WEBVTT - #027 Jason Flom with Jerome Morgan 0:00:04.080 --> 0:00:05.880 I think we have the best legal system. 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:09.280 It's just the people that implement they get lost along 0:00:09.320 --> 0:00:11.479 the way and forget what their job really is. 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.800 He just kept on trying to remind me that who 0:00:15.880 --> 0:00:19.040 was in authority, who was in control, and how easy 0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:23.360 it was for my body to be found in any 0:00:23.440 --> 0:00:24.760 alley of New York City. 0:00:25.800 --> 0:00:28.479 It's a tough prison when you have the guards going 0:00:28.520 --> 0:00:31.880 against you because they are the biggest gang in the prison. 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:33.680 They do that. 0:00:33.720 --> 0:00:36.080 They'll give a guy a life sentence and go home 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:40.159 in eat spaghetti like it was nothing. And anybody that said, well, 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:42.319 why would you confess to something that you didn't do? 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:45.400 My question to them will be why wouldn't you confess 0:00:45.520 --> 0:00:49.920 when somebody's threatening to kill your life? The judge, he said, 0:00:50.120 --> 0:00:50.720 how you feel? 0:00:50.760 --> 0:00:51.520 I said, I'm okay. 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:55.280 He said, well, the days you're lucky day you're going home. 0:00:56.840 --> 0:01:14.360 This is wrongful conviction. Welcome back to Wrongful Conviction with 0:01:14.440 --> 0:01:19.480 Jason Flamm. Today we have two very special guests. Jerome Morgan, 0:01:19.680 --> 0:01:22.880 who was exonerated after serving twenty years in prison in 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:25.680 Louisiana in the worst possible conditions. 0:01:26.160 --> 0:01:29.320 Morgan was seventeen when he was convicted of the murder 0:01:29.440 --> 0:01:32.000 of a sixteen year old at a party and was 0:01:32.080 --> 0:01:35.520 sent away to Angola for life. He proclaimed his innocence, 0:01:35.680 --> 0:01:39.320 but it wasn't until new evidence was discovered in prosecutors' 0:01:39.319 --> 0:01:44.000 files that Morgan's conviction was overturned, helped by two eyewitnesses 0:01:44.040 --> 0:01:47.600 who recanted, saying their statements more than twenty years earlier 0:01:47.840 --> 0:01:49.560 had been coerced by police. 0:01:49.600 --> 0:01:53.559 Kevin Johnson and Hakeem Shabaz were teenagers when they said 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:57.200 they were coerced into naving Jerome Morgan as a shooter 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:00.560 in the murder murder of the sweet sixteen party back 0:02:00.560 --> 0:02:01.640 in nineteen ninety three. 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:05.720 The DA's office finally dropped the charge last May. It 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:08.960 was a triumphant moment for Morgan and his attorneys at 0:02:09.040 --> 0:02:12.720 Innocence Project New Orleans. A teenager who went to prison 0:02:13.200 --> 0:02:16.040 walked out as a thirty seven year old man. 0:02:16.520 --> 0:02:19.000 And one of his attorneys is here as well. From 0:02:19.040 --> 0:02:21.560 the Innocence Project of New Orleans also known as IPNO. 0:02:22.400 --> 0:02:26.920 Kristin Winstrom is here. Jerome and Kristin, welcome to ronful conviction. 0:02:27.000 --> 0:02:28.120 Thank you, thank you, thank you. 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:32.919 Let's go back to May twenty second, nineteen ninety three 0:02:33.000 --> 0:02:34.600 and even a little further back than that. 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:37.040 You grew up in New Orleans, Yes, sir, Yes, I 0:02:37.080 --> 0:02:40.040 grew up in the neighborhood called Putch Train Park here 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:43.200 in New Orleans. It was a neighborhood that was built 0:02:43.200 --> 0:02:46.640 for and by Black's in nineteen fifty five, right after 0:02:46.720 --> 0:02:50.160 Brown versus Board of Educations with the Separate but Equal 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:54.480 law that was written into the constitution, and so they 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:56.200 had lent the history of ownership. 0:02:56.440 --> 0:02:58.480 And so, you know, I grew up in a culture 0:02:58.480 --> 0:02:59.519 of being. 0:02:59.320 --> 0:03:02.600 Able to teach it yourself and being able to take 0:03:02.639 --> 0:03:04.840 care of people, you know that needs your help in 0:03:04.880 --> 0:03:05.600 the community. 0:03:05.800 --> 0:03:07.040 And did they have a big family. 