WEBVTT - Renée Fleming 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:03.480 This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing. 0:00:26.680 --> 0:00:31.680 Renee Fleming has a powerful effect on people. Conductor Sir 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:38.880 George Shoalty described the opera singer's voice as double cream. 0:00:38.920 --> 0:00:43.040 Garrison Keeler said she made his nostrils twitch. New York 0:00:43.120 --> 0:00:47.199 chef Daniel Blue created a signature dessert to honor her. 0:00:48.280 --> 0:00:52.800 But Renee Fleming is down to earth. When the People's Diva, 0:00:52.920 --> 0:00:57.000 as she's been called, went to Paris to rehearse Handle's Alcina, 0:00:57.360 --> 0:00:59.920 one of her favorite roles, she spent most of the 0:01:00.040 --> 0:01:03.200 first week looking for playgrounds for her two young daughters. 0:01:04.400 --> 0:01:08.119 Renee grew up in Rochester, New York, where both her 0:01:08.120 --> 0:01:12.000 parents were high school music teachers. During the first two 0:01:12.120 --> 0:01:14.720 years of her life, while in her playpen, Renee would 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:18.720 listen while her mother gave singing lessons. A few years later, 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:22.960 Renee organized a barbershop trio with her younger sister and brother. 0:01:23.800 --> 0:01:28.360 One might say Renee Fleming was born into music. Often 0:01:28.400 --> 0:01:31.479 refer to myself as an indentured servant because we grew 0:01:31.560 --> 0:01:33.800 up with it. My parents were both We all sang 0:01:33.840 --> 0:01:36.440 all the time. You take a family cross country trip 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:39.440 and be singing the road signs and in harmony, and 0:01:39.480 --> 0:01:42.160 I thought everybody did that. I just like, oh, well, 0:01:42.160 --> 0:01:44.120 this is what families do. Your friends would get in 0:01:44.160 --> 0:01:45.720 the car with your family and it was like throw 0:01:45.800 --> 0:01:50.000 on with these crazy flemings, exactly fleming and singing to 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:52.720 the trees, missing to the exit signs, and and we 0:01:52.800 --> 0:01:55.720 talked about singing. Did you feel like this was your 0:01:55.760 --> 0:01:59.240 way to communicate with your own parents? Well, interestingly, my 0:01:59.320 --> 0:02:02.200 dad was a big jazz fan. My mother didn't bring 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:05.040 music home much at all. She wanted to break from 0:02:05.040 --> 0:02:08.240 it when she came home. Other than when we performed, 0:02:08.280 --> 0:02:11.240 she prepared us. You know, I think her idea was 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:13.680 that we would be the next one traps. You know. 0:02:13.760 --> 0:02:15.960 My father, thank god, put the kabushion then and said, 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.760 I don't think so. Um. Let me guess your mother 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:22.120 was the competitive one. She She was very type AI, 0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:26.000 you know, she's check and my my grandmother and my 0:02:26.080 --> 0:02:28.359 aunts were all like this. I mean they would come 0:02:28.360 --> 0:02:32.240 over and they just the work ethic was unbelievable. I 0:02:32.280 --> 0:02:35.040 think I work hard. No no, no no. They used 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:36.840 to look at me and say, you know, Renee, you're 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:39.280 you really need to step it up. You know, and 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:41.480 I see myself doing the same thing with my two daughters, 0:02:41.520 --> 0:02:43.800 so I can't I sort of can't help it. But 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:46.000 the music thing, you know, it was just so natural 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:49.800 for us, and my way of rebelling against it was 0:02:49.840 --> 0:02:52.400 to find my own music. So I became a composer 0:02:53.080 --> 0:02:57.360 in middle school, started writing songs and then I played piano, 0:02:57.400 --> 0:02:59.920 I played guitar. And what kind of music did you write, 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:03.880 you're like, John, Yeah, it was sort of singer what 0:03:04.040 --> 0:03:07.000 we call now singer songwriter, But I also wrote art 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:10.480 songs that I actually notated and wrote out that other 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:14.040 people sang. In that time, women weren't particularly encouraged to 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:17.160 be composers. In a different setting, that might have been 0:03:17.200 --> 0:03:19.400 the direction I would have gone in, because I loved 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:22.120 it and it suited my temperament much better than performing. 