1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:13,840 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 2: I'm Tracy V. 4 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: Wilson and I'm Holly Frying. Today we're going to talk 5 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:22,640 Speaker 1: about some US Supreme Court cases, although not comical ones 6 00:00:23,400 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 1: like Nicks versus Headen, which we covered recently and was 7 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 1: about tomatoes. We are going to be talking more about 8 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: tariffs though this time. It's a collection of cases that 9 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:39,760 Speaker 1: followed the Spanish American War, and these cases together limited 10 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,280 Speaker 1: the rights of people living in certain US territories. These 11 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: cases still stand today. They still affect the lives and 12 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:50,240 Speaker 1: civil rights of people in places like American Samoa, Guam, 13 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: the Northern Mariana Islands, Puerto Rico, and the US Virgin Islands. 14 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: So people who were born in all of these territories, 15 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: with the exception of Americans, are considered US citizens by birth, 16 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 1: but while living on any of these any of these 17 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: islands territories, they don't have the same constitutional rights or 18 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: representation in Congress as citizens who live in one of 19 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:17,680 Speaker 1: the fifty States. Some of those court cases involved the 20 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: Philippines also, that was a US territory at the time 21 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:24,959 Speaker 1: but has since become independent. So together these cases are 22 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: known as the Insular Cases, with insular meaning related to islands, 23 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 1: and they were in the news last year because the 24 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: US Supreme Court declined to her case that was challenging them. 25 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 1: Before we start with this, I want to note there's 26 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:43,960 Speaker 1: a whole range of opinion in all of these places 27 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 1: about their relationships to the United States, Like, for example, 28 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 1: there are American Samoans who think that they should be 29 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: considered US citizens from birth, but then others who think 30 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: that would erase their existing culture and traditions. Or as 31 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:03,560 Speaker 1: another example, there is a movement for Puerto Rican statehood 32 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 1: that's been going on for decades, but there are also 33 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,680 Speaker 1: people who opposed that movement, with some of the opponents 34 00:02:09,720 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 1: advocating instead for an independent Puerto Rico. So this episode 35 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,720 Speaker 1: is really focused on the court cases and the context 36 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,720 Speaker 1: around them. It is not about the lived experiences and 37 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: opinions of the people living in all of these territories. 38 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 1: I don't think the two of us are the best 39 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 1: people to try to like embody that no, and even 40 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,680 Speaker 1: if we were, I feel like that is a podcast 41 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:36,239 Speaker 1: of its own and not an episode of ARM. 42 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 2: Not an episode of ours for sure. 43 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:40,639 Speaker 1: Before we talk about these cases, we need to set 44 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 1: the stage on how the US had approached its territories 45 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,560 Speaker 1: before the Spanish American War. The original borders of the 46 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,800 Speaker 1: United States were set under the seventeen eighty three Treaty 47 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 1: of Paris, which formally ended the Revolutionary War between Britain 48 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: and its North American colonies. This treaty did not acknowledge 49 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 1: the indigenous names and peoples who had been in North 50 00:03:02,120 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: America for thousands of years prior to europeans arrival, or 51 00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: contain any reference to borders of their own lands and territory. 52 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 1: For a time, the Articles of Confederation formed the basis 53 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 1: for the US government. These were ultimately replaced by the 54 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:22,320 Speaker 1: US Constitution, which went into effect on March fourth, seventeen 55 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:28,359 Speaker 1: eighty nine. The Constitution didn't include anything specifically about adding 56 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: new territory to the United States, but it did include 57 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 1: language about adding states. An Article four, Section three quote, 58 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 1: New states may be admitted by the Congress into this Union. 59 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,080 Speaker 1: But no new state shall be formed or erected within 60 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 1: the jurisdiction of any other state, nor any state be 61 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 1: formed by the junction of two or more states or 62 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 1: parts of states, without the consent of the legislatures of 63 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: the states concerned, as well as of the Congress. Section 64 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: three also incl language about territory that was not considered 65 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 1: part of a state, quote, the Congress shall have power 66 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 1: to dispose of and make all needful rules and regulations 67 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: respecting the territory or other property belonging to the United States. 68 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 1: And nothing in this Constitution shall be so construed as 69 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,600 Speaker 1: to prejudice any claims of the United States or any 70 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: particular state. Soon, new states were being added to the Union. 71 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 1: The first state that wasn't one of the thirteen original 72 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: colonies was Vermont in seventeen ninety one. Kentucky became a 73 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: state in seventeen ninety two from land that had previously 74 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 1: been considered part of Virginia. Tennessee became a state four 75 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:46,159 Speaker 1: years later, formed from the Southwest Territory that was land 76 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 1: that North Carolina had ceded to the federal government. Ohio 77 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:53,360 Speaker 1: joined the Union in eighteen oh three and was formed 78 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 1: from part of the Northwest Territory. With the exception of Vermont, 79 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:02,159 Speaker 1: which had considered itself an independent republic before becoming a state, 80 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:06,080 Speaker 1: these newly added states had all been formed from organized, 81 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:09,839 Speaker 1: incorporated territory that was already considered to be within the 82 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,279 Speaker 1: US borders under the Treaty of Paris. So incorporated in 83 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 1: this case means that the territory is considered to be 84 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,800 Speaker 1: fully part of the US under the Constitution, and the 85 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 1: only parts of the Constitution that don't apply to incorporated 86 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 1: territory are articles that specifically apply to the states. Organized 87 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 1: means that Congress had passed an organic act or a 88 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:36,839 Speaker 1: body of laws establishing a government and usually a bill 89 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,359 Speaker 1: of rights for the territory. So, for example, the Northwest 90 00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:45,480 Speaker 1: Territory was unorganized before Congress passed the Northwest Ordinances. The 91 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 1: Northwest Ordinances of seventeen eighty seven also outlined a process 92 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:52,920 Speaker 1: for the territory to be admitted into the Union as 93 00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 1: no less than three and no more than five states. 