WEBVTT - THE GEN-Z ATHLETE: A DEEPER UNDERSTANDING 0:00:00.880 --> 0:00:04.520 What is it with young people these days? How many 0:00:04.559 --> 0:00:09.200 conversations have started with that question that complaint Just in sports, 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:12.000 there's a clear generation gap when it comes to athletes 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.240 in gen Z. Those are the ones now in college 0:00:15.240 --> 0:00:17.680 and high school and very early in their pro careers. 0:00:18.200 --> 0:00:22.439 Their loyalty, toughness, resilience, and commitment to team are being 0:00:22.880 --> 0:00:26.760 loudly questioned by some folks in older generations. My guest 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:30.600 is Dr Kensa Gunter, an esteemed sports psychologist and one 0:00:30.600 --> 0:00:32.440 of the smartest people I've met when it comes to 0:00:32.479 --> 0:00:36.240 gaining a deeper understanding and appreciation for where young athletes 0:00:36.320 --> 0:00:39.319 are coming from, ways to reach and motivate them and 0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:44.120 maybe melts away some misconceptions. Kensa's work with athletes from 0:00:44.120 --> 0:00:47.199 the Atlanta Falcons and Georgia Tech and organizations like the 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:50.640 NBA and U S Olympic Committee. But Kenson's field of 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:54.240 expertise is much wider than sports. We also talk about 0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:57.840 useful tools for all of us to improve mental wellness 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:01.320 and ways to proactively treat our total health well cancer. 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:04.360 I am so excited about this conversation I could geek 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:08.080 out on the topics of psychology and sports psychology of 0:01:08.120 --> 0:01:11.520 young people areas you're an expert in, so I'm going 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:14.640 to approach this with a genuine enthusiasm but hoping to 0:01:14.720 --> 0:01:17.480 learn a lot from you today. Well, thank you for 0:01:17.560 --> 0:01:20.520 the opportunity to be here. I am absolutely looking forward 0:01:20.560 --> 0:01:23.320 to this conversation, and like you, I could geek out 0:01:23.360 --> 0:01:26.360 on the same topics and so I'm really hoping that 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:29.720 the audience gets something from this and it's interested in 0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:33.480 what we have to discuss, no doubt, that's our job here. 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:38.360 Let's talk about your work with younger people. I've seen 0:01:38.400 --> 0:01:43.920 you give amazing talks explaining concise, concisely and beautifully what 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:47.120 is inside the head of what has become known as 0:01:47.200 --> 0:01:50.960 generations Z kind of the post millennials born nineties seven 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:54.440 or later, so roughly twenty four years old or younger, 0:01:55.160 --> 0:01:58.400 and some of the things that confound people in my 0:01:58.560 --> 0:02:03.200 generation and in your generation, different generations. About this younger group, 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:07.760 is there unique way of looking at things? And in 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:11.000 the world of sports, lots of older people complain about 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:13.680 younger people because of things they don't do, the ways 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:16.720 that they don't think like we think, what can you 0:02:16.800 --> 0:02:20.920 share with the group about you know, this generation, the 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:24.960 characteristics in general understanding that generations are generalities and there's 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:27.320 a lot of diversity and complexity within a generation. What 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:30.359 have you found there the common threads for folks who 0:02:30.360 --> 0:02:32.840 are in gen Z. So, so the first thing I 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:35.280 want to say is is that when we think about 0:02:35.320 --> 0:02:39.560 generations and the uniqueness that exists in generations, the uniqueness 0:02:39.560 --> 0:02:42.120 exists across all generations, right, So we think of it 0:02:42.160 --> 0:02:44.360 as a facet of diversity. And so when we look 0:02:44.400 --> 0:02:46.200 at this current generation, what we have to do is 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:49.200 look at the context in which they were developing in 0:02:49.240 --> 0:02:51.280 their formative years, what was going on in the world 0:02:51.360 --> 0:02:54.760 around them, right, And so this is the generation that really, 0:02:54.800 --> 0:02:56.960 if you think about it was was raised in the 0:02:57.040 --> 0:03:00.960 time and if we think about sports like professionalization of 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:03.840 youths for the era of the helicopter parents or the 0:03:03.919 --> 0:03:08.600 law more pearance, right, the idea of instant access to information, 0:03:08.639 --> 0:03:11.640 and so you have a generation who's used to those 0:03:11.680 --> 0:03:16.600 things being very commonplace world. And so this is a 0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:22.200 generation that really is interested in belonging. They're interested in meaning, 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:26.360 they're interested in having opportunities to showcase their abilities. They're 0:03:26.440 --> 0:03:29.400 interested in connectedness. But with the era of social media 0:03:29.400 --> 0:03:32.920 and technology, they're also very interested in expressing their individuality. 