1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael, Managing editor of Crypto for Bloomberg News, 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: and this is Bloomberg Crypto, a daily Bloomberg I heard podcast. 3 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: It's Tuesday June. One of the features that early investors 4 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,960 Speaker 1: in crypto would talk about a lot is something called correlation, 5 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: or specifically the lack of it. Correlation is a concept 6 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:29,960 Speaker 1: that refers to the relationship between different financial assets. You 7 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:32,240 Speaker 1: can think about this as if the gold price goes 8 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 1: up and the price of oil also goes up, you 9 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: might say that those prices are positively correlated. But if 10 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: you're an investor looking to diversify your portfolio, you don't 11 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: want everything going in one particular direction, And for a 12 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,920 Speaker 1: while it looked like crypto assets might fit the bill. 13 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: Over the past year, as inflation rates have begun to rise, 14 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: not just in the US but around the world, the 15 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: price of crypto has fallen in line with the price 16 00:00:56,800 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 1: of stocks. What does that mean for crypto supposed independence 17 00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: from other markets? Bloomberg reports of Aldana Hadrick joins me 18 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:12,120 Speaker 1: for more. Holdanna, thank you so much for joining us today. 19 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:14,319 Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. You are one of the 20 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: folks at Boomberg who writes about pretty much everything in markets. 21 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,319 Speaker 1: I feel, yeah, just about. It's just about and in 22 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,479 Speaker 1: that extremely broad and interesting remit that you have. One 23 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: of the places you've been reporting on has been what's 24 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 1: happening with crypto as it relates to what's happening with stocks. 25 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:32,120 Speaker 1: Can you talk a little bit more about that. Yeah, 26 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,040 Speaker 1: I love looking at this because I love looking at 27 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:36,199 Speaker 1: the stock market, which I cover on a daily basis, 28 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 1: and then also crypto, which is just its own little animal. 29 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:44,039 Speaker 1: But basically, what's been happening this year, broadly speaking this 30 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:47,920 Speaker 1: year is that we have really strong correlations between stocks, 31 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 1: US stocks and cryptocurrencies. And when I am saying cryptocurrencies, 32 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: I really mean bitcoin, because a lot of people are 33 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: just looking at bitcoin basically, And so what you're seeing 34 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 1: is that on a day when stocks are up, you're 35 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 1: very likely to also see bitcoin going higher. When stocks 36 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 1: are down, bitcoin also very very likely is going down. 37 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:12,240 Speaker 1: So we have this really strong correlation. The correlation is 38 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: particularly strong between bitcoin and tech stocks, and that's because 39 00:02:17,360 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 1: a lot of strategists and analysts, when they're looking at 40 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:23,920 Speaker 1: these different asset classes, what they'll say is that both 41 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 1: are sort of risk here. So give a lot of 42 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:30,720 Speaker 1: tech companies that are high growth companies. High growth and 43 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 1: high growths means aren't necessarily super profitable fast exactly, they're expanding, 44 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: you know, they're spending a lot of money. The cash 45 00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: burn is really high, but profits maybe are out in 46 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: the future. Everybody knows that crypto is really really volatile, 47 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 1: and so therefore you you sort of just have both 48 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 1: falling into the same category. And so these correlations have 49 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: been really really strong in two because we've had this 50 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:00,360 Speaker 1: you know, different Federal Reserve than what we've had over 51 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: the last two years, where you have the Federal Reserve 52 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: and you know, central banks around the world raising interest 53 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 1: rates to combat persistently hotter than expected inflation. You're seeing 54 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: these hotter than expected inflation prints. And so that's just 55 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:20,799 Speaker 1: not an environment that is very it's not comfortable for 56 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:23,400 Speaker 1: for crypto and for tech stocks. Well, let's talk about 57 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 1: why that is right. So when folks say, oh, high 58 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:29,679 Speaker 1: interest rates are bad for text dogs or high interest 59 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:32,120 Speaker 1: rates are bad for stocks, like, what exactly is that 60 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: like directionality there? Why is the one leading to the other. Well, 61 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: if you have higher interest rates, it's just you know, 62 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 1: the cost of doing business becomes a lot higher. That's 63 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 1: exactly what the FED actually wants. They want to cool 64 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: down growth because we just have been having inflation coming 65 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 1: out hotter and hotter than expected for just a much 66 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:56,559 Speaker 1: longer period of time than so many people had been expecting. 