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:25.200 I was so shy. Performing was so far away from 0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:30.480 whoever he was. A specific opera, the first opera, if 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:33.840 you can recall, because I remember the first movie I 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:36.520 went to see in a movie theater. What was the 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:45.480 first opera that you became you know, I would say, gosh, sure, Angelica. 0:03:45.600 --> 0:03:50.160 This is what I remember because my mother performed it 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:53.960 and we were in the first row, and this is 0:03:54.000 --> 0:03:56.360 the Eastman Theater. So first of all, I was incredibly 0:03:56.360 --> 0:04:00.960 impressed by the theater, this massive chandelier, you know, all 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:03.440 the velvet. I mean I took up violin because of 0:04:03.480 --> 0:04:06.520 the velvet in the case. So there were nothing if 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.760 not superficial. I guess you know. I didn't really know 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:14.000 anything about the story, but she was crying, and she 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:16.400 was crying because she was singing about, you know, her 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:18.560 her dead baby and wanting to be joined with her 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:20.919 baby again. And you looking at her three children in 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:23.880 front of her. Somehow, I think that really impressed me. 0:04:24.320 --> 0:04:26.760 Did you ever imagine at that time it mean the 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:29.960 middle school and you're seeing this piece, that that would 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:31.360 be a path for you, that you would end up 0:04:31.400 --> 0:04:36.520 where you are now. Gosh, no, nobody really asked kids 0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:40.360 in those days, what do you want exactly? What would 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:43.800 you like to do? You just went along. I know 0:04:43.920 --> 0:04:46.720 so many people in my generation who applied to three 0:04:46.760 --> 0:04:50.200 colleges and never gave it much thought. And really, you know, 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:54.240 the way we raised children now is worlds apart from 0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:56.839 how we were raised. How do you feel? How do 0:04:56.839 --> 0:04:59.200 you feel? My parents couldn't give a damn? How I 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:02.120 felt no, really, the only thing I thought that I 0:05:02.160 --> 0:05:05.680 wanted to be was the president. So there was i'd say, 0:05:05.680 --> 0:05:08.440 a colonel of ambition there in the world I was in. 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:11.360 It was, you know, doctor lawyer or a few of 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:13.760 a more working class background, a job that gave you 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:16.960 a security and a pension, the Long Island Railroad, the 0:05:16.960 --> 0:05:20.160 police department, the fire department. You know, you learned very 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:24.719 quickly to choose from the menu. Actor was not on 0:05:24.760 --> 0:05:27.680 the menu, the men that was submitted to me. Well, 0:05:27.720 --> 0:05:29.920 I wanted to music again, like my parents, So that's 0:05:29.960 --> 0:05:31.680 another thing you did. You followed your parents because you 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:34.640 couldn't think of anything else to do. And then when 0:05:34.640 --> 0:05:38.640 the singing became more interesting, and particularly jazz um, when 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:41.240 I really found myself in through singing with it in 0:05:41.240 --> 0:05:43.760 a club every weekend for two and a half years. 