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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, A production

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Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. Am Holly Fry and

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Speaker 1: I'm Tracy V.

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Speaker 2: Wilson. We talked about John Grant this week. Huh.

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Speaker 1: I kept wanting to call him John Gone, which is

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Speaker 1: not that's not right. I didn't tell you this while

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Speaker 1: we were recording, because you had said that during recording

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Speaker 1: that I had to. I typed it that way a

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Speaker 1: lot of times too, and I didn't want to say

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Speaker 1: it and cemented in your head as that way because.

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Speaker 2: I was like, that won't help the problem. Here's what

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Speaker 2: I want to talk about.

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Speaker 1: First, Okay, James the First's Book of Orders regarding how

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Speaker 1: they were all going to get through the plague together.

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Speaker 1: Because there's a bit of advice that was no good

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Speaker 1: but that I love.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 1: He wanted people to eat more butter. Uh, I'm good

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Speaker 1: with that because he thought that butter was somehow protective

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Speaker 1: against the plague. Okay, like specifically just eating a lot

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Speaker 1: of buttered bread. I don't know what the logic was exactly.

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Speaker 1: Did he think like germs would stick to the butter

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Speaker 1: and not get it on your body, but it's going

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Speaker 1: in your I don't know. He just thought that Butter

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Speaker 1: laminated your insides in some sort of way. I'm like, cool,

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Speaker 1: I don't think I'm gonna get to plague. Then we

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Speaker 1: love a little Butter. It just made me giggle to end.

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Speaker 1: The other thing that made me giggle a lot while

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Speaker 1: I was working on this, aside from John Aubrey's kooky

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Speaker 1: versions of people's lives, was that John Grant And some

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Speaker 1: of this is simply because London was so much smaller

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Speaker 1: at this time than it is today, that like every

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Speaker 1: intellectual knew each other. But the way they all know

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Speaker 1: each other just I was like, this is like an

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Speaker 1: episode of Like Friends sixteen fifty. Like Peeps is talking

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Speaker 1: to all of them, visiting everybody. Everybody's up in everybody's business,

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Speaker 1: all of the dudes at the Royal Society know each other.

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Speaker 1: It just cracked me up a little bit in terms

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Speaker 1: of like thinking about a city that we know today

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Speaker 1: as being that large. I mean, it's hard to imagine

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Speaker 1: people even knowing everybody in their neighborhood when you're in London,

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Speaker 1: it's so populous that like the idea that all of

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Speaker 1: these guys were just buds. The Jeeps was at their

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Speaker 1: houses all the time, looking at their stuff. It just

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Speaker 1: cracks me up somehow.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. It's like, oh, this little band of

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Speaker 2: friends cute.

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Speaker 1: And I kept when I was working on the episode,

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Speaker 1: because of the timeline of his life. I kept being like, wait,

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Speaker 1: did he become friends with these people after he got,

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Speaker 1: you know, famous for writing this thing? But he knew

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Speaker 1: Petty before that, and Petty was already kind of in

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Speaker 1: with a lot of those people, So that's I think

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Speaker 1: he at least had acquaintanceship with most of them. The

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Speaker 1: other thing that's interesting and a little sad. We mentioned

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Speaker 1: specifically in the episode that he was friends with a

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Speaker 1: number of artists, right, two of whom were famous for

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Speaker 1: their portraiture. Do you know how many images of John

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Speaker 1: Grant we have? Is it none? It's zero? It's a

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Speaker 1: goose egg, We don't have any. He may have known

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Speaker 1: a lot of portraitists, but either they never painted him,

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Speaker 1: or if they did, it got lost and nobody even

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Speaker 1: knows it happened. Yeah, which is a pity. Maybe it's

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Speaker 1: one of those things where it's still somewhere, but it's

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Speaker 1: been handed down in the family and nobody knows. Maybe

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Speaker 1: or maybe he was just like a person like today

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Speaker 1: that don't like to have their picture taken and he's like, no,

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Speaker 1: not me, Let's look at numbers instead.

