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Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode of Car Stories with some

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Speaker 1: Kay and Amelia Hartford. It is so great that we

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Speaker 1: both plan to match today.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Military Day.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Song and I are both wearing green pants and

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Speaker 1: a white shirt.

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Speaker 2: What is your favorite pizza in the world?

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Speaker 1: Favorite pizza?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, pizza place?

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Speaker 1: Oh, pizza place?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, pizza Yeah. Where do you get like your last pizza,

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Speaker 2: your slice of pizza?

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Speaker 1: Where would you go if I were to tell you

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Speaker 1: about a pizza place I've had recently, It's Mulberry Pizza,

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Speaker 1: Mulberry Prime or issue my two go Tos? What about you?

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Speaker 2: Domino's pizza?

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Speaker 1: You like Dominoes?

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Speaker 2: I think that's Domina's the best pizza in the world. Really, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: yeah it is.

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Speaker 1: We'll have to agree to news story. I don't get

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Speaker 1: me wrong. Dominoes is good. But don't think I might

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Speaker 1: just like a.

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Speaker 2: Little people under to make the power of a franchise

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Speaker 2: the reason. It's good. It's good. That's good, it's good,

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Speaker 2: it's great. It is good. But it's the Big Mac

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Speaker 2: is the best tasting hamburger in the world. Okay, it is.

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Speaker 2: It's served over three billion people probably by now.

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Speaker 1: I wish I could agree with this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, if there was no McDonald's okay, and I put

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Speaker 2: and okay. If there was no McDonald's, no Dominoes and

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Speaker 2: no KFC, and you came over to my house and

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Speaker 2: I put a Domino's pizza in front of.

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Speaker 1: You, it'd be too much for me.

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Speaker 2: No no, no, no, okay, and I give you a

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Speaker 2: slice of that.

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Speaker 1: And I wasn't talking about like too much food. It

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Speaker 1: would just be like what too much? Too much everything,

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Speaker 1: like a cheese pizza, it's like overdone. I like simple,

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Speaker 1: like okay.

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Speaker 2: If I came over with my house and I put

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Speaker 2: there's no McDonald's and I put a big Mac in

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Speaker 2: front of you, you would say this is the best

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Speaker 2: that it's processed.

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Speaker 1: It's not real.

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Speaker 2: It's because you know, and I don't know.

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Speaker 3: I don't think.

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Speaker 1: Maybe I'm Jayden, but I know based on recently in Japan,

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Speaker 1: when I went to Starbucks, I got a Machia Late

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Speaker 1: and then I came back to the States and I

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Speaker 1: got a Macho Lte and it tasted completely different and

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Speaker 1: it was so much better in Japan.

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Speaker 2: That's not my point. It's not my point. There's no

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Speaker 2: there is no But.

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Speaker 1: I'd much rather go support a mom and Pop play.

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Speaker 1: I could be like the food drink taste better there.

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Speaker 2: Pop opened a Hamburger spot.

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Speaker 1: The only one you could convince me on is Taco Bell.

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Speaker 2: No, that's gross. No, okay, okay, let's have about KFC

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Speaker 2: argument if you came to that in so long. Okay, Well,

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Speaker 2: for the chicken people out there, if I made a

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Speaker 2: KFC original recipe at my house, people would think that

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Speaker 2: is the best chicken ever made.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I can tell a difference between fresh

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Speaker 1: ingredients versus non fresh, frozen preservative ingredients.

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Speaker 2: Well, okay, if I made the same recipe with fresh

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Speaker 2: organic chicken from Whole Food or Ariwon, it would be

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Speaker 2: the best chicken.

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Speaker 1: That's why it would be great because it wouldn't upset

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Speaker 1: my stomach.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's why there's a KFC because it was the

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Speaker 2: At one time, it was a mom and pop. At

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Speaker 2: one time, McDonald's was a mom and pop.

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Speaker 1: You can't compare. We're talking about the food today, you

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Speaker 1: can't compare it to what it was.

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Speaker 2: Man, this is anyway. My vote is Domino's Pizza the

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Speaker 2: best pizza. And you say Mulberry, Okay, I know Mulberry

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Speaker 2: is the best.

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Speaker 1: I'm just saying that's what I guess.

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Speaker 2: I can't convince you that Dominoes.

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Speaker 1: I just feel like I asked myself out of working

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Speaker 1: with so many potential brands.

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Speaker 2: No you didn't no, no, no, no, no like Dominoes. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: well yeah he a Dominos. I love you guys. Anyway, So,

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Speaker 2: speaking of awesome thing, right, our first guest today is.

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Speaker 1: Jen Horsey, and I am just constantly impressed with Jen,

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Speaker 1: from being a racing driver, from a journalist to being

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Speaker 1: the first female analyst on ESPN for sports.

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Speaker 2: She's about giving back and paying forward and creating opportunities

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Speaker 2: for other people's dreams to happen, and she arrives in

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Speaker 2: that and it's pretty amazing.

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Speaker 1: She doesn't usually take the spotlight, is usually the one

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Speaker 1: helping others behind the scenes, so it's really nice for

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Speaker 1: her to come on and just get to know her

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Speaker 1: on a more public scale.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I hear that she can make some mean pastries.

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Speaker 1: I want to croissants, Jen, please.

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Speaker 2: So without further ado, Jen Horsey, So, Jens, thank you

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Speaker 2: for coming.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for coming today.

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Speaker 3: Thanks, guys, I'm super happy to be here. I kind

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Speaker 3: of know you from different world, so it was cool

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Speaker 3: to see get the invitation and be able to join

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Speaker 3: your great podcast.

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Speaker 1: We like to have people on who inspire us, and

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Speaker 1: if someone want to look at your resume, they'd be like,

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Speaker 1: holy crap, this is possible in a lifetime and you

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Speaker 1: did what and you've done how much that I don't

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Speaker 1: even know where to begin. I kind of want people

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Speaker 1: to hear who are listening from you a little bit

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Speaker 1: about yourself and how you got to work today before

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Speaker 1: we kind of dive into everything. How did this all

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Speaker 1: start for you? I don't have like a straight path,

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Speaker 1: you know. When I was a little kid, I didn't

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Speaker 1: grow up in a car household. I didn't follow racing.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know anything about cars at all. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to be a journalist from a really young age. I

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm just curious about people. I'm curious about

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Speaker 1: what makes people tick, and also recognize that you could

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Speaker 1: go and do a lot of cool stuff.

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Speaker 3: And I wanted to be in it. I didn't want

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Speaker 3: to be watching things from a distance. I didn't want

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Speaker 3: to be sitting behind a desk. I wanted to be

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Speaker 3: in it. So I was like, Okay, I'm going to

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Speaker 3: be a journalist. So of course I went to theater

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Speaker 3: school because that's practical, and I have a technical theater degree.

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Speaker 3: You do, Yeah, I did lighting design. That was that

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Speaker 3: was my experience.

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Speaker 1: I'm telling you, she could tell me anything and I

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Speaker 1: can't be surprised.

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Speaker 4: Wow.

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Speaker 3: So partly because I knew that would be fun. I

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Speaker 3: love the theater environment. I thought I would meet really

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Speaker 3: interesting people, which I did. Yeah, did you grow up Toronto?

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Speaker 3: So I'm originally from Toronto to school in the East

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Speaker 3: Coast and Halifax at Dalhousie University. And while I was

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Speaker 3: in school, I was like promoting bands on the side

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Speaker 3: and then also being a freelance writer and working in

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Speaker 3: campus radio and my student paper, and I was going

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Speaker 3: to do the experiential path. I'm not super into school,

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Speaker 3: so I think everyone should go to school. I think

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Speaker 3: degrees are great. It's not my favorite environment. So I thought, Okay,

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Speaker 3: well I'll do the school because I have to get

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Speaker 3: the piece of paper, but I'm going to get a

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Speaker 3: lot of experience. So I went through and did the

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Speaker 3: experiential route to becoming a journalist. Got an internship at

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Speaker 3: Canadian Press, which is Canada's associated press. It's the Why service,

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Speaker 3: which turned into a full time job so my first career,

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Speaker 3: I was a journalist. So first career, yes, just to

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Speaker 3: date myself completely, my first big story was nine to eleven,

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Speaker 3: so I was a junior reporter. At that time. News

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Speaker 3: is obviously twenty four to seven. The wire in particular,

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Speaker 3: it's sort of like that for everyone now because of

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Speaker 3: the Internet. But again this is like early two thousands.

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Speaker 3: The Internet played a really different role in our lives,

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Speaker 3: and I soon realized I was never seeing my friends

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Speaker 3: and family. I was a junior reporter, so I worked

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Speaker 3: a lot of nights. I worked a lot of weekends,

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Speaker 3: and I learned quickly that as long as there was

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Speaker 3: something in the slot beside your name on the assignment board,

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Speaker 3: they just skipped and went to the next one, and

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Speaker 3: you could just do whatever you wrote in the slot.

