1 00:00:04,795 --> 00:00:21,715 Speaker 1: Countdown with Keith Olderman is a production of iHeartRadio. Trump 2 00:00:21,755 --> 00:00:25,315 Speaker 1: has now doubled down on his smearing of military heroes 3 00:00:25,395 --> 00:00:28,435 Speaker 1: of Medal of Honor recipients by comparing them to the 4 00:00:28,595 --> 00:00:32,515 Speaker 1: likes of Miriam Adelson and her late husband Sheldon, whose 5 00:00:32,555 --> 00:00:36,435 Speaker 1: contribution to America was literally that a contribution giving Trump 6 00:00:36,475 --> 00:00:38,755 Speaker 1: a out of campaign money. And no, I am not 7 00:00:38,915 --> 00:00:43,075 Speaker 1: leading the podcast with the Democratic National Convention nor the 8 00:00:43,275 --> 00:00:49,035 Speaker 1: lamest anti convention protest ever seen. To a local news 9 00:00:49,075 --> 00:00:52,635 Speaker 1: reporter in Pennsylvania, Trump has now insisted veterans are not 10 00:00:52,995 --> 00:00:55,795 Speaker 1: enraged at what he said, that he has not done 11 00:00:55,915 --> 00:01:00,715 Speaker 1: untold damage to his supposedly ultra patriotic base, and naturally, 12 00:01:01,235 --> 00:01:04,395 Speaker 1: in doing that, he made it worse because now he 13 00:01:04,475 --> 00:01:07,755 Speaker 1: had to clarify that what he meant was that Miriam 14 00:01:07,755 --> 00:01:12,315 Speaker 1: Adelson looks better than Medal of Honor winners because Medal 15 00:01:12,315 --> 00:01:15,435 Speaker 1: of Honor winners are often horribly wounded or dead, and 16 00:01:15,475 --> 00:01:18,435 Speaker 1: who wants to look horribly wounded or dead. 17 00:01:18,835 --> 00:01:21,795 Speaker 2: Many veterans are upset about that, and clean hear in Pennsylvania. No, 18 00:01:21,875 --> 00:01:24,355 Speaker 2: I didn't hear that. I only heard when I say better, 19 00:01:24,875 --> 00:01:26,995 Speaker 2: I would rather in a certain way get it because 20 00:01:27,035 --> 00:01:30,035 Speaker 2: people that get the Congressional of Honor, which I've given 21 00:01:30,075 --> 00:01:35,475 Speaker 2: to many, are often horribly wounded or dead. They're often dead. 22 00:01:35,515 --> 00:01:39,955 Speaker 2: They get it posthumously. And when you get the Congressional 23 00:01:39,995 --> 00:01:42,435 Speaker 2: Medal of Honor, I always consider that to be the ultimate, 24 00:01:42,475 --> 00:01:44,955 Speaker 2: but it is a painful thing to get it. When 25 00:01:44,995 --> 00:01:47,675 Speaker 2: you get the Presidential Medal of Freedom, it's usually for 26 00:01:48,355 --> 00:01:51,315 Speaker 2: other things, like you've achieved great success in sports, so 27 00:01:51,435 --> 00:01:55,035 Speaker 2: you've achieved great success someplace else. When you get the 28 00:01:55,075 --> 00:01:57,875 Speaker 2: Medal of Honor, generally speaking, and I've met many of them, 29 00:01:57,915 --> 00:02:00,515 Speaker 2: and I've seen the families of many of them, this 30 00:02:00,635 --> 00:02:04,195 Speaker 2: is an incredible honor, but it was a statement that 31 00:02:04,315 --> 00:02:07,835 Speaker 2: is much more painful to get because they're oftentimes in 32 00:02:08,035 --> 00:02:10,595 Speaker 2: very bad shape. I've seen him come up and they've 33 00:02:10,635 --> 00:02:15,115 Speaker 2: suffered greatly, Whereas the Presidential Medal of Freedom need to 34 00:02:15,955 --> 00:02:18,555 Speaker 2: my knowledge, I don't think anybody suffered other than they've 35 00:02:18,675 --> 00:02:20,995 Speaker 2: you know, they've worked hard, and they've done graz things. 36 00:02:21,155 --> 00:02:25,275 Speaker 2: Onesday military award. One's a civilian award, but sometimes very 37 00:02:25,275 --> 00:02:26,355 Speaker 2: painful to get the other. 38 00:02:26,795 --> 00:02:30,075 Speaker 1: Well, that settles it. Trump took time out from digging 39 00:02:30,115 --> 00:02:33,515 Speaker 1: that hole to insisting to a Pennsylvania audience yesterday that 40 00:02:33,595 --> 00:02:37,315 Speaker 1: Kamala Harris's laugh is that of a crazy person, because 41 00:02:37,355 --> 00:02:40,955 Speaker 1: clearly somebody has told him that people no names please 42 00:02:41,275 --> 00:02:45,315 Speaker 1: have been calling him crazy, and because you know, he's 43 00:02:45,355 --> 00:02:48,395 Speaker 1: never laughed in his life, except perhaps to express cruelty, 44 00:02:48,835 --> 00:02:51,675 Speaker 1: he will get the chance to do that today when 45 00:02:51,715 --> 00:02:55,995 Speaker 1: he could easily go full KKK level racist at a 46 00:02:56,075 --> 00:03:00,875 Speaker 1: rally at Howell, Michigan, known for decades as the haven 47 00:03:00,995 --> 00:03:05,475 Speaker 1: there for white supremacists, where marchers chanted we love Hitler 48 00:03:06,235 --> 00:03:10,715 Speaker 1: last month when they followed we love Hitler with we 49 00:03:10,875 --> 00:03:17,555 Speaker 1: love Trump, and that's Howell, Michigan, Howell and not howl. 50 00:03:18,715 --> 00:03:22,915 Speaker 1: Trump is neither howling nor laughing cruelly or otherwise about 51 00:03:22,915 --> 00:03:26,315 Speaker 1: the Poles. Morning Consult not only saying it's tracking Pole 52 00:03:26,675 --> 00:03:29,595 Speaker 1: now has her up forty eight forty four. It was 53 00:03:29,715 --> 00:03:32,795 Speaker 1: three points last week, it is now four points. She's 54 00:03:32,835 --> 00:03:37,195 Speaker 1: also above water on favorability by fifty to forty five, 55 00:03:37,635 --> 00:03:42,755 Speaker 1: so Kamala Harris is plus five favorable, her high water mark, 56 00:03:43,075 --> 00:03:46,795 Speaker 1: something Trump has never come close to approaching. Morning Consult 57 00:03:46,875 --> 00:03:49,875 Speaker 1: also notes that since she took over the campaign four 58 00:03:49,875 --> 00:03:53,355 Speaker 1: weeks and two days ago, she has not trailed Trump. 59 00:03:53,595 --> 00:03:58,195 Speaker 1: Once in any of the daily tracking updates. The poles 60 00:03:58,275 --> 00:04:01,075 Speaker 1: continue to be so good, so uniformly, that it is 61 00:04:01,115 --> 00:04:03,875 Speaker 1: now hard to keep up with them all and probably 62 00:04:03,955 --> 00:04:07,235 Speaker 1: not worth the en effort, as you already know. Sunday, 63 00:04:07,355 --> 00:04:11,435 Speaker 1: CBS News polling put her up three, but ABC and 64 00:04:11,475 --> 00:04:16,155 Speaker 1: the Washington Post pegged it at six. Sienna in Arizona, 65 00:04:16,155 --> 00:04:18,795 Speaker 1: for the Times, has gone from Trump by six in 66 00:04:18,955 --> 00:04:23,955 Speaker 1: May to Harris by five. Now Sienna in North Carolina 67 00:04:24,075 --> 00:04:27,115 Speaker 1: is Harris plus two, with or without Kennedy in the race. 68 00:04:27,515 --> 00:04:31,435 Speaker 1: It is so consistent. Now let me caveat it again. 69 00:04:32,355 --> 00:04:35,355 Speaker 1: It could all go south before you finish listening to 70 00:04:35,395 --> 00:04:40,395 Speaker 1: this podcast. Who knows. But it's so consistent at just 71 00:04:40,635 --> 00:04:46,275 Speaker 1: this moment that even Politico has noticed. Somebody there wrote, 72 00:04:46,515 --> 00:04:50,115 Speaker 1: some Republicans are preparing for the possibility that Harris will 73 00:04:50,115 --> 00:04:52,875 Speaker 1: have a larger lead on Labor Day than she does now, 74 00:04:54,715 --> 00:04:57,475 Speaker 1: good grief, that is perhaps the only certainty here. Hell, 75 00:04:57,555 --> 00:05:00,235 Speaker 1: Labor Day is two weeks from yesterday, and her post 76 00:05:00,315 --> 00:05:05,195 Speaker 1: convention bump, which is average historically four points, will not 77 00:05:05,315 --> 00:05:08,075 Speaker 1: show up in the polls until this weekend. She will 78 00:05:08,115 --> 00:05:10,595 Speaker 1: probably give some of that back next week, but she 79 00:05:10,715 --> 00:05:14,875 Speaker 1: will be up more and even more often by Labor Day, 80 00:05:14,955 --> 00:05:18,675 Speaker 1: and then we will be in the home stretch. Historical 81 00:05:18,715 --> 00:05:22,195 Speaker 1: analysis by a couple of authors indicates that whoever gets 82 00:05:22,315 --> 00:05:27,675 Speaker 1: the largest bump from their convention maintains that bump through 83 00:05:27,835 --> 00:05:32,355 Speaker 1: election day. The convention, although meaningless, as I will point 84 00:05:32,395 --> 00:05:35,075 Speaker 1: out in a moment, is not meaningless when it comes 85 00:05:35,155 --> 00:05:38,915 Speaker 1: to the polls. As an aside, though, I continue to 86 00:05:38,955 --> 00:05:42,395 Speaker 1: be amazed by Democrats who are literally afraid of these 87 00:05:42,515 --> 00:05:46,795 Speaker 1: good numbers, trauma leftover from the first half of this 88 00:05:46,995 --> 00:05:52,475 Speaker 1: year and twenty sixteen, of course, fear of overconfidence. I 89 00:05:52,555 --> 00:05:57,155 Speaker 1: look at them and I see an opportunity to be 90 00:05:57,275 --> 00:06:02,755 Speaker 1: less afraid and to be more vindictive. There's a stable, 91 00:06:02,955 --> 00:06:08,195 Speaker 1: small lead. Let's get more sleep now and be more 92 00:06:08,435 --> 00:06:14,035 Speaker 1: vicious down the stretch. Let's metaphorically kill them and eat them. 93 00:06:14,355 --> 00:06:17,915 Speaker 1: The bigger the lead, the bigger the win, the less 94 00:06:18,035 --> 00:06:21,515 Speaker 1: likely the Republicans are to even try to force a 95 00:06:21,595 --> 00:06:26,755 Speaker 1: contingent election where Republicans merely stall certification for Harris long 96 00:06:26,875 --> 00:06:30,235 Speaker 1: enough to create a passive aggressive kind of January sixth, 97 00:06:30,275 --> 00:06:33,395 Speaker 1: where the Electoral College count can't be finalized, and then 98 00:06:33,755 --> 00:06:39,475 Speaker 1: God knows what happens next. Metaphorically, look at the poles, 99 00:06:40,355 --> 00:06:47,195 Speaker 1: get more sleep, metaphorically, kill them and eat them. And 100 00:06:47,275 --> 00:06:52,075 Speaker 1: please remember when you do that, don't be like JD. Vance. 101 00:06:52,515 --> 00:06:55,995 Speaker 1: Remember what to eat them with. If you are going 102 00:06:56,115 --> 00:07:00,875 Speaker 1: to demean yourself and do the eat the local food ritual, 103 00:07:01,275 --> 00:07:06,955 Speaker 1: just eat the dam food. Don't go to pat Cheese 104 00:07:07,035 --> 00:07:11,675 Speaker 1: Steaks in Philly and accuse them of hating Swiss cheese 105 00:07:12,155 --> 00:07:16,395 Speaker 1: because the cheese steike wit is wit cheese whiz. It's 106 00:07:16,755 --> 00:07:19,195 Speaker 1: like Swiss cheese either, but everybody says it's in souls. 107 00:07:19,395 --> 00:07:21,795 Speaker 1: Why do you guys say Swiss cheese is the story 108 00:07:21,995 --> 00:07:22,555 Speaker 1: native We just. 109 00:07:24,595 --> 00:07:26,195 Speaker 3: Whiz first, all right. 