1 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:05,520 Speaker 1: After World War Two, the World Bank was set up 2 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: to help with the reconstruction of Europe. Currently, the World 3 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:11,880 Speaker 1: Bank focuses on rehabilitating countries in the Global South. A 4 00:00:11,920 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 1: man from the Global South, a j Bannga, is now 5 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 1: the head of the World Bank. I had a chance 6 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: to sit down with him recently to talk about how 7 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,000 Speaker 1: the World Bank is operating today and how it differs 8 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 1: from his previous job CEO of MasterCard. 9 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:25,920 Speaker 2: So for those. 10 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 1: People that might be unfamiliar with the World Bank, what 11 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:31,360 Speaker 1: exactly is the World Bank? 12 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:35,239 Speaker 3: The World Bank, David has five units in it. The 13 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 3: first unit that was created was the International Bank of 14 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 3: Reconstruction and Development IBID, and that was what was created 15 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:45,640 Speaker 3: during the Bretton Woods conference if he spoke off. 16 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:47,839 Speaker 1: This is in the after World War Two that were 17 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:49,599 Speaker 1: set up. Largely I thought. 18 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 3: To reconstruct Europe and reconstruct Europe, and so there was 19 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 3: a big debate on the topic of should development be 20 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 3: added to the name or art because it is reconstruction 21 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 3: that is the primary focus. And eventually the pounding folks 22 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 3: who sat around there came to the conclusion that there 23 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 3: would be a mission for this that went beyond the reconstruction, 24 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:09,960 Speaker 3: as it turned out that is what happened. The next 25 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 3: part of the bank that got created was IDA, the 26 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 3: International Development Association that caters to the poorest countries in 27 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:19,400 Speaker 3: the world, seventy eight of them currently. But in history, 28 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,960 Speaker 3: you know, South Korea was a recipient divider, China was 29 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 3: a recipient of IDEA India. Yes, so you know Turkey. 30 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 3: These are countries that have now prospered and grown. But 31 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 3: both IBID and IDA construed what people call the World Bank. 32 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:38,120 Speaker 3: Then came IFC, which was the arm created to work 33 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 3: with the private sector and to help catalyze private investment. 34 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 3: Along came NIAGA, which is the insurance Guarantee Agency which 35 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 3: provides political risk insurance and other such insurances for people 36 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 3: like us in our old lives investing in countries. And 37 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 3: then the fifth part of it is called Exit. There 38 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 3: are plenty of acronyms in the bank. By the way, 39 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 3: there's a vice personal of acronyms hiding somewhere in the bank. 40 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 3: But the exit basically is a settlement of investment disputes. 41 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 3: So again, in our old lives, if you had a 42 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:10,800 Speaker 3: dispute to the sovereign, that's where you would come to 43 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 3: for arbitration and settlement. Those are the five units put together, 44 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 3: we do about one hundred and twenty billion of lending 45 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:22,000 Speaker 3: in a year across the five IDA provides grants. One 46 00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 3: third of what it gives is pure grants to the 47 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 3: poorest countries. The others are all concessional or price loans. 48 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 1: All right, So the World Bank Credit after World War 49 00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:34,839 Speaker 1: Two now has many different missions. You say, you lend 50 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: out about one hundred and twenty billion dollars a year take, Yeah, 51 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: And it's headquartered in Washington, DC, and it has a 52 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 1: very unusual governance structure. I don't know who set that up, 53 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 1: but what is the who came up with that idea 54 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 1: of Rube Goldberg or somebody? 55 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: How does that work? 56 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 3: If you were countries contributing capital and money in the 57 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:55,359 Speaker 3: case of IBID and ifc capital comes once in a while, 58 00:02:55,480 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 3: bank earns money on the loans it gives to developing 59 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 3: two countries who borrow, and the repayment of those loans 60 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 3: more than covers the administrative expenses of the bank. So 61 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 3: it's actually not reliant on taxpayer funding for administrative expenses. 