94 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:01,440 Speaker 1: When the United States started acquiring new terrance, that new 95 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: territory was also incorporated. The first big addition of land 96 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:09,160 Speaker 1: to the United States was the Louisiana Purchase in eighteen 97 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 1: oh three. The Treaty of Session that was part of 98 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,839 Speaker 1: the Louisiana Purchase agreement said, quote, the inhabitants of the 99 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:19,919 Speaker 1: cated Territory shall be incorporated in the Union of the 100 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 1: United States, and admitted as soon as possible, according to 101 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: the principles of the Federal Constitution, to the enjoyment of 102 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 1: all these rights, advantages, and immunities of citizens of the 103 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:35,159 Speaker 1: United States. Florida was also incorporated when it became part 104 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:38,040 Speaker 1: of the United States under the Adam Zonice Treaty, which 105 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:42,160 Speaker 1: took effect in eighteen twenty one. States formed from these 106 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:45,719 Speaker 1: territories were added to the Union, following the same basic 107 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 1: template that had been outlined in the Northwest Ordinance of 108 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:53,440 Speaker 1: seventeen eighty seven. As the nineteenth century continued, the United 109 00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 1: States approach to expansion was described as manifest destiny. That's 110 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:01,159 Speaker 1: a term first used in Right Blace in eighteen forty 111 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 1: five as part of an argument that the United States 112 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 1: should annex the Republic of Texas. This came to mean 113 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: that the United States was destined to expand across the 114 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: whole of North America, and this idea framed the United 115 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 1: States expansion as necessary and inevitable, and as the nation's duty. 116 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 1: This also was connected to a series of removals, wars, 117 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:28,040 Speaker 1: and genocidal policies against the indigenous nations of North America, 118 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: in which tens of thousands of people were forced to 119 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 1: leave their homelands and move to land known as Indian 120 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:37,880 Speaker 1: Territory west of the Mississippi River, primarily in what is 121 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: now Oklahoma. Support for the philosophy of manifest destiny was 122 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: not as universal as it sometimes described. There were people 123 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 1: within and outside of the US government who argued against 124 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: such aggressive expansion, and there were people of a range 125 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: of backgrounds, races, ethnicities, and religions who didn't want the 126 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: place they were already living to be annexed or purchased 127 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 1: by the United States for all kinds of reasons. Thousands 128 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,000 Speaker 1: of Indigenous people also died as a result of the 129 00:08:10,040 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 1: force removals that were involved in making way for this expansion. 130 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: But the underlying assumption was that any territory the US 131 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 1: was acquiring would become one or more states. Assumption is 132 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 1: not even a strong enough word. It was obvious and 133 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: unquestioned that newly acquired territory would be admitted into the 134 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: Union as states. There were debates about whether slavery would 135 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:37,319 Speaker 1: be allowed in newly organized territory and newly admitted states, 136 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: and a number of compromises and appeasements maintained a balance 137 00:08:41,280 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: between slave states and free States in Congress, but there 138 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,320 Speaker 1: was really no debate about whether this new territory was 139 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 1: on a path to statehood. There was no sense at 140 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:56,200 Speaker 1: all that a territory could be unincorporated. The only real 141 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,840 Speaker 1: exception to this pattern involved the islands that were claimed 142 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: under the Guano Islands Act of eighteen fifty six. This 143 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 1: act allowed US citizens to claim uninhabited islands as sources 144 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:12,319 Speaker 1: of guano or bird poop, so these islands didn't need 145 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 1: to be incorporated they did not have a permanent human population. 146 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:20,640 Speaker 1: Alaska's status was also kind of vague for a while 147 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 1: after the US purchased it from Russia in eighteen sixty seven. 148 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 1: The US made this purchase just two years after the 149 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 1: end of the Civil War, it was still in the 150 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 1: middle of trying to rebuild itself. In Secretary of State 151 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 1: William H. Stewart's decision to buy Alaska was widely criticized 152 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:42,680 Speaker 1: and lampooned. Alaska was organized as the District of Alaska 153 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:46,320 Speaker 1: in eighteen eighty four, but at the very end of 154 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: the nineteenth century, the United States acquired territory that it 155 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 1: didn't necessarily want to incorporate. We're going to get to 156 00:09:54,320 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: that after we have a sponsor break. The United States 157 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:11,480 Speaker 1: approach to its territories really shifted during and after the 158 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:16,880 Speaker 1: Spanish American War. This war evolved from Cuba's struggle for 159 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 1: independence from Spain, and it was also influenced by sensationalized 160 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 1: news reporting in the United States and the explosion of 161 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 1: the USS Maine in Havana Harbor on February fifteenth, eighteen 162 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:33,280 Speaker 1: ninety eight. The Treaty of Paris that formally ended the 163 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 1: Spanish American War was signed on December tenth, eighteen ninety eight. 164 00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 1: It recognized Cuba as an independent nation while giving the 165 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:45,520 Speaker 1: United States control of Puerto Rico and Guam. Under the treaty, 166 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:48,959 Speaker 1: the United States was also allowed to purchase the Philippines 167 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: from Spain, which it did, although the Philippines had declared 168 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:56,479 Speaker 1: its own independence, and the US takeover of the Philippines 169 00:10:56,520 --> 00:11:00,120 Speaker 1: sparked the two year Philippine American War. There are many 170 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: treaties of Paris. This is obviously a different one than 171 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 1: the one that formerly ended the Revolutionary War. Paris is 172 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:09,600 Speaker 1: where all the cool treaties happen, where we always go 173 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:13,600 Speaker 1: to negotiate a peace. I mean, yeah, any excuse to 174 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:16,920 Speaker 1: go to Paris. While the Spanish American War was ongoing, 175 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 1: the United States had also annexed Hawaii. For some very 176 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:24,840 Speaker 1: brief context on that, in eighteen seventy five, the US 177 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 1: and the Kingdom of Hawaii had signed a reciprocity treaty 178 00:11:28,360 --> 00:11:31,959 Speaker 1: that allowed Hawaii to freely export goods like sugar. 