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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast Catch us

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Speaker 1: Live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app. We're listening to

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Speaker 1: that wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 2: It's hot.

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Speaker 3: Remember Chuck Schumer was talking about this a couple of

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Speaker 3: weeks ago, went the CSIS talk about a bipartisan effort

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Speaker 3: to get our arms around this whole technology, and that,

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Speaker 3: of course is easier said than done.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, especially when the technology is moving at the speed

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Speaker 4: it's moving. Sure, and Washington moves at the speed it moves.

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Speaker 3: Now, you're known for covering crypto, and it's not unlike

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Speaker 3: the idea where you have lawmakers all arguing over something

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Speaker 3: that they don't quite understand. But in this case, they

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Speaker 3: seem to be acknowledging that and they've been setting up

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Speaker 3: these series of briefings and learning sessions to get everybody

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Speaker 3: up to speed. Here's the Majority Leader just a week ago.

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Speaker 5: It is clear that the private sector is making advances,

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Speaker 5: but the privates can't do it alone. And the combination

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Speaker 5: of our government in Congress working with the private sector

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Speaker 5: to make sure that we innovate way ahead of everybody else,

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Speaker 5: but at the same time that there are safeguards so

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Speaker 5: that innovation doesn't get out of control or be used

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Speaker 5: for negative purposes.

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Speaker 3: I don't know, though it's supposed to be bipartisan. We

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Speaker 3: actually asked Marshall Blackburn about it a couple of weeks ago.

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Speaker 3: He name checked hers that I need Republicans to make

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Speaker 3: this happen. But what format will take remains a question.

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Speaker 3: Megan Scully is with us in studio. She'll figure all

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Speaker 3: of this out for us, right Megan, Bloomberg News Congress

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Speaker 3: team leader. The attempt to regulate.

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Speaker 2: Something that you don't understand is a pretty tough job,

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Speaker 2: isn't it.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, we've seen this in the past. I

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Speaker 6: remember watching Congress try to do this with the Internet

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Speaker 6: early on, and certainly with crypto more recently. And Congress

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Speaker 6: does not really like regulating technology. It has a long

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Speaker 6: history of avoiding this or trying to until it gets

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Speaker 6: to the point where they don't have any their choice,

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Speaker 6: just because, as Kaylee said, technology evolves at a much

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Speaker 6: faster rate than Washington moves. So you have this this

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Speaker 6: sort of weird dynamic going on right now, and as

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Speaker 6: you mentioned, tons of closed door learning sessions for members

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Speaker 6: of Congress, where the very people who they are seeking

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Speaker 6: to regulate are bringing them up to speed on the

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Speaker 6: technology that they are looking into.

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Speaker 2: What could go wrong?

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Speaker 4: I'm seriously right.

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Speaker 6: So it's just this, it's this kind of weird movement.

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Speaker 7: You know.

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Speaker 6: Schumer I think said it was it was the most

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Speaker 6: difficult thing that Congress was going to do in the

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Speaker 6: coming months, and I think months is probably an optimistic

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Speaker 6: time frame in terms of regulation. So now they're trying.

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Speaker 6: They're talking safeguards, which is what they talk about when

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Speaker 6: there is no regulation and companies sort of regulating them.

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Speaker 2: You've seen this movie before. Yeah, yeah, she's got the buzzwords.

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Speaker 4: And it really sounds a lot like crypto, including the safeguards,

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Speaker 4: guard rails and the other thing you often hear, you

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Speaker 4: got to put some guardrail rails around this, just no

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Speaker 4: one really knows what they should look like or what

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Speaker 4: exactly they're guarding around. So I guess it begs the question, Megan,

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Speaker 4: is are we likely to see this addressed like as

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Speaker 4: an individual issue or are we just going to start

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Speaker 4: seeing AI things embedded into other legislative efforts, whether it's

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Speaker 4: related to defense or competition. Or things like that.

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Speaker 6: Well, considering it's difficult to get any legislation through Congress

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Speaker 6: right now, but you do have few musk pass bills.

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Speaker 6: When you mentioned defense, and we have the Defense Authorization

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Speaker 6: Bill being debated now on the Senate floor, I think

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Speaker 6: that you're going to see kind of a patchwork framework

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Speaker 6: of now I'm speaking and think the guardrail technology the contagious,

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Speaker 6: but you're going to it's it's going to be bits

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Speaker 6: and pieces here and there. I suspect rather.

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Speaker 2: Than comprehensive bipartisan no.

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Speaker 6: And you're seeing that now because there are several bills

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Speaker 6: for stins that have been introduced, but none has really

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Speaker 6: rose to the surface as being the AI bill. And

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Speaker 6: you have so many competing interests here as well. You

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Speaker 6: have the big tech companies, the Googles and whatnot, who

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Speaker 6: were educating Congress on it, but then you also have

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Speaker 6: these small tech companies who fear that regulation is going

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Speaker 6: to hinder them. Then overlaying all of this obviously is

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Speaker 6: concerns about competition with China and not wanting to slow

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Speaker 6: down our pace at all. So it's extremely complex and

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Speaker 6: probably too complex for a divide of Congress to deal

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Speaker 6: with quickly. And cohesively.

