1
00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,640
Speaker 1: This is Dana Perkins and you're listening to Switched on

2
00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,720
Speaker 1: the BNAF podcast. So last week BNF held its annual

3
00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:09,680
Speaker 1: summit in New Delhi, but this year was different because

4
00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:13,560
Speaker 1: it took place alongside the B twenty or Business twenty meetings.

5
00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,200
Speaker 1: These are the official business community Engagement forum for the

6
00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:20,919
Speaker 1: G twenty meetings. Among the attendees was Amaitab Khant, the

7
00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:23,560
Speaker 1: SHEHRPA of this year's G twenty summit in New Delhi.

8
00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:26,880
Speaker 1: Amatab has had a long career in Indian public service,

9
00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:30,360
Speaker 1: with many roles focused on promoting business interests in the country.

10
00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,440
Speaker 1: He formerly served as the Secretary for the Department of

11
00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:37,040
Speaker 1: Industrial Policy and Promotion, the Chairman and CEO of the

12
00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:41,519
Speaker 1: Delhi Mumbai Industrial Corporation, the Secretary for the Indian Ministry

13
00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,240
Speaker 1: of Tourism, the Managing Director of the Kerala State Industrial

14
00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:49,199
Speaker 1: Development Corporation, and most recently the current CEO of the

15
00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:52,600
Speaker 1: Government of India's think tank n t Ayak. At the summit,

16
00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:55,960
Speaker 1: BNAF CEO John Moore sat down with Amatab on stage

17
00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:59,400
Speaker 1: for an interview. Together, they discussed his vision for India

18
00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:03,360
Speaker 1: as a large scale green hydrogen producing nation. India's expanding

19
00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,800
Speaker 1: electric vehicle sector and how a well designed circular economy

20
00:01:06,840 --> 00:01:10,120
Speaker 1: might feed into it, and how attracting private capital investment

21
00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:14,000
Speaker 1: will help to decarbonize India's hard to abate sectors. As always,

22
00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:16,560
Speaker 1: if you like this podcast, make sure to subscribe to

23
00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:19,440
Speaker 1: receive updates on future episodes and give us a review

24
00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:22,479
Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to make us more discoverable

25
00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:25,920
Speaker 1: by others. And now let's listen to John's conversation with

26
00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:27,839
Speaker 1: A G twenty shirpup Am tab Kant.

27
00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,399
Speaker 2: And now it is my great pleasure to ask to

28
00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:48,800
Speaker 2: come on the stage, Ami tab Can mister Ami tab

29
00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:54,200
Speaker 2: Kent G twenty Scherpa, former CEO of Nitti Ayog, So

30
00:01:54,400 --> 00:02:03,120
Speaker 2: please come and join me. You joined us for our

31
00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:06,360
Speaker 2: first event here twenty seventy, so thank you very much

32
00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:10,720
Speaker 2: for sticking with us. It's been an interesting last few years,

33
00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:14,079
Speaker 2: not least for COVID. So we had some virtual events.

34
00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:19,280
Speaker 2: And actually you just put out a book and this

35
00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,480
Speaker 2: is the book. When I knew about it, Amazon delivered

36
00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:26,440
Speaker 2: in a day or two and it's a fascinating book.

37
00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:29,280
Speaker 2: And I suppose question one is why did you write

38
00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,760
Speaker 2: a book? Why did you think a book was required.

39
00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:36,160
Speaker 3: So the book is about you know, it's on seventy

40
00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:40,560
Speaker 3: five years of business and enterprise in India. And I've

41
00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:43,560
Speaker 3: been a great believer that if India has to grow

42
00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:47,200
Speaker 3: at high rates of eight to nine percent per annum

43
00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,560
Speaker 3: for the next three decades and lift a vast segment

44
00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:54,120
Speaker 3: of our population above the poverty line, is the private

45
00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:56,400
Speaker 3: sector which has to be the key driver of growth,

46
00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:59,440
Speaker 3: and the government must retreat in a range of areas.

47
00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:04,120
Speaker 3: And you know, on the eve of our colonization, actually

48
00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:07,440
Speaker 3: we had twenty four percent of the global GDP. By

49
00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:09,840
Speaker 3: the time we became independent, it had come down to

50
00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:14,400
Speaker 3: just five percent in nineteen forty seven, and then you know,

51
00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:17,360
Speaker 3: the British Raj was replaced by a lot of license raj.