62 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 3: It is reliant on taxpayer funding for IDA because the 63 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:17,519 Speaker 3: poorest countries, because they give away money to them every 64 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,359 Speaker 3: third every year that needs money. The way there for 65 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 3: taxpayers that are involved in this whole thing, and I 66 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 3: think government's basically said that if they're going to be 67 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 3: putting money into this, we'd like to have some insight 68 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 3: into it. That created this structure where there are twenty 69 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 3: five executive directors full time who sit here in Washington, 70 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 3: DC with some staff. Each of them represents either one 71 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 3: country or a group of countries, depending on how much 72 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 3: capital is coming from them. 73 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: Now, the tradition, as I understand is there are two 74 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 1: organizations set up after World War Two. One is the IMF, 75 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 1: the International Monetary Fund, and one is the World Bank. 76 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 2: And there's an. 77 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 1: Unspoken I guess rule or tradition that the IMF. 78 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 2: Had is picked more or less by Europe. 79 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 1: And the head of the World Bank is more or 80 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 1: less picked by the President United States and then ultimately 81 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 1: approved by their board. But the World Bank and the 82 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 1: IMF you have nothing to do with each other, or 83 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: you kind of work with each other, or there's completely 84 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 1: different purposes. 85 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 3: I mean, the purposes are different, but when you put 86 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 3: them together on the ground, if you don't work well together, 87 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 3: you're not being very helpful to your client country. So 88 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 3: I believe very deeply that we must be great partners 89 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 3: in the ground. I mean, the challenges in the world systems, 90 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:31,599 Speaker 3: David are too big for people to create silos and 91 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 3: try and solve them by themselves. So two plus two 92 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 3: is equal to five in this case. So what the 93 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:41,080 Speaker 3: IMA focuses on is macro and obviously foreign exchange and 94 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 3: the flow of funds and financing in markets and credit 95 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 3: default swaps of countries and things that we understand. What 96 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:49,679 Speaker 3: we try and do is actually developing. Vi'r truly a bank, 97 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 3: so we give longer term money. Our loans are anywhere 98 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 3: from twenty to fifty years in length. 99 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 2: Fifty year loans. That's a long loan. 100 00:04:57,279 --> 00:04:59,640 Speaker 3: So the IBRD after I came, I got a boat 101 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 3: to through fifty year loans for things. 102 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 2: Like one of those fifty year loans. 103 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 4: I like thin get one of absolutely, although you'll have 104 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:06,480 Speaker 4: to be around to enjoy it. 105 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 3: The fifty alan was designed to cater to things that 106 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 3: you you know, if you think about a country trying 107 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 3: to invest in its healthcare or in its education and 108 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:21,280 Speaker 3: skilling systems to create the right kind of people for 109 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 3: the future of the jobs they're going to create. It's 110 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 3: very difficult to think of that as a payback in 111 00:05:26,360 --> 00:05:27,320 Speaker 3: ten and twenty years. 112 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 1: So many of your predecessors have said that the bureaucracy 113 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: in the World Bank is unbelievable, and as a result 114 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 1: they often reorganize the World Bank, and every new president 115 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 1: World Bank reorganizes. Are you reorganizing or you just accept 116 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 1: what it is and just dealing with other things. 117 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 3: I mean, my view is very simple. The institution grew 118 00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 3: in a certain way with these five different pieces. That 119 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,799 Speaker 3: creates its own silos, and that's fine. I don't believe 120 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 3: in driving a car by looking in the rear view mirror. 121 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 3: I'm focused on the front. To me in the front. 122 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 3: If you're going to create jobs with those three pillars 123 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:06,440 Speaker 3: I spoke of, you have to work together. You have 124 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 3: to have one country plan, which is coosynchronous. You have 125 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 3: to have one direction, which is I'm going to do 126 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 3: these jobs. You have to one ability to work on 127 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 3: the ground with your client. If you're going to get 128 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 3: the client, we talk about public private partnerships. If the 129 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:22,160 Speaker 3: client needs a public private partnership, it needs to come 130 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 3: to three parts of the bank to get their loan 131 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 3: and go through three project management systems, and three due 132 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 3: diligence systems and three environmental and safety scare go. I 133 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 3: whan they will go crazy. If they had so many 134 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:34,280 Speaker 3: people to deal with us, they wouldn't be in the 135 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 3: condition they're in. So we have to turn from You 136 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 3: can call it bureaucracy, you can call it processes and 137 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 3: systems built by years of experience. 