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Speaker 3: You've been covering the hill for a minute, more than

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Speaker 3: a minute, thanks two minutes. You ever heard of it

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Speaker 3: all senators briefing before like this as closed door, all

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Speaker 3: not d's or ours, not a particular caucus, not a leadership,

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Speaker 3: but everyone.

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Speaker 2: So they you saw last week.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, so it was the first time we've seen it

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Speaker 6: on AI. It is interesting for a policy area or

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Speaker 6: a tech area. Usually when we see in all senators

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Speaker 6: classified briefing, it's you know, on reduce Ukraine or you

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Speaker 6: have something along those lines. That there definitely was a

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Speaker 6: sense of urgency in terms of how they handled it

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Speaker 6: and with the level of secrecy with which they did.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for coming in.

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Speaker 3: Megan Scully runs our Congress team here in the newsroom

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Speaker 3: in Washington, d C.

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Speaker 2: At Bloomberg. We thank you as always Megan.

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Speaker 3: This point, there's so many different applications that we're talking

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Speaker 3: about potentially here, which also makes this really complicated. Killy,

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Speaker 3: you know, we're we're talking about chatbots, you know, use

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Speaker 3: of some of the lower hanging fruit, or military applications,

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Speaker 3: which get way more complicated and much more dangerous as

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Speaker 3: soon as you start to wade into those waters.

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Speaker 8: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, or even things like transportation like Tesla investing heavily

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Speaker 4: in AI and an autonomous driving I mean, there's so

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Speaker 4: many different tentacles to it, which is why I was asking,

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Speaker 4: you know, are we going to see this kind of

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Speaker 4: departmented transport issues, defense issues or because it seems like

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Speaker 4: it's touching every area of our society. But defense is

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Speaker 4: a very big one, and from a national security standpoint,

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Speaker 4: maybe that's where there's greatest impetus to try to start

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Speaker 4: those efforts right.

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Speaker 3: We're going to get into all of this now with

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Speaker 3: John Costello, the deputy director of the what WANTI Center

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Speaker 3: for AI and Advanced Technologies at CSIS.

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Speaker 2: That's where again.

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Speaker 3: Chuck Schumer went to deliver that speech a couple of

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Speaker 3: weeks ago the Center for Strategic and International Studies here

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Speaker 3: in Washington. John, it's great to have you, Thanks for

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Speaker 3: joining us. Let's start on a broader level here and

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Speaker 3: then maybe we'll drill down a little bit. Do you

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Speaker 3: have any hope that the Senators who are being briefed

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Speaker 3: on AI will be able to find a path to regulation.

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Speaker 9: Hope springs eternal. I think what we're seeing in this

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Speaker 9: issue vice, I think tech issues that we've seen before.

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Speaker 9: Is certainly a political will, and a political will coupled

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Speaker 9: with an acknowledgement that I'm less something is done. You

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Speaker 9: have technological change can outpace society and our ability to

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Speaker 9: really handle it and handle it responsibly, and so I

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Speaker 9: am I am hopeful that Congress can find a path.

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Speaker 9: I think timeline for that obviously is is fungible and flexible.

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Speaker 9: But I'm seeing a little bit of a wind change

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Speaker 9: from what we've seen before.

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Speaker 4: So as we're talking about pace and how there may

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Speaker 4: be a pace mismatch with how fast the technology and

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Speaker 4: the technology companies that are developing it are moving versus

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Speaker 4: kind of these regulatory efforts. Is this just going to

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Speaker 4: be a scenario where the industry has to self regulate

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Speaker 4: at least for the time being, and can they do

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Speaker 4: that in a consistent way?

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Speaker 9: I think I think that's a good question. I think

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Speaker 9: for some things that are that they may have identified

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Speaker 9: as best practices, I think things that that you know

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Speaker 9: can can address some of the government's concerns. I think

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Speaker 9: that's that's certainly, And you are seeing, certainly the big

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Speaker 9: players start to get together and try to put some

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Speaker 9: boundaries or to put some rules and adopt those best

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Speaker 9: practices universally. But it doesn't cover everyone, It doesn't cover

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Speaker 9: up and comers in the space, and it certainly provides

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Speaker 9: no guarantee to the public and to other companies that

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Speaker 9: their competitors aren't going to limit themselves in that way.

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Speaker 9: You want to have a fair ecosystem. I think it's

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Speaker 9: also history has shown us on tech that you can

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Speaker 9: convince companies to adopt best practices and voluntary ones, but

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Speaker 9: asking them to not pursue a particular line of business

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Speaker 9: that their competitors pursuing, or that international companies that they

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Speaker 9: compete with are pursuing, that's really difficult, and only legislation

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Speaker 9: and law can really tell companies not to do that

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Speaker 9: by providing that level playing field, whereas that is not

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Speaker 9: that is not an area we want you to sell in,

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Speaker 9: this type a product, product you what we want you

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Speaker 9: to sell in and things that cost like that or

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Speaker 9: you know, reduce profit opportunity.

