Speaker 1: So this is a lab. Yeah, this is uh, the
Speaker 1: robot taxi of flex Line where they come in. First,
Speaker 1: it's just a body, that's what I call it, the
Speaker 1: body of the vehicle, and then lots of pieces that
Speaker 1: have to be assembled, put together, tested. Now I'm told
Speaker 1: you're not building a quote unquote car. No, I'm not.
Speaker 1: Does this look like a car to you. Don't say
Speaker 1: the word car. Don't say the words car. It's a vehicle, Yeah,
Speaker 1: a transportation vehicle. Will sell you a ride in this vehicle.
Speaker 1: Can we get in? Of course you can. All right there,
Speaker 1: it is okay, so comfortable. That's what we want. We
Speaker 1: don't want you to think about driving. This is why
Speaker 1: it's not a car. Hi. Everyone, I'm Emily Chang and
Speaker 1: welcome to the latest edition of Bloomberg Studio. At one
Speaker 1: point out today, we're taking you to the Zoo's factory
Speaker 1: floor in Fremont, California, where they believe they're building the
Speaker 1: future of transportation. You're listening to CEO Aisha Evans, one
Speaker 1: of the top ranking black women in Silicon Valley who
Speaker 1: grew up in Senegal. After twelve years working her way
Speaker 1: up to the top ranks at Intel, she took a
Speaker 1: leap into the startup world to join Zooks with a
Speaker 1: goal to transform ride hailing as we know it. Just
Speaker 1: a year later, she sold the company to Amazon for
Speaker 1: one point two billion dollars. How does Zouks fit into
Speaker 1: the future of ride hailing and Amazon? Could a Zooks
Speaker 1: deliver your Amazon packages one day? Here's Evans view of
Speaker 1: the road ahead on this episode of Bloomberg Studio. One
Speaker 1: point out, I should have so great to be here
Speaker 1: with you. Thank you for coming and thank you for
Speaker 1: having me. You came to Zooks as CEO and over
Speaker 1: from Intel, and just a year later you sold it
Speaker 1: to Amazon. How did that happen so quickly? It was
Speaker 1: a journey. Um, it takes a lot of capital to
Speaker 1: um takes this endeavor all the way. It's a it's
Speaker 1: a worthy one. And um, when we looked at the
Speaker 1: ecosis done, when we looked at everything that was going around,
Speaker 1: we had to decide whether to stay private or whether
Speaker 1: to get a long term oriented partner like some of
Speaker 1: our fellow travelers. And then the pandemic hit. That brought
Speaker 1: a lot of clarity, shall we say. And so the
Speaker 1: opportunity presented itself and we went for it wise, Amazon
Speaker 1: the right fit. First of all, they're a great company. Uh.
Speaker 1: They have created both octogonal and adjacent multibillion dollar businesses.
Speaker 1: They are long term oriented and very purpose driven, so
Speaker 1: that matched our ambitions. They've never owned a car company, though, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but we're not a car company exactly. We're a right
Speaker 1: hailing company. Talk to me a little bit about how
Speaker 1: you got to Silicon Valley. Your story is not the
Speaker 1: story of a typical tex EO like Jeff Bezos or
Speaker 1: Eddie Jassy. Tell us about your upbringing. I was born
Speaker 1: in Senegal, West Africa. Uh. My parents, I thanked them
Speaker 1: to this day. UH sort of made school um an
Speaker 1: implicit expectation. It was an up for discussion. Very early on.
Speaker 1: I showed an aptitude and interest uh in math, physics,
Speaker 1: not so much in biology and in building things. Uh.
Speaker 1: And so they cultivated that. And then I bounced back
Speaker 1: between Paris and UH and Senegal, learned a lot about
Speaker 1: what technology does to people's lives, uh, and what it
Speaker 1: makes possible. I literally had a contrast every few months.
Speaker 1: And so computers were coming online, not the Internet, but
Speaker 1: what the Internet was going to make possible was also
Speaker 1: coming online. The US was to the place to be
Speaker 1: to study that. Then basically um got jobs in the
Speaker 1: industry and eventually ended up at Intel in Importland. Through
Speaker 1: that started interfacing with Silicon Valley, and then zooks came along.
