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Speaker 1: Let's see. My week has been full of working on

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Speaker 1: this stuff and trying to get ahead of the curve

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Speaker 1: here and get a little bit of an understanding for

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Speaker 1: what the hell's going on with all this AI thing

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Speaker 1: that's coming in and taking away all our lives. So

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Speaker 1: that's been fun tinkering with the stable diffusion. It's scary.

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Speaker 1: It's harder than I thought it was going to be.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm kind of glad to hear that there's

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Speaker 2: some skill required.

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Speaker 1: I was too, and I mean like it's far and

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Speaker 1: away not the skill that an artist needs to create

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Speaker 1: an amazing work of art. And the limitations are still

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Speaker 1: very present. But we should all be very scared because

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Speaker 1: it's it's coming. We should all be very scared. That's

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Speaker 1: what I'm here to tell. Everybody, run screaming into the streets.

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Speaker 1: The sky is falling.

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Speaker 2: Wow, you really full of.

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Speaker 1: Full of something something? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but it is like exponential, isn't it. So it's

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Speaker 2: gonna proofs so much more quickly. Yeah, then we're going

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Speaker 2: to be ready to handle the improvements anyway.

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Speaker 1: Anybody ever had uvulitis.

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Speaker 2: Sounds gross?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's awful. Uvula swells up from uh from snoring,

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Speaker 1: that was my problem. It seems well, I literally injured

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Speaker 1: myself snoring. That's that's the age I'm at now. Had

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Speaker 1: I had a day long injury. That what inhibited my

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Speaker 1: ability to do things because a snort too hard. Ah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, getting old is fun. It's so fun, so much fun.

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Speaker 1: Speaking of getting old, let's talk about something old. How's that?

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Speaker 2: Okay? I think it works a way of.

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Speaker 1: We're old, but this is way older.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know what's going to make you feel young

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Speaker 2: thinking about eighteen sixty. So yeah, I e about today's story.

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Speaker 2: I got real into this one. We had a listener

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Speaker 2: named Seth Batts, who is at Seth's Sculptures on Instagram,

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Speaker 2: suggests Winnaretta Singer as an episode, so started diaming into

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Speaker 2: her life. She had like two chasted marriages and a

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Speaker 2: bunch of lesbian love affairs and like sounds like a

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Speaker 2: really exciting person. But as usual, we got a little

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Speaker 2: sidetracked when we learned that Winneretta was the twentieth of

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Speaker 2: her father, Isaac Singer's twenty six children. Oh yeah, so

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Speaker 2: I'm over here, like, well, what in the world is

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Speaker 2: going on with Isaac Singer and his presumably exhausted wife

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Speaker 2: because my god. Well, a quick click on his Wikipedia

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Speaker 2: page and we were down a rabbit hole about a

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Speaker 2: womanizing actor turned inventor whose sewing machine changed everything, not

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Speaker 2: just in the home but also in the business world.

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Speaker 2: So before we get into Winneretta Singer, let's tell you

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Speaker 2: all about her father, Isaac Merritt Singer, the inventor of

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Speaker 2: the sewing machine and inexhaustible ladies man.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, let's go.

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Speaker 3: Hey, their friends come listen.

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Speaker 2: Well, Eli and Diana got some story to tell. There's

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Speaker 2: no matchmaking oromantic tips. It's just about ridiculous relationship.

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Speaker 1: I loove.

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Speaker 3: There might be any type of person at all, an

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Speaker 3: abstract concept or.

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Speaker 2: A concrete wall.

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Speaker 3: But if there's a story where the second plans ridiculous romance.

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Speaker 1: A production of iHeartRadio. So.

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Speaker 2: Isaac Merritt Singer was born in eighteen eleven in upstate

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Speaker 2: New York. He was the youngest of eight kids, and

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Speaker 2: he was like, I can do better. And when he

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Speaker 2: was ten, his mother divorced his father and left for good.

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Speaker 2: So Singer Senior remarried, but Isaac didn't get along with

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Speaker 2: his new stepmother, so at twelve years old, he ran

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Speaker 2: away to Rochester. Ah boy, firstplace of Eli Banks. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and also the garbage plate.

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Speaker 1: Oh, the garbage plate. Well.

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Speaker 2: At first he joined the Rochester Players, traveling theater troupe.

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Speaker 2: American Business History or describes him as quote a fine

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Speaker 2: looking youth, tall, handsome, blonde, and cheery. He's also said

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Speaker 2: to have like red hair and other sources so picturing

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Speaker 2: kind of a strawberry blonde.

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Speaker 1: Oh sure. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So he's a pretty good looking, charming, tall, attractive man. Okay,

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Speaker 2: cool personality, kind of a big personality.

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Speaker 1: Sure.

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Speaker 2: Apparently his biggest ambition was to become a great Shakespearean actor. Oh,

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Speaker 2: his favorite role was King Richard.

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Speaker 1: Oh.

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Speaker 2: Isaac also apprenticed at a mechanics shop when he was eighteen,

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Speaker 2: and he took to that very quickly, so he clearly

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Speaker 2: had some kind of like innate talent with machines.

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Speaker 1: In eighteen thirty, at just nineteen years old, Isaac married

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Speaker 1: the fifteen year old Catherine Hailey. They had two kids together,

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Speaker 1: William and Lillian, and of course they were super broke

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Speaker 1: at this time. Actors back then not much different than now.

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Speaker 1: The kids dressed in rags they played in the streets,

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Speaker 1: while Isaac mostly just worked odd jobs trying to make

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Speaker 1: ends me. In eighteen thirty six, they packed up and

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Speaker 1: they moved to New York City. They're all actors go

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Speaker 1: to make their fortunes.

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Speaker 2: He was like, Hey, if I'm going to be an

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Speaker 2: acting man, I got to go to the big app.

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Speaker 1: Book, the actions. When they got to New York City,

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Speaker 1: almost immediately Isaac joined another traveling theater troupe called the

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Speaker 1: Baltimore Strolling Players, and he was almost always out on

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Speaker 1: the road with these guys. He effectively abandoned Catherine and

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Speaker 1: he would go out and amuse himself with a ton

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Speaker 1: of other women in their many stops on tour. One

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Speaker 1: newspaper wrote, according to American Businesshistory dot org quote, his

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Speaker 1: intimacy with the female part of the population was severely

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Speaker 1: commented upon, and much sympathy was expressed for his wife. Damn, damn,

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Speaker 1: they had it in the papers. They were calling him out.

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Speaker 2: The journalist got wyndodayse yeah, buddy, well, and apparently I

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Speaker 2: guess everybody who ever came across him, because they were

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Speaker 2: always being like, damn, sucks for Catherine because he's going

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Speaker 2: home like three ladies on his arm every night. So

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Speaker 2: when Isaac was in Baltimore, he met a beautiful woman,

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Speaker 2: and that brings us to this episode side p Who

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Speaker 2: was that woman? So mary Anne Sponsler and her family

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Speaker 2: had no idea that Isaac Singer was already married, but

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Speaker 2: she was super into him. They got together, they started

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Speaker 2: seeing each other, they even got engaged. He asked her

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Speaker 2: to marry him, but of course he can't do.

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Speaker 1: That, right he's already married.

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Speaker 2: Uh huh. So eventually she must have learned the truth.

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Speaker 2: Some kind of agreement was made because Isaac and Catherine

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Speaker 2: stayed separated, and Catherine moved back home to her parents'

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Speaker 2: house with their two kids, still in New York, but

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Speaker 2: just not with him anymore, okay, and Isaac and mary

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Speaker 2: Anne moved to New York City and were like living together.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 2: In eighteen thirty seven, mary Anne gave birth to the

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Speaker 2: first of their ten children together.

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.

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Speaker 2: And apparently Marianne was always introduced and referred to as

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Speaker 2: Missus Singer or in some sources, Missus Merit, So everybody

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Speaker 2: already thought that they were actually married.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, who wouldn't that makes They've got ten children together

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Speaker 1: and they must.

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Speaker 2: Be I mean, seems pretty committed, I guess and where's Catherine, right,

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Speaker 2: She's not around anymore. But yeah, the doubtful honor of

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Speaker 2: being Isaac's wife was still just Katherine Haley's.

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Speaker 1: So Catherine packs up and moves takes the original kids

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Speaker 1: with him, and he's just like, well, I already got

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Speaker 1: another one. Yeah, I don't worry about I got the

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Speaker 1: spare ready to go. Ten kids here. Well, so far

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Speaker 1: in Isaac Singer's life, he proved to only be good

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Speaker 1: at one thing, getting women pregnant. He wasn't really good

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Speaker 1: at making money, which is a challenge when you've got

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Speaker 1: ten plus.

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Speaker 2: Children, million kids to take care of.

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Speaker 1: He would be out there working odd jobs, doing some

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Speaker 1: acting gigs. So you know, I got a commercial down

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Speaker 1: at the local medicine show.

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Speaker 2: He's going to walk down the streets like, hey, what

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Speaker 2: are you doing right now? Are you to come to

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Speaker 2: see a medicine show?

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Speaker 1: Have you tried Frederick's hair tonic? Frederick's hair tonic the

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Speaker 1: only tonic that's made with real hair. Well, one day,

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Speaker 1: while he was on one of these odd jobs, inspiration

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Speaker 1: struck and he invented a drill that would bore through rock.

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Speaker 1: And this is going to be really useful for canal building, which,

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Speaker 1: of course, at the time the mid eighteen hundred's super

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Speaker 1: on vogue. Everybody's digging canals, right.

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Speaker 2: What's funny about this story is that apparently Isaac was

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Speaker 2: on Yeah, He's working at one of his jobs, which

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Speaker 2: was some kind of digging job, and he was just bored.

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Speaker 2: So he was like, I don't want to do this.

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Speaker 2: I'm just gonna make a drill that'll do it faster

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Speaker 2: so I don't have to do He said.

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Speaker 1: I'm bored, But who should be bored is these rocks.