0:03:33.240 --> 0:03:36.840 They're interested in understanding the why behind certain things, right. 0:03:36.840 --> 0:03:38.760 I mean, we live in the Google era where you 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:42.560 can google anything and in five seconds, so they're interested 0:03:42.600 --> 0:03:44.920 in understanding the why. I understand how they fit in 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:47.680 a larger puzzle. Puzzle. This is a generation that is 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:51.480 more diverse culturally than any of our past generations, so 0:03:51.520 --> 0:03:54.960 they're very interested in again understanding and allowing space for 0:03:55.640 --> 0:03:59.920 unique differences. Um. But it's also a generation who may 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:03.760 have had different experiences as it comes to learning how 0:04:03.760 --> 0:04:08.640 to manage frustration, learning, how to deal with setbacks and disappointments, UM, 0:04:08.760 --> 0:04:12.560 learning how to develop what previous generation might think of 0:04:12.560 --> 0:04:14.560 as some of those kind of automatic skills that you 0:04:14.680 --> 0:04:17.800 just get from from moving through day to day. They 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:21.800 may not have been had the opportunity to develop those 0:04:21.800 --> 0:04:24.479 skills in the organic way that previous generations did. So 0:04:24.520 --> 0:04:26.720 we may need to teach a little bit more for 0:04:26.760 --> 0:04:29.680 this generation to help them understand some of those principles 0:04:29.720 --> 0:04:32.800 that may feel automatic and commonplace again to generations in 0:04:32.839 --> 0:04:37.680 the past. Yeah, as those things apply to attention span. 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:42.279 You mentioned handling adversity, UH with patients. Some of the 0:04:42.279 --> 0:04:45.320 things that have always taken time to learn. What does 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:49.760 it speak to the current situation in college athletics where 0:04:49.960 --> 0:04:52.760 the transfer portal exists and a couple of thousand players 0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:55.120 are in the portal because they're seeking a new opportunity, 0:04:55.400 --> 0:04:59.880 a fresh start, and and choosing to when the time comes, 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:02.720 maybe opt out of a bowl game because they want 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:06.559 to preserve themselves for their own individual careers down the line. 0:05:06.600 --> 0:05:10.200 Things that just rock the world of of baby boomers 0:05:10.200 --> 0:05:12.640 and other generations. What does it say about this young 0:05:12.680 --> 0:05:15.240 group that that they don't think like we want them 0:05:15.240 --> 0:05:17.960 to think all the time? Yeah, I think historically what 0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:20.119 we have thought of and what we have placed value 0:05:20.160 --> 0:05:22.440 and is this idea of loyalty and this idea of 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:25.760 enduring right that was a common principle and theme that 0:05:25.800 --> 0:05:27.880 existed in the world of sport kind of you just 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:30.960 you sacrifice for the team, You endure, you suck it up, 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:34.880 you you deal with whatever the circumstances may be in 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:37.480 the situation that you're in. But again, what I think 0:05:37.480 --> 0:05:39.719 we're seeing with this generation is a desire for the 0:05:39.800 --> 0:05:42.279 values that they hold personally to match the values of 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:44.159 the team in which they're on or the university in 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:47.080 which they're attending, and I can really what I've seen 0:05:47.200 --> 0:05:49.840 is a connection between this and what I mentioned earlier, 0:05:49.880 --> 0:05:52.479 that professionalization of sport. If we think about the youth 0:05:52.480 --> 0:05:56.159 sport landscape right now, you have not only the school 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:58.320 the teams that exist at the school, but you have 0:05:58.480 --> 0:06:02.359 community based teams, you have travel teams. It really is 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:07.000 um a very intense and robust endeavor. When you think 0:06:07.000 --> 0:06:10.400 about youth sport, you have different teams that may recruit 0:06:10.480 --> 0:06:12.960 kids from across town. It's not that you play in 0:06:13.040 --> 0:06:15.640 the on the team that's in your area. You may 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:18.600 be recruited by a team across town to be the star, 0:06:18.839 --> 0:06:20.919 to have the opportunity to get the playing time. And 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:22.880 so that's what kids are familiar with it at a 0:06:22.960 --> 0:06:25.360 very young age. So the idea that they would take 0:06:25.400 --> 0:06:27.920 that mentality that I can go to a different team 0:06:28.240 --> 0:06:30.600 and be a star and get the opportunities that I want, 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:33.200 it's something that just stays with them. It doesn't seem 0:06:33.200 --> 0:06:35.120 like a foreign concept to them in the way it 0:06:35.160 --> 0:06:38.320 seems like it is to us. But that has become commonplace. 