52
00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:21,120
Speaker 3: So I really believe that now we are the fifth

53
00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:24,840
Speaker 3: largest economy in the world. We are accelerating the pace

54
00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:27,920
Speaker 3: of growth in the by twenty twenty seven will be

55
00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,720
Speaker 3: the third largest economy in the world. But the important

56
00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:33,400
Speaker 3: thing is to raise per capita incomes in a very

57
00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:36,960
Speaker 3: big way, and that would require India to have three

58
00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:41,040
Speaker 3: decades of high growth rate. We've grown at high rates

59
00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:43,800
Speaker 3: but for limited period of five to six years. So

60
00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:46,760
Speaker 3: we need to grow at eight percent plus for three

61
00:03:46,880 --> 00:03:50,320
Speaker 3: decades and that's critical to be a way developed and

62
00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:53,680
Speaker 3: an advanced economy. And they're the role of private sector

63
00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:58,200
Speaker 3: in energy transition, in sunrise areas of growth, a vast

64
00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:00,800
Speaker 3: range of areas. The disruption has to come in from

65
00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:01,680
Speaker 3: the private sector.

66
00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:04,280
Speaker 2: And how do you you mentioned private sectors being an

67
00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,960
Speaker 2: engine for that growth. How do you think the private

68
00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:09,680
Speaker 2: sector and government can best work together because it needs

69
00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:11,800
Speaker 2: to be a partnership. How do you think about that?

70
00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:16,400
Speaker 3: So if you look at recent times, the government has

71
00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:20,400
Speaker 3: actually acted as a facilitator and a catalyst, and it's

72
00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:22,960
Speaker 3: done a lot of job in the central government, a

73
00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:28,880
Speaker 3: lot of job of cleaning up rules, regulation procedures. Acts

74
00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:32,479
Speaker 3: is scrapped, fifteen hundred laws. It's done a huge amount

75
00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:35,560
Speaker 3: of work on ease of doing business. It's brought in

76
00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:39,080
Speaker 3: the Goods and Services Tax, which replaces about twenty eight

77
00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:43,680
Speaker 3: different taxes and cesses, broad in the Insolvency and Bankruptcy Code,

78
00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,200
Speaker 3: the Real Estate Regulation Act. It brought down corporate taxes

79
00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:49,160
Speaker 3: to global benchmarks.

80
00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:50,800
Speaker 4: It's done a lot.

81
00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:54,520
Speaker 3: It's done a lot now it gave away a lot

82
00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:58,479
Speaker 3: in terms of resources, so that corporate balance sheets could

83
00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:03,040
Speaker 3: improve when it reduced corporate taxes. It's now important that

84
00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:06,159
Speaker 3: the private sector really in the post COVID era, puts

85
00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:10,200
Speaker 3: in resources for investments and drives further growth.

86
00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:11,080
Speaker 4: This is critical.

87
00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:13,360
Speaker 3: The second key thing is I think what the central

88
00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:17,200
Speaker 3: government has done, the same thing has to be done

89
00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:22,240
Speaker 3: by a number of state governments. Because India's very large countries.

90
00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:24,680
Speaker 3: It's bigger than twenty five countries of Europe. So you

91
00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:28,800
Speaker 3: need states to become the key driver of bringing in

92
00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:33,200
Speaker 3: ease of doing business and driving those states. Urbanization will

93
00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:35,400
Speaker 3: be a very key driver of growth in the coming years.

94
00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:38,960
Speaker 3: And my belief is that India needs to fire on

95
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:39,880
Speaker 3: all cylinders.

96
00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:41,520
Speaker 4: It can be just services.

97
00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,520
Speaker 3: You need to grow on manufacturing, you need to raise

98
00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:49,960
Speaker 3: your agriculture productivity, and you need to do sustained sustainable urbanization.

99
00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:54,040
Speaker 2: For a long time, any thoughts on government companies, government

100
00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,200
Speaker 2: owned state owned enterprises.

101
00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:59,240
Speaker 3: So I've been you know, several state companies have done

102
00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,479
Speaker 3: very well. But I've been a long term believer and

103
00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:05,040
Speaker 3: that's the government philosophy that government should remain in.

104
00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:06,839
Speaker 4: Just four key sectors.