Speaker 1: I heard a story about you kick a phone in
Speaker 1: order to talk to your friends long distance. Did that
Speaker 1: really happen? Oh? Yeah I did. I always had a
Speaker 1: double life a little bit in terms of family friends
Speaker 1: in different ecosystems. I still do to this day. And
Speaker 1: so back then it was landlines, it was expensive and
Speaker 1: my dad isn't was intellcommunications, so if he was not confused,
Speaker 1: so we had a rotary phone, I'm dating myself and
Speaker 1: he locked it, but obviously I figured out how to
Speaker 1: still make the phone calls. Who were role models back there.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's so hard for young people, especially young girls,
Speaker 1: to see themselves in the tech industry. Um Mary Curry
Speaker 1: was and still is a role model. UM. In France,
Speaker 1: you study philosophy and a lot of the philosophers are
Speaker 1: also mathematicians, so they will role model. And they also
Speaker 1: forced you to think. You worked your way up to
Speaker 1: chief strategy officer at Intel, and it was a difficult
Speaker 1: time for Intel. Intel was kind of losing its way.
Speaker 1: What was it like working there at that time? It
Speaker 1: was a difficult time in the sense that anytime you're successful,
Speaker 1: you earned the opportunity to talk about what's the next
Speaker 1: phase of the journey? And I was in the middle
Speaker 1: of that. But it was also fun. I learned a lot.
Speaker 1: What was it like going from an established brand name,
Speaker 1: storied tech company like Intel to a startup like Zooks.
Speaker 1: I assume there are major differences in culture and execution there.
Speaker 1: It was quite an awakening. Uh so at Intel, I
Speaker 1: was a little bit known as uh, not a rebel,
Speaker 1: but um somebody who questioned things and who maybe did
Speaker 1: the normal Oh my gosh, you know was too slow?
Speaker 1: Is this or that or the other? An agitator of sorts,
Speaker 1: an agitator, yes, a change agents. I think it is
Speaker 1: the elegant way of putting it. And so al right,
Speaker 1: when I arrived at zos, yes, it was fast. Uh
Speaker 1: it was. We were making decisions quickly. But from an
Speaker 1: infrastructure standpoint with I was like, whoa, maybe there's a
Speaker 1: reason for infrastructure and so, but I embrace the journey
Speaker 1: and said, okay, we have to build one. When you're
Speaker 1: doing what we're doing Uh, it's not just about the technology.
Speaker 1: You have to think about the steps to get into market.
Speaker 1: You also have to think about building the company so
Speaker 1: that it's ready when you scale. If you wait until
Speaker 1: you need to scale to actually build the infrastructure, bad
Speaker 1: things happen. What's it like being a leading black female
Speaker 1: executive in such a white male industry. It depends. I
Speaker 1: don't wake up in the morning thinking I'm that. I
Speaker 1: wake up in the morning thinking I'm Asha. I've got
Speaker 1: stuff to do, meetings, decisions to make, kids to take
Speaker 1: care of, making sure then is ready. Obviously in the moment,
Speaker 1: sometimes I think about it because you look around. But
Speaker 1: I try and turn it into an opportunity because that
Speaker 1: it's just how I have one on ones with myself
Speaker 1: and how you think about it and how you show
Speaker 1: up it's important. So I try and tell myself that
Speaker 1: means that I'm bringing a perspective that nobody else has
Speaker 1: and that's additive. And then I try and also figure
Speaker 1: out a way to have what I call an inclusive
Speaker 1: environment where I see people's point of view and they
Speaker 1: see mine. H and I try not to get angry
Speaker 1: when it manifests itself in annoying ways. What are the
Speaker 1: obstacles that you've overcome to get here. I think that
Speaker 1: often people assume, both from a gender and uh sort
Speaker 1: of ethnicity standpoint, that it's not normal to be here,
Speaker 1: and therefore maybe you've got a discount, when it's often
Speaker 1: the opposite. You have to try much harder than than others.
Speaker 1: I've had to work on sort of how I receive
Speaker 1: information when or how I really I ideal with behaviors
Speaker 1: that are not acceptable and sort of learn when you
Speaker 1: take the high road. I've had to uh find my
Speaker 1: voice and not be afraid of it and use it.