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Speaker 2: But I just love that because it's like, see how

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Speaker 2: useful laziness can really be, such an inspiration.

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Speaker 1: To that work and boredom.

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Speaker 2: You know, he did some work so he could not work.

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Speaker 1: Well. He ended up selling the patent for this invention

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Speaker 1: for two thousand dollars, and like any smart business man,

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Speaker 1: he took that cash and he decided to use it

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Speaker 1: to start a traveling theater.

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Speaker 2: Troop and they were in business decision.

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Speaker 1: And they were called the Merit Players. Well, with all

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Speaker 1: her kids in tow, mary Ann was selling tickets for

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Speaker 1: the Merit Players and she would sew their costumes while

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Speaker 1: Isaac handled all the production duties. But guess what turned

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Speaker 1: out to not be a profitable business model, and soon

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Speaker 1: the two thousand dollars was all dried up and they

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Speaker 1: were broke yet again, kids, don't use your life savings

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Speaker 1: to start a theater trip. Please, please don't do that,

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Speaker 1: even if your life savings, as they were for us

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Speaker 1: when we started ours were zero dollars.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: Well, of course Isaac had to start thinking of some

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Speaker 1: ways to make some money, and he looked back and

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Speaker 1: was like, well, jeez, I invented a really useful drill

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Speaker 1: for digging canals and that got me two thousand dollars,

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Speaker 1: So maybe I'll just invent something right quick and sell

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Speaker 1: that too. So he drafted up plans for a machine

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Speaker 1: that would carve the little wooden letter blocks that were

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Speaker 1: used for type setting at the time.

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Speaker 2: Okay, see another need. Yeah we can make this type

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Speaker 2: a little faster.

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Speaker 1: You see a need, you fill it, you make money.

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Speaker 2: Boom. Well, now, of course Asik needed money to build

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Speaker 2: a prototype right so he could sell it, and fortunately

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Speaker 2: he met George Zeebert, a Philadelphia publisher and bookseller, who

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Speaker 2: agreed to go into business with him, and he gave

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Speaker 2: him seventeen hundred bucks.

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Speaker 1: Hi that young man. Aren't you the one who invented

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Speaker 1: the rock boring drill. Well you seem good with money,

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Speaker 1: after all, you started a theater troop with that two

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars. So here's some more.

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Speaker 2: So they set up at a workshop in Box and

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Speaker 2: this workshop is owned by Orson Phelps, and Isaac got

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Speaker 2: to work making this machine. Okay, but it just wasn't

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Speaker 2: working out. Unfortunately, it missed their shot on this one.

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Speaker 2: The machine itself was fine, but at the time most

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Speaker 2: of the wooden type blocks were being replaced with metal. Oh,

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Speaker 2: so there was no market for this machine.

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Speaker 1: Oh jeez.

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Speaker 2: So Isaac's out of money again and he's like got

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Speaker 2: nothing to do. But for some reason, George Zebra continued

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Speaker 2: to finance his life. Not entirely sure what was going

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Speaker 2: on here with Zebra? Oh, because this is not cheap.

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Speaker 2: By this point, Isaac Singer had two quote unquote wives

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Speaker 2: and eight children to take care of.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god.

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Speaker 2: So I mean he's kind of an expensive guy to

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Speaker 2: keep on your on your apron strings like that.

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Speaker 1: N zeb Did Zebra have a little crush on Isaac

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Speaker 1: or something?

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Speaker 2: I mean, that's an interesting we speculation.

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Speaker 1: Mister Zebra was madly in love with Isaac Singer, a tall,

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Speaker 1: handsome actor.

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Speaker 2: Time he's like, oh in a smart and inventive Oh,

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Speaker 2: I can just put money into this hands.

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Speaker 1: Man but not good with his money. I could fix him.

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Speaker 2: I can fix him. Oh okay, I love this. I

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Speaker 2: think I can't Jorge Bieber in love with Isaac Singer.

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Speaker 1: Let us carry that through the rest of the episode.

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Speaker 1: Speculations Historically, the train is going to be riding alongside

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Speaker 1: us this one. Well. Fortunately for George Zebra's dwindling bank,

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Speaker 1: account orson Phelps needed some help. Remember this is the

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Speaker 1: guy who owned the workshop that they were working out

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Speaker 1: of in Boston that he was manufacturing sewing machines. There

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Speaker 1: were practical sewing machines at this point, but they weren't

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Speaker 1: really reliable enough to be commercially successful. So orson Phelps

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Speaker 1: is like, well, hang on, there's this inventor farting around

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Speaker 1: my factory with nothing useful to do. Maybe he'll take

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Speaker 1: a look at these bunk ass sewing machines and see

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Speaker 1: if he can do something useful with them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, not a bad idea.

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Speaker 1: But at first Isaac Singer shown a sewing machine and

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Speaker 1: called it a quote paltry business and according to American

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Speaker 1: business history. He went on to say, quote, what a

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Speaker 1: devilish machine you want to do away with the only

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Speaker 1: thing that keeps women quiet, they're sewing. Well, have we

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Speaker 1: take away the dutiful sewing duties, They'll just be yapping

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Speaker 1: all the time. I don't want to hear that.

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Speaker 2: Meanwhile, I'm thinking about sewing, which admittedly I don't do

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Speaker 2: a lot of sewing. Sure, in fact, I do know sewing.

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Speaker 1: I would say, I've never seen you, Sow.

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Speaker 2: I would say I have some sewing, like a accoutrement,

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Speaker 2: but it stays in a box in a drawer that's

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Speaker 2: never open.

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Speaker 1: That for that emergency one day, that.

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Speaker 2: One day when I decide, you know what, now I'm

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Speaker 2: going to learn how to do a button or something.

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Speaker 2: But it seems to me to be the kind of boring,

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Speaker 2: like hands busy work that would allow you to talk

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Speaker 2: quite a lot. Actually, And don't women have sewing circle.

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Speaker 2: The whole thing is they're all getting together to chat

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Speaker 2: and so they can and Sow. Maybe that's what he means.

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Speaker 2: He's like, they all go sit together and don't talk

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Speaker 2: to me, that's the main thing.

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Speaker 1: Or maybe Mary didn't like talking to him. So when

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Speaker 1: he came in the room, she was like, not now,

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Speaker 1: I'm sewing, and he was like, oh, they can't talk

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Speaker 1: when they sew. I get it. I understand women.

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Speaker 2: Now He's like, it's like pat and your stomach in

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Speaker 2: your head and rubbing your stomach at the same time.

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Speaker 2: That's the stupid. Well, of course we know that Isaac

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Speaker 2: overcame his fear of women talking and he did look

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Speaker 2: at the sewing machine. So in eighteen fifty these three

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Speaker 2: men put a commercial enterprise together. It was George Deeber

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Speaker 2: providing all the funding, Isaac Singer doing all the inventing,

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Speaker 2: and forsuen Felt doing the manufacturing, and they had an

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Speaker 2: equal three way share of everything they would potentially make.

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Speaker 2: And Isaac Singer did figure out the trouble with the

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Speaker 2: sewing machine. So at the time it used a curved

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Speaker 2: and the shuttle moved in a circle. But I guess

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Speaker 2: that led to a lot of like threads maybe snapping

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Speaker 2: or bunching up badly. The thread would sometimes be pulled

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Speaker 2: too tight, so it just required a lot more hands

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Speaker 2: on that you had to fix it a lot. Okay,

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Speaker 2: Isaac replaced it with a straight needle, and then he

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Speaker 2: had the shuttle move in a straight line. And after

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Speaker 2: these innovations, they were able to create a practical, reliable,

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Speaker 2: and easy to use sewing machine. And I think he

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Speaker 2: also was the guy who put the pedal that was

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Speaker 2: operated by your foot. So it was quite a few

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Speaker 2: little innovations that fixed existing problems with what was already built.

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Speaker 1: Okay, if that makes sense, I gotta I gotta say,

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Speaker 1: there's no way Marianne didn't have a hand in this.

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Speaker 1: I'm she's back swing all his costumes. I guarantee he

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Speaker 1: went to her and was like, what what would make

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Speaker 1: this easier for you? M Maybe you know, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: speculation station, I guess, but I just feel pretty confident

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Speaker 1: that Mary had some input into this machine.

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Speaker 2: It seems to me that you're probably not wrong, but

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Speaker 2: I think it goes back further because I think they

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Speaker 2: knew they knew what they wanted the machine to do,

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Speaker 2: or they just didn't know how to do it. And

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Speaker 2: Isaac is like looked at it and was like, I

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Speaker 2: figured out how to do it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but you're probably but he you know, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it would just take one look at it and go

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Speaker 1: I got the fix. You probably spent a couple of weeks, right,

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Speaker 1: It probably went home was like, honey, what the hell's

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Speaker 1: wrong with the sewing machine? Why do people hate it

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Speaker 1: so much? I want you to do it with shit? Well,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, dear. I guess it's just I don't

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Speaker 1: know if there's some kind of little pedal or something.

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Speaker 1: I mean, my feet aren't doing anything. Maybe they could

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Speaker 1: get involved. I don't know. I'm inventing all history here,

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Speaker 1: but I like it.

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Speaker 2: Well, as long as you like it, that's what matters. Well, anyway,

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Speaker 2: they just did an amazing job because their new machine

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Speaker 2: was so super efficient that making a man's shirt went

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Speaker 2: from taking nearly fifteen hours for one shirt to taking

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Speaker 2: one hour in sixteen minutes. Wow, now that's amazing savings. Okay,

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Speaker 2: fourteen hours, I ask, hell, Yes.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's incredible. I also just don't know why. It

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Speaker 1: really makes me assume that there were shirt making races.

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Speaker 2: They had a time, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean if they got an hour, sixteen is a

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Speaker 1: very specific time someone had to stop watch. True, So

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Speaker 1: like they probably had a line of people at sewing

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Speaker 1: machines go.