0:03:07.360 --> 0:03:07.520 No. 0:03:07.600 --> 0:03:09.960 I grew up in foster care from the age of 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:13.600 three until my own full arrest. My mom she didn't 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:18.680 receive a former education, so her reasons were because she 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:21.520 wanted us to have an education, she placed us in 0:03:21.600 --> 0:03:23.920 falster care. And that's how I end up in the 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:27.400 punch Trained Park neighborhood with a foster family by the 0:03:27.480 --> 0:03:28.400 name of the Johnson's. 0:03:28.840 --> 0:03:32.040 And on May twenty second, nineteen ninety three, you were 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:35.200 barely seventeen years old. It just turned seventeen, Yes, sir, 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:36.480 so are you're still a child. 0:03:36.880 --> 0:03:40.160 Yes, yeah, as a young young male and you know, 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:44.480 going through the phases of puberty. Of course, naturally, you know, 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:47.880 as a young person you struggle with your identity, you know, 0:03:48.000 --> 0:03:51.440 this this stage of puberty and just trying to find 0:03:51.440 --> 0:03:52.200 your identity. 0:03:52.520 --> 0:03:56.040 You ended up going to a party in a hotel ballroom. 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:58.360 It was a sweet sixteen party, yes, sir, and so 0:03:58.400 --> 0:04:00.760 it sounds like, you know, recipe for a good night 0:04:01.360 --> 0:04:02.840 and then things went crazy. 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:06.280 Yeah, well this the backup a little bit. 0:04:06.440 --> 0:04:09.040 I was put out from the foster home in Punchry 0:04:09.080 --> 0:04:12.640 Train Park a day after my sixteenth birthday for being 0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:15.200 suspected of selling drugs in the neighborhood. 0:04:15.600 --> 0:04:16.520 In nineteen nine three. 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:19.599 My best friend was murdered, but before then, his mom 0:04:19.680 --> 0:04:22.640 called him in nineteen ninety two with some crack rock 0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:26.479 in his room, and so she called all of our parents, 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:28.599 you know, his friends, because you know, it was a 0:04:28.600 --> 0:04:29.240 group of us. 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:31.400 It was friends that hang out every day. 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:35.160 And so she called my foster parents and then in 0:04:35.200 --> 0:04:38.200 turn put me out, and so I didn't see my 0:04:38.279 --> 0:04:41.279 friends because I went to stay in another area in 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:43.960 New Orleans in the eight war with my aunt who 0:04:44.040 --> 0:04:47.080 had a one bedroom apartment on Franklin Avenue and she 0:04:47.160 --> 0:04:50.640 stayed there with her daughter, who was a year younger 0:04:50.640 --> 0:04:54.800 than me. And so my friend Romeo Johnson asked me 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:57.119 to come to the party because we hadn't been hanging 0:04:57.160 --> 0:05:00.000 out and they wanted to, you know, spend some time, 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:03.640 and so I agreed. We met up at another friend's 0:05:03.680 --> 0:05:07.240 house and walked to the party, and so we got there. 0:05:07.760 --> 0:05:09.680 I was very familiar with a lot of people there 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:13.400 because my freshman year was spent at McDonald thirty five 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:17.360 and that's where the young lady whose birthday was. 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:18.479 That's where she attended. 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:21.080 And by this time all it was, all of us 0:05:21.160 --> 0:05:23.760 was juniors at the time, are just finishing our junior 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:26.719 year in school, and so all I needed was to 0:05:26.800 --> 0:05:29.400 and I have credits to graduate, so you know, it 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:33.640 was pretty much a friendly party until two group of 0:05:33.680 --> 0:05:36.520 guys started to you know, push and shove each other 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:40.560 while dancing on the dance floor, and so that escalated. 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:43.839 But one group of guys left out to I guess, 0:05:43.839 --> 0:05:47.799 avoid anything that may transpire from that pushing and shoving, 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:51.440 but then decided to come back in. And the moment 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:53.479 they decided to come back in, the other group of 0:05:53.520 --> 0:05:56.160 guys that they was, you know, getting into the skirmish 0:05:56.279 --> 0:05:58.520 with you know, approached them and then they started to fight. 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:00.800 And once the fight started, it was like a bro 0:06:01.800 --> 0:06:04.800 many people fighting and then shots he erupted. And once 0:06:04.839 --> 0:06:06.960 shots he erupted it. I was standing there next to 0:06:07.400 --> 0:06:11.120 the speakers by the DJ table because I enjoy music. 