Speaker 1: Are you pleased with the change you've seen or has
Speaker 1: it not changed fast enough? I can't be pleased. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm pleased that there is change, but absolutely not. We
Speaker 1: have to do a lot more as an industry. Why
Speaker 1: isn't it changing faster? Why don't we see more people
Speaker 1: like you in positions of power? Well, I think that's
Speaker 1: a complicated answer. I think it starts very early on.
Speaker 1: I have a son who participates in Lego robotics, and
Speaker 1: we had some observations and kids are what seven eight
Speaker 1: and you already see differences. I think also from a
Speaker 1: social standpoint around middle school when there's a transition for girls,
Speaker 1: maybe having a support system to stay in math, demystifying it,
Speaker 1: teaching it differently. And then as people come up the ranks,
Speaker 1: making sure, especially for women, making sure that we have
Speaker 1: a support system around them so they can traverse through
Speaker 1: some of the some of the phases like for example,
Speaker 1: marriage and our birth and so on. You're building a
Speaker 1: ride hailing service, not a car. Why is it important
Speaker 1: to have a woman in the room, people of different
Speaker 1: races in the room. I'll give you a story. We
Speaker 1: were discussing pick up and drop off, and um, I'm
Speaker 1: the only woman in the room. Yes, I'm always in
Speaker 1: jeans and what have you, but occasionally I dressed up
Speaker 1: and have high heels on. We're wearing high heels today. Yep.
Speaker 1: I made a comment when you arrived, right, and so
Speaker 1: I was like, okay, we have to think about it
Speaker 1: from that standpoint, because if we're giving right to customers
Speaker 1: in San Francisco, for example, on a Friday evening, on
Speaker 1: a Saturday evening, maybe some folks have heels on, and
Speaker 1: maybe we need to think about the pick up rages
Speaker 1: because expecting them to go up hills in you know,
Speaker 1: high heels, probably not a good idea coming up. How
Speaker 1: does zooks out maneuver Cruise and weymo in the autonomous
Speaker 1: ride hailing race. We'll be right back. Let's talk about
Speaker 1: the competition. What is Zooks's edge over GMS crews, Google's
Speaker 1: way now, and if you could level with us, what's
Speaker 1: their edge over Zooks. I look at them a little
Speaker 1: bit like fellow travelers. Yes, we competitors because we're in
Speaker 1: the same space and we're going after some of the
Speaker 1: same things. But this is a big industry. It's not
Speaker 1: going to be a winner take off. Second, it's a
Speaker 1: safety critical product and therefore I think it's important to
Speaker 1: lay that groundwork. Now. Having said that, I would say
Speaker 1: one of the big differences is that we are going
Speaker 1: straight to what we think is the ideal product to
Speaker 1: provide rights to customers. We are not here to enhance
Speaker 1: your driving experience. We don't even want you to think
Speaker 1: about driving. So the customer experience is built in such
Speaker 1: a way that you're here to be transported. You have
Speaker 1: an app which you already know how to do today.
Speaker 1: You have an app where you say I want to
Speaker 1: go from point A to point B, especially in dense
Speaker 1: urban environments, think downtown San Francisco, and we show up
Speaker 1: and we pick you up sliding doors, you step in
Speaker 1: a little bit London cab inspired. We don't ascribe to
Speaker 1: taking a car that was architected designed for a human
Speaker 1: driver and then adding sensors and compute to it in
Speaker 1: order to make it fully autonomous. What about Tesla which
Speaker 1: is right down the street. Our Tesla and Elon must competition,
Speaker 1: fellow travelers, this is Silicon Valley. We are, you know,
Speaker 1: paid tribute to disruptors. Having said that, we're not exactly
Speaker 1: in the same business. We don't sell a car to people.
Speaker 1: We saw a right to people. Our customers are not drivers.
Speaker 1: There are writers, and therefore we use the same types
Speaker 1: of technologies, but they are in the car selling business.