110 00:07:26,235 --> 00:07:29,915 Speaker 1: Okay, alright, love what I want? I wanna. I want 111 00:07:29,995 --> 00:07:37,675 Speaker 1: a cheese steak with wiz. JV. Vance turning a cheese 112 00:07:37,715 --> 00:07:43,235 Speaker 1: steak at a tourist trap into philosophy or being generous 113 00:07:43,275 --> 00:07:47,355 Speaker 1: into a callback to a John Kerry campaign misstep from 114 00:07:47,435 --> 00:07:49,355 Speaker 1: two thousand and three two thousand and three might as 115 00:07:49,395 --> 00:07:55,155 Speaker 1: well invoke the campaigns of Rutherford B. Hayes and President Polk. JV. 116 00:07:55,435 --> 00:07:58,035 Speaker 1: Vance continues to be the gift that keeps on giving. 117 00:07:58,155 --> 00:08:02,835 Speaker 1: Last Friday, there was a new character on the Vance campaign, Atlas. 118 00:08:03,595 --> 00:08:10,235 Speaker 1: Atlas is quotequote, his unquote dog named for Atlas shrugged 119 00:08:10,275 --> 00:08:16,635 Speaker 1: because those book oriented trumpers of all. Red Ain rand As, 120 00:08:16,675 --> 00:08:19,675 Speaker 1: a professional dog walker, pointed out to the website Jezebel 121 00:08:20,315 --> 00:08:24,275 Speaker 1: as Vance introduced Atlas to the airplane stairs on Friday, 122 00:08:24,995 --> 00:08:28,635 Speaker 1: he was holding the leash to Atlas's easy walk harness 123 00:08:28,755 --> 00:08:31,235 Speaker 1: with just a couple of fingers. I mean, all I 124 00:08:31,355 --> 00:08:35,715 Speaker 1: have is malteses, and even with them, I do what 125 00:08:35,795 --> 00:08:38,555 Speaker 1: everybody else who's ever had a dog for more than 126 00:08:38,635 --> 00:08:42,235 Speaker 1: ninety seconds. Does I double wrap the leash around my 127 00:08:42,395 --> 00:08:46,715 Speaker 1: hand or quadruple wrappit, or I often have it go 128 00:08:46,835 --> 00:08:51,315 Speaker 1: across my palm and intertwine it with my fingers. All 129 00:08:51,555 --> 00:08:57,355 Speaker 1: dogs have outstanding body control and low centers of gravity. 130 00:08:57,595 --> 00:09:02,395 Speaker 1: But as to JV quote his unquote dog, Atlas is 131 00:09:02,435 --> 00:09:07,275 Speaker 1: a German shepherd. With that light grip, Vance looked like 132 00:09:07,275 --> 00:09:09,195 Speaker 1: he was carrying a piece of string in his hand. 133 00:09:09,395 --> 00:09:12,355 Speaker 1: If Atlas had pulled hard enough, he would have not 134 00:09:12,395 --> 00:09:14,755 Speaker 1: only gotten away from JV, would have pulled him down 135 00:09:14,755 --> 00:09:19,955 Speaker 1: the goddamn stairs. I would point out since Friday, we 136 00:09:20,035 --> 00:09:24,475 Speaker 1: have not seen Atlas on the campaign trail. He did 137 00:09:24,515 --> 00:09:27,275 Speaker 1: not go and get a cheese steak and strike up 138 00:09:27,275 --> 00:09:30,755 Speaker 1: a conversation with the guy at PATS, although I'm sure 139 00:09:30,755 --> 00:09:32,755 Speaker 1: it would have been a smarter conversation than the one 140 00:09:32,875 --> 00:09:39,995 Speaker 1: JV had. From deep in their souls, you can hear 141 00:09:40,035 --> 00:09:44,595 Speaker 1: the disappointment forcing its way out like a primal scream. 142 00:09:44,955 --> 00:09:47,995 Speaker 1: It was the primal scream of reporters who were promised 143 00:09:48,675 --> 00:09:53,115 Speaker 1: tear gas and violence and Billie clubs and got only 144 00:09:53,795 --> 00:10:05,155 Speaker 1: their own tears. The reporters nationwide on Fox, internationally on BBC, heartbroken, stunned, leaving. 145 00:10:06,235 --> 00:10:09,075 Speaker 1: There were no riots at the opening day of the 146 00:10:09,075 --> 00:10:15,355 Speaker 1: Democratic National Convention in Chicago, not one goddamned canister of 147 00:10:15,435 --> 00:10:21,995 Speaker 1: tear gas, unused pro Palestine protest signs that we got, 148 00:10:22,115 --> 00:10:26,155 Speaker 1: got hundreds of them in Union Park. They're still sitting there, unclaimed, unused, 149 00:10:26,275 --> 00:10:31,235 Speaker 1: staring up mockingly at Trump's stalking horse, Cornell West, as 150 00:10:31,275 --> 00:10:35,155 Speaker 1: he wondered where all the protesters were at mint condition 151 00:10:35,355 --> 00:10:41,395 Speaker 1: now available at extremely popular prices. I am somewhat agnostic 152 00:10:41,515 --> 00:10:47,715 Speaker 1: on this issue, but organizers and journalists hoped for thirty thousand, 153 00:10:48,075 --> 00:10:52,595 Speaker 1: perhaps forty thousand protesters to march to the United Center 154 00:10:52,675 --> 00:10:55,835 Speaker 1: yesterday and to become as big a story as Joe 155 00:10:55,835 --> 00:11:02,235 Speaker 1: Biden's farewell address, and actual estimates ran the gamut from 156 00:11:01,635 --> 00:11:07,955 Speaker 1: maybe there were ten thousand more towards three thousand, twenty 157 00:11:07,955 --> 00:11:11,955 Speaker 1: five hundred something like that. In short, the Chicago White Sox, 158 00:11:12,395 --> 00:11:14,915 Speaker 1: who have lost ninety five out of one hundred and 159 00:11:14,915 --> 00:11:18,875 Speaker 1: twenty five games this baseball season. They are more popular 160 00:11:18,995 --> 00:11:23,435 Speaker 1: in Chicago than are the protests against the Democratic National Convention. 161 00:11:24,675 --> 00:11:29,595 Speaker 1: Oh the humanity. I think you can tell I am 162 00:11:29,635 --> 00:11:33,275 Speaker 1: not a big one for Democratic conventions nor Republican conventions. 163 00:11:33,675 --> 00:11:35,875 Speaker 1: There has not been much to see or talk about 164 00:11:35,915 --> 00:11:39,595 Speaker 1: at them since Ford tried to become Reagan's co president 165 00:11:39,675 --> 00:11:43,755 Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty or Kennedy almost knife Carter the same 166 00:11:43,835 --> 00:11:48,635 Speaker 1: year at Madison Square Garden. Hell, maybe there hasn't been 167 00:11:48,715 --> 00:11:50,875 Speaker 1: much to see or talk about since security tried to 168 00:11:50,875 --> 00:11:52,795 Speaker 1: beat the crap out of Dan Rather while he was 169 00:11:52,835 --> 00:11:56,435 Speaker 1: live on CBS talking to Walter Cronkye in nineteen sixty eight. 170 00:11:57,595 --> 00:12:01,315 Speaker 1: The conventions were interesting even when I was a kid, 171 00:12:01,795 --> 00:12:05,675 Speaker 1: because the primaries didn't used to decide the nominee for 172 00:12:05,715 --> 00:12:10,075 Speaker 1: the most part, the conventions did you proved yourself eligible 173 00:12:10,595 --> 00:12:14,995 Speaker 1: at the primaries. The decisions were made at the convention 174 00:12:15,795 --> 00:12:17,755 Speaker 1: as long ago as nineteen eighty, when I was a 175 00:12:17,795 --> 00:12:22,155 Speaker 1: sportscaster for United pres Internationals Radio network. I timidly asked 176 00:12:22,235 --> 00:12:25,355 Speaker 1: our political chief if there was a chance that I 177 00:12:25,395 --> 00:12:30,475 Speaker 1: could somehow borrow somebody's credential and go to the Democratic 178 00:12:30,515 --> 00:12:34,235 Speaker 1: Convention in New York and just record a feature there, 179 00:12:34,795 --> 00:12:36,995 Speaker 1: a feature that had a sports angle, just for the 180 00:12:37,035 --> 00:12:42,435 Speaker 1: background noise. The political chief opened the top drawer of 181 00:12:42,475 --> 00:12:46,755 Speaker 1: his desk and handed me four different credentials. If you 182 00:12:46,835 --> 00:12:50,355 Speaker 1: need more, let me know. As recently as two thousand 183 00:12:50,355 --> 00:12:52,635 Speaker 1: and eight, I was MSNBC's anchor for the entirety of 184 00:12:52,635 --> 00:12:55,435 Speaker 1: the network's coverage of the Democratic Convention in Denver, and 185 00:12:55,475 --> 00:12:58,035 Speaker 1: neither I nor my co host, Chris Matthew spent one 186 00:12:58,075 --> 00:13:01,955 Speaker 1: minute inside the convention because the news bosses had long 187 00:13:01,995 --> 00:13:05,715 Speaker 1: ago figured out that nothing interesting happened inside the convention, 188 00:13:05,955 --> 00:13:09,195 Speaker 1: and the backdrop inside the convention simply looked like a 189 00:13:09,275 --> 00:13:12,955 Speaker 1: large crowd at an indoor arena attending a basketball game 190 00:13:13,035 --> 00:13:16,435 Speaker 1: or a concert, except there was no game and there 191 00:13:16,475 --> 00:13:23,995 Speaker 1: was no concert, just the crowd extremely boring, extremely fast. 192 00:13:24,915 --> 00:13:28,075 Speaker 1: So they sat us outside with the train station in 193 00:13:28,115 --> 00:13:30,075 Speaker 1: the background, and I thought, well, who on earth is 194 00:13:30,075 --> 00:13:33,035 Speaker 1: going to leave the convention to come over here, and 195 00:13:33,075 --> 00:13:36,395 Speaker 1: then President Carter showed up, and then everybody else showed up, 196 00:13:36,435 --> 00:13:38,795 Speaker 1: and I realized they all wanted to get out of 197 00:13:39,035 --> 00:13:42,195 Speaker 1: what was not just the convention boredom, but the convention 198 00:13:42,315 --> 00:13:46,955 Speaker 1: boredom you had to pretend was fascinating. I don't know 199 00:13:47,035 --> 00:13:50,795 Speaker 1: why they still hold the conventions. I mean, obviously it's 200 00:13:50,795 --> 00:13:53,875 Speaker 1: an infomercial now and you get all your viral soundbites, 201 00:13:55,235 --> 00:13:58,155 Speaker 1: but not from a political point of view. I mean, 202 00:13:58,195 --> 00:14:01,195 Speaker 1: the dirty secret of the Democratic and Republican Conventions is 203 00:14:01,235 --> 00:14:04,075 Speaker 1: that they are exactly like the conventions of every other 204 00:14:04,115 --> 00:14:08,035 Speaker 1: business organization in this country, from the American Psychiatric Association 205 00:14:08,195 --> 00:14:13,835 Speaker 1: conference to the wholesale beard, hair brush, manufacture and supply Cartel. 206 00:14:15,075 --> 00:14:18,595 Speaker 1: They are vacations you can write off as tax deductions. 207 00:14:19,195 --> 00:14:23,115 Speaker 1: There's free booze, free food, free entertainment, you get to 208 00:14:23,155 --> 00:14:26,075 Speaker 1: see old friends, you get to see if you can 209 00:14:26,115 --> 00:14:31,195 Speaker 1: talk your old friends into becoming something else but business news. 210 00:14:32,115 --> 00:14:34,595 Speaker 1: I mean, it was a nice handoff from President Biden 211 00:14:34,915 --> 00:14:38,995 Speaker 1: to Vice President Harris last night, only we are well 212 00:14:39,035 --> 00:14:41,675 Speaker 1: reminded throughout it and before it, and accurate that this 213 00:14:42,035 --> 00:14:46,515 Speaker 1: is not the handoff that will be later, this was 214 00:14:46,635 --> 00:15:13,795 Speaker 1: just the convention handoff. Now something wonderful. There is one 215 00:15:13,835 --> 00:15:16,915 Speaker 1: thing I will give the entirety of the Trump fascist 216 00:15:16,955 --> 00:15:20,235 Speaker 1: attempt to violently overthrow the government of the United States 217 00:15:20,275 --> 00:15:24,475 Speaker 1: credit for, and that is message discipline. They may have 218 00:15:24,635 --> 00:15:28,875 Speaker 1: been gifted by being given the man who can fool 219 00:15:29,035 --> 00:15:31,715 Speaker 1: all the people, all of the time, long enough to 220 00:15:31,755 --> 00:15:35,195 Speaker 1: get elected anyway, or they may now be shackled to 221 00:15:35,275 --> 00:15:40,475 Speaker 1: a corpse, but they have always stayed true to their jackass. 