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Speaker 3: Well, so what can law makers do right now? John,

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Speaker 3: I'd love to get as specific as we can, because

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Speaker 3: we talked, you know, we were discussing earlier how much

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Speaker 3: jargon there is with guard rails safeguards, like what what

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Speaker 3: can we actually do here?

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Speaker 2: Could they?

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Speaker 3: For instance, would it would it be a requirement to

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Speaker 3: show the information or data that you're feeding your your

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Speaker 3: AI or your your language model. The big concern, of

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Speaker 3: course is, you know AI eventually turning on humans, and

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Speaker 3: I don't think that's going to be happening in the

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Speaker 3: next five minutes. So what would count now?

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Speaker 9: Yeah, so what counts now?

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Speaker 10: Really?

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Speaker 9: Some of the some of the bill's been introduced this effect.

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Speaker 9: Gary Peters, for instance, Senator Peters introduced a bill in

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Speaker 9: the Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee where government agencies

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Speaker 9: would have to report or make it transparent when they're

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Speaker 9: using AI to make decision that would impact the public,

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Speaker 9: and included a right to appeal a decision that was

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Speaker 9: heavily informed or made by an algorithm. You know, Congress

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Speaker 9: can direct investment on technical problems we know that need

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Speaker 9: to be solved to make regulation effective, or at least

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Speaker 9: to make a safety effective. There's something that's called the

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Speaker 9: transparency and explainability problem. Right now. AI is a little

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Speaker 9: bit of a black box. So put a bunch of

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Speaker 9: stuff in it, it learns, and it eventually learns to

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Speaker 9: spit that out. But it has trouble explaining how it

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Speaker 9: reached that conclusion. That's usually good for something small, but

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Speaker 9: when you're making decisions based on combat or based on

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Speaker 9: public policy, obviously you need to have the ability to

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Speaker 9: scrutinize that and understand. So those are things that they

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Speaker 9: can do. They can also ask the government, existing regulators

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Speaker 9: and under existing law to study or to adopt rules

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Speaker 9: that can that can update their own regulations to account

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Speaker 9: for AI. There's a lot that existing law can do

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Speaker 9: in areas where it already applies, and they can get

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Speaker 9: ahead of the ball in that way.

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Speaker 4: Well, John, you just mentioned combat, and this is a conversation, Joe,

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Speaker 4: that you've had before with Democratic Congressman Seth Moulton from Massachusetts.

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Speaker 4: He raised this very issue, the idea of AI and

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Speaker 4: warfare and weaponry. This is what he said.

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Speaker 11: There are no moral guidelines, there's no moral compass for

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Speaker 11: autonomous weapons, or at least it's very easy to shut

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Speaker 11: it off. And given the destruction I I mean Vladimir

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Speaker 11: Putin is literally erasing Ukrainian cities, you can very easily

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Speaker 11: imagine him flipping that switch. That's what's so dangerous about this.

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Speaker 11: I think it could be even more dangerous than nuclear

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Speaker 11: weapons because we haven't established any kinds of restrictions. We

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Speaker 11: haven't established any international treaties, no Geneva conventions to restrict

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Speaker 11: how this is used.

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Speaker 4: So is that what we need? John, A Geneva convention

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Speaker 4: for AI?

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Speaker 9: I you know, I think in Geneva conventions, I think

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Speaker 9: states setting norms on what they can expect from each

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Speaker 9: other and what what where they're willing to restrain themselves

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Speaker 9: for the betterment of a collective whole, like like we've

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Speaker 9: done a little bit with with nuclear weapons or biological

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Speaker 9: and chemical warfare. I think is I think it's something

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Speaker 9: a lot of states are considering on how to pursue. Obviously,

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Speaker 9: the international UH community right now is a little it

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Speaker 9: can be a little fractured or federated, but I think

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Speaker 9: most states agree that that there is potential harm here.

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Speaker 9: If this becomes, you know, universally adopted, we can enter

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Speaker 9: an age of warfare that is uh, you know, very

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Speaker 9: dangerous and dystopian. I think once they realize that finding

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Speaker 9: the pathway to get some level agreement, it will be

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Speaker 9: by But I do know that is in contention, and

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Speaker 9: that's a lot of states are talking about that and

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Speaker 9: considering how to proceed.

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Speaker 3: Hey, John, we only have a minute left. What the

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Speaker 3: lawmakers need to know that they do not today?

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Speaker 9: They need to know like at its core, what are

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Speaker 9: the what are the real technical UH issues or technical

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Speaker 9: problems UH for AI that contributes to issues like like

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Speaker 9: you mentioned, how do we how do we trust that

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Speaker 9: we're going to maintain control? Like how do we trust

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Speaker 9: that it can explain its decisions?

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Speaker 3: And are you helping to teach them that as c

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Speaker 3: s I S briefing them?

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Speaker 9: We we work, We've briefed members of Congress before, we

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Speaker 9: continue to brief members of Congress and we expect to

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Speaker 9: continue to work with them along with our other thing

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Speaker 9: tanks in the area. This is something that we are

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Speaker 9: focused on for certainty.