0:05:48.200 --> 0:05:51.000 Then my parents got nervous. Oh, it's so hard, it's 0:05:51.000 --> 0:05:55.560 too competitive. What happens when you're you're writing songs, popular 0:05:55.640 --> 0:05:57.720 music or whatever, you know what you said, singer songwriter, 0:05:57.839 --> 0:06:00.800 whether it's Karl King or what have you, and you're 0:06:00.800 --> 0:06:05.600 singing jazz in nightclubs in Rochester, they're knowing Potsdam where 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:09.360 I went to undergraduate school is Potsdam a hotbed of jazz. 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:15.000 It's a college hotbed and the drinking age was twenty one. 0:06:15.600 --> 0:06:18.440 So yes, so we all spent a lot of time 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:22.279 in clubs. In this particular Algiers Pub had very high 0:06:22.360 --> 0:06:24.960 quality jazz all the time. And the guys that I 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:28.360 worked with are are all working musicians. It was an 0:06:28.360 --> 0:06:31.280 extraordinary education for me in many many ways. I mean, 0:06:31.279 --> 0:06:33.800 that's how we learned. That's how I was able to 0:06:33.839 --> 0:06:49.280 embrace performing good Because Illinois Ja KD heard me sing 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:51.640 in pot Salmon said why don't you come on the road, 0:06:51.640 --> 0:06:55.880 we come to New York and cats Yes, it's great 0:06:55.920 --> 0:06:59.159 tenor saxophone player was really going to put me on 0:06:59.200 --> 0:07:01.000 the map as a jazz a singer. And I just 0:07:01.080 --> 0:07:03.560 knew I didn't have the courage. You could have been 0:07:03.560 --> 0:07:07.360 a popular singer. What where do you take the term 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:11.600 you're saying, I'm going to operate? Is it now? Had 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:14.120 I grown up in New York City, the singer songwriter 0:07:14.240 --> 0:07:16.560 thing might have opened, doors might have opened. I mean 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.960 I sang on television in high school winning some talent show, 0:07:20.120 --> 0:07:23.400 literally playing a song that I wrote, making the decision 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:25.720 to go on undergraduate school. That's sort of solidified. My 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:29.840 graduate school was where so you went from you went 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:36.120 back home. Yeah. Then I tried to pursue jazz then, 0:07:36.720 --> 0:07:38.960 and that didn't work. Despite the fact that Eastman had 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:41.800 a phenomenal jazz department, I just couldn't get in. I 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:46.120 couldn't break in. So, you know, it was really circumstance 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:50.000 that pushed me towards classical music, and eventually I really 0:07:50.000 --> 0:07:51.920 embraced it. And the other thing is I realized it 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:54.600 was much more suited to my temperament. I liked being 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:59.120 in the practice room. I liked studying. I enjoyed wrestling 0:07:59.200 --> 0:08:03.200 with this instrumental harder. I don't know that it was harder, 0:08:03.240 --> 0:08:08.440 but it was more internal kind of cerebral work. You know. 0:08:08.480 --> 0:08:12.040 The interesting thing about jazz or anything popular, you see, 0:08:12.040 --> 0:08:15.640 it was a very personality driven and I just didn't 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.800 have that. I think I do now. Interestingly, I've come 0:08:18.840 --> 0:08:20.360 out of my show. I mean when I tell people 0:08:20.360 --> 0:08:23.200 I was extremely shy that nobody believes me. Now that's 0:08:23.200 --> 0:08:26.240 the thing that people have to overcome. Yes, exactly. You know, 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:29.200 I found a lot of comedians to be extraordinarily serious 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:33.760 and and draws withdrawn sometimes, So yeah, I think sometimes 0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:36.160 we overcome things by going after the very thing that 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:39.240 really eludes us. So certainly in my case that was it. 0:08:39.840 --> 0:08:43.719 I would observe friends who were comfortable performing, and I 0:08:43.720 --> 0:08:45.760 would just try to act like them, So that was 0:08:46.559 --> 0:08:49.880 that worked. It's an impersonation. Someone said to me, how 0:08:49.880 --> 0:08:52.160 do you perform in the theater, Like why is