138 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 4: That's yesterday. I've just focused on tomorrow now. 139 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: Historically, at least in the last couple of years, the 140 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: World Bank has been focused a bit on climate change. Today, 141 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 1: the zeitgeist in Washington is not as favorable for that phrase. Perhaps, 142 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 1: So how has the World Bank adapted to that change? 143 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 4: Good question. 144 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 3: So what I've done over the last few months, not 145 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 3: just now from the election but earlier, is to go 146 00:07:08,040 --> 00:07:10,280 Speaker 3: to people in the Hill and now people in the 147 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 3: administration and tell them what's inside that climate change. I 148 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 3: understand the words can be not what you want, but 149 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 3: let's talk about what's inside it. First fact, we said 150 00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 3: we would try and get to about forty five percent 151 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:25,400 Speaker 3: of our financing every year going to what qualifies in 152 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 3: the world is climate financing. When I joined, by the way, 153 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 3: my successor had done a terrific job and already got 154 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:33,800 Speaker 3: it past thirty, which was the commitment he had made. 155 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 3: But he was past thirty, so I kind of said, 156 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 3: I think we can get to this forty five. But 157 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,640 Speaker 3: what's inside it? Half of it is designed to go 158 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:45,560 Speaker 3: for what you would call resiliency or adaptation, which is 159 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 3: heat resistant, varieties of seeds, drip irrigation, a school roof 160 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 3: painted white, not left wrecked in so it's eight degrees 161 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 3: schooler inside, you know, a road that doesn't wash away 162 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:59,240 Speaker 3: in a monsoon, and a school that's hurricane resistant. That's 163 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 3: actually what our clients want because they're dealing with this. 164 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 3: They want to invest in education, but they don't want 165 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 3: the school to get washed away. They want to invest 166 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:08,640 Speaker 3: in roads, but they don't want the road to get 167 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 3: washed away in a rain. They want to invest in agriculture, 168 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:13,560 Speaker 3: but obviously they don't have the same amount of water 169 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 3: to use. So this is all Frankly, we should have 170 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 3: this in large parts of the develop ald too. That's 171 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 3: one part of it. The other half, which we're trying 172 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 3: to do is what you would call mitigation. Five percent 173 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 3: of that twenty two and a half percent of that 174 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:32,079 Speaker 3: half is what goes to energy. Every Spring and October meeting. 175 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:35,599 Speaker 3: I get demonstrations outside the bank with my portrait on 176 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 3: an oil barrele calling me the fossil fuel guy, which 177 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 3: is interesting because of that five percent, one percent goes 178 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:46,160 Speaker 3: to natural gas and financing for it, four percent goes 179 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 3: to renewables, but the other seventeen and a half percent 180 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:52,680 Speaker 3: is to do what build a rail corridor in Africa 181 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,839 Speaker 3: called Lobito, So instead of transporting goods by truck, you're 182 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:59,719 Speaker 3: doing it by rail, which is ecologically more friendly. When 183 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:01,959 Speaker 3: you go the Amtrak here, you hear them telling you 184 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 3: how much you saved versus the flight you could have taken. 185 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 4: Same idea. So once you explained this to folks, you. 186 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 3: Get a very different understanding of what we're actually trying 187 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 3: to do with climate and even an energy. We're financing 188 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:16,520 Speaker 3: all of the above, if you know what I mean. 189 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 3: I'm the one thing we don't do is school financing, 190 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 3: which we stopped years before I joined. But I have 191 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 3: raised the topic with the board last year in August 192 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 3: or something about re getting into nuclear because to me, 193 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:32,599 Speaker 3: small nuclear reactors could be transformative and safe and a 194 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 3: great way to get to renewable energy. For data centers 195 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 3: in Ai. 196 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:38,959 Speaker 1: Well, the World Bank traditionally was not in favor of 197 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: financing nuclear and you're now changing now. 198 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 3: Actually the World Bank had a specific policy of not financing. 199 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 3: It's the board policies that got passed. 200 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:46,800 Speaker 4: I raised it. 201 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:48,719 Speaker 3: I didn't kind of make too much progress in the 202 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 3: first meeting because people went off into their camps. 203 00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 4: But the good news is the board. 