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Speaker 2: I think they did, because they probably priced how much

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Speaker 2: you made on how many shirts you made, rather than

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Speaker 2: how long it took you to make a shirt. So

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Speaker 2: they were like, this is the average amount of time

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Speaker 2: to make a shirt. So if you take longer, that's

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Speaker 2: your problem.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah. And then you know if a woman, if

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Speaker 1: someone was sewing a shirt and a factory and they

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Speaker 1: were like, we'll give you thirty two cents per shirt,

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Speaker 1: and it takes them fifteen hours, and then they make,

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Speaker 1: you know, thirteen shirts in that time. They're like, wow,

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Speaker 1: fifteen hours of work. We'll continue to give you thirty

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Speaker 1: two cents. Huh for that amount of time. Well, now

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Speaker 1: they just had to sell this machine, and they expected

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Speaker 1: to rake it in. Isaac Singer's theatrical training was going

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Speaker 1: to come in handy here. He'd put a cute girl

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Speaker 1: in the shop window demonstrating the machine for people, and

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Speaker 1: he would go around singing something called the Song of the.

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Speaker 2: Shirt, which, of course, how does that go?

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Speaker 1: We don't, oh, the song of the shirt? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I think you were seeing Yes.

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Speaker 1: No, I remember this. I remember this from history class.

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Speaker 1: It was ladies and gentlemen, come on down. We got

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Speaker 1: shirts all over town. They got cuffs and sleeves and

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Speaker 1: buttons too. A shirt for me and a shirt for you. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but you never got the shirt you need unless you

359
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Speaker 1: got a sewing machines. Come on down and buy a

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Speaker 1: sing I saw and and and everyone in town say, wow,

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Speaker 1: I owe her for this shirt. Thirty two cents about

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Speaker 1: it now? Now I'm not naked. Damn my lad, I forgot.

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Speaker 1: You know, there was some of the on the original

364
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Speaker 1: sheet music. Some of the words are blurred out, so

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Speaker 1: I couldn't.

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Speaker 2: Either, you know, regional two kind of varies.

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Speaker 1: Oh sure, yeah, do you remember the second verse?

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Speaker 2: I was afraid you're gonna do that? Uh, get a

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Speaker 2: singer now and fill your drawer. Get a singer now

370
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Speaker 2: and make some mar shirts for me and shirts for you.

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Speaker 2: And everybody looks like, now, how's that?

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Speaker 1: That's pretty good? Lovely? The song of the shirt, I'll

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Speaker 1: take toe please. Well, the song of the shirt certainly

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Speaker 1: got everyone's attention, as I'm sure it got yours, But

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Speaker 1: the sewing machine patent wars, as well as Isaac Singer's

376
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Speaker 1: womanizing ways would nearly tank the whole business. So we're

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Speaker 1: gonna take a quick break and hear all about that

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Speaker 1: right after this. Welcome back, everybody.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so we already know that is Singer technically did

380
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Speaker 2: not invent the sewing machine, right. Rather, he invented solutions

381
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Speaker 2: for existing problems and improved the design of what was

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Speaker 2: already available. Although I will throw out here that American

383
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Speaker 2: Heritage says even so without Isaac Singer it never would

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Speaker 2: have worked, so we can still say he was the

385
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Speaker 2: inventor of the sewing machine as we know it today.

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Speaker 2: What this means though, is that, of course a lot

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Speaker 2: of other people were involved in inventing parts of the

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Speaker 2: sewing machine that you had to have, you know, for

389
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Speaker 2: the whole thing to work. So there was a lot

390
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Speaker 2: of different patents that were involved in making a sewing machine,

391
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Speaker 2: and that meant there was a whole patent war going

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Speaker 2: on at this time.

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Speaker 1: Jesus, somebody's like, well, I invented the gears, and someone's like, oh,

394
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Speaker 1: the noodles exactly. The guy's like, well.

395
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Speaker 2: Pretty much, yeah, well I like that. Yeah there Apparently

396
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Speaker 2: they're like I think American Heritage said, there were ten

397
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Speaker 2: major features that had to be present for a sewing

398
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Speaker 2: machine to be a useful sewing machine, and Isaac only

399
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:09,760
Speaker 2: invented two of them, so that there's eight other patents

400
00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:12,440
Speaker 2: in there, right, that's going to be an issue. So

401
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:16,000
Speaker 2: the two other big sewing machine manufacturers, which was Grover

402
00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:21,040
Speaker 2: and Baker and Wheeler and Wilson, accused Singer of patent infringement.

403
00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:24,439
Speaker 2: And there was also Elias Howe, and he was the

404
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:28,639
Speaker 2: guy who invented several essential features, including the needle with

405
00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:32,280
Speaker 2: an eye at the point. Pretty essential and you kind

406
00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:34,720
Speaker 2: of needed that. So he kind of felt he had

407
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,440
Speaker 2: a claim to all sewing machines that anybody was making,

408
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:41,639
Speaker 2: because without his needle thing, y'all out of luck. So

409
00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 2: they were all pursuing lawsuits all against each other for years,

410
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Speaker 2: which is very expensive. They're sinking a lot of their

411
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Speaker 2: profits into lawyer's fees.

412
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Speaker 1: At this point.

413
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Speaker 2: And the machines themselves were kind of too expensive as well.

414
00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:56,120
Speaker 2: They cost one hundred and twenty five dollars.

415
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:57,919
Speaker 1: Oh, like that's the retail price.

416
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,679
Speaker 2: Yes, And this was at a time and most families

417
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Speaker 2: were only making five hundred dollars a year.

418
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Speaker 1: Oh my god, so what a purchase for comparison, five

419
00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:12,680
Speaker 1: hundred dollars a year is what the average podcaster makes today.

420
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:13,399
Speaker 1: That's tough.

421
00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:17,199
Speaker 2: Oh, that's a tough one. And what's funny is they

422
00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:20,400
Speaker 2: could easily have made them cheaper because according to American Heritage,

423
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Speaker 2: they only cost twenty three dollars to manufacture. Oh my god,

424
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,280
Speaker 2: so their profit margin was prifty markup.

425
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Speaker 1: Geez.

426
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Speaker 2: I guess of course you have to You do have

427
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 2: to build in some marketing costs. And they were traveling

428
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:33,840
Speaker 2: and stuff, so I don't know how much they were

429
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 2: actually making profit wise, well on this machine.

430
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Speaker 1: But the traveling song of the shirt chorus, you know,

431
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Speaker 1: they don't work for peanuts.

432
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Speaker 2: Well, and you gotta pay royalties. It plays on the radio.

433
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:47,600
Speaker 1: Oh and it's a thirty six piece band.

434
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:52,359
Speaker 2: They probably would do social like all right, he definitely

435
00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:55,200
Speaker 2: would at anyway, all this means is that they were

436
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 2: doing okay, right, They have a great product that people

437
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:01,400
Speaker 2: really need, but business is kind of slower than they

438
00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:04,359
Speaker 2: had expected. They're just not making the piles of money.

439
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,040
Speaker 2: They're not Scrooge mcduckaney yet like they figured they would be.

440
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:11,480
Speaker 2: And then there's some kind of ruthless logan roy business

441
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:15,440
Speaker 2: tactics that happened at this point that Isaac Singer employed

442
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,000
Speaker 2: to get rid of orson Phelps.

443
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 1: Oh, he's factory on it.

444
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:22,399
Speaker 2: That's right. He bought him out without Deeber's permission, using

445
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:25,239
Speaker 2: money that belonged to both him and George Zieber. So

446
00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:27,920
Speaker 2: he was like, I'll buy him out myself and then

447
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,240
Speaker 2: used Zebra's money. Oh so, now that Orson Phelps was

448
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 2: out of the picture, they moved the business from Boston

449
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 2: to New York, probably to be closer to Isaac's two

450
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:41,120
Speaker 2: families and ten children. And they even found a new partner,

451
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 2: which was helpful because you know, all the expenses.

452
00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:47,160
Speaker 1: Right, may be helpful. But this guy also decided really

453
00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:52,160
Speaker 1: quickly that he hated Isaac Singers. Isaac had gotten very

454
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 1: like haughty and authoritative, a little full of himself at

455
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,080
Speaker 1: this point, not to mention he was pretty ruthless, and

456
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 1: his reputation was not exactly of the most shining citizen

457
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,800
Speaker 1: in town, right, not at all. Besides his estranged wife

458
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,199
Speaker 1: Catherine his first wife, of course, he lived with his

459
00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 1: fake wife, Mary Ann Sponsler and their eight kids, and

460
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:17,640
Speaker 1: then he also maintained two other affairs at the same

461
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:22,879
Speaker 1: time with two different women, both named Ellen dam Then,

462
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:27,679
Speaker 1: totally unbeknownst to Mary Anne, the mother of the most

463
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: of his children, he also had another serious mistress on

464
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,480
Speaker 1: the side as well. This was an employee of his

465
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 1: named Mary McGonagall. She started calling herself missus Matthews and

466
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:44,760
Speaker 1: together she and Isaac Singer had seven kids, five of

467
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:48,560
Speaker 1: whom lived past birth, and that was between eighteen fifty

468
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:52,320
Speaker 1: two and eighteen fifty nine. So a lot of respectable

469
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,600
Speaker 1: people found Isaac pretty gross, pretty scandalous. And when he

470
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,160
Speaker 1: tried to hire a lawyer to take on these many

471
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 1: patent in fringe lawsuits that he was always dealing with,

472
00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 1: this guy flat out refused to work with them. He

473
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,399
Speaker 1: was like, huh uh, I heard about you and all

474
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: your ladies, and I'm a respectable gentleman and I'm not

475
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 1: going to sully mice my reputation by taking on Isaac

476
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:19,399
Speaker 1: Singer as a client. But he did recommend to him

477
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 1: to a junior lawyer on his staff. So much money

478
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: due to your level, But you should hire my friend

479
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:32,320
Speaker 1: Bill over here right. This guy was a former Sunday

480
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,919
Speaker 1: school teacher named Edward Clark.