0:06:11.320 --> 0:06:14.600 But once I heard the shots, my immediate reaction was. 0:06:14.520 --> 0:06:17.200 To jump behind the DJ table and hide under the 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:20.479 DJ table so that I won't get shot. A few 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:22.600 of my friends in my peripheral I could see them 0:06:22.680 --> 0:06:25.320 running in some of the same directions and then running 0:06:25.320 --> 0:06:26.240 into another room. 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:27.880 How many people were at the party. 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:32.040 Well, by record, over eighty because everybody had to enlist 0:06:32.080 --> 0:06:35.159 their names before leaving. But that don't account for the 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:37.520 people that may have left as they were running from 0:06:37.560 --> 0:06:38.279 the gun shots. 0:06:38.760 --> 0:06:42.320 But at least eighty people, it was a pretty big party. Yes, yes, yeah, 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:44.760 it sounds like a recipe for disaster. I mean, gunshots 0:06:44.760 --> 0:06:47.359 in a crowded place like that, anything could happen. You 0:06:47.400 --> 0:06:50.360 could have been shot, so you're hiding under the table. 0:06:50.279 --> 0:06:56.039 Right and the shots ceased. You hear a lot of screaming, yelling. 0:06:56.279 --> 0:06:59.880 I heard, in particular, somebody shot in the area where 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:03.440 I thought i'd see my friend run too, So immediately 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:06.280 my attention went to there. I left it, went and 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:09.480 went into that room and found a person that we 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:12.400 was acquainted with was shot in the leg and my 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:15.360 friends were trying to help him. So immediately took off 0:07:15.440 --> 0:07:19.080 my shirt because I see two wounds, entry wound and 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:21.200 exit wound. I don't know where I learned it from, 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:24.080 but I took off my shirt to tie around his 0:07:24.160 --> 0:07:27.040 leg under the wound to stop the bleeding. But my 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:29.640 shirt didn't fit because he was a kind of bulky guy. 0:07:29.800 --> 0:07:34.840 So my friend Romel Johnson snatched the table caught off 0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:38.480 of the refreshment table to tie around his leg, and 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:40.960 so once we tied that around his leg, we sat 0:07:41.000 --> 0:07:42.760 there and to the ambulams came. 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:48.280 And then the police were called quickly. Yes, yes, I'm 0:07:48.280 --> 0:07:50.160 sure probably a lot of different people, probably called nine 0:07:50.200 --> 0:07:54.400 one one, and they showed up within minutes, right. 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:57.160 Yeah, Well, but at the time I had no knowledge 0:07:57.160 --> 0:07:58.880 of it. Like I said, I was in this adjacent 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:00.440 room waiting with this victim. 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:01.560 Into the ambulance came. 0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:05.560 So my personal knowledge of the police being there came 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:08.160 about when we came out of the room with this 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:11.800 victim and just that'll go with the paramedics so they 0:08:11.800 --> 0:08:12.960 can get him to the hospital. 0:08:13.680 --> 0:08:15.760 But once I came out of there, it was like 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:17.080 table set up. 0:08:17.320 --> 0:08:20.480 It was ununiformed police there and uniform police there. 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:24.600 So I'm sure everybody listening is going, okay, well, so 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:28.160 what's the story here? I mean, why would anybody possibly 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:31.920 there's over eighty people, because, like you said, not including 0:08:31.960 --> 0:08:33.760 the people who left, they counted eighty people there, and 0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:35.800 obviously a lot of people probably ran right out the door. 