the 0:08:52.160 --> 0:08:56.200 theater so soothing to you? And I say, because I 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:57.719 know that for two and a half hours, you know 0:08:57.880 --> 0:09:00.480 exactly where I'm going to be, exactly what I'm going 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:02.880 to say, exactly what you're going to say, and exactly 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:04.560 how a roomful of people are going to react to 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:08.160 what I say. And you don't feel performance pressure because 0:09:08.200 --> 0:09:12.920 I had terrible stage right. I do feel the pressure 0:09:12.920 --> 0:09:16.960 in rehearsal. I feel the pressure to unearthed, to get 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:19.920 down to it and get the work done. And if 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:23.600 I feel that we got the work done, then it's orgasmic, 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:24.719 you know, Like I go out there and put it 0:09:24.760 --> 0:09:27.079 the only thing I'm like, well, how's everybody doing? You know, 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:29.880 I'm like, really, I'm very happy, comfortable. Yeah, I think 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:31.800 they're gonna like it. If I go out there and 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:33.680 I'm a little bit hesitating because I'm thinking I don't 0:09:33.679 --> 0:09:37.280 think we got it. But you do two years at 0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:39.600 Eastman and the graduate degree there. Then what happens? And 0:09:39.600 --> 0:09:43.000 I went to Juilliard did POSTGRADU I could be a 0:09:43.040 --> 0:09:44.680 doctor or a lawyer who as long as I was 0:09:46.200 --> 0:09:50.200 Why Juilliard Juilliard at the time the American Opercenter, so 0:09:50.240 --> 0:09:53.199 now the Juilliard Opercenter. I believe it was a post 0:09:53.240 --> 0:09:57.600 graduate program. I was cast as Mozetta in Lubo m 0:09:57.640 --> 0:09:59.720 So I came here to sing a role. You get 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:03.200 free lessons, coaching, all of the support that we couldn't 0:10:03.240 --> 0:10:07.240 otherwise afford. You know, you're a beginner. And I worked 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.600 in rocket Feller Plaza for a law firm, pay my 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:12.360 rent and everything, and it was a great year. It 0:10:12.440 --> 0:10:14.599 was a phenomenal year. Say to yourself, why didn't I 0:10:14.640 --> 0:10:17.200 do this sooner? Yeah? Yes, because I was so happy 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:19.839 and I was running around the city like a maniac, 0:10:20.360 --> 0:10:22.520 so active. And then I took a full right grant 0:10:22.600 --> 0:10:26.600 studying in Germany and that was hard. Were you there 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:31.480 in Frankfort? It was important. It was probably one of 0:10:31.520 --> 0:10:34.320 the most crucial pieces in my education because it was 0:10:34.360 --> 0:10:38.080 so challenging. Number One, I didn't speak a word of German. 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:40.320 When I went there, I was in the whole schield 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:43.840 for musique and was not accepted into the opera department, 0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:46.760 which was very disappointing to me at the time. I 0:10:46.800 --> 0:10:50.440 cried the whole way there, literally sobbing yes, and my 0:10:50.520 --> 0:10:53.520 boyfriend at the time, who became my husband, said well, 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:55.679 you know, don't not go because of me, and I 0:10:55.720 --> 0:10:58.640 remember thinking, God, that would be the furthest thing from 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:02.800 my mind. I was so kind of self possessed, but 0:11:03.080 --> 0:11:08.040 also clueless about the choices I was making. That's why 0:11:08.040 --> 0:11:11.520 I wrote a book for young singers, because if young 0:11:11.559 --> 0:11:13.920 singers are any one of them like I was, you 0:11:14.000 --> 0:11:16.720 just don't know what you're getting into. But I was 0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.840 also very lucky because that year turned out to be 0:11:19.920 --> 0:11:23.360 a very formative experience. I mean, learning to speak fluent German. 