204 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:55,200 Speaker 3: Has come together and said we're willing to discuss. They 205 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 3: told me then come back by June next year with 206 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:02,559 Speaker 3: a thoughtful policy that lays out everything from gas to nuclear, 207 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:05,839 Speaker 3: to geothermal, to hydro to solar and win and help 208 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:08,400 Speaker 3: us understand the context of energy in the context of 209 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:12,439 Speaker 3: the country. The idea, David, is affordable accessible energy. Just 210 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 3: like I said, the poverty is a state of mind, 211 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 3: not just an in a state of being. Electricity is 212 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:21,560 Speaker 3: a human right. We just need to understand that there's 213 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 3: six hundred million people in Africa with no elecxity. Six 214 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 3: hundred million, not brownout and blackouts, no elexity. I have 215 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 3: said we will reach three hundred million of them in 216 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:36,839 Speaker 3: partnership with the African Development Bank by twenty thirty with affordable, 217 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,280 Speaker 3: accessible elecxity, enough for them to not just get two 218 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 3: lanterns from a solar cell, but to actually get what 219 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 3: you call tier three elecxity, which is productive use. 220 00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:48,800 Speaker 2: Let's talk about how you get to be the head 221 00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 2: of the World Bank. 222 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 1: Presidents of the United States more or less recommend to 223 00:10:53,080 --> 00:10:54,839 Speaker 1: the Board of Governors. I guess it is of the 224 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 1: World Bank. You are appointed by a president United States 225 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:00,559 Speaker 1: or recommended the board approve you. But what were you 226 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:02,439 Speaker 1: doing before? I mean, how do you get qualified to 227 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 1: be the head of the World Bank. 228 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 3: My background, as you know, well we've known each other 229 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 3: some years, is that I am a private sector guy. 230 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:11,679 Speaker 3: I grew up in India and joined NESLE, worked there 231 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 3: for a few years, ended up at PEPSI for a 232 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:16,439 Speaker 3: couple of years, joined City Bank. I worked there for 233 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:20,000 Speaker 3: fourteen years and ended up running all of Asia during 234 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 3: the financial crisis, and then quit and became the CEO 235 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:25,960 Speaker 3: of MasterCard for the next twelve to thirteen years. 236 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 2: So you're minding your own business. 237 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: You're running MasterCard, it's doing pretty well, and all of 238 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:31,439 Speaker 1: a sudden somebody says, how would you like to be 239 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:32,679 Speaker 1: the president of the World Bank? 240 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 2: And you said no. 241 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,079 Speaker 3: It actually didn't work that way. MasterCard says that I 242 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:38,719 Speaker 3: was there those twelve years. You and I have discussed this. 243 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:40,800 Speaker 3: I'm very lucky. I had a great run. I joined 244 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 3: when a year after the IPO and the firm was 245 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:47,000 Speaker 3: about twenty billion in valuation. I left at three hundred 246 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:50,040 Speaker 3: and sixty. It's not about five hundred plus. So the 247 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 3: company is doing well. It's in a great spot and 248 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 3: well run and scaled over the years. I had told 249 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:57,199 Speaker 3: my board that I would give them ten years. I 250 00:11:57,280 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 3: joined at fifty and at sixty I wanted to think 251 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 3: of something else through my life. We had a great 252 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 3: succession process. I stepped away, became executive chair, and then 253 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:09,240 Speaker 3: stepped down all together and joined General Atlantic as vice chair, 254 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 3: and became the chair of the Fiat Families holding company XOR, 255 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:15,959 Speaker 3: and joined the board of Tamasek. And I had this 256 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 3: portfolio approach to my life until I got cold in 257 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 3: February of twenty twenty three, and then a few days 258 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:24,040 Speaker 3: later they announced that I was the candidate. 259 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:26,559 Speaker 1: So now you're the head of the World Bank, and 260 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 1: the approval process is the President recommends you, and then 261 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:31,839 Speaker 1: the Board of Governors has approved you. 262 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 3: Yes, So essentially they were ninety days between the recommendation 263 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 3: and the election, and I spent that period traveling and 264 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:42,760 Speaker 3: visiting almost ninety three country leaders and CSOs and companies, 265 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 3: and then they have to get together in vote. I 266 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 3: got all the votes other than an abstention from Russia 267 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 3: at that time. 268 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:51,000 Speaker 1: So in the long history of the World Bank, you're 269 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 1: the only person who's been the president came from a 270 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: developing country. 271 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,960 Speaker 4: Is that right? Yeah? 272 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,120 Speaker 3: Probably true. I haven't thought of it that way, but 273 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 3: that's probably true. Okay, I'm just going back in names. 274 00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, when you're running MasterCard, you're probably dealing with CEOs 275 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,839 Speaker 1: and in developed markets. Now you're dealing with people in 276 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 1: not less developed markets, right, And was at a big 277 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: culture shock? 