179 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 2: To the US. 180 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: In exchange, the US took control of an area known 181 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: as Puuloa, now home to the Pearl Harbor Naval Base. 182 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: This treaty led to a huge explosion in the sugar 183 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 1: industry in Hawaii, driven by US business interests, which made 184 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:52,480 Speaker 1: the Hawaiian economy increasingly dependent on these exports. Then, in 185 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 1: eighteen ninety three, Sandford Dole, a lawyer who was born 186 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: in Hawaii to American parents, led a committee of sugar 187 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 1: planters and other American businessmen to overthrow the Hawaiian monarchy 188 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 1: with the backing of the US military. Dole petitioned the 189 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:11,440 Speaker 1: US to annex Hawaii in eighteen ninety four, and one 190 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: reason the US did so four years later was to 191 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 1: ensure that it did not lose control of Pearl Harbor 192 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 1: while fighting a war with Spain. That is, like the 193 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: most brief abridged synopsis, and we're about to have another 194 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: one because then in eighteen ninety nine, the US took 195 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 1: control of part of the Samoan archipelago again incredibly briefly. 196 00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 1: In the nineteenth century, Germany, Britain, and the US all 197 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: established business interests in Samoa and became heavily involved in 198 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:49,839 Speaker 1: Samoan politics. Each of these nations backed different political factions, 199 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 1: and when a civil war began in eighteen eighty nine, 200 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,199 Speaker 1: one side was backed by the US and the other 201 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: was backed by Germany. The first phase of fighting ended 202 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 1: in eighteen eighty ten, nine, mostly because most of the 203 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: Western powers ships were either damaged or destroyed in a cyclone. 204 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 1: Violence resumed in eighteen ninety three, continuing for about a year, 205 00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:15,320 Speaker 1: again with Germany and the US backing opposing factions. Then, 206 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: when Marito lal Peppe, leader of Samoa, died in eighteen 207 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 1: ninety eight, the Chief Justice who issued the decision on 208 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 1: who his successor would be was an American citizen, so 209 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:33,760 Speaker 1: a lot of Samoans and Germans in Samoa opposed this decision. 210 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 1: This led to renewed hostilities. Ultimately, Britain, the United States, 211 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 1: and Germany negotiated the Tripartite Convention without the involvement of Samoans, 212 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: and this partitioned the archipelago between the United States and Germany. 213 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: Just as a note, German Samoa was placed under control 214 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,319 Speaker 1: of New Zealand after World War One. It became independent 215 00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty two. The US portion still a US territory. 216 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 1: So by eighteen ninety nine, the US had taken control 217 00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:09,599 Speaker 1: of Puerto Rico, Guam, the Philippines, Hawaii, and part of Samoa, 218 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:12,439 Speaker 1: and it had a number of reasons to want access 219 00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: to territory in the Caribbean and the Pacific. Many of 220 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: these islands had strategic military importance and could also serve 221 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 1: as refueling points for trading ships. Investors saw range of 222 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:29,400 Speaker 1: agricultural and commercial opportunities. This was also happening as the 223 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,520 Speaker 1: Panama Canal was being built, a project that the US 224 00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: took over just a few years after taking control of 225 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,400 Speaker 1: these new territories, so people were seeing new potential for 226 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: international shipping. There was also an argument for the US 227 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:46,960 Speaker 1: to take over these islands that was explicitly racist, that 228 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: they were not capable of governing themselves, so the United 229 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:54,440 Speaker 1: States needed to take them over, an argument not to 230 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 1: keep control of all of these islands was also racist. 231 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 1: There were basically people who did it want islands full 232 00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:05,880 Speaker 1: of people who were predominantly indigenous or Hispanic to suddenly 233 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 1: become US citizens. In some cases, religious prejudice was also 234 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 1: a factor, since some of these areas were predominantly Catholic. 235 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: This can seem like an odd argument considering that the 236 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 1: US had already incorporated a lot of territory in North 237 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:25,640 Speaker 1: America that had previously been colonized by Spain and had 238 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 1: some demographic similarities to these islands, like under the Treaty 239 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: of Guadalupe Hidalgo that ended the Mexican American War in 240 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: eighteen forty eight, Mexico ceded more than half its territory 241 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 1: to the US. People living there had been given a 242 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 1: year to decide if they wanted to become US citizens, 243 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: and by the time the Spanish American War ended, multiple 244 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: states had been formed from that territory. But as an example, 245 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 1: when California became a state in eighteen fifty, formed from 246 00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 1: territory that had been part of Mexico, it had a 247 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,480 Speaker 1: population of about ninety two thousand people. Meanwhile, at the 248 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 1: end of the Spanish American War, the population of Puerto 249 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: Rico was more than ten times that, and there were 250 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: roughly seven million people living in the Philippines. The entire 251 00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:17,680 Speaker 1: United States population at this point was about seventy six 252 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,240 Speaker 1: million people, So there were a lot of people who 253 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 1: just completely freaked out about the idea that if the 254 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: Philippines became a state, Filipinos would make up almost ten 255 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 1: percent of the population of the United States. Also, with 256 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:34,320 Speaker 1: the exception of Puerto Rico, these newly acquired islands were 257 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: geographically very far from continental North America, and that added 258 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: to the perception that they were more foreign than something 259 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: like the southwestern part of the continent was Also, to 260 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 1: be clear, we're not suggesting that racism and prejudice were 261 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:53,680 Speaker 1: directed only at the people in these newly acquired island territories, 262 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:56,680 Speaker 1: or that everyone living in the continental US had the 263 00:16:56,720 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 1: same constitutional rights at this point as exact samples. After 264 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:04,320 Speaker 1: the US Civil War, the Fourteenth Amendment had granted citizenship 265 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:08,159 Speaker 1: to anyone born or naturalized in the United States and 266 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:12,160 Speaker 1: subject to US jurisdiction, and the fifteenth Amendment had given 267 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: black men the right to vote, but in practice, many 268 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 1: black men could not freely exercise their right to vote, 269 00:17:18,840 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: and women did not have a constitutional right to vote 270 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:25,919 Speaker 1: at all. Native Americans were not considered US citizens, and 271 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 1: immigrants from many Asian countries were banned from becoming citizens. 