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:41.480 If we think about the elite sport youth circuit that 0:06:41.520 --> 0:06:47.000 exists across multiple sports, kids are recruited kids are showcased 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:49.600 as being stars at a very young age, and so 0:06:49.760 --> 0:06:52.599 I think it's not that we're seeing college kids do 0:06:52.760 --> 0:06:55.919 something different. College kids are doing what they're used to 0:06:55.960 --> 0:06:58.960 doing in they're they're just mirroring the experience that they've 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:01.600 had in youth sport now at the collegiate level, because 0:07:01.640 --> 0:07:04.919 they do want an opportunity, and they are thinking not 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:07.840 only about the team's success, but they are thinking about 0:07:07.839 --> 0:07:11.040 a branded name and creating opportunities for themselves. I've that's 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:14.320 a great point that is not often considered when we 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:17.400 judge college athletes. This is all they've known right since 0:07:17.680 --> 0:07:21.000 youth sports, So it doesn't seem like they're quitting on 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:23.920 their team when they're seeking a different opportunity. They don't 0:07:23.960 --> 0:07:26.560 even view it that way. I think there is a 0:07:26.600 --> 0:07:29.600 concern by people who are trying to motivate and and 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:32.280 coach this generation who are from a different generation, that 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:35.360 there is perhaps not enough concern for the name on 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:37.880 the front of the jersey and concern only for the 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:39.520 name on the back of the jersey. How do you 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:44.040 see that? Yeah, I totally think that. Um, what we 0:07:44.120 --> 0:07:46.400 have to understand is that there has been a movement 0:07:46.440 --> 0:07:49.120 and a shift for a while now, but definitely in 0:07:49.160 --> 0:07:51.520 the last few years to really emphasize and focus on 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:54.240 the person of the athlete. I think historically in the 0:07:54.240 --> 0:07:56.200 world of sport, we've done a really good job of 0:07:56.280 --> 0:08:00.680 celebrating and acknowledging the performance and really honoring and elevating 0:08:00.720 --> 0:08:04.040 that while at sometimes not even really acknowledging or honoring 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:08.080 the performer and the person that that that executed that 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:11.480 awesome performance. And so to your point, I think thinking 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:13.840 about loyalty, the team really speaks to the front of 0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:16.120 the jersey, but truly what you do see is this 0:08:16.360 --> 0:08:19.880 increased awareness and attentiveness to the name on the back right, 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:23.200 because that's a person who is having a lived experience, 0:08:23.560 --> 0:08:26.160 regardless of what sport context they're in. And I really 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:32.200 think when we think about teams, organizations, cultures, it's about 0:08:32.200 --> 0:08:34.760 how are you creating a system that allows that individual 0:08:34.800 --> 0:08:37.199 to thrive, right. I don't really think it's that kids 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:40.479 want to transfer and go to different schools, just because 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:42.199 I really think it is they want to be in 0:08:42.320 --> 0:08:45.360 environments where they feel like they are valued, respected, where 0:08:45.400 --> 0:08:47.320 they feel like they have an opportunity, where the work 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:50.600 that they put in might an opportunity that they get 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:52.760 on their field of play, and they really want to 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:56.480 know that the team that they're part of cares about them, 0:08:56.520 --> 0:09:00.640 particularly given how much they are often sacrificing for the team. 