taking advantage of my family's history with

0:33:54.040 --> 0:33:56.600
<v Speaker 2>MS to try and squeeze as much money out of

0:33:56.680 --> 0:33:57.880
<v Speaker 2>my family as possible.

0:33:58.800 --> 0:34:02.320
<v Speaker 1>Since Erin and Sabrina had opened their relationship, he started

0:34:02.320 --> 0:34:05.960
<v Speaker 1>seeing someone named Kia. He loved spending time with her.

0:34:06.400 --> 0:34:10.560
<v Speaker 1>She was like a breath of fresh air. One night,

0:34:10.600 --> 0:34:13.160
<v Speaker 1>while Aaron was out on a date with Kia. He

0:34:13.239 --> 0:34:15.320
<v Speaker 1>got an alarming text from Sabrina.

0:34:15.960 --> 0:34:18.280
<v Speaker 2>Sabrina had told me that she was in the bathroom,

0:34:18.600 --> 0:34:21.040
<v Speaker 2>had taken a whole bottle of pills.

0:34:22.080 --> 0:34:26.280
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina had made a suicide attempt. Aarin began to panic.

0:34:27.080 --> 0:34:31.000
<v Speaker 1>He knew Sabrina often lied in exaggerated things, but if

0:34:31.040 --> 0:34:33.560
<v Speaker 1>there was any chance at all that this was true,

0:34:34.480 --> 0:34:35.560
<v Speaker 1>he had to help her.

0:34:36.160 --> 0:34:40.760
<v Speaker 2>So Kia and I rushed home. We parked outside.

0:34:40.840 --> 0:34:43.640
<v Speaker 1>While Aaron and Kia were still in the car, the

0:34:43.680 --> 0:34:45.600
<v Speaker 1>front door of the house opened.

0:34:45.960 --> 0:34:49.360
<v Speaker 2>And Sabrina walks out with two of her friends to

0:34:49.640 --> 0:34:50.440
<v Speaker 2>go out to dinner.

0:34:51.160 --> 0:34:54.279
<v Speaker 1>She didn't see him in the car. She walked right

0:34:54.360 --> 0:34:58.480
<v Speaker 1>past him. For Aaron, that moment changed everything.

0:34:59.360 --> 0:35:04.080
<v Speaker 2>This was surely a power play to try and keep

0:35:04.160 --> 0:35:04.960
<v Speaker 2>my attention.

0:35:26.560 --> 0:35:29.920
<v Speaker 1>Aarin was starting to realize that his girlfriend, Sabrina was

0:35:30.040 --> 0:35:33.000
<v Speaker 1>lying about the severity of her MS symptoms to get

0:35:33.040 --> 0:35:37.239
<v Speaker 1>financial support from him and his friends. Aaron hadn't found

0:35:37.280 --> 0:35:40.200
<v Speaker 1>a way to leave the relationship. He was still worried

0:35:40.239 --> 0:35:44.280
<v Speaker 1>about her physical and mental health. One night, Sabrina texted

0:35:44.360 --> 0:35:47.880
<v Speaker 1>him that she had attempted suicide and locked herself in

0:35:47.920 --> 0:35:49.040
<v Speaker 1>the bathroom.

0:35:49.040 --> 0:35:54.560
<v Speaker 2>So Keia and I rushed home, parked outside, and while

0:35:54.560 --> 0:35:58.360
<v Speaker 2>we're sitting out there, Sabrina walks out with two of

0:35:58.400 --> 0:36:00.280
<v Speaker 2>her friends to go out to dinner.

0:36:01.360 --> 0:36:04.040
<v Speaker 1>Aaron was scared that Sabrina's life was at risk and

0:36:04.080 --> 0:36:08.720
<v Speaker 1>she needed immediate medical attention, but here she was dressed

0:36:08.800 --> 0:36:11.280
<v Speaker 1>up to go out laughing with her friends.

0:36:11.719 --> 0:36:16.400
<v Speaker 2>This was purely a power play to try and keep

0:36:16.480 --> 0:36:20.880
<v Speaker 2>my attention. After Sabrina came home, I told her that

0:36:20.960 --> 0:36:23.160
<v Speaker 2>I saw her leaving, and she tried to tell me

0:36:23.200 --> 0:36:26.279
<v Speaker 2>that they were taking her to the hospital. I told

0:36:26.320 --> 0:36:27.480
<v Speaker 2>her I knew that was bullshit.