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:37.640 The people who are closest to the door, it's a 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:40.160 safe bet they went to the street and got the 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:43.040 hell out of there. I want to ask Christen this too, 0:08:43.160 --> 0:08:47.240 Like again, it sounds like you're going home and it's 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:50.200 a very unfortunate incident. You actually acted in a very 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:53.360 kind of heroic way for somebody who's not trained as 0:08:53.400 --> 0:08:55.160 a doctor or anything else. Maybe you saw it on 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:59.200 TV or whatever, but you did what a concerned and 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:01.880 honorable citizen would do, which has come to the aid 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:05.719 of somebody who's been shot and bleeding, and you did 0:09:05.760 --> 0:09:07.640 what you could do in the circumstance, and then stayed 0:09:07.640 --> 0:09:10.560 there till the ambulance came. That's more than ninety percent 0:09:10.559 --> 0:09:13.120 of people would have done or did do right. So 0:09:13.280 --> 0:09:17.240 it sounds like that's where this story ends, but it's 0:09:17.320 --> 0:09:20.679 not so. Kristin, What can you tell us, like, how 0:09:20.679 --> 0:09:25.120 did he possibly become a suspect under this scenario? I mean, 0:09:25.120 --> 0:09:27.040 I know it's Louisiana, and I know it's New Orleans 0:09:27.040 --> 0:09:30.720 and crazy shit happens here every day all day and 0:09:30.800 --> 0:09:31.760 twice on Sunday. 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:33.319 But tell us what happened? 0:09:33.640 --> 0:09:37.079 Well, to clarify a little bit. Once the shots are fired, 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:40.120 not only was Jerome's friend shot in the leg, but 0:09:40.160 --> 0:09:42.880 there was another individual who shot in the abdomen. He 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:46.800 ultimately survived that shooting. And one boy, Clarence Landry, was 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.199 shot and killed and he died there on the scene. 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:51.960 And so that's how this became murder charge. But the 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:55.520 reason that when our office looked at Jerome's case and 0:09:55.559 --> 0:09:58.160 we were committed to representing him, even though we didn't 0:09:58.200 --> 0:10:00.800 initially know how we're going to do it, is because, 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:05.840 by everyone's account, the gunman shot those bullets and then 0:10:06.000 --> 0:10:07.200 ran out of the room. 0:10:07.320 --> 0:10:09.600 It was a single gunman, yes, single gunman, a lot 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:10.200 of shots though. 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:14.200 Let me think I believe there were eight shots. Seven 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:14.760 or eight shots. 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:16.040 That's a lot in a crowded room. 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:19.360 But yeah, and so by all accounts, that gunman ran 0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:22.200 out of the room, as you would expect somebody who 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:24.920 shoots a gun into a crowd, But he left the building. 0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:27.920 He left the building. And when the detectives arrived a 0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:31.680 bit later after the initial police arrived, and they took 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:35.720 down the names, phone numbers, addresses, school social security numbers 0:10:35.720 --> 0:10:37.440 of every kid who was still in the room and 0:10:37.520 --> 0:10:40.400 kind of had them line up and asked them their information. 0:10:40.440 --> 0:10:42.360 I think basically was asked him, do you know anything? 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:45.160 Everyone in the room gave them their basic information and 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:47.520 said I don't know who it was. I couldn't see it. 0:10:47.840 --> 0:10:49.760 They were then free to leave. And so there was 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.280 in the police report a list of I believe eighty 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:56.280 four names and Jerome's name, date of birth, address, social 0:10:56.320 --> 0:10:59.480 security number is listed there By all accounts he was 0:10:59.480 --> 0:11:01.520 in the room after the shooting. So the gunman fled, 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:03.800 Jerome Morgan is still in the room, and somehow he 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:07.120 gets convicted of this murder. So that's why we are 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:10.120 always confident in his innocence. But I can tell you 0:11:10.440 --> 0:11:11.280 why he was. 0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:15.000 Convicted let's talk about that, because it is an insane 0:11:15.040 --> 0:11:24.720 story of incompetence, malfeasance, misconduct, carelessness, and just sort of 0:11:24.760 --> 0:11:27.839 a don't give a fuck about the truth type of attitude. 