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:03.559 So yes, not only do we need to think about 0:09:03.600 --> 0:09:05.720 the name on the front, but we also need to 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:09.200 be really mindful of um and express care and concern 0:09:09.440 --> 0:09:12.319 for the name on the back as well. You work 0:09:12.400 --> 0:09:15.880 with NFL teams and be a teams. The Olympic Committee 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:18.200 will get to all those things. But you use the 0:09:18.200 --> 0:09:22.760 word culture, and so often it's well, does this player, 0:09:23.120 --> 0:09:27.120 this person fit into our culture and shouldn't they sublimate 0:09:27.280 --> 0:09:29.640 some of their own personality traits to fit into this 0:09:29.760 --> 0:09:34.079 culture because the collective is everything. That's not necessarily the 0:09:34.120 --> 0:09:37.320 way a lot of younger athletes view it. Is it? Well, 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:39.520 I think the assumption is is that just because we 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:42.560 share colors in a jersey, that we have a culture. Right. 0:09:42.800 --> 0:09:44.680 I think a lot of teams make that mistake and 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:47.440 think just because we're all under this umbrella, that means 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:50.320 that a culture is automatically created. And really, culture is 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:53.480 reflected in your actions, right, It's reflected in what you value. 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:57.000 It's reflected in how you treat one another, whether we're 0:09:57.040 --> 0:10:00.560 talking coaches to coach, coach to athlete athletes athletes like, 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:03.240 culture has to be created, and I think one of 0:10:03.280 --> 0:10:05.079 the things that we really have to be conscious of 0:10:05.200 --> 0:10:07.400 and really really have to ask ourselves, is what is 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:11.000 the culture we're creating? Right? Certainly everybody in competitive sport 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:13.480 wants the culture of winning, But what else is embedded 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:16.120 in this culture? Do we have an environment or are 0:10:16.160 --> 0:10:20.240 we cultivating an environment that allows for folks to come 0:10:20.280 --> 0:10:23.040 in with the strengths that they have, also with the 0:10:23.040 --> 0:10:25.720 weaknesses that they have, and can we create an environment 0:10:25.960 --> 0:10:29.280 that helps them to grow and thrive and fail and 0:10:29.320 --> 0:10:32.760 make mistakes and learn and still come together for this 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:35.880 common purpose, in this common goal. It's not that everyone 0:10:35.960 --> 0:10:39.080 has to be the same on the team, right, We 0:10:39.160 --> 0:10:42.120 just need to create space for everybody to contribute. I 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:44.040 think of it as a puzzle, right, And if you 0:10:44.080 --> 0:10:46.360 think of a team, and everybody on that team represents 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:48.840 a unique piece of the puzzle. All the puzzle pieces 0:10:48.840 --> 0:10:50.800 aren't the same, but we need them all in order 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:53.200 to have a complete picture. And so what I think 0:10:53.240 --> 0:10:59.040 you see is again you see individuals and wanting to 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:02.600 be a part based system that values them, right. They 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:04.440 want it to be a two way street. They don't 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:08.080 want to be the only ones showing commitment, dedication, heart 0:11:08.120 --> 0:11:10.840 and passion to the team. They want the team to 0:11:10.960 --> 0:11:13.720 actually show some of that back to them too. Yeah, 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:18.160 and being valued takes different forms from making money sharing 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:20.599 in the amazing revenues of college athletics through n i 0:11:20.800 --> 0:11:25.240 L dollars. They see their coaches being paid ten million 0:11:25.280 --> 0:11:29.920 dollars and more, breaking contracts going places, uh in the 0:11:29.960 --> 0:11:32.720 middle of a contract for greener pastors, and wonder why 0:11:32.720 --> 0:11:35.000 why they shouldn't share in that as well. You know, 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:38.840 coaching this generation cancer has been a puzzle these athletes 0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:41.080 were talking about. In this age group. Are are coached, 0:11:41.160 --> 0:11:46.320 some of them by boomers born for six Generation X 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:48.160 coaches in their fourties and fifties. And now there's you've 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:52.280 got millennials, folks born between one and nineties six, you know, 0:11:52.320 --> 0:11:55.120 at forty and younger. They're millennials coaching in the NFL, 0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:59.040 the NBA. So that's just you know, one generation removed. 