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Speaker 3: If you chose your own destiny and just followed your interest,

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Speaker 3: you could choose what you wanted to do that day. So,

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Speaker 3: because I was working a lot of evenings and weekends,

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Speaker 3: I used to assign myself on the weekends to things

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Speaker 3: that I thought would be interesting that I didn't have

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Speaker 3: any experience in, and that potentially I could bring my

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Speaker 3: friends and family too, So at least I would see

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Speaker 3: them because I wasn't seeing them. So weekend I assigned

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Speaker 3: myself to a rally. I did not know the difference

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Speaker 3: between a car rally and a political rally. Like I

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Speaker 3: knew that this was car racing, I knew nothing about it,

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Speaker 3: literally nothing. So I went to the stage rally. It

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Speaker 3: was the Canadian Season Ender Championship to be decided. High stakes,

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Speaker 3: everyone going super fast, and that particular race is called

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Speaker 3: the Rally of the Tall Pines. It's one of North

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Speaker 3: America's most notorious I now know notorious difficult, late night

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Speaker 3: grueling races. I know of people who have injured themselves

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Speaker 3: pretty seriously just hitting a jump wrong. And it's known

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Speaker 3: as winter roads with summer ditches, which is to say

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Speaker 3: it's the conditions can be very icy, but there's no

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Speaker 3: snow to catch you if you fall off the road,

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Speaker 3: so it's a pretty gnarly race. I went out. I

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Speaker 3: was standing in the woods and I watched this red

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Speaker 3: Mitsubichi Lance Revolution come careening around a corner flat out sideways,

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Speaker 3: passed inches from me out of forty five degree angle

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Speaker 3: to the road direction, and I was like, wait, that

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Speaker 3: guy's doing that on purpose, Like you can slide a

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Speaker 3: car sideways on purpose and not crash, and I was hooked.

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Speaker 3: I was like, I got to figure out how to

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Speaker 3: do that, Like I wasn't hooked, like I need to

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Speaker 3: watch this more. I was like, I need to know

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Speaker 3: how to do that, like I wouldn't be able to

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Speaker 3: go sideways on purpose.

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Speaker 1: So this is where it gets a little bit ridiculous.

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Speaker 3: We had to go to the banquet afterwards. Sitting at

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Speaker 3: the banquet tit table and there's like twelve people around

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Speaker 3: a table and the table is you know, seven time

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Speaker 3: Canadian rally champion, shop that builds all the best cars,

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Speaker 3: guy that won the race, a couple friends and family,

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Speaker 3: fifty five year old man sitting to my left and

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Speaker 3: his wife. And I did not know there was such

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Speaker 3: a thing as a privateer in racing. I didn't know

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Speaker 3: you could just be in a car race. So I

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Speaker 3: was like, okay, I get all this and looked around

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Speaker 3: the rest of the table. But like, mister mann beside me,

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Speaker 3: whose name was Keith, how did you get here? And

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Speaker 3: he's like, you know, my wife and I would have

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Speaker 3: been racing for the last four or five years. It's

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Speaker 3: been super fun, really enjoyed it. But I think we're

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Speaker 3: going to sell the car and put the money into

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Speaker 3: the boat. And I was like, huh, well, how much

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Speaker 3: is a race car? How much does that cost? He

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Speaker 3: gave me a number. Turns out it wasn't very big,

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Speaker 3: and I said, well, I'll buy it. And that's the

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Speaker 3: day I became a race car driver.

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Speaker 1: Actually, after seeing this car go sideways through the woods,

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Speaker 1: You're like, I love this, I want more. I'm going

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Speaker 1: to buy a car and I'm going to learn how

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Speaker 1: to rally race.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. So I went from you know, pretty fun in

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Speaker 3: amazing career interviewing. You know, I interviewed Bill Clinton, I

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Speaker 3: talked to Nelson, Mandela Garth Brooks one day, crime and

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Speaker 3: politics and all sorts of things amazing, but also felt

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Speaker 3: like I'd kind of done it. And then I had

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Speaker 3: this opportunity to do this wild thing on the weekends.

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Speaker 3: So I bought a race car and I started racing.

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Speaker 3: So I was a race car driver for a little while.

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Speaker 1: You actually a lot of talent, Yeah, I as.

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Speaker 3: You know, I'm terrible. I'm a terrible race car driver.

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Speaker 3: I've also tested to do some stunt driving, and I

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Speaker 3: can kind of do it because I can slid a

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Speaker 3: car sideways like I'm better than a regular sort of

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Speaker 3: civilian driver, but like, no, I'm a terrible car driver.

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Speaker 3: But as it turned out, I also don't have the

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Speaker 3: car sickness gene. So although I was terrible driver, the

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Speaker 3: experience that I got behind the wheel showed me that

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Speaker 3: I actually could probably be a pretty good navigator. So

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Speaker 3: in stage rally there's a driver and a co driver.

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Speaker 3: The co driver is more a navigational role. No, I

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Speaker 3: do not get car sick and I had some opportunities

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Speaker 3: because I was still working as a journalist, I had

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Speaker 3: some opportunities to do some competition and kind of cover

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Speaker 3: it from inside the cars for features for magazines. I

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Speaker 3: pitched some stories that would be fun and learned that

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Speaker 3: I actually was a pretty good navigator. So I competed

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Speaker 3: for fun in regionals in the middle of the back

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Speaker 3: of the pack. I wasn't last, but I certainly wasn't

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Speaker 3: going to win, and became a relatively successful co driver.

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Speaker 3: But also I'm kind of scrappy, So I parlayed my

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Speaker 3: media skill into working with the US Rally series, doing

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Speaker 3: online media coverage and helping them with their pr and

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Speaker 3: helping them with their marketing and that's kind of how

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Speaker 3: I fell into this car world. I did not imagine

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Speaker 3: that I would my life would take that significant and

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Speaker 3: left turn at the banquet of my first race. But

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Speaker 3: that's how I got into cars. And I've been doing

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Speaker 3: car stuff now since the early two thousands and met

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Speaker 3: a lot of fantastic people along the way and heard

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Speaker 3: a lot of great stories along the way, And that's

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Speaker 3: what drew me to it in the first place.

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Speaker 1: Anyway.

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Speaker 3: Sure, forty five degree angle sideways to the road amazing,

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Speaker 3: But like what makes everybody tick was what always fascinated me.

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Speaker 3: And I love that I've had the opportunity to be

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Speaker 3: part of this community for so long.

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Speaker 1: Have you ever been rally racing song? No?

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Speaker 2: I never raced, been on cars.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, do you get carsick in cars? No?

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Speaker 2: It puts me to sleep really.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, would you like to be a co driver

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Speaker 3: because you are biologically equipped to do that?

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Speaker 2: Wow?

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Speaker 3: Are you a nervous passenger?

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Speaker 1: No? If I go to Thank God, I'm all the opposite.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, most race car drivers are terrible passengers.

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Speaker 1: I don't passenger well and I will puke. I'd get

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Speaker 1: so nauseous in a car if I'm not the one

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Speaker 1: in control. If I'm in the back seat, especially, i'm done,

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Speaker 1: it's game over.

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Speaker 3: I always tell people they're like, wow, can you be

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Speaker 3: a co driver? I'm like, okay, Well, when you were

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Speaker 3: a kid, were you the kid lying with your head

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Speaker 3: in the foot well upside down, reading comic books, chewing

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Speaker 3: on really sweet gum, and like smelling all the gas

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Speaker 3: fumes and just kind of feeling fine about all that.

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Speaker 3: If so, then yes you can be a co driver.

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Speaker 3: If you've ever once in your life been carsick, I

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Speaker 3: don't take in airplanes. No, no, you.

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Speaker 2: Sorry? You get sick an airplane?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I have to be in control.

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Speaker 2: The best sleep something there is when the plane's taking off.

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Speaker 2: As soon as it lifts off, ninety nine percent I

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Speaker 2: pass out.

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Speaker 3: I usually sleep on planes too. Maybe it's part of

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Speaker 3: the like anti carsickness gene.

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Speaker 2: Can't do it feels so good. I'm a moment I'm

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Speaker 2: like out, So it's it's I look forward to flying,

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Speaker 2: and I look forward to taking ride alongs with like

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Speaker 2: race car drivers and drifters because it's so relaxing, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's super relaxing.

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Speaker 3: I can think of some people who would like to

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Speaker 3: have you in their right seat.

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Speaker 2: For sure, but I'm horrible with directions. I don't think

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Speaker 2: i'd be a good navigator.

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Speaker 3: It's not really directions, it's a whole language. So yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's really different. I actually can get lost pretty easily

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Speaker 3: if I'm not paying attention. So navigating does not look

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Speaker 3: to the navigator like a race at all. Navigating looks

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Speaker 3: like reading a book. The code driver can't necessarily even

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Speaker 3: see over the dashboard because obviously for weight balance, you

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Speaker 3: guys know cars, the code driver is kind of a

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Speaker 3: piece of equipment, and the co driver should be down

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Speaker 3: as far as they can and back as far as

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Speaker 3: they can, so barely seeing over the dashboard is pretty normal.