272 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 1: So the idea that the US might apply constitutional rights 273 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: and protections only to some people also was not. 274 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 2: At all new. 275 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 1: What was new was the idea that the US could 276 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:47,159 Speaker 1: acquire territory without that territory ultimately becoming a state. That 277 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:49,959 Speaker 1: is where we get to these Supreme Court cases. On 278 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 1: May twenty seventh, nineteen oh one, the US Supreme Court 279 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:57,200 Speaker 1: issued its decision in six cases that had all been 280 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 1: argued over the course of nineteen hundred and nineteen. Most 281 00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 1: of these were related to Puerto Rico. There was also 282 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:07,679 Speaker 1: one case relating to Hawaii and one related to the Philippines. 283 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 1: Some constitutional law scholars frame these six decisions as the 284 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: core insular cases. There are others who include two other 285 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: cases that were decided in December of that same year. 286 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 1: There are others who include a lot more cases that 287 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: were decided over the next two decades, for up to 288 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:29,800 Speaker 1: a total of thirty five cases. So like the argument 289 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: over which cases are the insular, cases can really vary 290 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 1: depending on whose opinions. 291 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:35,200 Speaker 2: You're reading. 292 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 1: The idea that at least some of these cases would 293 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:41,560 Speaker 1: be grouped together as the Insular Cases was there right 294 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:45,159 Speaker 1: from the beginning. Some of the court's opinions collectively refer 295 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 1: to the Insular Tariff Cases. In February of nineteen oh one, 296 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:52,439 Speaker 1: after the cases had been argued but before they were decided, 297 00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:56,080 Speaker 1: the House of Representatives passed a resolution calling for the 298 00:18:56,080 --> 00:18:58,639 Speaker 1: briefs and arguments from five of the cases to be 299 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 1: printed together as a book called the Insular Cases. That 300 00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: book is one thousand and seventy five pages long, well 301 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 1: light reading. Yeah, clearly we're not going to be talking 302 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 1: about all of these cases in detail to quickly tick 303 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: through these nineteen oh one cases. That's not just the 304 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 1: first six, it's the other two as well. One outlier 305 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 1: was Who's versus New York and Puerto Rico Steamship Company. 306 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 1: This looked at the question of whether Puerto Rican ports 307 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 1: were domestic or foreign ports in the context of US 308 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:34,879 Speaker 1: shipping law and New York laws around the pilotage of 309 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:39,440 Speaker 1: nautical vessels. Most of the other cases addressed the core 310 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 1: question of whether Puerto Rico, Hawaii, or the Philippines should 311 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 1: be considered a foreign country in terms of tariff law. 312 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: These cases were Delema versus Bidwell, Gutsa versus United States, 313 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: Armstrong versus United States, two different cases called Duly versus 314 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 1: United States, and fourteen Diamond Rings versus United States. These 315 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:07,879 Speaker 1: cases all involved similar scenarios. A person or business had 316 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 1: been required to pay a duty or had something seized 317 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 1: by customs, but they argued that no duties or fees 318 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:17,439 Speaker 1: should have been required or customs should not have seized 319 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: the goods since the goods had not come from a 320 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:24,200 Speaker 1: foreign country. The Court issued decisions in these cases establishing 321 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: that none of these places were foreign countries in the 322 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 1: context of tariff law unless the duty had been imposed 323 00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 1: before the United States annexed them. The last of these 324 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 1: nineteen oh one cases, not in terms of time decided 325 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 1: just in terms of us talking about them, was Downs 326 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: versus Bidwell, and that looked at whether parts of the 327 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:48,879 Speaker 1: Forker Act were constitutional. The Foriker Act, also called the 328 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 1: Puerto Rico Organic Act, had been passed in April of 329 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:57,399 Speaker 1: nineteen hundred. Among its many provisions, the Forker Act established 330 00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: a fifteen percent tariff on goods that were imported into 331 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:05,199 Speaker 1: Puerto Rico from the United States and vice versa. But 332 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 1: Article one, Section eight, Clause one of the US Constitution, 333 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 1: known as the Uniformity Clause, requires that quote all duties, imports, 334 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States. So 335 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,879 Speaker 1: if throughout the United States included Puerto Rico, it was 336 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 1: unconstitutional for it to have this separate tariff. The Supreme 337 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 1: Court's plurality decision was that no, the Foriker Act was 338 00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:41,520 Speaker 1: not unconstitutional because while Puerto Rico belonged to the United States, 339 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 1: it was not part of the United States. Of all 340 00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 1: these cases, Delema versus Bidwell and Downs versus Bidwell have 341 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:54,080 Speaker 1: gotten the most attention in terms of study and analysis, 342 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 1: and Downs versus Bidwell in particular has become notorious for 343 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:01,879 Speaker 1: its racist language. To get into more on that, after 344 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 1: a sponsor break, as we noted before the break, in 345 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,240 Speaker 1: nineteen oh one, the US Supreme Court issued a decision 346 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: in Downs versus Bidwell that described Puerto Rico as belonging 347 00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:25,359 Speaker 1: to the United States but not part of it. Downs 348 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 1: versus Bidwell also established a distinction between incorporated and unincorporated territory. 349 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:36,639 Speaker 1: As we talked about in the first part of this 350 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 1: show like this was a new idea. This was not 351 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,199 Speaker 1: how the United States had been doing it before. In 352 00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:44,760 Speaker 1: the words of a concurring opinion by Justice Horace Gray, quote, 353 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:48,760 Speaker 1: so long as Congress has not incorporated the territory into 354 00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:53,360 Speaker 1: the United States, neither military occupation nor session by treaty 355 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 1: makes the conquered territory domestic territory in the sense of 356 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: the revenue laws. But those laws can so learning foreign 357 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:06,119 Speaker 1: countries remain applicable to the conquered territory until changed by Congress. 358 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,280 Speaker 1: If Congress is not ready to construct a complete government 359 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: for the conquered territory, it may establish a temporary government 360 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 1: which is not subject to all the restrictions of the Constitution. 361 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 2: That doesn't sound. 362 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:23,680 Speaker 1: Like a fat loophole at all. In other words, Puerto 363 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 1: Rico and by extension, the other island territories were not 364 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 1: foreign countries in terms of tariff law, but also were 365 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,760 Speaker 1: not part of the United States in any way that 366 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 1: would bring them under the Constitution's uniformity clause. 