0:36:27.960 --> 0:36:31.160
<v Speaker 1>For the last five years of their relationship, Sabrina had

0:36:31.200 --> 0:36:33.400
<v Speaker 1>been convincing erin that she was on the brink of

0:36:33.480 --> 0:36:37.360
<v Speaker 1>collapse mentally and physically, and that he was the only

0:36:37.440 --> 0:36:40.840
<v Speaker 1>person who could keep her safe. But now the extent

0:36:40.880 --> 0:36:44.319
<v Speaker 1>of her deception was becoming clear to Aaron. This wasn't

0:36:44.400 --> 0:36:48.880
<v Speaker 1>just exaggeration and bad spending habits. This was emotional and

0:36:48.920 --> 0:36:49.920
<v Speaker 1>financial abuse.

0:36:53.320 --> 0:36:57.120
<v Speaker 2>The following weekend, I invited one of my good friends

0:36:57.120 --> 0:37:01.080
<v Speaker 2>over to kind of steal my resolve, and I sat

0:37:01.120 --> 0:37:02.880
<v Speaker 2>Sabrina down on the couch in the living room and

0:37:02.920 --> 0:37:05.800
<v Speaker 2>I told her we are not in a relationship anymore.

0:37:06.640 --> 0:37:10.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm not paying for everything anymore. I'm done.

0:37:12.320 --> 0:37:14.680
<v Speaker 1>The next weekend, while Sabrina was out of the house,

0:37:15.000 --> 0:37:16.799
<v Speaker 1>Aaron's friends helped him move out.

0:37:17.719 --> 0:37:20.879
<v Speaker 2>I ready a due apartment across town, where she didn't

0:37:20.920 --> 0:37:23.640
<v Speaker 2>know where I lived. I think she knew it was coming.

0:37:24.200 --> 0:37:27.920
<v Speaker 2>She knew she was busted for the fake suicide attempt,

0:37:28.239 --> 0:37:32.120
<v Speaker 2>and she had just resigned herself to the fact that

0:37:32.200 --> 0:37:34.919
<v Speaker 2>the spigot that was Aaron is turned off.

0:37:36.200 --> 0:37:39.640
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina and Aaron still had a lot of mutual friends.

0:37:40.080 --> 0:37:44.000
<v Speaker 1>After the breakup, Aaron distanced himself from their social group.

0:37:45.320 --> 0:37:48.719
<v Speaker 2>She told a lot of people that I was physically abusive,

0:37:49.800 --> 0:37:53.960
<v Speaker 2>financially abusive, that I was the one pissing away all

0:37:54.000 --> 0:37:54.680
<v Speaker 2>of our money.

0:37:55.960 --> 0:37:59.240
<v Speaker 1>Aaron was isolated from his community. I left to deal

0:37:59.280 --> 0:38:02.600
<v Speaker 1>with the impact of years of financial and emotional abuse.

0:38:03.800 --> 0:38:10.960
<v Speaker 2>I was left with significant psychological trauma that I, unfortunately

0:38:11.080 --> 0:38:13.360
<v Speaker 2>didn't take the time to properly process.

0:38:15.680 --> 0:38:18.960
<v Speaker 1>A few years past, Erin was trying to rebuild a

0:38:19.000 --> 0:38:21.520
<v Speaker 1>base of stability in his life and pay off the

0:38:21.520 --> 0:38:25.160
<v Speaker 1>debt he mounted while taking care of Sabrina. One day,

0:38:25.320 --> 0:38:27.719
<v Speaker 1>Aarin was on Facebook when he saw that one of

0:38:27.719 --> 0:38:30.719
<v Speaker 1>his old friends had posted a GoFundMe for Sabrina.

0:38:31.560 --> 0:38:33.800
<v Speaker 2>I clicked on the link and gave it a read.