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Speaker 2: Numbers are good.

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Speaker 1: I want to write a TV series about the Searchers

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Speaker 1: because every time I read more about them, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: this is excellent. And you could go a number of ways.

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Speaker 1: It could be a drama, it could be a comedy,

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Speaker 1: it could be it could be a murder mystery. Sure, sure,

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Speaker 1: I just love the idea that you know, there's a story,

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Speaker 1: there is a story to be examined there. Because they

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Speaker 1: were picking primarily elderly women because if they did get

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Speaker 1: exposed to plague and consequently died, it would feel like

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Speaker 1: less of a loss because they had lived their lives.

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Speaker 1: They were also more capable at that point because most

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Speaker 1: of them had outlived their families of living in quarantine

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Speaker 1: without that causing as much distress. But it also just like,

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Speaker 1: it's just fascinating to me that they also a lot

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Speaker 1: of the time were already the people that were also

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Speaker 1: taking care of the six. So there was like a

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Speaker 1: perception of like you probably were, you probably have already

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Speaker 1: been exposed to everything, and you're still all right. So

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Speaker 1: it's okay for you to go into this house where

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Speaker 1: somebody might have died of plague. I think of the

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Speaker 1: Eddie Wizard bit about how Grandma's live forever. I'm a Graham,

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Speaker 1: I lived to a million. They're just in destruct to

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Speaker 1: bullet that point. Yeah, it's very fascinating, very fascinating. All

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Speaker 1: of this sort of not William Petty, but Petty things

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Speaker 1: amongst all of these accounts and letters and whatnot, are

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Speaker 1: quite interesting. There is an aspect we didn't go into

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Speaker 1: it regarding the money arguments that Petty and Grant were

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Speaker 1: getting into towards the end of Grant's life that are

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Speaker 1: probably not what you think they were. They were not

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Speaker 1: about how Grant was spending money. Remember, Grant had power

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Speaker 1: of attorney and he has some say in Petty's finances,

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Speaker 1: and he kind of like would withhold money when he

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Speaker 1: was handling his accounts because he thought Petty was spending

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Speaker 1: it irresponsibly, and Petty was basically like, it's my money,

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Speaker 1: it's my problem, get out of my business. And that

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Speaker 1: was a big part of their rift. Although they clearly

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Speaker 1: loved each other very much right to the end even

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Speaker 1: though they were having those issues. But it's just fascinating, yacinating. Also, man,

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Speaker 1: that whole plague plus fire in just a couple of years,

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Speaker 1: London went through it, man, Yeah, which also did enable

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Speaker 1: the city to rebuild in ways that were more prepared

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Speaker 1: for its growth up to that point. But that's kind

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Speaker 1: of bright siting something that's really yucky. So yeah, anyway,

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Speaker 1: John Grunt, thanks for demography, sir. Hooray, hooray. Yeah, I've

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Speaker 1: wanted to talk about him since we did the episode

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Speaker 1: on Actuary Science. Yeah, because he's just interesting to me.

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Speaker 1: The fact that he was like not I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: literally like if I just tomorrow was like, you know what,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to do some analysis of these government reports

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Speaker 1: that we have and that I became famous for it,

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Speaker 1: and that's the work that I'm not, yeah for their

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Speaker 1: except it's even weirder because I at least look at

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Speaker 1: things like that as part of my job. Was just like,

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Speaker 1: nobody's doing anything with this. Maybe I do some with

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Speaker 1: this other than deciding whether to leave town right.

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Speaker 2: Or to have a chit chat and be like.