Speaker 1: So how does Dukes fit into the future of Amazon, Well,
Speaker 1: that story is yet to be written. First of all,
Speaker 1: we uh, we hope to deliver on the promise of
Speaker 1: a new segment and uh sort of a big business
Speaker 1: uh and be one of those in the tradition of
Speaker 1: of Amazon. We know there's a world of possibilities, but
Speaker 1: I tell everybody, we first have to earn it right
Speaker 1: before we talk about sort of synergies and possibilities and
Speaker 1: opportunities together. Zero times anything is still zero and it
Speaker 1: will be for a long time. So we're focusing on
Speaker 1: building our business, getting to market, and then there's a
Speaker 1: myriad of possibilities of things we could do together. Zoo's
Speaker 1: gonna be dropping off my boxes? Is that what I
Speaker 1: should expect potentially, if that's the right thing to do
Speaker 1: and if it makes sense to do so. But first
Speaker 1: we're going to make sure to take you everywhere you
Speaker 1: need to go without having to worry about parking, having
Speaker 1: a car and so on. What's am I having Amazon
Speaker 1: as your boss? It's been good. We're an independent subsidiary
Speaker 1: of of Amazon, so yeah, they are involved. We agree
Speaker 1: on what's going to happen, why it's going to happen.
Speaker 1: How often did you talk to Jeff Bezos or do
Speaker 1: you talk to Andy Jassey or maybe it's Dave limp Um.
Speaker 1: I don't talk to them that often. I mean we
Speaker 1: have a monthly business review or quality business review, but no,
Speaker 1: it's not like I'm besties with them and we're on
Speaker 1: the phone and wrapping and channing. Now, well, you must
Speaker 1: know what their expectations are. What is Amazon expecting of
Speaker 1: zoos execute get to market scale, and do you have
Speaker 1: the funding to do that? GM? Google very well funded
Speaker 1: competitors or fellow travelers. As you say, are you getting
Speaker 1: what you need? Yes? More than what I need. I'm
Speaker 1: funding is not something I even worry about. So what's
Speaker 1: it like to operate in that environment where money is
Speaker 1: not an issue? Well, I mean you have to be careful,
Speaker 1: right because you also don't want to be a drunken
Speaker 1: sailor and be like, oh now I have You still
Speaker 1: have to be a very disciplined You have to manage
Speaker 1: the phases of the business. We're like, okay, how do
Speaker 1: we execute? How do we make our mouthstones? How do
Speaker 1: we get to market where things organized properly? How do
Speaker 1: we hire? How do we retain and so on and
Speaker 1: so forth? How do we stay mission driven? The public
Speaker 1: seems to have lost interest in waiting around for self
Speaker 1: driving cars. I wrote in Google self Driving Car in
Speaker 1: and I'm still waiting to be able to buy or
Speaker 1: just ride a self driving car on demand? Why is
Speaker 1: it taking so long? I think? In self driving, first
Speaker 1: of all, the opportunity is so clear, um, the so
Speaker 1: the beach is so broad. We forgot that bigges things
Speaker 1: do start small. One second, it's a hard problem to solve.
Speaker 1: We talk a lot about safety, uh and we talked
Speaker 1: talk a lot about human error when it comes to driving,
Speaker 1: but we also forget that collectively, at least in the
Speaker 1: United States of America, humans collectively drive a hundred million
Speaker 1: miles before having a fatality. That's a lot of mouths.
Speaker 1: So humans are also pretty good. And the thing humans
Speaker 1: are good at, which is hand I call it exception handling.
Speaker 1: We all know how to drive. If we're all fully autonomous,
Speaker 1: would be deployed already. But we're driving amongst human and
Speaker 1: you have to deal with so many little scenarios. There
Speaker 1: are so many things that you've been learning about driving
Speaker 1: since births and codifying that using AI sensors and computers
Speaker 1: is turning out to be a lot harder. Last, but
Speaker 1: not least, it's a safety critical system. None of us
Speaker 1: should deploy until unless we have closed loop evidence that
Speaker 1: we're safe. So what is the a I need to
Speaker 1: learn how to do at this point? What are the
Speaker 1: challenges left to solve? It needs to know how to
Speaker 1: deal with unexpected things as they as they happen, And
Speaker 1: is that possible that it can. Can I learn that?