278 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:12,120 Speaker 2: No? 279 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:14,079 Speaker 4: No, So this is that's a great question. 280 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 3: So even in master can't remember my business was growing 281 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 3: in all kinds of locations. You end up going to 282 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:22,680 Speaker 3: developing and developed countries. That's kind of where the future 283 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:25,319 Speaker 3: and the current are. The difference is what you go 284 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 3: in with as a perspective in whom you meet and 285 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 3: the circumstances you're dealing with. I've been there almost two years. 286 00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 3: I've made fifty odd trips overseas. I would say make 287 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 3: a fair number of trips, David to the big shareholders 288 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 3: in the developed world because making sure that you're aligned 289 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 3: with them is important. The developed world has had a 290 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:45,679 Speaker 3: great deal of political change in the last seven or 291 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,679 Speaker 3: eight months, and so my biggest shareholders, the governments have 292 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,760 Speaker 3: changed over making sure that you can help to understand 293 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,439 Speaker 3: what they're looking for and you answer what they think 294 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 3: you could be doing. It's kind of important in this job. 295 00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 3: You're dealing with very different challenges. But at the end 296 00:13:59,640 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 3: of the day, at the end of the day, what 297 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 3: I'm trying to do is to get the institution to 298 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 3: focus in the developing countries on young people and their future. 299 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: What is the problem with young people in their futures 300 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: that you're trying to address. 301 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 3: One point two billion young people in the emerging markets 302 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 3: are coming through the pipe in terms of a demographic bulge, 303 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:24,840 Speaker 3: and they will be ready for a job in their 304 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 3: age profile in the coming twelve to fifteen years. Most 305 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 3: people think of this over the history of development. When 306 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 3: you get this kind of a demographic bulge, they call 307 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 3: it a demographic dividend, and that is true. If these 308 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 3: people get clean air, clean water, education, health care, and 309 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 3: they're growing up, skilling and once they're grown, they should 310 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 3: get a chance to get a job, either at a 311 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 3: small firm or a big firm, or an entrepreneur or something. 312 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 3: Because if that doesn't happen, these young people now are 313 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 3: without hope and without optimism. 314 00:14:56,760 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 4: And without earnings. 315 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 3: If our business is to eliminate power, you cannot eliminate 316 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:04,680 Speaker 3: poverty just by building a school or a bridge or 317 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 3: an airport. That's important. Their inputs the output of eliminating poverty. 318 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 3: The single best way to do it is earning jobs. 319 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 3: You know, a friend of mine once told me that 320 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 3: poverty is both a state of mind and a state 321 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 3: of being, and a job eliminates both those aspects, gives 322 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 3: you dignity and gives you earning. 323 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 4: And I'm just very convinced. I'm just very. 324 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 3: Convinced that this young population can be the driver of 325 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 3: growth for all our Western companies and our children and 326 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:41,040 Speaker 3: our grandchildren if we get them productive employment with the 327 00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 3: dignity that that brings. 328 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 1: The gap between the developed market youth and the undeveloped 329 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 1: market now called maybe the Global South by some is 330 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 1: getting bigger, not smaller. And they also don't have access 331 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 1: to the internet as much as maybe people in developed 332 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: markets do, so how are. 333 00:15:57,160 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 2: You trying to bridge this gap? 334 00:15:58,560 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 4: Great question. 335 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:03,080 Speaker 3: So I mean, look, you know, opportunities are not everywhere, 336 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:05,680 Speaker 3: but talent is. The problem is the past has been 337 00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 3: that you kind of move. That's why talent moves to 338 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 3: find its opportunity. What we're trying to do here is 339 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 3: to change that equation a little bit. What we've looked 340 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 3: at in the theory of creating jobs in a country 341 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 3: or development is there are three things that need to happen. 