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Speaker 3: I'm tall enough that I can usually see, but just barely.

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Speaker 3: And the language of stage rally is the turns are

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Speaker 3: coated in numbers, and so it's like a left one

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Speaker 3: would be a hairpin turn, and a left three would

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Speaker 3: be a ninety degree left turn. And it's depending on

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Speaker 3: what system you use. It's a numeric scale from one

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Speaker 3: to six typically, And unlike in desert racing, where it's

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Speaker 3: kind of they're telling you about gotcha's, in stage rally

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Speaker 3: code driving, they have everything in the book. So it's

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Speaker 3: a constant stream of the co driver just talking, you know,

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Speaker 3: one hundred, which would be like one hundred yards one

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Speaker 3: hundred left four titans and opens right six left six

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Speaker 3: three hundred, Like you're just constantly and so as I'm

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Speaker 3: saying that people who compete in rally, I'm painting a road.

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Speaker 3: The idea is that the driver can drive ahead of

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Speaker 3: their eyes. It can be safer because if I say

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Speaker 3: left three over crest, that's a ninety degree turn over

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Speaker 3: the top of that hill that you can't see over,

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Speaker 3: so you should probably have the wheelcock to the left

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Speaker 3: before you get to the top of that hill. If

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Speaker 3: on the other hand, I say flat overcrest, pin it

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Speaker 3: and go straight, like get as much air as you can.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, but as I say, it's so fun.

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Speaker 3: It is pretty fun. And I got to ride in

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Speaker 3: really fast race cars doing amazing things for a number

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Speaker 3: of years. It was it was really fun. And when

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Speaker 3: it's working and you have a good vibe with the driver,

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Speaker 3: it's you're like.

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Speaker 1: Sharing a brain.

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Speaker 3: So it's very cool. Like you feel like as a

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Speaker 3: co driver, I have a really clear mental image in

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Speaker 3: my head of the road that we're on, and I'm

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Speaker 3: my eyes are flickering up a little bit, and I'm

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Speaker 3: looking at the tree line to see if it's bending

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Speaker 3: the way that I expect it to be bending. Very

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Speaker 3: occasionally and mostly kind of doing the uh girometer that's

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Speaker 3: in in my body and understanding where I am on

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Speaker 3: the on the course. And it is amazing fun and

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Speaker 3: when it clicks it it really is like you're one person.

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Speaker 3: It's very cool and you're one with the car.

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Speaker 2: What characteristics makes a great symbiotic co driving and driving relationship?

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Speaker 3: Well, I heard the act of being a co driver

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Speaker 3: is described once as doing calculus in a hurricane. If

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00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:48,040
Speaker 3: you feel like you can figure that out, that's your

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Speaker 3: You're in a good position. Boats that's another one. Can't

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Speaker 3: do it.

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Speaker 2: Definitely not me. I'm opposite of the stereotype my co driver. No,

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Speaker 2: I cannot do math.

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Speaker 3: We don't actually have to do that focus and.

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Speaker 2: Even that I have like add so and I'll fall

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Speaker 2: asleep on it.

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Speaker 4: We will die, we will die.

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Speaker 1: Were you the first ever female to report on ESPN

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Speaker 1: in in that space?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, In the end, I started out as a researcher. Again,

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Speaker 3: I just follow my heart right, so I would be

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Speaker 3: sitting in the booth. So if you think about how

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Speaker 3: a motorsport show works, usually there's like a play by

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Speaker 3: play person and then there's an analyst person, and the

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Speaker 3: analyst person is typically an ex competitor and the play

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Speaker 3: by play person. That's like a whole skill set of

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Speaker 3: being able to call the action. At X games. Because

378
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Speaker 3: the sport was so new, there wasn't an analyst person.

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Speaker 3: There wasn't an experienced person, so they brought in and

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Speaker 3: a number of people who know a lot about racing,

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Speaker 3: but not a lot about that particular sport because it

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Speaker 3: was kind of a niche sport at the time, And

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Speaker 3: so I was assisting them and I would sort of

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Speaker 3: be handing from like when they weren't on camera, I'd

385
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Speaker 3: be handing them like note cards with like you should

386
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Speaker 3: say this now, this is what's happening with that car.

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00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:20,760
Speaker 3: That cars debeated attire, like whatever. It is. A couple

388
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Speaker 3: years in, I took you oute to compete. We front

389
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Speaker 3: flipped very spectacularly. We were highlight reel footage for a

390
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Speaker 3: really long time. Then I was brought back as an

391
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Speaker 3: in car reporter, so it was head to head racing.

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Speaker 3: They didn't really need co drivers, so they hired two

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Speaker 3: co drivers to effectively co drive the audience, so we

394
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Speaker 3: were miked live to air as reporters in the race

395
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Speaker 3: cars as they raced head to head, and then eventually

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Speaker 3: they asked me to sit in the booth as an analyst,

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Speaker 3: so as an ex competitor most knowledgeable about the sport

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Speaker 3: to provide context. And I believe I was the first

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Speaker 3: female motorsport analyst, so I like predate Danica Patrick by

400
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Speaker 3: a little while the role that she plays on the

401
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:03,879
Speaker 3: Indie Car prodcast. I am much more comfortable behind the

402
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Speaker 3: scenes supporting people than I am being in the spotlight.

403
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Speaker 3: So I challenged myself to do that TV for a

404
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Speaker 3: number of years, but it's not a natural place for me.

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Speaker 1: Have you always been such an unmotivated person?

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Speaker 3: And I say that jokingly, you know, I think if

407
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Speaker 3: you're I think if you're chasing the thing that interests you,

408
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Speaker 3: and I tend to be like singularly passionate about a thing.

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Speaker 3: I think that you're motivated because it sort of becomes

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Speaker 3: your raison d'etre, for better or for worse. What actually

411
00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,080
Speaker 3: inspires me every day is that there are people who

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Speaker 3: are really good at the thing that they do as

413
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Speaker 3: race car drivers, as builders, as you know, key figures

414
00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:41,760
Speaker 3: in the community. They're really good at that. That does

415
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:43,600
Speaker 3: not mean they're good at marketing. That doesn't mean they're

416
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Speaker 3: good at communications. It doesn't mean that they have the

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Speaker 3: time or the inclination or the interest in doing it.

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Speaker 3: And what I love to see is those people who

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Speaker 3: are incredibly good at a thing have the chance to

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Speaker 3: do it. So what inspires me is giving those people

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Speaker 3: the funding, the time, the space to really shine and

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Speaker 3: show what they're capable of. And so that's what motivates me, Like,

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Speaker 3: and how do you How are you not an ambitious,

424
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Speaker 3: motivated person when you get an opportunity to support amazing

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Speaker 3: things happening in the world.

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Speaker 2: That's beautiful. That's beautiful that it's so selfless, you know.

427
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Speaker 2: And then it's amazing that you know, most of the

428
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Speaker 2: time we see the people in front of the camera,

429
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Speaker 2: but it takes people like you to fan the flames

430
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Speaker 2: as well.

431
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Speaker 3: You know, even with all the skill sets in the world,

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Speaker 3: if you have a thing that you're really passionate about,

433
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Speaker 3: like why waste your time on other stuff?

434
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Speaker 2: Right?

435
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:38,840
Speaker 3: Like stuff is great at marketing, he can do all

436
00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:41,119
Speaker 3: kinds of things, but wouldn't be great if you just

437
00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:42,800
Speaker 3: had hours in the day to work in the shop,

438
00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:46,440
Speaker 3: Like how amazing is that? How much better is that output?

439
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:48,680
Speaker 3: How much more satisfying is that for him? How much

440
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:49,840
Speaker 3: better are all our days?

441
00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:50,119
Speaker 1: You know?

442
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:53,520
Speaker 3: And so yeah, exactly being part of it and supporting

443
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:57,280
Speaker 3: it and watching sort of genius come to fruition, that's

444
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,840
Speaker 3: really satisfying.

445
00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,560
Speaker 2: You know. And Also I was listening to a conversation

446
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,399
Speaker 2: you had. I think it was an antidote about you

447
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:10,040
Speaker 2: teaching somebody how to drive manual, and the first thing

448
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:12,679
Speaker 2: you teach them is how to fail, like how to

449
00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:16,359
Speaker 2: stall right, and when you start from there, then you

450
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,600
Speaker 2: can build on that. And to me, I was like, wow,

451
00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:24,080
Speaker 2: that is amazing insight that's just so smart, and it's

452
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,920
Speaker 2: like so insightful, and it's something that I would have

453
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 2: never came up with. And it's this like natural ability

454
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,600
Speaker 2: to teach, you know. And I wonder, like, where do

455
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:34,560
Speaker 2: you get that from?

456
00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,280
Speaker 3: That is a question I don't know the answer to.