367 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:39,399 Speaker 2: This decision sort of. 368 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 1: Read into various parts of the Constitution and previous court decisions, 369 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,879 Speaker 1: arguing that you really couldn't infer from the Constitution that 370 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:54,480 Speaker 1: territories were part of the United States, like the thirteenth 371 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:59,880 Speaker 1: Amendment to the Constitution abolished slavery quote within the United States, 372 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: were in any place subject to their jurisdiction. So, according 373 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: to this argument, that had to mean there were places 374 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 1: that were subject to US jurisdiction but were not part 375 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 1: of the United States. Or in the fourteenth Amendment quote, 376 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 1: all persons born or naturalized in the United States and 377 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,879 Speaker 1: subject to the jurisdiction thereof are citizens of the United 378 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:26,199 Speaker 1: States and the state wherein they reside. So in the 379 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 1: Court's view, that suggested that in the United States and 380 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:34,840 Speaker 1: subject to US jurisdiction could be two totally different things. 381 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: To quote from the plurality opinion authored by Justice Henry 382 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: Billings Brown quote, We are also of the opinion that 383 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: the power to acquire territory by treaty implies not only 384 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: the power to govern such territory, but to prescribe upon 385 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 1: what terms the United States will receive its inhabitants and 386 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,360 Speaker 1: what their status shall be in what Chief Justice Marshall 387 00:24:56,440 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 1: termed the American Empire. There seems to be no middle 388 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,480 Speaker 1: ground between this position and the doctrine that if their 389 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 1: inhabitants do not become immediately upon annexation citizens of the 390 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:13,200 Speaker 1: United States. Their children thereafter born, whether savages or civilized, 391 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 1: are such and entitled to all the rights, privileges, and 392 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:21,480 Speaker 1: immunities of citizens. If such be their status, the consequences 393 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:26,120 Speaker 1: will be extremely serious. Indeed, it is doubtful if Congress 394 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:29,600 Speaker 1: would ever assent to the annexation of territory upon the 395 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 1: condition that its inhabitants, however foreign they may be, to 396 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,320 Speaker 1: our habits, traditions, and modes of life, shall become at 397 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: once citizens of the United States. Legal racism. Yeah, it's 398 00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 1: very It's like, it's straightforwardly racist. Uh. 399 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,159 Speaker 2: The Plurality opinion concluded. Quote. 400 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:56,920 Speaker 1: If those possessions are inhabited by alien races differing from 401 00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:01,240 Speaker 1: us in religion, customs, laws, men, methods of taxation, and 402 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:05,679 Speaker 1: modes of thought, the administration of government and justice according 403 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:10,360 Speaker 1: to Anglo Saxon principles, may for a time be impossible, 404 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: And the question at once arises whether large concessions ought 405 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,600 Speaker 1: not to be made for a time that ultimately our 406 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:20,680 Speaker 1: own theories may be carried out, and the blessings of 407 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 1: a free government under the Constitution extended to them. We 408 00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 1: decline to hold that there is anything in the Constitution 409 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: to forbid such action. It went on to say, quote, 410 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,200 Speaker 1: we are therefore of opinion that the island of Puerto 411 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: Rico is a territory, a pertinent, and belonging to the 412 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,719 Speaker 1: United States, but not a part of the United States 413 00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 1: within the revenue clauses of the Constitution. That the Foriker 414 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 1: Act is constitutional so far as it imposes duties upon 415 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,199 Speaker 1: imports from such island, and that the plaintiff cannot recover 416 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:57,199 Speaker 1: back the duties exacted in this case. So this was 417 00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 1: one of many five four decisions among the insular cases. 418 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,320 Speaker 1: Just in case folks are not from the US, they 419 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 1: don't necessarily know how the Supreme Court is set up. 420 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 1: There are nine justices, and so in a lot of 421 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: these cases, the decision was five to four. A dissent 422 00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:21,440 Speaker 1: by Chief Justice Fuller included the statement quote great stress 423 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:25,159 Speaker 1: is thrown upon the word incorporation, as if possessed of 424 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:30,199 Speaker 1: some occult meaning. Justice John M. Harlan also penned a 425 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: dissent of his own, which set in part quote these 426 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 1: are words of weighty import. They involve consequences of the 427 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:40,719 Speaker 1: most momentous character. I take leave to say that if 428 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:44,399 Speaker 1: the principles thus announced should ever receive the sanction of 429 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:48,520 Speaker 1: a majority of this Court, a radical and mischievous change 430 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 1: in our system of government will be the result. We will, 431 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,440 Speaker 1: in that event, pass from the era of constitutional liberty 432 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,640 Speaker 1: guarded and protected by a written Constitution into an era 433 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 1: of life legislative absolutism. Together, these nineteen oh one cases 434 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 1: established the idea that Puerto Rico, Hawaii, the Philippines, Samoa, 435 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,880 Speaker 1: and Guam were part of the United States in some 436 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:16,200 Speaker 1: ways but not others, and could stay that way indefinitely. 437 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,119 Speaker 1: Cases that followed later in the early twentieth century also 438 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 1: outlined limits on the constitutional rights of people living in 439 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:27,639 Speaker 1: these territories. As we said earlier, some scholars consider these 440 00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:30,320 Speaker 1: later cases to be part of the insular cases, and 441 00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:34,159 Speaker 1: some do not. As a few examples, Door versus United 442 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,359 Speaker 1: States decided in nineteen oh four looked at the question 443 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 1: of whether residents of the Philippines had the right to 444 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 1: a trial by jury. The right to a jury trial 445 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 1: is outlined in the sixth Amendment to the Constitution, but 446 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:48,680 Speaker 1: the Court ruled that it would only apply in the 447 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 1: Philippines if Congress enacted legislation to establish that right. Hawaii 448 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 1: versus Mankiche was similar, finding that the right to a 449 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 1: jury trial had not existed in Hawaii in the window 450 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:06,200 Speaker 1: between when the US annexed it and when Congress passed 451 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: an Act to provide a government for the Territory of 452 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 1: Hawaii in nineteen hundred. This act bestowed US citizenship on 453 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 1: the people who had been citizens of the Republic of 454 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 1: Hawaii as of August twelfth, eighteen ninety eight. So once 455 00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,320 Speaker 1: people in Hawaii were considered to be US citizens, they 456 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,920 Speaker 1: were entitled to a trial by jury. But when Hawaii 457 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:32,880 Speaker 1: was a US territory whose residents were not citizens, they 458 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:37,320 Speaker 1: were not entitled to a jury trial. Gonzales versus Williams 459 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: was decided in nineteen oh four. Although Puerto Ricans were 460 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:44,640 Speaker 1: not considered US citizens at that time, they were supposed 461 00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 1: to be able to travel freely to the United States. 