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Speaker 1: Oh, two people died of purples this week. I still

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Speaker 1: do that, Like I look at the I look at

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Speaker 1: like the flu report yeah, to determine what precautionary steps

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Speaker 1: I want to take regarding the flu that kind of stuff.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean, I think that's perfectly normal. It

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Speaker 1: is really interesting too, that nobody had been using any

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Speaker 1: of this available information to actually establish at least baseline

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Speaker 1: numbers of what was going on in London while they

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Speaker 1: were repeating complete falsehoods based on assumption, and like, just right,

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Speaker 1: the accepted wisdom of the day was not that wise.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The part about people assuming there were way more women

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Speaker 1: than men, uh huh reminded me of the little tidbit

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Speaker 1: that you will see circulating sometimes about how people perceive

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Speaker 1: women as talking a lot more than I talk in

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Speaker 1: a group. It reminded me of that a lot me too,

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Speaker 1: And I was like, is it that perception?

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Speaker 2: Is it that.

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Speaker 1: The men of London were like, oh, women everywhere? Or

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Speaker 1: I don't know, was there some other thing? Was it

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Speaker 1: that women were doing so much of the various kinds

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Speaker 1: of like day to day labor, that people saw women

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Speaker 1: everywhere even though they were not They were just busy

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Speaker 1: and constantly about I don't know, I don't know what

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Speaker 1: flavor of bias may have led them that incorrect assumption,

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Speaker 1: because especially when you consider the fact that they thought

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Speaker 1: a lot of people believe there were two million people

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Speaker 1: in London, so at that point they thought there were

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Speaker 1: one point five million women, yeah, and half a million men, many,

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Speaker 1: so many guys. This should have been so much more

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Speaker 1: obvious than what you're doing. Fascinating, fascinating. Thanks John Grint

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Speaker 1: for all your work. We talked about old inventions that

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Speaker 1: most people probably think are newer inventions this week, which

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Speaker 1: I loved, and I will say this, I could read

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Speaker 1: Heron's books all day long because a lot of his

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Speaker 1: little inventions, which like he wasn't inventing things to be

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Speaker 1: like I've invented a thing, it's the new thing.

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Speaker 2: This is going to change things.

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Speaker 1: It was all kind of like theoretical expressions of mechanical concepts,

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Speaker 1: but some of them were wild and potentially manipulative. There

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Speaker 1: was one invention in the Pneumatics that is called temple

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Speaker 1: doors opened by fire on an altar, and it is

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Speaker 1: basically a way for temple priests to trick whoever is

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Speaker 1: there into believing that a god has opened the doors. Well, okay,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, Haron, yeah, what are.

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Speaker 2: You doing, ma'am? Did we talk about him at all?

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Speaker 1: This is so long ago you may not remember either.

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Speaker 1: But did we talk about him at all in the

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Speaker 1: Automata episode? I don't think so. And I went looking

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Speaker 1: I don't have my outline for that episode because it

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Speaker 1: was so long ago, and I looked. I don't remember

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Speaker 1: where I looked for it, but anyway, I lost the

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Speaker 1: thread of it. So I don't think so. But I'm

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Speaker 1: not positive. But he has a lot of really interesting

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Speaker 1: stuff in there, and I really love his little vending machine.

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Speaker 2: It's quite cute.

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Speaker 1: Although I will say this, when we were discussing it

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Speaker 1: and you, I had put in the outline that it

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Speaker 1: looked like a samovar. Yeah, and you said it's just

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Speaker 1: like a cylinder for making tea. And I was like, what,

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Speaker 1: I've only had coffee out of a samovar, but I

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Speaker 1: think I'm a coffee girl.

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Speaker 2: Is all that it is?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Well, And when I saw the word samovar, I was like,

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Speaker 2: what is?

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Speaker 1: And then when I googled it and saw a picture,

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Speaker 1: I was like, I know exactly what that is, but

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Speaker 1: I thought other people might also have just not heard

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Speaker 1: it called that. I feel like I always heard it

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Speaker 1: be a tea urn This is like one of those

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Speaker 1: fascinating things where it's like your life experience is difference

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Speaker 1: from someone else. Yeah, because I have never heard it

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Speaker 1: called a tearn. Yeah, not doubting you, just I clearly

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Speaker 1: moved in a different circle where it was always full

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Speaker 1: of coffee. This has reminded me of a like one

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Speaker 1: of the first or I guess the first actual writing

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Speaker 1: job that I had after getting out of college, and

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Speaker 1: I was writing catalog copy, and the copy in the

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Speaker 1: catalog already referenced Bruins. And I am not a sports person,

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Speaker 1: and at that point had only ever lived in North Carolina,

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Speaker 1: and so I was like, do people know what bruin means?