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Speaker 3: Thank God, you've got the future of humanity in the

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Speaker 3: palm of your hands here, John, be careful, John Costello CSIS.

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Speaker 3: He's at the wad Wani Center for AI and Advanced

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Speaker 3: Technologies at CSIS. I don't know, Achille, It's just it's

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Speaker 3: something that it's going to be a slow roll. And

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Speaker 3: to your point, AI is not slowing down for it.

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Speaker 4: No, in fact, it's moving at quite a clip.

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Speaker 7: Joe.

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Speaker 4: Perhaps a terrifyingly quick clip.

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Speaker 3: To want someone to tell me when the machines take over,

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Speaker 3: and I want to just do some scheduling around that.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the

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Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the

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Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App.

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Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

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Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

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Speaker 3: It's some interesting hearings on Capitol Hill just in the

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Speaker 3: last twenty four hours. You could argue messaging hearings because

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Speaker 3: they don't seem to be generating, or at least he

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Speaker 3: planned on generating legislation. Isn't that the point of a

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Speaker 3: hearing that it ends up at some point Kaylee becoming a.

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Speaker 4: Bill Yes, she says with the question mark, right, but

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Speaker 4: you know.

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Speaker 3: That's just not always the way it goes. I'm Joe

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Speaker 3: Matthew in Washington. That is Kaylee Lines, and we're going

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Speaker 3: to have a conversation with Mike Dorning, who is watching

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Speaker 3: some of these hearings, so you don't have to today.

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Speaker 3: It was it was RFK Jr. Yes, invited to Capitol

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Speaker 3: Hill by none other than Jim Jordan, the Republican chairman

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Speaker 3: wants doctor to the Democratic presidential candidate, who he seems

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Speaker 3: to be a fan of. And I'm still not even

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Speaker 3: sure what the whole point of the exercise was.

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Speaker 2: But RFK Jr.

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Speaker 10: Robert F.

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Speaker 2: Kennedy Junior.

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Speaker 3: I did not like the idea of being framed as

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Speaker 3: anti vax. This is something that we've been hearing about

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Speaker 3: a lot lately.

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Speaker 12: At one point you say I'm anti vax and that's

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Speaker 12: a bad thing. The other thing, the other moment, you

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Speaker 12: point out that all my children are vacs. Fact, I'm

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Speaker 12: fully compliant with the vaccine schedule myself, except for COVID.

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Speaker 12: I took flu vaccines for twenty years straight. I have

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Speaker 12: never been an anti vax.

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Speaker 1: I have never.

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Speaker 12: Told any I have never told the public avoid vaccination,

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Speaker 12: the only thing I've asked for. And my views are

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Speaker 12: constantly misrepresented so that the truth of what I believe

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Speaker 12: is not allowed to have a conversation with about that

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Speaker 12: with the American people, which I believe vaccines should be

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Speaker 12: tested with the same rigor as other medicines and medication.

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Speaker 2: All right, So there's a taste for you.

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Speaker 3: Mike Dorning is with us in studio, Bloomberg News Deputy

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Speaker 3: Congressional Editor.

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Speaker 2: What was this all about? What was the committee? What

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Speaker 2: was the purpose of the hearing?

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Speaker 13: Well, in theory was about internet censorship, but really it

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Speaker 13: was about amplifying Democratic presidential candidate who's problematic to President Biden,

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Speaker 13: because you know, potentially he could show some weakness among

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Speaker 13: Democrats and their support for President Biden. As you know,

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Speaker 13: whatever mister Kennedy's current explanation of his views on it,

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Speaker 13: vaccines are a lot of people who have doubts about

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Speaker 13: vaccines have sort of clustered around him, and he did

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Speaker 13: talk a lot about supposed links between vaccine and autism

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Speaker 13: and other things for many years.

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Speaker 4: Well, and when you say that this was about kind

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Speaker 4: of censorship, that was the premise of the hearing. And

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Speaker 4: then he said during the hearing that he was being

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Speaker 4: censored when Democratic members of the committee objected to what

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Speaker 4: he was saying some of what he was saying, and

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Speaker 4: it was kind of like the person testifying in the

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Speaker 4: Republicans were the ones on the same side going against

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Speaker 4: the Democrats on this, which is a reversal of the

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Speaker 4: dynamic that we have seen as of lead in this committee.

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Speaker 4: At least usually the target is being targeted by Republicans.

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Speaker 4: But it just kind of all speaks to this issue

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Speaker 4: of free speech and a conservative feeling largely that their

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Speaker 4: voices aren't aren't heard, that they are silenced on things

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Speaker 4: like media, social media, et cetera.

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Speaker 13: Well also it speaks to the prevalence of conspiracy theories

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Speaker 13: these days and things like. You know, the comments that

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Speaker 13: he was that the Democrats were objecting to were assertions

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Speaker 13: that Kennedy made about Caucasians and and Black people being

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Speaker 13: disproportionately vulnerable to COVID vaccines or COVID and that somehow

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Speaker 13: supposedly Ashkenazi, Jews and Asians weren't vulnerable, which you know,

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Speaker 13: was suggestive that it was somehow plot against uh racial groups.