0:38:34.760 --> 0:38:38.840
<v Speaker 2>She was in Japan. Someone had cleaned out her accounts

0:38:38.880 --> 0:38:42.080
<v Speaker 2>while she was in Japan, and she was stuck there

0:38:42.160 --> 0:38:47.800
<v Speaker 2>with no return ticket and no money. I posted a

0:38:47.880 --> 0:38:51.080
<v Speaker 2>reply to the GoFundMe saying that if you're going to

0:38:51.080 --> 0:38:54.959
<v Speaker 2>start raising money for Sabrina, how about you start raising

0:38:55.000 --> 0:38:57.279
<v Speaker 2>money to pay all the people back that she took

0:38:57.320 --> 0:38:58.719
<v Speaker 2>money from and never paid back.

0:39:00.040 --> 0:39:03.840
<v Speaker 1>Organizer of the GoFundMe criticized him for calling Sabrina's character

0:39:03.920 --> 0:39:07.680
<v Speaker 1>into question. His concern was shut down in the comments,

0:39:08.600 --> 0:39:11.440
<v Speaker 1>but other people had started catching on to Sabrina's lies.

0:39:12.120 --> 0:39:15.319
<v Speaker 1>The friends she was hanging out with in Japan. They

0:39:15.320 --> 0:39:19.440
<v Speaker 1>collected evidence then posted their side of the story to Facebook.

0:39:19.880 --> 0:39:23.440
<v Speaker 2>Sabrina posted that she had spent the day at the

0:39:23.480 --> 0:39:26.399
<v Speaker 2>Bullet train station trying to figure out what the best

0:39:26.400 --> 0:39:29.719
<v Speaker 2>time to jump in front of the train was. In reality,

0:39:30.120 --> 0:39:33.200
<v Speaker 2>she had spent that day at Disneyland, Tokyo, spending hundreds

0:39:33.280 --> 0:39:36.040
<v Speaker 2>or one thousands of dollars and at the same time

0:39:36.239 --> 0:39:38.320
<v Speaker 2>pleading poverty on Facebook.

0:39:41.760 --> 0:39:46.319
<v Speaker 1>Finally, Sabrina was exposed. The truth was out there and

0:39:46.360 --> 0:39:48.440
<v Speaker 1>there was no way for her to talk her way

0:39:48.480 --> 0:39:48.879
<v Speaker 1>out of it.

0:39:49.800 --> 0:39:53.880
<v Speaker 2>Over the next week, I probably fielded a dozen or

0:39:53.880 --> 0:40:00.880
<v Speaker 2>more apologies. Sabrina's scam worked great until people actually started

0:40:00.920 --> 0:40:04.280
<v Speaker 2>talking to each other, and then it all fell apart.

0:40:05.560 --> 0:40:09.080
<v Speaker 1>Other people began to come forward, sharing their own stories

0:40:09.080 --> 0:40:12.160
<v Speaker 1>of Sabrina borrowing money and never paying them back.

0:40:12.920 --> 0:40:16.440
<v Speaker 2>It felt gratifying to know that I wasn't the only one,

0:40:16.640 --> 0:40:19.840
<v Speaker 2>and at the same time, I was racked with guilt that

0:40:19.920 --> 0:40:22.480
<v Speaker 2>if I had figured some of this stuff out sooner,

0:40:22.600 --> 0:40:26.040
<v Speaker 2>maybe a lot of these other people wouldn't have lost

0:40:26.080 --> 0:40:26.760
<v Speaker 2>all this money.

0:40:28.160 --> 0:40:30.720
<v Speaker 1>One day, something unexpected happened.

0:40:31.560 --> 0:40:36.040
<v Speaker 2>I'm at work at Nintendo, just plugging away, and I

0:40:36.080 --> 0:40:40.080
<v Speaker 2>get an email notification on my smartphone. I looked down

0:40:40.360 --> 0:40:46.280
<v Speaker 2>and it's from the FBI ari information about Sabrina Taylor.

0:40:47.040 --> 0:40:50.600
<v Speaker 1>The FBI was investigating Sabrina for fraud.

0:40:51.640 --> 0:40:53.960
<v Speaker 2>I gave the agent a call and we spent about

0:40:53.960 --> 0:40:57.400
<v Speaker 2>an hour going through all of the different parts of

0:40:57.640 --> 0:41:02.640
<v Speaker 2>my time with Sabrina, her MS treatments, and diagnosis.