0:11:59.200 --> 0:12:02.320 But what are the challenges that are may be different 0:12:02.320 --> 0:12:06.160 from other generations and trying to motivate and reach Gen Z, 0:12:06.840 --> 0:12:08.719 you know, I think the bottom line is this. What 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:12.080 we have to understand is that regardless of UM, the 0:12:12.120 --> 0:12:15.840 generation that someone identifies with UM, we really have to 0:12:15.880 --> 0:12:19.720 focus on developing relationships with folks and we really have 0:12:19.800 --> 0:12:22.600 to focus on understanding them. Right. There's a quote that 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:24.440 says people don't care what you know until they know 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:27.240 that you care. And so I think the real issue 0:12:27.240 --> 0:12:30.199 and the not real issue, the real opportunity, let me 0:12:30.240 --> 0:12:33.760 say it like that, The real opportunity exists in asking 0:12:33.760 --> 0:12:35.400 ourselves the question, what are we going to do to 0:12:35.400 --> 0:12:38.480 try to understand these young athletes that we're working with 0:12:38.559 --> 0:12:40.720 and what are we gonna do to try to reach them? 0:12:40.720 --> 0:12:43.600 And we can't just place that responsibility on the athletes 0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:45.800 to make all the adjustment. It may mean that me 0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:48.480 as a coach or me as a therapist, right, who 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:52.160 who identifies in Generation Z? I mean Generation X? I'm sorry, 0:12:52.400 --> 0:12:54.400 me as a therapist was in Generation X. I may 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:57.400 have to adopt my style to meet the person that's 0:12:57.400 --> 0:12:59.840 sitting in front of me. Right. I think smart coaches 0:12:59.880 --> 0:13:01.760 to do that, but they worry you can't coach this 0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:05.120 generation hard because if I raise my voice, I I'm 0:13:05.160 --> 0:13:09.200 not you know, consciously supportive and nurturing they're out the 0:13:09.280 --> 0:13:12.760 door like tomorrow to the other program. That's what older 0:13:12.800 --> 0:13:16.160 coaches worry about with this this current generation. And again 0:13:16.200 --> 0:13:17.840 I would say that I don't think that it's that 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:22.840 this generation can't take criticism or can't take hard coaching, um. 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:25.679 But I do think we have to be conscious that 0:13:25.679 --> 0:13:30.679 that that has to be balanced right with praise. There's 0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:33.680 nothing wrong with constructive criticism. But nobody only thrives as 0:13:33.679 --> 0:13:35.960 an environment where they're only hearing about the criticism and 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:37.960 hearing about the things that they're doing wrong. So we 0:13:38.000 --> 0:13:41.120 have to be conscious of balancing that with positive feedback, 0:13:41.160 --> 0:13:44.840 with instructive feedback, balancing that with praise when they do 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:47.680 something well. I know sometimes in sport there's this idea 0:13:47.800 --> 0:13:49.720 of well, if I tell them that they're doing something right, 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:53.000 they won't be motivated. That's that's a that's a myth 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:55.760 in fact, right, And so I don't think it's that 0:13:56.280 --> 0:14:00.360 this generation can't handle the toughness. What I do think 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:04.880 is that this generation in some ways wants to understand 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:07.040 the purpose for the toughness. There needs to be a 0:14:07.040 --> 0:14:09.800 purpose for the toughness, but beyond that it needs to 0:14:09.800 --> 0:14:12.920 be balanced and if you have a relationship with someone, 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:16.800 then offering that constructive feedback and that criticism feels like 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:20.760 just that feedback and criticism as opposed to a personal attack. 0:14:21.280 --> 0:14:23.800 There's an article that recently came out about the Los 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:27.560 Angeles Rams and they talk about how there are some 0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:31.520 principles of positive psychology that were integrated into their system, 0:14:31.560 --> 0:14:35.120 their organization, and how it contributed to the field within 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:37.840 their team a feel of respect. They said there was 0:14:38.000 --> 0:14:41.480 no yelling, coaches didn't yell, people had conversations, they talked 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:43.760 to one another. They were able to give feedback, but 0:14:43.800 --> 0:14:45.880 they were also able to come together and work toward 0:14:45.920 --> 0:14:48.440 a common goal that resulted in them winning the Super Bowl. 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:50.680 And so I think again we have to shift that 0:14:50.840 --> 0:14:55.080 idea that tough love, tough coaching, hard coaching is the 0:14:55.120 --> 0:14:58.200 only way to reach folks and understand in the context 0:14:58.200 --> 0:15:01.480 of a relationship, you can had that constructive feedback, but 0:15:01.520 --> 0:15:04.320 it has to be balanced with respect, and it has 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:07.280 to be balanced with education so that folks can learn 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:10.760 and not just Gil attacked Rams of cars coached by 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:14.240 Sean McVeigh, who's millennial. He's just thirty six years old, 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:17.440 brilliant guy and has a very young orientation to the staff. 