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Speaker 3: Well so over in the Oversight Committee yesterday it was

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Speaker 3: all about Hunter Biden a hearing regarding ir S whistleblowers

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Speaker 3: tied to a probe into the president and his son,

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Speaker 3: and the hearing devolved very quickly into I don't even

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Speaker 3: know what when Marjorie Taylor Green decided to hold up

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Speaker 3: in image a pornographic image of Hunter Biden.

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Speaker 2: We'll use your imagination.

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Speaker 13: This is evidences of Hunter Biden making excuse me, this

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Speaker 13: is my time making pornography.

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Speaker 3: Should we be displaying this, mister Sherman, Yeah, that's the

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Speaker 3: ranking member. They did display as she had it held

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Speaker 3: up on an easel. As Jared Moscowitz pointed out, that

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Speaker 3: was some intern's job to produce that content.

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Speaker 14: Effort to own Hunter Biden. Okay, they're assembling nude photos

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Speaker 14: of him, right, having some intern have to sit in

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Speaker 14: a room and blow up these photos and put it

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Speaker 14: on post a board and figure out, oh, which ones

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Speaker 14: are beyond the pale.

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Speaker 3: Alexandria Cossio Cortez claimed Mike that that was a first,

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Speaker 3: an historic first where pornography was shown in a congressional hearing. Again,

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Speaker 3: what is the point of the exercise. It's not about legislation.

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Speaker 8: No, it's not.

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Speaker 13: What it's about is Congress can't really do anything at

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Speaker 13: the moment. Mostly they're logjammed with like partisan divisions and

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Speaker 13: infighting inside the Republicans. They really have nothing better to

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Speaker 13: do with their time in Washington, so they may as

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Speaker 13: well use it to score some political points that they

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Speaker 13: hope will either help them with their base or help

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Speaker 13: them with the campaign later on. Now, it's not like

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Speaker 13: Congress has never been cared about politics before. I mean,

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Speaker 13: it probably has as much to do with the inability

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Speaker 13: to get substantive stuff done as anything else. And then

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Speaker 13: just the tenor of the times, what it takes to

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Speaker 13: rile people up in this Internet age where there's so

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Speaker 13: much unfiltered product out there to rile people.

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Speaker 3: So that becomes the point then just to go viral, right,

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Speaker 3: I guess, get a viral moment the matter with the hearings.

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Speaker 13: And that's a pretty high return for a lot of

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Speaker 13: these Congress people like for their day, they can raise

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Speaker 13: a lot of money. That's how you do the email fundraising. Ironically,

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Speaker 13: one of the way things that Republicans have done while

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Speaker 13: they don't have anything better to do is censure Adam Schiff,

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Speaker 13: which weirdly enough has wound up being this.

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Speaker 4: Totals raised a ton of money off of that.

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Speaker 13: He's raised a ton of money, and he's running for

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Speaker 13: Senate in California, which is where a state where money

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Speaker 13: is more important than anywhere else because it's so large.

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Speaker 4: Well, Mike, as you're talking about the inability of Congress

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Speaker 4: to get much done, there is a lot that they

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Speaker 4: haven't been able to get done, including in the Senate,

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Speaker 4: a lot of confirmations of nominees or promotions of people

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Speaker 4: in the military. Hundreds at this point because of the

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Speaker 4: blockade of Senator Tubberville.

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Speaker 3: Joe Tommy Tuberville of Alabama. We played tape of you

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Speaker 3: yesterday the Defense Secretary asking him directly to end the blockade.

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Speaker 3: It's impacting military readiness, he says. And Bluebird caught up

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Speaker 3: with the Senator this morning on Capital Hill.

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Speaker 10: I got a letter of five thousand veterans. CIM is

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Speaker 10: fully supporting five thousand. So talked a lot of constituents,

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Speaker 10: some against phone calls have been ringing majority four sixty

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Speaker 10: percent of the people in this country we are four

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Speaker 10: not having abortions, paid for anything to do with abortion,

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Speaker 10: six percent Republicans and Democrats.

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Speaker 4: So I guess he's gonna stick with it. But Mike

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Speaker 4: not back in down. A lot of people have been

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Speaker 4: forced to weigh in on this issue, including the governor

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Speaker 4: of Florida, neighboring state from where the Senator just is from.

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Speaker 4: And he was asked about this, and it didn't seem

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Speaker 4: like he was opposed to what the Senator doing.

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Speaker 13: No, he didn't quite as I understand it. I haven't

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Speaker 13: listened to the whole show, but from what I've read

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Speaker 13: about it, didn't quite come out and endorse the military blockade.

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Speaker 13: But he did endorse what Teverville's doing.

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Speaker 3: Overall, we've got that, We've got that part of the conversation.

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Speaker 2: Listen to Ronda Santis.

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Speaker 7: Republicans and the Congress should just take a stand on this.

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Speaker 7: The DoD should stand down. We have all these other

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Speaker 7: problems in our military. You know, we need more ammunition,

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Speaker 7: we need more recruiting, we need all these other things,

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Speaker 7: and yet they're focusing on abortion tourism. So that'll be

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Speaker 7: an easy thing for me day one as commander in chief.