222 00:15:40,835 --> 00:15:48,315 Speaker 1: Unlike liberals, unlike reporters, they have never expected Trump to pivot. Never, 223 00:15:48,675 --> 00:15:52,835 Speaker 1: they have never asked him to become something he's not, like, 224 00:15:53,395 --> 00:15:58,835 Speaker 1: you know, a human being. And then came Tom Vasili 225 00:15:59,075 --> 00:16:04,355 Speaker 1: of Newsmax, I hope you are sitting down. 226 00:16:04,875 --> 00:16:06,955 Speaker 3: What some have called a slump over the last few 227 00:16:06,995 --> 00:16:10,795 Speaker 3: weeks is a tremendous opportunity for reinvention. And whether the 228 00:16:10,835 --> 00:16:13,555 Speaker 3: former president of the campaign allow it to happen, though, 229 00:16:13,995 --> 00:16:17,995 Speaker 3: remains to be seen. Kamala Harris is getting a clever makeover. 230 00:16:18,795 --> 00:16:22,635 Speaker 3: Mister Trump can and should use this moment to reintroduce 231 00:16:22,715 --> 00:16:25,795 Speaker 3: himself to the electorate as well. Unlike the whistle stop 232 00:16:25,915 --> 00:16:28,755 Speaker 3: tours of years past, when people heard from a candidate 233 00:16:28,835 --> 00:16:32,475 Speaker 3: maybe once. Today they often hear elements of the sub 234 00:16:32,515 --> 00:16:37,555 Speaker 3: speech dozens of times, and it frankly gets boring. That's 235 00:16:37,595 --> 00:16:41,635 Speaker 3: why long speeches and hour long rallies don't win elections. 236 00:16:42,275 --> 00:16:44,115 Speaker 1: Wait, there's more. 237 00:16:44,955 --> 00:16:47,395 Speaker 3: Mister Trump shouldn't be campaigning in arenas. He should be 238 00:16:47,395 --> 00:16:50,595 Speaker 3: campaigning in supermarket parking lots and gas stations like he's 239 00:16:50,675 --> 00:16:54,035 Speaker 3: running for town council. Knock on some doors with some volunteers, 240 00:16:54,155 --> 00:16:56,835 Speaker 3: drop into some living rooms and suburban neighborhoods along the 241 00:16:56,875 --> 00:16:59,475 Speaker 3: way as well. How many Americans know the Donald Trump 242 00:16:59,475 --> 00:17:03,435 Speaker 3: who loves music, everything from opera to Sinatra to Metallica. 243 00:17:03,555 --> 00:17:05,595 Speaker 3: We know mister Trump plays golf a lot of it. 244 00:17:06,075 --> 00:17:08,395 Speaker 3: What's his secret to playing the game so many people 245 00:17:08,395 --> 00:17:10,795 Speaker 3: struggle to master for decades? Believe me, I'm one of them. 246 00:17:11,475 --> 00:17:14,435 Speaker 3: Whatever happened to Grandpa Trump? I loved Grandpa Trump. We 247 00:17:14,475 --> 00:17:17,675 Speaker 3: saw him at the convention, a smiling former president, one 248 00:17:17,675 --> 00:17:20,435 Speaker 3: grandchild on his lap, another on stage telling the nation 249 00:17:20,795 --> 00:17:22,955 Speaker 3: about the Donald Trump most of us have never met, 250 00:17:23,155 --> 00:17:26,195 Speaker 3: the one who greets his grandkids with bear hugs and kisses, 251 00:17:26,235 --> 00:17:28,395 Speaker 3: picking them up in the air and making them laugh. 252 00:17:28,555 --> 00:17:32,435 Speaker 3: Donald Trump should treat this like celebrity apprentice in reverse 253 00:17:32,875 --> 00:17:34,435 Speaker 3: earning it every day. 254 00:17:35,115 --> 00:17:42,235 Speaker 1: Yes, more Trumpian retail politics, more parking lots. Have him 255 00:17:42,235 --> 00:17:45,635 Speaker 1: take the tie off. Don't have him talk about himself 256 00:17:45,715 --> 00:17:48,515 Speaker 1: or get up there for an hour. It's boring. Golf 257 00:17:48,675 --> 00:17:52,235 Speaker 1: tips is what we need. Golf tips from Uncle don Old. 258 00:17:52,915 --> 00:17:56,795 Speaker 1: That's the ticket. I'm sure he'll go for that. Throw 259 00:17:56,835 --> 00:18:00,675 Speaker 1: out everything he understands, everything he enjoys talking about himself 260 00:18:00,675 --> 00:18:05,795 Speaker 1: in front of large crowds, feeling, no existential dress, no memento. 261 00:18:05,915 --> 00:18:08,475 Speaker 1: Mora is going to live forever. They love him. Now, 262 00:18:08,635 --> 00:18:12,915 Speaker 1: throw all that out and give golf tips in parking lots. Brilliant. 263 00:18:13,195 --> 00:18:17,235 Speaker 1: Tom Basili of News Max the new Trump, the kinder 264 00:18:17,355 --> 00:18:21,875 Speaker 1: gentler Trump like Max Biali stock implores Franz Liebkin and 265 00:18:21,915 --> 00:18:25,395 Speaker 1: the producers show the world the true Hitler, the Hitler. 266 00:18:25,435 --> 00:18:28,795 Speaker 1: You loved the Hitler, you knew the Hitler with a 267 00:18:29,075 --> 00:18:33,915 Speaker 1: song in his heart. What now you want me to 268 00:18:34,035 --> 00:18:43,915 Speaker 1: change that quote to Trump? Why? Also of interest here, 269 00:18:43,915 --> 00:18:47,355 Speaker 1: Phil Donahue has died. In addition to the recognition that 270 00:18:47,475 --> 00:18:51,915 Speaker 1: he almost single handedly changed television talk shows and in 271 00:18:51,955 --> 00:18:56,435 Speaker 1: fact changed television and is a Hall of Famer Pantheon 272 00:18:56,635 --> 00:19:00,795 Speaker 1: television person. He remains the centerpiece of what is almost 273 00:19:00,835 --> 00:19:04,635 Speaker 1: an article of faith here on the left that MSNBS 274 00:19:05,635 --> 00:19:09,595 Speaker 1: fired him and ended his career when he had the 275 00:19:09,675 --> 00:19:13,835 Speaker 1: highest ratings on that network because he dared to question 276 00:19:13,995 --> 00:19:19,235 Speaker 1: the war in Iraq. I think you know I never 277 00:19:19,275 --> 00:19:22,995 Speaker 1: defend MSNBC. I think you may remember I never criticized 278 00:19:23,035 --> 00:19:26,955 Speaker 1: anybody who hit George W. Bush. But this whole Phil 279 00:19:26,995 --> 00:19:30,995 Speaker 1: Donahue story, it's not true, none of it. And you 280 00:19:31,035 --> 00:19:33,515 Speaker 1: know how I know it's not true because not only 281 00:19:33,635 --> 00:19:37,115 Speaker 1: was I there, but when they canceled Phil Donahue in 282 00:19:37,155 --> 00:19:40,355 Speaker 1: two thousand and three at MSNBC, the show they replaced 283 00:19:40,435 --> 00:19:46,795 Speaker 1: him with was called Countdown with Keith Olriman. That's next. 284 00:19:46,795 --> 00:19:50,875 Speaker 1: This is an all new edition of Countdown with Keith Olreman. 285 00:19:52,675 --> 00:19:56,115 Speaker 3: This is Countdown with Keith Olberman. 286 00:20:17,035 --> 00:20:19,555 Speaker 1: Still ahead of us on this all new edition of Countdown. 287 00:20:19,595 --> 00:20:24,555 Speaker 1: Phil Donahue has died a legend of television and in politics, 288 00:20:24,555 --> 00:20:28,155 Speaker 1: a legend of corporate repression of the anti war protests 289 00:20:28,515 --> 00:20:31,395 Speaker 1: as the Bushies led us into Iraq. The man who 290 00:20:31,435 --> 00:20:33,915 Speaker 1: tried to warn us and lost his top rated show 291 00:20:34,275 --> 00:20:39,035 Speaker 1: and maybe his career as a consequence. Except and as 292 00:20:39,075 --> 00:20:41,355 Speaker 1: you know, I am the last person to ever defend 293 00:20:41,475 --> 00:20:46,475 Speaker 1: MSNBC or to criticize anybody who attacked George Bush. That's 294 00:20:46,515 --> 00:20:52,115 Speaker 1: not how it happened, not at all. The real story 295 00:20:52,595 --> 00:20:56,195 Speaker 1: of bad ratings and cost overruns ahead in things I 296 00:20:56,195 --> 00:20:59,155 Speaker 1: promise not to tell first. There are still more new 297 00:20:59,195 --> 00:21:01,995 Speaker 1: idiots talk about the daily roundup of the miscrants, morons 298 00:21:02,035 --> 00:21:05,355 Speaker 1: and Dunning Kruger effects specimens, who constitute in two days 299 00:21:06,315 --> 00:21:12,595 Speaker 1: worst persons in the world. The Brons worse. Laura Ingram, 300 00:21:13,115 --> 00:21:15,475 Speaker 1: who has her own show on Fox News called The 301 00:21:15,675 --> 00:21:19,355 Speaker 1: Ingram Anger. No, I don't think that's what. It's called. 302 00:21:19,875 --> 00:21:24,355 Speaker 1: The Rock Concert Vibe DNC, she writes, is in lieu 303 00:21:24,395 --> 00:21:27,315 Speaker 1: of a convention where the main players are capable and 304 00:21:27,435 --> 00:21:32,195 Speaker 1: confident enough to discuss the salient issues. They will entertain you, 305 00:21:32,715 --> 00:21:38,155 Speaker 1: but you pay for it with lower living standards. Laura 306 00:21:38,235 --> 00:21:42,075 Speaker 1: hit her head sometime about I don't know nineteen eighty five, 307 00:21:42,115 --> 00:21:43,955 Speaker 1: and then again in nineteen ninety five, and then in 308 00:21:43,955 --> 00:21:46,675 Speaker 1: two thousand and five, and several times since. I think, 309 00:21:47,115 --> 00:21:51,755 Speaker 1: just as a reminder, at the Republican Convention way back, 310 00:21:52,915 --> 00:21:56,995 Speaker 1: month ago, month ago, it was they had Hulk Hogan 311 00:21:57,155 --> 00:22:02,435 Speaker 1: on is like the keynote speaker Hulk effing Hogan from 312 00:22:02,435 --> 00:22:08,475 Speaker 1: the year nineteen eighty one. Olk Hogan as the keynote 313 00:22:08,595 --> 00:22:11,675 Speaker 1: speaker or something. He spoke the same night Trump did, 314 00:22:11,715 --> 00:22:14,355 Speaker 1: and he ripped off his shirt and did a trump 315 00:22:14,435 --> 00:22:17,315 Speaker 1: a Mania bit. But the Democrats are the ones who 316 00:22:17,355 --> 00:22:19,915 Speaker 1: are not dealing with substance at their convention. Oh and 317 00:22:19,955 --> 00:22:23,875 Speaker 1: by the way, at the twenty sixteen Republican Convention, Laura 318 00:22:24,035 --> 00:22:27,715 Speaker 1: Ingram went on stage and gave a long siege Hile's 319 00:22:27,835 --> 00:22:31,755 Speaker 1: salute to a giant image of Trump, a big, full, 320 00:22:31,955 --> 00:22:36,475 Speaker 1: stiff armed, forty five degree angle right armed salute to 321 00:22:36,595 --> 00:22:40,515 Speaker 1: Trump like he was Hitler. So please don't tell me 322 00:22:40,875 --> 00:22:44,835 Speaker 1: about entertainment versus substance unless the substance you're talking about 323 00:22:44,995 --> 00:22:49,835 Speaker 1: is how he is Hitler. The runner up worser Abby Phillip, 324 00:22:50,715 --> 00:22:58,395 Speaker 1: Abby Phillip, Abby, Abby phil Lip. You don't know the 325 00:22:58,475 --> 00:23:03,755 Speaker 1: name she's on CNN. No, No really, CNN, you don't 326 00:23:03,795 --> 00:23:09,515 Speaker 1: know that name either. See Capital N, Capital N. You 327 00:23:09,555 --> 00:23:12,715 Speaker 1: don't record anyway. She does a show it used to 328 00:23:12,795 --> 00:23:17,235 Speaker 1: be a news network, nice five person panel the other 329 00:23:17,355 --> 00:23:21,435 Speaker 1: night discussing the Harris campaign on her show, because after all, 330 00:23:21,755 --> 00:23:24,875 Speaker 1: it's still nineteen ninety eight, right, and as many guests 331 00:23:24,915 --> 00:23:26,675 Speaker 1: as you can have on so they can have a 332 00:23:26,715 --> 00:23:29,555 Speaker 1: pie fight. That's the idea of cable news. This is 333 00:23:29,675 --> 00:23:32,595 Speaker 1: what the third guy to run CNN since I started 334 00:23:32,595 --> 00:23:35,555 Speaker 1: this podcast, and they just keep getting worse and worse. 