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:25.959 How many languages do you speak fluently well? I studied 0:11:25.960 --> 0:11:28.200 French in high school like many of us did. That was, 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:31.120 you know, the language. Paris is my second home, and 0:11:31.160 --> 0:11:33.120 I sang there every year for a long time, so 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:36.360 my French is when I'm there, it picks up again 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:39.600 and it's good. But German is even more fluent and consistent. 0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:41.800 During that year, you learned to speaking fluently in that 0:11:41.840 --> 0:11:45.080 one year. Well, you know, I love the study of 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:48.440 learning and of memory, because what I've discovered is that 0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:51.080 at the end of that year my German was okay, 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:54.199 it was good, you know. But every year, every time 0:11:54.240 --> 0:11:56.080 I go back, it gets better and I don't have 0:11:56.160 --> 0:11:58.640 to speak a word of German in between. So the brain, 0:11:58.679 --> 0:12:02.600 those neurons keep firing. Then you come back to Julia, Yes, 0:12:02.640 --> 0:12:05.000 and I come back to Juilliard. I tried to stay 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:07.120 in Germany. I tried to stay there and get work. 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:10.520 No one would have me, so I came back in 0:12:10.559 --> 0:12:13.840 my career started here. Then how well, I had a 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:17.520 rough couple of years of sort of no man's land, 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:22.160 which is very common with singers between education and the 0:12:22.200 --> 0:12:24.600 start of career. It's very common for all of us, really, 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:27.360 all musicians, you know. And there's this catch twenty two 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:29.640 where you can't get management unless they can go here, 0:12:29.720 --> 0:12:31.840 you perform, but you can't get a job if you 0:12:31.840 --> 0:12:34.240 don't get managed. In the acting world, okay, call me 0:12:34.320 --> 0:12:37.559 when you're in a show, and that's the manager you're 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:41.480 trying to get. So competitions were the thing that helped me. 0:12:41.520 --> 0:12:44.840 And when the main competitions exactly for me. It was 0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:47.400 the men competition. It took me three times, but I 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:49.840 finally won. All of a sudden the doors opened. But 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:52.400 it took about a year and a half. I'd say 0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:59.000 things went slowly. And the first paid, legit professional job 0:12:59.080 --> 0:13:03.240 you have was doing what the first real engagement was 0:13:03.280 --> 0:13:06.640 in Houston Grand Opera, and it was the Marriage of Figaro, 0:13:07.240 --> 0:13:09.760 and that really put me on the map, and that 0:13:09.840 --> 0:13:12.920 described that so important. I had never sung the opera 0:13:12.960 --> 0:13:15.600 in Italian, I'd sung it in English. So I went 0:13:15.679 --> 0:13:19.959 to rehearse with really seasoned professionals, I mean people who 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:23.120 were big opera stars already, and I was a beginner. 0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:26.120 You know. The first day of rehearsal Thomas Allen, in particular, 0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:30.360 Sir Thomas Allen, He's got such an intelligence and uh 0:13:30.480 --> 0:13:33.240 sophistication about his portrayal of all of these Mozart in 0:13:33.280 --> 0:13:37.000 here heroes. He's still performing I think at the Royal Opera. 0:13:37.559 --> 0:13:40.079 I was just jelly at the end of the first 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:42.920 rehearsal because I thought I can't even keep up with him. 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:46.240 Mozart Rich Sativa is really hard. Imagine doing very quick 0:13:46.320 --> 0:13:49.000 dialogue and a foreign language that you don't speak. Really 0:13:49.760 --> 0:13:51.640 and I learned. You know, when you're young, you just 0:13:52.080 --> 0:13:55.400 you just you do what you have to do to 0:13:55.520 --> 0:13:58.120 keep up. I lifted the car off my baby because 0:13:58.160 --> 0:14:01.040 I had to lift the car from my David exactly. 