342 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 3: The first one is you need to have the enabling infrastructure, 343 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:25,400 Speaker 3: whether it's bridges, roads, airport, schools, healthcare, eleccity, digital connections 344 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 3: that you know that thing. Then you need to have 345 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:34,680 Speaker 3: the right regulatory policies land labor, bankruptcy law, anti corruption, 346 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 3: some concept of what elecxity will costing get paid that 347 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,040 Speaker 3: you will get paid back, laws in the system, right 348 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 3: kind of governance. That's the second pillar. The third pillar 349 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 3: is to allow the private sector is basically creates jobs. 350 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 3: Government doesn't create jobs. Government is the enabler of the 351 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 3: private sector to do so. Right, from small businesses and 352 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:54,880 Speaker 3: small farmers all the way to companies that we are 353 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:57,360 Speaker 3: active with. You've got to get those three pillars in place. 354 00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 3: That's what I'm working on. IBID and I are my 355 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 3: two public sector arms that work on that infrastructure part. 356 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:06,520 Speaker 3: We have what's called the knowledge bank, which to me 357 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:08,720 Speaker 3: is even more important than the money bank. 358 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: How do you compare the satisfaction you're getting out of 359 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 1: doing this compared to MasterCard or General Atlantic or PEPSI 360 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 1: are just more satisfying or you. 361 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 4: Know, there's a time and life for everything. 362 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 3: When I look back from where I am today, even 363 00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 3: though it's hard work and it's different from what I thought, 364 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 3: I am so privileged to have this opportunity. I want 365 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 3: to be able to look my grandchildren in the eye 366 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:33,480 Speaker 3: and said. 367 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:37,120 Speaker 2: I tried, you haven't any grandchildren yet? Three three, okay. 368 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:38,960 Speaker 2: And they're not interested in the World Bank that much. 369 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:41,119 Speaker 4: They're interested in the World Bank because I'm there. 370 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 3: They're not interested in the World Bank person That, by 371 00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 3: the way, is one of the interesting issues I believe 372 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:47,480 Speaker 3: that I want to start up programmers having in the 373 00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,360 Speaker 3: middle of designing is to get people from the donor countries, 374 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:53,640 Speaker 3: young people like our children and grandchildren who are going 375 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 3: through the time between an undergrad and a postcrad and 376 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:58,680 Speaker 3: give them a chance to come work with us for 377 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 3: a couple of years country where we're doing real work. 378 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 3: Let them get exposure to what the Bank really is, 379 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 3: let them see what life in a Zimbabwe or a 380 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:09,920 Speaker 3: Congo or a Vietnam and the kind of work we're 381 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 3: doing there, and let them come back with a better 382 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 3: appreciation of why the World Bank is important for them. 383 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:17,399 Speaker 1: At the World Bank today, as you go forward, how 384 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 1: would you measure your success? 385 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 2: What is your standard? 386 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 4: I want to be called the ultimate plumber. 387 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 3: I fix the plumbing of the World Bank, because you 388 00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 3: can keep building a new house on top of plumbing 389 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 3: that's not working, and as we all know in our 390 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 3: respective homes, that's a recipe for disaster. If you fix 391 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 3: it the right way, beautiful houses get built and stay 392 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:38,479 Speaker 3: a long time. And I think the Bank is at 393 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:42,040 Speaker 3: a juncture when fixing the plumbing is really important. Whether 394 00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 3: it is the speed, whether it is the partnership with 395 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,480 Speaker 3: other multilateral banks, because together one plus one is equal 396 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 3: to three, whether it is the partnership with the private sector, 397 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:55,200 Speaker 3: which I'm cultivating very carefully. I just believe there isn't 398 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 3: enough money in the MDB and government. 399 00:18:58,280 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 4: Worlds to do it. 400 00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:01,600 Speaker 3: You need the privates to be a part of that solution, 401 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,359 Speaker 3: whether it is this pivot to jobs and what it 402 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 3: can do for cutting down illegal migration and building opportunities 403 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 3: all that. Nothing is possible without fixing the plumbing. Transparency 404 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 3: is my friend. I won't get it all right, I 405 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 3: will screw things up, but you should evaluate me by 406 00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:20,400 Speaker 3: how I fix things when I get to know, rather 407 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 3: than just a point of time. Jobs is what I 408 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 3: want to be seen as the transition of the bank, 409 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 3: for I want to move this bank from working on 410 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,680 Speaker 3: input to working on the output of jobs, because that's 411 00:19:32,760 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 3: the ultimate way to put a nail in the coffin 412 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:36,560 Speaker 3: of poverty. 