481
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 2: I just find that so funny that he's like, your

482
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 2: personal life is just too gross for me. How about

483
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 2: my friend a Sunday school teacher?

484
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: Amazing well.

485
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,280
Speaker 2: Edward Clark, of course, did not find Isaac Singer's lifestyle

486
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 2: to be very palatable himself or his personality. They were

487
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:55,959
Speaker 2: very different men. But he did think that he had

488
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 2: the best possible sewing machine on his hands and that

489
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:02,480
Speaker 2: he would make a fortune if the business was just

490
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:06,639
Speaker 2: managed right. Okay, so he had dollar signs in his

491
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 2: eyes and he became the third partner in this singer

492
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 2: sewing machine company.

493
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 1: He's like, the Lord says that your life is not righteous,

494
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: and you know you sin regularly, but the Lord also

495
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,119
Speaker 1: needs a new wing on the Sunday's School.

496
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 2: You know, think of all the good we could do

497
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:29,160
Speaker 2: with this money. But immediately some problems sprang up because

498
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 2: George Zeber did not like Edward Clark. Maybe speculation station

499
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 2: a little jealous of this new gentleman coming in. Wow,

500
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 2: because the former partner was like an old guy, but

501
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 2: this is like their same age. Yeah, so maybe he

502
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 2: was a little like, oh, you're letting this man get

503
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 2: close to you. So George Zieber didn't like Edward Clark.

504
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 2: And Edward Clark's over here, like what is Zebra even

505
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 2: doing here? Like he doesn't have a formal role in

506
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 2: this business. We don't really need him, Like we have

507
00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 2: income now, so we don't only need a funder like,

508
00:26:58,280 --> 00:26:59,680
Speaker 2: you know, like he just kind of felt like, who

509
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 2: what is guy doing here? So neither of them kind

510
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,880
Speaker 2: of saw the point of the other. And then one

511
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 2: day George Zieber got sick with a fever, so Isaac

512
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 2: and Edwards show up at his bedside and they convinced

513
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 2: him to sell his share in the Singer sewing machine

514
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 2: business to them for six thousand dollars. Oh And Zeber

515
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 2: initially refused to do this, but Isaac Singer told him,

516
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 2: I've spoken to your doctor and he says, you don't

517
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 2: have long to live. Do you really want to tie

518
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 2: up your widow and a bunch of it to a

519
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:34,880
Speaker 2: bunch of potential debts and all this litigation, with these

520
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,520
Speaker 2: patent lawsuits and stuff. It's going to be so terrible

521
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,200
Speaker 2: for her. You don't want all that. You just want

522
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,919
Speaker 2: to take the money and run. It was only after

523
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 2: the deed was done that George Zeber, who completely recovered

524
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 2: from his fever, discovered that Isaac Singer had never even

525
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 2: seen his doctor. Of course, he had lied about the

526
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 2: whole thing just to muscle him out.

527
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 1: Of course he did. George, George, come, why did you

528
00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:01,120
Speaker 1: say send my doctor in here? I'll tell you he

529
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,200
Speaker 1: was too in love with Isaac Singer. He didn't think

530
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: he'd betray him like that.

531
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 2: I think I think you're right. I mean it does

532
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 2: this make it make sense? Because I was like, this

533
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:12,080
Speaker 2: guy's either like not smart, this is not this, or

534
00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 2: he's just like blinded by worship of this gentleman or something.

535
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:17,960
Speaker 1: I mean, this is not Zeber. Being in love with

536
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 1: Isaac Singer was not in our original read when we

537
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: were researching this. This is I'm this is a revelation.

538
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 1: This changes the whole thing. I'm loving this. You know

539
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: he's lying in bed. Oh I don't have long to

540
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:36,160
Speaker 1: live though, Isaac. Oh my dear Isaac. All right, well

541
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 1: I suppose that business is better in your hands.

542
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 2: No, Zebra, don't do it.

543
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 1: I signed this deed with a kiss.

544
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 2: With a kiss. Oh my god, it's so funny. I

545
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 2: did take a little bit of exception to American heritage,

546
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 2: kind of made fun of Zeber and Phelps because they

547
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 2: were sort of like, well, Isaac Singer had just been

548
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 2: honorable and like actually upheld his agreements with us, we

549
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 2: would have been part of the business and everything would

550
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 2: have been fine. But he went behind our backs and

551
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 2: did all this shady shit, and American heritage called them

552
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,560
Speaker 2: gentle chuckleheads.

553
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: Oh being, And I was like, well, that's.

554
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 2: Not really fair to like expect someone to uphold a

555
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 2: business agreement to say, you're just some fool.

556
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:23,120
Speaker 1: Wow.

557
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 2: But then you like learn more about George and you're like,

558
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 2: I don't know, he'd.

559
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:33,320
Speaker 1: I don't know, naive right, he really thought Isaac Singer

560
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:37,920
Speaker 1: would do the best thing or the right thing anyway, And.

561
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 2: Nope, nope he did not.

562
00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: He did the money thing. Money please many, please my many. Well,

563
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 1: now it was just Singer and Clark who would equally

564
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 1: share the financial success of the sewing machine. But they

565
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 1: still had all these damn lawsuits to deal with, all

566
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: these patent wars going on. Elias Howe, the the needle

567
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 1: eye guy, especially, was getting aggressive. He's like, it's easier.

568
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 1: It's easier for a camel to go through the eye

569
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,600
Speaker 1: of one of my needles. I don't know, there's a

570
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 1: joke here somewhere.

571
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 2: I don't know. If you're finding it better, I'm gonna

572
00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 2: find it.

573
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,720
Speaker 1: It's easier. Hang on, there's a needle and a camel.

574
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 1: A needle and a camel walk into a bar and

575
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what, all right, let's you gotta cut

576
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 1: me off? Am I cut off?

577
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 2: Let's get these stitches straights.

578
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 1: Oh, let's see we got something out of it. Nice.

579
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:37,400
Speaker 1: Thanks for the save. So Elias how it's getting aggressive,

580
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:40,240
Speaker 1: and he was Hella broke and he wanted piles of

581
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 1: money instead from all these sewing machine companies. He's like,

582
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,480
Speaker 1: I don't like being poor. I want to be rich.

583
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 1: Give me my money. But he also had a really

584
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 1: strong case. Yeah, but all these constant battles nearly tanked

585
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 1: the entire sewing machine industry. They're spending all what little

586
00:30:56,480 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: profits they're making on fighting each other. Fifty six, a

587
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 1: lawyer named Orlando Potter suggested, hey, uh, why don't all

588
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 1: you different companies pull your patents together and share the profits.

589
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 1: Elias Howe, meanwhile, could get a royalty on every single

590
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 1: machine ever sold. And surprisingly they're all kind of into it.

591
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: They're like, well, I'd rather unite than fight against each other.

592
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: It's it's almost eighteen sixty and I'm gonna say something

593
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 1: no one's ever said before. United we stayed, but divided,

594
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 1: we fall. If only that lesson could last another ten

595
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 1: years or so. This was the very first patent pool

596
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: and this would later be used for airplanes, automobiles, even

597
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:55,040
Speaker 1: the movie industry. So finally business could boom, and boy

598
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 1: did it. By eighteen sixty, Singer was the third best

599
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,720
Speaker 1: set sewing machine and everybody's just stacking the paper.

600
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:07,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh my god. But eighteen sixty was also the

601
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 2: same year that all Isaac singers shit hit the fans.

602
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 2: Oh no, so, as you said, they're raking it in.

603
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,520
Speaker 2: Singer and Clark are millionaires. Isaac was living like a king.

604
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 2: He and Mary Anne sponsoror, along with her eight kids.

605
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,880
Speaker 2: They lived in a mansion on Fifth Avenue. And you know,

606
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 2: our boy Isaac, flamboyant actor. He wants to be the

607
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 2: center of attention. So he had this giant carriage built.

608
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 2: It weighed two tons, it was painted canary yellow, It

609
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 2: was drawn by nine horses. What and it could seat

610
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: thirty one people. It's a carriage, butts okay, it's I mean,

611
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 2: it's kind of It also had beds for his kids

612
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 2: and a toilet in the back, and a small orchestra

613
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 2: would sometimes sit on the seats on the outside and

614
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 2: be playing him on the street.

615
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's like a horse drawn r V. Yes,

616
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 1: it's an arc.

617
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a horse drawn hummer limo in a

618
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:13,400
Speaker 2: hot tub in it.

619
00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:17,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, I had a pool and an orchestra.

620
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 2: Although I guess having a toilet back then was a

621
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 2: little easier because it was just the chamber pot.

622
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: I mean, right, sure, that's fair.

623
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: He just had to have a little space for it

624
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 2: to be.

625
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 1: Yeah. Probably didn't smell much worse than a greyhound today,

626
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 1: am I right? Folks? Wah wah.

627
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 2: So he's you know, he's flouting his wealth very loud

628
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:42,000
Speaker 2: and clear for the whole city to see. Of course,

629
00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 2: he's also still supporting his two kids with Catherine Haley. Okay,

630
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:54,040
Speaker 2: but Catherine herself. He finally divorced, ironically accusing her of infidelity,

631
00:33:55,800 --> 00:34:00,080
Speaker 2: which is just oh my god. It's also crazy. As

632
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 2: soon as he got rich, he's like, Okay, I got

633
00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 2: to get rid of this bitch because otherwise she's going

634
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 2: to have oh more money that I have to get

635
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 2: rid of her before I get too much richer, harsh here,

636
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:11,799
Speaker 2: she's going to get more, That's what I think.

637
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, you're probably right.

638
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,839
Speaker 2: So he's accuseding, he accuses her of infidelity to get

639
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 2: this divorce and their son William stuck up for Catherine

640
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:25,240
Speaker 2: in court. So Isaac Singer never forgave him. He snubbed

641
00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:27,319
Speaker 2: him for the rest of his life, and he left

642
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 2: him the least amount of all of his children in

643
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:31,880
Speaker 2: his will. He only left him five hundred dollars.