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:22.080 You talked about, you know, working with NBA an NFL players. 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:25.920 You know John morant is in this generation, um Jamaar 0:15:26.080 --> 0:15:30.280 Chase and Justin Herbert in the NFL are are under 0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:33.280 twenty five years old. You've got maybe fifteen guys in 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:37.480 the NBA who began this season as teenagers. Joshua Promote 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:39.800 for the Spurs, who's having a good rookie season, just 0:15:39.880 --> 0:15:43.240 turned nineteen. In your work with pro athletes who are 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:46.480 very young, what is the dynamic there? That's that's different 0:15:46.480 --> 0:15:50.360 about college where for generations none of the power was 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:52.680 in the hands of the college players. In pro sports 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:55.160 is different, I mean, certainly in the world of pro sport, 0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:58.920 it's it's a different experience than being in collegiate sport. 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:00.960 There may be some overlap, says it relates to just 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:02.640 being in the world of elite sport. When you think 0:16:02.680 --> 0:16:05.880 about athletic identity, the public nature of their lives and 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:10.400 how they are um constantly living their life in the 0:16:10.440 --> 0:16:13.800 public eye right like that, those things are um certainly 0:16:13.840 --> 0:16:16.800 commonplace when we think about the transition from college to 0:16:16.920 --> 0:16:19.760 professional sports. Because the difference, one of the biggest differences 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:23.200 is pro sports is a business right, whereas collegiate sport 0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:26.000 exists in the context of an academic institution. And so 0:16:26.040 --> 0:16:28.720 I think when you think about these young athletes who 0:16:28.720 --> 0:16:31.760 are coming in, it really is about helping them make 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:36.760 that transition from college to this world of pro sport 0:16:36.800 --> 0:16:39.760 and understanding what that means. Right. It's a it's a 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:43.840 steep learning curve, but the idea of still performing at 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:46.560 an elite level, right because that's what they're expected to do, 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:49.520 but managing some of the other transitions, the length of 0:16:49.560 --> 0:16:52.840 the schedule, the diversity that exists within the organization as 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:56.000 we're talking about generational diversity and how to navigate that space, 0:16:56.440 --> 0:17:01.680 um thinking about how to manage their personal lives with 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:05.160 this new professional life right and still perform, thinking about 0:17:05.200 --> 0:17:11.440 managing family relationships, romantic relationships, relationships with new teammates, relationships 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:14.640 with new coaches. It really is providing them support as 0:17:14.680 --> 0:17:19.440 they navigate the newness of this professional sport landscape. That's 0:17:19.560 --> 0:17:21.360 that's really what we try to do, and that may 0:17:21.359 --> 0:17:24.720 look different for every individual. Right. That's why experts like 0:17:24.720 --> 0:17:26.480 you are hired because you just you iline a lot 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:30.280 of complex stuff. That's life. It's sports. It's the explosion 0:17:30.359 --> 0:17:34.239 of fame for many of them, wealth that's beyond their 0:17:34.280 --> 0:17:38.520 imagination and the and the complications that surround that. Besides 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:40.680 what use outline, what are some of the other challenges 0:17:40.720 --> 0:17:43.920 that that athletes of that generation have expressed to you 0:17:44.160 --> 0:17:47.479 who are already UM in the professional ranks. I mean, 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:49.359 I think one of the things that people might not 0:17:49.400 --> 0:17:51.760 think about sometimes is the loneliness that may come with 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:54.520 making the transition UM. In the world of collegiate sport, 0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:56.879 your schedule is made for you, and you're constantly around 0:17:56.880 --> 0:17:59.560 your teammates, if not other athletes in the department. But 0:17:59.600 --> 0:18:01.800 when you may the transition to pro sport, again, you're 0:18:01.840 --> 0:18:04.119 around your team when you're practicing, when you're traveling, when 0:18:04.119 --> 0:18:06.080 you're playing games. But there is a lot of downtime, 0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:08.560 and so trying to learn about what is it that 0:18:08.640 --> 0:18:10.240 I want to do in my downtime. How do I 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:12.840 want to spend this downtime in a way that allows 0:18:12.920 --> 0:18:17.199 me to continue developing my identity