457
00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:39,600
Speaker 3: I mean, I've always been an observer, right, I wanted

458
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:43,160
Speaker 3: to be a journalist. I wanted to observe and see

459
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:48,160
Speaker 3: things and translate them into I think capture the moment,

460
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:50,920
Speaker 3: capture the essence of the thing, communicate those things out.

461
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,439
Speaker 3: So am I a teacher or my communicator? Maybe I'm

462
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:58,960
Speaker 3: a communicator. It may be about storytelling around around the thing,

463
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,720
Speaker 3: and certainly with teaching somebody to drive stick. Yeah, absolutely,

464
00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 3: you should stall a car, like, don't be afraid of that,

465
00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:08,000
Speaker 3: or you're never going to learn. So you do. You

466
00:22:08,040 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 3: do have to learn how to overcome failure, and it's

467
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:13,000
Speaker 3: a pretty small failure, I think, especially, and this is

468
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,680
Speaker 3: maybe a little bit about having been an outsider to

469
00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:18,040
Speaker 3: the automotive world when I joined it. I learned to

470
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,440
Speaker 3: drive stick in my twenties. I didn't Again, I didn't

471
00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,920
Speaker 3: grow up in car culture, so as a young woman

472
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:24,760
Speaker 3: at the time.

473
00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:26,960
Speaker 1: I was afraid of a lot of stuff of cars.

474
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:29,320
Speaker 3: And the first time I was sitting with a race

475
00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:31,240
Speaker 3: car driver in the right seat showing me how to drive,

476
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,560
Speaker 3: He's like, so you've seen in the movies every time

477
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,600
Speaker 3: you hit a curb the car flips over six times

478
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,000
Speaker 3: and burst into flame. You know that's not actually what happens.

479
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:39,679
Speaker 3: We're going to crash today and it's going to be okay.

480
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,399
Speaker 3: It's like, okay, that's cool. And I think, especially with

481
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,359
Speaker 3: young women, especially the way young women are conditioned to

482
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 3: really succeed. I think there are some differences in the

483
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,040
Speaker 3: socialization with young boys and young women. I think girls

484
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:57,240
Speaker 3: the way that we play as children and we collaborate together,

485
00:22:57,640 --> 00:22:59,440
Speaker 3: and also the way that we perform in school. I

486
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,600
Speaker 3: think Mormans were really expected to be perfect. I think

487
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:07,199
Speaker 3: there's a perfectionist tendency that girls are socialized around that

488
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,240
Speaker 3: is less prevalent among boys. I think boys the definition

489
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 3: of success for young boys can be different than academic

490
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:18,040
Speaker 3: success or perfection or you know, you're so pretty, you're

491
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 3: so smart for girls, right like, I think there's a

492
00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:23,520
Speaker 3: there's a judgment thing where the boys have a little

493
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 3: more flexibility, and so I think that teaches young women,

494
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,679
Speaker 3: young girls as they become young women, to fear failure

495
00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:34,159
Speaker 3: a little bit. And with cars especially, it's you're going

496
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:35,920
Speaker 3: to fail. You're not going to learn unless you fail.

497
00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:38,880
Speaker 3: So when you're at the racetrack, all the guys are

498
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 3: like lined up on the fence watching the guys on

499
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,200
Speaker 3: the track, like fling their cars around before they go

500
00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,800
Speaker 3: out for their session. And for me, it was really

501
00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:50,720
Speaker 3: interesting to learn how collaborative it was and that there

502
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 3: wasn't really a lot of judgment, like they were just watching,

503
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 3: they were just participating. And I think as girls, you

504
00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 3: feel a little bit more pressure to succeed and a

505
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,440
Speaker 3: little bit more pressure to be perfect. I don't think

506
00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:07,840
Speaker 3: there's as much experimentation, and I think you feel like

507
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 3: it's judgment even when it isn't.

508
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, I've really like this is like hitting me deep,

509
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 1: Like I resonate so much of this, and honestly, I

510
00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:17,120
Speaker 1: don't feel like I'm so happy that there's so many

511
00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:18,960
Speaker 1: women that there are today compared to what there were

512
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 1: ten years ago. I still don't feel like there's enough.

513
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: And these are conversations that being a female in the

514
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 1: space you don't get to openly have a lot of

515
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: And just hearing you say like the fear of failure

516
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 1: and how that is kind of a very prevalent thing

517
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,400
Speaker 1: and it's not really talked about as much, Like really

518
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: hits home for me to just hearing this. And you're

519
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 1: a lot better at putting feelings and thoughts and towards

520
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 1: them than what I am at doing. Just to explain

521
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,720
Speaker 1: what this is, what it's like, I mean, it's definitely

522
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 1: it's a different experience that women have right, I was

523
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 1: one of the reasons I was uncomfortable in the public eye.

524
00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 1: It was a little uncomfortable on television. I didn't I

525
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:02,840
Speaker 1: came up sort of at the dawn of social media too,

526
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 1: and I started building a social media following, and then

527
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 1: I backed off because it's a different experience online. Well,

528
00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:11,919
Speaker 1: you're more scrutinized to and you're expected to know more.

529
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: And if a guy doesn't know, it's okay, whatever, who cares.

530
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 1: But if a girl doesn't know, it's like, wait, she

531
00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: doesn't know that. You don't know that?

532
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, I think there's kind of an assumption that

533
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 3: you're not meant to be there as a woman, so

534
00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:27,160
Speaker 3: you kind of have to like almost overcompensate to a degree.

535
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,119
Speaker 3: That's just society, right, Like these people there aren't people.

536
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:32,320
Speaker 3: There's a lot of hate on social media, and I

537
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,640
Speaker 3: think a woman's experience on social media and a woman's

538
00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 3: experience in the public eye is a really different experience

539
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,840
Speaker 3: than a guy's experience. Yes, everyone is scrutinized. I think

540
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 3: women get a lot more hate and various other inappropriate interactions, right,

541
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 3: And I just didn't want to do that, Like I

542
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,159
Speaker 3: don't have the time or space and my brain to

543
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:53,200
Speaker 3: be dealing with that every day. And I have every

544
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 3: respect for those of you who are succeeding in that

545
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:59,280
Speaker 3: space and able to turn that off because it's a lot.

546
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,480
Speaker 3: And I heard you say on the podcast before, you

547
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,400
Speaker 3: know you have to work twice as hard for half

548
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 3: the respect, and I think that's really true. I think

549
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,720
Speaker 3: it is changing. And again it's kind of just society.

550
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:12,600
Speaker 3: And the example I have is, so I was the

551
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:17,159
Speaker 3: first female analyst in motorsport, right like, not on ESPN,

552
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 3: but in motorsport at all in the US certainly, who

553
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,479
Speaker 3: knows about the rest of the world. And so we

554
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,720
Speaker 3: were at a race and I went to go check

555
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 3: out my position. There's two seats, they got microphones in

556
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 3: front of them on a bored and whatever. So I

557
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 3: need to go check out my position and get a

558
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 3: feel for how I was going to see and interpret

559
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 3: the track for the audience. During a practice session, very normal,

560
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:39,400
Speaker 3: and there's a sound guy and he's thinking around trying

561
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 3: to get stuff working, and I sit down on my

562
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,119
Speaker 3: seat and he's like, well, you can't sit there, and

563
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 3: I was like why not. I said, well, that's for

564
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:50,119
Speaker 3: the analyst, and my co host was there and he

565
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 3: was like, that is the analyst and he was like,

566
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 3: oh my god, I'm sorry. Right, but the base assumption

567
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 3: is that I don't belong there and that a woman

568
00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,800
Speaker 3: couldn't possibly, but also, yeah, of course not I was

569
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,000
Speaker 3: the only one. Yeah, very fair assumption on his part.

570
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 3: So yes, I think there is a different experience that

571
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 3: men and women have. I don't think a lot of

572
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 3: it is like a deliberate sexist, I don't think so.

573
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 1: I think there just has been a figure in that

574
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 1: space for people to know that it's possible, absolutely, and

575
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 1: I do see that shifting absolutely the.

576
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:23,119
Speaker 3: More and more women that there are. I've started working

577
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,720
Speaker 3: with Amanda Sorensen, who is she has a pretty robust

578
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:29,720
Speaker 3: social following and she plays in a lot of different

579
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:34,440
Speaker 3: motorsport realms and it's actually really great working with her

580
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:39,159
Speaker 3: because she doesn't anticipate some of the backlash that I

581
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,439
Speaker 3: just I do. But I'm my mindset's a little older, right, like,

582
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 3: so I'm expecting more resistance and she just doesn't expect

583
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:48,879
Speaker 3: it to be there, and it's which is great, Like

584
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 3: how much have things changed in twenty years.

585
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,479
Speaker 1: Because I think I still have a little bit of

586
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 1: that expecting backlash.

587
00:27:56,280 --> 00:27:58,639
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think you're kind of like you're between

588
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:03,159
Speaker 3: our ages, right, and your experience is a little different

589
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 3: time as well, And so I think it is changing.