0:14:01.920 --> 0:14:04.960 And when you get these opportunities, you have to rise 0:14:05.040 --> 0:14:08.560 to the occasion and take a risk and get out 0:14:08.559 --> 0:14:11.640 there and really make it work, or you don't get 0:14:11.679 --> 0:14:14.560 the opportunity again. You know, it's so competitive the field. 0:14:21.960 --> 0:14:25.000 I think all my horseback riding and doing horse shows 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:27.800 as a kid really prepared me for that. And when 0:14:28.040 --> 0:14:30.880 when the curtain, I don't need to be so molodramatic, 0:14:31.440 --> 0:14:33.000 but the world you live in that kind of lends 0:14:33.000 --> 0:14:35.080 itself this. When the curtain comes down and the shows, 0:14:35.120 --> 0:14:37.840 the first show is over, how did you feel? Well? 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:41.200 You know, it's unfortunately too long ago from you hotely 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:44.640 remember that, but you know, I can tell you there 0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:48.680 was a euphoria in those early experiences, a sense of 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:51.520 happiness and relief when I would go from one engagement 0:14:51.560 --> 0:14:54.560 to the other. You know, our world, we never stop, 0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:57.280 so there's no sort of you do a project and 0:14:57.280 --> 0:15:00.720 then you take a break. It's just after that it's 0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:03.960 a blur. It's like It's all one big episode of 0:15:03.960 --> 0:15:06.400 a TV show to me, Now, yeh, what was it 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:08.520 like doing? I'll go, God, don't you know? And when 0:15:08.560 --> 0:15:11.720 I watched the film, I remember events in my life 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:13.960 at that time. A scene will come on and I'll go, 0:15:14.240 --> 0:15:16.160 I remember that day. That was the day of my 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:18.200 contractor called me, tell me a pipe burst at my 0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:20.680 house in East Hampton. You know, I don't really do 0:15:21.600 --> 0:15:26.840 your roles and experiences. Somehow, if they didn't parallel your life, 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:30.640 they were helpful in some way. Two things. One is 0:15:30.720 --> 0:15:33.960 more tangible than the other. Someone Melanie Griffith, years ago 0:15:34.000 --> 0:15:35.840 said to me that every role you play is the 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:38.360 chance to bury that part of yourself that you don't like. 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:40.520 And the other thing I find is that when God 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:42.760 wants to make fun of me and to mock me, 0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:45.640 I'll get a script and what's going on with that 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:49.320 character is exactly what's going on, right, And I'll read 0:15:49.360 --> 0:15:52.360 the script and it's almost God to say to me, see, 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:54.760 stupid it looks when it's on paper. I have felt 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:57.520 that a lot of times when I've been in any 0:15:57.600 --> 0:16:01.280 kind of conflict or struggle. Some how the repertoire that 0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:04.720 I'm performing has just coincidentally mirrored it in a way 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:34.080 that's been healing. Let's say healing. This is Alec Baldwin 0:16:34.400 --> 0:16:48.160 and I'm talking with singer Renee Fleming. More in a minute. 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:52.120 This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to here's the 0:16:52.120 --> 0:16:57.200 thing today with Renee Fleming and your work, because in 0:16:57.280 --> 0:17:00.360 my work it's not this way. You can't do what 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:04.440 you do unless you summon up some reservoir of the deepest, 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:08.280 deepest passion to sing these roles effectively. To think of 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:12.000 a role you've you've performed where even you sat there 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:15.160 and go, God, this is killing me. Well it came 0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:16.640 out of you, like you couldn't believe it came out 0:17:16.640 --> 0:17:18.840 