outside of my sport, 0:18:17.440 --> 0:18:19.840 but also allows me to engage in a routine that 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:21.480 allows me to show up and perform when I need 0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:23.879 to write. So it's that balance of how do I 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:28.199 become a professional, right, how do I, um take a 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:32.639 different kind of charge over managing my time, managing my energy, 0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:34.760 engaging in the things that I need to do to 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:38.719 do my job well, while also potentially exploring other areas 0:18:38.720 --> 0:18:40.440 of my life that I may not have had time 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.960 to explore before. And sometimes there can be a loneliness 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:47.879 and a real uncertainty around thinking about who am I 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:51.080 outside of basketball? Right. But that's something that we really 0:18:51.160 --> 0:18:54.480 mentioned early in the process because for all of these athletes, 0:18:54.800 --> 0:18:58.280 at some point their sport will end, right, there will 0:18:58.280 --> 0:19:01.640 be a career transition out, um, and we want people 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:05.760 to understand the sport is what you do, right, and 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:07.879 for many it's a large part of their identity, but 0:19:07.960 --> 0:19:10.600 it's not your whole identity. So really just making that 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:15.200 adjustment and expanding the view that they may have with themselves. 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:19.000 You mentioned onliness that's interesting not from yourself and professionals, 0:19:19.040 --> 0:19:21.040 but from the public. That may be a limited appetite 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:25.480 for people to express problems because you have defied incredible 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:28.360 odds by making professional sports. I mean you're literally one 0:19:28.400 --> 0:19:31.119 in a million, Um, You're living the dream that so 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:36.240 many people have and and have. You know, Riches beyond 0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:39.840 your wildest imagination, and yet you're a lonely and people 0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:42.400 don't necessarily want to acknowledge that those problems are real 0:19:42.440 --> 0:19:45.960 and significant. Uh yeah. I think sometimes people have this 0:19:46.119 --> 0:19:48.760 idea that being in the public sphere or having access 0:19:48.800 --> 0:19:54.560 to financial resources eliminates any stress and eliminates the reality 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:58.440 of you experiencing any kind of struggle, strife, or distress 0:19:58.480 --> 0:20:00.840 in your life, right, And I think reality is is 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.680 that that's that's not the case. These are people. Yes, 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:06.040 they are extraordinary and what they do in their field 0:20:06.040 --> 0:20:08.680 of play extraordinary, but they are people first, and being 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:10.879 in sport does not absolve people from some of the 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:14.600 ills and the struggles and the stresses that happen for 0:20:14.720 --> 0:20:16.879 any of us as we're trying to navigate life. And 0:20:16.920 --> 0:20:19.560 so I know, for something it's like but they have 0:20:19.720 --> 0:20:22.960 access to so much, but they also have some unique pressures. 0:20:23.040 --> 0:20:25.119 And again, like I said, there are people first. So 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:28.200 they're also trying to navigate relationships, understand who they are, 0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:30.880 like I said, develop their identity, and they're also trying 0:20:30.880 --> 0:20:34.080 to perform consistently at a high level on a public 0:20:34.119 --> 0:20:38.560 stage where it has real implications um for their career, 0:20:38.760 --> 0:20:41.800 for their ability to potentially provide for their family, real 0:20:41.880 --> 0:20:45.199 implications that that they have to be mindful of and 0:20:45.200 --> 0:20:48.440 that are constantly top of mind. And so there are 0:20:48.480 --> 0:20:52.159 some there are some great opportunities, but again, the opportunities 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:55.160 don't erase the fact that as people, they still deal 0:20:55.200 --> 0:21:00.000 with some challenges. To your pride, Graduate of University of Georgy, 0:21:00.000 --> 0:21:02.159 you're drinking from a mug that says dogs on it, 0:21:02.600 --> 0:21:06.560 and the dogs sit atop the college football world after 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:10.960 conquering Alabama. Finally we talked about this, uh about a 0:21:11.000 --> 0:21:14.920 week or so ago. The collective psychology of sport fascinates me. 0:21:14.960 --> 0:21:18.040 I covered team sports and individual sports like tennis, but 0:21:18.160 --> 0:21:23.240 let's focus on the team aspect and the SEC mythology. 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:27.720