462 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 1: Isabella Gonzalez had tried to join her fiance in New York, 463 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 1: but was turned away at port. She was pregnant, and 464 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 1: authorities described her as an alien who was likely to 465 00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 1: become a public charge. The court found that she was 466 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 1: not an alien and should not have been denied entry 467 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,920 Speaker 1: into New York, but also did not find that she 468 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,280 Speaker 1: was a citizen. This case is sometimes cited as a 469 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 1: factor in Puerto Rican's ultimately being given citizenship as part 470 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 1: of the Jones Schafroth Act in nineteen seventeen. When I 471 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 1: got to this part, I was like, I kind of 472 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 1: wish I had done a whole episode on this one case, 473 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,080 Speaker 1: which might happen at some point in the future. We 474 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: still could. 475 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:28,040 Speaker 2: One of the last. 476 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 1: Cases that is sometimes grouped together with the insular cases 477 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: was Balzac versus Puerto Rico, decided in nineteen twenty two. 478 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,080 Speaker 1: This was a case in which Jesus M. Balzac, editor 479 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: of a Puerto Rican daily newspaper, had been charged with libel. 480 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:46,480 Speaker 1: So this case was connected to the rights of free speech, 481 00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 1: freedom of the press, and trial by jury, which are 482 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 1: all considered basic constitutional rights in the United States. The 483 00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: court found that Puerto Rico had not been incorporated into 484 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 1: the United States, and that the sixth the Amendment right 485 00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:03,880 Speaker 1: to a jury trial did not apply, and that Balzac's 486 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 1: published work was not protected by the rights to free 487 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 1: speech or a free press. There are a lot of 488 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:15,240 Speaker 1: contradictions among these cases and sometimes within the cases themselves. 489 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 1: As we said earlier, many were decided five to four, 490 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 1: and often those five justices agreed on the outcome but 491 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: not on the reasoning behind it. But together they established 492 00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:30,480 Speaker 1: what's known as the incorporation Doctrine. They outlined differences between 493 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 1: incorporated and unincorporated territories and set the stage for the 494 00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:38,920 Speaker 1: United States to be able to claim unincorporated territories in 495 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:43,120 Speaker 1: perpetuity without allowing them to enter the Union as states 496 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:47,440 Speaker 1: or de annexing them. While the US Constitution established the 497 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: nation as a representative democracy, the Insular cases set aside 498 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 1: several territories territories that were inhabited primarily by Hispanic and 499 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 1: Indigenous people as not entitled to full particition, patient or 500 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,960 Speaker 1: representation in that democracy. While as we said earlier, these 501 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,960 Speaker 1: cases still stand, there have of course been some shifts 502 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 1: in details over the last century. The Philippines became independent 503 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,600 Speaker 1: from the United States in nineteen forty six after being 504 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: occupied by Japan during World War Two. Japan had actually 505 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,920 Speaker 1: declared the Philippines independent in nineteen forty three, sort of 506 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 1: trying to get the support of Filipinos during this occupation. 507 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: As we said earlier, the people of Puerto Rico were 508 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 1: granted statutory citizenship in nineteen seventeen, and in nineteen fifty 509 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,760 Speaker 1: Public Law six hundred authorized the people of Puerto Rico 510 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,680 Speaker 1: to draft their own constitution, so Puerto Rico today is 511 00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:45,520 Speaker 1: considered to be self governing. Hawaii became a state in 512 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,120 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty nine, a process that took more than fifty years, 513 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:53,280 Speaker 1: due in part to racist attitudes against the archipelago's native 514 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: Hawaiian and Asian residents. While voters in Hawaii overwhelmingly ratified 515 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:02,880 Speaker 1: at statehood, many Native Hawaiians have pushed instead for Hawaiian 516 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:07,920 Speaker 1: independence and sovereignty. Residents of Guam gained US citizenship under 517 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 1: the Guam Organic Act of nineteen fifty after having been 518 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,440 Speaker 1: essentially abandoned by the United States and left to a 519 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:19,600 Speaker 1: horrific occupation by Japan during World War Two. Today, American 520 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:25,080 Speaker 1: Samoans are considered US nationals, but not US citizens. You 521 00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:26,760 Speaker 1: can say this of all of these places, but the 522 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:32,600 Speaker 1: United States has definitely been most focused on them when 523 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: it has been like the most within US interests to 524 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:40,479 Speaker 1: do so so, Like there's the most focused on the 525 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 1: well being of Guam when there's a like strategic military 526 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:46,480 Speaker 1: reason to do so for some reason, and like This 527 00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,160 Speaker 1: abandonment of Guam during World War Two is kind of 528 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 1: the US did basically just like cut his losses. We 529 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: mentioned the Northern Mariana Islands and the US Virgin. 530 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,320 Speaker 2: Islands the top of the show. They have not come up. 531 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 1: Again because they were not US territories when the first 532 00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: Insular cases were decided. The US purchased the US Virgin 533 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:11,080 Speaker 1: Islands from Denmark in nineteen seventeen. The Northern Mariana Islands 534 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 1: became a US territory in nineteen seventy five, even though 535 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:19,400 Speaker 1: neither was a US territory when the original Insular cases 536 00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:24,040 Speaker 1: were being argued and decided. They're both considered unincorporated territories. 537 00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:28,400 Speaker 1: Following this same model that the Insular cases established, the 538 00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:32,200 Speaker 1: US Virgin Islands, American Samoa, and Guam are all on 539 00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:37,760 Speaker 1: the United Nations list of non self governing territories. Broadly speaking, 540 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: people living in these territories are considered to be entitled 541 00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:46,040 Speaker 1: to fundamental constitutional rights, but not necessarily to others, and 542 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:49,719 Speaker 1: opinions can also differ on which rights should be considered fundamental. 