0:41:03.640 --> 0:41:06.400
<v Speaker 1>The FBI kept erin up to date on Sabrina's case.

0:41:07.000 --> 0:41:10.359
<v Speaker 1>She was charged with four counts of wire fraud. She

0:41:10.400 --> 0:41:12.960
<v Speaker 1>appeared in court for the first time in November of

0:41:13.000 --> 0:41:16.960
<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty one. After that, Erin was able to see

0:41:17.000 --> 0:41:20.920
<v Speaker 1>the case the FBI had built against Sabrina.

0:41:21.400 --> 0:41:25.080
<v Speaker 2>It wasn't until I saw some of the evidence that

0:41:25.840 --> 0:41:28.000
<v Speaker 2>I was one hundred percent certain that she had never

0:41:28.040 --> 0:41:35.239
<v Speaker 2>had MS. They had forged documents using doctor's letterheads. They

0:41:35.440 --> 0:41:39.160
<v Speaker 2>had statements from multiple doctors that they'd tested her multiple

0:41:39.200 --> 0:41:43.120
<v Speaker 2>times that she never had MS. One hundred percent of

0:41:43.160 --> 0:41:44.040
<v Speaker 2>it was a lie.

0:41:46.840 --> 0:41:49.480
<v Speaker 1>Erin had been paying for drugs like gaba penton under

0:41:49.560 --> 0:41:54.080
<v Speaker 1>the impression that they were critical in managing Sabrina's MS symptoms,

0:41:54.120 --> 0:41:56.800
<v Speaker 1>but gaba penton can be used to treat a variety

0:41:56.880 --> 0:42:01.120
<v Speaker 1>of more mild conditions. After learning the truth about Sabrina's health,

0:42:01.680 --> 0:42:04.360
<v Speaker 1>Eric did some research and learned that she was taking

0:42:04.400 --> 0:42:08.360
<v Speaker 1>around three times over the maximum recommended dose of gaba pentten.

0:42:09.400 --> 0:42:11.799
<v Speaker 1>We don't know what she was using it for, but

0:42:11.840 --> 0:42:15.120
<v Speaker 1>the drug is often used off label for anxiety, and

0:42:15.239 --> 0:42:20.640
<v Speaker 1>if misused, it can be addictive. Sabrina Taylor defrauded numerous

0:42:20.719 --> 0:42:24.480
<v Speaker 1>victims out of over six hundred thousand dollars. She stole

0:42:24.560 --> 0:42:28.359
<v Speaker 1>this money, not from strangers, but from people who trusted her,

0:42:29.000 --> 0:42:32.880
<v Speaker 1>who were concerned about her diagnosis, and who were willing

0:42:32.960 --> 0:42:36.400
<v Speaker 1>to make compromises in their own lives to help her

0:42:36.480 --> 0:42:40.680
<v Speaker 1>afford treatment and care. On July one, twenty twenty two,

0:42:41.280 --> 0:42:44.080
<v Speaker 1>she fled guilty to one count of wire fraud for

0:42:44.160 --> 0:42:48.399
<v Speaker 1>a scheme to defraud friends and acquaintances. Her health wasn't

0:42:48.480 --> 0:42:53.920
<v Speaker 1>the only thing she fabricated. Sabrina's entire identity was a lie.

0:42:54.480 --> 0:42:57.920
<v Speaker 2>She never worked for the Gates Foundation, she never graduated

0:42:57.920 --> 0:43:01.440
<v Speaker 2>from you dub, and she'd never even gotten close to

0:43:01.480 --> 0:43:06.400
<v Speaker 2>medical school, and has mostly lived her life off the

0:43:06.440 --> 0:43:07.400
<v Speaker 2>generosity of others.

0:43:07.400 --> 0:43:10.640
<v Speaker 1>At this point, there was one question all of her

0:43:10.719 --> 0:43:13.160
<v Speaker 1>victims wanted an answer.

0:43:12.840 --> 0:43:15.200
<v Speaker 2>To where was the money going.

0:43:16.120 --> 0:43:18.360
<v Speaker 1>It was the kind of thing that was impossible to

0:43:18.480 --> 0:43:23.120
<v Speaker 1>understand unless you watched it up close. Like Aaron had

0:43:23.480 --> 0:43:28.680
<v Speaker 1>watching Sabrina's bank account drain transaction by transaction, he knew

0:43:28.680 --> 0:43:29.480
<v Speaker 1>where the money went.