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Speaker 7: That policy will go out the window.

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Speaker 2: Sounds like he's hanging out with Tommy Tubberville.

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Speaker 13: Yeah, it does sound like that. You didn't hear him

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Speaker 13: quite say we shouldn't promote anyone to the rank of

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Speaker 13: general or admiral, and we should totally lock down any

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Speaker 13: promotion of flag or general officers in the military, which

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Speaker 13: is Tuberville's position. But this abortion issue is, you know,

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Speaker 13: intensely personal to people on both sides. It's highly motivating

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Speaker 13: Alabama's a very red, culturally conservative state. You would think

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Speaker 13: that guming up the military would be problematic, but in

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Speaker 13: these times, people care about this issue a lot, and

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Speaker 13: neither sides that interested in backing down.

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Speaker 2: Sound like you talking about Disney, Kaylee, Yeah, it did.

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Speaker 2: You could just substitute that very much.

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Speaker 3: So, you know, I'll be curious to hear if now

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Speaker 3: every presidential candidate needs to weigh in on this in

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Speaker 3: the next twenty four hours.

442
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:38,240
Speaker 13: I wouldn't be surprised if they do.

443
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 2: You'll hear it here, Mike, Thanks for coming over.

444
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,240
Speaker 3: Great to see if Bloomberg News Deputy Congressional editor on

445
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 3: messaging hearings that are not going to be ending anytime soon.

446
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,960
Speaker 3: Read about the the RFK testimony on the terminal. If

447
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 3: you're interested in what actually took place in the room

448
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 3: here defending himself against complaints of racist and anti smenic

449
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 3: online misinformation, you'll have a deeper dive on your terminal.

450
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,800
Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us

451
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the

452
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business app, or listen on

453
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,280
Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcast.

454
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 3: It was fifty four years ago today that the world

455
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:23,960
Speaker 3: heard this for the.

456
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 9: First time on all demand.

457
00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:35,880
Speaker 3: On Yes, the Great Neil Armstrong upon the Moon landing

458
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 3: that you know, Kaylee lines. To this day, some people

459
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 3: still think was staged. I'll never get over that.

460
00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 4: We're not going to all sorts of things today.

461
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 3: No, of course they do. And imagine if that happened now,

462
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:47,720
Speaker 3: I mean, it would.

463
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 4: You know, especially with Ai am I right right.

464
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 3: It would be Ai and it was fake and Elon

465
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 3: did it or I don't know what. But it's an

466
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:59,120
Speaker 3: opportunity to take stock of where we are here because

467
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 3: we have a very successful space program, one that was

468
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,920
Speaker 3: considered to be at least in terms of human spaceflight

469
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 3: on the rocks. At the end of the Shuttle program,

470
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 3: we were paying Russia to get to the International Space Station.

471
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,040
Speaker 3: And boy, things have changed a lot, Kaylee. You can't

472
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 3: turn on Bloomberg without seeing a rocket launch about every

473
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 3: other day now. Yeah, and we're actually, you know, we're

474
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 3: building our own rocket again to return to the Moon

475
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 3: and eventually Mars. So it's kind of the golden years

476
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,919
Speaker 3: of space all over again. As we mark this important anniversary,

477
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:31,280
Speaker 3: we thought we'd bring in Keith Cowing once again, the

478
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:34,760
Speaker 3: editor of spaceref dot com. Formerly with NASA. Keith has

479
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,320
Speaker 3: helped us through a couple of good milestones in a

480
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:39,680
Speaker 3: space flight over the past couple of months, and it's

481
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 3: great to have you back.

482
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:40,720
Speaker 2: Keith.

483
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,520
Speaker 3: First of all, happy anniversary. I guess I should say

484
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 3: to you.

485
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 8: I remember it, were you all alive?

486
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 3: I'm so happy to say that I was not alive. No,

487
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 3: So did you watch it on TV?

488
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:53,680
Speaker 1: Yeah?

489
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 8: I was fourteen. I took off when I was at

490
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,560
Speaker 8: boy Scott Camp. I rushed HOMEOD I just sat there,

491
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 8: you know, for three days watching the whole thing.

492
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 2: That's so cool.

493
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 3: I'm jealous actually, because it's been since then, since the

494
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:12,159
Speaker 3: Apollo program, right that we've we haven't had a rocket

495
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 3: of this size that we're working on now to go

496
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 3: back to the Artemis program, since the old Saturn five rockets.

497
00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 3: We're getting back into the business of deep space exploration.

498
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:22,640
Speaker 10: Keith.

499
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's sort of like day Javow. And you know,

500
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 8: the interesting thing is is you know all these questions

501
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,600
Speaker 8: about you know, did we go and who's going to

502
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 8: go back and all that. Yeah, you know, two thirds

503
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 8: of the people alive today have never seen a human

504
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 8: walk on another worldwide. So when we do it in

505
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,520
Speaker 8: four years, it's like doing the same thing again for

506
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 8: the second first time, because for them, it's for you guys,

507
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:51,400
Speaker 8: it's your first moon landing for sure.