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Speaker 1: And now, obviously, now that I know about things like

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Speaker 1: sports teams named the Bruins, it made it made a

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Speaker 1: lot make a lot more sense when the marketing manager

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Speaker 1: looked at me like she could not believe I was

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Speaker 1: asking this question, and I was like, I in hindsight,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, yes, this is because I lived in North

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Speaker 1: Carolina and did not watch any variety of sports, and

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Speaker 1: now you live in the greater Boston area where everything

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Speaker 1: is Bruins hockey. Baby, I love it, love it. Though

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Speaker 1: that was never my team. No, I wish every room

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Speaker 1: had a disco ball in it. Oh, I was going

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Speaker 1: to share how we got to this show.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: So my husband, who I love very much because he

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Speaker 1: is precious and who knows me, sent me this very

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Speaker 1: funny Instagram reel by someone who was saying she was

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Speaker 1: in a public bathroom and there's a button on the

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Speaker 1: wall and if you push it, the lighting goes out

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Speaker 1: in the bathroom for a second, and then a disco

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Speaker 1: ball starts spinning and lights come on. And this is like,

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Speaker 1: I don't remember where they said it was, because in

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Speaker 1: a different in a different post, they mentioned where that was.

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Speaker 1: And I we are in the middle of a multi

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Speaker 1: year prepping to redo my bathroom, and I'm like, thank

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Speaker 1: you for this information level of my life because he's,

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Speaker 1: of course like, you want to disco ball in the bathroom? Right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I had not thought of it, but it's gonna happen now.

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Speaker 2: Well, and I can.

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Speaker 1: I can think of specific locations where I would be

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Speaker 1: unsurprised to find a disco ball in the bathroom.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: I would be unsurprised at a gay bar for there

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Speaker 1: to be a disc.

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to bathroom.

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Speaker 1: Remember if Lips Atlanta, which is a drag a drag

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Speaker 1: venue here in Atlanta, has disco balls in the bathroom there,

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Speaker 1: Hold de core is adorable. Yeah, we have a Death

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Speaker 1: Star disco ball in our tiki lounge. Sure, sure, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't go in the cantina. Because you've never seen a

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Speaker 1: disco ball on Star Wars, So it does not go

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Speaker 1: in our immersive cantena space.

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Speaker 2: Yeah right, I have such rules.

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Speaker 1: I'm so rigid about what cannon can't go into cana.

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Speaker 1: No disco balls, if ever they show one, Yeah, Star Wars, It's.

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Speaker 2: Going to go right in there immediately, I'm sure.

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Speaker 1: I honestly don't know, because the whole premise of the

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Speaker 1: cantena is that it's a dive bar on tattooing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, when the dive bar on Tattooing comes under

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Speaker 1: new management and they turn it into a drag cantina,

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Speaker 1: which would be pretty funny, I would like that. I

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Speaker 1: would find that hilarious. I'm thinking about various Star Wars

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Speaker 1: characters that would make yeah, make great drag kings or queens. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so of course I associate mirror balls with disco balls.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, of course.

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Speaker 1: So when I initially saw that there was this like

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Speaker 1: description of one from the late nineteenth century, I had

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Speaker 1: a moment where I was it's like whoa. But then

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Speaker 1: I thought about it and I was like, self, you

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Speaker 1: have for sure seen pictures of performance spaces and dance

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Speaker 1: halls and stuff like that with disco balls in them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, from way before the disco era. It just hadn't

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Speaker 2: really clocked.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it is one of those things. A

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Speaker 1: lot of times there are pictures like that. Now, all

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Speaker 1: I can picture is that photograph from the shining of

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Speaker 1: the Overlook Hotel where they sort of are dappled with light,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know that you see the disco ball

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Speaker 1: in it. Yeah, yeah, but you see the effect that

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Speaker 1: is very obviously from a Mirrord ball.