590
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 3: I think it's changing really fast. And there are now

591
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,840
Speaker 3: a ton of women in motorsport paddocts, maybe not all driving,

592
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 3: and it would be great to see more women driving,

593
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 3: but again in due time, that's changing too, right, Like

594
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,160
Speaker 3: it used to be a kid, even with parents who

595
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 3: are race car drivers, the boy in the family would

596
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 3: be like, yeah, you can be a race car driver,

597
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:26,200
Speaker 3: and the girl in the family would be like.

598
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,719
Speaker 1: You should be a doctor, you know, or whatever it is.

599
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 3: And I think now it's like, well, if you, I

600
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 3: mean you guys should both race, and if you're both

601
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,120
Speaker 3: good at karting, like sure, let's put you in race cars.

602
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 3: And that just wouldn't have a generation ago, that wouldn't

603
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 3: have been the assumption, right.

604
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 2: You know, I'm staying really quiet on this, and I'm

605
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 2: so happy you guys are having this conversation. I'm so

606
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 2: happy you're here, Amelia to be able to talk to

607
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 2: Jen to share this to all the female listeners out there.

608
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 2: Prior to this conversation, if I'd have this conversation, I

609
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 2: would go, no, no, no. I think you guys could

610
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 2: do this, and you can do this, but the female

611
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 2: experience is something that I will never understand. And when

612
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 2: you articulate it that way, is that there's a whole

613
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 2: set of problems and you know, societal boundaries or expectations

614
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: that women have that men will never understand. It's like,

615
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 2: it actually is very clear to me now, and it's

616
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,960
Speaker 2: just beautiful that you guys are able to share. And

617
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 2: also like it does sound positive that it's changing and

618
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 2: getting better.

619
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it is. I think it's just sometimes

620
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:30,720
Speaker 1: you don't know something is possible or even able to

621
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 1: do it until you see someone else do it. And

622
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 1: that's the cool thing that I really feel like social

623
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 1: media and the internet helped expedite that process because seeing

624
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,200
Speaker 1: other people do things was a lot more tangible.

625
00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 3: I mean, I would not be here without Michelle Mouton.

626
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,280
Speaker 3: I met her once. I was just like, I.

627
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 2: Can you share who this person is? Michelle?

628
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 3: So, Michelle Mouton was a World Rally Championship driver. She

629
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 3: must have been the first or certainly the most. She

630
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 3: has a few first victory, a few first things. I

631
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 3: don't want to miss speak on exactly.

632
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, in the eighties.

633
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, and she was it was the Audi Quattro, Yeah, squattro.

634
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:11,920
Speaker 3: She did Pike's Peace.

635
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: She was fast.

636
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:15,440
Speaker 3: I remember meeting her. She was staying beside a friend's

637
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 3: brother and I kind of knew my friend's brother and

638
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 3: they were talking and I was just like.

639
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:23,840
Speaker 1: I don't care about celebrity normally, right.

640
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:25,960
Speaker 3: Like people are people, and people are awesome, and I

641
00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 3: want to share their experiences and hear their experiences. And

642
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,520
Speaker 3: part of this maybe just having been a journalist. Nobody's

643
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 3: ever been behind a barrier for me. But there's this

644
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 3: woman and I'm like, oh my god, that's Michelle.

645
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 1: I would have found out.

646
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 3: I found out.

647
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever found out before.

648
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:38,320
Speaker 2: No.

649
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 3: I found out hard. I couldn't talk. I tried to

650
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 3: approach her several times, like literally, she's standing at the

651
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 3: side of a racetrack, like any other person that's standing

652
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 3: at the side of a racetrack watching stuff happen. And

653
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 3: finally I went I was like, oh my god, you're

654
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 3: such an inspiration. You know, the dumbest, like how many

655
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:55,760
Speaker 3: like what what do you say?

656
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 1: You know?

657
00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 3: Finally, what what I do say is meet your idols

658
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 3: for sure, because we talked for a little while and

659
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:03,000
Speaker 3: I was like, you know, you are really an inspiration.

660
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:05,160
Speaker 3: It sounds cheesy, but it's amazing as you cool.

661
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,560
Speaker 1: Didn't mean because I say, don't meet your hero No, No,

662
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: definitely do. I definitely do.

663
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 3: And we talked about it, and I, you know, talking

664
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 3: about being a role model, and I think she's very

665
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:18,840
Speaker 3: aware that she is a role model. But I was like,

666
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 3: you know, it was just so great because you're like

667
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 3: super competitive, and she's like, yeah, you know, because I

668
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,240
Speaker 3: never wanted to be fast for a girl.

669
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:26,560
Speaker 2: I was just fast.

670
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:30,320
Speaker 1: Oh, I say the same thing, right, like when I've

671
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: never played the female card for being the fastest female

672
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 1: C eight Corvette. I just wanted to be the fastest period.

673
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 3: The car doesn't know.

674
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, the car doesn't know what gender you are. The

675
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 1: car really doesn't give a fuck. Sorry, but like, yeah, yeah,

676
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 1: she was amazing to me.

677
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,040
Speaker 3: Still inspired by her, and yeah, so it's super important

678
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,120
Speaker 3: to have role models. And it's weird at this stage

679
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 3: of my career where I kind of realized, I guess

680
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 3: I am a role model.

681
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 1: To some weird thing, isn't it.

682
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 2: Yeah.

683
00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 1: I get told that for myself, and I'm like, I

684
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: don't understand how because I don't think I had so

685
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,000
Speaker 1: much of that when I was younger in this space,

686
00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: and then I found it as I grew older. But

687
00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: it's like a weird thing to think that you are

688
00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:10,040
Speaker 1: a roll bottle.

689
00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 3: I think just being present and being and doing and

690
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 3: following your heart and being open and you pass it forward.

691
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:19,840
Speaker 3: Right again, It's a small industry. Sometimes you talk to

692
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,080
Speaker 3: people and they think the world is a zero sum game.

693
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 3: There's like five resources and everybody's fighting over those same

694
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,840
Speaker 3: five resources, and if somebody gets one of the resources,

695
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 3: then there's only four left.

696
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:32,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's not how I see the world. I

697
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 1: thin totally agree that there.

698
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,480
Speaker 3: Is enough for everybody, and if there's a really great opportunity,

699
00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 3: new resources will be made to service that opportunity. Or

700
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:43,280
Speaker 3: you know, if there is new genius in the world,

701
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 3: there will be a space for it. Right, So support everybody,

702
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 3: Support everybody's work, everybody's projects.

703
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,719
Speaker 1: Life is not a zero sum game. There may be

704
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,520
Speaker 1: competitions in racing, but life is in a competition. Everyone's

705
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:56,840
Speaker 1: on their own path and that's okay, and some people's

706
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 1: happen quicker than yours, but you're on a path for

707
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 1: in and it really is no competition. I sincerely believe that,

708
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 1: And I like, I love cheering other people on because

709
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 1: if someone else is doing great, you're going to do

710
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,160
Speaker 1: great too. It's just how it works.

711
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 2: I'm just like so impressed with both of you today.

712
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 2: I'm like extra proud that we get to do this

713
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 2: podcast because, honestly, same, I've always yearned for mentors in

714
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:28,920
Speaker 2: my life, both of you. For whoever is listening, it's like,

715
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:31,719
Speaker 2: you know, you guys are just wonderful, like you know,

716
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 2: teachers to be able to listen to Hu Hien right

717
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:39,240
Speaker 2: and talking about stuff within the like the automobile industry

718
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 2: or the racing industry. And because I have a habit

719
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 2: I think many of us do, but I'm trying to

720
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 2: work on it is not to compare myself to other people.

721
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think everyone struggles with that. Yeah, it's hard not.

722
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 2: To, of course, and especially in this town. Right, Like

723
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,920
Speaker 2: you're driving down the street and you see billboards and

724
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 2: you're not on.

725
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 3: Them, right, I don't.

726
00:33:58,880 --> 00:33:59,200
Speaker 2: I don't.

727
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 3: I don't know how you guys do it. I don't

728
00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 3: like the whole Hollywood thing, Like I don't know how

729
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,800
Speaker 3: you audition and get that many no's, like I just

730
00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 3: I can't. I mean, it's good. And one of the

731
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,480
Speaker 3: jobs I had when I was in college was telemarketing,

732
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:13,279
Speaker 3: which was amazing because you.

733
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 1: Get a lot of nos for telemarketing. It taught me

734
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 1: a lot about set a few more choice awards than

735
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: just no even oh.

736
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I interrupted a lot of stuff. I don't know

737
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:24,680
Speaker 3: why people answer the phone when they're having sex, but

738
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:25,480
Speaker 3: sometimes they do.

739
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 1: So you glossed over this, but I feel like it's

740
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:47,360
Speaker 1: so important to just pause and talk about the fact

741
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 1: that you brought rally cross to the US.

742
00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 2: What is that?