of you. You know there, Well, there are two sides 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:21.080 of it. One is the vocal. One one is this 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:22.959 feeling that you know I'm in the right place at 0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:25.840 the right time to be singing this and and you know, 0:17:26.840 --> 0:17:29.760 well the voice is such an evolving instrument. So when 0:17:29.800 --> 0:17:33.160 I sang Tais, for instance, at the met some years ago, 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:40.080 and had these spectacular costumes from Christian Loqua, you just 0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:43.359 thought the stars have aligned to make this role of 0:17:43.520 --> 0:17:46.399 suit me perfectly. Right now. I love singing in French. 0:17:46.840 --> 0:17:50.000 I love Massinee, the way it lies, the character, the 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:52.639 fact that you know, the psychological drama and this opera 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:56.440 where these two people completely changed places with each other. 0:18:05.840 --> 0:18:08.960 That was a case certainly where I just thought, you know, 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:12.679 and I was going to do it again, and somebody 0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:16.000 stopped and said, do you want to sing it again 0:18:16.040 --> 0:18:19.000 in five years if it's not as good as it 0:18:19.160 --> 0:18:21.680 was this time? And I said, you're right, I'm not 0:18:21.720 --> 0:18:24.200 going to I'm not going to risk that. Oh it was. 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:26.600 It was perfect. I mean it was. I couldn't do 0:18:26.640 --> 0:18:29.040 it better. So it's not very often I can say 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:31.520 that I couldn't do it better. Someone else maybe could 0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:33.439 do it better. Different It was the best that I 0:18:33.480 --> 0:18:35.359 could do. But you said, there's two things, the voice 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:38.080 and what else the voice and then also what you 0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:40.800 bring artistically to anything. You know, for instance, the Marshall 0:18:40.840 --> 0:18:44.000 Room right now, and Rosencovalier evolves all the time. For me, 0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:48.560 it's not a vocal issue. It's a it's an artistic issue. 0:18:48.560 --> 0:18:51.680 It's who she is, what she's grappling with. Is she manic, depressive? 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:55.560 Is she's simply lonely. She's one of the most interesting 0:18:55.640 --> 0:18:58.200 characters in all of opera for women. I mean, how 0:18:58.240 --> 0:19:00.119 she was created by two men, I don't know, but 0:19:00.280 --> 0:19:28.960 I'm grateful to have her. You know the other thing, 0:19:29.200 --> 0:19:32.560 I don't know if you feel this squeeze, but you may. 0:19:32.800 --> 0:19:37.400 We're squeezed between what's kind of commercial and popular opera 0:19:37.480 --> 0:19:42.200 hits artistic. How was that changed in the opera world 0:19:42.200 --> 0:19:45.000 and you're during your career, Well, there are two parts 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:47.280 to it, because there's one, there's there's the titles. And 0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:52.200 I wasn't born to sing unfortunately, Mad and Butterfly Tusca. 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:55.119 You know, bo m. My voice isn't I'm not a 0:19:55.359 --> 0:19:58.159 lyrical spinto. I'm a lyric soprano, so my voice is 0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:00.720 too light for those parts. I'm fortunately, if I could 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:05.240 sing those roles, then the success I've had with the 0:20:05.280 --> 0:20:07.800 public would have transferred over to the repertoire. Did you 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:10.399 did you try to do them? No, that kind of 0:20:10.440 --> 0:20:13.080 assignation happens in your world. People that are experts, who 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:17.360 are technical experts tell you that's not your repertoire, right well, 0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:19.480 and in trying to sing that repertoire, I would have 0:20:19.560 --> 0:20:23.000 harmed my voice, or at the at the very least 0:20:23.040 --> 0:20:25.840 just not been hurt. We're not amplified, and you know, 