644
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's just an average american's annual salary,

645
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:39,600
Speaker 1: the sweet learned earlier.

646
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 2: Oh good job, Ube. Wait a call back.

647
00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 1: Still that sucks. I know, right, I guess it was

648
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 1: a let me let that be a lesson of the

649
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 1: rest of you. Thirty two hundred kids.

650
00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 2: Okay, his oldest son. Very funny, but anyway, poor William.

651
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:59,319
Speaker 2: But if y'all are thinking that, oh, how excited he

652
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 2: is to finally be free to marry Mary Anne's sponsoror

653
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 2: after twenty five years, you clearly have not been listening,

654
00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:09,960
Speaker 2: because Isaac was not in any kind hurry at all.

655
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:10,279
Speaker 1: No.

656
00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 2: In fact, a few months after his divorce, Mary Anne

657
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 2: was out and about and she spots Isaac driving down

658
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 2: the road in his carriage alongside none other then Mary McGonagall.

659
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:24,959
Speaker 1: Oh from before.

660
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,440
Speaker 2: From before, the one who had five children with him.

661
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 1: Oh my god, who he somehow has kept these women separate?

662
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 2: I mean new York's a big place there.

663
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:36,840
Speaker 1: Yes, that's fair. Yeah, I mean Mary Anne did already

664
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 1: have suspicions about old Mary McGonagall, so when she saw

665
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 1: them together, mary Anne screamed out loud and caused a

666
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 1: big old scene, drew a whole bunch of attention, and

667
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:50,520
Speaker 1: when she saw him back at home, they had this

668
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:54,320
Speaker 1: big fight. According to an article called Singer and His Wigwam,

669
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 1: he knocked her unconscious and also hit one of their daughters,

670
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 1: and Mary Anne marched straight to the police station and

671
00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: had him arrested for cruelty and bigamy. Just kind of funny.

672
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: She was big of me and they're not married, right. Well,

673
00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 1: he was let out on bond because of course he

674
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 1: was a rich man in New York City, and he

675
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:25,960
Speaker 1: fled to London, apparently, according to American Heritage, taking Mary's

676
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:28,839
Speaker 1: younger sister Kate McGonagall with him.

677
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,600
Speaker 2: Oh my god, Mary's like, well.

678
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:35,319
Speaker 1: Your sister and my girlfriend are all mad at each other,

679
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 1: so let's get out of here.

680
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 2: Also, look at the pattern. We have a Catherine and

681
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:43,759
Speaker 2: a Kate, a Marianne and a Mary and two Ellen's. Oh,

682
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:45,800
Speaker 2: it's like he's like, I have a lot of bities

683
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 2: so that y'all all got to have the same.

684
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: Keep the straight.

685
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 2: It's not gonna get tripped up by calling you all

686
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:52,120
Speaker 2: the wrong name.

687
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:57,399
Speaker 1: To be fair, there were only twelve names back then. Well,

688
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,360
Speaker 1: if it weren't bad enough that he took his third

689
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:06,239
Speaker 1: girlfriend's little sister with him. While the police were investigating

690
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,000
Speaker 1: the many infidelities that Mary Anne accused him of, they

691
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:16,720
Speaker 1: found another quote unquote wife of his, a sewing machine demonstrator,

692
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 1: one of these cute girls hes stuck in the window,

693
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 1: named Mary Eastwood Walters, and she'd had a daughter with

694
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:25,280
Speaker 1: him in eighteen fifty two.

695
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:27,439
Speaker 2: My god, man, So.

696
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 1: It turns out this guy actually had four separate families

697
00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 1: with sixteen children, all of them living in New York City.

698
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 1: I don't even know if the two Ellen's were still

699
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:39,920
Speaker 1: around at this point.

700
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 2: Who knows. I'm sure I would not put it past him.

701
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 2: That's just that he came out just some casual things

702
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 2: on the said.

703
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: In addition, definitely, I mean, you got little Kate McGonagall

704
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 1: here too. That's not the first time they met. If

705
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:54,480
Speaker 1: she fled to Paris with him, or can't fled to

706
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 1: London with.

707
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,880
Speaker 2: Him, well, and Mary, I guess Mary McGonagall is also

708
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:01,640
Speaker 2: a shop yindow demonstrator. I mean, they were all like demonstrators.

709
00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:04,319
Speaker 2: So he's like finding all these cute girls, making them

710
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 2: his employees, leaving me, telling me multiple kids with some

711
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 2: of them.

712
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:12,759
Speaker 1: You're telling me that a rich businessman deliberately hired young

713
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 1: attractive women so that he could attempt to sleep with them.

714
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 2: Shocking.

715
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 1: I know, well, it never happened before Isaac Singer, and

716
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:24,279
Speaker 1: I certainly know it never happened after. Glad we can

717
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:25,879
Speaker 1: put that history behind us.

718
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:29,480
Speaker 2: We're better than that today. Also, I have to wonder

719
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,880
Speaker 2: because they call her a wife quote unquote wife.

720
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:32,359
Speaker 1: Uh huh.

721
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:36,919
Speaker 2: So did Mary Eastwood Walters think she was married to him?

722
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 1: Did? Did they? Was that his thing? Or he was

723
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 1: just like, call yourself my wife when we're out in public.

724
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 2: It's probably because they had a kid together. Yeah, I

725
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:47,160
Speaker 2: bet once they got pregnant, he was like, Okay, call

726
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 2: yourself something, and that'll make you respectable. You can like

727
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:52,240
Speaker 2: hold your head up in society somehow.

728
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can have a wife with multiple children in

729
00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:59,240
Speaker 1: each corner of town. But jeez, if I had a

730
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:02,200
Speaker 1: child with some one out of wedlock, that would be embarrassing.

731
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,439
Speaker 2: Right, because she had to know he was married, yeah,

732
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 2: or at least think he was married to.

733
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 1: Married famously married. We said earlier that like even journalists

734
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: were talking shit about him running around with everything.

735
00:39:14,080 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 2: Well, at this point, Edward Clark was furious because all

736
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 2: this rigamarole with his divorce and all his extra families

737
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:22,920
Speaker 2: and all this stuff was all over the papers. And

738
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 2: what was really bad about it was that Clark had

739
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,959
Speaker 2: made their company successful by selling sewing machines at half

740
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:33,839
Speaker 2: price to community leaders, including clergymen, so that they would

741
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:37,000
Speaker 2: influence other people to buy those like the original social

742
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 2: media fluids. And now they were saying, well, I'm a

743
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:42,320
Speaker 2: church person, you know, I am a community leader. I

744
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 2: can't be associated with a company with a guy like this.

745
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:45,800
Speaker 1: Right.

746
00:39:46,719 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 2: All of this, in addition to the outbreak of the

747
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 2: Civil War, made Clark write quote, business is pretty much

748
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 2: at a standstill now. Singer did come back to New

749
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 2: York from England to settle things with Mary Anne because

750
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 2: she sued him for divorce. She's a bit of a

751
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 2: head scratcher because they had never gotten married, as we said,

752
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 2: but she argued that since he had lived with her

753
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 2: for seven months exclusively after his divorce from Catherine that

754
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 2: they had a common law marriage. Oh, and that meant

755
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:20,200
Speaker 2: she was entitled to some alimony payments and some assets

756
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:21,560
Speaker 2: and things, not to.

757
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 1: Mention all the multiple children we had together.

758
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 2: So Singer did agree to her terms, although he says

759
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:29,360
Speaker 2: she could never get married again. Wow or ever, I

760
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 2: guess because she had never been married in the first place.

761
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 2: And then he left again for Europe to wait for

762
00:40:34,719 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 2: all the accountability I mean, unpleasantness to die down right,

763
00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 2: But of course it's Isaac Singer. So he found someone

764
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 2: to comfort him in his time of sorrow and we

765
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 2: will meet her right after these words Welcome back everyone.

766
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 1: So Isaac Singer took himself back to Europe, but this

767
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 1: time he went to Paris instead of London, and he

768
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,200
Speaker 1: stayed at a boarding house owned by the English born

769
00:41:03,239 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: widow of a Frenchman. She had a daughter named Isabella

770
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:12,359
Speaker 1: Eujanie Boyer, who was nineteen years old at the time.

771
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,720
Speaker 1: She was intelligent, attractive, and lively, and it wasn't long

772
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:21,480
Speaker 1: before Isaac Singer fell for her. American heritage writes that

773
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 1: her mother had no problem with her daughter becoming the

774
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 1: mistress of a rich American. Some sources say Isabella was

775
00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:31,839
Speaker 1: widowed or divorced already, but others say that she left

776
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,680
Speaker 1: her husband for Isaac. This may not be very likely

777
00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:38,160
Speaker 1: because she was Catholic, and of course the Catholic's still

778
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:39,760
Speaker 1: very much frowning on divorce.

779
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and only nineteen right.

780
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:45,360
Speaker 1: Right, although his you know, Isaac's first wife was fifteen

781
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 1: when they got so. Oh man, by nineteen you could

782
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 1: have several divorces under your belts, a couple of kids

783
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 1: and a failed business or two.

784
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,439
Speaker 2: Oh man, people live life on the air, right.

785
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:04,240
Speaker 1: But whatever the truth of their situation was, Isabella clearly

786
00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 1: had a pretty good idea about how to wind Isaac

787
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 1: around her finger, because when they came back to New

788
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: York in eighteen sixty three, Isaac actually married her like

789
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,200
Speaker 1: a for real marriage, church priest everything.

790
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 2: Wow.

791
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 1: Yeah. American Heritage says that this lady was pretty savvy.

792
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: She she lost no time in building good relationships with

793
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 1: all of his children, right, got to know all seventy

794
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:34,719
Speaker 1: three thousand of them, whether they were legitimate or not.