743
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: So?

744
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:57,360
Speaker 3: Rally cross is a it's a motorsport. Currently it's nitro cross.

745
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,799
Speaker 3: Travis Pastrona is the face of the new imagining of

746
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:06,600
Speaker 3: American rally cross. It's rally style cars. They've diverged quite

747
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 3: a lot now, but originally it was rally style cars

748
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 3: racing door to door on a closed course. So the

749
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 3: thing about stage rally, if you're not familiar with stage rally,

750
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 3: if you want to go watch a stage rally, you

751
00:35:18,080 --> 00:35:20,080
Speaker 3: have to figure out where it is. Then you have

752
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 3: to get a map of the stage rally, and then

753
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 3: you have to find a place to intersect the road

754
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:26,319
Speaker 3: where the cars are going to be racing, and then

755
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:27,919
Speaker 3: you have to stand on the side of the road

756
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 3: in whatever inclement weather nature is throwing at you that

757
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:34,879
Speaker 3: day with your thermos of coffee and watch cars come

758
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 3: by in one minute intervals. It's amazing on television. It's

759
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:41,280
Speaker 3: an adventure in person, not everybody's cup of tea in person.

760
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,879
Speaker 3: Rally cross is kind of the answer to that. So

761
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 3: it is these rally style cars which are capable of

762
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 3: going very fast in a straight line and also amazing

763
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 3: hairy sideways, angled slides, racing door to door. So you

764
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 3: also don't have to do the math to figure out

765
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:57,880
Speaker 3: who's going faster than who because they're racing. They all

766
00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:00,840
Speaker 3: start at the same time, but it all happens five laps,

767
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:07,120
Speaker 3: super fast, short heats, really exciting indoors out on a track.

768
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 2: I had the.

769
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 1: Pleasure of going to one of the recent races and

770
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:12,440
Speaker 1: it was such a It was windy and no one

771
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:20,000
Speaker 1: cared which period. It was a great time. If people

772
00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: wanted to go watch rally cross, if they wanted to

773
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:24,600
Speaker 1: see what the schedule was, they wanted to go to

774
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 1: a race, how would they go find that.

775
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:29,880
Speaker 3: So it's called nitro cross now and it's nitrocross Racing

776
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:30,480
Speaker 3: dot com.

777
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 2: Okay, for people who don't know Trevis Pastrano, it's.

778
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 3: Astra if you have if you have autocorrect, then definitely

779
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:41,560
Speaker 3: it's Pastrami.

780
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,239
Speaker 2: I remember his name.

781
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 3: Definitely, word Microsoft Word thinks it's Pastrami. I have had

782
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 3: to correct that out of press releases.

783
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 2: But if you YouTube him, he's basically he's doing what

784
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:54,879
Speaker 2: Ken Block is doing for.

785
00:36:56,200 --> 00:37:01,560
Speaker 3: Crazy amazing innovator. He started racing motocross, he started racing

786
00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:03,719
Speaker 3: on two wheels. He was the first guy ever to

787
00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 3: do a double backflip on a motorcycle. I think that

788
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:09,200
Speaker 3: was like six or seven. He's just like a while.

789
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 3: He jumped out of an airplane without a parachute.

790
00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,239
Speaker 1: So it's all, oh, yeah, he's been around a long time.

791
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, what's next for you? Then? What's you know?

792
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 1: You're kind of in that boat open, figure it out,

793
00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:23,480
Speaker 1: make the time for new things to come in type thing.

794
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:23,839
Speaker 2: Yeah.

795
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 3: I mean I I've worked with Papadoccus Racing since twenty ten.

796
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,319
Speaker 3: I continued to do that. I work with Ryan Tirk,

797
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 3: I work with Frederick Osbo. I'm working with Amanda Sorenson

798
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 3: not with Papadoccus Racing. I need to correct that because

799
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:37,600
Speaker 3: she's also in the Formula Drift paddock, but I don't

800
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:39,719
Speaker 3: have anything to do with her FD team. That's more

801
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 3: of an influencer. What is she doing with the other

802
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,000
Speaker 3: parts of her career. So I've sort of taken a

803
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:48,399
Speaker 3: step back to refocusing on the drivers, and they're also

804
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:50,799
Speaker 3: their social properties and so there's a lot of opportunity

805
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 3: for me to flex my creative jobs as well as

806
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:56,319
Speaker 3: marketing and sponsorship sales. So those are the things I'm

807
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 3: focusing on right now, doing a little bit of stuff

808
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:00,800
Speaker 3: with grid Life as well, which is another super fun property.

809
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:01,840
Speaker 3: I loved life.

810
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:02,480
Speaker 2: What is that.

811
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,280
Speaker 3: It's a music and motorsport festival, So they have drifting,

812
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 3: They have a grid Life Touring Cup which is short

813
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 3: like fifteen minutes, touring, car racing.

814
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 1: And everything from drifting. Those of these three main the

815
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:15,560
Speaker 1: three main disciplines.

816
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,479
Speaker 2: Where have I been for me under a rock?

817
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:24,879
Speaker 3: Literally, it's it's very passion oriented. As I say, Music

818
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:27,840
Speaker 3: and Motorsport festival. There are five stops this year. The

819
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,880
Speaker 3: closest one to us is Laguna and it'll be at

820
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 3: Laguna in the fall. The big one is Midwest at

821
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:36,319
Speaker 3: Gingerman but it's largely amateur racing. So I mean, you

822
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 3: say you've never been a race car driver, Here is

823
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:40,759
Speaker 3: your chance. You get a car from Amelia.

824
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 1: You guys get the car driver. There you go, and

825
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:46,240
Speaker 1: it's time attack, so you can't race.

826
00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 2: I can't do it.

827
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:48,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, but time attack is different.

828
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,480
Speaker 2: Not that it's because I'll quit everything and go want

829
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:54,799
Speaker 2: to be a race car driver.

830
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:57,360
Speaker 3: Welcome to being a race I don't mean.

831
00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 2: Well, that's why I can't. Bees don't work for me.

832
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 2: Like golf, I can get too competitive, Yeah, because I'm

833
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 2: so competitive.

834
00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:08,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm the same. I literally at my first race,

835
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 3: I bought a race car. You know, you know it's

836
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:12,400
Speaker 3: a path.

837
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:16,040
Speaker 2: It's a path that I shouldn't go on because it's

838
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 2: going to go nowhere to just make me broke right

839
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:23,799
Speaker 2: and homeless. Eventually, I need to feed this dog. Well

840
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 2: for the young folks, I'm sure there's questions out there,

841
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,319
Speaker 2: and I actually was, like you mentioned that you came

842
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:35,360
Speaker 2: from traditional like print journalism, and now there's this influencer

843
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:41,239
Speaker 2: like person. What sets certain influencers apart as a race

844
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 2: car driver, As an influencer, what does one need to

845
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 2: be aware of and what can one like work on

846
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:49,400
Speaker 2: to become successful?

847
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:51,839
Speaker 3: Jeezu, Melia, it feels like you're the person answer that.

848
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:55,799
Speaker 2: Objectively. You know objectively.

849
00:39:55,880 --> 00:39:57,239
Speaker 1: I think you have an eye for talent, so you're

850
00:39:57,239 --> 00:39:58,760
Speaker 1: the right person answer this question.

851
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:03,080
Speaker 3: Oh dear, well, that's very kind. I think a willingness

852
00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:05,920
Speaker 3: to learn and a willingness to grow. So I'm going

853
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,560
Speaker 3: to give away a secret here. With race car drivers

854
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:10,640
Speaker 3: or with people that I'm interested in kind of working with,

855
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:12,879
Speaker 3: there's a little tests they sometimes do and I will

856
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:16,440
Speaker 3: bring out three juggling bean bags. I'm not a very

857
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 3: good juggler, but I can juggle, and I'll hand them

858
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:20,839
Speaker 3: the bean bags and see what they do and if

859
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 3: they really try and they fail, because it's a lot

860
00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 3: harder than it looks when you're first learning. It's not

861
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:27,840
Speaker 3: actually that hard, but it is when you don't know

862
00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 3: what to do, it's hard. It's like you know, solving

863
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:32,160
Speaker 3: a Rubik's cube or something. It's just the thing you

864
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:35,320
Speaker 3: know how to do or not. If that person tries

865
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 3: and drops the bean bags and then says no weight,

866
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 3: to show me again, and then drops the bean bags

867
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:43,360
Speaker 3: again and then continues to try that's a person I

868
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:45,359
Speaker 3: want to work with. They're willing to grow, they're willing

869
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,279
Speaker 3: to learn, they're willing to fail if they try once

870
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 3: fail and then smash them down in frustration. That's not

871
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 3: a person I will work with.

872
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: People have done that.

873
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 3: Oh yes, yeah, yeah really yeah, And it's just you know,

874
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 3: it just shows something kind of fundamental about their character.

875
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:02,040
Speaker 1: Do they want to grow?