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:28.600 that's a very important distinction between what we do and 0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:31.439 what everyone else does. So to try and build a 0:20:31.480 --> 0:20:35.360 career on titles that aren't sort of at the heart 0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:38.879 of the oposite people love is more challenging. On the 0:20:38.880 --> 0:20:41.760 other hand, the trend that I've seen since I started 0:20:41.800 --> 0:20:45.240 singing twenty years ago, you know, plus, is that people 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:48.240 have been more interested in learning about pieces they didn't 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:50.919 know and experiencing pieces they didn't know, as opposed to 0:20:50.920 --> 0:20:55.159 going to the umteen Zaida for instance. The other squeeze 0:20:55.320 --> 0:21:00.160 that I feel is virtuosity versus artistry, because people will 0:21:00.200 --> 0:21:02.639 go to opera, I mean the three tenors case in point, 0:21:03.080 --> 0:21:06.440 for thrills, for vocal, for the thrill of what the 0:21:06.560 --> 0:21:10.480 human voice is capable of producing, and for tenors and sopranos, 0:21:10.520 --> 0:21:13.120 and it's really for us. It's a high note. It's 0:21:13.160 --> 0:21:15.080 all about the high note. You know, are you going 0:21:15.160 --> 0:21:17.080 to break glass? Are you going to is it going 0:21:17.119 --> 0:21:20.720 to give us shivers? Are we going to cry? Because 0:21:20.760 --> 0:21:50.959 you've just throbbed on that high sea to kind of 0:21:51.119 --> 0:21:54.320 figure out how to program so that one gets some 0:21:54.480 --> 0:21:57.600 of that without you kind of really using up your 0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:00.159 principle and using up what it is that you have 0:22:00.760 --> 0:22:04.080 and or interesting them in music that doesn't have that, 0:22:04.359 --> 0:22:08.240 music that's more about poetry and prose, and in turning 0:22:08.240 --> 0:22:11.080 a phrase that's more subtle. I've gone back and forth 0:22:11.119 --> 0:22:14.119 between those two things my whole career. What's one of 0:22:14.119 --> 0:22:18.080 the more popular in your mind in your range, oh, traviata? 0:22:19.440 --> 0:22:22.200 I guess in the in the greatest tests category exactly. 0:22:22.200 --> 0:22:25.360 And what is one that you might have been doubtful 0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:28.280 about or at the very least indifferent about. That was 0:22:28.359 --> 0:22:29.639 you were approached and it turned out to be a 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:33.120 wonderful experience, But there was more esoteric I think rode 0:22:33.200 --> 0:22:35.760 Linda Handles roteal Linda. I. You know, I was drawn 0:22:35.800 --> 0:22:38.960 to her because of the character, the story. She's a mother, 0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.520 she's courageous, she's strong. It's a masterpiece, this opera. It 0:22:42.640 --> 0:22:44.520 wasn't known they had never been done at the mat 0:23:10.040 --> 0:23:12.159 so some of these titles in a way, you know, 0:23:12.240 --> 0:23:16.000 being given this place that I've had it that meant 0:23:16.040 --> 0:23:18.880 for some time, also give me the opportunity to say 0:23:19.000 --> 0:23:22.200 what about this? Having done a lot of the standard 0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:25.040 repertoire that I could sing, and I've sung fifty four roles. 0:23:25.960 --> 0:23:27.600 You know, I've been saying fifty one. I was right. 0:23:27.640 --> 0:23:35.640 I recounted it was a miscount. Executive opening up. Yeah, 0:23:35.680 --> 0:23:41.440 you're so you're so unproductive, you're so lazy, exactly, French. 0:23:43.040 --> 0:23:49.600 I have opera audience has changed during your career. I 0:23:49.640 --> 0:23:53.199 think the challenge we face in opera in general, and 0:23:53.200 --> 0:23:57.359 I would say forget opera and classical music is really exposure. 0:23:57.720 --> 0:24:00.600 It used to be that we had exposure obviously in schools. 0:24:00.960 --> 0:24:05.760 We had exposure through churches and through our families. Every 0:24:05.920 --> 0:24:09.560 socially climbing family got a piano and felt that a 0:24:09.640 --> 0:24:13.000 musical education was part on arts education, was part of 0:24:13.040 --> 0:24:16.320 their children's, you know, the betterment of their lives. And 0:24:16.359 --> 0:24:18.080 that you know, it is what it is, it is, 0:24:18.160 --> 0:24:21.119 It is gone. It's just simply people don't feel it's 0:24:21.160 --> 0:24:25.840 relevant anymore. My heart when you say that, But it's true. 0:24:27.400 --> 0:24:30.119