413 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:40,160 Speaker 1: So if you go to a cocktail party and somebody says, well, 414 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 1: what do you do? You say, I'm the President of 415 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:44,159 Speaker 1: the World Bank. What's the immediate reaction? 416 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 4: They say, mostly they say oh wow. And then I said, 417 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:49,080 Speaker 4: I don't say oh what do you know? What I do? 418 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:51,680 Speaker 4: Not really? And then you kind of explain what the 419 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 4: bank does and these five things in the though. 420 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:55,680 Speaker 1: I mean, you have to have a business card, says 421 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 1: president World Bank, or they know who you are. You 422 00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:58,200 Speaker 1: don't need a business. 423 00:19:57,920 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 4: Card, Actually I do. Would you like to have a 424 00:19:59,280 --> 00:19:59,679 Speaker 4: business card? 425 00:19:59,760 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 2: Yeah? 426 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 4: Wow? Wow. 427 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, wow, okay present World Bank. 428 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 2: Great, it's a great business card. 429 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: So if somebody says, what is the World Bank accomplished, 430 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: what would that best example be? 431 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 3: If you go back over the last five or ten years, 432 00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:17,199 Speaker 3: It'll be very simple things. One hundred million people connected 433 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:19,680 Speaker 3: to elecxity, you know, more than three to four hundred 434 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,640 Speaker 3: million people with access to improved healthcare. 435 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:23,239 Speaker 4: That kind of thing. 436 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:27,119 Speaker 3: Where I'm going now is I've made a few specific commitments. 437 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,200 Speaker 3: Three hundred million people in Africa connected to Eric City 438 00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 3: by twenty thirty. 439 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:33,359 Speaker 4: I think it changes how Africa works. 440 00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:37,880 Speaker 3: One point five billion people connected to better primary healthcare 441 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:40,680 Speaker 3: by twenty thirty. That is to fight off what I 442 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 3: believe are the diseases of prosperity. You know, heart attacks, diabetes, 443 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 3: blood pressure, things that are creeping up in these countries 444 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 3: and which cannot be solved without distributed rural health centers 445 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:56,880 Speaker 3: with nurses and medical diagnostic reader as its own. That's 446 00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,240 Speaker 3: the second big thing they're focused on. And the third 447 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,399 Speaker 3: thing I'm focused on is getting eighty million women in 448 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:06,479 Speaker 3: the emerging markets access to equity to open businesses by 449 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 3: twenty thirty. Equity not debt, and those three things are 450 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 3: just examples. We've got others in the pipe to do 451 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 3: with this nine billion dollars to be focused on small 452 00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 3: hold of farmers because I believe that if you don't 453 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:23,880 Speaker 3: make small hold of farmers an interesting job for young people, 454 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 3: they will all go to the cities and a lot 455 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:28,600 Speaker 3: of them will end up in urban poverty. To keep 456 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 3: them in that farm and earning well, you need to 457 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:34,639 Speaker 3: create the right conducive environment, cooperatives that help them. They 458 00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 3: can access markets, fertilizer, seeds, better technology. 459 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 4: That kind of work is what we're trying to do. 460 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,879 Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln famously said God must love poor people because 461 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:45,840 Speaker 1: he made so many of them. But you don't think 462 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 1: it's inevitable. There have to be so many poor people 463 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 1: in the world, right. 464 00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:51,400 Speaker 3: I think it's very challenging to change this and bend 465 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 3: the arc. But what are you here for if you're 466 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 3: not going to try so. 467 00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:57,920 Speaker 1: The main message you want to convey to people about 468 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 1: the World Bank is that it's in good shape, You're 469 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,119 Speaker 1: on top of it, and that it's going to get 470 00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:05,400 Speaker 1: better and the world will be happy for the World 471 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 1: Bank doing what it's doing. 472 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 2: Is that right? 473 00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 3: The main message I want to communicate is that there's 474 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 3: a lot of good people trying to fix this place, 475 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,719 Speaker 3: to make it even more relevant in that job's approach. 476 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,920 Speaker 3: We have to get there. We're not there, We're a 477 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,840 Speaker 3: work in progress. But I feel very proud of what 478 00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 3: we're trying to do. And it's a real privilege, David, 479 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:25,800 Speaker 3: it's a real privilege. 480 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,639 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to hear more of my interviews. You 481 00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: can subscribe and download my podcast on Spotify, Apple, or 482 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 1: wherever you listen.