105
00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,600
Speaker 3: Other sectors government should actually get out and government should

106
00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:13,960
Speaker 3: ensure that the private sector steps in in many of these.

107
00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:15,279
Speaker 4: Key areas of growth.

108
00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:18,640
Speaker 3: So a few sectors where it's critical government should remain.

109
00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:22,640
Speaker 3: Otherwise it should be there should be private sector play

110
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:23,240
Speaker 3: in India.

111
00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,400
Speaker 2: Okay, and let's talk a little bit about innovation, because

112
00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:28,560
Speaker 2: you talk a lot about innovation and you've personally been

113
00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:33,640
Speaker 2: involved in a lot of legislation for innovation over the years.

114
00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:36,960
Speaker 2: What do you think of the real strengths India has

115
00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:38,760
Speaker 2: in innovation space.

116
00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,200
Speaker 3: Let's say, so, I think you know one of the

117
00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:44,520
Speaker 3: biggest innovations India has done. If you look at the

118
00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,479
Speaker 3: last two and a half decades, most innovation has come

119
00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:51,880
Speaker 3: out of tech companies. Has come out of Google, It's

120
00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:56,279
Speaker 3: come out of Microsoft, Apple, Amazon in the western part

121
00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:58,039
Speaker 3: of the world, and it's come out of Tencent and

122
00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:02,280
Speaker 3: Ali Baba in China. But in India's case, we took

123
00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:06,240
Speaker 3: a different model of digital public infrastructure where the public

124
00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:09,800
Speaker 3: interest layer was created by the government on top of

125
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,280
Speaker 3: which we've allowed private sector to innovate. And these are

126
00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:17,200
Speaker 3: open source models, these are open APIs, They are interoperable.

127
00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,640
Speaker 3: So you know, between twenty fifteen twenty seventeen, we opened

128
00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,880
Speaker 3: five hundred and fifty million bank accounts. Today India does

129
00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:29,280
Speaker 3: about eleven x more fast payments than what USA and

130
00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,280
Speaker 3: Europe do. We do forty six percent of the real

131
00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:33,880
Speaker 3: time fast payments in the world.

132
00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,080
Speaker 4: We do four x of what China does.

133
00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:40,760
Speaker 3: So we've created a whole range of digital public infrastructure,

134
00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:44,720
Speaker 3: including an education, digit Loca, many other So that's a

135
00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 3: huge innovation. But the other big thing that's happened is

136
00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,200
Speaker 3: that we started the startup India movement. In twenty sixteen,

137
00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:53,520
Speaker 3: there were just about one hundred and fifty six startups.

138
00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:57,160
Speaker 3: Today you have a over about one hundred thousand startups

139
00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:00,680
Speaker 3: and many of these startups actually what they did then.

140
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:05,200
Speaker 3: Once we'd created the digital public infrastructure layer, you're seeing

141
00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:09,720
Speaker 3: many startups doing a cash less, a paperless credit.

142
00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:12,480
Speaker 4: It's all cash less, paperless.

143
00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:15,800
Speaker 3: There are many other startups who then went in and

144
00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,560
Speaker 3: started creating wealth. So you have a startups like Zeroeda,

145
00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:23,480
Speaker 3: grow up Stock which started creating taking the stock market

146
00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,240
Speaker 3: into Tire to tire three cities. Almost twenty nine percent

147
00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:29,520
Speaker 3: of the stock market is controlled by a young startup

148
00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:32,760
Speaker 3: like Zeroeda. Then you had a number of young startups

149
00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:37,840
Speaker 3: like go Digit and Acho which took insurance a cash less,

150
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,440
Speaker 3: paperless you can get an insurance policy in India in

151
00:08:40,559 --> 00:08:45,040
Speaker 3: less than a minute to all people in rural areas.

152
00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,480
Speaker 4: So what we've seen is huge disruption, huge.

153
00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:52,640
Speaker 3: Innovation on the back of the digital public infrastructure.

154
00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:56,600
Speaker 2: Right and in the book you talk about platforms and

155
00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:59,520
Speaker 2: innovative ecosystems. I want to say a little bit more

156
00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:00,040
Speaker 2: about that.

157
00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:00,559
Speaker 4: Yeah.