0:43:30.760 --> 0:43:33.799
<v Speaker 2>The truth is, the money was just going to traveling

0:43:34.520 --> 0:43:39.440
<v Speaker 2>and shopping and not having to work. She was trying

0:43:39.520 --> 0:43:45.400
<v Speaker 2>to live the lifestyle she thought she deserved and didn't

0:43:45.440 --> 0:43:48.879
<v Speaker 2>care how many people she had to leach off of

0:43:48.960 --> 0:43:50.440
<v Speaker 2>to make that lifestyle happen.

0:43:51.680 --> 0:43:54.799
<v Speaker 1>When Sabrina pled guilty, the US Attorney's Office for the

0:43:54.840 --> 0:43:59.080
<v Speaker 1>Western District of Washington released a statement about her crimes.

0:43:59.440 --> 0:44:01.520
<v Speaker 1>We've laics actor read sections of it.

0:44:03.320 --> 0:44:07.000
<v Speaker 3>Taylor engaged in a sustained and calculated course of conduct

0:44:07.320 --> 0:44:11.200
<v Speaker 3>that preyed upon her victim's best emotions. Taylor used a

0:44:11.200 --> 0:44:14.400
<v Speaker 3>substantial portion of the defrauded funds to pay for luxuries,

0:44:14.719 --> 0:44:17.759
<v Speaker 3>such as almost sixty thousand dollars from multiple trips to

0:44:17.840 --> 0:44:21.840
<v Speaker 3>Japan and Korea, nearly thirty eight thousand dollars for online

0:44:21.880 --> 0:44:26.040
<v Speaker 3>purchases from Amazon and Etsy, more than twenty nine thousand

0:44:26.200 --> 0:44:30.840
<v Speaker 3>for clothing, and nearly sixteen thousand dollars for makeup. Taylor

0:44:30.920 --> 0:44:33.960
<v Speaker 3>met some of the people she defrauded online, using shared

0:44:34.000 --> 0:44:37.760
<v Speaker 3>interests such as Japanese anime, comic books, or video games

0:44:37.760 --> 0:44:39.279
<v Speaker 3>to establish a relationship.

0:44:42.120 --> 0:44:45.759
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina's sentencing hearing was six months later, in January of

0:44:45.800 --> 0:44:49.040
<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty three. It was the first time Aaron had

0:44:49.040 --> 0:44:52.840
<v Speaker 1>seen her in over five years. He delivered a statement

0:44:52.920 --> 0:44:53.520
<v Speaker 1>at the hearing.

0:44:54.920 --> 0:44:59.480
<v Speaker 2>I laid out a lot of the trauma that had

0:44:59.520 --> 0:45:05.000
<v Speaker 2>come with everything that you know, my dad had basically

0:45:05.040 --> 0:45:07.640
<v Speaker 2>worked an extra year or two passed when he thought

0:45:07.680 --> 0:45:10.719
<v Speaker 2>he was going to retire to try and cover all

0:45:10.760 --> 0:45:14.920
<v Speaker 2>of my debts. Essentially, I told the judge that one

0:45:14.920 --> 0:45:18.759
<v Speaker 2>of her favorite tactics was to threaten to commit suicide

0:45:18.800 --> 0:45:21.080
<v Speaker 2>to get people to do what she wanted when she

0:45:21.200 --> 0:45:25.760
<v Speaker 2>wanted it done. And I think because of what I said,

0:45:26.800 --> 0:45:31.880
<v Speaker 2>the judge rescinded her bail and sent her into confinement

0:45:31.920 --> 0:45:36.000
<v Speaker 2>immediately because he did not want her to try to

0:45:36.000 --> 0:45:37.000
<v Speaker 2>repeat that pattern.

0:45:38.239 --> 0:45:42.200
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina was sentenced to twenty seven months in prison. Assistant

0:45:42.320 --> 0:45:46.520
<v Speaker 1>United States Attorney Joe Silvio released a sentencing memo, We've

0:45:46.560 --> 0:45:48.200
<v Speaker 1>had a voice actor read part of it.