543 00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:54,360 Speaker 1: The unincorporated territories are not represented by the Electoral College 544 00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 1: in presidential elections. They are represented by one delegate each 545 00:34:58,960 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 1: in the House of Representation, it is who can serve 546 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:06,400 Speaker 1: on committees and can introduce legislation, but cannot vote. There 547 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,400 Speaker 1: are actually six total non voting members of the House. 548 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:13,200 Speaker 1: The sixth one represents Washington d C. So, as is 549 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:16,920 Speaker 1: the case with the unincorporated territories, residents of Washington d C. 550 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,000 Speaker 1: Don't have the same representation in Congress as people who 551 00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:23,799 Speaker 1: live in what the states do. A key difference here, though, 552 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,279 Speaker 1: is that the Constitution itself outlines the creation of a 553 00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 1: district to serve as the seat of the government. 554 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 2: Washington d C. 555 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,279 Speaker 1: Did not come about because the Supreme Court kind of 556 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:39,840 Speaker 1: made up but justification to do so. At this point, 557 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:44,520 Speaker 1: there's near unanimous agreement among historians and constitutional law scholars 558 00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 1: that the insular cases are rooted in racism and colonialism, 559 00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,680 Speaker 1: but there's less agreement about what the outcome would be 560 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,799 Speaker 1: if these cases were overturned, and whether that outcome would 561 00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:58,560 Speaker 1: ultimately be positive for people who would be affected. And 562 00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,439 Speaker 1: in more recent years, they're some attempts to use these 563 00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,879 Speaker 1: decisions to try to protect the rights of people who 564 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,280 Speaker 1: are living in these territories. For example, in the US, 565 00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 1: it would be considered unconstitutional to pass laws tying property 566 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:16,879 Speaker 1: ownership to race. Theoretically, since the unincorporated territories don't have 567 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,360 Speaker 1: full constitutional protection, it would be possible to pass laws 568 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 1: giving these islands indigenous people's preference in terms of land 569 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:28,400 Speaker 1: ownership based on their race, which could help protect their 570 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:32,720 Speaker 1: connections to their ancestral homelands and their traditional ways of life. 571 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 1: Having worked on this show for a decade, Tracy notes 572 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:40,480 Speaker 1: that she's not really optimistic about this working out. I 573 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:43,879 Speaker 1: would agree with that, And she also read a lot 574 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: of arguments that basically kind of summed this up to, 575 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:48,480 Speaker 1: no matter what good end you try to put them to, 576 00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:50,880 Speaker 1: these decisions are still racist and should. 577 00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:51,480 Speaker 2: Still be overturned. 578 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:54,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, And to be very clear, the only reason I 579 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,680 Speaker 1: said there is near unanimous agreement instead of just unanimous 580 00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 1: agreement is because I know if we say unanimous, we're 581 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:02,880 Speaker 1: gonna get an article somebody sends to us that's like, 582 00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,880 Speaker 1: here's the one outlier who claims this was not about racism. 583 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,600 Speaker 1: There have also been a number of Supreme Court cases 584 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: in more recent years that have continued to uphold elements 585 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: of the Insular cases and to outline ways in which 586 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:22,319 Speaker 1: people living in these territories can be treated differently from 587 00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:26,200 Speaker 1: people in the fifty States or Washington, d C. In 588 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:30,880 Speaker 1: accept the context of congressional representation, we're talking about Washington DC. So, 589 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,799 Speaker 1: for example, the US versus Valeo Madero was decided in 590 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,200 Speaker 1: twenty twenty two. Valeo Madero was a Puerto Rican living 591 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,080 Speaker 1: in New York who had been receiving supplemental Security income 592 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:46,840 Speaker 1: payments that's what we colloquially called social security or disability payments. 593 00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:50,640 Speaker 1: He moved to Puerto Rico, making him no longer eligible 594 00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:53,960 Speaker 1: to receive these payments, and the government did not realize 595 00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:57,040 Speaker 1: he had moved and kept sending the payments. When they 596 00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,200 Speaker 1: realized what had happened, the government sued to try to 597 00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: recoup that money. The argument in this case was that 598 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:09,359 Speaker 1: excluding Puerto Ricans from the program violated the Constitution's due 599 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:13,040 Speaker 1: process clause in the Fifth Amendment. In an eight to 600 00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:17,040 Speaker 1: one decision, the Supreme Court disagreed, ruling that the Constitution 601 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 1: did not require supplemental Security income payments for people in 602 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:26,200 Speaker 1: Puerto Rico. Justice Neil Gorsich wrote a scathing concurrence, agreeing 603 00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:30,520 Speaker 1: with the majority opinion but also arguing stridently against the 604 00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:34,640 Speaker 1: Insular cases. He wrote, quote, flaws in the Insular cases 605 00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:37,880 Speaker 1: are as fundamental as they are shameful. Nothing in the 606 00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 1: Constitution speaks of incorporated and unincorporated territories. Nothing in it 607 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:48,359 Speaker 1: extends to the latter only certain supposedly fundamental constitutional guarantees. 608 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,240 Speaker 1: Nothing in it authorizes judges to engage in the sordid 609 00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: business of segregating territories and the people who live in 610 00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:59,239 Speaker 1: them on the basis of race, ethnicity, or religion. The 611 00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:02,239 Speaker 1: Insular case uses can claim support in academic work of 612 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 1: the period, ugly racial stereotypes and the theories of social Darwinists, 613 00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:09,919 Speaker 1: but they have no home in our Constitution or its 614 00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:14,799 Speaker 1: original understanding. The case that the Supreme Court declined to 615 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:19,400 Speaker 1: hear last year was Fitisimanu versus United States that was 616 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:24,760 Speaker 1: brought by three American Samoans living in Utah. They argued 617 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:29,560 Speaker 1: that the Fourteenth Amendment's birthright citizenship clause should apply to 618 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:34,040 Speaker 1: the people of American Samoa. While American Samoans who moved 619 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,400 Speaker 1: to the United States can apply for citizenship, they're not 620 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:42,120 Speaker 1: guaranteed citizenship. They are also denied various rights like voting 621 00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:45,799 Speaker 1: and running for office until they become citizens if those 622 00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:49,000 Speaker 1: applications are successful. As we said at the top of 623 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 1: the show, people in American Samoa have varying opinions on 624 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 1: these issues. In this case, the government of American Samoa 625 00:39:56,520 --> 00:40:01,080 Speaker 1: and Congresswoman al Mua Amada, who represents American samo submitted 626 00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:04,440 Speaker 1: a brief opposing this idea. It read, in part quote, 627 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 1: the citizenship clause does not require imposing birthright citizenship on 628 00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:11,839 Speaker 1: the people of American Samoa over the objection of their 629 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:15,400 Speaker 1: elected representatives and government, and in violation of their basic 630 