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Speaker 2: Of some type.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I think that's the thing. Is a lot of

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Speaker 1: times you're seeing the dappled lighting effect and not necessarily

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Speaker 1: the ball right too.

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Speaker 2: It's fascinating. Yeah, it's fascinating. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure glad somebody thought to do that, because I

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Speaker 1: love it. He's very sparkly, so sparkly.

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Speaker 2: It's so good.

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Speaker 1: It's so good, it's unconsitably good. How much a simple

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Speaker 1: device can bring joy. Yeah, just I'm like a kiddie

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Speaker 1: chasing it around the room.

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Speaker 2: Love it. Love it.

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Speaker 1: The best I'm thinking about the machines that blow bubbles,

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Speaker 1: which like the first time I ever experienced one of those,

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Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure I was in Boone, North Carolina, when

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Speaker 1: I was in high school or maybe early college age,

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Speaker 1: and I was just like walking around downtown Boone and

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Speaker 1: there was some kind of store that had a bubble

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Speaker 1: blowing machine in the window that was just blowing the

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Speaker 1: bubbles out into the street, and I was like, this

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Speaker 1: is the best thing I have ever seen. Yes, because

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Speaker 1: it also it also paired very well with one of

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Speaker 1: my favorite things to do, which is just to like

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Speaker 1: walk around a little town and see what all the

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Speaker 1: shops are. Yes, one of my favorite developments in mheld technology,

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Speaker 1: if you can call it that, in the last I

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Speaker 1: don't know fifteen years, has been and bubble guns, so

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Speaker 1: people can carry because they sell them in Disney parks, okay,

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Speaker 1: and so there will be time and kids of course

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Speaker 1: go bananas for them. Like you hand one of those

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Speaker 1: two kids and they're just bubblegun in it left and right,

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Speaker 1: So they're kind of like populating the parks with bubbles

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Speaker 1: without having to do any effort on their own, like

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Speaker 1: they're just little kids running around making magical things happen

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Speaker 1: all the time, which I love. There's nothing better than

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Speaker 1: just walking through a surprise cloud of bubbles to me.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure there are people that don't like it. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I love that, love that. I have a prism

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Speaker 1: that was a present from my mom many years ago,

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Speaker 1: hanging in the window in this office, and there are

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Speaker 1: certain times of year when the sun hits it at

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Speaker 1: the right angle and mikes rainbows on the wall and

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Speaker 1: I love it. I have a stitch of Leelo and

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Speaker 1: stitch bubble machine where he's actually blowing the bubbles. It's

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Speaker 1: like its own little uh huh automata. Yeah it's the best.

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Speaker 2: Oh, it's the best.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Best.

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Speaker 1: But the problem is, have you ever messed with speaking

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Speaker 1: kitties the catnip bubbles? So our cats don't really care

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Speaker 1: about catnip, Yeah, but they might care about bubbles, and

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Speaker 1: that way you know their cat safe.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay, that's a good point. That's a good point.

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Speaker 1: Because we used to have a kiddy named Zisu who

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Speaker 1: she loved a bubble and We discovered this because of

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Speaker 1: that stitch bubble machine. Like I just reminded myself of

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Speaker 1: it thinking about it, and she would go after them.