876
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 3: Like they may want to on paper, grow, but they

877
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 3: aren't willing to go through the unable moment of not

878
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 3: being good at something. And I'm actually more do what

879
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:13,800
Speaker 3: I say, not what I do. Like I'm more inclined

880
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:15,279
Speaker 3: to like smash the thing down and be like I

881
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:17,000
Speaker 3: suck at those I don't want to do it anymore,

882
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 3: and I don't want to work with those people. That's

883
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 3: something I actively work on with myself, is like being

884
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:26,239
Speaker 3: open to not being perfect at things. So I think

885
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 3: it's about again, it's just like a willingness to learn

886
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:32,120
Speaker 3: and being open to growing.

887
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 2: That's a characteristic that she has that she does. Yeah,

888
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:40,080
Speaker 2: like it really is. It's like there was this moment

889
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,360
Speaker 2: where I was like I caught that, and I was like,

890
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 2: she's always willing to challenge yourself, even within criticism and

891
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 2: learn from it and become better and walking away from that,

892
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:58,320
Speaker 2: you're like, wow, that's those are characteristics of a winner.

893
00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 2: And it's okay to fall, it's okay to you know,

894
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:04,919
Speaker 2: fail to drop the bean bag, right, and but it's

895
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:08,400
Speaker 2: your willingness to like, you know, put the embarrassment in

896
00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:10,680
Speaker 2: the ego to the side and go, let me try

897
00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 2: to figure this out. And sometimes you don't. Maybe you

898
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 2: never figure it out, but you're just you're still grinding.

899
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 2: It's one step forward and it's like it's almost so simple.

900
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 2: But that's something that I can take, you know, and

901
00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 2: I still can apply today because it's you know, from

902
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:27,960
Speaker 2: you know, what we do in Hollywood. It's like every

903
00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 2: day you're, like you were saying, it's like it's a

904
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 2: no every day, I'm too handsome for that role, a.

905
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:38,840
Speaker 1: Problem with which we all have.

906
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:45,719
Speaker 4: Every day celebrities are they.

907
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:48,799
Speaker 2: But every day it's a no. You know, there's a

908
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,840
Speaker 2: no from something right, and it's like it's and I

909
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 2: think I'm gonna I'm gonna that's it's I'm gonna borrow that.

910
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:57,520
Speaker 2: It's like there's another beam bag I dropped, Like get

911
00:42:57,600 --> 00:42:59,879
Speaker 2: up and start juggling and maybe I'll never figure it out.

912
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:03,359
Speaker 2: At least I'm able to try to juggle right, and

913
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:09,319
Speaker 2: that's that's something. And also you were talking about gratitude

914
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,520
Speaker 2: to be able to step back and go, dude, I'm

915
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:15,160
Speaker 2: just like grateful to be here. It's like something that

916
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 2: I have to keep reminding myself every day is like

917
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 2: to go, hey, look at my life. You know, look

918
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:23,800
Speaker 2: at my wife, look at my dog. I have health,

919
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:28,080
Speaker 2: you know, having the headlights on bright, you know, and

920
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 2: that's something that you know I relate with, you know,

921
00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 2: and like I was like, God, that's awesome. Then Jen

922
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 2: also believes.

923
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 3: That, Oh I wish I knew it when I was twenty.

924
00:43:37,200 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 3: You know, Comparison is the thief of joy. We talked

925
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 3: about that earlier. When I was younger, it was like

926
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:43,560
Speaker 3: I got to do this. I got to do this thing.

927
00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 3: I'm not where I should be. I'm late, you know,

928
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:47,839
Speaker 3: I didn't take a journalism degree. So now I'm doing

929
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:49,840
Speaker 3: this intern thing and I'm like in my min twenties,

930
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:50,840
Speaker 3: I'm doing an internship.

931
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:51,600
Speaker 1: What am I thinking?

932
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:55,000
Speaker 3: And just to pause and reflect on where I'm at

933
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:59,839
Speaker 3: and realize how awesome things can be. I mean, it's

934
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:02,680
Speaker 3: always perfect and sometimes things are really terrible. Sometimes you

935
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:06,520
Speaker 3: pause and reflect and you're like, yep, today sucks. But

936
00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:08,319
Speaker 3: that's when you drop the bean bag and you're like, Okay,

937
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:09,759
Speaker 3: I got to pick it up and try again, but

938
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:11,520
Speaker 3: maybe not till tomorrow. I'm just gonna take a little

939
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 3: minute for me. But deliberately and consciously practicing gratitude is

940
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,359
Speaker 3: something that I brought into my life in the last

941
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:19,880
Speaker 3: few years, and I think it's you know, there's a

942
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 3: little bit of a cheesy pop psychology moment for that,

943
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:27,000
Speaker 3: but also that is where the joy lives. The joy

944
00:44:27,160 --> 00:44:32,440
Speaker 3: is and realizing and understanding what you have and it

945
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:34,839
Speaker 3: doesn't need to be what somebody else has. We talked

946
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:36,560
Speaker 3: earlier about being on our own paths.

947
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:36,839
Speaker 1: Right.

948
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 3: I wake up in the morning. I'm so lucky. I

949
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 3: love a block away from the beach. I have a

950
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 3: ridiculous giant dog who has all the joy in the world.

951
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 3: Every time he sees the water. I get to go

952
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:49,520
Speaker 3: and watch sunrise with him every morning as he splashes

953
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:53,279
Speaker 3: around in the water. Like what a great situation that is.

954
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 3: I grew up in Toronto. I own palm trees. Now

955
00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:58,719
Speaker 3: my house has palm trees on it. I don't have

956
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:02,080
Speaker 3: to deal with sleet and snow in the morning. So yeah,

957
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:05,200
Speaker 3: gratitude is it's key, I think to happiness.

958
00:45:05,560 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, so simple, so hard at the same time, so hard.

959
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 1: Yeah.

960
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:14,120
Speaker 2: And that's where like social media, it's like I start noticing,

961
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 2: like I get super mentally disturbed.

962
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:19,799
Speaker 3: It's exhausting, right.

963
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,799
Speaker 2: But it's necessary evil to it. It's like you can't

964
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:23,359
Speaker 2: avoid it.

965
00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:25,960
Speaker 3: I think you have to be deliberate about it. Like,

966
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:28,480
Speaker 3: I think the worst thing ever is doom scrolling, Right,

967
00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 3: somebody says scrolling.

968
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 1: Scrolling even heard of that, where you just scroll for

969
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,480
Speaker 1: hours on it. You just let the algorithm feed you

970
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 1: whatever it's feeding you.

971
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, doom scrolling, well.

972
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:43,800
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, if you're really tired and you just only

973
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:47,360
Speaker 1: find energy and being able to it's it's a dark place, yeah, And.

974
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:49,840
Speaker 3: I mean it is. It does insight comparison. So I

975
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,880
Speaker 3: actually have a TikTok account that's for my dog that

976
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 3: basically only has like fuzzy puppies on it, Like basically

977
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 3: the algorithm understands that that account is for fuzzy cute puppy.

978
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 3: And so that's how I deal with doom scrolling. I'm like,

979
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:04,760
Speaker 3: I'm going to go look at my happy outfit.

980
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:07,840
Speaker 1: Wow, I have forced myself this year. I made a

981
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 1: resolution that I was only going to try to go

982
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,360
Speaker 1: on social media if I was looking for inspiration or

983
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 1: was planning to post. I'm trying not to allow myself

984
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 1: to scroll. And if I want to scroll, I go.

985
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:23,759
Speaker 1: This isn't an ad. I go on dueling and I

986
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 1: learn another language. And that's my form of all Right,

987
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:28,879
Speaker 1: I don't feel like reading a book. I don't feel

988
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 1: like doing my emails or turn a rent right now,

989
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:34,480
Speaker 1: I'm just going to play DUELINGO. So then at least

990
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:35,520
Speaker 1: I'm learning something too.

991
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:38,919
Speaker 3: Yeah. I replaced my social media folder on the front

992
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:41,200
Speaker 3: page of my phone with the New York Times. I

993
00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 3: play the games on the New York Times to sort

994
00:46:43,160 --> 00:46:46,479
Speaker 3: of fill the like random scrolling. I play Wordley because again,

995
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:48,600
Speaker 3: like obviously I'm one hundred years old, because I play

996
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 3: Wordle do connections in the morning. And actually, yesterday I

997
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:55,120
Speaker 3: was out lunch with a friend and I can't remember

998
00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,680
Speaker 3: what he called it, but I renamed during lunch, I

999
00:46:57,719 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 3: renamed my social media folder to poison.

1000
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:04,319
Speaker 2: That's a good idea.

1001
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 3: I think his was like toxic sledge or something, and like,

1002
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 3: don't get me wrong. Social has tremendous value, but I

1003
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 3: think you should be deliberate about it. I should choose

1004
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:16,440
Speaker 3: to go watch Amelia's feed, right, I should choose to

1005
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 3: be inspired by you in a day, not let that

1006
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 3: algorithm just like feed me things, right.