795
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:39,320
Speaker 1: She even convinced Isaac to convert to Catholicism. She really

796
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:42,360
Speaker 1: had this guy pegged. She well, she might have him pegged.

797
00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 2: No, I don't know what they were into speculation station.

798
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:49,280
Speaker 2: Isabella's pegging Isaac.

799
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 1: Uh huh. She's like, who's the sewing machine?

800
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,399
Speaker 2: Now, I don't know, And you were like, I lost

801
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 2: the threads.

802
00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,560
Speaker 1: Hey, hey, lost the thread. A lot of lost threads

803
00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:06,280
Speaker 1: in this well together, Isaac and Isabella, of course, Isaac

804
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:08,839
Speaker 1: being one of the most fertile men in America at

805
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 1: this point, they had six children, one of which is

806
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 1: the subject of an upcoming episode, Winnaretta Singer, the twentieth

807
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 1: of Isaac's twenty six kids, twenty two of whom lived

808
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 1: past childhood.

809
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 2: Oh my god. Now. Many sources also say that Isabella

810
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,040
Speaker 2: was so beautiful that she was the model for the

811
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:29,919
Speaker 2: Statue of.

812
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:35,040
Speaker 1: Liberty, Oh famed Hattie, the Statue of Liberty. I look

813
00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 1: at her and I'm like, wow, gorgeous speachers.

814
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,239
Speaker 2: I mean, she's got some strong bones, you know.

815
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: Some strong bones.

816
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 2: Got a cool flick. Say, a statute of Liberty is

817
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:46,040
Speaker 2: an algamo.

818
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:51,320
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, you know, aout the statues, a little copper.

819
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 1: It's a little copper.

820
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 2: Oh wow, you got it.

821
00:43:55,400 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 1: I see, well, true coppers, but the green copper, the degree,

822
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 1: the vertigree is a little it's just not working for me. Okay,

823
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 1: I'm allowed to have that opinion. Wow, well all right,

824
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:12,680
Speaker 1: look if you look like the Statue of Liberty, stay

825
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 1: out of my face. Fine, it all comes out now.

826
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,399
Speaker 2: You know, you're learning a lot, You're tired.

827
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:25,000
Speaker 1: You're hungry, you're porn here.

828
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 2: Well, I hate to say it, but that seems to

829
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 2: be probably an apocryphal story. Not not true.

830
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 1: Oh that she was modeled after her, Yeah.

831
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:36,400
Speaker 2: That she was the model for the Statue of Liberty.

832
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:39,480
Speaker 2: According to Reuters, the Statue of Liberty was actually originally

833
00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 2: designed to look like an Arab woman, a peasant. The

834
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 2: sculptor Frederick Auguste Bartoldi originally pitched it to Egypt to

835
00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 2: be on the Suez Canal, but they rejected that design.

836
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 2: So when Bartoldi was working on a design for Lady Liberty,

837
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:58,160
Speaker 2: he kind of went back to it, and then other inspirations,

838
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 2: including the Colossus of Rhodes, kind of affected its design

839
00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 2: and stuff. He had a bunch of different inspirations, so

840
00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:06,719
Speaker 2: over time it evolved into a big ass Statue of

841
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:10,359
Speaker 2: libertas the Roman goddess of liberty that we know and love.

842
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 2: So we'll probably have nothing to do with this fellow

843
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 2: point well love.

844
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:17,200
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I just I felt bad. So I

845
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,879
Speaker 1: looked up at picture the statue of Liberty's face. She's

846
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:21,200
Speaker 1: perfectly pretty.

847
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 2: Okay, I was going to say, I don't think she.

848
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 1: Looks like you know, you know where I think it

849
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 1: comes from. Huh, what a killer to smile?

850
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:32,880
Speaker 2: Oh my god, come on, I'm coming. I'm coming out

851
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:33,480
Speaker 2: there to punch you.

852
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:36,320
Speaker 1: Come on, give us a smile, Libertas, I'll.

853
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:38,439
Speaker 2: Punch you right in the dick.

854
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:47,960
Speaker 1: That doesn't help anybody, I don't know, make me feel bad. Well, anyway,

855
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:54,040
Speaker 1: even though Isaac was now respectably married for once, for once,

856
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:57,840
Speaker 1: this was not enough to change Edward Clark's opinion of

857
00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 1: him his his business partner and singer. So he was

858
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 1: just totally done being in business with this guy at

859
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:07,399
Speaker 1: this nasty reputation. So in July of eighteen sixty three,

860
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 1: they rancorously agreed to dissolve their partnership. Isaac's main stipulation said, Okay,

861
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:17,360
Speaker 1: we can split up here, but neither of us is

862
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:20,319
Speaker 1: allowed to be president of the corporation while the other

863
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 1: one is alive. And if I'm Edward Clark, I would

864
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,239
Speaker 1: take that as a threat. I know, right, Okay, so

865
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:28,040
Speaker 1: I should sleep with one eye open then.

866
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 2: Just like King Richard and come killing me him my sleep.

867
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:36,359
Speaker 1: Well, they both held considerable stock, so they were both

868
00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 1: making a mint anyway, especially after a tailor named Ebenezer

869
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:46,600
Speaker 1: Butterick started making and selling dress patterns. So now this

870
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:50,960
Speaker 1: whole like pinterest culture exploded, opened up the market hugely

871
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:53,520
Speaker 1: to housewives who could just take these patterns and make

872
00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:56,440
Speaker 1: their own clothes at home. And Edward Clark had actually

873
00:46:56,480 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: already started targeting them to purchase sewing machines. Remember earlier

874
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:02,759
Speaker 1: when we said that the machines were one hundred and

875
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:05,560
Speaker 1: twenty five dollars, when most families only made five hundred

876
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:10,200
Speaker 1: a year. Well, Edward Clark decided, I got a pretty

877
00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:12,280
Speaker 1: good idea. Maybe you don't have one hundred and twenty

878
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:16,440
Speaker 1: five dollars right now, but I will accept five dollars

879
00:47:16,520 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 1: down up front, and then women can take the machines

880
00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:23,960
Speaker 1: home and pay them off with monthly payments. And thus

881
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:28,360
Speaker 1: began the first consumer credit program.

882
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:31,760
Speaker 2: Pretty amazing, pretty remarkable. I mean, that's the smart idea.

883
00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, buy now, pay later, and if you don't, I'm

884
00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:39,479
Speaker 1: sending Isaac to your house. You'll end up with thirteen kids.

885
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,160
Speaker 1: You weren't planning on happy Oh no.

886
00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 2: And the husbands were like, don't let him in.

887
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:47,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm terrified of for some reason, all the women

888
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:47,919
Speaker 1: go for him.

889
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:52,000
Speaker 2: I'm saying, I mean, at least later you can be like,

890
00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:53,600
Speaker 2: I guess the money had a lot to do with

891
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:55,960
Speaker 2: I mean, but I mean he was definitely a charmer.

892
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 2: He must have been. It was like the life of

893
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 2: the party kind of guy and maybe pretty magnetic.

894
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:04,719
Speaker 1: All handsome and yeah, probably didn't hurt that. Oh I

895
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 1: was making five hundred dollars a year. You make that

896
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 1: in a day?

897
00:48:08,080 --> 00:48:12,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, five minutes. They were also doing very well

898
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 2: because they were selling a ton of Singer sewing machines

899
00:48:14,640 --> 00:48:18,120
Speaker 2: to the Union Army, and they advertised proudly that quote,

900
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:24,120
Speaker 2: we clothed the Union Armies while Grant is dressing the rebels. Oh,

901
00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:27,319
Speaker 2: and dressing in this case means bandaging up wounds by way,

902
00:48:27,320 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 2: because I at first was like, why is Grant dressings? Confused? So,

903
00:48:32,960 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 2: by the time the war ended, the Singer Company was

904
00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 2: expanding internationally. They opened a factory in Glasgow. Eventually Russia

905
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:42,319
Speaker 2: become one of their biggest markets and It made them

906
00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 2: one of the first American companies to prosper internationally. According

907
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:49,760
Speaker 2: to American business History, Edward Clark had hit on another

908
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 2: business innovation too, Like the sewing machines changed the business

909
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:57,240
Speaker 2: game in a lot of ways. So Edward had tried

910
00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 2: licensing sales agents across the country to sell singer sewing machines,

911
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:04,520
Speaker 2: but too often they would sell a competitors model instead

912
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 2: of a singer.

913
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:05,760
Speaker 1: Oh wow.

914
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 2: So Clark's was shut up and he required his employees

915
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:12,880
Speaker 2: to only sell singers exclusively. They were not allowed to

916
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:17,640
Speaker 2: sell another competitor's model. And he opened hundreds of local

917
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:21,320
Speaker 2: offices from which to demonstrate and sell sewing machines and

918
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 2: like all over the states. And this was the very

919
00:49:24,120 --> 00:49:28,640
Speaker 2: first retail chain, No kidding, the singer sewing machine. That's

920
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:29,320
Speaker 2: so crazy.

921
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 1: Imagine people at the time just looking up being like, eh,

922
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: they're opening a singer sewing store.

923
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:39,280
Speaker 2: There goes the neighborhood, like the old mom and pop

924
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:42,080
Speaker 2: place is gone because of the singer sewing.

925
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:45,000
Speaker 1: Like there's a singer sewing office right there, and another

926
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:49,719
Speaker 1: one right across the street. He's the boy what mattress

927
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:51,279
Speaker 1: firm or the Starbucks of its day.

928
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 2: I wonder if if every people were like, ooh, it's

929
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:56,920
Speaker 2: the sewing machine office. Do you know there's gonna be

930
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:59,040
Speaker 2: a cute girl in the window.

931
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, but she's got four kids with Isaac Singer.

932
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:06,799
Speaker 2: I can overlook it. I can over but you're right.

933
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:11,040
Speaker 2: They became so ubiquitous that jokes were made about their brand,

934
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:14,720
Speaker 2: including this one. Okay, why is a singer sewing machine

935
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:15,360
Speaker 2: like a kiss?