508
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm like sitting in the studio raising my hand

509
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 4: right now, Keith, like, yes, I want to see it

510
00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:57,959
Speaker 4: for real? So when am I going to you? Just

511
00:27:58,160 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 4: you just kind of gave a year range, two, three,

512
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:03,119
Speaker 4: four years? What realistically is the timeline and who's going

513
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,199
Speaker 4: to be doing it? Am I going to be watching

514
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,760
Speaker 4: us guys back on the moon or is another country

515
00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 4: going to beat us to it?

516
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 8: Well, you know, it depends on which schedule you look at,

517
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:15,359
Speaker 8: which day of the week, and which pr you believe

518
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 8: NASA stuff. DASA is a budget problem right now, not

519
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 8: necessarily with the Moon program, but with other stuff, and

520
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 8: they've had developmental issues of the rocket all that long

521
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 8: story short, you know, when we're going to have people

522
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 8: on the moon again from the US probably several years.

523
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 8: It's probably going to be delayed again. Twenty twenty eight

524
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 8: probably is a good number to aim at, although twenty

525
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 8: seven might happen. And of course China's saying hey over here,

526
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:44,240
Speaker 8: we're going to do it by twenty thirty. Yeah, they

527
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 8: might do it earlier. We might be later. So you know,

528
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 8: all I can say is I was asked this lunch

529
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 8: on TV on an Asian network. You know who's going

530
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 8: to get back this? Well, we already did it.

531
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,959
Speaker 2: Okay, So I'm glad you said that.

532
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 8: So all right, if China goes back and we are

533
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 8: the first ones to go back, we'll just be landing

534
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:06,000
Speaker 8: next to him in our big American lanner. Roll down

535
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 8: the window and say where do y'all want us to park?

536
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 8: I mean, everybody's going back to Everybody's going back to

537
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 8: the moon. You know, it's not just US, Israel, India

538
00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,720
Speaker 8: and Japan and God knows everybody. So this is like

539
00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 8: the song that you guys didn't hear growing up, and

540
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 8: that's everyone's gone to the Moon. That's really what's happening now.

541
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 2: That's so great. And after all, we painted the parking

542
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 2: spots up there, Keith.

543
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 8: Yeah, and we left up Yeah, we left our bag

544
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,160
Speaker 8: of astronaut poo and the flags that have faded, and

545
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 8: you know all the things that you know, we forgot about.

546
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,200
Speaker 8: But you know, you know, they told me when I

547
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,160
Speaker 8: was going up that we'd be landing on the Moon

548
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:44,479
Speaker 8: by you know, the time I was in high school. Well,

549
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 8: we did it, and then they said, oh, Mars by

550
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,719
Speaker 8: nineteen eighty one. Well, you know that's the other day

551
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 8: Yaught asked me about and the answers I don't know,

552
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 8: but I'll be probably be the eighties when I should

553
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 8: have been in my twenties. So there's a lot of

554
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 8: us boomers out here. We are really frustrated, and he's like,

555
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 8: hurry out before we die.

556
00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:06,840
Speaker 4: Keith, I gotta ask you, though, as you're talking about

557
00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 4: the fact that we have already done this, why do

558
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 4: we need to prioritize doing it again? Why not just

559
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 4: focus on Mars right, Like, why is getting back to

560
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 4: the moon so important?

561
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,960
Speaker 8: Well, that's excellent question, and the answer is a historical

562
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 8: parallel to this. When the two or the British and

563
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 8: the Norwegian teams walked to the South Pole back in

564
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 8: nineteen twelve, the next time anybody did that was fifty

565
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 8: years later. They flew over it, but they didn't make that.

566
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 8: When they went back a second time, they went back

567
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 8: with tractors and all kinds of gear that didn't exist.

568
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 8: So we're going back to the Moon now, not just

569
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,760
Speaker 8: to pick up where we left off, but we're going

570
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 8: to stay. And if you're going to go to Mars,

571
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 8: and I've been on expedition to the Arctic in the Himalayas,

572
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 8: you don't want to do your homework there. You want

573
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 8: to do it before you leave in your backyard is

574
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 8: my tank? Can I set my tap in my backyard

575
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 8: at night? You know, before we go to the Arctic.

576
00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 3: So we're going to go that becomes the way station.

577
00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:00,800
Speaker 3: Then that's the gas station on the way to Mars.

578
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 2: Right well, that.

579
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 8: That's the thing. And at the south pole of the moon.

580
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 8: And by the way, everybody wants to go there. India's

581
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 8: lander may go there, Chinese lander is going to go there.

582
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 8: We're going to go there. There's water in the irregular

583
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 8: it's not dirt, but it's sort of ground rock and

584
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 8: there's water in there. And if you can extract that,

585
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 8: that's a rocket fuel to get home. And b if

586
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 8: you're going to stay there for a while, which is

587
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 8: the point, you can use that as part of the

588
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 8: atmosphere and whatever else you need to grow plants and

589
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 8: to keep your salads on your plate and keep you happy.