0:45:49.880 --> 0:45:53.200
<v Speaker 4>Taylor carried out an extensive Frond scheme using deceit and

0:45:53.280 --> 0:45:58.240
<v Speaker 4>deception that preyed upon humankind's better angels. Several of Taylor's

0:45:58.280 --> 0:46:02.400
<v Speaker 4>victims suffered substantial financial hardship, some likely will never be

0:46:02.480 --> 0:46:07.920
<v Speaker 4>made whole financially. Equally as important, Taylor exploited and betrayed

0:46:07.920 --> 0:46:10.680
<v Speaker 4>the trust of each of her victims, and many of

0:46:10.719 --> 0:46:14.319
<v Speaker 4>Taylor's victims will continue to pay an emotional toll for

0:46:14.440 --> 0:46:15.439
<v Speaker 4>many years to come.

0:46:17.600 --> 0:46:20.400
<v Speaker 2>I was definitely a lot less anxious during the time

0:46:20.640 --> 0:46:23.359
<v Speaker 2>that I knew she was in prison. She has been

0:46:23.400 --> 0:46:27.000
<v Speaker 2>returned to the Seattle area. I know she's still around here.

0:46:27.960 --> 0:46:31.640
<v Speaker 2>Luckily I haven't run into her, but that's definitely something

0:46:31.640 --> 0:46:33.400
<v Speaker 2>that's on the back of my mind.

0:46:34.239 --> 0:46:37.920
<v Speaker 1>Even though Sabrina isn't in Aaron's life anymore, her financial

0:46:37.920 --> 0:46:41.279
<v Speaker 1>abuse will affect him for a long time. It's hard

0:46:41.280 --> 0:46:43.800
<v Speaker 1>to know the exact number that Aaron spent on Sabrina,

0:46:44.320 --> 0:46:46.400
<v Speaker 1>but he estimates it was at least one hundred and

0:46:46.400 --> 0:46:51.200
<v Speaker 1>fifty thousand dollars. His debt severely impacted his credit and

0:46:51.239 --> 0:46:53.279
<v Speaker 1>he'll be paying it off for years to come.

0:46:54.440 --> 0:46:57.920
<v Speaker 2>The total number I ended up owing my mom was

0:46:58.080 --> 0:47:01.120
<v Speaker 2>just short of one hundred thousand dollars. I've been paying

0:47:01.160 --> 0:47:04.239
<v Speaker 2>back what I could in the years since, and there

0:47:04.280 --> 0:47:05.839
<v Speaker 2>is no way I'll be able to pay my mom

0:47:05.880 --> 0:47:08.960
<v Speaker 2>back before she dies. I'm one of the lucky ones.

0:47:09.719 --> 0:47:12.279
<v Speaker 2>I had someone that I could borrow that kind of

0:47:12.280 --> 0:47:16.839
<v Speaker 2>money off of to get everything straightened out. I very

0:47:16.880 --> 0:47:19.680
<v Speaker 2>easily could have had to declare bankruptcy over this.

0:47:23.280 --> 0:47:26.279
<v Speaker 1>Sabrina was ordered to pay some of her victim's restitution,

0:47:26.920 --> 0:47:29.680
<v Speaker 1>but Aaron's name was not included in the list because

0:47:29.719 --> 0:47:33.920
<v Speaker 1>of statute of limitations to Aaron, this isn't a story

0:47:33.920 --> 0:47:36.280
<v Speaker 1>about how we shouldn't trust others.

0:47:36.960 --> 0:47:41.040
<v Speaker 2>She is the outlier. For every Sabrina that's out there,

0:47:41.600 --> 0:47:45.360
<v Speaker 2>there are ten thousand people who actually need the help.

0:47:46.640 --> 0:47:49.520
<v Speaker 1>To Aaron, this is a story about how we should

0:47:49.520 --> 0:47:50.960
<v Speaker 1>trust ourselves.

0:47:51.200 --> 0:47:54.120
<v Speaker 2>If you feel like you're being taken advantage of, or

0:47:54.360 --> 0:47:58.200
<v Speaker 2>if you feel like you're doing everything for this other person,

0:47:58.560 --> 0:48:02.399
<v Speaker 2>and I'm going to keep your head above water, start

0:48:02.440 --> 0:48:05.799
<v Speaker 2>asking for proof. That was really what unraveled Sabrina's entire

0:48:05.880 --> 0:48:09.760
<v Speaker 2>con was somebody asked for the receipts.