335 00:23:35,555 --> 00:23:38,955 Speaker 1: They brought in some British guy whose experiences in print 336 00:23:38,995 --> 00:23:42,075 Speaker 1: and he drove the BBC for a while into the ground, 337 00:23:42,155 --> 00:23:44,395 Speaker 1: and then he was with the Times and he's got 338 00:23:44,955 --> 00:23:48,595 Speaker 1: imaginary newsrooms. And I don't know what's going on. Five 339 00:23:48,715 --> 00:23:53,075 Speaker 1: people on a panel to discuss the day's news. Who 340 00:23:53,515 --> 00:23:57,755 Speaker 1: wants this? The ratings indicate nobody wants this. Nobody wanted 341 00:23:57,755 --> 00:24:02,875 Speaker 1: it in two thousand and three. Anyway, during this one 342 00:24:02,875 --> 00:24:05,475 Speaker 1: of the five people in the five person panel on 343 00:24:05,555 --> 00:24:08,395 Speaker 1: the Abby Phillip No, it's a real show. The Abby 344 00:24:08,435 --> 00:24:11,875 Speaker 1: Phillip Show was the how do we put this play? 345 00:24:12,115 --> 00:24:17,115 Speaker 1: Intellectually challenged Congresswoman from North Carolina Nancy I skip morning 346 00:24:17,155 --> 00:24:20,755 Speaker 1: sex to be at this prayer breakfast Your holiness mace. 347 00:24:21,875 --> 00:24:24,675 Speaker 1: Keith Boykin wrote after being one of the other panelists 348 00:24:24,715 --> 00:24:28,035 Speaker 1: that Michael Eric Dyson and I had to correct Representative 349 00:24:28,075 --> 00:24:33,355 Speaker 1: Nancy Mace RSC at least ten times last Night for 350 00:24:33,515 --> 00:24:38,635 Speaker 1: purposely mispronouncing Kamala Harris's name. I will say Kamala's name 351 00:24:38,715 --> 00:24:41,955 Speaker 1: anyway that I want. To Mace, who is either from 352 00:24:42,035 --> 00:24:47,035 Speaker 1: South Carolina or North Carolina. I'll decide which Carolina she's from. 353 00:24:47,155 --> 00:24:51,195 Speaker 1: Mace called her Kamala. I'll say Kamala's name anyway that 354 00:24:51,275 --> 00:24:54,555 Speaker 1: I want. The only reason that Nancy Mace gets away 355 00:24:54,555 --> 00:24:56,955 Speaker 1: with this sort of stuff is not because they put 356 00:24:56,955 --> 00:24:59,355 Speaker 1: her on Fox News or Newsmax so she has a 357 00:24:59,395 --> 00:25:02,875 Speaker 1: lot of followers on Twitter X. It's because people like 358 00:25:02,995 --> 00:25:07,835 Speaker 1: Abby Phillip and CNN and platform her. I understand CNN 359 00:25:07,915 --> 00:25:10,915 Speaker 1: has been in a kind of slow burning fire and 360 00:25:10,955 --> 00:25:13,475 Speaker 1: they're all trying to get out of there before it 361 00:25:13,595 --> 00:25:17,115 Speaker 1: actually turns into an ash heap metaphorically speaking. I understand 362 00:25:17,155 --> 00:25:21,555 Speaker 1: they're trying anything they can to stop the disastrous collapse 363 00:25:21,595 --> 00:25:26,035 Speaker 1: of ratings, which by the way, is affecting everything in television. 364 00:25:27,115 --> 00:25:30,835 Speaker 1: Aim your profit goals lower and things won't be quite 365 00:25:30,835 --> 00:25:33,635 Speaker 1: so bad. But who's going to do that. That's my 366 00:25:33,835 --> 00:25:36,995 Speaker 1: money that you're not making because nobody's watching. We've got 367 00:25:36,995 --> 00:25:39,835 Speaker 1: to have something else on this network until you get 368 00:25:39,875 --> 00:25:41,795 Speaker 1: to the point where we can do the daffy duck 369 00:25:42,075 --> 00:25:45,635 Speaker 1: bit where somebody self destructs live on television. The ratings 370 00:25:45,675 --> 00:25:49,395 Speaker 1: are going to keep going down. I'm not going to 371 00:25:49,435 --> 00:25:51,555 Speaker 1: say it. I'm tempted to say it. I'm not going 372 00:25:51,635 --> 00:25:53,795 Speaker 1: to say it. I'm not going to say it. But 373 00:25:53,955 --> 00:25:58,795 Speaker 1: our winner, Marcel Telloma, who is still identified on Twitter 374 00:25:59,035 --> 00:26:04,315 Speaker 1: x as the head of Students for DeSantis. Marcel tweeted 375 00:26:04,355 --> 00:26:08,355 Speaker 1: out a map in which an electoral map, an electoral 376 00:26:08,395 --> 00:26:12,875 Speaker 1: college map in which Trump beats Kamala Harris two hundred 377 00:26:12,875 --> 00:26:15,235 Speaker 1: and seventy three electoral votes to two hundred and sixty 378 00:26:15,275 --> 00:26:20,875 Speaker 1: five and explained, with the brilliance that can be conveyed 379 00:26:20,915 --> 00:26:25,275 Speaker 1: only when you are this terse and this absolutely convinced 380 00:26:25,515 --> 00:26:28,155 Speaker 1: that no one has ever thought of something like this before. 381 00:26:29,275 --> 00:26:34,475 Speaker 1: If he writes Trump wins California, he does not need 382 00:26:34,555 --> 00:26:40,715 Speaker 1: a single battleground state. This is the way to victory. 383 00:26:41,515 --> 00:26:43,995 Speaker 1: This is not a troll count. This guy is legit 384 00:26:44,515 --> 00:26:47,475 Speaker 1: well legitimately he was the head of students for Dsantis. 385 00:26:47,515 --> 00:26:50,275 Speaker 1: There is a story about him online from last July. 386 00:26:50,355 --> 00:26:53,755 Speaker 1: Students for DeSantis coalition of university student groups organized by 387 00:26:53,795 --> 00:26:56,755 Speaker 1: Never Back Down said it's reached one hundred total chapters 388 00:26:56,755 --> 00:26:59,635 Speaker 1: across thirty seven states. There's an incredible energy from young voters. 389 00:26:59,635 --> 00:27:02,155 Speaker 1: Blah blah blah blah blah. Governor DeSantis as our next president, 390 00:27:02,275 --> 00:27:08,355 Speaker 1: said Marcel Teloma. The group stir. If Trump wins California, 391 00:27:08,395 --> 00:27:11,755 Speaker 1: he does not need a single battleground state. This is 392 00:27:11,795 --> 00:27:16,915 Speaker 1: the way to victory, Marcel Teloma. By the way, I 393 00:27:16,955 --> 00:27:19,555 Speaker 1: got a better idea, Marcel. You know what, never mind 394 00:27:19,555 --> 00:27:23,835 Speaker 1: having Trump try to win California. The real easy way 395 00:27:24,995 --> 00:27:27,755 Speaker 1: to beat Harris and put Trump back in the White House. 396 00:27:27,755 --> 00:27:31,955 Speaker 1: You ready, you gotta pen, Marcel, the real way to 397 00:27:31,995 --> 00:27:38,035 Speaker 1: do this. Trump, as you know, has the Republican nomination already. 398 00:27:38,755 --> 00:27:44,035 Speaker 1: Now you're with me still? Now he should also get 399 00:27:44,275 --> 00:27:49,115 Speaker 1: the Democratic nomination. All right? This is the way to victory. 400 00:27:49,235 --> 00:27:52,915 Speaker 1: Huh am, I right, Marcel Dechelle, this is the way 401 00:27:52,955 --> 00:27:58,395 Speaker 1: to do it. If he's both candidates, he can't lose. Probably, 402 00:27:59,035 --> 00:28:09,435 Speaker 1: Marcel Talloma, Trump wins California. Today's worst person California in 403 00:28:09,595 --> 00:28:25,555 Speaker 1: the world. Phil Donahue died Sunday in New York. He 404 00:28:25,675 --> 00:28:27,915 Speaker 1: was eighty eight. He had been sick for a while 405 00:28:27,995 --> 00:28:31,435 Speaker 1: since last year at least, And so do our number 406 00:28:31,435 --> 00:28:35,315 Speaker 1: one story and Phil Donahue. This is not about what 407 00:28:35,355 --> 00:28:38,035 Speaker 1: a good guy Phil Donahue was and he was. This 408 00:28:38,115 --> 00:28:40,355 Speaker 1: is not about what a committed liberal he was and 409 00:28:40,435 --> 00:28:43,115 Speaker 1: he was. And this is not about how he changed 410 00:28:43,195 --> 00:28:46,795 Speaker 1: television talk shows television, indeed for good or for ill, 411 00:28:47,515 --> 00:28:52,115 Speaker 1: all of which is true and unquestionable. This is about 412 00:28:52,115 --> 00:28:55,435 Speaker 1: the contention that has echoed for more than two decades 413 00:28:55,475 --> 00:29:00,275 Speaker 1: that Phil Donahue was fired by his last employer and 414 00:29:00,395 --> 00:29:05,475 Speaker 1: had his career ended by his last employer, MSNBC because 415 00:29:06,155 --> 00:29:12,515 Speaker 1: he opposed the Iraq War. That's not why he was fired. 416 00:29:13,675 --> 00:29:16,075 Speaker 1: That might have been why he was fired as soon 417 00:29:16,355 --> 00:29:19,995 Speaker 1: as he was, but that was not why he was fired. 418 00:29:20,155 --> 00:29:23,675 Speaker 1: And the reason I know this is I was there 419 00:29:24,715 --> 00:29:28,795 Speaker 1: and as I saw this play out in real time. Initially, 420 00:29:28,875 --> 00:29:32,675 Speaker 1: I was a disinterested bystander the firing played out, and 421 00:29:32,715 --> 00:29:35,315 Speaker 1: people told me things in real time that they thought 422 00:29:35,355 --> 00:29:37,275 Speaker 1: it was safe for me to know, because what the hell. 423 00:29:37,715 --> 00:29:40,075 Speaker 1: I was only going to be back at MSNBC in 424 00:29:40,155 --> 00:29:42,635 Speaker 1: two thousand and three for a couple of weeks, maybe 425 00:29:42,675 --> 00:29:45,715 Speaker 1: just a couple of days. I'd been hired by NBC 426 00:29:45,835 --> 00:29:48,235 Speaker 1: Sports do the Olympics and other stuff for them. It's 427 00:29:48,235 --> 00:29:50,275 Speaker 1: not like I was going to replace Phil Donahue at 428 00:29:50,315 --> 00:29:55,035 Speaker 1: eight o'clock on MSNBC when they eventually fired him. Well, 429 00:29:55,155 --> 00:29:58,035 Speaker 1: actually I did replace Phil Donahue at eight pm on 430 00:29:58,155 --> 00:30:00,755 Speaker 1: MSNBC when they actually fired him, but that was not 431 00:30:00,835 --> 00:30:03,195 Speaker 1: the plan. That was never the plan. And then all 432 00:30:03,235 --> 00:30:06,915 Speaker 1: of a sudden one night, that was plan Phil Donnie 433 00:30:06,915 --> 00:30:09,955 Speaker 1: who had retired in nineteen ninety six because his ratings 434 00:30:09,955 --> 00:30:12,915 Speaker 1: had dropped from first because he was the originator of 435 00:30:12,955 --> 00:30:19,275 Speaker 1: that format, the daytime drama live talk show. Barbara Walters 436 00:30:19,315 --> 00:30:22,675 Speaker 1: did one, Doctor Phil did one. They've all done them. 437 00:30:23,155 --> 00:30:27,075 Speaker 1: This was the original the Donahue Show, a high feminist content, 438 00:30:27,235 --> 00:30:30,435 Speaker 1: a high liberal content, and given the fact that he 439 00:30:30,515 --> 00:30:34,955 Speaker 1: often did really stupid topics, a high intellectual topic and content. 