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Speaker 1: But I was always worried about all the soap getting

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Speaker 1: on her paws because she would bath them closed. And

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Speaker 1: I started buying the catnip one. She didn't seem to

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Speaker 1: care much about the catnip of it, but she really

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Speaker 1: loved to jump after a bubble and it made her

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Speaker 1: very happy. So I would fill the machine with the

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Speaker 1: catnip bubbles and she'd be occupied for hours. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: feel like Opel might particularly. So we have various small

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Speaker 1: toys that Opel will knock out of the air if

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Speaker 1: you throw them past her, And so I feel like bubbles,

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Speaker 1: I sort of. I think we tried some kind of

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Speaker 1: bubble something many years ago. It didn't really work, but

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Speaker 1: let's try again. I know I haven't tried it with

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Speaker 1: any of our newer girls. I wonder if they'd be

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Speaker 1: into it. Ye're gonna have to get some and fine

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Speaker 1: down any excuse to make a bubble. What Onyx is

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Speaker 1: really into is pressing the one button she has figured out,

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Speaker 1: which is the button that says treat, and we throw

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Speaker 1: a piece of her regular kibble and she chases it

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Speaker 1: and eats it. I also think disco balls. I've seen

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Speaker 1: some cats get pretty excited about disco balls. Also, yeah,

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Speaker 1: they like laser pointers, so they'd probably like disco ball.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I know there is some debate among cat behaviorists about

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Speaker 1: laser pointers and similar things because they don't get the

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Speaker 1: satisfaction of like catching prey, and that it can make

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Speaker 1: some cats kind of neurotic. So one, this isn't veterinary advice.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I have.

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Speaker 1: Had a cat before that I could not play with

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Speaker 1: laser pointer because because of that, like it was clear

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Speaker 1: that she to catch it and that was never gonna happen.

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Speaker 1: But these two will chase it for a while and

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Speaker 1: then they'll just wander and do something else.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's kitties, breath mints, vending machines, Yeah, and disco balls.

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Speaker 1: This is where my brain's at right now. This is

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Speaker 1: what my brain can handle.

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Speaker 2: Uh huh.

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Speaker 1: Silly amusements.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, my episode that we recorded in this session session,

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Speaker 1: I couldn't say it was not silly amusement. So thank

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Speaker 1: you for bringing some levity.

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Speaker 2: Great, happy to do it.

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Speaker 1: Listen, It's all because my husband sent me a disco

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Speaker 1: ball reel, and I went, where did disco balls come from?

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Speaker 1: Who invented this magic that can make happiness so easily?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, that's really all it takes. What a good question. Huh,

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Speaker 2: thanks mister Weastie.

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Speaker 1: Again, I wish I knew what the like motivation was

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Speaker 1: there where he was like, you know what I'm going

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Speaker 1: to do? Oh, thanks the whole little stick them on

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Speaker 1: a ball. I'm gonna make it his first patent drawing. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: his are not the way we see them today where

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Speaker 1: they're all little flat mirror pieces. They were like little

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Speaker 1: almost like tiny contact lens stock size mirrors that had

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Speaker 1: that same kind of dome shape to them, at least

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Speaker 1: in the illustration. So interesting, interesting, and I think it

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Speaker 1: was Omega when they picked it up and started me

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Speaker 1: and they started doing the flat once because they had

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Speaker 1: developed a material that could go on the balls more easily.

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Speaker 1: Thanks to them. Anyway, if this is your weekend coming up,

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Speaker 1: I hope you look at sparkly stuff as long as

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Speaker 1: it makes you happy. Have a party. Spin your disco ball,

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Speaker 1: be it death star, kitty Cat, or pumpkin shaped or

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Speaker 1: just a classic. All of them are good there's no

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Speaker 1: shame in the disco ball game. Seriously, find whatever brings

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Speaker 1: you a little bit of in these trying times that

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Speaker 1: we are all living in. If you do have to

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Speaker 1: work this weekend, I hope that you also find some joy.

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Speaker 1: Maybe you could bring your own tiny disco ball with

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Speaker 1: you places just to look at and make your happiness happen,

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Speaker 1: whatever it takes. I want everybody to take care of

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Speaker 1: themselves and each other and find joy and delight. We

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Speaker 1: are going to be right back here on Monday with

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Speaker 1: a brand new episode. We will also have a classic tomorrow.

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Speaker 1: Stuff you Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.