0:48:10.880 --> 0:48:14.440
<v Speaker 1>The experience has given Aaron a new perspective on financial

0:48:14.520 --> 0:48:15.600
<v Speaker 1>and emotional abuse.

0:48:16.400 --> 0:48:19.120
<v Speaker 2>This kind of thing happens to a lot more people

0:48:19.760 --> 0:48:24.439
<v Speaker 2>than anyone realizes, and it's not something you should hold

0:48:24.440 --> 0:48:28.000
<v Speaker 2>against anybody when it happens to them. The same kind

0:48:28.000 --> 0:48:31.440
<v Speaker 2>of thing can happen to anybody under the right circumstances.

0:48:32.760 --> 0:48:36.360
<v Speaker 2>I am a lot slower to trust people than I

0:48:36.440 --> 0:48:39.840
<v Speaker 2>used to be, but it hasn't kept me from trusting

0:48:39.880 --> 0:48:45.800
<v Speaker 2>people at all.

0:48:45.920 --> 0:48:49.520
<v Speaker 1>We end every weekly episode with the same question, why

0:48:49.560 --> 0:48:50.800
<v Speaker 1>do you want to share your story?

0:48:52.920 --> 0:48:56.640
<v Speaker 2>These things do happen to men, and you're not less

0:48:56.640 --> 0:49:01.280
<v Speaker 2>of a man for this. Having happened to you, and

0:49:01.680 --> 0:49:04.480
<v Speaker 2>I really think that we need to be just as

0:49:04.520 --> 0:49:07.160
<v Speaker 2>honest as the women that are coming forward with stories

0:49:07.200 --> 0:49:13.480
<v Speaker 2>like these. If this story helps one person get out

0:49:14.320 --> 0:49:20.040
<v Speaker 2>or helps their friend get out of a toxic, abusive relationship,

0:49:20.440 --> 0:49:21.680
<v Speaker 2>then this was all worth it.

0:49:30.400 --> 0:49:32.840
<v Speaker 1>On the next episode of Betrayal Weekly.

0:49:34.360 --> 0:49:40.600
<v Speaker 5>How in the world could someone stoop that low and

0:49:41.360 --> 0:49:46.799
<v Speaker 5>go to that extreme? Were you too cowardly? Just tell

0:49:46.920 --> 0:49:48.320
<v Speaker 5>me the truth.

0:49:55.040 --> 0:49:57.720
<v Speaker 1>If you'd like to share your story on betrayal, please

0:49:57.760 --> 0:50:03.160
<v Speaker 1>email Betrayalpod at gmail dot com. That is Betrayal Pod

0:50:03.560 --> 0:50:07.319
<v Speaker 1>at gmail dot com. Please note that we are not

0:50:07.480 --> 0:50:11.480
<v Speaker 1>a mental health organization. If you are in crisis or

0:50:11.560 --> 0:50:16.080
<v Speaker 1>currently experiencing domestic violence, we encourage you to seek local

0:50:16.160 --> 0:50:20.440
<v Speaker 1>help or dial nine to one one. Please contact organizations

0:50:20.480 --> 0:50:24.560
<v Speaker 1>that offer immediate support. In our show notes, we've included

0:50:24.600 --> 0:50:28.480
<v Speaker 1>a list of US based resources. You can follow us

0:50:28.520 --> 0:50:31.839
<v Speaker 1>on Instagram at Betrayal Pod or find me at It's

0:50:31.880 --> 0:50:36.080
<v Speaker 1>Andrea Gunning. To access our newsletter and additional content, and

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0:50:57.680 --> 0:51:00.880
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0:51:00.960 --> 0:51:05.160
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0:51:05.239 --> 0:51:08.680
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0:51:08.880 --> 0:51:13.120
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0:51:13.239 --> 0:51:17.600
<v Speaker 1>editor is Monique Lebord, also produced by Ben Fetterman. Our

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0:51:23.160 --> 0:51:27.400
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<v Speaker 1>and mixing by Matt Delvecchio. Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines.

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