440 00:30:35,355 --> 00:30:39,515 Speaker 1: But by nineteen ninety six he was done and he retired, 441 00:30:39,915 --> 00:30:44,395 Speaker 1: and in two thousand and two MSNBC approached him about 442 00:30:44,395 --> 00:30:49,795 Speaker 1: doing a primetime show on MSNBC, and again when they 443 00:30:49,835 --> 00:30:52,595 Speaker 1: did fire him, the show that replaced him at eight 444 00:30:52,595 --> 00:30:57,115 Speaker 1: o'clock on MSNBC was called Check's Notes Countdown with Keith Alderman. 445 00:30:57,475 --> 00:31:00,395 Speaker 1: And see that's your first clue that Donahue was not 446 00:31:00,475 --> 00:31:06,235 Speaker 1: fired because he opposed IRAQ and Bush Countdown originally started 447 00:31:06,315 --> 00:31:09,795 Speaker 1: as essentially just another hour of the latest news from 448 00:31:09,875 --> 00:31:14,875 Speaker 1: Iraq after we invaded, and gradually, i'd say within two months, 449 00:31:15,155 --> 00:31:17,555 Speaker 1: I began to take a somewhat skeptical view of this. 450 00:31:18,275 --> 00:31:20,955 Speaker 1: But before I went on the air, before they assigned 451 00:31:20,995 --> 00:31:24,795 Speaker 1: me the eight o'clock show and replacing Phil Donahue, I 452 00:31:24,875 --> 00:31:27,595 Speaker 1: had spent about a year doing a daily commentary on 453 00:31:27,635 --> 00:31:30,635 Speaker 1: the ABC Radio network that was carried by a couple 454 00:31:30,675 --> 00:31:33,355 Speaker 1: of hundred stations, including one in New York, in which 455 00:31:33,395 --> 00:31:38,195 Speaker 1: I questioned the sanity of this impending war, and we 456 00:31:38,235 --> 00:31:40,155 Speaker 1: all knew it was coming for a year. We all 457 00:31:40,195 --> 00:31:42,315 Speaker 1: knew it was the only thing the Bush administration had 458 00:31:42,315 --> 00:31:45,315 Speaker 1: been prepared for as of September eleventh, was an a 459 00:31:45,355 --> 00:31:48,635 Speaker 1: war in Iraq. And the only conspiracy I ever put 460 00:31:48,675 --> 00:31:50,755 Speaker 1: any weight in was the idea that they looked at 461 00:31:50,835 --> 00:31:52,955 Speaker 1: nine to eleven and went, oh crap, what are we 462 00:31:52,995 --> 00:31:54,915 Speaker 1: going to do now? Oh my god, it's an excuse 463 00:31:54,955 --> 00:31:57,755 Speaker 1: to go into Iraq. That was the conspiracy of nine 464 00:31:57,755 --> 00:32:00,315 Speaker 1: to eleven. That's the inside job, and that's the extent 465 00:32:00,355 --> 00:32:02,995 Speaker 1: of it. They were prepared to go into Iraq at 466 00:32:03,035 --> 00:32:06,155 Speaker 1: whatever excuse presented itself. If the weather had been bad 467 00:32:06,195 --> 00:32:07,875 Speaker 1: six weeks in a row, they would have said, that's 468 00:32:07,875 --> 00:32:12,715 Speaker 1: Sadam Hussein fault. We're going in. In any event, my 469 00:32:12,875 --> 00:32:14,915 Speaker 1: point is that if you're going to get rid of 470 00:32:14,995 --> 00:32:17,835 Speaker 1: a guy for opposing Iraq and George W. Bush, you 471 00:32:17,875 --> 00:32:21,635 Speaker 1: are not going to replace the Phil Donahue Show with 472 00:32:22,475 --> 00:32:27,355 Speaker 1: Countdown with Keith Olderman. You are firing Donahue and replacing 473 00:32:27,395 --> 00:32:32,715 Speaker 1: him with Olderman. Bad call, buddy. And again I don't 474 00:32:32,755 --> 00:32:36,435 Speaker 1: defend MSNBC, and I am defending MSNBC because I saw 475 00:32:36,475 --> 00:32:39,235 Speaker 1: this play out in real time. Countdown started it as 476 00:32:39,235 --> 00:32:42,475 Speaker 1: another hour of news from Iraq, and by June I 477 00:32:42,635 --> 00:32:45,795 Speaker 1: was telling the real story about the rescue of Private 478 00:32:45,915 --> 00:32:49,035 Speaker 1: Jessica Lynch, who had been taken hostage by the Iraqis 479 00:32:49,075 --> 00:32:51,635 Speaker 1: when in fact she was in a hospital and they 480 00:32:51,635 --> 00:32:54,435 Speaker 1: were torturing her there, and knowing fact, the doctors turned 481 00:32:54,475 --> 00:32:58,475 Speaker 1: out from the Iraqi hospital had contacted US servicemen through 482 00:32:58,515 --> 00:33:01,195 Speaker 1: intermediaries and said, we don't have enough equipment to take 483 00:33:01,235 --> 00:33:04,075 Speaker 1: care of her. We're worried about permanent spinal damage. Why 484 00:33:04,075 --> 00:33:07,555 Speaker 1: don't you over and get her when we'll stand outside 485 00:33:07,795 --> 00:33:09,795 Speaker 1: and you can go in and get her, And they 486 00:33:09,875 --> 00:33:14,435 Speaker 1: turned it into the raid at Entebbe, and I was 487 00:33:14,475 --> 00:33:17,635 Speaker 1: the first newscaster nationally to go and say, you know, 488 00:33:17,675 --> 00:33:20,195 Speaker 1: there's this report from a Toronto newspaper that that's not 489 00:33:20,275 --> 00:33:23,195 Speaker 1: the way it went down. And Bob Right, the head 490 00:33:23,235 --> 00:33:27,995 Speaker 1: of NBC, called up the head of MSNBC Primetime, my boss, 491 00:33:27,995 --> 00:33:31,355 Speaker 1: Phil Griffin, and said fire him. And Griffin talked him 492 00:33:31,395 --> 00:33:35,715 Speaker 1: down to make him apologize. And I said, apologize to who, Phil, 493 00:33:35,715 --> 00:33:37,675 Speaker 1: And he said, apologize to the troops. I said, I 494 00:33:37,675 --> 00:33:40,155 Speaker 1: didn't even mention the troops. I guess that's why you're 495 00:33:40,195 --> 00:33:42,035 Speaker 1: making the troops look like they didn't know that this 496 00:33:42,155 --> 00:33:44,435 Speaker 1: was I said, so you want me to tell the 497 00:33:44,475 --> 00:33:46,995 Speaker 1: story again and explain that I wasn't trying to insult 498 00:33:47,035 --> 00:33:50,235 Speaker 1: the troops. Yes, that'll subtle it. Otherwise we'll have to 499 00:33:50,235 --> 00:33:53,475 Speaker 1: cancel the show. And I said to myself, it's a 500 00:33:53,515 --> 00:33:55,315 Speaker 1: little demeaning. On the other hand, I got to tell 501 00:33:55,355 --> 00:33:57,715 Speaker 1: the story again. I got to throw a little cold 502 00:33:57,715 --> 00:33:59,995 Speaker 1: water on this idea that this was some sort of rescue. 503 00:34:00,035 --> 00:34:02,115 Speaker 1: So I told the story again. In fact, I said, 504 00:34:02,155 --> 00:34:04,075 Speaker 1: would you like me to apologize again next week? And 505 00:34:04,115 --> 00:34:06,355 Speaker 1: they said yes, And soon we were doing all the 506 00:34:06,395 --> 00:34:09,195 Speaker 1: stories that question whether or not George W. Bush was 507 00:34:09,275 --> 00:34:13,715 Speaker 1: lying to America, which he was. That's what they got 508 00:34:13,755 --> 00:34:16,515 Speaker 1: instead of Phil Donahue. They did not fire Phil Donahue 509 00:34:16,515 --> 00:34:19,755 Speaker 1: over IRAQ to get me, not just to get me, 510 00:34:19,835 --> 00:34:22,675 Speaker 1: but to get eight goddamned years of me saying this, 511 00:34:22,995 --> 00:34:25,555 Speaker 1: screaming at George Bush getting on the cover of The 512 00:34:25,595 --> 00:34:30,435 Speaker 1: New Yorker. Shut the hell up, mister president. They fired 513 00:34:30,475 --> 00:34:33,355 Speaker 1: Phil Donahue in two thousand and three for the following reasons. 514 00:34:33,675 --> 00:34:38,155 Speaker 1: Number one, they made NBC management and MSNBC in particular, 515 00:34:38,195 --> 00:34:41,355 Speaker 1: they made the classic daypart mistake. I have talked about 516 00:34:41,475 --> 00:34:44,715 Speaker 1: day parts before. If you remember Katie Kurk being lured 517 00:34:44,755 --> 00:34:47,475 Speaker 1: away from the Today Show on NBC to host the 518 00:34:47,515 --> 00:34:50,595 Speaker 1: CBS Evening News and being an utter disaster, that was 519 00:34:50,635 --> 00:34:55,675 Speaker 1: a dapart mistake. The daypart is the mornings, the afternoons, 520 00:34:55,715 --> 00:34:59,155 Speaker 1: the middays, the evenings, the late nights, the overnights. It's 521 00:34:59,155 --> 00:35:02,075 Speaker 1: a radio term, but it applies to television. And the 522 00:35:02,195 --> 00:35:05,275 Speaker 1: simple truth about day parts is just because you are 523 00:35:05,355 --> 00:35:07,675 Speaker 1: popular in one day part does not mean you will 524 00:35:07,715 --> 00:35:10,595 Speaker 1: automatically be popular in another. In fact, it may mean 525 00:35:10,595 --> 00:35:14,915 Speaker 1: you will be unpopular. I learned this at the age 526 00:35:14,955 --> 00:35:19,515 Speaker 1: of thirty two. No earlier than that. I learned this 527 00:35:19,595 --> 00:35:23,555 Speaker 1: at the age of twenty nine. I went from KTLA 528 00:35:23,635 --> 00:35:26,395 Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, where my sports cast was on at 529 00:35:26,475 --> 00:35:29,635 Speaker 1: ten minutes to eleven o'clock every night, and it was 530 00:35:30,635 --> 00:35:34,315 Speaker 1: the intellectual thing to watch on TV. I went from 531 00:35:34,435 --> 00:35:37,515 Speaker 1: KTLA down the street to KCBS, from channel five to 532 00:35:37,595 --> 00:35:40,235 Speaker 1: Channel two, where the sports cast came on not at 533 00:35:40,355 --> 00:35:42,955 Speaker 1: ten fifty every night, but at eleven thirty every night. 534 00:35:43,195 --> 00:35:45,875 Speaker 1: It was the same sports cast. I was the same guy, 535 00:35:46,155 --> 00:35:48,955 Speaker 1: the lighting was a little bit better, the material was 536 00:35:48,995 --> 00:35:52,315 Speaker 1: a little bit better, and everybody hated me because that 537 00:35:52,435 --> 00:35:55,675 Speaker 1: was a different day part. Everybody who liked the thing 538 00:35:55,715 --> 00:35:58,235 Speaker 1: and thought it was intellectual, they were going to bed 539 00:35:58,275 --> 00:36:00,395 Speaker 1: at eleven o'clock. They were literally not going to stay 540 00:36:00,435 --> 00:36:02,515 Speaker 1: up till eleven thirty. All the people who were watching 541 00:36:02,515 --> 00:36:04,315 Speaker 1: me at eleven thirty were the people who did not 542 00:36:04,355 --> 00:36:06,595 Speaker 1: have to be at their jobs early the next morning, 543 00:36:07,875 --> 00:36:11,195 Speaker 1: people who were fungible, let's put it that way, in 544 00:36:11,275 --> 00:36:13,955 Speaker 1: terms of their career. That's how I learned about day parts. 