1007
00:47:21,560 --> 00:47:21,759
Speaker 1: Right.

1008
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,759
Speaker 2: I run to social media when I start feeling insecure.

1009
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 1: It's the worst thing to do.

1010
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:27,919
Speaker 2: It's up because it isn't that weird.

1011
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:30,200
Speaker 1: If I find my screen time is too high and

1012
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: I'm like, man, I need to get out of this

1013
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:34,680
Speaker 1: headspace of scrolling and do something else. I turn off

1014
00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: the color on my phone.

1015
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 3: It's good.

1016
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:37,360
Speaker 2: It's not the color.

1017
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, So then it's just black and white because you

1018
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:41,520
Speaker 1: find the things that attract you on social media's because

1019
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,319
Speaker 1: it's bright. That's all these colors. It's very like such

1020
00:47:44,360 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 1: a science behind you off the colors on your phone

1021
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:48,439
Speaker 1: and it's black and white, yeling, and this is boring.

1022
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,040
Speaker 3: It's an accessibility setting.

1023
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:50,600
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1024
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 2: One of my pet peeves is you're at lunch with

1025
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:57,280
Speaker 2: somebody and they are on their phone. I can't even

1026
00:47:57,320 --> 00:47:59,759
Speaker 2: be their friends. I put them in a different category.

1027
00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:02,759
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, someone's talking to you and they

1028
00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:04,920
Speaker 2: pick up their phone and they're like this, and then

1029
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,960
Speaker 2: I've seen it where we're having an intimate conversation, like

1030
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 2: the three of us and one fools on Instagram.

1031
00:48:11,239 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 1: Just wait till everyone's are in the goggles.

1032
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 3: You'll never know who's doing a lot.

1033
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:17,840
Speaker 2: That's crazy. That's crazy, And I call them on it,

1034
00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:21,160
Speaker 2: and I'm like, yo, we drove all the way over

1035
00:48:21,239 --> 00:48:24,560
Speaker 2: here to spend time with each other. You're now rare

1036
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 2: this this might be like one of ten meetings left

1037
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:35,000
Speaker 2: as friends and you're on Instagram. Yeah, like scrolling strangers

1038
00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:37,360
Speaker 2: Like I don't understand it, and you realize it's an addiction.

1039
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, it totally is an addiction. I'm I just had

1040
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:44,839
Speaker 3: this conversation with a friend yesterday. I have to do

1041
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:49,480
Speaker 3: more stuff right. The pandemic twenty twenty one. Part of

1042
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:52,879
Speaker 3: twenty two was dire right. I was inside my house.

1043
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:55,000
Speaker 3: I opened a boot like bakery.

1044
00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:59,400
Speaker 1: So bummed that I wasn't able to go get some

1045
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:01,759
Speaker 1: of those chalk cli croissans or the almond croissans, one

1046
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:06,279
Speaker 1: of the croissants. She opened up a bakery at her

1047
00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 1: own house during during COVID time. Was kind of like,

1048
00:49:10,840 --> 00:49:13,719
Speaker 1: I was obsessed with your stories, obsessed. When we were

1049
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 1: talking with ed about the sour dough bread I was

1050
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 1: talking about her. I still need to try these croissans.

1051
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:22,600
Speaker 1: I will make you some crysoons. I will make you

1052
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:24,560
Speaker 1: some croissants. She didn't have to enough to get free

1053
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:27,799
Speaker 1: business during COVID. Well, okay, and it was contact list

1054
00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 1: for listening.

1055
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 3: It was well, I had I had a job, like

1056
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 3: I was working for an energy dr company. I had

1057
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 3: a real job. So I took this job expecting to

1058
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 3: be like going to events and promoting events and working

1059
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 3: with athletes and doing all this exciting stuff. And I

1060
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:46,680
Speaker 3: was stuck at home by myself on zoom calls for

1061
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 3: eight hours a day, just losing my soul, you know,

1062
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:54,560
Speaker 3: because I'm basic. I started making sour dough bread because

1063
00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:57,879
Speaker 3: that's what you do, and because I have nothing else

1064
00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:00,960
Speaker 3: to do, I'm documenting it all on social media. But really,

1065
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 3: what I want more than anything in the world is

1066
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:05,959
Speaker 3: a chocolate croissant. And the pandemic is like two months

1067
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 3: in and I haven't had a chocolate croissant because everything's

1068
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:10,000
Speaker 3: closed and bakeries are closed and you can't go to

1069
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:11,879
Speaker 3: a cafe and get one. And I don't even eat

1070
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 3: chocolate croissants. Set off and it's like a twice yearly thing,

1071
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 3: but I need one because it's my comfort food. So

1072
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:20,799
Speaker 3: I started learning how to make them and documenting it

1073
00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 3: on social media. I was living for these stories like Instagram.

1074
00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:28,320
Speaker 3: That's why I knew about sour dough bread. In the process,

1075
00:50:28,320 --> 00:50:30,800
Speaker 3: and we were talking with d I ended up buying

1076
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,479
Speaker 3: flour in fifty pound bags. Like it became. As I say,

1077
00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:37,239
Speaker 3: I follow my passions and kind of serially, and so

1078
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 3: the baking became a bit of a passion and it

1079
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,799
Speaker 3: broke up my week. But you can't eat I mean,

1080
00:50:42,200 --> 00:50:45,720
Speaker 3: that's a lot of pastry and I'm vaguely gluten intolerance,

1081
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:45,840
Speaker 3: so I.

1082
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:46,839
Speaker 1: Shouldn't eat any of them.

1083
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,200
Speaker 3: So but I just really enjoyed the process, and so

1084
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:53,439
Speaker 3: then I started selling them on Sunday mornings. I lived

1085
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 3: in the Venice Canals in a little tiny apartment that

1086
00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:58,520
Speaker 3: backed out onto the canals, and you know, it was

1087
00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:02,000
Speaker 3: the pandemic. People were walking around outside. So I started

1088
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:06,760
Speaker 3: just like masking up and selling my wares. So on Sundays,

1089
00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 3: I basically had this bootleg bakery where I would get

1090
00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:10,799
Speaker 3: up at five o'clock in the morning prepare pastries. People

1091
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:13,280
Speaker 3: would be lined up by nine thirty. It was so stressful.

1092
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,920
Speaker 3: I'd be like trying in my tiny apartment oven trying

1093
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:20,239
Speaker 3: to get any heat into these pastries, and then I

1094
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:22,080
Speaker 3: would be sold out within an hour. And it was

1095
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:23,880
Speaker 3: very funny because it ended up being this kind of

1096
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 3: weird have you heard.

1097
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:26,960
Speaker 1: About the lady that makes the pastries?

1098
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 3: And people would line up. It became a thing during

1099
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:32,799
Speaker 3: the pandemic. And then I did the other basic thing

1100
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:34,919
Speaker 3: that one does during the pandemic, as it turns out,

1101
00:51:35,120 --> 00:51:36,880
Speaker 3: and I got a dog, and he weighs one hundred

1102
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:39,840
Speaker 3: and fifty pounds and his head is counter height and

1103
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:47,360
Speaker 3: he really likes pastries. So that ended my baking career. Yeah, Steve,

1104
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:51,879
Speaker 3: Steve the dog started enjoying the pastries. It's very hard

1105
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:53,560
Speaker 3: to bake when you have one hundred and fifty pound

1106
00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:56,360
Speaker 3: dog who really wants what you've got working on the counter. However,

1107
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 3: I can occasionally, so come to an FT event and

1108
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 3: I'll get you some past.

1109
00:52:01,239 --> 00:52:04,320
Speaker 2: My mouth is watering, like there's a Gens chocolate croissants.

1110
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:06,399
Speaker 2: It has a great ring to it with Steve as

1111
00:52:06,440 --> 00:52:06,759
Speaker 2: the mess.

1112
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 1: Just look at a photo of these puppies.

1113
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:14,520
Speaker 2: Wow, my constructive way past the pandemic.

1114
00:52:14,560 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 1: We could have talked forever. I've thoroughly enjoyed this and

1115
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:20,719
Speaker 1: I would love for down the line. Maybe season two,

1116
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:24,640
Speaker 1: you come back on and join us. This was amazing.

1117
00:52:24,680 --> 00:52:28,640
Speaker 2: Maybe teach us how to make some chocolate. Yeah, we'll

1118
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 2: bring an ove in. We'll just do that. But thank you.

1119
00:52:32,280 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 2: It was a gift and a true honor to get

1120
00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:35,880
Speaker 2: to know you better.

1121
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:37,439
Speaker 1: You guys, thank you so much.

1122
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 3: I really enjoyed chatting with you today about our crazy

1123
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:43,839
Speaker 3: wide range of topics. And I will bring croissants next

1124
00:52:43,840 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 3: time for sure.

1125
00:52:44,840 --> 00:52:45,560
Speaker 1: Please, thank you,