936
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:17,360
Speaker 1: I don't know why is a sing a song machine

937
00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 1: like a kiss?

938
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:20,200
Speaker 2: Because it seems so good.

939
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:26,960
Speaker 1: Oh seems s E a M S. But it sounds

940
00:50:27,000 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 1: like s E, which.

941
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:32,640
Speaker 2: Is also weird because it's kind of duncan on kisses, right,

942
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:34,239
Speaker 2: because like they seem good but they're not.

943
00:50:35,120 --> 00:50:37,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, this guy's kiss.

944
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:41,120
Speaker 2: This is George Zber being like, don't kiss Isaac Singer.

945
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:43,520
Speaker 2: It seems so good, but then.

946
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 1: Take it for all your words. Well, Isaac at this point, shockingly,

947
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: he actually seemed to have turned over a new leaf.

948
00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:57,920
Speaker 1: American Heritage writes quote, he suddenly became a model of

949
00:50:58,080 --> 00:51:02,400
Speaker 1: docile domesticity, a doting father and grandfather.

950
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:08,240
Speaker 2: Interesting, Isabella really changed or maybe he's just tired?

951
00:51:08,600 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 1: Right? Yeah, Well, when it seemed that Isabella wanted to

952
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:15,719
Speaker 1: go home to France, Isaac packed up all her shit

953
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 1: and moved there. No, she has got him, Oh yeah,

954
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 1: apped up. She must have been just the most charming, smoking, hot,

955
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 1: delightful person, I guess, and funny. Maybe she's really funny.

956
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:31,160
Speaker 2: Maybe she's really funny.

957
00:51:31,640 --> 00:51:34,240
Speaker 1: Just thinking of the you know, the type of woman

958
00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:36,120
Speaker 1: it would take for me to pack up and move

959
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:41,880
Speaker 1: to Paris. She must have been really something special, as in,

960
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 1: she's got fewer than three legs and a working face.

961
00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:50,640
Speaker 1: What does that mean? That means I would move to

962
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 1: Paris very easily?

963
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:53,160
Speaker 2: Well, yeah I figured that out.

964
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:56,480
Speaker 1: I don't know. The face doesn't even have to function.

965
00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:58,200
Speaker 1: I'm just look, if you asked me to move to

966
00:51:58,239 --> 00:51:59,840
Speaker 1: Paris right.

967
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:01,720
Speaker 2: Now, especially if you're paying for everything.

968
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:05,239
Speaker 1: Yeah. Right. So they're living in Paris, and when the

969
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:08,880
Speaker 1: Franco Prussian War broke out, they went to Devonshire, England,

970
00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:12,960
Speaker 1: where Isaac Singer purchased a big estate with one hundred

971
00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:17,000
Speaker 1: and ten rooms called Old Way Mansion. In eighteen seventy one,

972
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 1: American Heritage says, you know, this is the time of

973
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:22,640
Speaker 1: life when anyone this famous will be thinking about writing

974
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 1: a memoir. But Isaac Singer had no formal education, and

975
00:52:26,600 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 1: in fact he was actually pretty close to illiterate. So

976
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:31,759
Speaker 1: instead of a memoir, he decided he was going to

977
00:52:31,880 --> 00:52:36,480
Speaker 1: build this huge, ridiculous house of course that he called

978
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:41,440
Speaker 1: the Wigwam, and this was inspired by the Petitrinal at Versailles.

979
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:46,600
Speaker 1: It featured one hundred and fifteen rooms, a completely equipped theater,

980
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:51,439
Speaker 1: a coach house big enough for fifty carriages or two

981
00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:56,680
Speaker 1: of his carriage buses, and a marble hall with of

982
00:52:56,719 --> 00:53:02,280
Speaker 1: course a grand staircase. This building cost him five hundred

983
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:06,720
Speaker 1: thousand dollars, which in today's money is eleven million, although

984
00:53:06,760 --> 00:53:08,840
Speaker 1: I gotta imagine it would cost more than eleven million

985
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:12,120
Speaker 1: to build it today. Probably he entertained all of his

986
00:53:12,239 --> 00:53:15,000
Speaker 1: kids and his neighbors there. He even once let an

987
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 1: entire circus come through, Yeah, which honestly I respect if

988
00:53:19,040 --> 00:53:20,840
Speaker 1: you've got a house that big and you're actually using

989
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:21,560
Speaker 1: it for something.

990
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 2: No. I was like, oh, he got a completely equipped

991
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:26,440
Speaker 2: theater so he can go in and like do his monologue,

992
00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:29,239
Speaker 2: rite something. But actually it sounds like more like he

993
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:31,919
Speaker 2: would let traveling theater companies use it. Yeah, And he'd

994
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:34,280
Speaker 2: be like, I also have I come with an audience

995
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:37,160
Speaker 2: because they're twenty fucking kids, and I can go show

996
00:53:39,719 --> 00:53:40,600
Speaker 2: all my neighbors.

997
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 1: And he probably stepped into and is like, I'll be

998
00:53:43,120 --> 00:53:45,239
Speaker 1: playing your King Richard tonight right away.

999
00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:46,920
Speaker 2: Real, you gotta imagine him.

1000
00:53:46,920 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 1: And they're like he did, at least we're not doing Shakespeare,

1001
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:49,760
Speaker 1: and he's like, you are.

1002
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:53,440
Speaker 2: Now tonight, you're doing King Richard. So finally, in eighteen

1003
00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:58,319
Speaker 2: seventy five, Isaac Merritt Singer died at age sixty three.

1004
00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:02,560
Speaker 2: Finally she said, fine, well, I guess I don't mean

1005
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 2: to like that, but as.

1006
00:54:04,160 --> 00:54:07,560
Speaker 1: The final thing to happen to happen happened all of us.

1007
00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:17,200
Speaker 2: Ultimately, Isaac merrit Singer died. He was given a very

1008
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:20,239
Speaker 2: impressive funeral. He had a seventy five carriage procession of

1009
00:54:20,360 --> 00:54:23,200
Speaker 2: two thousand mourners in Devonshire, where.

1010
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:25,560
Speaker 1: He lived, nearly two thirds of which were his children.

1011
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:29,759
Speaker 2: I know, right, He was like, don't take much again.

1012
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:34,200
Speaker 2: Built an audience Back in New York City, Edward Clark

1013
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:37,160
Speaker 2: was telling anyone who would listen how he was quote

1014
00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:43,279
Speaker 2: sincerely deploring the loss of this distinguished invintor, and as

1015
00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:47,240
Speaker 2: American heritage rites quote at once got himself elected President

1016
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 2: of the company or.

1017
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:52,520
Speaker 1: Of course, oh yes, so sorry. Oh it's tragic that

1018
00:54:52,600 --> 00:54:55,560
Speaker 1: he died. Somebody sign right here, please? Oh no, oh,

1019
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:58,800
Speaker 1: I ever go on, I'll be raising my salary. Oh

1020
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:00,120
Speaker 1: my heart at ache.

1021
00:55:00,560 --> 00:55:04,319
Speaker 2: I'd like the carriage too, as a company called right well.

1022
00:55:04,360 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 2: Isaac Singer left behind a fortune of thirteen million dollars,

1023
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:11,840
Speaker 2: which is worth closer to three hundred million dollars today,

1024
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:17,040
Speaker 2: which he divided unequally between all his kids. Sure, but

1025
00:55:17,080 --> 00:55:20,640
Speaker 2: there were very bitter battles about it from all sides.

1026
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:23,319
Speaker 2: A lot of people contested this will like every kid

1027
00:55:23,360 --> 00:55:26,759
Speaker 2: had something to say. William and Lillian, his children, and

1028
00:55:26,840 --> 00:55:30,440
Speaker 2: Catherine were given the least amount. William the least of all,

1029
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:32,160
Speaker 2: since he stuck up for his mom in court, as

1030
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 2: we recall. But apparently Mariann's sponsoror was the most combative.

1031
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:39,000
Speaker 2: She forced a whole court hearing trying to get a

1032
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:42,680
Speaker 2: million dollar settlement. But American Heritage says that most of

1033
00:55:42,680 --> 00:55:45,319
Speaker 2: our kids had turned against her by then. I don't

1034
00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:47,719
Speaker 2: know what that means. If they were like this. The

1035
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:49,880
Speaker 2: dad's got a circus, so I'm gonna go hang out

1036
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:51,920
Speaker 2: with him, he said, I don't know. At any rate,

1037
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:54,359
Speaker 2: the only witness that she could get to show up

1038
00:55:54,360 --> 00:55:58,840
Speaker 2: for her side was old Orson Phelps Oh, the manufacturer

1039
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:01,879
Speaker 2: guy Wow, that he had muscled out many years ago,

1040
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:05,600
Speaker 2: and she eventually settled for seventy five thousand dollars, but

1041
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:07,120
Speaker 2: she made a real meal of it.

1042
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:12,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. Isabella, his last wife, went back to Paris and

1043
00:56:12,760 --> 00:56:16,400
Speaker 1: she remarried to a Dutch musician in eighteen seventy nine.

1044
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:22,640
Speaker 1: And interestingly, this musician, named Victor Rubsat however that's pronounced

1045
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:27,640
Speaker 1: in Dutch, was the son of a shoemaker or schumacher.

1046
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:33,920
Speaker 1: But he became an internationally successful singer and violinist partly

1047
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:38,120
Speaker 1: by falsely claiming to everyone that he was an aristocrat

1048
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 1: named Vicoltstenburg.

1049
00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:41,360
Speaker 2: Crazy.

1050
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:45,560
Speaker 1: But fortunately he was gifted the title of Duke of

1051
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:48,920
Speaker 1: Campos Deelis from the Italian king in eighteen eighty one

1052
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 1: and he became a real aristocrat, so he didn't have

1053
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: to lie about it anymore. After he died in eighteen

1054
00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:58,920
Speaker 1: eighty seven, Isabella married a third time to an art

1055
00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:02,880
Speaker 1: collector in eighteen nine. She died in nineteen oh four

1056
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:04,239
Speaker 1: at sixty two years old.