0:11:28.040 --> 0:11:30.839 They were fishing in the wrong pond, right, They knew 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:34.439 that the actual perpetrator left, So what did they do. 0:11:34.480 --> 0:11:36.960 They decided to pick somebody from a group of people 0:11:37.000 --> 0:11:40.840 who should have automatically been excluded, right, And they lied 0:11:41.240 --> 0:11:43.880 in order to accomplish that goal. I mean, and they 0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:46.280 didn't lie a little, they lied a lot, right, Which 0:11:46.280 --> 0:11:48.520 is one of the things that makes this case an 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.720 important case for people to know about because it wasn't 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:54.680 a small lie. It was a big lie, and it 0:11:54.720 --> 0:11:57.960 was a series of them that led to Jerome almost 0:11:57.960 --> 0:12:00.000 having his entire life taken away from him, but certainly 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:03.520 his more than half of his life was taken from him. 0:12:03.840 --> 0:12:05.719 And had you guys not gotten involved, he would have 0:12:05.800 --> 0:12:06.400 died in prison. 0:12:06.720 --> 0:12:09.760 Yes, he had a sentence of life without parole. So 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:12.040 that was a sentence in Louisiana. That's a sentence to 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:12.680 die in prison. 0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.520 So, Jerome, you were a boy, not a man. All 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:19.199 of a sudden, you're a boy in a very grown 0:12:19.280 --> 0:12:23.160 up situation. So what happened and then what went through 0:12:23.160 --> 0:12:23.640 your mind? 0:12:24.240 --> 0:12:27.800 Well, but you know I was there. You know, I 0:12:27.880 --> 0:12:28.680 was a witness. 0:12:28.920 --> 0:12:32.000 I seen the fire from the gun, and I seen 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:36.520 the guy and dead and you know other guy shot. Now, 0:12:36.640 --> 0:12:39.240 the guy that was breaking up the fight, I didn't 0:12:39.520 --> 0:12:43.000 see him because from the record, he ran out into 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:45.920 the lobby. And that's how they initiated the call to 0:12:46.040 --> 0:12:48.560 the police, because as soon as he ran out, he 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:51.040 ran into a lobby and a person in there saw 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:53.960 that he was injured and bleeding and called the police. 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:56.920 You know, just that experience. But being in New Orleans 0:12:57.000 --> 0:12:59.880 is like it's no surprise at that time. You know, 0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:04.320 New Orleans had a heavy culture and kind of rowdy music, 0:13:04.520 --> 0:13:08.560 bonce music, hype music, and that's what started the humbug 0:13:08.840 --> 0:13:09.400 between the. 0:13:09.320 --> 0:13:10.280 Two group of guys. 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:12.360 You know, Like I said, I was put out from 0:13:12.400 --> 0:13:15.400 the Foster Home, so I was staying with my aunt, 0:13:15.679 --> 0:13:18.920 and you know, we were poor. Usually when I was 0:13:18.920 --> 0:13:21.199 staying with in the Foster Home, you know, I was 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:25.680 more well off because I had more community, more neighbor support. 0:13:26.240 --> 0:13:28.800 But I'm saying that because at this particular time, I 0:13:28.840 --> 0:13:30.920 had to go find some cheap clues to wear to 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:34.360 the party something new, and at the time the trend 0:13:34.520 --> 0:13:38.000 was Warner brother T shirts, you know, Jean Sharks and 0:13:38.080 --> 0:13:42.280 tennis shoes, maybe some socks or something. But I say 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:44.240 that to say, this is what I bought all Knall 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:46.400 Street that ned it went to the party, and this 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:48.720 is what the group of guys that got into with 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:51.960 the guy who would feelings shot and his friends wore 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:56.360 that night, Warner brother T shirts and Jean Sharks tennis shoes. 0:13:56.520 --> 0:14:01.319 So my thing is by a lot of people being 0:14:01.400 --> 0:14:04.839 aware of who I was and my friends because we'd 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:08.920 be at a lot of teenage events, you know, school dances, parties, 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:11.360 we used to go to skate country a lot, so 0:14:11.480 --> 0:14:13.839 a lot of people are familiar with our face and 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:17.319 so they probably misassociated me with this other group, and 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:21.640 the other guy that actually did it probably resemble me 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:25.600 in their perspective. So that's how I was associated with 0:14:25.720 --> 0:14:28.760 that group, by you know, these teenage rumors. But at 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:30.960 the time, like I said, I needed to and I 0:14:31.040 --> 0:14:34.400 have credits to graduate high school, so I was trying 0:14:34.440 --> 0:14:37.640 to focus on that, especially since my mom initially put 0:14:37.680 --> 0:14:40.360 me in foster care to get an education, and so 0:14:40.680 --> 0:14:44.920 I was also working at when Dixie at a grocery store. 