67 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,320 Speaker 1: And so when you have this environment where it just 68 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 1: costs more to be doing business basically anything, yes, basically 69 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 1: anything for tech socks, it's you can sort of just 70 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 1: look at it and think about, Okay, we have these 71 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: high growth names like we just mentioned where out in 72 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: the future, their their profits are just much further out 73 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 1: in the future, and so in a higher inflation environment, 74 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,840 Speaker 1: those companies just don't fare as well. And then, just 75 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:25,599 Speaker 1: as we mentioned, you have this correlation with because it 76 00:04:25,720 --> 00:04:28,000 Speaker 1: is risk here, just people think of it as being 77 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 1: risk here, and so it's just it's think about an 78 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,720 Speaker 1: everyday investor, do they want to be owning something that's 79 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: super risky that can sort of swing around based on 80 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:42,280 Speaker 1: macro trends and what then or our Nilon Musk tweet, 81 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: the flow of money is just not what we saw 82 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: over the last two years, where the FED was being 83 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 1: much more accommodative in terms of, you know, trying to 84 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 1: stabilize the economy during the pandemic, where they were buying 85 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 1: treasuries and just putting a lot more money out into 86 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 1: the system. Now they put a stop to that. They're 87 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:05,880 Speaker 1: raising interest rates. The labor market is extremely tight and 88 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:10,599 Speaker 1: inflation is much too high against this backdrop, today, the 89 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: Federal Open Market Committee raised its policy interest rate by 90 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 1: three quarters of a percentage point and anticipates that ongoing 91 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 1: increases in that rate will be appropriate. Here's the thing, though, 92 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: This correlation persisted or existed before a higher inflationary in 93 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 1: a higher interest rates environment, and that was despite the 94 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 1: assertions of various folks in crypto, especially bitcoin, as you mentioned, 95 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: who would always say, no, no, the whole point of 96 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: bitcoin is to not be like anything else that's happening 97 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,839 Speaker 1: in the market. Why do you think even prior to 98 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:45,479 Speaker 1: this environment that you're describing, where like all risk assets 99 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 1: moving in one direction, why was that not holding true? 100 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 1: Why was bitcoin not behaving in the way that people 101 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 1: were expecting. I love these arguments, I love hearing them. 102 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: There's so many, and they tend to sort of change, 103 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: like the flavor changes, depending on what's happening. So maybe 104 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,160 Speaker 1: you know, like three or four years ago, you were 105 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: hearing a lot of people saying that you should own 106 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 1: cryptocurrencies because you know, for bitcoin, the supply is limited. 107 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,440 Speaker 1: So the idea is because the supply is limited, that 108 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 1: it will act as a very good inflation hedge. Three 109 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 1: or four years ago, we had inflation in the US 110 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 1: running it around two percent. Right now, obviously that's very, 111 00:06:23,279 --> 00:06:26,120 Speaker 1: very different. So really what should have happened had that 112 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:29,120 Speaker 1: hand out is that bitcoin would be performing a lot 113 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:33,839 Speaker 1: better during a higher inflation environment. These are just theories, 114 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:38,840 Speaker 1: you know, their arguments for for ornaments, the arguments. Yes, 115 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 1: I mean, you have a lot of scholars who just 116 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:44,960 Speaker 1: look at this sort of on a longer trend. I know, 117 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:47,440 Speaker 1: I've I've talked to some professors and scholars who have 118 00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 1: looked at gold, for instance, where you just have a 119 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:55,039 Speaker 1: much longer history to study, and they had been warning 120 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: all along, like, you know, maybe this really isn't the case, 121 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 1: maybe bitcoin is not digital gold exactly, and you know, 122 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: wait to see how things pan out, especially wait to 123 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,239 Speaker 1: see what happens during crashes. And so now we really 124 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: do have it not holding up as well, and at 125 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 1: the same time we have really high inflation, forty year 126 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:19,119 Speaker 1: high inflation in the u S at least, and there 127 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 1: are other countries where like that's cute. Yeah, we love that. 128 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 1: Thank you, Danna. We'll be right back. What about the 129 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: idea that the institutionalization of crypto, which means like more traditional, 130 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:46,679 Speaker 1: bigger investors moving in, contributes to that correlation with stocks. 