590
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:30,480
Speaker 8: So we're going back to stay. And that's the thing

591
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,320
Speaker 8: when once you sort of get the idea, what's it

592
00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:33,640
Speaker 8: like to live on the moon for a couple of

593
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,360
Speaker 8: years straight? My god, you probably figured out all right,

594
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 8: now we're ready to go to the Mars. We solved

595
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 8: a few of the medical problems and the life support

596
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 8: and all that. Or we could just go to Mars

597
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 8: and like Elon wants to do and you know, crush

598
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:46,840
Speaker 8: your fingers.

599
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 3: Right, wow, Keith, I hope like heck, you get to

600
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:51,120
Speaker 3: see this happen.

601
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, I will.

602
00:31:58,680 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 2: That's fine.

603
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 3: We'll have virtual reality. It'll be like you're there. It

604
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 3: don't even worry if you can't believe you're walking on

605
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 3: the moon yourself. Keith Cowing love talking with the editor

606
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 3: of space ref dot com.

607
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,120
Speaker 2: He always makes us laugh, Kailey, he does.

608
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:14,120
Speaker 4: I loved that segment.

609
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 2: Years ago.

610
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:16,400
Speaker 1: Today.

611
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:18,720
Speaker 4: Yes, don't sign me up for going to the moon,

612
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:20,480
Speaker 4: but I would gladly watch you do it.

613
00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 3: Joe, Oh god, no, no, I'm I'm not getting in

614
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 3: that line with Katie Liones. I'm Joe Matthew at Washington.

615
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 3: This is the fastest show in politics. With some final

616
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:35,360
Speaker 3: thoughts straight ahead, Thanks again to Keith and everybody chiming

617
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 3: in this hour. I'll let you know what happens since

618
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:45,720
Speaker 3: with the next mission to the Moon covering NASA from Washington.

619
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 2: Every day here on Bloomberg, this is Bloomberg.

620
00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the

621
00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, tune

622
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 1: in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business Hat.

623
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

624
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 1: flagship New York station Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty.

625
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:13,720
Speaker 2: Some final thoughts here on a story that I was

626
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:17,240
Speaker 2: remiss to not mentioning yesterday. I mean it really I

627
00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 2: feel I'm kind of embarrassed, Kaylee.

628
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 3: Everyone knows the third Wednesday in July everyone is National

629
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 3: hot Dog Day.

630
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 2: It started here in Washington. The North American.

631
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:30,440
Speaker 3: Meat Institute would do this annual hot dog lunch in

632
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:34,000
Speaker 3: Washington for lawmakers and staff. And it was such a

633
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 3: thing around fifty years that they codified it third Wednesday

634
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 3: in July National hot Dog Day.

635
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know who was.

636
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 3: Really excited about it yesterday was the Senator from Utah,

637
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,760
Speaker 3: Mitt Romney. Yeah, out with a video. He's wearing a

638
00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 3: hot dog hat and he's holding a hot dog with ketchup.

639
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 4: On it fully loaded.

640
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 15: Well, as you all know, today is National hot Dog Day,

641
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 15: and perhaps you also know that hot dog is my

642
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 15: favorite meat. I love hot dogs.

643
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 2: I love them in buns.

644
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,839
Speaker 15: I love them outside of buns with maked beans. I

645
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:12,080
Speaker 15: just like hot dogs. It's the best mess meat there is,

646
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 15: without question. So to all of you who like me,

647
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 15: are celebrating a nationalt hot Dog Day, congratulations to you,

648
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 15: and may there be many many more hot dogs served.

649
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 2: Thank you a wonderful lamb. Very well, thank you in

650
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:24,439
Speaker 2: this wonderful lamb.

651
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:27,520
Speaker 4: Joe, do you like your hot one in a bun?

652
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:33,520
Speaker 3: Inside buns are outside buns? So I said, you know,

653
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:36,600
Speaker 3: I've never I love this that you can't speak. This

654
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 3: is the best moment ever with Kaylee Liones. I just

655
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 3: want to let this ride for a minute. Do you

656
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,840
Speaker 3: put ketchup on the hot dog? Are you one of

657
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 3: those I'm not you put mustard on a hot dog?

658
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 3: You don't eat hot dogs.

659
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:53,680
Speaker 4: If I have a choice, I'm going for the burger.

660
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:55,839
Speaker 4: But I'm so happy for the Senator that he loves

661
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 4: hot I think.

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00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,319
Speaker 3: He needs to talk to dirty hair, corruption, apathy, and

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00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 3: red tape.

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00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 7: Now that doesn't bother me.

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00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:04,040
Speaker 9: But you know what does bother me?

666
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:06,480
Speaker 2: What's that? Well, you know what makes me really.

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00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 4: Sick to my stomach.

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00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 2: What's that?

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00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:12,040
Speaker 9: It's watching you stuff your face with those hot dogs. Nobody,

670
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:14,799
Speaker 9: I mean nobody puts ketchup on a hot dog.

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Speaker 3: Congratulations, as the Senator says on this hot dog Day.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Sound on Podcast.

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00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,600
Speaker 3: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify,

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Speaker 3: and anywhere else you get your podcasts, and you can

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00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:33,120
Speaker 3: find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one

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00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 3: pm Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com