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:19,400 Speaker 1: right to self determination. This brief stress the importance of 631 00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:22,360 Speaker 1: FAA Samoa, or the Samoan culture and way of life, 632 00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:26,400 Speaker 1: arguing that FAA Samoa is fundamentally important to the Samoan 633 00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:30,799 Speaker 1: people and that imposing birthright citizenship on American Samoa would 634 00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:34,960 Speaker 1: undermine it. The Samoan Federation of America, which supports and 635 00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 1: advocates for Samoan Americans living in the United States, was 636 00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:43,120 Speaker 1: one of the organizations that submitted a brief supporting the petitioners. Yeah, so, 637 00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,640 Speaker 1: as we said earlier, people are not a monolith. There 638 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:50,560 Speaker 1: are varying opinions on this. There were more briefs submitted 639 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: in support of applying birthright citizenship to American Samoa, but 640 00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,600 Speaker 1: also a lot of people currently living in American Samoa 641 00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:03,839 Speaker 1: who really that's not what we want though, a lot 642 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 1: of these things are complicated and we have not gotten 643 00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:11,839 Speaker 1: into it here. But like these distinctions and which rights 644 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:15,279 Speaker 1: apply and which don't, like a lot of them just 645 00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:19,480 Speaker 1: trickle down to all kinds of things about people's everyday lives. 646 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:21,680 Speaker 2: A lot of. 647 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:29,000 Speaker 1: These places have uh, disproportionately higher participation in military service, 648 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,560 Speaker 1: so there are a lot of military veterans, but uh, 649 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,160 Speaker 1: you know, military veterans and returning to these places aren't 650 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:38,520 Speaker 1: able to do things like vote president afterward. And in 651 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:42,399 Speaker 1: some cases the veterans services in their local areas are 652 00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 1: a business. 653 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:45,000 Speaker 2: Good. Yeah, I was reading. 654 00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:49,240 Speaker 1: I was reading one thing about people from Guam needing 655 00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:52,400 Speaker 1: particular veteran services and having to go to Hawaii to 656 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:58,879 Speaker 1: get them, which is like four thousand miles away. So anyway, 657 00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:02,320 Speaker 1: do you have listened mail? I do I have listener mail? 658 00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:09,480 Speaker 1: It is from Miranda. Miranda wrote after our Two Sergeants 659 00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: episode and said, Holly and Tracy, longtime listener, first time writer. 660 00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,000 Speaker 1: I was listening to your episode on Judith and Emily's 661 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:19,160 Speaker 1: sargent and a name caught my attention, Minister Gordon Gibson. 662 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:21,560 Speaker 1: Imagine my shock to hear the name of the retired 663 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:25,319 Speaker 1: Unitarian minister who used to be my neighbor. I'm just 664 00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:27,560 Speaker 1: going to put a note here to say that Gordon 665 00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,600 Speaker 1: Gibson is still living, is retired. We don't normally talk 666 00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:32,400 Speaker 1: a lot about living people in the show, but then 667 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:34,400 Speaker 1: in this case, this case, we're talking about a thing 668 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:38,600 Speaker 1: related to like their historical connection. So this email went 669 00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 1: on to say, it was interesting to learn about an 670 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,560 Speaker 1: early Unitarian in the form of Judith, who participated in 671 00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:47,080 Speaker 1: slavery as an institution. When I usually picture Unitarians as 672 00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:51,840 Speaker 1: being abolitionists, it's a fascinating juxtaposition that mister Gibson discovered 673 00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:52,600 Speaker 1: those papers. 674 00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:53,440 Speaker 2: As he was. 675 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,480 Speaker 1: Very active in the civil rights movement. He was arrested 676 00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:59,000 Speaker 1: in Alabama and founded a project to keep the history 677 00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,200 Speaker 1: of the civil rights movement alive. He was the only 678 00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 1: Unitarian Universalist minister in Mississippi from nineteen sixty nine to 679 00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:08,560 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four. I'm always fascinated by the intersection of 680 00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:11,839 Speaker 1: historical people and moments with each other over and through 681 00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:13,680 Speaker 1: time and I was so tickled to hear his name. 682 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:16,600 Speaker 1: He's retired now but still very active in the community. 683 00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:18,920 Speaker 1: I alas have moved away, but I'm very proud to 684 00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:21,759 Speaker 1: have known him. Attaching my pet tax Scottie is my 685 00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:24,400 Speaker 1: bad tempered nine year old calico. Her sweet face is 686 00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:28,160 Speaker 1: a lie and the flufey baby boy is Willow, just 687 00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:33,280 Speaker 1: over a year and very naughty. These cats are definitely adorable. 688 00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:38,440 Speaker 1: We have one in a little cat sort of one 689 00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,879 Speaker 1: of those sort of like plushy little cat houses, which 690 00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:44,799 Speaker 1: we have a similar one at our house that is 691 00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:46,839 Speaker 1: gray that one of our kitty cats likes to lie 692 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:48,760 Speaker 1: in in a very similar position. 693 00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:50,480 Speaker 2: So thank you so much for sending that. 694 00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:55,640 Speaker 1: This comment about Judas Sergeant Murray participating in slavery at 695 00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:59,920 Speaker 1: a time when Miranda usually pictures Unitarians as being abolition 696 00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:04,480 Speaker 1: reminded me a little bit of Benjamin Leigh, who we 697 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,880 Speaker 1: covered on this show a few years ago, who was 698 00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:12,320 Speaker 1: a Quaker, not a Unitarian, but was expelled from congregations 699 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:16,279 Speaker 1: for his incredibly vocal denunciation of slavery at a time 700 00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:20,600 Speaker 1: when like a number of Quakers were participating in slavery. 701 00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:22,920 Speaker 1: So that just sort of reminded me of that a 702 00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 1: little bit. I don't know if we have run that 703 00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,759 Speaker 1: episode as a Saturday Classic, but maybe if not, I 704 00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:31,040 Speaker 1: might line that up. Having been reminded, Benjamin Lee is 705 00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:34,399 Speaker 1: one of my favorite historical figures. So thank you so much, 706 00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:38,160 Speaker 1: Miranda for this email in these cat pictures and this 707 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:41,120 Speaker 1: note about things that I did not know about Gordon Gibson. 708 00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:43,480 Speaker 1: If you would like to write to us, store at 709 00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:47,080 Speaker 1: History Podcasts at ieartradio dot com. And we're on social 710 00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:50,560 Speaker 1: media as Missed in History, so you'll find our Facebook 711 00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:55,960 Speaker 1: formerly Twitter, Pinterest, and Instagram, and you can subscribe to 712 00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:59,360 Speaker 1: our show on the iHeartRadio app and wherever you like 713 00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:07,520 Speaker 1: to get your p stuff. You Missed in History Class 714 00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:11,600 Speaker 1: is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, 715 00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:15,320 Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 716 00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:16,360 Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.