545 00:36:14,115 --> 00:36:16,755 Speaker 1: Katie Kuric went from The Today Show, where she was 546 00:36:16,755 --> 00:36:18,795 Speaker 1: a co host and when you got tired of her on. 547 00:36:18,915 --> 00:36:21,075 Speaker 1: Then came that guy who later wound up to be 548 00:36:21,115 --> 00:36:24,715 Speaker 1: a you know, and then she'd come back on when 549 00:36:24,755 --> 00:36:26,835 Speaker 1: you were tired of him. And they took her and 550 00:36:26,955 --> 00:36:29,955 Speaker 1: she mostly did interviews in little fluff pieces, and she 551 00:36:30,035 --> 00:36:31,875 Speaker 1: was a happy gal. And they put her on the 552 00:36:31,875 --> 00:36:33,755 Speaker 1: CBS Evening News, where her job was to read the 553 00:36:33,795 --> 00:36:37,515 Speaker 1: teleprompter at six thirty at night, and nobody knew her 554 00:36:37,515 --> 00:36:39,155 Speaker 1: at six thirty at night because she'd been on at 555 00:36:39,155 --> 00:36:41,635 Speaker 1: seven thirty in the morning, and everybody hated her because 556 00:36:41,675 --> 00:36:44,275 Speaker 1: she wasn't that good at reading the teleprompter and she 557 00:36:44,315 --> 00:36:47,915 Speaker 1: couldn't do those little fluffy interviews. It was a newsreading job, 558 00:36:47,955 --> 00:36:50,595 Speaker 1: and it was a disaster. And it happens again and again. 559 00:36:50,675 --> 00:36:53,915 Speaker 1: And somebody, several somebodies, including the people who spent millions 560 00:36:53,955 --> 00:36:58,315 Speaker 1: of dollars on the MSNBC Phil Donahue Show, thought that 561 00:36:58,435 --> 00:37:01,035 Speaker 1: because Phil Donna You had been a brilliant success between 562 00:37:01,035 --> 00:37:03,835 Speaker 1: the years nineteen sixty seven and nineteen ninety six on 563 00:37:04,035 --> 00:37:07,155 Speaker 1: over the air television, usually running at one o'clock in 564 00:37:07,195 --> 00:37:10,515 Speaker 1: the afternoon or two o'clock in the afternoon, that he 565 00:37:10,555 --> 00:37:13,235 Speaker 1: would be a success at eight o'clock at night on 566 00:37:13,475 --> 00:37:19,515 Speaker 1: cable in two thousand and two Daypart plus the other 567 00:37:19,835 --> 00:37:23,555 Speaker 1: great mistake, which is a success on broadcast television, was 568 00:37:23,595 --> 00:37:27,235 Speaker 1: automatically a success on cable television or vice versa. That 569 00:37:27,395 --> 00:37:30,555 Speaker 1: was the primary reason they had violated the first rule. 570 00:37:30,595 --> 00:37:32,475 Speaker 1: The show was doomed from the day they signed them 571 00:37:32,555 --> 00:37:35,595 Speaker 1: to the contract. They also had another problem to get 572 00:37:35,635 --> 00:37:38,035 Speaker 1: him to come out of retirement, even though he wanted to. 573 00:37:38,235 --> 00:37:41,155 Speaker 1: He's from television. He wanted to keep doing it. I'm 574 00:37:41,195 --> 00:37:44,035 Speaker 1: from television. I want to keep doing it. It's part 575 00:37:44,075 --> 00:37:48,115 Speaker 1: of our psychological problems. Even though he wanted to do it, 576 00:37:48,195 --> 00:37:50,635 Speaker 1: he knew he had them over a barrel. It was MSNBC. 577 00:37:50,835 --> 00:37:54,435 Speaker 1: It was a minefield. There were littered corpses everywhere of 578 00:37:54,515 --> 00:37:57,635 Speaker 1: shows that had not succeeded. The eight PM thing alone 579 00:37:57,675 --> 00:38:01,195 Speaker 1: was a disaster area. Between my two stints there, I 580 00:38:01,315 --> 00:38:03,155 Speaker 1: was gone for four years and four months and there 581 00:38:03,155 --> 00:38:05,875 Speaker 1: were seventeen different shows on on at eight o'clock. You 582 00:38:05,915 --> 00:38:07,955 Speaker 1: had to get what you wanted why you could get it, 583 00:38:07,995 --> 00:38:11,395 Speaker 1: And Phil Donahue said, I want a huge staff, and 584 00:38:11,475 --> 00:38:14,075 Speaker 1: I'm not going to Secocca's freaking New Jersey to do 585 00:38:14,195 --> 00:38:16,435 Speaker 1: my show. I'm going to do it from thirty Rocker. 586 00:38:16,435 --> 00:38:18,795 Speaker 1: I'm not going to do it at all, and it's 587 00:38:18,795 --> 00:38:21,075 Speaker 1: going to have a live audience, and I want a 588 00:38:21,115 --> 00:38:23,915 Speaker 1: staff of three times the size of anybody else's. I 589 00:38:23,955 --> 00:38:27,395 Speaker 1: want three executive producers. And I went, okay, mister Donahue, Okay, 590 00:38:27,435 --> 00:38:32,115 Speaker 1: mister Donahue, Okay, mister Donahue. The show now cost about 591 00:38:32,275 --> 00:38:35,115 Speaker 1: ten times as much to produce as any other hour 592 00:38:35,235 --> 00:38:38,555 Speaker 1: on cable news, meaning that it didn't just have to 593 00:38:38,595 --> 00:38:41,675 Speaker 1: do as well as the other shows on MSNBC or 594 00:38:41,755 --> 00:38:45,475 Speaker 1: even slightly better to lift up the boat, but just 595 00:38:45,515 --> 00:38:47,835 Speaker 1: to pay for itself, it basically had to do ten 596 00:38:47,955 --> 00:38:51,235 Speaker 1: times better ratings than any other show on cable television. 597 00:38:51,235 --> 00:38:55,475 Speaker 1: And guess what it didn't. The Donahue Show on MSNBC 598 00:38:55,635 --> 00:38:58,355 Speaker 1: premiered in August of two thousand and two. The rating 599 00:38:58,595 --> 00:39:04,675 Speaker 1: was zero point one. The network was averaging in its 600 00:39:04,955 --> 00:39:09,795 Speaker 1: depths zero point two the Phil Donahue Show, after initial success, 601 00:39:10,075 --> 00:39:12,515 Speaker 1: the highest rating they'd ever gotten for a premiere show, 602 00:39:12,835 --> 00:39:17,755 Speaker 1: even mine, sank to about half of the average audience 603 00:39:17,915 --> 00:39:21,755 Speaker 1: on MSNBC. Was it because he talked a lot about 604 00:39:21,795 --> 00:39:26,675 Speaker 1: Iraq and doubted the reasonableness of going to war there? Maybe, 605 00:39:27,075 --> 00:39:28,595 Speaker 1: maybe it was the fact that he was on at 606 00:39:28,635 --> 00:39:30,635 Speaker 1: eight o'clock at night, and everybody who used to watch 607 00:39:30,715 --> 00:39:32,795 Speaker 1: him was either dead or looking for him at two 608 00:39:32,795 --> 00:39:36,675 Speaker 1: o'clock in the afternoon. Back to the day part subject. So, 609 00:39:36,835 --> 00:39:39,795 Speaker 1: how come when the story of Phil Donahue's firing by 610 00:39:39,915 --> 00:39:43,835 Speaker 1: MSNBC as the Iraq War started always points out that 611 00:39:43,915 --> 00:39:48,395 Speaker 1: Donahue Show and Donahue were fired and canceled while it 612 00:39:48,555 --> 00:39:53,595 Speaker 1: had the highest ratings on MSNBC. Well, they left out 613 00:39:53,635 --> 00:39:56,595 Speaker 1: one detail in that, which was they had the highest 614 00:39:56,675 --> 00:40:00,395 Speaker 1: ratings on MSNBC at the time that the show was canceled. 615 00:40:00,715 --> 00:40:05,275 Speaker 1: For the month of February two thousand and three, it 616 00:40:05,395 --> 00:40:08,515 Speaker 1: averaged four hundred and forty six thousand viewers. Just to 617 00:40:08,515 --> 00:40:11,355 Speaker 1: give you a relative idea, at these sort of apex 618 00:40:11,395 --> 00:40:15,115 Speaker 1: of countdown on MSNBC two thousand and nine, we did 619 00:40:15,275 --> 00:40:18,035 Speaker 1: an average of a million, two hundred thousand viewers a night. 620 00:40:18,755 --> 00:40:20,995 Speaker 1: Four hundred and forty six thousand was the best at 621 00:40:21,075 --> 00:40:24,795 Speaker 1: MSNBC in two thousand and three as this war approached. 622 00:40:24,995 --> 00:40:27,875 Speaker 1: It was terrible. It was a low number. It wasn't 623 00:40:27,915 --> 00:40:30,795 Speaker 1: that much bigger than anybody else's, and it sure wasn't 624 00:40:30,835 --> 00:40:33,955 Speaker 1: ten times bigger than every other cable show in the business. 625 00:40:34,715 --> 00:40:36,915 Speaker 1: It had the highest ratings that month, and they canceled 626 00:40:36,955 --> 00:40:40,715 Speaker 1: it anyway because it was hemorrhaging money. And my friend 627 00:40:40,795 --> 00:40:43,275 Speaker 1: of the time, Phil Griffin, who had filled me in 628 00:40:43,315 --> 00:40:46,275 Speaker 1: on the entirety of this story as it unfolded, said 629 00:40:46,275 --> 00:40:48,995 Speaker 1: that they were only getting those high ratings because they 630 00:40:48,995 --> 00:40:51,435 Speaker 1: were spending, now on top of everything else, a fortune 631 00:40:51,475 --> 00:40:55,075 Speaker 1: in advertising. They bought every local commercial they could get. 632 00:40:55,195 --> 00:40:57,675 Speaker 1: They put bus ads in most of the major cities 633 00:40:57,795 --> 00:41:00,195 Speaker 1: trying to get people to watch Donahue. Was a desperate 634 00:41:00,235 --> 00:41:04,995 Speaker 1: attempt to keep Phil Donahue on the air. As he 635 00:41:05,155 --> 00:41:08,675 Speaker 1: put it, an unfortunate term, and Phil was known for 636 00:41:08,715 --> 00:41:11,115 Speaker 1: them at the time of February. In March of two 637 00:41:11,155 --> 00:41:14,195 Speaker 1: thousand and three, we had to carpet bomb with advertising 638 00:41:14,275 --> 00:41:17,115 Speaker 1: as like, Phil, what about IRAQ? Oh, you're right, buddy. 639 00:41:17,635 --> 00:41:20,715 Speaker 1: The reason we are left with the impression that MSNBC 640 00:41:21,075 --> 00:41:24,555 Speaker 1: canceled the late Phil Donahues show because he was opposed 641 00:41:24,555 --> 00:41:27,795 Speaker 1: to IRAQ was Phil Donahue wanted it that way. I 642 00:41:27,915 --> 00:41:31,955 Speaker 1: understand this fully well. I think what happened to me. 643 00:41:32,075 --> 00:41:34,915 Speaker 1: The biggest lesson, I think is the how corporate media 644 00:41:34,995 --> 00:41:38,595 Speaker 1: shapes our opinions and our coverage. Donahue said, this was 645 00:41:38,635 --> 00:41:42,995 Speaker 1: a decision, my decision, meaning relating to the cancelation of 646 00:41:42,995 --> 00:41:46,875 Speaker 1: his show, the decision to release me came from far above. 