0:14:45.600 --> 0:14:48.160 So I was trying to figure out my life. 0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:50.120 As it would end as a teenager and as I 0:14:50.160 --> 0:14:52.040 would approaching being an adult. 0:14:52.880 --> 0:14:54.560 But you know, I had a lot to figure out. 0:14:54.880 --> 0:14:58.040 I was reading about your case in the National Registry 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:01.560 of Exonerations. And here's where it gets really weird. Right, 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:03.200 and I'm just going to read this right the way 0:15:03.240 --> 0:15:06.120 they wrote it. It says that in June nineteen ninety three, 0:15:06.200 --> 0:15:09.200 so this is the next month, shortly after the Clime 0:15:09.400 --> 0:15:12.000 police received a crime Stoppers tip that the gunman may 0:15:12.080 --> 0:15:16.120 have been you, Jerome Morgan. The detective assemble the photographic 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:19.760 lineup that included the photograph of you, a seventeen year old, 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:22.040 and other people who had been at the party. This 0:15:22.120 --> 0:15:24.320 is where it gets weird. Two witnesses are shooting were 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:28.080 shown the photo lineup containing your photo. One witness did 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:32.640 not identify anyone in the lineup as the gunman, and 0:15:32.760 --> 0:15:36.600 the other, Kevin Johnson put it says, put Morgan's photo asides, 0:15:36.600 --> 0:15:38.280 I'm going to call you by your last name here 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:41.360 and said quote he knew that guy from grade school 0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:44.360 and he was not the shooter. Now I'm getting the 0:15:44.440 --> 0:15:46.880 chills like I do on this show, and I'm going, Okay, 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:50.080 wait a minute, we're done. Let's keep looking, because now 0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:52.280 we know this guy's not the guy. Yeah, so that 0:15:52.320 --> 0:15:54.320 should have excluded you right off the bat. Now, there's 0:15:54.360 --> 0:15:57.000 another part of this that's extremely disturbing, which is the 0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.880 same kid, Kevin Johnson told police that he chased the gunman, 0:16:01.040 --> 0:16:02.800 which is a crazy thing to do in the first place. 0:16:03.640 --> 0:16:04.200 He chased the. 0:16:04.200 --> 0:16:06.840 Gunman outside the building and followed him until he leaped 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:10.960 over a fence and escaped. Right, so the police knew 0:16:11.880 --> 0:16:15.840 that the gunman ran, jumped over a fence, and escaped, 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:20.600 and later on they managed to sort of twist this 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:25.560 into a whole different narrative where they said that actually 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:28.040 they didn't show up till half an hour after the 0:16:28.080 --> 0:16:31.000 shooting happened, which we know was not true at all, 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:35.720 and that therefore you must have been the guy who 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:38.800 ran away, jumped over the fence, and then came back 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:41.640 to blend in with the crowd, because that would be 0:16:41.920 --> 0:16:45.000 just the dumbest fucking thing anybody could possibly imagine to do. 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:49.600 Knowing that the police must be on their way, you're 0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:53.200 going to go back and sort of as they would say, 0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:55.560 blend In, that's a little bit of a stretch, right, 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:59.680 So Kristin, how did they get how did they get 0:16:59.720 --> 0:17:02.720 a con? I mean you would think that there's just 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:07.679 not a reasonable person that would believe this story. 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:09.680 Yes, there was a gunman who ran out of the 0:17:09.760 --> 0:17:12.680 room and Jerome was undeniably in the room after the 0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:16.560 police arrived, and the best witness to who that gunman 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:20.280 was explicitly excluded Jerome from the lineup, So it seems 0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:22.960 pretty clear that Jerome was not the person who did it. 