1057
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:06,960
Speaker 2: Now we you know, I've roasted Isaac a little bit

1058
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:09,760
Speaker 2: I feel because I don't think he was very fair

1059
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:12,760
Speaker 2: to a lot of these women. Doesn't seem like especially

1060
00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:15,839
Speaker 2: mary Anne. But American Heritage does end it's very in

1061
00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:18,880
Speaker 2: depth story about Isaac Singer by pointing out that the

1062
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:21,600
Speaker 2: only detailed account of his private life comes from the

1063
00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:25,600
Speaker 2: divorce proceedings that were started by mary Ann's sponslaugh. So

1064
00:57:25,640 --> 00:57:28,880
Speaker 2: they're kind of like, it's sort of an unreliable narrator

1065
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 2: because she has, you know, a bone to pick. And

1066
00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:33,560
Speaker 2: they write that most of the women in his life

1067
00:57:33,560 --> 00:57:35,640
Speaker 2: were very fond of him. She was the only one

1068
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:37,800
Speaker 2: who grew to hate him, so we might have an

1069
00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 2: unduly negative view of him. Now, maybe all these ladies

1070
00:57:41,400 --> 00:57:43,960
Speaker 2: were completely fine with this arrangement because he was like

1071
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:47,240
Speaker 2: willing to maintain the kids and like give them money,

1072
00:57:47,280 --> 00:57:49,720
Speaker 2: and they were like fine, I don't care. Like it's

1073
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:52,760
Speaker 2: entirely possible that they were totally, you know, into it.

1074
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:56,880
Speaker 2: Interesting and they conclude quote a less prejudiced witness might

1075
00:57:56,920 --> 00:57:59,680
Speaker 2: have concluded that Singer must have been more often than

1076
00:57:59,720 --> 00:58:04,520
Speaker 2: not a charming, likable vulgarian, bubbling over with animal spirits,

1077
00:58:04,680 --> 00:58:08,240
Speaker 2: with a voracious appetite for life, and already if rough

1078
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 2: talent for savoring all its delights. Okay, so just you know,

1079
00:58:14,040 --> 00:58:16,520
Speaker 2: to give him his jest desserts, right, or give him

1080
00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:18,840
Speaker 2: his fair credit or whatever. Yeah, I just wanted to

1081
00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:21,840
Speaker 2: include that here. And you know, unlike many men in

1082
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:24,120
Speaker 2: his position, it must be said that he did acknowledge

1083
00:58:24,200 --> 00:58:27,560
Speaker 2: and support all of his kids, whether he was married

1084
00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:29,439
Speaker 2: to their mom or not. A lot of men would

1085
00:58:29,480 --> 00:58:30,000
Speaker 2: not have done that.

1086
00:58:30,360 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 1: That's true, that's true.

1087
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:33,240
Speaker 2: It sort of feels like one of those things was like,

1088
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:34,840
Speaker 2: that's what you should do. So I don't feel like

1089
00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 2: I should praise you for that, but I guess a

1090
00:58:36,680 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 2: lot of people did. Now I have to praise you

1091
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:39,480
Speaker 2: for that.

1092
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:42,000
Speaker 1: Low bar situations, yes.

1093
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:44,880
Speaker 2: But it is. It does seem like he really enjoyed

1094
00:58:44,920 --> 00:58:47,960
Speaker 2: being a father. He mostly enjoyed his kids and really

1095
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:50,800
Speaker 2: wanted them to be around him. He's clearly spent time

1096
00:58:50,800 --> 00:58:51,600
Speaker 2: with them and stuff.

1097
00:58:51,640 --> 00:58:55,439
Speaker 1: So that's so interesting. I'm curious. You know, Mary Ann

1098
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:59,240
Speaker 1: had such a right, such a story to tell if

1099
00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:02,960
Speaker 1: only he had in that memoir right, right.

1100
00:59:02,960 --> 00:59:05,440
Speaker 2: And when we say he's illiterate, he wasn't like he

1101
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:07,960
Speaker 2: couldn't read or write, because he did write letters and stuff.

1102
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:10,680
Speaker 2: He just had very poor spelling and grammar and stuff.

1103
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 2: He just clearly was book.

1104
00:59:13,080 --> 00:59:16,640
Speaker 1: He should have embroidered it with one of his machines.

1105
00:59:16,680 --> 00:59:18,480
Speaker 2: He should have had somebody else embroidered.

1106
00:59:18,680 --> 00:59:22,360
Speaker 1: Just stitch it into fabric, the fabric of our lives,

1107
00:59:22,960 --> 00:59:25,600
Speaker 1: fabric of my life. It could be the title of

1108
00:59:25,600 --> 00:59:27,440
Speaker 1: his memoir, Fabric of my.

1109
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:30,959
Speaker 2: Life, or or threads, the Threads.

1110
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:37,080
Speaker 1: Of my Life Losing the Threat by Isaac Singer. A

1111
00:59:37,120 --> 00:59:41,000
Speaker 1: stitch in time saves not a stitch from my songing

1112
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:46,600
Speaker 1: machine saves you one hundred Wow. Okay, all right, I

1113
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:47,240
Speaker 1: do not know.

1114
00:59:47,600 --> 00:59:49,800
Speaker 2: I found this really cool story because there was so

1115
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:53,720
Speaker 2: much interesting business history in it too that I find interesting,

1116
00:59:54,200 --> 00:59:56,920
Speaker 2: and then also his insane private life and how funny

1117
00:59:56,920 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 2: that it bubbled over to affect his businesiness. It must

1118
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:03,720
Speaker 2: have been pretty serious. That's the other thing that's sort

1119
01:00:03,760 --> 01:00:05,960
Speaker 2: of fascinating about this in a way that you can't

1120
01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:08,240
Speaker 2: really dive into because none of these women, of course,

1121
01:00:08,280 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 2: have their own articles written about them or anything like that,

1122
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:15,520
Speaker 2: except for Isabella Boyeers, So you know, we get no

1123
01:00:15,640 --> 01:00:19,320
Speaker 2: perspective from Mary McGonagall, for example, or Mary Eastwood Walters

1124
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:21,760
Speaker 2: or any of any of them. So I have no idea,

1125
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,960
Speaker 2: but you know, it sort of speaks to how differently

1126
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:29,040
Speaker 2: marriage was viewed, I suppose, or how differently men's behavior

1127
01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 2: could be viewed. American Heritage also was saying like, oh,

1128
01:00:32,440 --> 01:00:34,240
Speaker 2: he was a man who just was in the wrong time.

1129
01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 2: He would have done super well you know, in a

1130
01:00:36,520 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 2: harem times or you know, like you know, yeah, or

1131
01:00:43,600 --> 01:00:48,320
Speaker 2: maybe ethical non monogamy today, but in his time people

1132
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:52,200
Speaker 2: are very scandalized by it. So it was kind of

1133
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:56,640
Speaker 2: I guess that makes it maybe more special or not special,

1134
01:00:56,680 --> 01:01:01,600
Speaker 2: but commendable that he acknowledged his kids, yeah, because it

1135
01:01:01,640 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 2: made it was so much more scandalous to have illegitimate

1136
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:06,760
Speaker 2: we sure. So maybe that's part of it too, is

1137
01:01:06,800 --> 01:01:08,680
Speaker 2: that he was They're like, well, he really could have

1138
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:10,600
Speaker 2: made it a big secret and tried to cover it up,

1139
01:01:10,640 --> 01:01:13,040
Speaker 2: but he was just like, no, this's my family. Everybody

1140
01:01:13,080 --> 01:01:17,000
Speaker 2: knew he needed that big ass carriage around, so.

1141
01:01:19,000 --> 01:01:23,880
Speaker 1: Because you never know, right, Well, I love this story,

1142
01:01:23,880 --> 01:01:26,560
Speaker 1: what a weird one. I love the shirt song.

1143
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:30,080
Speaker 2: The song of the shirt. Well, thank you Success for

1144
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:33,760
Speaker 2: the Winneretta singer suggestion, because it's We've got two episodes out,

1145
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:36,360
Speaker 2: but now I'm very excited to get into Winneretta as well.

1146
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:38,400
Speaker 2: I hope you all enjoyed this story as much as

1147
01:01:38,440 --> 01:01:41,040
Speaker 2: we did. For real, please reach out and let us

1148
01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:43,360
Speaker 2: know or give us other suggestions so that we can

1149
01:01:43,440 --> 01:01:47,440
Speaker 2: fall into further and further rabbit holes. Our email address

1150
01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:49,800
Speaker 2: is redic Romance at gmail dot com, yep, or.

1151
01:01:49,800 --> 01:01:52,000
Speaker 1: You can find us on the Instagram. I'm at Oh great,

1152
01:01:52,080 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: it's Eli.

1153
01:01:53,040 --> 01:01:55,120
Speaker 2: I'm at Diana Mike Boone.

1154
01:01:54,920 --> 01:01:56,800
Speaker 1: And the show is at redic Romance.

1155
01:01:57,760 --> 01:02:01,200
Speaker 2: That's right, I'm sorry, I completely lost the thread.

1156
01:02:03,200 --> 01:02:07,920
Speaker 1: One more thread loss before we go. Thank you so

1157
01:02:08,040 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Please come back to the next episode.

1158
01:02:12,120 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 2: We love y'all so much for listening.

1159
01:02:14,080 --> 01:02:17,560
Speaker 3: Ye the next time, by bye bye, so long friends,

1160
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:21,320
Speaker 3: It's time to go. Thanks for listening to our show.

1161
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 3: Tell your friends, nabors, uncles, and dance to listen to

1162
01:02:25,040 --> 01:02:26,840
Speaker 3: our show Ridiculous Well Dance