Speaker 1: Of course it's possible. I mean I'm one of I'm
Speaker 1: an optimist when it comes to technology. I started in wireless,
Speaker 1: so you have to think from switchboards all the way
Speaker 1: to today. Quite a journey. Um, I'm fascinated by a
Speaker 1: flying airplanes. The right brothers. If they were trying to
Speaker 1: solve what is being sold in aviation today, they wouldn't
Speaker 1: have tried. We we just let let it marinate, let
Speaker 1: it take its time. The algorithms will get better. Uh,
Speaker 1: compute gets better all the time, censors get better all
Speaker 1: the time. It will happen. What about security challenges. We've
Speaker 1: reported on how Tesla's have been hacked. So you have
Speaker 1: to design security in your into your product from the beginning.
Speaker 1: And for us, we look at all the scenarios of
Speaker 1: what could happen from the security standpoint. Now, these these
Speaker 1: robots or these robot taxes are also recording all the time,
Speaker 1: so they sort of know what's happening inside of them
Speaker 1: and around them. So that gives us a little bit
Speaker 1: of a of an edge. And then you look at access.
Speaker 1: But this is something you just have to pay attention
Speaker 1: to understand what's going on in that world and make
Speaker 1: sure that you design against it still to come. Aisha
Speaker 1: Evans shares her outlook for Zoux's future and her favorite
Speaker 1: guilty pleasure. How many rights have you taken? A lot? Actually,
Speaker 1: it's not fair, right, I take a lot of rights,
Speaker 1: both in our L three testing fleet as well as
Speaker 1: in the ground up robotaxi. So when you take a ride,
Speaker 1: what's your report like generally afterwards? Well, okay, so two
Speaker 1: different things on the test fleet because and this is
Speaker 1: a big difference between us and our fellow travelers. I
Speaker 1: mean our L three fleet, the Toyota Highlanders that are
Speaker 1: outfitted with the same sensor, architectural placement and compute. They
Speaker 1: are purely engineering test vehicles. So when I it's called
Speaker 1: drive review. When I take a ride, it is with
Speaker 1: understanding what progress we're making, what issues were still having.
Speaker 1: I'm fascinated the scenarios we can't handle, how fast was
Speaker 1: teleopts able to step in, and so on and so forth.
Speaker 1: So then I have a long report and the app
Speaker 1: and this and that. When I'm in the robot taxi,
Speaker 1: it's more like I'm excited. I'm usually giggly. Uh. And
Speaker 1: then after five minutes on board and I'm on my device,
Speaker 1: which is what you want? How is it navigating supply
Speaker 1: chain challenges? Has the chip crisis impacted you? Yes, it has,
Speaker 1: It's impacted everybody. Um. Look, first of all, some things
Speaker 1: are just more expensive than they should be. Uh. Second,
Speaker 1: but you accept that it's the same for everybody. You
Speaker 1: have to get a lot more crisp around your needs
Speaker 1: because lead times are longer. And uh, that's really when
Speaker 1: it pays off to have had a good relationship with
Speaker 1: your suppliers and treated them as partners so you can
Speaker 1: talk about your problem statement and arrived to solutions. But
Speaker 1: it hasn't like slowed us down. It's just been an
Speaker 1: extra vector to manage buber and lifts. Seemed like they
Speaker 1: would be obvious partners, could be talk to them. We
Speaker 1: in this industry, there are no secrets, and we're all friends.
Speaker 1: We all talked to each other at some level on
Speaker 1: another so yes, we all have talked to each other.
Speaker 1: Who do you imagine would be your first customers? Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, Las Vegas. We've been public that that's
Speaker 1: our our first lunge. I call it a sort of affectionately,
Speaker 1: a one street dance urban environment. How's that with a
Speaker 1: lot of demand. Uh And then we really think that
Speaker 1: in starting at least at the beginning, big cities that
Speaker 1: have a very dense, uh urban sort of landscape where
Speaker 1: people are going to work, people are going to museums,
Speaker 1: people are going to restaurants, they don't want to worry
Speaker 1: about parking, we think that will be the first customer.