131 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 1: How does that work in practice? This is a huge 132 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: component of this. This is a really big factor, I 133 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 1: think because over the last two years, I would say 134 00:07:55,720 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: largely is where you had a lot of institutional investor 135 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:03,440 Speaker 1: just coming in becoming more interested in crypto. You know, 136 00:08:03,440 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: maybe in two thousand eighteen, two nineteen, they were writing 137 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: it off, they were saying, it's way too volatile. I 138 00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 1: don't want to be involved with this. Then you saw 139 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:15,679 Speaker 1: crypto taking off during the pandemic again because we had 140 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: really loose accommodative monetary policy from low low interest rates. Yes, 141 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:25,360 Speaker 1: and they didn't want to miss out on what had 142 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:29,840 Speaker 1: been happening in one where crypto prices were just skyrocketing. 143 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:32,840 Speaker 1: It was the hot thing, it was really trendy. Everybody 144 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: wanted to be in on it, whether retail or institutional investors. 145 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 1: So having institutional investors be a big player in the 146 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:44,199 Speaker 1: space definitely contributes to this idea that the correlations with 147 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 1: stocks and crypto are just much tighter or stronger in 148 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,079 Speaker 1: recent months than they had been. And it's the reason 149 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,079 Speaker 1: for that that institutional investors just like buy and sell 150 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 1: way more and so they have that ability to move 151 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: markets in one direction or another. Yeah, And it's really 152 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 1: art actually to break down. Like I think people are 153 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 1: obsessed with figuring out like what proportion of if you're 154 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,240 Speaker 1: looking at bitcoin for instance, like is it retail, what 155 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:12,960 Speaker 1: proportion is institutions? Uh, people love looking in at this 156 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: and into this and having having huge arguments about it. 157 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:23,200 Speaker 1: You know, retail investors definitely got hurt during this sell off. 158 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:26,200 Speaker 1: So we had bitcoin hitting nearly sixty nine thou at 159 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 1: the end of November, it's fallen something like forty Yeah, exactly. 160 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: So definitely there's a lot of people who have lost 161 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: a lot of money because they bought the high the 162 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:40,599 Speaker 1: high and now or if they're selling, they're selling a 163 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:43,960 Speaker 1: pretty decent blue One really interesting thing that to be 164 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 1: looking at to figure out sort of like who is 165 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: getting impacted is you can look at a number of 166 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:52,240 Speaker 1: different measures like this one is wonky, but like in 167 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: the money measures where you're looking at the percentage of 168 00:09:56,200 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: bitcoin addresses that are in the money, meaning you know, 169 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 1: people who bought bitcoin of prices lower than current prices, 170 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 1: and that has really been trending lower during the decline, 171 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 1: meaning that people are just you know, sometimes maybe they 172 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: they've just had enough and they sell their bitcoin or 173 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: their crypto holdings, even at a loss, even at a loss. 174 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:17,079 Speaker 1: And so the reason you're able to do that is 175 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:19,800 Speaker 1: because of course all these transactions aren't public, or at 176 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: least they are accessible if you know what you're looking for. Yeah, 177 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:25,520 Speaker 1: I mean that's what the whole blockchain is. You're supposed 178 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: to be looking at this sort of public ledger. It's 179 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 1: supposed to be very transparent and open where you can 180 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: see how money is moving around. You talk to investors 181 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:39,320 Speaker 1: all daylong. Yes, by the way, what is the vibe um? 182 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,199 Speaker 1: So I talked to investors who you know, like stock 183 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: market investors as well as crypto people. It's really within crypto. Again, 184 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:51,439 Speaker 1: going back to those arguments that you might be hearing, 185 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 1: like it's an inflation hedge, things will pick up, things 186 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: will be better. You a lot of times you'll hear 187 00:10:56,640 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 1: some of those arguments where you know, maybe they're basing 188 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 1: things a little bit more on sentiment than what's actually 189 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: going on on the stock market side. Just about everybody 190 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:11,319 Speaker 1: I talked to when they're talking about crypto there, they 191 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: always are tying things back to correlations and how bitcoin 192 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 1: on its own isn't really independent, so to say, doesn't 193 00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:22,800 Speaker 1: become a self fulfilling prophecy though, where you like, if 194 00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 1: you believe a thing is correlated, then you're like, well 195 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:26,680 Speaker 1: it's going to move in this direction. I might as well. 196 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: I might as well, Yeah, I might as well a 197 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 1: little bit. Yeah, that's a good point. The hive mind 198 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 1: of markets. One of the stories that you wrote recently, 199 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:39,320 Speaker 1: because you know, you went one key, let's stay there. 