158
00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:04,640
Speaker 3: So, actually, the model that we've created, if you look

159
00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:07,280
Speaker 3: at the world, the model that we've created is that

160
00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,840
Speaker 3: every Indian has a digital identity, every Indian has a

161
00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:14,679
Speaker 3: bank account, every Indian has a mobile and the cost

162
00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:19,280
Speaker 3: of acquisition of the customer has fallen way radically. In India,

163
00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:22,840
Speaker 3: it used to be about thirty five dollars to acquire

164
00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:25,240
Speaker 3: a customer. It's come down to one dollar because you

165
00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,200
Speaker 3: can now acquire a customer on the basis of his

166
00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:33,360
Speaker 3: digital identity. In Europe and USA, it's all paperwork, it's

167
00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:34,560
Speaker 3: all you know.

168
00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,240
Speaker 4: So it's still over one hundred dollars.

169
00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:41,040
Speaker 3: To acquire a customer. The cost of acquisition of customer has.

170
00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:42,480
Speaker 4: Fallen very radically.

171
00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:45,640
Speaker 3: The challenge in the world today is that you have

172
00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:48,719
Speaker 3: about four billion people who do not have an identity.

173
00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:50,760
Speaker 3: There are two and a half billion people who do

174
00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:53,880
Speaker 3: not have a bank account. One thirty three countries in

175
00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:57,360
Speaker 3: the world do not have a fast payment mechanism. So

176
00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:59,679
Speaker 3: if you want to provide, if you want to transform

177
00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,199
Speaker 3: the world, world, you need to take the India model

178
00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:04,880
Speaker 3: of digital public infrastructure to the rest of the world

179
00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:08,600
Speaker 3: and transform many of the global South countries to really

180
00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:09,400
Speaker 3: uplift them.

181
00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:11,000
Speaker 4: Very sharply great.

182
00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:14,320
Speaker 2: It's great to see that sort of business model approach

183
00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:15,120
Speaker 2: to SCALU.

184
00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:18,680
Speaker 3: And it's all private sector innovation, it's all young startups,

185
00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:20,720
Speaker 3: they're all national assets of India.

186
00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:27,000
Speaker 2: And are there clearly you're very passionate about platforms. Are

187
00:10:27,040 --> 00:10:29,840
Speaker 2: there any other innovations that you think we should keep

188
00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:32,400
Speaker 2: our eye on that you think are particularly important?

189
00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:37,640
Speaker 3: John, I think one of the biggest stories the energy

190
00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:41,200
Speaker 3: transition story of India, and I think it's important to

191
00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:45,000
Speaker 3: realize this that we do about one hundred and eighty

192
00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:49,080
Speaker 3: five gigaward of clean energy. Now we are on the

193
00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:54,320
Speaker 3: road to do major transformation. My personal view is that

194
00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,959
Speaker 3: not merely renewables, but India will do path breaking work

195
00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,720
Speaker 3: in greenheight rogen. Will be the cheapest producer of green

196
00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:07,360
Speaker 3: hydrogen simply because of climatic conditions. The size and scale

197
00:11:07,400 --> 00:11:11,120
Speaker 3: of India and very good young entrepreneurship. And actually my

198
00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:15,040
Speaker 3: view is that the green hydrogen mission etc. When implemented,

199
00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:18,320
Speaker 3: will lead to actually India becoming And you know, the

200
00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:21,960
Speaker 3: challenge is that even if you were to do all

201
00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:26,280
Speaker 3: your electricity clean electricity, it will be only twenty percent

202
00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:26,920
Speaker 3: of energy.

203
00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:27,880
Speaker 4: You need to.

204
00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:34,880
Speaker 3: Really decarbonize hard to abate sectors like refinery, steel, cement, fertilizer,

205
00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:36,640
Speaker 3: all that.

206
00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:39,040
Speaker 4: That can't be done with electricity. You need green hydrogen.

207
00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:42,600
Speaker 3: And my view is that by twenty forty seven India

208
00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,720
Speaker 3: will be a global champion of green hydrogen, will actually

209
00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:49,360
Speaker 3: be instead of importing two hundred billion worth of fossil

210
00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:52,600
Speaker 3: fuel which we do now, will be actually exporting energy.

211
00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,320
Speaker 2: So a couple of other questions around the transition now

212
00:11:56,360 --> 00:12:00,320
Speaker 2: we've made to the energy transition CCS. So what are

213
00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:04,319
Speaker 2: your thoughts on CCS. It's a devised opinion often.