Speaker 1: So commercialization is on the horizon in Las Vegas and
Speaker 1: also San Francisco that would be next. How do you
Speaker 1: stay motivated on that road to commercialization given that there
Speaker 1: are still, as you say, these hard problems to solve,
Speaker 1: because every day literally either something happens in terms of progress,
Speaker 1: and it's really important to not just look at the
Speaker 1: ultimate success. But I call it like kind of along
Speaker 1: the way, the little celebration. I mean even when I
Speaker 1: do drive review, yes I have a long list or
Speaker 1: you know, what about this? What about that? But the
Speaker 1: vehicle will do something new or something awesome, and you're like,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, you go awesome. So there are so
Speaker 1: many things that happen on a daily basis, weekly basis
Speaker 1: that you see advancement. I talk it's like climbing, right,
Speaker 1: It's like you get to a certain element or certain place.
Speaker 1: You appreciate the journey, You turn around, you look down,
Speaker 1: you see what you've done, and you're like, all right,
Speaker 1: let's go for the next week. So as you put
Speaker 1: points on the board, what does a sha Evans see
Speaker 1: as the future of zoos? Do you see a global
Speaker 1: mobility giant or do you see something more modest? I
Speaker 1: see I want and I hope to lay the foundation
Speaker 1: for a global mobility giant with our about human being
Speaker 1: need transportation everywhere. It opens up access to economic mobility,
Speaker 1: it opens up access to knowledge, it opens up access
Speaker 1: to inclusion, uh not to mention safety, the environment and
Speaker 1: frankly humans, which is too valuable to spend. Also four
Speaker 1: hundred billion hours worldwide driving and we think that this
Speaker 1: is at the center of that puzzle. So that is
Speaker 1: the goal. All right, so we're gonna do this is
Speaker 1: a little rapid fire section now. Um so just quick
Speaker 1: answers um what a zooks stand for? The word zooks
Speaker 1: is basically a marine um uh sort of species that
Speaker 1: is solar powered and self moving in the ocean. Interesting.
Speaker 1: Best piece of advice for your twenties, take a shell pill.
Speaker 1: It'll be okay. What about your forties? Enjoy the journey
Speaker 1: you've made it. Um. I hear you're under restaurant at
Speaker 1: some point. Is that true? I confuse the love of
Speaker 1: cooking and running a restaurant. What's your favorite thing to cook?
Speaker 1: Chebujin which is a Senegalese dish. Biggest guilty pleasure? Trashy books?
Speaker 1: What bucks not telling? Um? Speaking of fellow travelers, what's
Speaker 1: your favorite travel destination? Hawaii? Me too? Which island Hawaii?
Speaker 1: I'm from Hawaii, Kauai? All the way last TV show
Speaker 1: you binged? I'm in the middle of it. A bridgeton.
Speaker 1: What's your view on work life integration? I don't use
Speaker 1: the word balance, work life choices, setting expectations on all sides.
Speaker 1: How do your kids fit into your life? They are everything?
Speaker 1: They are the beginning and the end. Our driver list
Speaker 1: future is always right around the corner or ten years away.
Speaker 1: Give us a realistic timeline. When can we ride in
Speaker 1: a zooks? A lot of people ask me, when can
Speaker 1: I tell my kids they can't have a they shouldn't
Speaker 1: get a driver's license? And I think it's going to
Speaker 1: be probably my kids kids. Arguments for and against going
Speaker 1: public against uh, definitely focus UM. The quarterly pressure is
Speaker 1: something I understand and know, and this is a long
Speaker 1: term journey, so focus is important for it seems to
Speaker 1: be everybody's dream in this valley. Is it yours? No? No?
Speaker 1: My My My dream is to uh to get this uh,
Speaker 1: this robot taxi out there and to see it delivered.
Speaker 1: The promise that I know it will. Is Zook's going
Speaker 1: to be on public roads this year? I don't know.
Speaker 1: We'll have to see what about ten years, what a
Speaker 1: success look like for Zoos in ten years several cities
Speaker 1: and there I say, Hey, I'm gonna zooks my way
Speaker 1: over there, Asha Evan's see Jos. Thank you so much
Speaker 1: for joining us. Great to have you my pleasure. I
Speaker 1: appreciate you coming over. And that's it for this edition
Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Studio. At one point out thanks for joining us.
Speaker 1: This episode is produced by Lauren Ellis, edited by Brian
Speaker 1: Carter Gainer, and executive produced and hosted by Yours truly
Speaker 1: Emily Jang. We'll see you next time.