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:26.520 After Kevin Johnson excluded Jerome from the photo array, the 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:28.679 police had no other leads. I don't know that they 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:31.000 were doing much work. They relied at that point on 0:17:31.240 --> 0:17:34.000 rumors from high school kids. That's what the crime stoppers 0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:35.520 tip was based on. These are all just high school 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:38.040 kids spreading rumors. And there were rumors that they're of 0:17:38.480 --> 0:17:41.240 other people besides Jerome as well. But the rumor that 0:17:41.440 --> 0:17:43.240 got to the police was Jerome Morgan, and so they 0:17:43.320 --> 0:17:46.240 put that photo line up together, he was excluded, and 0:17:46.320 --> 0:17:48.440 then they had no more leads. And so then that 0:17:48.640 --> 0:17:51.639 was June second, when that photo array was shown, and 0:17:52.000 --> 0:17:54.720 nothing happened in the investigation. I mean, you can look 0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:56.760 at the police reports and there's really nothing in the 0:17:56.760 --> 0:18:00.800 police reports between June second until August twenty second, three 0:18:00.880 --> 0:18:03.880 months after the crime. And based on the police reports 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:08.240 and what the jury heard, supposedly spontaneously, the police just 0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:11.280 called Hakeem Shabaz, who was one of the kids who 0:18:11.960 --> 0:18:14.160 was shot that night. He was shot in the abdomen 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:16.440 and survived. He was not involved in the fight, but 0:18:16.520 --> 0:18:19.240 he was trying to break up the fight, and supposedly 0:18:19.520 --> 0:18:22.240 the police called him three months after the crime. This 0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:24.440 is the first time speaking with him, and he just said, 0:18:24.680 --> 0:18:26.520 Jerome Morgan shot me, and he came in and made 0:18:26.560 --> 0:18:30.359 a photo identification. So that's the account that the police had. 0:18:30.440 --> 0:18:31.480 That's what the jury heard. 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:36.320 Right now. What's troubling me a little bit about this 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:40.760 is if you were the guy who got shot and 0:18:41.520 --> 0:18:45.240 you knew who did it, what the fuck would take 0:18:45.280 --> 0:18:48.280 you so long to come forward with that information. Did 0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:49.480 you know Shabaz? 0:18:50.080 --> 0:18:52.760 Well, yeah, he was a familiar face because we attended 0:18:52.880 --> 0:18:54.879 McDonald thirty five as Freshmans together. 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.840 Right. What happened there, Kristen, the true. 0:18:58.680 --> 0:19:02.480 Story of how Hakim came to name Jerome Morgan. So 0:19:02.960 --> 0:19:05.040 the truth is is that Hikim had no idea who 0:19:05.119 --> 0:19:07.520 shot him. He like everyone else in that room. It 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:10.919 was a dimly lit ballroom, and when the shots are fired, 0:19:11.160 --> 0:19:13.400 there was a bright light that came from the gun. 0:19:13.760 --> 0:19:15.600 No one could see the face of the gunman. Hakim 0:19:15.680 --> 0:19:17.600 was in the middle of breaking up a fight. He 0:19:17.760 --> 0:19:20.359 was in no better position to identify the gunman than 0:19:20.600 --> 0:19:22.719 other people who were shown photo rays and couldn't make 0:19:22.720 --> 0:19:25.600 an identification. So the truth is he didn't know. But 0:19:25.840 --> 0:19:30.159 in that three months he heard rumors about Jerome as well. 0:19:30.240 --> 0:19:33.760 He heard that name being thrown around. And what actually 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:36.840 happened was the police called him and got him on 0:19:36.920 --> 0:19:40.400 the phone and they said, Hikim, do you know who 0:19:40.440 --> 0:19:43.359 shot you? And he said no, and they said Jerome 0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:46.080 shot you. So the detective is telling him Jerome shot him, 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:52.200 and Haikim, hearing the same name that he's heard in rumors, thinks, okay, 0:19:53.200 --> 0:19:56.880 I'll believe that. He agrees, okay, and he goes down 0:19:56.920 --> 0:19:59.720 to the police station and makes an identification and makes 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:03.400 a form statement. So now we have one witness who 0:20:03.640 --> 0:20:06.199 explicitly says that Jerome Morgan was the gunman. 0:20:06.760 --> 0:20:07.440 But that's not all. 0:20:08.280 --> 0:20:12.560 No, So now at that point, the police arrest Jerome. 0:20:12.560 --> 0:20:15.959