214
00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:08,000
Speaker 3: So my view is that we need to do more

215
00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:11,720
Speaker 3: work technologically on CCS to bring down to make it

216
00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:15,520
Speaker 3: commercially viable. I think we need to do more work

217
00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:20,240
Speaker 3: in terms of establishing its commercial viability. I think more

218
00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:23,480
Speaker 3: resources need to be put in there. You know, the

219
00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:26,400
Speaker 3: challenge for the world is that there's no shortage of resources.

220
00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,360
Speaker 3: I mean, you talked about a couple of trillion the

221
00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:32,080
Speaker 3: world is. The world is today sitting on three hundred

222
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:36,800
Speaker 3: and fifty trillion dollars. Pension funds and investment asset companies

223
00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,439
Speaker 3: are sitting on one hundred and fifty trillion dollar. We

224
00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:42,559
Speaker 3: need to de risk some of these areas to allow

225
00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:43,920
Speaker 3: more resources to flow in.

226
00:12:44,280 --> 00:12:45,640
Speaker 4: So no shortage of funds.

227
00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:50,520
Speaker 3: But my view is that long distance transportation etc. Will first,

228
00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:55,000
Speaker 3: you know, and refinery. For instance, India consumes twelve percent

229
00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:57,800
Speaker 3: of the gray hydrogen, so the first route will be

230
00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:02,440
Speaker 3: green hydrogen because will be easier to make it commercially doable.

231
00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:04,920
Speaker 4: It's technologically established, so.

232
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,720
Speaker 3: Green hydrogen, and it's in its liquid form green ammonia,

233
00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:11,040
Speaker 3: which can then be exported to the rest of the world.

234
00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:13,959
Speaker 3: Green hydrogen will be the first bet. A little more

235
00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:15,920
Speaker 3: work on ccs is required.

236
00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:18,120
Speaker 2: Okay, great, that's very clear, thank you. And then the

237
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,280
Speaker 2: other key key area of circularity. Again, that's another area

238
00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:24,720
Speaker 2: that devines people. What are your thoughts on there?

239
00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:31,480
Speaker 3: So I'm a great believer that circularity is critical. It's

240
00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:36,679
Speaker 3: not possible to do complete new areas of growth. All

241
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:38,520
Speaker 3: these are new areas of growth. I mean you have

242
00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:43,240
Speaker 3: a scenario in China where two wheeler, where vehicles, four

243
00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:46,840
Speaker 3: four where wheeler electric vehicles are all dumped.

244
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,600
Speaker 4: They become the biggest dumping grounds today in China.

245
00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,360
Speaker 3: I mean cities are after cities are just become dumping

246
00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:57,559
Speaker 3: grounds of two wheelers, three wheelers and four wheelers because

247
00:13:57,679 --> 00:13:59,920
Speaker 3: every year you have a new electric model coming in

248
00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:03,040
Speaker 3: I mean lithium, cobalt nickel.

249
00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:04,120
Speaker 4: We are not importers.

250
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:08,640
Speaker 3: We've not taken over colonies and countries in Africa to

251
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:11,920
Speaker 3: do mining. But you will need battery and it's very

252
00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,880
Speaker 3: important that when you do battery for both on the

253
00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:17,800
Speaker 3: electric side, on the mobility side and for the mobile

254
00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:18,920
Speaker 3: telephony side.

255
00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:21,000
Speaker 4: We need a vast number of.

256
00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:25,400
Speaker 3: Young Indian companies which get into the business of recycling.

257
00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:29,240
Speaker 3: But more important than that is that we need from

258
00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:33,120
Speaker 3: the design process itself, and the design process is very

259
00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:34,360
Speaker 3: critical that.

260
00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:37,160
Speaker 4: Later to do it will be very difficult.

261
00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:40,479
Speaker 3: You need from the design process itself in the manufacturing

262
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:45,400
Speaker 3: that everything must become an input into another production level

263
00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:48,080
Speaker 3: and that will require a huge amount of innovative work

264
00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,120
Speaker 3: to be done to drive circularity. It can be done

265
00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,680
Speaker 3: by rules and regulations too much. If you put in

266
00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:57,160
Speaker 3: too many rules, the rules hamper ease of doing business.

267
00:14:57,480 --> 00:14:59,840
Speaker 3: You need to push the limits on innovation.