200 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:41,520 Speaker 1: But one of the stories you were recently was this 201 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: idea of like one of the most profitable trades in 202 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 1: crypto was like buying and selling at a time when 203 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:50,920 Speaker 1: the stock market was actually not open because bitcoin trades seven. 204 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 1: How did that work as a trade? This is so fun, 205 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:57,440 Speaker 1: This is super interesting. So we know crypto trades seven. 206 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: It's trading every single day of the week, even on holidays. 207 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:06,080 Speaker 1: We have a trading internationally across hundreds of exchanges. The 208 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 1: stock market is open Monday through Friday to four pm 209 00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:12,839 Speaker 1: New York time. And so if you separate out those 210 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:16,200 Speaker 1: hours that time span and look at how bitcoin tends 211 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,720 Speaker 1: to perform during those hours versus the so called after 212 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: hours when US markets are closed, you actually see that 213 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,920 Speaker 1: bitcoin doesn't fare as well when US markets are open, 214 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 1: and then it holds steady. It's sometimes it does really 215 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 1: well in these so called after hours. So this is 216 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:37,160 Speaker 1: the after hour effect is basically what it's been dubbed, 217 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:40,839 Speaker 1: where on weekends maybe you can see it rallying and 218 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: having happy times, and then as soon as as soon 219 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: as the US as soon as they wake up, it's 220 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 1: like so, yeah, so this is really really interesting. There's 221 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:54,440 Speaker 1: a couple of different theories on what's going on. One, 222 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 1: for instance, is that news continues to come in overnight, 223 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,199 Speaker 1: so traders have to keep pricing all of that stuff in. 224 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: Another is if you, as stocks are closed and you're 225 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 1: trader and you're still very interested in seeing what's going on, 226 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: you're forced effect. Yeah, I mean you just yes, the 227 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 1: board the board markets trader h yes, yes, uh, and 228 00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 1: uh we're very trendy, very trendy, uh, where they're forced 229 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:27,720 Speaker 1: to look at crypto because stocks are closed. Another is 230 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 1: that maybe you just have a lot of international investors 231 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: who are more willing to take on greater risks. You 232 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 1: know a lot of international exchanges might let you use 233 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 1: a lot more leverage, for instance, more you can just 234 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:44,680 Speaker 1: be a bit risk here with your with your bets. 235 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:47,960 Speaker 1: The fourth one, which I've heard from a couple of 236 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,559 Speaker 1: people now, is we just don't know. These are just theories. 237 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 1: Nobody knows. I like to say it's aliens. So we 238 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 1: again all all of the sual things that we resort to, 239 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 1: and we have no idea why something is happening. Yeah, exactly. 240 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 1: But again it just goes to show this correlation and 241 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 1: just how bitcoin is moving during US hours, when US 242 00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: stock investors are up and about and during their thing. 243 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: All right ya, you heard it here first, the board 244 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 1: trader hypothesis of correlation. We were the first, We were 245 00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: the very first. Don't google it, just don't use anyone else's, 246 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: don't ask anybody about it. Amazing. Thank you, such a pleasure, 247 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:30,000 Speaker 1: as always, thanks for having me. You can find more 248 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 1: of Wildanna's reporting on the Bloomberg Terminal on Bloomberg dot 249 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 1: com or find her on Twitter. She's at Vildanna Hadrick. 250 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:42,280 Speaker 1: That's h A j R. I C. On the next 251 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 1: episode of Bloomberg Crypto, we'll take a look at where 252 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: the UK stands when it comes to protecting crypto investors 253 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 1: from fraud, scams and abuse. Bloomberg reports A will show 254 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: who's based in London will join me for a conversation 255 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,440 Speaker 1: about where the UK is and where are you think 256 00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 1: it should be when it comes to keeping consumers safe 257 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: from crypto risks. I'm Stacy Marie Ishmael and this is 258 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Crypto, a daily podcast from Bloomberg and I Heart Radio. 259 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: For more shows from I Heart Radio, visit the I 260 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:16,560 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 261 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: Email your questions, comments, so suggestions for the show to 262 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 1: Crypto at Bloomberg dot net and you'll find us on 263 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 1: Twitter at Crypto. The supervising producer of this episode is 264 00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 1: Vicky very Galina. Associate producer is zan Ab Sudiki. Associate 265 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:37,880 Speaker 1: producer is Thy Butler. Desta wonder At is our engineer. 266 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: Original music by Leo Sidron. Bloomberg's head of Podcasts is 267 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: Francesca Levi.