647 00:41:47,195 --> 00:41:49,835 Speaker 1: This was not an assistant program director who decided to 648 00:41:49,835 --> 00:41:53,755 Speaker 1: separate me from MSNBC. They were terrified of the anti 649 00:41:53,835 --> 00:41:57,875 Speaker 1: war voice. Let me interrupt to say these things are true. 650 00:41:58,195 --> 00:42:00,675 Speaker 1: They were terrified of the anti war voice. My own 651 00:42:00,715 --> 00:42:03,635 Speaker 1: experience over the Jessica Lynch story would explain that. On 652 00:42:03,675 --> 00:42:06,515 Speaker 1: the other hand, of course, it wasn't the assistant program 653 00:42:06,555 --> 00:42:09,555 Speaker 1: director who separated him from MSNBC. It was the president 654 00:42:09,635 --> 00:42:12,355 Speaker 1: of MSNBC, the president of NBC News, and the president 655 00:42:12,435 --> 00:42:15,475 Speaker 1: of NBC because that's the decisions they reserved for themselves, 656 00:42:15,515 --> 00:42:17,835 Speaker 1: because those are the egotistical ones, the ones where you 657 00:42:17,835 --> 00:42:20,035 Speaker 1: can call in some TV star and say either you 658 00:42:20,155 --> 00:42:23,435 Speaker 1: do it my way or you're fired. To resume mister 659 00:42:23,435 --> 00:42:27,395 Speaker 1: Dona Hues's comments, they were terrified of the anti war voice, 660 00:42:27,435 --> 00:42:29,995 Speaker 1: and that is not an overstatement. Anti war voices were 661 00:42:30,035 --> 00:42:33,035 Speaker 1: not popular, and if your general electric, you certainly don't 662 00:42:33,075 --> 00:42:35,395 Speaker 1: want an anti war voice on a cable channel that 663 00:42:35,475 --> 00:42:39,355 Speaker 1: you own. Donald Rumsfeld is your biggest customer. So by 664 00:42:39,395 --> 00:42:41,555 Speaker 1: the way, I had to have two conservatives on for 665 00:42:41,595 --> 00:42:45,315 Speaker 1: every liberal. I could have Richard Pearl on alone. Richard 666 00:42:45,315 --> 00:42:48,555 Speaker 1: pearl was a diplomat in quotes who worked for Bush. 667 00:42:48,595 --> 00:42:51,835 Speaker 1: But I couldn't have Dennis Kucinich on alone, former mayor 668 00:42:51,915 --> 00:42:55,115 Speaker 1: of Cleveland, who was most anti war. I was considered 669 00:42:55,235 --> 00:42:58,915 Speaker 1: two liberals. It really is funny almost when you look 670 00:42:58,955 --> 00:43:01,275 Speaker 1: back on how the management was just frozen by the 671 00:43:01,315 --> 00:43:04,955 Speaker 1: anti war voice. We were skolds, we weren't patriotic Erican 672 00:43:04,955 --> 00:43:07,355 Speaker 1: people disagreed with us, and we weren't good for business, 673 00:43:08,315 --> 00:43:10,435 Speaker 1: all of which is true, but all of which somewhat 674 00:43:10,475 --> 00:43:14,515 Speaker 1: exaggerates the point here. If half a million people and 675 00:43:14,595 --> 00:43:17,275 Speaker 1: it wasn't that many were watching Phil Donahue every night, 676 00:43:17,595 --> 00:43:19,995 Speaker 1: half a million people in a country that even then 677 00:43:20,115 --> 00:43:24,115 Speaker 1: was pushing three hundred million isn't very much. His anti 678 00:43:24,155 --> 00:43:27,355 Speaker 1: war voice was an annoyance to these people, an embarrassment 679 00:43:27,395 --> 00:43:30,515 Speaker 1: to people like Bob Wright, who ran NBC. Phil Donahue 680 00:43:30,555 --> 00:43:34,595 Speaker 1: treated it as if he was I don't know, he 681 00:43:34,795 --> 00:43:38,995 Speaker 1: was the guy amiel Zola writing jacquesues against the French 682 00:43:39,035 --> 00:43:43,195 Speaker 1: government in eighteen ninety something Phil also forgot in making 683 00:43:43,235 --> 00:43:45,355 Speaker 1: this statement that in the fall of two thousand and two, 684 00:43:45,395 --> 00:43:49,195 Speaker 1: he was on the air on MSNBC, alongside the late 685 00:43:49,275 --> 00:43:51,955 Speaker 1: Jerry Nackman, who also had a show that wasn't doing well, 686 00:43:52,435 --> 00:43:56,795 Speaker 1: talking about they're terrible ratings. They're going to fire us, 687 00:43:57,195 --> 00:44:00,835 Speaker 1: Nachman said to Donahue, and Donahue said, yeah, they are. 688 00:44:02,515 --> 00:44:04,555 Speaker 1: That was in the fall of two thousand and two. 689 00:44:04,875 --> 00:44:07,875 Speaker 1: Weeks after the Donahue Show had premiered. There was talk 690 00:44:07,915 --> 00:44:10,235 Speaker 1: of moving Donahue to the middle of the day. There 691 00:44:10,315 --> 00:44:13,155 Speaker 1: was talk of moving Donahue somewhere else. There was talk 692 00:44:13,155 --> 00:44:17,635 Speaker 1: of putting him on a hey hiatus. Instead, everybody got 693 00:44:17,635 --> 00:44:20,715 Speaker 1: fired except poor Knackman, who got sick. The reason I 694 00:44:20,835 --> 00:44:23,715 Speaker 1: was at MSNBC was Jerry Knackman was sick. They didn't 695 00:44:23,755 --> 00:44:25,675 Speaker 1: have enough anchors. They asked me to fill in for 696 00:44:25,715 --> 00:44:28,555 Speaker 1: a few days, and the next thing you knew, I 697 00:44:28,595 --> 00:44:32,635 Speaker 1: was doing the show again. Would they have fired Phil 698 00:44:32,715 --> 00:44:37,155 Speaker 1: Donahue if Bush had said, we have fixed this, there 699 00:44:37,195 --> 00:44:40,395 Speaker 1: will be no war in Iraq? Yes, they would have 700 00:44:40,435 --> 00:44:45,275 Speaker 1: fired him. It was hemorrhaging money. It was putting out 701 00:44:45,395 --> 00:44:48,035 Speaker 1: ten dollars for every dollar it took in. Would they 702 00:44:48,035 --> 00:44:50,715 Speaker 1: have fired him that fast, no way. They were short 703 00:44:50,715 --> 00:44:52,995 Speaker 1: of staff. They were so short of staff they brought 704 00:44:53,035 --> 00:44:56,195 Speaker 1: me back. And I had left five years before in flames. 705 00:44:57,275 --> 00:45:01,835 Speaker 1: That's why I was there. I'm wrapping this up. New 706 00:45:01,915 --> 00:45:05,835 Speaker 1: York Magazine in twenty ten, I believe, wrote a long 707 00:45:05,915 --> 00:45:10,555 Speaker 1: story about the then climaxing cable wars, particularly between CNN 708 00:45:10,595 --> 00:45:14,715 Speaker 1: and MSNBC. Gabe Sherman, I think, wrote this with the 709 00:45:14,795 --> 00:45:17,795 Speaker 1: surgeon patriotism. Following the terrorist attacks of nine to eleven, 710 00:45:17,915 --> 00:45:22,435 Speaker 1: NBC CEO Bob Wright told Shapiro, that would be Neil Shapiro, 711 00:45:22,515 --> 00:45:25,715 Speaker 1: then the head of NBC News, that MSNBC should try 712 00:45:25,755 --> 00:45:28,435 Speaker 1: and out flank Fox on the right. We have to 713 00:45:28,435 --> 00:45:31,395 Speaker 1: be more conservative than they are, right, told Shapiro pointedly, 714 00:45:31,835 --> 00:45:35,235 Speaker 1: that's absolutely true. By the way, Bob Wright actually thought 715 00:45:35,235 --> 00:45:38,395 Speaker 1: you could be to further right than Fox was at 716 00:45:38,395 --> 00:45:41,155 Speaker 1: that time, And for years I thought he was an 717 00:45:41,155 --> 00:45:44,795 Speaker 1: idiot who just had these psycho drama ideas going on 718 00:45:44,835 --> 00:45:46,675 Speaker 1: in his head. Well, of course, then came Trump. He 719 00:45:46,795 --> 00:45:48,795 Speaker 1: was right, he just didn't know how to do it. 720 00:45:49,395 --> 00:45:52,955 Speaker 1: Swirling graphics of the American flag, New York Magazine wrote 721 00:45:53,115 --> 00:45:55,155 Speaker 1: soon became a fixture on the network, along with the 722 00:45:55,195 --> 00:46:00,355 Speaker 1: tagline America's News Channel, it said, in graphics that were 723 00:46:00,395 --> 00:46:02,835 Speaker 1: taped to all the cameras so that all the anchors 724 00:46:02,835 --> 00:46:07,875 Speaker 1: would see it and say it Erica's News Channel. Despite 725 00:46:07,875 --> 00:46:11,355 Speaker 1: the network's emphasis on flag waving, MSNBC showed how little 726 00:46:11,395 --> 00:46:14,035 Speaker 1: it understood the Fox model when, with Phil Griffin as 727 00:46:14,115 --> 00:46:17,995 Speaker 1: MSNBC's primetime head, it hired the liberal Phil Donahue, who'd 728 00:46:17,995 --> 00:46:21,875 Speaker 1: been Griffin's childhood idol, out of retirement in April two 729 00:46:21,915 --> 00:46:24,315 Speaker 1: thousand and two to anchor an eight pm primetime talk 730 00:46:24,355 --> 00:46:27,875 Speaker 1: show that would challenge Bill O'Reilly. The show debuted with 731 00:46:27,875 --> 00:46:31,515 Speaker 1: the highest ratings ever for an MSNBC program, attracting more 732 00:46:31,515 --> 00:46:34,035 Speaker 1: than a million viewers in its first night, but within 733 00:46:34,075 --> 00:46:37,595 Speaker 1: a month the audience was cut in half. Standard for MSNBC. 734 00:46:37,755 --> 00:46:41,035 Speaker 1: Rita Cosby once got nearly million viewers her first night, 735 00:46:41,075 --> 00:46:42,115 Speaker 1: by the end of the week, she was down to 736 00:46:42,155 --> 00:46:45,275 Speaker 1: one hundred and seventy five thousand to resume. At the 737 00:46:45,315 --> 00:46:50,035 Speaker 1: same time, executives expressed increasing unease about Donahue's vocal opposition 738 00:46:50,075 --> 00:46:52,235 Speaker 1: to the looming war in Iraq. At a time when 739 00:46:52,275 --> 00:46:56,195 Speaker 1: red meat patriotism prevailed, Donahue booked anti war guests like 740 00:46:56,315 --> 00:47:00,715 Speaker 1: Michael Moore, Rosie O'Donnell, Susan Sarandon, and Tim Robbins. By 741 00:47:00,715 --> 00:47:02,395 Speaker 1: the way, I should point out that years later, when 742 00:47:02,435 --> 00:47:04,315 Speaker 1: I was trying to explain to Phil Griffin that Rachel 743 00:47:04,315 --> 00:47:07,195 Speaker 1: Maddow was the next star of MSNBC and she should 744 00:47:07,195 --> 00:47:10,075 Speaker 1: be given her own show, he tried to hire Rosie 745 00:47:10,075 --> 00:47:15,075 Speaker 1: O'Donnell instead. Soon, the Donahue pro problem threatened Griffin's job. 746 00:47:15,315 --> 00:47:18,955 Speaker 1: In a tense phone conversation, NBC News President Shapiro told 747 00:47:19,075 --> 00:47:23,675 Speaker 1: MSNBC president Eric Sorenson to fire Griffin, but Sorenson pushed back, 748 00:47:24,555 --> 00:47:27,115 Speaker 1: I'm not going to do that, he told Shapiro. Number One, 749 00:47:27,155 --> 00:47:29,115 Speaker 1: Phil's been loyal to me for a long time. I 750 00:47:29,115 --> 00:47:31,795 Speaker 1: don't think it's right. Number Two, we're shorthanded. We have 751 00:47:31,875 --> 00:47:34,155 Speaker 1: all this talent and he's the one who's managing it. 752 00:47:35,595 --> 00:47:37,315 Speaker 1: Part two was a lie. They didn't have any talent 753 00:47:37,355 --> 00:47:40,115 Speaker 1: at all. That's why I was back there. As a compromise, 754 00:47:40,195 --> 00:47:42,995 Speaker 1: Griffin's job was spared, but he was stripped of responsibility 755 00:47:42,995 --> 00:47:45,675 Speaker 1: for the show. The new producer insisted on a precise 756 00:47:45,755 --> 00:47:51,115 Speaker 1: numerical balance between liberals and conservatives. Donahue's problems only increased 757 00:47:51,155 --> 00:47:54,195 Speaker 1: when Chris Matthews let it be known that he wanted 758 00:47:54,235 --> 00:47:57,675 Speaker 1: Donahue off the air. Matthews was a rising force at 759 00:47:57,675 --> 00:48:00,555 Speaker 1: the network, with a reported salary of five million dollars 760 00:48:00,595 --> 00:48:04,555 Speaker 1: a year. He cultivated former ge CEO Jack Welch and 761 00:48:04,795 --> 00:48:07,995 Speaker 1: had