268
00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:04,040
Speaker 2: And we talked about a few different technological options. If

269
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:09,200
Speaker 2: you're speaking to entrepreneurs or business people funding entrepreneurs, which

270
00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:11,840
Speaker 2: sectors do you think right now in India? Which are

271
00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:13,560
Speaker 2: the ones that you would really focus on.

272
00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:18,880
Speaker 3: I think India is the cusp of electric mobility revolution.

273
00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:25,320
Speaker 3: Everybody will buy electric vehicle. Whether we've already done a

274
00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:29,120
Speaker 3: substantial amount on two wheelers three wheelers, is India consumes

275
00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:32,400
Speaker 3: about seventy percent of our vehicles are two wheelers, and

276
00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:35,280
Speaker 3: we've done a lot on two wheelers and three wheelers.

277
00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:38,800
Speaker 3: We are now going to buy fifty thousand, almost close

278
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:41,920
Speaker 3: to fifty thousand electric buses. So this is a huge

279
00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:46,120
Speaker 3: opportunity for making India in electric buses. Every two three

280
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:49,600
Speaker 3: tier cities will only have electric buses. Actually, then that

281
00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:53,760
Speaker 3: opens up the opportunity for vast number of fast chargers

282
00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,680
Speaker 3: in India, and that opens up a vast opportunity because

283
00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,200
Speaker 3: India is a great automobile manufacturer. When the world it

284
00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:04,000
Speaker 3: is moving from combustion to electric, you're moving from two

285
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:07,160
Speaker 3: hundred parts to just twenty five paths, and India needs

286
00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:10,440
Speaker 3: to become a global champion of electric vehicle manufacturing to

287
00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:11,520
Speaker 3: export the rest.

288
00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:11,840
Speaker 4: Of the world.

289
00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:16,320
Speaker 2: Great again, very clear, emaability is to your top choice.

290
00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,640
Speaker 2: And then one final question, we have one minute left.

291
00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:23,520
Speaker 2: You talked about growth earlier and actually the World Bank

292
00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:27,480
Speaker 2: says GDP in India will probably five times bigger by

293
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:31,960
Speaker 2: mid century. We've talked about decarbonizing. What would be your

294
00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,400
Speaker 2: key message for the leaders in this room for green growth?

295
00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 2: How to grow and decarbonize? What would be the key

296
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:39,880
Speaker 2: thing for them to think about.

297
00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:44,080
Speaker 3: So I'm a great believer that the only way India

298
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,760
Speaker 3: should grow net zero's net positive for India, it's important

299
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,800
Speaker 3: to go digital and go green. If you go digital

300
00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:55,080
Speaker 3: and go green, you will attract your companies, will attract

301
00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:58,120
Speaker 3: greater value, You'll be able to attract capital from the

302
00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:02,239
Speaker 3: rest of the world. So get down to just focusing

303
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:05,040
Speaker 3: on going green. There's no shortage of capital in the world.

304
00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:05,760
Speaker 4: Let me tell you.

305
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,119
Speaker 3: I mean the world is flushed with funds right now.

306
00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:11,880
Speaker 3: All you need to do is to push the limits

307
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:12,560
Speaker 3: on going green.

308
00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:17,320
Speaker 2: Great, So they're aligned going green and being successful as

309
00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:20,680
Speaker 2: the same. Yeah, and being digital. Thank you very much,

310
00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,200
Speaker 2: so thank you. You joined us seven years ago, you

311
00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:27,120
Speaker 2: join us again today. Please join me in thanking, mister Cant.

312
00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,760
Speaker 1: Bloomberg n EF is a service provided by Bloomberg Finance

313
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:44,320
Speaker 1: LP and its affiliates. This recording does not constitute, nor

314
00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:48,560
Speaker 1: should it be construed, as investment advice, investment recommendations, or

315
00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:52,120
Speaker 1: a recommendation as to an investment or other strategy. Bloomberg

316
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:55,520
Speaker 1: an EF should not be considered as information sufficient upon

317
00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,160
Speaker 1: which to base an investment decision. Neither Bloomberg Finance LP

318
00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,800
Speaker 1: Nor any of its affiliates makes any representation or warranty

319
00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:05,800
Speaker 1: as to the accuracy or completeness of the information contained

320
00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:08,919
Speaker 1: in this recording, and any liability as a result of

321
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:10,879
Speaker 1: this recording is expressly disclaimed.