the ear of the NBAC CEO, Bob Wright. The 762 00:48:08,035 --> 00:48:11,755 Speaker 1: two summered together on Nantucket and you know the limerick 763 00:48:11,875 --> 00:48:16,835 Speaker 1: about Nantucket. Matthew saw himself as MSNBC's biggest star. Well, 764 00:48:16,875 --> 00:48:20,075 Speaker 1: he was MSNBC's biggest something, and he was upset that 765 00:48:20,075 --> 00:48:24,755 Speaker 1: the network was pumping significant resources into Donahue's show. Again, 766 00:48:25,515 --> 00:48:28,595 Speaker 1: I would never defend Chris Matthews under any circumstances, but 767 00:48:28,635 --> 00:48:32,435 Speaker 1: he's absolutely right about this. Matthews was delivering ratings with 768 00:48:32,675 --> 00:48:36,275 Speaker 1: almost no advertising, ratings that were usually much higher than 769 00:48:36,315 --> 00:48:40,635 Speaker 1: those of Phil Donahue, and here thousands and thousands of 770 00:48:40,915 --> 00:48:44,955 Speaker 1: dollars in advertising were spent daily to try to sell 771 00:48:44,995 --> 00:48:48,555 Speaker 1: people on a Phil Donahue show that nobody wanted, whether 772 00:48:48,675 --> 00:48:53,235 Speaker 1: it offered a solution for world peace and eternal life. 773 00:48:53,315 --> 00:48:55,715 Speaker 1: In the fall of two thousand and two, US News 774 00:48:55,715 --> 00:48:58,355 Speaker 1: and World Report ran a gossip item that had Matthew 775 00:48:58,435 --> 00:49:01,035 Speaker 1: saying over lunch in Washington that if Donahue stays on 776 00:49:01,075 --> 00:49:03,755 Speaker 1: the air, he could bring down the network. After the 777 00:49:03,795 --> 00:49:07,075 Speaker 1: item was published, Matthews showed up at Donahue's office and apologized. 778 00:49:07,635 --> 00:49:12,195 Speaker 1: He didn't deny it. Donahue remembers Matthews made a hobby 779 00:49:12,315 --> 00:49:15,315 Speaker 1: within MSNBC of trying to get the rest of us fired. 780 00:49:15,515 --> 00:49:17,315 Speaker 1: He tried to do that to me in two thousand 781 00:49:17,315 --> 00:49:20,475 Speaker 1: and eight during the coverage of the Republican National Convention, 782 00:49:20,715 --> 00:49:24,235 Speaker 1: when we got removed because of something I said. Matthews 783 00:49:24,275 --> 00:49:27,675 Speaker 1: had been saying equally stupid things and usually factually inaccurate ones. 784 00:49:27,795 --> 00:49:30,435 Speaker 1: But he did call Jeff Zooker and then Jeff Immelt, 785 00:49:30,435 --> 00:49:33,395 Speaker 1: the head of GE, and say you should fire Olderman 786 00:49:33,555 --> 00:49:36,955 Speaker 1: and keep me. Back to the New York Magazine article. 787 00:49:36,955 --> 00:49:39,395 Speaker 1: With the war looming, Sorenson and Griffin decided to take 788 00:49:39,435 --> 00:49:41,435 Speaker 1: him off the air to make war for twenty four 789 00:49:41,475 --> 00:49:44,715 Speaker 1: to seven make room for twenty four seven war coverage. 790 00:49:44,715 --> 00:49:46,915 Speaker 1: Matthews told me he had nothing to do with the decision. 791 00:49:47,075 --> 00:49:49,675 Speaker 1: That's true. They never listened to him. For Griffin, the 792 00:49:49,675 --> 00:49:52,915 Speaker 1: firing of his childhood idol was a painful experience. The 793 00:49:52,915 --> 00:49:55,355 Speaker 1: guy that got me into TV probably hates my guts, 794 00:49:55,475 --> 00:49:57,875 Speaker 1: and I wish he didn't because I love the guy Griffin, 795 00:49:57,915 --> 00:50:01,955 Speaker 1: says Griffin, who prevented Rachel Maddow from appearing on MSNBC 796 00:50:02,155 --> 00:50:05,595 Speaker 1: for several years as an anchor. Anyway, he was paid 797 00:50:05,635 --> 00:50:07,795 Speaker 1: back by the fact that somehow Rachel has forgotten this 798 00:50:07,915 --> 00:50:10,915 Speaker 1: and made him the president of her production company. In 799 00:50:10,955 --> 00:50:13,315 Speaker 1: any event, So all that was playing out, and I 800 00:50:13,435 --> 00:50:15,355 Speaker 1: was just hanging around for a couple of days filling 801 00:50:15,355 --> 00:50:17,355 Speaker 1: in for Jerry Knackman who was just out sick. And 802 00:50:17,395 --> 00:50:20,875 Speaker 1: then the diagnosis came back about how sick Jerry Nackman was, 803 00:50:20,955 --> 00:50:23,595 Speaker 1: and suddenly they didn't have enough anchors. Less Your Holt, 804 00:50:23,595 --> 00:50:25,315 Speaker 1: who was doing something like four or five hours a 805 00:50:25,355 --> 00:50:28,515 Speaker 1: day on MSNBC, was suddenly called to New York to 806 00:50:28,555 --> 00:50:34,915 Speaker 1: do more action coverage from NBC News about the Iraq War. 807 00:50:34,995 --> 00:50:38,195 Speaker 1: And now MSNBC had no anchors, They had nobody who 808 00:50:38,235 --> 00:50:41,435 Speaker 1: was familiar to their audience, They had nobody. Nacman was sick. 809 00:50:41,715 --> 00:50:44,995 Speaker 1: They certainly weren't going to have Phil Donahue anchor Iraq 810 00:50:45,035 --> 00:50:48,275 Speaker 1: war coverage. And now Lester Holt was being taken away 811 00:50:48,275 --> 00:50:52,995 Speaker 1: from them, and Brian Williams was already in Iraq personally 812 00:50:53,315 --> 00:50:56,635 Speaker 1: looking for Sodom Hussein or whatever he was doing in Iraq. 813 00:50:56,755 --> 00:51:00,635 Speaker 1: So the plan was canceled. Dona Hughes show hires somebody 814 00:51:00,635 --> 00:51:02,875 Speaker 1: good like Sam Donaldson and have him do a show 815 00:51:02,915 --> 00:51:06,755 Speaker 1: called Countdown with Sam Donaldson. I've already told you how 816 00:51:06,795 --> 00:51:10,275 Speaker 1: they turned that into Countdown with Keith Olderman. But the 817 00:51:10,275 --> 00:51:13,715 Speaker 1: gist of it was, as I said earlier, if there 818 00:51:13,715 --> 00:51:16,555 Speaker 1: had been no threat of Iraq war, or if everybody 819 00:51:16,595 --> 00:51:20,635 Speaker 1: had said, you know, Phil Donahue is right, this is asinine, 820 00:51:20,915 --> 00:51:25,155 Speaker 1: This is power greedy. This is Bush trying to use 821 00:51:25,275 --> 00:51:30,115 Speaker 1: nine to eleven in the most insincere and brutal way 822 00:51:30,195 --> 00:51:34,675 Speaker 1: possible as an excuse for an unrelated war. If everybody 823 00:51:34,715 --> 00:51:38,315 Speaker 1: had said that, if Bush had resigned from the presidency 824 00:51:38,515 --> 00:51:42,795 Speaker 1: and Cheney with him, if they had made Michael Moore 825 00:51:42,915 --> 00:51:46,115 Speaker 1: President of the United States, they still would have fired 826 00:51:47,195 --> 00:51:56,635 Speaker 1: Phil Donahue because he lost money. Phil Donahue Television Hall 827 00:51:56,675 --> 00:52:14,915 Speaker 1: of Famer, not fired over Iraq. I don't know the 828 00:52:14,955 --> 00:52:17,555 Speaker 1: damage I can do here. I mean, I know it's 829 00:52:17,595 --> 00:52:20,035 Speaker 1: disrespectful in many ways to have brought that up now, 830 00:52:20,075 --> 00:52:24,875 Speaker 1: But when else is it relevant? This is a topical 831 00:52:24,875 --> 00:52:31,275 Speaker 1: subject the passing of Phil Donahue anyway. Did they mistreat him? Absolutely? 832 00:52:31,675 --> 00:52:33,755 Speaker 1: Was it his fault that they spent ten times as 833 00:52:33,835 --> 00:52:36,475 Speaker 1: much money as he was making. No, it was not 834 00:52:36,595 --> 00:52:39,795 Speaker 1: his fault, but the idea that he then turned it 835 00:52:39,835 --> 00:52:41,835 Speaker 1: into it is all about it. It was not all 836 00:52:41,875 --> 00:52:47,155 Speaker 1: about it. Please share this podcast with somebody who doesn't 837 00:52:47,195 --> 00:52:50,595 Speaker 1: listen for whatever reason. Friday's regular episode and then the 838 00:52:50,635 --> 00:52:53,395 Speaker 1: bulletin on Trump insisting that the Medal of Honor winners 839 00:52:54,195 --> 00:52:58,195 Speaker 1: were only as important as the Congressional Medal of Honors 840 00:52:58,195 --> 00:53:01,195 Speaker 1: that he gave out to corporate donors that drew a 841 00:53:01,195 --> 00:53:03,915 Speaker 1: total audience of a quarter million. So thank you. Keep 842 00:53:03,915 --> 00:53:07,235 Speaker 1: it up any who. Brian Ray and John Phillip Shaneil, 843 00:53:07,275 --> 00:53:10,115 Speaker 1: the musical directors have Countdown, arranged, produced and performed most 844 00:53:10,115 --> 00:53:13,675 Speaker 1: of our music. Mister Chanelle handled orchestration and keyboards. Mister 845 00:53:13,755 --> 00:53:16,475 Speaker 1: Ray was on guitars, bass and drums. It was produced 846 00:53:16,475 --> 00:53:19,795 Speaker 1: by Tko Brothers. Our satirical and pithy musical comments are 847 00:53:19,835 --> 00:53:23,275 Speaker 1: by the best baseball stadium organists ever, Nancy Faust. The 848 00:53:23,275 --> 00:53:26,395 Speaker 1: sports music is the Olderman theme from ESPN two, written 849 00:53:26,395 --> 00:53:29,835 Speaker 1: by Mitch Warren Davis, courtesy of ESPN Inc. Other music 850 00:53:29,955 --> 00:53:32,595 Speaker 1: arranged and performed by the group No Horns Allowed. My 851 00:53:32,635 --> 00:53:35,155 Speaker 1: announcer today was my friend Larry David, and everything else 852 00:53:35,275 --> 00:53:38,235 Speaker 1: was pretty much my fault. So that's countdown for this. 853 00:53:38,315 --> 00:53:41,995 Speaker 1: The seventy eighth day until the twenty twenty four presidential election, 854 00:53:42,315 --> 00:53:45,755 Speaker 1: the three hundred and twenty first day since convicted Felon 855 00:53:45,795 --> 00:53:49,675 Speaker 1: Daventia J. Trump's first attempted coup against the democratically elected 856 00:53:49,675 --> 00:53:53,395 Speaker 1: government of the United States. Use the September eighteenth sentencing 857 00:53:53,435 --> 00:53:56,475 Speaker 1: hearing if it happens, because say what you will about 858 00:53:56,515 --> 00:54:00,075 Speaker 1: Trump's lawyers, whatever the deadline is, they are never ready 859 00:54:00,115 --> 00:54:03,195 Speaker 1: for it. Use the mental health system you have this 860 00:54:03,315 --> 00:54:07,115 Speaker 1: President Biden used residential immunity to stop him from doing 861 00:54:07,155 --> 00:54:11,515 Speaker 1: it again while we still can. And anti Semitic, anti immigration, 862 00:54:11,635 --> 00:54:15,875 Speaker 1: gun nut Republicans, please stop shooting at Trump. The next 863 00:54:15,875 --> 00:54:19,555 Speaker 1: scheduled countdown is tomorrow. Bulletins is the news warrants till 864 00:54:19,595 --> 00:54:21,955 Speaker 1: the next one. I'm Keith Oldremman. Good Morning, good afternoon, 865 00:54:22,035 --> 00:54:42,955 Speaker 1: good night, then good luck. Countdown with Keith Oldreman is 866 00:54:42,955 --> 00:54:47,755 Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit 867 00:54:47,795 --> 00:54:52,475 Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.